>Latest News Fighter UA is out! https://dnd.wizards.com/a

File: 2000yearsago.jpg (204KB, 505x462px) Image search: [Google]

204KB, 505x462px

what's the biggest thing you've ever fought?

Can't wait for this thread to be all arguing fighter UA too!

Fuck, already?

>>50549401
Knight. Arcane archer is cool but needs adjustment so it scales better. Sure their "maneuvers" deal a bit more damage than BM but BMs get 4 per rest to start with, and more later. Samurai seems almost as strong as Knight but I'm not a weeb. Sharpshooter is... mainly meh. Something that you get from the feat anyway, plus a bit more damage, three times per rest?

File: 1474446158899.jpg (428KB, 1600x1136px) Image search: [Google]

428KB, 1600x1136px

Just rolled stats for a new char, the lightning thing did not work out so at this point I am open to anything. I want help using these good stats :)


Stats: 16 15 15 12 11 9

>>50549401
>Which UA Fighter archetype are you most excited to play as?
Arcane Archer, I really liked the subclass, it's my fav gish right now, I just wanted you had more magic arrows /rest....

Samurai. Looks like it's built to survive shit and make dramatic last stands. I'm a huge sucker for that.

Knight is great, too, for a front line leader-ish type character.

>>50549401
>Which UA Fighter archetype are you most excited to play as?
Knight is pretty boss. My GM doesn't allow UA because most of it is imbalanced shit, but if I play with someone else I'd love to try that. I dislike the overlap with sentinel but eh, marking is cool.
Second place would go to Samurai for a low level game, SS and AA are kind of shit desu.

File: 1433575912715.jpg (2MB, 2480x3508px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2480x3508px

>>50549401
>Which UA Fighter archetype are you most excited to play as?
Knight seems like a fantastic unstoppable tank. Wade into combat getting everyone's attention, probably have heavy armor master to improve survivability.

>>50549439
Dragon turtle

took a handful of ships with harpoons and a spellcaster on a hot air balloon to kill it

File: skeleton_mage_by_jasontn-d9yp37e.jpg (203KB, 1024x725px) Image search: [Google]

203KB, 1024x725px

>>50549378
My line of thinking when creating it(in case you're the undead patron warlock guy) was to create something similar to Necromancers(WIz), but to have an identity entirely to itself. So if you wish to create a warlock necromancer, try that sort of avenue for ideas. Something like corrupting stuff or spreading your patron's influence.

>>50549401
Knight. 4e Marking makes its glorious return.

>>50549439
I pitted a party against a spinosaurus from Tome of Beasts, which showed up in their path fighting a T-Rex.

>>50549439

As in size wise, or challenge wise? Strahd is the toughest, I guess the Gulthias tree technically the largest.

Also Arcane Archer looks fun as fuck, hopefully it's AL legal before I hit level 5 in the next season though I doubt that'll happen.

>>50549465
>it's built to survive shit
survive for 3 turns

>>50549459
One every Monday for "the coming months".

Did you sleep for the last 4 weeks or something anon?

>>50549495
I think it's kind of weird how they have several "you use your reaction but not really" features

>>50549516
New thread already, I mean.

>>50549503
Kind of enough to ensure, say, a retreat for the party. On top of Second Wind, and heavy armor + shield, and possibly Heavy Armor Master, it's decent.

>>50549536
>New thread already, I mean.
Bump limit was reached already

>>50549554
Time flies by when you're shitposting and witnessing a UA launch live

>>50549503

Gish it up with wizard 2 to get Absorb elements and shield to make them even tankier.

>>50549462
Normal human is pretty good with that array. Increases the modifier for 4 stats.

If it's arranged in stat order, barbarian is best. If is not and you can put the numbers in any attribute, you can play whatever the fuck you want anon.

>>50549500
i just meant difficulty. lemme lookup strahd. never played that campaign.

>>50549475
that sounds tight.

>>50549401
At least the new UA wasn't just battlemaster variants with fey training and anti undead features.

>>50549602
I'm glad they moved away from superiority die this UA. I think all the other fighter UAs involved them

>>50549584
It is not in array order.

But I dont know what I want to play :S

I liked this UA, the subclasses just need some adjustment in their scale and it will be great

>>50549602
battle master with fey training? wich one?

I want to play a Knight so fucking bad right now. Instead, I'm forced to play a fucking bladelock because I made some bad decisions and don't want to back down on them. Life is suffering.

>>50549647
Kill off the character

have your character walk off into the sunset

have your patron call upon your character for a pressing matter

etc

easy

>>50549646
He's satirizing the Druid one

>u r fey and don't get sleeped
>u scare undeads
>u summon rabbits

What is the most fun way to play a paladin? Is it best to do another class for full caster smites? What shuld I do?

>>50549676

Sorcadin. Go paladin 2, sorcerer the rest of the way. Smite fools in combat and shit spells when you feel like it, smite forever.

>>50549459
Going to play samurai and just RP knight. They are essentially the same except for focus of tank v damage

>>50549676
Dex, defense fighting style, dual scimitars, elf it up. What are you, heterosexual?

>>50549676
Personally I like going Paladin/Swashbuckler with Magic Initiate for GFB and Booming Blade.

5 minute short rest master race.

I don't want to stifle my players, but how can I make my sessions more serious and more dramatic? I've only played DnD twice (both as DM) and both times were full of belly laughs all around, which isn't bad, don't get me wrong, but I'd like to be able to set different moods as well.

>>50549676
thats a common error, you only use smite when you want someone or something go down fucking fast.
Mind that the paladin is the GISH.
All of their spells are for glorius melee combat, take a look at the paladin spells, they will tell you how you must play..

>>50549699
>>50549717
>>50549724

Thanks :)

What classes for an all-Eladrin adventure?

>Ancients paladin
>Bow fighter
>Cleric of nature
>Bladesinger wizard
>Archfey warlock

File: 1480629399123-tg.gif (2MB, 300x200px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 300x200px

>>50549730
>not doing 5 minute long rests, 1 action short rests
Look at this scrub

Does a Thief (Or any other class with "climbing doesn't halve movement") need to make a check to climb trees/walls/etc?

>>50549768
My encounter design can't handle that, senpai.

>>50549676
straight Paladin until level 11, take PAM

but if you're playing in a normal campaign, still I'd say just go pure pally.

>>50549699
This is dumb. Smites cap at 4th level castings. You'd only have one attack, if you didn't go Favored Soul (which is not official)

a 2 Pally 18 FS could be neat. But then, if we're talking about anything within the boundary of reality, you will never make it anywhere near level 20.

if you were a level 5 character and were 2 pally 3 sorc you'd suck ass. No extra attack, and you'd only have one more 2nd level spell slot over a level 5 Paladin.

Since 99% of games go from like level 1-8, it's just best to stick pure single class unless you have major synergy like a sorclock

>>50549775
Depends on the DM. Checks for climbing are generally only required on surfaces that are difficult to climb, like a flat brick wall or a sheer cliff. Something like a tree with branches or a mortared wall that has decent handholds would likely require no check.

>>50549788
Just make literally every single encounter deadly-rated, where some are "super-deadly."

can someone please clarify this part of the knight subclass for me? or give an example?

>You can make this special attack even if you have already expended your reaction this round, but not if you have already used your reaction this turn.

File: 1480370291370-fit.jpg (50KB, 599x384px) Image search: [Google]

50KB, 599x384px

>>50549788
>1+4e
>not doing 3 encounters per round

>>50549668
That's a shit thing to do, as a player.

>>50549816
You can't use it on a turn where you used you reaction, but you can use it on any other turn this round.

>>50549820

He's got a point.

>>50549401
>Be sure to fill out the survey on last week's Druids.
I never wrote so much in a survey, but I hated so much Druids' UA that I had to do it

>arcane archer gets to use their class ability twice per rest until level 15

The fuck?

>>50549816
>You can only make this special attack once against a given creature within a turn.

>>50549816
Unmarked dude's turn. Moves away. Opportunity attack. Used reaction that turn.
Marked dude's turn. Moves away. Opportunity attack.

does the Noble Calvary give the 2 proficiencies and the language? it says alternatively which makes me think you have to choose, but I feel like it'd oddly worded.

>>50549855
Next we have to tell WotC that this is ridiculous

>>50549816
You can use it on a creature's turn even if you already used your reaction, but never more than once on a given turn.

Just remember that "turn" and "round" are not synonymous.

>>50549823
No it's not.

You are there to have fun. If you are not having fun with your character, or could be having more fun with a different character, then do something about it.

Your GM would have to be a real cunt to say "no, you picked this class so you have to stay this class because I say so I don't care if you're not enjoying it". If your GM is actually like that then leave that group

>>50549768
>not using free action long rests

>>50549855
Yeah, shit's getting adjusted for PHB2.

>>50549816
Every creature has a turn in a round, you can't use it multiple times on a creature's turn.

Example

Orc 1 and Orc 2 surround Knight
Orc 1 procs the reaction attack, cannot use it again until Orc 1's turn is over.
Orc 2 procs the reaction attack, cnanot use it again until Orc 2's turn is over.

>>50549890
>using actions

>>50549852
Nah senpai, all the druid circles were solid. A solid healer, a solid buffer and summoner, and a solid blaster, all of them with great flavor.

>>50549891
>one shot with arch-mages as high level wizards/sorcs/etc that have unlimited spells

could b fun

>>50549913
What

>>50549902
>having turns

I bet you don't even play Dungeon World

>>50549934
running a one shot wherein the players are extremely powerful magic users that have unlimited spells could be fun

>>50549909
>A solid healer
It's shit compared to Life domain, and all other features except for the level 10 ability were weak

>a solid buffer
This is the only one I got satisfied

>a solid blaster
It deal necrotic damage to kill undead. And Land druids are better blasters because they have more spells per day

>>50549855
On one hand, 2d6 damage + fairly useful effects (apart from Grasping Arrow) is a lot more impressive than the other level 3 skills at level 3. The issue is that it scales terribly, and you and practically you won't learn more than four arcane shots in most campaigns.

File: hammer warriors.jpg (105KB, 513x478px) Image search: [Google]

105KB, 513x478px

how is the Forge Domain?

I wanna make a Hammerite

>>50549581
At that point why would you not just go Bearbarian.

>>50549993
Domain's spell list and early level features are great, pretty strong

>>50549956
How is that related to your quoted post tho

>>50549971
Granted, you probably won't need more than four. Piercing is all you really need for damage, Seeking is quirky utility, and the rest are all just various ways to get enemies to be worse at attacking.

>>50549993
Fucking mental, m8.

>>50549966
Dreams has an extra healing resource that also gives a slight speed buff, and it can make any rest super-safe. At high levels its healing spells have an automatic dispel magic on them. It's good.

And the Twilight circle gets an extra damage resource it can put against everyone that heals on a kill, with an extra benefit against undead. It's fine.

>>50550050
>At high levels its healing spells have an automatic dispel magic on them
Arcane cleric get the same thing at level 6 tho

>It's fine
I dunno man, everything looks weak compared to moon druids. But I think maybe the problem is the base class

>>50549966
>It's shit compared to Life domain

anon this is just really stupid to say, I hope you understand that.

Yes the Fey Druid isn't as good of a healer as a Life Domain Cleric. Thing is - it doesn't need to be. It's a Druid with some healing ability. It still has wildshape and all that druid shit, and gets stuff other than just healing from the archetype.

Life Domain Cleric is 100% dedicated to healing and little else.

Also the Fey druid's healing is pretty fucking sweet, as it's a bonus action. You basically have no-slot-required Healing Words on demand.

Saying that the fey druid is shit cause it doesn't heal as well as life cleric is like saying paladin is shit because it doesn't fight as well as a fighter

>>50549993
really fucking strong.

some people didn't like the CD but I fucking love it. I don't know about you lads, but I rarely find that the party just gets the opportunity to stroll into the giant city and have a shopping day. The lich always needs slaying, demon lord needs banishing etc

so, the martials and semi-martials that depend on gear fall even further behind if the GM isn't good on allowing them the opportunity to purchase shit or loot good shit of enemies.

All a Forge Cleric needs to create something are items worth the value of that something. So if you have a shit ton of chainmail, old swords, shields etc you've looted off gobbos and orcs and bandits just gathering dust in the bag of holding, your Forge Cleric can actually turn that into armor and shit that the martials need.

oh and even despite the CD it's stupid good

Guys. Guys. Guys, Arcana cleric can dispel a spell on an ally they heal. What if you could dispel a spell on an enemy that fails a save? Would it be OP?

So for a small ranged fighter (Goblin in my case) who would be better, Arcane Archer or Sharpshooter.

With only a shortbow your dps wouldn't be very good as a Arcane Archer but you still get the utility of the Arcane Arrows.

Sharpshooter with a light crossbow would still have really good dps and scales good with your level. (Sharpshooter at 20 with haste, in the first round, using actions surge does 11 attacks, dealing 220 extra damage in that one turn if every attack would hit)

>>50549888
It's not about the GM, or fun. I said that I will play the bladelock until he is dead, and I will not back down my decision. It's a matter of honor and principle.

>>50550179
Assassin?

>>50550211
Well assassin is not a fighter

>>50549790
>if you were a level 5 character and were 2 pally 3 sorc you'd suck ass. No extra attack, and you'd only have one more 2nd level spell slot over a level 5 Paladin.

But you would have green flame blade and its all upside from that point on?

>>50550169
>dispel a spell on an enemy that fails a save?

what

>>50550179
neither? I'd say battlemaster is still the best archer. Take Sharpshooter, something that every archer will take, and a lot of the Sharpshooter archetype's stuff is rendered redundant. Take Close Quarters shooter as your fighting style for pretty much a completely redundant archetype.

light crossbow would need xbow expert.

can Gobbos not use longbows?

File: stupid grandma.jpg (336KB, 1536x1152px) Image search: [Google]

336KB, 1536x1152px

>>50550211
>AA does not even have a new feature at 10th

>>50550136
>Fey Druid isn't as good of a healer as a Life Domain Cleric
I think I would be fine if the heal was a d8

>gets stuff other than just healing from the archetype.
Yeah, but, I want your honest opinion, do you think the level 6 ability is worthy it's slot alone? It seems a little weak to me, maybe in game it's better, maybe you could sell it to me, but right now, I don't see it as really worthy.

The level 10 ability is really, I will give you that, but most of the time we don't get to high levels. I think it's stupid the level 14 feature be almost the same than the level 6 arcane domain

>Saying that the fey druid is shit cause it doesn't heal as well as life cleric is like saying paladin is shit because it doesn't fight as well as a fighter
I agree with you, but I don't think druids are that strong, so I think the subclasses should give more

>>50550136
>a shit ton of chainmail, old swords, shields etc you've looted off gobbos and orcs and bandits
While I'm not sure people actually use this, in the PHB it says monsters' items are worth basically nothing and even if it's not destroyed or heavily used it's going to be worth half the selling price.

>>50550249
>>dispel a spell on an enemy that fails a save?
>what
When you cast a spell targeting one creature, if it has to make a save against the spell and fails that save, end one spell of your choice on the creature which is of equal to or lower level than the spell you cast

>>50550261
I mean. As a DM I'd allow the use of monster weapons for forge domain CD.

Makes more sense then turning 75 gold coins into studded leather.

>>50550261
If only there were some way to mend damaged gear. Maybe a cantrip of sorts.

RAW I don't think Mending works that way but all the DMs I've had have basically said Mending can repair damaged gear, as long as you still have all the pieces to glue back together. so, for example, you can stitch chainmail back together but can't replace missing links in the mail with it.

Would allowing someone to take a single Extra Attack in place of an ASI as a non-martial class be stupid?

>>50550249
>can Gobbos not use longbows?
Nope. Longbows are heavy weapons.

But I think Sharpshooter deals more nova damage than a battle master at higher levels. Just see what I wrote in brackets, I don't think Battle Master can compete with that damage.

Also he is a DMPC so I want him to be as simple as possible. Arcane Archer and Sharpshooter require less thinking and input from the player than Battlemaster.

>>50550240
Extra attack is huge, I don't think you're appreciating it.

It's not just more damage, it's

>another chance to hit
>the ability to attack multiple targets, if you kill your target with your first attack you can run over and attack a different target
>another chance to crit and deal a fuckton of damage with smite
>another chance to Smite

GFB will alleviate your damage. If there is an enemy 5ft of your target it's arguably better than having two attacks for sure.

but by and large it won't be better than having an extra attack.

you are also delaying ASIs, and will be missing out on Paladin's level 6 (one of the best abilities in the game) and paladin's level 7 (also really good, ancients pally gets half damage from all magic ffs)

multi-classing only really works at higher levels. if you're starting at level 1, doing a multi-class like pally sorc is pretty rough.

>>50550332
Why not just make Extra Attack a Feat then.

And then it'd probably still be best on a Fighter to be honest family.

>>50549401
>arcane archer
>sharpshooter
>not Ranger subclasses

Hoo boy, why even have the Ranger class at all wizards?

>>50550332
But why?

>>50550261
>leather armor is 5 gp
>gobbo leather is probably small, so worth half that
>probably shittily made and smelly, so worth half
>1.25-2 gp per gobbo
>kill 50+ gobbos to reach the max value the feature allows, which you can use to create a chain mail, scale mail or weapon

Although I guess you could create a plate mail, one fifteenth piece at a time, if you have someone who is profiecient enough to put it all together.

>>50550364
The ranger will be getting some new subclasses in a few weeks. And since they'll work with both PHB and revised rangers, they'll probably be good. Patience, anon.

>>50550336
You will not make it anywhere near level 20.

Battlemaster will be better. You shouldn't measure how good something is purely by damage either, that's really stupid.

if you're at level 20 it doesn't matter how much stupid damage you're doing anyway, the casters are basically gods by that point.

>>50550356
>>50550367
I have a player that wants a Forge cleric who can actually be useful in melee frontlining. I'm inclined to allow him it. What can go wrong, at worst?

>>50550136
what insanely useful items can you make your party that is less than 100g? once youve geared everyone with the best 100g or cheaper items, which isnt a whole lot...

>>50550364
Ranger doesn't mean "ranged weapon user".

Ranger means "person who goes out to range in the wilderness/border regions"

Is there any way to save an image from Roll20? It turns out a bunch of character art I thought I lost when I reformatted is saved on Roll20, but I can't find a way to save the images to my PC short of using the Snipping tool.

>>50550382
No dude I don't even play a Ranger, but if those subclass names don't scream Ranger I don't know what does

>>50550332
what the fuck

how do you people come up with these retarded ideas

>>50550398
The best way to survive the wilderness is not go there. It's full of nasty things that will kill you.

>>50550201
Gain a sudden bout of suicidal tendencies.

>>50550425
that's kind of the point, anon

>>50550429
see >>50549823

GM actually invests time and effort into inserting whatever retarded character you come up with into the campaign smoothly. Making him start all over just because you're bored after one session is an asshole move.

>>50550332
for what purpose

>>50550259
The level 6 ability is solid. It pretty much assures you'll never be ambushed or disturbed during a rest, it's like a built-in leomund's tiny hut.

If nobody can cast leomund's (which druids don't get), it's going to be great. Don't need to take any time to cast it, it's just automatic, and it helps alot.

I just read up on the heal too and it's even better than I thought. 120ft range, and while the amount you can heal in one go is restricted, the receiver of the heal also gets a buff (1 temp HP/spent die, +5ft speed per spent die).

It's all around a good, thematic archetype. Level 6 is weaker than it could be for sure, but its still good.

>>50550389
You are right, and I never said otherwise. But I just wanted to say that Sharpshooter is not worse in EVERY way than a BM.

But as I stated the fact that he is a DMPC is important because I want him to be simple. Less input from me is better for the party.

>>50550355
So getting 2x attack at 8 is too bad? You also get Haste at level 5 and thru that you have 2 attacks

>>50550499
I am stupid nvm haste is at level 7.

>>50550398
>Ranger doesn't mean ranged weapon user
It shouldn't portray itself as that then
Also people normally think of ranger as ranged weapon user due to modern things, such as warcraft or other mainstream fantasy things.

>>50550528
>It shouldn't portray itself as that then

It doesn't, you're just retarded

>>50550528
>It shouldn't portray itself as that then
It doesn't

>>50550487
You convinced me it's a good circle. My problem is the base tho, the spell list isn't as good as the otes classes imo.

Also, how would you compare land with dreams? Both are for casters druids, which one you think is stronger in general?

>>50550528

Isn't Aragorn the guy who gave Rangers their class name? I don't remember him using a bow, ever.

>>50550528
Right. That's why it only lets you pick archery as a Fighting style, and definitely doesn't want you dual weilding

File: Screenshot_20161205-181847.png (4MB, 1440x2560px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 1440x2560px

>>50550548
>>50550552
Idk it looks like it does in this here picture

>>50550528
You're a fucking idiot. Ranger=he who rangers

It's like you think fighters should be called meleers

>>50550609
>has no class features exclusive to the bow, but is holding one in a single picture

wow anon, didn't know we were in kindergarten. bet you thought fighters were just sword guys, because that's what the picture is right?

>>50550609
That character has 3 melee weapons.

>>50550568
If Aragorn was anything in 5e he would be a fighter and you know it.

>>50550609
>fighter shows a guy with sword and board
>fighters arent meant to use bows

>rogue shows drow with two daggers
>forget about bow sneak attacks

>monk shows wot4e
>forget about punching people

File: Battle_of_Moria.png (470KB, 1036x528px) Image search: [Google]

470KB, 1036x528px

>>50550568
wellllllll....
Yes, I know, not canon.

File: rage_by_rabbiteyesd4j927k.jpg (134KB, 900x1451px) Image search: [Google]

134KB, 900x1451px

With the new Archetypes, can a level 3 fighter kill an entire camp of kobolds alone now?

>>50550645

Do I know it? Why do I know that? His whole origin is that he was out in the wilderness roaming around and shit before he joined Mr. Underhill. Remember when Frodo was stabbed and he was telling the Hobbits which herbs to get to slow the poison? Sounds like Survival skill, which is more likely to be found on a ranger. Also he always looked like he was wearing medium armor, which I guess could be a fighter as well, but seems more like a ranger thing.

>>50550678
In groups of 8? With a short rest after every fight. In groups of 3-6, with a short rest after about every two or three fights. In groups of 2? Yes, maybe without a rest.

>>50550678
Depends on the intelligence of the character and the kobold, really. At level 3 and alone, Knight's Implacable Mark isn't useful unless Kobold shifts, while Samurai's Fighting Spirit can easily be baited with maybe the loss of two kobolds if the Kobolds just run away the moment he invokes it, and then keep poking at him if he tries to rest.

But realistically Kobolds aren't the smartest of creatures, so they might not think so far ahead if they're not well-led.

>>50550528
>due to modern things, such as warcraft or other mainstream fantasy things.
Yeah as I said, you're a dumbchucklefuck

>>50550261
The determination of value for the Forge CD doesn't go by selling value, I don't think.

either way that rules pretty dumb, shit works just fine for the monsters.

>>50550499
>>50550519
Haste first off requires an action to cast, so there goes that turn.

second yea you're not getting it till 7 assuming 2 paladin. Guess what a pure vengeance paladin gets at level 9? oh right, haste, and they also have extra attack and +CHA to all their saves and allied saves, and more lay on hands, and 2nd level paladin spells (Find Steed is fucking amazing), and 3rd level Paladin spells (aura of vitality is fucking amazing)

and remember the attack from Haste can only be used to attack, no GFB.

consider a pure level 11 veng pally vs a 2 pally 9 Sorc, just from pure damage standpoints

sure the pally sorc can cast fireball and do more damage than the pally if there's multiple targets in the AoE. Guess what. A pure wiz/sorc/light cleric/fiendlock/lorebard can do that too.

otherwise it's not a competition, especially if the pally player took PAM like a smart guy

What's the best school for a dapper noble Wizard? I'm thinking Conjuration for things like conjuring up a chair to look smug in or a deck of cards to play.

Originally I wanted him to be as much an Elemental Plane of Air themed wizard as possible but I'm making an alternate version since I have no idea how the DM will feel about using UA Theurgy (Tempest) Wizard, so only Core book things.

>>50550641
Technically some of the Ranger specific spells are only compatible with a bow.

>>50549503
So enough for most combats to end.

>>50550795
>So enough for most combats to end.
one combat (maybe not the entire combat) per rest

>>50550792
And some of the other Ranger things are only compatible with a sword.

At best, you could argue that there's a strong incentive for all Rangers to be capable of using ranged weapons, but that has more to do with the fact that hunting is easier with a bow or spear with a sword.

Ranger hasn't been a dedicated archer in any edition. It's always been lighter armor survivalist fighter to some degree. Those are things that make ranged weapons more appealing when plate armor is off the table, but it's far from a default assumption.

Would it be worth to get Crossbow expert as a small creature fighter to get light crossbows instead of a shortbow?

I will get the sharpshooter class and get to 20 dex at level 4 and take the sharpshooter feat at 6. But not having disadvantage in melee range get obsolete at level 10.

>>50550920
>But not having disadvantage in melee range get obsolete at level 10.
Do people even play at this level?

>>50550935
Well the adventure will go to level 12-13.

>>50550948
It will be useful 69 ~ 75% of the game, it is worthy

>>50550920
I'm starting to feel like Sharpshooter is a better class for people who want to spend their Fighter feats on areas other than damage.

I mean, a lot of the best ranged feats are baked into the class, so you do good damage regardless. That frees you up to take other stuff and puts stats other places.

It's kind of like the Warlock of Fighters. Just grab a bow and get decent dex and your combat ability is covered.

>>50550920
While the damage buff is useful, I wouldn't take the sharpshooter feat for that alone. If you're playing a campaign that's likely to be primarily above-ground (i.e. longer engagement ranges, larger combat arenas) Sharpshooter is worth it purely because you can now shoot light crossbows out to 320 feet, or Hand Crossbows up to 120 feet w/ an extra attack as the bonus action.

If you're going dungeon diving and the engagement range is likely to be lower, I'd suggest you skip sharpshooter.

>>50550964
>t's kind of like the Warlock of Fighters. Just grab a bow and get decent dex and your combat ability is covered.
You just sold sharpshooter for me

>>50550964
This is the reason I dislike fighting style archetypes actually, because it's already covered in feats. Champion/BM archer with SS means sharpshooter makes no sense as an archetype IMO, and giving feats as class abilities fucks with how feats work. I can get it if there's a build-specific feat like Sentinel but the must-have bow feat being baked in doesn't sit well with me.

Hey guys, got a player who's taken up my offer of being a previous NPC in our campaign; a thief.

But thieves seem a little underpowered, at least with the early stuff they do. What could I give them or do to make them more interesting or at least less situational?

>>50550715
>kobolds aren't the smartest of creatures

they're probably right behind hobgoblins tbqh, they're clever and total tinkerers with devices and traps

>>50550999
I think the sharpshooter feat will be worth it.

But what else are decent options besides Crossbow Expert? I don't want lucky, mobile doesn't seem to be worth it, so that leaves tough and alert as good feats.

>>50550765
Sorry for being stupid, what is PAM?

>>50551059
P A M
o r a
l m s
e t
e
r

>>50549503
It works until the END of your next turn, so 6 turns.

>>50551059
Phat Ass Mage

>>50551092
anon what have you done

>>50551095
>It works until the END of your next turn, so 6 turns.
shit, I read it wrong

>>50551059
Polearm Master, feat

it's the best for Paladins, as you get a bonus action attack with the shaft of the polearm after making an attack, and you also get to make an attack on an enemy that comes within your range

>>50551043
Thieves are really good, get caltrops, ball bearings, health kits with healer feat, just get items and relish in being able to actually use them effectively in combat while everyone else has to use actions. AT is arguably better, but that doesn't make Thief bad.

>>50551056
They have a natural talent in tunneling, engineering and trap making, but I don't think that makes them intelligent in the sense of being able to be able to spot and identify an enemy's limitations and make use of it. The average Kobold's quite good at tunneling but has below-average INT, after all.

That said, if the lvl. 3 fighter keeps pushing in he could probably be done in by traps, delaying tactics and raids on his own he might still get fucked over anyway.

>>50551120
thanks

>>50551010
I see what you mean. If there's something I dislike about it, it's that it includes benefits from feats without calling them out specifically, meaning it's a bit of a trap option if someone tries to double up. If you're a Sharpshooter and take Sharpshooter and Crossbow master, for example, you've just wasted a portion of your feats.

I feel like it should be more clear about what the intent is, and that utility feats are the way to go to offset it.

>>50551043
>>50551165
Thief is one of those things that become better the more creative you are with it.

>Fighting a Giant
>Giant has a big gash in it's back from Barb
>Sleight of Hand cunning action to cram a vial of Alchemist Fire in the would
>Attack to kick the vial and shatter it

Granted it might've been easier to just throw the vial, but my DM says you can't use your Use an Item action to make an attack roll with an item.

File: 1460240255948.jpg (85KB, 736x1152px) Image search: [Google]

85KB, 736x1152px

>Arcane Archer
I like it, but 2 is too few, and waiting to 15th level just does not cut it in terms of using your key feature
>knight
I want to play one, very 4e fighter feeling
>samurai
Why is 3rd level so fucking stronk? dip then leave
>Sharpshooter
meh

>>50551165
thieves are good fun at low levels, do fall off at later levels though and are completely dependent on items

a duo of a low level thief + forge cleric could be awesome. James Bond and Q making him all sorts of gadgets

What is the biggest cheese build in 5e? (for biggest damage; or being generally OP)

>>50551241
Not playing 5e.

>>50551165
>>50551211

Point taken anons, I'll just have a word with the player about it next session after maybe allowing them to trip upon a multitude of useful things.

>>50551241
Jack of all trades, Rouge 1 Cleric 1 Bard 3 All the Proficiencies

>>50551241
Well there's cone of cold horse but that's more a meme

a good minmaxy build is sorclock. Quickened EBlast coupled with Hex is pretty good damage

Is it possible to make a balanced minion swarm class/archetype in 5e or does having a bunch of summons/undead inherently break the game?

>>50551222
RIP
She broke her spine and now she's dead.

>>50551284
Having a shitload of minions breaks the game horribly unless you nerf them so much that they're practically useless in battle except for acting as a damage buff and are extremely limited when outside of it as well.

The game is not designed around you being able to have several summons/minions that can do anything besides basic attacks, if they can even manage basic shit like grappling, carrying or using items, or acting as a meatshield then they'll let you solo encounters far above your pay grade with even mild creativity.

Outside of combat its just a pain in the ass to stop the PC from abusing them for profit.

>>50551284
Necromancer and the new Sheperd Druid are perfectly fine if you want to control other creatures. But you have to wait till level 6 to start making use of them.

>>50551284
>Is it possible to make a balanced minion swarm class/archetype in 5e or does having a bunch of summons/undead inherently break the game?

As I see it, you could potentially have a minion summoner class whose (few) minions subtracted from his HP to fuel their own, and attacked on his turn; basically being Extra Attack. You could give him a couple more features, but be careful because 5e is not really made for minion-summoners.

>>50551284
It could work, but essential it needs to be designed around that fact entirely and use up its own actions to do so.

Say, for example, you had a Death Knight archetype for Fighter that could have a 4 man skeleton entourage, but had to give up an attack or reaction to have one of them make an attack or reaction. If one died, he could summon a new one by spending some hit points.

That would essentially work fine, since as side from covering more area, it'd be the same number of attacks and a similar amount of health.

That's the way to make a minion character work. It needs to be instead of whatever they're doing, rather than supplementary like summons.

The existing summon and animate dead spells would be a lot less OP if the caster had to burn their actions to get them to do things or maintain control.

>>50550201
But you will bitch about it online?

>>50549760
das it mane. Maybe this new fey druid

>>50551434
What about the new fey bard?

Should I multiclass from level 5 fighter? Next level I only get an ASI which I don't need since I have 20 in my primary. I can pretty much multiclass into anything not CHA based.

>>50550765
You have convinced me, I am making him a Dragonborn (Brass) Palladin. I will see what I do with him but the goal is atleast 11 levels palla before I start doing stupid shit.

>>50549401
Samurai cause I am.an unabashed weeb and i look foreward to kitbashing it into non Japanese culture

Like Dwarven or elven Samurai

File: throne-of-blood-1957-movie-review-ending-arrow-through-neck-taketoki-washizu-toshiro-mifune.jpg (86KB, 600x402px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 600x402px

>>50550000
Because stuff like pic related, is my guess. Samurai's pretty much an amalgamation of Toshiro Mifune characters.

>>50551459
just hit 6, take a good feat, or up your constitution. youre so close not to get it. you dont have to take fighter 6 this level up, but at some point

>>50551446
>a path all based on charn
>in a realm where everyone is immune to charming

>>50551459
depends. Either stick fighter till 11 or multiclass after 5 or 6.

need that ASI for a feat? your main attack stat sub 16 still somehow? then stay fighter for the level 6 ASI.

otherwise multi-class and get some utility/versatility

>>50551586
I assume it would be played in the material plane proper, not in the feywild.
They would be the charmers, not go around charming feys

>>50551563
Truly the best place for them to take interpretation from.

>>50551586
It makes more sense than the undead slayer dealing a type of damage undead are resistant to

Sup fampais, newish DM here and the players have entered a forest.

Instead of just letting them walk through all montage style I was hoping to pick your brains for ideas or tips on how to implement some of my own.

So far they've run an errand for a woodland being to even allow them entrance to the forest. Classic, blocking the path scenario, but now they're on their way.

Things to note: the forest has a moderate fey presence, it's a really big forest, they're on a southern continent and the forest stretches south so the further it goes the colder it gets.

Was thinking of having the pixies fuck with them by illusioning up some big threat, hopefully convincing the players to retreat into a direction of the forest that appears less safe, but the path is blocked by something much scarier.

When they reach the unsafe place some real threats appear.

Upon resuming the path they make their way back to the path to catch pixies giggling at their expense. Mocking their frightened faces and growling like the illusion they conceived.

They can then decide to get their revenge on the fairies or not. If they try they might have a comical fight. After the run in with the pixies thinking of having them happen upon a wood elf ranger that got himself stuck in a trap after being pranked by the same pixies, his own trap.

Ranger reveals he's from a not too far off village to the west. He wishes to thank them for their help. Brings them back. He reveals he normally doesn't go that far out but something is off with the woods.

Woods are supposed to be getting colder bringing the animals his way as they migrate north towards them. But the southern part of the woods is staying warm for some reason so fewer game. Druids in the elf village are worried something is off. Ask players what they've seen, etc.

Players are heading towards a stronghold that has a red dragon in it, but they don't know that. It is basically the cause of the unnatural heat.

General idea good/shit?

>>50551734
Fuck me, phone posting like a fag, I apologize for the eyesore.

What do you guys really think about the Sharpshooter archetype?

>>50551792
it's useful when your DM bans feats or you want non-combat related feats

Okay, I just had a crazy idea. Well, multiple.

The first was if lumping together the Battlemaster and Knight into one subclass with all those features would be a good way to make a true 4e fighter or be completely insane.

What was more completely insane was the idea of removing Battle master and champion as subclasses, and letting any martial class add them on top of their existing progression.

Now, obviously this would buff martials. A lot. But I'm wondering if offering the choice between maneuvers and raw power is unwarranted.

>>50551792
It's fine, people just like to bitch about things. It's not amazing or terribly original, but it works.

>>50551734
Depends on the circumstances. It can invoke a "oh come one fuck off with your autistic shit" reaction just as easily as "yay, something cool to do!", the latter more likely if they are just looking for something to do and the former if they have a clear, reasonably easy reachable goal and the forest is just the means to slow them down for the sake of prolonging the game.

>>50551792
Seems underpowered in comparison to the others. They get big sources of advantage, while SS gets... half a feat and a little bit of extra damage. Later, they get to negate a penalty. Eh.

Though I guess ranged is inherently better than melee in a sense...

>>50549401
What does /tg/ think about refluffling/reflavoring
Personally, I prefer it when my players do it, and I like to do it myself

>>50551734
What are the players doing, what's their larger mission? Are they passing through the forest to get somewhere or will they hang around?

>>50551924
>What does /tg/ think about refluffling/reflavoring
it's /5e/ fav thing
people here would tell you to refluff a fighter with a greatsword as a brawler with iron fists

>>50551896
They get really strong in the later levels though against single enemies. I think that at level 20 with haste he can do the most damage in one round possible of all classes (disregarding features that instantly put you to 0 hp).

He can get up to 11 attacks, which would be 242 EXTRA damage if every attack hits. Then you would have the damage of his weapon, potential sharpshooter feat. This doesn't even take magical weapons into account.

>>50551987
Sorry, but haste only gives you one extra attack. Where are you getting 11 from? 4 + 1 from haste + 1 from snap shot?

Good resources for basic campaign DM tips?

I'm DMing LMoP and my players just finished up the sidequests with the orcs, necromancer, and banshee, so they're about 66% or 75% of the way through.

We're all excited to move onto a different campaign/setting, they get to make all their characters and stuff.

I think I'd like to homebrew the next campaign, LMoP is pretty good but I think I'd prefer to work with something of my own creation. Working with pre-written adventures is difficult since there's often a lot of material that you need to know all at once, but I feel like with a homebrew you're more intimately familiar with everything involved, so it'd be easier to develop it session by session.

I find the idea of homebrewing a whole setting overwhelming though. But does that mean I need to learn a shitload of Forgotten Realms lore so I could make it take place in that? Any general advice would be appreciated, I guess.

>>50552075
Look up matthew colville and watch his Running the Game videos.

Does anyone have the updated character options list?

>>50552053
4 normal ones, 4 from actions surge, 1 from haste, 2 from snapshot because you take the attack action 3 times but once with haste which only allows one attack.

4+4+1+2=11

>>50551792
I like it more now that I'm thinking of it as essentially extra feats rather than actual class features. It does mean you have more room to spend on other non-combat feats, but it doesn't have much flavor or meaning as a subclass. It's very bland, but it's fine.

I'm thinking my next character will be bugbear battlemaster 3/Assassin X to sort of thematically emulate devastatingly strong sword play. 10ft rapier strikes, heavy armor, superioirty dice still strong sneaking skills.. should be fun. Just need to figure out what techniques I'm taking, probably lunging strike, menacing attack, and riposte.

>>50551947
>>50551873
They had a map earlier and saw it was a trek to reach their destination. Someone has gone missing and this is their only lead thus far. They haven't got much urgency otherwise.

One of the players is a ranger and his favored enemy are fey so I'm throwing him a bone with some forest stuff. And they will later return to the forest later on in the plot.

One of the other players also was hoping to run into a village because they're out of healing potions.

So overall it feels like a good idea. Rather, was hoping to ask you all for other forest ideas that I could perhaps use, throw in during their return visit, or for any critic about the proposed current plan.

>>50552158
Just let it whip, my man

File: 1444961935913.jpg (464KB, 746x1000px) Image search: [Google]

464KB, 746x1000px

How do I convince a player to roleplay diarrhea without it being crude and childish? I'm running a survival-focused campaign and our female elf sorceress is suffering from dysentery I've decided. I just want her to accurately portray the suffering that comes with brown water leaking down her legs.

>>50552158
Heavy armor doesn't go so well with assassin. If you want to sneak and not take points in Str then get light armor instead.

>>50552174
>our female elf sorceress is suffering from dysentery I've decided
You have the filthiest magical realm and you shouldn't force it on your players, or anyone else.

>>50551792
My group rarely plays past level ~8, and allows feats, so I would never pick it over arcane archer. Decent idea, just unfortunate that its main early thing is something arcane archer can get and then some more on top of it

>>50552186

I'm mulling back and forth if I want to do the heavy armor - it'll give me more AC at the expense of my sneaking it's true. I suppose I'll just stick with light armor for the sneaking unless I'm in a party that can give me invisibility or PWaT.

>>50549495
Well, marking is an optional rule in the DMG, seeing it back as a class feature is nice.

>>50552294
Glorious Return, I says.

What would be a good magical light or hand crossbow for around level 7-10?

>>50552174
i think disadvantage would do the trick.

>>50549495
Haven't had a chance to look too closely at it, but isn't it really similar to paladin's Compelled Duel spell? I'm most excited about this, because that's my favorite spell in the game.

File: a.jpg (18KB, 423x91px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 423x91px

Does an Aasimar deal the extra radiant damage if they hit an enemy with a reaction attack (like from an AoO or such) outside of their turn?

>>50552420
>once on each of *your* turns
No.

Does anyone have the char options pdf, plz I need it.

>>50552420
>once on your turn

>does he do this outside of his turn

Probably late to the party but...

>Bugbear
>Tunnel Fighter
>Knight
>Sentinel
>Polearm Master
>Riding a Rhino

Seems like a good way to challenge my Players. I enjoy crafting PCs that are minmaxed for Mini-bosses.

>Mongo say you no shall pass

>Friends got me into 5e
>Went full in and bought the starter set & Handbook
>They dont want to play

Will I ever get to play this game?

>>50552746

Have sex with your friends to convince them to play.

>>50552746
Get better friends.

>>50552746
Find more friends

>>50552746
You should go to your local gaming shop and play D&D there, then suggest D&D outside of the gaming shop.

>>50552746

Roll20, /r/lfg, or find an adventurer's league near you.

So the Sharpshooter archetype is for the DM who disallows feats but does allow UA? Is there such a creature?

anyone got any tips for roleplaying as a kenku? i like the sound mimicry they get but it seems like it would be difficult to convey most things to other players and npcs

>>50552707
That sounds like an intimidating character and a fun encounter, but be careful about how you built that. Building enemies like PCs usually fucks up CR calculation and can make fights more joyless than they'd be otherwise--typically player options have more flexibility and more resilience, both of which can make a fight drag on too much or otherwise be anticlimactic.

>>50552879
>Is there such a creature?

Perhaps, in a basement far and unfamiliar to mortal men, such a creature dwells

Although, if they allow UA you could just take Close Quarters Shooter as your fighting style and make the archetype redundant mostly

File: 1470423127744.png (45KB, 600x600px) Image search: [Google]

45KB, 600x600px

>>50552174

>>50552879
My DM (who bans feat) asked, "should I allow UA?", but I told him no

>>50552879
Feats add complexity, new subclasses and races just add options for character creation

>>50552174
You don't, please don't even try.

I'm playing a sharpshooter fighter/deep stalker conclave ranger in a gestalt game.
Oh the keks that will be had.

Goblin sharpshooter dude here.

Would it be the best idea to take a light crossbow whenever I use Steady Aim, and switch to a handcrossbow on other turns seeing as I have a bonus action free to attack with it?

>>50553101
how about you just fire your fucking bow and stop debating in circles about the best ways to maximize muh damage

>>50553144
He wants to be more effective.
Most characters want to be better at their job than be worse at their job.

>>50553144
>Fighter can do pretty much nothing but attack
>Not trying to get the most out of those attacks
Why would I even play a fighter if I want to do something else than deal damage?

>>50552174
>I'm running a survival-focused campaign and our female elf sorceress is suffering from dysentery I've decided

this is fucking disgusting. you are disgusting. i would leave a game immediately if the DM pulled some shit like this

>>50552879
>DM who disallows feats

aka human garbage

>>50552174
yeah if you want a character to be sick or something just give them the "poisoned" condition
dont get all nasty with it
there is an extremely low chance that anybody else at the table has your scat fetish

>>50553267
he might be new
i didnt allow them in my first game of 5e because i was still getting used to the system and the less shit i had to keep track of the better

File: batmane.png (191KB, 263x288px) Image search: [Google]

191KB, 263x288px

>>50552174
i hope your players kill you in real life

>>50549464

They're pretty strong. I think they could scale better too, but I'm glad they're not a 1/3rd caster. That would have been disappointing.

Not a fan of the other 3, but I do think they're a good start. I especially like the idea of the Samurai, but I wish they had a little more mechanical depth to them. I also dislike their capstone, although I think the flavor behind it is okay.

Knight's first ability is also the same way, where I think the idea is okay but I think it's also kinda awkward in a lot of places. All 3 are really rough, but could be great when they're more polished.

File: ew.jpg (31KB, 313x286px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 313x286px

>>50552174
End your life.

>>50552158

Also I won't be playing this character for a long time but I guess it's worth asking. Since I won't get my first ASI until level 7, but the duelling style means dex isn't important for me as far as damage goes, what feat should I take? I was thinking:

-Alert, because assassin (probably - might do Arcane Trickster for more utility)

-Defensive duelist

-Mage slayer

Lucky of course is always worth a take but not very flavorful for this character.

>>50551411
>>50550201

He wants to play a Knight because that's what he is irl. He can't be a Knight without honor or principle.

Unless he's being a historical Knight, then it's pretty much anything goes.

>>50553471
Yeah samurai is just very boring.
Feels like they didn't try hard at all.

Sharpshooter is actually legit pretty good at high levels though. Once they get their capstone, you can make *15* attacks in your first turn in a combat with actions surges, and give each or those attacks +11/12 damage.
You can stack sharpshooter on top of each of those if you'd like too.
Now that's some damage.

>>50552174
What do you mean "I've decided"? Like, arbitrarily, "You, yes, you get the dysentery, tell me about the poos"?

>>50549464
Since there's feats to add superiority dice, you might be able to convince your DM to let you take a feat to add an extra arrow or two.

I would have rather Arcane Archer be an actual spellcaster that gets to use a spell slot to create a magical arrow instead, but I'll take what I can get in terms of ranged combat in this game.

>>50553639
>You, yes, you get the dysentery, tell me about the poos

fucking kek

>>50553629

I think Samurai and Knight would be cooler if they were designed more like Arcane Archers. With different abilities they could use that make them better at defending or being a weeb as needed, instead of just one ability that makes them good at defending/being a weeb and after they used it all they're stuck being a fighter with no subclass.

Less true for Knights at higher levels since I think they get a few more things, but Samurais have nothing else except the skill proficiency and the thing that only works when they're about to die anyways.

One thing I do like though, is the skills. Nice way to give the Fighter more stuff to be good at.

>>50553101
Yes, it would be best. Unless you have better options than light crossbow!

>>50553681
I think knight is mechanically good.
I think samurai is not mechanically good.
They're both boring.
Knight being essentially all of the same thing is a little dull to read even.

>>50553738
>Unless you have better options than light crossbow!
Such as? Being a small creature sure limits the weapons you can use.

>>50553681
both are pretty boring and unflavorful desu

>>50552099
Will do, thanks!

>legendary Druid Villain BBEG goes fire elemental next his grove of bad guys
>Bard casts wall of force
>They all die within a round because fire elemental burned up all the oxigen

Lol

>>50553762
Well exactly, I can't think of any. No doubt someone can minmax harder somehow but that seems solid tactics, not even slightly cheesey

>>50553964
Does magical fire require oxygen to fuel it?

>>50553976
Elemental fire doesn't require anything. But not requiring something doesn't mean it's not going to eat it anyways, right?

>>50553976
Consult GM fiat: answers may vary.

For my money; yes, unless otherwise stated as part of the spell effects.

question, I was always under the assumption that if you used action surge for an attack action, you only got one extra attack. was I wrong? If I get multiple attacks, do I get all those attacks again? Or just one?

>>50554042
You get a full action.

>>50554042
You can use your multiple attacks if you take another Attack action with Action Surge. That's the entire point--it has no restrictions.

>>50554042

You get all of them. Haste limits you to one extra attack, action surge does not.

>>50554042
ACTION surge

you get another ACTION

you can use that ACTION for anything you can do with an ACTION

Actually I'm not certain; can you cast two spells with action surge? I vaguely recall some restriction on spells cast per turn? like you can only cast 1 leveled spell but you can cast a leveled spell and a cantrip?

>>50553777
Samurai is flavorful as FUCK. That flavor happens to be awful weeby Fightingu Spirito shonen hero, but it's still flavor.

>>50554141
>can you cast two spells with action surge
ACTION surge

you get another ACTION

you can use that ACTION for anything you can do with an ACTION

>>50554141
>Actually I'm not certain; can you cast two spells with action surge?
Yes. The restriction only applies when you cast a bonus action spell on your turn. It's a little bit unintuitive perhaps, but it's fine as long as you just remember that only bonus action spells activate such a limit.

>>50554141
You can cast 2 spells with action surge as long as you haven't cast a spell as a bonus action. If you cast a spell as a bonus action, the only other spells you can cast that turn are cantrips.

So if you were a fighter 2/sorcerer X, you couldn't say, Fireball, Action Surge Fireball, Quickened Fireball. You could do the first two, but not the third.
You could, however, Quickened Fireball, Firebolt, Action Surge Firebolt.

File: 555.jpg (22KB, 367x111px) Image search: [Google]

22KB, 367x111px

>>50554187
don't you dare turn that on me mr

this is what confuses me. I guess it's just in place so someone couldn't healing word and cure wounds in the same turn or something

>>50554152
Too bad it sucks.
Fuck, I'd even play a champion fighter over a samurai.

>>50554270
I mean if you're going to go samurai past level 6 yea, otherwise it's bretty gud

>>50554344
They should've just let them do it every 1d4 rounds or something desu, like they did with one of the druid archetypes.

They also should've made the rest of it less terribly boring.

>>50554373
3/short rest is fine man

>>50554408
It's really underwhelming actually.
Compare it to barbs for Christ's sake.

>>50554373
The number of uses is fine, I think. The main issue is that they don't get enough later on to make it more worthwhile

>>50554424
>>50554422

File: 1377373194118.jpg (70KB, 634x476px) Image search: [Google]

70KB, 634x476px

>>50554141
>>50554117
>>50554056
>>50554052
damn, i been using action surge wrong this whole time and been denying myself an extra attack.

>>50554422
>Advantage without granting advantage in return
>Uses based on short rest rather than long rest
>More attacks thanks to being a fighter, so more instances to roll with advantage

While you'll have fewer overall rounds of resistance, not giving up advantage in return and being able to make 4+ attacks with an Action surge is very nice.

Again, in mainly is a matter that it doesn't scale quite enough and the other class features aren't as worthwhile.

>>50554422
Barbarians get theirs back on a long rest

all you'd need is one single short rest to have as many focus things as a fucking level 17 barbarian has rages per day

rage is a core class feature of the barb and the focus thing is just something you get with the archetype

yes the rest of it is mediocre, the focus thing is not

>>50554472
>>50554502
Having advantage against you is irrelevant when you're raging.
You're not taking more than two short rests a day that get mileage unless your DM is a retard.
So 9 rounds a day versus 20 (soon 30, and soon much more).

If I was limited to being only able to choose the samurai archetype for fighters in a game or else any single given barbarian archetype, I would be more effective in combat (and other things) with the barbarian.

You can run the math if you'd like.

>>50554220
You could do Quickened Fireball(bonus action), Firebolt(1st action), Action Surge Fireball(second action).

>>50554570
Can't cast any non-cantrip spells once you quicken, doesn't matter if you have an extra action to do so or not.

>>50554539
you are comparing a core feature of the class to something the archetype gets

yes a Wizard is better at casting spells than an Eldritch Knight, congratulations anon

>>50554596
>Can't cast any non-cantrip spells once you quicken,
where does it say that?

>>50554626
The archetype doesn't make the fighter more desirable.
There are other fighter archetypes that do make the fighter more desirable.

That's the point - you need to be at a certain threshold for a certain class to have good enough of a pull to pick it over another, and samurai doesn't put the fighter over the "OK I'll play that and not barbarian" threshold.

>>50554640
right here
>>50554241

File: tomsick.gif (1MB, 300x217px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 300x217px

>>50552174
Okay, guys, we've had our fun picking on Diarrhea DM.
What other sicknesses are off the table?
Are we just drawing the line at GI / poop-based illnesses? Can you give your players chicken pox? Non-stop sneezing? The flu? Projectile vomiting?

>>50554657
But action surge adds to this. Whats the point of using those 2 sorcery points to quicken when you could just cast 2 fireballs? 2 sorcery points for replacing fireball with 2 cantrips doesn't make sense.

>>50554241

That specifically only applies to casting a spell with a bonus action, though, not to spell casting in general.

>>50554761

Who said we're done?

The shame shall last an enternity.

>>50554539
>Having advantage against you is irrelevant when you're raging.

Because of resistance? The Samurai gets that as well, but doesn't give up advantage, so I'd say it's plenty relevant.

>9 rounds a day versus 20

Do all your fights last 10 rounds? I tend to find 5 is much more common, if not less.

And again, consider that a Fighter gets more attacks overall, especially with Action surge. Essentially being able to get 2 rounds of advantage out of a single use of the ability.

And again, you're comparing an archetype to a main class feature. Yes, the Samurai is overall outdone in terms of this by a Barbarian, especially a high level one, but it's far from a useless feature.

Say you use them all consecutively each short rest, and you've effectively dipped 3 levels of Fighter for a limited duration Rage that refreshes on a short rest. And then consider that you don't have to use them all consecutively.

That's why it's useful.

File: late night encounters.png (583KB, 1098x2629px) Image search: [Google]

583KB, 1098x2629px

stolen from a nameless anon in /osrg/

>>50554805
It's almost like these two features from two very different classes aren't always perfectly compatible.

>>50554848
Most fights my players play in go from 4-12 rounds.
Almost never fewer but do once in awhile go over.

My argument is it's just not good enough for me to choose fighter over barbarian ceteris paribus, where for most other fighter archetypes I can feasibly think to choose them over other classes for certain concepts without sacrificing enough mechanical strength to make me feel gimped.

>>50554923
And my point is more that it's a fine base feature, but the subclass is more let down by a lack of stuff after that.

I mean, look at the other stuff. You get the ability to use Wisdom to help persuade nobles, as well Persuasion as a skill if you don't have it, but unless you've got decent Cha and Wisdom it's kind of a waste one way or another.

Then they give you proficiency in Wisdom saves, or another mental save if you already have it. Which is nice, but can be gotten with a feat easily levels earlier, and isn't a bad option if you're boosting Wis anyway to persuade nobles.

Then you get the 'we ran out of ideas' feature of Rapid Strike, along with 'maybe get a free turn once per day if you're already doing badly'.

I think a lot of these subclasses are mainly just a lack of scaling on early features and a lack of interesting or meaningful late ones.

I mean, the level 7 and 15 features on all the core fighters are pretty good, or at least tie back into their main gimmick.

>bards choose their extra spells from only one class' list
>wizard have to choose at least one spell from their school when they level up, if there's any available
How's that? Does it makes them less dominant?

>>50555110
If it was better it could carry the archetype.
Works for the battlemaster.

But it's not good enough.

>>50555131
Very minor changes that don't really change anything, just makes stuff slightly more restrictive

you should buff stuff to their level, not nerf them

whats with this UA and shit level 7s?

Does WotC really think proficiency in two skills is worthy of being a level 7 feature

>>50555229
Fighter level 7's are shit by design.

>>50555143
Battlemaster wouldn't carry the archetype if it didn't gain more uses, gain more options, gain more impact, and get other features later to help it function better.

At best, Samurai has the last two, as Advantage does get more impact with more attacks, and the last two features it gets do somewhat mesh with Advantage and Resistance, respectively.

I feel like what it may need is a similar 'regain 1 if you're out' mechanic.

>>50555229
7th level for martial archetypes is *always* a ribbon, save for the EK's. Skills are the easiest ribbon to hand out and are more useful than the shit that the Battle Master gets.

>>50554923
Christ anon, fix your encounter math... that, or get better players. Maybe rock paper scissorso is more your speed?

>>50555256
Those are extension of the first class benefit.
Which you could do in the case of samurai too.
But they fucked up and didn't.

>>50555251
EK's is basically the focal point of the class, but they kinda give up a good level 3 for it.

Champion getting half proficiency to initiative is handy, but it's probably the weakest of the three.

Battlemaster is a solid option if you apply it correctly, and can be great for scouting.

These ones are probably on par with Champion's, maybe a bit worse in some ways since there's often other ways to get them.

I mean, this is sandwiched between two levels where a Fighter can just pick up any 3 skills he wants.

>>50555292
>rounds is necessarily correlative of speed
I play most of my games with three other players, one of us being the DM.
They're all fast and efficient with their turns. We just actually play hard encounters, and encounters with actual tactics and movement, from chase scenes to puzzle fights.

>>50555251
>>50555263

Eknight's is amazing

battlemaster gets additional manuevers and another die

Monster Hunter's is great AND it gets another sup die

cavalier's is good and gets another die at 7

scout's is a joke tho

>>50555297
>but they kinda give up a good level 3 for it.

they get spellcasting and a great ribbon that actually has some mechanical usefulness (never being disarmed, always having your weapon on you that you can summon with a snap of your fingers is pretty fucking good)

>>50555324
>Big sacks of HP and/or turns doing nothing are tacticool.

No anon, tactics make the fight faster (aka less rounds, because I have to spell that out for you)

>>50555390
You're assuming a whole lot about the encounters that don't follow from what's been said.
It's a whole lot shorter of an encounter when the players run across an open field against enemies defending a keep and die, yep~

>>50555390
Not him but it's pretty retarded to think that health or doing nothing are the only ways to make a fight longer.

>>50549724
Instead, go Half-Elf Varient.

+2 Charisma for paladin and swashbuckler love, +1 to any two stats, darkvision and booming blade.

File: seekingarrow.webm (1MB, 450x360px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 450x360px

>Arcane Archer

>>50555324
I'm sure those chase scenes and puzzle fights have to a lot to do with the DPR comparisons.

>These two options don't compare based on expected rounds per encounter
>My circumstantial evidence says that combats can go 12+ rounds
>That is outside the norm, shorten that.
>Well I artificially inflate my round number and it doesn't take a lot of irlove time!

That's what you sound like. Not to mention that nobody mentioned irl minutes or hours you defensive dinguss.

>>50555526
>combats can't go any number of rounds
Literally and unironically.

>>50555455
Give an example then.

>>50555441
If an encounter has so much positioning and need for cover or is taking place in a puzzle or chase scene, then I heavily doubt the ability or usefulness of a Barbarian being able to rage through all of that.

If your fight lasts 10 rounds because there are a lot of empty turns of people repositioning and scrambling for cover, a Barbarian rage isn't going to be as helpful.

If anything, that's a situation where I would want a Samurai fighter, because they can apply their effect alongside an action surge tactically and precisely.

>>50555590
Relentless rage isn't a thing? Woah.
My mind = blown.

>>50555544
>Most fights my players play in go from 4-12 rounds
>Thats longer than the norm
>It doesn't take a lot of time
>Nobody mentioned time
>>Combats can't take 12+ rounds

Nobody said that either, but please keep moving the goal posts

>>50555590
>actually following the "your rage which you can enter and end at will automatically stops if you don't do something violent for SIX SECONDS" rule
All the Barb has to do is throw rocks at people to keep being angry, anyway.

>>50555553
You could try to have enemies use creative tactics if you're invading their territory, like having them try to bait you into traps or something. You might be faced with overwhelming odds and be forced to flee and it'll probably be while before you're safe enough to leave combat. Or maybe you can have the battle start at a really long range that the party might need to approach more carefully if they aren't built to fight at that distance.

Just try to be a little creative jesus, not everything needs to be the same static shit.

>>50555590
>samurai with sharpshooter
>on demand advantage

4 fucking sharpshooter attacks made with advantage

>>50555604
persistent rage is late game nigger

>>50555616
>combats need to conform to the norm
Literally and unironically~

>>50555544
How does "you should shorten your combat round count" equate to "combat can't take longer than X rounds"?

>>50555646
>4 fucking sharpshooter attacks made with advantage
You can do the same with GWM. Combine it with action surge for a really strong nova.

>>50555646
All games are late game or they are shit. SHIT!

>>50555651
>"My circumstantial evidence says that combats can go 12+ rounds"
>implying anyone needs "evidence" to point out the fact that combats can last any number of rounds
L A M O !

Wouldn't be 5eg without two people with different approaches to running the game arguing about how best to run the game in the other persons approach.

>>50555663
lost synergy with GWM as you could be missing out on bonus action attacks

>>50555667
98% of games probably don't make it past 10 man. All the published adventures go to like 10 iirc

>>50555692
The equivalent conversation of "you're taste is shit " -> "no *you're* taste is shit" ad infinitum is fun isn't it?

>>50555702
Good for those games man!

>>50555712
>you are taste is shit

>>50555692
>>50555712
but they need to know that I am right and they are wrong

File: 1443858472515.png (527KB, 858x1000px) Image search: [Google]

527KB, 858x1000px

>>50555712
>you're

>>50555712
I think it's perfectly possible to have good or bad taste in types of D&D games just like everything else. Sure different people like different things but some people like Paul Blart Mall Cop 2. Arguments about taste are one of the only worthwhile things about this site.

>>50555620
>ignoring the rule that the Barbarian actually has to act like a frothing berserker in the slightest degree

Oh the horror! And tossing rocks means the Barbarian isn't doing something else, like say, Dashing, which might be important in a chase scene.

It is entirely reasonable to think a Barbarian might have their rage end early if combat is dragging on for 12 rounds. It only lasts a minute anyway, so at least 2 of those rounds he'll be without Rage.

>>50555727
>>50555743
Not him, but ">you're waifu a shit" is a common meme
I'd imagine this is a variation