Modern Fantasy

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I actually like it more than medieval fantasy. But magic should not take the big part.

>>51000773
That depends on how many parts modern to how many parts fantasy you're mixing.

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>>51000773

One thing is working out how modern cities work in a world with magical creatures that will predate on humans. I remember watching the scene where Noctis and crew were on the train when demons started to manifest inside forcing it to stop so they had to escape before the tunnels closed. That said, in 12 when you see the war in Nabudis you see a bunch of mages channeling energy into a massive sheild to repel the arcadian airships before their Palling tower was raided and they were all stabbed to death.

So that could be stuff to use to help design cities and towns. I imagine going to some rustic village out of the ways where the men and women of the village have to take turns patrolling and keeping monsters out of their farm fields and then you go to a city where they have it down to a science locking down areas when a monster from the sewer system shows up

>>51000773
RWBY

>>51000773
If there's no masquerade in effect it generally works better in a setting other than our world. People have a pretty good understanding of our own world so trying to insert significant fantastical elements leads to dissonance which stops people getting into the work.

>>51001781
i cannot fathom why anyone would be attracted to that godawful mess of a series

>>51000773
It could work, but most authors and designers just go full retard and give knights in those settings magitech ak47s.
That's the general problem, I could go on furhter but have niether time nor desire to do so.

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I thought this was cool

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>>51003140

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>>51003146

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>>51003159

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>>51003166
That's all

>>51003183
That was really neat.

Modern fantasy, like sci-fi fantasy, is a kitchen sink, and people tend to like kitchen sinks because it gives them more leeway to pull off shit you wouldn't normally see in a purebred setting. The trick is just how that kitchen sink is thrown together.

>>51000773
>thoughts
boy oh boy, i do love me some modern fantasy. not fantasy with a modern theme and design slapped onto it, but the modern world (at least modern earth recognizable at a glance) with fantasy elements blended in. Dresden Files, Percy Jackson series (greek and egyptian story lines only, with minor adjustments to roman and cutting the nordic part) WoD, high school dxd (the tits are just a bonus for the setting) etc etc. give me a setting set in the american west shooting wendigos and skinwalkers while dealing with the devil at a crossroads or an IT guy finding out his neighbor is actually a vampire trussing him up for dinner and trying to figure out how to save his hide over any fantasy setting (barring Endless Legend)

really, if i could just get Supernatural as a campaign i would be happy as a pig in a truffle farm

>>51003317
I have the exact opposite opinion. Couldn't care less for fantasy elements jammed into modern day, but a fantasy world advanced to the point of resembling modern times? Fuck yeah

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>>51003347
I understand, accept and respect your different opinion

>>51003183
Thanks for sharing these!

>>51001161

Depending on how late it is, monsters might or might not have been driven to near extinction by bored militaries who have nobody else to whomp on due to globilization frowning on wars of conquest, leading to a low-fantasy esque age of legends where only unmolested parts of the world/and or criminal underworld still contained them.

>>51003183

That's pretty terrifying.

>>51003317
Does modern fantasy always have to be dark, though?

>>51003422

Perhaps, then I imagine you'd have monsters that adapt to such a world or at the very least some unscrupulous wizard is still making monsters for the military or criminal types and they get out.

So a few are natural (like dire bears/owl bears and shit like that) and then you have Resident Evil level monsters.

>>51003559

In my opinion, no.

>>51003183
There's a bunch more, let me see if I can find them. It's a really cool concept.

>>51003559
no. Percy Jackson isn't dark at all compared to the other ones. highschool DxD is an echii anime that just happens to have stumbled onto the fine grey line of being set in an interesting world that can easily be turned into a semi-dark setting by a very simple few minor adjustments.

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Usually, when I think modern fantasy, I think Trailer Park Fae. Pic related.

Ultimately I wouldn't imagine that 2017 in a fantasy world would be anything like 2017 in the real world. At that point, you'd end up with, well Final Fantasy.

I'm not saying that like it's a bad thing, mind - magitech is still neat as hell. I just don't think outright fantasy and our own definition of modern would make sense. The fantasy elements would have to remain a secret.

>Fullmetal Alchemist
The only fantasy element in that is alchemy itself, and the entire story revolves around it. It works for FMA, but if I'm playing a setting, I'd rather it not be all about that setting's particular flavor of magic.

>>51003317
I can't stand that style of modern fantasy. Strikes me as pointedly lazy, just chucking old myths into down town Chicago. Trying to build a fictional, fantastical setting that has made it to a modern or near modern technological and societal level is a lot more interesting and uncommon.

>>51000773
...Why is that guy's head so big in proportion to his body?

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>>51003608

>>51003696
He's asian

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>>51003718

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>>51003737

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>>51003747

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>>51003769

>>51003718
>Iberian country
>Using an old norse name
>Not even changing out the letters they don't have

The paperwork will lead to mutiny, people will get lynched, and when the dust has settled the courts will find it all justified. There will probably be an auto da fe for the guy who choose the name.

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>>51003780
And that's the end of it. There are more, but it's mostly the author talking about his OC.
Shame it hasn't updated in more than a year.

>>51000773
>a modern fantasy setting with some elements taken from Full Metal Alchemist.

So you're going to fill a generic steampunk setting with Mary Sues?

Seriously though, kidding, if you're having fun playing in the setting it's a good setting and who cares what I think?

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>>51003801
Thanks anon, totally stealing the fuck out of these in a modern fantasy campaign I plan on running soon.

DmC is a pretty good take on contemporary fantasy, if simple.

>>51003683
Sounds fun, do you have examples?


The 'theres magic but everything is the same' is a bit shit. I'd expect IT workers but not ww2 or the British empire

>>51003422
Really the idea of war being frowned upon in our modern culture is due to WWI and WWII. Otherwise war would be very much a regular occurrence in the world.

>>51006869
World wars seem inevitable once things get to a global scale

>>51003669
Really the element of FMA that catches my eye is the idea of state funded magicians.

>>51007038

Agreed. You normally see magic users being indepdent sorts which would make sense in a time when a centralized governing body wouldn't even be considered or difficult to maintain.

Any setting that advanced into a modern-ish era would no doubt centralize and control the way magic is used and who can use them.

>>51006904
WWI really wasn't if you look at the circumstances leading up to it. Really what caused it was Otto Von Bismarck's political chess game where he got everyone to make political alliances with one another in order to keep Germany safe from distruction, and since he wasn't at the head of the nation any longer his political chess game fell apart and the world went to war. WWII was inevitable just because of WWI.

>>51005600
Mostly I'm interested in the ideas so that I could steal them for my own setting.

>>51000773
I don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet but The Secret World does it pretty nicely. Though the supernatural elements are kept somewhat on the down low in the setting, you can easily ramp it up for your own.

>>51007142
I would think such political clusterfucks become increasingly more likely as several large and powerful nations interact with each other

>>51007583
Not nessearly, most of the reason why is because Germany was a new state that several nations wanted a piece of because of its abundant resources. Most of the nations at the time where fairly powerful and were mostly focused on fighting one another independently because at the time the major political game was expanding their colonies and Germany was he only nation who didn't have that.

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>>51003317
I want the opposit.
I dislike the traditional approach to modern fantasy which is to go with urban legends and horror movie cliches.

Instead i want something like Ivalice, a fantasy setting that HAPPENS to be modern while retaining fantasy elements such as melee weapons, colourfull fantasy races and fantastical terrain.

I do not mind the real world with its history and peoples beeing represented as such a world, in fact that would be an ideal state to me.

Speaking of Endless Legend: you could argue that endless legend is modern fantasy.

Personally i think the two settings that pull off modern fantasy the best are Ivalice and Shadowrun, hillariously enaugh these settings are pretty much the opposit of one another.

>>51001161
Artstylew wise this guys image nails it almost 100% for me, with the exception of fantasy races missing. Have medieval stylistic elements like knights plate and swords mixed with modern materials and processes also modern weapons and gear. Endless Legend does a great job at doing that, especialy the vaulters faction.

What i dislike about common modern fantasy is the "urban" part.
I live in the modern world in a country highly mixed population density, i think focusing on the "urban" aspect doesnt do our modern world justice. Thats what i like about the new Final Fantasy game, theres monsters out there, i think you can go even more Witcher with this: The cities are prosperous and modern, the wilds are dangerous and savage.

Some great modern Fantasy:
>Shadowrun
>Ivalice
>Endless Legends
>Lore Elderscrolls
>Eberron
>Zamonien
>Turok
>Nausicaa
>Mirrodin
>Ravnica

Tho the latter four arent exactly "modern" but have modern elements.

>>51007878
This. I like the brazen kitchen sink more than the secret kitchen sink.

>>51007878
Endless Legend is sci-fi disguised as fantasy. Dust does weird shit and is the epotomie of 'sufficiently advanced technology is no different from magic'

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>>51007545
The secret world is more of a setting that used to have a masquerade until it came crashing down a couple moths before the game's story started, when an eldritch abomination came and ate Times Square. And a chunk of Tokyo.

Which might be a good way to handle a Modern Fantasy setting that's set on Earth: All the magic and fantasy elements have either just arrived or revealed themselves, and your stories are all about the two worlds being forced to interact with each other on a global scale.

>>51008175
>when an eldritch abomination came and ate Times Square. And a chunk of Tokyo.
I haven't played through this (probably won't ever), but I blame Orochi.

>>51008175
I have only played up until the completion of issue 10. Is all the secret shit just fully blown open for the hole world to see by the end of Tokyo?

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>>51007878
>What i dislike about common modern fantasy is the "urban" part.
>I live in the modern world in a country highly mixed population density, i think focusing on the "urban" aspect doesnt do our modern world justice. Thats what i like about the new Final Fantasy game, theres monsters out there, i think you can go even more Witcher with this: The cities are prosperous and modern, the wilds are dangerous and savage.

Agreed. Final Fantasy 7 did this by having you start within the bowels of Midgar and then after you make your great escape you see the vast world and places like the Chocobo farm and Kalm which was in stark contrast to Midgar yet you walk into the bar and you see a TV hanging on the wall.

>>51009092
I'd have murdered for a Final Fantasy 7 that started and ended in Midgar, just using every sector and heavy urban environments of all varieties to tell the story. I think it could have worked amazingly that way. My favorite parts were always Midgar and the brief return to it.

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>>51009191

Yeah, it was a waste to never be able to explore all the other sectors and go between the upper and lower plates. More so when you consider there were areas that were apparently exposed to sunlight and had natural growing plants in them such as Aeris' Mon's house. Imagin if you had to trek through urban jungle that was literally covered with vines and vegetation with the associated monsters therein?

>>51009292
>>51009191
Urban atmosphere needs a counterpoint or it loses its own significance.

Likewise a dense population centre needs a landscape it ties within to give itself an identity. a city is only truly alive with what lies beyond and how that influences it.

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I love modern fantasy stories where magic is just another fact of life and it fills niches for certain technologies or improves them

>>51009469
>We will never see ninjas in space with Seals allowing easy interstellar travel or zero-g fights with posthuman soldier/warriors.

When you get down to it Seals are pretty gamebreaking in a sci-fi setting.

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>>51009372
Yes, but you can still limit the sphere of influence and scene easily to keep the scope and content a lot tighter. Midgar could have been explored fully, invested in and seen as both the source of the sickness and the only place to find a way to stop it, following mission and mystery across every sector as the seat of power in the world. The country around it and other locations could be seen in brief events, like a venture to the ranch, or a flight to Wutai, a return to the hometown, or a much more frightening finale of having to fly to the crater, after surviving the Weapon attacks on the city you spent all game in. Make the world feel a lot more lived in if it's just a reasonably sized and heavily populated locale that feels like part of a much bigger world.

>>51009292
Yeah, exactly. Midgar was a lot of cities and things in one magitech whole - the urban theme would be frequent, but you had a whole ecosystem and wild variety. Like the the Empire from FF6 if it won and went to modern times.

>>51003317
I generally see the distinction made that what you describe is called urban fantasy, with the term modern fantasy usually being reserved for worlds where magic and whatnot are overt parts of the world that exist outside of shadows and secrecy. Of course this isn't a hard rule and terms are always vague and rarely used strictly like this, but I find such delineation to be useful since they have entirely different appeals.

>>51009506

The hand-seals that allow them to do their techniques or the literal seals used to do various things from sealing away objects to performing other techniques? Or both.

Remember in one of the movies there was an enemy nation that had a modern navy with Carriers with gliders powered by their own chakra with shuriken machine guns.

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>>51000773
I love urban fantasy, but my flavor is more like Buffy/Neverwhere/Dresden Files than Final Fantasy.

Really wish there were more novels that were urban fantasy without romance bullshit, but hey.

>>51007545
The Secret World saddens the hell out of me, because it could have been the Vanpire: The Masquerade spiritual sequel I've been aching for... then they had to make it a fucking MMO. God damnit.

Still tried it during a free trial, and the character I made that fends off magical baddies with just a shotgun and a sledgehammer still makes his way into my games.

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I think a lot of people in this thread are confusing Urban Fantasy like V:tM, Dresden Files and the cavalcade of Buffy imitators with Modern Fantasy that OP is talking about
I think what OP wants is a fantasy setting that isn't locked in medieval stasis, a typical fantasy world that has progressed to what is considered a modern standard of living and possesses what we would consider modern technology even if it is powered by magic

Personally I took Eberron and advanced the timeline a little over 200 years so you have elemental cars, modern guns and guys with swords fighting monsters because it's still fantasy

>>51010365

There has to be a better name for this sort of thing. Science fantasy isn't really appropriate and like you said modern fantasy implies more Underworld/Dresden/Buffy then a fantasy setting that has modern day contrivances

>>51003608
>>51003718
You have no idea how much of a fucking cock-tease all of this is!
There is just the scant bit of worldbuild, two characters in various poses, lots of little tidbits that hint at a bigger whole, all over on the tumbler site thing that these are from.
But there is nothing else! There is not enough explanation or story!! Grahh!

>>51008234
>blame Orochi
You're right, and nine times outta ten, you're also right without even trying. The remaining one outta ten it's the dragon.

>>51010703
Contemporary Fantasy maybe

>>51010703
Contemporary fantasy

It's hard to forget that knights & castles were "contemporary" and "boring" to medieval storytellers

The "fantasy" was the intrusion of the fantastic into mundane life

I think in a setting with magic on the level of something like D&D, it's kind of hard to make a case for technology advancing as far as it has in our mundane world.

Magic fills so many needs that we've developed technology to deal with. Why develop that technology when magic is accessible? It'd presumably form an industry of its own pretty quickly.

>>51011290

Then magic becomes the technology. Instead of cellphones people communicate with mini magic mirrors that let you see who you're talking to. Maybe you can even go as far as using presdigitation to create a UI to help you navigate how to use the spell.

I mean, if any tom,dick, and harry can use a fucking scroll a simple magic item shouldn't be beyond them.

>>51010323
It's still built like a single player game at least. You can easily do anything that isn't dungeons by yourself.

>>51011290
It's interesting to read about African tribes and how their complete and utter belief in magic meant everyone and their mother casually collected fetishes to do everything from keeping away wild beasts, to flying, to having attractive children.

>>51010365
>The setting of I Couldn't Become a Hero, So I Reluctantly Decided to Get a Job.

>>51011429
Yeah, this is the more interesting angle to take I think, rather than just transplanting the magic into the real world modern age.

If you want that kinda thing, you'd probably need a situation like Shadowrun, where magic is very new to the world (or at least, has returned after being gone for a fucklong time) so that it hasn't had the chance to replace the need for tech advancement.

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>>51011962

>Spend your highschool years mastering the sword and being the top fighter of your class
>Gain your license to wield all classes of weapons and armors including magic arms
>Get picked up for a premier bodyguard position for tourist to the Wyldes fighting off the random Dire Boar and getting contracts to kill the mage experiment gone wrong #345

At least the insurance is pretty good.

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>>51011654
You're not wrong, but it still plays like an MMO--ie, big empty world's you can't interact with and combat that just consists of spamming hotkeys. No thank you.

>>51003737
>NATO reporting name
Nice touch.

>>51000863
I like it if the magic is present and most people have the capacity to learn it. But it is not the ridiculously high level, make continents float, mages are actually gods wielding endless power style magic.

Tone it down to more subtle levels and it works out well enough. At least enough to have a good argument for modern technology existing along side it.

I'm also a fan of magic societies being very underground and hidden.

>>51003140
>>51003146
>>51003159
>>51003166
This is the aspect of modern fantasy that I do not like, or the angle it takes that bothers me a bit. Where they try to turn all mystic/magic things or creatures into something scientifically explainable only.

Where they make vampires a virus, or something purely non-magical. And demons are just a drug addiction or something. I don't mind modern but I want the magical to be magical.

>>51014960
See but that's something that the images you're pointing at don't do. What we've got here is all that the scientific community has figured out about 'demons' but if you read through it and the rest there is a still a whole hell of a lot of 'fuck if we know' that science has no idea about, like crosses and religious iconography helping ward of demon infestation of the body. They're working entirely off the little they can figure out, but a lot of it is still
>spin three times in a circle and call out the name of your first crush, then drink the water that has never seen moonlight
> "But why Mr. Scientist?"
>Because it makes X happen, don't ask me why, and don't ask how many Timmys we went through to figure it out.

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>>51014960
Then quit posting in this thread if you do not like the genre

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>>51015226

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>>51015246

Outside of mages and ninjas hanging around, what would be a good reason to keep swords and steel armor around in the modern era when guns are common?

Wizards still using their same old stuff like wood staves and wants with crystals is generally accepted. But would knights and paladins still hang around in a modern fantasy setting?

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>>51015265

>>51015231
>Then quit posting in this thread if you do not like the genre
That's not the definition of the modern fantasy genre.

>>51015276
Probably some bullshit where magical creatures need to be defeated with old enchanted items. Or maybe something where guns can't be enchanted.

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>>51015276
Maybe gunpowder just doesn't work in the setting.

Why? I dunno, magic did it. Maybe there's things that look like our guns, but they're magic powered so a lot more trouble than our own.

>>51015276
Steel armour you could say has an anti-magic component that kevlar/body armour doesn't. And you could do something with the symbology of a sword making it some how more magicable than guns.

>>51015276
There's also the rule of cool. How about you just go with that?

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>>51011962
>he uses the english names of anime
Fucking kill yourself, faggot

>>51014960
You are literally everything that is wrong with fantasy as a genre.

>>51015276
How about armor that's enchanted to be fucking tough to crack, and so to get through it people use enchanted melee weapons that are unaffected by the armor's protection and hit it like normal? And there could be some rule that, while guns can be enchanted, it'd just be wasteful to enchant the thousands of bullets people use on the battlefield. This leaves the option of snipers or gunslingers who paid through the nose to get special enchanted bullets.

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>>51015276
>what would be a good reason to keep swords and steel armor around
Fighters and Monsters can outpace most modern guns that aren't built specifically to counter them
Wizards can fuck up large areas and have more utility but Fighters are basically Revengence level even without enhancement and most monsters laugh at the average man portable firearm but if you swing an enchanted sword hard enough you can still fuck them up

>>51015276
Enchanted armor > bullets
Enchanted armor = enchanted weapons

Then you just say the enchantment process doesn't work on guns for whatever reason. Maybe there are too many moving parts in a gun for the enchantment to function, or just straight up no one has been able to adjust the old enchantments properly for the newly developed weapons.

If its expensive enough, then its only going to be in the hands of a few elite (like PCs). So to the average person and for most soldiers, guns are still the best you can hope for. But PCs who actually have enchanted gear for one reason or another are like small mobile tanks.

>>51010365
Do you have notes for this? I wanted to do something similar myself.

>>51015342
This is my solution. Knight armor is just as effective, if not more, at stopping bullets as Kevlar. Why? Why not, just go with it for the sake of the aesthetic.

>>51015514
Unfortunately I lost the notes I made on the setting when my last laptop shit itself
Really all you have to do is look at Eberron's starting point as taking place just after WW1 then advance forward I decided that things didn't progress as quickly so it took a little longer to advance to a modern level
Anyway after you hash out the setting details just pick a system to run it in that can support modern weapons and tech as well as magic and mosters

>>51015276
A combination of the capacity to acquire superhuman attributes through hard and grueling(sometimes very specific) work, enchanting items with powerful effects being expensive in every way, monsters needing to be put down by said expensive enchantments lest they be free to cause untold amounts of damage and culture.

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>>51014960
And then there is this faggot

Absolutely
every
single
last
damn
fucking
thing
that
happens
everywhere
always
no matter what
has a damn scientific explanation.

your love of mystical magical bullshittery that has no explanation is just stupid willfully remaining stupid. In a modern setting with scientists, scholars, experts, and professionals will definitely figure out what makes a demon tick and what makes a zombie get right back up.

Seriously this "lol I don't have to explain shit because its magic" is the reason fantasy has been complete shit for years.

>>51015330
I like this aspect, it goes back to the old Iron disrupts magic thing.

But even in more modern eras steel plates would be expensive to have around and ordinary people still would not have it very often. So the city police wearing steel plate might be a special deterrent against mages casting wildly around town.

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>>51015919
*tips fedora*
Nice to see such a euphoric fellow who understands that magic isn't real and science has to reign supreme in every setting, even fictional ones.

>>51015276
Now I wonder, if we can have ninjas, would there be that many lumbering knights around?

>>51014960
And this shit is what happened to modern fantasy as a whole

>>51014960
So to you Bewitched, I Dream of Genie, and Sabrina the Teenage Witch are excellent examples of modern fantasy?

>>51016017
Not having the knight be lumbering would help with their numbers.

>>51015994
>anon makes a completely logical and reasonable argument
>lol *tips fedora* kek
Not even that anon but hang yourself if you think this is a real argument

>>51016155
"I don't want magic to be magic because science" is hardly a logical and reasonable argument.
A big part of magic is the fact that it's fucking mystical.

>>51016172
It literally isn't though. Magic was just the catch-all term for shit people couldn't understand. The purpose of science is to give explanations to things. This isn't even touching on the fact that saying "lol its magic i don't have to explain shit" is a fucking lazy excuse for bad worldbuilding

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>>51016017
>>51015276
If you look at the Naruto setting, where everyone is a Wizard AND a Ninja, there are in fact Samurai. And they are in fact, widely and justly feared, and basically considered not to be fucked with. Because while Ninjas use Chakra for Ninja magic and shit, Samurai use Chakra to power fucking chakra power armor, and have fucking chakra light sabers.

>>51016201
I take it that your interpretation of gods is just to make them super advanced aliens, too, right? Even though, by its very nature, the divine is supposed to transcend mortal knowledge and existence?

>>51016236
>implying these implications
Yeah sure, whatever you want to believe

>>51015919
I'm sure they'll rigorously test and derive the natural laws that govern apparently supernatural entities and phenomena. I think it's reasonable to say that these laws might not so closely resemble the laws of physics and biology with which we, in the real world, are familiar.

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I feel as if there's room for science and magic to be happily married. Solomonic and Hermetic philosophy are a thing, after all.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism

McFucking educate yourselves

>>51016155
It's the current version of "If you do not agree with me then you are X" argument that means I said this therefore you have to shut up now.

Sort of like calling someone a racist and then they are required to stop talking completely because the R word was said.

Now here, if they say anything anon does not like, call them fedorafags and then everything they think and say is instantly invalid.

>>51016233
Meanwhile the samurai that do appear in the story are two mooks that could not survive 2 minutes against a 12 year old.

>>51016292
The 12 year old had plot armor powers, Naruto after all is the epitome of a great concept/setting driven into the ground by a writer who lost his fucking mind/had no idea what he was doing

>>51016236
No you dumb ass.

A god can still be a god, but the understanding is that the god is a real and active force, and that power actually has an opinion or agenda, and so part of the scientific understanding and practise would include methods of convincing power to work for you.

That's what the anon means by scientific understanding. If the world is composed of period elements, or classical elements, there is still a scientific understanding of how these elements interact to create matter and reactions. "Because magic" is lazy. Explain the magic, so long as it's internally consistent to the world, not necessarily our own. Is magic the overlapping and bleeding of dimensions? Then there will be a science of the study of these dimensions, their interactions, and how to evoke such effects in a reliable and repeatable process. They'll even come up with scholarly names like World-lensing. Rarely will it straight up be called "magic"

>>51016321
So you're saying that midichlorians are superior to the force being mysterious? That over-explaining concepts somehow makes for better world building? You must have loved Prometheus.

>>51003262
Just say it. Dresden files did a good job on the kitchen sink, while the Iron druid did a bad job.

>>51016305
You do realize that one of the 12 year olds in this setting is ninja jesus right?

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Here, rate some of my ideas for explaining away some stuff:

>Have Magic?
>Get Monsters

I'm stealing this from Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, the two from the 3DS. In both games, despite all the power Pokemon have, it still leads to the creation of ENTITIES of hate and malice from all the run-off. Even the Demi-urge level Pokemon can get wrecked by it.

So I'm thinking the same thing can happen if you have magic in any other setting. Pull a Buffy and let the common people summon demons? You eventually get a Godzilla equivalent coming out from all the left over magic. If it's an every day occurence, where people have Crystall Ball Cellphones and Ignis Stone propelled cars, then the leftover magic will pool and you get beasts appearing from the sewers. This can also lead to the corruption of natural animals, so massive, dinosaur sized iguanas and rodents can appear near magic heavy areas.

Overall, it's a way to nerf magic. A place that goes heavy on it is at risk of incurring the wrath of a Dark Matter or Bitterblack that can ruin the place.

>>51016344
I'm saying that midi-chlorians are the bodily manifestation of the Force, that informs the Cosmic Force. An incredibly Hindu philosophy relating the universe to the body, and the changes of one effecting the other.

The Force was never mysterious in the first place. Originally it was described as an energy field that life creates, it flows and binds all things. Jedi can actually sense and measure the Force, and even discern what side of the Force a person or place attracts. Hell, they can actively train to understand and manipulate the Force in both reliable and repeatable ways. Nothing about that is unexplainable or mysterious. Mystical? Yes. Mysterious? No.

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Some people above mentioned it, but I think they were just looking at it wrong.

>Plate versus Kevlar
>Why not both?

Plate is still heavy and massive. There were lots of reasons it went out of style, and that was one of those. So unless you are in the setting's equivalent of a S.W.A.T. or S.T.A.R.S. team, you're probably not going to get it issued to you. Heck, Kevlar can just take the place of 'Leather' armor and it's useful in that it lets you carry more stuff you could need.

>Swords vs Firearms

If you have magic in the setting, or an equivalent, just do what Star Ocean and Dune does. Monsters have a magic shield around them that helps absorb blows. Modern day Hammers and Swords have been tuned and designed to take on them. Not only that, you could steal from other Sci-fi series like Macross and Evangelion and make people have to hit specific points on top of that.

HOWEVER, once that shield is down, firearms are better at tearing the flesh. They are also good at dealing with people and most low level monsters that you could expect to encounter.

PS, there's a guy here who made a crazy in-depth gun setting here on /tg/. You could take his ruling on the matter.

>Modern guns can enchant the frame to handle different bullet types, but the the bullets themselves are just regular ones.
>Shotguns and old-school guns can load magical ammunition, but that makes them expensive to use.

>>51016344
No OP but again this isn't what he's saying.

Think about the magic system in the Warhammer universe, or even the Nasuverse, everything is spelled out and has it's own sort of logic behind it. It's a force that can be measured and studied but it's still has a few mysteries about it.

Also the force isn't all that mysterious if you understand Taoist concepts past an elementary level.

>>51009191, >>51009292
Apparently they're going in that direction for the FFVII remake; rather then cut large sections of the game out (since it's too much game to combine with modern graphic memory requirements), they're breaking it up into multiple games.

The ENTIRE first game is the Midgar prologue to the main plot of the game.

>>51016361
That isn't a nerf to magic, it just means the world is fucked in the (near)future. Consequences, dire or otherwise, don't stop us from exploiting everything we can, so I doubt it'll have any effect there. They'll probably just blame whatever scapegoat is fashionable at the time and keep on keeping on.

>>51016456
>Plate is still heavy and massive. There were lots of reasons it went out of style, and that was one of those.

No that's not the reason why it went out of use, it went out of use because it couldn't stop bullets. Full-plate isn't actually heavy, it's just expensive.

>>51016456
Technically you also have the situation where some nations wouldn't allow the purchase of firearms past pistols or allowing you to keep the rifle you used while in the military.

>>51011290
>Magic fills so many needs that we've developed technology to deal with.

This is largely setting-dependent.
In the "standard" style D&D setting such as FR, magic is very difficult to learn (the equivalent to being a lawyer or doctor in terms of study) and very expensive, way out of the reach of every day people, and adventurers are hardly examples of a "normal" person unless you're talking like those MMO worlds where they just use magic to be lazy with storytelling.

Technology that is easier to use and in use by EVERYONE rather then the elite who can afford a magic-user's services would definitely be desirable.

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>>51016462
It's more of a reason to stop players from just magicking the problem away. They have to go into dark and dangerous places, get their hands dirty, and actually work to solve a problem. Imagine if Mike Rowe occasionally had to clear out a basement with dog sized rats, or even bigger.

>>51016489
I was under the impression that Plate was still good against bullets, just expensive and required you to train someone for a long time to fight in it properly.

>>51016503
So would enchanted swords and daggers be in vogue? I could see a gangster rapper equivalent flashing daggers in a place like that instead of the Glocks we have here.

>>51016508
Just gotta explain why those same elites and wizards would allow such a thing.

>>51016548
Elites didn't always like technology advancing in real life either, but it did.
Elite types are usually so far up their own asses that they don't even realize change is upon them until it's already HAPPENED.

As for wizards, what do they care?
Even if it's JUST D&D magic, it can do plenty of shit using just study and effort that technology requires a lot of money and bulky shit to replicate, assuming it can replicate it at ALL.

>>51016533
Plate could stop bullets during the later middle-ages and the early renaissance period but gunpowder eventually got more powerful making armor ineffective.

>>51016587
Actually if you read a lot of fiction from the 19th and early 20th century a lot of the elites from that time period loved technology because it made their businesses operate for less money. The people who didn't like technology was actually the working class because they kept losing their jobs.

>>51016533
If you look at countries like European and Asian countries guns are actually quite uncommon whereas things like knives and baseball bats tend to be the weapons of choice for street gangs, till you get to the level of organized crime like the Yakuza but even then you don't find too many guns in those organizations.

>>51015276
In my setting two reasons justify why both gunpowder weapons and swords and steel still exist.

1) Access to magic trivializes firearms. You can fire magic missiles and fireballs which have greater destructive potential than a rifle round.

2) Enchanting a hunk of sharpened steel is a lot more cost efficient than enchanting the several moving parts of a gun. Of course, Magic Bullets exist, but magical firearms in general are incredibly expensive and incredibly rare.
Though mass-producing a gun is possible, mass-producing enchantments aren't because each part must be personally attended to by a wizard for the magic to work.

>>51016548
Maybe wizards are lazy shits and don't want to waste their time doing something simple with magic when they can get a machine to do it for them.

>>51016690
Reminds me of the Ork weaponry they have in Brazil. If actual Dragons occasionally emerged from the Amazon, wouldn't the governments be harder pressed to take away guns?

>>51016711
Guns are good against large groups of people and for taking land. Lots of settings make it clear that Snipers and Assassins are hard counters to Casters.

>>51016739
An armed citizenry is still an issue for nobility, especially in times of war. But another thing that has to be considered is that peasantry/citizenry have never been allowed access to weapons in these nations. Citizens were not permitted to purchase unless they were in the military and these laws carried over into the modern day.

>>51016840
I can see that working today, where governments still try to keep their restrictions going despite the possibility of Demon attacks if we go with the 'Suddenly, Magic' modern fantasy.

But if beasts and monsters were always a thing, either every village is armed and defended, or humanity mostly exists in megacities to be able to handle the big monsters.

>>51016918

I imagine farther from major population centers you see people armed with weapons and better able to handle monsters that happen near the villages/farms while city people tend to lean more on the soldiers/police officers who handle that shit thus you don't see the citizenry of a city armed to the teeth with guns.

How would magic be regulated in an urban setting? what sort of politics would be embroiled regarding the study of magic?

Also, how would each school of magic be treated by society? Would illusion majors be ridiculed much like our gender studies majors?

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>>51016739

How else are we suppose to deal with the local cartel that turned to ancient blood magic and turned themselves into were-jaguars?

>>51017019
Strictly speaking D&D magic? Abjurers would be a school more for engineers I think and essentially be the STEM of magic as barriers and protective wards would be an essential part of a modern day society to keep monsters outside the city.

Necromancers would be doctors as well as an essential part of law enforcement being able to communicate with the dead to find out answers as well as dealing with ghosts and spirits who are haunting/damaging an area or person/people.

Illusion would probably be part of the entertainment industry.

Evocation would also be a STEM like field harnessing elemetal powers for things like engines and what not.

Conjuration would be up there with Necromancy as well as Transmutation.

As far as regulating them? Assuming modern sensibilities you would have laws in place against unlawful use of mind altering spells and such spells/abilities that can breach personal privacy such as reading people's minds. A charm spell would be akin to slipping roofies in someone's drink and special task forces within authoritative bodies would be made to specifically deal with magic users of all sorts and ways made to properly contain them.

>>51016918
I'd vision it like villages in Southern Africa, Lion and Rhino attacks aren't common enough to were they are to great of a problem but they can be an issue from time to time.

>>51017019
I'd imagine I'd work something like the way FMA handles Alchemy. Most of the alchemic research is state-funded but to receive the funding you need to pledge yourself to the service of the country.

>>51017019
Register with the authorities or you're an outlaw, with special divisions dedicated to finding and dealing with those like you. This in no way stops a thriving underworld and black market from existing, but that's the general spiel fed to the masses.

Magic that messes with minds and/or actions, if it exists, is banned by any self-respecting country. Again, doesn't stop those same powers from making use of it whenever they feel they can get away with it. It just isn't kosher in the light of day.

As to those in power. Either they are magical themselves, or very old and very powerful magic keeps them in their positions. Ancient packs with the gods/the land/fey/the heavens/demons/etc work pretty well. Having to fulfill very strict and demanding criteria also works. Anything other than just because.

>>51017281
>Ancient packs with the gods/the land/fey/the heavens/demons/etc work pretty well

No it doesn't. That shits all over any democratic country. We'd revert back to middle-age bullshit of theocracies and monarchies if we have to resort to gods to tell us how to live our lives.

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>>51016918
>humanity mostly exists in megacities to be able to handle the big monsters
Wasn't that basically OD&D's original setting, the bulk of civilization was living in walled fortresses and the players were off exploring ruins in the middle of bumfuck nowhere surrounded by monsters

>>51017364
Then you'll have to settle for mages telling you how to live your life. Having the democratic process be the ritual that keeps the magic strong and working isn't out of the realm of possibilities either. There just needs to be magic or some supernatural whatever keeping the people in power(who may not have magic of their own) in power.

>>51017364
You put too much faith in humanity.

I'd bet more than half the population in the US would willingly throw away their democratic system if Jesus descended from the heavens and proclaim he will make America great again.

>>51017500

Doubt it considering he's a middle eastern jew. As far as it seems they'd rather jesus look like cheeto-benito.

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>>51017500
> Jesus descended from the heavens and proclaim he will make America great again.
He already did

you had to have seen this one coming

>>51017500
That's not saying much, put any charismatic demagogue in the US and the people can be convinced to vote for throwing away their democracy, freedom and privacies bit by bit.

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>>51003183

>>51017383
I know that it was basically Fallout, but I didn't know about that. Neat.

>>51017364
Than democratic countries don't hold packs with gods. Maybe they've forged new ones with the land or something else. Maybe they've pledged themselves to gods who hold democratic-like processes to be sacred.

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>>51017383
>>51017592
Educate thine self on the gonzo bullshit that was THE ORIGINAL D&D SETTING

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>>51000773
It's a horribly underused genre in western media but is everywhere in Japan. Anime alone has tons of examples. It really depends how you want to go about it.

If you want to add magic to our real world setting in a *realistic* manner, you basically have to rewrite history back to the point where it became widespread and do a lot of speculation from there. The modern world would look vastly different as magic and technology would inevitably merge as mankind tries its damn hardest to metagame the hell out of it. Magic would be most likely taken for granted and seen as another field of science as opposed to mysticism. Mana powered driverless cars and magically strengthened armor plates would just be some examples. Makes for an incredibly interesting alternate history setting and is great fun to explore both philosophically and from a gaming standpoint but requires a lot of work and a good grasp of history to make effective and believable.

If you want to make a modern fantasy setting from scratch, go nuts. You can hand wave as much of the technicalities and historical inaccuracies if you wanted to. At that point it's just normal world building. The biggest challenge would be to establish how does magic stack up to technology? Would redundant systems coexists or would one negate the need of the other? For example, would firearms even exist in a world where a battlemage can propel a stone as fast as a bullet? Would a civilization even need airplanes if they could simply levitate an airship with magic? It all comes down to how available magic is and how hard it is to wield. If magic is easy to use the setting would be magic predominant with technology playing a supporting role. If it was only available to the few or the elite, like in FMA, technology would proceed more or less like it does in our world. Soldiers would still need guns and tanks to fight wars and mages would play supporting or specialized roles. Star Wars with its Jedi would be a similar example.

>>51017636
>>51017636
>It's a horribly underused genre in western media but is everywhere in Japan. Anime alone has tons of examples.

The problem with modern fantasy in anime is its overcliche'd trite shit with no proper framework or worldbuilding to fill in the plotholes.

To Aru Majutsu no Index has wizards and espers duking off in a world where the rest of the population don't even believe magic and super powers exist.

Fate Stay Night is Japanese WoD, and just as equally retarded in terms of worldbuilding and rules (which gets broken regularly through loopholes).

>>51017706
Fate Stay Night kind of has that pulp story telling idea that you can basically break rules by putting enough effort into something. Actually that's kind of true for all anime... Holy shit Anime is modern pulp.

>>51017448
>Having the democratic process be the ritual that keeps the magic strong and working

So just exactly like American politics then?

>>51017636
I think a proper method of mixing science and magic in an modern fantasy is to limit Magic into a quantifiable science, that still follows several metaphysical laws and doesn't exactly perform miracles.

Think the Law of Conservation in FMA, or the magic in DC comics (magic doesn't do miracles - it does trades, barters, conditions and deals. everything has a price)

>>51010365

If you ask me, they're two distinct subgenres of the same thing, with one merely being a top down version of the other. Like Lord of the Rings (built from the ground up leading up to the setting) compared to Forgotten Realms (ancient history written after the core setting is established).

>>51017787
There just needs to be something powering those in charge(even if they rotate every x number of years) that is not at all reliant upon mages and their power or else mages will be those in charge. It in no way needs to be perfect or tamper-proof(there's no real fun to be had with that), but it does need to exist.

>>51008007

The one thing that they never scientifically explain in EL are the souls of the Ended and Broken Lords, and whether they are indeed souls controlling dust to ensure their corporeal presence, or dust programmed to emulate their personalities. I always found that neat.

>>51017853

I don't think every instance will have mages immediately making a power grab. I imagine there are just as many people who can't cast a single fireball but have the charisma and authority to bring to heel or their side those that do the same way you get scientist and academics on your side. Basically, having guys like Enstein building the bomb for your country instead of using his knowledge of making such a weapon to forge one of his own.

>>51017881
This is true if spell-casting is a long and involved ritual with many mages and extremely rare reagents necessary for the really impressive stuff. In settings where mages are walking demigods or worse, this is something muggles would tell themselves to feel better. Never forget that while a scientist can design and build you artillery, mages *are* the artillery. The impact this fact would have on peoples psyche cannot be underestimated.

>>51017636
Which is why anime is infinitely and objectively superior to western visual media (movies,comics,ect...)

>>51017820
Really magic just needs a set of rules that it obeys like the magic from 40K. It's why I like the concept of magic being this energy that comes from another plane of existence and that most spells are just shaping the energy to get an effect.

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>>51017965
You don't even need to make magic ritualistic all you need to do is give your walking artillery piece as you put it some kind of ammo whether that be mana, spell slots, exhaustion or whatever
OR you could say that your fantasy warriors are also walking weapons of war, not the average line soldier but the capital W Warriors who can get around magic by basically being just as superheroic as the wizard

In the case of the first scenario you can take out a mage when he exhausts himself and in the case of the second the Kings and ruling class could be Warriors or employ warriors

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I much prefer a modern fantasy to actually be inspired by modern myths and set in modern times rather than what are I feel, cop out settings, like a medieval fantasy advancing to the modern age or the modern age being influenced by classical myths.

>>51018266
It all comes down to the simple fact that in superpowered settings, those with superpowers are the movers and shakers of the world. Whether they sit on fancy chairs, wearing fancy headgear or not is irrelevant.

>>51015919
Magic is only good when scientists get triggered by it because they can't figure out a consistent way to measure it.

>>51018591
Then just treat it as a Supers setting
You have crazy Wizards doing crazy experiments for good or ill, brave heroes who go out and defend the world/kingdom, and the occasional monster attack on a populated area

I think your only problem is you can't envision a world where those with power don't seek political power or a world where magic is a mundane fact of life like electricity and not an instant I win forever button

>>51018668
>>51018591
And player characters are, in most games already either supposed to be or are on their way to becoming the movers and shakers of the world
In a traditional fantasy setting the wizards don't all rule the world why would they in a modern fantasy setting, plus this is your own fictional setting you can do whatever you want it doesn't have to be 100% accurate to the real world, just say wizards don't run everything, if that grates on your autistic nerves then I don't think fantasy is for you man

>>51015276
Dune: Shields that only stop fast going things, making melee weapons viable, hell, even bows.

Magical Armor that can stop bullets despite beeing lightweight could work aswell.

Weeb Fightan Magic could work too, in Modern Fantasy its realy upt to your imagination.

Personally i like to run with the Dune idea, if the shields are magic or mundane is up to anyones liking, armor mostly results out of the need for melee combat (guns arent shit tho, just not that much better anymore, shields can overload)

>>51015265
I love this sorta stuff, that busy lived in weeb style works well for backdrops.

>>51014960
I think you are just going in a direction that is equally unacceptable.
Because in a premise such as what yo uwould prefer there is one thing that always happens: Magitek.
Technology is Technology and Magic is Magic, Shadowrun does this well, Eberron does this not well.
Magic shouldnt just be the "thingst echnology cant do fixed by magic", magic should work differently and do fundamentally different things than technology, instead of beeing a stand in for technology.

In Shadowrun of course you got scientists exploring magic, in a Magitek setting scientists are replaced by wizards, which isnt the same thing.

>>51016456
No.
Plate got out of style because it wasnt sufficient against the ever developing firearmrs that had a high range and good armor piercing quality.
There were times when plate was used against bullets and please stop the whole "plate is heavy" nonsense.

Landsknechts wore tons of armor that was professionaly manufactured, they fought on foot and not from horseback and it didnt encumber them.
Knights plate was made for a specific person and thus had the weight perfectly spread out across the body.
Plate Armor simply wasnt good enaugh to waste resources on.

However if there still were melee weapons then we would still use plate armor. Germanys police uses Chainmail due to an increase in Axe and Knife attacks.

>Dune
i agree.

>>51018668
>>51018718
Like I said, in a setting with superpowers, those who have them will be the people who matter and the people who matter will have them. This isn't limited to wizards blasting off spells. Heroes who can perform crazy shit on a consistent basis also count for all this. I don't care where the bullshit comes from but those who have it are the ones with actual power in the setting, whether they decide to sit in chair, stand behind it whispering or simply show up wherever and expect(rightfully) to have their whims met.

>>51018668
>a world where magic is a mundane fact of life like electricity and not an instant I win forever button
I was talking about settings where mages are demi-gods and worse. One where magic is neither fast, easy nor stackable can have muggles be very relevant.

>I think your only problem is you can't envision a world where those with power don't seek political power
I'm really just sick of settings that misidentify gods by calling them wizards/mages/sorcerers/casters and have muggles ruling the majority of shit just because that's how *we* do it, when the easy thing to do is have them be or backed by *whatever flavor of bullshit the setting has going on* when that's precisely what many of ours did to claim and keep power.

>>51019067
>misidentify gods
>misidentify

Not even in mythology you find in our non-fictional cultures do gods have the same sort of powers. Shit, the Greek pantheon was literally just "Giant fucking human cunts (and their offspring) with superpowers". Look at Zeus and Hera and tell me they weren't basically real humans with some serious fucking issues.

It's bizarre to claim your idea of what godhood entails is the ONLY CORRECT one. It's bizarre to think there even IS a "correct" one. I, personally, think it's more interesting to have terrifyingly powerful entities that have an actual reason to engage with far lesser beings because they're not just a force of nature or an arbitrary "I Say So" Engine. I think it's especially interesting if they are (indirectly) bound to a set of rules as well, in order to retain their position.

>>51019147
But you shackle these 'terrifyingly powerful entities' precisely because you know full well that were they to have their full agency, their wants, desires and whims would have terrifying consequences for those 'far lesser beings' and they would run roughshod over the whole setting. At least you have the courtesy to explain that you've neutered them and don't just let them run around unfettered yet inexplicably playing second fiddle to muggles.

I also don't believe there even exists just one correct way to portray gods. I just think that many casters(those able to rewrite reality on a whim) fit the bill of demigod or more and would damn well be viewed as such by the peasants that surround them.

>>51019345
I mentioned the silly idea of "correct portrayal" of a god because you wrote "misidentify gods". You're free to have a preference as to how this or that is portrayed, but please try to avoid coming across as believing your opinion on characterization of something which is more a concept than an actual character is somehow objectively correct.

My main problem is that having gods simultaneously willing AND able to run roughshod over a setting is, at best, uninteresting and at worst a complete clusterfuck where you can't ground any characters into because it's so hectic. A story where magic is a prominent feature needs, if nothing else, internal consistency of some sort. Any sort. A world where everything can instantly end or be solved with a metaphorical snap of the fingers, and it's obvious that this could happen even right at the very start of the story, is a world for children or delusional people.

If the story progresses in a fashion where powers consolidate where they COULDN'T before, thereby forming a threat, that's fine as long as the reason can't be sloppily summarized as "Because God says so". Or you can write a story exactly like that, but don't expect to have it treated as anything other than a joke. Though perhaps, if you have the skill, you can make it an exercise in fatalism and actually make it have some philosophical merit in hindsight.

>>51019345
>>51019475
So, in short, I don't actually disagree with most of your points. A setting where gods without any imposed limits (excluding self-imposed ones) are portrayed as playing second fiddle to the weaker masses WITHOUT A (sufficient) REASON is a very shallow setting.

>>51019475
I think we're sorta, kinda in agreement here. Mostly.

I can't wrap my head around settings where godlike beings are able to run roughshod over a setting and yet don't, with the only answer given for this being *just because*. It drives me mad. I don't even give superhero comics a pass even though it's all mostly regurgitated vomit written by incompetents who worship at the altar of status-quo. Either you fetter that shit or you follow the rabbit down it's mad hole.

In short, I dislike settings that try to have their cake and eat it to when it comes to powerful(magical) beings.

>>51019345
What the fuck is a muggle?

>>51019499
Yes to all of this. But not just limited to gods, any powerful beings really.

>>51019556
Oh so you just hate fun and have no imagination
congratulations you're gonna fit right in here
have fun playing your Game of Dongs no fantasy shit game where the most magical thing in the setting is the fact that your character doesn't have fucking dysentery

>>51019602
I just hate it when powerful beings are not allowed to have real effects on the setting. It's almost as if they were a poorly tacked on piece of the setting, a hyperbolic clusterfuck that the author didn't have the balls to either reign in, or simply be allowed to fully be a part of the world.

The fuck do you mean >What the fuck is a muggle?

You're not getting a (you) out of me that easily.

>>51000773
It's a nasty genre.

>>51019587
I can't imagine how anyone could end up needing a (you) this badly, but here you go.

File: Royal Bank Of 4chan One You Note.jpg (1MB, 3840x2160px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 3840x2160px

>>51019587
You really earned it fella

File: you can't be this retarded.jpg (28KB, 219x219px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 219x219px

>>51019587

>>51016344
Midi-chlorians did not grant the jedi force powers, they were merely bacteria that thrived in force rich environments the way fungus thrivesin damp environments. People don't seem to get this.

>>51020512
It was a poorly explained aspect of the setting for something that needed no further elaboration. We were well aware of what the Force was in relatively loose terms and had an idea for it's limits within the story. That idiot writers did what idiot writers do in the EU and turned it into dragon ball z: space magic edition is another story.

>>51015459
What anime is this from?

>>51021067

Project A-Ko/B-Ko. Basically a story about two super powered lesbians trying to win the affections of their friend C-Ko.

A-Ko (the one running on the missles) has super human strength and endurance and B-Ko is basically Tony Stark creating inventions to help her fight A-Ko up to and including wearing a suit of power armor.

There's actually two movies with them. This one where some weird aliens invade and kidnap C-Ko and another one in space where she is used to summon some Universe ending Dragon.