/5eg/ - Fifth Edition General

Is it viable to go single class samurai fighter?

>>51735480
Yes. It's 5e. Everything is viable.

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Napkin math.

Anons? Simple query: I know the DMG has rules for Blackrazor, Wave and Whelm, but do you think it'd be possible to update Frostrazor to 5e too?

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Frostrazor

The lore wizard is everything I wanted in a wizard flavor wise. Idc if it ends up OP or not it's perfect mechanics for portraying someone who has studied the very stuff of magic

>>51735495

>everything

Eeeeh.

>>51735495
You filthy liar.

>>51735500
So what's the best choice here? Warlock 5 Stone Sorcerer 15 sounds pretty tough.

Reposting because Chrono Trigger
>>51734656
Remember that not everything actually contributed to a dual or triple tech. Some were gained early (Aura Whirl and Triple Raid) while others came later (Double Bomb and Omega Flare). Each character combination would only ever get 3 dual techs with each other character and 1 triple tech (if even)

I would have the players designate a specific action/maneuver/spell that they'd be willing to create a tech with, and pair it with another player. 2-3 Dual techs with each, one triple tech per unique pairing (assuming you have more than 3 players). Let them spend some time to create something interesting that you can approve, and then let them go ham. Many dual/triple techs weren't actually more damage than just having the characters attack alone so you don't need to put too many restrictions on their use. One of the actions is considered the "Base" while the other action(s) augment. So lets say you're combining a Battlemaster's Sweeping Attack with Sorcerer's Firebolt. The Sweeping Attack is the base action, and the Firebolt augments. The Sweeping Attack deals damage as normal, and the Firebolt's damage is added onto the Sweeping Attack minus the damage dice (CHA to damage, additional Fire damage, etc but not the Firebolt's d10s). Now you have a burstier, fiery Sweeping Attack with more utility, but your cost is two player's actions and less total damage (just like CT itself). I'd look at the new UA Lore Wizard's spell augmentation for a rough guideline for Tech creation. Change damage type once, change area of effect/range/etc once.

Another game that tried to use multi-player combos was Guild Wars 2. They aren't overly fantastic, but they needed to be MMO friendly. If you want ad hoc combos, you could look into GW2's system for inspiration as its pretty good for the ad hoc style. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo

>>51735547
I play a monk. I enjoy playing as a monk. I am doing good in the game as a monk.

COME AT ME VILLAIN

>there will never be a 5e Spelljammer campaign book

>>51735585
A monk is very viable

Does the Stone Sorcerer's AC with Stone Durability include DEX? In other words, is it 13+CON+DEX or only 13+CON?

>>51735605
Good riddance. We might get an Eberron campaign book, though, since we're getting artificers and...

Hold on, Raven Queen isn't an Eberron deity?

>>51735660
No, just 13 + con.

>>51735660
No. It change how your AC calculate. It's 13+CON now. No DEX.

There is a sageadvice on it.

>>51735660
Why do people keep asking this question? People want to LOLSTACK AC Since PHB (with mage armor, monk and barbarian).

The answer will still be the same no matter what.

>>51735665
I thought she was a Points of Light deity.

>>51735698
I guess I must have confused her with Vol. I don't play official settings.

>>51735566
The best choice depends on what level you start at, and what level you'll reach in good time. If your game ends at 5 then straight Warlock is probably the best. If it ends at 8-9 then Warlock 5, Fullcaster 3 has a smoother progression of power than Warlock 3, Fullcaster 6 (one that has Extra Attack at 6 like Valor Bard, or Bladesinger). If it'll go even further than that then Warlock 3, Fullcaster X probably has the most power, but I think the higher level you start to go the more you want to be a Wizard bending reality, and putting people in mazes while you retire to your magical mansion with 100 ghost maids.

>>51735544
It's definitely way more powerful than the other traditions, but I love it.

Also wizards should have always had expertise in arcana, as if a fucking rogue knows more about magic than a wizard.

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What are good spells for a level 3 Deep Stalker Conclave archer ranger?

I already have Disguise Self (free), Goodberry, and Hunter's Mark.

If I want to use a spell for combat, it will be Hunter's Mark.

What should my final spell be? I was considering Speak with Animals, because I could use Primeval Awareness to get the gist of an animal's mood, then cast Speak with Animals for finer details.

This will be a wilderness exploration campaign.

Whats the best time to start introducing +2 weapons/armor to the story. PCs currently at level 9

>>51735665
>>51735698
She's a Points of Light/Dawn War deity. In Eberron she might have a palace on Dolurrh but she probably wouldn't have deity levels of power due to how the setting treats gods.

Hell, she could even be treated as a particularly old and powerful dragon who hates the undead and often takes the form of a raven.

>>51735753
You're not going to just give them literal +2, no fluff weapons, right? Also there's no magic item balance, just fit the game to the power you want them to have at a given moment.

I have a mirror of Truesight and I keep trying to use it at every opportunity. Looking at doors, objects, people, etc..
I've been playing it off that I'm very vain and I'm looking at myself in the mirror, I'm an elf so it works.
I have yet to see anything weird in the mirror. The only real use I've got out of it is looking under the door of the room the party rogue is in to get recon on trying to steal the cursed amulet that is driving him insane.
Do you guys know of some stuff in particular that I should be examining?
The DM gave it to me for a reason, right?

>>51735769
When I mean introduce I meant the possibility of finding one. I dont intent on giving them stuff for free

>>51735682
Especially stupid because no GM would just ignore it.

At worst, the GM just adds a certain amount of PB to all enemies so they can still hit you, which means your friends will likely be hit all the god damn time.

At best, he decides the encounters are too easy, and throws bigger and more dangerous stuff at you, AGAIN to the detriment of the rest of the party.

You can't win. You are fucking it over, no matter what you do. No GM would just let you be an invincible dude.

This isn't like the "I want +20 to sneak" or some other skills - skills are fine being good at, because they make you good in certain niche situations.

Being hit on a 18+ by most common enemies, will break a very core and central part of the game.

Be happy that they hardcapped AC like this.

>>51735749
I think Speak With Animals would be a bit redundant.

Anyone compiled those maps from the prrvious threads?

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While the glaring disparities between martials and casters have certainly shrunk since the days of 3.PF, I'm still inclined to give martials buffs. What if when Fighters gained Indomitable at 9th level, they could choose one of three effects?

>Before rolling for a saving throw, you may choose instead to succeed on that saving throw.
>Until the end of your next turn, before making an attack roll, you may instead declare that attack to be a critical hit.
>You may gain advantage on all ability checks for one minute.

Just off the top of my head. Has this actually broken anything?

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>>51735789

Probably not. But I've been posting them all day, so hopefully someone was working on it.

>>51735801
How about just declare the attack to be a hit?

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>>51735801
Making martials stronger in combat isn't the reason for Caster-Martial Disparity. Fighters are already far far better in combat than casters.

The primary source of Caster-Martial Disparity is that casters are still far more versatile OUTSIDE of combat. The amount of spells that outright replace skills entirely or can end encounters/skill checks/obstacles with almost zero effort is where the disparity comes from. Teleporting past obstacles, using invisibility in place of stealth, using charm magic in place of having to persuade or earn someones trust, ect.

>>51735801
Martials don't need combat buffs. They are universally great in combat. They deal loads of damage, and when they don't have they have defensive, mobility, or utility options in combat to make up for it.

It's out of combat where they need some help. Let barbarians move house-sized boulders, let fighters cross huge gaps and climb sheer cliffs, let monks dash on raindrops, let rogues smoothtalk their way through impossible situations. Be lenient when they want to do cool shit.

>>51735849
To be fair, 5e at least tells you in most Charm Spells that people will realise afterwards mind rape happened and will be angry.

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>>51735801
Stop.

How do Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade interact with Eldritch Knights above 7th? Do they get a free bonus action attack off of using it?

>>51735895
>When you use your action to cast a cantrip.
You used your action to cast a cantrip.

>>51735908
That's unbelievably dope.

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>>51735882
Where exactly does it say this? The "Friends" cantrip appears to be the only one the explicitly states this.

I seem to remember reading something about the rules regarding squeezing.

Can someone tell me where to find that or that I'm insane?

>>51735566
>Hexblade Blade/Stone sorcerrer
>Hexblade lvl 1 ability allows you to use Cha for attack and damage rolls with your weapon.
>Stone sorcerrer gives you extra Hp, proficiencies and a Con based unarmoured feature that works with shields.

All achievable in a lvl2 PC.
Delicious.

>>51735921
Charm person does as well

>>51735920
It's better than the Attack action for a few levels, yes.

>>51735895
You can't multiattack with it

>>51735895
The melee attack is part of casting the spell, yes, so you may make one melee attack when casting the spell.

That being said, since you're using your Action to cast a cantrip, you only make your melee attack once. You don't get the benefit of your Extra Attack feature like you would if you just melee attacked normally.

Huh, just realised Tabaxi have a climb speed. I've been looking for more ways to get it on characters because I love it.

I'm playing either a Tabaxi Swashbuckler or Deepstalker next. What do people think?

Can I make my Unseen Servant stand in front of a doorway after we enter a room so that someone/something trying to sneak after us from behind would trip over or bump into it?

>>51735849
>>51735875
Also charm condition inly give you advantage on persuasion check. You still need to nake that check

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>>51735944
>>51735921

Best way to make use of this is using disguise. Can't hate you if they don't know you.

>>51735971
They can't trip over a shapeless force

>>51735971
I'd say so.

Hey /tg i was wondering can you cast a spell that doesn't generate a shiny stuff and require chanting to be cast silently? So no one can notice or are there rules that already discuss them? [Spoiler] i'm to lazy to re-read the PHB again [/spoiler]

>>51736011
Depend on the context. If there is a somatic or material component, some people will see you doing weird gesture while casting.

>>51736000
They can get force applied to their foot.

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>>51736011
>>51736011

Play Sorcerer.

>>51736011
You have to do the components listed on the spell unless you are a sorcerer with subtle spell.

>>51736011
Friendly, hightlight + ctrl-S reminder

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So I've been reading through the Lost Mines of Phandelver starter set I'm going to run (total noob GM here) and it seems fine. But when the players get to Cragmaw Castle, the main villains, if alerted, can hold an npc hostage and they will kill him if the pc's don't back off.
Thing is, when my players inevitably get into this hostage situation, I have no idea how to resolve it. Would the players just have to leave? Is there any way to keep the hostage alive?

>>51736187
Hostage takers have a goal. If their entire goal is "go away", they'll never release them. Otherwise, let them give the PCs a task to complete.

My character needs to get revenge on a sort of BBEG (who isn't evil, just opposed to my character specifically).

He's a criminal mastermind, and he stole all my character's stuff, but may potentially treat him cordially and be willing to meet.

Now, I have explosives in one of the safe houses he manages, but he probably won't come to the house. I could find out where he conducts some of his operations, but I won't necessarily be able to sabotage it in advance.

How can I lure him into a trap and blow him up?

>>51736122
the capitalization means its probably a phone

So, as a guy who's playing an Undying Warlock, I'm rather annoyed they got no new invocations, while the Seeker which is unofficial did. As such, I tried my hand at homebrewing a few equivalents (one that only requires Undying Patron, Pact of Blade one, Eldritch Blast one, etc) and would like some reviews from /tg/.

Reaper's Gaze
Prerequisites: Undying Patron, Eldritch Blast Cantrip
Your patron teaches you how to infuse negative energy into your Eldritch Blast attacks. A creature hit by your Eldritch Blast must make a Constitution saving throw against your spell save DC. If it fails, it has disadvantage on all saving throws until the end of your next turn or you use Eldritch Blast on a different target. If it succeeds on the throw, it is immune to the effect for the next 24 hours.

>>51736269
Bloodrinker Axe
Prerequisites: Pact of the Blade, Undying Patron
When you create your Pact weapon, you can have it take the form of a Battleaxe with a handle of monster bones. If you wield it two handed, you deal critical hits on a 19 or 20. When you make an attack with it, you can expend a spell slot to deal an extra 2d8 Necrotic damage per spell level and you gain temporary hit points equal to half the damage dealt.

>>51736303
Using warlock spell slots?
Why would you steal what little the class has?

Map Anon, I appreciate your generosity.

>>51736303
Face of Death
Prerequisites: Pact of the Undying
You gain advantage on all Constitution checks, due to your unnatural unlige.

>>51736269
In terms of balance by itself, I think it's alright. But compared to the other ones we got in the UA, it's definitely the strongest.

>>51736303
Likewise. I'd say ditch the critical ability - that's more in line with the Hexblade abilities. The Pact Weapon abilities on offer are more "slow movement", "knock prone", "give health". And each of them only has one ability, not two.

>>51735728
Are there many people who play the super low levels, outside adventure paths and al?

We always start at 6 or higher, often 8. Admittedly it's a hold over policy from when we played 3.5 and Pathfinder.

Is there something new and enjoyable about rusty dagger shank town in 5e?

What's the verdict on all of the UAs released to date?

Going to play a level 3 loremaster wizard hobgoblin. Any advice on how to build it? I haven't played a wizard before.

>>51735572
Disgaea has multitech of a sort. Likely easier to implement than the Chrono trigger style.

>>51735605
There's not even a proper forgotten realms book in 5e. Just a half assed sword coast gazette.

I don't think they're going to scratch anybody's setting itches any time soon.

>>51736361
All of it? Some is good, some is bad, Wizards get unfair favouritism, Rogues have got some alright stuff, Warlocks finally have something worthwhile, Rangers have been fixed, Sorcerers have been fucked over constantly.

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>>51736187
DMing is all about having the correct balance of metagame, and internal consistency. A game that only has internal consistency isn't tailored to the people sitting at the table at all, and will lead to players being forced into unfun situations in the name of logic. A game that only has the metagame has no substance, and fails to provide a grounded world that is meant to be navigated.

Sometimes you need to let the hostage takers be intimidated by the barbarian when everyone gets excited, and he rolls a 19 on the die. Sometimes, if you as a DM, not the book, actually believe that the hostage takers would kill the hostage, then you do so, despite clashing with the player's expectations. The decision on when you favor the player's expectations is based upon numerous things. Did you warn them that their intimidation check could trigger the kill? Do you often rule in favor of your expectations over theirs, and have you done so a lot recently? Is this moment important to them? Would ruling in their favor make the world feel less real? How do players react when their 'great plans' fail? Are you communicating enough for them to understand why their expectations and yours could differ?

It's usually simplified to "Always say yes." or "Yes, but" or whatever, but if the game would be superior with a Barbarian winning the intimidation check, maybe the hostage takers were cowards all along, and you warp the world to match the players. Or you put your foot down, just be sure it doesn't make the game significantly less fun for a pedantic issue.

>>51736221
Since one of them plans to kill the npc anyway, I imagine I could get them to fight each other of the hostage holder tries to ransom his captive to the party...

On a scale of "Way of Four Elements"/10 how good's Sun Soul Monk?

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>>51736329

No problemo. I've been working on a collection since I started using Roll20. It's tricky to find good maps, so I like the share.

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>>51735822
I'd certainly hope they can hit the thing reliably enough without the help of a 1/day ability.

>>51735849
>>51735875
Fair enough. Without much consideration, I figured Indomitable could be a feature that actually let Fighters "just do the thing" every once in a while.

But it's true, spells have historically been shortcuts to whatever more difficult, mundane solution there is to any given problem, and while it's much better in 5e, it's far from fixed. However, I've seen what happens when people try really hard to fix it, at least in 3.5e, and it's usually a lot of time and effort, really messy, and doesn't actually fix the problem.

That all being said, I could certainly see how simply letting physically-based characters have some leeway to perform cool shit beyond the mundane limitations of skill checks would go a long way. I just like the idea of having some mechanics to more clearly adjudicate that kind of thing.

>>51735893
Make me, tall man. Better yet, do you actually have an opinion?

>>51735782
I had a friend who built a Pathfinder character that could only get hit by CR+2 enemies on a nat20, an his saves were high enough that he passed the typical DCs on a 4+.

He showed me the build.

He did fuck all else, and it would take him 8 rounds to kill what anyone else could kill in 2, but he would win very consistently.

I was very glad when he decided it would make the game too much of a slog and decided not to try to get me to let him play it.

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>>51736422
I should probably contribute myself.

>>51736445
Are these maps going anywhere, yet?

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>>51735785

Speak with Animals would give me full conversations.

What should I take in place of Speak with Animals, then?

>>51736439
The problem with letting martials do cool things is that for the most part it doesn't make sense. Why should a fighter be able to blink through a smog of deadly acidic poison? Why should a barbarian be able to summon a bunch of maids out of literally nowhere to maintain a cool mansion also summoned out of literally nowhere? Why should a monk be able to scry shit a thousand miles away?
You could make them to cool shit normally but the entire point of magic, for the most part, was always to do things that aren't normally possible or easy even with high stats and do it stylishly. At some point there's no functional difference between a boosted monk who can run on air and a wizard casting overland flight, both are basically magic.

>>51736400
Pretty good. Less good than open hand but definatelt better than Wot4E. Just compare their Burning hand. Sun soul use less ki and can do it as a bonus action.

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>>51736445
The thumbnail of this thing made me think I was looking at some kind of ugly rat.

>>51736484
Why are you just grabbing wizard spells and bolting them onto non wizard things? When somebody says "cool things" it should be things that are in theme with the characters doing them.

A fighter who can cut through spells, or castle walls with ease. A barbarian who can jump like Hulk. A monk... you know what, a monk meditating to have his spirit leave his body to do recon/scry is fine, I like that.

>>51736484

>Why should a monk be able to scry shit a thousand miles away?

Because he is in tune with the world about him? Seriously, that's not even a weird effect for a Wuxia guy.

What's the panacea that will fix sorcerers that isn't straight up deletion?

>>51736391
When will WotC rename themselves to Sorcerers of the Coast?

>>51736541
>>51736545
Because
>fighter who can cut through spells
If a fighter can cut the "coldness" out of Cone of Cold I'd rather call him a magic knight.
>who can jump like hulk
That wouldn't be that useful outside of combat except to bypass climb or certain dex checks.
>monk
Okay I fucked up with that one, you're right.

My point is that at some point they just become basically anime characters (which they are to a point already, a level 12 fighter can blow through a regiment of level 1s), and the thing about anime characters is that even the fighters are basically mages.

How is 5e and how does it play from an outside perspective? With none of the baggage surrounding it please.

>>51736574
5e is pretty good.

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>>51736445

I like it. Gonna save it. Looks like it could be altered to make a neat underwater map.

>>51736464

Not sure.

>>51736627
What assets d you use, mapbro?

last thread someone asked if they should allow an Artificer Wizard over the Artificer class
is it just me or is that a moot question? i mean one is its own class with its own features and rules and the other is a wizard with some extra features.
one doesn't really supersede the other, they can both function side by side without much redundancy.
i mean if you really need to you can change the name of the wizard class and thats all it'd really take.
call it Spell Binder or something like that

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>>51736641

Google, and lots of searching. I don't actually make the maps, silly anon.

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I have a question about Stone Sorcerer.
If I were to pick up the Twinned Spell metamagic feat, would I be able to cleave in melee using the Smite spells?

So, who here is looking forward to Tales from the Yawning Maw? What dungeon are you may eager for? I'm pretty excited for an official White Plume Mountain update, myself.

>>51736814
Twinned doesn't work on spells that have a range of self. Smites have a range of self.

>>51736837
What if I twin a Booming Blade after using a Smite as a bonus action? Would the Smite strike both targets hit by Booming Blade or just one?

>>51736591
In what ways?

>>51736828
White Plume Mountain's good, be fun playing as a Hexblade through it.

Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan and Sunless Citadel are both ones that I've wanted to play but never had a chance so I'm excited for that.

Of course I'm going to run a Tomb of Horrors game on the first day it's out. No one else in my group's ever played it but they've heard the stories.

>>51736858
Oh man, throwing new players through the tomb. Gonna be great.

>>51736852
Smite is lost after it takes effect on a target, so whatever target you hit first would take the Smite. The second target would be unaffected by Smite.

>>51736863
Hopefully they don't just put a "Passive Perception of 15 to figure out everything in this room will fuck you up". Kinda hope they write it a big more in the old school way but I can live with either.

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>>51736868
Gotcha, anon. Trying to make a Shaman from Warcraft without homebrewing shit and Stone Sorcerer seems the way to go. Thanks!

>>51736566
>which they are to a point already, a level 12 fighter can blow through a regiment of level 1s

That's exactly the problem.

You can fight 50 orcs easy at level 20 as a fighter, but a fucking castle gate will still stop you cold.

Why is it okay to be anime when killing people and being hurt, but drop back to being a mundane scrub the moment you are not swinging a sword around?

Glamour Bard, Illusionist Wizard or a Hexblade? My Dragon Sorcerer just found out that Poison resistance doesn't help much with d6 hit dice and an angry Green Dragon you might be related to.

>>51736893
>to be anime
Killing lots of enemy soldiers is specifically an anime thing now?

>>51736893
A castle gate is not the same level of difficulty as a bunch of orcs. A castle gate is meant to stop an entire army and hold off battering rams for a while
A level 20 should still be able to because a level 20 is basically a demigod.

>>51736905
Going full DW and killing a dozen with each swing probably is.

>>51736905
I use the phrasing the post I quoted used.

So does the new invocation:

Improved Pact Weapon
Prerequisite: 5th level, Pact of the Blade feature Any weapon you create using your Pact of the Blade feature is a +1 weapon. This invocation doesn’t affect a magic weapon you transformed
into your pact weapon.

Stack withThe New Pact of the Blade weapon pacts (Moonbringer/Moonbow/etc)?

>>51735534
God, thank you for reminding me of how nearly all stock WoL items are unusable garbage.

>>51736915
>A level 20 should still be able to because a level 20 is basically a demigod.

Well, he still doesn't gain anything to support this, I'm pretty sure.

>>51735605
>There will never be an x 5e campaign book.

There ya go.

On the other hand, SJ hardly needs anything new. You can find nice plans/battlemaps for nearly all of the ships, and umber hulks, neogi, mind flayers, and beholders and beholder-kin are already in. I may very well run a 3e and/or 5e game with SJ as a backdrop for at least some of it, the spelljamming ships make great dungeons.

Additionally, ship to ship combat is largely pointless in SJ, as what you really want to do is simply go in, board it, kill all the level 0 plebs, and loot the 100k to 500k helms.

>>51736958
How much HP does a castle gate actually have?

>>51736930
Yes it stacks, the ultrapact weapons aren't called magic weapons

>>51735801
The only real weakness martials have is a lack of interesting out of combat stuff to do aside from weak skills (same problem for all of the game's history) and against mind fuckery.

On the other hand, the biggest asset of being an elf, being a berserker, paladin oath choice, etc., could be viewed as protection against mind fuckery. Its already important in the game.

>>51735782
my bladesinger wizard has 32 AC with haste shield

>>51736999
About 999 hp

What do you think about attuning to magic items?

>>51737017
I'd probably just call in Rule 0 and let the Barbarian charge through it, the Monk jump over it, the Fighter cut it in half, and the Wizard transmute it into helium.

>>51735849
Charm magic does not do ANYTHING to replace social interaction or social skills. Unless you're an enchanter of the appropriate level, don't even DREAM of trying to use charm effects in social situation.

>invisibility in place of stealth
Well that's good for sneaking ONCE until you get somewhere. Invisibility is the proper power level.

Teleport is nice but it doesn't step on anyone's toes in any way.

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>>51737045
>Not playing a sorcerer with subtle spell and using Charm magic in all the situations ever
>Not being like "Prove it bro, I got a dozen witnesses who said I didn't do nothin." when they call you out on it.
>Not being able to get away with it because you're a Charisma Caster with high Charisma

I swear it's like the ONE fucking thing Sorcerers are actually better at than Wizards in 5e.

>>51736893
>but a fucking castle gate will still stop you cold.

Good.

>>51737061
They still know they are being charmed according to the spell itself. If they aren't idiot they can figure out who charm them.

Charisma skill isn't mind control or modify memory.

>>51736893
>Why is it okay to be anime when killing people and being hurt

Because its not anime?

>kill 1.5 thugs a round
>OMFG THIS IS WEEABOO

No.

D&D is largely an Appendix N simulator, not a derpy herp derp lala land SHIT ON MY BATTLEMAP UP SENPAI simulator.

>>51736999
It's just a multiple section of large resilent object according to the rule. So 27hp multiple times? Artificer Alchemist will grt through it pretty fast though.

>>51737074
It doesn't matter if they "know" after they've already done a favor for you and served their purpose, they can't press charges because they have no way of proving it. At most you won't be able to charm them again.

>>51737033
Notice how the wizard actually has a spell to do that (I think), and doesn't have to ask you to rule 0.

>>51737081
>Because its not anime?
Anon a level 20 anything is able to shitstomp a nearly arbitrary number of level 1s a turn.

>>51737074
Yes, but the fact they still agreed to whatever you asked and you have witnesses who didn't see you cast anything because of subtle spell.

>"Oh, I charmed you huh? Are you sure you're not just making shit up because you regret our agreement now? Prove I did anything, because I have a dozen witnesses who said I didn't."

You know... actual roleplaying.

>>51736915
>A level 20 should still be able to because a level 20 is basically a demigod.

No, a level 20 guy is basically a CR 8-12 dude, not a demigod. An empyreal (CR 23) is a demigod. An archmage is only CR 12 because they are great at blowing up low level parties.

Looking over the list, only a few such creatures can directly siege a castle -- some giants, treants, etc. Blowing through fortifications is not at all a given.

>>51737006
>>51736930
Correct, but for the wrong reason. It specifies that it
>Any weapon you create using your Pact of the Blade feature
>You can create a black, lead flail using your Pact of the Blade feature
>This invocation doesn’t affect a magic weapon you transformed into your pact weapon

So you fulfill the requirement, its created with Pact of the Blade, and it isn't a magic weapon you TRANSFORMED into your pact weapon.

>>51736915
>Going full DW and killing a dozen with each swing probably is.

Which you can't do.

You can however use your one level 6 spell slot to maybe kill CR 1 foes at level 11 or your level 9 spell slot to maybe kill CR 4 foes at level 17.

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>>51736484
>>51736566

I, too, would agree that a Barbarian casting Magnificent Mansion would make no sense.

But consider the following: martials and casters do not occupy different universes. They are not judged by two different standards of realism. The universe they live in is one of gods and magic, heroes and legends. A Barbarian that goes on adventures and pushes themselves far beyond the limits of the ordinary person, and survives, is heroic. And the sorts of feats that heroes can perform can be utterly extraordinary. It does not need explanation, it doesn't have to be magic, and it's not anime. It's fantasy, and has been a part of fantasy for a very, very long time.

>>51737006
But is it just me or can't you use Hex Warrior in combination with Cursebringer, since it's two-handed.

>>51737100
Not really.

>>51736484
In a world where magic exists in forms beyond study, its not unreasonable to attribute "magical" effects to the greatest fighters in the world.

>>51737102
>>51737095

All that so you wouldn't have to use a skill, that you get nearly for free, and at the cost of using a daily resource + making an enemy.

In the very, very, very, very, very, VERY best case scenario, it in no way is a "replacement" of social skills.

>>51737121
>level 9 spell slot
Wail of the Banshee and Weird as long as they're close enough, Greater Shout, just fireballs, etc. etc.

>>51737128
I'm not using anime as an insult because it isn't, I'm just using it as a term for being fantasically powerful in relation to everyone else around them.

>>51737141
Well I have nothing against it, but most of the time other people get pissy about giving fighters fantasical powers because muh weebs. You know, ignoring western myths like Siegfried or Byrnhildr.

>>51737128
This isn't going to be moronic horseshit about Herakles, a demigod who has always been canonically unbelievably more powerful than any PC fighter, is it?

>first on list

Wow, its garbage.

What are some good multiclass options for monks?

>>51737144
>I am uncreative so the way you play the game is badwrongfun. Let me bullshit reasons why it wouldn't work.

OK.jpg

>>51737111
>a level 20 guy is basically a CR 8-12 dude
Not him but I really fucking doubt a level 20 is a good encounter for a party of level 10s. Like how do level 10s deal with Time Stop or Implosion or just the superb amount of actions a monk gets each turn?

>>51735801
What about expertise in a STR/DEX skill of choice?
It's a small thing that might come into play a lot.

>>51737147
Magic users ARE unambiguously good at sweeping away enemies that are probably not going to be making appearances anymore.

>>51737160
Probably the same group who have issues with Ki and Psionics as non-"magical" magics.

>>51737175
>that are probably not going to be making appearances anymore
Those are the people I specificed, level 1s.

>>51737175
So are certain types of Rangers.

>>51737167
>uncreative
>badwrongfun
The point was that it doesn't obviate social interaction stuff at all (you make an enemy). Not that its "bad."

>>51737095
>>51737102
Doesn't prevent them from attacking you or send assassin after you. They don't know to prove shit either if you're dead without witness.

>>51737195
If they can attack you then Charm Person probably doesn't work on them anyway. Assassins are just free XP

>>51737167
>>51737144
You still have to use skill after charmed person. You just get advantage on the charmed target.
So yeah... it's not that good for sorcerer. You better just use Lucky or something and normal persuasion.

Just a reminder that create thrall only charmed the target. So you don't actually have a thrall, just a buddy who you get advantage on social skill.

>>51737169

>Not him but I really fucking doubt a level 20 is a good encounter for a party of level 10s

Using one lone non legendary opponent is generally a mistake, but its the truth.

>Like how do level 10s deal with Time Stop or Implosion or just the superb amount of actions a monk gets each turn?

The post you reference directly points out the only reason an archmage is rated at CR 12 (who does have time stop) is due to the fact that their Mind Blank and Stoneskin makes it unlikely they will be rapidly dispatched by a lower level party, and the area effect spells casters get are great for dispatching lower leveled foes.

A similarly high leveled foe is unlikely to be as uniquely suited for killing masses of much lower leveled enemies, and so is going to have an even lower CR.

>>51737179
Yes, I was agreeing with you.

>>51737199
Assassins are 100% unambiguously able to kill you

>>51737147
Right. "Anime" has often been used dismissively in regard to letting martials doing cool things. As in, Tome of Battle/Path of War were just "weeaboo fightan magicks", martials being able to do pseudomagical things is "anime", therefore not in line with the flavor of a setting/campaign, etc. I get what you mean now, though.

>>51737161
It's not as if removing the examples from Heracles suddenly cuts the list in half. The point still stands, and I don't believe you made any point at all. But hey, thanks for the (You). Here's a (You) for you too.

>>51737237
Removing people using artifacts, deities doing things, and deities using artifacts does, though.

>wow if I spew out enough lies at once, maybe people will run out of energy before hunting down and arguing every single example!

>>51735932
PHB pg. 192
Next time try ctrl+f in the pdf, fampai

>>51735961
What's the cat doing underground?

>>51736379
Since you're a hobgoblin go INT>CON>DEX
My rule of thumb is to try and take one spell with the ritual tag every level, it adds a lot to your utility and versality
IMO utility and control spells are overall better than straight damage
Change everything to Force damage unless you know the enemy has some kind of weakness
Target the INT of dumb strong brutes, target the STR of small frail mages
Most importantly, come up with a reason why you're not an evocation wizard with damage spells only like most hobgoblin wizards

>>51737222
>Using one lone non legendary opponent is generally a mistake, but its the truth.
Yeah...I can't really agree with that.
Like here's an example - a level 20 Wizard / Sorc has 4 level 9 spell slots. This potentially means 4 uses of Power Word: Kill (even though a wizard would never prepare these unless he knew in advance). Do level 10s even have enough HP to get by without getting instantly dismantled at a rate of one a match? Can they stop Weird, Finger of Death, and WotB? What about Time Stop + Black Tentacles? Or hell just normal spells which would be basically OHKOs due to level scaling. And let's say they get him into the danger zone - can they even stop the guy from using Greater Teleport to just fuck off in general? Or rather, do they have any answer to getting teleported into the sky?

>>51736857
>simplified compared to previous editions, making it easier to keep track of rulings
>UA offers a degree of customisation to DMs without being forced into the core game
>martials and casters are relatively balanced if you're not stupid with them

It's sort of like the iPhone. You can't really fiddle with the hard numbers as much as you can with an Android or something similar (unless you really break it open) but it's comfy to use and you get out of it exactly what you expect going in.

>>51737261
>What's the cat doing underground?

Treasure Hunting. Underdark had some cool shit. Could also just reflavor it as a tribal warrior of some kind who specialised in ambushes.

Wondering if I should bother taking Nature as a skill, I've only got a 10 in INT but people will most likely expect me to.

>>51736574
It's a simple edition, easy to hop on. Some of the crunch has been streamlined and class balance is better.
The combat can be a bit boring without some work from the DM, though.

>>51737266
1. Optimizing antagonists as if they were PCs, to kill PCs, is generally pretty dumb and pointless. The result is just going to be glass cannoning. Still, it can be analyzed.
2. A level 18 archmage is CR 12. Not CR 10. A level 20 archmage may or may not be CR 13 and is honestly hard to rate. The subtle distinction the last 2 levels make may or may not be a big deal.
3. Can the archmage survive 6 greatsword hits at 2d6+15 (lets assume he's found a +1 sword by now, as he would in virtually any adventure path, or even from Lost Mine) from Action Surge from a level 11 fighter? The answer is "fuck no, niggaz dead." There are a lot of other ways to fuck him up, even with less than perfect luck -- he has nothing for saving throws, minimal HP for a CR 12 monster, and of course, there's 3 other PCs who can obliterate him, at least 2 of which are likely to beat his inits. There's also polearm users which are generally more impressive, battle master shit, etc.
4. If you want to bring up range into the issue, most projectile weapons have better range and can still power attack.

So yeah, CR 12 is fine. Most high level types will have lower CR than that.

>>51737164
Monks don't work too well with multiclass because they need to get levels to improve martial arts.
That said, Assassin Rogue 6/Shadow Monk 14 is the ultimate Ninja.

>>51737292
Nature is the bookish knowledge
Survival is what you should have desu

>>51737266
>a level 20 Wizard / Sorc has 4 level 9 spell slots
They what?

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>>51736574
is good game

>>51737396
Why not both? I mean I've got 7 to throw around.

Perception, Stealth, Animal Handling, Survival, Athletics then maybe Acrobatics and Nature's what I'm thinking.

Quick question. Can a Hunter Ranger use Sharpshooter with their Volley ability?

>>51737345
>Can the archmage survive 6 greatsword hits at 2d6+15
Are you implying he'd be hit in the first place? I can't imagine an archmagus letting himself get closed on, since he can Dimension Door and Overland Flight on top of buffing himself with the use of Time Stop and also grappling anyone who comes close.

>range
I'm not bringing range in, I'm bringing in the problem that he can literally end anyone who tries to get close with instant death spells and sometimes end more than one person, and in fact doesn't necessarily need to use instant death because of the level disparity.
They can summon things at CR 10 or so too, one per round.

>nothing for saving throws
...? Why wouldn't a character have some saving throws?

>>51737406
They have 4 9th tier spell slots? Don't they?

>>51737416
Then take both, and hope you don't end up in a city campaign.

>>51737450
1 9th
1 8th
2 7th
2 6th

>>51737466
Hold up, a level twenty caster?
...I guess I've been stuck in the 3.5e mindset for too long.

>>51737450
>Are you implying he'd be hit in the first place?

Yep. Dead.

> can't imagine an archmagus letting himself get closed on

Which is why he's dead, because he's an overconfident fuckup who thought he was invincible. The end.

>and Overland Flight

Really, that's your one concentration based buff choice? Okay, so he's dead from longbows that do almost identical damage.

>I'm not bringing range in

you just did. He's dead.

>They can summon things at CR 10 or so too, one per round.

How? With what? Also, you apparently don't understand the concentration keyword and are a lost retard expatriate from 3e/PF who has no idea what he's talking about.

>...? Why wouldn't a character have some saving throws?

Because he's an archmage, wizard or sorcerer and is going to almost categorically fail his saving throws against anything but mind junk, while if the PCs are smart they probably have at least one paladin to boost their saves?

>>51737482
>what do you mean I can only cast wish once per day?
And now you know why all the wizard superiority players (well most of them) are still playing 3.5.

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>>51737482
>>51737450
>>51737266

>>51737502
>Which is why he's dead, because he's an overconfident fuckup who thought he was invincible. The end.
So basically your sole reason why he loses is because you make him act like a fucking retard?
>the concentration keyword
Why can't he just zoom off into the distance by teleporting to a safe distance.
Your requirement is that he acts like a tremendous idiot. I can't imagine why he needs to. Like again, the simple fact that he has instant kill spells that are too high class for your party means unless you're strong enough to kill him in the first round (possible depending on luck and postions I guess), you're going to lose a couple of party members.

>>51737520
>>51737513
Look lad I don't even play casters, I think I've played casters twice in 3.5 and once in 5 so an actual caster player could probably give better advice than me. I'm just saying I'm not buying that a level 20 character is only a CR13 challenge because that means they'd be able to mow through level 20s successively.

>>51737513
Wish should be a tier 10 spell desu

>>51737550
You mean an epic?

>>51737557
Not really? I dunno how it'd work really but Wish sounds like it deserves its own class or slot.
I mean it's basically the "fuck the rules" spell, I just think it's stupid to make it part of the tier 9 group. I dunno.

>>51737537
You don't need to play casters to understand action economy. 4 competent PCs will just gang up on the lv20 guy and fuck him up through sheer number of actions. That's why legendary actions exist.

>>51737584
The thing is CR means you're expected to be able to go through 3-4 encounters of this level. A level 20 caster should be able to kill at LEAST one guy just by virtue of instant death, leaving everything else aside.

>>51737574
That's why it can have permanent consequences if you try to do stuff other than replicate lower level spells, including never being able to cast it again. Now we just need WoTC to errata in somewhere that simulacrum cannot cast wish and we never need to have another conversation about it again.

>>51737600
That's where the whole thing falls down, because the mechanics assume you don't build your enemies like you would PCs. PWK is a shitty spell for PCs because they face big monsters with tons of hp and there's better uses for their 9th level spell slot.
Now when you make an enemy with PC statblocks specifically to fight other PCs, PWK becomes top tier because you can just drop the party's caster no probs.
Volo's guide does a good job creating monsters inspired in PC classes, check it out.

>>51737537
>So basically your sole reason why he loses is because you make him act like a fucking retard?

Why are you insulting yourself? You were the one describing his "unbeatable" tactics.

>Why can't he just zoom off into the distance by teleporting to a safe distance.

Its his (fucking nothing) for perception vs the rogue's and whoever's for a surprise round, then its his one initiative check against four people's. There's a very good chance that whoever wins initiative will shut him down, and as you're implying that this guy should be built like a PC rather than an NPC, he PROBABLY doesn't have Magic Resistance, and thus has essentially no hope of passing a save.

So he has about a 1 in 4 chance of getting any action at all off.

>Your requirement is that he acts like a tremendous idiot.

Why do you keep insulting yourself? You are the one describing his unbeatable precautions.

> Like again, the simple fact that he has instant kill spells that are too high class for your part

He has about a 1 in 4 chance of being able to use them. Ever. The PC's instant defeat spells, and damage bursts, are just as effective on him as well.

>you're going to lose a couple of party members.

Yes, I suppose that there is a 1 in 4 chance that the archmage gets a spell at all, and there's a small chance the spell kills someone. Like I said, glass cannons are not the greatest of antagonists to use.

For the record, here's an example of a CR 6 monster -- the chasme has 84 hp, resistance to fire cold and lightning, immunity to poison, magic resistance, hits everyone with a con based save vs sleep as a free action, and has a probiscus attack that deals ELEVEN six sided dice of damage.

To my mind, that's not that much less dangerous than the archmage, and there's about a 50/50 chance the chasme could solo the archmage (even if the archmage wins inits, he has a 50% chance to pass a save and the chasme has advantage vs all spells).

>>51737600
The level 20 caster has a less than a 1 in 4 chance of making it to his turn at all, followed by less than a 1 in 2 chance of his spell working.

In other words, its a fucking CR 4 banshee, minus the gigantic lists of resistances, immunities, free action fear and automatic ability to see the PCs coming.

How does everyone like advantage/disadvantage?

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Since everyone is busy btfo'ing the caster -
How do people like Cirno? What CR would she be (and don't say 9)?

>>51737709
Very much. I've long believed that RPGs need a two dice or three dice curve, because a single die roll yields brutally swingy results.

>CREATE THRALL
>At 14th level, you gain the ability to infect a humanoid's mind with the alien magic of your patron. You can use your action to touch an incapacitated humanoid. That creature is then charmed by you until a remove curse spell is cast on it, the charmed condition is removed from it, or you use this feature again.
>You can communicate telepathically with the charmed creature as long as the two of you are on the same plane of existence.

Is it acceptable to use this spell on your party as a GOOlock in order to make yourself a telepathic hub of communication for the team?

>>51737446
yeah

>>51737286
That analogy is fucked up. Iphones are overrated and overpriced garbage.

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>>51737713
>Pathfinder General

>>51737266
>What about Time Stop + Black Tentacles?

LOL WUT?

>This spell ends if one of the aetions you use during this period, or any effeets that you ereate during this period, affeets a ereature other than you or an object being worn or earried by someone other than you.

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>5-pound book full of writings costs 25 gp

>3-pound blank 100-page spellbook costs 50 gp

Wait a sec, is someone trying to cheat me here?

>>51737721
By far the best use.

>>51737721
>or you use this feature again.
Only one thrall.

>>51737721
Can't you already telepathy with willing targets with a different ability that you get wayyyy before level 14?

>>51737731
>pfg
what?

>>51737735
Are you okay? Are you having a stroke? Do you need help typing out words?

>>51737674
>For the record, here's an example of a CR 6 monster -- the chasme
I'm not him but that's a splendid example of a shitty CR assignment in my opinion.
Also other examples - Bugbears at CR1 when they can pretty much one hit party members at that point, and Shadows at CR 0.5 when they can basically reduce early fighters to worms crawling on the ground eating dust if they're unlucky with their rolls and are not even that weak in normal combat with a bazillion early resistances.

>>51737731
>all anime characters are /pfg/
>implying pathfinder even works for touhou characters
Nah.
t. actually /pfg/

Are class archetypes always forced on you at 3rd? Is there a way not to take them?

>>51737753
He's saying take the whole "HOW DOEZ I MAKE LE ANIME CHARACTER IN 5E" garbage to a game that actually supports it, like Pathfinder. 5E is quite content to NOT that kind of game.

>>51737740
Spellbooks have to be extra fancy dude. Though I like the idea of comely elven apprentices covered in tattooed on spell books for greater convenience.

>>51737757
I was pointing out that Black Tentacles immediately ends Time Stop

>>51737774
I was just trying to change the subject from some weird argument.
Also fuck your retarded shit, what's your beef with >le anime characters XDDD? Are you the type of autist who complains about monks using ki moves?

>>51737788
Were you phoneposting? Cos you typed like you were having a seizure.

>>51737759
Shadows are fucking terrible in general. I hate ability damage.

>>51737753
Pathfinder General and Pathfinder itself is considered an "anime" community around /tg/, and usually not for the better. Alot of people who moved on to 5e did so to get away from all the weebshit, so they get defensive when they see it creeping into 5e.

To be honest I can't blame them.

>>51737805
You mean a degenerate and shunnued "community".

>>51737805
What weebshit? Pathfinder hardly has any "weeb" stuff. Hell I'm going to challenge anyone to tell me what it means for someone to be "weeb" instead of merely "fantastical", because short of anime with meta-class powerlevels like Ajimu and Featherine they usually ain't shit compared to normal fantasy.

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>>51737792
>what's your beef with >le anime characters

Really Anon? You have to ASK?

Really?

>>51737795
The bigger problem is how early they show up. CR 0.5 is just bullshit for something that can eat your abilities.

Reposting from last thread.

Hello guys, I am going to be making a new char and once again stand with too many options before me. In short, what shuld i build?

I think for race I am going with Aaracocra, I feel like the 50ft flight speed would be super amazing, but I dont know what I want to build him as. I rolled for stats but essensialy got point buy rolls 15,14,13,12,10,9 and since this is a new char for an ongoing campagn he is starting as 5th level.

What cool or interesting things culd I make with my Aarakocra?

>>51737827
Because "anime characters" basically means "powerful characters", I've never seen it used differently except for autism over an artstyle. Like you could literally just redraw most fantasy anime in a realisitic style and it'd look like normal fantasy to you.

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>>51737844
Paizo actually tried this, didn't work.

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Wellp, just found Planar Binding. Great, I'm aroused now.

>its better than the 3e version in all respects except that you have to find the creature first
>bards can use it
>druids can use it too so that they don't have to just have nature goons for their minions forever
>no HD/CR limit
>makes good use of summon celestial, elemental, etc.

Unlike in the 3e version you can just plain assign a monster to follow you or to guard a dungeon room (the reason I was looking it up).

Don't tell the caster fags about this.

>>51737792
Casue it attracts weirdos who attempt to turn the game into their ERP session. Never again fuck off with your kitsune waifu bullshit.

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>>51737859
>Homura expy
>happy

>>51737859
I don't know who that girl is supposed to be, don't do pathfinder, but I don't see much wrong with her besides again probably autism over artstyle.
>literally the same
Left and right look completely different, even the clothing isn't the same. You're really stretching it, isn't that just a generic top and miniskirt?
My point is that the way I see "anime" used is some sort of fucked up insult for "strong" when that's honestly kind of fucking stupid to say, since again - if you ignore featherine classes they're actually weaker than most western fantasy.

>>51737876
>le waifu
>le ERP
Why don't you just kick out retarded ERPers then? I have no idea what this has to do with "anime". What does being strong have to do with ERP? You know that there are dudes in anime right? If you hate waifu bullshit that's something else entirely.

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>>51737889
>TFW anime drones literally defend blatant plagiarism because it fits their fetishes.

Yeah, I think this conversation is done. Holy shit. Just.... holy shit...

>>51737900
>plagiarism
Go post that thing in /a/ and see if anyone thinks it looks like Homura. There were about six girls in my university class wearing that sort of getup and this was before Madoka was a thing.
I'm sorry you don't get out enough to realize a top and miniskirt is hardly an original fucking design.

>>51737900
I dunno about exact but almost every single school battle harem and a lot of just normal """"""fantasy""""" (except everyone wears /fa/ as fuck shit) anime will have at least one girl that wears something like that.

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>>51737877
Bruh, did you even watch the whole thing?

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Everyone shut the fuck up

>>51737889
>featherine

...what is that?

> they're actually weaker than most western fantasy.

We are talking PF right? PF casters are stronger than even 3e casters, as one of the major design goals was to remove what few limits and drawbacks they had.

What could "most western fantasy" possibly mean? What western fantasy depicts wizards as people who can fly around invisible (in the first 1/3rd of their power level), and eventually hang out in time accelerated demiplanes scrying for victims and can then teleport in and time stop obliterate everything?

>>51737926
Fair enough, but of all the characters they could have based her off of, or probably not based her off of, the semi-summoner seems unusually weird.

Kind of like how Hunter the Vigil had a plagiarized Dante, and it wasn't even for the half-devil kind of hunter.

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>>51736326
Did you even read the UA?

>>51737931
>What could "most western fantasy" possibly mean? What western fantasy depicts wizards as people who can fly around invisible (in the first 1/3rd of their power level), and eventually hang out in time accelerated demiplanes scrying for victims and can then teleport in and time stop obliterate everything?

Comics?

>>51737931
>...what is that?
Featherine is the author of a work within the work. Basically meta shit or God.

>we're talking PF right?
No, I'm saying that anime characters are not much stronger than fantasy characters for the most part and actually generally weaker than high fantasy / mythology. The number of anime characters who are Arjuna or Enkidu or Heracles class are pretty few and far between.

Well wizards aside, mainly because "pure" casters are kind of a rarity in western fantasy (the problem is that people like Gilgamesh and Heracles were no less magical than the monsters they slayed because the very fact that they were heroes made them semi-casters in old tradition), you have people like Siegfried, who was literally invincible unless you hit a specific spot (that killed him), same as Achilles. Being literally invincible is beyond Wizards too, as far as I know. Then you've got people like Cu who basically solo'd an army and killed a guy from over the horizon.
If you drift from just normal fantasy you have bullshit like the Flash or Superman and stuff.

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>>51737817
There's just a ton of anime posting and "I'm not really an avatar faggot because they're DIFFERENT smug anime girls tee-hee" faggots.

There's also the furry-lite idiots posting 4 year olds with fox tails and shit, just really annoying people. "Why is this happening on /pfg/?" No idea.

>>51738010
Isn't that just /pfg/ and not Pathfinder?
>avatarfag
You can't avatarfag with smug anime girl reaction pics if that's what you're saying

>>51737996
Oh, okay. Yeah, anime characters are all over in power level. The main distinction is probably that they often gain resources during combat rather than only expend them.

>Well wizards aside, mainly because "pure" casters are kind of a rarity in western fantasy

Not at all. Maybe you mean in mythology, which is only a small inspiration for D&D; D&D is about as based off mythology as it is based off Lovecraft or based off Hammer Horror films.

>>51738010
>There's just a ton of anime posting
>implying there's anything wrong with animeposting
Why are you on 4chan if you kneejerk at anime? I'm sure there's other fatguy communities you could enjoy.

>>51738027
>not at all
Well I was mainly thinking off mythology at first. I'll admit that I don't read that much western fantasy that aren't mythologies or stories / legends; and at any rate modern western fantasy is semi-codified [BY] LotR and D&D, every other fantasy setting is just LotR+.

>>51738049
>every other fantasy setting is just LotR+.

I'd more say Three Hearts and Three Lions if I had to narrow it down to just one setting, since Middle Earth's similarities to D&D and most modern fantasy are more clearly parraleled in the former.

Amusingly, the elves from both settings usually show up in some form in most other fantasy settings as different subraces (high vs wood).

>>51738021
>Isn't that just /pfg/ and not Pathfinder?
Yeah. I'm just explaining why people are saying "Go back to Pathfinder." You dumb?

>>51738032
I'm answering a question. Do you know what a question is, friend?

>>51738082
So they mean /pfg/ and not Pathfinder, the system?

Who/what is everybody's favorite individual for each patron type? Do you go regular lovecraft for GOO's or those in the book?

>>51738032
>Why are you on 4chan if you kneejerk at anime? I'm sure there's other fatguy communities you could enjoy.
It clear to me that you only came to 4chan recently. Here's my advice - don't post embarassing shit.

>>51738084
Yes, although the two are almost synonymous here on /tg/.

Roll20 has the same problem.

>>51738109
Only actual newfags think 4chan isn't a weeb site with occasional havens of noweeb.

>>51738114
The more you know I guess
I never got told to go back to PF before

>>51737097
Ah yes, the ol' 'Gate to Helium' spell.

>>51738116
Only newfags aren't aware of such things as board culture. You could only be more obvious if you posted "Nigger, nigger, nigger! How do you do today, my fellow alt-right nazis, on this alt-right website?"

>>51738122
As others have said, DnD 5e almost prides itself on getting away from the anime stuff that dominates /pfg/ constant waifuposting, kitsune characters, and loli-fetishizing... so whenever anyone posts that sort of stuff in a 5e topic everyone gets super defensive and think's they're being "invaded" or something.

Again, I can't really blame them. I'd rather the weeaboo and spergs stay somewhere else too...

>>51737773
It gives you abilities at levels that without them you get nothing. If you didn't take an archetype as a fighter, you wouldn't gain a level 3, level 7, level 10, or level 15 benefit.

I guess it's possible but they never take anything away from you, they make you better.

>>51738114
>Roll20 has the same problem.
They have more legit full-on furries though.

>>51737817
The weebshit is less about the system, more about the /tg/ community that uses the system.

See the following Pathfinder games that were made primarily for the /pfg/ community:
>https://app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/66875/wrath-of-the-raunchy
>https://app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/65518/a-fluffy-fairy-tale-2-electric-boogaloo
>https://app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/67687/the-sultanas-hot-slave-harem
>https://app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/65144/of-dragons-and-yet-more-dragons

Have a look at the applications for extra giggles.

>>51738149
Looks like cancer without even opening the links, no thanks.

>>51738139
I'm not even talking about "actual" anime, I just feel like it's stupid as hell to lash out and attack things for being "weeb" because they feel overpowered.

>>51738125
Isn't it kind of stupid that they can True Polymorth it into a wraith which has 0 mass but they can't just change it into normal gas?

>>51738104
For fey I was a big fan of the Queen of Air and Darkness. Fiend I made a Dispater Warlock and that was fun. I ran a Cthulu warlock but it wasn't really like the Call of Cthulu. Now I DM a game with Dendar.

I like using the stuff of the setting cause that makes it easy to apply and have other followers of the patron.

>>51738160
"Overpowered" has nothing to do with it.

Shit like waifu-fapping, edgelord-glorification, fur-faggotry, and loli-pedobait is the problem.
See >>51738149

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> tfw Wizards "fixed" bladelock by making a fighter archetype for warlocks
> tfw you have to make deals with Blackrazor to be it
> tfw you will never be a Old God worshipping pirate, sacrificing his captives to Cthulhu

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>>51738149

>>51738139
I mean, if you REALLY honestly wanted to craft some balanced, well done loli-kitsune-half-oni-half-dragon waifu thing with a giant penis for a game, I might help you. But barely anyone wants to do that, they either want some OP garbage for their special snowflake ERP fantasy, or they're just dicking around.

That "Domain of the Frog" homebrew build was funny and not bad, but who the hell is gonna play that?

>>51738171
>"Overpowered" has nothing to do with it.
I've seen people call fighters "weeaboo" or "anime" if you want to let them do cool shit.

>Shit like waifu-fapping, edgelord-glorification, fur-faggotry, and loli-pedobait
So basically just kick them out if they start doing that bullshit? That's >that guy material. It still has nothing to do with being "anime", I could easily do all of that shit playing as a normal D&D Fighter.

>>51738172
Just refluff it, goddamn

>>51738162
Man the polymorph stuff in 5e is all kinds of insane. Especially as you appear to be able to true polymorph things into undead and constructs (which raises weird issues) but even though one of the oldest examples of Shapechange was turning into a spectre, a will o wisp, and a stone golem, you can no longer do it.

Oh well, gotta stock those dungeons somehow.

>>51738172
You still got the Claw of Acamar, just ask to have it turned into a rapier. No extra damage dice just finesse. Pump Rogue for swashbuckler and have fun.

>>51738184
>some balanced, well done loli-kitsune-half-oni-half-dragon waifu thing with a giant penis
I cannot even concieve of how this would even begin to work for a normal game.

>>51735500
I'm sorry, I'm a bit thick I guess.

Where is the warlock smite coming from? The spells?

>>51738172
>fluff requirements

You are a fool

How many people here actually use the standard settings instead of homebrewing their own? If you homebrew your own do you tend to keep the planes of existence and stuff or do you fuck with them so they're not as necessary?

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>>51737753
This is the average party roster of a /pfg/ game.

>>51738246
I doubt it's "average" since this game got linked as part of an example of "they're shit" games.

>>51738239
I tend to use Forgotten Realms but then invent an island somewhere.

I know enough lore to deal with the context, but not enough to have people running around interacting with it directly. Plus, having an island gives an "Abduction!" plotline.

>>51738217
Okay.

Dragon Sorcerer, pick stuff off the spell lists of oni and stuff either associated with dragons in past edition or some stuff that emulates a dragon.

Kitsune is either fluff or, as someone mentioned, consequence of an archfey pack. Bam, you can also make it into one of the beardiest builds around.

Race is probably half elf. Elves and presumably half elves can already be futa canonically, and all manner of insano sex or sexless mashups are explicitly legit, although they probably weren't thinking of giant penises at the time.

Waifu: High charisma maybe.

In other words, a normal character described abnormally.

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>>51738246

>>51738258
Notice how I said /pfg/ and not Pathfinder.

While this is pretty exceptionally awful for any normal Pathfinder game, this is pretty much the norm for /pfg/.

>>51737794
Guarantee he copy pasted from a .pdf.

>>51738239
I have run both and i like running forgotten realms more, because when I ran my own setting the cities didn't have as much character as I would have liked, and it was so much work to add stuff to it.

When I am in the forgotten realms, I can say "You are in Waterdeep." And players who know the setting understand the city well. I don't need to explain what the city's deal is all the time.

Plus I read forgotten realms books people make, Dark Elf Trilogy Cleric Quintet, all that good stuff and it helps with lore.

>>51738172
Replace "Shadowfell" with Far Realm.

You made a pact with an eldritch horror which was trapped in the form of a weapon. With every victim, it comes close to achieving freedom, and assuming it's real form.

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I want to play an angry religious figure, the personification of Pelor's burning hate, but in a more caster-y fashion than the usual paladin or mace-swinging cleric

How could I go about doing this while sticking to AL rules?

Is light cleric my only option? Do my damage through sacred flame and some fire/radiant spells

I was thinking I could also go Scourge Aasimar for that minute of pure BURNING HATE

Any ideas?

>>51738395
Why not theurgy light wizard? If you like UA anyway.

Wht's wrong with light cleric tho?

>>51737930
Good story

>>51738395
Undying Light Warlock is pretty good, sacred flame all day and you add your charisma mod to the damage. A bunch of other stuff as well.

>>51738457
>>51738462
This is for AL, so no UA allowed
Hell, if UA was allowed I would just pick that latest wizard thing and make everything radiant all the time

>>51738462
>>51738395
Oh with AL rules, I guess light cleric is your best bet.

Thinking of playing my next character as a Pacifist. My DM sees it as a group of Murder Hobos, though he is exaggerating.
The party just does not explore all ends and when someone threatens their characters or if someone is clearly evil they take them out.
Admittedly there is more killing than negotiating.
So i thought it might be a fun little challenge.

So far I was thinking of playing a Devotion Paladin with Shield Master who grapples his opponents to the ground and then uses Manacles on them.

I was also thinking of using a Net but apparently Nets use Dex and are always thrown at disadvantage(unless you take 1 of 2 feats), which is fucking lame. I might just carry some nets and try to use them in a non-thrown manner. Such as trying to wrap it around someone when grappling.

His holy quest is to subdue the evils of the world and reform them into being good.
He wants to build his own Prison to better contain and reform said evils

Use Intimidate and Persuasion to subdue the weaker willed beings. Spells like Command work well too.

Mostly just prepare the Buff/Debuff/Healing spells of a Paladin
Was thinking of also taking Magic Initiate Cleric to get Spare the Dying so I can legit stabilize dead enemies lol.


Major issue; Party is still gonna kill. Obviously my character can chastise them and such
>It is bad for your soul to kill, taking a life weighs heavy on it
>Don't be so eager to deal out death and judgement, even the very wise cannot see all ends
>You all lose when there is needless bloodshed, and all bloodshed is needless
But how do I justify someone like my character staying with these adventurers? They aren't cut-throats or evil.
I guess he could be trying to reform them as well?


Alternative is to play a Spellcaster and use Status effect spells to subdue people. It seems like it might be less fun. Though a Sorcerer who only takes Status Effect spells might be cool.
Twinned Enlarge/Reduce could be good. Make enemies small, throw in a sack.


Thoughts?

Does the new smite effects the pact of the blade weapons get make any new heights for novas?

>>51738473
Yeah at this time ether sun soul monk or light cleric is your best bet.

>>51738479
Are you a german? Your random capitalization of Nouns and burning desire to build camps really gives it away.

>>51738395
Play a bard, get the inspiring leader feat, and RP all your inspiring pep talks and bardic inspirations as general angry pelor related sermons and the like.

>>51738479
Without homebrew the net uses strength and does not have disadvantage, your DM may be putting rules on against you.

Also your party's main goal may be the goal of your paladin. If you want to start convincing them to not kill people, you have to have it work out. Try negotiating and seeing if you can gain something from it that wouldn't have been gained from the other way.

Also the murderous ways could lead to the death of an NPC or even a PC.

>>51738485
There's probably something with Eldritch Knight 11/Warlock 9 using action surge.

>Murder in Baldur's Gate has the Bhaalspawn as the main character
>He's a level 4 or so chump, not the epic-level badass that we see in Throne of Bhaal
>Slayer form is pathetically weak

This sucks, I'm changing this Abdel Adrian novel shit. I'll say that Adrian is the son of the Bhaalspawn, a half-elf from either Jaheira, Viconia, or Aerie. And that CHARNAME left a portion of his own essence in the child, before he ascended to godhood and disappeared.

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>>51738485
Probably. New content's already been used to improve the Nuclear Druid.

>>51738479
If you can take UA classes and your DM is upset about murderhobos you could try a tranquility monk. It looks terrible, but it might be fun. You could probably ditch the class after the at will sanctuary and just go for some kind of social focused sorcerer instead. Or just sit there in sanctuary pontificating about violence while summoned creatures engage in it for you. I mean, from a mechanical standpoint its not going to be good, but if that's not the priority.

>>51738485
>>51738542

I don't know what current records are, but Eldritch Knight 11/Hexblade 9 could pull off 12d6+40d8+102 for an average of 333 in 1 turn with Action Surge, blowing both pact magic slots, three 3rd level slots, and a 1st level slot before critical hits.

Numbers include GWM and the +2 weapon pact.

>>51738568
In my mind the BG main character is hanging out in a bar outside of time and space with other MC's like The Nameless One.

>>51738514
Sorry bro, Canadian.
Though i just noticed it too and it's pretty funny. I don't know why I do that. I guess I treat certain nouns as proper-nouns or i am just an idiot.

>>51738541
The net isn't super important, but i will talk to him about it.

>Try negotiating and seeing if you can gain something from it that wouldn't have been gained from the other way.
If we don't kill them they can just show us where all the treasure is
The party could be on-board with that

>Also the murderous ways could lead to the death of an NPC or even a PC.
I think this is a good idea, to bring it up mid-way through combat

>>51738593
>I mean, from a mechanical standpoint its not going to be good, but if that's not the priority.
It never needs to be good, it just needs to be functional.
Can it accomplish its goal with realistic dice rolls?
In that I don't need a 15-20 on every d20 roll to do what i need.
I feel like grappling, shield master shove to ground, then using manacles on the second turn works out well, mechanically. Could potentially take out an enemy in 2 turns.

>>51738485
Oathbreaker Paladin 11/Hexblade Warlock 9

Get a potion of speed(haste) and activate Curse 1st turn.

2nd turn is two attacks and a bonus action cast of blinding smite. First attack:

2d6+26(Str,Cha from Oathbreaker, GWM,HexCurse)+5d8(3rdDivineSmite,ImprovedDivineSmite)+10d8(Cursebringer)+3d8(BlindingSmite)

Second attack is everything but blinding smite.

All this together you could break 200 damage, but this is a lot of spell slots burned and it's a level 20 build and they never happen.

There is probably better.

>>51738661

Any sort of ambiguity is preferable to the canon of the Baldur's Gate books.

>Sanctuary
If the warded creature makes an attack or casts a spell that affects an enemy creature, this spell ends.

Wtf do they mean "affects an enemy creature"?
Things like Fog Cloud or Darkness affect everything.

>>51738485
Bugbear Assassin 3/Fighter 2/Hexblade 3/Valor 12 with 20 STR and GWM casting Elemental Weapon as a 5th level effect and using Hexblade Curse on the target deals 96d8 + 12d6 + 10d4 + 115 damage to surprised tofu, for an average of 614 damage. You get more damage if you add Paladin Divine Smite to the mix, but then you need to roll stats to get 20 STR.

>>51738477
>>51738486
>>51738538
Thanks anons, I will take these into consideration

Kinda sucks that the feature that increases sacred flame damage comes in so late in the game, but it is what it is

Will most likely go light or bard, gotta look at the spell lists

>>51738705
Bugbear Assassin 3/Fighter 2/Hexblade 3/Valor 10/Paladin 2 with 18 STR and GWM casting Elemental Weapon as a 5th level effect and using Hexblade Curse on the target deals 132d8 + 12d6 + 10d4 + 110 damage to surprised tofu, for an average of 771 damage.

>>51738667
>needs to be functional
Tranquility monk is a monk that basically doesn't have class features. It might even be worse than the elements monk, but it does have sanctuary at will. It can only accomplish its goal if your sole goal is to be a pacifist, and even then a wizard with sanctuary and invisibility would be better at that.
Yes, a grappling paladin will be far better.

>>51736400
You get to be Vegeta./10

Found out a wicked build.

Level 17.
Cast Prismatic Wall
+
Cast Thunderwave

50d6 damage!

WotC, warlock dips were already really good. There was no need to give them a free flying scout that also gives darkvision and a bonus to the most important skill in the game.

>need Devil's Sight Invocation to use Darkness effectively
>need Beast Speech to command my two-headed dog
>need Misty Visions to trick one of my enemies into walking into a trap
>level 2 Warlock

why can't I hold all these invocations?

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What Class + Spell can be done to make this a reality?

>>51738767
What are the two paladin levels for? Curse Bringer works with spell slots from other classes as written, so Divine Smite wouldn't be a valid reason.

>>51736269
For the eldritch blast based invocation, you could just copy and rename the raven queen one, or apply the no regen effect of chill touch.

>>51736303
For the weapon invocation, it should have an effect that doesn't need spell slots, and the smite should be damage only. Temp hp is a good effect though. Maybe something pulled from the Sword of Kas for theme.

>>51738886
So you can Curse Bringer and Divine Smite on each attack.

>>51736352
Level 1 and 2 are apprentice-tier. Level 3 is identity. Level 4 is "start with a feat" and level 5 is "fuck the first tier".

>>51738884
Wizard + Simulacrum, more or less.

>>51738824
it's a monk with better lay on hands that it can use as a bonus action as part of flurry of blows. how is that bad?

>>51736352
I don't like starting high levels. Anything more than a couple and you are a pretty experienced and accomplished adventurer, with the kinds of experiences that can really shape a person. Its more fun for me to play a character who has grown in to his current power level, writing a backstory for a 10th level character just doesn't have the same depth unless you write a fucking novel.

>>51738884
Illusionist Wizard can make it for a minute, maybe, Awaken?

It can definitely be done, just need the right parameters.

>>51738847
Yeah while I love the flavor as well, I think it isn't balanced at all for mc.

>>51736566
>If a fighter can cut the "coldness" out of Cone of Cold I'd rather call him a magic knight.
Not really. I think that kind of defensive ability is cool and technically nonmagical utility of extreme power. They can already learn to block a fireball with a shield.

>That wouldn't be that useful outside of combat except to bypass climb or certain dex checks.
Like flight, spider climb, or even teleportation for certain distances? That's exactly the kind of utility people often talk about. Instead of the cleric wind walking everyone, we all grab the barbarian and he jumps us there.

>>51738884
>>51739029
Actually fabricate awaken would definitely work.

>>51735633
...A FOUR ELEMENTS MONK!

>>51739047
>fabricate
>Creatures or Magic Items can't be created or transmuted by this spell
Don't think that will work out.

I was looking for the Bladesinger, but can't actually find it.

Is it just a meta archetype, similar to a "Witch hunter" style build, or is it actually a class archetype of the wizard in some book? Or is is UA?

My googlefu is shit.

>>51739034
stone sorcerer+hexblade looks particularly messed up. you could dump dex and strength and int and still be fine

>>51739081
It's in Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide

>>51739081
It's in the Sword Coast Adventure's Guide. It's an Arcane Tradition.

>>51739073
Well it would make a big paper lion, then awaken makes it a creature.

>>51739139
Ahh! I see!

>>51739105
>>51739104
Great, thanks.

It isn't just completely useless, right? I was hoping to make an elven magic user that could kick ass in melee too.

>>51738884
The class best suited for being a Summoner is a Druid.

Conjure Animals at 5th level, so you have to wait a while before summoning anything.
But summoning a single CR2 Beast is pretty decent, and considering you get to do it, before those Moon druids can even turn into CR 2 is pretty great.

Admittedly you won't be summoning Manticores. But when you get 4th level spells, you can conjure some minor fey and elementals.

You could take Magic Initiate or Ritual Caster and get Find Familiar if you want another, more permanent magic creature companion.

>>51739139
Awaken only works on a creature or plant, or are you working with the paper = wood = plant angle?

>>51739170
Im working with the paper = wood = plant angle thing.

>>51739170
>>51739185
No matter what, we are talking a forth and fifth level spell being used in this, maybe animate object in there somewhere as another 5th level spell. As a DM I'd allow you can spend all the spell components and make a little dog out of paper or stone or whatever and it would work.

>>51737111
If you actually compare to the DMG guidelines, most level 20 PCs are CR 15 or higher. The Archmage is *only* CR 12 because he doesn't have a full wizard's class features and actually isn't very well geared for blowing up low level parties.

>>51737216
You also get a telepathic communication link, so you can always talk to him. He won't block your calls either. What a good friend.