/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

Someone mentioned Scion last thread, and that made me actually look at the books I've had sitting on my hard drive for a year or so.

So is Scion any good? It's got some interesting concepts, but is it clunky as shit?

>>50921545
>How often does combat occur in your games?
In the last two sessions, there were two instances of "combat".
1. The Obrimos getting the drop on a Huntsman and killing him with one punch
2. The Obrimos deciding to completely dislocate someone's arm when he was escorting her off his property

However that was more of a historical game.
I'm moving it to the modern day however due to player issues with coming to terms with the setting.
So now there will be people with guns, and the desire to use them.

So I'm expecting a sharp uptick in the amount of violence, either from the PCs, or by NPCs in response to PC bullshit.

>>50921623

Scion 1e is terribad, mechanically, and the setting basically doesn't exist beyond its basic premise.

Scion 2e is shaping up to be a more solid game, but since it has an actual setting it's going to push folks who had imagined a different setting over 1e's threadbare outline away.

Secrets of the Covenants PDF ?

>begging<

>>50921751
Is it even worthy getting? Every review i've seen regarding it states it's utter shit, from broken and untested mechanics to horrible story settings using unreadable fonts. And this is coming from some hefty NWoD fanboys I know.

Can someone sell me on Forsaken? It's the one CofD line that's never clicked for me, and feels more like a urban fantasy game about shamans who happen to turn into wolves sometimes instead of a horror game about, y'know, beasts. I don't see the personal horror or any sort of obvious social metaphor in it.

Help me out?

>>50921818
It's pretty good, it sounds like your fanboys are stupid.

>>50921623

Scion 1e is a mechanical trainwreck with little attention paid to mythological accuracy but a fun premise that makes people look past all of that. Scion 2e should be amazing, but isn't out yet.

I'm dying to make four different trans Netjer characters.

>>50921818

Carthian chapter is the best one, which was unexpected. I still wish it was a book of settings but overall it's pretty good.

Any book that isn't Thousand Years of Night or the Dark Eras Companion is doomed to slide off me, I think.

>>50921895
I'd be more interested in hearing about a non trans character out of you. Or one where their gender identity and/or sexual preference wasn't a defining trait, whether they're straight, gay, queer, bi, asexual, or what have you.

>>50921743
>>50921895

Aight, looks like I'll wait for 2e then. Here's hoping it comes out on schedule

>>50921950

Look to the last seven years of my roleplaying hobby, then. The Changeling I had so much fun with was a cis man, for instance.

Heaven forbid someone queer explore that space in their fiction.

>>50921950
What's WoD without gender-politic conflict?

>>50921743
Scion isn't absolute shit, mechanically. It just... It works best for a very VERY narrativist game - if you, as the storyteller, are looking at the mechanics to figure out what you can do, it's gonna suck.

If you, as the storyteller, are making everything up by the seat of your pants, and let the players bullshit their actions through ("I climb the rampaging stone hellbeasty using divine balance and pull the cursed sword animating him out of his belly" "Roll a clinch to pull it out."), while you wear a shit-eating just as planned grin every time they figure a way out of something you had no idea about, then it'll be amazing.

My play group still insists that cows all praise Aten, after wrangling Pan/Satan into submission by rounding up the cattle of the damned.

Basically, Scion 1 is a basic premise and a vague framework on which to hang your stories. Storyteller is the best possible name for the guy running the show. Acknowledge that premise and don't get hung up, mechanically, on anything. Not even Fertility. Or anything else that should be good but came out as crap.

Scion 2e looks like it'll be nice, but I've seen white wolf fuck obvious things up before, so I'm not holding my breath.

>>50921879
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/werewolf-the-forsaken/426076-sell-me-on-the-tribes
you don't seem to want to be sold

>>50921984
Honestly everytime I picture the writers for WoD I see Hellsing abridged Rip Van Winkle..

>>50921879
That's because nWoD messily divorced werewolves from their previous social metaphors.

>>50921721
>Mage_Master_Race.jpg

>>50921967
Hey, of course you can explore it. But it's also all you talk about.

>>50922036
>talk about history as fertile ground for roleplaying and narrative, and viewing both CofD and other gamelines through the lens of numerous time periods
>talk about my fondness for the metaphors I see within Wraith and Changeling, and how the themes in those and other games resonate with me
>shitpost in damn near every single thread about whatever comes up
>mention being trans and wanting similar characters
>WOW DO YOU EVER SHUT UP ABOUT GENDER STUFF

>>50921545
>How often does combat occur in your games?
Like once every two months in the Beast game I'm in.

>>50922025
Homoerotic fanfiction?

>>50921879
I could see it working as a social metaphor for gang life. As far as personal horror goes, you're a threat to everything you love if you lose control and just by existing you put friends and family in greater danger of being fucked with by spirits.

>>50922026
>>50921721
>Obrimos
>Mage_Master_Race.jpg

Possibly, but not Obrimos after the abomination that is Forces and Prime in 2e.

Acanthus, on the other hand, with their new and improved Time and Fate, are in a class by themselves.

>>50922125
>Beast game
I'm sorry

If I change spell scale from number of subjects into area of effect and I fail the attack roll what happens? Does a magical shockwave go out that somehow misses everyone in the spell radius?

>>50921545
every few sessions at the very least in my hunter game. Sometimes as much as ever 4/5 sessions depending on how blood thirsty the group is. Some bad experiences have caused them to be far more cautious, they recently had their first death because they engaged two very tacticool pure with zero preparation.

>>50922212
>Prime
>being bad
wat?

Do you not know how to play blue?

>>50922212
All the arcana are hideously powerful if you get creative/sadistic.

>>50922378
I'd say it scatters in a random direction, like a grenade.

Less random if it was a spell with paradox on it, of course...

>>50921545
You forgot IGNORE ASPEL

>>50922026
It wasn't really that surprising, given that she had Cheap Shot to remove Defence, martial arts to increase damage, and a Forces 2 spell to give +Potency in damage to her unarmed attacks.

And the "guy", this being 1860 in the middle of London, had no armour.

So how common are proximi supposed to be?
Every time I think of using one as a GM I keep thinking they're supposed to be rare.
But if they're basically artificial half-awakened which can be passed down biologically, wouldn't it make sense for them to be quite populous?

>>50922475
And have it blow up in your face if you get a dramatic failure.

>>50922820

I think of them as the 'middle management' of awakened society. Uncommon but you're not really surprised to see one.

>>50921879
On this note I kind of wish someone could sell me on mage the awakening and beast, I like the prospects of both but I feel like I'm missing something and its driving me nuts

>>50922088
Anon is not speaking about your posting habits. Anon is speaking of your characters.

>I want to play a gay/trans man

is different in outlook and emphasis to

>I want to play a locksmith

Locksmith implies a certain skillset and outlook. Anyone can be gay or trans, it doesn't explain anything about them. Saying otherwise perpetuates ugly stereotypes about queer folk.

>he's gay, so obviously he has four dots in Crafts (Interior Design) and Addiction and Bad Childhood as flaws.

>>50923077

Mage only clicked for me after I read their historical settings, Mage Noir and To The Strongest. Maybe try that?

>>50923136

And again, I've never played a trans character except for maybe one elf who had a weird thing with ancestor worship.

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WTF Thyrsus

>>50923141
>mention being trans and wanting similar characters
Yes and I want to play characters with IBS

>>50922608
>Martial Arts
>1800
It better be Bartitsu

>>50923169
I want to play a schizophrenic with dubious hygiene and co-morbid drug problems. I don't get enough of that in my everyday life, as a schizophrenic with dubious hygiene and co-morbid drug problems. I personally feel that Onyx Path doesn't do enough to raise awareness and FORCE inclusion in every LGS of people with serious mental illnesses and equally serious substance abuse problems.

>>50923180
That period saw an enormous surge in popularity of women fighting in underground bare-knuckle boxing matches around the north and north-east. It was not unheard of for the rougher women of that age to beat the piss out of larger men. Unladylike, perhaps, but who cares about propriety when there's a pot of 3 guineas?

>>50923250
...What kind of drugs are you on?

>>50923250
Onyx Path aren't even really progressive. They're fucking fascist pigs for not even thinking of that. And it's called a STORYTELLING game people, don't have fucking stupid rules and setting shit when you should be telling me how to storytell, or mocking dirty reactionaries.

>>50923274
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartitsu
>Not using Sherlock Holmes Martial Art
Also you better do more old timey boxing stuff, trips, headlock throws, dirty boxing, they even used to kick.

>>50923296
Resperidone, Cipramil, Epilim because my doctor is a pusher. Alcohol, Cannabis, handfuls of hallucinogenic mushrooms and 30+ cups of coffee a day for recreation. I tried speed but it turned my brain to broken glass and the comedown lasted a full day of pain and anger. I managed to quit cigarettes, pretty proud of that.

I'm only small time compared to some other patients I've known. One guy hot-knifed valium pills and started hearing God, so he ended up in the room next to me. I met another guy who'd been on the Methadone program for 16 years, but shhhh don't tell the Health Minister.

>>50923274
>>50923326
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xubhxl_fight-club-a-history-of-violence_sport

This is relevant. It's narrated by Sean Bean, and, spoiler, he survives to the end.

>>50923347
>Cannabis
>I managed to quit cigarettes, pretty proud of that.

hmm...

>>50923390
Nah, it's a good thing. Cutting your weed with tobacco is like adding horse manure to your chocolate, destroying flavour and enjoyment just in order to make it stretch further. Too many bogans walk around screeching
>I'M GONNA SMASH SOME CUNT IF I DON'T GET A CONE
...when in reality, their bodies are crying out for the nicotine they mix with. Unable to recognise the true source of their discomfort, they conclude that Cannabis is "addictive" and they are experiencing "withdrawal".

Far, far worse are the Bogans who "pep it up a bit" by spraying insecticide on their Cannabis.

>I call it Venom, man, coz once it bites ya, ya throw up

>>50923471
>spraying insecticide on their Cannabis.

See, that's something they could have published rules for if they just cut out all those stupid sidebars. Things that are real. Things that are street. I bet they haven't even published rules for being intoxicated on Lean, despite it being one of the most popular recreational substances in America.

>>50923274
>women fighting in underground bare-knuckle boxing matches

please do explain this one. I have need for academic research purposes

>>50923529
>>50923384
http://fightland.vice.com/blog/gussie-freeman-slasher-of-the-ropewalk
Trying to find this other article about a fight that went on for over 100 rounds

>>50923664
Ah here it is.
http://fightland.vice.com/blog/death-in-the-ring-a-120-round-grudge-match-ends-in-horror
Old timey boxing was a rough time.

>>50923136
>Anyone can be gay or trans, it doesn't explain anything about them. Saying otherwise perpetuates ugly stereotypes about queer folk.
>he's gay, so obviously he has four dots in Crafts (Interior Design) and Addiction and Bad Childhood as flaws

And, of course, the character is absolutely *fabulous*!

>>50923805
The Gay is a walking stereoty- I mean, "Archetype", so he's also going to need a small white dog and a large home containing large amounts of male torso busts. He trained to be a Gay for a long time, his father was a Gay and taught him all their mystical arts before he was defeated in battle by Bulldyke, the last of the wereaurochs, at the Shrine of The Celestial Rainbow on top of Stonewall Mountain. The Pekinese has his own stats, as well as a tragic backstory - he watched his own parents get burned alive in front of him by an outlaw motorcycle gang, and he turned to a life of dogfighting in order to survive, and grow stronger. He has joined the Gay in order to help him defeat the Burning Ring Motorcycle Club. Together they quest for a really good nightclub that serves a decent daiquiri and has a dealer who doesn't think Mitsubishi is a type of car, do you dig me girlfriend? Mmmmmm-hmmmmm.

>>50923529
Check out the documentary mentioned above;

>http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xubhxl_fight-club-a-history-of-violence_sport

It is as it sounds. Fight Club, but with pissed off Celtic women in long skirts beating the living shit out of each other. Men screaming in tongues. Fried chicken smell of sweat. Ooh, and they served beer.

A more civilized time. I'd be proud if any of my daughters could break a cunt's jaw.

>>50923077
Awakening is X-Files/Kolchak the Night Stalker cryptobullshit conspiracy horror, only you can make reality floob.

Speaking of Awakening, are these house rules I found any good? The Proximi thing seems clever, but I'm not sold on the Yantra system

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1bpr1EjQ4RfZ5dz-tXmJJ93P2f_l7fUIUwpPLWs9Z-SI/edit#

>>50913641
I feel like you're looking at the setting wrong, but >>50920830 basically says everything I would.

How did 2e not go far enough? What you're doing seems to be completely ignoring that and tossing it out, which is just odd if you feel they didn't go far enough. The Tribes are pretty focused already, and the Sacred Prey aspect gives them a really good, narrow focal point as opposed to simply "adapting to technology" and "obsessing over territory". Werewolves can come up with new ways of looking at the world, sure, but that doesn't really preclude working in the Tribes.

>It also means humans spread to the far corners of the world, where werewolves undergo the First Change and there's no Pure to brainwash them nor Forsaken to teach them. This in turn leads to a huge rise in Ghost Wolf numbers.
If I'm not mistaken, a lot of them are brought around by the help of Spirits.

>Honestly I might take it even further and go with Pendragon's homebrew version of Tribes/Pure where he makes it so the Pure don't exist and Tribes are more akin to Protectorates/Small Wolfy Nations.
I haven't read it, but honestly that seems like a bad idea. Neat, sure, but infighting among the tribes makes it harder to play a group game. And there already *is* infighting among the tribes to begin with. I mean, look at Iraq.

>>50921879
There's the gang and cult stuff other people have pointed out, but there's also the rage. Forsaken is a game about rage and power, and letting that overtake you. Werewolves are also kind of workaholics. It's about balancing life and responsibility.
But even then, does it *need* to be a social metaphor? The personal horror comes in that you go insane and murder everything if you dip into your power too much, but if you don't dip into it, even more people might die. It has some of the most horrifying themes, because in Werewolf the monster is you.

>>50921950
>>50923136
I'm interested in hearing about a non-straight, non-white, non-male, non-cis character from Anon.

Why should someone have to play something they're not comfortable with just because you feel "queer" is too much of a type but have no problem with other labels?

>Anyone can be gay or trans, it doesn't explain anything about them. Saying otherwise perpetuates ugly stereotypes about queer folk.
Yeah, I'm sure you're so concerned about that.

Jakki is clearly in whatever the trans equivalent of babydyke mode is, but seeing people act like that's badwrong is so fucking frustrating. Oh no, someone wants to use RPGs to explore aspects of their identity in a safe space (tw: I said "safe space"), that's terrible. Her characters aren't just The Gay, it's a defining trait in a specific way, that informs their identity. I would much rather see someone who's mythical resonance is that they reinterpret a myth as a transgender narrative over "well, he's really good at picking locks".

Especially when as this very conversation shows it's almost impossible for disenfranchised minorities to divorce their status as minorities from their lives. Straight people get to bring their Straightness everywhere, but no one else does.

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>>50923529
>>50923274

>>50925083
As someone who knows what a Kimura is supposed to look like, that terrible technique triggers me.

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>>50925083
>using assassins creed to showcase some historical event/technique

Thats like asking a hipster in a Che Guevara t-shirt for a fair and balanced overview of communism

>>50921950
>>50925055
>Anyone can be gay or trans, it doesn't explain anything about them.

This.

Not because 'oh noes trans' or ''oh noes cis', bt because it really isn't as important as who and what the character is as a person who is stuck in this world with these powers is.

Like the guy who was honking his horn at the gay guys kissing. Their response?
"What, you cant handle two guys kissing?"
"NO, IT'S BECAUSE YOU'RE DOING IT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE GODDAMN ROAD!"

Sometimes it really isn't about your sexuality.

>>50923347
>Alcohol, Cannabis, handfuls of hallucinogenic mushrooms and 30+ cups of coffee a day for recreation. I tried speed but it turned my brain to broken glass and the comedown lasted a full day of pain and anger.
Have you considered possibility that the sorry state you are in is caused by your retarded lifestyle?

>>50924325
Personally I don't like it. There are completely unnecessary changes, some of which make Mages even stronger.

>>50925142
I'm not sure it's supposed to be one.
>>50925162
Anon, it's a gif of a woman bareknuckle boxing in a discussion about women doing that thing. Also, that shirt isn't part of your capitalist system, MAN, he made it himself.

>>50925197
Except that it kind of is? Again, it's pretty much impossible to get away from being a minority in this world. You can make jokes about people kissing in the middle of the road, but gays get shit on wherever they kiss. People get harassed. There are married couples afraid to hold hands in public. You can argue "that's not important", but I'm flat out going to tell you that you're wrong. That people can't be open about who they are is massively important.

Shit, look at the Goddamned Overwatch Christmas comic. People flipped their shit because a character is a lesbian. It wasn't even a major aspect of her, but people still flipped out. But no one flipped out that Widowmaker was in a heterosexual marriage. No one cares that Mercy is hetero.

And, to bring this back around
>because it really isn't as important as who and what the character is as a person who is stuck in this world with these powers is.
Not only can gays be people stuck in this world with these powers, the character concept that set anon off is literally focused on her powers. It's a reimagining of a traditional male fertility God as a transwoman.

It's already a character that's more creative and interesting compared to "I'm a Scion of Thor and I shoot lightning and punch things".

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>>50925385
>Che
>A real communist
Fucking moderate

>>50925385
So she's Kuan Yin. That's totally creative.

Of course, if you actually knew your shit, you would have known Kuan Yin was originally a male deity of war, who became the goddess of mercy after Buddha enlightened him.

Yeah, totally creative and unique transwoman deity you have there.

Well, except for Vishnu, Ishi Kore Dome, Inari (yet another transgendered fertility deity), and Ananda.

>>50925385
>but people still flipped out
I'd argue that's mostly because a shitload of porn suddenly became canon-breaking.

>>50925441
>Stalin
>A real communist
Authoritarian state capitilism is about as far from communism as you can get.

>>50925458
>abloobloo
You're sort of undoing your own argument there, aren't you? Also, Kuan Yin is a completely different thing. Jakki's concept is more "Osiris as trans narrative", not completely changing the nature of Osiris.
Although frankly with the whole "no dick" thing it comes off better as a transman narrative if you ask me.

Maybe we should all become trans, that way we won't have these discussions ever again

>>50925518
If there was a proper way to do so completely, reverse it flawlessly, and it was cheap, I'd honestly probably try, just to see what it's like.

>>50925500
Not really. Just pointing out that the 'totally unique thing of being a trans-demigod' isn't unique at all, and it doesn't make the character a better character, nor, as you just proved yourself, is it the most important aspect of the character, or even a relevant aspect of the character compared to the fact they are a child of Osiris re-imagined as a fertility deity as opposed to a solar-rebirth deity.

You could completely skip the transgender part and make the character concept clear without it.

>>50925500
Only fucking bourgeoisie scum say Stalin isn't a communist. He was a communist to heart, and slaughtered the dirty capitalists and reactionaries like the scum they are.

You're a fucking traitor to the worker's plight.

>>50925524
If there were a completely reversible and cheap (and painless) way to change physical features period, everyone would try it.
That's how you get the fall of Rapture.

>>50925575
No one said it was totally unique. I said it's more interesting than a typical Scion-as-action-hero concept.
Also, Osiris was a fertility deity, wasn't he? Either way, the "my dick is gone" God being reimagined as a transwoman is more interesting than Bulk Meatslab.

>>50925582
>Capitalism is okay if I do it
Call me when the working class actually matters.

>IGNORE X

he's starting to shit up the thread again, notice?

>>50925728
No, he was not a fertility deity, he was a rebirth deity based on the rising and setting of the sun. And the legends is that his penis is the last part of his body, but it was lost after Set cut him to pieces and scattered them. Isis could not find it, as it was washed down the Nile.

So even less imaginative than you thought it was to begin with.

>>50925230
>Have you considered possibility that the sorry state you are in is caused by your retarded lifestyle?

Have you ever considered my retarded lifestyle might be caused by the sorry state of my mental health?

Oh, I'm sorry, did you think all those homeless people in New York that stand on street corners screeching about the aliens were doing that for tax purposes? Mental illness has comorbidity with a range of poor lifestyle choices. You'd know that if you weren't so gloriously sheltered over the realities of mental health. Good day.

>>50925385
>I'm a Scion of Thor and I shoot lightning and punch things, and by the way, I'm kind of gay

Is still way better than

>I'm GAY and a Scion of Thor

And we are back to mage supremacy.

Seers of the throne in my game are stirring some shit with vamps. In more detail Praetorians are going to slap ordo dracul because one of the players bumped by accident into some mage bs. So I see the consensus is that everyone who gets into conflict with mages is boned so I guess I would have to do some houserulling to level out the playing ground.

But is it really so? If Seers would start pumping more stuff into the fight and other covenants would get invested how would you guys play it out? I'm not planing to have full out war of course

>>50925981
The vamps are dead, all the vamps are dead

>>50925981
Explain the following, using Mage. GO

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cXDgFwE13g

>>50924325
>Speaking of Awakening, are these house rules I found any good?
No.

>>50925981
If the Pentacle find out about it, they might decide to offer the Vamps some help, as they've discovered another Seer power play and want to ruin their plans wherever they can.

>>50922020

Pretty much this

>>50926010
Ech why?

>>50926020
Yeah been thinking about it. Wouldn't such conflict be a great chance for pentacle to knock seers down few pegs without exposing themselfs?

>>50926057
>knock seers down few pegs without exposing themselfs?
Precisely.
Throw a few enhancement spells at some Vampires, tell them not to show them off in front of non-Vamps.
Ask them to get some bio-matter from some targets for some sympathetic links.

They're in deep, but you can at least give them a fighting chance without risking your own safety.

>>50926074
Also aren't seers internal conflicts full of opportunities for vamps to exploit? I would assume average seers is ready for spirit/mage conflict but when presented with idea that maybe I should knife my superior when everyone is focused on something else he would consider it without noticing that idea isn't his?

>>50926199
They're less interesting in working with Vampires on a more equal footing though.
Seers are almost universally backstabbing slavemasters who would sell their own mother for another couple of points of tass.

I mean, if one thought he could get ahead by backstabbing his boss though, and get away with it, he might help the Vamps.

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>>50921545
I'm searching for a system where the players can all play as lolis. How well does WoD work for that?

Pic tangentially related.

>>50926237
Well mages are not somehow immune to dominate or majesty. Sure you probably would have to work hard to have pentacle mage sell out his cabal but as you say seers have very different work ethics.

"OI I should totally damage wards Warmaster set in place"
"Great job priscus! :O"
"I haven't done anything yet...:O"

>>50926303
They have some very effective means to resist dominate or majesty, though.

>>50926303
>Well mages are not somehow immune to dominate or majesty.
No, but they are quite resistive, given both their Power Stat, and defensive powers.

>>50926347
It would be silly if they didn't have those means. It's not like this things should work flawless used on other supernaturals.

But again I'm not big on mage supremacy as I said so I will still probably have to use every kind of whitstand/paradox mechanic in the books to hose them

>>50926385
Indeed, first thing you should do when you know Mages are after you, is mortal-up.

>>50925197
This

The only people that really give a shit about anyone's sexuality are cigfags and moralfags. In a world of privacy and personal freedom,, people REALLY don't give a shit about what you do aslong as it doesn't effect themselves.

Give me a good reason why I shouldn't erase the World of Darkness from existence.

>>50926396

>"What will you do now, Mage, when I'm wearing a suit of armor MADE FROM THE MOST IGNORANT SLEEPERS! Mwahahahahahaha!"

>>50926770

Doing that'll probably take CofD out of existance with it, but I figure most people will call that a fair deal.

>>50925497
People want a controversy to validate their view points. no one really cared. the collective 'meh' from the world is more triggering to the sadsorrysacs than defacement. which proves they were in fact disingenuous about their cause the entire time.

>>50926776
In OWOD you were even able to do that literally

>mage superiority
This chat never learns

Prime 4 enough to make a spell which increases the Reaction costs in an area?

>>50927278
Reach cost not . Fucking Autocorrect

When A Thousand Years of Night will be out people will bitch about Vamp supremacy

>>50927462
At least that book will be coherent with actual rules. M20 is a fucking train wreck

>>50927331
No, 5

>>50927676
Why 5? Tell me what I am Making or Unmaking?

>>50926247
Any setting that has children would work...

>>50926770
Think of all the d10 sets that will be forced to play Scion instead, you heartless bastard.

>>50927530
>M20 is a fucking train wreck

Agreed. As does everyone who has read it. Aspel argued that it wasn't, that no-one had a right to complain, then admitted he hated the setting and never reads the books, so we can safely ignore him.

Inspirational Mage films. Go.

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>>50928440

>>50928440
Dark City.
Pi.
Akira.

>>50926247
Vampire has a flaw called Child which prevents a character from having Strength or Stamina higher than 2 (so combat is pretty much a no-go for any character without Fortitude or Potence) and gives +2 difficulty to all rolls attempting to command or lead mortal adults (so it'll be harder to use Dominate or Presence on them in addition to normal social stuff).

Embracing children is considered strange, cruel or wasteful by most vampires, so your sire is probably a dick or at best an outcast. It's pretty possible that they'd be abandoned by their own clans for being too weak also.

It's possible, but it'd be pretty hard.

>>50925055
>I'm interested in hearing about a non-straight, non-white, non-male, non-cis character from Anon.

All at once? In the words of Kids in the Hall, "Hey, fat, black, crippled dykes are hard to come by."

For the record, I've played PoC, female, and gay, though perhaps the difference I'm feeling is that when I did play characters with those aspects, those aspects never became plot important. It didn't matter to the ST's story. Maybe that's my fault as an RPer, I'll admit that too. Didn't round out the identity enough so that the choices were meaningful.

>Jakki is clearly in whatever the trans equivalent of babydyke mode is

You know, when you say it like that, I withdraw my initial comment entirely. With apologies, even. I can understand.

>>50927998
Sure, but not many setting encourages playing little girls.

>>50928787
Interesting. I'll look into it.

>>50928150
>Aspel argued that it wasn't
No I didn't. I said it's a trainwreck and no one should expect otherwise from Ascension. Most of what people complain about is ~politics~, so there's even double in terms of "what did you think you were getting"

>>50927530
M20 and A Thousand Years of Night aren't even in the same game.

>>50928813
>fat, black, crippled dykes are hard to come by.
Not really. And maybe it's just me, but I actually want the minority status to come up. I want it to be important. I don't want it to be a token thing, I want it to be something they overcome. Society's prejudices may be hard to overcome in the real world, but that's why I want fantasy.

Although my last trans character was a MUSH character, so the fact that she was trans wasn't mean to be public knowledge. But then she was outed, because players are idiots and you should never allow them to be cops, because none of them know how the law works.
She was a Life focused Alchemist Moros who wanted to change her body. And everything else. About the world. Change to heal.

>>50928980
>players are idiots and you should never allow them to be cops, because none of them know how the law works

I will rarely agree with you 100%, Aspel, but I'll stand by you on this one. Hell, I think most STs should strive to leave the cops out of it too, except in the most broad strokes.

>>50928440

Frequencies

In my setting Mages are the only playable characters because all the other supernaturals are servants and cannon fodder

How much wiggle room is there for something like a calm, collected, and personable brujah who only loses their shit in combat/when ZA BEASTO wakes up?

>>50929593
Plenty?

>>50929667
Ok, wasn't sure if they had to be all hot blood all the time, like a gene seed flaw.

>>50929207
I think the cops should be involved if the players are idiots, but mostly as a threat. If it actually comes to needing to bingewatch Law & Order to know what to do next, shit has hit the fan.

But fuck me, the worst part of MUSHes is the way that the players in positions of power fuck things up. Here's a scenario: Someone has just been suspicious with a Banisher/Seer/Mad/Whatever by *not* directly engaging in hostility like everyone else. She even used Magic in front of probably Sleepers somewhere maybe to cause confusion--which is a big No-No, even more so than using your Familiar to throw obviously-supernatural-but-not-Supernal fireballs around--which let the villain escape. Do you:

A) Identify yourself as a member of the Adamantine Arrow
B) Let her know the man who escaped is potentially dangerous
C) Bring her in for questioning
D) Don't threaten, assault, or kidnap her
E) All of the above
F) Make zero effort to identify yourself as one of the good guys, tell a stranger they're coming with you, shoot them repeatedly when they try to flee (with help from the Guardian of the Veil, who had no problem with your familiar throwing fireballs!!!), and then kidnap a school teacher and keep a 20 something transwoman prisoner in the basement of a frat house (!!!), then throw a fit and rage delete your character when her attorney and literally everyone in the Consilium points out that's batshit insane?

>>50926019
What's wrong with them? They won't be used in a crossover chronicle because implying that actually works without whole cloth substitution ala those Hunter 1e books.

>>50926011
Loli is a spirit vessel or a Proximi with some dots in Forces

>>50929982
Nope. They're just more vulnerable to frenzy when the triggers come up.

>>50929436
Sooo, WoD and CofD as written then?

IGNORE X

In my setting Mages are the only non-playable characters because they are stupid chuunis and delusional idiots living in fantasyland.

>>50930089
>I know those feels
>They got caught three times
>Why did they pull the alarm?
>Nepotism is shity

How to find a non-tumblr group to run a V20 camarilla game?

>>50932432

But Tumblr is good and the Camarilla is boring.

>>50932532

Actually, all social media is Bad.

>>50932588

What about the secret thaumaturgical vampire Facebook from that one V20 book?

>>50932613

Even that one is Bad somehow. I'm sorry, it's just the law.

>>50922125
How do you approach the game? Is it working out for you?

>>50932432
I want to run one, though I'd first like some clarification on what you mean by "non-tumblr."

>>50932532
>the Camarilla is boring.
Well, when you have the Sabbat (edgelord assholes), the independents (also edgelord assholes, except the Ravnos, who are ordinary assholes) and the anarchs (who still run under the Camarilla's skirts whenever the aforementioned come calling), the Camarilla looks pretty good.

>>50928787
I notice VTR/NWoD lack this flaw (or... any flaws?) unless I am looking in completely the wrong place.
Is Innocents NWoD/worth it?

>>50932867

Innocents is one of the best books out there, but it is 1e and I'm not sure if converting it would take much work or not.

>>50932867
The Child flaw is found in the main rulebook for V20 Dark Ages.

>>50932888

Shouldn't be a whole lot. Some Merits might need retuning.

>>50932867
Something from the forums for Chronicles. I'm sure someone else will use it too.
General idea is that young child ( 7-12ish ) would begin with Child, while a young adult (17-20ish) would start with Adolescent. A Teenager (13-16ish) would get the worst of both worlds and start with both Conditions.

Child (Persistent)
Your character is a pre-adolescent (typically between 7-12 years of age). Character at this stage of development have several disadvantages when compared to an adult; their base size is 4, their Speed factor is 4, and any unarmed attack made against an adult or adult sized creature suffers a -2 penalty. You cannot raise any of her Attributes and Skills above 3 dots. Additionally, you do not benefit from the 10-again quality on teamwork actions that involve adult characters, and adult characters gain the 8-again quality on Contested actions against her. However, the characters smaller stature works to their advantage in some situations; against adults they gain a +1 die bonus to Stealth, Breaking Free of Grapple, or when Dodging.
Resolution: When your character reaches physical maturity.
Beat: When the characters youth causes a significant social or physical set back (especially when dealing with adults).

Adolescent (Persistent)
Your character is in an awkward transitionary phase of development - no longer a child, but not yet an adult, she struggles to find her place in the world. Adults tend to assume the worst in your character until she proves her maturity to them. You begin all Social Maneuvering attempts with adult characters at a Hostile impression.
Beat: You face prejudice or discrimination as a result of your age.
Resolution: Your character reaches developmental maturity.

>>50932844
Just not some crazy liberal people being players. I tried finding a game on roll20 and the group spend a long time complaining about Trump while in character. I just wanted a comfy tabletop session in a simple setting, to relax.

Basically I just want to play with normal people. I usually GM, but I haven't in a while and I'd like to actually play a little bit.

>>50932951

I wish I could find more crazy liberal people being players. Also,

>complaining about liberals in a game that has proudly been progressive for literal decades

>>50932844
>>50932951
I'd like to play if you're fine with people who never played much oWoD before.

>>50932951

Just play with your friends.

>comfy tabletop session
>VtM

So does "comfy" mean nothing anymore?

>>50932968
Sorry, radicals just irritate me, like I said, I'd like to play with normal, well adjusted people in an edgy aughts goth RPG.

Might as well look for a unicorn grove irl.

>>50933011
V20 is relatively inviting, if >>50932844 is serious, we could probably set something up over discord.

nice dubs

>>50933022
My friends don't like Vampire.

Also
>late 90's/early aughts
>not comfy

>>50932911
But V20 is VTM, not VTR. Or does that not matter and I should just use both books?

>>50933041
It'd be great if it works. Could you post the invite?

Thanks.

>>50933089

Entirely different games and rulesets.

>>50932951
So this is a "doesn't want RL-based political screeds" situation and not a "triggered by other people's identities" one?

>>50933011
>>50933090
Post your Discord handle and I'll invite you in.

>>50933090
I just made a server, here you go

https://discord.gg/rT439

I'd run a V20 game for you guys, but majority of this general is the worst shit. I did that once and will never do so again.

Randos on roll20 are better.

>>50933112
So there's no Child Flaw in VTR?
To the homebrewing lab I go.

>>50933151
I don't think it's necessary. It's literally just "take a Beat whenever physically being a child seriously inconveniences you."

>>50933151

Flaws don't even exist in 2e. Either use the rules in Innocents or have them being a child not have mechanics.

>>50933118
>So this is a "doesn't want RL-based political screeds" situation and not a "triggered by other people's identities" one?
It's a "don't be a raging autist about your political bullshit, I get enough of that shit IRL" situation. I don't care if you're gay, black or whatever as long as you're just a chill person and don't try to push your shit onto others.

>>50933061

It's the least comfy time.

>>50933141
No plsease babe come back I can change

I'll promise I'll never play a Sabbat character again or a Caitiff with 3 exclusive disciplines ever again

Don't leave

>>50933151
If it's 1e vampire there's innocents for stats and the Danse Macabre book has a 'Youth' masquerade on page 53. Otherwise for 2e the conditions posted on >>50932948 should do fine, plus the 'Child' mask. Pretty much all of 1e innocents wrapped up in two conditions.

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>>50933210
Too late! I'm already making a game on roll20 and you won't be able to join!

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>>50933249
You're breaking my heart anon

>>50933089
Requiem has Strength and Stamina attributes too, so the stat cap translates easily. The social drawback is relatively ambiguous too, so there's not really anything to change there either. Adults are less likely to obey you because you look like a small child. I don't know VTR at all, so I don't know how this would be represented mechanically, but a homebrew would be pretty easy. Having no mechanical drawbacks to looking like you're 10 sounds pretty silly honestly.

>>50933210
>three exclusive disciplines

You absolute monster.

I'm trying to imagine what the most Mary Sue-ish combination of three exclusive Disciplines would be. Valeren + Mytherceria is pretty Mary Sue, but I dunno what you would pick for a third. Spiritus, maybe?

>>50933372
mytherceria, obten, and necromancy. oh, wait...

>>50933393
Doesn't Necromancy have exclusive paths though? I thought the Path of the Cenotaph was Impundulu only.

>>50933372

10000% Temporis.

>>50933562
M-MASAKA

>>50933562
Sounds about right.

>>50932948
Why would you start the young adult age with the Adolescent condition? By 18 you're legally no longer a minor for most things.

>>50933249
Me and the other guy are still in the market for an ST.

t. Anon who wanted chill people to play with

>>50933141
I admit... I would quite like to join a game. What sorts of things are you afraid of /wodg/ doing?

>>50933672
Legalities don't matter, that Condition is based purely on how you're viewed by adults.

>>50933672
You're still perceived as a "kid" by many adults. Legality has nothing to do with anything.

>>50933672
In the Dark Ages setting, you'd be considered an adult at 16 or even earlier.

What do Changelings roll in clash of wills in 2e?

>>50933372
Obtenebration, Vicissitude, Temporis

And then take the another discipline merit and take, I don't know Dark Thaumaturgy

>>50933785
>dark thaum
>taking a disc thats already super cheap and accessible as an inclan.

>>50933785
what kind of retard ST lets something like that slide?

>>50933785
There's a merit for extra disciplines? I thought that you had to spend freebie points to get extras.

>>50933855
If it's RAW, it's the law!

>>50933868
you have to take the merit to be able to learn an extra discipline and then spend freebies if you want to rank it up

>>50933905
Huh, I don't remember that. Is that in V20 Dark Ages? And how many points does the merit cost?

>>50933841
I would argue you could pick a extremely rare and highly obscure/almost extinct path as your base and it would be worth it but ok here are other options
-Chimestry
-Obeah/Valeren
-Necromancy (again pick a rare path)
-Mythercia
-Quietus
-fucking Visceratika

Or you know instead of picking another discipline just pick the iron will and unbondable merit

>>50933929
V20 VtM, it's a 5 point merit

>>50934012
Weird, in Dark Ages it just says "You may choose disciplines not specific to your clan, but these may only be purchased with freebie points later". Maybe it's easier for 12-gen vampires to learn new disciplines?

>>50934058
Excuse me, I didn't look at the page for Disciplines, here's the skinny:

>Characters may
also acquire Disciplines other than those
commonly taught by their Clan, provided
they spend the proper freebie or experience
points and have access to a vampiric teacher
(again, subject to the Storyteller’s discretion).
Learning a new out-of-clan Discipline
requires that the teacher feeds the student a
point of their blood before instruction begins,
to start the mystical tie to the Discipline being
taught. Improving knowledge of a Discipline
already known does not require such a
transfer (although some unscrupulous teachers
may claim that it’s still necessary).

>Additional Discipline (5pt. Merit)
You can take one additional Discipline (Storyteller discretion) as if it were a Clan Discipline. All costs
to learn that Discipline are paid out as if it were native
to your Clan. A character cannot take this Merit
more than once, and Caitiff vampires cannot take this Merit.

>>50934120
So if you take the Additional Discipline Merit, your out-of-clan discipline can be levelled up naturally, but without the merit you can still learn out-of-clan disciplines, but to level them up you have to explicitly taught (and have out-of-clan blood put in you)?

I'm still kind of hazy on how levelling up disciplines works generally, especially with weirder ones like Vicissitude. Like you just naturally go from being able to shape bone to being able to turn into a giant beast? Seems like you would need someone to teach you either way.

>>50934306
Golden Rule my nigga, WoD is vague on purpose.

It doesn't have to be out of clan blood, a clanmate can teach you an out-of-clan discipline he knows.

>>50932795
Yeah, I'm having fun. The group is caught up in a bunch of Vampire business and there's a powerful Mage trying to become an Archmaster fucking with us and the Vampires to achieve it along with some other Mages trying to stop him. Plus VASCU is on our ass because of him not covering his tracks well enough and they suspect we're involved.

Anyone got any interesting stories from games of promethean the created or Changeling the lost?

So Mage: the Awakening 1e mentions kidnapping a PC as a potential plot point.

... How? I have no idea how you can go about actually kidnapping someone that powerful, let alone containing them long enough to get your demands.

>>50934634
Only a mage can defeat a mage

>>50934634
There is *always* a bigger fish anon

>>50933708
Most modern adults are mentally children. And when you're dealing with a condition that gives you resolution on developmental, not emotional/sociocultural maturity, what adults think of the kid shouldn't matter. Also, adults aren't naturally hostile to teenagers unless they're starting shit, and certainly aren't towards a 20 year old non-hipster.

It would make more sense to have Adolescent give the social penalty that Child has, without the stat cap tbdesu.

>>50934669
>Only a mage can defeat a mage
or some random thug with a gun. but whatever.

>Secrets of the Covenants PDF ???

Has anyone here played Genius the Transgression? Was it any good?

>>50928980
>Aspel MUSHes.

Oh god, tell me where so I can avoid it.

>>50934634
Option 1: Counterspelling
Option 2: Overwhelming force
Option 3: Judicious application of Sleepers
Option 4: Make them come willingly (hostages)
Option 5: They're a weaker Mage
Option 6: You realise while potent, no Mage can do fucking everything, and "Mage Supremacy" only applies when you consider groups of Mages, and their ability to compensate for one another's failings.

>>50935471
Here. You should avoid here.
Also you should avoid every MUSH.

>>50935506
>Option 6: You realise while potent, no Mage can do fucking everything, and "Mage Supremacy" only applies when you consider groups of Mages, and their ability to compensate for one another's failings.
Or as most people in this thread do: Assume every Mage is a 10th Degree Master who never fails any rolls and has infinite spell control.

>>50935456

It's real bad. There's a pretty solid chapter-by-chapter takedown of it on the forums, but the tl;dr is basically imagining a fangame built around fawning over the silliest parts of Ascension.

>>50935506
Literally impossible? Mages are the best

>>50935614
Can I have a link to these forums?

>>50935653
I assume the OPP forums.

How does one go about stuffing oWoD Mages lore into CofD?

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>>50936313

>>50936313
Mage Translation Guide?

>>50934634
Pretty sure the fiction in Reign of the Exarchs opens with a Mage who's been kidnapped and only escapes because his captors are dumb enough to let him go to the bathroom.

Steal whatever they did.

>>50928980
Shut up and die, Aspel, you insufferable, boring, diseased cunt. You are 100 kilos of cancer cells perpetually shitting up the internet. Turn off your computer and get your fat, lazy trannie arse out the door and down to a fucking gay bar, get some cock or something.

>>50929593
The older style of Brujah dating back to Ancient Greece placed an emphasis on debate, intellectualism and the honing of one's mind and body to achieve higher levels of perfection. Have a look at the Clanbook.

>>50934634
Killing a mage is much, much easier than keeping them alive and conscious somewhere against their will. It's just waaaay too much hassle, flips what this anon>>50935541 said and assumes the captor is a 10th Degree Master who never fails any rolls and has infinite spell control. The only way I can think of doing it is by making sure the mage wants to *stay* there, even if they may not want to *be* there.

>>50933141
can I play an Anarch Gargoyle Thaumaturge with Resources 5?

>>50933713
Yes, but "teenagers" didn't exist until after WW2. Up until that time you were just a "young adult".

>>50937125
So? A young adult is still young. Older generally have low or no expectations of the young if they don't know them, until they prove themselves.

>>50934306
>I'm still kind of hazy on how levelling up disciplines works generally,

That was something that was never made clear, in multiple editions. Elricsson joked about a "Rocky style training montage" in a speech he gave, and it seems to be the justification behind the "you are what you eat" rule they want to introduce in Vampire 5th. If you want to train Obfuscate, feed off the forgotten and the ignored; to train Potence, head to the local gym to feed on steroid-fuelled muscleheads.

For your own games, I'd make the training fit the discipline. Training Fortitude would probably require being pummelled over and over and the char gets tougher. Training Necromancy or Thaumaturge would require poring over ancient tomes. If all else fails, time spent in a locked room trying to will the effect into being.

>>50934695
>Also, adults aren't naturally hostile to teenagers

Usually it's the other way around.

>>50937170
You're missing my point. People aged 13 - 18 were granted MORE respect in the Dark Ages, because Young Adults were still Adults. After WW2 a psychologist writes a paper proposing a transitional, developmental stage for humans called "a Teenage", and mass marketing and talking down to them immediately follows - Rock and Roll, safe pre-packaged rebellion if you buy at the following stores, patronising judgement calls about their blossoming sexualities.

The situation is made worse because we in the West have no Rite of Passage we give our teenagers to signify to them that they are now adults, part of the adult world. The end result in 19 year old single mothers forced to become wise beyond their years and 20-something young men who haven't changed emotionally since they were 12.

4chan heaps a lot of shit on Jews, but at least they have a Bar Mitzvah to welcome a new adult to their society. What do we get in the West? A piss-up and an engraved tankard, if we're lucky.

Does anyone have the Tales of the Dark Eras fiction anthology?

>>50937497
Just buy it you cheap bastard, this isn't 7chan

>>50937385
Man, I seem to have struck a serious nerve here. All I'm saying is that the younger a person is, the less likely it is that adults will treat them with respect or as an equal. It doesn't matter what culture or time period you're in, there is no way a normal 16-year-old is afforded the same respect as a normal 45-year-old on first impression.

>>50937497
>Does anyone have the Tales of the Dark Eras fiction anthology

More importantly, we're still waiting for someone to share Secrets of the Covenants.

So for the prehensile tail predatory aspect for protean in VtR..is it a Goku monkey tail or the tail Dren has in Splice?

>>50937881
I think the idea of Protean is that the transformations have to mimic real-life wild animals, so it could be a furry tail like a monkey's, or a hairless one like a mouse or rat, which would be closer to Dren's I guess. It's up to player.

>>50937954
Sweet, time to make a monkey boy vampire.

>>50937964
That sounds pretty cool desu.

Suppose I want to straight up play a game set in the world of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, but not where there's a slayer anywhere nearby.

Would WoD be able to do it without heavily fucking with the crunch?

>>50937990
>prehensile tail
>feral senses
>wall crawling
>stealth and larceny
>parkour
>treat the entire city like a jungle gym
>chronicle ends with my brother coming to earth and revealing I'm an ayy

>>50938020
uh, what about CofD's Hunter: The Vigil?

>>50938064
It would be p. neat lore-wise too. You could be from some Gangrel offshoot that lives in a tropical rainforest in Southeast Asia or something.

>>50925385
>Shit, look at the Goddamned Overwatch Christmas comic. People flipped their shit because a character is a lesbian. It wasn't even a major aspect of her, but people still flipped out. But no one flipped out that Widowmaker was in a heterosexual marriage. No one cares that Mercy is hetero.
Idiots flipped their shit, and they flipped their shit because it was a "retcon". Nobody flipped out that Widowmaker was in a heterosexual marriage partially because the fact that she had a husband (who she assassinated) was a critical part of her backstory that we've always known about.

Blizzard has also always said that one of the characters was always queer (note that Tracer is still not confirmed gay; she could be a bisexual currently in a monogamous romantic relationship with a woman; hell, she could technically be a heterosexual currently in a nonsexual homoromantic relationship with a woman. As blindingly unlikely as that is, nothing we've seen technically contradicts it, for all the "WE DON'T LIKE 'TRACER IS GAY' GETTING SHOVED DOWN OUR THROATS" screaming from the idiots). We just found out which one it was recently.

Personally I'm just glad they didn't go for the butch-dyke stereotype and make Zarya into the "queer representation" character (even if part of the reason they didn't go with Zarya may very well have been not rocking the boat with Russia, which is currently in a bit of a love affair with anti-homosexual religious conservatism, to the point where the comic in question that depicts one panel of Tracer getting kissed by her girlfriend is banned in Russia).

>>50934339
Ignore this guy.

OOC disciplines can require you to get to ranking of 2 to teach yourself the higher levels. IC you can teach anyone.

Exceptions are the physicals.

>>50938491
>she could be a bisexual

I think on twitter they said she's just full on lezzy

>>50933703
>What sorts of things are you afraid of /wodg/ doing?
What don't you faggots do? I had one guy do nothin' but bitch about how VtR was better every session until he had to be removed.

Another guy tried to play a Trujah without knowing how to play one at all. I'm fine with Trujah, but you gotta earn such a right to play one.

Another tried to go around murdering people for shits and giggles and thought the Prince wouldn't find out that 30 people disappeared over 3 nights. The other players ripped his head off and gave it to the Prince immediately after the blood hunt started.

>>50937675
And I'm TELLING you that in other cultures - African, Native American, Inuit, Aborigine - once a "normal 16 year old" has undergone the appropriate initiation rites, they are considered an adult, with adult rights and responsibilities. There may still be an element of "look here, n00b" from the elders of the tribe, but there is a strict delineation between child and adult marked by rites of passage, no inbetween.

>>50938020
I can't think of any reason why it wouldn't.

>>50938491
Take it to /co/

>>50938634
What I don't get though is why you keep insisting that the distinction is so strictly black and white. It's not like the rite of passage makes everyone magically forget that you were still considered a child a couple of days or even years ago. And what are you talking about, there are no rites of initiation in the West? There are LOADS: there's getting a driver's license, graduating from high school, graduating college/university, getting married, and if you're religious, profession of faith/confirmation or whatever your denomination or religion practices, plus lots of others like first kiss, first drink, first vote, your majority-age birthday and lots more. None of them correspond to just "becoming an adult" in a generic sense because modern Western cultures involve so many highly developed specialized institutions that you are essentially initiated into each of them separately. The modern concept of adulthood (which carries with it a host of others like citizenship, education, work and so on) is too complicated to be initiated into all of it at once.

But the main point is I think you're seriously talking out your ass about cultures you know nothing about and have never lived in. It's irrelevant if a culture has a concept of "teenager" or not, it's a much safer bet that "all else being equal, age affords respect" will hold generally true no matter where and when you are. I am so done with your bullshit.

>>50938790
>there are LOADS:
>(proceeds to list shit that doesn't change either a person's outlook or how they are perceived, plus other life rituals irrelevant to topic)

What the fuck are you talking about? None of those change a thing for most folks. No-one says "well you have a driver's license, so you're a man now."

>But the main point is I think you're seriously talking out your ass about cultures you know nothing about and have never lived in.

Strange, I was just thinking that was what you were doing. I was talking about things like Australian Aborigine boys being taken to a sacred spot and having their penis split open like a hot dog with a sharp rock, after which they are considered an adult and responsible for their own actions. Either you have your dick split, or you don't. Pretty black and white.

>I am so done with your bullshit.
And yet, still you post. You sure love the sound of your own voice, Aspel, particularly when you don't know what you're talking about.

Hey I am planning to write an original story that is heavily influenced by Mage fluff and themes. Am I in danger of of copyright infingment if I change up some names and make some changes on how things work?

>>50938935
Unless it's getting published for profit, you'll probably be fine. Otherwise, change every term that's Capitalised - existing Copyright provisions allow fair use once you've changed things by more than 10%.

>>50938881
>thinking I'm Aspel

is that why you're so mad? holy shit dude. I'm definitely not him, I hadn't even heard his name until like two days ago.

>Nobody says "you have a driver's license, you're a man now"

No, because as I said, Western adulthood has lots of facets. No single one of them corresponds to becoming a full adult, and you don't need to go through all of them. And where the fuck do you get off saying "none of these change a person's outlook or how they are perceived"? They ALL do precisely that. Someone without a driver's license, who hasn't graduated high school, who's never had a job and never kissed anyone would definitely have a different outlook than someone who had, and would be pretty widely viewed as a generally lesser person. Even just having a driver's license is pretty socially important since it signifies that other people can rely on you to get them places and you have more freedom to go where you want. It shows you have more independence and responsibility, which are fundamental to adulthood in any culture.

I'm so bewildered I'm even explaining this to someone. It's like talking to a fucking alien.

>either you have your dick spit or you don't
Sure. Let's just assume that 100% of the time this happens, everyone instantly views the boy as a full-fledged adult and he's completely capable of fulfilling all of his adult responsibility. People aren't this stupid, they'll recognize a need for a transition phase of some kind. It'll probably be earlier and shorter than in the West, but basic psychology pretty much necessitates a transition phase.

Honestly I'm only responding because you have a real talent for revealing your own impressive denseness. But this is the last response. There's really nothing more I can do at this point.

>>50938992
Well for one Im ditching the exarchs but keeping a Seer like organization in tact.

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GUYS GUYS I found the perfect Beast!

http://yokai.com/shirime/
Shirime
尻目
しりめ

TRANSLATION: butt eye
ALTERNATE NAMES: nuppori-bōzu
HABITAT: city streets, late at night
DIET: none; it just enjoys scaring people

APPEARANCE: From a distance, shirime appears to be a normal human being. When close enough, however, it becomes apparent that it is a yokai. It has no facial features, but located in its butt hole is a large eye which shines like lightning.

BEHAVIOR: Shirime approaches travelers on the road late at night, looking like a man wearing a kimono. Once it has their attention, it asks them if they have a moment to spare. Before they can answer, the shirime drops its kimono to the ground and bends over, spreading its butt cheeks and revealing the giant, shining eye located inside of its butt hole.

Other than its very startling behavior, shirime does not do anything harmful. It appears to thrive solely on the joy of scaring people.

ORIGIN: Although there are very few documented encounters, because of its alternate name (nuppori-bōzu) and its shocking behavior, it is very likely that shirime is a close relative of the noppera-bō, another faceless ghost. In this case, shirime’s true form may simply be a shapeshifted animal playing a practical joke on humans.

>>50939154
God I fucking hate the Japs

>>50939154
The beast that gives other beasts nightmares.

>>50939138
>is that why you're so mad?

I'm not even mad. Just asserting what I know.

> as I said, Western adulthood has lots of facets. No single one of them corresponds to becoming a full adult

Exactly what I said, only I went on to say that we are left with a hazy perpetual never-never land for people to get lost in. We don't have a single event that says "now you're a man, son." We end up with assholes in their 20's that want their mum in a relationship, want to spend all their income on toys and complain that their parents are being arseholes about them smoking in the house.

>where the fuck do you get off saying "none of these change a person's outlook or how they are perceived"?

Why are you getting so butthurt over simple reality? There isn't some kind of complex adult heirachy that divides the west into Kissed and Unkissed substrata. Things like graduation are nothing more than job certifications, arguing that line is as asinine as saying a doctor is more of an adult than a teacher due to the hours of study.

>widely viewed as a generally lesser person

How do you type with your anus? When in the history of humanity has someone you describe - "sheltered" or "naive" is the word you're lacking - been considered "a generally lesser person"? You seem to be conflating the pecking order of High School with real life. I have genuine concerns you are too young to be on this site.

>Sure. Let's just assume that 100% of the time this happens, everyone instantly views the boy as a full-fledged adult and he's completely capable of fulfilling all of his adult responsibility.

Why assume he's completely capable? No-one's saying that. I realise you're having trouble grasping this, but it really is this simple. When a boy turns the right age, the men take him to sacred ground and perform a sacred rite. It varies from tribe to tribe but end result is physical, obvious proof that a boy is now a man. Otherwise, he is still a boy.

>>50939138
>this is the last response.

Thank fuck for that. The "but, but, but" was getting fucking childish (ironically enough)

>>50938881
>And yet, still you post. You sure love the sound of your own voice, Aspel, particularly when you don't know what you're talking about.
That's not me. I'm not even sure why you're having this discussion in the first place, since to start with none of that is relevant to the two conditions that were suggested.

>>50938935
>>50938992
This is a thing I've wanted to do but not done.

>>50939959
FUCK OFF AND DIE CHOKING ON YOUR OWN FECES, ASPEL

>>50939959
>>>/d/

>>50934712
Shooting a Mage is doable. It's holding one captive, that's the problem.

>>50940605
>ahh, Mr Bond... allow me to chain you into my faulty death machine and tell you all my plans.

>>50939959
>This is a thing I've wanted to do but not done.
Yeah, I'd practice on your creative writing skills some more, before you jump into that deep end. Friendly advice.

>>50941568
Don't talk to it. Don't encourage it. "Friendly advice" about it's writing is seen as "personal attacks". It is incredibly defensive of it's Magical Realm fan splats.

So reading the Carthian covenant book seems like they're not just a bunch of commie fucks like I've been led to believe. Why do they get painted with that brush when it seems pretty much every political ideology (excluding monarchism) can find a home in the Cartians?

>>50942021

narrow minded overview of them in the Core and stupid players/DMs

>>50942021
Most people just flat out don't understand leftist political systems, so it all gets lumped as "dey're unamerican commies"

>>50942078
Well I mean it isnt just leftist political systems. Nationalists, Libertarians, Neo-Cons, Paleo-Cons, as long as you're advocating something that isnt Invictus philosophy you're a Carthian. Hell they even list Fascism as an example a few times.

>>50942092
Hell /pol/ would be Carthians now that I think about it..

>>50942021

Because Marxist-Leninist, Maoist, and Juche Communism are the only real alternative styles of government and economy that managed to sucessfully exist for a very long time, marking them as a cultural touchstone years after the Cold War ended. Generic Commie is an easy go-to for "Not our style of government".

It would also stand to reason that most political radicals embraced during the Cold War would have some kind of Communist leaning. Right-wing libertarianism and Paleo/Neo-conservatism didn't really kick off until the 70s or so, making making many of those potential Carthians still Neonates compared to the Ancillae/potential Elder Carthians that might be Communists Embraced in the early 20th Century. Some Elders might be straight up Anarchists, which would be fun as soon as it sees its Covenant's childer talk about creating vampire equality through a state.

>>50942130
Yes and there could be just as many Elder Carthians embraced during the nationalist revolutions that swept through Europe.

Making them Commies is just lazy as fuck. Wheres my God damn French Revolution era Carthians that still think the Guillotine is a viable method of political change?

>>50942151

Ah, shit I forgot about those, my bad. Got too wrapped up in the idea of an Elder lobbing dynamite into modern day Carthian meeting.

>>50942168
>You fucking whipersnappers! You wouldnt know Proudhon from Godwin!

God help us all when Elder Frank is having one of his episodes.

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>>50942092
>>50942126
The Carthians are pretty squarely leftist. They mention Fascism a few times, but never actually explain what Fascist Carthians would look like. They're very much informed by the political philosophies surrounding the American and French revolutions, hedging towards the French ones, mostly due to the way that the French Revolution was a lot messier. And, of course, the early Russian Revolutions.
Carthians aren't just Leftists, they're *old school* leftists, where Left meant revolution.

>>50942130
There actually are some Anarchists who don't see a State as inherently wrong. The main problem comes in that most Anarchist thought defines a "State" as "an organization that has a monopoly on violence, and the territory within which it maintains that control". A lot of the successful "Anarchist" movements weren't completely anarchist. Of course, the biggest threat to anarchism is totalitarians deciding to crush your little commune.

>>50942151
Most Carthians are going to be that kind of Carthian. Or at least most elders. They're the kind of people more likely to be working directly off of Marxism as opposed to Leninism or Stalinism or God forbid Maoism. After all, the Carth pseudonym was being used pre-French Revolution. There are going to be Carthian Elders who weren't just around for Marxism, but pre-Marxist hobknobbing and philosowanking.
Oh fuck me, thinking about the French Revolution has Les Mis stuck in my head again.
I want to make Enjolras as a Carthian. https://youtu.be/cjp-Gyo5tNM

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>>50942470
Bonus https://youtu.be/gMYNfQlf1H8

I kind of dig the idea of an immortal stuck forever in the attitude of the student rebellion.

>>50942499
Gives a chilling new hidden meaning to the song "Empty Chairs and Empty Tables" after a few centuries have passed, doesn't it?

>Oh my friends, my friends forgive me
>That you are dead and I live on...

>>50921545
Constantly. Right now our Coterie is attempting to cope with a siege of the Domain disguised as political rioting, power outages, and domestic terrorism by right-wing extremists.
Our very first chapter featured my character being crippled by a werewolf and feebly crawling back to our vehicle while the others dealt with the ruffian

>>50942611
Wow, Anon, why would you do this to me.
https://youtu.be/eqqSa9n2ZQk

I hope that's the kind of thing that A Thousand Years of Night talks about. Just... everyone dying around you.
And here's another one to give you something in your eye, though it won't really give you Carthian inspiration https://youtu.be/GBVh8G-7Edg

>>50942470
Enjolras is the champ

>>50942470

I'm aware of that kind of Anarchistic thought, but I sincerely doubt that an Elder is going to keep a nuanced opinion of the nature of the State after getting really old, really powerful, and with a lower humanity.

>>50942754

The invictus is where carthians go when they grow up.

>>50942877

You'd like to think that, wouldn't you?

>There will be a Carthian Methuselah in your un-lifetime.

>>50942754
Iunno, one of the main differences between the Left and the Right is that the Right fall in line and the Left falls apart: i.e. nuance and minor disagreements mean Leftists will start fighting, while the Right will band together under a strong leader. You can actually see that happening right now in American politics. And of course that's even what the book mentions Carthians doing when they're in power.

>>50942900
In Requiem they're Ancillae, if I recall.

>>50942900

I said "when they grow up" not "when they get old"

>>50942920
The real Left would kill or convert the lukewarm false lefties and then rally to slay their fascist foes, though, destroying Capitalism once and for all. You'll see that before you know it, God willing.

>>50942470
>They mention Fascism a few times, but never actually explain what Fascist Carthians would look like.
Probably pretty much like National Socialists, from '33 onwards. Otherwise like, dare I say it, Trump and his following.

>>50942470
>Carthians aren't just Leftists, they're *old school* leftists, where Left meant revolution.
If this is true, you should have no problem imagining fascist carthians rising

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So, i ran my first in person game of Htv. I set it in 1979 miami, basic missing persons case to get the ball rolling , but i need some more ideas, and a little advice.

I know im gonna sound like "THAT ST" but i have a problem player, and that problem is my girlfriend. I have a party of 5 and all the players roleplay just fine, but she always acts more or less as herself (socially fucking inept) whilst playing social primary characters. This makes it so her character oft falls flat on thier face, because she cant figure out what to say.

Should i just make her roll for it more insteas of just doing it all through conversation? Help me please /wodg/, i have no idea.

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>>50944121
Note, im a freshly new ST who has never played off-fprum before, so it may very well be me being a dense motherfucker and thinking too inside the box.

>>50944121
Yes, roll for it. Only allow the "exceptional roleplaying to avoid die rolls" clause when you have a room full of aspiring actors.

>>50944121
use social maneuvering from CoD

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>>50944315
>>50944367
For every single conversation in which something is at stake? That system seems so damn clunky to be used that often, and even in the rules of the system the following situation wouldnt really work (this is what happened that made me ask this question):
Sofia Alaranza (Cuban flatfoot, Gf's character) walks into Club Stori, a fmous club in coconut grove. This is the club that her mark , a man (ghoul) by the name of James Alefantis, worked at.
She was trying to get access to the security camera tapes from an obese man in the security booth who went by the name of Gerry. The intention was to have her roll a successful intimidate or persudade, so that she could do it personally or she could talk to the DJ (another player character) and get him to do it at a +1 dice bonus. Or she could steal them or any number of things.

The problem is that she rolled intimidate, failed, and then sulked that she couldnt think of anything to do to get the damn tapes. No seduction, no bribery, nothing.

>>50944750
>have you tried talking to your gf

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>>50944837
*Inhales deeply*
Boi.

Of course I have, and when I did she chewed me out and said that I didnt give her enough detail to give her actual options ingame.

She is by far my worst player, and it saddens me that I cant get rid of her, so I simply have to try to make her better at the game. Or to make myself a more accommodating ST, either or works.

>>50945044
Sounds like you need to grow a spine. Explain to her what tabletop (i.e. not a computer game)

>>50944750
Why did none of the other players suggest a course of action for her to take?

>>50945044
Does she *still* want to play a social primary character? With your players' permission you can just reassign her dots. "She's always been a crack driver. You just never asked."
>>50945372
It's not the worst idea. Let others give their input, or give your own suggestions. It works as long as they have patience for it, and your girlfriend doesn't feel patronized.

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>>50945372
Is that common? Thats oft interpreted in my group as "trying to play someone elses character"

>>50945695
My most regular group shouts at eachother constantly. We also drink hefty amounts of beer. Basically we're like a bunch of jolly dwarves pretending to be bloodsucking Mob bosses

Your character is in a bar, not a dive but not The ritz

He's a had a rough day, hasn't had sex in 4 months

He see's a cute woman, probably about 30 and some clerical assistant or a court reporter by her cheap suit and vodka martini

He's a decent looking guy with enough disposable income to pay for some Smirnoff and a taxi to her place

BUT WAIT!

He is a heterosexual, and aware that the supernatural is kinda real

How does he determine this cute receptionist isn't a monster, or worse - a guy in a magical disguise

>>50945835
Buy up mortal Super Natural merits. Buy up dots in Occult.

Ask. Await response.

Good luck.

>>50945835
Convert to Catholicism if he isn't a Catholic already, join the Malleus Maleficarum, learn both Blessed Sight of St. Abel and Clarity of St. Collen, come back to the bar, check if she's a monster, and then kill her if she is or leave because sex outside of marriage is a sin if she isn't.

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Thanks for the tips everyone. I think I may just go with my old d&d 3.5 option of allowing people to just roll something like intelligence+streetwise or academics to ask me for a push in the right direction. It worked well then.

Also ill talk to my group about maybe giving eachother suggestions. Not entirely sure how thats going to go down though.

>>50922212
>Prime and Forces being bad
Time and Fate got buffed, the others are just as good.
if anything I find Life the less useful of the Arcanas outside of healing and an instant KO.

>Obrimos damage control (ironically)

lol

Just found this on /v/. It contains a few books the other Mega is missing (like the Clanbooks, By Night...)
https://mega.nz/#F!YIgVwQKY!ykGezjo3qppcgHXzTKuBGQ

>>50946498
>Life the less useful

Shapeshifting Stat buffs

>>50945835
Roll Perception + Occult.

>>50946065
there's also always the Common Sense merit

>>50934634
The artifact in Banishers. Handcuffs that prevent magic.

>>50947817
Kinky

>>50943176
>>50942470
>The real Left would kill or convert the lukewarm false lefties

That thinking is precisely why the left always eats its own and/or becomes a absolute tyranny to maintain purported ideological purity. At that point it becomes indistinguishable from right-leaning dictatorships.

>>50947817

If it takes a very powerful Supernal artifact, i.e., a McGuffin, to imprison a mage, then by definition it's damn near impossible to do so. Even the effects of heavy drugging can be reflexively mitigated with mana expenditure healing or Arcana.

With mages, it's generally kill or be killed (often very soon after they quickly leave combat), with capture and holding an extremely unlikely or unreservedly regrettable proposition.

Is it possible to make heartfelt character drama in wod splats. I like something a little less cutthroat but something profound as well. Like a coming of age story bit in wod setting

>>50947861
Actually, what we're seeing currently and we've seen a lot in the past (MLK complained about it, and liberals did it pre-Hitler) is that moderate liberals are trying to play the compromise game. The real problem with the Left is that it barely exists in any real form. Which is kind of why I like the Carthians so much. They're what I wish we had in real life, as opposed to kowtowing neoliberal moderates.

>>50948176
Literally any splat, but Promethean is all about that.

>>50948176
Find a good ST and play an Innocents game.

>>50948176
Yes.
Become a writer
Find actors to play with

>>50947941
>to imprison a mage
Funny how Space, Mind or Life 3 can do that perfectly well as well.

>>50948700

>>50948356
>Funny how Space, Mind or Life 3 can do that perfectly well as well

Except that the mage you are trying to imprison also has Arcana, many of which are more than capable of obviating or circumventing the pertinent effects. The casting mage would also need to spend all his time maintaining his spells to continue the imprisonment (or sacrifice greatly to relinquish or let the spells naturally degrade), and thus would be impractical.

Keeping a mage alive and imprisoned, particularly when attempted by anyone other than another powerful mage, is extremely difficult, impractical and generally quite dangerous, either directly or because a *planned* rescue by other mages is they type of scenario where mage abilities excel.

>>50938020
Normal WoD or CofD, either edition, can do it. CofD has a benefit in that psychic merits exist in the core, rather than having to get a separate book, which can work for magic and psychic powers. Default 'mode' of WoD could work well for Buffy.

>>50946065
Basic success on a stat+skill appropriate to the situation CAN be used to get information on the situation; it's a pretty common setup.

>>50948717
blabblablbald
clash of wills blablblablblab

>>50948356
This >>50936901 and this >>50948717

You'd have to be pretty fucking suicidal to try to keep a demi-god alive and conscious somewhere they really don't want to be.

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>>50949516
blablblablblab I don't like actually playing blablblablblab

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>>50939154
The most Dr. Who of beasts.

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Any NWoD games still recruiting a noob?

I played a wereworlf game before that seemed quite promising. Though it died of furries. I for one am not a furry.