Perturabo did nothing wrong, Emperor was a cunt.

>Rest? We were not made to rest; we go on, unflinching, unstoppable, unending in our strength. The Emperor did not make us for such mortal concerns as hearth and home, vanity or contemplation; we are his engines of war, his hammers, beating out the fabric of existence into a vessel fit for Mankind to inhabit.

Pert, and a couple of the other Primarchs, need to get their heads out of their ass about their situation. They're not people. They weren't born to do something. They were made. They're not just soldiers, they're tools. That's not such a bad lot in life, but it requires you to fucking get over yourself and realize what you are capable of doing matters more than your feelings.

>>49841832
>yo, just accept being a slave

Perty was a shithead but your approach is exactly the kind of shit that lead to the Heresy.

>>49841884
Pretty much this- I sincerely doubt they were given a choice in being brought into the world as weapons of war. Especially in the case of someone like Pert, who had a whole lifetime to begin a path down a different direction, only for Big E to show up and drag him kicking and screaming into a whole different role and berate him for not being great at it.

>>49841884
I just mean that a lot of them need to take a good hard existential look at their lot in life. You can't just desert your entire fucking species because you feel personally slighted.

>>49841978
Well technically you can, and they did.

>>49841730
It's harder to feel sorry for him when he never protested how he and Legion were shoehorned. Like stand up for yourself, say "Hey can I be the one who gets to build shit for once, instead of just tearing it down?"

>>49841730
Don't care, he was the most fa/tg/uy of all the primarchs, down building models and geeking out over history with Magnus.
Plus the absolute hilarity that was the Inron Cage.

>>49841884
Why did the Emperor give them free will in the first place? Couldn't he have at least installed a remote control or something? He made them with Magic-Science so that should've been in the realm of possibility.

Also I agree with >>49841832. Astartes and especially Primarchs (since they weren't born by normal human means) are necessary crafted abominations and closer to tools than people. Once they were done with conquering the galaxy humanity would and should have ditched them and evolve into a Eldar-tier psyker race with their own webway 2.0 and shit.

>>49841978
I'd honestly rather desert the Imperium than work for the Emperor.

He's a dick and a moron.

Of course, trading one dickhead god for four dickhead gods was a pretty poor idea.

>>49842624
Malcador 'should've given 'em tits' the Sigilite for president.

>>49842653
Why was Malcador shilling for women primarchs? Was it
>muh female compassion

>>49842692
They would have been passive aggressive instead of aggressive aggressive.

>>49842692
He basically argued that making them an actual family (adding sisters, not making them all female) might have brought them closer together.

>>49842583
because he didn't want the galaxy to be run by automatons.

>>49842516
He was the guy that's always really bitter about doing the shit jobs, despite never asking to do other things, doing them of his own accord, and never refusing a job - and it's not like he lacked the authority to do so, he just didn't. Some people are just like that.

He was also acutely paranoid, which didn't help - he named the Eye of Terror, and he called it that because he always felt it was watching him

>>49841919
>who had a whole lifetime to begin a path down a different direction
On Olympia he was his foster-father's general, doing the same stuff for him as he would later do for big E, though at least he got more opportunity to build there.

He also worked out he was post-human, not of that world and artificially created (when it comes to raw data he's just about the most intelligent primarch), though given how good he was at war combined with his paranoia that's not really a good thing - he knew he was a tool for war, probably why he never refused a mission despite the cost both to his legion and to his psyche

>>49842877
He should have hung out with Ferrus more.

>>49842898
He was good bros with Magnus at least. And he got along with Vulkan (but then again who didn't?) to where Vulkan helped him make a perpetual motion device to power a mini-clockwork warhound titan. He gave a Guilliman a ballin' clock that got put in Macragge's equivalent to Times Square.

>>49842806
Who would've been the mother? Come to think of it, which Primarch's had mother figures? Guilliman, and maybe Fulgrim, Corax, and Vulkan?

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B-But...

>>49843005
I don't remember the genders of the people that found Fulgrim. Corax was raised by a group of people, so he might have. Vulkan was raised by a blacksmith. I'm not sure if it's ever mentioned if he had a wife. Pert might have had a foster mother, but he probably liked her less than his foster father.

>>49842898
Ferrus was pretty similar, just not paranoid and emo about it - he took the 'I'm an artificially created posthuman weapon that's going to blast mankind out of the dark age' thing as a source of pride.

>>49843005
Most of the well balanced ones.

>>49843049
Exactly. Probably would have straightened him out a little. Frankly I'm surprised it's not mentioned they interacted at all, given how both were the most technically minded Primarchs.

>>49841730
HE A GOOD BOY

>>49841730

While Pert wasn't the only Primarch with autism, he certainly had the worst case of it.

>>49843785
Dorn was worse but for whatever reason he was given the job of fortifying Terra and labeled his Praetorian so he didn't superg out against the Emperor like Pert.

>>49843862

Dorn had a mild case of it but he was able to function well and actually made friends with the others.

Pert had a completely one-track mind; he could not enjoy anything other than building or digging and he wouldn't' shut up about it.

>>49842806
There is no way that co-ed primarchs would not be fucking.

>>49844055
Did any of the primarchs get married before being found by the Emperor?

>>49844089
I could see dorn and guilliman doing that, considering they had normal-ish lives, families and eventually ruled over actual interstellar empires.

The Emperor was a shit father.

>>49844089
None of them had any romantic relationships. Not that we've heard of, anyway.

I tend to think falling in love with a normal human would be for a primarch what falling in love with a child would be for you and me. Assuming you're not a pedophile, that simply holds no appeal for you physically, and mentally they're so far behind you that the gulf can't be surmounted.

>>49844155
But if they had had SISTERS, mind you... Or, I suppose, if two of them had been gay...

GASP

We found the Lost Primarchs.

>>49844155
I refuse to believe that an immense Chad like Russ never stuck his dick in anything.

>>49843464
It's mentioned that Pert was curious if Ferrus could see the Eye of Terror as well, and when he asked, Ferrus said nothing and gave him an annoyed glare, iirc.

Also, Pert just wanted to be a Diplomat and an Architect. A shame he never got to do either.

>>49844474

>Also, Pert just wanted to be a Diplomat and an Architect. A shame he never got to do either.

He might have gotten that chance if he was able to communicate his frustration in ways other than petty grumbling and fits of tard rage.

>>49844089
Iirc, it's mentioned in one of the old BA codices that Sanguinias had a wife.

>>49844486
I don't really think the Emperor would have let the primarch of the legion who went on the hardest missions and had the best geneseed act as a diplomat.

>>49844486
>implying the Emperor wanted diplomats

Big E was a typical fascist thug. He had no interest in diplomacy.

>>49844517

Diplomacy happens, just off-camera. It's much like the steamroll victories where the Imperial Navy bombs a rebelling planet flat and moves on -- it's routine, so it doesn't make the HUGE HEROIC STORIES OF HUGE HEROES DOING HEROICALLY HUGE THINGS!!!

>>49843481
#astarteslivesmatter

>no they don't

>>49842877
>He also worked out he was post-human, not of that world and artificially created (when it comes to raw data he's just about the most intelligent primarch), though given how good he was at war combined with his paranoia that's not really a good thing - he knew he was a tool for war, probably why he never refused a mission despite the cost both to his legion and to his psyche

This is what makes Perty one of the more interesting Primarchs. He has this weird sense of pride mingled with inferiority about what he is. He doesn't want to be it, but he doesn't want to be defective either, so he does whatever is asked of him. He sees this as the correct course, yet he finds it unsatisfying and unfulfilling, and he expects praise for essentially going against his own nature out of duty - praise he never gets, because someone who never says 'no' is always used for the least glorious and most shameful duties.

Maybe he hoped that after the Great Crusade he could finally be something else.

I can't respect Perturabo, but I can feel him. He a real human bean.

>>49844148
>BLAM

>>49841832
>Rest? We were not made to rest; we go on, unflinching, unstoppable, unending in our strength. The Emperor did not make us for such mortal concerns as hearth and home, vanity or contemplation; we are his engines of war, his hammers, beating out the fabric of existence into a vessel fit for Mankind to inhabit.

That was a Ferrus Manus quote you nob

>>49844712
I know it was. Ferrus was one of the only Primarchs that "got it" about what being a Primarch was.

>>49844431
as do we all, but it was most likely nordic wenches and not a monogamous spousal relationship.

>>49842563

fa/tg/guys don't smash a tenth of their models when they don't win a battle though.

>>49844915
We would if we were princes.

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The Lord of Iron toiled in silence for hundreds of years, because the Emperor told him to. He used his sons like other Legions used bolt shells, because the Emperor assigned to him such soul crushing battles that required a that terrible tithe of blood. He took the most unforgiving and inglorious tasks of the entire Great Crusade, because the Emperor told him to. You may look down on Perturabo and the IVth Legion, but do not forget that well your vaunted champions strode through golden halls wearing the laurels of glory because the Emperor assigned you the easy and heroic tasks it was the Lord of Iron that fought in the blood soaked mud on a thousand worlds so that you might claim those victories well his sons suffered deaths that you told yourself you were too good for. Look down on him from your high horse, but know that it was the Iron Warriors that paid the price for the ground it stands upon.

Does everyone here forget that Peturabo is called the Iron Tyrant for a reason? That the first thing he did with his legion was wipe out a tenth of it? That he called his brother Corax Craven and a Coward for not wanting to throw his Legion into the teeth of the enemy defences? That to him, human life meant nothing and he was willing to lose 90% of his armies if it brought victory?

Peturabo was a monster. He was the monster of industrial death, all the pointless slaughter of WWI come together in one person. Don't treat him like some wronged hero. He gave every bit as much as he took before he turned.

>>49844985
He was willing to lose however many it took to win. Decimation aside, he rarely threw lives away unnecessarily.

>>49844985
I mean, the people dying were Space Marines. They're pretty much dead from the time they start getting gene therapy.

>>49845027

I don't know if throwing Imperial Army soldiers into the enemy just to see how long it would take to wipe them out counts as necessary.

If Peturabo is fa/tg/uy of all the primarchs, then fa/tg/uys must be sociopaths.

>>49845053
War is hell, m8.

>>49844567
>this
People really seem to forget that the Big E was down with a lot of awful shit. For all his talk of bringing enlightened atheism to the galaxy and saving humanity from the aliens, he was perfectly willing to make a deal with the cats on Angron's world who literally cybernetically modified poor people and watched them murder each other for fun.

>>49845050
Aside from all the regular army that were dying, I guess.

>>49845165
Well yeah. They weren't aliens or infected with Chaos.

Big E doesn't give a shit about people. He cares about humanity as a species. It's a dark hungry galaxy and he's trying to make sure humanity comes out on top. Ultimately, his lack of care for people is his undoing but it's not like he wasn't aware of it. He just didn't give a shit.

>>49845050

Just because they're bred for war doesn't mean marching them into the meat grinder is the "correct" way of running things. I mean, Vulkan and the Lemon were pretty humanitarian by space marine standards.

That said, you can at least give Pert credit for seeing through the bullshit and seeing the space marines for what they really were. Weirdly enough, he was probably more like Colonel Kurtz than Konrad ever really was.

>>49844985
He fought a war of logistics, he fought a realistic war. With their grandiose assaults, fluttering colors, and elegant speeches most of the other Space Marine Legions represent 40k, superheros fighting in the Grim Darkness of the Far Future. Perturabo through that aside and jumped into the battles that could ONLY be won with brutal, siege warfare. His brothers were obsessed with "perfection", glory, senseless and wasteful carnage, or taking a decade and a half to take a plant with "just as planned". When the Emperor said "My son, see that grey, fortified, chunk of rock over there? Take it." Perturabo NEVER complained, he took the shittiest most inglorious battles the galaxy had to offer and then won them. What would Guilliman do if faced with a fortress world that, like granite, could only be taken by slowly and ingloriously wearing it down? What about Russ? Sanguinius? They couldn't fight such a battle, they were too busy winning the praise of the Emperor for their actions in glorious battles that the Iron Warriors could never hope of being assigned to. The other Legions were swords, spears, even daggers in the Emperor's hands. The Iron Warriors were his hammer.

>>49845216
Fair about his way of doing things. There's a reason the Space Marines of 40k are used as strike forces or the tip of the spear. They just work better and more efficiently that way.

Space Marines are dead men walking though. Soon as that geneseed goes in, they are destined to die protecting mankind.

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>>49845050
>They're pretty much dead from the time they start getting gene therapy
They have feelings, they do know pain, sadness, sympathy and they can master other things outside of battle, plenty of legions and chapters did that.

>>49845216
>Lemon
>humanitarian

>>49845339
Just because they can, doesn't mean they should. Space Marines are weapons first, people second. Thinking otherwise is deluding yourself.

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>>49845257
>Space Marines are dead men walking though. Soon as that geneseed goes in, they are destined to die protecting mankind.
Just like every other warrior of Imperium? IG have next to zero chance of retirement, skitarii are half zombies.
>>49845364
Guillliman proved you wrong, his realm was shaped and maintained as better place in Galaxy for ten millennia by astartes.

>>49844985
>>49845027
Even the decimation had something of a purpose, it was punishment for the legion fucking up at Incaladion due to pride and stubbornness - a war that cost them about ten times the marines of the decimation, including a ton of vets

>>49845439

>we lost a considerable number of marines so I'm gonna make sure it never happens by killing more marines

Pert was interesting but he was not sympathetic, likable, or even right in basically anything he did.

>>49845466
Pert would have been fine had Emps just given him the job of building the dankest fortresses ever.

>>49845486
Pert would have been fine if he spent more time around Guilliman instead of Fagnus.

>>49845486

It's possible he could have done just that if he ever actually did something other than say "sir yes sir" then go off and mumble to himself.

>>49844915
Don't smash your unlucky dice?

>>49844089
Khan probably wrecked bitches due to the culture of conquering everything (including the enemy's women)

>>49844089
Look at the size of Primarchs their dicks must be massive as well how would they even bang their wifes without killing them?

>>49845799

Remember it's 40k, and most of the plaents the Primarchs wound up on were death worlds.

I have a feeling Fenrisian women were a good deal larger and tougher than Terran ones.

>>49845656
>>49845799
It's very unlikely any of the Primarchs had a sex drive (maybe Fulgrim post-ascension).
Some might have married for political purposes though.

>>49845849
furrier too

>>49845466

The man wanted to be a builder and the Emperor shat on him from a great height. Man builds a fuckhuge stadium for his dad and the first thing Big E does is use it for a fucking trial on one of the only Primarchs who was decent towards him. I don't blame him for snapping.

>>49844700
I like this interpretation of Pert the best. Iron within!

>>49845165
Didn't Empy-chan also back the tyrants because Angron's warriors were closeted Khorne worshippers?

>>49847334
Yeah, the Nikaean Coliseum being used as the stage of a kangaroo court for his best friend always bugged Pert.

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>>49844915

>>49842191
and look where they are now, huddled together in the asshole of the galaxy for 10 000 years ebing consumed by hate.

>>49844431
he kept those huge wolves for a reason.

>>49845466
>Pert was interesting but he was not sympathetic, likable, or even right in basically anything he did.
I feel this can apply to most primarchs.

I can understand, maybe feel sorry for them, and they're all fairly interesting characters, but most of them aren't likeable in any way.

>>49844939
>He used his sons like other Legions used bolt shells
That's metal.

>>49845799
I defy you to prove Vulkan didn't rape female Dark Eldar to make a point.

>>49844128
I doubt girlyman would have. He was to busy trying to rebuild ultramar to get married.

>>49841730
The one of the Emperor did wrong was give command of the Legions to people who were at peak (and more) physically but had the emotional development of teenagers

the Horus Heresy was basically Horus going: "It's not a phase dad! No one understands me!"

>>49841730
>Emperor was a cunt.
Yeah but, who likes autists?