Is the BBEG in your game actually evil?

>>50060504
No, she only does what she must. Because she can.

>>50060504
All drow are evil. Always.

Yes. He's a Satanist who finds joy in life just being an evil fuck.

>>50060504
He's trying to prevent the rise of the Necrons through really dubious means and is generally a heartless fuck.

So yes, evil, but he's evil gearing up to fight evil and the PCs are gonna be left in a position where they can let this guy run unchecked and deal with the boatload of other shit he might unleash or do between now and the Necrons waking up, and fighting the Necrons without the undeniably-useful shit he's cooking up as part of his 'Fuck Up Skynet' game plan.

>>50060504
Of course. Being the bad guy is so last year.

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>>50060538
That doesn't sound like good BBEG material, anon. There must be more to this.

>>50060548
>>50060553
Sounds like standard fare.

>>50060622
itisthecurrentyear.jpg

>>50060538
But does she do it for good of all of us?

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Yeah, she's pretty evil.

As queen she had people executed for minor offenses. She tried to steal the power of a goddess but the ritual didn't work and she's been trying to possess her descendents and complete the ritual ever since.

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>>50060633
Sometimes standard is what works. Especially when I'm trying to innovate in other parts of the campaign.

>>50060680
Except the ones who are dead.

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>>50060715
Define 'Evil'

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Well he's a Danish Nazi who's using the concentration camps as soul harvesters to power his (demonic) super-weapons to win World War II, so yeah, he's pretty fucking evil.

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>>50060769

No, he's rather morally neutral actually

He's just an arrogant, self-importance, pretentious, uncompassionate, little twat. Which in, the eyes of my players is much worse than being evil.

>>50060504
good and evil are sorted out by those who pay. there is no good or evil only money.

i believe that was the assassins guild of ankh morpork's concept

>>50060633
Standard is a breathe of fresh air honestly. I'm tired of every villain being a misunderstood good guy or having a moral motivation or what have you. Sometimes villains are just sadists whose evil tendencies are completely alien to anyone with a lick of morality.

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He's the type that sincerely believes what he's doing is the best thing for everyone, but also happens to be a colossal dick about it.

>>50060504
those that are opposed to his plans consider him evil, and a horrible being, father of horrors that plagued the lands for a millennia, instigator of the worst war in recorded history, and is generally seen as the setting equivalent of the devil if it had one

to him, hes just a guy that wants to go home

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>>50060850
>>50060694

Standard is good, so long as it's not trite. In other words, if their motivation is just "for the evulz" then it's trite and not good. But that can be part of their motivation, just not the main driving factor.

This is of course just me. Like you guys said, sometimes, standard fare is all we really need.

He is a source of power, a bargain bin outsider peddling wishes and willing to offer the PCs exactly what they need for seemingly arbitrary prices. But every time he is called he seems satisfied and he always knows more than he lets on. He is ever advancing some unseen plot, for anyone can call him in secret and only he can see how all the pieces move upon the grand board. But what could an ancient and forgotten god ever desire?

>>50060633
>That doesn't sound like good BBEG material, anon. There must be more to this.

Just in case, but you get the reference... right?

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>>50060504
>Xorvintal in Space
Yes. Very yes. Several of them. Not all of them, but most.

>Magic-is-petrol-and monsters-are-everywhere.
Yes, but it's the kind of evil where you're just fed up with the way civilization has been going for you. It's not cosmic evil or demonic evil incarnate, it's just mortal cynicism and self-preservation.

>Warcraft WOTLK for days when I didn't remember I was DMing.

Look there's cartoonish evil at work abound in that setting but none of it compares to the level of disregard for life and altruism that the PC's have managed. Then again, it's my "oh shit I'm DMing this week?" campaign so I can kinda understand that they might not give a damn either.

Think that's all the ones I'm running right now. lvl30 one wrapped up and legacy-item one got cancelled for lack of interest.

He's forgotten normal life. He can't remember at what point in his service he had stopped thinking what it would be like to have a wage, pay rent, get a girlfriend, or any of those things, but he had to start when the war was finally over. The cheers of success and fanfare of victory made him feel great, but when he was told to go home, he had nothing but confusion and worry. Responsibility always scared him, but free choice is his nightmare. His undoing would not be someone else's victory or failure, it would be entirely his own, and there's no squad to cover him, no medic to keep him alive, no strong bonds of camaraderie to help him connect with others. He knows nothing but war, so instead of abandon everything he's ever known, he makes one.

He started a civil war to make friends, keep himself fed, his hands busy, and his mind in order. Also because someone was a bit of a dick and people were already kind of rowdy but really he just needed an excuse to form an army.

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>>50060968
I mean, the main motivation of the drow is to return to being the dominating force of the world, but that's got plenty of evil for the sake of evil entwined in it.

She's going to kill thousands of people to gain a spark of divinity and then challenge the goddess of Undeath for her throne.
She's bad news.

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>>50061022
After I read the other anon's continuation if it, it sounds really familiar, but I don't remember it

>>50061085
something something cake is lie

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>>50060504
Are you truly evil if you're making a unified army to fight off the demonic hordes that will invade in two decades time? Sure he's an eons old Lich and the army he's raising is from the corpses of the inhabitants of the numerous cities he has and is sacking but its for the good of the world right?

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>>50061107
im a fucking retard

>>50061085
It starts with Glad. Ends with Operating System.

>>50061107
Don't help him any further.

>>50061126
Lofwyr?

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>>50061148

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>>50061126
But you could have used necromancy to diplomatically unify the same people and had a living, less level-adjusted and more strong-willed army if you'd just told them there was a demonic horde on its way. You probably could have outsourced too; there's usually a Sequestered Circle or Tower of High Sorcery or Hackmasters' Guild to call on for that sort of thing.

The man himself? Not really, just incredibly misguided and bereft of morality.

The artifact whispering to his mind? Oh yes. Yes indeed.

>>50060504
I've been working on a plot where the villain is basically an ancient hero driven to madness, being manipulated by 4 lords of hell, trying to get him to spread their respective ideals (Corruption, Death, Fear and Pain respectively) and hope to manipulate him to kill the other 3.

The whole time, the hero still believes himself to be a hero, and talks about Justice and True Love conquering all. He isn't joker crazy,so much as out of touch with reality. When all the lords of hell are dead, he'll essentially go off the rails, with nobody to guide him, he loses himself even further and becomes far more dangerous and hard to predict.

So while incredibly destructive, and his death more or less necessary, I don't consider him evil, and his death would be more of a mercy killing.

>>50060504
Yes, quite. Though there are three.
The King of the Beaten, who damned the souls of his race for a chance at redemption.
A demon Prince who bound their souls to torment.
And the all reaching encompassing darkness that is the out realms, who wish to foothold deeper in the world, and burn it to cinders.

>>50061191
Cara bella, cara mia bella
Mia bambina, o Chell

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>>50061350
You'd probably like Birthright

>>50061202
When the demons would be summoned in the free lands very large area of cooperative city states that resist the influence of neighboring kingdoms together to maintain autonomy you kinda don't want to listen to a figure who has been relatively passed down as a hated foe of life for millennia it does not help he was part of a legend that has been warped over the long years to state that the heroes of legend were his adversaries and not his former adventuring party Never piss off a young elven noble they will fuck over your plans long after your friends are dead, you are asleep, and a new impressionable generation has arisen

>>50060504
D&D, more unethical than evil. No more than some of the proper nobility, anyway.

Fallout... he sincerely believes he's doing the right thing, but also is definitely racist. He is also not smart enough to realize he's falling into the same fallacy as Caesar.

my current BBEG is the lich of an ancient sorceror. he tried to use magic and reach the plane of the gods, the gods were angry and punished him with an unquenchable hunger to learn everything in the universe, yet unable to remember anything he learned the day before. He's currently trying to learn every spell in the universe that can be used to kill. While he is fully aware of his actions he is unable to stop what he's doing.

>>50061394
Love the look of the art, and I live next to a comic store. I'll check it out.

>>50060504

Yep.

He doesn't act out of malice, really. It's mostly fear and pride. But fear, pride, and an utter disregard for the wellbeing of any other life on the planet make for a real asshole.

It isn't really sentient enough to be 'evil', but it does want the extinction of the planet so, you know, kind of a dick.

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>>50061495
It's pretty great anon. It's not exactly like what you described, but it's got a lot of similar elements.

>>50061126
If he didn't try explaining the whole demon invasion first then yes, yes he is evil

My BBEG spreads chaotic magic all over the world ranging from Alice in Wonderland Nonsense to unholy nightmares come true because he used to be a god that no one believed in.

He reasons that the only way for them to notice him is if he goes all out with his power and teaches them by force that he deserves reverence.

Pretty bad/10, imo

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>>50061437
>Reputation is an obstacle.

When I suggested using necromancy for diplomacy I didn't mean play nice. Kill and animate the rulers as your keys to power; the living are better as soldiers, not allies or servants. It just sounded like you were killing the population at large for your efforts. One or two Demise Unseen castings and you'll be in business.

once had a campaign where there were 7 BBEGs each one being the personification of the 7 deadly sins.
party wipe from Sloth

>>50060504
Evil is subjective.

>>50062032
No it's fucking not. Objective morality is based on mutual respect.

>I can respect a cannibal eats people and that's his way of life
>Cannibal must respect I don't want to be eaten nor be a cannibal myself
>If no one wants to be eaten by the cannibal but otherwise respects his way of life, the cannibal might need to reconsider eating people.

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>>50060504
Yea pretty much.
Started from nothing: a street urchin. Struggled and clawed his way to Godhood. Now is slowly destroying all others gods till he is the One True God.

Start from nothing stop for nothing

>>50060504
The way I run a game, there's always a choice of antagonists and the players' actions define who ends up being the BBEG.
But unless they go evil themselves, all the possible antagonists are evil. Except the ultimate, most powerful that only becomes a direct threat of they really screw up.

That BBEG is simply so chaotic that it transcends concepts of good or evil.

>>50060504
Technically, there are a few major foes the party's on the path to going up against, soooo...

>The Alberro Prince's Sister
Yes and no. Split personalities. Around her bro, she's sweet and innocent. Behind the scenes, she summons period demons into virgin maidens to stir up a race war between humans and not!beastfolk.

>Magical Hitler
Yes, undoubtedly. Seeks power for it's own sake, seduced a chick to teach him magic, then had her killed, and also murdered his way up the chain of command. Doesn't care that he's split the empire, just wants to rule.

>The Last Prince of the Elves
More bent on revenge, as he blames the humans(and his twin sister) for the destruction of his homeland. But going so far as trying to wipe the entire human race is a bit much.

>[Redacted, let's call him Stan]
Yeah. Came from an evil empire, killed a messianic figure and absorbed his essence, turned into a monster, and has been sealed away for a thousand years. Over the centuries he's been planning to wipe the world because he's gone off the deep end, thinks "they're" all mocking him.

>The one pulling all the strings
Maybe? Controlling humanity through religion is one thing, trying to kill the true gods to make it so only he can influence humanity is another. Being wholly responsible for 70% of the fucked shit going on in the world, including Stan being what he is, is yet another. Also, this guy's a MASSIVE dick.

>The former party member(that the players have no clue is planning to kill them)
Fairly evil, though she really just wants to kill the party members after a good, hard fight.

>>50060504
Maybe? Is an extra-dimensional being with an insatiable hunger for mortal flesh evil, or just hungry? The 4-5 minor bads trying to steer it towards galactic domination, though, they're definitely evil.

>>50060504
Yes, Its the unleashed experiment of creating forks of serial killers and psychopaths and combining them together in a "super brain" it has spherical head that has slots to each of the consciousnesses that it houses.

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>>50060504
Current bbeg is currently skullface crossed with diavolo, so yeah pretty evil

Yes, because trying to use logic, reasoning, mercy and appeal to justice stopped working for him centuries ago to bring his wife back.

>>50062096
Nah. Morality is subjective and thinking otherwise is the path of cuckoldery.

Might makes right, sorry moralfags.

Yes. He's done what he did because he's petrified of dying. He cannot even entertain the concept of his own mortality; it would unstring him.
So to ensure he lives forever at any cost, he's done a whole bunch of super evil crap to innocent people who didn't deserve it.

>>50062752
Bullshit. If that were true there'd be no such thing as crimes.
Genocide? It's ok, we're strong enough that we were able to kill them all. Rape? Well, she couldn't stop me, so if I'm never caught, my strength has won the day and no wrong has been committed. Theft? Hey, he should've protected his stuff better if he didn't want someone strong like me to take it.
Murder would be the ultimate moral act in your nightmare world.

>>50060504
Yes. But a couple of his underlings are objectively good.

I have some fags in my group that rolled evil characters in what I told them was a good campaign. I shine a light on their evil shittiness every chance I get and try to polarize the party, not for a split but for some actual character development.

Too bad they all are too gay to roleplay in the roleplaying game they're playing.

>>50062883
>If that were true there'd be no such thing as crimes.

I mean, except for the part where the stronger party declares them to be crimes. Which is how it works.

If you were stronger than the government, yes, there would functionally be no such thing as a crime for you.

>>50060504
He's letting a crazier, albeit less dangerous BBEG do his thing so he can swoop in at the last minute, claim the glory, get rid of the heroes and then enact his own plan, which involves upsetting the political, economic and other, more esoteric balances in a region of space, just so he can get money from the neighboring sector. All in all, it's trillions of lives lost in the name of profit.

Yeah, I'd say he's evil.

>>50060504
Is the BBEG the most evil dude in the game, or is it just whoever's the main antagonist? Because if it's the main antagonist, then it's actually a group of totally 2-dimensional hero-types who try to beat the party repeatedly like some kind of Saturday morning cartoon.

>>50060504
I haven't decided yet, but I'm trying to think of things from his perspective.

He belonged to a species that mastered magic to such a degree that death due to old age was no longer a worry, but the flipside was that death due to war was a very real worry, because like humans, they made war on each other an awful lot. During their worst war, their civilization got wiped out because one of their number decided to end all war forever, and in doing so, merged their entire species into a collective consciousness super-being, which promptly fucked off to the Celestial Realm and never returned.

The badguy in question was a former arcanist and researcher whose crimes against nature were so vile that he was put into space-time prison, which meant that when the grand spell washed over his planet and ripped their souls from their bodies to merge into a single entity while reducing their bodies to their component atoms, he was chilling out in the Near Void.

After a few thousand years of immortal solitude, he learned how to project his consciousness not just outside of his body but also across the planes, and he discovers that his people destroyed themselves. However, he finds that their little science experiments (the moons of a gas giant terraformed to support life, where the game takes place) have grown into civilizations much like their own, albeit in a much earlier stage of development.

My two assumptions for this guy are that he
>1: Wants to break out of his time-space prison, and
>2: Wants to rule these silly little creatures

>>50063020
What were his crimes against nature

>>50063138
I was thinking typical mad scientist blatant disregard for ethics and sanctity of life type stuff. Creating horrible mutants whose mere existence is agony, live experimentation on members of his own species, enthusiastic use of torturous biological weapons, that sort of thing.

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>>50060504
He's essentially an Oni Cenobite who wants to unleash the horror upon the party's parents, because those parents drove him to death by exposure by the horrors they inflicted upon him. He found enlightenment in a bad evil wicked place and he wants to turn the party into Oni like himself because he's got a really fucked up way of viewing thing.

He's Freddy Kreuger by way of Pinhead's voice and general attitude. He's a very shitty uncle to the party, but he just wants what is best for them.

>>50060504
Wants to be rich and powerful, has cronies that want to ride his coattails. Will step on anyone to get what he wants.

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>>50060504
No.
The BBEG in my campaign has become a surrogate father for the players.
My BBEG truly believes that he is helping the PCs.
Unbeknownst to the players the BBEG is a genetic engineer from an enemy alien faction.
The players are all mind wiped clones who are unwitting agents of the aliens menace.
Despite this the BBEG regards the players as his adopted children; he truly cares for and loves them.
Ultimately the BBEG hopes that the players will betray their own kind in favor of helping the aliens. He truly believes that it would be in the players best interests.
That is unlikely that the PCs will turn traitor.

I can't wait for the final confrontation when the players discover the truth.

I hope that it destroys them.

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>>50063287
Now that's a quality future plot twist if I've ever seen any

Sssorta? Lich who stole a chunk of the Heart of God, the only way to get true immortality imw, and is now trying to eradicate death as a thing. More 'criminal against reality' than evil.

>>50063314
Oblivion maybe?

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>>50060504
He is absolutely evil, but he does it to fight off a greater evil.

Sortof an "ends justify the means" kindof guy, where the means was jumping off the slope of evil while laughing and flipping all the heroes the bird.

This was in no way required.

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>>50060504
Raging God of Nature, barely coherent.

It's really more a campaign about relationships and stuff, much in the way that zombie campaigns are not about zombies.

One could argue that the king that is chugging a choking coat of ash onto the forest with his industrial metropolis and slowly poisoning it is the BBEG, but he's not evil, and doesn't even know there's a problem.

I'm not sure if the BBEG of my game is evil or not because the world has lots of stuff going on and there are plenty of potential antagonists. If the PCs really upset someone to the point that they have a nemesis on their hands, it's pretty likely that that person would be evil.

The most evil faction in my game has nowhere near the reach or capability of many more notable powers. There's plenty of room for conflict with personal tragic evil on the everyday scale in D&D without a final bad.

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>>50063435
What's Oblivion got to do this with this? Wasn't the plot pretty straightforward? Dagon wants to come in and make ass to ass contact with the material plane, and that's about it. Where's the plot twist?

>>50062953
I think that it's fair to call any main antagonist with a PLAN THAT MUST BE STOPPED a BBEG, but it's also fair to call a personal nemesis who is willing to do bad things to hurt the party a BBEG.

If they're honestly good characters then I don't think the label fits. But why should it have to fit?

>>50062883
There is no such thing as crimes, they're a myth made by your mind.

>>50063540
BBEG's are the main opposing force to the PC party. At least, that's how I see it. So, in that way, they might not be evil at all, they just oppose whatever the PCs are doing.

>>50063541
Found mama's little boy. Having fun with your internet time? Don't waste your goodboy points on being an edgelord, you'll have more fun if you be honest and try to make friends!

>>50060617
you mean almost exactly fable 3

>>50063561
Oh, in that case the BBEG of my game is a medusa that used to be a queen, long ago. She hates her cursed form and longs for the admiration and companionship she had when she lived long ago as a human. Unlike most with her curse, she has not fallen to depravity or madness, but she is willing to kill innocent people to get her way, so yeah, she's evil.

She's also pretty much guaranteed for her quest to fail; at level 5 the party already used the temple that she has been looking for and planned to use to wish her curse away. That temple is now sealed away in an alternate timeline and was her last hope. The party wished for magic armor and wands and stuff that showed off how cool kobolds are.

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>>50063562
Spooky

>>50063513
Not that Oblivion, the Tom Cruise movie. I thought at first that you said you said you hadn't seen that twist before, so I was mentioning Oblivion where He thinks he's an earth man gathering up the last of Earth's resources to leave Earth with a colony of humans after an alien attack ruined the Earth, but it turns out the scavenger aliens he protects against with drones are actually the remaining humans, and he's a clone created by an inter-dimensional AI sapping the Earth of its resources

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>>50060504
Is he?

>End goal: Restructure the cosmos in a way that prevents the end of the universe that was woven into the plan of creation, so that he can truly live forever
>Invented the afterlife after stealing the power of Death's physical incarnation, gave it out to the gods for the small fee of getting to devour the souls of the faithless
>Also allowed necromancy to become widespread, and his rise to power was marked by a week of the living dead (unintentionally, but still)
>His methods have little care for the current contents of the world, would gladly kill everyone if it would make his job that much easier
>Also killed some of his siblings, mentors, and the like for personal gain

Yep, evil. His end goal would be good for everyone left, but that might not be many people.

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She just wants to live forever.

Too bad it includes soul-harvesting murderhobos that grind for XP killing anything they dont like, until she re-absorbs them.

and thats how i explain player characters in setting

>>50063769
The concept of Xenomorph dragons is terrifying.

>>50060504
It's Rogue Trader. Everyone is.

Yes, both are.

But one at least means well and is trying to combat the other one. Said other one is an unthinking force of destruction that can't be reasoned with and wants to eat all existance.

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>>50060504
Evil? Probably not. Greedy and power hungry? Definitely. He's not a total ass in that he knows he needs good guys and bad guys in the world to profit, but he's still in it for the money, the infamy, and the thrill.

>>50060504
Yes. No hidden explanations, misunderstandings or cringy histories. He's just evil and not interested in good at all.

>>50061350
Reminds me of Artorias

They want to see a return of the Giant Empires of old, and that includes the subjugation of all smaller, lesser races to serve Giants. BBEG 2 wants to see the surface world destroyed by a great leviathan to please their gods and for a insane and twisted sense of "justice" and to have free reign of the treasures hidden in the deep

>>50060504
He's a fuck up.

>lesser god tasked to observing the worlds in the universe until he gets older/wiser
>"screw that, i'll make my own world, with blackjack and whores"
>runs from the other gods with his lover, creates universe closed from outside
>at first everything goes well, he has his universe, his mortal servants, there's even lesser pantheon cropping up
>then mortals start doing mortal things, sometimes in his own name
>cannotdealwithit.gif
>"why is my world not perfect? What the fuck are you doing?"
>tries to stop it
>it doesn't stop
>cannot curb their free will or everything goes poof
>his lover has the brightest idea ever - if she destroys the keystone holding the world together, they can make a new one, hopefully with more compliant servants!
(one world shattering later)
>Everything is fucked, the mini-pantheon turns on two dumbasses
>massive fight ensues, everything is even more fucked, mini-pantheon is annihilated, but they manage to imprison the would-be worldbuilders in pocket universe
>1000 years later, god's lover pulls Rita Repulsa and tries to free the pocket universe into the main one (which will override the main universe, destroying everything there, including people's souls)
>All because one dumbass did an equivalent of taking your parents' car for a joyride.

>>50060504
Yes, and for no other reason than FUCK YOU ALL!

>>50061468
>but also is definitely racist

So?

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>>50060504
Campaign BBEG is a terrorist who's determined to break a fragile peace treaty between two nations who have been warring for centuries because soldiers from the other nation killed his son.

People opposed to the treaty consider him a hero for what he's doing. Those who actually want peace think he's insane for getting revenge for his son by getting everyone else's sons murdered in more pointless war.

The party mostly think he's an asshole, but I've had positive feedback over the fact that he doesn't give villainous monologues or anything like that.
Most of the time when they encounter him, he barely even speaks save to command his own men. He literally has no interest in the party or speaking to them, and probably won't unless they manage to rumble him for good.

>>50060732
Well, I guess there's no sense crying over every mistake.

>>50066829
You just keep on trying, even twelve hours late.

>>50060504
Not cartoonishly so but yes, he's easily one of the most evil fuckers in history. He has shades of grey, but mostly he's pitch fucking black.

He's just a Wizard who wants to be left alone but unfortunately he has to look after a city. So to do the best he just grants wishes.

The Gods are angry because the city has no concept of Religion

>>50060504
Only according to a moral framework that would identify him as evil, like anyone else.

I personally think he is evil, as his motivation for doing what he's doing is weak willed, economic, and disingenuous.

>>50062335
>Seeks power for it's own sake, seduced a chick to teach him magic, then had her killed, and also murdered his way up the chain of command. Doesn't care that he's split the empire, just wants to rule.
What does that have to do with Hitler?

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The "bad" guy in the campaign i'm playing in is basically a more sympathetic Nox. An unspecified apocalypse happened and wiped out 99.9% of civilization across the whole planet, and he alone survived in a sort of null-time capsule to emerge in the present day, hundreds of thousands of years later. Humanity now lives in relative squalor with no memory of how far we have fallen compared to the golden days of his time, and he's working tirelessly to travel back to the past and avert the disaster.
This would sacrifice the present to save the past, and he is tortured by his immoral actions that he feels are necessary. If he succeeds, more past-lives would be saved than present-lives would be lost.

I decided to join him.

What's the best kind of BBEG?

The asshole with noble intentions, or the noble with asshole intentions?

Is Peter the Great a bad guy?

The answer might surprise you!

>>50060504
Ancient Evil wants to break into the material plane for a singular reason, a man(Apple farmer) long ago got dropped into it's plane through near unexplainable reason(Wizard shenanigans), offered it an apple as an apology for intruding.

It now wants to come to the material plane for more apples.

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>>50068261
The latter.

>>50060504


Yes. He doesn't think of himself as such, but he's pretty damn evil. Not pure evil kick a puppy for no reason mind you, but very much an idealistic revolutionary that has turned into another one of those power corrupt rulers that he railed against in the beginning.

>>50068250
I've got a—similar villain. Only, the other way around.

He travelled back in time to start a 40k level apocalyptic war, because it was necessary to build a future Heaven. Of course his Heaven is arguable.

>>50060504
Depends on your point of view.

MY bbeg is a warden of reality where the universe goes through cycles of existence. After every hundred billion years or so, he manipulates events in the world to throw of the balance of the world which in turn ends it (think dark souls "the fire dies" sort of thing). If he doesn't do this within a certain time limit, the next cycle becomes one of complete misery until it ends.

He's just doing his job

>>50060504
I don't know, but he tried his best to piss me off

>>50060504
Pretty much evil, but not completely irredeemable.

Most of the minor villains are typically greyscale though.

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Can anyone help me think of a good motivation for my villainous character?

Without going into too much detail; he's a Rogue God that was either ejected from or quit the Celestial Bureaucracy that runs the universe. He stole this years primary harvest from all the people in one region literally overnight, causing a massive famine. The party seeks to get it back.

But what is his motivation? I haven't thought of one yet, and I'd like to give this guy a manifesto. Maybe that there are too many humans and starvation should kill a lot of them off? Maybe sell the food back for huge prices?

>>50060504
The "BBEG" is another group of assorted characters, who started as party's rivals, but after the conflict started to draw out, they started resorting to evil shit to get more power.
The party retaliated by doing even more evil shit, and as the result the land where the conflict is taking place now looks like hell, because it partially is

>>50069560
Well, what was he the god of?
That will dictate a lot of the motivation behind their actions.

>>50060504
Good, evil, right, and wrong don't actually exist in any tangible fashion, they're imaginary subjective concepts that change depending on the era, culture, and person.

I'm concerned about the possibility of having to play with people that are intellectually childish enough not to understand this.

>>50069725

Ahh, I haven't actually thought of that yet. He is just described as an 'ex-bureaucrat' so far. No specific title of head of any heavenly department.

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>>50069755

>I'm a mass murderer who raped and killed twenty children because it makes my weewee hard
>I'm a corrupt middle-manager who steals work from his underlings and fires them so they can't do anything about it; taking all the credit for myself
>I throw acid in women's faces because somebody accused them of being a slut; if she tries to protest I will behead her

>We aren't evil! Good and Evil are subjective! xd

>>50069755

Aaaaactually in many systems good and natural metaphysical concepts which have express and predictable actions and reactions which can be measured and with well-understood consequences.

When Detect Good exists, morality is a science.

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>>50060769
>Well he's a Danish

>>50060504
For once? Fucking YES.
Ticking all the boxes, all the tropes.

For nostalgic/classic fantasy good/evil divide. None of that blurriness that I usually favor.

For once we have THE GOOD versus THE EVIL and all is well.

>>50069815
Nice non-argument hinging on EMOTIONS! DON'T THESE THINGS MAKE YOU FEEL BAD? MUH CHILDRENS! MUH WOMEN! anon.

It's subjective. It's quite possible a few hundred years from now things you don't think are "evil" will be considered "evil" by the majority of society and vice versa.

The weak should fear the strong.

>>50069844
Not everyone plays plebian "vaguely medieval fantasy with modern CURRENT YEAR values and morality that are totally objectively true" DnD, anon.

Exact oppisite. He's a holy crusader appalled by the attocities he has seen in his years of combat. Believing that all evil spawns from the temptation presented by demons and devils he plans to destroy all the different hells that exist in his universe.

Recently, his altar boys/goons unearthed reference to an ancient ritual that can wipe out any choice planes of existence at the cost of destroying the plane that the ritual was performed on. He plans on scarificing his world to destroy Hell. In his mind, since there won't be a unholy place for all the souls of man to go they will ascend into the Heavens and be purified into divine, holy celestials.

>>50068271
If I ever make a novel series or something, I'm stealing this.

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>>50069934
>The weak should fear the strong.

>>50069934
Dude, being an asshole to innocent people is evil.

>>50070043
Couldn't he perform the ritual at some other plane of hell or something?

>>50060685
neat

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Our GM is a lazy fuck when it comes to building actual plot, and just ripped pic related straight from his favorite video game. On the plus side it's the party's favorite game too so we're enjoying this shamelessly evil psycho fucknugget.

He somehow hacked into our comm devices and regularly shouts obscenities at us.

>>50070145
The ritual has to be paired with a specific place of power located on his plane. I am thinking the place is a cavern at the top of a mountain, a place where some being of nothingness and entropy tried to enter eons ago. The Dark Being's birth ended up being a "miscarriage" in a sense. The universe kept moving on, the being died, but its brief exsistance stained the location; it's power remaining trapped in the "womb." All the Crusader has to do is find the location, open up a portal to any realm he wants caught in the crossfires, and pull out the plug to "the drainage pipe of the universe."

>>50070441
Thansk for clearing it out.

>>50062143
>Actually had to work to be a god.
>Didn't just do it on a drunken bet.

>>50060504
Yes.

>>50063635
Best answer.

>>50070090
>>50070115
>>50069934
Naw lads, morality is subjective, but I think edge-anon is doing a bad job of selling the idea.
Essentially, while there is no objective moral standard unless you want to start talking theology, but that's a whole other can of worms, there is the herd instinct which is common to most of humanity.
At the end of the day, most people don't like seeing other people hurt without some justification, however flimsy said justification would be. Within the scope of (most of) humanity, it could be said that this is objective.
However, in the grand scheme of things it's entirely subjective, as there's no reason that every species or society that could possibly arise would subscribe to the same set of values.

>>50066121
So... Kinda satan?

>>50068271
What TYPE of Apple? If granny smith, he is not evil. If fuji, inescapably evil.

>>50070890

I can get behind that.
See, I actually DO believe morality is subjective, or at the very least shaped by a collective notion of self interest, and find it easy to agree with you for the most part. But the way edge-anon puts it is both needlessly reductive and as willfully grim as a broody teenager.

>>50060769
>danish
to evil, literally satan right there.

>>50060504
Yes. He would just be a big guy otherwise.

I'll go ahead and get this out of the way for /tv/: for you, 4U, UUUU, four ewe.

Well, he's a Nephandus, so yeah.

To be fair, some people are just fucking sociopaths. They are incapable of empathy and the only time they are able to feel anything is when they hurt others. Which is really ironic, because most sociopaths are extremely extroverted, sociable and personable. They tend to have this thing where they only respect fellow predators.

I dunno, sometimes I think the scariest villains exist in real life, cause in real life, there is no one to stop them.

>>50060504
No, she is simply possessed by both a devil and an ancient dragon, at the same time, who are in a tug-of-war state and fucking her up mentally.

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>Having villains

My campaign is just revolving around the group trying to stop a natural disaster of sorts - something that'd fuck the world over pretty hard. It could be argued that what started the chain of events a long time ago was evil, but by the current time in game not only is he long dead, the impending calamity is much more than they intended - even he'd be mortified by the destruction it'd cause by now.

>>50071520
Maybe its just better to let nature take its course, then?

After all, if a small minority of people have to assume responsibility for an entire civilization, then haven't those people basically sealed their own fate by choosing not to act?

Why should they be responsible for the health and well being of the entire world?

>>50060504
Evil in the sense that the heroes work for the organization controlling her that in turns controlls them to fight the good organization on behalf of a fifth party.

It got complicated fucking fast.

I'm not sure we have a BBEG. The current plague of undead seems to have happened by accident. There's a centaur bandit that I want to kill, though. He's kind of a dick. Not sure he's more evil than us, since we did burn prisoners alive, but to be fair, that wasn't really planned ahead of time.

>>50071487
>Le i have a degree in psychology.

There is a customer waiting at the counter, they want a grande vanilla bean frappicino.

>>50060504
>Celtic Pathfinder
It seems like the gods of chaotic evil were behind trying to kill the world tree, so it's a safe bet.
>WoD
We're currently investigating some demons/vampires who definitely seem legitimately evil.
Though there was a spirit we dealt with last session who we couldn't tell for sure was evil. Then again, it was probably a Slasher.
Still, I have the hunch that my character's releasing it and consequently using the wish it gave me by telling it to literally go to hell is going to bite me in the ass later.
>5E campaign
We haven't met a BBEG so far, but we've found out that the plague cult we're trying to stop may be connected to the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, so I'd guess yeah, there's definitely some evildoing.

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>>50060504

Yea, but my players are also evil. So is their boss. And technically the BBEG is part of the same conspiracy as their boss, but all the real movers and shakers have their own buddies and/or higher ups, not all of whom get on.

Honestly I have got a big fuckoff chart so I can keep all this shit straight in my head. The beauty of it is, the players know there is a bigger picture, but haven't really got any idea what is really going on behind some of the missions they are sent on. Some real conspiracies in conspiracies shit going on.

Well one is just kind of a coward, the other is so fiercely loyal to his country that he is willing to commit horrible deeds for it, and the final one is so loyal to his men that he is willing to sabotage his entire country to save their lives

Does that make them evil?

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>>50063287
For the love of God, sotrytime that sit when the time comes!

Debatably. While he's a user of sanity/realiy warping magic, and a real prick besides, his main motivation is petty spite and a desire to fuck over his rivals.

My big bad is a nameless god of thieves who destroyed its own true name so no identity could ever be given to it or pinned for any crimes.

Its also the most reprehensible douchebag in a pantheon that contains a eldritch abomination that dresses like a clown and a minotaur that purchased and enslaved the souls of the entire elven race.

It's entire philosophy is "Everything is already there, so whenever you get something you are taking from someone else. So go whole hog about it."

Not a single thing in its church belongs to it, its clergy is a front for organized crime rings (Plural, and as it intended) and its holy men are the priests of the other faiths raised as undead.

Half of the magic items in the world are stolen and sacrificed to its Vault, a ancient stone door where nothing is ever given, only taken. Once something enters that vault, its gone forever.

It's the reason why necromancy exists, AND why its by definition evil rather then a morbid shortcut to make golems.

>>50062752
Might doesn't make right, it either enforces it, or is strong enough to ignore it. But power alone is not a moral system.

>>50062902
Crimes are based on law, not morality, that's why something can be morally reprehensible but still completely legal.

And yes the strong make the law but the weak make the morals.

Example: a strong man robs you, you call it wrong because he has abused his power to take what is not his, he calls it law because he is strong and you cannot meaningfully object.

>>50069934
Morality is inherently emotional, it based on someone feeling wronged and wanting recompence, if it were completely logical then not only would it still exist but it would be objective which it isn't due to its emotional nature.

>>50060504
Evil usually requires motivation indicating intelligence.

Bears ain't that clever so no.

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>>50070890
>>50071054
These fuckers get it.

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>>50071487
They have plenty of people to stop them, that why the world's better than it ever been anon.

>>50071572
Because they live on it and don't wanna die?

Yes. It doesn't matter how much you want to see your dead friends again, anyone willing to obliterate and reshape two worlds to revive three people is a monster.

>>50066517
Against humans in general.

Fuck's sake.

I ripped off the Master, sue me.

>>50069760
He's semi-mortal now, and requires large portions of food/energy to sustain himself?

>>50060504
I'd give a token 'well, that depends on what you consider Evil', but
>Obliterating current reality to reshape it to her whim and the whims of her servants
yeah.
Admittedly, her whims aren't that terrible, but those of her servants would create 'hollow' universes lacking consistent internal logic- a fact that would basically cause said universes to instantly 404 and trigger a hard reset of everything.
Which would be A Very Bad Thing.

>>50066715
>all that effort designing the outfit
>that complete lack of effort on the sword
Why?

Some? Sure. Most? Not particularly, they're just as temperamental as any normal human. And when particularly temperamental divine beings get into love triangles, affairs and cheating, it causes mayhem on Earth when they duke it out in the Heavens. Because of their in-fighting, major phenomena occur on Earth, such as mountains spontaneously erupting from the earth, columns of fire beaming out of clouds, and tsunamis appearing and immediately disappearing. The major clergy of the deities collectively shitting their pants, because in the game world, this has never happened before, and frankly the gods are fucking shit up all over the place for mortals. So far, nobody has managed to determine in-world exactly why the gods are fighting, but that's what a plucky band of adventurers is for!

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Varying shades, but without question

>>50060504
Kinda? Mostly just on a revenge mission.

Exalted campaign. Villain is a Twilight Sorceress whose little toy kingdom got effectively nuked by the Dragonblooded.

She still thinks of herself as "one of the good guys" and generally tries to avoid fucking over mortals any more than she has to. Example: She corrupted the leylines around a large town and it inadvertently began to attract a huge swarm of undead from a nearby shadowland. She tried to cast a ward to protect the town until she could fix it, but the PCs managed to interrupt the ritual thinking she was about to do something evil.

>>50060905
guy in picture is squeezing blood from a bird's anus

>>50060504
i never really have BBEG's, i feel like its railroading. i mean the setting has BAD people in it but if the party chooses to never interact with him as he is going about doing evil shit is he really the BBEG?

>>50060504
Yes.

Otherwise he wouldn't be a BBEG. And while there might be sympathetic undertones in what he does and what motivates him, by the end of the day he's still a sick fuck that orders loot, rape and pillage just because he can.

>>50080300
Yes.
It doesn't really matter if PCs decide to interact or if the BBEG will try to interact with them (why should he/she in the first place?). But if there is a BBEG around, then shit just happens. PCs might not give a fuck, but that won't prevent the situation at hand from happening.

Basically, ignoring BBEG doesn't mean he/she didn't do some nasty shit. In fact, it would be railroading to get the BBEG only act if players react to his presence.

>>50063020

Literally 50% elder scrolls dwemer

>>50060504

No, he's Lawful Neutral and the commander of the kingdom's military forces as well as a cornerstone of the government.
He's quite amicable and the PCs know him quite well, but he has a secret agenda. The players know everything he does, but not why he does it and they haven't figured him out yet.

The genocides against the kobolds, orcs and goblins. Declaring the local tavern to be structurally unsound and rebuilding it to be circular. Convincing one of the PCs to abandon life as an adventurer and join the king's forces instead: it's all part of his grand plan to eliminate fantasy adventurers as a concept. Since he eliminated all of the low level enemies (the orcs) there's nothing for low level PCs to fight, so no more adventurers can spring up and with the tavern remodeled, there are no dark corners for shady quest givers to hide in.
It's all going perfectly to plan. Soon will come the tax on ten-foot poles.

>>50078258
I don't know...I didn't draw it.

Not evil in the traditional sense. My current BBEG is entropy given form, which manifests as Masks, dread pirate roberts style, and each mask has its own agenda.

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There are two villains. When is the classic giant dick of a dragon and the other is the hardened Stern powerful adventurer with a heart of gold who really just comes off as a dick so people assume he's a villain because he has so many powerful artifacts and means at its disposal and that his aim is sometimes seem contradictive in the face of the king and his orders.

More to the point when the adventure has the artifacts necessary to save or condemn the world in his possession and he's not giving them up to other side just because he wants to be a dick kind of makes him the villain.

>>50060504
There is a reason why he is called a BBEG, not BBNG

>>50060504
Yes. More of a selfish asshole than pure evil though.

The thing is that the players seem to think he's not their biggest problem and that as long as he remains useful they'll make use of him. Essentially, they're willfully ignoring the BBEG because they have gotten the idea that he's a mostly harmless small fry.

This was never my intention, but I'm just gonna roll with their assumptions and when the twist comes to light act like it was all according to keikaku.

>>50060504
Fuck yes. He's an ogre magi that want an artefact to open a gate to a plane of constant violence and bloodshed in order to become Moses and bring all his race to what is basically their version of heaven.

While his current goal is pretty good for the world because no more ogres (think WHFB ogres) the party also need the artifact to save the life of an important nPC and he's still a savage beast that enjoy suffering, violence and bloodshed and routinely make pact with demons.

>>50060504
He is based on Zero from MGS so yes
I mean he dropped on us an attack with nerve gas

>>50061622
oh man, birthright. What volume was that up to?

Pretty much. He went psycho after a series of bad events and failures, one of which is the love of his life leaving him. Now he wants to turn back time, even if it could collapse several universes into one, essentially destroying everything.

>>50060769
>concentration camps
so you're playing an alternative fiction setting?

>>50083161
I only read until vol 3, and it looks like vol 4 is on its way

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>>50060504
No, but it is very, VERY hungry.

>>50075105
>but the weak make the morals.
That is a very negative thing in an era where there are people praising street gang mentality among the "weak" and claiming that the "Strong" deserve to be robbed of their possessions because all they have is a result of other people's work.

>>50060504
Think Regis Nex: what he does is technically "for the good of his people", but he has committed so many atrocities with a straight face and has ruled for so long as a cruel and unfeeling tyrant that all but his oldest and closest friends think of him as pure evil.

>>50069755
In the real world this is true.

In D&D you can literally detect where evil is, what it is and how evil something is.

>>50060504
Yes. Technically he's doing the right thing but he's taking the path of least resistance and highest body count to save the world despite there being perfectly legitimate alternatives

>>50086062
>>>/pol/

>>50068004
It's the nickname for him that most Animafags have. He's an incredibly charismatic megalomaniac who has swept up the provinces under his control through propaganda about bringing back the empire's glory(or making it great again, if you will), and blaming non-Christians and sorcerers for all the evils befalling the continent, even though he's a caster himself.

>>50060504
The BBEG in my campaign is a nazi (we play in 1946 divided Berlin) who can take possession of someone if they both sleep at the same time.
He uses this power to infiltrate, spy, kill and steal frm the allies, not for the Reich, not to avenge Hitler, but only to inflict pain and distress on the invaders