/L5RG/ Legend of the Five Rings General

>>51195982
Nah. My game I run now is in an alternate timeline but that's one based off of the shit the PCs did a century before in setting at the end of a two year game I ran a few years back, but I got some helpful stuff from some of the settings.

I actually didn't like the Togashi dynasty one, if any alternate Kami had to get a setting I'd have hoped for Bayushi. I want to see Rokugan where Sengoku Jidai is the norm, not an alternate possible future based on the second Day of Thunder

>>51196100
A Bayushi who won would be a very different person with very different methods. Getting smacked in the face by Shinsei and told to lose on purpose really changed him, probably for the better.

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>>51195899
>Hida Kozan was a Crab Clan Bushi and member of the Damned.
Hmm?

>Hida Ruri
Not just a Soshi, also a bloodspeaker that married into the Crab. Shark jumping moments from the official fiction ...

Hida Rohiteki I'll give, though she is apparently from d20 edition. YMMV on whether that counts or is disqualified.

>>51196230
>Hida Kozan was a Void shugenja, Kuni Witch Hunter, and Emerald Magistrate of the Crab Clan.
Hmm indeed.

>>51196100
I quite like the Togashi Dynasty for its emphasis on the mystical, and I really, really like the sidebar suggesting a possible plot hook where Hoshi is considering marrying a bakeneko, which would make her the Empress. He never marries without a reason guided by his family's supernatural foresight, so what does marrying a cat spirit from sakkaku help? Or is it the appearance of interest that is supposed to accomplish something? What happens if the Imperial line is half-shapeshifter going forward? Great stuff.

>>51195982
Expanded Togashi Dynasty can be found here:
https://www.scribd.com/document/241877426/Togashi-Dynasty-Expanded-v2

Unfortunately, it only previews the first four pages, and the damn thing rejects my card. Anybody willing to grab and post it?

>>51196230
Now how about the Toritaka alternate path for the Kuni Shugenja school, based on Toritaka methods, named after the family that developed it, and explicitly talking about how other Kuni Shugenja travel to Toritaka lands to get exorcism wards from Toritaka Exorcists (Who are objectively rank 2 or higher Kuni Shugenja).

>>51196298
Clearly it's some kind of trick by the Lying Darkness. You're not taken in by lies, are you?

>>51196251
Clearly we weren't referring to the same material.

In any case, by your literal statement they're a void shugenja and a kuni witch hunter, not a kuni shugenja.

>>51196298
What of it?

>>51196354
His mother was a Kuni shugenja and he was trained by Kuni in their stricter school that really only takes Kuni and very close relatives of the Kuni as students. Notice that his name is and was always Hida. Notice how it was never, ever Kuni even though he was in the stricter of the two Kuni schools.

>>51196375
They live in Toritaka lands because they're members of the Toritaka family, and are at least rank 2 in the Kuni Shugenja school because they couldn't have the alternate rank, that's what. They were never adopted into the Kuni family despite being trained in the School. If they were, they'd live in Kuni lands and there would be no reason for the alternate path to be named after the family because no member of the family would ever be in the school to develop it. Changing your family name changes your officially acceptable loyalties. It wouldn't exist as a path. That's what of it.

>>51196266
The fact that they're charging for something that was on a forum is really fucking dumb.

Is adoption even a thing in Rokugan outside of that one time the entire youngest generation of Scorpions were adopted by the Crane? I know ronin are sometimes allowed to join a family, but that's as adults, and changing your name from marriage is also as an adult.
Lineage and heritage are pretty important things, after all. Making a kid drop that doesn't seem like something they'd do outside of extreme circumstances.

>>51196528
Basically every summer the clans have small scale border wars. These are ended with a negotiated exchance of hostages who are treated as members of the host Clan, and some choose to be adopted into it if they get fully socialized.

>>51196528
Adoption happens. Bushi make orphans fairly regularly, one way or another, and those kids need to go somewhere. The Horiuchi family actually made a point of adopting orphans whenever it could, but relatives of the parents will take them in a lot of cases, either in the parent clan, like Doji Barahime adopting her Crane niece, or out of it, if the only living relative is a maternal uncle or something. Illegitimate children are often adopted by someone too, since even if the father doesn't want to acknowledge them, if the mother was a samurai, so are they.

>>51196436
Yes.

>His mother was a Kuni shugenja
Haven't read that anywhere. Son of a berserker, voice of an empress, stable void shugenja outside the Phoenix. In spite of the snowflakery, I quite like his parts in The Voice Of The Empress fiction, but don't care for the way Rokugan has apparently lost some of its strictness and minor grimderpness.

>>51196639
I can't find a single example of the specific strictness you are saying is canon. Literally nowhere does it say that everyone the Kuni train get adopted into the Kuni family. Plenty of Kuni marrying out of the family and changing their name. Some non-Kuni training in the school(s). Nothing about changing names to go into the school.

Also, void shugenja start to become more common and other schools start to work on training them without the Isawa stealing them away.

>>51196691
>Literally nowhere does it say that everyone the Kuni train get adopted into the Kuni family
It's in the way they talk about the Kuni. Each Kuni has part of the family library in their care. The sum of their knowledge is scattered amongst hundreds of family members, who have been entrusted by parents, mentors, and siblings. Once per year on the winter equinox the Kuni meet to discuss findings and recruit new shugenja - no one outside the family may participate, though the Hida daimyo is given detailed accounts of the event. Et cetera.

>>51196903
The family library has very little to do with training shugenja. Each member of the family has some of the library, and each member of the school has a satchel full of spells and maybe some copied theological texts. Very different things. Recruiting new shugenja means discussing known Crab with the talent and whatever political issues might result in training changes (Whether that's a direct exchange or gaining new students from outside the clan). If a Kuni noticed that a Hida kid probably has the gift, he's going to make sure the kid doesn't blow himself or others up, then pass word up to someone high ranking enough to make the necessary arrangements for that kid to switch from whichever bushi school he was originally slated for.
There are examples of non-Kuni in the schools and Kuni marrying out of the family. No examples of Kuni who were born to other families who didn't marry into the Kuni family as adults.

>>51196903
Read about the Kuni Library in the Book of Fire supplement.
It's not shared among the School, but the *Family*. Almost none of its documents are spells, and very few of them are standardized. Until they graduate their gempukku, Kuni students will probably only see the documents that their sensei personally owns, and probably not even all of those. There'd be literally no reason for a non-Kuni to ever be given those to protect, since maintaining the library is a family duty unrelated to School. Kuni Witch Hunters have part of the Library. Kuni without the shugenja gift might have part of the Library. Members of other families will only have bits of the library if they are allowed to borrow them from the specific individual who is maintaining those specific bits.

>>51197023
>If a Kuni noticed that a Hida kid probably has the gift, he's going to make sure the kid doesn't blow himself or others up, then pass word up to someone high ranking enough to make the necessary arrangements for that kid to switch from whichever bushi school he was originally slated for.
Never disagreed with that. The difference is whether they're inducted into the family or not, and I believe the reading of the setting material in which they are, because the Kuni are appropriately paranoid for a group of shugenja who stubbornly live on the blasted edge of Rokugan and hell, and the Crab as a whole consider most Rokugani to be annoying koma.

>There are examples of non-Kuni in the schools and Kuni marrying out of the family
Marrying out is irrelevant. Of the two non-Kuni, one is referenced to d20 edition by the wiki (I'm assuming that means they're from that era), and the other comes from after the Spider become a great clan. I'm happy to discount both of those as the "Kuni snowflake quota", to be ignored alongside anyone who wants to duel with their tetsubo or otherwise flaunt Rokugani's customs in the way some characters sometimes can.

>No examples of Kuni who were born to other families who didn't marry into the Kuni family as adults.
You know what betrothal is, right? Of course you do.

>Each member of the family has some of the library, and each member of the school has a satchel full of spells and maybe some copied theological texts. Very different things.
I disagree that you're making a relevant point.

>>51197299
>I believe the reading of the setting material in which they are
There is no such reading because it is not stated anywhere at all.

>Marrying out is irrelevant
Marrying out is very relevant. Changing your family means changing your loyalties. If they were paranoid enough to force any shugenja they get to join their family, they're paranoid enough to not let any shugenja go and take secrets with them. Also, the character referenced for the d20 edition is from the CCG. And like it or not, 2nd edition stuff (Meaning d20 stuff) is carried forward as canon in many places.

>You know what betrothal is, right? Of course you do.
No mention of them being betrothed into the family either.

>I disagree that you're making a relevant point.
Half of your argument hinges on the fact that the Kuni protect their library as individuals and wouldn't entrust it to a non-Kuni. Which I agree with, but hear out what the actual canon of it is. A non-Kuni trained in the school is not getting part of the library. They're getting spells and probably a copy of the Tao and some relevant writings that you could find in any temple anywhere in the country. If they have anything else, it's unimportant copies of broad and nonsensitive topics, like the nature of the taint or jade or general rules of engagement. The Library is protected by the Kuni family, not the Kuni shugenja school. Only members of the family have jurisdiction over the library.

>>51197377
>Changing your family means changing your loyalties
I'd say it means dividing your loyalties. The Kuni would not marry away a family member they believe cannot be trusted to remain secretive. This is true no matter which family you're talking about in Rokugan.

>A non-Kuni trained in the school is not getting part of the library. They're getting spells and probably a copy of the Tao and some relevant writings that you could find in any temple anywhere in the country. If they have anything else, it's unimportant copies of broad and nonsensitive topics, like the nature of the taint or jade or general rules of engagement.
>Calligraphy (Cipher), Lore: Shadowlands 2
They would be getting something that the other clans don't want (Shadowlands lore), or the Crab want to keep to themselves. (Crab clan ciphers)

If they are being given "writings that you could find in any temple anywhere in the country", a few unciphered spells, or basic knowledge made fit for Rokugani sensibilities, then they're not being trained as Kuni shugenja. They're not "delv[ing] too deeply into secrets no one should explore", they're not "sacrific[ing] certain inhibitions and reservations in order to serve their Clan and Empire to the best of their ability". Et cetera. They're just being fobbed off with the kiddie shit while the Kuni keep their knowledge to themselves.

>>51197632
>The Kuni would not marry away a family member they believe cannot be trusted to remain secretive. This is true no matter which family you're talking about in Rokugan.
This is also true no matter what school you train in. There's one school that does not uphold strict secrecy, and that's Mantis Brawler, which is also apprentice based.

>They would be getting something that the other clans don't want (Shadowlands lore), or the Crab want to keep to themselves. (Crab clan ciphers)
And if they actually gave away the cipher to anyone, it's a death sentence, probably on the spot. Giving away school secrets, of any school, is considered a heinous crime. If they told anyone about that cipher and it got out, seppuku wouldn't even be an option and war very well might happen if steps aren't taken to right the wrong with an assload of binding oaths or seppuku.

>If they are being given "writings that you could find in any temple anywhere in the country", a few unciphered spells, or basic knowledge made fit for Rokugani sensibilities, then they're not being trained as Kuni shugenja.
Learning things and having part of the library are also not the same thing. You can learn about the shadowlands and have experience dissecting a goblin without holding onto parts of the family's library, and that's what students do. A Crab non-Kuni learns all that and then applies it in the exact same way a Kuni does. A non-Crab can't apply what they learn very well, but they're still going to be the local expert if anything spooky happens. Duties of a school do not apply to non-clan members of that school unless they're a ward and sticking around as such. A non-Crane who joins the Daidoji Iron Warriors is not expected to serve in the Crane military. A non-Lion student of the Akodo is not expected to serve in the Lion military. A non-Scorpion Shosuro Actor probably isn't even directly taught that they can use their abilities for anything more than literal acting. It's the same for Kuni.

>>51197632
>They would be getting something that the other clans don't want (Shadowlands lore), or the Crab want to keep to themselves. (Crab clan ciphers)
Other clans want shadowlands lore when it becomes necessary, they just don't want to hear about it until then. And every single school has secrets that it won't allow its students to share. Every Technique is a massive secret. Every cipher is a massive secret. Spreading them around is dishonorable in the extreme, and also illegal and grounds for blood feuds and similar nasty stuff.

>>51197785
>A non-Scorpion Shosuro Actor probably isn't even directly taught that they can use their abilities for anything more than literal acting
There's another branch of schooling I'd not allow to pass to foreign clanners, though the first rank could get a pass. After the acting initial acting stuff, t's literally the "surprise stab people with knives" school.

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>>51195982
I was always fond of the Iron Rokugan setting. However, none of my players actually want to look at it (despite me thinking it's more historically accurate (maybe except the train, and dialling it further to the year 1200))

Question for /l5rg/: How many people does it take to consider a Scorpion removing their mask to be utterly dishonourable?

>>51198483
>How many people does it take to consider a Scorpion removing their mask to be utterly dishonourable?
There is no point at which it causes a loss of honour.

>>51198982
I mean, what happens if a Scorpion removes his mask without a full need to do so? Such as in front of one person? Or a group of people? Or even an entire court?

>>51199053
That would be an honor loss - he is betraying one of the core principles of his clan. Sort of. Junshin Scorpion (Scorpion who truly follow Bushido) are the only ones that don't wear a mask - which makes almost everybody distrust them.

>>51199053
Nothing. It's just removing their mask. No more relevant to Bushido than another clan samurai wearing a mask.

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>>51196266

>>51195982
Hoping to run an All-Unicorn game soon set during the Unicorn's return to Rokugan. I've also had ideas for Dawn of the Empire, but I'd like to get some GMing experience under my belt first.

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>>51195982
>Has anyone ever touched the Alternate Histories in Imperial Histories 1 and Imperial Histories 2?

Played the Thousand Years of Darkness, Iron Rokugan, Shadowed Throne, and Heroes of Rokugan.
>TYD was ok, but the darkness induced audience apathy kicked in pretty fast.
>Iron Rokugan's utter failure of making the traditionalist side even distantly sympathetic was a boomer.
>Shadowed Throne is underrated. It is a very good setting, had tons of fun there.
>HoR is meh, gaijin shenanigans can't save it from being unremarkable.

>>51201084
>HoR is meh
I had a similar feeling with HoR2, though I think it was mainly due to feeling like the GM was phoning it in, being completely new to RPGs, and the rest of the group being grognards' grognards who couldn't reign in the sarcasm when things were new and exciting to me but old hat to them.

On another note; haitch-oh-argh, or whore?

>>51201177
It is pronounced Whore. Also the guys that used to run the official living campaign were walking talking bags of dicks.

>>51199053
That just means there's another mask in play. A mask of honesty.

>>51197871
The Shosuro Actor Academy (That's the Acting Academy, not the infiltrator school, which is explicitly not open to outsiders) is a nationally famous artisan school that rivals the Kakita Artisans. They definitely get foreign students as part of their cover. The stabbing thing is probably downplayed as self-defense or verisimilitude training.

>>51203076
There's also a "don't think about it too hard" aspect. Even many Scorpion students in that school aren't actually being taught to be ninja, but everyone can tell that there's something more going on. Prying into it just isn't a good idea when you could just focus on what you're being taught instead.

Was there a trove of artwork/card art linked in the previous threads?

>>51204621
There is the Oracle of the Void which has every card printed for the game, with every printing with its own image, but I've never seen a large collection of L5R art linked at the start.

https://imperialassembly.com/oracle/

>>51205667
I can fuckin' see the story here.
>Be average samurai walking peacefully on the road
>Run into this posse
>They provoke a fight, thinking they are some tough cookies who can chase away a samurai "trespasser"
>Leftmost chick lacks confidence, she runs as the fight breaks out
>Second-from-left chick makes a charge but tumbles because of her oversized armor and knocks herself unconscious
>Rightmost chick puts up a fight, but she tries too hard and is quickly defeated
>Second-from-right chick is actually a solid opponent, you guess because she is the leader and now feels responsible for this mess
>You defeat her easily nevertheless
>Thinking these girls are not just some handmaiden with too much time on their hands (and too little brain in their heads), you give them a blunt but heartfelt speech about how women should really stay in the kitchen
>They skulk away, grumpily arguing between each other
>In the next town you learn that these four have a story
>Supposedly, they killed an unarmed monk from ambush a few years ago
>With his dying breath, the monk cursed them that they won't find rest until they defeat a true warrior in a fair fight
>They are also the daughters of the local daimyo btw: great shame will befall to their family if the curse is not broken, and great will be the reward of the hero who can save them

What to do?

>>51206229
Training montage.

>>51206229
You tell the tale to their father and let him honorably cleanse their shame by ordering their seppuku, since they clearly didn't have the guts to ask for it themselves after being so thoroughly shamed.

>>51206296
These girls are BAD. Like, you can truly believe that their biggest martial achievement was ganging up on an unarmed monk from ambush. A simple training montage won't cut it.

>>51206297
> cleanse their shame by ordering their seppuku, since they clearly didn't have the guts to ask for it themselves
They actually did as far as the rumors go.
>the monk cursed them that they won't find rest until they defeat a true warrior in a fair fight
>they won't find rest
As expected, it didn't work out very well.

>>51200778
Thank you so much.

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>>51206457
Then in that case go find a shugenja and get your ghost banishment going. Sounds like a good way to form a party. Lead into a magistrate game with it. Are you bad enough dudes to banish these unquiet specters of cute girls?

>>51195982
>No LBS pdf?

Are monks able to handle money?

>>51207076
Not for their own benefit. A lot of what they'd need to buy for maintenance or to not starve to death gets donated by pious folk, but not all of it.

>>51199299
Scorpion kill their Junshin who refuse to be useful.

>>51206229
>>51206457
Perfect for a Togashi Dynasty game. Since it looks like my l5r game might fall through, I might grab the other two players and run them through a few adventures in >>51200778
Because both of them think that canon rokugan is a bit stupid (Consider that one of them had a geisha for a grandmother and loves historical korean dramas- she has a point) and they love the mythic potential of the Togashi Empire.

>>51207076
There are plenty of beggar monks in Rokugan. Only their vows would prevent them. Even of those, not all monks zealously follow their vows - kinda like how the ideal Rokugani samurai is honour 10, while the average samurai is honour 5.

>>51207493
Sometimes. More often, they either scare them into thinking it's die or break their honour, or they just use them as the most honourable face of the clan.

>>51207225
Then what do monk orders of Daikoku do if they can't handle money to buy and sell things?

>>51207493
Not really. During 1E, the Emerald Champion was a Scorpion Junshin.
What happens is that the Junshin is not brought into the deeper secrets of the clan and become one more pawn on the board. While he is still not trusted, the Scorpion know many uses for an honest man...

>>51207546 >>51207576
Wasn't he given a mission to destroy another samurai with the implication that if he didn't than the assassins would kill him instead?

>>51207655
He was. The only reason he did so was because of his loyalty to the clan (something that every scorpion, junshin or not, understands).

>>51207569
Monks dedicated to specific fortunes have different vows. Nuns of Benten don't have a vow of chastity, for example. Monks of Daikoku probably spend a lot of time interacting with merchants and peddlers and generally promoting prosperity. They're still monks.

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So, our group only recently started playing a L5R campaign, and I'm still fairly unfamiliar with the setting. So, on a scale of 1 to Stalin, how paranoid should we be about the development that a NPC Scorpion lady has taken an interest in one of the party members, seemingly at random, and is kinda hitting on him?

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>>51207576
During 1E, aka right before the Scorpion Coup, Doji Satsume was the Emerald Champion.

The only Scorpion Emerald Champion that has been named in the lore is Shosuro Jimen, and he is anything but a Jushin, in fact his Exp 2 card has the fucking Villain trait.

Bayushi Yojiro, was the Clan Champion and a Junshin. He was also one of Wick's self inserts.

>>51207994
Yes.
She's up to something. But they'll expect you to think that, so she's just a distraction for the real problem. But they might expect you to make two mental steps, so she's actually going to do something because you won't expect it. But then you might outhink that, so she's not.
Or she's just trying to start up a fling so she can humble brag about it anonymously later on.
Or maybe she's actually into him.

The rabbit hole never stops.

>>51207994
About a 7 or so. If you can figure out why she is trying to get into his kimono then you might have something. It could well be mostly harmless.

>>51208073
Maybe she's not after him: The plan could instead focus on the person that loves him from afar.
Or the plan is to goad his family into a particular action.
Or the entire plan is to be a smokescreen that creates a scandal to hide an actual plan that a particular gossiping courtier could otherwise foil...

What is the most Special Snowflake character you've either played or interacted with?

>>51208419
Bayushi Kachiko

>>51206509
>>51207522

The plot twist is that the curse story is BS. The leader girl is actually a lowly castle servant, the tryhard girl is the daughter of an ashigaru, the coward girl is indeed the daughter of the daimyo, while the fatty girl is a random peasant recruited into the group only because three is an unlucky number.

The story is spread by ashigaru dad who wants to protect her daughter with it (supposedly, travelers should hear the story first and encounter the girls later - you are just one of those odd accidents). The parents of the leader girl also support the story, hoping that a suitably gullible samurai will take the bait and they can marry their daughter to him under the pretext of this "quest". The daimyo himself is fully aware of the truth and he finds it highly entertaining (he is also betting to marry his "cursed" daughter to a suitable hero and maybe even adopt the three other girls under the grass to gain even more political munition).

However, there is a dead monk, a former sohei of Bishomen who broke his neck when he accidentally fell off from a nearby cliff, and oh boy his ghost is pissed at being the butt-monkey of the story!

>>51208419
Crane Clan Shota Courtier and engaged to the Clan Champion.

Iron Chef Mirumoto who fought with chef's knives.

Mirumoto Batman, but he sucked at being Batman and got killed trying to outninja a ninja.

Scorpion Junshin who studied at the Ide School and was sooo nice and everyone lubbed her.

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>>51208155
>>51208073
Or the plan could involve multiple possible outcomes that are beneficial to the Scorpion.

>>51208670
>Iron Chef Mirumoto who fought with chef's knives.
Iron Chef Isawa shugenja who fought with polearms or a nodachi or some shit.

I tell a lie; that game never got past character generation.

>>51208904
The game I played with Iron Chef Mirumoto got about three sessions then the GM couldn't take his and Matsu "Kill Everything's" shit and ended the game. Matsu Kill Everything was just a lost DnD Murderhobo type who never got past the kill everything for the lulz stage of gaming.

Mirumoto Iron Chef couldn't figure out why no one in the group would eat his food and would get mad at us OOC for it. When I explained we just watch him chop up a fucking goblin with his knives and didn't want to catch the taint he got madder.

Shit was the opposite of cash.

>>51209041
I can believe it. Was this something started on /tg/, too?

>>51209105
Only the Ide trained Scorpion Junshin and Crane were from /tg/ games. The rest were RL games. I never actually played with the Crane, it was touhoufag and he had a period where he went full autism on L5R.

The other time I played with /tg/ we had a decent group, we just fell apart because of scheduling conflicts.

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>>51209041
It certainly is an adjustment just how important the social aspect tends to be in L5R. Even the gruff warrior type can't really get away with completely ignoring it. Particularly when you come fresh from a game where calling somebody a motherfucker to their face was a legitimate form of conflict resolution (or initiation, depending).

However, it does make for a very fun change of pace. And there is a surprising amount of fun to be found in figuring out ways to call somebody a motherfucker to their face without actually offering them formal insult.

>>51206229
Give them the D

>>51206229
>>With his dying breath, the monk cursed them that they won't find rest until they defeat a true warrior in a fair fight
>>51209473
>Give them the D
The fairest fight.

>>51208469
>while the fatty girl is

>thinking any of those girls are fat
She's not petite, but really, anon?

>>51208469
>three is an unlucky number
>going for four instead

>>51210318
People here are often dumb, anon, don't worry about it.

So I've been given the chance to make up some background characters for this game I am in and I've kind of hit a wall; I can come up with bushi and courtiers all day long but apparently I can't make shugenja seem interesting.
The game takes place in Isawa lands.

Can I get some help? Just throw your shugenja ideas at me.

>>51210754
Shugenja who's a complete lecher and has spells only to satisfy his needs, as he's related to someone important and can get away with it.

>>51210754

Shugenja/architect that builds temples, secretly dabbles in commerce to fund them.

Isawa-trained Kakita who focuses on Taryu-Jiai duels to honor both his ancestors and his teachers.

Guy that's bad at casting spells, but really good at astrology and other semi-magical divination skills, tries to hide his lack of casting ability.

Shugenja that thinks the little kami in places that samurai shouldn't go (brothels, gambling dens, whatever) don't get the veneration they deserve. Goes there to provide it, does not partake, gets terrible reputation anyway.

>>51210794
>as he's related to someone important and can get away with it
Himself?

>>51210988
>Shugenja that thinks the little kami in places that samurai shouldn't go (brothels, gambling dens, whatever) don't get the veneration they deserve. Goes there to provide it, does not partake, gets terrible reputation anyway.

I like this one a lot, anon. I'm imagining the kami are very pleased by the attention, and extend blessings to the establishments so the owners and patrons all love the shit out of him. Much to his embarrassment he has ronin, prostitutes, and other unsavory types bowing low to him in the street and swearing to do anything for their big bro.

Various small misfortunes perpetrated by his overzealous 'friends' happen to anyone that could appear to be a rival and it just makes him look like a crime boss.

>>51208670
>Crane Clan Shota Courtier and engaged to the Clan Champion
Did they sing too?

I think the most Mary-sue thing I ever played was a powerful Ox clan shugenja and a descendant of one of the NPCs.
I figured since Morito's brother had the potential to become the Naka, and was pretty strong before gaining that title; his brother's kids could have the raw talent as well.

>>51211149

Glad to help, that's the only one I've actually played. Character was an Asahina, because it got a nice mix of conflicting expectations between Crane courtliness and Asahina compassion.

>>51211670
Not only was my character related to someone very influential and powerful, but his lineage also became a problem in other ways. It became the only reason why the Isawa let him study as a shugenja in the first place, why he had a few teachers so interested in him and caused a few rivalries (I recall one character was very offended that some backwoods peasant was getting so much positive attention.)
And being from a minor clan my character had the duty of being sort of the 'model Ox' and was pressured into strengthening ties to the Phoenix.

I dunno I liked the game but I feel this character was too much of a Sue or Snowflake.

>>51211670 >>51212084
Anyone else think this is a mary sue?

>>51213010
I think it'd need at least more explanation to decide if it was a Sue or not.

I guess it's kinda snowflake-y, but it depends on how strictly you wanna look at it and what the other characters were like? It just sounds like the average tabletop PC to me. I don't see much of a problem with it, personally, and we've all seen way, way worse.

Both terms are shit are shit, anyway, that are too often used by people to mean, 'Something I don't like.'

>>51213567
Being from a minor clan that doesn't produce Shugenja isn't special enough? And being strong enough to learn from the Isawa isn't?

>>51214094
Shugenja can happen in the commoner populace. Just because a family isn't known for it, some still happen. And most aren't the Badger who are so isolated they can't even think to send them off to train with another clan. Shugenja are to most rare and valuable and worth investing in to get really trained.

>>51214094
Shugenja can happen in any bloodline. With marriages being what they are, it's not even that rare, relative to shugenja overall. And for shugenja from clans that don't have shugenja schools, the only option is to work out an arrangement with a clan that does have a shugenja school.

>>51207994
Don't worry about.

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>>51207994
Sometimes people just do affairs because they're fun diversions. But to be sure, try to figure out what the Scorpion as a clan might gain by her fucking you. Do you have leverage that blackmail might make use of? Is it to make someone else react? Maybe this is all about trying to father an illegitimate heir or something?

>>51208419
My roommate once had a guy try to convince him to let them play the Emperor's adopted gaijin daughter. Who was half jinn.
I think that beats everybody but Uikku and Kachiko.

>>51214909
That honestly beats both of those too, they were at least Mary Sues within a wholly Rokugan context.

>>51214322
>Maybe this is all about trying to father an illegitimate heir or something?
And this is why you take the dirt track.

>>51214976
You know, I wouldn't be surprised if there were some Iuchi with Jinn heritage running around. The rest of it is pretty bad, though.

>>51214909
Why is Uikku a Mary Sue?

Wasn't he just some peasant child in the Phoenix lands from hundreds of years ago that was blessed with autism and said some supposedly prophetic shit and then died before he ever got laid?

Aren't most of his writings or dooms just bullshit to say things that happened in the story were destined and to debate whether or not the dooms were actually fulfilled or not?

He's not even really a self-insert, just either Wick naming the guy after his 'Japanese' name or someone on the staff doing it as a joke.


Kachiko was pretty much perfect, so that one makes a lot more sense.

>>51215169
Yeah the real Wick self insert was his junshin Yojiro.

>>51215035
It doesn't matter if the whelp is genetically yours. Indeed you don't even need to get it up with her at all to find yourself fucked. All that needs to happen is that you spend some time unsupervised with her and there was a witness to say you were alone with her. Oh, and she arranges to get preggers by someone who vaguely resembles within a suitable time frame.

So no, in a land without genetic testing where testimony is all you can be fucked whether you fuck her or not.

>>51215249
A male samurai who denies being the father wins out over a female samurai who claims the kid is his.

>>51215249
Either way it's a matter of testimony, gossip, and sincerity. If your lord asks in private and you can sincerely say you blew your load in her ass, then he's more likely to lend strong support and testimony to your side.

>>51215296
>>51215249
Roll Sincerity.

Also, I hope you have high status Allies to vouch for your honor and integrity.

>>51215249
>in a land without genetic testing
There likely are ways for shugenja to divine one's lineage, however obscure or esoteric they may be.

>>51215380
Magic isn't admissible in legal cases, which it would be if she claimed the kid was yours.

>>51215429
No, seriously, >>51215296 is literally the whole of it. If you claim it isn't yours, it legally isn't.

The issue of legitimate children further complicates matters. When a child is born, the father must claim the child as his own before he is considered a legitimate heir. If the father testifies the child is not his, all evidence to the contrary does not matter. The child is considered illegitimate and the mother is shamed for the attempted deception. Women cannot deny whether a child is their own, assuming there were witnesses to the birth. An illegitimate child defaults to the same allegiances of the mother. If the mother is a ronin or a heimin, then so is the child. [common examples]. These are unfortunate happenstances, but to question this system is unthinkable. If a father's word cannot be believed about his own children, no samurai's word can be trusted in anything.

>>51215296
>>51215311
>>51215316
>>51215380
>>51215429
>>51215467

Also, the long game may not even care about formal acceptance. It may just be looking to create a nasty rumour about your PC. Denying your child I think may count as a nasty rumour.

Or an even longer game. The child you 'denied' may be raised on the lie her whole life and spend her adaulthood as your sworn enemy.

>>51215663
A lie that makes anyone pushing it look like a tard in the eyes of the law.
See >>51215521, which is a direct quote from Sword and Fan.

One of the things that is wrong with L5R is the Scorpion clan's 'lol just as plannedd!!!' stuff. They never fail, they're never at fault except when they are and don't worry about that CLEARLY it was the writer's fault. It makes them very mary-suey.

>>51215921
Still better than Spider.

>>51215942
>It's better than having your mouth pissed in!
That says a lot.

>>51215921
But that is really not the case. They got shit all over after their Coup failed (which incidentally failed because Shoju fundamentally misunderstood Kisada's personality), and then again when they got blamed for Toturi's kidnapping (they got out keikaku'd by the Lying Darkness most of the arc). Throughout Gold and Diamond they were second fiddles to the Daigotsu and the proto-Spider.

Really the only time they had huge advantages was during the Race for the Throne where the Scorpion players worked their asses off to get ahead.

>>51215921
Eh, they lose or fuck up as much as anyone else. They just tend to try to spin it around to their favor whenever they can and their fans follow suit.

>>51195982
Running a Naishou Province game set during the Reign of the Steel Chrysanthemum. The Emperor found the province during his youth when he traveled the Empire and will take up refuge in the Governor's Palace in the Spring so that he might unwind from the troubles of the Empire.

We're doing a game of years, so the party can watch his descent into madness and deal with it as best they can. Just did intro sessions over the past few days; the party are all ronin from the local tribal bloodlines. Two are Yamataru brothers, one attended a sword school based on the technique that Tadanobu used to pacify the mountain tribes and the other is a simple mountain hunter who denies any chance of a samurai having fucked its way into his bloodline.

The one who attended a sword school spent his intro session helping Isawa Daiichi and Shiba Heisuke search for a Zokujin in the mountains with the help of his senior; only to stumble upon an abandoned shrine where an Oni had taken up roost. The player helped defend Daiichi and by being an honest man helped form a small friendship with Heisuke, even going out of his way not to comment when Heisuke failed a fear roll and fled from the Oni. They ended up fleeing in general, and he decided to head south.

His brother pissed off Doji Ayumi and killed some of her samurai by the Itochi River. While searching for shelter in a roadhouse he was recruited by a Salamander Clan shugenja who pegged him for an upstart peasant by getting up close and personal. The Salamander jumped him into a rebellion lead by Doji Rin in exile; who wants his daughter back and the Emperor slain---nobody else has seen Okucheo's madness yet but Rin, but he still has backers.

The final was a bushi from the Tadanobu who was mutilated in his youth by bandits who also killed his sensei's son. He has been searching for his bloodline ancestry.

So I am hoping to run an L5R game sometime in the near future. Nobody in my group (including myself) has played before and I was hoping I could get some advice from /tg/.

First of all I was wondering if there are any actual plays or podcasts floating around that are a good example of how to really get across the flavour of Rokugan as a GM, or just have a good story?

Secondly I want advice on running an introductory game:

I found that the topaz championship and the example introductory adventure in the 4th ed. book to be... well they seem like poor fits for my group. Both of them focus a little too heavily on poetry competitions and the like up front. I personally don't mind that but worry that it will turn off my players (especially since they are coming from DnD and Dungeon World) if I make them read up on a new setting and system and then spend most of the first session doing poetry and dancing and stuff, though I do think they would enjoy it if eased into it a little.

Instead I am working on my own adventure which attempts to provide a more balanced approach between having to be courtly, getting into fights, and investigation.

The basic idea is that the PCs are being sent to visit some Daimyo who controls a province that provides a significant portion of the grain (though it could be just about any crop) for the clan. Large parts of the harvest have been stolen by bandits for a few years running.

The PCs are told that they should find a way to give their aid in protecting the grain, as well as in finding the bandits and killing them if possible. They are instructed to do this without giving any insult to the Daimyo of this province because despite his old age he was once a war hero and/or he is the close relative of someone important.

>>51216267
The Tadanobu's sensei has been overcome with grief and hatred, but duty-bound still trained the boy. On the day of his gempekku he was ordered to scout for bandits, only to encounter an Ikoma Duelist who was ordered to "break bones, you have to survive this." The Tadanobu killed the Ikoma in a duel (he demanded the Ikoma act with honor and won), killed the Ikoma's bandit henchman, and then upon returning to his village outside Oichi Mura, found his estate in flames and bandits laying siege to the town. The only man he saw fighting was his uncle, who was quickly killed by a bandit on a horse.

The Tadanobu killed a few bandits before breaking into his dojo to get armor, only to hear that his sensei had arranged the destruction of his family estate and archives. The bandits had taken to raping the sensei's wife in front of him, and the Tadanobu dispatched them though the sensei and his wife lost their lives. He was able to recover their daisho and learn that the Ikoma was working for a woman who wanted him dead for looking into his heritage.

In a blind but honorable rage he killed three more bandits before Otomo Jisuto arrived and helped him rout the bandits. Since the Tadanobu couldn't lie, he told the Otomo everything that happened and his sensei's place in this treachery would see him removed from the annals of history. In the aftermath the Tadanobu searched through the wreckage of his home and found an iron locked box which upon opening, contained a haori with the markings of an Akodo Vassal Family and a document claiming lineage to one of Sun Tao's 30 most skilled swordsmen.

They're headed to the city to do more work, and will be assigned to one another for a tournament being held for the Emperor's amusement. Should be fun, got plenty of threads to draw on. They're all upstart ronin with vague claims to legitimacy, but it is a bit of fun throwing together sessions on the fly using just their advantages and disadvantages as inspiration.

>>51216338
As far as actual plays go, I found Happy Jack's Saga of the Inukai pretty good.

>>51216338
> (cont.)
The PCs get to the province and meet the Daimyo and his children. From here things open up a bit regarding how overt they want to be in helping (and how politely they can give help overtly). For example they won't be refused if they volunteer to help fight the bandits and I'd give my players brownie points if the implied it was because the bushi in the party just want a good fight rather than "Oh man, sounds like you need help."

The eldest son of the daimyo is in charge of protecting the grain and will respond well to suggestions, especially if phrased indirectly "at the battle of X, person Y did this which was very effective", but responds poorly to being told to do a particular thing. This is because he is desperate to prove himself after years of failure.

The PCs can also choose to investigate some of the attacks that have already happened, both in this season (one or two minor ones) and from seasons prior. The PCs can also investigate the court and the officers in charge of protecting the grain in order to attempt to track down the leak.

The eldest son seems suspicious (evidence of him sneaking off and the like), but it turns out this is just because he is having an affair with a commoner.

The younger son is in fact helping the bandits, partly from greed and partly to try and become heir over his older brother. I plan on making discovering that before a climactic bandit attack much harder.

What I'm having trouble with is deciding which clan is best for this? I feel like it requires making my PCs all one clan but it gets tricky. I am leaning towards excluding shugenja, is that a mistake? Anyone have any feedback or ideas for complications or interesting scenes to throw at my players?

>>51216375
Thanks! I'll check it out.

>>51216375
Honestly, this. Tried listening to the One Shot podcast one and was shocked that for a guy who claimed to be huge into the setting, he got a ton wrong. Not to mention how surprising it was he used the Spider Clan, but to each their own.

>>51216338
Check out Legacy of Disaster too, it is a far better intro scenario than Tournament of the Samurai.

Though I will say, if you have the party get caught up in a border skirmish between the Phoenix and the Samurai on their way to Pale Oak Castle, it adds some extra tension to the Tournament of the Samurai (makes it look foolish and futile or all the more needed, and the murder looking like it will escalate into a proper war) and salvages what is really a terrible intro. I almost lost my group because I made the mistake of running that. Having run it by the books and then with that opening skirmish and the brutality of war beforehand, giving purpose to the stakes present helps a ton.

Best way to get new people into the setting is to explain things as they come, don't make them do -chan/-domo; Lord/Master/Sensei is just fine, and maybe have them read just their Clan section of the core book/great clans and let them skim Emerald Empire if they so choose to. Has always worked for me.

>>51216467
Yeah I listened to the One Shot podcast and I found the overall plot really weird. I thought that it was just because I was new to the setting and that the inclusion of the Spider may not have been that strange.

When you say "a border skirmish between the Phoenix and Samurai" do you mean that the PCs would be fighting the Phoenix or is that a typo for some other particular clan? (Perhaps the Dragon since it revolves around a Dragon being falsely accused of murder IIRC)

>>51216510
Yeah, I meant Dragon. Blegh.

The background for several characters in the tournie suggests a border skirmish war has been ongoing, I had my players walk through a battlefield that was still littered with the dead on both sides, and deal with bandit deserters who were looting the dead during a mountain storm. When they got to the tournament they were pretty much expecting the worst and really assumed that everything was as it appeared to be, until stories stopped adding up and the Kitsuki was willing to do his damn job.

>>51216564
Man that is a way better introduction than just "you are going to this tournament that is basically samurai wanking over how great samurai are and how artistic and wise and spiritual they should be." Which is fine in that it seems like a very Samurai thing to do, but it is shit in that there really isn't any tension. No good reason (or possible reasons) for PCs to care about winning it are given. Now I get that the adventure is more about the murder mystery than the tournament itself, but the murder doesn't happen until after the first half of the events.

My group is mostly made up of people with kids and so we tend not to start until after dinner and have to stop at around 11- 11.30, so we only get 3 to 4 hours of play time per session. If I ran that as written the introduction would be "Cool so you've made characters. There is this tournament you have been invited to. You get to court, introductions are made. You participate in a haiku contest. Welp, we are out of time, are you excited for next week everyone?"

>>51215921
>They never fail, they're never at fault except when they are and don't worry about that CLEARLY it was the writer's fault
You've bought too far into the propaganda. Unclench your vice-like sphincter, take a shit, then go back with a clear mind.

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>Having a 10-year time skip
>Shosuro Courtier (his father is all 'why aren't you a ninja like the rest of the goddamn family?') spends it on making his friendly rival (A Crane Shugenja with ridiculous ranks in Courtier skills) squirm.
>How? Find his bastard children and have them confront each other.

>First off, find the eldest daughter
>She's about the Shosuro's age, which was weird
>Find out from various sources that he's older than he looks, and also uses magic to make himself younger
>Find out that she's living in a remote village, practicing magic under a powerful Isawa Shugenja

>Get there in the evening
>He overhears from a group beside him that despite her 'orphan' status, she mops the floor in magic duels
>She's also a hothead and very emotional
>Open the door, we talk no more, and here comes the spawn of that Crane whore
>The Shosuro beckons her over with food and sake
>Have a long talk about her parents, how she has noble blood, and how he "may" know about his birth father
>She agrees, only because she wants to smack him in the face and demand why she was abandoned after scalding his face in a magic duel
>The Shosuro planned to stay in the village for three days, but since his job is done (technically), he plans to leave next morning
>She plans to stay in the inn with him until the morning, but alas, no more room
>He took the last room, and it's only small enough for one person, also no more spare futons
>Some accidental brushing and mistaken words later, the two ended up sharing the one futon

>mfw the Shosuro accidentally impregnated his friendly rival's bastard daughter
>mfw she's also of Imperial blood and left her in the care of the Isawa Shugenja because it would horribly dishonour both families
>mfw her father met with the Shosuro's father, and are in talks of marrying the two
>mfw both the Shosuro and the Crane hasn't said anything about the Imperial Blood part

Am I a bad man, /tg/?

>>51217239
>(his father is all 'why aren't you a ninja like the rest of the goddamn family?')
Don't do that.

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>Want to play L5R again, last time i played was a year ago, and it was 3e. I've GM'd two games since then.
>Just want to play a ronin, or maybe a shinobi if the GM doesn't allow ronin. Maybe even a shugenja, I've never played one before but they seem fun
>The only ads on roll20 are a guy in the forum asking if anyone's running and willing to let him in, and a "campaign" on the LFG search that's really just two guys saying they want a GM.

Somebody be my second, I want to commit seppuku to rid my spirit of the this pain.

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>>51217724
Consider the alternative:

>Get in game!
>It's full of edgy tryhards
>The GM fellates the spider
>It's so anti-fun that it kind of falls apart three sessions in

I'll do you if you do me.

>>51217789
See, I think I'd honestly prefer that over nothing. If I'm not having fun I'd leave, but at least I'd feel like I accomplished something by just finding an actual game rather than looking on roll20 and the gamefinder threads and finding nothing. That, and if there's one or two okay people in that's group, I'll at least have made someone new contacts. In my experience, having friends in the hobby is the best way to find new games ("Hey anon, you interested in a game on Saturdays?), so that might at least be something accomplished. Unfortunately, all my friends are into games other than L5R.

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So, as somebody new to the system, why are the Spider so universally reviled? Is it because they fall into the typical edgelordery, or is there even more to it?

Also, I've seen similar resentment expressed towards the Mantis as well. What's the story there?

>>51218452
The SPODER NOT-CLAN:
>Are followers of LITERAL SATAN, GOD OF HELL.
>Follow a belief system that is the literal antithesis of Bushido.
>Constantly harass the Crab, compete in the Rokugan's Biggest Dick Competition against the Scorpion, offend the Crane (this isn't hard), backstab the Lion, defile the Mantis and the Unicorn (this isn't hard either), horrify the Dragon and Phoenix, and make absolute mockery of the Brotherhood of Shinsei.
>Have the majority of their members infected with Magical Evil Plague (TM).
>Want to undermine the entire structure of Rokugan, Emperor, Peasants, and all.
>In AEG canon succeed in the endeavour for teh evulz

>And are AEG's pet clan beside the Mantis.

>>51217483
I don't understand. Does that mean:
>"Don't be a ninja"/"Don't listen to your father"?
or
>"Don't have this as a backstory"?

>>51218452
Personally, I like the Spider. Not the clan itself, and I make no claim that the recent lore with the most wasn't bullshit, but I like their schools and I like having the ability to use maho and taint without those things getting me killed the moment anyone finds out. Unpopular opinion, but still.

>>51218452
Oh yeah, and as for the Mantis, I think most of it comes from people who liked some of the minor clans that got merged into them (like the Wasp and the Fox) and aren't happy about them essentially just becoming Mantis But Archers/Shugenja. The rest I think come from people who for whatever reason think the Mantis get special treatment over the other clans.

>>51218592
>Are followers of LITERAL SATAN, GOD OF HELL.

You gotta admit, the kami in general are dicks, All Hail the Kolat notwithstanding. I mean, it is not like Onnotangu was not the slave of the Nothing, the Greatest Enemy of All, yet...

>Follow a belief system that is the literal antithesis of Bushido.

The weird-as Bushido the Rokugani follow is already the antithesis of the real Bushido, so there you go.

>Constantly harass the Crab, compete in the Rokugan's Biggest Dick Competition against the Scorpion, offend the Crane (this isn't hard), backstab the Lion, defile the Mantis and the Unicorn (this isn't hard either), horrify the Dragon and Phoenix, and make absolute mockery of the Brotherhood of Shinsei.

This can be told to some degree about literally every faction in the game.

>Have the majority of their members infected with Magical Evil Plague (TM).

This is bad tho.

>Want to undermine the entire structure of Rokugan, Emperor, Peasants, and all.

Like it would be a bad thing to do...

>In AEG canon succeed in the endeavour for teh evulz

So, they are like the Scorpion?

>And are AEG's pet clan beside the Mantis.

Now, this is the real reason why they are disliked. The creators shouldn't have pet factions, it shits all over the story and makes the setting unenjoyable. The Mantis is bad enough, we don't need the Spider too.

>>51218638
Don't paint the Shosuro as all ninja.

>>51218841
Oh, and also consider that as a child you don't choose your own school.

>>51218899
Yeah, how is that determined, anyway? Do the parents just decide "this kid's gonna do X", or is there some sort of procedure where they try to match the child to what suits their temperament best?

>>51218948
Little bit of deciding X, little bit of shugenja prophecy saying X, some amount of sensei saying X, whole lot of your extended family trading favours and working to get you into school X.

>>51218948
Depends. Aptitude is generally not considered, since there are things you're just going to learn whether you like it or not, because you're a goddamn samurai. Also keep in mind that shugenja talent is explicitly hereditary, and wasting the ability to "speak" with the kami is considered borderline blasphemous by most Rokugani, so if your parents are shugenja, you're most likely going to become one as well.

There's also the fact that which school to attend is a matter of prestige. It could be a bit of political maneuvering, it could be that the sensei at a specific dojo is a long-time friend of either parent, it could be that they want the child to grow up to be a specific type of person, or he could just be a hostage trained by a different Clan entirely.

Generally speaking, a child would start training at such a young age that determining aptitude would be really hard unless he had some specific genetic predisposition (a Hida born with one arm is probably not going up on the wall, and a disfigured Doji is probably not going to go to court), and quitting mid-way through training would both be considered shameful and rude. So you'd probably end up sticking to your guns even if it turned out you were better suited for other things.

>>51218796
Scorpion aren't evil. Even if they would be the first people to try to convince you they are. They're dicks, sure. And they accidentally an entire Imperial line that one time. But when shit hits the fan, you want the Scorpion around, because a Scorpion will stab a motherfucker up his butthole when he's asleep if he proves to be disloyal. Sure, the Lion are great and they have huge armies and they kick all kinds of ass, but a Lion will yell at you to defend your honor from across the battlefield so you know he's coming for you. A Scorpion won't. A Scorpion won't even necessarily want the credit for dealing with the problem, which makes them really useful when other Clans are too busy dick measuring.

Spider are just evil. As in, they are led by the goddamn prophet of the god of evil, they use explicitly evil magic that infects the soul with evil, and they summon allies from a pit leading to the literal realm of evil. The entire reason they were founded wasn't even to conquer or to build a society they like better. Fu Leng just got infected with evil and wanted to tear down everything the other Kami had made.

Even at their worst, the Scorpion aren't outright mustache twirling evil. At least when written competently. The whole coup was a seriously misguided attempt to prevent the Second Day of Thunder, with a bloodsword thrown in for good measure. The Spider at their best are still a Clan that doesn't have a problem with Tainted dudes running around and spreading corruption who pledge allegiance to a dude who is the embodiment of the Shadowlands. No, I don't care that Daigotsu II got severed from the Shadowlands, he's still the son of fucking Satan.

Also, shourido is super dumb, because it's essentially super bushido that lets them be Tainted without becoming Lost because they're too cool and edgy to be fully corrupted.

>>51218796
>You gotta admit, the kami in general are dicks, All Hail the Kolat notwithstanding. I mean, it is not like Onnotangu was not the slave of the Nothing, the Greatest Enemy of All, yet...
I don't think you quite understand what following LITERAL SATAN means. They're literally servants of a power that the empire has been locked into a genocidal religious war with since its inception as a political state. Jigoku literally embraces all things that are considered disgusting and blasphemous because it's contrarian like that, and its influence warps man, beast, and even the landscape itself into horrible monstrosities that commit horrible deeds. Its touch can warp a soul to the point where it falls out of the kharmic wheel so they can never properly reincarnate and get their ultimate reward (Which is a cornerstone of Rokugani religion). There are, not one, but FIVE different police organizations dedicated to wiping this shit out within the empire, and an entire clan dedicated to fighting it head on at all times.
Accepting its agents as a proper clan really isn't cool.

>>51220790

Jigoku at least still wants to do -something- with the world and not just erase it from existence like the Nothing. And it is cartoonishly unsuccessful with Fu "I had to get my ass kicked twice to learn the lesson" Leng being a perfect example for everything that is wrong with the Realm of Evil.

And then
>Accepting its agents as a proper clan really isn't cool.

Well, this is hardly an excuse in Rokugan.

>>51222068
Trying to place which clan each of these girls comes from. Spider (web leggings), Scorpion (mask), and Dragon (tattoos) are easy. I'm guessing the one in yellow with huge tits is Lion, the one behind her is Mantis, between Mantis and Scorpion is Crane, Phoenix is lying down in front, the one wearing almost nothing with a headband is Unicorn, and the one behind her is Crab.

So which clan produces the best sluts, and why is it Scorpion?

>>51223283
Because it's always Scorpion.
Also
>the crane doesn't have white hair
Shame, shame.

>>51223283
You can also infer it from the colour of their clothes. They all seem to be wearing their clan's colours, so it's mostly a matter of weeding out the duplicates (Mantis/Dragon, Scorpion/Phoenix)

if anybody wants the LBS pdf here

https://mega.nz/#!CpdlzDRY

anon from >>51207522
I'm basically rewriting/inserting things into the Togashi Dynasty (which I now call L5R Dragon Empire) to introduce more general plotlines.
One of the things I'm putting in is an equivalent to the Minor Clans founded for a great deed, called Ninshiki no Kazoku (lit. Family of Recognition). Perform a great deed or impress the Imperial Personage enough, you get your own family name and land. Some were sponsored by a Great Clan, particularly the Lion. Most of these grow out of Otokodate, which are formed not only by Ronin, but also sometimes by Clan Samurai who see an issue that needs dealing with and will take all the allies they can get.
Working from the Expanded Togashi Dynasty pdf, I'm puzzling through adding in the timeline parallels. Ideas for that so far
>Togashi takes action at the right time by sending letters to three certain men. He basically kickstarts the Gozoku, with the intent of creating the Imperial bureaucracy so the eventual Toturi I will have a smooth transition of power.
>White Stag kicks off partly because Emperor Hoshi severely restricts Gaijin trade: Only a limited number of gaijin merchants are allowed to conduct trade with the Empire, each must be sponsored by a Samurai, and each sponsor has one merchant that takes possession of the goods. Additionally, each merchant is allowed 1 ship full of goods each way every year. Travel papers for Gaijin are also restricted, with each applicant proving basic knowledge of Rokugani language, customs, and etiquette.
>Religious tensions between Rokugan and Gaijin rise when a sailor is persecuted for his faith. Emperor Hoshi orders him to find a way to make his faith compatible with Shinseism. During his quest to do so, he goes home to consult with religious authority there and never returns
>Battle of White Stag also kicks off when a Thrane sailor reveals Hawthorne's treachery. When confronted, Hawthorne opens fire, and things go as expected. The Thrane are kicked out.
(continued)

>>51223825 (cont)
Most of my ideas currently focus on White Stag, so, sorry.
>The Thrane sailor helps with the attack, and the Merenae help defend Rokugan. With the revelation of the power of gaijin pepper, and after seeing its secrets revealed, the Empress gives her life to create a powerful deterrent to its use: when present in large enough amounts (more than 5 shots), the Fire kami detonate it. The only time they don't do so is when it is being used against enemies of Rokugan who stand outside the Celestial Order.
>The Thrane, Drew MacIntyre, is made Ninshiki no Kazoku, and several ronin swear to his service. From now on, the MacIntyre family and their Rokugani members will be the gatekeepers of Rokugan. When Drew dies during the later events of the White Stag Era, he ascends as the Fortune of Honorable Gaijin, and the MacIntyre become the Tortoise Clan.
>A bit of peace, interrupted by the Wounded Emperor (Hoshi) declaring that Diego Resendes, the gaijin in charge of making his religion compatible with Shinseism has died and ascended to Tengoku as the representative of his religion, the Church of the Prophets (yes, I'm stealing the basic structure from 7th sea) and the Fortune of Religious Tolerance. Another wave of religious debate and arguments sweep across Rokugan, as nobody is sure what to make of the entire matter. The Kuni and other anti-shadowlands forces reject him, claiming it as a trick of Jigoku.
>The Resendes family, and plenty of his home village, arrive in Rokugan with a dire warning: the Inquisitors of the Church have declared Holy War on Rokugan, intending to wipe out all other religions. The Priest Valentine, brother to Diego, also brings multiple religious texts and what he could recover of Diego's notes. He intends to finish the work his brother started. He begins by inviting the Kuni Inquisitors in to watch over their religious rites, and by asking the Emperor for a safe space to hold services in. (cont)

>>51224299 (cont)
Geez that's a lot for one era.
>The Emperor responds by declaring that outside the Gaijin Quarter and MacIntyre (later Tortoise) territory, no shrines or temples to the Church may be built, and that practitioners outside those areas must worship in private. An exception is permitted for shrines built inside homes, provided that they be closed when visitors not of their faith are visiting.
>The Inquisitors scout force arrive and start by burning the Gaijin and Imperial Trade Districts, complete with the mass slaughter of the inhabitants. They are barely beaten. Rokugan is aided by the mass detonation of their gunpowder, but hindered by the fact that the Inquisitors blessed weapons deal more damage than they should. Drew MacIntyre dies during the battle, evacuating people from the scene. As mentioned before, he ascends to Tengoku as the Fortune of Honorable Gaijin.
>During interrogations of the Inquisitors, a Kuni discovers that they take damage from Jade and Crystal, but there is no evidence of Taint. He also suffers severe burns from objects the Inquisitors blessed, while some other Kuni appear to not. Angela MacIntyre, Drew's wife and now Tortoise Clan Champion, offers an explanation: if a member of one faith hates other faiths enough, they can deal damage to followers of those faiths with their holy items - but they also take damage from the holy objects of those faiths. The explanation is more or less excepted by the Kuni.
>A Mantis ship arrives heavily damaged, and with news: While watching the seas for the Church invasion, they saw it, 150 ships strong. Knowing Rokugan would have a hard time with it, their Shugenja took a page from the Empress' book - and sacrificed his life to power a storm to sink the fleet. The last they saw was a hurricane taking one ship into the sky and sinking the rest.
last bit in next post

>>51224747 (cont)
>several months later, a message arrives for all the gaijin in Rokugan - the land is full of terrible demon magics, and is now off limits to everyone. Anybody who stays is a heretic, but they may be forgiven if they return home immediately. Apparently the deciding incident was when an unnatural storm dropped the flagship of the fleet right on top of the Church's administration center, nearly killing the Prophet's Chosen (their leader). For the first time since the Empress died, Emperor Hoshi laughs. Shortly thereafter, he retires and ascends to Tengoku.
Thus ends the era of White Stag.
Lots of slightly broken peace follows, couple incidents here and there. Not sure if I should go up the Toturi dynasty or stay before the Second Day of Thunder. If I do, the Toturi are getting a longer reign.

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Speaking of Scorpion sluts, would you wreck Bayushi Karumi ass?
Talking about sex, the fastest way to generate conversation on TG

>>51225649
Like throwing a sushi roll down a hallway.

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>>51225649
May I present the argument of JUST FUCKING LOOK AT HER JESUS CHRIST.

That said, the competition is stiff. And so am I

>>51225735
Yeah, but Karumi knows how to do that thing with her tongue.

>>51225732
That's why you take the front entrance. Surprisingly, it's almost untouched and nearly pristine.

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>>51225649
Wreck her pre-Second Pit, or post-Second Pit?

The former would be satisfying, but it wouldn't be very interesting. Scorpion are Scorpion, and every move has an agenda.

The latter, I'd expect to have her surrounded with horny Crab bushi, and at the end of it leaving her battered and sweaty with cum everywhere.

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>>51225649
>>51225735
>>51226258
>>51226278

>>51226324
>crabpillowbooks.jpg

>>51226605
>actually written by a Crane

>>51226727
Crab was the author, Crane did the illustrations.

>>51226768
>Crab did the illustrations

Anon, no one gets off to stick figure porn.

>>51226727
A Unicorn PC in my game writes chaste yuri longing pillowbooks. She's a rising star in the literature world.

>>51226907
>rising star
I'm amazed books about staring at mares are popular with the rest of Rokugan.

>>51226949
We all know that the Unicorn have a horse fetish.

I mean, didn't Shinjo take it up the ass with her horse?

>>51220104
>Fu Leng just got infected with evil and wanted to tear down everything the other Kami had made.
Fu Leng wasn't present at the tournament of the kami where they decided who was fit to rule, and wished to correct that mistake. Togashi was a dick and claimed the whole of Rokugan as his weapon.

>>51227025
>I mean, didn't Shinjo take it up the ass with her horse?
Shinjo literally became a kirin to fuck another kirin.

>>51226907
Speaking of pillowbooks, one of the things that I really haven't seen mentioned outside of 1E's Way of The Crane is printing. From Crane we know of the existence of woodblock printing - which while difficult to create the plates for (each page must be carved from wood - a single mistake means you must start again). Yet it seems that after that one mention, it is implied that all literature in the Empire is hand copied. What gives?
That, and the mention in Iron Empire (IH2) of movable type printing pisses me off - it's like they forgot that Rokugani is ideosymbolic and that you need literally hundreds of symbols to write and read simple reports.

Personally, I have an ancient heimin invent hiragana, leaving almost all the kanji to the samurai class (and of course the samurai know hiragana as well, while bemoaning its lack of clarity - what they say in five symbols, a heimin uses 15-20, and the meaning can be ambiguous), and use sandcasted printing plates (take sandcasting box. Make first impression for plate base. Scribe your pages (and artwork) on the sand. Pour metal over.). Requires a bit of thought in regards to what the literacy rate does to the social structure, but it does make some sense.

>>51227297
Yeah, and Bayushi fucked Shosuro, who is a magic shadow tranny, Akodo sold his daughters to some cat men, Togashi is literally a date rapist, and Shiba was so addicted to Isawa's dick that he gave up rule of his own clan.

>>51227366
Is it heresy to write smutty pillowbooks of the Kami? Because now I want a character that does that.

>>51217850
I'd love to run, but fuck if you internet people aren't flaky as all hell.

>>51226949
No, she's a Shiotome and deeply repressing being into women because that isn't how you get children or stay faithful to your husbandu. Instead, emotionally fraught short stories.

>>51227543
I mean, not everyone flakes. Actually, in my experience, people tend to flake less often for rare games like L5R because unlike games like DnD and Pathfinder, there aren't a billion other games you could go to if you abandon ship. Even then, I normally just move on and keep in touch with the people I know aren't flakes, building a reliable group from the people I've met. My current Exalted group has been playing for over a year because of this.

If you want to run, what day would you do it? I've got a good record of not flaking, and I'd definitely be interested if it's a day/time I can make.

>>51228254
L5R flakes seem to be the worst. I have heard a couple of stories of /tg/ games that the GM just up and disappeared, didn't even have the courtesy to say anything.

>>51230036
Yep, that happened to me. I have no strong opinion on the other players (Although they seemed fine to me for the short duration I interacted with them), but the GM just up and disappeared, taking the entire campaign down with him.

The second group I found here has been completely fine though, with over a dozen sessions so far and no major problems.

>>51230036
>>51230144
That so? Are GMs just Moreno prone to flaking than players in online L5R campaigns then? Cause I've never had a player flake in a game I'm running. Although I've recently ended a campaign I was running because real life shenanigans just sapped all the desire to run out of me. I at least told my player's so though, rather than just running off with no warning.

>>51230690
>*just more prone*

Phone typing is awful.

>>51230690
I've never had that issue and I've been lucky enough to both run and play in L5R with randos from /tg/. Mileage will vary.

>>51227722

But among Samurai wasn't be gay seen as ok as long as you were just having sex with a younger samurai? Unless its ruining her chances at marriage, but all she needs to do there is show some cunning and find a gay Crane.

>>51232345
>But among Samurai wasn't be gay seen as ok as long as you were just having sex with a younger samurai?
Japan.

Why do ponies and riding horses both have Hunting (Tracking) 4, Intimidation 2 where Utaku steeds have no skills?
Is this an oversight?

>>51232345
Tell that to a high honor score samurai from a clan which values honesty and who thinks having an affair even the proper Crane approved way is a core violation of their values and duties of marital fidelity. Recipe for pain which is half the fun of this game sometimes

>>51234730
Probably. Just copy those skills over and maybe bump intimidation to 3 to represent their being just plain bigger.

>>51235105
>Tell that to a high honor score samurai from a clan which values honesty
Even the honest and courageously honourable samurai can approach a situation with respect, caution, courtesy, and consideration for consequences.

>>51235166
I think they actually got copied over from falcon, and that no horse should have those skills.

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>>51235105

Not living his life "fully and wonderfully" is a direct violation of Courage. Doubting the rightness of a life choice, even if it concerns her private life, is actually a direct violation of Honesty.

She must face these issues, or her life will head into dishonor and tragedy. Undertake a pilgrimage, meditate on her situation, and decide whether her love for women is true or it is just a fluke of Desire. If former, then she is into honorable stuff, and anyone who has a problem with this questions her honor and must be dealt accordingly. If latter, then this isn't a big deal at all, the carnal needs of the body can be controlled easily.

>>51236318
Sometimes people are stupid or think on things too hard. Its how you can get such variation within even one clan to have mutually exclusive stereotypes of yhe same family. Asshole stick in up the butt Doji, nice everyone's friend ones, lecherous womanizers, and more.

Remember that to Rokugan, Fear, Desire, and Regret are the three killer sins.

So if you want to fuck someone, don't fear the consequences, don't let your desire cloud your judgement and whatever you do, don't regret your decision. It'll come back to bite you on the ass.

>>51238976
This seems like a trick, Bayushi-san

>>51240877
He is right tho.

>>51232345
That would be the Greeks. In Japan, discreet homosexuality was okayish since it didn't allow for illegitimate children.

>>51243020
In Rokugan, they're so repressed that two women sneaking away together wouldn't even come across as potentially sexual to most samurai.

>>51233326

Since this isn't covered in the L5R books we're stuck looking to Japan.

Why does this shit come up in nearly every L5R thread? If you want to be faggot samurai in your faggoty ERP game, do it. Wick isn't going to come kick in your door and say "Your'e doing it wrong!" Well maybe he would, but he'd do it to everyone that is actually having fun in a game as he seems to hate every kind of fun that isn't his.

>>51243817

It's probably because homosexual samurai were a large part of old era Japanese culture but isn't mentioned anywhere in the L5R books, so all the noobs want to double check they aren't missing a bit on it somewhere. The new books are fairly good about covering a lot of culture so its not surprising people think they miss something.

Also if Wick kicks down the door to your house, does he claim he was being Machiavellian afterwards?

>>51243817
>Well maybe he would
While in his best cosplay, let's not forget that.

>>51243987
No, but he would invent a conspiracy to blame any inconsistencies on.

>>51243987
I mean, the books are pretty clear that you're expected to get married but that nobody cares if you have discreet affairs, and then never specifies anything about who you can have an affair with. The implication is that it can a gay affair and that's fine.

Is barding/horse armour available in 4e?

>>51256150
It's in one of the books. Probably Book Of Earth with the other non-core armour.

>>51256201
I see it, thanks.

>>51253891
Budget Aku

Anyone got a collection of 1e books?

>>51258377
>http://www.mediafire.com/folder/c7tfqff9sqp71/L5R

Does anyone know fluffwise what the difference is between an Ide Caravan Master and an Ide Trader? Crunch wise it seems that if you start as a Caravan master you'll really want to get the Trader level so you can use your commerce in public.

It often shows Ide wearing those mailman looking uniforms with the cap - is that the Caravan Master uniform or the Trader uniform?

>>51261177
I think mail-cap is the Trader, but don't hold me to that.

I also think the difference is a matter of authority and scale; a Caravan Master is probably in charge of a string of carts and has to deal with navigation and supplies as well as commercial stuff, whereas a Trader is the guy who is personally responsible for giving people a great deal on clay pots or whatever-- middle-management versus front-of-house, basically, though you can easily do both things if you want to specialise that way.

is there a 1e character generator?

What clan has the best duelists? Lions?

>>51262881
Nah bro, Mantis clearly.

>>51262881
Duelist as in one-on-one skirmish or iaijutsu?

In either case, Crab.

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>>51262881
In 3e it was the Unicorn. The Ide Duelist was silly shit. Though I did run a deck in the CCG I called Duel-icorn that got me to the top 16 at a Kotei and into the finals of a qualifier at Gen-Con one year. It was a Military/Honor Switch deck based out of Shiro Shinjo. The best was when I got out of Swiss in that Kotei and into the to 32 for the finals and drew a Kakita Dueling Academy player for my first finals round. Shit was so cash when I intimidated him when he challenged me to a duel and I busted out some funky dueling reactions making him lose the duel. He didn't challenge me the rest of the match and I ran roughshod over him. Discarding a Kharmic Strike in a duel vs Doji Domotai with pic related is so cash.

>>51262881


Also the Unicorn have the Calm Heart Duelists for non-lethal dueling, and the Dragon have the Mirumoto.

In fact, most clans are good at dueling except for the Crane, I can't think of anything good they can do in that regard.

>>51263375
I mean, the Daidoji can sometime play tank-duellist like a Crab might...

>>51217239

Is she attractive.

Random campaign idea: everybody starts as some flavor of ronin building up a criminal empire. This also allows you to use slightly reflavored rules from Way of The Daimyo.
What does TG think of this?

Is 1E the edition with the reality warping Kakita Artisans?

>>51266917
Yes. We still do not know why they didn't rule with the empire with roving death squads of jesters on transformed actors, guarded by dancers and musicians, using origami monsters to terrorize the populace so they could be summoned by storytellers who hold the population in fear.

>>51267003

White Winged Death Squads

>>51266183
Does it end with being hunted down by imperial magistrates?

>>51268516
Only if you fuck up. If you play your cards right, you might end up with the Emerald Champion on the take.
Think Samurai Mobsters.

>>51269027
>Only if you fuck up
I do prefer the stories about groups that do.

>>51269859
It only ends with being hunted down if you fuck up. The hunt still happens anyways.

>>51265093
Her father was able to have 7+ bastard children by face and voice alone. Fucker was kicking it to 40, but still looked no older than 25.

So, yes.

>>51267003
Because they're just that nice and honorable

Does anybody know where I can find the mechanical effects of Jade on those with the Taint? It's not just ignoring Invulnerability, right?

>>51272991
I think it is, but just touching it causes damage to the tainted rather than it needing to be a weapon. Book of water in the 4e core