Warmachine/Hordes General - /wmhg/

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>Menoth
:^)

Hello, I've never played Cygnar but I got lots of warjacks for a steal.

Ironclad x2
Cyclone
Defender

Lancer
Sentinel
Sentinel
Charger

I have Maddox but I wanted to build something with stormknights. Mainly the malcontents so full unit + 3x WA + UA + captain. Any advice for which casters jacks would work best?

>>51124899
What are the Malcontents? Form your post it sounds like Stormblades.

>>51124899

Fireflies bring a buff to lightning damage, which the Stormblades will love.

The Stormclad synergizes very well with all storm knights, including Maddox, thanks to accumulator.

>>51124911
A fictional group of stormblades from the novel malcontents that features Silvio Montero Acosta. Im lacking a Stormclad for them to marshal but it will have to do.

>>51124961
>>51124899
Maybe something like this:

http://conflictchamber.com/#b11bfN9H9Hada5a6a9dhaoaj9cae

Cygnar Army - 75 / 75 points

(Maddox 1) Major Beth Maddox [+30]
- Stormclad [18]
- Stormclad [18]
Storm Lances (max) [20]
Stormblade Infantry [10]
- Stormblade Infantry Officer & Standard [5]
- Stormblade Infantry Storm Gunner (3) [6]
Stormblade Captain [5]
Major Katherine Laddermore [8]
Journeyman Warcaster [4]
- Firefly [8]
Field Mechaniks (min) [3]

>>51124259
my memes are spreading, wonderful.

>>51124248
What heavies can survive synergy at 3? And how are you supposed to out-heavy 10p heavies?
>>51124319
>tfw you are actually scared shitless of isis now

>>51125009
>What heavies can survive synergy at 3? And how are you supposed to out-heavy 10p heavies?
My point exactly.

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>>51125009
ALLAHU ACKBAR

PRAISE BE UPON MY ABS

>>51125009
>What heavies can survive synergy at 3? And how are you supposed to out-heavy 10p heavies?

Just shoot them to pieces at range.

>>51125030
>Just shoot them to pieces at range.
Choir.

>>51125042
There's enough access to magical weapons to deal with choir.

>>51125048
You have enough magical weapons to shoot 8 jacks off the table? Outside of Caine1 I don't really see that happening. And even then it's a stretch.

>>51124319
>coc wont get theme lists
>or a way to make conflux useful

rm -r hopes&dreams

>>51124981
That look nice, thank you

>>51125071
CoC is confirmed for a theme in this doc.

>>51125071
>coc wont get theme lists
They're getting one this week.

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>>51125027
Yesssss it is finally time for everyone to acknowledge the superiority of the abs

>>51125057
Ossyan with MHSF is one easy example.

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Posted last thread but want input. Wanted to run sexy dragon lady with predominately heavies, not having to worry about much else:

Absylonia, Daughter of Everblight [+28]
- Proteus [19]
- Carnivean [19]
- Carnivean [19]
- Carnivean [19]
- Carnivean [19]
The Forsaken [4]
The Forsaken [4]

Can this list function well, despite lacking some token animus beasts for Slipstream/Wraithbane? It looks nice on paper.

>>51125086
>MHSF
Are Blessed. Not Magical.

>>51125089
A&H

>>51125086
Mhsf are blessed, but not magical?

>>51125042
>>51125048
>tfw Khador

>>51125080
>>51125078
Mkdir hopes&dreams

>>51125095
I don't see a lot of ret players bringing them anymore since they are no longer partisan, and lose Kiss.

>>51125095
So you have 1 unit that gets 1 turn of shooting into those 8 jacks. Let's also assume 2-3 shots from Warjacks. I am sorry but that is not going to be enough. That might take away 1 or 2, but then you will eat the alpha.

I guess we have to out-threaten Amon's Battlegroup. What's his range, 11"?

>>51125111
It is with Electromancers to fuck your warjacks up as well.

>>51125132
1 Unit of Electromancers fucks with 1 Jack per round. I mean, good idea, it's certainly something, but I don't see it being enough.

Getting rid of choir seems like a necessity. What are some good ways of doing that, ambush?

Khador can spam 5 man squads of Kossites for 7 points a unit, threatening 12.5" charges or 19" POW 10 shots from flanks.

>>51125142
Add Eyriss as well, that fucks another unit up.

Now two jacks are doing nothing, and on average, the MHSF kill two Crusaders, plus whatever Ossyan's battlegroup does.

Other merits are the Battle Engine, which can either slam(use the MHSF to kill the Fortified Jack first, of course) or hit with POW16s. You can bring also bring a unit of kittens to force the Amon player to choose between no spells or no ranged attacks, and calling no spells means the MHSF just kill the Fortified jack and then push everything anyways.

>>51125167
The problem I'm seeing with that is that once the ambushers get to the choir (probably turn 3), the shooting protection will no longer be relevant.

>>51125201
no ranged, I should say.

If they call no spells then you just get to shoot them to death with the rest of Ossyan's army.

>>51125201
>the MHSF kill two Crusaders
About 1.5 on average.

Other than that it sounds like you have a valid game plan. As long as that list can play into Sevy2 and Reclaimer (should be good with Shatterstorm) you should have a Protectorate drop.

>>51125201
I haven't seen an Ossyan list bring mittens ever. This is turning out to be a weird bizzaro Ossyan that sounds like it would do pretty bad into other lists

>>51125224
Changing metas change what you should bring.

I'd never seen Ossyan players bring mittens either, because there was never any need. But they present a real answer in this setup, and aren't entirely useless otherwise. Hell, he has Fortune for them now as well.

>>51125142
>>51125201
Keep in mind that Vassals counter Disruption, especially in amon's feat turn, when he can just shift his focus around anyway.

>>51125236
Focus Leak isn't considered Disruption. And with that being said, perhaps two units of electromancers instead of Eyriss. That even gives Ossyan some wider range of options for dealing with spam lists, for example.

Something like this, as a first build.

http://conflictchamber.com/#b51b464l4G4G3m3o3ubCf23i8M3yf2

Retribution Army - 75 / 75 points

(Ossyan 1) Lord Arcanist Ossyan [+28]
- Hypnos [18]
- Aspis [6]
- Aspis [6]
Mage Hunter Strike Force (max) [16]
- Mage Hunter Strike Force Commander [4]
- Soulless Escort (1) [1]
Arcantrik Force Generator [16]
House Vyre Electromancers [8]
House Shyeel Battle Mages [10]
Lady Aiyana & Master Holt [8]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
House Vyre Electromancers [8]

>>51125275
This list also presents a very real threat to Amon as well. If Hypnos gets Shadow Bind off on Amon himself, then Fortune'd MHSF have a very good chance at killing him.

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Haven't been paying attention lately, do we know the Mk.III stats for the Helios already?

>>51125417
Yeah, it's in war room

5 17 6 5 10 19
construct pathfinder

tractor beam, RNG 12 ROF 3, pushes 3" instead of damage

inferno fists, P+S 21, continuous fire, 1" on boxed

http://battlecollege.org/index.php/Helios

SKORNE SPOILERS WHERE

>>51125496
NEVER. AND YES I FUCKING MAD. I JUST WANT TO PLAY WMH AGAIN BUT FUCKING PP IS TOO BUSY SUCKING THEIR OWN COCKS OVER GRIND AND SHIT TO FIX THEIR FUCKING MESS OF A GAME

>>51125511
TOO BUSY BUFFING THE YARDSTICK FACTION IN TURN THROWING OFF THE GAME'S ENTIRE BALANCE

>>51125496
END OF THE MONTH

PPS_JACKSON SAID SO

>>51125689
WHAT THE FUCK. IT WAS MIDDLE OF THE MONTH LAST TIME I CHECKED

>>51125689
GOT A STEAMROLLER ON THE 5TH OF FEB

FUCKING SERIOUSLY MAN

>>51125088
Anyone? Is this at least going to be fun?

Are there any medium based ten mans outside of trolls?

>>51125088
Looks fine to me. Is speedy assaination the name of the game? If so a seraph, angelius might help to get positioning just right.

>>51126005
Name of the game is just to run as many beasts/jacks as I can with beast/jack casters I like, and a limited amount of Support.

More or less assassination, especially with flight on heavies. If I cut a Carnivean for a Seraph, I can point fill with 3/2 Shepherds/Spell Martyrs. I'm just not sure if they are necessary (if the extra 2" is worth it on one when others are lagging behind).

>>51126045
I'm hoping there's something interesting with the Legion theme forces. If we get something nifty like free Shepherds (or anything close to the obscene Protectorate theme force) I'll be happy.

>>51126045
I understand where you are coming from. Another benefit is that you can be armor 20 on the approach with such a list.

My personal preference would be dropping one carnivean for a neraph, deathstalker, and 3 shepherd. Maybe another carnivean for a ravagore.

I hope the theme force they reveal this week will be like a legion version of the menoth one. I want free forsaken.

Is it possible to run an army that is 1 caster and one of the massive robots like the kraken?

>>51126093
>Another benefit is that you can be armor 20 on the approach with such a list.
Not without frenzying.

>>51126137
Well yu can run those but that's not a complete army. You usually have ~100p to spend and Colossals or Gargantuans usually cost between 36 and 39 points.

>>51126149
But they're apart of normal play?

>>51126169
Yes, absolutely. They're just normal models with a bunch of type-specific rules. Not all of them are good (Hydra, Storm Raptor, Sepulcher and Conflux are notoriously bad) and their value is highly dependent on context. For example a Stormwall is a lot better with Arcane Shield, but doesn't want to see Ossyan with Mage Hunter Strikeforce.

>>51126149
>Not without frenzying.
At worst, you have one Carnivean checking to Frenzy (or, you know, just hanging one back). Abby handles 3, and you can put Bracer up on something to compensate.

And believe me, if you fail a threshold check (8 on 2d6) on turn 2, you better just concede because luck is not with you.

>>51126215
>Abby handles 3
And sits on 0? Fool-proof plan.

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;^)

>>51126228
>sits on 0
>turn 2 of the game
>behind a wall of large-base models
Yeah man, gotta watch those drop pod terminator squads coming in as reinforcements or something, right?

>>51125083
NO NIPPLES NO AMON
dude, I think we already had this
Amon needs his nipples
Look here, those are some good Amon nipples >>51125027

>>51126149
>Not without frenzying
Just don't force them all to SG. Though getting some fury on the forsaken might help for later.

>>51125949
Mercs got Assault Ogryns and Greygore Boomhwoler (though he is a troll I guess), Cryx got Bloodgorgers. Are Legion Grotesques medium based?
That's what I can think off the top of my head, maybe there's some more

>>51126371
No. I wish grotesques were that size since their wings get in the way on small bases.

>>51125479
Has anyone found a good way to use it? I've proxied a few times and it never seems to get much done, it wants to spend so much focus for the abilities and boosting.

I love the model I just don't want to but it and have it sit unused

>>51125048
Kill the Choir first.

>>51125949
>>51126371
I don't think so. Ogrun units are all 5-man or solos. The "heavy" infantry are 5 or 6 man units. Boomhowlers and Bloodgorgers are really just troll infantry units that happen to work for other factions.

>>51125949
Bloodgorgers in Cryx (assuming you mean outside of trolls as a faction, because the Bloodgorgers are blighted trolls)

>>51126228
>>51126215
To elaborate: I don't think that list is good at all. It's a one-trick-pony and that trick is not really good or unique. If you want to spam ARM20, play Khador.

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>>51127352
>he thinks you play that list for the ARM20

>>51127378
What else do you play a Carnivean spam for then? Because it offers nothing a more balanced list doesn't do miles better. Hell, it can't even properly alpha strike.

>>51127398
Its an assassination list I thought? Proteus to place a key model into a position that allows the carniveans to assault charge spays into a warcaster.

>>51127525
That is beyond janky. Might aswell just go for double blight blades and try to plink the enemy caster to death.

what are some beneficial matchups for CoC? I'm new to the game and I've beaten a 75-p Cygnar against not!Iron Man and a 25 against trolls, but I've lost against Khador three times, Menoth twice, and I actually lost against Skorne because I got charged by a tibs and a line of gladiators that took out four of my jacks and tilted me out of the game.

I think my big problem is that all the games I've lost save two were against lists being optimized for tourney play, where I'm just throwing together a fun list to try out to learn my faction a little better? That and the fact that my dice rolls are consistently meaning I have a 40% hit rate, but I'm not 100% sure if that's because of my dice rolls or because Vector means my 'jacks tend to have below-average MAT/RAT

>>51127740
Flares and yuge amount of foci is the reason why coc has shitty mat/rat on vectors.

>>51127740
>I think my big problem is that all the games I've lost save two were against lists being optimized for tourney play, where I'm just throwing together a fun list to try out to learn my faction a little better? That and the fact that my dice rolls are consistently meaning I have a 40% hit rate, but I'm not 100% sure if that's because of my dice rolls or because Vector means my 'jacks tend to have below-average MAT/RAT

Lazy analysis is that Khador and Menoth do what you do only cheaper and better, and you let Skorne Alpha you.

>>51127398
>What else do you play a list highly offensive heavies with strong defenses in a list where they get even more absurd with 12" flying charges with RNG 2 weapons and assault sprays for then?
Gee bob I dunno. A beast with 4 strong initial attacks, one of them being a clearing Sp10 Pow14, and you're honestly wondering why you play Carniveans? They're really good all-rounders. The only way that list would be differentiated is if he took Ravagore or two for AOE or infantry blocking (which aren't popular in MK3), or a Scythean for dedicated melee instead, which Proteus does just fine.

What's your definition of "balanced"? A Naga for getting Wraithbane so you can get a few extra dice every once in a while? A Seraph for 2" that likely won't matter when you have five 19pt heavies ready to smash a line? I guess he COULD shed a point and take a Spell Martyr? Hell, if Legion's beast theme is as good as the Protectorate's, you might get some free Forsakens or Shepherds or something.

>running 5 heavies at the caster using flight is "jank"
lol ok

>>51127839
>coc of slow
>not getting alphad 24/7

>>51127983
Your primary game plan relying on assault spraying a caster to death is jank. And 12" threat is nothing special. For example, it's 2" less than good Abby2 lists.

>>51128009

By *Skorne*? The only way it is going to happen if it's built so obviously you can see it coming.

>>51128301

Tiberion and a line gladiators. Does CoC do screening infantry these days?

>>51128315
I had a line of Reciprocators, but Tibs chewed through them pretty quick and the gladiators walked through to my jacks. that was a game where as soon as my turn ended I said "I fucked up" then lost more than half my army

>>51127740
CoC has pretty good matchups against both Khador and Menoth, and Skorne, to be honest.

What's your caster and list?

>>51127839
>Lazy analysis is that Khador and Menoth do what you do only cheaper and better

That is pretty lazy, and also wrong.

>>51128009
The only one that gets Alpha'd hard is Lucant, everyone else has shit to move faster or deal with the Alpha.

>>51127740
Played CoC competitively since mk3, played PoM mk2 for 3 years.

CoC is obviously very dependent of the casters you choose. The good matchups may just be polar opposites between, say, an Aurora infantry list and a Lucant vector list. So it's kinda hard to tell.

My feeling so far is that we struggle a lot against heavy armor is the TEP (battle engine) is not around, and that high def spam is super hard to deal with unless you pick specific answers (Attunement servitor + TEP/Eradicators/Positive charged shit/...).

Add the complex Induction system that is kinda hard to fully optimize and grasp, and CoC feels like being on the hardest faction to play at the moment.

I feel like CoC, if it brings a TEP, can have the upper hand against any combined arms list, and depending on the caster can be crushing a majority of the current top casters across the game. My feeling is the most difficult matchups are Hordes warbeast heavy factions combined with decent DEF (like 13+) as most of our troops and jack will struggle to hit. On the other hand the easiest match ups are the low DEF medium to high ARM opponent.

CoC have average+ threat ranges usually, and slower armies are no big deal.

I'm a bit surprised to be honest that you struggle on Khador, PoM and Skorne that I would pretty much all classify as easy targets for CoC.

Try the TEP, and abuse the Cipher rough terrain against non-pathfinder heavies. Don't field to much support and be very cautious with your positioning, and that should do the trick.

I know that playing PoM for 3 years, including counter-meta warjack centric lists, helped me a lot with positioning. That's really key for CoC as well, as most of our pieces are just plain average and need synergies AKA good positioning to deal with the opposing powerhouses.

>>51128848
I wouldn't say CoC has real problems with cracking armor, every caster but Aurora has a damage buff.

Hitting is more of an issue, but that comes down to Induction chains. If you don't have that shit figured out, then yea, those MAT/RAT scores are going to look awful terrible.

>>51128816
Lucant was my caster in the Alpha'd situation, yeah. I'm trying out a few things since I'm just getting started, but the core tends to be
(CASTER)
Corollary
Inverter (usually one, but I was trying two yesterday and it was kinda alright? they weren't able to help me with Directrix, but my enemy was running full sniper Khador and hitting 16 damage a round as well as running the anti-witch merc so I was spending more time blocking with them than moving them forward)
PA
Cipher
Recip max.
TEP
OD+attachment for more heals

it was a good list working with Lucant, then I switched to double-inverter double-cipher TEP Recips on Axis and got completely shut down by an Amon with two choirs because he essentially said "you can't shoot my six heavies if you're not magic" and then ran the board out from under me, then I fucked up in an on-the-spot Directrix build and went "if he's running a bunch of one-HP units I can beat that with servitors" and got outranged by the snipers

>>51128967
I should also clarify that I have yet to put together an Aurora infantry list, and after last night I want to put together a proper list for Lucant, Directrix, and Axis before I start throwing another caster into it and confusing myself even more.

>>51128903
All our casters (but Aurora) have damage buffs indeed, but some are really lackluster comapred to others.

For instance, Mother's Imperil is not very reliable, with flat unboostable RAT5 and relatively low range if your opponent play well enough and sniped/threat Mom' servitors.
Lucant on the other hand can cast Positive Charge, says, twice and all the army suddenly wreck everything.

The hard part (except with Lucant who can deal with it by taking the alpha and Axis in some way with his feat) is to allow the Induction chain to take place while advancing in melee. Usually, your opponent won't let you chain 3x3 Focus on 3 melee jacks when you rush his colossus, and Foc can be a problem very quickly.

Prime Axiom is the only piece able to trade heavies from range (Drag!) and still allow easy induction chains.

>>51128967
TEP + OD should deal with Amon just fine.

Heck, even without OD it's not a problem. Just target a Choirboy or something out of range to get your sprays on the opposing heavies.
Also, always field Attunment servitors with the TEP. Being able to reliably hit twice with 5d6 dmg (and without sacrificing a Cipher's activation) is a big deal.

I'd say Lucant without Axiom and Mother with Axiom can take Amon just fine. Not enough experience with Axis. Aurora will struggle because of the ARM spam, but could try it on Incursion or Hold the Line.

>>51128028
Define a good list. That list is just fine.

>>51128967
So, first thing: Optifex Directive can give any model in our faction(besides Axis) magical weapons, so Passage is basically a giant trap for the Menoth player.

Second thing is, sorry to say, lists aren't usually super modular in CoC. Shit that works well for one caster doesn't work very well for another.

At the core, what I'm saying, is a pretty good list. Some kinks(The UA on the OD is kind of a waste), but ultimately fine for dealing with what you're looking at.

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>>51128028
>Your primary game plan relying on assault spraying a caster to death is jank.
You're a moron; there are multiple people in this conversation. My plan is not to spray a caster to death (as one suggested) but to... well, you know, use the FLIGHT you get from her FEAT to pile the shit out of the caster.

But yeah, it's just a jank list. :^)

>>51128816
>That is pretty lazy, and also wrong.

'Caster-buffing battlegroups full of econo-priced but good warjacks along with a list-wide toolkit also largely provided by the warcaster?

>>51129190
I mostly put the UA on her because I wasn't thinking of things that I could use the points for, but as >>51129147 pointed out I can better spend the points on Attunement Servitors to give the TEP better shots.

>>51129190
with that list minus the UA and adding attunement servos it will beat Amon, but how would it stand up to most other things? I want to try making a list that I can run that can reliably deal with multiple casters; even if it's only two or three casters it's a victory for me and my list-making

>>51129236

You do realize that WTC is where Jank lists are actually used competitively, since it's a lot easier to place them into the matchups they're actually good for?

WTC-style events have very significantly different listbuilding from every other format.

>>51129296
You're still probably going to lose quite often against experienced players bringing solid lists. That's just part of the learning experience.

So that ultimately means that the issues here are tactics, not strategy.

And that's a matter of figuring shit out. As I said, you've got a pretty decent list, at least for Lucant, so let's talk about that.

So, what you want to leverage in Lucant is using the Axiom as area denial/objective holder, the Inverter to curb offensives and alphas, and the Cipher to slow down and disrupt the enemy.

Lucant is extremely resistant to shooting, so you're forcing your opponent to get in close, which you're cool with him doing it. Proper turn for feating is extremely important: It's very common to feat to avoid an alpha, and there are times that's good, but if it just causes your faster opponent to hold back another turn, then you've usually wasted it.

To be honest, Amon is a very tough nut to crack, with him dealing with all of the Menoth jacks downsides(Pathfinder to ignore rough terrain, Fortify prevents drags, no spells can be very annoying), but he's got fairly linear threat ranges that if you know about can let you deal with his shot.

For the other casters:

Axis does not want a Prime Axiom. He wants Inverters, and can take a Cipher and a Conservator.

Mom does not want an Inverter. It does alright, but it doesn't really help with her overall game plan.

>>51129283
CoC warjacks are pretty bargain priced as well for what they bring, and while those casters have toolkits, they don't bring the flexibility that CoC lists often bring. Amon doesn't have a ranged game for shit, while even Lucant can often shoot just fine, to say nothing or Syntherion.

>>51129478
So its a bad list except when it is good?

>>51129720
Aren't they all?

>>51129236
Let's see:
1) That list actually has a Seraph, because that player is not a moron.
2) If you think the enemy caster will stand within 14" of your beasts without anything to block for him or control effects (say, Haley2's feat) up, you sure have some easy opponents.

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>>51129904
...so you just admitted that the Seraph doesn't do much if it's not an "easy opponent". You can find plenty of Abby2 lists without a Seraph.

Look! Another similar list!

I get the feeling people in this general are just shit at the game in general, and have no idea what they are talking about. Post a list and ask about it, and all people can do is spout off saying "it's bad" without, you know, actually giving a reason as to why it is.

>>51129568
so on Axis I can do double inverter, cipher, conservator, or should I do doubles of conservators and inverters? and should I be keeping recips, or should I swap them out for a double conservator-cipher-double inverter list?

and on mom, should I be jack-heavy or infantry? because reliably I can drop an exponent servitor each turn to use her Arc node on, if I take a PA-corollary-cipher and then fill the rest with infantry or a TEP and infantry

>>51130195
>...so you just admitted that the Seraph doesn't do much if it's not an "easy opponent". You can find plenty of Abby2 lists without a Seraph.
No I said you won't be feat assassinating with such a list.

>>51130195
>Look! Another similar list!
It has three fucking models in common with your craptastic attempt at list creation.

>>51130319
>post a list with heavy beasts, except 2 raeks instead of a fifth
>ITS NOT THE SAME REEEEEEEE
autism in action. stop posting famalam

>>51130423
Because all heavies are the same right? Right? Face it, your list is shit, that list is good. Now go copy+paste that one and stop embarrassing yourself.

>>51130552
I'll throw all my models in a blender if you can provide the exact objective reason why that list is better.

And... go.

>>51130639
3" more threat on the heavies. Easier time clearing infantry (and yes they do exist) with barely reduced armor cracking. And if you've actually seen Abby2 in action (which I doubt) you will beamazed at the crazy shit Reaks can do with her.

But of course those hardly measure up to the glorious master plan of just spamming Carniveans and discovering that for such a list you should be playing a different faction entirely.

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>>51126327
>amon nipples

gotchu covered senpai.

>>51130834
>3"
someone's cheating

>>51131119
It's 2" on the feat turn, 3" without feat. Still a massive difference.

>>51125088
Id recommend switching a carnivean or two for something with utility.
Maybe one for a ravagore and one for a neraph or something.

Im partial to neraphs for their ability to reliably move an enemy a few inches while pounding on it.

I only recommend mixing it up because while a carnivean is tough, and will murder whatever it hits, its not exactly a khador juggernaut or a dire troll mauler in terms of toughness.

Then again, 4 carns and a proteus might just be too much beef for most to handle.

Played Makeda3 today. It's so nice having a caster that can easily kill a heavy then Fate Walker away.

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>Theme forces now on Thursday
>"maybe", not "definitive"
REEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>51130266
Double Inverter is fine with Axis. Conservator is a choice with him, but at the same time, Steelsouls are also very good with him.

As far as Mom goes, she wants to be battle group heavy, with a focus on ranged jacks. She's arguably the best PA caster in the game(Syntherion is also really good with it, but for different reasons).

Note that she can't use her personal servitors as nodes anymore, you need to bring ADOs or use jacks.

For Mom, she likes the Assimilator the most beyond the PA. Her feat + Ground Pounder can be very, very good. The common list for her is an Axiom + 3 Assimilators.

>>51131069
Yes, this pleases Menoth

>>51132208
well there goes most of the usefulness of the Servitors, at least they've still got aperture beams.

>>51134334
It was a change from Mk2 to Mk3, yea.

They're actually a little better now, because A. They now benefit from Mother's feat, and B. they have Gunfighter, so they can't be jammed as easily.

Also remember that that +2 damage is model/unit, not just model. You tag one model in a group, and they all suffer the bonus. especially important for blast damage stuff.

Had a bunch of games against Retribution with Khador today.

Thank god their casters are so squishy. Had to make some comebacks, because those threat-ranges are some serious bullshit.

Also, Invictus is broken as fuck. I'm never playing that matchup without Ashley ever again.

>>51134482
You mean Dawnguard Invictors? The joke is that they're infantry that have more than enough ARM to make it across the table, but they don't even need to because they're ranged. Sentinels are just fucking retarded honestly. I've lost an undamaged heavy to 3 unsupported Sentinels before. It's the most tilting experience you can imagine.

So do Circle players realise just how stupidly broken of a spell Hellmouth is, and that Wurmwood is still a top tier caster without it? It's like they're just crying that they have to learn to play the game now instead of swamping the objectives and popping feat.

https://en.reddit.com/r/Warmachine/comments/5n7v8b/this_weeks_theme_forces_teased_on_pp_forums/

>Cygnar is getting a theme force called "Storm Division". It will focus on Storm Knights and has a strong electric vibe.

>Legion of Everblight's theme "Ravens of War" Focuses on Legion's scout forces and faster models. Be prepared to... AMBUSH... your opponents with this list.

>Convergence of Cyriss brings a new configuration with their theme, "Destruction Initiative". This list focuses on Warjacks and Priest models, sure to be a favorite of Convergence players everywhere!

>Skorne's theme is called "Winds of Death" and focuses on the Venator model/units. It brings a ranged list to Skorne like you have never played before!

Wait hang on a minute here.
>Skorne's theme focuses on the Venator model/units

SO A RAT5 GUNLINE IN A FACTION WITH ZERO GUNLINE WARLOCKS OR SPELLS AND WITH ZERO SUPPORT MODELS

IS GETTING A FUCKING GUNLINE THEME?

>>51135107
Oh wait, I mumbled and mixed up some names here. I meant Imperatus, the character jack who you need to do 60 damage to in one turn or he'll just renegerate himself and fuck your army apart. I hate that thing so much.

Sentinels aren't nice either, but they're at least easy to snipe with auto-wounds.

>>51135286

In all fairness, with dedicated theme benefits, it may be worth doing. There is a bit of a hill to climb there, but that's what themes do.

>>51135368
Literally the only thing I can think of that would make a Skorne gunline viable is increasing the ROF of all reiver weapons to 2 or something. This means the Venator Reivers obviously become dumb, and the Cyclops Raider can actually threaten a heavy. This makes sense with the Raider apparently getting no changes.

But once again we get a spoiler that makes it look like PP haven't got a fucking clue, and instead of just being open about it, PP are quite content to look like fucking retards.

>>51135286
89 errata changes. Surely everything will be fine. Surely.

>>51135417

So ROF 2 on Raiders, maybe stealth on Venators...

The point is it's *possible*.

>also I think it's more this is the one they were willing to hand out for free. There is no way the construct one doesn't get them cash-money.

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What's the new cancer in MK3 for Circle? I know about Wurmwood and Una2, but beyond that, what should I invest in?

>>51139111
Kaya3 will rock the socks off the ox.

She might end up wanting goats, but it's hard to tell until we see her full card, but we know she has Synergy, FM: Reposition 3, and a feat that does Parry/acrobatics or ghostly/incorporeal to battlegroup.

>>51139111
Baldur2 dual Woldwraths is pretty degenerate, too.

If you don't already have them, you want dual sentry stones in every list.

>>51139229
>>51139258

Any infantry worth buying after Sentry Stones and Reeves?

>>51139267
Bloodtrackers are still good. Druids are playable.

>>51139267

Are Blood trackers still good?

Also, do people still use Shifting Stones?

>>51139362

Are Woldstalkers good now? They still seem pretty cool.

>>51139362
Yes and yes, but shifting stones are usually an afterthought now. They're not bad, but don't have an automatic place like they used to.

Bloodtrackers are unchanged, although I think Nuala is worse, so I never take her.

>>51139258
>>51139229
>>51139339
>>51139414

There are a bunch of Brennos marked down at my LGS. Is he worth playing in any list?

>>51139378
Woldstalkers are completely unchanged; they were playable before and still are, but haven't gotten any more exciting. Problem is I think I'd always take a Woldwyrd instead.

>>51139462
And I'd take Reeves over two units of Woldstalkers. They're not bad, but but there are other choices that fill *similar* roles and do it better.

>>51139434
He's a lot better, but worse than two Woldwyrds, so take them instead.

>>51139462
>>51139518
The take-home lesson here is Woldwyrds are *really* good now and fill a mid-range shooting and spell hate role quite well.

>>51125071
Ooh, the lesser-spotted Unix poseur.

>>51139518

It's kind of weird how many good ranged units Circle seems to have now.

Reeves
Woldstalkers
Blood Trackers
Sentry Stones

>>51139554
I'll probably have to grab some.

What about Protectorate? I had all the MK2 staples, and it seems like none of them are good anymore.

>>51139899
Jacks, Idrians, daughters and Flamebringers are all good with most casters. Knights Exemplar got a rockin new officer if you like running High Reclaimer

>>51139899
Uh? Choir, Reckoners, Redeemers are all still great. Outside of the casters being bumped around in power level, the biggest change to the Mk2 staples is that Idrians have replaced Errants as the hot infantry and Bastions are bad.

>>51139996
I'm primarily sad about errants and bastions.

>>51140079
Errants can still work, with Sevvy1 especially

>>51139899

Still getting good mileage out of my Daughters and plenty more out of my Knights Exemplar. Even Zealots are proving to be surprising deadly and frustrating for my opponents. TFG are now purely cheap chaffe/souls/speedbumps, but they do the job. Choir still makes into almost every list with jacks.

Bastions were never top tier anyway, so while it sucks that they aren't as good anymore, it's not like they were a staple of our lists in mk2.

My Vanquishers don't see much play, but Reckoners, Fire of Salvation, Scourge of Heresy still make it into plenty of lists. I'm also using a shitload of Crusaders, so magnetizing those kits was a good call. Redeemer is as good/better as its ever been.

Solos aren't as critical to our gameplan anymore. Hierophant, wracks, and Covenant still see regular use, but everything else is still niche for me.

It's not so much that all the staples are bad. It's just that 3 of the 4 units people never ran: Cinerators, Idrians, and Cleansers, got significant boosts, as did all our Character jacks, which gives us more options.

>Skorne
>ranged theme
Oh lawdy lol. Poor players, had a little faith in the 89 erratas meme only to get crushed by #designspace like this. Rip.

>>51140737
Is this a thing?

>>51140737
But don't you want venator slingers with ambush and a free venator solo or CA for every 20 points of venator models? Isn't that what skorne has really needed?

>>51141280
Yeah.

>Skorne's theme is called "Winds of Death" and focuses on the Venator model/units. It brings a ranged list to Skorne like you have never played before!

>>51141914

Slingers with Ambush would be fucking amazing, though.

>>51139630
Sorry, I have a job so I use windows :^)

>>51135286
So I'm guessing that the CoC change will be something like "for every two/three warjacks, bring a free priest model/unit" and optifex directive models gain either a static bonus to heals or an additional die or something. If the list is spectacular I might need to actually buy more priests.

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>Legion
>the warbeast faction
>gets a ranged scout theme force

File: eJwNyMsNwyAMANBduBdj8wlkjQxQIYIgVRIQuKequ7fv-D7iPU6xisrc5wqwHzO1scvJbcSSZWmtnDn2Y8rULojMMdUr3zyBELWxwVGgRQe1kAFy6K02XhnzXxWcgi2NnO9ZGz9JoUMi_VDeIhr56kV8f76BJzM.IylnXzS3vrSv_OCeCBgM3CXUS84.jpg (698KB, 1414x1750px) Image search: [Google]

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>>51142523
>No electro theme to make the Conflux not shit
>CoC will never be a real faction

>>51142939
Just wait for Mikael "9000 volts for the infidel" Pent caster AK orion

>>51142939
Eh, it's a generic warjack theme, we'll see what it has. I'm figuring either free Optifex or free ADOs. Perhaps free UAs, which seems wonky but might honestly be alright, even with Aurora.

My question is what the damn warjacks get. Every warjack in a CoC army already gets an ability, so adding a second one might be incredible. Especially since they can hardly give out the common stuff, like Shield Guard, Counter Charge, or shit like that.

>>51142939
I've seen them do some bootleg-Amon shenanigans. Just spam heavies, add a few of the repair lights and synergy them up.

>>51143047
CoC does heavies far better than Amon does, all and all.

All Amon does is just spam cheap heavies and hope for the best.

>>51143448
I only played 2 games against convergence ever, but their jacks are such a fucking pain to get rid off. I would rather try to grind through trolls to be honest.

>>51143466
Axis thene list is best grind.

>his alt wincon is clocking you

>>51143047
I've never been able to figure out Syntherion. I'm guessing you're supposed to make your jacks last, but anyone in any faction can one shot them easily, and it seems like he got some of his spells and feat mixed around. Weapons Platform? As a feat? The fuck am I supposed to do with that when the only good gun in the faction is on a shit jack with one gimp arm?

Syntherion just seems too easy to play around, and is extremely easy to deny. He doesn't ask any question your opponent won't have the answer to.

>>51143770
>He doesn't ask any question your opponent won't have the answer to.
So bring 2 skew lists and list chicken your way to victory.

Painting Hexeris1 is some of the hardest shit I've done. Not because he's difficult in the least, but because I'm doing it in the knowledge that I'll never play him unless he gets serious buffs in the errata. He is completely unplayable.

>>51141914
>venator slingers with ambush and a free venator solo or CA for every 20 points of venator models? Isn't that what skorne has really needed?
;~;

>>51144722
>clock oponents
>chicken then
>ignore rules them
>no meme lists cuz all units are good

Why is coc allowed this bullshit?!

>>51144818
The game right now is chicken as fuck anyway. Amon + 90 points of heavies, Harkevich + 90 points of heavies, Ret gunlines. How do you answer these without a skew list of your own? And if you're reactively bringing skew lists, you're playing chicken. The frustration is that Amon spam, Harkevich spam, and gunlines, are solid question lists that can win games.

It's a game of losing to shit you can't realistically account for. Protip to all Hordes players, bring 2 Gremlin Swarms in an assassination list to drop on objectives. Opponent has no magical weapons? You win.

>>51144858
By playing a baller-ass efficient assassination list and hoping to roll Killbox.

>>51144858
Harke... spam?


Tell me more.

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>>51144940
Have you not seen the glory that is double FieldGun + Destroyer-spam? It's fucking glorious.

>>51144858
>How do you answer these without a skew list of your own?
By playing Cygnar. Some of the top Cygnar lists are skewey (and all of them lack veriety), but you can get by with Haley2+3 quite well.

>>51144940
>Does Khador have strong cheap jacks
Yes.
>Does Khador have a caster with Mobility
Yes.

Then spam is good. Know what's worse than SPD6 Juggernauts? SPD6 Juggernauts with pathfinder.

>>51144940
>>51144959
>Harkevich
That guy almost got me into Khador. Almost.

http://conflictchamber.com/#b31b8D7w7p7p7s7s7q9u7y

Khador Army - 74 / 75 points

(Harkevich 1) Kommander Harkevich, The Iron Wolf [+28]
- Behemoth [25]
- Destroyer [14]
- Destroyer [14]
- Kodiak [13]
- Kodiak [13]
- Devastator [14]
Ragman [4]
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor [5]


This sounds like a whole lot of fun to play.

>>51144991
Yeah it turns out that having a feat that Strangleholds the entire enemy army is pretty fucking good.

>>51145038
Yup. Nice of PP to buff her in the last errata. I swear they keep trying to nerf her but actually make her stronger. The edition transition was the same.

>>51144959
Why zerkova tho?

>>51145069
She has sacrificial lamp, so you can spend 1 focus to give your entire battlegroup 2 for the price of one lonely mechanic. Meaning that if you bring 2+ Jacks with her, you are making profit for boosted shots.

>>51144749
He has some fucking AWFUL matchups, and he isn't consistent enough to be a great tournament caster, but I've had some really fun games with him. Run with with Praetorian Swordsmen instead of Nihilators, sidestep is nice with the feat, Berserk is not.

If you're concerned with tough, Bloodrunners have done me some great work recently... Not with Hexy, but they seem pretty sweet.

>>51145129
Hexxy1's awful matchups consist of:

>Warmachine factions
>Battlegroup focused lists
>Infantry spam lists with enough ARM to survive a POW8 blast

His spell list is without a doubt the weakest of all spellslingers in the game.

>Death March
Skorne infantry is bad
>Influence
LOL
>Obliteration
His big splashy spell that he can only cast once and is just a glorified Cannoneer shot
>Soul Slave
Skorne has to PAY for arc nodes
>Spirit Leech
His single target nuke, except it costs 3 fucking fury and steals fury from the target, so is actually atrocious against Warmachine

He easily has the worst feat in Skorne too. Like oh my god everything about him is so bad. I'd only put him above Morghoul2 because he actually does have game against Hordes faction.

>>51144940
>Harke... spam?
Mechano-ham-spam? SPAM = "Some Pork and Mechano-Ham"

>>51144749
>>51145129
I despise Hexy1, but it's not because of his performance. That's fixable... he could easily be made to fill a niche in Skorne. He's just has such badly-designed rules. What is WITH that goddamn feat, for crying out loud? It either does effectively nothing, or you clock yourself out resolving the thing.

It's really just one super-glaring example of a broader bad-design trend in the game though, namely - why would you write a rule that mechanically takes forever to resolve when you could get the EXACT same effect from something simple? It's like the stupid ten-man units each with their own individually-scattering template. What the hell is the point of that? Do I really need to roll scatter for each grenade on this zealots unit to move a max of 0.5"? Why wouldn't it just be "place a template" or "all units within X" type effect?

>>51145705
I really like Hexy2, so I'm likely partial towards Hexy1... I don't HATE Hexy1, I just recognize he is a casual caster to play against a new player, or in specific matchups.

I don't like the complexity of the nesting effect of the ability, but in a Magic heavy meta, it's pretty easy to explain. It IS super rough on a timer, but like I said, I only play him in casual environments, so the timer generally isn't a factor when I play him.

I do get the annoyance of a caster existing that isn't really suitable for tournament play... I guess that's what Soles would call not liking options?

>>51140209
I'm working through a 75point pSevy list and I'd like another Menites opinion

http://conflictchamber.com/#b21b0T1U2222241L302K2L2j3z3C

Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points

(Severius 1) Grand Scrutator Severius [+28]
- Crusader [10]
- Reckoner [16]
- Reckoner [16]
- Templar [15]
- Vigilant [9]
Choir of Menoth (max) [6]
Temple Flameguard (max) [11]
- Temple Flameguard Officer & Standard [4]
Knights Exemplar [9]
Vassal of Menoth [3]
The Covenant of Menoth [4]

>>51145981
I see no Blessing of Vengeance in that list.

>>51146048
I don't own the model

>>51145981
>>51146048
I could drop the Vigilant and KE to get Blessing of Vengeance and a KES

>>51146134
Slap a bit of TP on it and bam, your revenger is now the glorious Blessing of Vengeance. Maybe twist the spear that the pose fits. Seriously, the BoV has almost nothing special going for it (at least in contrast to stuff like Hand of Judgment or the new Eye of Truth)

>>51145874
Thing is, even when the clock isn't an issue, resolving Hexy1's feat is still just annoying. They could have his feat do something similar to magic bullet or blood burst for models killed in his range and get a VERY similar feel & game effect in half the time.

>>51147219

Other way around. Back strikes allowed, and the clock bleed will be WORTH IT.

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I'm trying to have some fun soon:

Sorscha1
War Dog
- Decimator
- Destroyer

Kovnik Andrei Malakov
-Juggernaut
-Juggernaut

Battle Mechaniks (Leader and 3)
Widowmaker Scouts
Widowmaker Marksman
Alten Ashley
Kell Bailoch
Eiryss, Mage Hunter of Ios
Kayazy Eliminators
Kayazy Eliminators

The basic idea is that I'm sick and tired of losing at scenario until I have to go for a hailmerry assassination. So instead, I'm going to assassinate from the get go.

Sniper Boat to do disgustion Sniperboat things; Widows and Kell nail systems/aspects, Ashley deals with annoying as fuck repairs and Eiryss is Eiryss (also lolDEF18).

Andy is protected by mechanics and his job is basically to team up Red Line with Sorscha's Boundless Charge to launch filled up POW 21 Juggernukes into the opponent.

The destroyer is in here because it got cheaper, so why not (also, it works well with freeze) and the Decimator is actually super good with Sorscha, because it can knock models out of the way for charge-lanes. Dog is here because Dog. Woof.

And last but not least, 2 units of Eliminators to tie something annoying up for a turn or four. They're really good at that.

>>51147219
I feel like nothing quite compares to grabbing an opponent's McThrall, chaining them into killing the entire unit and the Necrosurgeon, and then continuing your own activations is pretty sweet.

I get what you're saying about the end result being the same, but I think there's a lot more freedom with this. AoEs don't stretch out as far as the feat does currently, and I think it's an interesting factor that it matters what you're hitting.

Narratively, it's very different. I get that that isn't important for competitive, clean, or balanced gameplay, but it IS different.

>>51145874
>I really like Hexy2, so I'm likely partial towards Hexy1
I like Hexy2 as well, for EXACTLY the same reason as I don't like Hexy1. Hexy2 is a skorne spell-slinging caster done correctly. He's got spells you actually want to cast, he's got abilities that support those spells, and he has a feat that helps with the sort of things he already wants to be doing anyway.

Not saying Hexy2 is perfect, by any stretch, but his design suits the character and actually works within the game. He does a thing... which is a heck of a lot more than can be said for Hexy1.

>>51147291
There are units of McThralls being played for reasons other than being immediately turned into Gunslinger clouds?

>>51147271
Honestly, if your initial goal is to go for assassination, I'd drop the Mechaniks and round the Decimator up to a Torch, which brings a good deal more damage and also really helps your snipers.

>>51147425
If Malakov dies, I lose 28 points worth of models in one go.

Also, Torch doesn't do what the Decimator does. I'm paying for the gun specifically.

Mark 3 Faction Balance is fucking shit.

Game is dying here.

>>51148309
Menoth is honestly just too much to deal with.

>>51148366

Even outside of faction vs faction.

The internal balance of factions is just fucking garbage. You have like 1-2 choices that can deal with the meta, rest is utter shit. Well, for most factions that is.

Can anyone here help me with this Thyron List concept
http://conflictchamber.com/#bl1bf143d_2V313u3y3y3LfW4kgs4L0w

Retribution Army - 75 / 75 points

(Thyron 1) Thyron, Sword of Truth [+27]
- Discordia [18]
- Imperatus [22]
Dawnguard Sentinels (max) [18]
- Dawnguard Sentinel Officer & Standard [4]
- Soulless Escort (1) [1]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Fane Knight Skeryth Issyen [8]
Lys Healer [3]
Lanyssa Ryssyl, Nyss Sorceress [4]
Bunker (Steamroller) [0]
House Shyeel Artificer [5]
- Hydra [15]

>>51148309

Jacks need to be costed like Beasts.

>>51148668
I'd rather have beasts be costed like jacks.

Jacks are more efficient on a "damage for your buck"-basis, but I find animi to be the far more interesting mechanic, so I'd rather have more of that.

>>51148694

I would rather discourage jackspam to the degree that it is currently used by increasing their cost, since that would open more of a door for infantry to be used and would then be a buff to all of the shit that exists that isn't really usable because there isn't enough infantry in the meta.

increasing jack cost would be better for the health of the game than decreasing beast cost.

>>51148694
Id be fine with Beasts being costed like Jacks, if they hit a bit harder and were fury 3, like jacks.

>>51143770
Ok, so Syntherion used to armor skew back in Mk2 when most people didn't bring 5-7 warjacks, but even then, it was basically incidental.

However, what Syntherion does is be incredibly adaptable. Lists he brings shoot pretty well(double hot shot ground pounder, anyone?), melee well, hold objectives alright, have decent tools for getting an alpha(Mag Hold is a wonderful spell), can trade up on an opponent with Reconstruct, and he's got decent battlegroup healing to help his attrition game.

Short of upkeep hate casters, there's very few matchups where Syntherion is at a distinct disadvantage. And he's incredibly open about his list construction as well. With Prime Axiom, without it, and he works very well with every single jack in the faction, so he can build in a lot of different ways, which makes it harder to deal with him with any single strat.

His feat helps this as well. He's got a very combined arms feel, and his feat makes sure you get to shoot again. He was a great Mk2 cryx drop because of this: Your opponent could run to engage you, but then you'd just pop feat and shoot him anyways while still getting to melee.

But all in all, Syntherion is one of those rare casters who kind of does everything, and the trick to playing him is knowing when to do what.

>>51148640
Why is there a Hydra jackmarshalled? Why not on Jabrone himself?

>>51149541
With cheap Arcanists to put focus on them as needed, Ret gets more mileage out of marshals than most.

>>51149541
crush+3 focus from arcanists that stay around due to focus battery+assail+arcanist +2 melee damage power= free charge with 3 attacks at P+S19 and 3 focus to spend

>>51149837
>>51149969
Sounds actually pretty good. Due to Power Up, I didn't really take another look at Jack Marshals.
Any other decent combos?

>>51146588
I just feel like i get more utility out of a vigilant, unless BoV has shield guard. I tend to die to assassination rather then scenario so I like to bring some extra insurance.

>>51150274
BoV doesn't give B2B casters spellward, but it does have Shieldguard.
Plus, the bond is just too delicious with one well placed Ashes to Ashes. With Sevvy1, you're sporting POW 13 on all hits

>>51150333
Sevy1 has sacred ward, and def 18 from the vigilant (cover) and girded (no blast damage) is really really good, plus if I feel the threat of assassination is from range, the Templar has shield guard.

>>51149837

Marshalling a hydra is still stupid. It wants 2 focus per turn to double boost its 15/15 shot, so you're dedicating 4 points of support for it to get the pow 17 shots when it can aim. Compared to the one focus a turn from the caster for fully boosted 15s, you're almost always better off running the hydra on your caster and marshalling something else.

>>51147291
I mean, yeah, that's the "living the dream" version of Hexy1's feat... but does it really need to be that clunky for the one game every few hundred where that actually happens? I mean, McThralls can't even hit each other - a McThrall killed under his feat only kills like 0.4 other McThralls, on average.

>>51148668
>>51148925
Jacks are Costed like jacks because they are a different mechanic then jacks. Beasts are harder to cripple and easier to un-cripple, for most warmachine list there isn't a whole lot of access to construct healing, where as beasts get that natively.

Focus is also different then fury , focus gives a higher starting amount of actions and possibilities that dwindles as you assign and cast spells/ upkeeps. Where as fury has a lower start action economy that you can expand the use of by forcing and riling beasts to create more fury to use.

>>51150274
>>51150333
BoV is amazing with Sevy1; Blessing should usually be the first model you grab in a Sevy list. Probably the best bond of any character jack.

>>51150614
>Sevy1 has sacred ward, and def 18 from the vigilant (cover) and girded (no blast damage) is really really good
It is good, but if you're losing to those things, you should probably have Sevy further back. This is the guy that invented the term "backfield caster". Killbox combined with unfortunate terrain is the only reason your opponent should ever even get LOS to him.

>>51150705
This, 100%. Not saying that jacks and beasts are perfectly balanced right now (jacks ARE probably a little undercosted), but there's absolutely no question that a beast is inherently more valuable than a jack with the same stats and abilities. Power Up brought Focus and Fury a lot closer to parity, but Fury still has the edge as a mechanic.

>>51150614
I'd rather say that Beasts are overcosted. I quite like that I can play Rock'em sock'em robots now, and I'd hate to run even less infantry or support

>>51150879
Meant to reply to >>51150839 duh

Is there a plastic UA for fennblades?

>>51150705
Which would all be valid if jacks didn't also have better stats. What you said was very much true in Mk2, but less so now.

>>51150839
A low-end beatstick heavy jack can one round a top-end tanky heavy beast for two focus (remember that casters have higher foc than locks have fury on average). A top-end beatstick heavy beast can one round a top-end tanky heavy warjack for most likely losing the next activation, unless other beasts effetively give up theirs (which will virtually never happen becase that would be too crippling). Low-end heavy beasts can't even dream of trying to one round a heavy jack. Considering beasts cost more, that is not fair.

>>51151719
So you are saying that beasts are either overcosted or understatted? Hold the fucking presses, I would have never though that!

>>51151719
>All this wrong in one post
What's funny is this is basically just a post from MK2 with the factions flipped around.

>>51148932
>Having one more attack is why Legion heavies cost 18+ despite a Dervish being MAT10 PS18 under Amon for just 7 points!
Fuck off.

>>51150618
I mean, where else are those arcanists going other than near Thyron, his jacks and his support solos, which puts the near the artificer, and also near his hydra, but yeah it does seem like a waste if I was going to be using it for shooting, thanks for the feedback anon.

>>51152437
What is wrong in that post?

>>51153116
Dont forget three initials, all of which have the same pow.

>>51153223

The 3 focus hydra crush charge is cute but you have to prep for that turns in advance and its a lot easier to play around. Its better if you're spending the points on the hydra to get work out of shooting on the way in and Marshall cheaper jacks that are punchier with fewer resources like the sphinx with its reach or if you're devoting multiple arcanists anyway fire off a p+s 22, three-initial manticore.

>>51153116
"synergy is busted that why I'm right!"

>>51154231
>dervish has 3 initials
I see your brain damaged from the pounding Amon must of given you.

>>51154623
Incite is way better than synergy most of the time.

>>51154754
Incite is better than Synergy unless you run nothing but jacks, which Amon does.

Also, as of today, Protectorate has an Incite caster, too.

>>51154825
And they're both in the same faction!

>>51154501
the reason for the hydra is so that I don't have to feed it power from the Arcanists if I want it to attack, but I see how the manticore could be pretty sweet, desu I'm not expecting the world out of this list, I was just looking to diversify my gameplay from my usual Kaelyssa/Issyria pairing which have the same 2 units as their core

What is the most vanilla looking main faction? I adore the plastic steelhead models but cant bring myself to field them. Is there anything with similar theme?

>>51155441
Cygnar? Why not field Steelies? They don't break the game, but they aren't the worst. Riflemen are good in theme with Damiano, alongside a Trencher boat.

>>51155441
Cygnar Trenchers & Swordknights are pretty down to earth.

Or rather, outside of Cryx & Retribution, all Warmachine Factions have dudes that are just regular lookung

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Painted pics from some upcoming stuff

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>>51156530

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>>51156545

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Y'all motherfuckers gon' get a hell of a lot worse than coal up your stocking.

>GREYLORD FORGESEER

>"More than just craftsmen, Forge Seers also take to the battlefield alongside the warjacks they help create. These Greylords apply their knowledge of magic and mechanika to imbue the weapons of warjacks with the power needed to cut down unnatural foes who are more than flesh and steel. Clad in Man-O-War armor, Greylord Forge Seers charge into battle with the hiss of steam in their ears and the chill of winter at their fingertips.
TRADE POINTS: The Greylord Forge Seer is likely to see high demand from Khador players, since the model’s Empower ability grants warjacks a free focus point. With a Field Allowance of 2, stores are encouraged to order accordingly to ensure they have enough stock to meet demand."

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>>51156575
Strakhov's gone full Big Boss, it seems.

>STRAKHOV2

>"Assault Kommander Oleg Strakhov has spent decades carving a bloody trail through the kingdoms of western Immoren, eliminating high-profile targets and destabilizing opposing forces with well-orchestrated strikes. Strakhov stands as a Khadoran legend. Those who tell of his deeds speak of him as more specter than man, an unseen force capable of accomplishing impossible tasks under cover of night and leaving no evidence of his passage.
>TRADE POINTS: A warcaster who excels at getting the most out of his warriors, even if it costs them their lives, Assault Kommander Strakhov pairs very well with models such as Iron Fang Pikemen (PIP 33104), Assault Kommandos (PIP 33100), and Man-O-War Shocktroopers (PIP 33084)."

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>>51156594
Kozlov looks really uncomfortable with the Butcher standing behind him.

>>51156627
Wouldn't you be?

>>51153116
But anon the Dervish isn't mat 10 or ps18 base, you have to
Cast Senergy
Hit with three attacks from 3 different jacks
Then the remaining 4-7 jacks only have a plus 3 to hit and damage and IIRC the Dervish is mat 6 ps14 meaning they are only mat 9 ps17 without a choir.

>>51156594

>A warcaster who excels at getting the most out of his warriors, even if it costs them their lives

So, that just makes me think he has Last Stand.

>>51157594

stripping more unique spells away from skorne makes poetic sense for mk3

Conflictanon here, adding the new Protectorate theme forces.

Does anyone have the *names* of them, as while I've got the rules, I don't have their actual names.

>>51158677
Guardians of the Temple and The Creator's Might.

>>51158730
Thanks.

>>51155441
Every non-Cryx Warmachine faction has some pretty vanilla dudes.

Cygnar-Trenchers and Trencher accessories.
Khador: Winter Guard and winter guard rifle corps.
Protectorate: Zealots.

Even Hordes factions have a vanilla unit or two each.

But if you love steelheads just play mercs. They look like they stop being funny real quick when their paymaster is around.

>>51158677
Amon Bullshit and Thyra Bullshit.

>>51158663
Don't be silly, he won't have Last Stand.

He'll have Stay Death.

>>51156575
>>51156594
>>51156627
I came

>>51156816
Dude Dervish and Devout are base MAT 7

>>51156530
Woah sexy doggo.
Do you think he'll knot me?

>>51156594
>punished oleg
> a man denied of his charge lane

>>51160944
What a thrill...

>>51156594
>Pairs well with Khador's overpowered infantry

>>51162019
>IFP
>Ass Commandos
>Shocktroopers
>overpowered
Come on. What confuses me more is that he's supposed to be Mr Stealthy McGuerilla but apparently works best with Khador's prime face beating Infantry.

>>51156530
I kinda want a Warpwolf warlock equivalent to Karchev now.

>>51162138
It's wird how there's beast casters like Kromac2 or Thag2, but still no Karchev equivalent.

>>51162138
You have him. His name is Kromac 2.

>>51162152
Thag 3

>colossal warbeastlock

>>51162166
He means with a warbeast spiral, like Karchev. Personally, I prefer him not having it, as I'd rather not lose dice on attacks because he took 1/3rd of his health in damage.

Though, if we're gonna get into IK lore, it's much more plausible for a person to be stuck into a warjack frame than for a semi-sentient warbeast to also be a warcaster.

Kromac2 is arguably the best equivalent. Going by his story, he's changed to his beast form permanently, but only because of the power of his new magic axe.

I'm not as up on Legion lore, but I assume Thagrosh2 "The Messiah" is in a similar boat. Though I'd love to see >>51162199 and have a colossal warcaster with like, <10WB points, if any.

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WHO LOCK'n'LOAD HERE?

I went in 2013 (I live <3hrs away), but haven't gone since because the last time there was some con crud going around. Actually left early so I didn't catch whatever funk was going around.

>>51162363
No points.
Yuge fury.
Lots of hp armor flying a bunch of special rules.

>cons
>ez to instagib since colossal

>>51162372
Definitely heading to the outpost. 2015+2016 were tons of fun, even with the Mk3 launch mess.

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>>51162363
>CoC will never get a new caster in a fully mechanical jack body
>CoC will never get a new caster
RIP

>>51162503
>CoC will never
ftfy

>>51162448
No official outposts this year.

>PPS_JR: The outposts were done to celebrate the release of the new edition. That said, there will not be any official outposts this year.

>>51162578
>>51162503
It baffles me that PP seems to refuse to release new stuff for CoC.
I could brew up concepts and basic designs for a new batch of 'jacks in like ten minutes.

Anyone have a link to the Trolls deck? The one I bookmarkeda while back is dead.

>>51162724
What the flying fuck PP?

Did anyone realized that Eye of Truth super-Blessed Aura is working on ranged attack, spells, feats, and even non-attack based damages (Admonisher, FireWall) AND non-faction models (hi Eiryss1, Orin,...) ?

Discuss.

Redpill me on the Bokor and Shamblers. Waste of points or incredible tar pit?

>>51162760
DED GAEM XDD

>>51162727
Its a no release faction

Sucks conflux only works with 1 jack and said jack is for horde infantry clearing only good with synth.

>>51163085
Is your list going to generate a lot of corpse tokens? Then take them.

>>51163162
Even if it isn't, surely 10 bodies for 11 points is a sweet deal for blocking charge lanes.

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>>51162727
>It baffles me that PP seems to refuse to release new stuff for CoC.
They said this when they created the faction. It was going to be a limited release and receive only the most basic support. The new Hordes faction this July is the same thing.

For people who like the faction, it kinda sucks its that way. But I don't want you filthy technophiles taking away my sweet Kaya3 and Una2 #designspace. :^)

>>51163305
DELET URSELF TREEFUCKER.

>>51163305
I'm fairly certain they said the exact opposite about the new Hordes faction. Honestly I wish they'd just fucking own up to the limited release thing and put that sort of notice on the faction page for their website, rather than rely on word of mouth.

>>51163567
I hope it's limited. I couldn't care less about le hipster halloween spooky skeltals.

>>51163454
>doggo
>female
Anon...
You are a disgrace, dont you enjoy chiseled abs and pecs?

>>51163567
I just wish they realized how much more money they'd make if CoC wasn't a limited faction. Even quasi-regular releases, like releases at half or a quarter as often as other factions, would increase interest in the faction so much.
It feels like they're just waiting the faction out until lack of releases makes everyone who plays it just move to another faction.

>>51163616
Wot.
Tell me more about this faction.

>>51163706
I think it just amounts to a design contradiction sadly. Near as I can tell, the devs wanted CoC to be people's second+ faction, something that their long term players could get into without needing to spend the kind of money you would to invest in a full faction. Instead, they mostly got people who wanted it as their primary faction because of its aesthetic or it mechanics. It's why the idea of a 'Limted Release Faction' the way they meant it is laughably stupid, since it's both pissing away money and alienates a block of potential customers.

>>51163744
I mean, business-wise if I realise that people like a new faction that's "limited release" (but not limited run, for some reason? Like if you want to make something feel special because there's only so much of it why would you keep making more of it but not keep diversifying it?) enough that people are STILL asking us when we're releasing new stuff, and have been consistently asking us that question, I'd take it off of limited release because clearly it's going to be making me more money than it is now.

>>51163715
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e15h-fR1rGg

You can tell it will be good because of the high production value.

It's like all of their side projects. They start something that might turn out well, then drop it 5s later and start something else.

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I've gone and done it now.

>>51163872
Honestly can't tell if this is fanmade.

>>51160197
I apologize I didn't have the card on me.

>>51163904
>List pairing is Rasheth/Makeda3
>See a Circle playing with 2una
>Pick Makeda3
>He surrounds her with birds
>Blow them all away
Such difficult.

>>51163928
It's hipster, indie, and low-budget. It may as well be fanmade. It's basically a dressed-up showcase of the concept art, the only thing of value in that trailer.

>>51163941
Why does your opponent do the bird ball against Mak3? He has so many easy ways to victory and chooses that??

>>51163978
I don't recall ever hearing anyone say they think 2una is good because of zone control. It's ALWAYS le epic assassination maymays.

>>51163988
That's because most people just parrot the silly jank they hear on the internet. The true strength of 2na is her crazy attrition power combined with her denial feat.

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>>51163988
I like Una because she's sexy and I want her to drag me back to her nest.

Redheads make my peepee hard.

>>51164010
Justine Jolie, friend.

>>51163702
No I do not want to fug Amon.

>>51164283
>Not wanting to be embraced by Amons chiseled pecs.
What are you, gay?

>>51163305
I know they said that, but CoC seems very popular, so why not cater to the demand? Apart from
>lol, PP
, I mean.

>>51164352
>lol, PP
They indeed have a year of terrible decisions behind them. I sincerely hope 2017 will be better.

>>51164283
>amon
>as a stronk wuffer or gotte
Amon smells of sweat and ash.

Circle beasties smell musky and wild

>>51164352
It was a bad design decision. And I can't find the source that said the new Hordes one would be limited as well, though I seem to remember hearing that back when CoC was first released.

Maybe they've changed? I wouldn't mind it if CoC went on to become a full faction. They're just hurting themselves with how popular it is. Did they really think people wouldn't cream themselves over clockwork in a steampunk setting?

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So it's Thursday, I hope the themes are released.

I was worried yesterday, because down here in Portland we got 12" of snow and it won't melt until like, Tuesday, so pretty much the most important part of the state is shut down for the weekend.

>mfw Seattle only got 4" this entire season :^)

>>51164368
>>51164407
>The new theme is actually just PP saying CoC will no longer be limited
Not gonna happen, but it would be nice.

>>51164426
>yfw I live in the least snowed on area in the UK
Feels good being a pie eater.

Apparently new Cryx caster and jack have been spoiled, anyone have them spoilers?

>>51164776
Morty apparently found a way to get rid of Derilyss. Good on her.

>>51164776
They're not fully spoiled, it's just the snippets from the retailer's upcoming release info.

caster is Mortenebra2 -- large base, has field marshal where her jacks heal when another warjack is destroyed in their melee range. Her feat grants Flank[Friendly Warjack]

jack is Aiakos's jack - looks like crabjack chassis with extra arms, bond is Prowl, apparently it can create clouds itself.

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>>51164776
Kharybdis

: Aiakos 2 bond Prowl, which it can take maximum advantage of thanks to its ability to create clouds as a special action.

Mortenabra 2
: Field Marshal heal when another warjack is destroyed in their melee range, and feat: battlegroup Flank [battlegroup]

>>51164818
DERYLISS2?!?! PogChamp

>>51164835
Fuck off

>PPS_JR: The outpost in 2015 was a trial run for the larger scale outposts in 2016. With such a big undertaking as running four simultaneous conventions, we wanted to make sure that it was viable for the release of the new edition.

Get fucked eurofags. Sorry :^(

>>51165020
Thanks PP. Eat a dick PP.

Jackson on Theme Forces:
>We will be putting them up today. We're shooting for earlier rather than later.

>>51165676
>>51165676
>>51165676