What creatures have a CR over 21? (Except the Tarrasque)

Trump

>>51649420
Solar angels have a 23.

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>>51649420
There's a whole retarded book of them. The only one I see posted is the Neutronium Golem.

Angel, Solar
Black Dragon, Great wyrm
Black Dragon, Wyrm
Blue Dragon, Ancient
Blue Dragon, Great wyrm
Blue Dragon, Wyrm
Brass Dragon, Ancient
Brass Dragon, Great wyrm
Brass Dragon, Wyrm
Bronze Dragon, Ancient
Bronze Dragon, Great wyrm
Bronze Dragon, Very old
Bronze Dragon, Wyrm
Copper Dragon, Ancient
Copper Dragon, Great wyrm
Copper Dragon, Very old
Copper Dragon, Wyrm
Demon, Balor
Devil, Pit Fiend
Gold Dragon, Ancient
Gold Dragon, Great wyrm
Gold Dragon, Old
Gold Dragon, Very old
Gold Dragon, Wyrm
Green Dragon, Ancient
Green Dragon, Great wyrm
Green Dragon, Wyrm
Red Dragon, Ancient
Red Dragon, Great wyrm
Red Dragon, Old
Red Dragon, Very old
Red Dragon, Wyrm
Silver Dragon, Ancient
Silver Dragon, Great wyrm
Silver Dragon, Old
Silver Dragon, Very old
Silver Dragon, Wyrm
Tarrasque
Titan
White Dragon, Great wyrm

>>51649457
>solars
Why are they so dirty?
Like holy shit Solars are hilariously overpowered.
In many settings they would be the gods themselves.

>>51649420
For 5e:

20

Ancient Brass Dragon
Ancient White Dragon
Pit Fiend

21

Ancient Black Dragon
Ancient Copper Dragon
Lich
Solar

22

Ancient Bronze Dragon
Ancient Green Dragon

23

Ancient Blue Dragon
Ancient Silver Dragon
Kraken

24

Ancient Gold Dragon
Ancient Red Dragon

30

Tarrasque

>>51649460
what book?

>>51649639
>Ancient Black Dragon
>Ancient Copper Dragon
>Solar

>Lich

What the hell? Why is lich so OP?

>>51649721
Immostal's Handbook - Epic Bestiary
search for neutrinium golem on 1d4chan to get the download links

>>51649420
Cthulhu.

>>51649863
xD epic

>>51649782
High level casting bruh

>>51649888
PF actually has Cthulhu statted (in on of Paizo's own books too, rather than some 3rd party one), and he does indeed have CR higher than 21 (he's CR30, which is the highest challenge rating in Paizo's books; there's some 3rd party monsters that go even higher).

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>>51649420
Golden Manhatten here has CR of 32

warning: wonky CR even for 3.5 (!!!)
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/abomination.htm

But I <3 Infernals and Dream Larvas.
And Phanes are absolutely AMAZING.

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PF monsters

CR 22
Devastator - Demonic version of 40ks Titans
Fomorian Titan - First creatiosn of the gods who trie dto overthrow them, since sealed away
Red Wyrm Ravener - ultra lich dragon which eats souls
Tempest Behemoth - living weapon of the gods, theme is air and storm
Thanatotic Titan - death titans
Volnagur - the End-Singer, spawn of the god of destruction, starfish with many wings

CR 23
Angel, Solar
Blood Queen - horrific giant maggot thing from beyond the stars
Chemnosit - another spawn of rovagug, god of destruction. giant worm thing
Elohim - horrific mix of insect, fungi, and other things that play at god.
Ifestus - titan who likes magma and hot things
Inder - giant column of fire that rules over all fire elementals
Jabberwock - yes its that one from Alice in Wonderland. In PF its a Tane, a living weapon of the Eldest, the Fey lords.
Lypso - Giant water elemental who rules over all water elementals
Susir - giant storm/tornado that rules over air elementals

24
Dantalion - Duke of Hell who serves Baalzebub
Fafnheir - the most powerful linnorm dragon on Golarion
Guardian Dragon - Divinely created dragons who guard divine treasures
Hekatonkheires
Nightripper - 953 kill serial killer who was only killed on his 13 execution attempt, personally chosen by Lamashtu to serve as her personal assassin.
Onyst - Earth elemnal who rules over earth elementals
Yamasoth - ancient terrifying qlippoth lord

25
Drakainia - the twisted "daughters" of Lamashtu
Lorthact - Duke of hell on the run from the Whore-Queen eiseth, ruler of erinyes
Mythic Wyrm Red Dragon
Shamira - powerful succubus who serves Nocticula
Tarrasque
Treerazer demonic dinosaur like nascent demon lord

>>51650907
>Nightripper - 953 kill serial killer who was only killed on his 13 execution attempt, personally chosen by Lamashtu to serve as her personal assassin.
Only 953? Lightweight. A level 20 character can get 1,000x that kill count within a week if they try hard enough.

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>>51649420
Tarrasque Wizard!
>Tiny Pic

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CR 30-32 The Dread Tarrasque.

Said to be the originator Tarrasque presumably living on layer 666 of the abyss, but no one knows where it is.

>>51649782
5e liches are proper high-level casters with legendary actions.

>>51651264
How far down in the abyss do you have to go before the demons no longer know that there is a material plane?

>>51649842
Oh, I thought this was an actual book.
There's no way I'm reading or using it, but what I have seen is awesome and you're retarded yourself for calling it retarded.

>>51649934
It's complete bollocks. A lich is supposed to be a threat of roughly the same level as a vampire. It's not some ancient demilich who can shatter planets with a thought, it's an ordinary regular campaign boss.

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>>51650907
26
Bezravnis - giant three tailed scorpion Kaiju
Korada - Agathion (animal angels) Empyreal lord of monks, inner peace, and forgiveness
Kostchtchie - Hey its that russian dude who had his soul stolen by Baba Yaga

27
Agyra - flying kaiju
Baphomet - the first minotaur and demon lord of all of them.
Bokrug - Its a Great Old One, and it's a tentacly lizard thing.
Gibbering Orb - Who taught the Shoggoth to fly?
Xoveron - demon lord of gargoyles and ruins

28
Dagon - take every horrific thing fromt eh seas, this has all of it and more. Also demon lord of fishy things.
Demon Lord Shax - demon lord of envy, lies, and-above all else-murder. Looks like an anthro stork who wears evil surgeon gear.
Mogaru - another kaiju, this time an homage to Godzilla
Sifkesh - the Sacred Whore, is the demon lord of suicide, heresy, and hopeless despair. looks like a dismembered but still whole angel.
Vildeis - empyreal lord of devotion, sacrifice, and scars. Bloody, scarred, bandaged angel.

29
Deskari - Lord of the Locust Host and the Usher of the Apocalypse, son of Pazuzu, and horrific insect thing
Hastur - Who do you think it this is?

30
Cernunnos - empyreal lord of primal wilderness, looks like a buff elf with stag horns.
Cthulhu - Do I have to explain this?
Nocticula - THE succubus queen.
Pazuzu - Ya know that dude who possessed Linda Blair? This is him. He spends his free time randomly possessing people, in between waging devastating wars upon countless demon lords, angelic armies, and even Hell itself.

>>51651155
He did it while much lower level. Why do you think Lamashtu picked him personally to remake into a demon lord?

>>51651394
>Bokrug
I didn't expect Paizo to stat a god that's mentioned in a single sentence of a page long story.

>>51649965
they also did several other old gods, like hastur (didyou kill him? everybody roll multiple will saves to put on his cloak and you turn into him), ithaquoa, likely a few more when strange aeons finishes

>>51649460

The Nechaschismic Dragon is probably the most insane thing in the book. The longer it's there it subsumes reality itself until you destroy it or it becomes all of existence.

>>51649782
If you're a man who has outwitted and beaten Death itself by your own power, will and spite... You're pretty up there on the power rankings.

>>51651340
CR in 5e is based on how hard it can fuck the party in three rounds, averaged with how hard it can resist being fucked by the party over those rounds. Liches, as full casters, are capable of doing a lot in those first few rounds.

>>51649420
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Dreg_Titan_(3.5e_Creature)
The dreg titan is homebrew, but I've always been fond of it.

>>51651340
>A lich is supposed to be a threat of roughly the same level as a vampire.

This is what Vampirefags actually believe.

You are a flying lamprey, a victim of a curse or disease. They literally will themselves to lose be forever.

>>51651731
*live forever

>>51649591

>Though they are not gods, the solars' power approaches that of demigods, and they often have an advisory role for younger or weaker deities. In some polytheistic faiths, mortals worship one or more solars as aspects or near-equal servants of the true deities—never without the deity's approval—or consider notable solars to be offspring, consorts, lovers, or spouses of true deities (which they may be, depending on the deity).

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>>51651340

>A lich is supposed to be a threat of roughly the same level as a vampire.


This is what bloodsacks ACTUALLY BELIEVE

>>51651394
Special mention going to Lucifer, being the single highest CR monster in Pathfinder at CR 39.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/devil/devils-unique/devil-lucifer-prince-of-darkness-tohc

>>51652077
Yeah, I was only going for official and not third party.

>>51652077
>At-will wish
Game over

>>51652077

If he's so strong how did Papa Asmodeus kick his ass out of hell?

>>51652222
>Lucifer's face when YHWH is an even more monumental dick when it comes to screwing people over with wish side effects than even the most That Guy DM

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>>51652610

Stat him /tg/

>>51649531
Empyrean

>>51649435
Fpbp

>>51652669
YHWH = 26
His CR is 26

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>>51649420

>>51652866
I'd much rather fight an Alcolich

Altuin the star turtle has a CR of 84000. Thats the highest CR i could find.

Officially though Dragon magazine had a CR 99 Time dragon.

>>51653160
If we count unofficial publications I might as well post my homebrew with a CR of one million.

>>51651394
It's bizarre how retarded the Empyreal Lords are. They have relatively too low Int and Wis scores.

>>51652866
>Immune to almost everything
>Resistance 100+DR/- for the thing it isn't immune to
>Instantly revives 2d4 times per fight
>At-Will ability to cause Suck or Die effects at 1500ft range
>+100 to four skills
>+50 to mental stats
What the hell

>>51652077
>create water
bet he never thought that would come in handy

>>51654821
Don't forget

>uses d20s for all his hit dice, and has maximum rolls for each one
>has an ability that deals his max hit points to a target, no save

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>>51649460

How the hell do they expect you to run a game at this level?

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>>51649460

But could it beat the lady of pain?

>>51655842
It has stats, so no.

>>51655779
Its really boring actually. Its a lot of maths and just numbers. You arent hacking at a goblin with your gleaming lobgsword, you are doing 30 attacks with a 16% probability of doing 3d100 each with a damage reduction of 42.

Highest i played was lvl 21 and that was a one off session to fight the last evil of the plane we were on.

>>51651290
Yeah but 5e is 3.5 for faggots.

Most things in the book that this creature is from:

Golem, Neutronium (Large Construct)
Hit Dice: 250d1000+1,966,080 (2,216,080 hp)
Initiative: +79
Speed: Fly 5,901,426,338' (perfect)
Armor Class: 932 (-1 size, -1 Dex, +80 gravitic mastery, +844 natural), touch 88, flat-footed 932
Base To-Hit: +187 (+437 grapple)
Attack: Slam +512 (40960d10+246 damage; average 225,526)
Full Attack: 2 slams, as above
Special Attacks: Gravitic aura, heat aura, pulsed x-ray, starquake
Special Qualities: Accretion, construct, damage reduction 1500/-, darkvision 60ft, fast healing 1500, gravitic mastery, immunity to magic, low-light vision, magnetar, superluminal, unearthly construction
Saves: Fort +163, Ref +162, Will +163
Abilities: Str 502, Dex 9, Con —, Int —, Wis 11, Cha 1
Environment: Outer space
Organization: Solitary, patrol (2-4), or with time lord (Divine Rank 192, 960HD)
Challenge Rating: 9721
Treasure: None
Alignment: always Neutral
Advancement: 251–353 HD (Large), 354–707 HD (Huge)
Level Adjustment: +17,427 (assuming sentience)
A ball of blistering heat surrounding this automaton is palpable. At its centre you can discern a dark grey humanoid shape, only slightly taller than a human, but proportionally built like a stocky dwarf. The surface of the figure is featureless, and seems to bubble and ripple as if constantly boiling.

>>51658272
If you want something that your players could actually contend with though.

Atropals.

Atropals are not only hard to fight but are fucking horrifying and the moment I learned about what they are I never stopped noping.

Size/Type: Large Undead (Evil, Extraplanar, Lawful)
Hit Dice: 66d12 (792 hp)
Initiative: +6 (+2 Dex, +4 Improved Initiative)
Speed: 5 ft., fly 240 ft. (perfect)
Armor Class: 51 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +40 natural)
Base Attack/Grapple: +33/+53
Attack: Touch +49 melee touch (2d6 Con drain/19-20)
Full Attack: 2 touches +49 melee touch (2d6 Con drain/19-20), eye ray +30 ranged touch (negative level damage/19-20)
Space/Reach: 10 ft/10 ft.
Special Attacks: Constitution drain, energy drain (2d4 negative levels, Fort DC 59), spell-like abilities, summon nightcrawler
Special Qualities: Abomination traits, undead traits, rebuke/command undead, regeneration 20, SR 42, DR 15/good and epic and silver, negative energy aura
Saves: Fort +22, Ref +26, Will +43
Abilities: Str 43, Dex 15, Con O, Int 28, Wis 22, Cha 42
Skills: Bluff +85, Concentration +85, Diplomacy +97, Hide -2, Jump +1, Intimidate +91, Knowledge (arcana, history, religion, the planes) +78, Listen +77, Search +78, Sense Motive +75, Spellcraft +84, Spot +77
Feats: Alertness, Cleave, Dodge, Combat Expertise, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Critical (touch), Improved Critical (eye ray), Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Lightning Reflexes, Mobility, Power Attack, Quicken Spell-Like Ability (finger of death), Run, Spring Attack, Weapon Focus (touch), Weapon Focus (eye ray), Whirlwind Attack
Epic Feats: Devastating Critical (touch), Overwhelming Critical (touch), Undead Mastery, Zone of Animation
Environment: Any
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 30
Treasure: Standard
Alignment: Always lawful evil
Advancement: 67-80 HD (Large); 81-100 HD (Huge)
An atropal’s natural weapons are treated as epic, evil, and lawful-aligned for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

>>51649639
Don't forget all the Demon lords and Tiamat

>>51658290
they also reanimate themselves as CR 11 monsters

>>51649639

The Kraken is sort of iffy because they lose a whole lot of their difficulty without water.

>>51651881
>>51651881
>>51651881
>>51651881
>He doesn't know about Vampire Age categories, Salient abilities, and the broken ass shit they can do depending on their strain of vampirism and what they do at Patriarch Age

A vampire can become fucking Elder Evil at age 1000, Liches don't even scratch the surface of the broken ass-shit vampires have access too, the only thing preventing them from reaching this is the fact that they're all lazy as fuck due to being CE.

The last time a Vampire was anything but CE he took over Baldur's Gate singlehandedly, waiting fo rhis army of 40,000 undead to arrive and slapped the vampire lord template on for extra measure and was a Blackguard.

Almost all of a liches shit is reliant on research, from it's salient abilities (See Forgotten realms monsters, and Van Richten's guide to Liches on this) and the power rituals it gets for being the prime receiver of the boons of the Negative energy Plane's supposed "will", even Vecna used those things to become a Deity.

Even then, there are few if any who know of such powers, post the time of troubles Magic changed and shit went whack.

>>51655842

Destroy? No, the Lady of Pain is already beyond such a state, but it would probably force her to do something special just to get rid of it.

>>51658290
>>51658272
>>51652866


Mind to give the name of source books? Is it in the archive? I am not a D&D player but i'd like to have a look at the creatures they imagined.

>>51658774
Immortals Handbook. It's a work of one guy, so I would strongly recommend buying it for money.

>>51651466
Tsathoggua is far more fucked up.
As soon as you get within his eldritch might aura you become charmed and think he is your best friend forever.

>>51652077
Ok, I get it
But who in their right mid would even fight this guy?
You don't even need to know his stats to know it's insane
Not murderhobos would just attack him

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>>51661385
>>Not murderhobos would just attack him

>>51662110
I forgot the even
Not even would just attack him

>>51662121
Oh for fuck's sake
Not even murderhobos would just attack him

>>51658407
Liches are wizards. In most editions of D&D, wizards can do everything. The vampire can do it? The ever-living wizard has a way to do it too while doing other stuff.

>>51649420
Luficer has a CR of over 30 last time i chekced.

>>51662165
Murderhobos will attack anything, even the sky, even Allah himself.

>>51662939
>as you enter the room you see a 10 ft tall humanoid standing before you, he has long black hair a-
>I charge
>what?
>I said I'm charging him, he's unprepared right?

>>51651329
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Layers_of_the_Abyss

>>51655842
It has stats so it can't win but it's sure as fuck gonna destroy most of the outlands before she manages to maze it then it'd probably destroy the maze too.

>>51649420
There is a real lack of CR 20+ threats for high level games. Most require you to do a lot of leg work (build a dragon, stat out npcs with class levels). Nearly all printed monsters with a CR of 20 or greater are either total chumps that die fast, or they're in the epic level handbook and there is zero chance of killing them.

>>51651329
Layers of the Abyss aren't actually in ordered number. Those are the numbers assigned to them when they are discovered.

So layer 51 might have never even heard of the Material plane and not even have any Tanar'ri (mortal souls) in it. Meanwhile layer 549 could be full of nothing but mortals-transformed-into-demons whose soul propose is trying to claw back to the Prime.
>Why are their gasps in the numbers

Because writers like putting meaning on specific numbers.

>>51663246
>are their
Are there. Sorry

I challenge you to create a cool creature with a CR over 21.

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>>51663345
:^)

>>51651425
Bokrug isn't a god.

>>51663345
The Umbral Blot already exists.

It's a sentient, annoyed, and self-mobile sphere of annihilation that is a construct.

>>51663546
seriously fuck that bossfight

>>51663547
Oh yeah???
>Bokrug, The Great Water Lizard, is the lake-dwelling god of the semi-amphibian Thuum'ha ("Voiceless Ones") of Ib in the land of Mnar.

>>51663546
>>51663732
Am I the only one who always beats it on the first try with no problems?

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Uvuudaum. CR 27.

>>51659034
I can only find the two books. Are there any others?

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>>51663345
Rate my monster /tg/
http://pastebin.com/25Hzt3jk
Also suggestions?
First time making a monster that high CR

>>51664574
Meh, double barrel is 4d8 if you fire both barrels

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Probably a Suel Demilich, it'd bump up the danger at least, maybe give it a few Salient abilities, a Blackfire wand, age category bonuses, and 25 clones of itself pre demilichdom and you've probably got a decent fight, seeing as players won't be familiar with a Lich that possess you to rot you out and kill you.

Fun fact, Lich's can craft a ring that lets them steal people's fucking ranked skill points if the user wearing it dies, what worser way to die than to empower a villian with your skill checks?

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We have the Grand Aboleth, or by 3.5, in Faerun, known as the "Eldest", a City sized Aboleth with a nasty ability that's the equivalent of Cthulu's "Drive men mad when you wake up" feature, except maybe it's only limited once a day after a use of Astral projection ends.

A quick way to make it would be to grant an Aboleth the Kaju template, translated features and Aboleth class levels, give it form of madness and Elder Evil abilities presented in Dragon magazine, and it's probably good to go.

I'd say, get the Kaju template, (DM) the Elder evils book, (3.5) and Iggwilvs demonomicon (DM) for the Demon Lord Template, Ecology of the Aboleth, (DM) and Lords of Madness(3.) to construct it.

So: Really big Aboleth-
Form of Madness
Enslavement out the ass
Astral projection and some huge broke ass Plane shift/Teleportation ability
Kaju template, or just have it at largest Size category
Those two Aboleth classes found in 3.5

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Oh right, Santa/Krampus
Enslaver of the Seldarine.

So yeah, stat Krampus and you've got to fight a guy who can literally do that Enmity of an outsider crap the Deck of many things does, and immediately drop you in that flaming part of hell, and immediately enthrall anything with enough pointy ears

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Then There's Proper Orcus.

As in the one that floods you with Liches, has access to a far more diverse set of spells, more relating to him, and does that shit in Neverwinter Online which was a callback to him getting annihilated as Tennebrous, so he can at will deploy Sphere's of annihilation, which when charged up with Negative energy Explode in the same fashion as that trick when you put that rod in the Sphere, except it does Necrotic/Negative energy damage. And most importantly, switches back and forth between a 10th level Pale master Tier Pseudo-undead and living form passively, and in addition to that, is literally wearing Undead Power armour, and is using his wand, and the OcrusSword.

Lucky 4e-5e's desparate attempt to make him coverboy to compete with PF had then forget his entire arsenal of anti-fun

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There are two Death Knight Template in 3.5, one for the Demogogron spawned type, and another for the one Lord Soth has.

So er, give this guy the Lord Soth one + the benefits of the Default, I don't think Lord Soth's variant left anything out of the original though.

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CR 22, always use this guy as the prelude to letting his master out.

>>51664534
>3.5 rules
Pure cancer/10

Trolling about shit mechanics aside, the monster idea is neat and I like the idea of a monstrous angel coming to cleanse the world of sin. Holy reactor is a cool name and idea too I really like the idea of it feeding off of evil energy. However, I'm fairly certain that all sphinxes are female so there's no need to note that. Your writing style is also a little weird and unclear at times so some parts I had to read twice.

I would totally steal this idea and adapt it. I'm imagining this either being a world ending event caused by the BBEG or the players mistakenly invoking one of these creatures to fight the bad guy and then have to contend with it after it decides it's best to just wipe out everything.

>>51665435
Thanks, glad you like it

D&D has male subraces of sphinxes, two of them in fact if my memory serves me correctly so that's why I specified it.
Though on that note, what parts were unclear? I wrote that thing a while ago and probably while half asleep (not to mention some parts I wasn't sure how to phrase in the rules) so I can understand why it might not be legible

Though yeah, the basic concept was a holy version of the Tarrasque sent down when a major god goes "Shit's fucked up, time to start over" or if things have gotten REALLY bad and it's time to go Sodom and Gomorrah on a nation's ass

>>51665435
>>51665536
Actually nevermind, I'm rereading it for the first time in about two months and I can already tell why it's hard to read

>>51655842
Within the context of the lore, I believe it should, since neutronium golems are basically the attack dogs of time lords, and the Lady of Pain is unless I'm mistaken just a planar god? Planar gods are comparatively only middling CR on the immortals scale.

>>51664149
No idea, what did you find? I assume Ascension and Bestiary?

>>51665700
Yes

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>>51649460
While we're on the subject of retarded shit.

What I love about Ymir is that he really is just a big meaty giant the size of Mercury and nothing more.

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>>51649460
>>51651512
>>51655842
If anything can give the lady of pain a run for her money it's one of these absurd things. Hard to beat a breath weapon that erases people from reality.

>>51665865
>animal handling(Bovines)
lol

>>51666703
I'd be more afraid of the nigger that uses the thing as a whip.

>>51666739
Gotta love how fast the encounter suggestions escalate
>Aftermath of attack
>Guy claiming to be from another dimension
>AN ARMY OF MACROBE HUMANS FROM ANOTHER DIMENSION BEING LED BY GARGILLIAN, WHO USES A NEXUS DRAGON AS A FUCKING WHIP

>>51666812
The first two are really nice ways of incorporating the thing into your game, the third one is some hilarious bullshit that I'd love to see play out once and only once.

>>51665828
That's it

>>51666812
This book also has a nigger who uses a galaxy as a shuriken...

>>51666929
At times like this, I wish I saved the Nigguard Prestige class post.

>>51666929
You can fight the DM in it, as in the in-game characters fighting the literal DM.

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the 3e epic level handbook has a lot of cool shit especially the atropal.

>>51664837
>Sleigh movement: infinite

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>>51666703
>Nexus dragons occasionally find themselves at odds with time lords, but usually steer clear of such beings
What the fuck are those Time Lords?
How does the hierarchy between those and literal gods work?

>>51665695
>>51666703
Does anybody have stats or anything on the Time Lords from this book? Googling "D&D Time Lord" just gives me a bunch of severely unbalanced Dr. Who homebrews.

>>51667916
I'm fairly certain time lords are significantly above gods.

But I'm >>51667994 so I don't actually know.

>>51667412
QUAAAIIIIDDDD

>>51667916
In the Immortals world, Time Lords are sentient universes. Or that is to say, universes in the setting are sentient beings. In the book it actually describes fighting one, as if you were on a world, everything from the air to the ground and inbetween is attacking you. Like if you're in a house, even the furniture starts trying to kill you.

In all of existence, you've got the multiverse of different time lords kind of wandering around and existing. Typical gods are significantly lower threat than Time Lords becuase they exist and live within the Time Lords, and are specific to that Time Lord universe "body". Some gods are more powerful than others though and some can be special in their relationship with Time Lords, but generally, gods are weaker.

That said, as seen, Nexus dragons for example can be around the power of a Time Lord, and there are a number of such entities that are around that level of power, and some few that are more powerful.

>>51668186
So they don't have a presence in the Forgotten Realms, Nerath, Sigil, Eberron, etc?
Which literature and rulebooks feature them?

>>51668234
Who doesn't, the time lords? It's important to clarify that not all universes are time lords, a time lord is basically an awakened universe. So some universes are just mundane and unawakened, some are fully sentient and empowered Time Lords, and some fall between the two ends of the scale.

So if you hold the Immortals lore above the others, then those other settings could exist within/are part of time lords, depending on how "awakened" their parent universe is.

As I recall, time lords are explained and written about in either vol. 2 or 3 of the Immortal's Handbook.

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>>51668186
There comes a point where fear isn't an issue anymore, because no matter who you are, what you do or what you might become, those powers would never need to know you exist.
That is several points beyond that.

>>51668373
If you're thinking of it as a whole, then for a Time Lord, if the universe is their body, then the Neutronium Golems for example, are the white blood cells of the immune system.

>>51651394
Do the Gods not have CR?
Am I a heretic of all religions to say that?

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>>51665695

LoP can swar greater deities like gnats, and at the end of 2E she restructured the planes with a single word. Not sure if her origin was ever revealed or not.

>>51658407

Sure, vampires become much stronger as they age. So do liches, just check some of the shit in this thread. An alkalich will shit all over any vampire lord.

>>51669349

*Akalich

>>51669306
She's not greater than the setting she exists in, it would be like if the actual physical rulebook started fighting against her.

Still not powerful enough? We can keep going higher, Immortals goes as high as the DM.

>>51669404

If it steps into sigil it gets fucked. Vecna was only able to get inside and not get swatted because of a cosmic loophole that she then fixed.

>>51669404

If it has stats, she beats it

>>51669265
The gods are unstatted and lack CR. They are so powerful, they transcend the ability to kill them.

>>51669446
But the Great Old Ones do?

>>51669446

Pretty sure they are statted. Immortals handbook or another one.

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>>51652895
>I'd much rather fight an Alcoholich

>>51669442
In Immortals, once you enter the acashic library, it becomes true freeform roleplay without stats.

>>51669442

Looking at her lore she isn't that powerful on a cosmic scale. She thumped a local god and can kill or teleport mortals.

We literally are talking on the scale of creatures that can remove reality by breathing being used as handheld weapons and you are bringing in someone who can't leave a fixed area.

>>51669452
Only some great old ones. Bokrug is basically shit tier and barely counts as a Great Old One. Cthulhu is just a very powerful one off priest of the actual Great Old Ones, Hastur you only really kill his current incarnation upon that area. You'll notice from that list quite a few of the more powerful ones aren't statted.

>>51669472
Immortals handbook is such ridiculous stupid bullshit and is third party, there are no official PF stats for gods.

>>51669544
So, in PF, is the only thing more powerful than time lords Apsu and Timiat?

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>>51666929
Just who the hell do you think I am?

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>>51669306
>Not sure if her origin was ever revealed or not.
Pages of Pain. It raises more questions than answers though.

>>51669508
>>51669535

The Lady of Pain, like Kaine in WoD, is a walking plot device. Any DM that uses her otherwise is a autist who clearly does not understand the Planescape setting.

>>51668234
only this one it is a 3rd party book not an official suplement

>>51667412
Look's like Nihilant from half life.

>Where's my bloody HEC ?

>>51669404

You don't understand. What that ability entails is that she can reconstruct or deconstruct anything within her domain like they're made of Lego. If the Neutronium Golem attempted to intrude, she'd disassemble it the same way the Time Lord who sent it created it.

>>51649977
what is this?

>>51649460
Holy shit. Doctor Who isn't one to fuck around.

>>51649782
The lich is one of the most iconic endgame bosses in D&D, of course it's going to be up there.

>>51669404
I'm pretty sure the Lady of Pain would be able to beat the rulebook coming to life and attacking her.

This thread made me nut. I love the cosmic Marvel comics where people talk to fucking Eternity and Infinity and shit. These immortals books are like that on steroids. I love it.

>>51670823
Her realm is within the Time Lord though.

To be fair, there are gods which can exceed Time Lords, and she may be one, but there are things greater than Time Lords in the setting, the scale keeps going higher and higher to a point where normal RPG conventions like stats are discarded. The Immortals setting actually takes the real world into account, for as meta as that may be.

>>51669404
Post stats for DM

>>51668234
You don't understand. The Forgotten Realms, as a campaign setting, IS a time lord.

>>51671667
1000d1000 levels in virginity :^)

>>51663879
When I was doing a speedrun I hit him first of all the Lord Soul bosses. Easy kill, free dosh. But then, I was kinda unimpressed with most of that series of bosses, even the first time I played. Seath went down like a chump, Nito was tricky to get to but other than that not really an issue. Four Kings gave me some trouble on figuring out where the fuck he was but otherwise took 3 tries and we've been over Bed of Chaos. Super cool fights all around, but not as difficult as they were built up to be.

>>51674432
>Nito was tricky to get to
Why can't people understand that dog skeletons can't see you if you hug the wall?

>>51669349
>Akaliches
>Canon
>Implying the vampires I'm talking about are vampire lords, AKA Orcuscocksuck web enhancement shit that offset the actual aging process of vampires

I still don't understand akaliches

>>51678881
Maybe when you're 10k years old, then you will understand.

>>51678881
Really old wizards that are stronger than most gods because they're really fucking old.

why does everybody always think of that 3rd party imortals handbook before they think of the epic level handbook.

>>51681526
Because the neutronium golem became memetic at some point.

>>51649420
All the Deities.

>>51678881

You combine one with a acidilich to get a neutralich.

>>51670974
Not that anon but iirc that's one of the higher beings of one of the good aligned outer planes.
Had laser stigmata and a bunch of other crazy shit.

>>51668186
>>51669306
What would be the ramifications, if say WoTC made the Immortals handbook official lore, as well as declared that the Lady of Pain is a Time Lord?

I think it would be neat.

>>51658407
A lich's strength is entirely unrelated to their special abilities and racial attributes (although they are nice) and is derived solely from the fact that they're Epic level arcane spellcasters.

An Awakened housecat with 20-some levels of Wizard and a Lich are not significantly different in power.

Oh wow, a vampire with Blackguard class levels and a couple templates. That's adorable. Spellcasters are fundamentally, institutionally broken in 3.X. A high level wizard's godlike abilities are limited only by DM house-rules, begging and pleading not to break their campaign, and the number of available sourcebooks at your disposal.

Using only 100% core, SRD materials that are in every single game of dungeons and dragons, you can chain-summon an arbitrary number of Solars with a single use of Gate.

Gate summons and binds the target to your will absolutely for as many rounds as you have caster levels. Solars cast Divine spells as a 20th level Cleric. 20th level clerics can cast Gate. See where this is going?

Lich McSkellington casts Gate, choosing to use the caster-level duration rather than bargain for a long-term deal. There's no save or any resistance allowed when dealing with non-unique entities or non-deities, the Solar is effectively a Summon Monster for the next 20 rounds.

Lich McSkellington commands the Solar to cast Gate, summoning another Solar under the same conditions. This second solar is bound to the will of the first, who is bound to the will of the lich.

You see where this is going. 20th level clerics get 4 9th level spell slots per day, not counting their domain bonus. Even ignoring bonus spells from their WIS of 25, that means every solar Gated in will then summon four more solars, who will then summon four more, each.

Repeat this process as many times as you want, then have one of the most recently summoned Solars use Gate for its traveling abilities to the exact location on whatever Plane you want to annihilate. Scry-And-Die.

>>51668234
basically you are just a single cell in its body

>>51685080
Liches in 5e get a whole lot of nasty features aside from that, not the least of which is using spellcasting on legendary actions.

>>51676545
Just demi-liches are murder machines.
And exactly what sources are you drawing on for your "vampires are the ultimate super evil and would beat everything but they're just too lazy"?

>>51685756
I think he is talking about straud

>>51684096
It'd have no effect on well constructed games because they'd never use that shit.

>>51685080
Based on a flawed assumption. Not all Solars will have Gate prepared or 9th level spell slots left, and the binding doesn't last long enough to make them rectify that.

Your opfu is weak, young one.

>>51681526
Because it's fucking awesome/pants on head retarded, depending on how serious you like your games. In either case, people usually have strong opinions on it.

>>51685824
Stroud may be a shithole, but I wouldn't go as far as to call it the ultimate evil.