/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

FIRST FOR RED TALONS

SECOND FOR MAGE SUPREMACY

>>51543789
>What is the best way a hunter could take down a beast?

Best way to take down anything which hasn't got twinked out Defense which they can apply to firearms, with about four of them being 300 yards away with hunting rifles.

>>51543801
>>51543808

These two comments need to switch. Because Mages are just so much fucking better than gay Werewolves.

>>51543789
Same way you take out a mage in Dresden Files: Far, far away from the target with a high powered rifle.

>>51543801
Red Talons are just a bunch of wolf fuckers.

>>51543835

YOU WANT THE KNOT? YOU GET THE KNOT.

MAGES ARENT GONNA SAVE YOU, MEWLING MANTHING

>>51543866

Most of them ARE wolves

>>51543899
That doesn't make it better. Because literally none of the players are.

>>51543922
>Not letting your dog play a werewolf and interpreting its random behavior as abstract dance instruction on what it does

So what do werewolves even do? I'll specify oWoD although I don't know what they're like in nWoD either.

>>51543978
>Not bringing a dog to a werewolf LARP and telling everyone its a lupus Bone Gnawer/kinfolk.

>>51543982
kill their ancestral allies and die

>>51543982
>I'll specify oWoD
They're like really angry power rangers with lots of fucking because they have to breed the next generation for the war.

In the CofD they're really angry spirit police since after their ancient progenitors killed Wolf it fell on their tribes to protect the world from the dangers of spirits, and also the Pure tribes who are dickbag werewolves who didn't participate in that ancient assassination then got all high and mighty and genocidal about it afterwards.

>>51544035
>Power rangers

Sorry, I meant Planeteers. I don't know why the hell my brain shit Power Rangers out

I was wondering if there would be anyway for kindred to become mages (awaken)?
Got a Tremere who is interested in this matter.

>>51544048
Maybe you were thinking of Hengeyokai and its Sentai packs.

>>51544077
Nope, their souls have gone to fuck. Maybe if you cured the vamperism first, otherwise you won't be getting an Avatar any time soon.
Alternatively see I think its called "Dirty secrets of the black hand"

>>51543982

Fight a losing war against the forces of corruption and entropy, die like doomed warrior viking wolfmen. Get lots of cool spirit powers and shapeshift into a living battletank of rip and tear.

How significant does an item have to be for its spirit to be Rank 2?

>>51543982
>So what do werewolves even do?
They're fucking gay, dude

>>51543847
>Same way you take out a mage in Dresden Files: Far, far away from the target with a high powered rifle.

Killing Dresden still required the very active and direct assistance of a supernaturally-adept demon spawn, Dresden actually *wanted* to be killed, and he didn't even stay dead.

#magesupremacy

As for Beasts, they can be killed without too much difficultly with careful planning and decent firepower. Just don't try to take them on in their own lair. The only beings sufficiently adept in the Astral and capable of the latter are mages.

So half-templates stack? A wolf-blooded, ghoul, proximi sounds goofy enough to be awesome.

>>51544168
I wasn't talking about that you retard, good job spoiling shit. KYS

>>51544167

Are you that shitposting frog? You really need to try harder.

>>51544251
Don't call me a frog, werefagger.

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I am the frog

>>51544274

So you ARE the frog!

Are you mad because muzzies are raping your women? You do know werewolves are very eurocentric? They are Your Dudes.

>>51544316
I always thought vampires were the most Eurocentric splat.

>>51544316
DId I hurt the werefagger's feelings? Dawwww.

>>51544334
They are, Werewolves come from Asia, Americas pre-colonization and africa/middle east. Also Australian pre-colonizition

>>51544358
No one cares about werewolf history, werefagger.

>>51544348

No frognon, You are the werefagger.

>>51544388
Not even the same person.

>>51544390
>>51544396
You're both werefaggers, werefaggers.

>>51544406
Didn't know understanding what I'm talking about makes me a faggot, good to know, thanks senpai :^)

>>51544429

Id rather be a fag than a frog!

>>51544429
>>51544462
>Gay werewolves swooning over eachother

>>51544462
What does that even mean, I'm not even from Quebec.

>>51544474
I'll have you know that only one of my werewolves is bisexual.

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>>51544474
Love is in the air

Is David Hill the Brucato of nWoD/CofD?

>>51544576
Yes.

>Father's thrusting COCK

>>51544576
In that he was behind Mage, yes, but in that Mage 2e was basically a one man written mess with some weird anti-technology screed? No.

>>51544576
Yes, just with less weird Furry shit.

https://twitter.com/machineiv

>>51544605
Oh wait David Hill, not Dave B. Yes, Hill is. Or McFarland.

Actually yeah, McFarland is the Brucato

>>51544605
>Implying Mage 2E isn't the best fucking thing yet

>>51544605

Brookshaw is the most competent writer OPP has, you fucking MAGGOT.

>>51544595
Don't remind me of it. I'll gladly take Dracula's new old world of drakness and all the bloody junks that come with it instead.

>>51544651
>>51544628
Be nice he got the Davids confused with each other.

>>51544651
>>51544628
I honestly got them mixed up and thought the anon was making some kind of weird joke about how both were on mage.

I am apparently very easily confused today.

>>51544651
Maybe, but he keeps wanking Mages despite them being already pretty good, which only serves to justify mageposters.

>>51544722

You're just being paranoid.

>>51543789
Cyanide.

>>51544614
>https://twitter.com/machineiv

Huh, he retweets Liz "Kickscammer" Sampat? Not surprised, but amused.

>>51544778
I've always been more partial to VX.

>>51544820
Oh, neat.

It saddens me how Valkyrie are treated like thugs with guns, while they should have such things at their disposal..

So apparently in Geist 2e, Sin-Eaters do not have souls. There is a tease that since you have to die to become one of the bound, the Geist is making the bargain with your Ghost. In Chronicles of Darkness a ghost is not the soul of somebody, but rather an echo left behind.

Also been listed that a theme of the game is "people without souls are still 'people' "

>>51544933
Perfect mystery fuel for a Moros.

>R.I.P Sin-Eater

>>51544933
This doesn't make sense. Aren't soulless people the easiest to possess? Why wouldn't a weird ghost who wants to "live" again just take over the body?
>In Chronicles of Darkness a ghost is not the soul of somebody, but rather an echo left behind.
Isn't it only a theory for Rank 1 ghosts? Rank 2 ghosts remember their lives very well and are fully cognizant.
>"people without souls are still 'people' "
What?

>>51545011

You have a lot of catching up to do

>>51545011
>What?
Ghosts. They don't have souls, but are still people.

>>51545094
>Ghosts are people too
Next thing you know you'll be telling people Beasts are still people.

>>51545124
Ghosts aren't people, they're just fake impressions of people.

Regards: A Moros

>>51545032
Is this from Mage? Because I don't really like it so I wouldn't know or care.
>>51545094
So are ghosts soulless echos or not? This seems contradictory.

>>51545158
>Mage hater

>>51545011
You can make a ghost from someone that's very much still alive. This means that while they may be a part of someone (echo/psychic imprint/etc), they are not the person nor their soul. Whether this means they should be treated with callous disregard is up for debate.

>>51544984

Mage and Geist seem to mix together very well.

>>51545011

Nah it's been said before, most heavily in mage that a ghost and a soul are two separate things. To even make a soul you need like 5 different arcana at work.

I imagine that the ghost of a sin-eater isn't aware it's a ghost when its making the bargain, why would it? The Geist probably snatches the Ghost up the moment dies and makes the bargain to put the ghost back inside the body at the price of fitting itself in there too. I imagine the combination of ghost and geist makes do for the "soul" in the same sense that the divine fire is in the place of a Promethean's. That being said I don't think it has a permanent case of the soulless condition.

>>51545170
I don't hate Mage, I just don't like it and I ignore it.
>>51545189
So it's Mage stuff. Nothing important, then.

>>51545124
Well, duh! People can be hated in a way such things as forest fires or rabid dogs can't.

>>51545158
>So are ghosts soulless echos or not? This seems contradictory.
In CofD, Soul is not the seat of identity. It's more of a stabilizing doodad. Live people who lose their Souls deteriorate mentally and spiritually, but remain people. Ghosts are echoes without Souls, but they CAN be sentient people.

>>51545108
Never, not until they realize the Red scare was overblown, but that the commies still are the enemy.

>>51545158
>>51545210

Ghosts are like making an ephemeral copy of a movie. It's not the original, but it still plays like everything on the disc. That being said if you are in the scenario where you are not dead but made a ghost, it's like a sequel movie where everything picked immediately where the last movie left off, but you still only have the burned copy of the original movie.

Mage stuff is important since all the underworld and ghost stuff there is all the same underworld and ghost stuff in Geist.

>>51544115
Reasonably significant to a fair few people, or supremely significant to a single person.

So think heirloom necklace given to the firstborn, grandad's beloved and painstakingly restored mustang, or the knife that a serial killer used to cut a bloody swathe across the state.

Can someone tell me how the ashes of kindred can be used? Some artifacts suggest that ashe can be used for aggrivated wounds.

>>51544933
>"people without souls are still 'people' "

That's what those bleeding heart Libertines and monkey-lovers want you too believe.

Heck, sleepers are barely "people," and that's still debatable and definitely giving them far too much credit.

It'll be a calm day in the Aether before I treat some soulless undead thing who willingly bargained with even deader things to keep ambulatory as "people."

-Azrael, Obrimos Censor of the Mysterium

>>51545385
I'd say they'd be a pretty potent Sacrament for most Death spells.

>>51545388
>Heck, sleepers are barely "people,"
Mysterium pls go...
>-Azrael, Obrimos Censor of the Mysterium
Oh... Well played.

>>51545385

Kindred ashes sound like a great sacrament Yantra for certain Mage Death spells or even a Quintessence for an Imperial spell.

>>51545388
Daksha please, you're embarassing yourself.
Go back to jerking off over your totally legitimate and certainly not fake Archmaster leaders.

>>51545358
Can death magic make a ghost of a still living person?

>>51545358
So my "ghost" would basically be a perfect copy of my mind and we can go merrily on our separate ways?

I'm not a huge fan of crossovers. All lines should be able to stand on their own, and have their own different explanation for things that aren't "the objective truth for everything" like Mage tries to do.

>>51545469
Stop trying to deny the greatness that is Mage

>>51545466
Yes, it's a death 5 spell though. Hell, you could probably make a familair ghost of yourself if you tried hard enough.

Honestly I might do that myself once I get death that high, I alredy have a sentient golem that's an exact replica of my mage.

>>51545469
Then you should probably give up on knowing anything about ghosts or the underworld as those are explicitly crossover material for multiple game lines and have the lore (and mechanics) spread throughout.

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>>51545466
Sure.

>>51545492
>Hell, you could probably make a familair ghost of yourself if you tried hard enough.
Why bother?
Create Ghost makes it completely loyal and it follows all of your directions without needing compelling. Which is better than most familiars.

>>51545492
>I already have a sentient golem that's an exact replica of my mage

What could go wrong...?

#MageHubris

>>51545501
This sounds like a completely stupid way to have people buy books. I'll just make up whatever suits me based on the core book.

So are the supernal realms actually realms in the sense of the Astral, in that your soul can actually go there, or by 'collection of symbols' are they more like classifications of the pure symbols of magic whose influence is barred from this world by the Abyss?

This part is really confusing to me honestly, I think I have gnostic retardation

>>51545552
>I hate the gameline but insist on asking questions about it then telling people to fuck off when they answer.
You seem like a fun person.

>>51545541
The mage's vice is Vanity, she wanted to build a perfect imitation of herself before she awakened and got some severe scars.

Also you know, it's sentient and has now bindings to the mage, so it isn't a slave... Probably.

>>51545374
What about an antique from WWII?

>>51545580
I'm not telling anyone to fuck off. I ask how it works, I don't like the way it sounds and decide to use the core book instead. Stop putting words in my mouth.

>>51545562
>more like classifications of the pure symbols of magic whose influence is barred from this world by the Abyss
For most purposes, the above. It's not totally barred, though. Awakenings do happen. Exarch meddling is a thing too.

>>51545562
Okay, so basically your Soul is stuck in one realm from birth to death, the Fallen World (bar Archmastery and Ascension). When you Awaken, your soul projects itself (while still remaining in the Fallen World) to the Supernal where it receives enlightenment in the form of an Awakening from the Watchtowers in an act of Imperial Magic.

When you project yourself into your dreams, your Oneiros, the Temenos or Axis Mundi, then you're still projecting your soul. If you die in those realms, your soul is still in the Fallen World, so your projection snaps back, albeit perhaps with the Soul Shocked condition.

Archmastery is the act of forging your own path back to the Supernal, through the Astral, through the fucking Abyss which blocks it off, and claiming your own hold there. This moves your soul from the Fallen World to the Astral, which renders you semi-immune to world-shaking events which would overwrite much of the Fallen World (Imperial Magic).

The Supernal Realms themselves are a realm of symbolism and symbols. It's the source code of reality, and everything in reality either comes from them, or is placed there from reality (depending which Order you believe).

Your Soul can move wholely into the Supernal, that is a fact. That's essentially what Archmastery is, where you manage to move into the Supernal wholely in such a way that you're not absorbed by its raw power, but imprint yourself upon it.

>>51545562
The second. They aren't 'places' and there's nowhere for you to go to. The reason mages awaken to the 5 paths is cause the lighthouses were made to make the experience intelligible to those that awaken.

>>51545648
Quite possibly, the Spirit within might have gone to sleep though, depending on the character of how it gained its abilities.

It would still have to have been quite significant though.
However given the emotions of the time, that wouldn't be hard.

>>51545729
>everything in reality either comes from them
No decently informed Mage believes that.

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>>51545807
The Diamond thinks so.
>As Above, So Below
Gnosticism and Platonic forms, Son.

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>What is the best way a hunter could take down a beast?

Dox the Beast.

>>51545884
DaveB was pretty adamant in stating that Mages are very much aware that 90+% of shit that goes on is not caused by the supernal. You can use supernal magic to understand them, the world and the supernal, but that doesn't mean that everything has a supernal link buried deep down or connects to the supernal in any way.

>>51546091
That's not what I meant.

What I meant was that the Diamond Orders think the world is defined by Supernal Symbols. Not that everything in the world is explicitly Supernal.
The Free Council however thinks that Supernal Symbols are defined BY the world.

The difference is practically meaningless, and has next to no practical application. But it's still a canon dispute.

>>51546154
>and has next to no practical application.
Unless you're a cool guy and use it to spark violent mage fights

>>51546175
Doesn't spread enough Banisher panic. Gotta tell people only Banishers believe one way.

>>51546154
I just go with everything being mirrored in the supernal, and vice versa.

>>51546243
This seems completely busted compared to other compact bonuses.

>>51546403
they're non stacking dots, so that makes it a little less OP.

>>51545750
I really like the questions the Sundered World poses about the Supernal watchtowers.

>>51546091
That's not exactly what Dave said.

>>51546617
Eh, way I see it it's pretty simple.

1. Oracles and Exarchs broke the heavens and re-wrote reality.
2. Oracles created the concept of Watchtowers to guide Souls to the Supernal for Awakening.
3. The Supernal cannot represent something that doesn't exist, so no Cars back in pre-history. Or perhaps it can, but people simply cannot find it.
4. In the Sundered World, mankind is barely developing basic farming skills, so Watchtowers as we understand them are straight out.
5. Thus, the Watchtowers appear as different things, such as a big rock, or perhaps they don't even appear, but their symbols still call out from before time began, from the reality that once was.
6. As mankind advances however, the Watchtowers begin to take symbolic shape, based on what Mankind is capable of.

>>51546759
>3. The Supernal cannot represent something that doesn't exist, so no Cars back in pre-history. Or perhaps it can, but people simply cannot find it.
Time may have an effect on what symbols are represented when. The way I see it, the supernal symbol for car has always existed since time in the supernal is meaningless. That doesn't mean it's meaningless to us and it clearly has an effect on what symbols are dominant.

Barely related to WoD, but what makes dark hair and light skin an attractive combination?

>>51547190
The contrast.

>>51547190
The sharp contrast. Very striking.

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>>51545984

How do you defend against doxxing if you have no dots in Computer?

>>51545984
Jesus fucking christ NWoD

>>51547397
Occultation? You can't be doxxed if there's no info on you.

>>51547409
>he doesn't know

Hasn't been nWoD for a while now, mate.

>>51547550
Fuck Swedish Dracula and his bloody genitals, I'm calling it nWoD

>>51547583

Wasn't the name change back when it was still under CCP?

>>51547583
I genuinely prefer CofD.
Stops people confusing it with WoD, which was my biggest gripe.

>>51547728
Too bad people still associate the two completely different settings.

>>51547470
Only +3/-3 at best.

>>51547747
Not exactly unreasonable to do so, despite having some quite varied tones, ultimately they are very similar.

>>51547789
But they're very different. Neither is a substitute for the other, and the only similarity is in appearance.

>>51547789
Except one of them is shit.

>>51547894
Hey, it had a pretty good metaplot.

>>51547894
Yeah nobody likes nWoD.

Why isn't there a Abyssal Arcanum?

>>51547894
The only good game oWoD had was Demon: the Fallen

>>51548150
It's called paradox

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>>51548081

>>51548178
>SA

>>51547957
>>51548081
>>51548156
The correct response would have been "Which one?"

>>51548201
doesn't make it not exist

>>51548178

why can't they just do anal?

>>51543789
make friends with Heroes and direct them where the Beast dwells

>>51548285
>some garou often enjoy multiple partners while performing this rite, although having more than one sexual partner during the rite can be SOMEWHAT CONFUSING.

>>51548201
>4chan

I'll take that dead gay comedy forum over this place anyday.

I'll still visit for pdfs and because their WoD thread is slower than I'd like.

>>51544576
Was there ever any doubt? The man is even more unable of keeping his personal opinions outside of his works, and his main concurrent is Matt "MRAs are the servants of personifications of misery" McFarland

>>51548330
You can fuck these furry titties but you'll also get a knot in your bum

>>51548348
>paying to post

>>51548384
Counterpoint: less shitposting and /pol/acks

>>51544798
>http://imgur.com/r/tumblrinaction/3t3nk5l
reminder that David Hill honestly posted that he considered Waifus racist and was throroughly corrected

>>51548285
somewhere in the flavor text it mentions that because magic and shit playing it safe isn't a guarantee against getting knocked up

>>51548357
wait, as a traveling shitposter from /v/ I dont actually know what I'm talking about, crinos have knots?

>>51548285
They're in Crinos form. They're instinctively driven to doggy-style for the sole purpose of procreation

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>mfw /tg/ and 4chan in general can't wrap their heads around Death of the Author

Just ignore the retarded fluff, you sods.

>>51548434

The only official source of Crinos genitals I xan recall is in the tribe novels, with Zhyzack raping(???) a make Black Spiral while she was in Crinos.

But I seem to recall he was shifting abd threatening to bugger-murder her prior to that so, BSD probably don't count as rape.

I would rather another magefag vs vampfag shit-war over this talk of knots.

Change the fucking subject, werefaggers.

>>51548528

True, true.

So.....


You guys think Bastet have barbed penises in Crinos?

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>>51548578

>>51548578
>TINY
>BARBED
>STRAWBERRIES

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>>51548604

>>51548578
>>51548528
So of the various splats, werewolves have the biggest natural dicks right? Or do demons out class them in that department

>>51548489
Was the BSD a guy?

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>>51548638

>>51548638
Nah man, a life mage can have a way bigger penis.

>>51548703
I said natural but speaking of that do you think there's any archmages out there that that made their dick the size of a galaxy just for bragging rights?

>>51548150
It's the 11th arcana if the Scelesti are to be believed. Unless you're crazy enough to deal with The Gate/The Old Man you're probably not going to learn it.

>>51548718
They would just create a galaxy full of penis shaped planets

>>51548528
I kinda agree with you but are kinda a little bitch sooooooo

>>51548718
>Implying magic isn't natural

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>>51548724

>>51548732
Or a universe full of penis shaped galaxies

>>51548732
That's not very impressive unless they were actually fully functional. What would they need to accomplish that?
>>51548743
Isn't the whole point that its not

>>51548599
>>51548633
>>51548683

You guys angered the frog

>>51548718

using high enough life magic to permanently alter your pattern is just as natural as being a magic yiffing shapeshifter

>>51548718
>PHENOMENAL COSMIC POWUH!!!
>itty bitty maturity

>>51548751
The whole point is that reality was rebuilt to supressed it. Even those who did this ultimately use it and are incapable of eliminating it. It's as 'natural' as anything else.

If them not being born with big penises is the issue then just imagine a master of life and time going back in time to give themselves a huge donger straight out of the womb.

Have Night Horrors: Conquering Heroes or
Beast Mortal Remains been shared?

>>51548833
>Arcmages time traveling in order to give babies giant dicks
So this is the power of mages....

>>51548833
I think Anon is more asking in a "Has a big dick and didn't hafta do anything special to get it" kinda way

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>there are people in this thread who unironically like CofD over WoD
Shame on you, seriously.

>>51548976
I'd rather be the spirit realm 5-0 than a hippy

>>51548809
I read that as 'Itty bitty titties' till my brain told me titties doesn't have an M in it anywhere.

Though same difference I guess, insecure female life mages.

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>>51548988
>wereniggery
Please stop.

>>51548976

>tfw got into wod late

I'm probably not going to be able to play anything that isn't 'neonates in the camarilla' ever again.

>>51548976
>Only one good gameline

>>51549036
>Mage the Ascension
>Vampire the Masquerade
>Demon the Fallen

>>51549009
>he doesn't like hatefucking things to death

>>51549046
And only one of those is good.

>>51549009
Respectfully, I refuse

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>>51549053
>anon likes playing the Vampire Diaries
>muh mystery
>muh personal horror
Unbelievably shit taste, swine.

>>51549083
>Being an oWoD degenerate
>calling others swine
Go to bed, little man. This is an 18+ board.

>>51548477

People can barely learn to ignore posters they don't like, they're probably not going to ignore book text.

>>51549046
Mage is the best gameline.

Only a mustard covered assmonkey would disagree.

>>51548976
What does the World of Darkness have over Chronicles of Darkness that should sway me to prefer the former?

>>51549167
I agree, Mage the Awakening is a very good game

Mage the Ascension on the other hand is toilet paper with Phil Brucato's shit smeared on it.

>>51549167
Obviously Ascension is the best of WoD, but WoD is clearly superior to CofD.

>>51549200
It's interesting and fun, the same can not be said of the absolute trash that is CofD.

>>51549223

>It's interesting and fun

You're going to have to be more precise than that. Anyone can have fun with anything.

>>51549200
It has tons of metaplot to jack yourself off with with half the design!

>>51549223
Huh. I've seen a lot that sounds interesting and fun in my casual perusal of CofD, so I'm going to assume this is a purely subjective sort of thing.

>>51549244
>>51549267
CofD has you play weak, timid, losers who struggle over (((PERSONAL HORROR))) like fairy princess tumblr queens.

WoD has you play badass, competent, confident winners who fight actual horrors with claws and spells and guns.

Hey /CofD/, I wanted to ask if anyone has tried Princess before? The idea of Exalted magical girls in WoD is insanely appealing to me, and my group (we're the kind of autists that love Only War, Exalted, CoC and Hunter) has been toying with the idea of trying it.

>>51549289
So basically in CofD I get to explore interesting dramatic stuff, and in WoD I get to jerk off over my OC?

link good podcasts / play sessions

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>>51549374
>monsterhearts but super srs
>interesting dramatic stuff
Yeah, right back to tumblr with you.

>>51549289

But I could play Dread: The First Book of Pandemonium and have the same thing with better rules. What does WoD have over that?

>>51549289
I noticed that CofD has starting characters with smaller amounts of attributes and skills and superpowers than WoD, but that can surely be altered to taste by giving some extra Experiences to start with. Is it, like, Humanity is less of a big deal in Masquerade? I know about the Paths that let you be a sociopath with no consequences but got the impression they're at least supposed to be uncommon.

>>51549472
>Is it, like, Humanity is less of a big deal in Masquerade?

Sort of. There are things in Requiem that will cause Humanity dings that don't cause those dings in Masquerade; for example IIRC surviving something that would have killed you as a human isn't on there.

>>51549400

Monsterhearts is good though

Even if I would rather play Urban Shadows any day of the week

>>51549703

That's honestly an opinion I never would have expected out of you. Urban Shadows is pretty neat though. CofD and WoD fans alike ought to give it a look.

>>51549755

You're surprised that I like Monsterhearts or surprised that I prefer Urban Shadows?

Monsterhearts is definitely the better game (I'm all for dramatic queer romance), but I'm not in love with playing teens and Urban Shadows has more types of character to play around with, which is one of my biggest weaknesses. I've given hope on their stretch goal material ever coming out, sadly.

>>51548976
If I like WoD would you become my gf?

>>51548988
>FREEZE! Drop the human or I'll rip and tear!
>Aw shit! It's the fuzz!...y

>>51549771
What's the sales pitch for Monsterhearts? Only time I've been exposed to it is through Rory so... you know.

>>51550008
>it's a Street Gang Has A First Team For Backup episode

>>51550013

Powered by the Apocalypse game about teenage monsters struggling with the confusing and uncomfortable world of sex and romance. It's probably one of the best games for interpersonal drama out there, provided your group is decent and respectful.

If your group is not... well, there was a NO MONSTERHEARTS sign on the front door of my old game shop for a reason.

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>>51549857
You're going to need to do a lot more than have good opinions if you want to be treated as something other than trash, but agreeing with me is a start.

>>51550055
>You have the right to remain silent, incorporeal, in another dimension/plane of existence, et cetera.
>Anything you say, moan, gurgle, project into my mind, or in any way communicate to me may be used against you or a portion of you in a caern of law.
>You have the right to an Elodoth.
>If you cannot afford, summon, will into existence, transmute et cetera an Elodoth, one will be provided for you.

>>51550125
>Sex and Romance
I am very unsold.
Oh well, I guess that's why he likes it.

>>51550125
>game dealing with confusing and uncomfortable world of teen sex and teen romance
Not even throwing monsters in the mix makes me want to go back there.

>>51550125
Are... Are you using this game as some way to erp? Or like, 'exprience' being a awkward teen in a female body?

>>51548839
>Have Night Horrors: Conquering Heroes or
>Beast Mortal Remains been shared?

I don't believe so, but would like to second the request.

>>51549289
What an intelligent and unbiased comparison based upon provable examples.

I have been swayed.

>>51550423
Beast Mortal remains is way better, trust me, I got both and only one of them did I finish reading.

>>51550391

The game's basically designed to play out contemporary YA Supernatural Romances, so it's less Anita Blake and more like Beautiful Creatures. I just went for more of a Clone High vibe when I tried it out, though.

>>51549771

The latter. And yeah, I file Urban Shadows in the Technoir file: cool but will never be completed in a KS sense.

>>51550312
>>51550371
>>51550391

It's not so much about ERP as how your characters respond to the nasty web of social connections that arrive from intimacy and discovering your sexuality or gender. You're either gonna love it (and similar games like Dramasystem) or hate it.

>>51550586
>You're either gonna love it (and similar games like Dramasystem) or hate it.
I'm probably going to go with the latter.

It does not sound fun at all.

>>51550586
You know this sounds like you have a thing for orientationplay, right.

>>51550678

Some folks really enjoy drama-driven roleplay-heavy stuff, others do not. It's just a matter of taste.

You're talking to someone who loves Wraith, which is basically just group therapy pretending to be a game about ghosts with problems.

>>51550696

You're not supposed to get off on Monsterhearts. It's more about discomfort than, like, awesome boners.

>>51550720
I mean, people get awesome boners from discomfort so... Whatever, don't worry about it.

The author of Demon: The Fallen sure does like to have every character say "Think about it."
Over and over and over.

>>51544722
Mage supremacy bullshit is an oWoD shitstorm anyhow.
Just look at the past dozen threads, about how Caine vs. Random Archmage.

>>51551107
>Caine vs. Random Archmage.
I'd pay to watch that fight honestly.

>>51551107
Nah that's not true, it has plenty of footing in nWoD

>>51551141
Yeah. People whine because mages try to categorize things within their framework. BOO FUCKING HOO.

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>>51551107
>>51551141
It's a simple thing, in all honesty.

>oWoD Archmage annihilates Caine

>nWoD Archmage annihilates True Fae

>>51551178
>>nWoD Archmage annihilates True Fae

Nah. True Fae use modified Archmage rules, and have an easier time grabbing more life lines.

>>51551221
Except the True Fae are only rank 7 entities. Archmasters by definition surpass them.

The True Fae also aren't Supernal beings as of 2e, according to Dave. They lost their "modified" privileges.

>>51551107
While Archmages have been moved away from galaxy destroying/universe creating, a strong argument can still be made for Mage Supremacy in CofD. Not that it matters though, because the other splats aren't somehow invalidated just because Mages can become stronger than them.

>>51551247
>Not that it matters though

Precisely this. Why does it matter if wizards are potentially greater than the rest? You don't have to use them if you don't desire to.

It's your Chronicle.

>>51551238
Are you talking about the Old Gods of Thistle?
Those are just Arcadian Old Gods.

>>51551363
It was strongly implied that the Gentry were synonymous with them. In fact, they pretty much WERE the same thing by the words of Dave.

He later retconned this as of 2E. The two Arcadias are no longer the same. One is a place, the other Is a code-reality.

So how are Rank 6+ beings scaled?
I get they're practically Gods, and beyond most PCs capacity to fuck with. But within their own category, what are some examples of each?

What makes something a Rank 8 over a Rank 6?
I'm assuming Spirits like Luna and Helios are Rank 9-10.

>>51551458
No one has ever met a rank 9 Spirit. Luna and Helios are both rank 8.

Imperial Mysteries has non-canon mechanics for 6+ entities. They're meant to throw you a bone on how to use them, and aren't binding. If Werewolf ever gave rules to Luna, they would be very different.

>>51551499
Gaia if she exists would be rank 9. Rank 10 is past comprehension it would be like the spirit of the universe.

>>51550239
>McGruff! Your a loose cannon. I'm assigning you a partner, Ms Wiskers. Now I don't want no gruff about it being a basket case either

>DAMN IT McGruff! Those were intertwilight gentries! That' it. I want your collar your claws and your totem pipe on my desk tonight

>>51551104

Look, they had a bazillion years to think about things in The Pit, and goddamnit, you're gonna do it, too.

>>51551618
>spirit of the universe
By that logic Gaia should be weaker than Helios.

>>51551499
>Luna and Helios are both rank 8
Good to know, leaves Rank 6 for Demi-Gods, Rank 7 for Gods, and Rank 8 for Over-Gods.

Could I have a "spirit of magic" as a familiar?

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>>51551642

The loose cannon jokes will never not be funny.

>>51551647
>Rank 8 for Over-Gods
Not really. Anything 6+ is considered godlike. Not all gods are equal.

What rank would be celestial entities like galaxies, black holes, gravity, strong nuclear force, etc.?

>>51551665
I get that, but if you had to try and categorise the existing Gods, then you'd go Low, Middle, and High with Ranks 6-8.

Basically I was going to have a Rank 6+ Spirit with vested interests in my city, who the Seers have bargained with, and I wanted to know how powerful it should be.
Good to know that Rank 6 alone is fine.

>>51551664
Its a classic setup of angry antag authority figure talking down the hero protag. And it's flow of noun noun noun are very translatable

>>51551693
The godlike hierarchy is classified like royal families. Archmages differ in power and have a spot in each rank depending on their Arcana.

>5
Minor god
Dihir (pl. Dihim)
Incarnae
Marquis/Marchioness

>6
Lesser god
Dihar (pl. Dihim)
Incarnae
Prince/Princess

>7
Greater god
Dihar (pl. Dihim)
Incarnae
Duke/Duchess

>8
Ancient or immense entities;
universal concepts, planets etc.
Ilusah (pl. Ilusahim)
Lesser Celestine
King/Queen

>9
Greater Celestine
Emperor/Empress

>>51551649
>Could I have a "spirit of magic" as a familiar?

Possibly, but remember that not all "magic" is supernal, and a "magic spirit" probably will not do much for a mage.

>>51551649
Not a Spirit of Supernal Magic.
And any Spirit of non-Supernal Magic won't be able to enhance Supernal Magic with its influences over Terrestrial Magic.

What you CAN do however, is get Spirits of certain phenomenon which you can already fuck with due to Magic.

e.g.
A character concept I've had for a while now, but never got to use, is an Obrimos with Fate proficiency.
The character has a Rank 2 Spirit Familiar, which was birthed when a Cat died, after having survived close encounters 8 times. The Spirit itself was one of Luck (and Cats), and could use its influences to strengthen Luck.
In effect that meant increasing the effects (just a tad) of any spell the character had already cast which manipulated Luck, through the expenditure of Essence.

So simply put, no, Spirits cannot be of Supernal Magic, and they cannot use their influences to enhance a Spell the Mage is casting, beyond perhaps acting as an Environmental Yantra.
What they can do however is enhance something you've already created using Supenal Magic, through modifying the effect, rather than the source.

>>51552095
>>51552243

Alternatively, you should have your Familiar be a Spirit of Stage Magic.

>>51551642
>In the spiritual justice system, humanity is represented by two separate yet equally important groups: The Rahu, Cahalith and Irraka, who investigate spiritual anomalies, and the Elodoth and Ithaeur, who banish the offenders. These are their stories.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP3MuUTmXNk

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>>51552263
That's pretty fucking great.
Only question is, what form does it take?

>>51552281
A bunny that hops around in a top hat like a kid in a pillowcase.

I don't know much about spirits.

>>51551649
Yes.
Have your mentor use Shape Spirit to change an existing spirit to a spirit of supernal magic indefinitely.

>>51552403
Why do I feel like that shouldn't be possible?

>>51552095
Not sure if E2 removed everything from E1 but supernal spirits do exist they don't last that long and spirits of that nature were limited to One dot. Having one through backstory is bullshit though.

>>51552537

Supernal familiars no longer exist in Mage 2e due to the revisions to the familiar rules.

>>51552481
It's technically possible but spirits of that nature can't last long in the fallen world. Without being an archmaster you can't replicate a sanctuary for them and when they die the backlash is not worth the trouble last time I checked.

>>51552537
>>51552565
From what I've been able to tell, any kind of supernal spirit has been completely supplanted in the rules by actual supernal entities.

>Play Ananasi
>Get Tick Body and Blood Pump
>Spend 10 blood to get 11 actions in one turn
There has to be some sort of errata on this right

>>51551748
Gaia is a rank 9 entity. I would put the Exarchs and the God-Machine at her level.

...I'm not sure about The Principle.

Newfag here. What's the God-Machine?

>>51553182
Extra-dimensional entity with a major boner for technomystic programs which seeks to extend its foothold in our dimension through a network of mystic infrastructure, angels and mortal pawns.

It's ultimate goals are inscrutable.

>>51553182
Nobody knows for sure. It's basically a magic supercomputer with some kind of keikaku.

>>51553161
The Exarchs are beyond Gaia.

>>51553182
Imagine Cthulu crossed with the matrix.

>>51553182
Skynet with magic.

>>51553161
If the exharchs exist I would put them at 10. There are also quite a lot of supernal spirits I'd put at ten. Simply due to being embodiments of fundemental systems. For the most part, it really would just be power leveling jacking because it only becomes an issue to archmasters who need their help. Any supernal entity who wants to mettle in the fallen world has to do it through proxies.

>>51553311
I'd probably put the Exarchs and the God-Machine on the same level.

They also seem to work together (knowingly or unknowingly) far more frequently than one would expect. I can't wait for the nature of their relationship to be addressed in the crossover chronicle.

>>51548156
Don't you fucking talk shit about Orpheus

>>51553481
I forgot about Orpheus

>>51553402
The Principle is likely the only thing we know of that could be a 10. The Exharchs are a 8/9, I'd say. The pax and the fact that they can't manhandle the Fallen world willy-nilly is testament to that. Hell, the fact that the Fallen world is important to them at all, that they might even need it, proves that in their hubris, they might've (spiritually)crippled themselves permanently.

>>51550125
>game about teenage monsters struggling with the confusing and uncomfortable world of sex and romance.
personaldramafags erryone

>>51553523
>The Principle
Who?

>>51553542
Possibly the being responsible for the creation of souls, the being that most closely resembles the Abraham God, plays a big role in Promethean

>>51553523
There's absolutely nothing to suggest that The Principle is stronger than the Exarchs.

>>51553570
Other than its ability to create souls, something the Exarchs haven't been able to do.

>>51553523
>they can't manhandle the Fallen world

I don't think you know how Imperial Magic works. The Exarchs have already manhandled reality to their personal whims, that's the entire point of their existence. They won their right to rule the World of Darkness when the Celestial Ladder shattered.

>>51553595
Having a trick they don't doesn't really equate to being stronger, though. It just means it can do a thing they can't.

What's the best Legacy for an Obrimos who is conveyed with flight, freedom, breaking the walls and shackles of body mind and soul?

>>51550720
Interpersonal drama/romance=! Sex and gender

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>>51553633
>this level of denial

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>>51551643
Oh fuck you're super right

>>51553613
Willy-nilly. They can't manhandle the world willy-nilly. The simple fact that they even need or care about the world proves to me that they crippled themselves in their mad, hubris-fueled grab for power.

But, that's just, like, my opinion

>>51553570
>>51553633
DaveB has said that the Principle is beyond the supernal. Whether that means it's stronger or just outside it's purview, we don't know. But, it is beyond the supernal.

>>51553756
It's not a denial so much as an objective statement. If it can be sufficiently proved that The Principle is stronger than the Exarchs, I'll believe it. My ego isn't wrapped up in my preferred splat being the best at everything. But when all I'm presented with is "the power to make souls" with no context for how great of a feat it is compared to completely rewriting reality and being ascended beings who exist on a higher plane of existence, my first reaction is to be skeptical.

>>51553865

I personally believe it's the source of all souls and possibly also the same thing as the Empyrean.

>>51553865
>beyond

That could mean anything to be honest.

>>51553865
Great, because if there was one thing CofD needed it was some mysterious One God figure who will be inevitably construed (correctly or otherwise) to be the world's placeholder for the Judeo-Christian god. Still I suppose not having it officially labeled as such takes an edge off of how fucking obnoxious it is.

>>51553954
>>51553872
Why do magefags get so butthurt when their is something stronger then their favorite splat?

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>>51553971
>no butthurt in either post

>>51553957
The Principle isn't exactly the sole God figure in the setting. Gaia, The Exarchs and the God-Machine are all good contenders.

>>51554098
I know, but from what I see here it seems that The Principle is being set up to be elevated above them somehow, like with its ability to make souls and Dave saying it's "beyond" the Supernal. That's what I mean when I say "One God", as in it would be Top God, not the only god.

Quick question: can Daeva actually love someone?

>>51554299
If you want them too, yes. As far as I know there isn't anything in 2e saying they can't and there's even a snippet where a Daeva vampire feels guilt for exploiting her little brother for blood and money.

>>51554330

>there's even a snippet where a Daeva vampire feels guilt for exploiting her little brother for blood and money.

Wasn't there incest involved as well?

>>51554349
They didn't bone or anything, but she did bring him to orgasm through the Kiss and he groped her boob and she loved it.

Then once the afterglow was over things got awkward.

>>51554380

Was that in the Daeva book or 2e?

>>51554388
2e.

>>51554411

Damn. That's gonna take a bit to search through. Don't suppose you remember which section?

>>51554428
>>51554411

Never mind, found it.

>>51554428
Starts on page 57.

>>51554438

Love the start of it.

>All the handholds of the tree are familiar. I don’t even have to knock on the second story window. It opens. He’s been waiting for me. The first time, I had to force him. The second time I had to beg. I’m relieved I don’t have to do that anymore, but part of me hates him for not resisting.

And then this part.

>He opens a wallet with Spider-Man on it, and hands me his last ten spot. It breaks my heart, even more than the blood, because what the hell else could I possibly take from him?

>“This is the last time,” I say. It’s such a pretty lie. I jump up on the windowsill, the air feels good and I need to get outside. I don’t turn back. “Tell mom and dad I said hi.”

Bit ruined by the artwork of the two punks in the bathroom stall.

>>51554484
She'll be straight up fucking her little brother in a year.

>>51554484
Guess it would have been too much to actually show an illustration of near-incest between a college aged vamp and her brother who is in highschool and therefore a minor.

>>51554504

Doesn't have to show the near incest scene, but her going up to his window would have sufficed or just as she's leaving it.

How would a Mage counter a Vampire using Celerity?

Simple or creative, I just need some answers.

Mage Awakening question.

If you were going to drop the Death Arcana and subsume it into the other ones how would you redo the paths inferior and superior arcana?

>>51554537

time

If a sleeper sees a mage wave his hand casting a forces spell, and sees a phone shuts off, is that paradox? If a sleeper sees a mage wave his hand but doesn't see the phone is that paradox? If the sleeper doesn't see the mage but sees the phone shuts off, is that paradox?

>>51554537
Time, Fate, Space, Mind, Death, Matter, Forces. These seem the most relevant to me.

>>51554568
The sleeper understanding it's magic is not necessary, only the sleeper seeing it is. The abyss will handle the rest.

>>51554537
Time magic is the simplest and most direct way. Either by the Mage accelerating himself or by slowing or stopping the vamp. Forces could be used to create a ring of fire around them, or Space could be used to paralyze them or alter the direction in which they move. Prime illusions or Mind projections could be used to make them run into a wall or out of a window or something.

>>51554568
It wouldn't be paradox for any of those. While seeing a jackass wave his arms around while spouting nonsense and then seeing a phone shut off randomly is weird, it's not exactly the kind of overt magical phenomena that would invoke paradox.

>>51554627
>>51554646
Doesn't Celerity allow the Vampire to act first though? How is a Mage going to react fast enough to do all of that?

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>>51553567
>abraham

so he's powered by foreskin?

Which splat book has the circumcising your daughter talent for a plus 1 to rolls?

Is my genital mutilation of devotion feat a one time bonus or is it as permanent as losing eighty percent of my nerve endings?

>>51554678
The vamp will act first but it better be a good hit, or else the Mage's armor spells will keep him on his feet long enough to counterattack.

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>>51554537
Use life and give yourself aids so the vamp becomes a pozzed up hillary supporter

>>51554678
The caveat for all mages is whether they're prepared or not. That's why I listed Fate up there. Being caught with your pants down by a vampire with celerity and every intention of killing you ends with you dead, so says DaveB. Knowing about the vampire beforehand changes everything and access to even just one of the things I listed turns you into their worst nightmare if you're smart.

/pol

>>51554717

Where did Dave say this? I'm asking because he also blatantly stated that Mages are "noticeably more powerful" than Vampires.

Celerity is also a single Discipline, and isn't going to be the norm among the Kindred. Prep-Mages are going to outnumber the speed-leeches by a very good margin.

>>51554700
>>51554717
Mages have a superior version of Celerity.

>>51554756
Right before the release of 2e. The gist is that prepared mages are really fucking terrifying (and they're the ones everyone talks about), but those you can get the jump on are simply wildcards at best. The trick is being sure you've caught the mage by surprise and that it isn't all just going according to keikaku. This is what gives Acanthus the top stop, no contest.

>>51554717
>The caveat for all mages is whether they're prepared or not
This is very true. If I were a Mage I would have a list of unwritten rules I would follow, no exceptions.

>set up a lasting Mage armor every morning between the shower and breakfast
>always carry at least one imbued item/artifact which functions solely as a magic weapon
>always carry a regular weapon (preferably a gun hidden from notice by magic)
>wear at least one imbued item/artifact whose sole function is defense
>maintain a magically fortified bolthole
>become at least a disciple of space and take portal/teleportation as a rote so i can escape from sticky situations and flee to said bolthole
>learn how to put up a mental shield or always wear an imbued item/artifact that provides me with one
>avoid getting in too deep with other supernaturals
>never head into a potentially dangerous situation alone (appearing to be alone is fine)

I'll add more as I think of them.

>>51554789
Not all of them.

>>51554801
Catching a Mage off guard is going to be incredibly difficult for any Kindred. An Acanthus is just downright impossible to surprise, unless you're another Mage.

There's a good reason why they're the strongest players in the World of Darkness. Knowledge is power and observation is key.

>>51554805
A lot of these can be handled by your cabalmates, and very likely are. Not to mention the mage economy of trading favors and items.

>>51554827
Not all Vampires have Celerity.

>>51554843
Very true, and that makes me think of something else that should be on the list

>do your best to avoid becoming dependent on people who are not you

>>51554844
The vamp in this scenario does.

>>51554805
>>51554855

That list is a tad bit overboard, with all due respect.

>>51554877
Better to be overly prepared than not prepared enough.

>>51554831
So is there any other supernatural that can potentially equal a prepared mage?

>>51554914
A plain with a cellphone

>>51554925
I still cant figure out how someone thought the you are being recorded bullshit was something clever and worth writing..

>>51554937
To be fair in theory its just a simple masquerade violation and it would make sense if the creature in question was scared of drawing attention to itself for whatever reason . Making it work on literally anything is retarded

>>51554950
But then why wouldnt the supernatural in question just kill the bastard, take the phone and be on his merry way if he was already in the process of kicking his ass?

It specifies recording correct, not livestreaming?

>>51554914

Demons can do some goofy stuff.

>kill as many people as you roll successes on a Dexterity+Firearms roll

>>51554964
Did it? I would assume that it would have to be a streaming option for it to work or at least that the data was being transmitted somewhere else so that people could leak it in which case you would have to be a lot more careful.

Probably not related but how would paradox effect a recording of someone doing something magical anyways? Would it just not trigger anything because it could be waved away as special effects?

>>51554983
I'm not sure how it works in 2e but prior to its release, the Free Council book opened with a story where some Libertines made a web show where they had a Thrysus shapeshift into a sexy demonslayer type character and they filmed her summoning and fighting bad spirits with actual magic and then released it on the internet.

>>51555063
So it just does nothing then? What if a special effect expert watched it and realized that the stuff was impossible? Would that somehow trigger paradox on something? Or is it so far removed from the mage at that point that nothing happens

I don't really know much about how their stuff works

>>51554982
Still not as scary compared to an Unmaking Praxis. Or a Rote if you concocted the spell yourself.

>>51555126
I'm not wholly sure what would happen, but to me Sleepers can only cause Paradox when they are faced with magic and have absolutely no way to rationalize it away. So ask yourself what's more likely: A special effects expert watching the show and thinking "That's impossible! There is no explanation!" or "Jesus this stuff looks real. I wonder how they pulled it off?".

Also this might be a moot point because I just remembered they may have said something about editing the footage to not look too real.

>>51555126
Paradox only happens at the time of casting otherwise when a person sees magic retroactively they have to deal with disbelief. I haven't finished mage e2 yet but in e1 disbelief is annoying for a mage. As it can unravel spells but only those that last more than an instant. You can't unravel a firebolt because it's already been cast and flung but you can unravel a protection spell if you see the mage take a break to the face and survive it outwith a scratch.

>>51555152
>comparing a Practice at a Mastery level to a character creation-available Embed

>>51555214
My point still stands.

>>51555214
Don't respond to the perfectly spherical mageposter.

Also are you from Yoorop or something? Its fucking 5:30 in the morning jakki and I feel like you've been in this thread all day. Do you have special no sleep powers from your dark masters or something? Or have you been embraced

>>51554982

Isn't that still defended against? Are templates even considered "people" for that matter?

>>51555152

Unmaking is Withstood. Though, after a certain point a Master is going to start bypassing Withstand on a regular basis.

>>51555301

I've got insomnia and I'm nervous about runni Edge of the Empire when i wake up in the morning.

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>>51555301
I may be a magefag, but that doesn't mean you have to go and hurt my feelings!