Supersoldiers

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>>51133730
Post-human warriors who can never go back to their old lives and are basically dead men walking. People who are willing to make the ultimate sacrifice.

>>51133730
Any of those things or more are fine as long as they are part of a well written piece of work.
Lately though since I've been playing a lot of Warframe I'm partial to "children warped by being trapped in a hell space for years and now have to use cyborg drones to channel their powers safely".

>>51133730
Those that have been forged in the fires of battle, and have been granted equipment to match their skill/dumb luck.

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All of them really, but in the vein of >>51133848, being a super soldier is their whole life. It's not something they'll return to a normal life from. Whether it's selected from birth in 1996, being part of a warrior caste, genetically engineered, or cybernetics. Once a super soldier, always a super soldier. Thematically it works well with subjects such as real life veterans struggling with returning to civilian life in an exageration for emphasis kind of way, sorta like Forever War.

I'm also a huge fan of having several different and competing kinds of super soldiers, with different strengths and tasks. One idea was genetically manipulated Russian part bear hunter force, or massive, quickly grown shock troops wielding heavy weapons and durable as hell, but not particularly clever or versatile. The officers essentially being a mixed of handlers and day care workers. Also had the idea for cybernetic conscription, where a people are just rounded up, cut up and stuffed with cybernetics and training software and sent off. Implants would powered by the body and would include an in body defibrilator and other emergency life support allowing to soldier to fight through minor but usually fatal damage.

I put my own spin on super soldiers in a nationbuilding game once. An accidental opening of a gate to tell, followed by a failed invasion of hell, lead to the creation of a breeding program to create demon blooded super soldiers.

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>>51133730
I guess, thinking about it, I don't have a particular favorite. As such, I'm a fan of situations where it can be achieved through different means.

Shadowrun has some neat lore on this. It's perfectly possible to make someone who is super-soldier-tier using exclusively bio-mods, cyberware, a mixture of both, or magical influence. Some are better than others, and often give more in order to be so; an augged-up fucker with cyberlegs and arms is giving up something more than a guy who achieved higher-than-possible norms with fancy new organs that no one can see or discriminate against him for. Adepts are in the middle: their powers can be "turned off," so they only draw attention when placed under occult scrutiny or if they get flashy; they're also vulnerable when not powered, whereas a cyber- or bio-aug can rely on most of their stuff being passive.

Some settings also have interesting and varied ways of going about it: Metal Gear (all of them) give you ways: cybernetics, (very high quality) enhanced-armor, organic parasites, occult meddling, child prodigies raised in war, and pure Charles Atlas Superpower; if one forgives the use of tvtropes parlance.

Star Wars gets in on it: Mandalorians and Republic Commandos rely on child-soldier rearing and martial culture to show for their super-soldiers, while Death Troopers show that cybernetics are also used to achieve the goal.

In terms of power-level, variety is also the spice of life. Using the Shadowrun stuff as an example, I'd expect cyberware-users to be more inherently powerful since they're giving up more for their abilities; SPARTAN- or Astartes-tier as opposed to ORION- or Gland-Trooper-tier; the latter two being achieved through more subtle organic manipulation as opposed to full-on gene-modding and cybernetics. If nothing else you can usually rely on unbelievable expense to prevent higher capability from being very common, including pic related's crazy-expensive (but crazy-awesome) super-armor.

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>>51133730
Powers from God.

>>51133730
I prefer a combination of all three. They're a genetically enhanced warrior caste, born/bred for the sole purpose of combat through a process of eugenics and cybernetically enhanced in their teenage years (with mostly things such as a large amount of unspecialized stem cells in their bloodstream (don't know if this is possible, I'm no biologist) that allows them to heal wounds much faster than ordinary humans).

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>>51133730
The spartan program in OPs image probably covers my favorite tropes for a super soldier

>indoctrinated/brainwashed at a young age
>extensive training
>genetic/cybernetic augmentation
>given specialized equipment to further enhance what they can do.

Yeah its dark as fuck when it comes to super soldier programs but I like how straightforward the result usually is.

>I admire it's purity

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>>51133730
I'm more into the idea of the developing someone's mind rather than making them stronger or faster. The person who can manipulate outcomes in a strange or hostile environment is a more interesting character to me.

>>51133730
I have a soft spot for the second and third generation Spartans, personally. Fuck the Gen IVs and that cunt Palmer in particular.

>>51133730
Evil enemies that are stronger than the protagonists, who will have to get smart and lucky to to defeat an objectively better opponent.

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>>51136534

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>>51134350
>breeding program
>demon blooded

>>51136591
Fucking 343

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>>51136591
Makes me want to puke with rage every time.

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>>51136591
Halo bums me out whenever I think about it. Halo 4 and 5 are shit, Bungie tried to remake halo and failed and 343 are retards.

>>51136591
I miss Johnson. He was best Spartan.

>>51137052
This.
The amount of hours I spent on Halo 1 and 2, and to a somewhat lesser extent H3 aswell as the friends I made along the way..

Bums me out to an extreme amount.

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>>51133730
I'm a sucker for the old "was once a man", even if they can get a bit angsty at times.

Pic related, for example - not a bad webcomic.

Both men in the scene are supersoldiers - one was a UN peacekeeper during some pretty horrific wars (including genetically engineered child soldiers), then got plenty of surgery and genetic therapy of his own.

The four-armed bloke is also a genetically modified supersoldier but he was grown and trained from the ground up to be one.

I think you can guess who wins

Rolled 5, 4 = 9 (2d6)

TEST

>>51137052
Now, Destiny had and has some serious problems with grind and amount of actual content, but overall I think it's pretty damn good. I'm happy with it in all respects, and the lore in particular is pretty awesome.

>>51137251
The lack of couch co-op was such a stupid move. 343 got cocky and tried to take out one of the features that arguably made Halo what it is today.

>>51137239
Johnson was to good for this world.

>>51137389
>I think you can guess who wins
Since extreme body modification and crazy alterations advance with time the four armed guy?

>>51137567
I'm willing to bet he was trying to imply an "experience dwarfs everything," angle.

Which honestly makes sense. If they're both augged up, but one has the experience of a great many wars and the other has four arms, I think I'd choose the experience over the gimmick.

Of course, this also assumes that most of their augments are equal. I haven't read the webcomic, so I don't know.

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>>51137433
To be honest I don't own Destiny but from what I know from friends it's a competently made game, but it's no Halo 1.

>>51136173
And not even just that, but they also cloned the kids, the clones of which died within a few months/years, just to cover up the kidnapping.

A super soldier I feel is the modernisation of the ideals of a knight; individuals selected from and perhaps by birth to be given the training and resources to become ultimate fighters, so that others don't have too.

My ideal would be a seperate caste of people trained from infancy, and who retire either to an incinerator, something like a dreadnought or to teach the next generation of half man half monster killing machines

>>51137665
I think that was partly the issue: people thought Bungie were gonna make something like Halo again, but instead we got a well-made, beautifully designed Borderlands ripoff with a relative dearth of stuff to do after a few months.

Here's hoping Destiny II is better.

>>51133730
I like the approach of the religious supersoldier. Not game-balanced like Paladins in an RPG or something, but physically better than normal soldiers in every meaningful way, powered by an active and approachable deity that can be spoken to directly.

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I like the concept of a super solider as simply that: a soldier with a higher degree of competence than the average grunt. Special forces and the like. I've always liked the idea of special forces being trained in more useful things like languages and customs as well so that they can build upon the basic soldier and become something more finely-tuned.

>unf dat CADPAT

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> When you dont have any pictures of L'Enfant Terribles
> So you post their dad instead
> mfw

>>51133730
I like the SPARTAN II's. They cost as much as a spaceship and only about half of them even survive the augmentation. They're all kidnapped conscripts without real names and no real contact with the civilization they're built to protect.

>>51140274
A beatiful tragedy, me thinks

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I'm rather partial to bird magic.

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Those who are made by starting small. Like not enjoying a party.

>>51133730
I've personally liked something like a cross between halo and warhammer 40k on steroids.

Pretty much children drafted to be soldiers, genetically modified, tons of technology and organs grown in test tubes shoved into their bodies, pumped full of drugs and hormones and trained constantly and ruthlessly with a high mortality rate. The end result is terrifying super humans who while still technically having the psychology of humans are so psychologically damaged by their lifetime of being soldiers that they are pretty much all sociopaths with no sense of the value of human life outside of numbers.

Retroviral therapies, nanomachine accelerants, and a device that constantly backs up their memories, experiences, and neural pathways to a main storage system, in case they need to be 'brought back'. Tuned for a generally more vibrant experience - stronger emotional reactions, faster reflexes, greater physical strength of course, quicker minds - beyond mere soldiery.

They're meant to return to the population, outside of war, to spread their altered genes. It's far easier to have them born naturally than spend millions on every single applicant that comes our way.

>>51137433
The narrative in Destiny was obviously unfinished, but the lore and flavor text is in a class all its own.

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I think trained from birth probably works the best.

I really like Halo's Spartans because it was really reinforced that the only ones that were left were a combination of insanely strong and insanely lucky.

In a less space-operalike setting, supersoldiers designed to be more spooky Black Operations types would be pretty neat as well, ones that could probably take out a battalion of enemies if they were given some camping supplies and orders to do so.

>>51133730
>Whether they're genetically engineered, cybernetically enhanced, trained from birth
More like bested by generic grunts on regular basis.

>>51141639
Why do you say that? I've never played Destiny but from everyone I ask they say the story is non existent.

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>>51133730

In a setting where all your average grunts are genetically engineered, cybernetically altered, trained since childhood, wear spaceproof power armour with exoskeletons and personal shields, as well as pumped full of performance enhancing drugs and dope, what would you have to do more to be considered ''super''?

>>51141960
Be superer. Could always have a cold war style arms race with genetic and cybernetic modifications.
>Our super soldiers are genetically modified to have perfect eye sight, hearing, an improved sense of smell, a much higher pain tolerance, and to build muscle more easily
>Well ours have cybenetic eyes that allow them to spot an ant from a mile away
>Well ours have an advanced ballistic computer hooked up to their brain so they can calculate firing trajectories on the fly to hit an ant from a mile away
>Well our super soldiers have a 25% greater lung capacity
>Well our super soldiers have bones like steel that can resist small arms fire
>Well our super soldiers have skin like kevlar that's resistant to shrapnel

Alternatively you could have each soldier be customized depending on the needs. The elites tasked with hunting down rogue super soldiers might be given every single augmentation available. The basic grunts might just get the basic suite of upgrades while special forces get some additional upgrades depending on their specialization (UDTs have larger lungs so they can hold their breath longer and can have better stamina, snipers might have the aforementioned ballistic computers in their brains).

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>>51133730
>Favorite supersoldiers
Cute artificially engineered inhuman girls that can murder people without remorse and are a thousand times more powerful than you but will obey your every command.

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>>51140953
that's not magic

>>51142543
>NGNL
get this trash out of here faggot

>>51137650
You are correct. Webcomic is in the filename, it's pretty good.

Also, the guy who made the 4-armed guy was starting from scratch, with the techniques used to make the old soldier being kept very secret, and genetic modification being hugely frowned upon and prohibited - a prohibition which carried enormous penalties, usually the destruction of the offender's army at the hands of the super-soldiers, bioweapons, or nukes.
Or, on more than a couple of occasions, all three.

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>>51140274
>>51140714
This is one of the things that annoyed me about post-war Halo; you could have had a storyline about Spartans having to adapt to peacetime, without much in the way of wars to fight, and, having been raised from childhood for nothing BUT war, exploring how they would deal with it.

>>51143962
Well, there is a S2 that did retire from active duty, and was used to test new tech, so it's not an unimaginable stretch.
I believe she even got married.

>>51142543

Sauce?

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>>51133848
>>51133937
>>51139969
Why not all three?

I've got two variations in my 1700s Dark Fantasy setting.

#1 are less 'supersoldiers' and more merit-based nobility. They're given near-limitless authority and enough arcane trinkets to fuck up a city.
A martial-themed one can juggle cannons and catch bullets, as long as their arcane gear stays powered.
A noncombant will just have shit like an automapper.

#2 is more of a 'failed supersoldier.' It's what happens when the techniques used to make arcane items mesh poorly with aftereffects of a three-century old arcane storm, and the subject dies while this is going on.

They heal rapidly from any injury, which is nice, and they get more dangerous as they do so. Think missing fingers turning into 4" claws, extra heads, etc. They're also undead in a setting without clerics, and they don't need vital organs to live. The catch is that, seeing as they're dead, motivating them to work for you is nigh-impossible.

>>51140953
Respect.

>>51137052
The fuck you on about

H5 Multiplayer is excellent singleplayer is meh

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>>51144461
No Game No Life.

>>51145844
>implying settingfags give a damn about multiplayer.

>>51141935

Lead writer said 'well screw you guys' when Activision went full money grab and forced Bungie to cut certain parts of the story out of the main release. That's the start of it, at least.

>>51133730
>genetically engineered, cybernetically enhanced, trained from birth
I like a mix of all the above. I'm currently writing in a setting that uses them extensively.
> Cybernetically enhanced, memory and identity erased, trained from rebirth as weapons
> Genetically engineered and trained from birth, minor cybernetics
> Nano-enhanced to interface with equipment
> Cybernetically enhanced and sealed into power armour
The thing is that the projects don't tend to go well, and you end up with escaped projects running around, and collecting together.
And then starting a eugenics program, crossing genetic enhancements with hereditary magical powers, sprinkled with warrior culture and training from an early age.
Although as a nod to ethics, the eugenics program is more matchmaking than forced breeding.

>>51145202
Underrated post.

>>51143995
>tfw no 2,5m tall Spartan waifu to snu snu with

>>51133730
They're not treated or considered human due to being exposed to conditions and circumstances that have broken them psychologically. While what remains of the person still exists, they're hidden behind a ruthless exterior needed for the jobs They're simply weapons with personalities, don't mistake their quirkiness for any sort of sympathy or human understanding.

>>51139951
>a well-made, beautifully designed Borderlands ripoff
T H I S
H
I
S

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>>51142543
Correct description, wrong and objectively shit tier example. Try again.

>>51145844
>multiplayer
>setting
what

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>>51153324

>>51134350
Yeah that shit's good.

My supers setting had a ton of different types of supers, with various countries doing different shit. China pumped conscripts full of science drugs to make them into banes, the EU had a task force of psyonics, japan had a range of power-armoured weeaboo wet greams.

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>>51133730
It's all in the mind really.

>>51133730
I like my supersoldiers to have some kind of black box super device in their core.
Usually these are gotten through sinister means, be they a shackled AI or a grey goo in a can or a sinister organ harvested from extradimensional horrors.

>>51143995
considering where that comic took place, she and her implied children are probably all dead, anon
>tfw when she knew the armor was going to john and felt safer because of it

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>>51140989
>tfw madness combat has a more nuanced plot than your campaign keeps turning into

Feels bad man

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>>51133730
What do you consider a super-soldier? Do they have to be augmented somehow, or does someone who's just really good at being a soldier count?

>>51143962
There was that priest movie, where all of these guys were taken as children and trained to be super badass vampire killers so that they could end the war. When the war was over, they struggled to adapt to civilian life, feared by the people they once saved.
It was an okay movie I guess

>>51155679
Happening to have nigh-perfect genes for a soldier is a perfectly legitimate claim for super soldier status. Really to qualify they just need to be better than you can get through normal training and soldiering experience.

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>>51140953
>tfw you will never hunt that bounty

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These two guys could beat everyone posted before them.

>>51153404
[honor of the regiment intensifies]

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>>51156842
>implying you can beat the ass

>>51133730
Doom guy is my favorite.

Probably because of the memes.

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>>51156929
Oh they have that covered.

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>>51157010
>covering ass
>with anything but hands

>>51156842
>warhammer
>competing with bolo
good joke, my friend.

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>>51133730
I like the ones who unabashedly enjoy being superhuman. Typically this comes paired with them being an ordinary guy who then gets augmented somehow. After that their victories should be less about their superior physical abilities than about their wits and character.

Basically, Captain America.

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>>51153404
I am Resartus.

The Seven Swords/Legions from Living Steel/Dragonstar Rising.

>>51157751
Jesus. That level of hubris is far different from the Cap'n that I've been told of.

>>51158556
That's not Hubris, it's this thing called determination, and belief that you are doing the right thing, and the bravery to stand up to the whole of humanity if necessary to prove the righteousness of your cause. Cap isn't proud, never has been, he's righteous and concerned only with justice and doing what is right, what is truly the right thing to do.

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>>51157751
>I like the ones who unabashedly enjoy being superhuman.
that's... not really cap at all. cap does good because doing good is the core of his being, but his personal life is a whole lot of suffering. hell, the speech you posted is from when cap, and people like him were being rounded up and deported to the negative zone without trial, and cap was forced to fight some of his best friends

>>51158785
Except he was wrong. Did you read the story?

He literally realizes that he was entirely wrong and willingly surrenders himself because he got so caught up in defending his cause against everyone by any means that he was getting innocent people killed and failed to notice when he lost the support of literally anyone who wasn't fighting beside him; civilians were actively jumping him because of how wrong he was and how hurt everyone was getting.

That means this statement, particularly in hindsight, is hubris. It's actually a silly bit of foreshadowing, because he literally doesn't live up to it. When the entire world--personified by the civilians who tackle him mid-fight with Iron Man--shows him how fucking wrong he is, he breaks down into tears and turns himself in.

>>51158785
>>51158924
I should specify this is with the comic's shitty writing. In the actual comic Civil War, neither side is protrayed as good or correct or even just. The film did a much better job of making it so both sides actually had viable points; one wasn't more right than the other, and if you didn't flip-flop at least once or twice when watching it the first time, you must have been pretty fucking dead-set on who you thought was correct from the get-go.

>>51155679

BB is organic, SS, LS and Raiden are definitely super

>>51158924
>Did you read the story
did you? while the marvel editorial team/main book for civil war decided that pro-reg was correct, the rest of the writers, and most of the general public, were unabashedly anti-reg, because the pro-reg side was goddamn fascism which consitently violated the constitution, trained children to be government assasins, and hired villains to throw heroes into the goddamn negative zone. and then tony stark let the world get invaded by skrulls. the problem was that a scottish fascist was writing the main book, so he didn't see any of the problems

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>>51158987
>BB is organic
By which I assume you mean not a super-soldier, but just a really good soldier.

>[SS and LS] are definitely super
By which qualifications? If they're clones of BB, who I assume based on your comments is just a regular soldier, what makes SS and LS super?

Raiden I understand; especially if we're talking about post-cyborg Raiden.

>>51159008
I'mma be real, dude: I never gave even a little bit enough of a shit to read about it after the actual event Civil War was done. I was even enough of a normie that I just bought an anthology of it after the fact and read all of that at once.

The movie did it much better, but that doesn't change the fact that the comic, as it was portrayed in the Civil War itself (I won't comment on something that I haven't read), Cap'n was not only wrong, but couldn't even live up to his own statement in >>51157751.

>>51158963
>>51159062
In the Movie at least I always agreed with Cap but I saw Tony's points. They were and are logically sound but they don't work in the long term and are very easily turned to evil purposes. When you have Mutants like Jean Grey, and the Scarlet Witch, and Gods like Thor running you cannot chain them to bureaucracy, just because some are evil, and sometimes in fighting this evil, collateral damage happens, it's the same In the real world. You also can't lock them up for being good people that don't want to kill for your governmental system, even if they make mistakes, they do not deserve that. If Mutants and other Super-humans existed regulating them would only serve to do one thing, normal humans would quickly become extinct. The entire premise is stupid on it's face, because the Mutants would rally under Magneto or a similar leader and bring down humanity as a whole. It's no different in the comics, in my view, the argument is the same it's just on a larger scale in the film.

>>51159169
The main point the film did better than the comic did was the fact that with the film, it was only supers who wanted to be vigilantes. You didn't see them actively targeting people who just happened to be Enhanced to twist them to the government's purposes. The Accords were very simple: if you want to be an Avenger, you play ball for the UN.

The comic turned the entire registration into a semi-fascist organization where supers who didn't play ball were put into a hyperspace gulag, and it didn't matter whether or not you wanted to be a hero; you still had to register and be government-ruled.

In that case, the movie stood head-and-shoulders above its source material. I always found it so hard to agree with either side, because Iron Man was supporting a fascist-lite contract and Cap'n was doing some borderline terrorist shit to avoid it. Both sides were wrong, the comic just portrayed one as more wrong than the other.

With the film, the more government-gulag shit was not only downplayed--reserved for those who not only didn't want to play ball, but actively resisted after being given multiple chances to stop--but the main character who represented that side to us wasn't aware of the worst of it and actively tried to fight against it on the down-low while staying true to the spirit of the Accords.

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>>51159169
>because the Mutants would rally under Magneto or a similar leader and bring down humanity as a whole. It's no different in the comics, in my view, the argument is the same it's just on a larger scale in the film.
conveniently, m day happened at the exact same time. and even then, the sentinel containment around the xavier institue (cyclops and emma frost having imprinted the deaths of a bus full of former x-kids into ms marvels mind as their oh so polite way of telling the SHRA to kiss their mutie ass, and the pro-reg side not wanting to deal with the most power/square inch short of asgard) failed on pretty much a daily basis. speaking of super soldiers, do giant, human piloted weapons platforms count?

>>51159274
I agree the movie did it much better, but locking up Hawkeye and Scarlet witch and the others for shit Tony started, was total BS and puts me firmly on Caps side here. It's also not just the avengers that are required to register, all "Enhanced" individuals must register. The Avengers are just the only ones relevant to the plot of the film. For me the issue comes down to who i trust more The American Government/UN and Tony Stark, or Captain America, literally the personification of the best of humanity, and America specifically, For me that's Cap.
>>51159328
I know they left the mutants at Xaviers Institute alone, for the most part anyway, if they tried they'd have Logan, and Jean Grey to deal with, and neither the comic or Fox movie versions are anything you want to fuck with.

>>51133730
Man the Halo novels really hit home how much the Spartan program sucked

>>51159406
>Logan, and Jean Grey
jean was dead at the time, but logan brought in x-23 as a back up (at this point still in full murder folk. pluss for blinking the wrong way mode) and scott was on to banging emma, at this point at her most mind-rapey. plus the school was basically turned into darwinian mutant army training for the relatively few remaining mutants. because motherfuckers just would not stop trying to kill them

>>51159406
my biggest issue was that tony was trying to force his guilt over his fuckups onto others. which, okay, scarlet witch was a terrorist, but unlike tony, most of the other heroes were fighting things that weren't there fault (and were, in several cases, the fault of the government). so just because tony has immense personal guilt, other heroes should be forced to be easy targets next time hydra builds a superweapon with government funding

>>51159599
Haven't read all of them, but Logan alone is nearly unkillable, in fact quite possibly Immortal, and how fucking stupid are the Pro-reg people to keep going after the Xavier Institute and X-men? They're an incredibly powerful team. Storm, Cyclops, and Logan, could probably kill entire armies easily with just the three of them, attacking them seems foolhardy and stupid.

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well my take on it is pretty autistic but what I had was almost like the Kwisatz Haderach from Dune, except a girl, and I didn't hold back on her abilities. I didn't do it because of magical girl / anime shit, because I don't watch anime at all and can't get into it despite trying multiple times. That said this girl was born from a weird sort of "delayed pregnancy".... almost like immaculate conception, but she had her father's genetics somehow. And the weird foresight her bloodline provided was magnified tenfold in her. So she would have visions of the future rather than just Jedi-type super reflexes for plot armor. She would take stim drugs soldiers usually saved for last stands because they were heavily poisonous but would give incredibly enhancement to coordination and awareness (think +8 Dex potion). This led to her overdosing a couples times, and her brother getting angry at her.

But my favorite part of her was breaking the rules of what was ordinarily fairly realistic combat. I had just started playing CS GO and stupid as it was I became enamored of the time I saw someone cheating with "wall hacks" and "aim hacks" and watching the pro-players pull off unbelievable shots. So I decided that as her abilities flared she would be able to do some truly insane things in a flash of insight. For example shooting enemies as they ran between spaces in a walkway from a hundred meters away. Or shooting enemies she was barely aware of. Or my favorite, where she "feels" where an enemy soldier is and shoots him through a wall, despite not even hearing him walking behind said wall.

She also started visiting a mystic to enhance her powers, all this meditation and vibration occultism stuff that her more down-to-earth brother thinks is a load of hogwash, but she thinks will help her unlock more of her abilities and turn her into the perfect living weapon.

So I have a white-haired Zen prophet operator girl with a sniper rifle and two Tec-9 pistols.

>>51159651
That's one of my issues with Tony's actions as well, but Scarlet Witch did not know any better at her introduction and was legit brainwashed by Hydra, and yeah your last points hits my biggest problem on the head, Hydra would have an easily accessible database of Enhanced people world-wide thanks to the Sokovia Accords.

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Gigantic, near-mythical demigods of warfare made equally from science as much as they were born of mysticism, taking the absolute best offered by humanity and perfecting them further- offering a window in a possible future of evolution. Echoing Greek and Babylonian demigod figures like Heracles or Gilgamesh, they are armies unto themselves and are humanity magnified. But with magnification comes magnification of their flaws which they must grapple with to prevent them from stumbling into the abyss. Rage, lust, jealousy, greed, etc- all much be controlled and tempered for the process to be final. In some ways the ascension to demigod-hood strips away at one's being to the very core, revealing their true nature.

They are not immune to emotion however, which is one thing I staunchly disagree and hate 40k for ignoring. Super soldiers, especially if they are some new evolution of mankind, should not be mentally sterile unloving zealots with no emotion at all. Not only are such things unrelatable and shitty characters in general, but it doesn't work thematically either. One is not truly tempted until love, and not parental love, is thrown into the mix in war. Heracles' story is moving and tragic not because he simply had super powers, but because he was struggling to redeem himself in his own eyes after mistakenly thinking he killed his family.

>>51136173
Gotta agree, I don't really like Halo but god damn the Spartans just hit all of my buttons for Super Soldiers.

>>51140008
They are. They are exactly that. They're kinda like ambassadors. Ambassadors of firepower.

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I'm a fan of the ones who can't even be considered human again, Not that you would say it to their face. Also partial to the insanity and brainwashing pic related.

>>51160430
That is one wonder of an American Patriot

>>51159692
>pretty autistic
You got that right.

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>>51133730
I think Pilots are pretty good. Not really that 'super', just very skilled and geared up enough to make use of that skill.

Plus the giant robots, that helps.

>>51133848
I actually though that development was stupid as hell considering the North Koreans could make knock-off version of the Nanosuit easily enough and had numerous soldiers with them.

But I guess they decided that a skilled soldier in a high-tech suit wasn't *special* enough for them or something.

>>51133730
Genetically engineered super soldiers grown within artificial wombs.

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>>51134350
>selected from birth in 1996

mah nigga

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Oldman's war had a very interesting and indepth look into super soilders. Both as your every day super mook and as the super soilders above them. that ans greenmen in flying saucers

>>51160983
>not really 'super'
Nigga say that to how they can kill dudes in one punch without shattering the bones in their hands. I know there's nothing in the lore to suggest that they should be able to take that, and it's just mastery of their weapons, the Jump Pack, and their partnership with the Titan that makes them super, but goddamn is that some serious gameplay and story segregation.

>>51133848
I liked them when they were just extremely well-trained soldiers wearing several million dollars worth of high tech suit.

I don't remember anything in the first game about the suits being non-removable without serious risk of death, and that makes the cheap Korean knockoffs relatively reasonable.

>>51133730
My versions (for the book I'll make someday) are selected and trained from birth. They under go slow long term cyberisation (not 100%, most only have around 45% as keeping some oganic healing factor is useful and more cost effetive), with accelerated full dive VR training as soon as their brain can handle the stress of the deep neural chip implantation. Also they get the nicest gear, including power suits and full support staff. So performance is great, but the very high cost makes them unattractive for most things.

That is the thing, it is not one magic thing that makes them great, it is all of these things invested together. Although if I had to say the notable addition of the accelerated full dive VR training is the crtical part. They basically become brains in a jar for a few years as their new bodies are build. During which they can train 4 times faster as the support system can accelerated inputs and eliminate sleep, giving them decades more combat experience over the common soldier and a huge amount of information few can match.

Genetic enchantment was used for the earlier versions, but with new genetic bio-weapons those versions they were easy to kill as they all had the same genetic weakness.

>>51140953
But she wasn't a super soldier. She was just some adopted human kid by the Chozo.

After getting nearly killed too many times by the other kids on the playground at school her new dad decided to augment her with some gene therapy and basic power suit he and some friends made. In Chozo society she was considered handicapped. Apparently Chozo society did not have a very good support system in place for such things as she was a special needs case.

Really makes you wonder what the Chozo elite military units could do.
And how they all got killed.

>>51142765
In one version she learns how to fight ghosts.
So I think the line is a bit blurry given how advanced Chozo tech is.
But they do later note that it wasn't magic, just tech beyond understanding involving unusual energy types.

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I'm surprised this hasn't shown up yet.

I like my supersoldiers to be cloned from the very best your people have to offer. They are trained from birth to not only be unstoppable, but to have the principles of your society engraved into them to uphold. Then they are put out into the field where every day is a war, to have their beliefs tested at every corner and to be iron in their judgement.

>>51159062
>If they're clones of BB, who I assume based on your comments is just a regular soldier, what makes SS and LS super?
Big Boss is stated to have a genetic predisposition to being a soldier, like his genetics make him perfect for the role, he is as good as you can get without enhancement
Solid and Liquid are his clones who also had their genetics tweaked to enhance the qualities that made Big Boss the badass he was, they are stronger, faster, have more stamina and are probably a little tougher that Big Boss which combined with their training make them effectively a whole level above their progenitor

What about a society with castes where each caste is the equivalent of a Supersoldier ?

Basically genetically engineered, cyborgized (at least a brain-machine interface but I like the idea of engineered beings with a design where both genetic modification, cybernetics and surgery are used and interwined, and couldn't be separated) higly improved humans yet specialized in their domain of expertise.
I'm not talking about workers being infrahumans with a 60 IQ but almost Space Marines tier quality ones. (without their overexagerated effectiness)

Actual Supersoldiers are more silicone than flesh completly redesigned "human" brains grown in vats, then grafted on ultra fast spaceships or drones control units because despite their mastery of human augmentation, this civilization never managed to create true A.Is.

Savants are mastodons with giants brains directly connected to an army of weak A.Is.

Rulers are a mere subclass of Savants assisted of social experts and incredibly socially intelligent and charismatic faces.

Space Travelers are adapted to both life in space and large range of planetary habitats and the situations they can find themselves (negociation, diplomatie, fight,ect...),ect...

>>51159062
>By which qualifications? If they're clones of BB

I thought it was mentioned that their genetic makeup had been *slightly* tampered, but not by much, but still setting them apart from all-organic Big Boss

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Accidental supersoldiers born from unknown eldritch forces/technology.

The supersoldier doesn't know what he or she can do. The antagonists don't know what the supersoldier can do.
Then again, this will be hard to pull off in an RPG.

I loved the scene where Sho fucking dies, literally dies - and the symbiotic organism the antagonists ripped out of his skull regenerates a clone of Sho from memory so it can break out of the laboratory it is placed in.

Or the scene where Sho's dad is transformed into a mindless monster. Sho is unable to fight back because ~that's his dad man~, and gets his entire fucking brain excavated by a claw swipe. Without any brain left to control it, the symbiotic organism takes control until it can regenerate Sho's brain, and basically uses a laser cannon meant to take out spaceships in orbit on Sho's mutated dad, vaporizing him completely along with a few kilometers of woodland.

>>51162191
IIRC, the Chozo all got killed by Motherbrain.

I guess it was a rather apocalyptic fight that severly handicapped Motherbrain too - hence why she struck a deal with Ridley and the Space Pirates.

>>51133730
Bio-engineered adults sealed in superbulky armored suits, equipped with weapons and turned docile enough to count as murderfucker attackdogs.

>>51136534
I'm kinda bummed Spartan 3 wzre never used after Reach. I mean, they was quite a lot of survivors from them, compared to 2s for example. Yet we never hear about them in game.

I like to headcanon that Noble 6 survived by hiding in some secret bunker and going cryo, then waking up when the covenant war is finished, going back to the Infinity with some severe PTSD, making him unable to work with former Covenants, but going back into the fray against other threats.

He'd break down when seeing June and would be brought in front of the Noble monument, to help him accept that they're all dead but him and June.

>>51137052
5 is legitimately good. Singleplayer is meh, but multi is damn good. Give it a go again someday.

>>51162191
I get the impression that a fully upgraded suit containing Samus at the end of most games really does represent the peak of chozo warriors or beyond, honestly. She didn't start that way by any means but it is how she ends up. No guardians they made can really test her, and she wins against all of the horrifying threats that contributed to chozo departures and genocides that we know of. Samus probably isn't a born super soldier but she's certainly been made one.

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https://youtu.be/e6c5RZL9Skw

the greatest there is

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>>51164260
Nevermind that at the end of Metroids timeline (Metroid Fusion) she has become part human, part metroid. She can literally just replenish her lifeforce by chomping down on some lifeform, robot or machine.

>>51164345
>not posting the best 40k soundtrack ever while posting a picture of it

Shame on you. I even downloaded the mp3.

>>51164391
https://youtu.be/Czpve_uNiLM

>>51159692
>pretty autistic
Very autistic

>>51164391
The lord inquistor soundtrack was great but did not have enought religious chanting for my taste

>>51164420
>Not enough chanting

I thoroughly disagree on that. There a fuckton of it when it was needed.

>>51164464
>when it was needed
>implying a 40k song should not be enterily made of chants for the emperor

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>>51164260
Well her development route was different so it is hard to say.

She took and incorporated Chozo weapons and stuff into her setup, but the sub-fame was based on a survivor suit (faster but less armor), not a warrior suit. Still a survivor suit with missile upgrades and stuff is defiantly not civilian. I would guess after the Chozo upgrades she got to ~90% of what a full warrior would get. She never got that big weapon thing the elite guards had (which broke down motherbrains final defense door in one blow by a relatively untrained user, scary thing, I want one), nor the two other beam weapons although it was implied that at least one of those was forbidden as even the warriors were not allowed it till hours before the very end. But then she got other non-standard upgrades later so I could see her surpassing them at some point.

As for the whole part about defeating the "horrifying threats that contributed to chozo departures and genocides" I think it is over played as she often shows up shortly after the full scale conflict and takes down what is left, granted what was left could take down the earth's military so she still a super solider in that sense. (so yea I guess I change my opinion on this, really more of what level she is at at the time)

But the performance metrics for her are all over the place, as her power level changes with the plot.

>>51133730
I don't really like the idea of super soldiers, leads to too much wank and plot armor.

If you really want some elite motherfuckers, chrome them up.

The ones that are treated like the horrifying monsters they are. The West has a tradition of glorifying the superhuman while the East is more fixated on the sublime -- Japan in particular focuses on the practical implications of humanity having to coexist with a monster that could crush someone's skull like squishing a grape

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>accidental creation
Check.
>psychotic murderhobos
Check.
>mystical voodoo powers
Check.
>betrayed their creators
Check.

The whole "you were a child soldier all along" gives it that extra oomph.

>>51133730
A horrible fusion of humanity's best efforts to enhance the human body beyond nature and the quest for capable fighters for any conflict that are inhuman enough that we don't feel bad about their expendability.

I always wondered how a super-soldier could do anything but be a career beret sporter. Like, how can you constantly rationalize "I could kill everyone in this room with my bare hands and no one could slow me down, nevermind stop me."

Like this came up in Exalted once with my career soldier character realizing upon Solar Exalting "I can basically rule the world and none of you people can stop me." We always had checks and balances on peoples power but how do you do that with a soldier of this caliber? Do you just keep them serving forever? What happens when they got old and wounded? Old Yellar them?

Can creating a super-soldier ever create a human in a life outside of war? This is of course assuming a high benchmark of power but even the 40K glandies someone mentioned earlier had hyper-aggressive traits and other specialized regiments from the D-99 archetype garnered over debilitating effects.

>>51159328
I really liked the human piloted Sentinels.

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I think Halo is the best and definitive video game interpretation of a super soldier. Easily the best military sci fi work of fiction in my opinion. Great characters, great lore, great aesthetics - I'm surprised that it has managed to enjoy such immense mainstream success considering a lot of the weirder elements present in it

But yeah I love Halo 1,2,3, Reach and ODST. With a few hiccups, they are some amazingly written stories

I also like Soldier 76 because he's a badass even if he is just a composite of Captain America, The Punisher and CoD protagonists

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>>51165794
>Easily the best military sci fi work of fiction in my opinion IN VIDEO GAMES

Is what I meant. I'd say pic related is best all around work of Military Sci Fi followed by Forever War

>>51161967
Skitarii Spartans?

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>>51164160
see >>51148394 and >>51153352

>discussion is about supersoldiers, the lore Halo built around them, and how it's been thrown into the shredder by Traviss and 343.
>"b-but don't worry anons, shooting against 12-year-olds over the internet with it is still fun!"

>>51164812
This. We have far too much circlejerking about "fiting gud" and not enough about how they're seen as outcasts by mainstream society, or how they might see themselves as such. Doubly so after conflicts end.

Basically I want someone to take to supersoldiers the same way X-Men treated superheroes

>>51165794
>great aesthetics
Eh, aesthetics were at best okay and got worse and worse as the series dragged on. Original mjolnir armour was fairly practical looking, now its nothing but sharp edges and gaps with flexible armour behind it.

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>>51166282
Speak for yourself. It peaked at Reach and descended from there at a rather rapid rate.

>>51166183
As faggots?

>>51166391
Marvel's civilians are some of the most retarded I've ever seen. They only ever seem to focus on the bad things that happen when their heroes save the day, and constantly conveniently forget that while collateral damage is terrible, the heroes are often stopping something that wants global-scale disasters.

They're ALWAYS against the heroes on a large scale. It's like they forgot how to appreciate literally anything.

>>51166355
Armor in Reach was breddy gud, but the guns were ugly. Especially the assault Rifle.

>>51166355
The armour in reach is terrible its just random painted plates over black clothes or whatever you want to call it. Its the same kind of aesthetic that ruined Doom.

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>>51166581
Honestly mate, again speak for yourself. It wasn't the best weapons, but they weren't the worst. I thought it really fit a lot of the "used future," aesthetic that Halo was so good at.

>>51166592
You must be so fun at parties.

>>51166733
It was too jagged and made no sense as an immediate prequel to Halo CE.

>>51166733
>You must be so fun at parties.
>oh my god someone doesn't like the same armour aesthetics as me
>They are a terrible and boring person
Fuck off faggot. I never called you a 12 year old for liking bland edgy modern scifi armour that has lines for the sake of having lines.

>>51166935
The aesthetic change was jarring, yeah. Just like the change from Reach's very "used future," to Halo 4 and 5's crazy amount of lines and mass-produced super-soldiers. I just feel the used future aesthetic is where Halo shined best, so the first change was a welcome one.

Kind of like how they decided to go for a more tactical theme change with ODST, adding things like holosights and helmet lights more akin to Colonial Marines. It was neat and fun.

>>51166977
>i don't like this aesthetic
>instead of trying to join the conversation and engage people i'm just going to say it's the same thing that ruined the most popular shooter in years because i'm a contrarian
>oh shit someone doesn't like the way i do things
>better call him a faggot
Again, you must be so fun at parties.

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I think my favourite supersoldiers are the Fremen and Sardaukar from Dune. They're both chosen as soldiers because of the worlds that produced them- Arrakis is an entire planet of desert and rich in Melange, and Selusa Secundus is a bombed-out radioactive (IIRC) hellhole.

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>>51167106
I wish the author went into more detail in what in particular made the Sardaukar the best before the Fremen came about.

We got exposed to the Fremen as readers, so we could see their exceptionally martial culture alongside their few genetic mutations (excellent toughness and stamina, a degree of natural water retention so a longer amount of time hydrated on less water) and draw those conclusions for ourselves.

We know very little about what growing up on Selusa Secundus did to the Sardaukar to make them the best; we're just told it did. I feel like that is indicative of the author's trend with those stormtroopers: he did a lot of telling us that the Sardaukar were the best without showing us. We only really hear about them killing all the Atredies men without seeing it, and when we do see the Sardaukar they're busy getting killed by Fremen with shockingly low casualties for the desert men.

>>51160983
>not super
the DEEPEST LORE pretty heavily implies they're augmented in some way

>>51167318
Where and how?

>>51161023
Mostly because NORK's nanosoldatos isn't that strong.
Then again, they never manage to portray the random side plot of Alien invasion to be desperate in any way shape or form.

>>51143962
They could have had the UNSC starting to come apart after the strain of war ruined their careful ship rosters designed to prevent planetary loyalties from dominating fleets. And the various other Inner Colonies and outer colonies that were not on the main covvie invasion path could all be ready to overthrow ONI with Earth so devastated.

>>51167325
>A large black market surrounding the technology used by Pilots is rumored to have developed across the Frontier, covering areas such as weapons modifications, physical alterations and strengthening, stolen training simulation pods and Titan-Pilot combat interface abilities.
>physical alterations and strengthening

>>51167554
Neat. Where's this quote from?

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>>51133730
I think these guys are the zenith of cyborg supersoldiers. (Pic unrelated but fun)

http://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/4c87bf18e89ff

http://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/4bfe37c9056f6

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>>51134350
this is basically my idea for a comic book

I want to have a super experiemental soldier program, of which there is a lone survivor after the program is closed, and the man escapes the goverment's rule, flees the country, and lives his life as a normal civillian in a strange new country.

He's german, and he swims across the Atlantic to live in Florida.

The story picks up 10 years after he's struggled to find his place in the world, with the ever advancing tech norms. He even gets himself a desk job. After he discovers that an old contact he knew at the research compound survived the war, and passed the torch to their offspring -- this contact tracks down our wouldbehero and forces him to confront his past, face to face. Will he submit to the blackmail and threats? Can he stop the newblood from revitalizing the super soldier project? Is he still under their command?

All that and more... in an alternative history sci fi adventure.

>>51137433

Destiny was fun for about a month. I was very disappointed with the campaign, or lack thereof.

I've read the grimore cards and the background is amazing. I particularly loved the lore for Oryx on the gas gaint. Why Jason Jones scrapped the campaign story I'll never know. It felt like a jumbled mess, and half the time I didn't know why I was fighting and who I was fighting.

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>>51166282
God, the way 343 ruined the art design is really upsetting.

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>>51168181
And it sucks because they have some actual good concepts.

>>51168181
Personally I really like the Halo 2 standard ODST helmet, though it does look a lot like the Galfed marines in Metroid prime and they probably wanted them to stay distinct.

>>51168181
It turns so shit so quick.

>>51168181

Wait in Halo 5

Buck? Is that the name of the armor?

>>51168738
It's the character who wears it.

It's the same Buck from ODST; he got turned into a SIV and made a part of the fireteam hunting down Chief.

He's also voice- and face-acted by Nathan Fillion.

>>51164406
pretty, very, they're just words. i should probably get tested though.

>>51168774

They turned Buck into a Spartan?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ygvv_Ae3dg

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>>51168804
>>51168774


R E M I N D E R

ROOKIE WAS TEAM KILLED

>>51168804
Huh. Halo chill-out mixes with ASM rain in the background. Who'da thunk.

>>51168831
fucking gimped off screen in the dumbest way they could have legitimently planned. Only thing worse would have been dying from suffocation at a rio gloryhole.

>>51168831
>>51168869
I heard that he was killed offscreen but TEAM killed?

Man 343 are assholes.

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>>51168831

>tfw get to join the ODST
>Bitch ass sniper wakes you up from nap
>Now you gotta board a conveant ship
>uh oh EMP
>Wake up hours later and try to find your team
>Dodge Coveant kill teams and random bullshit
>Meet your Sergeants ex girl girlfriend who is the CIA or something
>Gotta drag a fat ass alien out of the city
>Do it
>Finally take a nice nap
>Turns out one of your squad mates was part of those the terrorists before the Coveant showed up
>Yeah we didnt remember those guys either
>tfw he kills you

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>>51168900
>Turns out one of your squad mates was part of those the terrorists before the Coveant showed up

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Halo has been my favorite ever since I played halo 2, and then went back to play halo CE.

The expanded universe is fantastic at making the Spartans interesting and giving them a challenge against the Covies. Fall of Reach and Ghosts of Onyx in particular.

It's interesting to me because I find it hard to read Space Marine fiction, or give a shit abotu their struggles what with them being either PUREST OF PURE to one degree or another, or ULTRA EVIL in so much of the lore. I still respect them as an important and awesome part of the fiction, I just don't really go to their novelswhen I could read a guard story or some stuff.
>>51168866
ODST's sound track is by far the most chill and introspective. I love all of Bungie's sound tracks, and even some of halo4's. Seriously great shit from marty.

>>51168927
If I remember right, it was fucking Mickey, too. The pilot-turned-groundpounder who somehow became an ODST despite the lore calling him out as something of a coward. HE, somehow, was a goddamned Innie.

>>51168900
Wait, one of the ODST squad was a Sep?

And killed Rookie?

(Having seen ONI's evil bullshit trying to make the Seps back into the bad guys was retarded.)

>>51168948
Wow, fucking hell 343.

>>51168938
>Ghosts of Onyx
For me part of it was the child soldier aspect. And the fact that it didn't hide from how fucked up some of those kids got. One became so riddled with PTSD she became a mute. A few of the others were semi-feral, especially from the first couple of training companies.

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the eternally crusading kind.

>>51168948
>>51168965
You're misremembering. It was Mickey who got him killed by rushing the Innie captain who was holding Rookie hostage after a flank attack went south.

Mickey defected long after that, when the surviving characters from ODST were made Spartan IVs. Jun outright states that had Rook lived, he'd have been made a Spartan as well.

>>51168965
Wait, I thought the Innie's kind of stopped being a thing once the Covies started glassing planets?

>>51169052
To specify:

On January 3, 2554, Alpha-Nine was deployed to Draco III's capital city of New Albany as part of the UNSC's response to an uprising instigated by the United Rebel Front. While the ODSTs were storming Draco III's capitol building, they were caught in an ambush in the legislature chambers. Buck ordered the Rookie to flank the rebels while the rest of the team provided cover. However, he was captured and beaten by the rebels, whose leader, Captain Ingridson, subsequently held him hostage on a shielded presidential balcony. At the conclusion of a prolonged standoff, Michael Crespo (Mickey) charged the balcony and attempted to force Ingridson to stand down. This prompted the rebel captain to execute the Rookie with a pistol shot to the head.

The UNSC won the ensuing firefight, with the remaining Insurrectionists killed or captured; Captain Ingridson was shot by Taylor Miles (Dutch) instantly after she killed the Rookie. The Rookie was buried at sea in one of Draco III's oceans. Taylor Miles was shaken by his death and decided to retire, while Crespo continued to harbor a deep-seated guilt over his failure to save him. His death would serve as one point of motivation for the remnants of Alpha-Nine to become Spartan-IVs. While talking to Buck, Jun-A266 mentioned that had he lived, the Rookie would have been offered the opportunity to become a Spartan alongside the rest of his team.

It was after this event, when they were all Spartans, that Mickey would turn traitor. Buck captured him and refused to kill him, instead giving him to ONI.

>>51169058
Apparently after the war they nearly captured the Infinity.

I guess some of the outer worlds were not on the covenant's main invasion path.

Or some of the inner worlds saw a chance for freedom after Earth got devastated.

>>51169092
So many layers of bullshit. And handing someone over to ONI makes Buck a villainous fucker.

>>51169092
>>51169118
Sorry, reread it to make sure. He handed Mickey over to Jun instead of the ONI agents there because "he believed Mickey was still a Spartan."

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>>51168938
>That scene in fall of reach where a young John beats the life out of some ODSTs

>In Hunt the Truth one of the survivors tells what happened

>>51169118
>>51169174
For more specifics:

In August of 2555, Mickey participated in a mission alongside Buck and Romeo at a United Rebel Front facility on Talitsa to recover the captured Huragok Quick to Adjust, and his human handler, Sadie Endesha. The three were sent on the mission by Dare due to their past experiences with the Huragok. On the way to the rebel base, they were surrounded and captured by rebel forces, whereupon Mickey's treachery was revealed to his teammates. As the rebels, led by Doctor Schein, led Buck and Romeo back to their base, the latter began to insult Mickey and Schein.

In response, Mickey attacked and inadvertently pushed Romeo down a hill. While the URF soldiers chased after him, Buck used the opportunity to attack Mickey and succeeded in moving the fight just out of sight of Schein and Romeos pursuers; whom the Spartan began to massacre. As their brawl continued, Buck eventually managed to knock Mickey unconscious with a headbutt. Schein attempted to help Mickey and shot Buck in the back. Holding him at gunpoint, Schein attempted to use Buck as a hostage to force Romeo to surrender. However, Buck used his helmet to knock the doctor to the ground and smashed his own rifle against his face, killing him.

While Romeo rescued Quick to Adjust and Endesha and finished off the remaining rebels, Buck awaited by Mickey until he regained consciousness. Upon awaking, Mickey begged for Buck to kill him, believing death was better than prison. However, Buck opted not to and the two sat down together in silence until a dropship arrived to extract them. When they returned to the Spartan facility on Mars, Buck had Mickey handed over to Jun-A266 instead of the ONI agents that were waiting for their return, since he believed that Mickey was still a Spartan. Mickey's defection led to the review of the SPARTAN-IV candidate vetting procedures to prevent further defections from within the branch.

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Spartans are absolutely my favorite. Shame what's happened to the franchise.

Even more of a shame because I love the universe too much to stop buying the games

There's this one caption out there where it's a post apocalyptic setting and the pic is a mech suit with someone inside who has been trapped inside for years and has mentally broken from the torture. The mech, now working with a bandit gang, is seen by someone who knows it's origins and desperately tries to free them from their prison.
Anybody have this picture or know what I'm talking about?

>>51169267
That's quite the exaggeration there since they had no armor on at that point.

>>51169307
Then you're a fool who's responsible for the universe getting ruined.

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>>51169327
Still, John didn't have his suit either which significantly enhances his strength.

And I still enjoy the gameplay at least. Forge is also the best it's ever been, and the custom games you can make are insane.

>>51167539
>343i could have gone with this
>Instead we get A.I. rebellion out of fucking nowhere

This is one of those times where I think a retcon would be completely justified.

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>>51133730

>>51169463
A few rebelling AI would probably have been necessary in my idea too, in order to make the navy come apart without the ships getting locked down.

I like to imagine it, people cutting deals with Jackal pirates, starting exploratory missions to find forerunner tech to get the final edge over rivals etc.

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>>51169323
I gotcha senpai.

https://www.keiththompsonart.com/pages/sequester.html

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>>51133730

>>51169572
I wrote f.a.m., what the fuck??

>>51169596
Hello, newfriend.

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super soldiers are dumb
a squad of riflemen could fuck up navy SEALs, it's not like training forever makes you unstoppable

>>51169614
Not new, but I've never noticed that before.

>>51167056
>>instead of trying to join the conversation and engage people i'm just going to say it's the same thing that ruined the most popular shooter in years because i'm a contrarian
Well it is the same style of armour in the new doom game. Which I think is shit. But yeah keep saying "hurr you must be real fun at parties."

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As the highly trained fist of some illuminati/templar organisation.

>>51166592
>Doom
>Ruined
Go and stay go

>>51161837

As far as I know, there was seriously fucked up need to know going on with the nano-suits.

Also, unless C3 changed it (since I didn't bother) it isn't that the nano suits are irremovable, but that remaining soldiers in the suits were so damaged that the suit was holding them together and maintaining their life support.

>>51168804
Everyone relevant in Halo now has to be a Spartan. Because fuck subtlety 343i needs to sell their action figures.

>>51167224

That's part of the point. The Sardaukar are dangerous, but they've been untested for ages.

They can beat any House army easily with better gear, support and training, but they haven't starved for decades.

The Fremen beat the Sardaukar because it was like fighting their ancestors: The ones that eked out survival on Selusa Secundus.

>>51169174
Fucking IVs are hardly Spartans in the first place worth some exceptions.

>>51169327
That pic is actual from a test run of halo2's MOJNIR

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What if we turn Space marines INTO drop pods?

>>51169849
Except it's not even close.

The armor in the new Doom is heavy-looking, pondering and purposeful, with a lot of segmented plates and hardly an inch of exposed under-suit. It's asymmetrical, and shows battle-damage. It looks old, like it could be an out-of-date suit relative to the era he's fighting in.

343i Spartan armor, on the other hand, is very sleek and smooth. Almost all of the plates are a solid piece and look like they're bolted to a section of the under-suit--a great deal of which is exposed. They have things like unicorn horns and stylized plates, whereas the Doom armor is supposed to look like it was put together by an entity with nothing but hurting others on his mind.

So you're not just smug, but also completely incapable of artistic analysis.

>>51170600
>>51168804
It makes some sense that once the mods were safe for adult installation that they'd give them to the best of the ODSTs.
>>51170856
They don't have the same background but their enhancements and armor are almost as good as the SII ones.

They're just for the most part shitty retards.

>>51170916
Part of the problem was that they jumped from "we can only use kidnapped genetic prodigies," to "we can do a few more people, but we have to use war orphans and child soldiers because of how dangerous it still it," to "now adults can just volunteer en masse because we worked out all the kinks!"

It was the super-soldier equivalent of us jumping from the Autumn and the Paris-class frigate--both of which were ships that needed something like a 2- to 4-to-1 ratio to beat a Covenant warship of equal size--to a massive uber-warship that could carry its own supporting Paris-class ships in its fucking belly while literally ramming through Covenant ships because fuck it, mang.

The jump in tech was just ridiculous and strayed a great deal away from Halo's theme of humanity barely getting by. Now we're a gene-modding super-power? Why? We were reduced to double-digit planets after the war, and lost a continent's worth of landmass on our home fucking planet.

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>>51133730
Time loops.

>>51170999
>It was the super-soldier equivalent of us jumping from the Autumn and the Paris-class frigate--both of which were ships that needed something like a 2- to 4-to-1 ratio to beat a Covenant warship of equal size--to a massive uber-warship that could carry its own supporting Paris-class ships in its fucking belly while literally ramming through Covenant ships because fuck it, mang.
>The jump in tech was just ridiculous and strayed a great deal away from Halo's theme of humanity barely getting by. Now we're a gene-modding super-power? Why? We were reduced to double-digit planets after the war, and lost a continent's worth of landmass on our home fucking planet.

Half a continent, and probably some boiled ocean since it was Kenya's coastal city.

I personally think he meant half A continent not necessarily half of the continent that actually got bombarded, so about half of Australia worth of Africa got turned to glass.

Personally I think the tech jump is semi reasonable given the more open trade of tech, remember in First Strike Cortana alone managed to turn the basic Covenant plasma torpedoes into beams almost as deadly as the covenant super-laser that was used to such devastating effect at Reach. (only less deadly because it's slower than light)

>>51137389
>Genocide Man
this is the edgiest shit
I am laughing my ass off

>>51170916
That's an issue I have, actually.I feel that a setting in which the augs and the Armour are good enough to make every who meet certain adult requirements into supersoilders on the same level of ability as the raised from kids hyper-trained supersoilders is a fundamentally different feeling than what Halo had been.

In the Bungie days, the Spartans were either 1)slightly better but overall not worth it ORIONs, 2) a very small number of hyperleathal anti-insurgency blackops-turned alien killers, trained from age 9, and half washed out or died thanks to the crazy ass things done to take them above and beyond. or 3) PTSD riddled xenocidal preteens suped up with not all together safe augmentations and used as a 'fire and forget' self guided FUCK-THE-COVIES weapon explicitly used to buy humanity more time and bleed the covies for every last drop they possibly could.
They were the morally dubious and desperate creations of an interstellar military hellbent on keeping humanity unified, and then keeping humanity alive.

The IV's are... they're space cowboys, they're overpowered joe's with a cocky attitude and at the speartip of a humanity that is the big dog on the block at the start of 4, but still gets duped like rubes by hick-split lips.

>>51171054
fuck yes, are they making an anime for that bomb ass manga? the movie was alright in it's own way, but i want to see an actual honest to manga anime.

>>51171088
Except the plasma was something Cortana could work with because we have a degree of experience with lasers. There's cross-tech there that useful.

What the fuck was crossed and traded to take the Spartans and make them so universally amazing and, well, universal? What did the Covenant give to us that made it so we could just give it to anyone who could make a passable soldier?

There's also the theme to consider. This guy (>>51171124) gets what I'm trying to say. It just doesn't fit Halo. It's not what Halo was, and it stepped way beyond where anyone really felt Halo should have gone.

>>51171158
Not that I know of. Someone just colored a piece of the art.

>>51153324
But Universe Shiritori was objectively the best part of that show.

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>>51142543

>>51170600
Technically there's still many ODSTs, it's just they've been trying to make more Spartans without the kidnapping. Their recruitment pool is closer to ORION than the rest.

>>51171182
>What the fuck was crossed and traded to take the Spartans and make them so universally amazing and, well, universal? What did the Covenant give to us that made it so we could just give it to anyone who could make a passable soldier?
There always was an indication that "How to make Spartans" was some form of implanted knowledge Halsey was gifted with back in First Strike and to a degree Fall of Reach. (And the way Guilty Spark reacted to the Chief vs the other humans)

It's possible that Forerunner stuff they found helped them continue on the track to "augmented Evolution" that Humanity once attained in the ancient past.

>>51171124
I agree however that it DID fuck up the theme, having them be awkward barely-human killing machines was more interesting than Space GI Joes.

>>51171370
>forerunner stuff
This is a fair assumption, as that's the same explanation they gave for the advances that led to most of Infinity. Honestly though, I'm still such a fan of the older theme with the ORIONs, SIIs, and SIIIs, that anything 343i is bound to disappoint; they don't seem like they're dropping their new theme any time soon.

Just to be clear, the orions and spartan 2s were concived as a cleaner means to crush insurrection. They were around way before contact at harvest

>>51170999
It's actually a reverse. It went from "Try to get some adults" to "Fuck, we need kids" to "Fucking people bitching about muh morals, get orphans" to "Okay, we need more guys. Can we get adults yet? My boss got a court martial after the last kidnapping." as the Is AR guys like Johnson.

>>51171370
Technically the prehistoric humans has just about every Joe be at least S-II level. The forerunners didn't develop shit as much as they took shit the humans already did & wire shit so humanity had an easier time rediscovering everything.

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>>51164636
She switched to a warrior suit at the end of Zero Mission, after passing the test of the Chozo God of War.

>>51136026
Never before have I wanted a game based on a single image so much in my life.

>>51171483
Yeah that's sorta what I mean.

They force devolved humans (And somehow split them back into Neanderthals and Sapiens?) and then left tricks to bring them back up to par once the Forerunners were gone.

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>>51171441
It's not that simple.

>try to get some adults
Those weren't nearly as capable as any that followed them, so I hadn't initially counted them. Their augments weren't nearly as deadly--to themselves and their enemies--or controversial. While it was a lot easier to produce these soldiers, they were hardly the super-weapon that the UNSC wanted, and their cost outstripped their performance.

>fuck, we need kids
Not just kids, mate. Literal child prodigies that were the absolute top of the gene pool; no one else would work with such dangerous mods, and even then half of them washed out and were reduced to invalids. They also had to test for attitude and all sorts of other parameters. It wasn't nearly as simple as "wee need kids."

>fucking people bitching about muh morals, get orphans
One corrupt-as-shit officer decided to throw all sorts of ethical clauses out the window and tried to get as much mass-producibility as he could out of the Spartan program. That required war orphans and child soldiers, and even then, many washed out with a similar invalid situation as the S-IIs. Others became half-feral, or were from the start.

>okay, we need more guys. can we get adults yet? my boss got a court martial after the last kidnapping
And suddenly we've jumped to nearly problem-free ubermensch for everyone. Larger acceptable gene pools--and they got some fucking retards into that project--with nary a reference to any kind of dangerous washing out. No signs of progress either, as the last reference we had to mass-producible Spartans was the S-III project, and that was anything but free of bugs.

The leap is mind-boggling, and completely against the consistent theme of Halo up to then.

>>51162319
I like 'em like that except they're cute anime girls and nobody teaches them mullusc defense tactics

>>51171697
It's much more simple

ORION project happened, results weren't up to par. They recruited some adults but things didn't work out as well as desired.

Turns out that implanting shit pre-puberty made best results. They had ONI agents kidnap & flashclone some kids with promising physical and mental abilities, implants & Mark IV power armour just happened to come out around that time. It was a huge success, exceeding all expectations but creating a second batch encountered many issues including finding kids compatible with their implants.

For the IIIs, their improved augmentations were less risky but less capable too. They went with orphans because there's some controversy over the kidnapping & flash cloning. Disposable heroes, they're basically a suicide squad sent on high risk high reward missions. Equipment, aside from NOBEL team, were much below IIs though better than most others. Most were orderline bootleg Spartans compared to IIs but still very good.

By IVs, they wanted more Spartans but went a different direction post-war. Adults alike ORION but either very promising recruits or hardened vets. Their improved implants are much safer but way below IIs in results. Adults vs prepubescent kids after all. They decided to focus on power armor more & the GEN2 power armor was far more of a crutch than others. Physically, a IV in GEN2 is around a II in GEN1. A II in GEN2 or even a III in GEN2 would rape a IV in GEN2.

>>51171697
It's actually rather consistent. Attempts at mass producing Spartans have been here since the Spartan-3s. Their augments kept on getting less invasive and safer and more accepting of a wider gene pool every time. It started to become "We need more, shit as many out as fast as possible".

>>51172024
I never heard the IVs were worse than IIIs out of the armor.

>>51172024
You're mostly fine until you hit the IVs.

>went a different direction post-war. adults like ORION but either very promising recruits or hardened vets
Okay, more or less fine so far, though you don't really explain how they just randomly improved the implants to be so much safer. It's stupid, but for sake of conversation, sure. Let's roll with it.

Where you lose me is here:

>but way below IIs in reults
Where is the proof of that? Because looking at IVs, we see nothing to suggest that they're somehow physically lesser than a II outside of their armor. All of the IVs are fucking huge, and they even took a cute little scientist and turned her into a bitch capable of single-handedly killing a Phantom full of Covenant, including two elites with swords.

>adults vs prepubescent kids after all
And there's no evidence that this changed the end result from a physical perspective, though the argument for experience difference is obviously there and entirely valid; it's not however where I think you were going with it.

>they decided to focus on power more & the GEN2 power armor was far more of a crutch than others
Again, I'll accept this when you show more concrete evidence, and I'm being that stingy for a reason. While watching Fireteam Osiris jetpack down and kill that many Covenant with their fancy armor was neat, there was nothing to show that they weren't just using the same armor as Blue Team.

Chief left the cryopod he entered in the same kind of armor, and Cortana just gave him a throwaway line about upgrades. What evidence do we have that the upgrades were that big a deal? MJOLNIR in itself was such a crazy fucking achievement, and I'm not seeing anything to suggest that GEN2 was SO much better that it acts as a crutch.

>physically, a IV in GEN2 is around a II in GEN1. a II in GEN2 or even a III in GEN2 would rape a IV in GEN2
This honestly feels like you're ass-pulling. With everything proceeding it being on shaky ground, nothing here means anything.

>>51172210
It's on the wikis. I know, I know, fan wikis, but I'm not going to sort through all the extended universe shit 343 is putting out myself. Halopedia is moderately noncancerous, though the articles for things in Halo 1-3 are miles better than the newer stuff. To get back to the point, IV's can't be augmented as agressively as II's and III's could because IV's are adults. So to compensate for the more modest augmentations they doubled down on the GEN2 MJOLNIR.

>>51172206
>attempts at mass producing spartans have been here since the spartan-3s
Dude, where? We go from S-IIIs in the books to suddenly mass-production super-soldiers for everyone in H4. Unless there's a book somewhere between the two that shows more consistent attempts at ironing out all the bugs from S-III to suddenly being totally fine in S-IV, I call bullshit. That's a crazy leap with zero real explanation.

>their augments kept on getting less invasive and safer and more accepting of a wider gene pool every time
Again, where? From S-III to S-IV there's nothing. No experiments, no explanations, no nothing. Just a tech jump.

>>51172279
The neat thing about wikis is that they're sourced. I'm not asking you to go look at it personally, but where in the wikis are they sourcing the claim that S-IV augs weren't nearly as aggressive and they doubled-down on armor effectiveness as a result?

>>51172336
The wiki cites an interview with Frank O'Connor at Comic Con and Halo: New Blood on the Spartan IV page. The page on Sparan IV augmentations also seems to refer to the same Comic Con interview for the claims that SIV's are weaker and use GEN2 to make up for it. So really it's just Frank O'Connor saying things that have yet to be contradicted.

>>51172432
>one dev just making claims
>literally no evidence of those claims except Word of God
Oh, joy...

>>51172463
Welcome to 343, please enjoy your stay. He is the franchise director, so it's marginally more reliable than some random developer saying shit. Marginally.

>>51172210
I'm not actually sure which is worse but the attention towards power armor the IVs got made me think they focused more on getting people into power armor and letting the armor handle the rest than IIIs.
>>51172244
As impressive as some IVs are, were any of them taking down multiple ODSTs hand-to-hand as a teenager & unarmoured? The kind of shit the IIs do in the books is crazy.

Proof is even in the dialogue. Buck himself described IVs as a downgrade from the others.

No evidence? Getting the implants in before puberty was a big thing. Puberty we all know to be a big change in the body. It's one of the reasons they went for kids besides the mental conditioning for both IIs & IIIs.

The book Spartans did similar & even during the Locke vs Chief fight it was clear Chief had the upper hand the entire time. Not only that but Osiris isn't the average IVs, Buck especially proved himself in the field prior.

The augmentations again. Previous they didn't work well for adults & needed kids for maximum effect. Now they work for adults & characters themselves admit they're weaker than IIs. Not only that but there's a reason it's a GEN2, not a Mark Roman Numeral.

>>51172563
GEN2 Irritates me because rather than armored plates and actual protection of critical areas of the body, they've handwaved it by saying the new undersuit is as strong as the old armor plates of the MJOLNIR. So now you're just attaching pads that look cool to your armor without it making any real difference. And dammit, I miss my mix and match parts list. I want my Commando helmet with the visor and a grenade rig on my chest.

>>51172244
>Chief's armor
That's not gen 2. That's a mk 7 Cortana modified.

>>51172563
>the kind of shit the IIs do in the books is crazy
We never have a chance to see IVs do stuff out of armor, if I remember right. Part of why we have no proof of how effective they are without it.

>characters themselves admit they're weaker than IIs
>buck himself describes IVs as a downgrade
I don't remember the line, but I'm willing to at least cede it for sake of conversation. I'd like a quote, but that's mostly because I'm curious what his thoughts on the matter are.

>getting the implants before puberty...
>the augmentations again
And we have zero evidence that the implants make that much of a difference when put in pre- or post-puberty. No scientist telling us that or anything. We know that it was easier to brainwash the kids for the II program and we know Halsey comments on their puberty being a factor (something along the lines of how their bodies were already undergoing change, so they might take the change better), but no one makes any such comments or comparisons regarding the ORION augments or the IV augments. The IIIs being so young were mostly political--as far as the characters training them could tell--and as such we don't know if their augs rely on it either; no one comments one way or the other.

>Locke & Chief fight
It's just as valid for me to attribute that to the difference in their experience as it is for you to attribute it to the difference in their augments.

>>51172649
Yeah, even ignoring the in-universe sperging over whats stronger, the aesthetic is just so opposite of what we've come to expect from Halo. It feels like it should be in Infinity, not Halo.

>>51172655
With a handwavey comment, and literally nothing to suggest one is better than the other aside from, apparently, Word of God as noted here (>>51172432).

>>51172701
buck said from new blood

We're not exactly like those artificial gods from the earlier generations. More like demigods. And I'll be damned if that usually isn't good enough

>>51172701
We've actually seen a crazy ex-Spartan IV fight in a comic. Strong for unarmored but not Spartan level.

It's from one of the books. I don't remember which.

Didn't they say it was? I remember it was said that it was for best results & one of the reasons IVs are weaker.

I can say the same about Buck, Arby or another's experience. Osiris is explicitly above the average IV team.

>>51172795
Certainly sounds like something he'd say. Also the first I've heard of in terms of in-game or in-universe comments that support Word of God. So at least there's that.

Still makes me really miss the days of Bungie being in control of Halo, though.

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>>51164345
Although i obviously like the space marines imperial fists, I really like the stormtrooper/tempestus scions / karskins/cadia's elite of the imperial guard (or astra militarum)

>>51172858
>didn't they say it was?
The first I've ever heard of in-universe proof one way or the other is Buck's quote according to >>51172795, which still doesn't actually prove that the pre- or post-puberty line was the reason, just that IVs are apparently not as strong (or not as good, Buck's words could be taken either way I guess) as IIs.

>>51172858
>>51172902
halsey report said

ORION candidates were volunteers from various UNSC special forces; men and women who were undoubtedly qualified for any military assignment. But they were much too old to undergo genetic augmentation. Inserted gene sequences led to subminimal target changes, while immunosuppressants failed in most subjects, caused rampant, irreversible genetic fragmentation and degenerative conditions.
Refinement: Next-generation candidates must have more malleable, robust DNA structure/repair enzymes. With satisfactory testing of the L-DNA hydroxyl repolymerase, the most suitable candidate would be prepubescent.

>>51173081
We know that already, mang. That's regarding the Orion troops and the S-IIs that would follow.

None of that really proves it would carry over another two generations of tech, especially considering the crazy jump of tech between when they made S-IIIs and S-IVs.

Honestly though, the only argument I can stand on now is how it doesn't fit from a thematic perspective. As pointed out above, Word of God happened. So as stupid as I think it is, it's true now.

>>51172563
>Proof is even in the dialogue. Buck himself described IVs as a downgrade from the others.
Where? It sounds like clip worth watching.

>>51169038
CRUSADERS IN SPACE KILLING THINGS THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND!

>>51173114
Overall, the IV augmentations were an upgrade from IIs but I'm unsure if it was completely different enough to completely negate that key flaw altogether. It's why ORION wasn't the success they wanted to begin with.
>>51173133
He said it was New Blood. Turns out it wasn't a game.

>>51172795
my favorite take on the super soldier is when their makers inadvertently create a new viable breed, having a post human bend to my likings the idea of creating those who might be our successors appeals in a strange way, so I tend to like my super soldiers as being able to breed

As bad as the SW prequels are, I stole the idea of "clones of a perfect warrior" from that.

Actually, I thought of the idea myself, but when one of my players pointed out how similar it was I just said fuck it and gave them all jetpacks.

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>>51173303
How perfect is your perfect warrior? Is he a combination of some of the finest genes in the galaxy?

>>51173303
MGS did it too, it's not exactly a new concept.

>>51173338
No
But when the BBEG releases Gen 2 they will be
>>51173494
The difference being that MGS only had 2, whereas I'm using a small army's worth.

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Post-human cyborgs or robots who are so effective that they are individually considered to be strategic assets on the same level as a nuclear weapon or battleship.

>>51133730
I like supersoldier portrayals that show them as immensely flawed, and go into more detail about the psychology behind them.

Like Space Marines, except less retarded

>>51173614
MGS had 3 clones and a stunt double.

>>51161837
IIRC wasn't there only a risk of death because Alcatraz was essentially meat-jelly inside a suit that was acting as a support structure for his entire body due to massive and 100% fatal internal trauma.

>>51162191
Chozo ascended to a different level of reality.

Samus was left behind.

>>51173834
A stunt double, that just happened to be a soldier on the level of Big Boss,and even big boss fell before the inferior clone Solid Snake. I find the fact that the clone was best somehow ironic, but I'm not sure how to describe it,

>>51173872
She was left so the Chozo can brag about how much better they are.

>>51173884
Can Venom lift ZEKE?

>>51173893
No, she was left to guard against threats no other species had the ability to defeat, this is pretty clear in the games, I think.
>>51173920
I'm not sure, did he ever have a chance to come into contact with Metal Gear ZEKE?

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>>51173747
ever read Supergod by Warren Ellis?
also Hail Durandal

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>>51169092
>Mickey is sad the Insurrectionists killed Rookie
>Decides the only logical thing to do is betray the rest of his squad and the UNSC and join the Insurrection because it's the UNSC's fault the Insurrectionists killed Rookie

>>51133730
>>51136173
If any of you like Halo's Spartan's I'd check out Hunt The Truth. It's a audio drame and 343 fucked up with Halo 5 but it really shows how great the setting can be if used right and it's a shame it isn't, expands on the extent ONI was willing to go to cover up their actions

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>>51136591
I still with the old halo 4 leaks about how Chief was gonnna rebel against the UNSC and fight against mass produced Spartan IIIs loyal to ONI and shit, man that sounds better than what we got
At least the Forerunner books are actually pretty good and make Didact seem decent in context

>>51169267
>In Hunt the Truth one of the survivors tells what happened
I thought that soldier was just an ONI agent to trick Girraud?

>>51142543
If I asked her to be happy, would she find her own happiness?