/hhg/ - Horus Heresy General

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First for the Ninth.

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>>51756396
>Rolled 7
This thread is now fortified.

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Third for Scoria, who I'm making a grossly oversized model for. Arachnarok spider was too perfect to overlook, make some Narthecium mandibles, toss on some cables and armour, then turn the abdomen into the Abeyant command platform. Fun and simple, and hopefully he'll look scary enough to do his job as a Primarch deterrent.

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>>51756435
>Rolled 7
>>51756422
>First for the Ninth.
Fourth for the Vth. Traitors BTFO.

>>51756422
>>51756435
>>51756457

It's all the actually loyal legions that showed up for Terra.

Cool.

>>51756450
Why do you keep posting the Spiderbooty?

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>>51756469
It's almost like I did it on purpose.

Repostan

Bad theory crafting

Shitty List of the day:
TSons 2k, Zone Mortalis Assault Force
205 :: Praetor (Raptora)
ML1, Iron Halo, Digital lasers, Force Weapon, Master Crafted

155 :: Chaplain (Raptora)
ML1, AA, Refractor Field, PW >> FW, Crozius >> FW (Sword + Axe), Melta Bomb
155 :: Chaplain (Raptora)
ML1, AA, Refractor Field, PW >> FW, Crozius >> FW (Sword + Axe), Melta Bomb

165 :: Apothecaries (Raptora)
AA x3

390 :: Cortus Talon (2x)
Chainfist x2, Heavy Flamer x2, Exta Armour, Havoc Launcher

310 :: Breacher Squad (Raptora)
13 man, 2 Flamers, Nuncio-Vox, AA, PF, Breaching charge
310 :: Breacher Squad (Raptora)
13 man, 2 Flamers, Nuncio-Vox, AA, PF, Breaching charge
310 :: Breacher Squad (Raptora)
13 man, 2 Flamers, Nuncio-Vox, AA, PF, Breaching charge

ZMAF gives base to base Breachers +1 invuln so you you get 3 squads of 4++ / 3++ in combat

Nth for two questions on unit viability;

One, are Spartan Assault Tanks actually good? Being unkillable is pretty damn useful, but if I'm not taking a primarch is there any justification for it? Seems a Land Raider is better for dropping a Command squad (or whatever) out into combat.

And two, are Thallax any good? T5 3W is kickass on jet packs, but their guns lack firepower and they aren't doing much in CQC. Do they just take shots until volkite/heavy bolters delet them? I have 40+ skittles from 40k I can use as titanguard or thralls, so are they worth getting? the models are sex though, may buy some anyways

>>51756473
Because it's a very nice one. Also, Cathedral of the Spider.

>>51756495
Seriously though, why did so few legions actually show up to defend Terra? It also boggles my mind that the traitors were so shit that even with 8 legions and orbital supremacy they couldn't take on three legions.

It gets even better when a single primarch holds off those 8 legions for 3 days.

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What's on your table tonight /hhg/?

>>51756544
>UM were role playing new imperium and busy killing word bearers
>SM were mostly dead, and also isolated.
>DA were busy with BEING TOTALLY LOYAL ALL TIME EVERY TIME NOTHING TO SEE HERE
>RG also were mostly dead, so preoccupied with running away and picking fights were they could
>SW were butchering innocents to "help" bring Magnus to justice
>IH were busy having an autistic shitfit and becoming traitor-hunting cyborgs.

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>>51742631
>>51742615

(Posted in the last thread)

>Also pissed he can’t auto-kill a primarch in one turn. “He’s the Emperors
executioner and has killed 2 primarchs already”.

Angron almost killed Russ in a 1v1 fight on Malkoya. But that doesn't mean jack shit on the table.

Also what right do thay have to complain about Russ. He can kill any Primarch including Horus.

>>51756544
To be fair those 8 legions probably only made up about 5 real legions after having their numbers depleted, especially since the Thousand Sons were already a token force.

>>51756524
Spartans are pretty much only good for transporting fuckheug deathstars, otherwise leave the fat box at home, especially since everyone tends to be prepared to crack one open with Lightnings and such.

Thallax are good, just not for killing. Durable as fuck, nimble, ignore terrain with Reductor, can hold objectives and if you give them Destructor do a decent job of poking away at tanks while you do it with S7 Rending or S6 Lance. They won't be slaughtering infantry, sure, but they do utility jobs and hold forward objectives very well, which helps with the somewhat sluggish Mechanicum. Just don't upgrade them much, mine have Destructor and a Photon Thruster just because there's an abundance of Rhino Vets and termies in my meta, they will do fine naked or just with the augment.

Re. Skittles, the Hoplites are excellent with 10 or 12 in an Arvus Lighter to suicide-kill a Knight,Spartan or put some serious damage on a Fellblade or Mastodon, for pretty much fuck all, and leave scoring 5++ troops behind that won't mishap by hitting Ruins and such because Reductor.

Thralls are good, cheap tarpits and objective holders, give them Fearless and Carapace and you can't really go wrong with them.

Peltasts IMO do best with rad-carbines, so use your 40K Vanguard, and have a couple big units of 20 in Triaros buffed with 5+ FnP or PE:Infantry at permanent BS5 and BS2 Overwatch, rips through most things easily, killing 9 or 10 marines per salvo and being hard as nails scoring.

Back that lot up with some artillery fire, maybe one or two Vulturax, some Myrmidons for TEQ, PEQ and Custodes mashing and whatever else you want, maybe a Warhound to make the Titan Guard 4+ rerolling 1s then 5+ rerollable FnP, becoming almost Terminator-level tough to small arms.
Just don't take the Karacnos, it doesn't have the required firepower and costs too much for a precious Heavy Support slot.

>>51756604
>innocents
>filthy witches
Pick one.

>>51756643
I expect a lot of primarchs to start getting buffed into the stratosphere. All the traitor primarchs that turn demonic will get some serious buffs.

The Lion will probably be pretty bullshit, and I expect Sangy to be almost gamebreaking powerful.

>>51756643
>bringing that shit into this thread
Let it go anon, or talk about it on B&C.

>>51756586
Building a SW praetor for the SW army I'll probably never actually build. Thinking I'll slap a xenophase blade on the end of a nemesis halberd and call it a paragon blade. Maybe the GK hand holding a Daemonette head on the other arm.

>>51756643
>what rite to complain

Apparently they're pissed he can't kill a leviathan with ease, and that he "doesn't do enough to boost the legion".

I would actually be okay with Russ if they lowered the WS and/or I and took away either his armor, sword, or axe benefits. At least then he'd be pheasable to bring in smaller games

>>51756680
Plus the traitor Primarchs were all the shitty retarded ones, while they faced the best three.

>>51756586
Fourty Mk'V' marines.
It's a mix of MkII, MkIII, MkIV, MkV, MkVI and some SW bits thrown in.
Hopefully it will look okay. Keeping the MkII/III away from the other marks, using MkV torso's for them. I have something like 22 of them just sitting here.

They're all going to be bolter/ccw Grey Slayers.

>>51756643
Just thought of something.

About the 2 missing legions ... Supposedly the Ultramarines numbers swelled by a large amount when those were disbanded. And this is not claimed by UM themselves, but by those from other legions.

Space Wolves claim they did a legion before nudge nudge wink wink.

Who would be speaking the truth here ? The jobbers trying to impress others or outsiders making an observation ?

Does this mean that actually SW did fuck all pre-heresy besides making wild claims about being executioners ?

>>51756868
I wouldn't be surprised.

>>51756868
Does anyone have that image of the timeline for the last years of the great crusade?

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>>51756868
they were busy practicing their wet leopard growls

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>>51756586
Building lots of RG mk IV

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Reporting in the new bread.
Are there any good tutorials on painting Blood Angels/red using Citadel paints?
The only one I like the end result of is the PantingBuddha way, but it somehow it doesn't feel like a method to paint either power armour or entire army with.

>>51756930
The rattle can red is actually great for a smooth basecoat believe it or not

Left the last thread a few hours ago, but on the topic of making Legion Champions great again, would this not be a great idea: give an option specialise the champion, somewhat similar to Marks of Chaos, but not differentiated to allow for purely secular/material differences between different types of champion:

>Option 1: +1WS and +1I
>Option 2: +1S and +1A
>Option 3: +1T and -1I
>Option 1: +1 Invuln

>>51756983
Or you could give them access to paragon blades, problem solved.

>>51756944
What exactly is that? Google doesn't show anything relevant, I'm from a non-Anglo country if it helps.
I'm asking for tutorials utilising Citadel paints because I have a lot of their paints, and I'd have to wait at least until Monday to have any other delivered.

>>51756999
That's a bit simplistic, a "no-brainer", but I don't know if it "solves" the problem for making it less useless. Point-for-point, I don't know if they'd be any more use than just another Praetor though.
Maybe if Champion was an option for a Praetor that removed MotL instead?

>>51756930
>Are there any good tutorials on painting Blood Angels/red using Citadel paints?
Have you tried Duncan? It's in English but they show it and the colours.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9HzqHVg1uE

>>51756983
>>51756999

Or give them Rending and maybe even Murderous strike by default. To represent them being so skilled they can occasionally drive their blade through gaps in the armour and such

>>51757063
That's actually a really good idea.

>>51757051
I've watched it, I really dislike the highlight method he's using, it looks cartoony. I won't comment on the drybrush method.
Maybe I'm just too picky about my dudes.

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>>51756734
>"doesn't do enough to boost the legion"

What are they going to complain about next. That Russ doesn't have a wolf powered sleigh, Scornspitter doesn't have skyfire, he can't fart S10 AP1 large blasts out of his ass.

>>51757063
Thing is, we've done the maths on the Paragon Blade and it doesn't beat a powerfist to the face the majority of the time. So giving him one built-in won't really cut it, unless he's also got a couple extra attack and is swinging around a Charnabal sabre.
Also, that basically makes him a Marine-statted Force Commander with Cult Horde and Tainted Flesh, he can have a ID weapon for 5pts. Funny that, mine has occasionally tackled Praetors because he got a lucky Rend in before Chainfist time.

>>51757093
>I really dislike the highlight method he's using, it looks cartoony
Really? What kind of method are you looking for?

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>>51757130
>he can't fart S10 AP1 large blasts out of his ass.

>>51756868
Too many authors talking about one topic is what happened. The current explanation(see: copout) is that all this lore we are reading is second or third+ hand accounting of what happened compiled into a 'historical' document. Which means that it may be flat out lies in some cases. Victors do get to write the history books after all.

BL doesn't count, that's just too many authors trying to out snowflake each other.

As for the "Emperors Executioners", it's reached wolfywolf meme levels. SW are the worst mary sue, worfing, snowflakes of all the legions. And it's not even the fan-bases fault.

>>51757149
Well there should be a trade-off between powerfists and paragon blades. A powerfist does win out in a mathhammer vacuum, but not being able to swing before everybody else attacked can be very risky. And I always happily accept a praetor with powerfist that challenges with my sergant wielding a powerfist ; my sergant is most likely going to die, but he has a very real chance to take the praetor down with him for a fraction of the points.

Paragon blade is not as straight up killy, but way better at killing off grunts with 2+ saves and if you get that murderous strike through the invulnerable save you still won. And it allows you to strike at initiative, which means that anything without an invulnerable save does not want to accept the challenge.

Powerfist is more reliable, Paragon Blade brings the risk factor which makes a lot of people hesitate to go into a challenge if their character has an unwieldy weapon or lower initiative.

Giving legion champions a 'killing blow' rule where they have AP 2 and ID if they roll a 6 to wound is pretty much the same as a praetor with paragon blade : a gamble for you, but an even more risky gamble for the opposing warlord to go into that challenge.

>>51756983
delicious 3++ TS champions

>>51757343
Fair point, and it works especially well against Mechanicum, where my Archmagi and Automata wouldn't particularly care about a couple powerfist hits to the face, but are shit-scared of a lucky slash, even with a 3+ invuln.

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Alright, so we've got six legions that didn't make it to Terra in time. Three were smashed at Isstvan V, and in older fluff the legions were smaller to begin with so the remnants wouldn't have made a difference anyway. In the new fluff it’s likely that a handful of each will make it back (they might have a company from each legion present, just so players don’t feel left out during a few years’ worth of FW black books).

The Ultramarines and Dark Angels were held up in the galactic east and were a little late – but only a little. In the old fluff, they were about to arrive and Horus didn’t think he could defeat them, so he lowered the shields to goad the Emperor into beaming up. They might keep that, but I think the Ruinstorm is an addition to the new fluff. It’s keeping the UM, DA, and BA from traveling efficiently through the warp, and Angelus (the Passage of the Angel of Death, presumably) and an upcoming BL novel (“Ruinstorm”) will explain why only one of them get through quickly.

In really old fluff, the Alpha Legion wasn’t with the other traitors on Terra because they were trying to pull the Space Wolves further away from the Solar System. In early 2000s fluff (Index Astartes, I think), the Battle of Yarant was mentioned as a catastrophic event that smashed the SW and reduced their numbers to a few thousand (only one successor chapter, after all). In new fluff, Russ thought he could assassinate Horus and that’s likely to lead up to that battle.

>>51756544
>>51757436

Part 2

Why were three legions enough to defend Terra? Traditionally you assume you need a 3:1 advantage as the attacker. But of the eight traitor legions present (again, AL were away) the EC went off to do their own thing and there were only 1,000 Thousand Sons. So you’ve basically got 6 half-strength legions. Of the defenders, the BA and WS should be assumed to be at half-strength too, while the IF were the only legion to be near full strength. That’s only a 3:2 advantage in Astartes. Okay, some of the WS did respond to the EC’s antics so we can’t really discount them, and the traitors had more opportunity to reinforce themselves. So you could argue for a 2:1 or better traitor advantage.

The traitors probably had more humans with them than the loyalists, and of course daemons. Not sure about titans, but we do know that most titans on both sides were destroyed at the Titandeath. The loyalists had some remaining Custodes and Sisters of Silence.

Insanity and loss of cohesion mean the traitors probably needed a greater than 3:1 advantage to win, and the daemons probably gave them that advantage. So they were on the verge of winning before the DA and UM’s imminent arrival.

>>51757436
Sounds cool.
I'm looking forward to the BA being BAdass and the SW eating humble pie.

>>51757436
>In the old fluff, they were about to arrive and Horus didn’t think he could defeat them, so he lowered the shields to goad the Emperor into beaming up.
Weren't the SW and the DA together right after the Ultras?
>>51757457
>Traditionally you assume you need a 3:1 advantage as the attacker.
Yes, but that's presumably without the advantage of assaulting from orbit, which very few medieval generals had, as a rule.

>>51757491
They also didn't have voidshields, anti-air and teleporter scramblers in the middle ages.

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>>51757436
>>51757457
>The main rule of warfare. As the number of combatants increases, the resemblance to complete uncontrolled insanity approaches infinity. And then you have to take into account the terrain...
>Basically you start with a planet that's been nuked, polluted, and generally lived-in for a few hundred thousand years too long. And everyone on it is fighting everyone else, constantly. Your basic unit of land is the Bunker, vault 101 style. There isn't any natural plant life left of course, so all the oxygen is made in vats with the food. ""Luckily"" this means you can build anywhere that isn't intensely radioactive, and hence fight over those areas. Get Mega-City-One, nuke it and rebuild it a few times, and then you start to understand.
>Then the Emperor comes along, and manages against all odds to conquer the place. Suddenly everyone isn't killing and dying all the time, and a population boom happens. So Emps organised the largest set of public-works since the first colony ships. He rebuilds huge areas of the planet, and creates the Palace, the Astronomicon, and a buttload more besides. And what he gets is effectively one giant city, the second largest (after Comorragh) in the universe. "Huge" just doesn't do it justice as a description. Neither does "Labyrinthine", "Over Populated", or "Gothic Nightmare". And this New Terra was mostly just thrown over the original foundations of whatever was there, like a pile of gold-bricks onto a rat maze. There are bunkers and emplacements still around that date back to the War Against The Men of Iron and even before.

>>51756868
>>51757294
There's a guy on B&C who wrote his own II Legion fluff and rules after doing as much research as he could - actually did a decent job. He had an interesting idea, that the SW weren't originally meant to be executioners (so more in line with their 40k character), but Russ was close friends with the II Legion primarch. Several legions had to destroy the IInd, for whatever reason, and as fate would have it, Russ ended up killing his friend. The SW were only able to deal with the guilt by convincing themselves that being executioners was their job, and from then on they owned the title.

In any case, there's no contradiction between SW destroying a legion and the UM absorbing the survivors. It's not like they'd be happy to join the SW, and they were probably psychologically and physically more similar to the UM anyway (no fangs). Maybe the destroyed legion was already on good terms with the UM.

>>51757155
I'm open to suggestions.

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>>51757545
>Then the Heresy came, and the Emperor says to Dorn "Fortify this fucking madhouse". So now everything that didn't have a gun emplacement before does now, everywhere. And he walled in half the doors and windows, put hundreds of AA batteries on every roof, and generally panicked because if they would only ever be necessary if the space defenses (the best in the galaxy bar none) have failed.
>Then Horus arrives in orbit. He's punched through the space-defenses at massive cost, but the war in space is far from won, and the Palace is just a flat no-fly zone, so he can't just pick and choose landing areas. So he bombards everything his ships can reach, fills the sky with Drop Pods, and tries to march on it.

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>>51757576
>Which is when Rule 1) kicks in and everything immediately gets Mega-Fucked, for both sides. Ruined streets and bunkers make navigating a nightmare, communications are somewhere between impossible and actively detrimental, Drop Pods land off target, plans and backup plans fall apart in seconds, demons run amok. And the Primarchs are constantly trying to out Tactical Genius each other, so no-one has a fucking clue what's actually going on in the big picture. It's Stalingrad writ large, but without even the merest hint of sanity, and a thousand space marines charging into every breach.
>So it takes roughly 10 minutes of this menial bullshit for a load of the Chaos forces to get bored and just decide "Fuck It, Let's Just Wreck The Place". So now everything makes even less sense, entire companies ignoring sensible objectives to go on the Chaos Marine equivalent of a bender. The Emperor's Children Rape, Murder and pillage the civilians of Terra so hard that even 10,000 years later they still live in fear at the memory. Only the Iron Warriors and Sons of Horus are wholeheartedly tearing at the palace, dedicated to rubbing it in Dorn's face like a bitch no matter what. And to the horror of the loyalists, they're succeeding. Brick by brick the greatest military stronghold in the galaxy is falling.
>Which sounds great for Chaos, were it not for the simple fact it wasn't falling quickly enough. It was taking days to advance inches, and Guilliman was en-route with reinforcements, with Leman, El'Jonson, (and possibly) Corvus and Vulkan right behind. If the siege wasn't ended before they got there, the traitors would likely lose. So Horus lowered his battle barge's shields, effectively inviting the Emperor (who didn't know about the reinforcements) on-board to just duel this fucker out and make the entire rest of the conflict pointless. Everything else is history.

>>51757573
Cartoony just means the highlight is too light a color compared to the basecoat. Same technique with a closer shade will look more natural.

>>51756983
Trying to make a flat beat stick when a strictly better one exists is a bad idea. 35 Points is not worth the current rules either.

Instead make a Challenge beast: When fighting in challenge he gets FnP 4+, reroll to hit, reroll failed saves, rending. Must always issue a challenge but can select who must accept or deny.

It's hard to compete with Chaplains in terms of buffing a unit, and Praetors in terms of raw power 1v1. But with a Champion fishing out characters and punching above his weight, it would make him worth considering.

>>51757545
Is there a high-res version of this somewhere?

>>51757573
I'm not familiar with any method of highlighting other than drybrushing or edge-highlighting, that doesn't involve an airbrush. Especially if you're limited to GW paints and (presuming) a brush?

Also I think as highlights go that design isn't particularly "cartoony" (if by cartoony you mean too high contrast).
>>51757568
>tfw Guilliman convinced his "friend" Primarch to go school-shooter/Horus mode and orchestrated events to cover his role up

>>51757628
>>tfw Guilliman convinced his "friend" Primarch to go school-shooter/Horus mode and orchestrated events to cover his role up
Interesting theory, we all know how power-hungry Guilliman is, second only to his desire to be seen as Good.

>>51757604
I had the same feeling. What if the highlight is done with the basecoat colour? I have stronger theory than practice.

>>51757628
>>51757628
>>I'm not familiar with any method of highlighting other than drybrushing or edge-highlighting, that doesn't involve an airbrush. Especially if you're limited to GW paints and (presuming) a brush?
A shame. Thanks anyway, I'd look into airbrushes but can't afford it atm.

>>51757614
>Trying to make a flat beat stick when a strictly better one exists is a bad idea.
I wouldn't disagree that specialising the Champion to be a terror in challenges is a bad idea, but there's no reason not to make him a beatstick in regular fighting too, seeing how he's not a compulsory HQ let alone Master of the Legion, and people are paying premium points to bring him in.

>>51757655
>I had the same feeling. What if the highlight is done with the basecoat colour?
That can be done if you lighten it with white. It's a bit more awkward though. There's also the option to mix the basecoat with the colour that Citadel's paint system made to highlight it with. https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/Downloads/CitadelPaintingSystem.pdf

In my experience highlighting that would seem "cartoony" up close can look understated when the model is on the table and the eyes at head-height, not to mention different lighting conditions and 3D versus pictures.

There's also the option of using the glazes (Bloodletter Red), because if you apply it over a highlight it reduces the contrast between the two colours, bringing them closer to the generally bright but deep colour of the glaze. I'm currently using it on Imperial Fists, it's interesting.

What should I read next, Nemesis, Cybernetica, or the The Primarchs anthology? (Just out of what I've got downloaded at the moment, might as well work through these before getting anything else.)

>>51757655
I started out in military modeling, where highlighting isn't commonly done - some shading, maybe. So I started highlighting red with a slightly lighter red, keeping it subtle... and I wasn't very happy with it. Honestly, minis look better with stronger highlighting. Yes, a little cartoony, but sci-fi soldiers wearing bright red are already cartoony. They just are. Embrace it.

To me, an extreme highlight for red is Tau Light Ochre. If you want to stay subtle, use somethign like Wild Rider Red. I wouldn't use the same red as the basecoat. Waste of time. Seriously, you'll spend a lot of time and then realize you might as well not have.

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>>51757093
I think grey areas ba looks the best

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>>51757573
http://heresy30k.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/16-grey-areas-blood-angels-legion/?p=851

>>51757769

>>51757751
>The Primarchs anthology
Shit book desu.
The Fulgrim story is worth it for kookiness/absurdism factor, and while I skipped the Lion story, the Omegon story was poor, as was the Ferrus Manus story, except when it dealt with Meduson and the Imperial Army.

>>51757802
Right, cheers for the warning, will set it aside for now.

>>51757750
>he's not a compulsory HQ
Only moritats, libbys, MoS and pmedicaes aren't.

>>51757828
Thanks for the correction.

I'd be open to him getting it then, if it'd mean he could become better at his job description!

>>51757751
>Nemesis
Pretty nice if you don't mind reading about not marines

>Cybernetica
Nothing changes : the book. You can easily skip this one because it doesn't tie into anything.

>>51757863
Gotcha, cheers. Nemesis it is.

>>51757751
>>51757826
I also remembered which one Nemesis was - it's the one with the assassins.
It has its moments, but it's basically the Rogue One of 30k.
I did think a certain moment at the end with a certain loyalist Primarch was worth it though, but I'm biased.

Haven't read Cybernetica, but the one thing I have read by Rob Sanders, "Iron Within" in the Age of Darkness, was top-tier. I think it's later in the setting than the other two, so if you're in order you might be breaking it.

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>>51756586
Something I could use some opinons on actually, if anyone could offer any.

Which head should I give this guy's staff?
A) stupidly long choppy spear
B) single axe wing
C) double axe wing

>>51757936
A. The other two are fucking awful, sorry,

>>51757936
post that painted sons, he looks like candy

delicious candy, post legionary feet so I can suck on

>>51757936
A. I feel with the other two he would need to be holding the staff either lower or right under the head for it to look natural.

>>51757936
Depends which kind of force weapon you want it to be, you've got a recipe for all three there.
I personally am impressed by how much the middle one looks like a gallowglass axe I'm tempted to steal it. Which bitz did you use for that, staff and wing-parts?

>>51757936
I'm going to guess TSons, so A), though you should shorten the staff.
If it's BA, then C) if it's a chaplain.

>>51757750
>That can be done if you lighten it with white. It's a bit more awkward though.
It is, either mine are fucked or GW whites are fucked.
>when the model is on the table and the eyes at head-height
Fair enough, I've never had mine on taletop.

Glaze could indeed work, I think I'll give that a try.

>>51757758
>sci-fi soldiers wearing bright red are already cartoony. They just are. Embrace it.
Point taken. I'll see what can be done about highlights.

>>51757769
>>51757799
These look good, though I can't into airbrush. Wet blending each model would be too much time-consuming.

>>51757802
Omegon's story is actually pretty cool.

>>51757936
What head is that?

How do we make bolter custodes not shit? Just make the caliver assault 3? Maybe even salvo 2/3? Because I can bet better shooting than a few heavy bolters elsewhere for that price point...

Mechanicum players, what/who do you take for your HQs?

I want an Archimandrite and a barebones/Machinator only Magos Reductor for my Reductor, but I'm unsure what to do with the 3rd HQ slot, since I need the extra FA and such more than HS slot #4, and I might have some Milita allies, so no Matrix of Ruin for me.

Anyone use any of the special characters for any of the variants? Scoria looks like a decent duellist, if pricy, but I'm wondering about Draykavac, Satarael and Decima. Inar looks decently supporty, but I don't get what you want Decima the expensive for, or Draykavac.

>>51758047
>Assault 3 AP2 ID.

No thanks, you'll have your melee and like it.
Maybe have the Hbolter sections have double shots or something, but you are not trivializing fighting automata, one of the best things for beating your T5 faces in.

>>51758108
>Scoria
>Decent Dualist

Bit of an understatement, m80

>>51758030
>GW whites are fucked.
Ceramite white is fucked in my experience, but white scar can work if you shake for like a minute and thin it well. Consider getting a special flow retarder like liquitex or winsor and newton galeria (the brand of the pot I'm using) to thin your paints instead of water, I can never go back to water after using these.
I hear as well that Ulthuan Grey is the colour you'll want if you're painting large areas white - you basecoat using it, but then use thin coats of white scar over it to brighten it, and you get shading done if you use this method too. Ceramite white is kind of obsolete except in teeny details like eye sockets, it would seem.
But enough about white, the highlights; I don't think lightening the basecoat with white is a viable option either, since it'll either be too subtle or end up looking like a shittier version of the official highlight colours. What you might choose instead is mixing the basecoat Mephiston Red with the highlight colour, and highlighting with that. BUT even then, Citadel's highlights are designed to be thin, and their basecoats opaque, so you might be sacrificing the best of both worlds for uncertain results.
I do recommend the glaze though.

And what the other guy said about highlights being cartoony is only valid from a certain point of view. It is "cartoony" if your point of reference is the convention of historical painting. Normally that isn't done there, mostly because camouflage is meant to look drab and the high-level modellers use airbrush techniques.
There IS such a thing as highlights that are too cartoony, I have struggled with them myself, and glazes are the biggest saving grace with them.
Try the colour that's closest to the basecoat first, and if that's not enough, apply smaller amounts of the next brightest colour on top of them and you can work the colour up.

>Omegon's story is actually pretty cool.
Eh, the "stinger" is a potent one, but the story just drags on I thought.

>>51757982
The staff is from the Rubric Marine sprue, the eagle from one of the Sisters/Custodes sprues in BoP.
>>51758041
Third party.

Consensus seems to be cut the first section off the haft and stick the blade on, thanks to all for commenting, I think I'll probably do that.
>>51757962
Candy is dandy

>>51758167
Thanks.

>Consensus
Screw consensus, I think you have a nice-looking axe there, though for the legion that's in it, I think the aquila-wing look isn't exactly apropos.

>>51758192
Yeah, I was gonna either paint it as if it was a raven rather than make it gold, or do it in stripes, same with the eagle on his pauldron.
Arg, stop convincing me to do the axe with your polite comments.

>>51758162
Well, it's what he's for. He's the "Fuck You Snowflakes" character, and I love him very much for what he does, but he does cost rather a lot and can't compare to an Archimandrite or Inar for buffing, so runs out of steam a bit in larger games.

He's superb fun against those guys who love their Primarchstars too much, especially when most of the Firedrakes/Deathshroud/Justaerin/Butchers get ripped up at I5 by S10 Castellax or Shredding power claws.

He's good, but I wouldn't say he's an auto-take unless you're being a dick and taking him in 1.5k/Zone Mortalis or something, where pretty much nothing can challenge him.

>>51755252
Not at all. I'm giving all my tacticals bolters, pistols and CCWs and there's no problem at all fitting them on there. Was planning on putting pouches and grenades on them as well, but those didn't have any room left for them.

>>51758242
>Arg, stop convincing me to do the axe with your polite comments.
Do what you need for WYSIWYG, let the rules decide. If you want a sword, go for A, an axe, go for B.
I wouldn't recommend C used as-is for a maul, though, it looks too simple, and if you're not careful it could easily be off centre.

>>51758163
I can thin them alright with water, the issue is when mixing them as the pigment's either too thick or pieces keep getting stuck together.
I've had success with Celestra Grey for white basecoat, just two layers over black undercoat did it.
Luckily I have some spare models to test the highlights, I'm just trying to explore all the options before I commit.
Thanks for all the advice, I'll deliberate upon it some more and hopefully have a marine to post tomorrow.

>the "stinger"
What?
The story's pace is a bit slower, but I found it a refreshing change. Sanders' take on AL is the better one.

Is there any reason to take a frost blade or axe? With Specialist Weapon, you're basically paying power fist money for a weapon that's nowhere near as useful as a power fist. They're not even that great for giving power fist model +1 Attack, when you could just as well take a cheaper lightning claw.

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>>51758346
>painting white over black primer

>>51758398
Some people like to try out stuff.

>>51758258
>He's the "Fuck You Snowflakes" character
by being a bigger snowflake, this is not a good thing

>>51758346
>>the "stinger"
>What?
It's TV Tropes terminology for something at the end of the story that retroactively changes the feeling of the story. A type of twist ending.

>>51758375
I haven't looked through SW in detail, but the thing with specialist weapons is you can equip them alongside volkite chargers, meltaguns, etc and not feel like you're missing out.

>>51758398
He's not talking about White Scars here.
Multiple thin coats should do the job passably for small areas, particularly if he works up with a grey rather than ceramite.

I have heard grey primer is a better choice though, but I've never used it, black and white only.

>>51758463
>FW realised that the only answer to snowflakes was exothermic armour
Clever.

>>51758143
>>Assault 3 AP2 ID.
Where are you getting this? Im talking about the heavy bolter part, the S5 Ap4 Heavy 3 on a non-relentless model for no reason. Not making the fucking 12" death laser assault 3 ha. You crazy

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>>51758487
>units should have no downsides

>>51758466
>I haven't looked through SW in detail, but the thing with specialist weapons is you can equip them alongside volkite chargers, meltaguns, etc and not feel like you're missing out.

Most ICs get to have a pistol, CCW and a charger/(combi-)bolter. Not to forget that at power fist price, you might as well take the fist or if you really want a sword/axe, why not invest an extra 5pts. in the great frost blade, which is basically a power scythe?

>>51758485
Kek.
>but also exothermic armour makes the area around them colder now

>>51758463
He's not really a snowflake much, though, he's a powerful smashy character who's entire backstory is "Was imprisoned for shadiness, broke out, became scary as fuck." That's really not much.
Also, what's the alternative? Give Domitars Eternal Warrior, so they can wade in there and fuck stuff up very slowly?
He's for winning Herohammer on the tabletop, nothing else, and that's fun to trigger people who think their Primarchs should be immortal and wade through anything the Mechanicum has, then get entertainingly salty when they lose.

>>51758485
Sadly, they didn't quite throw off their retardedness long enough to work out the proper terminology.

>>51758487

Oh, that's fine. Honestly I thought they were Relentless already. My bad.

>>51758515
>units should not be objectively shit for no reason
FTFY
Downsides are one thing, but when it makes the unit garbage-tier and there's no point to taking it there's a difference.

>>51756396
Holy shit we reached the 500 posts of Ultramar before moving to the next thread?

>>51758542
>He's not really a snowflake much, though
>never before seen character
>super edge lord renegade admech ultra magos
>imprisoned for FORBIDDEN to hide "Well where was he before?" gap
>broke out in order to be shoehorned in
>beats 17/18 primarchs, the literal demigods of the setting, in melee.
>16 of those fights being an outright slaughter
>not a special snowflake

What archetypes that aren't well trodden by the known, extant legions could be feasibly used by the lost legions.

To avoid autistic screeching and surges of NO FUN assume that the IInd and XIth Legion purgings are being retconned, or were never part of the setting to begin with.

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>>51756586

Cleaning mould release.

>>51758542
>Also, what's the alternative?
I don't know, if only there was some other aspects of the game besides having your warlords go head-to-head in a challenge that mechanicum could be good at, some kind of, I don't know, long ranged combat?

>>51758639
This means colour schemes, battlefield doctrine, cultural aesthetic motifs, etc.

>>51758651
Wait, you mean i can just shoot at Primarch and it will die?

Say it ain't so!

>>51758579
17/18? We don't have Sanguinius and the Khan yet, so surely 15/16, and the fight with Russ is a toss-up.

Thing is, he basically has no character other than a brief history, he may as well be a 0-1 Archmagos Prime option. He's not a character so much as a ruleset. He's possibly bullshit, depending on how limiting you view the slow-as-fuck bit, but he's not special, renegade or edgy enough to start with to be a snowflake. If anything, he's a bit boring.

>>51758651

RIP salty legion players, although I concede that Mechanicum doesn't lack for big guns. It is nice to have an EW HQ though. Maybe if EW was a 35ish pt upgrade for Archmagi I would be fine with losing him, like the Custodes and the Auxilia (Well, the Marshals pick their trait which can be EW, so not exactly.)

>>51758645
>the madman

>>51758693
>Sanguinius
>Lion
So 15/18 it is.

>>51758693
>everyone forgets about Lion
It ain't easy being green in the future.

>>51757802
The Fulgrim one is good for getting a glimpse of the Emperor's Children in the midst if their fall. I also never liked the idea of a daemon straight up possessing Fulgrim for the entire heresy, then he becomes a prince and what, the "real" Fulgrim is suddenly full Slaanesh? Better to make it so the daemon corrupts him, brings him to Chaos, but otherwise it's actually Fulgrim himself doing the things

>>51758736
>>51758754

Sorry, friends, I always forget the Lion out of all of them. Why's he so forgettable?

Ah well, I suspect Sanguinius will chew up and spit out Scoria, if only because whoever writes his rules will want to make him the great champion of Herohammer.

>>51758693
>beating any primarch, the most special snowflake of characters while costing almost half as much
>not a special snowflake himself
Even the nameless shield captain you can make is a snowflake due to being a golden banana.

We get it you like cheap, OP units. Stop shilling for the special edge-lord admech spidermans honor.

>>51756681
>Re. Skittles, the Hoplites are excellent with 10 or 12 in an Arvus Lighter to suicide-kill a Knight,Spartan or put some serious damage on a Fellblade or Mastodon, for pretty much fuck all, and leave scoring 5++ troops behind that won't mishap by hitting Ruins and such because Reductor.
What about an Arc rifle Peltast suicide squad? While they may lack the 5++, they have double the range (or double the shots), which means they could kill that Spartan and avoid the Cataphractii's retaliation, while they still wound marines on 2+ from comfortable 24" away.

>>51756699
He's probably talking about Prosperine civilians, which literally did nothing wrong, unlike Magnus and his many children.

>>51758645
I like how FW gave up on trying to limit materials and said "Fuck it, cast them brick-style."

>>51758848

Arc Rifles are mistyped in this to be Range 12" Rapid Fire, so they have no range advantage.

Also, that's way more expensive, and the big thing is it's an annoying, cheap and scoring squad that just did that, so it's a waste of another turn to turn the Catas around and smack them in the face. No point to making the suicide unit more expensive than it needs to be, especially since you'll probably be dropping within 12" anyway since you have the 6" disembark to get as many shots as possible.

>>51758639
I'd start here for the missing primarchs' personalities. It doesn't necessarily say much about the legions though.

No need to copy this guy, but his approach was well thought-out.

For combat styles, dunno. Underwater/gas planet specialists? Lots of pilots and whale-stormbirds.

>>51758847
Are we going to have to have the "Is the slow and deadly character OP" argument again?

Also, difference between "Bullshit OP unit" and "Special Snowflake". Primarchs, Valdor and such are the latter, Scoria and the Tribune are the former, if anything.

>>51758956
Are whale-stormbirds a meme?

>>51758956

>Lots of pilots and whale-stormbirds.
Has the project that I've not even fully planned yet become a meme already? I'm not entirely sure how to feel about that, now I'm afraid it'll be shit.

Problem I'm having is trying to work out how to do a proper mech-spine and gondola for it without it looking too boring, Orky or Dark Eldar.

>>51758984
Scoria is a special snowflake.

>>51758956
>>51758639
Oops, forgot both links. Sigh.

Primarch personalities going by the Tarot arcana:
http://menducia.atspace.com/primarchs/II.html (that goes to one of the missing primarchs/arcana but the links to the others are on the side)

Guy who did a good job with II Legion headcanon:
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285838-the-lost-and-forgotten-building-the-ii-legion/

>>51759027
Well, even if he is, he's not worse as such than all the Primarchs and named characters who are dumb enough to try and duel him, so whatever. I'll take him and enjoy, because if any Traitor character or strong character is a Snowflake we're probably all damned, unless you play Milita and Cults or Solar Auxilia.

If an option is available to centurions, does that include consuls as well? Like if, say, a legion wargear option is available to the praetor and centurions, does that mean naked centurions or can consuls also take it (seeing that they're just centurions with extra rules)?

>>51759054
The High Priestess sounds like Malcador.
>The Sun (i.e. Dorn): Potentially a very strong pair, the Sun working more in the public light and the High Priestess behind the scenes.
Yup, Malcador.

>>51757602
This, many many times. It has always made sense.
40k is people doing the best they can after 30k's series of unfortunate events.

>>51757936
Heh, looks like that anon who was writefagging his legion and had some special axes

>>51759170
You mean 40k is people dancing to the tune of events set in motion by 50 different kinds of 2deep4uscrub superhumans, right?
:^)
:^|
:'^(

>>51758829
>Ah well, I suspect Sanguinius will chew up and spit out Scoria, if only because whoever writes his rules will want to make him the great champion of Herohammer.

I mean, other than chaos infused horus(who sangy might have been able to fight if he wasn't wounded and exhausted after fighting for three days straight) and the emps. He really is top-dog.

sorry russ

>>51758108
Decima is worth only because of his haywire scream, and is loyalist only, so cannot be in the same army as any other named Mechanicum.
Because he's the only loyalist one.
Satarael is an Archimandrite, but only available to regular Taghmata and Cybernetica. Scoria isn't an Archimandrite but rather an Archmagos Dominus, and Draykavac isn't available for Reductors either.

Again... What's your question?

>>51759268
>He really is top-dog.

>Sanguinius lost to Ka'Bandha
>Lorgar (LORGAR) beat him

>>51759214
Well that's not me, I'm the anon with the biscuit tin. Whatever that form that ends up as, it's just a force weapon.

>>51758528
>>but also exothermic armour makes the area around them colder now
Of course, because it sends the heat away from the battlefield :^)

>>51758645
how many custode tanks did u buy?

>>51759359
>lost

You mean got knocked out when the psychic backlash of 600 marines dying at once hit him. Next time they fought he ripped him apart with his bare hands, and then decapitated a keeper of secrets. Then he pulled a fucking bane on the same bloodthirster a few years later, after he held the gate of terra for 3 days.

>>51759394
Does Russ make puns like Mr. Freeze?

>>51759054
That was pretty cool read.

>>51756983
What is wrong with current champ.
He hits other consul level or lower guys on 3s, with a reroll.
You get what you pay for on the tin. A guy to kill all the consul and lower level sergeants.
Not everyone needs a fucking paragon blade

>>51757130
Look at all his boys giving there best wet Leopard growl.

>>51758907
>Arc Rifles are mistyped in this to be Range 12" Rapid Fire, so they have no range advantage.
That's bullshit of course. They're 24", meaning scatter has less of an effect on you.
But they'll be about 50pts more expensive, I guess, it's true.
But they at least can still perform a function after popping the Spartan, rather than the Hoplites' "Stand still, engaging oportunity targets forbidden. You've outlived your usefulness. Praise the Omnissiah".

>>51759458
>A guy to kill all the consul and lower level sergeants.
You mean either have his sword bounce off his opponent's 2+ or get a mutual powerfist kill against the first sergeant he meets.

>>51759458
At initiative ap2 would be the best thing for a champion, unless you are one of the legions with an @I ap2 weapon you either try to chip through artificier armour with a power sword or you wait until initiative step 1 where any sergeant with a power fist can ID your expensive HQ character.

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>>51759431
No.
He's cold like that.

>>51759531
>not being an IH termie for a 135 point brick shithouse with a 3++, MC-Power Fist, and WS6 to gib anyone in his way

>>51759580
Ice pun there, Carlos.

>>51759568
Emps champion with blade of perdition is pretty good. Especially for clearing up chaff units.

>>51759431
I think Perturabo, Guilliman, or Fulgrim are big enough assholes to make puns like that.

Alpharius would do it too, but he'd get away with it.

>>51759582
>great sword ravenwing jetbike champion with rad and stasis grenades rerolling to wound against T5 plus

>>51758693
>wah but we don't get EW so...
Literally kill yourself.
ONE legion can buy that shit. ONE.
It should be a fucking rare ability. Just because 40kek has every other fucking Chapter Master with the fucking shield doesn't mean HH should.

>>51759605
>Especially for clearing up chaff units.
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE DEATHFIRE DOESN'T SPILL REEEEEEEEEEE.

>>51759668
Show me in the book.

:^)

>>51759639
>imperial fist tartorus termie with storm shield and thunderhammer

>>51759639
Eh, I've always enjoyed IH centurions. The fact most every guy can easily grab a 3++ gets things pretty scary, especially with Primus Medicae or Chaplains. Gets into rape territory reaaallly quick.

>>51759531
DG, WS, and UM are fine though.
And the yiffs I suppose

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>>51758829
Because all the DA books are turds.

>>51759715
> Then all these other posters saying how their legion champions are fine
So what Legion do you ass mad players use?
Probably IWs.
> wah wah Iron fire not good enough wah shrapnel rounds too weak wah wah
I'm sorry your legion is balanced. Cry a fucking river

>>51759768
This isn't a legion vs legion thing, it's a consul vs consul thing. Sure a UM/WS/DG/SW champion is fine compared to an [other legion] chaplain, but it's still worse than a UM/WS/DG/SW chaplain.

The thought exercise is to boost champions, not the legion shitfling you paint it to be.

>>51759832
>SW chaplain
Forget I said that, SW are of course too loyal to need Chaplains.
:^)

>>51759768
>shrapnel rounds
>not good

Biggest meme out there, pinning *can* be insanely useful. I play against this motherfucker that loves spamming pinning jetbikes, fucking ruins squads on foot through sheer volley of fire.

However, any half-competitive list has transports for it's troops, so I'll give that they could be improved by pinning on a wound instead of an unsaved wound, might make it more useful.

But seriously, fuck getting pinned, it will ruin your day

>>51756544
Because the fluff is fucking stupid at that point
> Horus dies because muh emperor muh psychic powah
> Suddenly every fucking traitor flees without other reason than Horus's death even when there are a llot of powerful commanders such as Mortarion or even Abaddon.
WHY

>>51759866
But that's the role of the Spooker of the Dead.

>>51759895
>spamming IW jetbikes
Sounds like an interesting character.

>>51759492
Yeah, I guess it's largely personal preference. I like the Hoplites because it's likely that that squad will be immediately wiped off the board by anybody nearby, or the squad who's Spartan they just popped, and the Hoplites both cost you less if they die and have a higher chance to survive
Also they can continue popping vehicles if they live, and if all else fails throw some S5 into a nearby Support Squad and lock them up in glorious melee.

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>>51759906
>Abaddon
>better commander than Horus
I wonder who could be behind this post.
WHO COULD IT POSSIBLY BE?
>>51759914
Remind me, does a spooper have zealot like a chaplain?

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Are Word Bearers competitive anymore?

I mean, TS have a better psychic phase (we knew this, and Diabolists sucks), Burning Lore gives us a few Lv1 dudes but that's all.

Gal Vorbak in a Spartan are not worth it anymore with their ride becoming more expensive, an Anvillus is pretty weak, and the Kharybdis despite 5hp is still only AV12 (and Heat Blast is a joke). They are just a blender to weak units, not worth charging other 2+ save units unless forced too.

Tactical Squads are meh now, and other legions do Assault Squads better. I'm looking at you Night Lords and Dark Angels.

Ashen Circle now are vastly overcosted, while cool looking, there is no point.

Their special Dread has always been rubbish, a Knight is always better for just a little more points.

For 2500pts, can you help me salvage my dreams of playing the army?

>>51759106
>(seeing that they're just centurions with extra rules)
...so, that means they can take those.

>>51759330
I'm planning on eventually having some of each variant to play with, since they both look fun, so I was just wondering if anyone uses the other named characters. I've seen Scoria once and none of the others.

>>51759962

I don't think he posts here anymore.

>>51759966
>Are Word Bearers competitive anymore?
>HH
>competitive
Absolutely disgusting behaviour.

>>51759600
I coldn't resist.

>>51759600
>>51760008
chill out, guys

>>51759924
More like a kid that has nigh-unlimited access to his parents credit card, but I guess it's the same idea.

I suspect he doesn't even like IW based off the wretched quality of his models (no lenses, literally just leadbelcher primer with 3-4 heavy coats of nuln oil. Doesnt even bother with hazard stripes). At least it's painted, but badly painted makes me angry, like what a waste of the models.

I'll have to get pictures to trigger those good IW painters (and anger the IW players here whose models look bad compared to his). Speaking of which, anydody else have experience with kids/teens at their LGS? I've found they're either based and like painting but suck at play, or are memelord waacfags that have yet to learn what 'tactics' are

>>51759962
>Remind me, does a spooper have zealot like a chaplain?

No, just Fearless and gives his unit PE (Infantry). On top of the FNP and his vial of wolf aids.

>>51759966
Don't know WB enough to give specific advice but I guess I'd say: they're still a legion force, with all the strengths that entails. And they'll mostly be fighting other legion forces, so a lot of your weaknesses will be their weaknesses.

In short, 30k is still to a decent extent about mirror matches; you don't have the crazy imbalance between factions you see in 40k.

Also, if you can wait until Angulus, you may get some new rules for some of your pets.

>>51759832
>>51759866
I think he means WS Chaplain?

>>51759981
Just making sure there isn't some "consul ain't the same as a centurion" clause somewhere that I've missed.

>>51759966
Wait for the shadow crusade book. Right now 30k is pretty unbalanced so older books legions are underpowered compared to TS or fucking robots

>>51759665
Your HQ units aren't feasibly 325 points, though, nor do they often cost you Slay the Warlord and D3 extra points, as well as make you lose control of half the army if you've killed a couple other 2W MEQs.

I do get your point, but seeing as every army but Cults and Legions do get it, man up.
Maybe make it a 2k+ option, like the Custodes, and obviously have it expensive.

>>51759966
Making use of good psychic powers with Lorgar and their characters, they can be very scary. Also daemon friends are very helpful. They just have a less reliable tactic than just shooting/assaulting, and making use of their good Ld and buffs Lorgar can give to everyone

>>51760030
Pretty much similar to yours, plenty are cool to be around and have lots of fluff discussion, a couple are dicks who are extremely passive-agressive the whole time, including the manager's son, which is a pain.

>>51759966
>>51760082
How's Zardu Layak in action? Any tactics? Seems like he can do pretty good or at least a very fun army with daemons amd his slaves

>>51760064
True, but most forms of instant death (custard creams notwithstanding) come in doubling your toughness, which no Magos has ever feared.

>>51760063
When will that be coming out?
WB have had 3 updates, and still feel like they get the shaft each time.
TS look pretty hardcore right now.

>>51760130
Zardu is support only.
His slaves make him not able to join another unit, so why bother? He can go against tactical squads, but not really anything else.
With Tacticals being less good, he has fallen out of favor.

>>51760143
Looks like it will take a long time for it to come... but word bearers are pretty fun to collect and you can get daemons for Angelus and maybe use them in some years with WB

My Legion is better than your Legion

>>51760134
Mostly it's Custodes, Paragon Blade Praetors and Primarchs swinging around ID weapons, to be fair. Mostly it's a pain that they die to a lucky hit from the Praetor they were about to horribly mash with I3 Power Axes and robots, although I suppose that's the point of Paragon Blades in the first place.

Maybe instead have an upgrade that reduces ID weapons to D3 wounds instead? Then it will take an average of two wounds, which is enough that Mortarion and Company will hack through easily enough but Mr. Paragon chump will do a lot of damage at most?

>>51760283
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

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What deficiencies does this list have? I want to place an order with FW so I can get those legion bits, and I might as well make it big enough for free shipping.

Death Guard (2000pts)
ROW: the Reaping

>HQ
Marshall Durak Rask (165)

>Troops
-Legion Tactical Squad x20 w/extra CCWs, vexilla; sergeant w/artificer armor, melta bombs, power weapon, rad grenades (310)
-Legion Tactical Squad x20 w/extra CCWs, vexilla; sergeant w/artificer armor, melta bombs, power weapon, rad grenades (310)
-Legion Support Squad x5 w/plasma guns, extra CCWs; sergeant w/artificer armor, melta bombs, power weapon, rad grenades (220)

>Elites
-Apothecary Detachment x3 w/artificer armor, augury scanner (180)
-Contemptor Dreadnought Talon x1 w/CCW and kheres assault cannon (190)

>Heavy Support
-Heavy Support Squad x7 w/missile launchers, hardened armor, augury scanner (240)
-Heavy Support Squad x7 w/missile launchers, hardened armor, augury scanner (240)
-Legion Vindicator x1 w/demolisher cannon, dozer blade, armorer ceramite (145)

Rask with the plasma squad for rerolls, apothecaries with the two tactical squads and the support squad.
I know the power scythes are elite, but in my head fluff I'm saving them for legion champions and the death shroud

>>51760286
>Maybe instead have an upgrade that reduces ID weapons to D3 wounds instead?
Only if praetors get an upgrade that makes them immune to attacks from robots.

>>51760283
But my legion is your legion.

>>51760283
Indeed it is. Therefore I'm going to give up all my intentions to play the legion I love, and play a legion with superior rules instead. I actually don't like them, and especially hate their paint scheme, but painting that is a small price to play for getting my hands on that one legion-specific unit with the good rules.

>>51760283
But that isn't true, my legion did [xxxxx] and has the superior primarch.

Rolled 17, 15 = 32 (2d20)

>>51760283
>>51760289
>>51760322
>>51760332
>>51760341
Dice one is the best legion, dice two is the best primarch.
If the either die shows 2 or 11 then the other is the worst of the relevant category.
If both show 2 or 11 then Russ and the Wolves are best.

>>51760401
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>51760401
>word bearers and magnus
Hmmmm.

>>51760064
It's almost as if, while FW allows you to sink 300 points into a T4 model to make it a combat monster, there is still a sort of...balance... where if it dies, there are... consequences. Instead of it being point and click. Crazy huh?
Oh wait until forgot Mechanium can make a not!grav centurion unit, the most point and click unit in 40k... so close. Mechanium are still broke as hell
> ib4 BUT BUT KEKSTODES
Did you seriously try to make a BALANCE argument while referencing custodes? The current poster boys of FW pay to win power creep?
Are you retarded?

>>51760317
> No Chem Flamers
No cups for you

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So who's your favourite Astartes character in the heresy and why /hhg/?
> because of memes is an acceptable answer

>>51760460
Can someone paint a Sombrero and moustache on this pic please

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> rolled d20 to pick a legion
> rolled 2
> rolled 11
THE YIFFS ARE COMING FOR ME BOYS

>>51760401
dice+2d20
more like this

>>51760460
But he's not mexican!

Why isn't there any art of papa Sang, Khan and Dorn broing it up?

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>>51760460
I know it's a clichéd choice and that, but he's just such a magnificent bastard.

>>51760460
kharn, but I don't really liked named chars

>>51760508
The siege isn't for a few years yet.

>>51760451
I'm sorry morty, I want some but I want to foot slog all of my dudes

>>51759958
>have a higher chance to survive
But Hoplites can only shoot right before the charge. Peltasts may not even engage in close combat.
So they'll live. So they'll continue popping vehicles.
But Hoplites' 5++ and spears do look sexy. Dammit why must all the Mechanicum look so fucking sexy?

>>51760493
Don't care want pic

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>>51760460

Because he exactly what makes the IV legion awesome.

>>51760317
>>51760535
I know pure footslogging is a thematic thing, but I do feel a rhino for the plasma support squad would help. They're going to be priority target #1, especially with the warlord with them, so it may be worth keeping them safe in a metal box until they're in rapid fire range.

>>51760535
> not having a squad of out flanking vets with all Chem munitions suddenly appearing in the back lines to shred/snipe/ rape the enemies back line
You would have been purged on Isstvan III.

>>51760486
fucking fail

>>51760430
He doesn't become a combat monster, he has 4 powerfist attacks. Myrmidons are not anywhere near Grav Cents, they can't drop in and murder with no retaliation, they can't Ignore Cover with psychic bullshit and they can't shoot Turn 1 unless the opponent is an idiot and charges expensive units at their transport.

I'm beginning to think these players who think Mechanicum is broken have no idea how to play other than Spartan Primarch Deathstar fights, it's almost as if you had to avoid the slow, short-ranged and very dangerous things that cost a heap of points. Or shoot their 3+ faces, they take as many bolter shots to kill as a 9 man tactical squad who've lost their artificer sarge.

>>51759966
Word Bearers weren't top-tier before Inferno but they weren't far behind. So if they're now uncompetitive, so are most legions. In other words, suck it up and make your army. And we all need to apply peer pressure so TSons and SW players don't make the hardest lists they can. 40k used to be less competitive; we need to prevent the same change from happening here.

One of the big shifts in Inferno is that the legion special units are quite points-efficient. In the past you paid a lot for them and the AoD legions book only fixed a few of those (e.g. Justaerin). I'll be upset if the next red book doesn't tone the new ones down and maybe improve the older ones (not too much - I think it's important for generic units to remain attractive).

Or maybe the new OP units were written with the next rules edition in mind. Doubt it, but you never know.

Anyway, I rarely see Dreadclaws get shot down. That's what I'd use unless you're able to take multiple Land Raiders.

>>51760460
Ahriman. I'm a sucker for the whole 'road to hell is paved with good intentions' thing. I also like the parallels between Ahriman's relationship with Magnus, and Magnus's relationship with Big E, except Ahriman is the most human therefor the most relatable.

He also seems like a reasonable guy so I feel sorry for him and how it all turned out.

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>>51760476
>>51760550
Someone needs a shitty paintjob?
On it.

>>51760130
>>51760167
Zardu can join Vorbak and then pic his powers for the few buffs and combine with a handful from Lorgar. Otherwise the blade saves are ok, but not the best

>>51760317
In bigger points would want AA maybe, something to deal with deathstars or things in 2+. You have ML that can deal with blobs or 3+ and armor ok.

Also this is the second time in a week I've seen people miss the heavy support squads become non-compulsory troops with the reaping. That opens things up

>>51760317
Doesn't the reaping make the heavy support dudes troops? (and therefore scoring)

I'd try to squeeze in some Grave Wardens because they can stay back near the missile launchers and defend them from deep strikers while shooting. If the enemy's too far away and your backline isn't threatened, have them walk behind the tac squads. Consider the dropping the Vindicator and maybe the dread. They'll take a lot fire because you don't have many different things to attract anti-tank fire.

>>51760460
Argel Tal is a very tragic character, he has seen the truth and it is the greatest horror in the universe... I hope FW makes a nice mini for him and not another ugly Gal Vorbak

>>51760718
MAH MAN

>>51756868
Might Autek Mor be a survivor of a lost legion? The guy comes out of nowhere and is angry as fuck. They purge his legion, survivors are shunted wherever, he's pissed so he goes and executes the rogue leader of the Moragul clan and spends the rest of his days being a badass.

>>51760610
Y-you don't say that

>>51760579
>>51760811
>>51760817
Alright so if I want to do vehicles I should do several: would I be better off with 2 vindicators? Or should I try and get some plasma cannon squads if I want to keep it foot-slogging?

Not against dropping the dread, I just have one now and I'll probably use it at smaller point levels.
All I've bought so far is one 10-man tactical squad and a dread, so I'm open to modifying most of my list

Can I use 40k vindicators for my word bearers 30k army? The FW ones look retarded to me

How do you effectively use a mechanized lascannon heavy support squad?

I want to represent Sun Killers using the Hunter Killer Mission RoW for Shattered Legions. It doesn't make sense narratively to hole those guys up in a fortification, so mounting them in something is my other option to keep them standing vulnerably out in the open.

>>51761094
I wouldn't blame you, I'm in agreement: what the fuck is wrong with those dozer blades, goddamn.

In a more direct answer to your question: yes it is absolutely period appropriate. Mars-pattern Rhino chassis were extant during The Heresy. Resinfags can cry more.

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Sicaran Venator
Are they worth it? Is there a better Anti-Tank in the Heavy Support slot?
190pts for 1, or could run a Sicaran Battle Tank with sponson Lascannons for 205pts.

I already run a Contemptor Mortis with 2 Kheres and a Xiphon Pattern Interceptor for AA.

While I never see Super Heavy units at my FLGS, I do see lots of Av13 and 14; with a rare Spartan that deploys EC Palantine Blades.

>>51761127
Thank you brother. I use resin mk IV as they look really nice so money is not the biggest deal but those vindicators are just retarded

>>51761070
Having mobile scoring is also helpful, so having a rhino with tacs is never bad as your tacs can't run. having heavy support with heavy flamers and chem munitions is good anti infantry and ML are all around good choices. Anti tank is a personal choice of you want tanks, dreads, or something else to handle it

>>51761131
People say it's great because it can "stunlock" Titans.
It can theoretically pop Spartans, but I'm not convinced it's a more worthwhile investment than a larger number of shots with weapons that are no less effective against anything weaker than a flare-shielded Spartan.

>>51761200
Yeah, I don't like them.
I have two but I don't think I'll field them except as "spares": one a crazed melee cortus, the other a kheres mortis.

I've been trying to come up with a use for my SoS from the Prospero boxset and I think I got it. I plan to use breachers with my SW, get some sweet Viking shield wall action going.

That's when I remembered sheildmaidens were a thing. So I was wondering if anybody had boarding shields and some sisters around to tell me how they compare sizewise. If they're to big what do you guys think would be a good alternative? Puppets of war have nice Norse shields, but I think they'd be about the same size.

>>51761254
No

>>51761254
I think it's a cool idea even though I hate your legion. Post progress if you end up doing it

>>51761131
>>51761239
See, that is my thought process as well.
2x S10 shots vs a Flair Shielded Spartan though, needs 5s to glance and 6s to Pen. Sure its Ap1, but the Arachnus Heavy Lascannon Battery on a Deredeo for 235pts looks like it would be better at tank hunting, and can double up as AA if needed while having BS5 and a 5++.

>>51761355
But Deredeo is fucking ugly and Sicarian venator looks kinda cool. That's it

>>51761313
Well, that's about as helpful as can be.

No as in the idea is stupid? Or no as in I can't help you? You gotta give me something.

>>51761346
I haven't a camera, so it'll be shitty phone posts. But I like this idea, the less wolf the better.

>>51761399
Sicaran is a bigger footprint, while cheaper though.

Sicarans should also not pack sponsons, cause Ordnance means you will rarely want the HBs over the main gun.

>>51759106
No, it doesn't include consuls. That's why Burning Lore is available to Praetors, Centurions, Diabolists and Chaplains, but not to Masters of Signals or Vigilators.

I'm onto your tricks, preacher boi

>>51757568
I lost sight of that project as it built on, but I'm glad that's still a part of it. Nice to see my input remains.
As for the whole missing legions thing, both of those rumors are false. The Space Wolves were not involved, and the Ultramarines Legion did not swell. The former was referencing Russ's misguided attempts to get Angron back into the fold, and the latter was just a couple randos commenting on unfounded rumors.

In both cases, ADB has clarified they're bull shit in BL writing.

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>>51760401
LITERAL CANCER REMOVE REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>51761046
Automata Technologyl Death is most certainly from the Iron Hands. Unless he changed his name. Which Iron Hands have been known to do.

>>51761577

The problem is that something has to have happened. They didn't just vanish. Logic and common sense has to apply. And the disappearance of two Legions would have left a Mark. The Legion or fighting force that did kill them would suffer a massive and noticeable drop in numbers that could not be hidden.

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Attempting to make the BaC Contemptor some Alpha legion iconography. Envisioned the three reptilian heads on the front to be kind of moulded bas-relief, but I can't sculpt.

Shit or no? Also no I have not trimmed mouldlines or last bits of sprue yet

>>51761897
Or filled gaps. All will be done. Just fucking around with chain and stuff for now.

How useful/useless are flakk missiles?

>>51759668
I often wonder if people realize they sound autistic when they type out or actually say 'reeeeee.' I mean, it sounds ridiculous, it doesn't contribute to a conversation, it doesn't make people take you seriously. What purpose does it serve?

>>51761929
Not bad. Legs look cool for a BaC dreadnought. Three chains it's a bit excesive though. Maybe leave one or two idk

>>51761960
The purpose is actually to sound autistic

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>>51761875
>Automata Technologyl Death
The what?
Also, Autek is one of the original batch of IHs (meaning he's a classmate of Endryd Haar). If I didn't know the IH legion master is some Iron-me Amadeus, I'd claim Autek was the legion master since he had field command.

>>51761970
A side effect of positioning the left leg further back and the tip of the foot still being level with the plane of the sole of the underside of the second foot is that the left leg needs to be lowered slightly, maybe by about a milimetre. Hopefully not noticeable.

>>51761929
if you can turn the head to look the direction the model is going, it would be a 9/10

>>51761929
>>51761897
Shouldn't the top heads be pointing outwards, rather than inwards? At first I thought they were Gal Vorbak claws.

>>51762029
Yeah, that's unfortunate. I sort of imagining it turning and firing from the combi-bolter in mid-stride, but it's not a kit that's very conducive to dynamic posing.

>>51761437
You can make up for having to use the phone camera on your cameraphone with more light. Bright overhead light, another lamp at the same level as the minis, at a 45 degree angle in front of the mini 2-3 feet away (assuming you're taking the picture from up close, the lamp would be to your 4 or 8 o'clock). You want a slightly gray background because it's neutral in both color and darkness, but you also want white paper angled towards the mini to reflect overhead light towards it. Fold sheets of paper into triangular rolls to do that.

>>51761879
We don't know how early into the Crusade it happened. The EC were down to a couple hundred marines at one point, and somehow they were fairly large before Heresy time. For all we know they were 1,000 strong when culled. And there only hints that one of them was put down by the SW; the other may have disappeared in space, or suffered from something like the TS's flesh change, who knows.

>>51761879
Correct, but we will *never* know. We will get hints, but by the virtue of GW's stance on the Missing Legions, we can always guarantee that the hints are false.

So yes, something happened to them. But none of the hints that have been dropped over the years have any truth to them, unless you want to accept it as a headcanon.

My own personal headcanon is what I offered to Athrawes, who incorporated it.

>>51756396
>>HONESTLY, YOU'LL KNOW LESS ABOUT HOW THESE RULES WORK AFTER READING THEM THAN YOU DO NOW


Before, it said not to expect further scans.

Has something changed?

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>>51761879
>The Legion or fighting force that did kill them would suffer a massive and noticeable drop in numbers that could not be hidden.
What if both the SW and 11th were tasked with destroying the IIth, but 11th suffered so many casualties and lost their Primarch, so they were absorbed by the Ultramarines.
The SW is the Emperor's ExecutionerS, as in plural. Russ will carry 11th's burden now.

>>51762227
Thats not bad.

>>51761998
Great success.

>tfw no Curzefag Shitposting House on the /hhg/ map
You done goofed

>>51761879
>The Legion or fighting force that did kill them would suffer a massive and noticeable drop in numbers that could not be hidden.
This is why the more conventional (but maybe boring?) answer is that the legions lost, teutoburg style, and the emperor scrubbed them for the record for their failures.

>>51760485

Fortify your position.

Yah know. I think it's pretty Damon stupid forgeworld doesn't sell just a bundle of plain boarding shields. Unless I'm just stupid, and can't seem to find it.

>>51762615
Son...I don't know how to tell you this
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Space-Marine-Boarding-Assault-Upgrade-Set
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-DE/Legion-MKIII-Breacher-Siege-Squad?_requestid=1468244

>>51762011
Except there are claims his geneseed isn't what it should be.
He's probably not a thunder warrior, but he could be a missing legionary.

>>51762158
Someone posted a cheap-ass book scanner for Scananon and he'll do it.

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Would you let me field this as my Predator Executioner?

>>51762734
Once the turret's painted, absolutely. Aesthetically I like the Deimos-pattern look a lot more, but that isn't relevant. Mars-pattern stuff was officially around and the weapon actually looks better than the FW model's.

I like the paintjob on the hull.

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>>51762690
I don't know.
Typhon is sort of the same species as Mortarion's former dad
The RG made chymeriae of their own
Sanguinius was legit scared of being subjected to a Damnatio memoriae
Without Tzeentch's help, the XVth was dying on its own.
Non-Fenrisians cannot become Space Wolves
DG and Sallie resilience is beyond what's considered "normal" even for astartes

We have monsters of our own, anon, and the galaxy does right in fearing us.

>>51762734
yes

>using the "snap city" sponsons

>>51756450
I had picture him more as a scorpion than a spider. the two archeotech pistols are in the claws, and the photon thruster is in the stinger, and his torso comes up out where the head would be... kind of like The Rock when he turns into that weird CGI monster in The Mummy, but he'd have the scorpion arms and a separate set of scorpion arms (and I guess also machinator array arms too, SO MANY ARMS)

I'm used to playing historicals where EVERYTHING is already laid out for you. I know that there are 30k grogs too, but there is still way more room to maneuver and I love it.
>Loyalist Luna Wolves
>alright, I'll use the Reaver and Legion Command bits for my Praetor and buddies because they look good
>but I want Justaerin too, why wouldn't they be the bodyguard?
>well they're a Loyalist warband, and Justaerin would have been balls deep in treason, so clearly the Praetor doesn't trust them yet
>going to add SOH icons to many of the models only to poorly deface it, and have little bits of green here and there on their armor
On that note, would it be better to actually paint them as SOH and then add white over it, or just paint them as standard Luna Wolves and add green in areas they would probably miss? There's no time limit or anything, I just want it to look as good as the money I'm spending. Also is there anywhere I can get wolf pelts and shit, or do I have to sculpt that myself if i want it?

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>>51763026
I think I heard a rumour of him getting a scorpion body, but why would people associate him with a scorpion in the first place?
He's not House Malinax, those are merely the oathbounds, and they're Xana's, not his.

>>51762689
The second one I knew about. I don't need more marines. The first is what I swore I'd seen, but couldn't find again.

I own up. I'm a dumbass. It happens.

>>51763028
Sounds pretty cool, and I think SoH repainting their armor in the old LW scheme is better than making a Crusade-era force. You get to use all the later SoH bits and your army's presence on Heresy-era battlefields is less weird.

One crazy approach would be to paint them green, apply hairspray, paint white, then all the white over hairspray will rub right off. It's a technique model airplane guys use to have patchy paint with bare metal paint showing beneath (especially Japanese WWII planes, they had terrible paint).

But you could also paint them white, then paint green patches, then partially repaint over the edges of those patches. That's what I'd do instead of basically painting two armies.

Fur is murder, but I doubt your dudes would deny being murderers. They'll want 40k SW upgrade sprues and presumably-upcoming FW SW bits.

>>51761131
They're amazing for killing other medium tanks like Predators, Vindicators, Sicarans; less great for killing heavy transports like LRs, Spartans and Macrocarid Explorators; and very handy to have in someone in your meta has a shooty LoW like a Typhon or Fellblade variant. That massive blast ignores cover template doesn't mean shit if it never gets to fire. They'd also be great against a Knight Porphyrion, but since most knights have a melee focus with shooting on top they're a lot less useful against them.

If you're gonna run them, though, I think you have to run two of them for it to be reliable, which really eats into your HS slots. In Armoured Breakthrough I think they're great since you have a lot more freedom with those slots anyway, but in most lists I'm less sure it's a good idea.

Personally I don't really like the Lascannon sponsons on the normal Sicaran anymore now that the cost was increased. The main cannon is better at killing people than tanks unless it's shooting light armor like a Rhino. Since it has a hull-mounted Heavy Bolter as stock I think you're better off going full-dakka and doing sponson HBs plus a pintle HB for 12 S5 AP4 shots total - plus then you're really getting a lot of mileage out of it being a Fast Tank.

>>51763093
Turns out "scoria" is an actual word.
>1. a cindery, vesicular basaltic lava, typically having a frothy texture.
>2. slag separated from molten metal during smelting.

Anyway, the scorpion body thing was something FW said during an event panel when they were introducing Book 6.

>>51763103
I wish I had a more positive message for you, but I don't, so just don't sweat it.

>tfw just read thousand sons
Magnus why, also god fucking damn it wolves

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>>51763154
>Turns out "scoria" is an actual word.
No shit, Sherlock ;^)
You don't google everything FW feeds you? Everything has a theme
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scoria_(disambiguation)
Scoria is even a guy

>>51763126
Thanks for your advice on this.
I can run 2 of them, but I run a Kharybdis as my 3rd slot.
Is it 2 for Redundancy?
I still feel that despite the price increase, the Regular Sicaran is still pretty good, and the Lascannons are nice Anti-Tank and the Accelerator Autocannon is emergency AA.
Never thought of making it go full anti-infantry mode though, 12 HB shots and the 6xTLd S7 AP5 rending shots means I could just drown a squad in shots.

>>51762689
>MkIV breachers
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

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Does this trigger hhg?

>>51763093
>>51763154
Yeah, I had heard that bit from FW as well but the idea had popped into my head around the same time anyway just from reading the rules. The abeyant grants an extra attack, so it has to have some kind extra set of claws or arms. It has an extra gun (a fairly large one at that) and that weapon is fired in addition to all other weapons, so that implies another, larger appendage for the gun. It all just kind of comes together and makes sense to me. Stinger laser, big ass scorpion claws, big durable body (the fucker has 5 wounds when he's in that thing), etc.

As for Malinax only being the Knight House... well, I agree with that, but they've been painting more and more stuff in those colors because they're fucking cool, so I wouldn't be surprised if they just make that the main post-Scoria color scheme for Xana II.

I'm curious if they're having trouble figuring out how they're going to model him in a way that you can bring him with or without the abeyant, since reading the rules and using the example of the Magos Dominus model his abeyant seems like it was a more permanent addition to his body after he consolidated power on Xana II. Personally I wouldn't mind if they'd just push his model out as abeyant-only since it's not like anyone is going to run him without it... the entire point of putting him in a list is to have a fuck-off close combat monster and there's little reason to go half-way on that.

>>51763245
the sprue nubs do

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>>51763254
Oh, I'm sure most Abeyants are USB-plugged, not unlike Draykavac's. His is pretty much a crawler throne, the regular Dominus' is a set of crawler-lower body (which is my own headcanon for them), so I'm sure whatever Scoria gets, it'll be both cool and removeable.

Above all, I wonder why Scoria still wear a regular human face.
Not saying that face is actually his, but I was kind of hoping he wore a bitching hat or mask.

My favorite idea for the lost two primarchs is for one to have completely refused joining the crusade for moral reasons and the other to have already started his own galactic empire and refused to let the Emperor be his master.

In the former, the Primarch would say something along the lines of how wars of conquest are inherently evil, or that the Emperor could use peaceful methods to form His Imperium over the course of a few millennia (being immortal means he'd have the time), and the like. Maybe Emps kidnapped him Angron style, or better yet, maybe the Lost Primarch killed himself to avoid being part of something he thought was wrong, which later prompted the Emperor to abduct Angron so as not to lose "another one."
Then his legion was either disbanded or simply absorbed by the Ultras.
Or perhaps he did allow himself to join the crusade, but only did so in order to try and befriend his brothers so as to convince them to stop the warmongering. In this case, eventually the Emperor would have had to arrest him for dissent and sedition (however peaceful it may have been), eventually leading to Russ executing him.

For the latter, Lost Primarch 2's travel through the warp was even more wonky than most, and he actually ended up landing several decades, or centuries, before he was lost (time travel and all that). He did the usual thing of taking control of his own world, but since the Emperor hadn't launched his crusade yet, he had time to continue his conquests and eventually managed to create his own mini-empire.
By the time the Emperor reached him he was in full tyrant mode and would refuse to bow to any other conqueror, even if it was his father.
What happens from there could go in a few directions. Maybe he "joined" up in order to get his hands on a legion, but tried to turn them traitor too quickly and they exposed him.
Maybe he never joined and the Wolves and his own legion were forced to end him rightly.

>>51763245
In one of the BL books an outrider sergeant is using a regular bike while leading a squad of jetbikes, so I don't see an issue desu

>>51763235
You generally want to specialize units for one role. I like melta-vets in a dreadclaw for anti-tank, or attack bikes, or javelins. Conversion beamer predators are tempting just because they look so old-school sci-fi.

But yeah, two Venators is just in case the first one misses.

>>51763235
It's for redundancy and insurance against bad rolls. If you are in the situation where you really need to penetrate to prevent the target from firing one bad turn could mean game over. You did say there weren't a lot of LoWs in your meta, though, so if that's not a concern it may not be a big deal. Again, their main attraction is that they hard-counter the Typhon, but if no one uses a Typhon or any other giant-pie-plate-all-your-guys-are-dead LoW then it's not nearly as important and you might be better off with cheaper, less durable anti-tank.

If you have elites slots don't overlook Laser Rapiers. They're really, really cheap for what they do compared to similar tank destroyer vehicles, and artillery is arguably harder to destroy. The main problem there is that a mostly immobile unit and 36" range means that a 48" range tank could just stay back and keep hammering away, but if Spartans are the concern it's not a big deal.

Lastly, if you REALLY just need to fucking delete a Spartan before it can get too far, and you're okay with making reserve rolls (or have some form of reserve roll manipulation) then the Primaris-Lightning is probably the best pick. I think it's 230 points to set it up with one volley of four S8 AP1 Armourbane missiles + Strafing Run and Tank Hunter, but that WILL kill a Spartan almost every time. With the cost increase of the Spartan it's also an even better points trade, so even though it's basically dead weight after it fires the missiles you're way ahead in points and tactical game state as well.

>>51763366
>BL does mixed squads, with mixed (jet)bike patterns and armour
They're truly the worst.

>>51763386
On second thought I can't be certain he had the jetbikes in his squad, so take that with a grain of salt, bit I distinctly remember him remarking how how could take turns faster with tires and the jetbikes couldn't exactly keep up.

>>51763428
Slower vehicles, and especially the non-floaty ones have tighter turning radii, but grav can simply outrun fucking everything, as well as deepstrike by slowing their falling speed to surviveable levels.
Give and take, you see.

So my Thousand Sons got posted by someone else last thread.
Contrary to what they said, it is all WIP. I'm blocking out colors before going back and making them nice.
I'm really not sure how I feel about this.

>>51763547
The ones with the white trim?

File: 20170216_212621.jpg (4MB, 5312x2988px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 5312x2988px

>>51763600
Yeah.
For reference here's a later stage. Still shit in progress, but at least it's closer than what anon said was my final product.

File: mkeks.png (176KB, 358x310px) Image search: [Google]

176KB, 358x310px

>>51763624
weird that someone would bother to do that. desu i don't think the white works at this stage, you got a finished one?

Anyways Kill some space wolves anon. And look like pic related when you do.

File: fuck.png (5MB, 1772x1080px) Image search: [Google]

5MB, 1772x1080px

>>51762851

What would you need to save these Iron Hands?

File: 20170216_214018.jpg (5MB, 5312x2988px) Image search: [Google]

5MB, 5312x2988px

>>51763685
These two are the closest, but I need to figure out how to get some depth into that white without losing the contrast.
I tend to build up my whites from brown or bone, but there's not really room on mkIV pauldrons. Advice is appreciated.
Will do.

File: flipped.jpg (879KB, 2000x1125px) Image search: [Google]

879KB, 2000x1125px

>>51763826
white can be a bitch. maybe someone good at painting can tell you

What is the argument for Sekhmet going mostly power axe over mostly power fist? Just saving up on points? They're the most likely to face down a Death Star, anyway.

>>51762361
>implying you're relevant anymore.
>implying you ever were.

>>51762011
>Automata Technology Death
His name, it's like Crysos Morturg, or Bion Henricos, it's a play on the inspiration behind the character. Not really important, but it's about as IH a name as they come.

>>51763989
The thread image is alright. But space wolves get bullied more than WB.

ignore namefags

>>51764043
So, Morturg is Death Chrysalis, and Bion is Bionic Enrique?
>Autist Mor :^)

>>51763547
>>51763624
>>51763876

I mean, these are shit all over.
>Colours outside where they should be.
>White paint droplets all over the place for some reason.
>Zero depth for every colour.
>Thick paints.
>Bad metallic coverage.

You can say whatever you want, but you can't deny you're not a good painter.

>>51763939
It's force axe so you can charge the weapons up for instant death.

People are taking chain fist so they can karate chop tanks and dreadnoughts

>>51763547
>>51763685
Someone did that with me as well, answered a question and everything. But it wasn't annoying, just odd. Mind you my guys look a little better.

>>51764121
Maybe LARPing that they have minis.

>>51764064
>muh awoo prosecution.

I would've defended the yiffers, but really, as time goes on, they have proven time and time how shitty, idiotic and WAACfag players they all are. So far I haven't seen a post by them that is not cringy, retarded, whiny or trying to bend the rules in their favour.

Euthanize all woofs! #mhhga

>>51764142
You misunderstand
Remove awoo

The image does not acknowledge our bullying of the yiffs.
No one even cares about turd bearers. Just Erebus

>>51764089
Nah, they're just really fucking glossy and my camera goes nuts with it. I coated them with blood for the blood god because I wanted them to be gloss. They're shit, but I'd like to be criticized for shit that I've actually done.

>>51763826
>>51764089
harsh but true. Thin paints. Multiple thin coats. If done in one coat its too thick. Pray at the altar of duncan. And take more time. You also picked one of the most detail heavy marine models there are.

>>51764205
Also wash gold and highlight. Wash white and highlight.

>>51763240
UM praetorians would like a word.

>>51764279
And IF players would like an official Dorn model considering even Mortarion got one, but nobody gets what they want.

>>51763513
Which is funny since bikes are definitely assault units whiles the jetbikes are gun toting skirmishers

>>51764336
Eh, I don't think too highly of a unit that has to buy their sarge.
At least command squad bike/jetbike squads can all have power weapons