Pathfinder General /pfg/

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>>50657632
http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1034837
>totally not Han Solo

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>>50657666
Post your best ninjas.

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>>50657677
How about bio-mechanical spaceninjas?

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>>50657632
REMOVE KITSUNE!

Who would be interested into joon an Iron Gods campaign?

>>50657743
Depends on the schedule and maybe on the rules

>>50657632
>What is the best way to play NEUTRAL EVIL?
Actually be evil.

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>>50657677
Define ninja.

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>>50657743
JOON AN

Gotta have more details than that, anon-san.

>>50657804
Become ninja.

>>50657782
I am an eurofag so have present the difference with your country's time zone and the Greenwich Meridian one.
I GM on evenings around 19:00 and my sessions last to 23:00 or 00:00.
Concerning rules, which will make you happy and entertain?

>>50657817
Hm... in EST that's 14:00. definitely depends on the day then but not impossible.

What's the PB, level, allowed classes, special rules/restrictions, etc? your first post made it sound like this was an already-existing game?

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>>50657677

which one do you think is best

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Jean Glitterdust

Davatti | Unchained Rogue

- Thief, born and raised in Nex.
- Pretty darn successful, especially in a place were magic defenses are so common.
- The gang Jean is a part of use disguise and seduction to get into mages' houses
- Going great until a brawl happens during one of the jobs and Jean gets hit with a teleporting curse.
- litterally forced to teleport hundreds of miles every few minutes to an hour.
- This keeps up untill he's discovered by Koya, in Varisia.
- with her and Desna's guidance, Jean's able to control this affliction and master it to the point where Jean can control 4th dimensional travel.
- Forever indebted to Koya, Jean settles down in Sandpoint. Though his thieving fingers are getting twichy

LIkes:
Gold, gems, moving fast, Tight clothes, Women, Men, Pineapple, Heeled shoes

Dislikes
Going hungry, Sandals, Sand, Fire, Large bodies of water,

>>50657811
I already GMed Iron Gods but my players didn't lie up to my expectations.
I was expecting to enjoy a game in which there would be an awareness of certain ethos. At least that of sword & sandal considering how pro-Howard the setting of Numeria is but when your players are mainly millenials who even didn't read The Lord of the Rings because there is the movies you can bet soon the campaign is going to be a chore than an entertainment.
I am looking for players who actually roleplay and have at least a philia for barbarian or science fantasy settings.

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Does anyone know much about Osirion? I've got a game starting set in it (In the adventure path for it) but the wiki is kinda short on details and I'm a bit unfamiliar with it.

Which is a bit of an issue when I'm playing a native. (A magpie mage spellburst savant who is greedy enough to want to try to find magical knowledge in old tombs)

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>>50657632
i got you OP

>>50657859
I had been GMing Iron Gods since 2014 but the campaign had a lot of issues, mainly players leaving because didn't feel comfortable with other players, new players showing up to be That Guys, irresponsible players who didn't respect the schedule and players leaving because of real life issues.
Concerning character creation rules I am open to do 25 builds and third party material as far the PCs pitched respect the setting's ethos. The only restriction will be that your character must belong to the city of Torch. Could be an immigrant, but haves to be one that has been living for at least half a decade in said settlement.

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>>50657901
The best thing to do with Numeria, honestly, is to ignore paizo's "tech is bad and must be bad, the heroes should all be plucky young technology haters and magic users that only know enough to get through the dungeons", and go full-out 80s psycho sci-fi with the thing.

Just let people use their skills and feats and go nuts exactly the way their skills should have already have allowed; and there's your answer to the fucking world wound.

>>50657977
Tell us what torch is like/you-want-it-to-be-like.

>>50657986
In my first run I ignored Paizo rule on timeworn tech. I keeped the glitches but the idea of an item becoming useless after wasting all the charges was discarded.

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Any suggestions for making a Ghost Huntery sort, using gestalt and basic 3pp stuff?

>>50657632
>What's the best way to play Neutral Evil
Selfish, uninterested in the affairs of Law or Chaos- more interested in money, whores, fighting, and more whores.

Also weird mommy/daddy issues.

>>50657632
Avoid being a horrid slut like Caster, for a start.

>>50658245
I'll wreck your face bro

for serious

>>50658098
To elaborate. I'm after the sort of ghost hunter who solves things more through clever thinking and resolutions rather than throwing holy water.

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>>50657677
My best ninja was a vampire girl who had trouble using her Ki, since... Ki power is connected to self-living energy and she hadn't any at all.

Was fun!

>>50658004
It's for the best. The tech was deliberately written out at twice (or more) what its value should be, and the crafting/recharge methods flatly unbelievable.

Crafting a tech weapon for example not only requires the feat chain (ouch), but if you'll read carefully, also requires TWO, read them, TWO artifacts.

And you can't even hope to just "bring one to the other" to get the job done either; because guess what? Those artifacts? THEY'RE COLOSSAL STRUCTURES!

But it gets better.
See, there's a way around that. A stupidly simple way (once again making caster crafters the top dog though) at that.

... ALL those massive problems with recharging and keeping the thing from going dry despite 10gp/shot batteries (of which you might need four or more shots to actually use the weapon a single attack, let alone a full attack)? Gone! Because it's a robot! Spend 1k on making that gun a robot, and program it as more or less a helpful famililar for the wielder; sharing what little senses and intelligence (AND ACTIONS) that it has, and never running out of juice.

Inexplicably, the tiny reactors that even the smallest little spider drones have are in every robot but impossible to replicate elsewhere... So, fuck it, just awaken everything.

They really did screw the pooch on Numeria from top to bottom when it came to the mechanics. It's the Exalted 2nd edition of its setting.

>>50657977
Theoretically if one were to sign up, what level would one be starting at, in order to perhaps roll up a character and come up with concepts?

>>50658437
In that case would it come from the stolen life coursing through her veins? I mean I've always kind of liked the idea that vampires are physically indifferent from regular creatures when sated, but when they're ravenously hungry they're fanged skeletal horrors.

Fist of the Stolen Life sounds like an interesting martial arts style for them though.

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I missed >>50651346 entire thread, how annoying.

I was wanting to ask today about goblin campaign, would have been perfect thread for it.

In any case: Has anyone played we be goblins?
did your group have fun/not?
Just finished session 1 of what looks to be me running all 3 adventures, going pretty well.

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What would you guys say is the coolest way to play druid?

>>50657632
A cute slut that parties hard, lives forever, and eats halfling veal with a glass of elf blood every other Sunday

>>50658670
Melee druid for maximum rip and tear.

>>50657928
For starters, it's critical to realize that Osiriani women are obsessed with foreign cocks. It's just an ingrained cultural fascination, but it's ubiquitous. A smart move for an enterprising PC would be to find a way to monetize this lust by selling exotic manmeat to the masses.

>>50658466
>cute robot gun obsessed with helping the wielder slay demons and defend the defenseless

I couldn't be more erect

>>50657632
Just play your actual self.

>>50658670
Orphan raised by dinosaurs that turns into a dinosaur, has a dinosaur companion, and summons dinosaurs.

>>50658611
yeah we did
it was pretty funny because we're all a bunch of SERIOUS BUSINESS ONLY characters in our main game, and our goblins were a bunch of fucking retards that took 4 hours to do the first module

>>50658670
No shapeshift
Maximum Geomancy
>Magma is nature too, who cares what happens to your bodies or those trees? It'll be great soil in a few centuries

uncaring neutral fury of the elements

>>50658854
>>50658670

I play my druids Neutral. Like a shark or a hurricane.

>>50658865
>NATURE SAYS FUCK YOU! I CAST SHARKNADO 3!

>>50658744

You know, I think I'm being trolled.

>>50658865
>Sharks
>Neutral

Yea sure, Mr. Totally-Not-A-Shark.

>>50658877
... I'm not so sure.
Sometimes a bit of the author's magical realm does show hints of itself in the various regional descriptions, so it's entirely possible that while nowhere near the level of information you demand, anon is actually giving you factually correct information.

I don't know the place, myself, so I cannot confirm nor deny these allegations.

Can I ask y'all about the virtues of the VMC mechanic?
It looks... apt, for being able to combine concepts that would have been inelegantly covered via the miserable tool that is multiclassing, but is it something any of you use for it's intended purpose, or is it the tool of minmaxing jizzswillers?
I have an idea to rip of Guts from Berserk as a ZS Warder VMC Barbarian specializing in Primal Fury, but I feel as tho I ought to feel bad for doing it

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Am i right in understanding that reach grapples pulls the target adjacent to you? Like a rope dart?

>>50659184
>fem roadhog
if they're not gonna make her massive like him, her tits should be a lot bigger

What's the cutest possible familiar?

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>>50659198

sorry, lemme fix that.

>>50659218
That's a good hog.

>>50659218
better.

i'd actually want to fuck the first one, this one actually looks like a gender bender.

Hey /pfg/ I just got into a very interesting situation and have the following stats to play around with 34/16/14/11/9/8 in level 1. What in the world do I even play with these stats

>>50659218

See, that actually works as female roadhog. It doesn't get my dick hard but it works as the character.

>>50659181
VMC is pretty mediocre, so don't feel guilty.

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>>50659218
>>50659184

if you're doing one you gotta do both.

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>>50659216

This little guy right here. Or pipefox.

>>50659241

I don't mind VMC bard, purely because you get bardic knowledge at full level as the level 3 feature.

>>50659233
You don't, because using those numbers means the DM is going to throw some outrageous bullshit at you to neuter you without fail, or do their best to come up with perfect counters to you such that your strengths mean little. The system just doesn't handle player numbers getting that high.
Either way, story time.

>>50659233
Exploiter Pact Wizard

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>>50659247

you mean dogsnek?

>>50659242
>fem junkrat
yes pls

>>50659258

Do dogsnakes squirt tears at their enemies giving them visions of their last moments alive?

Didnt think so. Clearly the second choice.

>>50659250
>>50659241
It does seem like the best way to use it is to get some quasi-magical capacity, but it looks like, from far away, it is such a better use pf's (admittedly shitty) feat system, it's almost silly.

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>>50659218
Remember guys, this is how "good artists" draw female versions of male characters.

>>50659242

>heart shaped gasmask goggle hole
>Gold eye shadow
>Amazing eyebrow

Damn it i dont wanna get crushed.

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>>50659272

At least some good cosplay comes out of it.

>>50659181
It's not a bad idea, the execution is just...underwhelming, on the whole. But if you can spare the feats and it fits the character, why not? You just have to watch out that you get something that's actually worth all those feats and that you get what you were looking for at a reasonable level(and not, say, about 10 levels after it stopped being worthwhile).

>>50659216
Whichever one you love most

>>50659251
GM is an old friend of mine who just wanna have some bullshit fun. Most of the rest of the group is pretty new to Pathfinder and he let em look into some of his old 3.5 books and take what they fancy. So, I'm not expecting any of that bullshit since he was laughing over how broken this will be the whole time I was rolling

>>50659272
I know that set, that artists has one single body type and face and he uses it for all of the characters. He is probably using some 3D poser software.

>>50657990
Torch is a dwarf founded community which economy relish in the forge of skymetals that is purchased by crusaders heading to the Worldwound. Since is an independent community which counts with the genius of aan ex-Technic League member I considered to introduce this time elements that I didn't the first time.
>>50658466
I do agree with you.
>>50658477
Soon I'll post a link. I want to start at level 1 but I am open to start at level 3 if people vote for that option.

>>50659242
>>50659274
Trashmouse is much much much better than highwaysow.

>>50659272
>>50659292
Hey, can y'all stop complaining about cheesecake?
>>50659299
I actually have sorta struggled looking over feats, because everything seems locked behind long feat chains or simply isn't so useful compared to what I gain as an initiator.
I'm looking at power attack and the feat that allows you to belay the attack penalty on the first blow. I wanted Imp. Trip, but Combat Expertise, hell, all feat tax shit, pisses me off.

>>50659184

Roadhog posting aside, I think that only works with Greater Whip Mastery i think.

>>50659361
>>50659299
I'd say look up the archetype packages done by super genius. They're a lot better than the shitshow that is VMC.

Sadly none exist for initiators.

>>50659370
Hamatula strike works on any piercing weapon (so yes you could use it with a bow and arrow, without any strings even), and with a successful grapple you move the target adjacent to you (no matter their original position).

So it works by RAW with hamatula, but it's up to DM veto, for a hook / ropedart type thing like roadhog uses I imagine that most DM's would allow it.

>>50659390
>super genius
That is outside what the DM is allowing for 3pp.
He has kept it to DSP and SoP.

>>50659404
Have you tried asking him specifically about the archetype packages and taking a look at them?

>>50659361
PoW and PoW:e both have a bunch of feats you might want to take a look at. Though I agree that figuring out what feats you want/need can be a pain in the ass.

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>>50659355

I just want highwaysow as a wingman... or woman

>>50657632

Who could possibly want to shoot the breast of BEST Girl with a high-energy laser?

>>50659434
You want a pig that can fly?

>>50659415
No, because the VMC thing, for me, is fairly optional. It's nice because it fits the concept, but hardly needed.
What can you tell me about it, before I try to make the pitch to my DM?
>>50659416
I meandered them for a bit, and there wasn't too much. The PoW books have many feats that cover things that PF did not for some reason, but not too much that helps a strength based face beater beat face better, or give more options to do other than beat it harder/faster/stronger.
From what I've heard, I also do not have access, or want access, to the "good disciplines", so I work with what I got.

Magicians root
>Alchemical ingredient
>DC 5(+1 per use) addiction chance
>+1 int, -1 dex, -1 wiz
>Duration 1 hour
>Vision is blurred and hearing dulled
>The user begins to "feel" stimulus around themselves making up for impaired senses.

Magicians moonshine
>Alchemical potion
>DC 5 (+2 per use) addiction chance
>+2 int, -2 dex, -2 wiz
>Duration 30 min
>User becomes almost completely blind, speech requires DC idk check and an intense ringing roars within the users ears. User can transmit and receive basic information or commands (location, actions, ect) telepathically. The user can chose to give or withhold information however all incoming information is non voluntary and required. User can "feel" surroundings, environment, and organisms nearby (idk how far, help)

>Addiction DC is cumulative between both
>Addiction penalty is -2 int or something while not under the influence
>Frequent use (x uses) causes permanent damage
Thoughts?

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Anyone got that Minos race statblock handy?

>>50659596

#### Minos Characters
Minos are defined by their class levels - they do not possess racial Hit Dice. All Minos have the following racial traits.

- +2 Strength, +2 Constitution,-2 Intelligence: Minos are incredibly strong and tough, but are a bit slow witted.
- Size: Minos are Medium creatures, and they have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
- Speed: Minos have a base speed of 30 feet.
- Languages: Minos begin play speaking Minos and Common. Minos with high Intelligence can choose any languages they want (except secret languages, such as Druidic).
- Powerful Build: The physical stature of Minos lets them function in many ways as if they were one size category larger. Whenever a Minos is subject to a size modifier or special size modifier for a Combat Maneuver Bonus or Combat Maneuver Defense (such as during grapple checks, bull rush attempts, and trip attempts), the Minos is treated as one size larger if doing so is advantageous to him. A Minos is also considered to be one size larger when determining whether a creature's special attacks based on size (such as grab or swallow whole) can affect him. A Minos can use weapons designed for a creature one size larger without penalty. However, his space and reach remain those of a creature of his actual size. The benefts of this racial trait stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the subject's size category.
- Dark Vision 60ft
- Chain Breakers: Minos gain a +2 racial bonus on Strength checks to break objects and a +2 racial bonus on combat maneuver checks to sunder.
- Trampler: Minos gain a +2 bonus on combat maneuver checks made to bull rush or overrun an opponent. This bonus only applies while both the member of this race and its opponent are standing on the ground. When a Minos overruns an opponent they may Trample, as per the universal monster ability, with a slam attack that deals 1d6+1-1/2 their strength

>>50659579
Doesn't follow addiction rules.
Has no combat application, penalties both mechanically and rp-wise for it's use. You'd see it more used in someone's lab when they are using Planar Ally.
Permanent damage? So on top of the temp damage (that ALWAYS outweighs whatever bonuses you get), the addiction downsides AND the mechanical/rp penalties, you are throwing a new foil (that comes up mayber twice with PF drugs) to make it even more unpalatable.
Anon, stop. Drugs are already ignored by 80% of players because their drawbacks greatly outweigh their bonuses.
>>50659596
>titcow race

>>50659640

Thank you senpai!

>>50659652

The Minos are described as tall humanoids with the lower halves of bovine and the upper body of stocky humans.

It's actually quite accurate to the race!

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Tell me about that character you really want to play, but haven't had the opportunity to yet.

I've been wanting to play a Gingerbread Sphere Witch focused on Creation and Alteration, but my GM keeps flaking out. I just want to coat the world in candy.

>>50659652
I never said I was telling my players what it did *wink wink
Maybe they find a mislabeled potion or find a vat of the stuff stewing about

>>50659596

Little do we know is that she's completely flat chested and those are litterally just sacks on her chest for holding things. Look at how the armor is formed under her arm pit.

You know it to be true. Those boobs are LIES!!

>>50659653

No problamo, there's supposedly a pdf of this stuff laying around somewhere, but that's going to be harder to find than the statblock!

There's also an Alternate Racial that got added in where Trampler is replaced with +2 Natural Armor, representing a thick hide.

>>50659666
Stocky != tittymonster, anon, goddamn.
>>50659680
Anon, that is low, and you know it.
If the players are that dumb, then fuck'em, but don't set them up with your custom shit, because the moment they hear "take -1 to these stats, and roll fortitude", they are gonna throw it down a well.

Are there faerie familiars in any of the 3pp stuff?

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>>50659596
>>50659683

>mfw that's not actually a cloth top, but a sculpted breastplate

You know what? Yeah sure, fine. Have the huge tits - somebody's gotta have 'em, and it might as well be the Titcows, eh?

But if you're going to have massive tits and expect to enter battle with armor, at least find a way to squish those girls down so you can fit on some reasonable armor. Like, the Draph from Granblue Fantasy are ubiquitously H-cup+, and they still find the time and ability to put on breastplates.

>>50659714
Fair enough, so just remove all penalties outside of the regular addiction ones in game?

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>>50659434

That webm is great.

>>50659748
I mean if you are going to make a custom drug, then make it something worthwhile.
That means look at how Paizo does it, and throw it out. No one uses drugs outside a very sparse few like harlot sweets because their drawbacks veer into the untenable for their price.
Make it cheep, make it +1/2 -1/2, make it low on the addiction threshold.
If there is something else attached, make it plot hook worthy, something that you can tie into the overarching narrative rather than haha the DM gotchu~ nonsense.

>>50659770
I don't get it

Did we get the paths of prestige leaked yet?

>Feysworn
The spell progression adveances your existing class (+1 existing class), but you have to skip progressing spells at level 1. It grants some neat Fey-related class abilities as well.
Feymarked - You're automatically resurrected on the Frist World if you're slain (there are some other details, but that's the jist of it); immune to spells that don't target Fey.
Obedience - You have to perform daily obedience to your Eldest.
Fey Boons - Gain deific boons based on the eldest you worship.
Breacher - Know where the closet breach to the Frist World is.
Summon Fey - You can summon Fey.
Alien mind - Gain a bonus to saves vs. mind-affecting effects.
Plane Swap - Plane shift to the First World.
Tear Reality - Rip a breach between the First World and MAterial planes to unleash a magical effect.
>Requirements
Feat - Fey Obedience
Languages - Aklo, First Speech, or Sylvan
Skill ranks - Know (planes) 5
Special - Must worship one of the Eldest

>>50659905
>deific obediences?
Lantern King - Light a lamp & tell and story/joke, get a +4 vs. illusions
Lost Prince - Write down a memory on paper, burn it, get a +4 bonus on AoOs when moving through theatened spaces
Ragadahn gets a 2-page write up, with all the typical deity information. Ragadahn also gets numerous mentions throughout the book. I would say it's all interesting. The obedience is cool and grants a nice bonus.
Shykas - Build some simple and fragile, then leave it to deteriorate to get a +2 in Initiative.
Green Mother - So, you have to find a nice patch of vegetation, have sex (by yourself or with someone else), and whisper someone else's secret at the moment of climax. If you do that, you get a +4 bonus on saves vs. mind-affecting effects.

>TANE?!!
The Tane section is written journal entry style and looks like a campaign handout. It's an in-world discussion of the Tane, their origins, and a description of some of them. There are no game rules or stats in here. It's a neat section that looks like something a Pathfinder might write about Tane.

>So what are the lost origins of Gnomes?
There are a number of reasones given for why Gnomes left the First World for the Material Plane. The article states that all are true, but then offers another major reason Gnomes are on Golarion. Finally, there's a "Curator's Note" that basically says that this kind of information is often very unreliable.

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>>50659919
>The Tane section is written journal entry style and looks like a campaign handout. It's an in-world discussion of the Tane, their origins, and a description of some of them. There are no game rules or stats in here. It's a neat section that looks like something a Pathfinder might write about Tane.

Now Tane I could get into.

Paths of Prestige

>Feats
Bladed Brush - Shelyn whorshipers can use Weapon Finesse with Glaives
Daring Exploit — Enhaces ability to use Dare, Deed, or inspiration-type abilities
Erastil’s Blessing - Erastle whorshipers can use Wisdom instead of Dex to maodify bow attacks
Flame Blade Dervish - Grants various bonses when using flame blade
Ghost Whisperer — Grants various bonuses useful for interacting with undead
Guided Star - Desna whorshipers can enhance their starknives
New Thassilonian Magic — Grants some additional goodies to Thassilonian Specialists
Smite Evil Magic — Sunder evil creature's spell effects
Strike True Combat - Enhances Combat Expertise. Spend a Move Action to gain a +4 attack bonus to your next attack before the end of your turn.
Two-Weapon Drunkard Combat - Caydenites fight with a tankard as though it were a light mace
Uncanny Ally - Grants Uncanny Dodge to allies
Prestigious Caster - If I'm reading it correctly, it grants you +1 level in existing class, if you've taken a level in a Favored Prestige Class and it forced you to skip a level of spellcasting. That should mean you gain back 1 level of spellcasting that you've otherwise had to miss out on. You can take it multiple times. Each time gains you back one casting level.
Favored Prestige Class - [No idea, what it does isn't mentioned]


>list the 14 PRCs
ASHAVIC DANCER (Ashava)
BREWKEEPER (Cayden Cailean)
CRIMSON TEMPLAR (Ragathiel)
DARECHASER (Kurgess)
DAWNFLOWER ANCHORITE (Sarenrae)
DEVOTED MUSE (Shelyn)
HERITOR KNIGHT (Iomedae)
HINTERLANDER (Erastil)
ROSE WARDEN (Milani)
RUNEGUARD (Soralyon)
SACRED SENTINEL (Torag)
SCAR SEEKER (Vildeis)
SPHERE SINGER (Desna)
STARGAZER (Pulura)

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>>50660017
>>50659838
Didn't they already use this name for a book? The one that gave us the Swordlord and Magaambyan Arcanist PrCs

>>50660017
>DARECHASER (Kurgess)

Anon.

Please.

Which is better, Summoner or Unchained Summoner? Just in less vague terms, I don't want any "Summoner is best because of synthesist", I want to know which is better and why. I have never really played a Summoner before and I am interested in trying.

Also, is there a way to progress the eidolon while taking levels of Hellknight signifer? Or is Hellknight Signifer just recommended for Wizards who don't really lose anything for taking prestige levels?

>>50660017
>CRIMSON TEMPLAR (Ragathiel)

WE RIP AND TEAR NOW!

>>50660057
Base summoner is "technically" more powerful, but not by much since the Eidolon was nerfed via Flavor Restriction, when the real problem with the class, the Summon Monster spam, was left mostly untouched.
Really the difference between them in terms of power is negligible.

>Also, is there a way to progress the eidolon while taking levels of Hellknight signifer?
Nope, not that I know of. Summoner doesn't Prestige too well.

>>50660052
There's not much since the PDF isn't widely available yet.

>The Darechaser looks like an Investigator that boosts physical abilities and skills rather than mental ones

>Its requirements are what you would expect from a worshipper of the god of athletism
Which means fucking nothing. Maybe Toughness/Endurance? I dunno.

>>50660057
Chained Summoner is better. Less restrictions on the evolutions(since UC Summoner is restricted by the eidolon type) and better spell list.

>>50660017
>HINTERLANDER (Erastil)
>DARECHASER (Kurgess)
>CRIMSON TEMPLAR (Ragathiel)
>BREWKEEPER (Cayden Cailean)
>SCAR SEEKER (Vildeis)

All this want. I dont wanna get too hyped for it though.

>>50660091

What about Heritor Knight and Rose Warden?

>>50660084
Crimson Templar:
Alignment - LG
Deity - Ragathiel
BAB - +6
Feats - Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), Power Attack, Vital Strike

Crimson Templars get:
Fiendish Studies (sorta like Studied Target and/or Favored Enemy)
Obedience
Shield of Wings (grants various bonuses)
Ruthlessness (coup de grace with a bastard sword)
Sneak Attack
Bonus Feats
Divine Boon
Heavenly Fire (adds fire to Sneak Attack)
Immolate (attacks potentially disintegrates evil creatures)

>>50660017
>SPHERE SINGER (Desna)
Anything concrete about this one? Prequisites, skills, feats

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>>50660017
>Edgelordthiel gets a PrC
>but not Based Damerrich
Paizo, I am disappoint.

>>50660116

Milani gets a PrC too! A PrC too!

>>50660110
This sounds about right for the average Ragathiel worshipper.

>>50660116

The Weighted Swing is too serious for a PrC.

>>50660110
Sounds like a paladin alright.

>>50660110

That actually sounds like a useful PrC, or at least like one that managed to blend flavor with mechanics.

>>50660087
>>50660095

Thank you both, I may just look into being a straight summoner.

>>50660105
>>50660108
I'll post what there is.

Heritor Knight:
The heritor knight focuses on emulating the Inheritor as she was in life. To this end, they gain abilities based on the miraculous 11 Acts of Iomedae. Fighters who specialize in the longsword will find the class especially rewarding, but any martial follower of Iomedae can enter with relative ease.

Rose Warden:
Alignment - CG
Deity - Milani
Skill ranks - Disguise 5, Stealth 5
Feats - Iron Will
Rose Wardens are champions of hope for those oppressed by tyrants. Their class abilities are sorta focused on working anonimously and behind the scenes to help people stand up to their oppressors.

Brewmaster:
Alignment - NG, CG
Deity - Cayden Cailean
Skill ranks - Craft (alchemy) 5 or Profession (brewer) 5
Feats - Brew Potion
Spells - Able to cast 2nd-level spells or prepare 2nd-level extracts

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Would Everyman Gaming's Unchained Fighter VMC well with Barbarian?

>>50660114
Sphere Singer:
Alignment - NG, CG, CN
Deity - Desna
Skill ranks - Know (geography) 3, Perform (sing) 6
Feat - Weapon Finesse
Spells - Able to cast 2nd level spells
Special - Proficient with starknife

The sphere singer is more bardic than anything, using specialized performances (known as "starsongs") to support Desna's themes of luck, travel, and dreaming. It's quite whimsical. ^_^ [That face was from the writer's post, not from me]

>What are starsongs? Are they just variety of performances?
Essentially, yes. I wouldn't discount them as "just performances" though - I think the starsongs do some fairly impressive stuff.
>Does spheresinger have something beside them?
Plenty! Power to contact (and eventually influence) others through dreaming, versatile performances, and eventual apotheosis into a fey form.

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Speaking of Prestige Classes, what are the top three PrCs you'd want updated for 2016 Pathfinder?

>>50660244

>Something necromancer based, focus on UD
>Nobel Scion
>Assassin

>>50659787
I get what you are saying now. I was trying to stat out something similar DMT but I forgot that shit doesn't work the same in a fantasy setting. Let me try again

Magicians root
Typedrug, ingested;Addictionminor;Save FortitudeDC (something fair)

Effect (1 hour)
User gains the blindsense special quality (Fair amount of feet), location psionic (I think? Pathfinder format is weird)

User gains low light vision special quality (maybe dark vision or scent idk)

User gains blind fight special quality

Effect (1d3 hour)
User gains thelight blindnessspecial quality, becomingblindedandsickened for 1 round if exposed to bright light, such as sunlight or thedaylightspell, anddazzledfor as long as she remains in areas of bright light.

User becomes partially deafend. He takes a –2 penalty oninitiativechecks, takes a -4 penalty on Perception checks based on sound takes a –2 penalty on opposedPerceptionchecks, and has a 10% chance of spell failure when casting spells with verbalcomponents.

Magicians moonshine is similar but with the upgrades of all the listed effects.

Better? worse? Not good enough?

>>50660187

Well all the Unchained fighter does is make AAT, AWT, and Combat Stamina class features without taking anything away.

However you cant use Combat stamina while fatigued so i'd go against it.

>>50659181
Conceptually it's not bad.

Problem is, what you get out of it.

See, they take the level 1 abilities of a class that aren't spells, and split them ALL up, and give them to you one at a time. If they run out, they go to level 3, and so on.

So while that's not so bad when all you've got coming is sorcerer bloodlines, you've got a distinct... problem on the martials (WHO WOULD'VE THOUGHT).

The gunslinger for example... At level 3 you gain firearm proficiency (you could have it from elsewhere to begin with, and probably HAD to if you started level 1). At level 7 you get gunsmith, but you either had to get your ammo from somewhere (and so needed gunsmith) OR you're in a guns everywhere setting (in which case the VMC is literally uselessly redundant) but either way, you couldn't get level 3 operational without the level 7 ability here if these were your only source of firearms usage. At level 11 you get the amateur gunslinger feat, which means you get one first level deed (woohoo). At this point you've lost three feats to getting three feats that you basically needed to get all at the same time, far far later than you needed to get any of them, and you could have actually gotten more mileage out of simply PICKING THE FEATS, or better yet having taken a firearm archetype for your class. Anyone not forced to VMC would have done all this while getting full BAB and d10HP from just... taking A level of gunslinger - and getting more deeds to boot

>>50660244
Eternal Blade, Telflammar Shadowlord, Runescarred Berserker

>>50660316
>Telflammar Shadowlord

This.

>>50660284
Make it 1d3 hours bonus, and 1d6 hours malus, and I'd be ready to drop that before a extended brawl or dungeoncrawl.
Blindsense, darkvision and blindfight for a pc that lacks all of them in a crawl is highly worthwhile, and a decent crawl usually takes less than 2 hours.
Now the price is where the clincher comes. Is it affordable enough, not for high level adventurers that can get magic to give them the effects, but low level pcs that can't afford such magic dongles, but are looking for a temporary fill in?
This, imo, is where drugs usually fail, being too expensive for a very temporary effect that comes laced with a downside.

>>50659443
To be fair at that point it has nothing to do with the target and everything to do with getting to fire the high energy particle beam (there's no way that's just coherent light)

>>50659338
2-3 usually 3 is better for everyone involved anon, that's a basic rule of pathfinder.

>>50657632
Self-interest above all, with no regards about law or order.

This is why Neutral Evil is the meanest alignment, they don't care about saturday morning plots to ruin the town's water supply and run it into chaos, they only care about themselves.

A lot of what people consider to be "Chaotic Neutral" is actually Neutral Evil.

>>50660430

An unfortunate truth of Pathfinder too is that level 3 encourages odd-numbered attributes, not just because of the whole level 4 thing, but so many players expect the game to die between level 1-4.

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/pfg/, tell me about the houserules you've created for popular 3PPs (psionics, PoW, spheres, ertw's beguiler, ect.) to rein in the shitty powergamer in your group.

>>50660464
>to rein in the shitty powergamer in your group.

I dont actually know what that is like. Maybe I am the power gamer? Who knows.

>>50660480
Do you make character building choices only to be the best in the group and never roleplay?

>>50660480
Is your name Steve? In my experience shitty powergamers are always named Steve.

>>50660464

Usually you fix the powergamer by talking with them about the campaign's scope and how you want them to be a team player.

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>>50660017
>Mfw you can dispel a demiplane through Smite Evil Magic

Question, can someone tell me why a Wizard is better than an Arcanist?

When I read it, the Arcanist's ability to spontaneously cast prepared spells seem more useful than the Wizard's casting.

>>50660017

>Bladed Brush
>Whoreshipper

Oh you sneaky!

>>50660522
Exploiter Pact Wizard says hello!

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Good news everyone!
I know there was some interest in seeing the Old Crow I was making for RotJR. Well she is now finished, and I shall share her with you all.

Here is Umidori Hikari, the Old Crow that's seen some shit.
http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1031974

>>50660501

No.

>>50660486

I like to RP! I think I do it the most in my group.

>>50660526
Except apparently everybody is a whoreshiper, so I am going to guess that's it's just a retarded typo

>>50660392
Cheap enough but illegal, used by """""wizards""""" in the caves or swamps of the desert.

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>>50657632
Posting best Caster

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>>50660594
>Best caster

Ha thou whisheth wench!

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>>50660594
Then why didn't you post Gilly Rays?

>>50660532
I don't know what any of that means

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>>50660650
Exploiter Wizard basically ransacks the Arcanist's best ability (Arcane Pool and Exploits) and runs away laughing.

Pact wizard gets spontaneous casting from their patron spells, an oracle curse, and oracle spells.

It's honestly kinda fucked up how powerful these are together.

>>50660522
A wizard's spells come online one level earlier than an arcanist. That is enough reason in itself.

>>50660536

>tfw you start shooting the shit with another player in semi-freeform and another player character gets salty
>tfw you try egging the other character on to join in but it apparently only gets them even more salty

>>50660714
That sounds pretty great, I am going to look into this.

>>50660733

I never understood that. I try to get people to interact outside the game, in the game forums, even in the game chat.

Fucking silence. Like everyone is afraid to type.

>>50660714
Screw you old man, you the only reason you outshine the martials because Valeros is an idiot and Harsk is a punching bag in everything except the audio dramas.

>>50660733
What the shit? I used to be in campaigns where players would literally run off and do their own stuff on days off or when we couldn't get enough players together to play on game day, at least when it was appropriate to do so. Why the fuck would someone get butthurt over doing that?

>>50660757

I know, right? I'm usually silent in the game forum, but when we're actually in-game I always feel compelled to engage with the environment and characters as often as possible!

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>>50660629
>>50660641
No

>>50660866

I dont mind if people are quiet, I get that. But you could at least pretend you want to be playing the game. And if you dont have anything to say then just chill and chime in when you want. It is okay to talk.

>>50660786

I don't even know, dude. The fourth player jumped into the conversation well before the third player did, and that guy had a blast when our initial nips and jabs turned into playful banter.

It was literally an off-session of the lads sharing a pint down in old Oppara, it was absurdly comfy!

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>>50660872
Your caster might be hot but did she sleep with Cleopatra AND Yang Guifei? Or can she produce one thousand babies from one hundred women?

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>>50660916

My caster made his own perfect waifu clones of himself so there!

>>50660772
How do we rebuild Valeros to be competent, now that we have all these new books.

Hard mode: no 3pp

>>50660997
What is his build anyway, TWF?

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>>50660714
On the topic of Pacts, I'm sort of wondering what would make a good Patron. I'm currently trying to decide between a Mirror Witch and an Exploiter Pact Wizard (The idea being that the character's father formed a bloodline pact with said patron).

I kind of want something that's ambiguous, yet clearly powerful, but I'm not certain what kind of entity would work for that, and what Patron Spell List would work with it on top of that. Can anybody help?

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Damn Vigilantes have a lot of options; I never want to play another martial or sneak attack class again.

Will roll one who wields a scimitar and looks like this.

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>>50661058
Even the stupid stuff it gets - dual identities, for instance, or the magical princess stuff - can be a lot of fun.

Which is kind of hilarious. Most of the time, Paizo takes a good concept and ruins it. Vigilante was a terrible concept, everybody knew it was going to be absolutely terrible, and then suddenly it was a great class. It was such a strange inversion.

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>>50658670
Comly, humble, and with enough power to scare the living shit out of people

>>50661143
is this image going to be posted in all threads now

>>50661084

God, I still remember the threads spent bitching about how awful the Vigilante is going to be, or how worthless the Magical Child archetype was or a million other nitpicks that mellowed out into glowing affirmation of the class.

>>50661143

Avowed (Fey) is a better fit for that ass.

>>50661186

It's not even a nice ass, it's got that thick cellulite look that makes you think it'll probably look like curdled milk when it's jiggling.

Tight bubbly rears from gym bunnies or heck, cushioned Mom butts are better than that.

>>50661205
To be fair, Magical Child is still pretty shitty. Not even Jolly's stuff even props it up, because
>lmao no 7th or 8th level spells in its spell list

>>50657897
> pic
>"he"

Anon, why are you lying?

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GMs: you guys use a screen? If so, do you use the basic PF one, or a different one?
I'm looking at buying http://www.ragingswan.com/raging-swan-press-gm-screen-inserts/ for my group, and making my gm screen out of binders, since I always aim to do a bunch of systems.
If you guys have a better one in mind, I'd give that a look too.

>>50661234
>Jolly can't even prop it up
Never taken a long look at the class, but woah, that's pretty bad.

>>50661302

Disguises and mulibrousous tincture, my friend. That's a he.

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>>50658670
>normal Druids
As someone who guards the wilds not out of a hatred of civilization or an obsession with beasts, but a knowledge that balance must be maintained if the worlds are to coexist.

>Devolutionists
Someone who thinks sapience was a mistake and is willing to end their crusade against it with themselves.

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>>50661353
>Sapience was a mistake

>>50661034
Yep. From what I remember he's actually one of the more competently built iconics.

>>50661347

A guy with a sensitive chest and soft skin is hardly a he, anon!

>>50661401
Why else would they deliberately specialize in removing the self-awareness from people's minds?

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>>50661338
Am also wondering if what I was looking at is in the trove.
I don't need experience point rewards in my DM screen, that's silly. It really doesn't need to be quickly referenced.

>>50661446

But it has a penis, anon!

>>50657632
How do you teach new players to be good at RPGs? Im a long time grognard and Ive started running a pathfinder game for some of my friends who have never really done anything like this before. I had hoped that they would be, at worst, naieve, but its much worse than I could have possibly imagined.

They have a total lack of curiosity, and ignore anything dangerous. All they care about is money.

What am I doing wrong? Ive never run a party this green before, and Ive never seen people who are so basic that their adventurous fantasies peak at "hoard money to start a business selling aftermarket ship refits".

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Alright, I need some advice on some features.

How does Eldritch Heritage (Draconic) Interact with Dragon Disciple?
What about Sorcerer VMC with Dragon Disciple?
Which is generally better choice, the Eldritch Heritage feat chain, or the VMC?
Is it worth it for a Kobold Oracle with the Dragon Mystery and the Scaled Disciple feat to become a Dragon Disciple? or is that just a trap option?
If I were to Gestalt Draconic Sorcerer with Dragon Mystery Oracle, would that cause too much overlap?

Also, in your opinion, what scale-color/subtype of Kobold is best?

>>50661545
So does Forrest, and we love her.

>>50661405
Alright, here's Valeros at level 12:
http://www.pathfindercommunity.net/iconic-characters/valeros---iconic-fighter/valeros-iconic-fighter-12

And it looks like he's a TWF-based fighter. Probably have his focus be Heavy Blades and swap his shortsword for another longsword, grabbing the Effortless Dual-Wielding AWT. Assuming he gets Combat Stamina as a free feat he can do fairly well with his Con score, and maybe trade out Toughness for Weapon Trick (Two-Weapon Tricks), which nets him two attacks as a standard action.

>>50661338
The problem with Magical Child is that it's just an unchained summoner without any pf the good parts. Sure, it can still cast, and it can still fight, and it can still give its familiar the mauler archetyoe(?) and have it go to town... But that's it. Warlock had the exciting-but-mediocre Mystic Bolts, Zealot was a discount Inquisitor/Paladin, Cabalist is "THE BLOOD: The Movie: The Game: The Archetype".

This is made worse because Transformation Sequence, the ONE GIMMICK the magical child had, is now available to any Vigilante with any kind of magic at all. Presumably SLAs count for that. All it costs is one social talent, which could be a decent trade if you wanted swift action identity swaps.

>>50661552
>What am I doing wrong?
Well, for starters, you're running Pathfinder for people who have never played before.

>>50661552
1. Do not use PF as a way to teach a player good game etiquette. Just like D&D, it comes down to the game's focus.
2. Scrap your current game.
Begin a new one where they are landed knights under the service of a lord. Strip away the necessity of getting paid, give them status that does not need to be earned, but maintained and can be built upon.
3. Use milestones rather than XP, and non-monetary rewards, good ones, rather than giving them loot. Focus the game on doing things for reasons other than getting paid.
4. Have them build characters together AND creating backstories as a group, not as individuals. This goes a long way towards discouraging dickhole pcs and outrageous backstories.

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>>50661631
>Begin a new one where they are landed knights under the service of a lord. Strip away the necessity of getting paid, give them status that does not need to be earned, but maintained and can be built upon.

I want this. Can we play this game /pfg/? pretty please?

>>50661694
You have not played a game like this?
I've been in such games, my old grognard DM did exactly this to deal with players like >>50661552 is dealing with, who have no ambition and are blinded by big numbers.
By making the game about something other than the numbers racket, the players must find something else to hold tight to.
Being Big Damn Heroes usually does the trick, so long as the DM allows the world to treat them like Big Damn Heroes.

>>50661715

Nope, never. It would be the best!

Which AP would be best to turn into an Eroticly-Charged Lewdventure?

>>50661694

I want it too, I need it bad!

>Each character gets a horse, squire and stout keep protecting a village they rule over
>Downtime rules are in effect, money you pour into your village through construction or gifts will increase your monthly income

And then the crusades are called and the party must venture far away to the Holy Land, where they have the potential to become mighty counts and dukes (or even a crusader king) yet giving up everything in their old plot of land

>>50661611
Its what they wanted. If I had my way we would have started with mouseguard.

>>50661786

Shattered Star and Jade Regent!

>>50661786

Iron Gods!

>>50661823
Wait, why shattered star?

It's just a lot of dungeon crawling.

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>>50661631
>>50661694
>I will never play a knightly game
>it will never be a gestalt, wherein I make one side a Vigilante with the Obscurity Talent
>I will never get to be some mysterious middle-aged knight who's been in service for decades
>I will never have the reason for my obscurity being that I am actually a Literal Animal in disguise

>>50661786
>>50661823
>Shattered Star book 2
>except in an erotic lewdventure game

good god no, it was bad enough playing through it with a normal party, I don't want to hear people fighting over who gets to be turned into a literal whore.

>>50661848
Book 2 and the Sorshen trap.

>>50661791

Why are there no comfy games like this?

>>50661823
>>50661786
>STILL falling under Sorshen's control

You were meant to destroy the Runelords, not join them! Bring balance to the world, not leave it in ruin!

>>50661631
How do you scrap a game without players feeling like its a punishment? The only reason I ask is because there's a lot of implicit cross-accusation on the subject of who's sandbagging the team and making the game run like molasses with ADHD, so Im afraid that if I scrap the game that they'll all blame eachother rather than recognize that they're all a fault for being such utter shitbirds.

>>50661855
>>50661854

There was a knightly campaign that was recruiting a few months ago that was all about this!

Didn't start as Knights though, the players were Knight-hopefuls who must perform great works to get Senpai to notice them and do the old tappity on the clavicle.

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>>50661844
Cuz Robowaifu I assume. Though which one? The good robot or the bad robot.

>>50661854
I don't remember that trap.

But it has these, right?

>>50661854
sorchen is too powerful just to be a whore
she fucks you, not the other way around

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>>50661553
Hello? Anyone?

>>50661888
>>50661631
The other reason I dont run a game like this is because they all insist on just the most special snowflakes they can. One of them, first thing when we did character creation, asked me if there was any way he could be a God, then went down the list asking if he could be a demigod, half god, an angel, or half angel, where I finally relented and let him play an aasimar.

>>50661799
You should have persuaded them, or ran a different fantasy game that isn't as fraught with problems for rookies.
You got my vote, anon, good luck.
Other advice:
No electronics at the table, period. Paper, pencil, dice, a beverage only.
TAKE COMMAND. Run the ship tight as a drum. When you speak, they are sitting and listening. If they don't hear you, they don't get a repeat. Stomp out the embers of drama IMMEDIATELY. Pull people aside, tell them when/how they are fucking up and instruct them to stop, or begin a process of reconciliation.
Pull them together! Put people on the spot occasionally, but draw players out. Give them plot hooks, make them attractive, make them dangerous, make it so they can't be ignored. Find out which among them will stand up, he is the leader, and will be the iron heart of your group, and unless they are a fuckwit, your route into the players' heads.
>>50661872
You round them up, and YOU take responsibility. Man the fuck up, because if it has gotten to this point, YOU HAVE BEEN FUCKING UP.
This shit should have been handled weeks ago, and you know it. Drop your balls, apologize for your poor DM behavior, reset.

>>50661888
>There was a knightly campaign that was recruiting a few months ago that was all about this!

Now I am just sad.

>>50661791

>you will never notice the peasantry organizing a harvest festival
>You will never secretly fund the celebration and secure rare foods, spices and alcohol
>You will never watch the revelry from the sidelines, before a peasant girl pulls you in to dance with her

>You will never go to tournaments, participate in a melee or earn a noble title.

WAKE ME UP INSIDE

>>50661930
It hasnt been weeks, Ive been trying everything to get these fuckers to get in line once every other week for six months.

I also reject the idea that this is my fault. I have never in my life encountered people this shitty, how was I supposed to know that people this idiotic would even be capable of breathing, let alone wanted to play RPGs.

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>>50661338
>>50661540

>>50661715
>Being Big Damn Heroes usually does the trick
Not him but I tried that, didn't really appeal to them at all.

I'm pretty sure if I charged them,with land they'd dump the rights to it on the next sapient they saw just to spite me.

>>50661909
>Cuz Robowaifu I assume. Though which one? The good robot or the bad robot.

BOTH ROBOTS. WAIFU EVERY ROBOT AND ROBOT ACCESSORY.

>>50661927

Almost everyone wants to become a god when they first start out, I wouldn't get too worked up over it.

Though I really do agree the special snowflake habits of people in these campaigns are obnoxious. Is it really that hard to play a native from the region?

>>50661927
That is to be expected from new players who do not know the tropes, stereotypes and scope of the game.
It's up to you to teach them this.
>>50661957
Anon, realize something: You have been playing games for so long you have forgotten what it means to not already know how it works.
You are the gm, shit rises to the top, not the bottom, and at the end, it's the GM's responsibility to make the game work, however that must be. If you can't take responsibility for your game, then it was dead before it began.
I have brought in plenty of new players, and most have turned out fairly savvy because I am on their shit. I am making sure they are challenged, and demand that they listen, learn and rise to the occasion.
Realize that the first thing people hear about rpgs is "You can do or be anything". What they don't hear is "Within reason and scope of the game you are playing", so yes, you will have new players asking if they can be this powerful thing or that character from this show or whathaveyou, because that is all they know. You bring them down to earth, you break them of the ideas that are shit, in reprogram with the ideas that matter.
>>50662022
>they'd dump the rights to it on the next sapient they saw just to spite me
You had shit players, and there was a clear disconnect between yourself and them. Did you talk to the players individually and find out what kind of game they wanted, in what setting? I actually used CofD Werewolf for an entirely new group once because it is implicitly about a group, a family, that while abrasive and sometimes at odds, comes together as one for each other and what is theirs.

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>>50662028
Why not all three?

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>>50661888
I remember that one. I should have joined it, but I didn't think I had enough time to learn both Spheres, PoW, AND Gestalt in order to send in an app.

>>50661909
>>50661910
It's a Sepulcher with a clone body of Sorshen, which triggers a phantasmal killer effect on the first person who touches it. If the person who triggers it dies, they wake up in a clone body of Sorshen. If they fail the will save, but don't die to the trap, then they're "tied" to the trap and will wake up in the body if they die from anything else. Another player in my group freaked about it when I forgot about it and triggered it, so the GM had to retool the entire trap.

I still expect the other player to freak a little when the clone body gets up anyway, and it's revealed to be running off a piece of my PC's soul.

>>50662029
Eh, depends, really.
Most of the time, you want to use an idea you have, and the "region" is for some reason incredibly homogenized.

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>>50662029

>mfw the players with the weirdo races get all fanny-flustered when the normal-ass human from the region accidentally becomes the Party Face
>mfw I just wanted to play a yokel with a heart of gold whose sorrow over the kingdom's turmoil turned into a seething, burning desire to Make This Right.

>>50662072
You cant have it both ways. You cant say "you need to be personally responsible for the quality of your players" and then turn around and say "that example is irrelevant because your players are shit". Im trying to take responsibility by finding the right carrot and the right stick. I think this has far less to do with these guys being new, and far more to do with a fundamental lack of creativity and curiosity. Ive tried giving them titles, ties, friends, a cause, a quest, and even a job, and all of it falls by the wayside the second things get even the slightest bit dangerous, they run away, and then get started on something else. That behavior isnt tied to their characters, its tied to who they are as people, and I need to find a way to break them of the habit.

>>50662124

Yeah, and the idea always seems to be some bullshit about being an Easterner with a Japanese Sword (also known as a Katana) in the middle of Fantasy Poland.

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>>50661553
Gonna try to bump this question again

>>50660017
>Erastil’s Blessing - Erastle whorshipers can use Wisdom instead of Dex to maodify bow attacks

Wha-
Is this attack or attack and damage?
Considering bows aren't even bothered with stat to damage too much, this is a step above Desna style.
>Actually useful weapon
>Actually useful stat to SAD into

>>50661956

>you will never ride out with your knights to put down the brigands who have been bothering your peasants
>you will never help them rebuild after a large storm
>you will never watch your fledgling village grow into a bustling town

At least I can day dream?

>>50662199
>>50661553
>>50661915
I literally cannot read past the first line of that without my brain rejecting it and moving on to something more important. If you're trying to play a build that is both creative and optimal then you must walk that path alone.

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>>50662178
But what if I just want to take those mechanics and play a Not!Russian swordlord?

>>50662219
>If you're trying to play a build that is both creative and optimal then you must walk that path alone.
>implying Stormwind
gee, thanks anon

>>50662148
>You cant have it both ways
His situation is not yours.
I said YOU need to take responsibility for your game. You have players that needed to be shepherded, and it is becoming clear that you weren't prepared for a group of rookies you needed to bottlefeed.
The other guy had players willing to specifically spite him, which means there was a massive disconnect in play.
Unless your players have specifically gone out of their way to screw you, and only you, over, his example is not yours.
In his, they are assholes.
In yours, they are rookies reacting to the dissonance of expectations v reality, and the game is suffering because of that.
Have you pulled them aside to explain to them the expectations of the game at it's core, and why what they are doing does not work?
Have you asked them individually what they are looking for in the game, what they feel rpgs are about?
>>50662178
Yes, because Fantasy Poland != Real life Poland.

>>50662178
This is honestly why are start my campaigns and shit in trade hubs/major metropolitan areas where you can probably find just about anything if you look hard enough.

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>>50662244

Well that's delightful and great, but you're never met with Aleksander Restovski the snot-nosed punk with an Aldori Dueling Sword, it's always Murashima Toshinori of Minkai that somehow ended up in the ass end of the Greenbelt after taking the Path of Aganhei or something!

What gestalts well with kinetcists/blasters in general?

I can't really seem to think of anything that would really help them aside from something that gave them more BAB/saves etc?

>>50662272
Fuck you, I was Al-alharim, the crippled Quadasim with a talwar that was a gift from my captain upon being discharged from the military.
That said, if you get that booty-blasted from animays, you may need to find a different hobby. PF/D&D was never a hallmark of European fantasy at any point.

>>50662256
I have tried both of those things. I explained, in detail, why things like starting a business were boring and not terribly well done in Pathfinder, and that the game is more suited to adventuring than anything else.

As for discussing individual motivations, I got a mix of "kill shit", "make money" and in one case their response was the first 12 words of the original Pokemon theme song.

If that doesnt sound like it can be fixed, Im perfectly willing to just abandon the game. The way I see it though, if it can be fixed then there's no reason why it cant be fixed in situ, and Id rather not invest introducing them to a new system and setting if there's no greater chance they'll learn.

>>50662330
For kineticists:
>Spherecaster that uses CON as its casting stat
>Fighter (Not even kidding)
>Avowed goes with everything

>>50662256
>Yes, because Fantasy Poland != Real life Poland.

I expect Fantasy Poland to look like Real Life Poland just enough so that I'm not questioning where the heck I am every darn tooting second.

It honestly just reeks of American writers who are utterly convinced the rest of the world is a heterogeneous rainbow confection of people just like their own pleasant little slice of upper-middle class suburbia. The kind of writers that bitched at CDPROJEKT for not including more brown people in The Witcher 3.

>>50662371
>I expect Fantasy Poland to look like Real Life Poland
And what game was this, anon?

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>>50662272
See, it's always because there's that one faggot who bitches about refluffing. Maybe I want to take Jolly's Mercurial Duelist and make him be some kid from Not!Russia, then refluff that Katana to be the family's specially-made dueling sword, but NOOOO, you can't do that because the Dueling Sword exists! Nevermind that it is functionally just a longsword.

>>50662371
Yeah, but people have a habit of getting around. A SAMOORAI in muh fantasy poland would be pretty rare, but not impossible.

One incredibly confused foreigner doesn't turn MUH 100% WHITE NO CHINKS, NIGGER, SPICS ALLOWED fantasy Poland into a "heterogeneous rainbow".

>>50662401
No, it's just another case of the anti-weeaboos or germanaboos getting butthurt at the merest mention of anything east of Greece.
>>50662449
You have a better chance of getting a argument from a dedicated weeaboo than his type. I have one in my group, and I bring in characters with "katanas" all the time just to spite him.

>>50662449
>One incredibly confused foreigner doesn't turn MUH 100% WHITE NO CHINKS, NIGGER, SPICS ALLOWED fantasy Poland into a "heterogeneous rainbow".

Last time I was in a Kingmaker campaign my character wound up being the only Brevic human in the party, the rest of them were either from wayyyy far south or wayyyy far east or straight-up "raised in the wilds" animal-things.

My character felt more in touch with the NPCs than his own party. The heterogeneous rainbow might not have been very large, but it was hanging over my character's head every fucking second.

>>50661545
But is it a feminine penis?

>>50662487
That sounds more like you and/or your character being a bit of a xenophobic cunt.

>>50662487

That is on the GM. Creation rules are there so the party has coherence. People have to have a reason for being where they are. Wandering adventure only takes you so far.

>>50662487
>>50662518
>player party made up of exceptional people from places far away
>mad about one of the oldest ideas in fiction
Y'know, Conan LEFT Sumeria and never actually went back, instead going around the known world kicking ass, getting rich/laid, and establishing his own kingdom miles away from his homeland.
>>50662513 called it, you were being a dick and likely playing out your own issues in a game.

>>50662531
It's Kingmaker. The whole point of it is that you stop being wandering adventurers and settle down to make a kingdom.

>>50662466
>>50662513

You sound upset, are you really going to call me a "xenophobic cunt" for wanting a bit of thematic consistency in a campaign? It really is as >>50662518 put it and it was on the DM to rein them in, but I get the niggling sensation you'd be telling me, "that GM was a 'xenophobic cunt'" for telling the other party members to *maybe* look a bit into the native region and figure out any ways they could get their concept from Issia or Port Ice or Restov or heck, the River Kingdoms.

>>50662556
>and establishing his own kingdom miles away from his homeland.

Missed a part there friend.

>>50662531

This isnt iron gods. It is Kingmaker. It would be like running a Grey Gardner campaign where a Shackles pirate shows up to run a country instead of a ship.

Why is it that clerics can be any alignment, but they've got all these mechanical differences with positive/negative energy that pretty much -solely- affect their interactions with undead? Why not require clerics be any non-evil, and have a separate necromancer class? Not every evil god has association with undead.

>>50662602
might as well ask why every cleric knows how to inflict/cure wounds
Why not separate healing to another class because not every god is a healing god

>>50662559
>re you really going to call me a "xenophobic cunt" for wanting a bit of thematic consistency in a campaign?
You can still have thematic consistency beyond "PC's are all from the same area/ethnicity/etc". There's a lot of people moving around Golarion, and you can probably encounter most f the races anywhere given the fact you can walk to just about anywhere that isn't !Mesoamerica.

There's nothing wrong with asking people to take a look at more native concepts but don't get mad when they don't do it because they don't want to play that.

>>50662531
>>50662571

Yeah, and Aragorn was of Arnor and Gondor by blood and knew it was his destiny to return to his homeland, take up his crown and rule his people after a lifetime of wandering.

This is Brevoy we're talking about, not Andoran or Cheliax or Taldor where anyone and everyone from anywhere could be hanging out. It's a respectable yet northernly kingdom in the ass-end of nowhere whose native population is almost entirely some shade of Ulfen, Taldan or native Hallit.

>>50662602
Because while pathfinder is flush with free content, it is not flush with common sense or principled design. There is no higher reason beyond the opinion of the person who wrote that particular aspect of the system, then forgot about it and wrote something equally unhinged.

>>50662620
You're kind of right. Clerics are conceptually dumb in the context of a large pantheon. They make the most sense when you're just dealing with a Christian god. Dammit gygax.

>>50662559
>thematic consistency
You mean the theme of adventurers leaving their homeland to wander, sometimes far from home, in search of life, wealth, happiness?
The problem is that you wanted other people to fit your own idea of "proper characters", and when they didn't, you proceeded to clearly hold a grudge against them, despite how in the game, you would have had plenty of time to get to know them as individuals. You seem to have chose not to, maintaining a vaguely nationalistic, xenophobic bend that doesn't serve the game at all.
>>50662597
>>50662641
>It is Kingmaker.
>points to Conan example, where he murdered the corrupt king on his throne and became a beloved king in a land that considered his kind savages at best
This is more what you wanted, not the tone of the campaign.

>>50662602
Numeria literally borders the river kingdoms. Shit iirc there's even an artifact weapon that functions as an non-magical +2 Adamantine weapon or something like that from Numeria that shows up in one of the books.

Besides that's not his point. The premise of Kingmaker is that some adventurers got a permit to settle an area. There is shit fuck about needing to be a native for the campaign to make sense.

>>50662664
I think Cleric is conceptually dumb as a class period.

>>50662667
>>50662677

He is not talking about the campaign making sense. He is talking about party cohesion and how poorly written back stories are just lazy on the part of players and no one wants to play with you if you cannot put time into character creation.

I guess paizo does actually post here.

>>50662664
Community both hates Core rulebook and at the same time massively objects touching it

>>50662717
They're definitely over powered.

>>50662730

No he isn't. He's whining that he doesn't like that everyone wasn't a Brevic and how that shat on cohesion despite you having many other ways to make a cohesive party that isn't dependent on where the characters are from.

>>50657743
Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes

>>50662732
It's a shame. It really was super good at the time. I guess the holes just started to show as time passed. I think they just tried to do too much.

>>50662730
Part cohesion is not made by your backstory, you fool, and when has it ever?
Actual party cohesion has always stemmed from interacting and learning who the other people are.
For 60% of groups, they are people brought together by circumstance, and yes, that works. Saying you are all friends via backstory is the lazy way, often a shortcut, but that isn't what you are talking about.

/pfg/, how do you make your maps for online games? I hear a lot about tiled, but I don't really know where to look for tilesets or anything.

>>50662759

No you said that! He didnt like how no one was able to relate to the people in the game except him!

>>50662781

>the back story has no play on party cohesion

Dropped. Not even going to bother reading the rest of your post.

>>50662664
>Clerics are conceptually dumb in the context of a large pantheon
>mortal representatives of the gods charged with ministering over their particular faithful, bringing doctrine to others and maintaining houses of worship is conceptually dumb
Why is this?

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>>50662667
>You seem to have chose not to, maintaining a vaguely nationalistic, xenophobic bend that doesn't serve the game at all.

>Campaign that prominently features a kingdom falling apart right next door should not feature some degree of nationalism

Nigga what?

>You mean the theme of adventurers leaving their homeland to wander, sometimes far from home, in search of life, wealth, happiness?

Which is one of the driest concepts imaginable for a character, you know. Every character should have a reason for doing what they're doing and, most importantly, ending up in the campaign location in a way that makes sense. Brevoy is not a place your average Tien will decide is a fantastic place to live, they'll be settling in the Land of the Linnorm Kings, a region I personally have no problem with seeing samurai and ninja in.

>The problem is that you wanted other people to fit your own idea of "proper characters", and when they didn't, you proceeded to clearly hold a grudge against them, despite how in the game, you would have had plenty of time to get to know them as individuals.

Or maybe it's because they wound up doing fucking nothing with their backstory (because it was from so far away) and I ended up having to take the lion's share of NPC interaction and plot advancement because my character, more than any other, had a legitimate investment in both the region and the campaign plot? Being some swarthy foreigner is SHIT for giving a damn about the region, and when someone who has investment suddenly becomes the big dick party organizer I got nothing but grumbles.

>>50662775
No, the problem is with the scope of Pathfinder
If Pathfinder became Golarion the RPG rather than restoration of 3.5, you would probably see every god having their own class of cleric.

But Pathfinder cannot really have class packages that make sense in only one setting, because they are selling it as the "baseline fantasy rpg" for everyone to make their shitty fucking homebrew settings on. But on the other hand, they will never print rules they can't use themselves.

Jack of all trades, the ruleset. Pleasing the majority, not none of the niche.
Expect the niche will be served by the 3pp, like vultures settling on the bloated corpse. DSP for example...

>>50662809
> He didnt like how no one was able to relate to the people in the game except him!

>My character felt more in touch with the NPCs than his own party.
No it was HIM who couldn't relate to the party, not the NPCs and the party or the party and the NPCs

>>50662840

Because their back stories were shit! Fuck off you illiterate pile of steaming paizo shit. At this point any replies are bait. No one is this dumb.

>>50662830
Thank God its not though, Golarion is probably in the running for top 10 worst default RPG settings.

Vizier may not be the best on its own, but it's pretty damn good as part of a gestlalt. I think I may have to give Akasha a more thorough lookthrough at some point.

>>50662840

NPCs grow and evolve right alongside the PCs, anon.

>>50662825
>Which is one of the driest concepts imaginable for a character, you know.
Not really, no
>Brevoy is not a place your average Tien will decide is a fantastic place to live,
Good thing your a fucking adventure and PCs and their circumstances are almost never fucking "average".

>>50662815
But the god of War's clerics... Heal. Or heal undead. And so do the goddess of water's clerics. And the god of paying your bills on time. All of their mortal representatives heal if they are good, heal undead if they are evil, or do either if they are neutral. See the disconnect?

>>50662860
Sure, but official settings usually overpower fanmade settings by mere volume of fluff.

Your best ideas are useless unless backed by even more best ideas to flesh it out.

>>50662830
>Jack of all Trades
>half the system is tied up on vancian and pseudo-vancian casting

Pick one, faggot. D&D's "vancian" casting only makes sense in the subset of settings that are entirely based on D&D.

>tfw you're Asian and like playing Tian characters because you're yellow
>people think you're a weeb

some of us don't want to play-act as white people all the time with a good reason

>>50662809
>He didnt like how no one was able to relate to the people in the game except him!
Then why didn't his character learn?
>>50662825
>I didn't bring other people into interaction with the world, instead doing it all myself, by myself
>continues to ignore the original kingmaker example that inspired the AP he was playing
You know it's pretty shitty of a player to monopolize social interactions, regardless if you think you "should be". Why wasn't the native population willing to work with people who were doing what they could for them?
Why were you the only one doing it?

>>50662883
You say that like fluff volume is a good thing by any metric after about the 15 page mark.

>>50662874
That's not even relevant to the discussion. His character didn't want to connect with the party because they weren't brevic.
>>50662855
And that wasn't in the original post and we have no way of knowing the quality of their backstories because the guy is mad that everyone didn't make a vaguely eastern European white dude.

>>50662881
>But the god of War's clerics... Heal. Or heal undead.
You are looking at the mechanical effects alone, rather than what they mean.
Channel Energy represents a connection to higher power. To channel positive energy is to heal your flock, to channel negative energy is to drive foes of the flock away.
That it heals undead is an incidental thing of the system, not a feature of being a cleric.

>>50662888
I would cut my arm off to go back in time and erase the concept of Vancian casting from existence. Its just so fucking shitty from a gameplay, thematic, and narrative perspective, and I cant believe its stuck around this long.

>>50662939
I think his problem is that a war god would want to heal anybody.

>>50662952
From what I understand, Vance himself made it work rather well. The problem isn't vancian casting itself, it's that D&D made it the default.

I was reading the potion creation rules, and I'm a little confused. Like, bulls strength, sure, the drinker gets the strength bonus. But what happens if I drink a potion of Continual Flame? Does the inside of the drinker's mouth glow? Does it fizzle? What happens if you drink a potion of color spray?

>>50662952
Yet when it was done away with, people howled about it not being muh D&D.
It works in Vance's setting because it has hardcoded rules that couldn't be ignored like in D&D.

>>50662888
People copy it to their own settings because it is in DnD
>>50662923
Write enough fluff and some will stick.
All of it does not have to turn out to be megapopular. You just write enough that there is something for everyone.

Or you just write something "completely different" and hope you become some freak niche setting that gets some cult following, like Dark Sun.

>>50662875
>Not really, no

Umm, yes? It's one of the cookie cutter backstory excuses to get your character out on the road. It's the sign of a shitty character.

>Good thing your a fucking adventure and PCs and their circumstances are almost never fucking "average".

And yet you're giving us one of the most classic excuses for doing anything ever, "I want a good life."

Yeah, and that good life somehow manages to take you from Minkai to Brevoy without an explanation beyond "I traveled."

>>50662892

>Why were you the only one doing it?

Because the other players were more interested in the immediate concerns of the quest, while my character made it a point to interact with the other NPCs about the succession crisis or House politics, which eventually made the DM realize "hey, I like RPing with this guy more than the others, I think I'll throw in some Brevoy-relevant NPCs."

Also you'd be SHOCKED how much more motivated you are to roleplay when your character actually has an investment in the region! It's almost like a local patriot with a sword will have more meat to chew on than Local Murderhobo with Sad Backstory from Region We'll Never Visit.

>>50662928

My character connected in the "business associates" way, anon. He felt more kinship with the Brevic NPCs because they share a cultural heritage *and* friendship, while the PCs were just comrades.

>because the guy is mad that everyone didn't make a vaguely eastern European white dude.

Or you know, they could've made a Galtian refugee, or a former slave that escaped through the River Kingdoms to Brevoy, or an Iobarian villager or some other thing that makes sense.

>>50662962
You can't fight anymore if everyone is dead.

>>50662890
And I'm 1/8th Oglala, doesn't mean I insist on playing Arcadians when it doesn't fit.
Nor would I play as an Ulfen in a Mwangi campaign
Or a Keleshite in a Tianxia campagin
Or a Brevin in an Akiton campaign
If you're so insecure as to make your own race be the sole controlling factor of what you play as, then you yourself have a problem with racial relations.

>>50662998
That seems like a fairly strong endgame for a war god.

>>50662962
Because it is a god of war, not death or slaughter, and if everyone is dead, then the war stops.
You are also mistaking positive/negative energy as something relative to the gods, rather than something above even them.

Rolled 1, 2 + 2 = 5 (2d5 + 2)

>>50662490
wanna find out?

>>50663018
Im not objecting to the very idea, Im just explaining where that guy is coming from: you would think that a war god would bestow something more useful or related to their aspect rather than healing. Like, if a war god were to have an avatar on the face of the earth, healing would probably be pretty low down the list of their blessings. And yet, it gets top billing on all vaguely good gods, regardless of their aspect.

>>50662993

>Also you'd be SHOCKED how much more motivated you are to roleplay when your character actually has an investment in the region! It's almost like a local patriot with a sword will have more meat to chew on than Local Murderhobo with Sad Backstory from Region We'll Never Visit.

This is one of the strongest reasons to have a "native" character. The plot is actually impactful then, the BBEG is no longer "just some bad guy who did the meanie" he's a legitimate Tyrant that has oppressed your people, your FAMILY, for years and it's time to stop him, dammit!

And DMs pick up on this, which leads to favoritism.

>>50662993
>mad that people didn't make characters the way he thinks they should have
>players got mad when they noticed the DM CLEARLY FAVORING A PLAYER, but that is ok
>hey share a cultural heritage *and* friendship
Fuck out of here with that. That makes no sense at all, considering that irl, people from different VILLAGES would consider the other barely relatable.
Your idealized thought of nationalism doesn't even apply the way you think it does. You got a free pass because you could fellate the DM the best.

>>50662993
> It's one of the cookie cutter backstory excuses to get your character out on the road. It's the sign of a shitty character.
Classic doesn't mean bad. You honestly sound like you have some kind of chip on your shoulder.

>>50663018
You've locked onto the idea that it's justifiable. And it is. But that doesn't mean it makes the most sense or the best option, just because you can justify it. In my mind, the original idea of holy men healing is a Christian idea, and it carried through. It's like the reason you have 6 items in league of legends. It wasn't an active, real design decision. It's because there were 6 item slots on WC3, so there were 6 in dota, and League didn't bother to change it. I feel like the cleric healing, regardless of God or domain (I can take fire and destruction and channel positive energy) is a holdover, not an active thought.

>>50661553
>How does Eldritch Heritage (Draconic) Interact with Dragon Disciple?

Eldritch Heritage can't be used with a bloodline you have, when you take a level of DD, you will end up with a dead feat that your DM may let you retrain. Why? Because of the line "This bloodline cannot be a bloodline you already have." this is saying if you have a previous bloodline, you cannot double it up. And I think this would also encompass both. Ask your DM, as they have the final say, but as a DM myself, I would say the feat becomes moot and you would be able to retrain it.

>What about Sorcerer VMC with Dragon Disciple?
Your effective sorcerer level is equal to your character level by VMC. Dragon Disciple is your effective sorcerer level is equal to your sorcerer levels plus DD. You have an effective sorcerer level, not sorcerer levels. If you were say Bard 5/DD 2 with Sorcerer VMC, your effective sorcerer level would be 7, not 9.

>Which is generally better choice, the Eldritch Heritage feat chain, or the VMC?
VMC if you don't need the feats. Otherwise Eldritch Heritage is fine.

>Is it worth it for a Kobold Oracle with the Dragon Mystery and the Scaled Disciple feat to become a Dragon Disciple? or is that just a trap option?
You end up with a lot of overlap with abilities, but it's your choice man.

>If I were to Gestalt Draconic Sorcerer with Dragon Mystery Oracle, would that cause too much overlap?
Yes, usually when people gestalt you try to vary what you can do, if you wanna go for that, then I guess you can.

>Also, in your opinion, what scale-color/subtype of Kobold is best?
Green dragons are my fave, mainly because of the corrosive gas breath.

>>50663081
>is a holdover
Pathfinder is a holdover

>>50663009
>1/8th oglala
hahaha is that how the hipsters say they're cherokee these days

File: tattoomap.png (395KB, 853x480px) Image search: [Google]

395KB, 853x480px

I want to put together a character who is a criminal from the gulags of Irrisen to submit in the RotJR campaign. Basically the only demand I have for him to be covered in Vory-style tattoos. Anybody have build suggestions?

>>50663042
>>50663081
It is because you are looking at a cleric as though it is a warrior, rather than a supporter of that god's doctrine and defender of his worshippers.
Evil gods have a native connection to negative energy, good gods positive. What you are actually talking about are the domains clerics have have access to, which are the direct influences of gods.
I am coming from a standpoint that I understand what the logic behind it is, ie clerics carry the god's particular ethos to the people, and defend the god's people via supportive (if channeling positive energy) or offensive (if channeling negative energy) ways.
Tell me why this explanation does not suffice entirely, or point out where it's logic breaks down that does not rely on mechanics alone.

>>50663124
Fuck you, my mom actually grew up on the Reservation in Pine Ridge, until she was older and her dad got a job with a road construction company to get his family out of the reservation, since he was afraid of the government stealing his children

>>50663124
He's got a point though. A lot of my family is French, but I don't like playing assholes.

>>50663146
Its not that its illogical, its that its thematically unsatisfying that all good gods, regardless of aspect, dole out essentially identical power. Its like divine power health insurance supplied by your employer: its all roughly the same, with slight differences depending on benefits negotiation.

You are logically correct within the metaphysical framework of Pathfinder and DnD, its just that that framework sucks ass.

We're sortof having two different arguments.

>>50663146
That's the problem. You aren't "wrong," the argument is sound, and I can't just say you're incorrect. But that doesn't make you write, and it doesn't mean you have the lay of what the designers intended by merit of not being wrong. Be careful with that. There are a lot of equally justifiable stances, don't cling to tightly to the one that makes the most sense to you. You'll alienate good ideas.

>>50663130
Tattooed Sorcerer||Warlord

>>50663160
you're not seriously equating having 1/8 of some blood with being completely yellow-skin, are you?

>>50662800
I'd like to know this too.

>>50663160
If you're 1/8th, that would mean your mother grew up on the reservation despite only one of her grandparents actually being Oglala, which seems like an unnecessary use of the tribe's extremely limited resources.

>>50663146
Actually no god has connection to positive and negative energy planes
They are really their own things