Exalted General - /exg/

>>49786287
Let us discuss the religions of theCreation, because why not. Specifically, the Immaculate Faith. Have you used sympatethic Immaculates in you non-Dragonblooded games?

>>49786324
There's a dynast running with my circle in the deep West, who is probably an immaculate believer. She is willing to commit outright blasphemy in the name of personal gain, though.

>>49786324


My Immaculates tend to be pretty much universally good people, even the nameless ones that get cut down trying to take on a Solar were just trying to do the right thing. I tend to focus on their conflict with the Fair Folk, rogue gods, and Lunars though.

I had a put-upon mortal follower of the Immaculate faith holding an administrative post in one city they were in.

The party figured he must be a Dragon-Blooded if he cares so much way out here. When they found out he wasn't, they guessed he must be the nonexalted son of one of the Dragon-Blooded who were running the city. They never got around to finding out that he wasn't that, either. Just devout.

>>49786324
Almost every Immaculate monk I've put my players against has more or less been a decent human at worst. While non-monk Immaculate faithful tend to have more leeway in the morals department, I've always had a soft spot for the ardently-faithful Fire aspect samurai who believes that the Dragon-Blooded are the most enlightened people under the Immaculate Dragons themselves and therefore have a responsibility to act like they deserve to be. When it comes time to put an Anathema and their followers to the sword, they make time after the fighting's done to pray to the Dragons that these corrupt souls might lead more virtuous lives in their next incarnations.

>>49787224
>>49787334
Alright, that sounds about how I like to run Immaculate monks as well. Their faith kind of encourages them to be decent people who actually care about mortals, though obviouslu not as equals, while also being strongly opposed to the filthy Anathema and any dealings with them. I think that this, alongside with their considerable martial prowess, makes them pretty neat anatgonists for non-Dragonblooded Exalted. Neat PCs for Dragon-Blooded games as well, of course. More generally, Immaculate Faith, as a fake religion supporting an oppressive empire that also has many respectable, benevolent teachings and plenty of admirable peopel among its devout followers, is among my favorite parts of the setting. Not THE favorite part, maybe, but it's an example of the whole moral ambiguity, grey-areas-not-just-black-and- white thing done right. Exalted often fails at being nuanced in the way it wants to be, but the Immaculate Faith strikes me as one of the areas where the best of Exalted's writing comes through.

>>49786324

Most are pretty okay. But a pretty good chunk of them are villainous and hiding it. That's normally how I go about it. So while most of the ones you'll meet you can be decently sure are pretty good there will always be that one who is lying his ass off.

>>49786324
I've been playing softball with my party; they're new to Exalted and we're all new to 3e. They've been running around Nexus with basically no Immaculate presence, but have just left with a caravan to go explore the rest of the setting.
Now that the training wheels are coming off, they've run into a small kingdom ostensibly run by a devout member of House Mnemon, but more recently co-opted by their Infernal lover.

They haven't actually spent much time with the Dragonblood, being more interested and concerned about the murder-genie, but I'm pretty hype to have them dance around his issues with his faith. He was devout, and still considers himself so, but he's trying to reconcile what he knows and has been taught about Anathema with his wife's situation.

What happens when an Exalted gets prayed to? Does he get ambrosia?

>>49788325
He gets power. I think something like a free use of willpower per dot of cult. Ambrosia I"m almost certain is a god only thing.

I just want to say that things aren't hopeless despite the slow release schedule, games and fun can still be had; I started my current game by running into a random player here on /tg/ and it expanded and recruited and now it's an enthusiastic four-person Infernals game that the players love so much they have repeated fluff sessions outside the weekly game, where (for example) the players of the Slayer and the Scourge just sit in the roll20 chatroom without me and have their characters talk of sisterly bonding things.

Being villainous Infernals, I should perhaps note that they're bonding over exterminating most of a small village, eating the survivors, and driving one of the girls insane by making her watch and force-feeding her her relatives before sending her to be a comfort woman for the Slayer's army.

Meanwhile the other Scourge is selling drugs to the Guild rep and the Fiend is selling _other_ drugs to the local merchant houses here (hers secreted personally, his derived from anuhle venom) when not kidnapping another man's bride and sending her to Hell under pretense of a ritual to initiate her into sorcery.

They're cartoonishly horrible people all round and they are so going to get paladin'd once word of their exploits spreads a bit more.

>>49788481
They just need to make sure there is no survivors to tell the tales of what they do. Or be smart enough to not go flaunting their identity.

Given the average day in the world of exalted they'd likely just be considered warlords of some nature. Unless they happen to be near the realm in which case.

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>>49788542
Oh, they're pretty far from the Realm (and the shortest path between their location and the Realm goes through Thorns to boot).

But identity or not, they're flaunting their _actions_ like, well, selling anuhle venom. And using Chirality Prohibition Index. Which is going to bring them to the attention of local spirits as well as mortals. Spirits who have Measure the Wind and can go "ohshit, multiple high-essence malfean-aspected creatures".

That's a palad... a paddlin'.

(Except for the Fiend, of course, whom I trust to avoid this fate through judicious use of Loom-Snarling Disguise.)

>>49788325
>>49788373
To be precise, Ambrosia is a has-divine-mechanism thing. An Exalt can _theoretically_ get ambrosia by getting an office in Yu-Shan (good luck with that) to receive prayers there in the manner of a god. Sidereals are forbidden by law from doing this though; pretty much all other Exalts are banned from Yu-Shan.

Otherwise, refer to the Cult background for most regular worship.

So, do people in the Realm requisition help from the gods if needs dictate? Like, say a pesky Dawn Caste is running about the place killing everybody and the guy in charge of hunting the Anathema down wants to ask the local God of Quicksand or some shit to help make a trap. Would that be proper Immaculate as the god is supposed to be helping humankind out and what better way to do it than getting rid of an Anathema, or would it be heresy because it's an unscheduled worship or some shit?

>>49786324

I've used sympathetic Immaculates quite a few times in my games, often just monks in the threshold who generally want to help people out in their community by offering moral and/or philosophical services to people.

...That is until the PC's always bring back the Church of Sol instead.

I dimly remember a reference to the Beyond being the place from which effectively limitless amounts of Essence leak into Creation itself. Does anyone know the reference for that or am I going crazy?

>>49790389

I think you may be going crazy. I've been following Exalted since late 1e and I dunno WTF you're talking about.

>>49790389

The Beyond? Beyond what? I don't think there's any Essence in Elsewhere. I'd say that it's plausible that Zen Mu has limitless Essence, but I can't imagine it leaking.

>>49790389
Not sure where it would have said that, all we know about the Beyond is that it is the realm of the purely impossible, even given infinite Chaos.

Luna was born there, and Oramus existed there prior to the Primordials existing, and Prince Laashe was banished there.

>>49790497
Well shit. I guess I am.

>>49790516
The one where Oramus made Luna/the one they stuck that unreasonably buff Raksha that one time-yeah, that one >>49790538

>>49790645

"Beyond" simply seems to be a narrative device used in The Legend of the Titans mythopoeia. Oramus didn't exist before Cytherea, the first primordial, then he did as an ancient, venerable being. A zeroth primordial, if you will. It is likely a metaphor for the time time before existence itself, or a place so far into the Wyld that the rules of reality just stop (Pure Chaos I think it's called), which would make The Shining Answer (Beyond the Beyond) a new existence or Creation, something to look forward to after Zen-Mu became boring. Remember that this was about the time that they titans "invented despair so that they might feel it."

This boredom/despair might also explain why Gaia is looking for the Shining Answer out in the Wyld.

>Exalted
bp xp fix? there must be a way to just give you a certain number of xp to spend rather than make a chargen minigame of minmaxing the exchange rate

>>49786324
I usually make my monks and paladins the reasonably good sort, otherwise they wouldn't be throwing themselves into suicide rush trying to take down some rampaging dawn, just sadly misinformed as to the nature of those 'devils' they're trying to smite(although of course not nearly so misinformed as the ridiculous pro-solar andi-dragonblood/so-called-usurpation bias exalted seems to have...the 1st agers /did/ become monsters afterall, and even young mostly heroic demigods occasionally go nuts with often disastrous results)

the shitty and corrupt crusader types find a way to sneak off or sit behind a desk and send somebody /else/ to die

>>49791242

There's been one made for 3e already. In fact holden posted an XP-less version of Exalted 3e on RPG.net after he got BTFO'd

>>49788778
>Loom-Snarling Disguise

don't you mean the other one? the one after lsd that lets you disguise your essence

>>49791242
As the Chief Autismo who made the formula'd character sheet, my method is to go through chargen as normal then see how much XP everyone is worth.

Then give everyone enough XP to make up for the highest XP valued player, so if you have 470, 450, 440, give 20 to the second guy, and 30 to the third. Count this XP as pseudo-Solar XP, prevent players from getting Charms of any kind, Spells, Evocation, MA, that sort of stuff. Very, very little of the XP discrepancy comes from Charm selection.

If you wanna give everyone a little bit extra, just set an XP value that everyone becomes equal to, like 480 or something. In my experience 470 is a pretty optimized character ignoring silly tricks like buying all non-Favored Charms and shit.

This keep the general split of the chargen without creating different pools of XP that won't add up well.

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Could use some help with a character concept. I'm essentially planning to play an Immaculate Monk(from the threshold) that Exalted by standing up to some exalted trying to bully mortals.

Of course, being Anathema for a monk would be pretty bad, but instead of losing his faith(or committing sudoku) he reasoned that he was fated to be a villain, readily accepting his role as Anathema. In order for light to exist there must be darkness to challenge them. I doubt he's going to go about murdering innocents for the fun of it though, but its his way to rationalize the power he has, at least for a start.

What kind of skills and charmsets would fit with an Immaculate Monk? I was thinking either of going heavily physical, deep into athletics, resistance etc, mind over body and all that, with brawl or martial arts.

Or a more balanced approach with some martial arts, integrity, presence for philosophical debates, maybe lore, investigation and occult befitting of a monks duties to keep the peace, make sure the local spirits stays in check, etc.

>>49791619

What is your caste going to be?

If its Zenith your backstory may need to be tweaked a bit, or at the very least will have some sort of different worldview depending on the Sol visitation.

>>49791619

The "I'm a villain now" angle doesn't seem that great, he could probably be better of as a sort of trickster character that creates scenario that test peoples strength of character. He could have also gotten a vision from the UCS giving a brief explanation to him.

Immaculate Monks are preeminent Martial Artists, which kind of puts a damper on what kind of armour you can use. Depending on what MA you use, you might not need Dodge. Integrity is good for the mind over body aspect, allowing ruminations on the nature of the universe and all that. The Bridge keyword will also work well with MA. Presence will help him with preaching, maybe Performance for giving sermons, Lore for teaching and educating.

>>49791709

Yeah I was thinking Zenith but you're right that the Unconquered Sun speaking to him might be a problem. Maybe he misinterpreted his vision, or interpreted it in a way befitting of his previous dogmatic worldview. I expect eventually he'll develop it into a more befitting world-view, or change his faith altogether.

>>49791729

I mean, he doesn't feel like a villain, but after meditation and reflection on the rightful way of things, he could only come to the conclusion that fate has decided that he will test the world through his actions. He'll still follow his teachings and personal virtues, but I imagine deep down he thinks that he's the darkness that brings balance to the world. Anything else would shatter his Immaculate beliefs to the core.

What do you mean by a trickster though?

>>49791836

>Trickster

Doing something seemingly pointless or non-malicious with a benign end effect. Also, it's okay to have your characters faith shaken, makes for good character development.

>>49791905

Yeah that's the idea. I figured he's rationalized it so far, but once he meets his circle and gets those solar actions going, I imagine that it'll change.

Backing a little bit, you mentioned some martial arts might not even need dodge? I thought the two complimented each other. I've also yet to figure out which supernal ability fits the best either, either martial arts, integrity or perhaps lore.

>>49792063

Parry and Dodge don't go together,your Defence is the highest of the two. Crane Style, for example is all about defending yourself and defending your allies, and what it lacks in regular attacks it makes up for in counter attacks. Single Point Shining Into The Void Style, on the other hand, is all about being able to kill your opponent in a single decisive attack, and as such has next to no defence, needing the player to either branch out into Melee (and hope he doesn't get disarmed) or into Dodge.

Integrity and Lore are both caste abilities for the Zenith, which fits the preachy monk type. It also has Athletics, Lore and Performance, which you expressed interest in. Going as a Dawn, however, will allow you to master your chosen MA style straight out of chargen so you can get started on a second MA style, but is not as effective if you're only going to learn a single style.

>>49791411
that sounds pretty good.

>>49787546
>>49787334
>>49787224
>>49787278
>>49787568

this, basically. my immaculate dragonbloods feel it's their duty to fight the monsters for the good of their lessers, and try to treat the peasants well. nobless oblige sorta chivalry thing. it's why the dragons give them power, what they exist for

>>49792146

Was probably picking something like Snake Style, which seems to have a lot of defensiv charms in it as it is. I figured you needed both it and doge though. I've not read much about the combat rules of third yet so I'm quite clueless, but my 2nd edition instincts tell me I need dodge to further supplement a martial arts style, but maybe not as many as if you picked something like Void Style

Brawl also has a lot of interesting charms in it, although of course that's a whole lot less refined than martial arts, and maybe not as fitting for a monk.

>>49786324

Yes, but the problem is that Solars are going to hit their faith like a nuclear bomb. The issue is that the Immaculate Faith is objectively false, which makes for a disastrous revelation at the end.

I mean, there's no ambiguity. They're being conned.

Of course, since it's the state religion, I assume most of the adherents are actually fairly decent people. Immaculate monks actually roam the world doing good and so on. But it's all going to end up in a insanely bloody crash.

>>49792703

I think people overstate the value of a religion being "true" in a factual sense; it seems like a distinctly Western obsession, to be able to dig up Noah's Ark and put it in a museum or whatever.

>>49792732
Pretty much everything we call "religion" nowadays was meant to be the truth about the world. The whole thing about it being totally separate from the mundane world so you have to take it on faith regardless of evidence is something that happened later.

>>49792732

Actually, the problem is - in a world where gods are real and so on - the objective truth of a religion is really important. If your gods are fake, it means that all your effort has been wasted. If you pray to the Fire-God, he might in fact give you his blessing. If you pray to one of the Exalted, you *know* he's out there doing good and keeping you safe.

Like, it's not a nebulous - "Oh, I can feel him protecting me." There is a chance he might physically show up and bail you out of trouble. But if you're praying to a deity who doesn't exist, you've been betrayed.

>>49788373

In 2E, you got motes and extra willpower. I always felt it was a pretty piddling reward, especially since sustaining a high-level Cult would take quite a bit of effort.

I mean, high levels means that you're worshipped as a major God. How do you possibly keep that up? Are you constantly running around helping petitioners? Because that's the best way to build a cult.

The issue is even worse with ghosts. Ghosts, generally, can't support their worshippers at all except through tremendous effort. Shit's hard to do!

>>49792703

Most characters will probably have experienced the immaculate faith at one point or another in their lives. Inherently it's not a horrible religion, although its social strata is quite restrictive. The religion is not entirely false either. It teaches the Solars are demons, which they are when you look at the great curse and its wider effects(though a solar might not agree). It teaches that being a better person will lead to reincarnation, and.. who knows really. There is already reincarnation in Creation, so why not?

A Solar that likes the immaculate faith would probably try to change it for the better.

>>49792818

Being a better person doesn't lead to reincarnation, though. It's random, unless someone bribes a god to bump you up. Sidereals can do it too, like when my character used his influence to ensure that a PC Solar's lover reincarnated as an Appearance 5, Resources 5 merchant-princess with an excellent chance of Terrestial Exaltation.

The rest actually goes against the nature of the cosmos, where the Unconquered Sun gave the Solars the Creation-Ruling Mandate. It's not hyperbole, he literally went: "The natural order of things is for the Solars to rule."

>>49792839

Yes, the "natural order" enforced at gunpoint.

He doesn't have any cosmic authority, just regular power-based authority.

The CRM is and always has been exactly the same as IRL Divine Mandate: a useful political tool backed by murder, and nothing else.

>>49792855

The same can be said of all politics. The Solars have the biggest stick, and the highest standard of living doesn't exist without them. The only issue is the Great Curse: If they can solve that, everything is awesome forever.

>>49792864
Never been a fan of the Great Curse is the only reason the Solars went crazy, giving phenomenal powers to humans and then told you are just flat out better than everybody else, even if it's true, especially if it's true, is not conducive to keeping a level outlook on things.

I could very well see the events of the Usurpation happening without the Great Curse at all as the Solars being more and more distant from humanity and the rest of the other Exalted. Solars in the First Age were already working on life prolonging Charms, eventually they would have beaten down all the threats that could possibly kill them and achieved immortality. Then you've got 300 people with basically infinite power ruling forever.

Human nature shouldn't need the Great Curse to fuck shit up, but it should certainly help.

>>49792928

Possibly, but canonically the Great Curse is what drove them mad. Like, even Mr. Abortion Fists, Desus, was described as 'genuinely a great guy' before he went batshit.

>>49792928
yeah, theres only so much difference in power and lifespan and social position you can have before "lets breed the tengese like designer cats" starts seeming reasonable. people have gotten decent momentum behind eugenics even without a tenthousandth of the divide irl

>>49793135
but the great curse was technically what made them go so crazy so fast and is also what makes your character experience fits of madness on a scale short enough to see in game

partially related question: have any solars actually died of old age? I can't remember, but seemed to think there was at least one who actually fought in the primordial usurpation was still kicking around for their own...but were they the equivalent of that one civil war vet in the picture with a jetplaine and joined super young right before the end only barely living to the end of the first age?
________________________
looking at the wiki:

I know lunars must be able to live at least >768
to still be around from before the usurpation, longer considering the ones who did don't seem about to die of old age and had a decent length living in the first age

and from end of primordial to end of solar was at least 3700?

>>49793264
They had lifespans in one of the books, Solars I think were around 3,000 but had life extending Charms. Sidereals were set at 5,000 if I recall correctly and couldn't do anything to extend it. Lunars were a bit below Solars.

>>49793169
>what makes your character experience fits of madness on a scale short enough to see in game
looking at the infernals game being reported in the last few threads (here and >>49743005 ) i hardly think the great curse mechanic is needed for that

Question about Loom-Snarling Deception:

>The disguise is perfectly immune to mundane scrutiny and may not be resisted with Willpower expenditure. Appropriate non-Excellency Charms may pierce the ruse using standard roll-off rules, but the Infernal’s player adds (Essence) bonus successes to his roll.

What IS the roll for the roll-off? Part of me thinks it might be Intelligence+Larceny as for a mundane disguise, part of me thinks the disguise here is unrolled and the roll-off would be something social because the charm has a social influence keyword.

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Hypothetical for you all, for help with my game...

How would the Wyld Hunt approach something like a full Solar Circle making itself known on an important-to-the-Realm but not-part-of-the-Realm location like Wu Jian?

The in-book stated reasoning is that most of the Wyld Hunt can't spare the resources to deal with Solars. But you'd think 5 solars suddenly making their presences known in the Gateway to the West and largest blue water trading ports would illicit a pretty fuck-huge response from the imperials, right?

Really I'm just having trouble coming up with threats that a party of five solars won't steamroll over and my only thoughts are: "They're five solars, a perfect circle, in one place, working together. Everyone in the region will be concerned and either want to ally, use them or destroy them ASAP."

>>49795036
Basically, try to rig the fight as hard as fucking possible.

Splitting the circle is the obvious one: invite different party members to different things. But since that may be too much of an OOC hassle...

Put the Wyld Hunt on summoned agatae or other flying demons (sorcerous flying platform whatsitsname works too), with backup flying demons providing cover for the actual mounts against getting shot down (or backup sorcerer demon set on "counterspell"), and then everyone in the Wyld Hunt has an artifact bow and snipes the Solars from on high, preferably coming out of ambush at a time and place where the Solars are on the open sea or otherwise unable to run for cover.

Or try to lure the circle into giant traps. Like, "come visit our new temple" "the entire building is now on fire while collapsing into a sinkhole in the path of an avalanche" giant traps where perfect parry/soak/whatever still leaves you in a burning wreckage of flying boulders hitting you again next action.

>>49795036

If they make their presence too well known, their presence might spawn a panicked shitstorm on the isles. I can see all the houses temporarily agreeing to work together to deal with this incredible threat to the realm, scrambling to provide resources and warriors to gain political clout.

A shitstorm would descend on them. If they challenged the realm too openly. I'd advice my players against that personally but hey they are solars so YOLO.

If it's only sporadic rumors, enough of them will still spawn wyld hunts. But I would never have them go up against the Solars all five directly. Maybe they'd throw together some half-assed attempt the first time, and then realize that the threat is much greater than they thought. Then they'd get smart about it. Ambushes, assassinations, traps undermining their authority. Study their public figures and try to target what they care about.

>>49795085

I highly doubt every single member in a 5 DB Wyld Hunt are going to be bow users. They may have Archery 2, but whenever or not they'll have charms is another matter altogether

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>>49795085
>>49795110

Thanks for the advice. Open to more ideas, but this gives me things to consider.

>>49795214
The point isn't for them to be good bow users.

The point is for them to shoot with impunity by having the high ground and being prepared.

All the DBs can bring bows that shoot 400 yards down or whatever with ease; probably far from all the Solars will have weapons that let them shoot/throw/jump 400 yards up to retaliate.

(also, Aid Another/Coordinate Attack/whatever to provide extra dice for the good archers, or AOEs, or something.)

>>49795248

I can imagine a Solar player with Athletics charms basically running up, jumping from arrow to arrow as they fall just to reach them.

God, being a Wyld Hunt dragonblood must be terrifying when you have to deal with experienced/parties of Solars.

>>49791411

Yeah, this seems easiest and solves the problem,

how different are chargen xp numbers from 2e and 3e? like what would you estimate or each

>>49796124
What does comparing the numbers even tell you when so much stuff is rescaled and rewritten?

>>49795036
Summon cannon fodder demons to soften them up before going in themselves. There's karmic justice in pitting demons against each other. Roll of Glorious Divinity II in suggests Luminata in particular for this.

infernal using his own past lives rating as a cma sifu, yes/no? what about sorcery?

if so do you make him list what it knows or just let him pull out whatevers convenient?

>>49797780
>infernal using his own past lives rating as a cma sifu, yes/no? what about sorcery?
I guess. I'm biased against past lives as a thing, but pretending I'm not I don't see any reason not to.

>if so do you make him list what it knows or just let him pull out whatevers convenient?
I'd probably have him pick one particular past life that stands out above the rest, and that's his sifu, which will be limited by what that particular life would have logically known about or done.

>>49797904
Alternatively: If he really wants the imagery of learning from multiple distinct lives, I'd allow him to assemble a list of specializations that, in aggregate, amount to about the same stuff that one particular life would have known.

Sort of like Samurai Jack's training montage, where he learned basically One Thing from each mentor, as opposed to learning a bunch of those things from one single mentor.

>>49792703
The history part sure, but the 'solars 'n lunars r bad kay?' may or may not be, history has yet to show

>>49798213
Whether the moral and philosophical teachings of the Faith are false is also debatable, and, as is the way of these things, probably something that can't be objectively determined one way or another. I think it was mentioned in 1E that the Sidereals who came up with the Faith didn't consider these aspects of it to be fake. The teachings of the Faith reflect their own values and philosophies, and are something they sincerely respect and believe in. The Immaculate Faith is full of lies when it makes claims about facts, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's fake when it comes to statements about morality, society and such.

How much ambrosa does someone who spends 28 days in heaven with cult 2 get, and how is ambrosa measured?

>>49799099

Prayer isn't really quantified that specifically at any point, the same way Resources has never really represented a monthly income, even when it's tried to.

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>>49792839
>Appearance 5, Resources 5 merchant-princess with an excellent chance of Terrestial Exaltation

>Appearance 5

Everything else i can forgive, but app 5?

So shallow.

>>49799647

Wouldn't he also have to wait for her to actually grow up? I suppose that isn't too bad, though, only having to wait 20ish years when you can live to 3,000.

>>49799691
>>49799691
really only low baseline for exalted games' creepiness

>>49792949
Doesn't hurt that he made that charm that made it so no one, including himself, could see anything he did as wrong.

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills, because apparently my understanding of the rules differs a lot from what others think.

If I cast a spell and I gather more sorcerous motes than I needed, can I use them on the next spell I cast or are all excessive motes lost?

>>49800701

You don't just gather sorcerous motes, you're gathering them towards a particular spell.

You can't transfer sorcerous motes between spells without a special rule; that's why aborting a spell to cast a different one wastes all the motes you've gathered so far.

I don't see why excess motes would be any different.

>>49800801
Got any particular rule I can quote to that effect? That was my gut feeling too, but I can't actually prove it.

>>49800925
Page 465, right side, second paragraph, and fourth paragraph to really drill the point home.

What happens when a Lunar fucks a Dragon-blooded?

>>49801251

A child is born that has a (lower) chance to exalt into a dragon-blood later in life, and may or may not be a beastman depending on what the Lunar did.

>>49801251
The Lunar gets arrested for bestiality.

>>49792839
>Being a better person doesn't lead to reincarnation, though.
new edition, this might not necessarily be the case anymore. Or at the very least I doubt we're going to get an answer handed down from on high like in previous editions

>>49801294
i don't think they usually have laws that blame the animal

>>49801251
Depends on who knows of the dragon blooded fucking the Lunar.

I would imagine most dragon blooded will be very annoyed with this. A fairly good chunk of lunars as well.

The kid would likely have an interesting life if one was conceived.

>>49795248

Which is still one of the most lazy and ineffective ways to run a Wyld Hunt.

1) Fivefold Bulwark Stance or Flow like Blood laughs in the face of this tactic. If your opponent has this than the people who are not actually good at the bow are likely never going to hit them.

2) If you're in 3e, you won't have aid another/Coordinate attack. The most you can do you add dice is excellencies and command rolls for battle groups.

Such a wyld hunt composition may interest some groups but is creatively bankrupt. If you're going to launch a Wyld Hunt, consider options that are more interesting to the players enjoyment rather than what would ideally be best in the game world.

"But anon, INT 5 people should realize that this i-"

I don't give a flying fuck about that. Fiction in Exalted has shown time and time again it isn't just bombarding people from flying mounts until they die. Tense battlefields with burning villages and deadly escapes with assassins in tow are the norm.

>>49792812
>If you pray to one of the Exalted, you *know* he's out there doing good and keeping you safe.

You know honestly this is ground I kind of wish they would have more examples in the books. They talk about the possibility but we rarely if ever see an exalted actually try to blend secular and religious power into one. Even though it's one of the most bloody obvious ways of taking power.

So, I, an Eclipse, am nominally in charge of my group of Solars in a 3e game because I decided taking Bureaucracy as my Supernal would be a good idea (and I know the most about Exalted other than the ST), and I need to figure out some demons for the Twilight to summon so he doesn't feel left out.

Currently we are in Gem preparing for a group of Immaculates that we (I) managed to piss off. They will most likely arrive in a month and a half, two at most.
The Dawn and the Zenith are working on getting some personal cults going, the Night is working on gathering information from the Immaculate temple in the city, and I am working on my own resources and depriving the temple of theirs.

Since the Twilight is new to both Exalted and role playing in general, and he seemed to enjoy the idea of summoning hordes of demons, I think he would get a kick out of summon hordes of demons.
What would be some good demons for him to summon that might aid us? The main difficulty is that I'd prefer to keep us somewhat undercover until we get a bit more powerful/raid some of the first age tombs that we know the location of, so unless they can transform into something non-demonic they get to sit with the twilight, immaterial.

>>49803040
I'd say all the ones that made it to the final book are useful. Blood apes are good shock troops and an easy way of getting a Might 2 battle group, agata make nice mounts, and neomah are good spies and can make hordes of uncontrollable demon spawn if you wish.

>>49803040
Honestly for me I find that keeping them Immaterial is the best idea in general. Simply because anyone that sees you have demons are going to assume you are a dragon blooded.

As for stealth demons. Off the top of my head something like a bottle bug, Living armor hidden under clothing, Or a Neomah could prove useful and are able to hide themselves.

On the other hand I always say a swarm of blood apes works wonders no matter the situation. Just keep'em immaterial then have them jump every problem.

Merchant being a dick? Drop a blood ape. Bandits attack? Drop a blood ape. City guards stopping you? Drop a blood ape. Need to do negotiations with a dragon blooded royal? Drop a blood ape. There is nothing they can't solve.

>>49803040
Don't post about demons in Solarchan.

>>49792812
theres enough unemployed gods just sitting around I feel like if you got enough people together and prayed hard enough you'd either attract or create a suitable deity anyway

>>49803040
one stomach bottle bug and living armor each might be a good start

>>49803040
you can keep them immaterial, so basically summon whatever you want.

>>49803114
>can make hordes of demon spawn
are you thinking of demjen?

>>49803935
couple agetae for mounts if you didn't need to keep it low key...might still be worth keeping one immaterial on hand, passion moreys can be useful in ways that usually aren't /too/ obvious, gethin can be similarly low key, aalu and naneke are useful for paperwork and research, hopping puppeteers are good at building, the horny dwarves can craft stuff, couple dematerialized primjera are nice to have, etc

they're almost all useful

>>49803935
This is solid, though I think at least one of the party might find having to constantly get drunk to feed their bottle bug bothersome.

>>49803955
Yes, but then the demons are not actually doing anything useful, which means the character isn't actually participating.

>>49804027
>demjen
Those are the half eel demons that make little robots, right? I was considering them, but having to soak once a day near Gem is actually something of a bother.

>>49804027
Neomah can take demon flesh (or any flesh) and craft up weird mutants with it. So a sorcerer could just throw all the shit he has in his stables at a neomah, let it do its thing, and then have a bunch of horrid flesh-crafted beasts to hang around and guard his castle.

Morke and Holden are liars

>>49799647

Dude, it's the Mistress With White Hands from the Underworld book. She's spent like several centuries waiting for her boyfriend to reincarnate, it can't hurt to give them a happy ending.

>>49799691

Well, obviously. But waiting twenty to thirty years isn't a problem, because the dude is going to live for thousands of years. There isn't any hurry.

>>49802786
>1) Fivefold Bulwark Stance or Flow like Blood laughs in the face of this tactic.
So shoot the guys who don't have it first, duh.

>2) If you're in 3e, you won't have aid another/Coordinate attack.
You don't have aid another in 2e either. "(system) doesn't have (specific rule name)" is missing the point of cooperation. 3e has onslaught instead serving a similar role: pileons.

>"But anon, INT 5 people should realize that this i-"
>I don't give a flying fuck about that.

Fortunately, you don't need to. Simple natural selection and variation in tactics will take care of the issue with no INT or realizing needed. Simplified a bit: Wyld Hunts which try to rig the battle in their favor might survive; Wyld Hunts which charge Solars head-on to keep it interesting for the Solars definitely die; therefore surviving Wyld Hunts will be those who rig battles in their favor.

Anyhow, please do the Wyld Hunt the courtesy of treating them as people with plans and experience, not random encounters who just warble into the path of Solars to be harvested for loot.

>>49808172
I think point 3 was in reference to using the "mechanically best" approach in terms of system crunch, not in terms of common sense.

Wyld Hunts should, in my opinion
>Try to respond quickly to reports of Anathema to catch them before they gather power or change locations
>Try to ambush them if possible under the constraint of the preceding tenant.
>Try to attack a lone Solar rather than a Circle

>>49808172

The funny part is, if you defeat one Wyld Hunt, the bad guys are really fucked. This is because the Solar Circle that beat them is now tooled-up to the teeth with Daiklaives, Jade armor and a variety of useful Artifacts.

>>49803876
Prayers not directed to a specific deity default to Sol Invictus. Your god-summoning gathering are effectively engaging in sun worship, and He's not about to get off his ass and make miracles for them.

>>49808172

>>49808249 basically addressed the point I was trying to make.

>>49808172
>>49808249
>>49809699
>>49808291

The impression I always had was that the Wyld Hunt almost always harass Solars with large groups of mortal Hunters. (Sure, a lot of them die, but they're going to be rewarded with a better life in reincarnation anyway, right? They lived the life of a virtuous demon hunter.) Then after wearing the Anathema down the Dragonblooded go in to finish them off.

So for a Circle of Solars I'd think the Wyld Hunt's approach woud be:
1) Try to split them apart. Either by a) geography, b) misdirection or c) keeping them distracted with different battlegroups of mortals.
2) Dragonblooded with demon support go in and try to kill lone Solars that have been weakened by the battlegroups.

I can also see them dispatching battlegroups of demons to try and keep one particularly troublesome Dawn caste busy while they kill his circlemates.

Also worth noting that most Wyld Hunters probably haven't even had the experience of trying to kill groups of Solars. The Solar Exalted have mostly all been trapped in the Jade Prison since the Usurpation and the few that were free didn't usually end up meeting up from what we can tell from the lore.

The Bull of the North is the closest thing to a pre-Jade Prison break Solar that met up with other Solars (before or after the break I'm not really sure) and wrecked havoc. And we all know how they turned out for the Dragonblooded. By the point they went after him he had already amassed an army, and they needed to send a legion to meet him. Obviously trying to prevent that sort of thing from ever happening again would be on everyone's mind.

So the Wyld Hunt may not have proven tactics for fighting Solar Circles. Even their oldest members would have no experience doing it. The prospect of it would probably terrify those that had to fight a single Solar.

how do you handle solar chargen if you exalt an existing mortal?

>>49811599
There's rules for it on page 125.

Essentially, the mortal gets assigned a Caste that most closely matches with what skills he focuses on; swordsmaster will get a Dawn, performer will get Zenith, et cetera. They pick Caste Abilities and Favored Abilities as normal, with Favored being assigned to Abilities that already have at least one dot. They also immediately get 10 charms of their choice. At the conclusion of the current Story, they get the remaining 5 charms for free and get 2 dots of permanent Willpower, two dots for their primary, two dots for their secondary, and one dot for their tertiary attributes.

>>49811599

"To convert a mortal hero into one of the Solar Exalted during play, select the Caste that best fits the character’s concept and skills. Assign Caste, Favored, and Supernal Abilities as normal, keeping in mind his existing Ability ratings and previous development in play. Each Favored Ability must possess at least one dot. Select ten Charms that your character qualifies for. Choose your character’s Limit trigger and calculate his Essence pools. At the end of the current story, add five more free Charms and two dots of Willpower, and assign two dots among Primary Attributes, two dots among Secondary Attributes, and one dot among Tertiary Attributes."

Core, p125

>>49811679
>>49811691
Thanks. must have missed it somehow, that's exactly where I'd have expected it to be, heh.

Was using a chargen tool and saw when exporting the mortal and importing to solar I had negative bp from how I had built it. felt like it'd be wrong to remove traits to make room so I knew I was missing something

Lunar DBT ignores negatives on mutations taken, so if a lunar had "small" the only effect is a +1 difficulty to hit right?

so then minuscule has no effect on movement, equipment use, or health levels. gives +3 on stealth roles, a -4 external penalty to be hit, +1 dex? even though those positives are a direct result of the small size? the same small size that directly causes the negatives such as movement speed?

>>49813373
aye

>>49813373
another problem is that all DBT forms seem to automatically have the large pox?

>>49813373

"Players cannot apply the Large mutation to the war form; war forms are already larger and stronger than a normal human form. Players may, however, apply the Small mutation, accepting its benefi ts and penalties. This is how some Lunars create their smaller, less monstrous-seeming war forms."

Lunars, page 137.

>>49792928
Even if you go that route, the Solars wouldn't have been worse than the Dragonblooded have been, eliminating the justification for the Usurpation.

>>49813586
they were far more godlike and lived a few orders of magnitude longer. they seem more susceptible to greater disconnect and monstrous me

>>49813373
Note: The whole set of Size mutations is a mess, and I encourage talking to your ST to get some kind of standard consistency in them so we don't have some increasing DV and others giving external penalty to hit and whatnot. Get a standard set of scaling bonuses/penalties to list of size-affected things instead of this wite wuff editing where four sizes are written by three people.

>>49813908

With how big the size mutations are, they probably needed to be written by 3 people.

>>49813586
I've always kind of played it that way. The danger was more the long term damage the Solars could cause.

I'd list the causes as something like.

25% great curse
40% normal human megalomania
25% Power grab
10% The Prophecy

I've always felt the future viewing the sids did was just the thing that kicked something that was coming a long time ago into motion.

>>49813807
Mostly this, a Dragonblood can live to be 300-500 I think? Somewhere in that range, Solars can get to 3,000 and are much more powerful. Also, their places in society are much more powerful. The Dragonbloods have important positions but they are the leaders of bureaus, captains of the guard, etc. They are still in there doing the work that needs to be done and interacting with mortals much more frequently.

Meanwhile you have Solars who in 2e each had their own kingdom like setup within Creation where their word was law and really couldn't be checked by anyone within those bounds, even outside them they knew for a fact that there were only 299 other individuals who could check their power.

Just the numbers aspect, being told you are one of only 300 in the hundreds of millions of people living that in many ways are just better than anyone else. Dragonbloods are better than the teeming masses of mortals, but they are among a million or so other Dragonbloods. Solars are The Most Special and the Most Powerful, much easier for it to go their head and distance themselves from the rest of humanity.

if hawkmen are beastman descendents of lunars why do they have "angel wing" type wings and not "werehawk/my wings are my arms" wings?

>>49792928
It's never said that its all great curse or not the great curse or anything. Its left up to the ST and individual groups

>>49816174
Luna is a dick

>>49816174
Because of lunars, duh. There's a whole Craft (Genesis) subskill dedicated to making your breeding programs come out with the results you want instead of the results that make sense.

>>49816174

Lunar eugenics? I wouldn't be surprised if the Lunar in question used a combination of Hybrid Body Rearrangement and selective breeding to pull off something like that.

>>49815797
With the new sorcery system though I'd imagine this would be less so in the new edition. Life extension is far easier for dragon blooded as long as they have a single celestial sorcerer ally or a dragon blooded Savant.

So I could imagine in the first age the very top dragoon blooded likely lived far longer then their natural limits. There was more of them, They could have stronger allies.

is there any way for lunars to reroll the mutations chosen for dbt? (I don't mean add new ones by gaining more points, and not the charm that frees you from choosing thematic mutations for your spirit form.)

>>49816306
>>49816256

that makes sense. for some reason I was picturing straight up "hawk on woman" action and then she lays a giant egg(or hawk on man and the hawk explodes) ;)

>>49813908
Any suggestions or existing size fixes floating around?