40k Cheese

>>51606554
Are we going to help him as a 40k bro, or are we going to ignore him for being Tau?

>>51606554
You want to trick them or you actually don't know how to say:
>Hey guys I wont bring riptide tonight

>>51606599
Always knew that tau players are spergs.

>>51606554
>I almost always bring a Riptide
>but it's okay because Riptides aren't OP if you only take one
>r-r-really guys

I'm so tired of Taufags and this meme. Riptides are OP, full stop. It doesn't matter if you only have one. Even with zero Riptides, Tau is already stronger than an average, casual army from a crappy codex. What makes you think one Riptide added on top of that won't absolutely slaughter and win games single handedly due to its firepower and staying ability?

I've even seen people say Riptides are "weak" and "only good as punching bags" when their DEFAULT mode is either S6 HEAVY SIX!!! or S7 AP2 HEAVY THREE!!!. Like, hello? That kind of firepower is ridiculously good for something that will always be in range due to jetpacks and never have its weapons destroyed due to MC. Compare it to two Vindicators or something for equivalent points and see which is better.

>>51606648
>S6 HEAVY SIX!!!

S6 Heavy 8, even. AP4 to kill anything that's not marines, because Tau have plenty of plasma to kill the 3+ and 2+ save units which tend to be bad anyways like 35 point W1 T4 Terminators with 2+. The only good 2+ units are things like, surprise, surprise, Riptides.

Riptides are so ridiculous they can be taken in Kill Teams and can be spammed in 500, 750, and 1000 point games. KT specifically bans certain units just to prevent this kind of nonsense.

>>51606680

We usually play 1500 point games. Not to be combative, but are you saying that if you knew your opponent had one Riptide, you couldn't kill it?

I'm okay with losing, as it happens quite often, but this attitude really perplexes me in how angry it seems to make some players.

>>51606830

Name a way to kill a Riptide that doesn't involve

- Overpowered units
- Overpowered codexes
- List tailoring

Now for hard mode: do the same but with a bad, fluffy army like Black Templars or 100% chainsword vanilla marines.

You won't be able to.

>>51606830
>send 1500 points of your army to kill the Riptide over 3+ turns while the remaining 1300 points of Tau win the game

Sounds fair. There's a reason people call it a distraction Carnifex. The only difference is that the distraction is also something that you don't want to leave unchecked either, so damned if you do, damned if you don't. Pray you have enough MSU to feed it a squad a turn for the entire game.

>>51606830
>but this attitude really perplexes me in how angry it seems to make some players.

They're angry because clueless Taufags refuse to acknowledge how ridiculously broken and undercosted it is, as can be seen by your very own post. People even commonly say "Riptides aren't even OP anymore", which is technically true if you compare it to even more OP things, but what about the other 99% of the game that never got OP stuff at all, like Orks?

>>51606554
If you want them to stop bringing their A-game, stop bringing any kind of suits besides broadsides and replace them with Kroot and Vespids.

But you're not gonna do that because you're just another ass-sniffing Tau player who has absolutely no grasp on concepts like balance, so people will keep grav-dropping your well-frequented ass.

>>51607163
It's alright guys, he just likes the models. He should be able to play any army he wants to. But he doesn't want to lose, either.

>>51606680
Riptides cannot be used in killteams, it has an armory save of 2+. And it's now allowed in kill team

>>51607221
Maybe his opponents happen to like Wraith Knights or Kairos

>>51607250

Read the next sentence.

>>51607163

Are you implying HYMP Broadsides are worse than regular Stealth Suits? What's even funnier is that Kroot were auto-take in 6E championship lists and Vespids are the common Tau example of a "bad unit" but are actually an above average unit compared to other armies. It says a lot about the codex.

>>51607348
They aren't Riptide levels of broken.

Basically the entire Tau Codex needs to be redone, but then again, all the codices need to be redone, this time systematically.

Seems like sternguard with melta or grav guns could easily cripple a riptide without too much investment from the other player.

>>51607586
While that might be true, not every codex has access to Grav, and some might be have problems fielding meltaguns reiliably because range is an issue on those.
Let's talk about IG, or Tyranids, hell, even Orks, how is any of these supposed to bring down a SINGLE Riptide?
Not everybody plays marines

>>51606554

I feel you, OP. Riptides aren't OP at all, it's just that Imperialfags can't stand that we have a Terminator equivalent (TEQ).

If a Marine player brings Termies and nobody bats an eye, a Tau player should be able to bring a Riptide.

>>51607661
I don't play a ton of different armies so maybe all of these don't work, but Tempestus Scions have deep strike and can function a lot like sternguard with melta or plasma.

Perhaps a Flyrant with TL Devourer with Brain Leech Worms? S6, Assault 6, decent gun, can fight the Riptide in melee if it comes down and should beat it.

Orks, I dunno, bikers are certainly strong, but markerlights remove cover so they're not a good answer. Maybe the green tide to overwhelm their number of shots. Honestly not sure what Orks would do but honestly they're probably the codex I know least about.

It sounds like your shop is doing it right.

At my LGS if someone brings a Tau or Eldar army we have an unspoken rule they won't get games. If they try to ask for one oh look, I've got to go home. Or I've not brought the right figure case.

Of course we'll say this and then play other players at the store. If anyone complains we just ignore it, and the owner - whose idea it was - just says we're all adults and it's not his business.

Most of the time they work it out fast and either stop coming or change army.

Of course, he still sells the models and recommends new players with their Start Collecting Tau boxes come along to games night. It's funny stringing someone along

>hey anon, I was recommended this Tau box by (store owner), want to teach me 40k?
>sorry, I've got a game, grab a soda and I'll teach you after

Repeat until closing time, FLGS gets to sell soda, tryhard faggot gets what he deserves.

>>51606648

>Chaos Contempor Dread is 195 points base with a heavy bolter, power fist, and a bolter
>Riptide is 180pts base with a heavy burst cannon, SMS, and free weapon swaps

Tell me when the riptide gets fair again?

File: 1401790231998.jpg (49KB, 654x452px) Image search: [Google]

49KB, 654x452px

>>51607798
>pissants nobody is ever going to want to play with

Play better and then kill yourself. Who in the fuck are you to drive out some rando just for packing an army that triggers your feels? it's like talking to fucking /r9k/ sometimes

>>51607799
Chaos Contemptor is 195 with two twin-linked heavy bolters. That's 6 shots at S 5 AP 4 with BS 4 and twin-linking.

Not going to pretend like the Riptide isn't undercosted, but if you think the only way to beat a Tau player who has a unit that costs at best 100 points less than it should is to spam cheese that competes with '500 free points' Gladius, then you've got bigger problems.

>>51607837
spotted the tau baby

If GW won't balance the game we sure as hell have to

>>51607871
Do you also decline games against Space Marine or Chaos Daemon players? Because those armies are doing a heck of a lot better than Tau right now.

>>51607889
add war convo to that list as well.
what store is this?
I want to show up with my d-99 list and fuck them all up for the lols now.

>>51607864

Actually, it's a TL HB, and a powerfist with a combi bolter that we can indeed turn into another TLHB. Then, we get to pay 40pts to give them rending. The best we can do is give it a pair of Butcher Canons for 50pts, which is nasty sure. Eight S8 Ap4 shots is very strong. However, it's on a 245pt walker body that can explode in one hit, unlike that 180pt T6 2+4++ body with 5 wounds and FNP

>>51607938
2+/5++
Can be upped to 3++ with nova.

>>51607938
That's disingenuous, a stimulant injector costs another 35 points on a Riptide for FNP.

>>51607952
Also what this guy said.

>>51607773
Have you actually seen TS being played? Me neither, know why? 16 pts/model+10/melta, max 2 melta, 3 if the troop is 10 models. to field enough melats to make a dent in the monstruosity that is a MC with 2+, a 3++ and a fucking FnP on top of that, and considering the BS... 8 meltas for 1 (ONE) wound/turn... that is approx...400 pts of scions that have to deep strike, survive that and still be in range. yeah, good fucking luck with that. Also, that's one wound and the lovely and totally non-OP riptide will smash them to bits in 1 turn, while standing with its 4 other wounds.

Now, I don't know too much about tyranids, but I'm pretty sure that weapon isn't AP2 , and I'm also pretty sure that without AP2 piercing a Riptide is a nightmare, the only weapon that is Ap2, instakill and absolutely wrecks everything Riptide included is melee and good luck getting in melee with a jet MC.

>>51607968
the riptide can be balanced.
how's this?
base cost 200 points
ion accelerator: 20 points
vectored retro thrusters:15 points
Cannot use same nova reactor result two turns in a row.

>>51607938
>40 points for Rending

Why?

Also, it's only a 5++ on the tide, and getting that FnP is another 35 points on top of that.

The Contemptor also isn't that bad off there either, as it has a 4++ against glancing hits and a 6+ against pens.

This isn't as cut and dry as you're pretending it is. A Riptide with a heavy burst cannon has some big advantages in mobility and survivability, but this isn't a massive gulf in point cost.

BS 4 with twin-linked is far more accurate than BS 3, even at 1 less strength with the same number of shots. The Riptide has more wounds, but Novacharging to try and boost its invuln or get rending will chew through that advantage. A Riptide, especially without FNP, is really going to have to fear massed Plasma, the same way a Contemptor does massed Melta.

Is the Riptide undercosted? Sure. Does that mean your opponent putting one down with a Heavy Burst cannon and no support systems warrants bringing out a tournament spam list? Not really.

>>51607998
Pretty sure the Riptide already can't take Vectored Retro. Also, just go with that, but add that Nova charging shields only brings it to a 4+ invuln and FNP can't prevent wounds from a Nova charge.

I think that fixes most of it.

>>51607586

You ever even do the math on that? 5 Sternguard with combis and a pod is already more points than the Riptide and don't even auto kill it.

>>51608037
I would like it to take vrts, makes the shielded missile drones worth a damn otherwise they just fuck around uselessly.
but yeah only a 4++ and FNP can't save nova wounds and it's good.

>>51607773
>Perhaps a Flyrant with TL Devourer with Brain Leech Worms? S6, Assault 6, decent gun, can fight the Riptide in melee if it comes down and should beat it.

>Riptides are fine! Just use the most OP unit in the Tyranid codex that's capable of carrying an entire shitty faction single handedly to fight the Riptides! See? Easy!

>>51608010
>Sure. Does that mean your opponent putting one down with a Heavy Burst cannon and no support systems warrants bringing out a tournament spam list? Not really.

It is important to make it clear that Tau players are not welcome in the hobby.

>>51608010

>defending tau this hard

6+ against pens is worthless

both out in the open, riptide eats 8 plasma shots 6 wound it, 2 are saved. Guess who's still alive?

Vehicle of almost any kind eats 4 meltas and dies

>>51608037
I'd remove FnP from the model entirely, otherwise the only reliable way to bring one down is to spam D weapons, and that is almost as cheesy as a Riptide iteslf

>>51607889

Tau just surpassed Space Marines for total top ITC results.

>>51608010

Be glad you even get games as Tau.

>>51607871
Close faggot. I don't play at all, nothing in my area and neetbux wont support 40k. But please, explain your moral high ground of bullying others and a piece of shit who'll sell shit to new players only to fuck them over in the long term?

Get better. Beat the riptide, force the tau player to adapt. I understand that's hard for an autistic fuckwheel like you. But you'll be a better person for it- and you need it

Also, it should be noted that at least most Eldar players are aware of how retarded their rules are. Tau are all in denial

>we not OP! We swear!

Go find some eldar/tzeentch players to whine to instead.

>>51608057
>>51608070
Perhaps simply removing the option for Stim injectors on the Riptide and removing the option to even boost the shields would be good. Then the only way to mitigate damage would be to actually buy drones to bodyguard for it.

>>51608068
You call this hard? I'm just pointing out how you feel the need to lie about point costs and cherrypick your argument in order to make the Riptide seem even more undercosted or overpowered than it is.

Even in the example you gave, the Riptide who eats 8 plasma shots like that is dead if it had failed a Novacharge earlier.

>>51608095

Remove stim injectors, nova, and bump them to at least the cost of a land raider and we'll consider letting you watch as we play without you

Below is the current breakdown of what armies are winning events. The list combines all the top events for the year so far, taking only the top three winners from Major or GT events.

42 Eldar
22 Daemon
18 Tau Empire
14 Space Marine
11 Dark Angels
10 Chaos Space Marines & Renegades
6 Ad-Mech
6 Genestealer Cults
5 Imperial Knight
4 Astra Militarum
4 Space Wolves
3 Dark Eldar
3 Dark Eldar
3 Necrons
2 Tyranid
1 Harlequin
1 Grey Knight
1 Blood Angel
1 Ork

>>51608119

>t-this model is dead if it took a wound earlier in the game AND eats 8 plasma shots!
>it's totally balanced guys!

let me know when that plasma shot can remove it from the table

>>51606554
Riptides are cheese though. I play Tau and I admit this. SO here's the reality. Put your riptide down and be glad that someone is stepping up to challenge, or don't put the riptide down and play a casual fun game. The only third option is wanting to bring your OP unit without enemies bringing OP units of their own. Because you want to ROFLstomp the enemy without breaking a sweat. Maybe you get fun out of that sort of catharsis and that's fine, but consider the other player in this equation and how little fun they're having when you have a unit that is not only obscenely strong for it's points, but also has mobility that a lot of deathstars wish they had.

>>51607163
>well-frequented ass

underrated

>>51608123
Kek
Do you still not play against tau even if they only run kroot, with the old kroot hq? And maybe some vespids on top for the lol
Also, what would happen if two guys came to have a game (prearranged) and one of them was a tau player?

>>51607163
Ghostkeels are cool (outside of OSC) if you want a big intimidating suit, and they're not too overpowered (at least nowhere near Riptides)

>>51608154
Are they ok in targeted reconnaissance cadre?

>>51608089
>But please, explain your moral high ground of bullying others and a piece of shit who'll sell shit to new players only to fuck them over in the long term?

A shop sells what it likes during business hours, a private games night hosted on private property can be run however the host likes.

Nobody is obliged to play against unsporting players. The only way to teach good behaviour is by positive reinforcement.

>>51608169
so playing a faction they like is unsporting?

>>51608138
Let me know when you want to bring back those goalposts

>>51608119

Do you realize how many points it costs to shoot the amount of plasma it takes to get 8 unsaved wounds?

>>51608169
>Unsporting

You mean like refusing to actually give someone a chance to ever compete by refusing to even let them learn the game?

>>51608089
>refusing to allow someone to bully you is bullying

Lol what. Nobody has to play anyone. If they all want to boycott Tau players that's their right. Taufags really think they're ENTITLED to play whoever they want? If I were an SJW that would be called rape.

>>51608162
I hadn't even looked at that formation until today but it doesn't seem overpowered, I feel like the broadside and the pathfinders gain a lot more from that rule than the ghostkeel.

>>51608193
I thought Tau players were the one who thought not killing something in one turn was pointless?

>>51608182

Yes, playing Tau is unsporting. Just because you like unsportsmanlike stuff doesn't somehow magically make it sportsmanly. Your feelings have nothing to do with whether or not something is sporting. Just because a murderer enjoys murder doesn't make it legal and his murder victims the inconsiderate ones.

>>51608150
>Kek
>Do you still not play against tau even if they only run kroot, with the old kroot hq? And maybe some vespids on top for the lol
If that's what it takes for a tau player to admit they're hyper cheesy, then yes

>Also, what would happen if two guys came to have a game (prearranged) and one of them was a tau player?

Ignore them? If they offer to play a game, then politely refuse

>>51608186
>Let me know when you want to bring back those goalposts

I'm talking about how ridiculously undercosted they are, especially compared to shit that can die in a single fucking shot, unlike you're T6 5W 2+ 5++ pile of shit

>>51608203
>Actually trying to win /40kg/ bingo.

>>51608216
>not killing the Riptide in one turn

A Riptide with even a single wound left is still operating at 100% efficiency. It doesn't get immobilized, its weapons don't get destroyed, it doesn't take AoS style damage.

>>51608217
>Your feelings have nothing to do with whether or not something is sporting.

But yours do. Glad we settled that.

>>51608089
Is your BS 1? because you missed the point, mate. The point is that to bring down a Riptide, just like you said, you don't need a CREED-like tactical genius, nor incredible plans.
No, you need more cheese, and that forces the Tau to bring even more cheese to the table, until the whole shop is a fucking cheese-central where eldar scatterbike-spam is considered weak, and where you'd have to constantly bring the cheesiest lists known to man, totally killing any fun you can possibly have in this game.
That is the reason why I personally hate the Riptide.
Also, it's ugly as shit

>>51608219
>I'm talking about how ridiculously undercosted they are

And I'm pointing out how it isn't quite as ridiculous as you're hyping it up to be. I don't even bother with Riptides for my Tau army because people just spout memes about how a Riptide would only be fair if it cost 2000 points and required you to give your opponent a blowjob to field it.

>>51608230

>Riptide gets hit with a lucky roll and murders the shooter the following phase

>walker gets hit with a lucky roll and loses it's weapon, gets permanently immobilized, loses a turn, or FUCKING DIES

one of these costs more than the other

Why aren't riptides vehicles anyway? I mean dreadnoughts are like an extension of the space marine's body right? He moves the dreadnoughts limb reflexively as thought it was his own, and yet they're vehicles, but riptides and other suits are piloted, and yet they get MC status? wtf GW? I play Tau and SM and I'm pissed off at both of these things.

>>51608274

>Riptides area always Ap2 in combat
>Dreadnoughts have to have a destroyable weapon

>>51608240

No, mine don't. Tau are unsporting regardless of either of our opinions.

>>51608274
It's literally just a holdover from smaller battlesuits being made infantry in a time when being a vehicle wasn't a liability.

>>51608269

Riptides should cost 250 bare minimum for all the shit they get combined with being more durable than a Land Raider

>>51608269
>Tau are so OP I don't even use the Riptide

Thanks for proving everyones' point.

>>51608169
Am I the only one that sees selling things that you know are unsupported,and actively scorned as a complete fucking disk move and money grab?
Like srsly you recommend a new player the starter box knowing that if they really want to keep in the hobby they will have to buy a new army is shit

>>51608295
>Memes XD

And thanks for proving mine

>>51608309

Your point was garbage, so no problem.

>>51607798
I don't even play this game, but jeez that's both autistic and rude.

>>51608294
Cool. So all your complaining about Riptides being overcosted, factoring in the fact that you're probably thinking about them with Stim Injectors, amounts to a grand difference of about 50 points.

Yeah man, fuck those fucking Tau, getting 50 more points in their list than they deserve!

>Puts 10 free razorbacks on the table

>>51608304

He didn't recommend they play Tau, get some reading comprehension.

>Of course, he still sells the models and recommends new players with their Start Collecting Tau boxes come along to games night. It's funny stringing someone along

>OF COURSE HE STILL SELLS TAU MODELS TO TAU PLAYERS
>AND RECOMMENDS NEW TAU PLAYERS WHO OWN THE START COLLECTING SET TO COME PLAY

>>51608324
>He thinks Tau are OP
>Therefore he can't also think that Space Marines are OP
Not him but... seriously? That's the logic you're going with?

>>51608324
>implying any of the winning BC lists take RBs

35x6 = 210
50x5 = 250

5 Riptide list (which is an actual thing) gets more free points in addition to not having a useless codex and army full of 14 point chumps.

>>51608304
Except in real life, most people don't unconditionally refuse to play Tau, and not all Tau players use six riptides.

Get your head out of the /tg/ hyperbole for a few days and go play some actual 40k.

>>51608324

No, without stimm injectors. I'm talking a flat 180pt riptide puts out more damage than a land raider while being more durable. Guess what? Even at 250pts, Riptides would be taken and Land Raiders won't.

>>51608169
>Nobody is obliged to play against unsporting players
>New player is recommended by the owner these armies that nobody ever plays against
>Their being unsporting for not being privvy to your hazing bullshit.
Grow the fuck up. It'd be one thing if you actually explained to new players how things work around there, but to just lead people on, let them spend money on shit and then refuse to play with them because
>lol we tricked you into buying an overpowered army
Is literally, literally the most autistic thing I've ever seen on this board.

>>51608339
Seeing as how some people are refusing to play Tau or Eldar on principle but don't say the same with Space marines (probably because they play them), I'd say it's a fair point.

That's the entire point of this thread. One dude bringing a Riptide, especially at a reasonable points level, is not the end of the fucking world. If 50 extra points would make it fair in your eyes, then it clearly doesn't deserve the response it's been getting, at least not in the case of one.

Spamming wings? Sure, but I don't think anyone here has really been referring to that.

>>51608359

I'll bet you'd totally be willing to garnish your paycheck to support the Tau newbies though right? Because you're so sporting and charitable.

>>51608357
Cool. Hope that extra tactical squad helps you out man.

>>51608381

You assume all MEQ players are running Battle Company.

You assume the vast majority of Tau players don't run cheese.

You're wrong on both counts. Rethink your argument with that knowledge and see why this is such a common discussion.

>>51608391
>sporting and charitable

That would be the words I would use to describe someone willing to play against some new player who picked a random army, rather than refusing games over autistic rage.

>>51608396

So you're saying that even at 250pts Riptides are undercosted?

The difference between Tau and the other cheese kings is that nobody even pretends Gladius or Tzeentch summon spam is balanced, and nobody actually expects to get games with those armies.

>tfw I have no issue playing against my local Tau player with my pure Skitarii list
Granted he doesn't spam Riptides

>>51608381
Honestly ask yourself how many of these players (and I'm really going out on a limb assuming all these people actually play) but how many of them do you ACTUALLY think refuse all Tau players on principle? They're just taking out their aggression in the popular /tg/ manner and trying to fill out their bingo cards. I'm telling you real life isn't like this.

>>51608411
You suggested it, not me. Apparently that extra 70 points is really important to you though. Such an insurmountable difference could surely be overcome by spamming undercosted cheese of your own like OP suggests.

>>51608409

You keep talking but you still haven't put your money where your mouth is.

>>51608426
If somebody wants to start a cheddar arms race the only polite thing to do is oblige. The Tau player can always do what non-Tau players have been doing for generations: play at a disadvantage or not play.

>>51608413
To be fair, Skitarii has imho the best weapons to kill MCs, moreso if it's paired with admech.
If he manages to get the Riptide in melee, they can instakill it since its T goes down to 5, and while this whole thing costs 500+ points, it's an instakill that will pierce through most saves, and if you want to stay at range and kill it from "afar" they do have many MC-killer weapons

>>51608456
>Arms race

Getting into any sort of arms race is retarded when you're paying actual money to do so. How about you explain to the Tau player how they're basically bringing a 200 point Imperial Knight with 0 close combat ability, and ask them to just not bring it at 1000 points where it's a problem and save it for 2000 points or apoc or whatever?

All it takes it talking about the game like a human being instead of parroting memes about how Riptides instantly win everything forever.

>>51608492
I honestly just kill them with vanguard spam but point taken. Dumping 20 saves on them from a 55 point squad pleases me to no end because they will fail some of them.

>>51608415
sounds about right, should have realised it was bait as soon as I read it. I have to admit though, some of the most fun I had as a tau player was running a waac list against a war convo list. I only ran 1 riptide (only own 1) but I did take 420 points of FW flyers.
All in all was a fun game, we ran spoils of war maelstrom mission and I deployed first, managed to cap 4 objectives of the six on the board using infiltrating stealth team.
Ended up tying as I line broke with the flyers hovering and he slew my warlord in CC, though I did kill some shit in CC with my commander.
>>51608456
I just ask my opponent what he's ok with me running. I usually get the response of no flyers (I only own FW flyers since GW ones are shit) and if under 1000 points no riptide and/or no ghostkeel. Though I only have 1000 points of tau with no MCs/flyers, decent amount for casual games, once ghostkeel being ok at 1250 points and the other shit added on as the points increase.

>>51608511

>0 close combat ability
>S6 and MC so it has AP2

It's better than a dreadnaught with two shooting weapons without sacrificing any of its firepower

>>51608555
If the Riptide is in CC it's wasting its points and is a big dumb tarpit.

>>51608564

and yet, it will kill the Dread every time

>>51606554
Is the stealer ambush formation that cheesy?

I'm building an army around this because I like the idea and the models.

>>51608616
Not that cheesy anymore ever since the FAQ said that genestealers couldn't charge from a cult ambush

>>51608630
link for the FAQ?

Does it applies also for the 6 on the ambush table , or it is just to clarify it was not possible for any of the other result (I assumed it was the case while reading the codex).

>>51608651
The wording on the reply is weird, but the question it responded to makes it more clear. The clarification was just to affirm that cult ambush counts as infiltrate, so you actually need a 6 to be able to charge out of it.

>>51608351
You make a fine point I should have recognised the bait.
And sadly I can't cuz there are are no game stores in a 6h drive radius from where I live

>>51608274
>>51608272
Okay, if you could choose, Riptide as a vehicle or Dreadnought as an MC, why, and what would the rules look like?

Riptide still needs to have equivalent versions of battlesuit upgrades (it's still clearly a 'suit), and a shield and some sort of jump pack (as it clearly has those).

For Dreads you have to factor in there's a billion and one types and variants (though I imagine making them ICs would actually get easier)

>>51608573
Strength 6
2 attacks
Vs
STRENGTH 10
4 attacks, I 4
Are you fucking high?
Not to mention it's hitting on 4s (somethings 5s)

>>51606866
A lucky hit with beast hunter shells?

>>51608718
Well that's how I interpreted it on my first read. Charging from almost anywhere in the table with a high probability on turn one would have been a bit cheesy indeed.

>>51608737

he said its better than a dreadnought with 2 shooting weapons

in which case the dread is S6 AP-

reading comprehension

>>51607798
thats the most autistic and petty thing ive heard, its even a fucking dumb business model for the owner because why would they buy any models if they literally never get games at that store? instead of spending hundreds on building their army up they get their start collecting and never go anywhere.

oh but by all means revel in the sale of a can of coke.

>>51607798
You are disgusting. At least be honest with them instead of stringing along some newbie who probably doesn't know any better and just bought an army that looked cool and was recommended to them, and then spent time putting them together, painting them, and looking forward to playing them with other people and learning the hobby.

Is it really that hard to just say "I won't play against any Tau army, sorry"? Or just specifically mention that the Riptide is broken and you refuse to play against it? How is treating someone new to the hobby like trash and laughing at them just because you don't like the faction they picked out better than that?

>>51607798
You guys are assholes

>>51609717
>>51609719
Found Tau shitters

>>51610490
are you unironically defending this >>51607798 autist and his whole store of passive aggressive arseholes who are happy to encourage them to buy tau and then just snub them and drive them out of the hobby forever?

>>51606554
As a tau player I can tell you yes, Riptide is too good, I have one, I simply don't use it
>Why have one when you don't use it?
I like to paint and assemble shit even if I don't play it, I'm that much of an autist

>>51608128
No sister of battle...

Maybe they need more multi-melta options

>>51607798
>tryhard faggot
If he's a new player and he got recommended by the owner how is he a tryhard faggot? This is the definition of trap option

Oh wait, this was bait, that explains it

>>51606554
Show them tournament results.
Show that Eldar is winning almost three times as many events as Tau.
Show that Tau is grouped with three other codexes in Tier 3.
Show that codexes like CSM and Demons perform just as well if not better.
Show them actual cheese lists from other codexes.
Find groups like >>51607798 and bully them with Demons or Eldar until they add even more codexes to their banlist. Do it with their own armies until they just outright ban you from the store.

>>51610768
more people just triggered by riptide wings and bringing tonnes of riptides in like 1000point game

if you brought one in a 1000 point game people might gripe but thats all. if you brought 3 in a 1000 point game then just had the rest of your army a HQ and the minimum number of troops then people would be pissed.

>>51607798
I had someone like this at my LGS. It was fortunately only one person.
It got solved pretty quickly once we realized he was avoiding Tau, Eldar, and Necrons specifically for some reason. Just go up to them and say
>Hey, want to play a game? I have a new Ork army I'd like to try out. You sure you have time now, right? Are you absolutely sure?
>Oh, I guess I forgot my Orks at home, but I have Tau. Let's play.
>What, you suddenly don't want to? Why not?
Eventually he got harassed into admitting he doesn't want to play against certain lists, and after he outed himself as being scum fewer and fewer people wanted to play with him until he stopped showing up.

The usual to the answer to Tau i have seen in 1000 point games is fags bringing in land raiders and other impossible to damage things and then they freak out when they see tau. It literally makes 0 sense. Granted I am newer so I may not be kitting my armies out right but I am losing probably about 60% of my games so far. Psychic phase faggots

The same whiny people that hate Tau are the same liberal faggots still crying about how hillary losing

>>51608128
Dark Eldar twice? Is something else supposed to be in that slot?

>>51606866
'eadwoppa's killchoppa

If I ever will play WH40K, I will play Tau.
The amount of hate they produce is hilarious.

That makes me wonder about counter-cheese. Could a squadron of falcons filled with fire dragons reasonably kill a riptide wing immediately after deep striking?

>>51606866
Ork on a bike with a powerklaw.

>>51606866
>Name a way to kill a Riptide
Tank shock
Forcing a leadership test with any psychic power
Psy screech
Anything that can reach melee and can still hurt it
Any SM biker HQ
Any MC
Standard TH/SS termies
Dreadnoughts
Anything poison
Having the "rending" psy power cast on the riptide, then applying anything
AV 14
The list goes on

>Now for hard mode
See above

You kids really need to get good at the game.

>>51608128
>what armies are winning events

>42 Eldar
D weapon scatter bike faggots, don't play them

>22 Daemon
Tzeentch players

>18 Tau Empire
Because the "Take 3 riptide" formation was underused

>14 Space Marine
>11 Dark Angels
What's that? It's grav spam o'clock?

>>51608274
Please wait until 8th edition

>>51607798
>they won't get games
You just don't want to be beaten by 80 kroot and 20 vespid with no battlesuit support

>>51607798
You are the cancer that keeps people out of 40k.

>>51608128
I want to shake the hand of the guy who won with harlies, Takes serious skill or luck to pull that off.

>>51612774
>Tank shock
Is there something I don't know about tank shock or is forcing a Riptide to do a morale check against LD 9 really this reliable?

>>51608430
different anon, but you have shit instead of brainmatter

>>51613000
Naw, the game being absolute shit produced by a company that is literally Satan probably has something to do with it.

>>51607798
a dick move by the owner and a quick way to push newbies out of the hobby, who could have potentially bought more shit from the lgs

>>51607798
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZqUkk6fVuQ

>>51607694
Termies are fucking easy to kill you dipshit

>itt Tau shitters desperately pretending they're not op

>>51617163
If tau are op then eldar are balanced

>>51608128
Are necrons underpowered, umpopular or high showings but bad players?

I played my first game since the skitarii book came out recently versus genestealers and wiped the floor with them

>>51618401

Eldar fags don't delude themselves into thinking they're not op

>>51606648
>Like, hello?

>>>/reddit/

>>51613715
>mfw clueless retards still spout this meme

How many years out of date is this? Has to be 2 years by now.

>>51612774
>Tank shock

Too bad not every tank is a fast skimmer to catch the Riptide jetpacking behind impassible terrain.

>Forcing a leadership test with any psychic power
>Psy screech

You mean overpowered psykers.

>Anything that can reach melee and can still hurt it

literally OP melee units only, you're not going to do this with any of the sucky melee units

I'm not even going to bother refuting the rest, it's obvious you are dumb and can't even comprehend "list things that AREN'T as OP as the Riptide" because the whole point of countering Riptides is that you can only do it with equally OP shit

>Any MC
>TH/SS Terminators

Lol you're so fucking bad at this game.

>>51612774
>You kids really need to get good at the game.

Do you even know how many poison shots it takes to kill a Riptide? Smarter people than you did the math. You need over 100 splinter shots and over 14 Dark Lances to kill it. That's over 2-3 times as many points as the Riptide costs. You can shoot your entire army of poison DE shots at a SINGLE Riptide and it might not even die. You really need to get good at the game.

>>51610892
>>What, you suddenly don't want to? Why not?

Because I don't like playing against Tau.

I must live in a strange place. I have a few armies, but when I see fit to go to my FLGS, I only get games BECAUSE I have Tau and Eldar. Everyone is sooo sick of playing against flavors of power armor. To be fair though, I own neither a Riptide nor a Wraithknight. Most of my stuff is older, and I haven't debuted my Ghostkeel yet.

>>51620048
You disgust me with your holier than attitude

File: tau_feels_good_by_thevampiredio-d73bs39.jpg (130KB, 615x437px) Image search: [Google]

130KB, 615x437px

You guys are fags.

>>51620172
Just sharing my experience, no attitude here. One of my other armies is those SM no one will play.

File: What.jpg (86KB, 573x592px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 573x592px

this thread

>>51608037
>>51608057
>>51608070
The wording of Nova Reactor is 'On the roll of a 1 or a 2, something has gone wrong - the Riptide Shas'vre suffers a single wound with no saves of any kind allowed and the attempt fails."

Does FNP not count as a save? In my games, I never use FNP on Nova Reactor fails, it seems pretty clearly worded there.

>>51620748
FNP is not a save. I think it says so explicitly in the core rulebook.

>>51620748
Feel no Pain actually gives you a save specifically when it says no saves of any kind allowed.
Literally in the rules.
Only specifically saying it cancels FNP or if it is Instant Death can deny FNP

>>51620782
>>51620852
Wew lad, thanks y'all :^)

>>51620935
AW SHAT WE'RE FEEDING THE CHEESE
In all seriousness, limit yo cheese bro.

>>51620986
I'm a newer player, I have a single Riptide and a pretty varied army otherwise, including Kroot. No one ever complains at my LGS and we all have great games. Guess we aren't autistic enough to stop including people based on the army they play that isn't even the worse.

>>51621019
Well if it's only Riptide.....
The bigger problem that people worry about is LGS devolving into cheesefests as people become more accustomed to it.
(Which also fucks over new players, but that's its own story)

>>51607798
>playing same eldar army since 3rd ed
>suddenly eldar are stupidly op, games that were once interesting become boring point-and-click-to-win
>shit like this happens

This is why I stopped playing 40k. Was considering giving it another go, but this shit puts me right off.

I don't even Tau but all the torrent if manchild tears being spilled here makes me want to drop a few hundred into some weab cheese.

>>51621072
how can people be more upset about tau cheese than dark angels cheese?

>>51622395
I'm not entirely sure. Cheese is cheese no matter how you cut it. People are mad over the strangest things.

>>51608391

Suggesting someone pick up CSM or IG over Tau isn't gonna cost them an awful lot, I'd imagine, and if they get into it by getting games they'd spend a lot more.

Hell, sell them on something unit spammy and watch as the cash rolls in.

File: ki.jpg (1MB, 1280x1118px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1280x1118px

I figure this would be a good thread to ask. I have a Tau Battleforce and box of Pathfinders. What could I jump into with that and what would be the next purchase to make for moving to the next force size? Have a drone for your troubles.

>>51607798
>At my LGS if someone brings a Tau or Eldar army we have an unspoken rule they won't get games. If they try to ask for one oh look, I've got to go home. Or I've not brought the right figure case.


Why not just say "Don't wanna play against your army" like a regular non-autistic person?

File: Think+it+was+the+russians+_8fa404168d3ceb5153bf38b9ab2f1cb6.jpg (62KB, 600x338px) Image search: [Google]

62KB, 600x338px

Guys I recently started a Tau army for the express purpose of enjoying cheese. Like, I am talking about fitting an OSC and a hunter cadre with a riptide into 1000 points level cheese.

Every time I go to my LGS I just get slayed by some Eldar or Tau cheese army so it's kind of become cheese or be cheese. It's at the point where I have legit never won a game there with my Astra Militarum army (I do suck at 40k, which I guess makes me perfect for Tau).

Are people really this autistic about it though? Do you reckon I just flat out won't get a game? Why is ok for other cunts to cheese it up with Eldar, etc and pull out bullshit lists, but not Tau?

>>51623079
>I figure this would be a good thread to ask
>mfw someone would be stupid enough to think a thread like this is a good place to get friendly advice

Taufags everyone.

>>51623079
Pathfinders are good for cheap bulk markerlights, but you may want markerdrones or the FW skimmers for larger games. The Tau codex has few bad units, so if you play what models you like you will probably be fine.

>>51623601
As seen in this thread, Tau hate is a meme. If you want to be really bad just spam GMCs with Kroot to hold objectives.

i regularly vs tau with fairly casual armies and win. All you people complaining about the tau codex must really suck ass at decision making in game. Bitching about riptides is one thing but the rest of the army? fucking git good holy shit

>>51623821
I do have some old Kroot lying around that could enjoy a dettol bath...

>>51623880
I would wreck you faggot

>>51624253
if you're one of these people complaining about tau them obv not

>>51606866
A couple of venoms and luck

>>51623880
>doesn't know about Stormsurges or the Ta'unar
>can't even win a fight against the shift key

Your Tau players are probably trash.

>>51608128
Hurray for Dark Eldar putting up big numbers! >>51611436
Different Kabals had some disagreements and we decided on two entries

>>51618401
Sorry dude, We're incredibly op and it feels good.

ps. Dont put us on the same level with tau ever again

>>51624776
>Don't talk to me or my Farseer's Wraith Host again.

>>51608128
>10 Chaos Space Marines & Renegades
They need to stop listing these two together. They aren't the same army, and almost all of those (except for maybe a Magnus list) are Renegades.

>>51606866
15 tank bustas in a 4 rokkit / kannon battle wagon with a KFF mega mek.

>>51624987
?

rokkits got ap3. riptides got 2+ save.

>>51624709
who the fuck counts the taunar let alone buys it. isnt that mostly banned

>>51625888
>who the fuck...buys it

All the people that bought it? They're basically the Tau version of guys who own actual titans.

>>51608128
Who is the fucker who won with GK? I want to congrats that fuker.

>>51606554
Play your Riptide as an AV13/12/10 Walker with 3 hull points and a 5+ invul save. Problem solved.

>>51625380
Melta bombs... Oh, wait.

>>51606554
Congratulations, you have arrived at the core balance problem of 40k, which is that any semblance of balance is only based upon "may I". If you are looking to play a balanced and interesting game, you should play something else. Warhammer just doesn't do that. I know, I've tried.

>>51607798
Just wanted to drop in and say this is probably the most epic bait post I've seen in a long time

>having to warn each other what units you're fielding so the games aren't over before they started
>having certain models or armies be, per unspoken but universal agreement, the triggers that open the floodgates of cheese
>needing to warn each other not to field *these* units either if you want an interesting game
>still paying entire paychecks for pieces of painted plastic

Jesus. 40k sound like an absolutely SHIT game. Glad I never got into it.

>>51626890
40K reminds a bit of D&D.
there are some rules you must follow in order to have fun:
No cheese, heavy homebrew, and fluff before crunch.
If you follow this holy trinity of rules you'll have loads of fun even if you get absolutely curbstomped into the ground (well, maybe not, but you get my point).

>>51606648
>due to its firepower
ha-ha... Riptide have shit firepower for it's points cost. A Crisis team half of it;s price would outgun a Riptide. It's the combination of being already supertough and JSJ on top of being a decent threat so you cannot ignore them that makes Riptides OP.

>>51606648
>I've even seen people say Riptides are "weak" and "only good as punching bags" when their DEFAULT mode is either S6 HEAVY SIX!!!
SIngle Crisis with double CIBs can vomit out six S7 AP4. You can have three of them in a single squad. With six 2-show S5 AP5 drones. And it still would be cheaper than a fully loaded Riptide.

>>51626948
>Riptide have shit firepower for it's points cost.
If compared to the Tau Codex.
Compare it to any other codex that isn't Eldar bullshit or any other OP codex, is it still as shit as you claim it to be?

>>51626989
Leman Russ Exterminator
Avenger Strike Fighter
Fire Raptor Gunship

>>51606554
>genestealer cult ambush lists

what the hell else is GSC gonna bring?

>>51626945
>No cheese, heavy homebrew, and fluff before crunch.
The problem with this is that those are some very fuzzy and ill-defined rules.

I'd rather just play a good game and not have to worry about all of that nonsense.

>>51611290
>Hey guys, do I fit in yet?