What subtle Truths have traditional games taught you?

>>51023235
Wisdom and Intelligence are not the same thing.

>>51023235
>>51023244
That Ork thought magic is real
>see Trump supporters

>>51023235
People are more interested in dumbed-down games where they don't have to think (3e and GURPS are very guilty of this) rather than ones where they sit down and say "Let's brainstorm"

>>51023272
Why do you think that is?

It seems to me that the brain storm games are almost always more fun.

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>>51023235
That claiming to be something does not make you that thing.

Geeks are not more intelligent than any other subpopulation.

There are no right or wrong ways to play games; just degrees of closeness to one's own preferences.

Gaming preferences change over time.

>>51023244
This. I actually had fierce debates about this in my teens with adults, because I could not understand it. Now I do.

>>51023272
It appears that you've attempted to make a point of some kind, but I can't for the life of me figure out what it is or your functional logic behind it.

>>51023298
Because people are idiots.

I can't raise my kid to be smart but I can ground him for umming.

What I think is the simplest riddle or trap will stump my players for hours.

>>51023261

Had to shit up the thread with your pol/ nonsense. Couldn't help yourself could you?

1. Don't be a duck
2. Talking like actual human beings solves most if not all game problems
3. It is acceptable to choose not to play games with people who you don't like playing games with
4.don't be a dick

>>51023376
Is that because you're smart or your players are stupid?

>>51023272
>>51023298
Pray tell anon, what are these "pro brainstorm," non-"dumbed-down" games you speak of? And what makes them more "pro brainstorm" than the games you listed?

>>51023343
So you think it's a sort of rate versus state thinking?

>>51023395
You think he's wrong?

>>51023343

Most people including many intelligent people have visceral instinctive reactions which they double down on. Consistent analytical thinking is a rarity.

A lot of it originates down to survival instinct which calls for split second decisions with life or death consequences. But people seem to apply it to everything. Long term planning is difficult for the same reason.

>>51023298
What the fuck even is a brainstorm game? This almost sounds like a new buzzword.

>>51023442

Back to /pol/ I didn't come here to debate politics and neither should you.

>>51023410
I get the gist of what he's saying.

I, however, do not play by any set rules.

At the beginning we brainstorm how we all want the game to feel then lay down some real solid ground rules. I then develop rules with my group as we playand the game evolves with our interest in it.

We joke that it's our version of the U.S. Constitution and call new rules amendments.

>>51023466
I'm talking about the orks, my buddy.

>>51023406

I'm the forever DM so obviously I a genius storyteller. I think the problem is I spend 3 hrs a week prepping for a 6 HR weekly session. I think about the game all week long. My players live in the moment. A few are here for the social aspect more then the game.

>>51023396
>Talking like actual human beings solves most if not all game problems
This is actually something I've learned in game as well. Too many players want to engage in elaborate ruses, deceptions, or stealth-oriented solutions instead of going for an obvious diplomatic/social approach. This often blows up in their face and could have been avoided by just talking to the concerned parties.

>>51023235
Having fun is the only thing that matters.

>>51023235
Hoping for the best and preparing for the worst while trying your hardest is all anyone can do.

Gracefully accepting failure makes it that much easier to get back up, dust yourself off, and try again.

>>51023555
Sick trips.

You're right about the fun thing, but how do you solve the issue of everyone having different standards for fun?

>>51023526
Ah classic, they are the quintessential players; I never have a solution to fix this problem.

It seems to me to be more of a character trait than a learned behavior.

Have you tried talking to them about it?

>>51023272
>>51023298
>>51023343
>>51023425
>>51023454
Literally what?

>>51023235
>Just because we hold similar beliefs doesn't mean I'm automatically on your side.

This mostly has to do with alignment and how people treat it as a team. It is mostly fine in games with cosmic duality in conflict but even then there will be arguements and disagreement over how to proceed. This usually boils down to someone saying an NPC should agree with them because they have the same alignment or similar beliefs.

>>51023629
What about that discourse is confusing you?

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>charisma is the strongest stat
>>charisma is the strongest stat in any system and real life
>anything can be a reasonably worded argument.

>>51023576
>how do you solve the issue of everyone having different standards for fun?
As a player, I try to be aware of when it's time for me to step back and let someone else take the spotlight. I also try to know my fellow players well enough to push the story in a direction that all or most of us will enjoy. I think that if everyone has something they enjoy, some fun, then the mood in the group gets so good that it's easily worth it.

For example, in my current campaign I'm a utility-focused character with decent combat skills, and other players range from social diplomancers to combat monsters. I really like creative problem solving and mysteries, so when those things come up I tend to be pretty active. I don't much care for combat, but I know the combat monster lives for it, and it's not like I hate it, so I don't go out of my way to keep us out of fights. I do my turns quickly and let those that like it more take the spotlight. Same with scenarios where we run into a lot of talking and social. I'm going to ask a question every now and then if I feel we missed something, but I don't steal the words out of the mouth of people who'd rather want to do the talking.
It's not perfect, but I try.

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>>51023235
The dice pen and paper rpgs use are the Platonic solids.

In occult circles they represent the 5 classical elements (fire, earth, air, water, aether).

You can consider the act of rolling these dice in order to unroll your story as an alchemical ritual in which your game is embowed with elemental energy.

>>51023745
>charisma is better than wisdom

You can't smooth talk a wise man.

You may as well half ass anything you create as your audience will generally not be able to tell the difference.

>>51023770
Imbued*

>>51023811
This is incredibly important.

Applying this to any social interaction will change your life.

>>51023261
See: Hillary supporters.

How does it feel being a zero issue voter? (Muh vagina, btw, isn't an issue)

>>51023762
There's a lot of wisdom is this post.

Does your DM seem to embody the values and lessons that you are presenting?

>>51023884
Hillary supporters clearly can't manifest their will into reality otherwise she would have won.

Clinton's camp is more like imperium of man blind worshippers.

Clearly you people are the orkz

>t. Johnson supporter

>>51023926
Oy, ya git, wuts a leppo?

>>51023926
As much as this is a shitpost, I counter that Sisters of Battle are able to manifest miracles of the Emperor through belief power as well despite the Emperor being explicitly not a god, so it's not just the Orks

I guess that's how they got rid of Bernie Sanders :(

>>51023889
Kind of, in that he very clearly tries to have there be something for everyone, even if he fails from time to time.
He's a great and very permissive GM who noticeably tries to make sure we have fun, so I can't be too harsh on him, it's just that his permissive nature leads to frequent derailments that don't always work out in everyone's favour. He doesn't say "No" often, with the good and the bad that it leads to.

But I'd definitely say that I like him. It's kind of our fault that we sometimes drag him into improv that fails to satisfy everyone.

>>51023953
"What's 'a leppo'" was the media's linguistic killshot against Johnson.

After that no one could possibly take him seriously which is funny because it was clearly no one, including Trump and the New York Times, knew much about Aleppo at all.

>>51023926
Warboss Trump will bring WAAAAAGH!!! back to Amerorka, and lots o' shiny teef

>>51023660
All of it.

It looks like 3 people each having a totally different conversation with zero definitions or examples for what's being discussed, yet somehow achieving unanimous understanding and agreement on what appear to be only tangientially related points at best.

Maybe I'm the idiot here (which I could be), but from 'the outside' it appears to be a bunch of people talking past each other with totally different individual ideas on what's actually being discussed and finding themselves 'in sync' purely out of the sheer vagueness of the conversation.

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>>51023977
Have you considered trying your hand at DMing?

>>51024050
I see it as two people: one asking questions that sorta don't matter in order to get more out of the poster who clarifies his points.

You're right, on the surface it doesn't seem like they even have read one another's posts but it seems like they are satisfied with the communication.

It's odd.

>>51024099
>it's odd
Yes. My initial gut reaction was that of confusion and mild fear/paranoia, as though I had just discovered that all the other posters on /tg/ were just elaborately sourced conversational AI's akin to juiced-up Chatterbots.

>>51023796
But you can beat the shit out of one. Doesn't make strength the best stat.

>>51024422
Fair enough, well put

>>51024041
Warboss Krump needs to be a character now, in my opinion. E'll make da Waagh great again, kick out alla dese gits and unorky lads muckin about. Perhaps a Warboss taking over a Waaagh previously dominated by blood axes and their unorkylike behavior, e's a propa goff who wants to build a Waaagh to keep out the Blood Axes and other sneaky thievin gits

>>51023796
You can smooth talk everyone around the wise man, until mob mentality takes over.

>>51024520
Warboss Krump gonna kick out all da' gitz and make 'me build a wall wit' 'dez skullz

>>51023466
Meme magick isn't politics, it's practical esoteric autism.

Fun is a delusion marketed by slavemongers. There is no such thing as good company. There is no such thing as friendship either. You really are just wasting time. None of it matters.

Also you need to watch out where you store your d4s.

>>51023770
Hi, /x/.

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>>51023796
You don't need to.
You can smoothtalk his friends. His companions. His pet. Lover. Etc.
You could also just be his friend and not try and get anything from him, but share in his Wisdom.

Charisma is force of personality, not just guile.

>>51023235
Your fun offends someone
Optimism is delusion
Hope is fleeting
Cthulhu fhtagn

>>51024002
>no one knows what alepo is

Syrian Civil War going on for years now. Major frontline and conflict area is alepo.

Anon, stop, Gary is a fucking retard. Check when he was triggered by 'illegal immigrants'.

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>>51024520
>>51024041
>>51023926
>Not making a "Build the WAAAGH" joke

You are all plebians of low-birth and no taste.

>>51025476
>e's a propa goff who wants to build a Waaagh
Didja not read m8?

>>51023406
Because everyone has a different view of the world and different references.

>>51023396
>4.don't be a dick

This isn't wisdom, it's a smug, empty-brained tautology. It has no meaning, because the meaning of "dick" has an almost infinite variance among people and cultures.

>>51023770
>The dice pen and paper rpgs use are the Platonic solids.
Except the d10. Curse you, World of Darkness, for breaking our spell!

Never try to consume an energy sphere bigger than my head.

>>51024053
I've thought about it, but there's no real need for it in my current campaign, and I'm not sure I'm organised enough to pull off a good campaign. I don't require my GMs to hold a terribly lofty standard, I just want things to be functional, but I'd easily get very conscious and critical of my own GMing.
Maybe if someone really needs one down the line.

>>51025700
Spoken like a true dick.

>>51023235
want a good game?
Play your role in the story.
Going against the stream gets you nowhere.

>>51023463
Its a game where imagination and creativity can provide results far beyond what is encouraged, expected, or planned for.

ie, complex games that are easily broken.

When there are no consequences, many people default to acting very selfish.

Rigid plans are weak, flexible plans are strong.

Following a pre-determined path can be more fulfilling than having complete freedom (ie. sandbox games).

>>51025805
No fucking kidding.

On that note, laying down ground rules before the game starts is actually good even is the rules are extremely obvious.

That way if someone breaks them or is treading in dangerous waters they will think of the rules rather than the people and are more likely to play nice.

>>51025805
You sound like dick to me. Eg, the argument was right.

>>51023235
Don't feed the drama queen: everyone is a protagonist in a cooperative game.

Don't be afraid to say "no" to players: you are there to ensure everyone has a good time, yourself included.

No one likes Eldar until they're OP.

For some strange reason, the people that complain about WAAC fags are almost always WAAC fags themselves, and don't take kindly to losing a game. Even if it's Mordheim.

Don't play Monopoly with people you plan to spend more than a few hours with, that fucking game eats friendships like crazy.

Don't expect everyone to agree to your rules, or to your rulings for that matter.

>>51023244
This.

Don't cum inside until you've killed the evil wizard

>>51025805
>NO U

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>>51023235
It is easier to act than it is to be yourself, but aspiring to something greater is not impossible.

By providing fun and making others feel good you'll feel better about yourself.
Talking solves almost everything.

>>51023235
Never except a music box from a kindly old stranger.

>>51023235
People cannot change. They may say they will, they may try to, and they may believe they have, but they never do, and often times, in attempting to change something about their behavior, they end up making it more extreme instead.

>>51023343

>Ground my kid for 'umm'ing

Good to know you're grooming him early to distrust authority and hate you.

>>51023463
I think it means a game where the players are involved in the worldbuilding, like Dungeon World or Microscope.

You can't please everyone and that's okay.

Don't abuse rule 0 or else you'll get a horrible mess of a system.

A little world building goes a long way.

>>51023770
>some guy actually thinks space REALLY is dodecahedral
>inb4 the tetrahedron became associated with the element of Fire because it hurts to step on

I love the Pythagorean mystics

Looking at the sheer volume of characters I've had die from critical hit one-shots or critical failures over the years, I've learned that I have the worst luck of everyone I know.

>>51023235
That /tg/ is fucking pissed because its very difficult just getting a game going.

t. player that's only had a single session in his entire life

>>51023235
When you raise a bunch of outcasts to believe that they're 'special' or 'beautiful' on the inside, just because they're repulsive on the outside...

They generally turn out to be lazy and shitty on both sides.

>>51024002
>want to be world leader
>don't know your geography
okay, well that probably hasn't stopped too many people
>can't bluff
Well this is odd because as much as we want our president to be honest we don't want him sitting in front of the world with his dick in his hand every other week
>can't even use contextual clues to determine the nature of the item he is unfamiliar with
"What's Aleppo"? implies that he believed Aleppo to be an item of interest: like a project or a codename for some kind of scandal or operation. The guy couldn't even figure out we were talking about a place he'd never heard of and say "What's up with Aleppo" or "What's in Aleppo".

ALL the cunt had to say about it was "It's a very serious situation and, like many people, I'm not sure we would have gone about it the same way twice if he had had the option."

Or fuck it, he could even say "I don't know, has anything new developed in Aleppo I should know about? Has the situation really changed at all?" and run on that.

HE COULD HAVE JUST CHANGED THE SUBJECT BUT HE FUCKING BIT THE RETARD

>>51023235
You can bluff your way out of anything with a decent enough pokerface.

>>51025700
>It has no meaning, because the meaning of "dick" has an almost infinite variance among people and cultures.
So you're saying it doesn't mean anything, while in the same breath noting that it has context-sensitive meaning? Because those seem like two very different things. I'd think the point of "not being a dick" is paying attention to that context and acting respectfully and appropriately.

race-as-class

>>51023235
That OP is a faggot

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>>51023261
>>51023884
>>51023395
>derailing by blaming an invisible /pol/ boogeyman for derailing
he was just talking about meme magic, faggot. keep your agenda to yourself.

>>51023235
That people come together to socialize and share, and the curtain you cover that with isn't nearly as important as the interaction itself. But for me, D&D is pretty great curtain.

>>51023235
They'll bring out the edgelord in people.

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>>51023526
>>51023617
you're just dm'ing wrong. you can 'change' the player, as in, their attitude and approach, by changing the framing. though make sure you ease it in. e.g. if you want them to be more careful with traps, then make them deadly. if you want them to put more value in their mapping, then make the dungeon more labyrinthine, then put them through a chase. I hate DM's who baby their players. challenge them.

the fact is, you could've taken any of your riddles and stuck it in a room with a lowering spike ceiling that gives them 5 minutes real time before TPK, and 20 years ago, any average party would've made it through every time. If you did it today, your party would barely put up an effort and then bitch up a fucking storm when they realized you weren't joking about the spike ceiling crushing their beloved PC's. obviously I'm not suggesting TPK but just up the ante if you want them to take the game seriously. you'll be surprised what players are capable of when they're actually challenged.

also learn to embrace random tables. I do like a half hour of prep. with D&D there are tons and tons of great tools that make even no prep hexcrawls a cinch; JG's city state of the overlord being the gold standard

>>51023770
I always liked the idea of dice being a consultation with the oracle. do you have anymore dice occultism?

>>51025700
a vague statement is not the same as a tautology. "don't be a dick" actually cannot be a tautology because it isn't a proposition, but a command. It has no truth value.

>>51023317
Wolpertingers look like jackalopes with wings. Did a lot of bavarian immigrants move to the american southwest?

>>51034112
You need at least some variation so every elf does not become a swordsinger. Otherwise your races will be kinda bland.

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>>51034514
The variation doesn't need to be mechanical. IMO PC's differentiate themselves by what they've done and experienced in play, not what's on their sheet. And PC's represent extraordinary individuals, not the average little people, not all elves are fighter+MU's just like not all humans are thieves or fighters or whatever, just the adventurers, but these are what most all elves or dwarves will be as far as we can tell them apart. The other races are /weird/, they're aliens we'll never really grok, not humans with ears. Just like other human races.

All truths are beliefs, nothing more.

>>51024624
/pol/

You make a lot of friends if you are gracious in both victory and defeat.

>>51023235
The horse can say that it wants water, ask you to dig a well, be led to the water, and have the water fucking scooped up to its mouth, but you still can't make it drink.

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>>51034899
A truth I wish I'd never realized

I am an eurofag permaGM and learned that:
-Furfags aren't only toxic to a game but actually fucking evil and potential Ted Bundys or Jeffrey Dahmers
-All those who thought that the White Wolf narrative style would dominate the industry were unaware that WoD just belonged to a zeitgeist which will never return.
-Millennials don't fucking consume actual fantasy or sci-fi literature and the few who did are young adult crap cropophagist.
-Never play with someone five years younger than you. They freak out when they realize everything they love is going to be ruined in time.
-STEM majors are awful roleplayers and narrators. Most if their games are shallow power fantasies.
-If you are fit the fatfucks and hungry skellys will think you are a hjgh school drop out unable to GM. Is a waste to try convince them to change lifestyle fit wise.

>>51034989
>-Furfags aren't only toxic to a game but actually fucking evil and potential Ted Bundys or Jeffrey Dahmers
Story Time?

>>51035061
Too many to be told.
The usual furfag artist is a depressed cry baby with serious self loathing issues which gives him or her the belief that is entitled to perform dark macabre fantasies.
There was this brittish guy who drew hyperrealistic furries, usually hyper ones. I found out his favorite ERP freeform scenario is about hyper herms who murderfuck innocent kids.

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>>51035290
"hyper herms who murderfuck innocent kids"

Never have I found anything this psychotic in my games

>>51035290
I'm on board with this, same thing happened to me. I cannot ever bring myself to trust anyone I find out is a furry.

>Be me four years ago
>Perma-GM. Don't mind. It's all right.
>Friend wants to bring the son of a family friend who is also really into tabletop.
>Find out kid is a turbo-mega-ultra furry. Won't come play unless he can wear his fucking animal suit. Swear to god he never cleaned it.
>First day we knew something was wrong.
>Fucking kid was psychotic in game. He didn't just kill anyone, but took extreme delight in saying he was looking for children and torturing them to death.
>Went into gruesome detail about it.
>After that night I told my other friend, who apologized profusely, that this guy was never welcome back.
>That kid and three other furries committed three murders later that year, all as supposed 'Babysitters' who murdered the children they were looking after.

Every one of them in my town is batshit crazy and does stupid stuff.

>>51035501
He is not the only one with a seriously fucked up mind in that fandom.

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>>51035543

>>51023977
Your DM sounds a lot like me, so much so that it is shocking. Does he use weird NPCs a lot?

That all races are different.

>>51034989
I have a player in my party who plays a kenku and he isn't that bad.

Though I think the real reason he picked it is more because he's bad at roleplaying than because he's a furfag and choosing a beast race that barely talks was a good cop-out.

>>51023526
>genius story teller
>doesn't know the difference between then and than
You ever entertain the idea that you're not a genius story teller and maybe you're just a mediocre DM with a place that everyone can hang out at?

>>51035722
>typos
>in oral storytelling

>>51035757
You don't pronounce the difference between a's and e's? Savage.

>>51035614
Anon, you know that the guy who coined the meme: "Fuck you, I'm a dragon" got murdered by another furfag.

>>51023235
Is that Putin?

>>51023235
Some people will pretend to like stuff just to be part of a crowd. It seems obvious now, but the concept was alien to me for the longest time.

Also, that you can convince someone to stop talking about any subject by relating it to homo-eroticism.

>>51035781
You had me curious so I looked it up. Apparently his name was Matthew Finnegan and the guy that killed him was a juggalo, not a furry.

>>51035543

Gonna need sauce on that.

No way you couldn't find such a thing in an internet article.

>>51035873
A lot of what happens in my small town stays pretty local. (I live in Alaska, bumfuck nowhere USA.) Much worse things have happened that people only 40+ miles away don't even find out about for decades.

>>51035860
As if being a juggalo will stop you of being a furfag in your privacy.
You know why this shit is not vox populi? Because there is a lobby which is supported by STEM, lawyers, army memebrs and even cops who are fuefags and don't want the shit being overblown.
Dude, two years ago a guy in a con tried to poison everyone with a homemade mustard gas bomb or some shit in that line.

>>51023235
The furry community isn't a meme. I thought it was a worldwide joke and maybe a few deviants painting the whole crowd wrong.

I still don't understand it. Why bring fetishes into a game, or any social circle for that matter, so openly? So brazenly? So proudly? I mean everyone has fetishes, it's fair to admit it, but that shit stays on the down-low. Did they not get the memo? In what universe is bringing your sexual preferences into a completely unrelated conversation acceptable?

>>51035886

Mmmhmm.

>>51023526

>I a genius

>>51035936
>>51035722
I think he's being sarcastic. Nobody says 'obviously' without following it with sarcasm nowadays.

>>51023235

Players will rather go for easy truths if it means they don't have to make a hard decision.

>>51035901
They ever catch that guy?

>>51035901

Some idiot threw some pool chlorine powder in a stairwell. Not exactly 9/11, and nobody knows if it was one of the people from the con or someone doing it to le epic troll the furries.

>>51035967
It was a furry. When people want to troll them (which is something no one does since 2008) the modus operandi is standing front of the hotel where the convention is celebrated and harash people who come and go, never enter inside. The guy who tried to intoxicate the other attendants was obviously a fucked yp fellow yiffer.
But this kind of things are hidden because some furfags are actually relevant people. For the record Doug Winger was a brilliant engineer which did improved the laser targeting system of many fighters for the air force.

>>51023235
Players hate being left with open-ended decisions. On the other hand, they also hate it when they only have a finite number of options to pick from. And they hate when they have to follow a "story," and they especially hate it when there isn't a story to be immersed in. And they want hard riddles, but they hate your riddles because they suck and only make sense to yourself. Combat should be challenging and threatening to keep them on their toes, but you're doing it wrong if they get hurt.

Oh! And they want the campaign to be focused on intrigue and exploration and combat and dungeon-delving and NPC relationships and politics and cooking. And it should be sandbox, so you don't detract from player agency. You're a bad GM if you don't give every PC who splits off from the party their own solo adventure.

And don't forget to always keep every PC mechanically relevant at all times, or at least let your players remake new characters at the current campaign level and wealth at a moment's notice if they lose interest in their current ones.

And yes, they want to play right now.

>>51035923
The smart ones learn that no one will ever accept their fetishes, so all that's left are the worst ones. You'll never find a furry that, even when pressed, will admit to their fetish if they have any understanding of how other people will react, or what is socially proper.

>>51036039
He may have been technically brilliant
but he was still a degenerate

>>51036076
>subtle truths
>players are stupid assholes

>>51023492
So basically the rpg equivalent to a circle jerk.

>>51023235
Riddles, and puzzles in general, are hard to think up from scratch. I've come to respect anyone who can make a puzzle that really forces you to sit down and think from a different perspective.

>>51036076
Players don't know what they want. Or at least, players are ready to like whatever you give them. You just have to learn how to tailor the delivery to their taste.

I don't get GM's putting their players on a pedestal. But I also don't get players putting their PC's on a pedestal.

>>51023235
That most people want to be lead, rather than lead

>>51023235
You can't make anyone do anything, you can only control the incentives you provide for other people.

>>51023235

Spend time with people you actually like who get on with each other. Putting up with people you/others dislike for the sake of keeping the peace isn't worth it.

>>51023235
People don't like to think.
They claim they do, but they really don't.

>>51023235
Very few people deserve second chance but you should still err on the side of caution on to miss those few that do. Nobody deserves the third.

>>51023235
That you can only multiplex your time so far and beyond that you are stretched too thin. < 5 players.

That people repress their true selves and games let's some of that inner-self out into public. And for a lot of people it's disturbing as fuck.

That you can't ignore the meta-game and there are people behind these characters.

That most gamers are lonely losers.

That some people just want to vegetate and push the win-button over and over in the same familiar repetitive way and need to be coaxed out of their shell into creativity. That they're uncomfortable with unbound systems. That there are makers and consumers.

That the boardgame Diplomacy should not be played with people you want to remain friends with.

>>51023272
Sounds like you've got shit players.

>>51025700
Well someone had a lot of dick for breakfast.

>>51023235
That every shitty DM these days has been raised with shitty content-padding computer RPG's where they have to collect 5 wolf pelts. So now every story involves the 3 keys, the 7 wold seeds, the 4 elemental shards, the (I shit you not) 21 doors of savepointia.

Because they expect it. "Grind" is simply part of RPG's now.

>>51023410
"Doesn't have rules for every little fucking thing" is a good start.

>>51037450
It's part of MMORPGs and a very tiny amount of other RPGs.

>>51037450
>Things that never happen in actual tabletop games: The Post

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"Friends" and "People you enjoy playing games with" are not necessarily the same thing.

>>51023396

>It is acceptable to choose not to play games with people who you don't like playing games with

Depends on your friendgroups. Mine is filled with very socially awkward people that believe excluding anyone is mean and it's better to compromise eternally, in fear of excluding anyone.

Talking about it solved nothing, just more attempts at compromise that didn't work out. In the end, it drove me away from RPGs, because I just couldn't handle playing with some people in the group.

>>51035886

And the murderers name? Albert Einstein.

>>51035886
What's your tabletop scene like? play with the same old friends or this is a kind of crowd? what kind of games? I'm always curious how it is in rural locations

>>51037820

He doesn't live in rural Alaska anon, he's full of shit.

>>51023235
Do you mean the board?

There are fascinating examples of insanity out there, and that comes from someone who worked at an asylum.

If someone wants to learn about it... There is such a thing as an official "fuck-if-I-know" diagnosis, had to use it in my first pacient.

Anyone else wants to part with something that others probably don't know?

>>51036476
So you've never played in a group before anon?

>>51038121
What is this fuck if i know diagnosis called? Also, storytime?

>>51023235
That everyone's a liar, and most of them are bad at it.

>>51023235
No matter how clever you think you are, nothing is subtle.
No matter how honest you think you are, nothing is true.

>>51023235
People are not equal, some have more money, some had better education, some actually learned something from their parents and siblings, some are more healthy, some are just outright better.

The only fair game then, is luck.

>>51041114
>subtle truths
>nothing is subtle or True

Alright edge lord...

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>>51041114

>>51034451
Making a command is presupposing a truth. When you tell someone to stop being a dick, you are proposing a pre-conceived notion of what you assume a dick to be. I assume a dick is just a very masculine penis.

>>51041114
Best one so far as this statement is ironically, both subtle and true.

>>51041396
How can you say that when nothing is true or subtle?

>>51023376
this. I put a magic Organ in a bad guy's lair and they had to play a short sequence of notes. I stole the answer from a fucking Scooby Doo episode F-E-E-D notes.

its stumped them and they fiddled with it for like half an hour, which is fine with me because it was cursed with a laundry list of effects.

>>51023235
Morons are morons.

>>51023235
Most people who play tabletop RPGs just want to have fun playing a game. Except for that guy, he doesn't want the game to be a game at all. Instead he wants to use it as device to stroke his own ego with, sometimes in a circle jerk with other that guys. You should avoid playing with that guy. He isn't an urban legend or a myth, he's real.

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>>51037385

>>51041370
I understand your sentiment, however, I believe that playing the sophist doesn't help at all.

Certainly we can never Truly know what the true definition of some word is. Can I not use the word "society" to describe something simply because we cannot agree on a precise definition even if for the context we both understand it's meaning?

Due to the universal nature of the human condition, it seems to me almost all cultures will have a significant overlap of what it means to be a dick even if no one can really agree on what that is. The same way no one really can define cool but we all get the gist of it.

While it should go without saying that you shouldn't be one, the idea nonethelsss is important to the group.

>>51041439
Because you can't understand nuance. It's a generalization. If somebody says, nobody believes you, do you really think that they mean that not a single person in this world believes you?

>>51041582
You're right.

>>51023235
You sometimes have to work for your fun and be patient. Prepping sessions is a bitch but that's life. Related to that, as a friend, you have a responsibility to your players because they devoted time to your games. Don't flake and do your best each session. Definitely don't promise to game and cancel at the last fucking moment.

>>51023235

Violence is the function from which all authority ultimately derives.

>>51041582
the real problem with the platitude (which is actually the word I think anon meant instead of tautology) is that, being just another rephrasing of the golden rule, it still suffers from all the weird complications that make the golden rule a platitude and not actual advice.
The actual advice which they should give in its place is "communicate, learn what is expected or desired from you, and accommodate within reason."
Does the host like hosting every week? Would they prefer hosting rotates? If they like hosting, suggesting rotating sites might just come off as an insult. Snacks? Maybe someone has special dietary needs and prefer not to risk complications. Does the party want a fun, jovial atmosphere or do they take the setting and characters seriously and are pursuing verisimilitude and your dick jokes are disruptive?

"Don't be a dick" is advice to moral infants. While there are inarguably some people that need this advice, it's so far below actual thinking that to pose it as advice is a poorly veiled insult. "I know not to be a dick. Clearly you don't."

>>51041695

To be fair, this is 4chan. It's not like the poster isn't right about half the people in this thread.

>>51023576
You decide what kinda of fun your game is going to cater to, let your intentions known to all parties involved, and give them a chance to leave if your idea of fun is up to their standards.

>>51025700
>This isn't wisdom, it's a smug, empty-brained tautology.
No, a tautology is "You're a dick because you're a dick, so you'll be a dick."

>>51025700
>Accuses people of being smug and empty-brained
>Doesn't even know what tautology means
faux-intellectuals are the worst people.

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>>51041020

>>51038121
>>51040870
Irritable Bowel Syndrome?

>>51023235
that playing shitty boardgames with people is fucking stupid when videogames exist. People want to be entertained and apparently sitting around a table rolling dice pretending to be someone else isn't a good idea anymore. I fucking hate it.

>>51023466
>salty hillary cucks mad that an orange walking meme got elected president of the most overweight country in the world
You know, I hear ropes are going on sale...

never fuck with the fluff

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>>51040870
>>51042222
I'm not sure if it is the same in english, but my diagnosis was, according to the DRM-IV-TR, 300.9 Unspecified Mental Disorder (Not Psychotic). She had enough evidence of a mental disorder, but no available test would work on an almost blind, almost deaf and mute pacient.

Her prognosis just as bad, and my recomendation was that she should stay in the hospital the rest of her life, she was utterly incapable of living outside on her own.

Couldn't even define if what seemed to be mental retardation was an actual deficiency or the result of a lifetime inside the hospital with no suitable schooling before or after she was found in a country road decades ago. She never had a name or ID, you see. No one ever reported someone like her missing.

The period at that hospital was amazing, the scariest experience of my life was there, and that comes from someone who was assaulted, run over, defended a woman from a dog and had an old man ask me how much to fuck his butt not five minutes after seeing him for the first time.

>>51023235
Democracy is shit.

>>51037617
Fucking this.

People I enjoyed playing with were horrible for hanging out with after sometimes. Friends were often people I'd never even consider inviting to games.

Sure, sometimes someone would cross the boundary, but who knows how well that would last without the game to unite us or the friendship to keep the game together?

>>51023235
To win you have to be aggressive.

It doesn't matter how excited you are about something: nobody cares. There is a gulf between us all, and any understanding we have of one another is incomplete and temporary. Experiences are not, and cannot be shared.

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>>51023235
this probably should have been the first post.

>>51023235
Turns out it's really hard to not torture people. Once you decide that you're willing to hurt others to get what you want, and you have someone you don't like completely in your power, it's really fucking hard to not just resort to torture even though it doesn't fucking work. This is the case even if you don't believe torture to be effective. Every single player in that Vampire the Dark Ages game explicitly believed that torture is an ineffective interrogation technique. The ST himself made it clear he doesn't think torture works, and accordingly we never actually got anything useful out of torturing anybody. Yet nonetheless torture was still our first resort over and over again. It's just so goddamned easy to do, so seductive in its promises. Just hurt this person to make them talk, it seems so simple and straightforward. That it doesn't work just means that the more frustrated you get at them not talking, the easier it gets to hurt them even more.

Looking back on that game after it went into hiatus, i've gained a much better understanding of why torture has been so persistent throughout history despite it's terrible track record. Torture is easy and compelling, it's your instincts telling you that if you just hurt this person a little, they'll tell you everything you want to know. Effective interrogation is hard and complicated, it requires you to empathize with your enemy, to learn what makes them tick, to treat them well and share with them, to know how to ask leading questions and get people to talk about things.

Of course this is was a Vampire game, so eventually we just resorted to Dominating everyone into answering our questions truthfully. Interrogation is so much easier when you have mind control.

>>51044487
JUST ONE GIRLY AT THE TOURNEY AND IT'S KILL OR BE KILLED. THE DUNGEON MASTER IS THE BASTARD KNOWN AS PLEENY THE ILL

>>51023235
RPGs are a great way of practicing your craps skills with weirdly shaped dice and everyone looking at your hands.

Alternatively:
Most people seriously think I'm just lucky and actually give a fuck about imaginary adventures of their self-inserts.

>>51023235
Bad players are the fault of bad gms not training their players (or training them badly)

I am not smarter than my players.

Competitive games are superior, since players are up against the combined brainpower of each other.

Most gms think running a competitive game is like running a cooperative game. It's not, and a lot of players not liking competitive games is because of bad experiences.

People with external oddities like clothing, piercings, etc., are not too far gone so long as they have a normal body weight
People who eat poorly, no matter how normal they might appear, are always trouble.
Interestingly, the ones who don't eat enough are worse than the ones who eat too much.

>>51046542
ayyy

>>51023235
Wisdom and Intelligence are two different, separate things.

>>51046925
>Competitive game
>Gm
Yuck

>>51047321
>implying

I'm not him, but having a referee is necessary if you want your competitive banking simulation to be enjoyable. Having a game master is the only way to both allow secrecy, and prevent cheating.
If you're using tokens, you're not playing a complicated enough game.

not him by the by, just an autist dropping a post

>>51023235
White people can't dance and black people can't sing

>>51048730
>black people can't sing
>what is gospel

Listen to more things than the radio please.

>>51023235
Everyone is a shitlord of the highest caliber.

>>51023235
That /tg/ is the worst thing to happen to traditional games.

>>51049536
worst thing after Monty Python's Grail, but yeah.

>>51036076
Basically, no game > game.

>>51049564
>OD&D
>1974
>Monty Python's Holy Grail
>March, 1975

I suppose the worst things that happen to us are the most formative.

>>51041482
Saved by our own ineptitude once again!

>>51023235
Truth is subjective; reality is objective. They're both factual categories, but it's important to realize that subjective doesn't mean arbitrary - I may want the truth to be that I stabbed that Orc, but at the end of the day I still have to square the truth with that 1 I rolled.

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>>51023235

Self-deception is the most powerful thing in the world, and a huge part of all the problems people have stem from the fact that they keep lying to themselves, and not just being dishonest to others.

>>51023235
All of the people I know are worthless backstabbing pieces of shit.

>>51023272
But the whole point that makes 3.5 fun is sitting down and going "how do I make a [weird character concept] work in the most entertaining way possible?". Then you actually play it and get to have fun developing a personality around it with friends until you die/the game ends and then you get to go through the brainstorming fun all over again!

>>51050429
This is wrong and you did not learn it from table top.

Truth is objective, reality is subjective but you're too much of a pseudo-intellectual to realize it.

>>51023235
That wereboar rogues are subtle and terrifying.

>>51045916
While you're technically right one a perfectionist level, that doesn't mean you can't still experience something together even if it isn't 100% the same experience, ya dig?

Let's say you have a bowl of ice cream and you eat almost all of it except the last bits of melted stuff because your spoon is too big. Would you say you can't eat ice cream just because you can't have all of it?

Just something to consider.

>>51024002
>>51025454
The NYT also misidentified Aleppo twice, confusing ot for the both the legitimate Syrian capitol and the ISIS defacto capitol in their article about Johnson's Gaffe. Possibly the funniest thing in a very stupid election.

>>51046542
I feel you, man. Only that I don't play craps and just cheat with dice when I really need that very important roll to land with double critical.

>>51023235
People love to argue, doesn't even matter what you're doing, people will argue about it.

>>51041695
I disagree with your statements.

The simplest of ideas can often be the most profound. Indeed you are simply complicating things. This isn't a discussion about advise but Truth.

You went more into detail as to not be a dick, but his title still applies.

In a way what you have done is proven his statement and done exactly what each of us has done mentally upon reading his post.

>>51051315
No we won't.

>>51023235
Flat Earth settings can work, if you use Alderson Disk.

So long as you play it cool and retroactively connect all the randomly placed dots, you can trick people into thinking that you are a good storyteller. Once people are tricked into thinking that you are a good storyteller, they will search for deeper meaning where there is none, effectively writing the story for you.

>>51023261
i am more angered by your lack of knowlege in 40k fluff and your promotion of "if orkz belief it den it iz real!1!111" nonsense than your fucking autistic political commentary.

>>51051413
Go back to bed Scott Cawthon

>>51034989
no offense meant but you sound EXTREMELY jaded

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>>51023235
The only thing traditional games have taught me is that I am a repugnant "person" of serpentine character and the most shameful form of nihilism, affecting a facade of harmlessness to mask my incapacity for diligence or ambition...

...and somehow I still have friends willing to sit down at a table with me for six hours to throw dice around, blurt memes at each other, and eat pizza.

To this day, I don't understand the moral of the story.

>>51023235
Being able to laugh at yourself is an immensely useful and surprisingly uncommon ability.

Just because you can laugh at something doesn't mean you can't be invested in it too.

In most games (and activities in general) enjoyment is derived from being able to put your all into the play while being open to failure or foolishness. It's about doing your best too win. However that doesn't mean loosing is worth getting fucked up over.

Groups that are willing to invest themselves in what they are doing tend to have more fun.
Groups that are willing to risk failure to try do something cool or funny or try something new tend to become much better at the game.

I know it sounds pretty generic and straightforward but it is rarely felt in practice.

Also a lot of "nerd" types take themselves stupidly seriously even if they deny it. Even minor failures lead to bouts of "I'm a horrible, horrible person!" small insights lead too bits of "I'm a mystical sage!" and moments of self-awareness usually lead to both at the same time. It wouldn't be so bad if they weren't so afraid of failure or embarrassment.
No one really cares that much if you're a loser. The ones that do only do so briefly. If they do dwell on your faults that much they probably aren't that great themselves.
I just want you fucks to give more, I know you have it you.

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>>51025833

>>51023396
>1. Don't be a duck

Well fuck you anon people are born that way you know

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>>51051367
>Alderson Disk
That sounds fucking minty, stolen

>>51023261
Tell us more about how butt hurt you are.

>>51023261
>guaranteed replies
why must /tg/ always take the /pol/ bait

>>51052362
You can steal something that is common good, anon.
And I advise reading "Missile Gap" by Stross to make your own Alderson Disk more interesting. It dwells to all the implications of living on such "planet" plus it's a gold mine of ideas in general.

>>51023244
This
The first doesn't make sense while the second does.

>>51051367
Never heard about it before, but this is really neat. Why this was never used in Spelljammer?

>>51025700
Stop being a pedantic cunt.

>>51023235
That the mark of a true roleplayer is someone who doesn't NEED to roll charisma checks.

>>51023235
That if you want to find out exactly how degenerate that weird guy's fetishes are, just let him DM a single campaign.

>>51023261
Yeah, we won, cry some more about it. He will make this country great again, and he will drag you to greatness kicking and screaming in your temper tantrum if he has to.

And the best part is you can't do a fucking thing about it anymore.

>>51053304
>That if you want to find out exactly how degenerate that weird guy's fetishes are, just let him DM a single campaign.
Bullshit. Had a guy with serious case of transformation fetish, he GMed allright all his games. Meanwhile as a player, he was casting Polymorphy pretty much every given chance and then some

>>51051660
you don't NEED to be a "good" person to be enjoyable to be around. You don't even have to fake being a "good" person.

>>51053336
Dare you fucking doubt me? Son, the stories I could tell.

>>51053341
I dare. Most people contain themselves as GMs, because they are aware of this shit. It takes to be disfuntional degenerate to do otherwise. Are you saying you played with degenerates?

>>51023235
that seeing passion go into a game, whether art style or mechanics, really IS better than the most expensive game money can buy.

....but good fucking luck finding one that matches your preferences.

>>51053353
I am saying I played with a complete degenerate as a DM.

Are you aware of what coulrophilia is? It's a sexual attraction to clowns.

We made the mistake of letting one QT play a game with us in college, the same day Danny Degenerate DM's his first campaign.

She made the mistake of playing a rogue dressed in harlequin gear. And oh fuck did he ruin her desire to ever play DnD again.

The harlequin girl was shit on by prison guards, frozen solid by a wizard and molested while she was iced, tentacle raped, eaten by a giantess, shit out, then eaten again.

And none of this is mentioning what happened to our characters. Are you aware that there are people who get off on being covered by spiders? Who find that holes in the body thing attractive?

"Most people contain themselves as GM's"

I'm not gonna deny that. Most people can, but some people are autistic as shit and don't know where the social line is.

>>51053404
>some people are autistic as shit and don't know where the social line is.
And I'm not denying that. I'm simply bewildered you were playing with someone like that, because those spergs usually stand out like a sore finger long before you need to piss on every door to open them, every trap to deactivate it and every guard to beat it.

>>51051225
I understood that not too subtle reference

>>51043167
Well now youve got to tell us the scariest experience of your life, anon

Also that story of the woman is one of the most tragic things iv ever heard

>>51035923
So brazenly? So proudly?

Like the faggots have become? Just a couple of decades ago, that shit got you beat. You kept it quiet and in your own circles. It's the reason noone cared about AIDS. If it was kept in deviant circles, who cares? It's their problem.

You want to know why every fetish in the world is coming out and slowly but surely the most deviant acts are becoming more normal. Look back to the beginning of the slippery slope. Faggots and dykes being allowed to parade that shit in front of everyone.

>>51023235
Memes were a mistake and don't get too deep into a PC background

>>51023235
The opportunity to murder people lessens the need to actually murder people. But it's still nice to have that option.

>>51055394
>gay people being given basic human rights is why things like pedophilia or german scat porn are becoming the norm

alright, I'll bite. where's the actual, proven correlation between these things? I'll give you cucking on a long stretch of men becoming more feminine because of teh gays, but anything more than that you're gonna have to work for.

>>51054904
>Also that story of the woman is one of the most tragic things iv ever heard
As a mental hospital, most bathrooms didn't have any doors. It's unsettling the first time you notice that someone is taking a dump right in front of you... And only you are the one worried about that.

>Well now youve got to tell us the scariest experience of your life, anon
When I went to pick a patient on a wheelchair from her wing to the art workshop, I saw a woman standing. I'm not sure of some details, I remember she had only a t-shirt, but I can't recall if what covered her sex from my view was the shirt or the large belly she had. Either way, I was embarrassed, even if I already knew how much personal privacy the patients hadn't. While I waited for the one I came to take for the workshop, someone explained about the woman. The reason she had a belly that looked like a seven-month old pregnancy wasn't a child, but a tumor. Which also explained all those knobs, it wasn't a smooth belly like one sees on expecting mothers. Her doctors had already booked a surgery to remove it, but no one expected much. It was a recurrence of the tumor, and she already had gone through a surgery before. However, it was a mental hospital. The reason she was there for I-don't-know-how-many years wasn't her body, but her mind. In that room, there was one person absolutely oblivious to all this, her eyes towards the ground but never focused on anything. It was the woman herself, completely alien to what was happening to her. Those blank eyes. Seeing them was the most scary experience in my life.

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>>51023235
Worldbuilding is fucking addictive, almost as fun as roleplaying, and an amazing way to actually use all that trivia acumulated from years of reading.

And yet, the fluff you come up with has to be fun and interesting.

>>51051203
>you're too much of a pseudo-intellectual to realize it

Says the guy picking a semantic argument. Clearly, I did not express myself well, so to expand on what I was trying to say -

Human experience is fundamentally subjective, but it is based on an underlying reality that doesn't care what we perceive and exists regardless. Tabletop helped me realize this because it makes the difference between "what I understand to be true" and "what actually happened" very obvious. I understand that my character didn't strike surely enough to hit the Orc. What actually happened was that a number was lower than another number.

Real life isn't fundamentally different, it's just that we don't have the advantage of directly perceiving the underlying system (physics), and our brains are designed to convert information about reality into useful facts without you needing to think about it.

But the actually important point of all this is that subjective doesn't mean arbitrary. It is in the case of tabletop, because we make the rules at every level. But if I hit you with a chair, no amount of houseruling will stop it from hurting.

>>51056172

Not him, but I think he's trying to say those things aren't the norm, but the normal person has more exposure to those things, due to the general increase of tolerance towards behaviour previously considered "deviant".

He's saying that since people with atypical sexuality are allowed to parade their differences without consequences, that people with atypical fetishes can do the same.

>>51056699
but that's bullshit? the reason paedophilia is becoming more apparent is, arguably, because of the obsession in the media with younger and younger women. the BDSM community ALMOST became normal, but then everyone realised "hey wait, that's fucking stupid." furries were never accepted, that shit's too autistic. I can't think of a single fetish that isn't essentially vanilla that has mainstream acceptance.

>>51056761
...So any fetish with mainstream acceptance has mainstream acceptance?

>>51055394
Heaven forbid we treat people like people even if they do something that (You) find distasteful, but ultimately harmless.

Its an honor to post in the same thread as the sole, anointed arbitrator of what is and isn't morally acceptable when it comes to sexuality.

>>51056761

>I can't think of a single fetish that isn't essentially vanilla that has mainstream acceptance.

That may be a problem with you personally or the place where you live. Either your definition of vanilla is off or you happen to live somewhere that's more conservative.

>Paedophilia
This is one case where I don't see more exposure as more acceptance. The "media" conspiracy isn't even really relevant either. I think people find it just as distasteful as always, it's just much easier to get caught in the modern age so people get caught more often.

>BDSM
There's BDSM groups actively posting events on the Meetup and Event Calendar for my city. Whether or not it's normal doesn't matter; it's practiced openly without retaliation

>Furries
You're right about that. I'm not sure furries will ever be taken seriously, and there aren't really enough of them to try and make some greater tolerance movement on their own behalf.

>>51056871

Also, before people responding to >>51056172 start firing off at me, I'm just trying to make sense of his argument. I'm actually of the mind that having these things be out in the open is better than having people bottle them up and then go crazy because they can't express themselves sexually.

Games are all about finding an identity that suits you. In RPGs people pretty explicitly try on other identities. In strategy games, the concept of a play style is ever present. Games with only a single correct option aren't fun because they don't allow for the formation of identity and style.

>>51023235
All that matters as a GM is to provide a good time for the players while still having fun yourself.

>>51056761
>the reason paedophilia is becoming more apparent is, arguably, because of the obsession in the media with younger and younger women
>what is lolicon

>>51057397
I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or trying to refute my argument by proving it. I don't always understand if greentext is supposed to be sarcastic or not.

>>51057523
seems like I didn't understand your post too well
My first thought was about mainstream media like TV

>>51057687
no, that WAS my point. I thought you were saying I was wrong and that paedophilia wasn't becoming more mainstream and then citing the popularity of lolicon as a source, when lolicon becoming popular because of Japan's obsession with "purity" and youth leading them to animate their waifus to be younger and younger.