MTG 9/26 Banned/Restricted list predictions?

File: IMG_5511.jpg (42KB, 223x310px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 223x310px

>>49399727

>>49399790
agreed

File: 1470915469869.png (185KB, 500x644px) Image search: [Google]

185KB, 500x644px

>>49399790
As someone who plays a lot of B + U im pretty biased towards white cards thats so generically good

>>49399727
There's really no reason why Jace should still be banned in modern

>>49399727
Modern: BBE, Jace, and Stoneforge unbanned, Prized Amalgam and Become Immense banned.

Pauper: Peregrine Drake is banned.

>>49399877
So, you're essentially saying kill Dredge, Death's Shadow Aggro, Infect, UWR Nahiri, and Abzan? Kill 5 relevant decks? Does the format really need that big of a shake-up?

>>49399915
>Abzan

You do realize Stoneforge helps that deck alot, right?

>>49399877

Show me on the doll what the Graveyard decks did to you.

File: question.jpg (28KB, 310x232px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 310x232px

Why do people think unbanning jace is a good idea?

>>49400153
Because Ancestral Vision wasn't enough to save Blue in Modern. But why Jace, why not Preordain? Unlike Jace, Preordain is a common and therefore wouldn't price thousands of people out of the format.

File: 20160404_204618_HDR~2.jpg (805KB, 1800x2463px) Image search: [Google]

805KB, 1800x2463px

Oh, I think we all know who is coming to visit.

>>49399727
No changes. Possibly punishing fire.

>>49400186
My issue with Preordain is all it does is reinforce blue as "the color you play in a combo deck to find the pieces" which seems pretty boring.
I don't think the card is busted, but I think if it was sorcery speed it would be unbanned by now.
Jayce has no justification of unbanning. As a card, it is too strong. Arguing Jayce should get unbanned to "save" control is like arguing Jitte should be unbanned to "save" equipment decks.

>>49400235
Preordain IS a sorcery.

Also, you can't compare an entire color to a specific archetype.

>>49399877
>prized ban
It loses to so many side board cards. There is no world where this ban is justified.
>Immense ban
Banning a card because it is too good with infect just makes it more clear we need to ban the low drop infect cards.

>>49400270
Woops, I'm dumb. Yeah Pre is fine to unban.

>>49400271

And Twin lost to Torpor Orb, Spellskite, hell, even Path/Dismember. Your point?

Only cards that have a remote chance of being unbanned are BBE and Mystic.

BBE will mean AV can be cascaded into, but thats not too bad without all of the top of library manipulation that goes on in Shardless BUG, so that one seems more likely. I have my playset just in case.

Mystic could be unbanned, BUT its a real problem card because it means they will be scared to print any more good equipment without fear that Stoneforge will abuse it. Also, people seem to forget the power level of that card, it's a tutor that also gets you ridiculously far ahead and cheats on mana, I could see it being unbanned, but not in this B&R.

Everything else in this thread is ludicrous.

>>49400295
Twin existing meant that if you even suspected your opponent was on twin, you had to hold removal for the rest of the game from turn 3 at all times. If you didn't, you lost. It wasn't fun or interactive, it just happened, and didn't require any set up on their turn.

>>49400298
>BBE

Why make one of the best and most consistant decks in modern better?

>they will be scared to print any more good equipment without fear that Stoneforge will abuse it
>implying RnD really give a fuck about what cards they print

Also how is a Jace unban "ludicrous"?

File: 1385252035494.png (14KB, 244x192px) Image search: [Google]

14KB, 244x192px

>>49400392
>complaining that someone playing Twin made you have to interact with them
>but also saying it wasn't an interactive deck

?????

File: Skullclamp.jpg (49KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

49KB, 312x445px

Skullclamp should be unbanned.

I think it's a shoe-in we're gonna start seeing "ban creep" targeting planeswalkers. Planeswalkers might not have any real effect on competitive play, but they're a huge price point for the lineage and forcing people to spin in new ones for top dollar is just good business. It's the kind of thing no one will bitch about either because you're losing your one special thing but you're seeing all other decks lose theirs too, and everyone hates dealing with that. The "wheel" ban keeps the format off-balance (like the conversation around Mystic, around bans in general pre-Clamp Era) enough that they can generate interesting results, shake up tournaments, and get more casual players into semi-pro, which is the financial ideal - spending top dollar but not taking it home.

After next set it's a lock to start seeing Planeswalker tricks recycled - maybe not identical abilities, but definitely identical design intentions. Probably it'll be clumsy as fuck but that just helps the "wheel" to keep turning.

>>49401984
this. they won't unban Jayce but they will make a new scrywalker. probably in red to be assholes

>>49399915
How does that kill Nahiri?

>>49402129
Because power creep. Who's playing Nahiri when you can play Jace?

>>49399877
>Bitching about become inmense
/tg/ is bad as magic as always
>>49400235
>Jace is too powerful
Is a 3 loyalty planeswalker on Boltening; the format. if he brainstorms, he is dead. and it would take a lot more time for him than nahiri to win.

>>49403754
this
Jace would allow all the control archetype, Any Uxx deck would use it instead of going jeskai for nahiri. i would love it unbanned but wizards is a cunt and hate counterspell based control

>>49400186
Preordain enables UR Storm a lot better than Jace or Ancestral Visions, which WotC doesn't want to exist in Modern.

We won't see Jace unbanned though until more supply is printed to meet the demand for it, so my guess is MM 2017 we'll see him be in the set and unbanned.

As for the 26th, I think Stoneforge Mystic can be unbanned.

>>49403829

>Insults the boards Magic skill
>Then says Jace won't be OP

You're right about the Become Immense thing, but Jace will still be super busted in Modern.

If he brainstorms, and they bolt him, he is dead, sure, but you got to brainstorm, AND they burnt a bolt, so you're down no cards worst case scenario, and up a shitload if you can fetch away useless cards.

You get to also go 3 cards deep looking for a Counterspell for said bolt, and this is all assuming you have a bolt in hand, if they don't, he'll just start Fatesealing your shit away, while their hand is full of gas from the Brainstorm they got.

There's a reason fucking Slash Panther saw play as a Jace Killer for a while, he's ludicrously powerful, and unless they also unban a LOT of other things, he will remain being too powerful.

He is too versatile, and a good player will nearly always win if they resolve a Jace.

>>49400550
My personal thoughts on the matter are that not that many people have actually played against JTMS.

The biggest thing for Jace is that unlike Nahiri, you probably can't slam him down on turn 4 without protection of some kind. Most of the Nahiri decks also run path and bolt to clear the way or expect her to take a hit before clearing the board of dudes next turn.

>>49403919
But you just payed 4 mana for that brainstorm, AND you are now tapped out, in a control deck. In legacy, just paying two mana for a brainstorm can be absolutely backbreaking.

>>49403998
Yeah, he's a really good control finisher, but you need to be in control of the game before you can safely slam him down.

File: 1444708759458.jpg (44KB, 282x341px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 282x341px

Nahiri can close the game out a lot faster than Jace. I mean the game may technically be over when you resolve Jace sometimes but your opponent's still gonna get a lot of draws.

I could see them being played together.

>>49403919
>Wasting a Counterspell on a bolt
Plz. first i f you have mana to cast jace and a counterspell, then you are past t4 and any aggro deck already would have lost the game

Nobody wastes a 2 or more CMC counter on countering a bolt, a thoughtseize or a duress. Any deck like Jund will have 0 prblems with him. burn and death shadow's zoo can win before he gets online, he is just good against uninteractive linear combo decks

>>49404041
3 nahiri 3 jace 1 emrakul does sound pretty hot

>>49404034

Legacy is a much, much faster format with much more combo and FORCE OF WILL, you can't compare it.

The matches may be longer in legacy, but there are much less turns on average, its just each turn has so many microdecisions.

>>49404092

If Jace is unbanned, you'd be seeing MUCH more UBx in the format, so countering a bolt will be much more common. That was the scenario I was refering too.

He would probably not be played as a 4 of, yes, and I could see him being run as a 3-2 split with him and Nahiri, but he'd still be fucking broken. He does way too much, it's been proven with quadrant theory that he is broken, Jace is NOT healthy in a format without good permission, which is definitely modern at the moment.

He is not bad against any deck, and the decks he is good against, he'd be fucking oppressive to the point where the meta will converge, ESPECIALLY if stoneforge is also unbanned.

You want fucking Cawblade again, but in MODERN with access to more cards?

>>49404300
>You want fucking Cawblade again, but in MODERN with access to more cards?

Yes, because permission decks in modern won't ever be top tier, you will need Jace, And Counterspell, And Daze, And ponder/preordain to have a good reactive deck in modern. Have you seen Esper draw/go in modern? or Mono U tron? they are fucking shit in the first 4 turns of the game. any good deck can get around because control in modern is shit. Jace would help those permission, but he alone wouldn't make control tier -1 as people want to think. Modern is very different to legacy and the many linear strategies can stand a chance against control decks cuz they are faster and deadly

>>49399727
Nothing will change. Modern will continue to rot. Everyone will continue to praise for format.

>>49399727
How about instead of unbanning Jace, ban Nahiri, unban Preordain, and print Counterspell into Modern? That way real control becomes a relevant threat.

>>49404469

>Counterspell
>Daze
>Ponder
>Preordain

None of those existed back in Cawblade days, and it still was a big enough menace to get TWO cards banned from STANDARD.

And Standard back then was a lot stronger, Jund had BBE/Blightning and all of the nastiness and it was still CRUSHED by cawblade.

I think that Jace COULD be unbanned, but only if other things also got unbanned with it that powered up other decks, without powering up the decks with Jace in them.

That's too much effort for Wizards, so they just will keep him banned.

>>49404496
^ and unban Stoneforge

>>49404300
>You want fucking Cawblade again, but in MODERN with access to more cards?
YOU WANT FUCKING FAERIES AGAIN BUT IN MODERN WITH ACCESS TO MORE CARDS? XDDD

Shut the fuck up.

>>49404508
Preordain existed lol, as did Mental Misstep.

>>49404496
Why ban nahiri? what tould then be the clock that control decks could put to finish the game? Rev for 15 and going to time? Yes counterspell is needed in modern but permission alone is not the only thing that make a control deck

>>49404508
>STANDARD.
Never ever compare the power of a card on standard to modern. Bitterblossom dominated standard, Siege Rhino dominated standard, Standard is small and shit. Modern is big and there are too many tools and proven decks to beat jace. if you think cards that dominated standard shouldn't be in modern, then wild Nactl would have never been out of the banlist to begin.

>>49404540
>YOU WANT FUCKING FAERIES AGAIN BUT IN MODERN WITH ACCESS TO MORE CARDS? XDDD

^This. People bitched about Bitterblossom because of how Faeries dominated Standard. Where are they now? About as relevant as Soul Sisters, Ponza and Skred. While I do think Stoneblade would be stronger than Faeries in Modern, I highly doubt it would become the next Eldrazi.

>>49404556
>Why ban Nahiri?

Because Nahiri is not a real control deck, just a tempo deck in disguise. Banning it would promote true control decks.

>>49404496
>print Counterspell into Modern
That would require printing it in Standard, and Rosewater has stated it's a lot like Bolt in how format-warping it is, "but possibly in the right circumstance it might be reprintable." But as it stands, R&D seems to be trying to make Standard not have those "you have to run this to play this color" cards, and it doesn't sound like anyone in particular is pushing Counterspell to be in the format to begin with.

tl;dr don't count on it

>>49404614
So...ban Delver too? LOL

>>49404625
Red is a complete non-colour in Standard. Lightning Bolt would do nothing in the format.

>>49404625

>R&D seems to be trying to make Standard not have those "you have to run this to play this color" cards

New Chandra would beg to differ.

>>49404625

> But as it stands, R&D seems to be trying to make Standard not have those "you have to run this to play this color" cards, unless they are Mythic Rare Planeswalkers.

Fixed.

>>49404614
>Because Nahiri is not a real control deck, just a tempo deck in disguise. Banning it would promote true control decks.

lol

>>49404614

>Because Nahiri is not a real control deck, just a tempo deck in disguise. Banning it would promote true control decks.

Because if it doesn't consistently go into time, it isn't a "true" control deck, right?

>>49404642
Bolt would push red right into the metagame as we know it because of how efficient it is. People will just end up running red even as a splash just to have Bolt.

>>49404657
>>49404683
Well you got me on that one
she doesn't even seem that good compared to JTMS though, which is what literally everyone was comparing her to. JTMS was card advantage stacking on top of itself and very efficient removal, with the world's most destructive ult slapped onto a four mana walker. Her abilities are maybe burn, burn on creatures that has a hefty cost, two whole mana, and more burn that first requires some input from you. As it stands right now, she's going to do literally nothing until things get a little bit less creature-based with cards like Advocate in the format. She'll get rushed down or removed and die before anything could be accomplished. She's going to make a major appearance at the pro tour and everyone is going to be running her like no tomorrow, but she won't do anything against decks that are geared to get rid of problem cards like her.
but that's honestly my opinion

>>49404300
>You want fucking Cawblade again, but in MODERN with access to more cards?
Cawblade was just a tempo-control deck with cards that were relatively overpowered in a format that didn't have the tools to beat it. Stoneforge mystic is what pushed the deck over the top anyway. The non-sensational answer is, yes, modern wants a tempo-control deck.

People forget that Jace didn't see high-level play for half of his standard career. Jace is a very powerful card, but it's ultimately a 4-mana draw spell in a format full of high-value 4-drops. Yes, it's nearly impossible to beat a Jace if he survives a few turns and is in a deck designed to take advantage of him, but is that so bad? If a control deck can go from turns 4 to 7 without taking any damage, it's not a degenerate thing for them to have a card that lets them win in that situation.

Collected company in particular represents a great natural predator for Jace the same way BBE kept jace in check when worldwake was released. Creature decks in modern have fantastic tools to deal with 4-mana planeswalker.

>>49404834
It's not Stoneblade, we don't have Stoneforge. It's...Jace-Hiri? (idk what to call it lol)

I'd like to be able to play with Jitte.

I'm not expecting it to get unbanned though.

>>49405022
Jitte is one of few cards that probably deserves the ban, like Great Furnace, Seat of the Synod, and Blazing Shoal.

Pauper:
Peregrine Drake banned, hopefully Delver of Secrets as well because Delver into Daze into Spell Pierce/Force Spike and Counterspell means you might as well scoop, Izzet Blitz would survive without.

Modern: Become Immense and Conflagrate banned (pumping out power from the yard isn't the problem in itself without the broken starts of Legacy and Vintage Dredge, when it's backed by an asymmetrical 2mana boardwipe it is).
Hoping for a Summer Bloom and/or Splinter Twin unban, but probably won't happen because WOTC would have to admit they fucked up (Summer Bloom wasn't oppressive in any sense of the word, didn't kill before turn 3 too consistently and they admitted Twin was banned just to shake up the PT metagame).

Legacy: Terminus banned, pretty self-explanatory, zoo strategies could actually make a comeback afterwards.

>people are still asshurt over losing to Jace in cawblade that they think he'd be overpowered in modern

>>49404833
>6 mana chandra can plus and do 6 damage
>4 mana chandra can plus and do 6 damage
dont be salty because you didnt get ahold of the 60 dollar at release walker, the bitch is strong as fuck

>>49404914
jaceXnahiri

>>49399790
This is what I want but I know it'll never happen.

>>49405022
Jitte is one of the most busted cards on the ban list. It basically reads: Connect once with it, win all combat for the rest of the game.

>>49403829
>>49403919
>>49400271
Immense is most likely to be on the chopping block because Zooicide and Infect have cleared a few turn 2-3 kills during major events because of it. It's currently the card closest to going over the Turn 4 rule and in two decks.

Best of all, banning Become Immense doesn't invalidate either of those decks, so it won't noticeably reduce the variety of the format.

>>49400298
> it means they will be scared to print any more good equipment without fear that Stoneforge will abuse it.
But they haven't printed any good equipment for a while now.

>>49400550
>BBE
Is unbanned in the MTGO beta client right now, that's why people think it will be unbanned.

File: Deathflag Jura.jpg (1MB, 1920x1120px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1920x1120px

Pauper: Peregrine Drake is banned
Modern: Bloodbraid Elf is unbanned
Legacy: Sensei Divining Top is banned

File: 122[1].jpg (62KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

62KB, 312x445px

I'm a little suspicious of this guy now. It's too comparable to Lotus Petal, aside from being something you can't recur.

>>49408281
>Sensei Divining Top is banned
I don't want to be the guy who says this but, git gud

>>49400550
>Why make one of the best and most consistant decks in modern better?

Frankly, BBE is fighting too many powerful 4-drops now that Jund may not even care to play it anymore. It doesn't compare favorably with Kalitas.

>>49404614
No, pure control would still be garbage and unable to compete, just like it is now. Tempo-control is the best you can get in modern.

>>49408401
Idk, BBE cascading into Lili or Tarmogoyf or Bob still sounds better then Kalitas.

>>49408533
Jace coming back wouldn't make "pure control" better than what we have now, he'd just be used alongside Nahiri, similar to how he's used alongside either Stoneforge or CounterTop in Legacy. Jace is busted, but he's not Exodia ffs.

>>49408592
fuck you no it doesnt, I would rather play leyline on a stick instead of playing coco with a bolt that can pull my lockdown peice and auto win me the match.

>>49408698
I'm not saying he would, I'm saying banning Nahiri wouldn't make any other control decks any more competitive. I'm not talking about Jace.

File: Memeber.jpg (19KB, 160x89px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 160x89px

>>49399727

Remember?

>>49408743
Sorry meant to reply to >>49404614

>>49408752
Yeah and people though Arlinn was gonna break Standard LOL

>>49408700
BBE is guaranteed value. And Liliana, Bob, Goyf are all stronger cards than kalitas, the fact that you get a 3/2 haste is just icing.

>>49409029
Thats the joke, bolt issupposedly too strong to reprint yet people think a bolt stapled to an elf with one of the most broken green mechanics to get put on a card is fine.

>>49409326
Bolt is mostly used for instant speed creature kill, not hitting face.

>>49409557
3 damage comming alongside whatever you cascade into is a lot, it was enough to keep jtms from being relevant and is enough to smother a few decks out of the format. Also many walkers are considered bad because they dont protect themselves.

File: 1469069055188.jpg (63KB, 480x480px) Image search: [Google]

63KB, 480x480px

>>49406509
Jeskai fanfic control
>>49406490
>He fell for the chandra meme
Did you also bought narset at 50? pic is for you
>>49408281
>>49406231
Git Gud

Infect just cleared straight through another event.

It's looking more and more likely they're going to have to lose something.

>>49410416
Maybe this can be a now all decks have some side board against infect rather than Modern being a rotating eternal format.

>>49406231
>ban kiln fiend because turn 2 fiend into turn 3 battle rage, shadow rift, mutagenic growth means you might as well scoop

Screencap my godly prediction so you can act like hot shit when the banlist comes out and I'm completely right:

Banned:
>Cranial Plating
>Deceiver Exarch
>Disciple of the Vault

Unbanned:
>Artifact Lands
>Splinter Twin

>>49399925
That's what he means, it kills the current strategy of the deck and it just becomes Junk Deathblade.

File: 1300044776986.jpg (16KB, 250x250px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 250x250px

>>49412007
>Unbanned:
>>Artifact Lands

File: 12705455_802813009823421_2728466813195488277_n.jpg (20KB, 480x444px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 480x444px

>>49412064
>What is Stony Silence

I personally want Counterspell in modern and Simian Spirit Guide banned but we can't all get what we want now can we?

>>49408592
Not when you're at a absurdly low life total and need to start stabilizing, the meta is just too aggressive Jund needs the Lifegain. BBE would see play but not insta-4 of in the current version of Jund.

>>49404300
>Legacy
>much more combo
>than Modern


Ayy, look who's never played Legacy.

>>49399727
No changes
No changes
No changes

>>49412088
>Hey guys how about we make Modern even more reliant on drawing your silver bullets?
How about fuck off.

>>49412088
You're an idiot

>>49412548
Well, the only viable combo decks are Ad Naus and Scapeshift, and scapeshift is becoming titanshift. Legacy has 3 Storms, Elves, Aluren, Food chain, Charbelcher, Oops all spells, Show and tell, Reanimator, Omnitell.

>>49400298
the "we'll never be able to print better equipment" argument doesn't hold water, because they're never gonna print equipment better than Batterskull, Jitte, or the Swords. You can't make the same argument against Stoneforge as, say, Birthing Pod.

Honestly I'd love to see Stoneforge, a turn 3 Batterskull to stop some of the mindless aggro in its tracks would be great. There's plenty of other degenerate turn 3 plays in this format, so it wouldn't be a big deal, especially with Kolaghan's Command and all the artifact hate.

>>49412007
>unban
>splinter twin

Wizards will eventually do this because the card isn't overpowered and the deck that it creates also isn't overpowered but it's just too close to when they banned it

They won't go back on their word so quickly. Especially since they wrote several paragraphs about why it needed to be banned (so they could sell more eldrazi packs)

>>49410482
Most modern players would rather bitch until something gets banned than actually adapt their decks.

I feel like we need some unbans to keep linear aggro in check.
I feel like no changes are coming, but honestly anything could happen.

If Jace ever gets unbanned. How much would he spike up to?

Same with SFM, and Twin.

>>49414054
Since Zendikar isn't one of the sets they're revisiting too much for Modern Masters 2017 I highly doubt they will reprint him in that, even though they really should. Jace's price would easily skyrocket to Goyf prices if not more because of all the hype and depending on his performance, he'll either stay there or go down but not by much if he isn't preforming as well as people hope for.

Stoneforge Mystic had a ton of copies handed out in the recent GPs so it wouldn't spike as hard, but a 100% increase isn't out of the question

Twin would probably spike up to beyond it's normal price before the Modern Masters 2 reprint for a little bit before stabilizing.

>>49401898

I'd start playing MTG again on principle.

>>49400235
>Punishing Fire
That's so far away from being possible.

I would even hazard to say it will never happen.

Why in the world do people think Bloodbraid will be unbanned? I like her, and I want her unbanned, but I don't see why it would happen.

I'd love to do janky shit like BBE into Kolaghan's command to kill Delver and get a BBE back to hand, but Bloodbraid doesn't really bring anything of note to the format, right?

>>49413624
>Changes to keep linear aggro decks in check

Blazing Shoal, Hypergenesis, Rite of Flame, Seething Song, Splinter Twin, Umezawa's Jitte, Dark Depths, Chrome Mox, and Stoneforge Mystic are all options here. Either Twin or Stoneforge would probably be the most likely of the bunch.

>>49414950

I feel Jitte could come back. It's an insane card, but I doubt it would break the format in half. It certainly didn't break Extended any more than other staples like Goyf and Bob.

>>49414977
Jitte is banned for "muh fun" reasons, as it would kill MaRo's vision of Modern as a safe space for creatures.

>>49415017
Yes, and to sell new product with retarded power creeped mythic rare creatures.

>>49415025
Reprints aside, the only "chase cards" that were power creeped creatures for Modern since the inception of Modern have been Voice of Resurgence and Grim Flayer.

>>49415428
Eldrazi Displacer
Eldrazi Mimic
Reality Smasher
Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
Spell Queller
THOUGHT-KNOT SEER

>>49415568
>rare
>rare
>rare
>mythic(that sees little play)
>rare
>rare
rare's are not chase cards because they're opened significantly more than mythics

>>49415595
>rare
>rare (that only saw play because of Eye of Ugin)
>rare
>mythic(that sees little play)
>rare(that sees little play)
>rare

Fixed.

BRACE YOURSELF, CUNTS. THE TIME IS NOW FOR THE PREDICTION OF THE CENTURY.

Modern:

Unban
Stoneforge Mystic
Bloodbraid Elf
Splinter Twin
Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Ban
Become Immense
Inkmoth Nexus
Emrakul, the Anus Torn
Goblin Guide

Argue against it. Protip: You can't.

>>49415858
I don't have to argue against it, the stupidity speaks for itself

>>49415858
Why Emrakul and Gob Guide? There are much stronger decks than Jeskai and Burn, namely the afformentioned Infect, as well as Affinity, Dredge, and Eldrazi.

>>49410150
I certainly am not going to buy a 50 dollar on release walker and I picked up my nahiri for 10 dollars including shipping. Chandra is strong, not jtms strong but to put it simply having her live a turn or two means you have the game on lockdown, the repeatable ritual will make her a powerhouse.
If youre implying I think there are any exisitng modern decks that can afford to use new chandra that are/will be teir1 then thats just false, she is a good ritual but unfortunately there arent strong enough red 2 drops currently that will be fine losing the 2 mana to cast her in the first place.

>>49411900
No? Show any edict, journey, doom blade or counterspell which will probably even resolve.

>>49415996

I predict a similar thing happening with Torrential Gearhulk that happened with Nahiri after SOI.

Well, not quite as extreme, as the Gearhulk is 6 mana and very clearly is not broken. However, while Green Hulk is getting all the hype, I predict blue will end up being the best, similar to Arlinn getting all the hype as the "best walker in SOI", while that ended up being Nahiri by a landslide.

>>49415951
Emrakul gets rid of those Nahiri decks that all you cucks are complaining about, while also limiting everything else unfair that that card encapsulates.

Goblin Guide is far too pushed for a one drop. Monastery Swiftspear is significantly fairer.

>>49415908
>Calls me stupid
>Can't argue against it
ggwp

>>49414305
It's not even a good burn card, my dude. There can't be a real control deck built around it because modern lacks the land tutor power of crop turn. At best it is used to punish kitchen finks.

>>49415858
"WAaaahahahahhhh fuck fast decks please ban I haaate haivng to run real removal to deal with them. I just want to spam remand till I play some bomb and win due to it's raw power."

>>49416060
>You must hate fast decks
>Actively advocating the unban of Stoneforge and BeeBee to speed up Abzan and Jund

Yeah okay. I just think that Goblin Guide is too good for a one drop and Become Immense is far too good for what it does.

>>49403914
I hope you are wrong purely because if they reprint him and unban him in the same breath the already unbearable bitching on /tg/ about jewzards of the coast will be multiplied a dozen times over.

>>49416060
a) Punishing Jund would be a deck.

b) Ironic he didn't hit ban anything from Dredge or Eldrazi, it seems like he hates fast decks, and hates cards like Nahiri that make every dumb bomb he has meaningless by comparison.

File: 1474009532361.jpg (91KB, 819x621px) Image search: [Google]

91KB, 819x621px

>>49416122
>Wizards announces JTMS unban
>Wizards announces MM 2017 reprint
>Wizards actively forces everyone to at least try blue decks, makes mad bank
>Three months later, regret the decision and ban him again.
>/tg/ honorable seppukus from the emotional roller coaster
>mfw

>>49416144

don't you mean Sudoku?

:^P

>>49416131
Dredge is super flimsey and is easy to hate out. Cards like become immense and Goblin guide less so.

As for Eldrazi, i'm just grateful that we don't have to deal with the shit we had when Oath first came out... Anything below that shit is an improvement, and the deck isn't dominating anything so what's the problem?

>>49408346
I hear a lot of people want it banned just because it's bad for coverage

>>49416185
The card is anti-fun due to how much flexibility it provides to card drawing, and how long it takes to use it. Sure, some people can do it lickity split but that is a minority of top users. For the sake of the game not being garbo, it should be banned.

>>49416131
I feel like Jund wouldn't really like punishing as it just makes them even more vulnerable to graveyard hate. I think it would see play in jund side boards but I think the burnwillow + punishing dream is too unrealistic for how minor the pay off is.

Unban JtmS to make control good again
Unban BBE to make control bad again

File: .....gif (73KB, 840x514px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 840x514px

>>49408281
>>49408281
>>49408281
>unban BBE
>Jund is the top deck in meta
>unban a card that just adds fuel to the top deck in the meta

why

>>49416339
fuck you, that's why. Us pricks who can afford a playset of goyfs want to play with our 4 drop value machine.

>>49416339
That's why >>49416290 should happen

Jeskai versus Jund with the inferior babbydecks crawling in the dirt beneath them is how Modern should be played

>>49415595
>baby Jace
>Vintage all star, Legacy staple, modern played, former standard staple
>spiked to $90
>not a chase mythic

For modern

Unban:
Birthing pod
BBE
Chrome mox
Cloudpost
Deathrite shaman
Dread return
Glimpse of nature
GSZ
Jace, the sculpting faggot
Ponder
Preordain
Punishing fire
Rite of flame
Seething song
SDT
Splinter twin
Stoneforge mystic
summer bloom

Reprint:
Force of Will

I mean, we already are at the point in this fucking format where the card pool is too big and we have the combo pieces that win fast. It's demented to have the best deck to be banned every now and then, when there still is going to be one coming sooner or later. Also, a big portion of those broken cards are checked by other broken cards. Glad pro tours and artificial rotation is now over, since it was fucking demented.

Before incoming abloobloo; yes, these cards kill a lot of decks, they also allow a lot of other decks to be around. Yes, preordain helps storm, it also helps jank decks like taking turns. Yes GSZ is broken in decks like elves, but it's also broken in any other green deck that might want to side in toolbox around these combo type decks. But think it like this. It's either we unban every deck or we ban every deck, since there will always be "the best deck", always.

>>49416934
>"the best deck"
Given how mtg is rock-paper-scissors with some sideboard bullets and coin tosses on top this is false.

>>49416934
Eww, this is disgusting. Absolutely not.

>>49416198
No way the Punishing Fire/Grove/Liliana synergy is just so good. It's not busted but it's good, Jund would try and play it. Probably not 4 of, but like 2 Punishing Fire and 3 Grove probably. Also LotV could easily be a 4 of.

>>49416090
Goblin Guide isn't too good for Modern. Inkmoth should not be banned, Infect should exist in Modern. Emrakul? Seriously wut?

You're objectively wrong familia

>>49414737
No but that's the point, a card shouldn't be on the ban list if it isn't busted/format breaking to be on it. That's why Wild Nacatyl, GGT, Bitter'B, Ancestral Visions, and SotM were all unbanned. All have either uneffected the meta game or barely impact it.

Expecting no changes to the ban list, if anything Become Immense will probably get banned.

The only cards that have any kind of potential for unbanning are BBE, Jace, or Punishing Fire. Maybe Stoneforge but probably not.

BTW, these are just my predictions/thoughts based off of Wizards behavior and what I think would most likely happen. Not what I thin they should do with the Format.

>>49417046
I think it was Melissa De Tora who wrote about trying out no banlist modern. She essentially said that after playing for a few weeks it just became dominated by Delver with Treasure Cruise, Storm and Hypergenesis combo.

>Birthing Pod, Deathrite Shaman, Summer Bloom.

These have all been tried and tested and banned for various reasons. Pod won't come off because it limits design space for creatures that interact with the graveyard. Deathrite Shaman leads to consistant turn 2 Liliana of the Veil, as well as providing main deck graveyard hate. Summer Bloom, though inconsistant and hard to play, broke the turn 2/3 rule.

Chrome Mox goes into literally every deck as free land drop in exchange for a card. We keep that away from Modern.

Cloudpost unban would kill Tron. Then again, salty Tron tears would be delicious (Jundfag here).

>Ponder, Preordain, Rite of Flame, Seething Song

Wizards don't want storm in their pet format. Even if it helps storm a little bit it's on notice. Wouldn't surprise me if Gitaxian Probe eventually got banned.

>SDT

If they have this on watch for banning in Legacy, the idea of unbanning it in modern while proposing introducing Force of Will to the format is hilarious.

>Punishing Fire

Liliana and Grove say waddup.

>Dread Return, Glimpse of Nature, Green Sun's Zenith

Risky cards that could end up doing a lot of damage, but could be cool to see what happens if they were taken off.

>Bloodbraid Elf, Jace, The Mind Sculptor, Splinter Twin, Stoneforge Mystic.

These seem the most viable on the list. Unban Jace and Twin to encourage the return of draw go blue decks, unban Stoneforge and Bloodbraid to make sure they're kept in check. The only card in this list that could cause a lot of damage on it's own is Twin as it could make people go back to combo-win instead of grindy win, plus had to have a lot of sideboard hate directed at it.

As for guesses at possible bans, Become Immense is on my radar.

>>49416144
you mean
>jund pounds every blue deck till the only blue players are in legacy and edh

>>49417195
I agree with you m8

>>49417195
What is hilarious is that you people seriously think Bloodbraid elf is safe compared to preordain and storm buff. It's not even funny.

>>49417208
It's exceptionally unhealthy how dominant Blue is in Duel Commander. It is like over 60% of the meta while Green is also 0% of the meta. And the non-green non-blue decks are just a sliver.

>>49417269
Probably not safe, and probably not necessary as stats show that Jund is one of the most popular decks at the minute, but i think it's necessary if you unban JTMS. When Jace first came out, Bloodbraid kept it in check easily. Sure, Jace dies to everything in Modern right now, and i've love to try and let him off the leash, but Beebee is certainly safe as a stop gap for Jace.

I don't think one could come off without the other.

>>49417195
>Summer Bloom, though inconsistant and hard to play, broke the turn 2/3 rule
Yeah when people didn't show any of the following: removal to amulet, thoughtseize, mana leak/remand, blood moon or torpor orb or basically anything relevant. Near the end of January no one played the 1 SSG build with the possibility of turn 1ing since it hurt consistency. Combo decks are supposed to be fast at the risk of doing nothing if your opponent can interact, that's the whole point and a shitload of the format can goldfish on turn 3 even now. Death's Shadow does it arguably more consistently than Amulet ever with a 48 card deck with Thoughtseize and whatnot.
>Cloudpost unban would kill Tron.
By making Tron's mana even more stable without changing the deck at all otherwise?

>>49417530
a. this is why Become immense is on my radar.

b. look at Trons land base. by the time you've made room for cloudpost, glimmerpost, vesuva and thespians stage, you're not playing tron anymore, you're playing 12/16post.

>>49417571
>you're playing 12/16post
...Which in Modern is the exact same deck in everything but name and lands. You'd still play a set of Grove to cast Pyroclasm (and some sideboard cards) to stay alive and Sylvan Scrying to find lands, 1-2 basics, eggs, maps, stirrings, oblivion stones and fatties.

The only ban that's gonna happen is Peregrine Drake in pauper.

>>49417464
>Sure, Jace dies to everything in Modern right now
>I don't think one could come off without the other

How near sighted can one be. Modern =/= Jace-era standard.

>Probably not safe, and probably not necessary as stats show that Jund is one of the most popular decks at the minute

>>49417571
Jesus.

>>49417289
do you mean french?

>>49417590
Tron can be hated out in a significantly easier way. If your opponent has 2 cloudposts and a glimmer post, and you destroy a cloudpost, not only do they have access to 3 mana instead of two, they have a lot of ways to put more locus' onto the board without cards like crumble to dust being able to hose them.

You could argue that it gives the deck a boost but it doesn't really need one with the land base they have. The deck does what it needs to but isn't busted because hitting one piece of tron with a fulminator and hoping they don't have the second copy or a tutor to find that copy is much fairer than them hoping they don't have a second cloudpost/land clone and ramping up the mana significantly.

>>49417615
I said that Bloodbraid could be used as a safety gap if Jace became too oppressive. I personally think Jace would probably be too good and it would inevitably lead to BeeBee coming back. WotC is clearly scared because of the damage he did to standard and i don't blame them. When the entire top 8 of a tournament are all running 32 JTMS, you know there's a problem.

>what i want
unban: SFM
ban: nothing

>what is fair
unban: nothing
ban: become immense

>what will happen
unban: nothing
ban: prized amalgam, cranial plating

>>49417195
Dis nigga knows his shit, even though it sucks WotC has a hateboner for storm

>>49416054
Literally nothing wrong with Nahiri decks. Anyone who complains is a wiener.

>>49412007
>>49417741
What is with you people thinking WotC would go after Affinity?

The deck has barely changed in years and isn't any more dominant than it's ever been. It's in practically the same metagame position that it's been every banlist update and they've never hit it.

Show me where the Etched Champion touched you.

>>49418015
>Show me where the Etched Champion touched you.
it didn't. he couldn't shove it through the thought-knot seers :^)

>>49418015
>Affinity is always good, needs a ban
>Get extra tools to help deal with it
>Affinity starts to get hated out
>Still too good, needs a ban
>Meanwhile Dredge needs to be banned because it's actually a good deck now.
>Hardly dominant, easily hated out and only producing okay results in comparison to other decks.
>Must be banned for safety.

I swear, the magic community is so amazed at getting something new, then insists immediately on banning it when it hits modern because they don't want to have to learn to play around ANOTHER new thing...

>>49404508
None of this is even remotely true. Jund dominated standard until I rotated out, Jace was trash in the fave of Bloodbraid elf. Also Jund and caw blade never existed in the same format because in order for there to be blades, alara block couldn't have been legal. Congratulations on exposing how retarded you really are

With any luck every Planeswalker.

File: 106[1].jpg (74KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

74KB, 312x445px

>>49418156

>>49399727
>>49399790
Reminder that Aaron Forsythe has made it clear that JTMS, Stoneforge Mystic, Green Sun's Zenith and Seething song CANNOT be taken off the modern banlist.

Not they don't want to, they cannot.

>>49418207
Source.

>>49418184
Sigh.

I'm 25. I was playing competetively when Walkers hit and they warped the entire game. Evrry deck needed 4x Jaces to win. The game tanked as a result and me and a bunch of others left. I've come back a little recently and the game is still utterly shitted up by Planeswalkers/the death of blue/the death of the colour pie.

>>49418301
>I was playing competetively when Walkers hit and they warped the entire game. Evrry deck needed 4x Jaces to win.

So by "when Walkers hit" you actually mean Worldwake?

>>49418301
The problem with walkers isn't that they're too strong. It's that they are only printed at mythic and are only pushed because that's their only rarity.
Also the fact that they effectively replaced enchantments for design space
Imagine an uncommon walker

>>49418207
None of those cards do what they want for numagic and modern. They won't unban because winning with spells (song) isn't fun, jace is perceived as the most op Walker and their poster boi. Jace can't be unbanned because being banned makes him seem cooler (also he's blue and this is modern). Birthing pod was supposed to be a weaker green sun's zenith and look at how that turned out

>>49418362
This is pretty much exactly the deal with the Intro Pack Planeswalkers. The only reason they have a mythic rarity symbol is because "Planeswalkers are mythic", but they're basically costed and powered as though they were the same jank Intro Pack rares as ever.

>>49399915
>Death's Shadow Aggro
>using the shit name
Please kill yourself immediately.

>>49418414
Unsurprisingly a company that sells products wants to make a profit.

>>49418509
That's something of a non-sequitur.

>>49418473
I always prefered "Sudoku Zoo"

>>49418571
Are you trying to say Seppuku Zoo or 切腹動物園?

>Standard
-
>Modern
UNBAN Jace, the Mind Sculptor
UNBAN Eye of Ugin
BAN Eldrazi Temple
>Legacy
-
>Pauper
BAN Peregrin Drake
>Commander
BAN Deadeye Navigator

>>49418687
Hownew.ru

>>49418740
I'm just trying to help out my fellow otaku-kun. Yare yare daze.

>>49418753

>>49418734
>UNBAN Eye of Ugin
>BAN Eldrazi Temple

>If Eldrazi Temple is banned and Eye of Ugin is legal, the deck focuses on playing multiple lower-casting-cost Eldrazi per turn. A discount of two mana for each Eldrazi becomes a discount of four or more over the course of a turn. The deck becomes more explosive, more focused on a single build, and the powerful draws are still not interactive.

>If Eye of Ugin is banned and Eldrazi Temple is legal, the mana supports a more diverse set of builds. There still is a small percentage of games with two Eldrazi Temples powering out huge plays. However, there are more games where only one Temple is drawn, and the deck is powerful yet beatable.

This is a prediction thread, not wishlists. WotC already explained their choice of the two, and you'd be a fool to think it'll be reversed any time soon.

>>49418734
>BAN Deadeye Navigator
Literally why?

I understand the usual land-untappers are a bitch, but deadeye strikes me as an inferior, more expensive brago. I run deadeye and the full shit package, and I can honestly say he's won 3 games, and sat dead in my hand for a whole shitload more. At 6 mana you should win the game.

>>49418753
Daze isnt legal in modern and what the fuck card is yare supposed to be?

File: 252[1].jpg (73KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 312x445px

>>49419052

>>49419207
Ah, that makes much more sense

>>49419033
DEN is at the head of many degenerate infinite combos in Commander and fits in numbers builds they can defend the combo and/or straight up prevebt you from stopping it.

>>49418740
>>49418753
>>49419052
>>49419207
>>49419249

topkek

>>49416463
>Vintage all-star
>No Legacy play
>No relevant Modern play
>Former Standard staple

fixed that for you

>>49419452
>>49416463

I'm just shocked the prepubescent prick sees play in Vintage...

>>49419496
Vintage is weird.

>>49419496
New Tamiyo, Dack, Tezz 1.0, and even Narset are Vintage all-stars, and they don't see much play anywhere else.

Vintage is just really weird.

>>49419627
>new tamiyo
>narset
Not really.

>>49419627
Dack would be op if he were legal in modern.

>>49418389
GSZ should never come back, that card should actually stay banned.

Song actually NEEDS to come back, as the core reason why aggro is so dominant in the format is because combo is nearly nonexistent. Without combo to keep aggro in check, and aggro being the natural predator of control, aggro obviously becomes over-centralizing. Unbanning Song fixes this problem.

JtMS and Stoneforge should come back too, they wouldn't even be overpowered at all in the format.

>>49419691
Not really. Vintage is such an Artifact format that his -2 is always relevant and very powerful.

In Modern, his strongest effect is just his +1, which isn't really that amazing comparatively.

>>49419803
t. guy who has never seen anyone use Dack in Vintage

>>49419810
What deck in Modern do you think wants him?
He'd be "alright", but never overpowered in Modern.

>>49419846
I'm not talking about Modern, you were just going on about his -2, and I thought you should know that he's mostly used in Vintage to loot.

>>49419846
Thingascension would use him, and that's about it.

>>49404508
Wanna know how I know you never played Standard back then?

>>49419880
I supposed I phrased that poorly. I was saying his -2 is relevant in Vintage because it means that he's a more versatile card in Vintage. He's multiple modes.

In Modern he'd be pretty much exclusively a looter except against Affinity. Half the card is functionally blank compared to his usage in Vintage.

>>49419742
Combo nearly nonexistent? What?

>>49420382
Infect is the only relevant combo deck. Sorry CoCo and Valakut, you're midrange decks, and Ad Nauseum, you're not even relevant.

>>49420382
He's just salty that the only relevant control deck in the format revolves around a card that he traded his foil copies of for Arlinn Kords LOL

>>49420708
Storm is real.

File: images (1).jpg (10KB, 250x202px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 250x202px

>>49420815

>>49420708
Metagame breakdowns actually classify Dredge as a combo deck.

>>49420878
The Gargadon+Bridge build is combo, the Loam build is aggro.

>>49420925
>the Loam build is aggro

You're using Loam to build up to a giant Conflagrate. That's pretty combo-esque.

>>49420708
I thought everyone said modern is a more combo oriented format than legacy and that's why it needs Force of Will.

Two bans and now it isn't?

Why are people predicting a drake ban in pauper? I don't recall it being that dominant

>>49421003
>I thought everyone said modern is a more combo oriented format than legacy and that's why it needs Force of Will.

I don't think anyone intelligent has said that.

>>49419252
Not really. He can make infinite mana with other things, but that's about it.

>>49419742
People calling Modern way too aggro don't know what they're talking about.

Traditional Zoo has been for the most part replaced by the combo-oriented Death's Shadow variant, Burn has been declining, and even Affinity has been struggling due to the addition of not 1, not 2, but 3 new decks that it struggles against, i.e, Jeskai Nahiri, Dredge, and Eldrazi.

>>49421065
Most legacy players say that, since FoW is a bad counterspell unless what you are countering is otherwise unanswerable, since it two for ones you.

Admittedly, that's a different format completely, but I often am curious about that. High cmc stuff is less prevalent.

>>49421105
>Most legacy players say that

Say what exactly? Your follow-up doesn't seem to correspond to the notion that Modern is more combo-oriented than Legacy, so I am curious how you're reading that.

>>49421175
I meant the needing force part. And admittedly, this was several bans ago and calling control too weak.

Prediction: No ban, preordain unban.

>>49417652
>When the entire top 8 of a tournament are all running 32 JTMS, you know there's a problem.
It wasn't just that. 15 of the top 16 decks at that event ran 4 jace.

>>49421105
>FoW is a bad counterspell unless what you are countering is otherwise unanswerable

No...

It lets you tap out and still counter something. For all your opponent knows, you could have one in your hand at all time.

>>49421019
drake makes infinite mana with ghostly flicker and archeomancer, just like how cloud of faeries did. (and was banned for that same reason)
It's about a quarter of the field in front of delver and affinity.

>>49421240
Exactly, they're scared of the Jace unban because of the standard dominance. Of course a JTMS unban wouldn't be anywhere near as bad as... i dunno... say... Eldrazi winter, where the deck before the ban had 50% of the meta, but i understand why they're cautious.

>>49418301
>all that salty revisionism

>>49421250
It puts you down two cards to their one. In grindy matchups, you generally don't want to throw away multiple cards.

>>49421250
So what? Have you even read Force of Will? Imagine keeping a hand of 3 land, 2 Forces, and 2 blue cards against Jund. You have LOST.

>>49421801
>>49421479
It was asserted that FoW is "only good against otherwise unanswerable" spells. Not that FoW can be situationally bad. FoW can be and is sideboarded out against some decks.

FoW is good in a variety of situations.

FoW's main benefit/strength in Legacy is that it almost single-handedly keeps all the other turn 0-2 combo decks in check, and even then it sometimes isn't enough when ANS or Epic Storm get their god hands.

To have a legitimate control deck exist in Modern - lots of permission, removal/board sweepers, few win-cons (probably a couple PWers and Celestial Collonade) - it needs either strong, low CMC blue draw spells (which can't exist otherwise UR Storm becomes a thing again), stronger counterspells (if not literal Counterspell), or stronger win-cons. JTMS could potentially aid in that last one, letting control mages go UWx and rely on Collonade, JTMS and maybe 1-2 other things win them the game after they've spent the first 10-20 turns wasting the opponent's resources and refueling via Sphinx's Revelation to hit all their land drops.

>>49403919
You're retarded.
Jace is good in legacy because you've got FoW/Daze for protection, meaning you can afford to tap out on turn 4.

Jace is also played more or less exclusively in control, an archetype that is almost entirely worthless in modern. Protecting Jace is a lot harder and the quality of threats in modern is not especially worse than the quality of threats in Legacy.

tl;dr: Fuck off.

FoW is not a control card; it is an anti-combo card. Frankly it would do a lot to keep the fast decks down. I'd happily Force a T1 Goblin Guide, Ravager, or Glistener Elf.

>>49422171
>elf
Of course
>ravager
Sure
>guide
lol

>>49421250
>I don't play legacy
Thanks for clearing that to us

>>49422514
Why wouldn't you Force a Guide? By turn 4 it's gonna deal 8 damage.

>>49422525
Yeah, the fact that it (and Daze) don't force you to play draw-go has absolutely nothing to do with why it is played. My bad.

>>49422634
nigga just bolt it like just tap a mountain hahahaha

File: 14202724_10201740321227489_7772765620645599096_n.jpg (13KB, 500x281px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 500x281px

>>49422661
>Daze and FoW Force you to play Draw-Go
>Draw-Go
>Then delver is Draw-Go
>Shardless Bug is Draw-Go
>Reanimator is Draw-Go
>Show and Tell is Draw-Go

>>49422723
Nigga can you even read?

>>49422723
Read the post carefully.

>>49421862
>>49422661
Force allows you to interact on turn 1, so it's primarily good against fast decks. Meaning, it gives control a chance against aggro.format

Whoever said Jace is good in vintage is living in the past. Jace is a 1 of bomb, but Dack is where its at. Taimiyo is unplayable.

>>49423685
>Whoever said Jace is good in vintage is living in the past.

I believe they meant Vryn's Prodigy.

>>49423782
All Jaces are Vryn's Prodigy.

>>49423817
Don't you get cute with me.

>>49423843
:3c

>>49422137
>Jace is good in legacy because you've got FoW/Daze for protection
Nigga, what deck plays Jace and Daze?

Real talk, let's talk about unbanning Sensei's Divining Top for Modern. Their argument for its banning was that it made games go to time. I don't think that's an issue anymore when games tend to end on turn three. Most games don't even reach 40 minutes. And honestly, the problem was due to bad players not knowing how to use top, anyway.

>>49424011
Yeah, because Miracles is definitely what the format needs.

>>49424011
Time constraints were never the reason. It's not banned in Legacy and time isn't really an issue there. Sure sometimes there's Miracles v Miracles games where no one can do shit ever, but have you ever seen Ad Nauseam v Ad Nauseam?

>>49424025
A solid control deck is EXACTLY what the format needs.

>>49424041
UWR Nahiri already fills that role, it counters things, kills most your things and can actually finish a game after taking over.

>>49424025
No, you're right the format needs more hyper aggro. Countertop isn't even good in modern as the mana costs are more spread out. Terminus might be a problem, but without brainstorm in the format i doubt it'd be anywhere near as strong as it is in Legacy.

>>49424041
>Time constraints were never the reason.
Whatever the reason, I'm just saying let's give top a chance.

>>49424068
But UWR Nahiri is the ONLY viable control deck in the format, and that's the issue. Sorry RG Tron, you're Midrange as they come, and Blue Tron, you're not even close to relevant.

>>49425199
Control decks are mostly the same shit, the only thing that changes is the engine/wincon. Who knows, maybe Kaladesh block will give tools to memes like Thopter Sword and make them tier 1, but if you think that's going to make the format healthier you're delusional. The only option is to make alternative control decks a thing, but WotC will never do that cause those are uninteractive and boring, and if you think about it it's actually true.

>>49425605
Man, it's almost like Wizards gives aggro/midrange more n more options while giving nothing to Control in nuMagic.

>>49425605
>uninteractive and boring
Funny, you described Modern exactly.

The problem isn't control; or lack thereof, the issue with modern lies in that the decks that don't care what opponents are doing are more powerful than the decks that do care.
Infect, affinity, burn, these are all major players and none of them are fun to play against or to play. Eldrazi is just a slam big idiots deck, it doesn't really care. It only runs a few removal just to get by defence.
If wizards really wants modern to be anything but the current pile of uninteractive decks than they need to make spells that actually interact in ways that are interesting and not just a new Boros charm or coco.

>>49425792
>affinity
>none of them are fun to play against or to play.
>to play.
It's fun to be degenerate, anon.

>>49425792
Affinity is very fun to play. It's all about sequencing though, so if you're bad at sequencing I could see having a bad time of it.

That guy who lost the recent SCG Open made a couple glaring mistakes and it contributed noticeably to his death.

>>49425605
t. counter-hater
Control decks are the epitome of interaction. targeted discard/removal, counterspells. even taxes and land destruction are interaction and enable control. the problem is that since modern inception, all this has been nerfed AF, or literally stopped existing

File: Babby.jpg (53KB, 521x521px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 521x521px

Eh, the problem isn't that control isn't viable, is that there is no good hate cards for aggro

>>49426792
I'd have no problems if FoW and CO became legal.

Only if they printed cheap "can't be countered cards" with simple effects.

>>49425882
Affinity is the one linear aggro deck I don't get buttblasted losing too. I actually feel as if the pilot is actually thinking instead of going "lol bolt facex3" or "lol I pump my dude 5 times n kill you".

>>49427102
They printed cheap "on cast" cards just for you

>>49400572
how about them just complaining about having to interact.

It's like they enjoy the games just being two players masturbating and seeing how can orgasm first.

>>49425925
I claimed that alternative control decks, i.e. fringe playable decks like lantern, 8 rack or similar are boring and uninteractive. Classic control decks should be pushed a little but will never have that much variety, unless Wizards somehow print alternative to cards like snap, bolt, path, or other control staples. Only wincons change.

>>49431801
>Lantern, a deck designed to literally interact with your opponent's deck, isn't interactive

File: punishing fire.png (269KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

269KB, 312x445px

NO CHANGES NEEDED.

MAYBE UNBAN PUNISHING FIRE, if ANY changes are to be made that is, i mean, the current list is rather Balanced as it stands.

Punishing Fire would as its name implies, allow Life Gain decks to be Punished, and also it would prevent low toughness creatures from overruning the meta and reduce the impact of small guys like Snapcaster Mage, anything with 2 toughness or less would become very easy for the honorable decks like Jund to dispose of with capable strength. Jund are currently missing a tool like this to handle these small creatures which are otherwise running amok and totally out of control.

>>49432712
>Unban Punishing Fire
>Burnwillows hits Goyf levels of money
Wizards won't just fucking reprint shit though will they? The weight of a Magic card in 24c gold is worth around $80. Any card worth more than $80 is thus worth more than 24c gold. Wizards can literally print sheets and sheets of solid gold, but refuse to. I honestly cannot fathom it.

>>49399790
kill yourself

>>49400199
"If you want to play Braids, fuck you, and I hope your sleeves turn into acid while you're resolving a Blue Sun's Zentih." --Sheldon, probably

>>49421003
Modern is an infinitely more linear format. It is linear because it lacks
A) Interactive decks/cards of note
B) A combo bogeyman that can be faster than the random janky linear decks that can't interact with you

The presence of Belcher would be hilarious and might remove the retarded turn 4-centric linear meta

>>49434102
>Introduce Belcher to Modern
>T2 kills everywhere
>No one can do anything about it because there's no cheap interaction
Alternate spell costs aren't the enemy, Wizards.

If anybody knows where I can get legit Groves for $25 each lemme know. I don't want to pay more because they'll be reprinted in MM17

>>49435011
That's called waiting, you cheap faggot.

>>49434157
Thoughtseize the become inmense.
Also Wizards reprint daze and innocent blood you faggets

I expect no changes to the Modern ban list.

I would like to see Twin unbanned, cantrips unbanned, and Storm spells unbanned (that's the reason we're not allowed good cantrips).

But I won't see any of that.

Also just fucking build a sideboard to beat Infect people, jesus christ. You're as bad as the guys who whine and bitch about Dredge being unfair and refuse to include any graveyard hate.

>>49435128
>Storm spells unbanned

I meant Storm spells banned, obviously

File: 13521948_257860444581885_5136337800239081643_n.jpg (36KB, 693x349px) Image search: [Google]

36KB, 693x349px

>>49416060
>I just want to spam remand till I play some bomb
10.5/10

>>49432759
It loses value if there is more supply. They want it to be gold.

>>49435060
>just run black

>>49400572

It's non-interactive in the sense that the Twin player is free to play value city throughout the game. They don't *have* to play their copy of Splinter Twin to beat you, however the moment you slip up and don't leave up enough mana for your Twin answer, they just play it and combo off.

In short, the Twin player gets to play a regular game of Magic. If you try to play regular game Magic back, boom, Splinter Twin, you lose. And for a combo that only requires two cards that's way too much control to exert over your opponent's lines of play. That's why people consider it non-interactive.

>>49438101
Still sounds interactive to me

>>49399727
Sol Ring banned in Commander.
Everything else stays the same.

>>49432759
>https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/how-wizards-manages-its-savings-account
I believe this article is correct. And I feel what Wizards is doing is rational.

That being said, the opportunity cost to this model is people with a brain quitting your fucking game and refusing to pay another dime for your product when you decide to cash-out your Damnation account.

Possibly even sabotaging potential future players. I've told dozens of people and kids who were interested in Magic to stay the fuck away. Because the end-game of Magic is land bases of $20 for each card.

>>49440379
>Because the end-game of Magic is land bases of $20 for each card.

If only.

Announcing that "skirting" the reserve list was offlimits was a huge mistake.

>>49440571
The thing is, the "trust" is worth more than the possible Legacy/Vintage sales. On top of that FNM is hard enough to fire as is, the last thing you want is more formats cannibalizing your player base such that events are no longer large or fire. Modern, Standard, and Limited is the maximum number of formats a store wants to support. Anymore and it's too much effort and you risk low attendance at every event. It is fortunate that Commander players are smart enough to organize shit on their own if they want to play so that is a "free" market your store doesn't have to support.

It's ideal that your events have possibly 20+ players. That way, if a deck is dominant, you won't turn off players who are tired of playing against the same deck. This kills Magic communities more than you think. Imagine playing against Modern Eggs 3/4 rounds at FNM or Storm combo in Legacy or even Caw Blade - that can possibly happen if not enough people show up.

For the health of the game, all the formats hindered by the Reserve List need to die and be forgotten.

That being said, it does not forgive the sorry price state of Modern and Standard.

>>49441051
I don't think there is such a thing as "vintage sales". It is just a format for people to play cards they bought 20+ years ago.

I'm talking about stuff like reverberate or promo Phyrexian Dreadnought.

As for Modern, there's nothing healthy about it.

>>49441226
Oh, the whole Fork thing.

Yunno, if they continued to skirt the reserve list I don't think anything would be different. They reprint stuff at such a glacial rate that I really do wonder why people tolerate it. How long do you think it would have taken them to reprint functional ABU duals? I bet if they didn't clarify their stance of skirting the Reserve List, we would STILL not have Tundra 2.0 to this very day.

It's just the whole idea of waiting like 4+ years for them to reprint something so it becomes affordable is obscene. That's high school, that's journeyman trade, that's a college degree. Why the fuck would anybody wait that long just to pay an affordable price for ONE deck.

I can get a fucking kayak made in less time it takes Wizards to print Modern Masters from the announcement of the Modern format. I mean fucking think about that, you want to play Modern and you have to wait FOUR years until Wizards prints Modern Masters.

Kayak is sweet by the way. Cheaper than magic; and had more fun.

>>49441629
We probably wouldn't have Legendary Duals or whatever, but that clarification was a terrible idea because the reserve list was a mistake. Or rather, not removing almost everything off it when they revised it was a mistake. Should have just left power on it, because those are real collector's items.

Do you have any idea how many cool cards can't be reprinted because of that shit?

As for prices in general, its the huge demand. Magic cards didn't cost this much in 2000 when fewer people played. And there's a budget format. Its called Pauper, and I'd honestly rather play it then Modern. And I do.

File: 294424b88fcf7bd5020400b7610551e1.jpg (135KB, 733x1024px) Image search: [Google]

135KB, 733x1024px

Now that we've got Tamiyo back, how long until we get a new Vraska?

>>49441950
>Do you have any idea how many cool cards can't be reprinted because of that shit?
I do know. And I want to repeat my point is that even if they didn't clarify those cards would STILL not be printed in any volume today because they are purposely being slow motherfuckers with their reprinting.

Think about it, do you think that there would be a functional Gaea's Cradle today if they continued like they did with Fork. Or Tabernacle, Bazaar, Survival, Recurring Nightmare, or useless high-demand crap like Sliver Queen.

How many of those cards do you think would exist TODAY if they had not clarified. One. Maybe two. Out of dozens of desirables.

My point is it doesn't matter if they clarified or not, they still would fucking fuck the dog on speed. It will be 10 years until we see another reprint of the shock lands, by which point they'll probably be $30-$40 cards again. They've gone through Modern Masters 1, 2, and Eternal Masters and still ruined the sets by upping the price and limiting the supply. They would do the same with functional reprints.

Wasteland is now $40. And people are cheering. Well fuck them, that was what the price of the card was before there was a run on every goddamn Legacy staple. Force of Will is now MORE than what it was before the reprint.

Just because they can doesn't mean they will. They've proven that they won't time and time again.

>>49440349
lol

>>49442133
RTRTR

how likely is it that they will ban kitchen finx

>>49445908
No.

>>49442133
Soon, they mentioned her in the kaladesh story arc

>>49442218
There's one core issue with MTG: scalpers are highly respected, and WoTC loves it.

>>49446229
Ugh.

Here's hoping she won't be unplayable garbage like NewHiri

>>49405387
>Blazing Shoal
It could be unbanned today and wouldn't be as good as regular infect.
>muh turn 3 3 card combo kills
Literally glistener elf->double pump spell kills just as fast and is way way more consistent.

>>49412064
I don't understand what would get broken if you ban desciple and plating. You scared of KCI or atog?

>>49446290
Blazing isn't banned _just_ for infect. A blazing Progenitis deck could spring up on its own.
>Turn 1 kor Duelist
>turn 2 equip it with whatever
>then cast blazing shoal discarding Progen
>Win if they can't interrupt

>>49446318
Blue Infect would be strictly better.

>>49417195
People have done several modern no ban list tournies. A lot of what you said was bullshit.
Storm is not very good in the format, and hypergensis just outright is unplayable, delver is good, but weak to decks with chalice and stoneforge mystic control, it's the closest thing to a broken deck unless someone comes up with a great eldrazi list. Elves and Affinity are real contenders as is some form of Eldrazi.
>Chrome Mox goes into literally every deck as free land drop in exchange for a card
I don't think it is that good, but I agree it would be the format's brainstorm. It is basically the best card for control on the banlist. The format needs more fast mana or it needs less card advantage and insane threats, chrome mox is the only card that actually slot into controllish decks and as a plus encourages control decks aside from that.
GSZ isn't really risky but this is a format that banned birthing pod so idk.

>>49446310
KCI and 'Tog are garbage, but people would certainly brew. However, I feel that the Affinity with ArtiLands would be busted even without Plating/DoTV. Plating could easily be replaced with Ensoul Artifact, which becomes much more reliable thanks to Seat of the Synod, DoTV is only broken with the lands anyway so no changes to current Affinity there, and you also get other cards that become alot better thanks to the lands, including Thoughtcast, Frogmite, Ethersworn Canonist, and Tezzeret Agent of Bolas.

>>49446416
If people were playing with the lands then they are taking out other good lands to do it, what are you removing glimmervoid? Inkmoth/blinkmoth? the only land that would come out easily is darksteel, which would make casting colored spells slightly easier. Frogmite is not importent without either equipment or something similar and thoughtcast could already be played. Tezzeret would not start seeing play because of artifact lands, it's not the reason he currently doesn't.

>>49446416
Hate to break it to you, but losing DoTV and Plating is huge.

DoTV is the whole reason why the lands were broken to begin with, Plating banned is a huge loss for Affinity in its current form.

Literally all that would realistically happen with ArtiLands in the format is people would replace their Darksteels with Furnaces to make their Galvanics easier to cast.

>>49446277
>Unplayable
>Nahiri

Lolwut

>>49441051
Modern and Standard aren't even worth playing for how shitty formats they are though.

The "health" of the game is irrelevant if the healthy version is a vegetative quad-amputee drowning in its own spittle and dying, were it not for your intervention

>>49446590
Standard was good before WoTC decided to start printing Mythic Rares that every deck needed (mythics started in Shards of Alara, but iirc, it was Worldwalke where they really started becoming a problem).

Modern was good back when it was called Extended, and Chrome Mox/Jitte/Storm were all legal.

Modern Bann: Become immense, Prized Amalgam, Cranial Plating

>>49446779
>Just make Jund even better xD

Sorry sir it looks like you forgot to add that you think Bloodbraid Elf should be unbanned and that it's actually not as good as everyone thinks it is :^)

>>49446807
>DRS should be unbanned, it's just a fair honest creature

>>49446516
Furnace would replace Citadel, Seat would replace Glimmervoid. The deck would start running Thoughtcast.

>people are fine with a deck playing Power against them

Mox Opal is getting banned one day or another.

>but you need metalcraft !
Not exactly hard in this deck. There's a reason Etched Champion sees play.

>it's Legendary, you can only have one at a time !
Mox Sapphire has the same restriction in Vintage : you can only have one on the battlefield at a time, because your deck only runs one. Mox Opal also provides 4 extra colors.

>it sucks in multiples !
Many enablers suck in multiples, you only need one.

>just ban Plating/Ravager !
That's like banning Hypnotic Scepter in a UB Aggro deck because the deck is too strong and consistent, while the deck runs Ancestral Recall.

>>49449075
Opal in Affinity is nowhere near as good as Mox in Vintage. Please don't ever imply it is ever again.