Kill Team & HoR General

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>>49720329
Will chaos renegades work well in kill-team? I guess the leadership wouldn't be an issue, and they can take loads of boys and loads of special weapons. Melee Veterans might even be useful in killteam

>>49720430
I know that HoR has a dedicated Chaos Renegades list. I assume that regular KT would just have you using Chaos themed guard forces?

Awkward question:

Are the short new Kill Team rules not available on the interwebz? I can only find HoR, which is fine, but I just want to see the new document for reference.

>>49720490
I think that person is referencing the Chaos Renegades out of Imperial Armorer, what was it 13?

The special army which is Chaos Imp Guard, not just in appearance.

>>49720498
Click the OP image, you heretic.

>>49720506
How Guard like are they? I assume that they'll be fine in KT if they can bring a good number of bodies as well as some sort of vehicle and a few nice toys.

>>49720507
You know, glancing at the filename, it does say PDF, but I didn't realize that was a think instead of just images. So salty.

In other news, this is wonderful for me setting up a story-line based campaign between my friend and I, so thank you.

>>49720549
They are almost strictly worse than Guard (BS 2, no saves but can pay for 6+?). But they cost less than normal guard, and don't have the platoon structures.

The big thing about that army is depending on the choices you make for your HQ "Renegade leader" the army has different choices. Like Nurgle offers the plague drones from FW, or Khorne gains the Brass Scorp. And you can pick from a few non-god related options which also define your army more.

Soooo, as a core of troops, they are almost strictly worse. But they have a few odd choices Guard don't get, like the Lander which is 10 all around with no guns as a shit transport.

Probably not the best in Kill Team, but great for fodder.

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>>49720554

>>49720578
Yeah, I doubt they'd fare well. Guardsmen without armour who can't shoot aren't going to do well in KT. They also sound a bit out of date, given that regular cultists are WS/BS 3.

>>49720694
It was an intentional choice, because one of the renegade leaders grants the option to gain +BS for everything in the army.

And every other leader literally just takes the cultist to die, I mean, you can get 3 for every Necron Warrior.

But yeah, I wouldn't take them in Kill Team as my army. They'd be more suitable for a "fun encounter" like the 'Nids vs Kill Team onslaught, probably be about as fair honestly. Actually the 'Nids are probably at advantage in that scenario.

>>49720764
>you can get 3 for every Necron Warrior.
Scratch that, I meant 4 per Warrior. Like hella cheep mobs.
They're basically gretchin in all but name.

>>49720694
3 pts each, bs2 lasgun isn't bad. Can get a squad of 5 BS4 flak armored disciples for 35 pts. Great to give a relentless heavy weapon team and a special weapon.

Get a ton of 3 point mooks with shotguns, lasguns, autoguns or close combat weapon and pistol with a flamer as third specialist and have some fun!

>>49720329
Am I reading this wrong or do you not HAVE to take a troops choice? I assumed you did and wouldn't have bothered running standard csm and cultists.

>>49720808
That's correct. It says 0-2 Troops right there. So, if you really wanted, you could drop 200pts into a single Elite choice. You just need to have at least 4 models that aren't vehicles or beasts.

>>49720818
Thanks, time to kitbash some noise marines.

Here is my list: how about it

+++ Renegades kill-team (200pts) +++

++ Renegades & Heretics: IA13 (2014) (Kill Team Detachment) (200pts) ++

+ Elites (80pts) +

Renegade Disciple Squad (80pts) [Carapace Armour (20pts),
Disciple w/ Lasgun (10pts),
Disciple w/ Plasma Gun (25pts)]
····Autocannon Team (30pts) [Lasgun]
····Disciple Champion [Flak Armour, Lasgun]

+ Troops (120pts) +

Renegade Infantry Platoon (120pts)
····Platoon Command Squad (40pts) [8x Renegade w/ shotgun (24pts)]
········2x Renegade w/ Flamer (16pts) [2x Laspistol]
····Renegade Infantry Squad (40pts) [8x Renegade w/ Lasgun (24pts)]
········2x Renegade w/ Flamer (16pts) [2x Laspistol]
····Renegade Infantry Squad (40pts) [8x Renegade w/ laspistol and close combat weapon (24pts)]
········2x Renegade w/ Flamer (16pts) [2x Laspistol]

>>49720905
So that's, what, 40 dudes if I'm reading that right? Yeah, that's cool and all, I'd just never play with you.

>>49720939
What number is considered not dickish?

>>49720952
I don't know if 40 dudes is an issue, personally?

The biggest thing is that they are no longer a squad so I can't over-flow wounds, but I really don't see why it would cause too big of an issue.

I mean, that list is literally ruined by any vehicle allowed by the Killteam rules lol. Could you ever kill a Guard Sentinel? I guess you have like 2-3 heavy weapons peppered in there. But whatever.

>>49720952
It's not so much dickish as just kind of boring. You need to move and shoot them individually every turn and either your going to get lucky enough to kill my 10 guys with 3+ or I'm going to whittle away at your horde until you've lost 21 guys and start making break tests. I take it these guys' Ld is pretty poor?

>>49720978
Renegades doesn't start with any leadership. When they need to roll for LD the roll a d6 + 4, that's the amount of ld they have for the rest of the game. So if you are lucky, y could get ld 10, or 5 if you are unlucky

>>49720978
>>49720974
This more interesting?

5 disciples - carapace armour
Champion is the gang leader.
Plasma gun - specialist
Autocannon team - specialist (relentless probably)

6 Grenadiers - carapace armour
1 hot shot volley gun - specialist
Scout

10 mutants

Still lacking in anti tank, but its more varied.

>>49721022
So if you roll a high Ld, there's no real counting on break tests that normally keeps hordes more balanced...

>>49721054
Well, it is pretty risky/hard to keep track on since in killteam every model is it's own unit. That means that every models must roll a d6+6, before you roll for Ld. In regular games of 40k, renegade groups can buy chaos sigils that can make them imune to fear, pinning, moral, etc once per turn.

I'd likely ask for consensus on unit based effects before the game / tournament began. E..g just roll ld once for a whole 'unit' to speed things up, allow squad based effects (chaos icons, IG orders) to effect a whole 'unit' if in coherency despite them being moved separately

>>49721125
>Keeping track of 40 dudes' individual Ld scores.
How about no. I really don't understand how people find mob lists fun in Kill Team. They certainly aren't fun to play against.

>"I brought my Chaos Marine squad, they're fresh renegades from an Ultramarine successor that joined up with the Black Legion. They've lost some of their tactical sense from warp exposure, but they are still fiercely loyal to each other."
>"What did you bring?"

>Dumps a bucket of army on the table
>"I brot rengades"

>>49721263
But story wise it fits. The elite kill team of movie marines fighting through hordes of goons. To speed things up you could put them into 3-5 man units. Forge the narative.

>>49721054
They are so many, you'll get something near a uniform distribution. Luck won't have as much effect as statistics - unless you somehow roll 10s for everybody, but then why aren't you playing SoBs, with their invulnerable saves?
Ld 5 and 6 flee more often than not.
Ld 7 and 8 might stay a turn or 2, but will eventually flee.
Ld 9 and 10, especially 10, will stay at least a couple of turns, but without support will be shot down.

>>49721327
Focus fire the 9's and 10's. Although I guess you wouldn't know until you had gunned down a bunch anyway.

>>49721280
If they were small squads, sure, then my bolters have a chance to chew through a couple a turn, barring cover saves. There's also some suggestions(Against the Hordes on the last page) about mobs having respawns so there's not 40 of them on the board at once and I have to survive against the waves. That's fine, that sounds cool and intense.
Watching someone try to move and measure to can get as many of those 40 dudes in firing position as possible every turn is not.

>>49721327
>>49721352
Ok, so now I have to keep track of individual Ld scores for 40 dudes so I can kill off the high rollers early. If he's smart, those will all be at the back.

>>49721472
You only roll the first time you take a Ld check, but yeah keeping track of all of them will be a pain in the ass and will take forever.

>>49721472
I didn't see against the horde before. Thanks, that looks quite fun

>>49721472
>keeping track of individual Ld
just write it on a piece of paper.
you roll Ld when needed, so unless you pin them or something you'll roll it after having killed off half the horde, and then an extra third will run away and won't need bookkeeping.
There were easier ways to get the same mechanic into play, idk, start at Ld 7, +1 Ld for each passed test, -1 for each fail. Some will run, those that don't run will actually stay and fight.

>>49721673
I wouldn't count on an extra third running away though. If it was me, I'd put all the Ld 5-7 people up front to get gunned down before I even need to make a test. Keep all the Marine Ld equivalent guys in a second line just behind them.

>>49721763
That's the point.
You don't know their Ld, you roll it only when they do their first test.
Then they'll disappear, leaving you in a mess of a position.

>>49721911
Ok, I gotcha. Didn't understand before.

>>49721280
Yes, and it seems like a good idea on paper until I move my 15 Skitarii + Dragoon and kill around 12 guys, then the Orks player spends 50 minutes individually moving, running or shooting each gretchin.
Kind of breaks the heroic ambience when your opponent is 8 and can't understand the normal rules, let alone house rules like "4 man squads for units that cost less than 6pts a model"

crossposting/copypasting something i said from the previous thread

>>49710134
slowpoking your slowpoke. i'm thinking maybe some kind of manipulation or alteration of the cult ambush table. the garbage i'm thinking is Neophyte hq gives things with "neopyte" in the name a bonus piece of wargear for free (an armoury item called "Genestealer claw totem" that's effectively identical to one of the metamorph weapons but it's bonus is instead getting rending in close combat) so a nephyte leader makes you go hard on neophytes and makes them pretty versatile as they can shoot or fight. thing is to go hard on neophytes you gotta go big on squads which limits your ability to keep throwing things into shadows.

So the acolyte maybe alters result 1 and or 2 of the cult ambush table, making them come on from any board edge. Call it "underhive maps" or something. and if that's too strong i might just make it so that 1's rolled on the chart count as 2 having rolled a 2.

200 Points IG
>Veterans
Sergeant w/ Boltgun (Leader)
3 Sniper Rifles
Autocannon HWT
Camo Gear

>Veterans
Sergeant w/ Boltgun
Sniper Rifle
Plasma Gun (SPC: Sharpshooter)
Plasma Gun (SPC: Preferred Enemy)
Autocannon HWT (SPC: Relentless)
Camo Gear

Trying to think of a KT list oriented toward holding objectives and good cover. Not having 4+ saves for my Sharpshooter in case of Gets Hot is risky but having 3+ cover for anyone sitting in ruins without even GTG sounds good to me. Worth the risk or would a Sharpshooter Lascannon be better?

How strong is a bare-bones Terminator in HoR ? I know a team of five is easy to take care of due to the low number of models but what about when it's used as a force multiplier ?

>>49725808
What about a rocket launcher for the Sharpshooter? Having only ap3 isn't such a big deal and you get versatility in shots instead.

>>49720329
>dismissing concerns about template weapons
If blast templates are included, count me in. 12 completely missed blasts out of 12. I wish I had bits for a heavy bolter instead.

>>49720818
It was at this moment a crisis suit wing emerged over the horizon, cackling maniacally.

What's the best way to kit out a single XV08 crisis suit for kill team?
I figured Fusion blasters are a waste because no 2+.

Flamer and Missile Pod or Plasma Gun? Or should I keep it barebones?

>>49726647

A single Terminator won't make much difference either way. It won't hurt your list but won't really help it either. I guess you could go with a naked Sgt who plays the same as a regular Marine, and then tool up a Termie as an asskicker. Might as well go with a leader in Terminator armour though desu, unless you really want an extra Assault Cannon or Heavy Flamer. If it was just an extra gun you were after then a Sternguard Vet is cheaper.

HoR Dark Eldar list 250pts:

1 Sybarite
19 Warriors w 4 Blasters
1 Trueborn w Shredder


Is this good or gay or both? I was thinking about going all Hellions but it looked a lot weaker.

Thinking about using either Geedubs kill team of HoR as a reentry into 40k. Took about a year off from the game, and now that i have a steady (if small and carefully budgeted) income and a vehicle again, I was thinking about starting up again. So anyway, I decided to take a look at making a kill team for each of the armies I have so far, and am working on one for my Space Marines right now. I'm thinking about Scout based 'QRF' team, i.e 5 man squad with snipers and cloaks, with another 5 man in a Land Speeder Storm with a mixture of CQC capabilities, standard gear and a heavy weapon choice. My question is, although I'm planning on the team to be more fluffy fun than crunch powerful, how well would such a team operate. Also, I intend on plugging in either scout bikers, a razorback, or sternguard vets, depending on points left over and the local meta (I still don't want to lose too badly, after all). I'm open to suggestions and critiques, obviously.

>>49725808
Thinking of doing something like this but with a Commissar to do a Gaunt's Ghosts kill team

>>49728866

HoR has very dense terrain without many wide open fields of fire, so snipers aren't as good as they are in regular 40k. I prefer bolters and shotties for Scouts. Makes full use of the points that go into Infiltrate as well. Since you can Infiltrate you can do without a transport too.

Scout bikers are good. With White Scars rules you'll get extra bonuses for free.

>>49729022
Thats a good point about cover being a potential issue with the snipers. The idea I was planning on running with was something along the lines of 'squad 1 runs into trouble and calls in support in the for of squad 2 to kill the xenos/heretic/etc', and thats where the LS Storm came in. But like I was saying, the team is a WIP. Thanks for the advice.

>>49728866
Do a list for both. That way you are prepared no matter what

I've decided to build my own readymade Kill Team Playset, where I'll have say 5-8 teams that my friends and I (I'm the only one into 40k at the moment). I got this idea from the old MTG Guild Sets people would make (one guild per deck, one deck for each guild already set up).

I bought the Kill Team Box Set, so I have the Space Marine Tactical Squad and Tau Fire Warriors (might need to add something to balance them still), and I've bought some Tyranid Genestealers (added up to 190 pts with scything talons and broodlord)

Any suggestions on how to make the other factions as even as possibly? I'm trying to keep everything as close to one squad as possible to keep the complexity of the game down (not to mention cost), and I'm afraid this is my first forray into this exptensively planned thing for 40k.

>>49730565
Chaos: Plague Marines and/or CSM+Cultists
Imperial Guard: Veterans or Stormtroopers
Daemons: I don't know. Bloodletters?
Necrons: Warriors + scarabs?
Adepta Sororitas: Battle Sisters
Orks: Boys. Tons of boys.
Dark Eldar: Kabalites or Scourges
Eldar: Guardians (although they are ridiculous).

>>49730565
>Eldar

20 Guardians

>Orks

All warbikes

>DE

All Scourges

>>49730641
>All scourges
>Not all Hellions

Would you play against this list?

Crimson Slaughter (for free fear)

Chaos marine squad
Champion (leader) w/ combi melta
1x plasma gun (specialist master crafted)
3x bolter marines

10 cultists
8x autoguns
1x flamer (specialist: shred)

Chaos spawn: mark of nurgle (specialist : stealth)

>>49730961
I derped. Beasts cannot choose specialist and there is no shred for guns sadly.

Could give the flamer guy infiltrate and a regular chaos bolter marine preferred enemy or something.

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Its not the best considering just how hard Kroot got beat with the nerf bat.

But i have been having fun with...

15x Kroot warriors including 1 with shaper upgrade
9x kroot hounds
2x kroot ox

The fact the Ox are now T3 sucks. And the fact that kroot warriors are now only S3 and lost their +1 attack for the blades on the weapons made the unit loose a lot of flavor.

But hay its still a fun list to play.

The Ox gives me a little bit of anti tank and the hounds being able to take full advantage of being beasts is cool to see in action.

I know the shaper is pointless and i would be much better off buying more kroot or another hound instead of that upgrade but i wanted a "leader" and this gives me a good chance to field my anghkor prok mini (pic related but not mine)

>>49730638
>>49730641
Thanks anons. Seeing these lists is tempting me to make as complete a set as possible...

>>49730565
I'm doing something similar for my store. It's worked wonders.

Seriously, every time I play a game in there someone else buys in or I get a couple of people asking for a demo game.

It helps that my models are painted, and I have very bright, old school schemes that catch attention. Having painted models, and a good opponent, show the game off at its best.

It's crazy, I pretty much pull every new player aside with the standard warnings of price, GW's abysmal rules, and how a bad community can ruin it, and they don't give a fuck. Most of them are magic players though so it's funny how I'll talk about budgeting up to $100 for a kill team and theyll just laugh. That said, they make great opponents. Theyre enthusiastic and being able to go nuts and do whatever they want in a tabletop setting is really cool. Last guy I gave a demo to had a missile launcher jump off the top of a building on purpose so he could get down faster, using the rules that hurt you for distance fallen and everything, just so he could get a better shot.

No idea how long the bubble will last, but man the enthusiasm is there. It's nice to have fun with 40k again.

>>49726647
Dunno about an entire team, but a terminator sergeant with a power sword can be pretty useful in melee against MEQs. Strikes before anyone with an AP2 weapon and can endure most attacks striking at/before his initiative.

What do we think about this list?

246/250 Points Glory Boys
>Scions
Power Weapon
Plasma Gun (SPC: Master Craftsman)
Plasma Gun (SPC: Preferred Enemy)

>Scions
Power Weapon (SPC: Poisoned Weapons?)
Grenade Launcher
Grenade Launcher
3 Additional Scions

>>49731964
>>49730565
Funny, I'm doing the same thing. I've got a Tau, SW, DA, Skitarii, and working on a GSC kill team at the moment just in case one of my buddies comes over and wants to get into it. I've already had one buy his first box of Necrons.

>>49735111
look at a volley gun, theyre really good for dealing with beakies. Salvo 2/4 ap3 S4 is scary for marines, especially if you pick reaping volley so you can split fire. Will do more than two grenade launchers, thats for sure.

>>49735141
Likewise, albeit with HoR and for my group of friends rather than a store. Each faction is a (relatively) affordable project in terms of time and money, and I can give each one options with the addition of a new model or two at a time. So far I have some old Guard I hauled out of the attic and bought a few new things for, Dark Angels and Chaos (thanks DV), a swarm of ebayed Tyranids and am presently working on a Black Templar team. After that I've got some old 2nd/3rd edition Eldar models I mean to paint up, assuming I can resist the allure of new and fancy multi part plastic kits.

Can ork bikes climb on buildings?

>>49736563
In any sane world, no.

>>49736589
Yeah, I know, but this is 40k based game we are talking about :)

>>49736610
I cannot find any rules that say that you can't so I assume that the standard rules for moving vertically apply.

Really, though, bikes should not be able to climb. It's the one advantage jump packs have over them.

>>49736644
I know. Ork player here trying to figure out why not go bikes all day erryday. A normal boy in `eavy armour that does not come in a squad(10 pts), would already be cool, but he also has +1T and 4+ cover save while turboboosting towards you (for additional price of 8 pts lol).

>>49736677
Bikes are obviously very good, if slightly pricey. One is the cost of 3 basic boyz. Still, there's no doubt that the Toughness bonus they grant is a huge advantage, as well as the speed. Limiting their vertical movement wouldn't ruin their utility and would give jump troops some purpose.

Of course, if you're playing RAW then bikes can drive straight up walls to get to those pesky snipers. Just don't expect anyone you're playing with to think highly of you.

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>>49736754
Nah, I won't do that. Unless there was a believable ramp to turboboost on top of a building ofc)

But yeah, I'd seriously pay 10 pts per vanila boy if it meant that he didn't have to stick to a squad. The fact that multiple shot weapons will melt your squad is just heartbreaking. Try playing against skitarii with rad carbines to see what I'm talking about.*

>*rad carbine 18` fires 3 shots str3, but when you roll6 you get double wound. Ouch.

>>49736886
isnt there a rule under the entry in the main rulebook for bikes that specifically states they can't climb ruins? Perhaps it was in terrain?

>>49737376
Nope. You'd think there'd be something in there, but there's not a single mention of bikes being treated differently when it comes to movement.

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Played some HoR last weekend.

Mistakes were made.

>>49737768
Nice terrain.did you make it or buy it?

>>49737872
They're some old cardboard ruins from the 2nd Ed box, I think. Dug it out of the attic and made an attempt at basing.

>>49737768
>guardsmen
>closer than 12" to orks

Nigga you what?

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>>49738374
As I said, mistakes. We were playing the Take The High Ground mission from regular KT. Opponent rushed into the middle. Figured I'd man the walls with my flamer squad, get some shots into the horde, whittle them down and then let them eat more promethium as they charged.

Shooting didn't go as well as I hoped. Flamer dude got shot. The medic on the left kept them alive through one round of combat before promptly fucking off. Entire flank collapsed as I retreated to the other side of the board and made a final stand. Final volley went pretty well. Inevitable charge went as expected, and my opponent's boss nob ended up with a fancy new hat.

If a Tau player brought a single Crisis suit to the table with GW rules, would you play against them?
Two?
Three? (one would have to be very bare)
Four? (they'd be lacking a third system on all of them at this point)
Zero?

I want to paint up some 40k models, but 40k (the game) is a mess I never want to get back into. Are Tyranid Warriors usable in this?

>>49739267
Usable? Yes.

Good? No.

Though the models look great and dropping down 6 3W models seems fairly scary, unfortunately you'll realize that Warriors are paper thin and don't actually utilize much once they get to where they should be.

Allow me to explain; 3 wounds is fucking awesome, but on a toughness 4 model you'll very quickly run into some issues- namely that basic infantry fire can hurt you, and when it hurts it hurts bad.

This wouldn't be a major problem, except you've only got a 4+ save, meaning the Sternguard Veteran looking your way is a very deadly prospect, (if they're especially mean and brought Melta then you're screwed anyway) and even six guardsmen- what you could also get for 30 points- are like as not to take down a warrior before it gets into punishing range.

Which leads to the other big point, namely that your "punishing range" isn't very punishing at all. S4 AP6 claws don't scare anyone (except cultists, but they'll blob you to death) and coughing up 15 points to get a decent weapon (bonesword) will cripple your already weak model count.

But in a game where rule of cool is the law of the land, I'd do it. I've seen decent work mixing gargoyles and warriors, perhaps that would work

>>49739230
Yeah of course. Half the fun of Tau is the battlesuits. I might get mulched, but I think their power is balanced by their few numbers and vulnerability to break tests.

I don't think you can take four though in GW killteam. HoR limits it to two (though you can run a third as your HQ)

>>49739562
Four suits is 88 points in GW. Weapons add about 80 for baseline, so 168-ish points. You have your four model requirement, and some room to play around with 15-point weapons and support systems. 3+ save and two wounds, so it's legit.
I only plan to field three since the boxes are so expensive, though.

How is this HoR Iron Warriors list? Everyone is an IW with Veterans of the Long War except the one renegade they adopted.

Aspiring Champion with bionics - 32 points

Chaos Marine with heavy bolter - 25 points
Chaos Marine with flamer - 20 points
Chaos Marine x7 - 105 points
Chaos Marine - 13 points (Thinking of modelling this guy carrying the ammo for the heavy bolter since he is not a Legionary)

Chaos Biker - 22 points
Chaos Biker with meltagun - 32 points

Total - 249 points

Using the HoR ruleset, is it possible to make 2 roughly evenly-matched teams just with the Kill Team box?

The SM were 190 and the Tau were 134 using GW rules, how balanced could the teams be using HoR? - assuming we're playing Escalating Skirmish for our first 40k game ever.

And I'm picking Ultramarines as our SM, since their Chapter Tactics are pretty neato. Don't know anything about Tau yet.

And any tips for new players?

>>49739906
Despite the imbalance points-wise, they're not too terribly imbalanced in practice. My slightly modified version of the base list and my opponent's list straight out of the book were evenly matched. The Marines even had cover that the Tau lacked (Tau player set the board).

Fire Warriors are very good in KT, especially on the defensive.

>>49740005
>>49739906
Somehow I missed the HoR line. Sorry.

>>49739556
That's unfortunate. I'm no stranger to warriors being subpar, I suppose.

How do you beat tomb blades in kill team?
What would be the best SM units to beat 9 tomb blades?

>>49740339
If you can charge them, that's always a good idea, the T5 is annoying but any dedicated melee unit shouldn't have too much trouble with it. If that's your plan, run some Vanguard Vets w/ Power Swords or lances (mauls if they didn't take shieldvanes, but I'm assuming they did) under Ravenguard CT and stick to cover.

If choppy isn't your game, things may get a bit tougher. Sternguard are a solid pick to take them out one by one, but without much ignores cover the jink/armor/reanimation will be fairly annoying, even with a good deal of AP3. Regular Marines (scouts are dicey because he can get AP4, so you'll lose men more quickly) can try to drown them in shots, but that may could lose you a lot more men than you'd like.

I'd boil it down to three pretty entertaining options:
>7 Vanguard- Jump Packs, Power Weapon (Raven Guard)
>9 Sternguard (Imperial Fists)
>14 Tactical Marines (you pick)

You'll do alright, just stick to cover and play it smart. Try to get them seperated, losing line of sight on eachother will prove useful

>>49736004
Yea, DV was pretty good. I'm gonna use my cultists in there for some GSC and chaos.

>>49739769
Spicy
Literally the same list I'm running
(Works for me)

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My "Special Forces" Catachan. Mix of Catachan and Tempestus models using the Tempestus rules. If Steel Abs confer to 5+ adding some shoulderpads make it 4+ right???

>>49720578
>>49720549

they're squads of 10-30, with 3-5 squads for a platoon, 3 points per man.

1/5 can take a special weapon, 1/10 can take a heavy weapon

10 points for ws and bs 3 for the squad

5 points for 6+ save, again, for the squad.

>>49730762

Scourges will rape Hellions.

i'm just starting out with Kill Zone never having played 40k before (i've played other mini war games). bought the base box. i'm trying to build a fun dark angel and tau armies to play against each other. for the DA team i was going to buy a box of dark angel company veterans, but i have no idea for the tau. any suggestions around max US$35?

>>49745094
stealth suits or crisis suits? i really like the fire warriors, so something to support them would be great.

>>49739600
Really? Huh. I somehow convinced myself the squad limit was three. I've been away from the hobby for too long.

>>49745094
Well I know you can get some Terminator models from the Dark Vengeance boxset on Ebay for about 14$ with shipping included. (You would also need to play HoR, since GW Killteam forbids 2+ armored units)

You'll be hard pressed to find something that cheap and all encompassing for the Tau. Maybe some secondhand battlesuits?

>>49745138

Crisis suits are mean in KT. Fire Warriors supported by Crisis suits is pretty good.

Ok guys, me and a bunch of friends at uni who are all thoroughly disenchanted with 40k's dogshit rules from previous experiences in our teens or earlier (and from what we've heard the rules have only gone downhill since then) want to get into Kill-Team. We all love the lore and the models so we're not looking for another system, just one question. I'm kind of the rules guru who actually reads the rules then teaches everyone else them (because reading is hard when you're at uni, fuck me amirite?) so I want to know before I invest any time, which system would you recommend and why, HoR or GW's Kill Team?

>>49745442

HoR works better as a skirmish system IMO. It encourages using more terrain on the table, which in turn makes games more dynamic because you have to move around more, and the old static gunline army doesn't work as well. That makes vehicles less godly too. The overwatch rules are better and make more sense. The army lists are better balanced because most of the cheese is cut out, and the way different leaders remove different limits on model types makes them feel more characterful to me.

>>49728118
Well, barebones is no weps at all - mix it up, within reason the suit weapons are all fairly adaptable (except flamer, but it's still good to have) rely on specialists for special rules instead of other wargear

>>49745718
Flamers are cheap and amazing on crisis suits what are you talking about?

Vanguard or Rangers for Skitarii? No Sicarians, I want to still have friends

Have Pink Horrors been confirmed as useless for GWKT yet?

>>49746818
Rangers if you want friends

So, making a Space Marine kill team for a preexisting group which uses transports and increased table sizes to make them more useful. Literally never played HoR before and haven't played 40k since 5th.

I'm currently leaning towards a small elite force that will fit in either a Razorback or Landspeeder Storm, pros and cons of both? I could still be persuaded to up the model count a bit and buy a bog standard Rhino.

>>49747333
>increased table size to make them more useful

Why
h
y

I say this as a guard player. The Chimera may as well be a rape factory that can move up to 12" a turn. Why the hell would you need to make transports "better"?

And what about the kill yes that don't have vehicles. What the hell do they do?

>>49746818
I like a mix of both, but if you want full retard you take vanguard. Those little bastards pump out a stupid amount of damage.

That said, a few rangers are nice for their move through cover and their 30" rifles.

As for special weapons, I always feel conflicted. Theyre all good for different reasons. Arquebuses are nice if you take ignores cover so you have a kind of catch all anti armor/anti whatever heavy weapon. Plasma caliver are rape in a can of you take preferred enemy. And arc rifles are just all around hard hitters for a cheap price.

Honestly I just want to take one of each sometimes. I really need to try the skitarii out more to get a better feel for which works where.

>>49747469
It's more to emphasise the movement aspect of it, or so I'm told. Apparently it's to make it seem more like the A-Team or any of the countless 80's commando team schlock where they get inserted in by vehicle. From what i've heard it seems like a cinematic choice not a gameplay thingy, they seem pretty laid back so I don't think anyone's going full WAAC.

I'm so out of the loop from 40k I can't really comment on game balance atm though, give me a few nights to digest the 7th ed rulebook then maybe...

>>49747469

How common are vehicles? Not sure how many (multi)meltas I should pack with my Sisters.

Are grenade launchers useless piles of shit? I have come to this revalation after already building 3 renegades with grenade launchers

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>>49745138

Stealth Suits can have a +2 cover almost everywhere. One of the most survivable choices. Crisis teams have more options and more wounds. Crisis Flamers can turn half into a literal Hell.

>>49748001
The frag mode is pretty bad, but S6 AP4 is alright on a Guard Veteran or Storm Trooper with BS4.

On a BS2 Renegade.... Sorry, Anon.

>>49746818
>>49746944
>>49747469

My FLGS plays at 250 points, so I'm assembling a fully tricked-out Ranger squad. Went with double Plasma Caliver for Preferred Enemy and Master Craftsman specialists, one Arquebus, and an Arc Pistol on the Alpha.

>>49739906
>>49740005
Things would be pretty similar to basic KT, yeah. Only difference would be that the sergeant of each squad would be taken as a leader with 2 Wounds. Tau would get 134pts worth using every model in the box (but without any special upgrades), Marines work out at 160pts with the same + minimum special weapon options (flamer and missile launcher). The point difference can be made up with a few upgrades for the Tau, so it's certainly doable.

>>49745094
>>49745138
Seconding Stealth Suits. They're $27, let you bring one or two new interesting weapons to the table and let you play around with both Jet Infantry and the hellish combination of Stealth and Shrouded.

>>49745442
>>49745557
Seconding HoR. GW KT is very much a way to use your existing army to play a skirmish with only the minimum of rules tweaking. HoR has had some work put into it to make it a viable skirmish game, both in terms of the rules and the force lists you get to chose your team from.

>>49745094
Search ebay for some stealth suits. You can probably get a good deal on those, and try to pick up another support turret, they're pretty good for 10 points.

>>49745442
These guys suggesting HoR are suggesting it because it's designed better. This comes at a cost, however. It's more complicated. Every army has its own specific HoR codex with all different new rules you have to remember. Guys: this guy wants to teach uni students with poor attention spans. HoR will make them bored.

Yeah, HoR is a better system and I'd recommend it if your friends were already 40k gurus jaded with the current game. Knowing they aren't, GW KT is easily the way to go.

>>49749197
Conversely, if they're really into the lore and the models being able to pick individuals (or small squads) is going to be far more rewarding that being forced to stick to codex style squads and not get access to the really characterful HQ units. They did say they'd played 40k before, so they'll know about BS and all that.

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I played my first HoR Kill Team game today.

Rogue Trader versus my Deldar (kasrkin/"house guard" versus incubi, really). It was 300 pts each, and the table was multiple levels of Space Hulk tiles connected by ladders with a few broken patches in hallways that needed to be jumped over. The goal was to collect relics from each of the rooms and the game ended when someone reached the enemy's door (where he deployed from) or routed. Each relic held scored 1 VP (you could kill someone carrying relics and steal them) and reaching the door scored a bonus 4 VP.

Oh man, that was so much fun. There was certainly some balance issues, especially with my guys hyped up on Turn3 PFP before first contact and being able to hide in corners from to room to get up close and murderfuck his guys in those tight corridors - but first casualty was an incubus scoring a natural 6 on jumping the first gap (and plummeting into the abyss) and I ended up losing to a Rout test after the appropriate casualties.

Still, for two guys running with "I have no idea what I'm doing, so let's do this," that was fantastic. I enjoyed it way more than base 40k.

The highlight was leaving a distraction femcubus in a room with an emplaced lascannon. He rushed in there with 2 kasrkin and the RT himself and prepared to gun her down, asking why I just left her open like that. I stared him in the eyes and said, "Hit me." Lascannon missed her. Master-crafted hotshot lasgun missed her with one shot, and 4+ FNP ignored the other. The RT couldn't dent her suit. "Hit. Me." Decides not to charge after seeing the klaivex fuck up 5 guys earlier. My turn, I turn her around to the gunners and declare a charge. All 3 try to overwatch. "Hit me." Lascannon rolls a perfect 6 on To Hit. Then a 1 on To Wound. "HIT ME." Long story short, she ripped the kasrkin apart, and then the RT's powerfist exploded her.

Pic related is our lists.

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>>49749831
Pic related is the hero of the hour. This isn't my model (mine's purple with a white mask), but I love these old incubi models and being able to take their old wargear in HoR.

>>49749831
>>49749844
Sounds like a proper good time. I don't have Space Hulk or similar tiles to use for terrain, but I've been meaning to weave together a bunch of the old Necromunda structures/walkways and declare that ground level is death.

Hey is there a Pdf for the Up to date Killteam rules?

>>49750219
>but I've been meaning to weave together a bunch of the old Necromunda structures/walkways and declare that ground level is death.
Super jealous. I've wanted that stuff forever, but it is so damned expensive these days on ebay. I really hope it makes a return (with Necromunda) as GW brings back their specialist games.

>>49750580
Click the OP image, dingus.

>>49750608
It'll be interesting to see if they do. They haven't made cardboard terrain in ages. Their new plastic stuff is certainly very nice, and I'd love to see some Necromunda themed kits, but they'd undoubtedly be more expensive than a bunch of cardboard and a few bulkheads.