Is it evil to overkill an opponent? Like stabbing the corpse

Desecrating the dead is generally frowned upon, yes.

The guy's already dead, what does it matter?
Also inb4 thread devolves into 3.x shitposting

>>51636869

Probably not evil, but there's definitely something unpleasant and unhinged about it. At my table I wouldn't force an alignment change but people will definitely start reacting differently to you.

>>51636869
Mutilating a body is a disrespectful thing to do but not outright evil, and it could be justified if the guy has came back from the dead and you really want to make sure he doesn't do it again.

>>51636869
Debatably evil, but generally not capital E Evil. You can take it too far though.
Sure as hell isn't a good thing to do though.

With some enemies and situations it's entirely justified. Like stabbing the corpse of a monstrous humanoid you have a deep negative emotional reaction to.

>>51636869
Depends on the setting. If it's perfectly mundane, then mutilating the corpse should probably be seen as gruesome and unnecessary. If there's magic, or even the slightest chance of them somehow being brought back to life or zombified or what have you, then taking steps to prevent that by mutilating the body as thoroughly as you can is the rational resolution. If you're going to kill them anyway, make sure it sticks.

I could still see some people having issues with it despite that. Especially if your character doesn't bother to explain WHY he's cutting off the head and limbs and setting the whole mess on fire.

Maniacal laughter won't help your case either.

>>51636869
There is no such thing as Overkill and sometimes you've got to chop off a bad guy's head and throw it out at the mob outside to scare them off.

>>51636869
And why the fuck you would even do that?

>>51636869
Not inherently evil. If you're doing it to desecrate the corpse or to make it more shocking when the dead guy's wife identifies his body then yes (but probably only mildly so).

If you're doing it because you're freaked out and hopped up on adrenaline or you're afraid one or two stabbings might not be enough to actually kill him or something like that then not evil.

That said, well balanced people generally don't have the need to do that sort of thing so it's a red flag, especially if someone does it multiple times without good reason.

>>51636869

In general, I think most "normal" people would find it distasteful. It wouldn't be considered evil unless it was done regularly, or with a glee.

That said, with literally every question asked on this board it depends on the setting.

>>51636869
Aint no kill like over kill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VNUyjRRjxM

Though overkill is usually something that exceeds the requirements to kill an opponent, like bringing a battleship to a gun fight.

> playing savage worlds
> post apocalyptic campaign
> have a character who severs a female NPC's spine after capturing her
> not for rape urges, but as revenge, plans to give her a "new life" in their village
> they cart her around in a wheelchair, she slowly starts to die from infection
> she is also a major plot point being the River Tam psychic-girl trope that a nearby cult is searching for to force her to help them summon their elder god
> end up in combat with the cult
> one of the guards they find during their mission shoots and wounds the character
> she is just trying to protect her family to be honest
> the character has two wounds and is pissed as fuck for some reason
> finally outflanks her sneaking through some concerete
> catches her unaware
> shoots her twice, crippling her legs (we were using Gritty Damage)
> proceeds to take out his Saiga 12 shotgun and fire it five times into her chest.
> I remind him this isn't GURPS and once she's down it doesn't really matter rules-wise
> he proceeds to literally unload the entire mag into her body as she tries to crawl away
> I track out the wounds (even though she only has one as an Extra) and roll a Vigor to see if she somehow survives
> she does, despite being horribly torn apart and bleeding to death
> character picks up piece of rubble and chases her down, starts beating her head in with it
> finally I give in and say she's fucking dead already
> he gets his knife and cuts her body apart, saying how he cuts out her organs and stomps on them and shit
> i finally tell him to stop
> he says he's just RPing his character
> shows the gory remains to the girl he crippled as a warning of what will happen if she pisses him off

What the fuck is wrong with the people I play with.

>>51637224
Have you told this story before? The part about the crippled villainess seems very familiar.

>>51637435
Yes but this is an update.

>>51637224
every repost is repost repost.

Go to bed collete

>>51637519
But it's an update on the story. Read the whole post.

whats your motivation?
if it is an adaptoid, then overkill is necessary if unpleasant
if it is an average joe you need a damn good reason

is there a background?
if you come from a culture where nobody bats an eye, then there is less evil, since no one ever told you its wrong
if you come from a more typical culture, and you do it despite people telling you it is grave sin, then you have more to explain for

how are they after?
does the act cause conflict within you?
do you question whether or not it is correct?
do you continue doing it, believing it is necessary given whatever circumstance brought you to do it?
do you know it is wrong and do it anyway?

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>>51636869

Players can be healed or revived or reanimated. Best to make sure they can't come back.

Don't see how it could be.

They're already dead, so it's more creepy than evil imo

>>51637457
I thought cripple girl died from infection in last update.

>>51636869
No. Only if you stab it 7 times with yo dick.

DM determined that when I cut out a dude's spleen then tossed it in the river because I was pissed at him I went from CN to CE. I thought that made sense, that was pretty overkill, I'd say ye it's bad

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>>51636869
There are reasons to desecrate a body. One of which is to keep some kinds of undead down for good. Another is because sometimes you can't be sure something is truly defeated.

It is usually not a positive experience for ones mental state.

>Stealing a 4Chan joke for your webcomic.
Disgraceful.

>>51636869
I think it's way more evil to loot a dead body. Try telling the average player that and watch the legions of hoops they have to jump through to explain it isn't.

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>>51636869
If they piss your character off titanically or if it's the straw that broke the camel's back then it's justified for you to lose your cool and go all out. Deriving sadistic pleasure from it would probably be pretty clearly evil, though.

Of course, it shouldn't be an excuse to protect you from the setting's consequence.

>>51640198
It's a YTMND joke.

>>51637070
Just teabag it like a normal person.

>>51636869
>desecrating already dead enemy

Not evil, but shamefur dispray.

>>51640213
Huh? I mean, I get looting dead innocents being evil, but if you're fighting an evil magic emperor with some staff of magic power it's actually nearly a moral imperative to take anything especially dangerous from his body so it doesn't fall into the hands of looters who might misuse it.

>>51640566
Needing to provide rationalization to excuse it is why it's inherently wrong.

>killing babies is wrong
"Well what if killing a baby was the only way to stop a tsunami from killing millions????"

>>51636869

Mostly depends on purpose.

You hack a zombie to bits because you don't trust it won't just get back up: Smart.

You shoot the enemy once or twice before approaching to see if he's dead: Smart.

You smash the enemy soldier into a half-inch slab of metal and meat because he made fun of your hammer: Probably not good

>>51636869
Using more force than is necessary to kill someone–overkill–is not evil.

Wasting time and effort mutilating an already defeated foe is just mental illness or retardation, so is evil.

>>51640260
Have to bleed out bodies right proper for the temple buddy its quite honorable adhering to the gods words about proper sacrifice

>>51636869
Is it evil to poke a dead body with a stick?

>>51640992
It big stick? Little stick? Pointy stick?

In some situations, like killing a regenerating enemy or an undead, overkill is a necessity.

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>>51636869
>stabbing the corpse 7 times with your spear and then stabbing it another 7 times with a dagger

If you're really scared about him coming back to life, then just decapitate the body, destroy the brain, burn the whole thing to ashes, either dump it in a river or bury it, make a tombstone/memorial/shrine appropriate to your religious ideology, and give a respectful offering to the deceased.

>>51639795
Why did you do that specifically to his spleen ?

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Monster hunting in a WoD equivalent, I was a SAW gunner with holy silver bullets and the party was fighting a vampire lord.

I turned the fucker into a rotted pile of mince since you can't be too careful. Turned out to not be enough overkill, the resulting mess still tried to mug a player before they staked it.

>>51643959
>he sets out to fight monsters without having fully researched their weaknesses and how to defeat, subdue, and kill them
Shiggy le diggy

>>51636869
For me it depends on the situation.

Is the enemy known for regeneration or being hard to kill?
No not evil, smart

Is it a breakdown of character due to storyline involving the enemy?
Not not evil, human

Is it a one time thing after some intense battle with an enemy that committed unspeakable crimes or that slaughtered everyone the character knows?

Again not evil, human

Is it because it's fun? Do they do it all the time? Was it unprovoked even after the enemy was dead? Is it to establish fear in other non-combatants? Etc.

Evil

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>>51638008
>D&D

Leave.

>>51644457

Time and materials for thorough research are a luxury you don't always have. Sometimes you can tell from the corpses what kind of beastie killed them, sometimes you can't. Sometimes the tomes and legends are accurate, sometimes they're not. Sometimes one kind of critter fakes evidence that it's something else, or an immortal monster spreads false legends about itself and its weaknesses. Sometimes you get jumped.

There are a lot of times you just have to run down the old silver-fire-decapitation-salt list and see what works.

>>51644745
I mean, at minimum you want to have like a cheat-sheet that says "vampires are weak to X, have Y powers, and generally do Z" in case you might run into them. Especially if your character is supposed to be a monster hunter instead of a random joe in the wrong place at the wrong time.

>>51644798

Oh, yeah, you want as much intel as possible. But a lot of the time you have to gather it yourself, and it's always gonna be unreliable. There are shitloads of vampire stories; you're not gonna know until the fight starts whether the one you're hunting can turn into mist, or punch through walls, or mind-control people. Or whether it's actually a spider-monster wearing human skin and not a "vampire" at all.

I actually really like how WoD does this. You've got groups like the Union, swapping stories and intel and trying to help each other out, but there are enough varieties of supernatural weirdness that you're never totally certain, and you can never feel totally safe.

>>51636869
Depends on the setting/characters culture. Could well be that that characters god/culture considers it evil to not make super sure someone is dead.

In our society it is fairy evil to kill intentionally, thus overkilling is evil

>>51645068
>Could well be that that characters god/culture considers it evil to not make super sure someone is dead.

It could easily be a thing about mercy and reducing suffering. Double-tapping someone might be considered more respectful and merciful than letting them die slowly and in agony.

>>51636869
Just to cause pain? Yes.

To make sure they're dead? No.

>>51636869
It's questions like this that make me glad that I've managed to avoid games with alignment systems.

If I ever run a game where PC alignment matters, I'll instead tie the alignment to what a specific god*. If that god thinks something is evil, then it's evil.

That simplifies a lot of moral dilemmas. For example the Orc baby problem gets solved with the question "Does this god like Orcs ?"

Plus there is the possibility that two PCs might do detect evil on the same person at the same time and get different results because their powers come from different gods.

*Chosen by the player. Subject to GM veto like any other part of a players character concept.

>>51636869
Depends on the situation. If it was just some random bandit mook, yes. But if that same mook burned down your village and salted your fields, it's justifiable as driven by something other than evil intent.

>>51645189
>It's questions like this that make me glad that I've managed to avoid games with alignment systems.
You mean nonsensical troll/attempted logical fallacies that a GM worth a shit would shoot down immediately?
>Orc baby problem
Orcs have been "usually evil" since forever, which means they are not destined to grow up to be marauding bandits.
Only autists (and people who haven't played games with objective morality) trot that question out like it means something, when it hasn't for 20 years.

>>51636869
It's not evil per se, but it certainly communicates something about the character being unhinged.

>>51636869
Standard minimum protocol for high level games:

-Kill enemy
-Chop his body in parts
-Dissolve it in acid
-Separate what is left in 7+ parts
-Each part must be encased into lead, gold, and concrete/stone spheres. Ideally use granite for the outer shell.
-Each part must be buried in a different part of the world preferably somewhere deep underneath earth or in ocean depths.

>>51636869
Just tell the others that it's part of your beliefs. You must continue to attack the body so that the spirit understands that it is dead. Otherwise they will continue to seek you out after the battle is over.

>>51645778
And the thing still comes back to life half the time.

>>51636869
How the fuck would this be evil? Why are alignment babies so fucking retarded?

>>51636869
Not really. I'd call it Chaotic, though, unless you have a good reason to do so(like reasonable suspicion that they might be brought back to life later or come back as undead or something).

>>51640213
Looting the bodies of fallen enemies is not considered evil in almost any pre modern setting. Its a normal part of warfare and its how most people acquire better gear.

No hoops are required, you are just a prick or ignorant.

>>51645778
That's just silly. Either the enemy needs to have a reasonably intact body to be brought back, or they can be brought back regardless and anything you do after beheading the body and chopping it to pieces is just minor inconvenience for whoever it is bringing them back.

>>51636869
why?

>>51636931
>Probably not evil, but there's definitely something unpleasant and unhinged about it.
You mean Chaotic?

>>51647014
It prevents regenerators from coming back. And prolongs the time between resurrections for those who are "destined" to return.

Maximum protocol is too much setting specific. In D&D one of the best ways to do it is probably Unname spell. If you can pull it off.

>>51637958
This is faggy

>>51646929
>>51647147

This doesn't have anything to do with the law/chaos axis.

>>51647481
Sure it does. How you treat the dead is more to do with social norms than morality, not counting those cases where fucking about with them can cause undead to pop up.

>>51644867
That's why your always carry the Texas Ranger's Bible. And remember, If you don't know what to try, more dynamite will probably kill it.

>>51637097
Just fucking burn the body. Unless you're in a cave or somewhere it's not really viable to have a fire burning it's the easiest and most viable solution.

>>51636869
If it goes beyond emotional outburst or simply ensuring death has in fact taken place, yes, it's mutilation of a body for personal pleasure and indicates you're out in the head.
Unless there's some sort of obscure due to the dead rule, just bury or burn them.

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>everybody's face when one of my players threw a corpse in a bonfire because reasons

>>51636869
Overkill is... (Select one or more depending on setting and overkiller)

>An outpouring of rage that's probably not emotionally healthy but also isn't 'evil'
>A "Fight or flight" demand to make sure it has bloody well stopped twitching. Natural and forgivable
>A deliberate expression of extreme paranoia. Not psychologically well but possibly healthy in an adventurer, especially one burned by unexpected survivals in the past.
>A deliberate choice to desecrate a corpse. Probably not cool (Though also not a major evil) unless...
>Deliberate and possibly necessary action to stop your foe from being healed, being revived, and/or rising as the undead.

And remember: In the very wrong setting, they're not dead unless you decapitate the body, burn the head and body to ashes seperatley, scatter the body ashes over flowing water, dissolve the head ashes in holy water, place the head ashes/holy water mixture in a blessed chest, lock the chest securely, weld it shut, and then bury it upside-down at a crossroads.

>>51648823
What about settings where desecrating corpses is a direct cause of certain types of undead?

>>51645778
>-Each part must be encased into lead, gold, and concrete/stone spheres. Ideally use granite for the outer shell.
>-Each part must be buried in a different part of the world preferably somewhere deep underneath earth or in ocean depths.

Add in some dungeons, and you're literally just setting up the next campaign

>>51636869
I think it depends. I wouldn't see double tapping someone by cutting their throat or impaling their heart after he goes down as "evil". Neither is beheading undead. I think of it as more of a "making sure this doesn't come back to bite us in the ass", but "unnecessary" mutilation i could see as evil, but only if it's not for revenge.

>>51648077
You need a pretty big pile of wood to properly burn a body to ashes.

>>51641041
All of the above.

Depends why you're doing it. While mutilating a corpse is frowned on, making sure some undead horror doesn't stand back up is a different matter. Pleasure or practicality?

>>51644745
I feel like salt should be higher up on that list.

>>51647481
I thought following societal norms and established customs, such as burial rites, was entirely along the law/chaos axis.

>>51636869
Kind of dickish but not evil, per se.

>>51644743

Is IRL corpse stabbing a traditional game now?

>>51638047
No she was dying but not dead yet.

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our group's That Guy cuts the penis off of every enemy corpse because LOL XD
>everyone else at the table

>>51640240
What if your character doesn't have balls to teabag with?

>>51636869
No, not really provided the requisite emotional stimulus is there.

ie he murdered your wife and taunted you with the fact that she was to bear your child, and you only hear about it from him but he's under a truth spell and holy shit you were going to be a father until he brutally torture maimed your love to death.

Of course if this was a wizard with an overly elaborate death trap no one would bat an eye

>>51636869
Just because something is distasteful does not make it evil.

>>51636869
>Prevent undead from rising, or disallowing necromancers to use body: Good aligned unless done for evil reasons.
>Ensuring an enemy is dead or reacting with anger towards an enemy that caused you deep pain, using the corpse as an example to stop the death of millions: Neutral. No changes even if paladin. Doing it too much may mean you're crazy though.
>Lashing out against an undeserving enemy, stopping someone from receiving respectful funerary rites knowingly without there being a reasonable justification: Evil.

The book of exalted deeds explains this better, as does the complete paladin manual, me thinks, but this answer is shorter and should be decent enough.

>>51654353

Then they can coin purse.

Which is all the more humiliating.

Mutilation of corpses is generally perpetrated with malicious intent and therefore evil

>>51655640
What if they don't have that part either.

>>51654353
Queef on their face

>>51657560
Give 'em the old brown dot on their nose.

If your character doesn't have sexual reproductive organs, where is their bladder and urethra connected to relieve themselves of urine?

>>51636869
Well, recently in a 5e campaign we had an enemy that was weak as shit but kept reviving due to dimensional bullfuckery. So our dwarf just sat there pounding it. At one point, he tried to go and put all its parts into what seemed a sturdy enough pot, but it didn't work out well.

>>51640214
Excellent reference picture, btw

>>51644743
Yes, there are literally NO other games where someone can be healed, revived, or resurrected.

Not a thing, doesn't exist.

>>51648919
I'd be surprised if there wasn't a religious ritual that contained at least some of that which would be putting the spirit to rest.

>>51636869
Depends on the situation.

If the guy is getting pleasure chopping a random pleb soldier or townguard to bits than yes.

If the PC his wife's murderer in the back of the head three times while screaming and crying from sorrow, I'd say no. It all depends.