/btg/ Battletech General: Unseen Edition

Which assaults would you give to a MoC lance?

>>49386039
Stalker, striker, banshee. Possibly a cyclops or leftover Awesome or Atlas Maybe a Thug if I'm doing the 'SL salvage to make the periphery more interesting than all unseen all the time' thing

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>>49386039

Well, your choices are pretty limited in 3025, which is the main time period in which it's a problem.

>Atlas -D or -RS:
Leftover Star League Mechs, RS's are D's converted over to the new standard. Can't be too many, being leftovers.

>Banshee -3M or -3MC
Again with the leftovers.

>Highlander -733, Thug -10E, Striker -2C
All SL leftovers given to the Inner Sphere/Periphery General category when they limited access to the Unseens. How production values work for them, I don't know.

>Longbow -7Q
Made in the Terran Hegemony only, another leftover from the SLDF occupation.

>Charger -1A1
Only variant of the Charger they get MUL access to; must be an SLDF leftover by definition. Given how terrible they are, I can't imagine many survived.

>Battlemaster -1G, Stalker -4N and -3F
Finally, some reasonably in-production Mechs that the MoC can actually get their hands on. Not that they manufacture them, but they can at least theoretically import the things. (Note: there is no IntroTech Cyclops available to the MoC!)

In 3025, the MoC has 10 Regiments, 2 Battalions of troops (Periph 1e). Sphere-wide, the proportion of Assault Mechs, IIRC, is roughly 10% of the total number of Mechs available. MoC forces are notably light, but lets assume for the sake of argument this proportion holds true (it's more likely about 5% for the MoC). The MoC has - at most - 1,152 Mechs available to it, assuming all of the listed units are at full strength (again, unlikely). At roughly 10% of the total, we should assume about 115-120 Assault Mechs available to the MoC. At an even distribution, that's 10 examples of each of the 12 available Assault Mech designs.

What's far more likely is that there's 2-6 of every design that isn't a Beemer or Stalker. AT MOST, assuming a lance of each of the other designs, there's 36 total "everything else", and about 30 each of Beemers both kinds of Stalker.

So smart money's on the Beemer or Stalker as an "iconic" design for the MoC.

>>49386171
>Note: there is no IntroTech Cyclops available to the MoC!
That seems a bit odd to me, but then, the MUL is kinda an odd thing. I'd at least give them the base cyclops.

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Hey /btg/ I was kind of thinking of a BT equipment system that would have been nice to see, if only as prototype gear. I saw the "Gyroscopic Stabilizers" from aToW as add-ons for ballistic firearms that have the Burst trait, and thought it'd be a neat idea to upscale them for Tactical Scale.

The image in my head would be an extra ton and take an extra crit - but that might need balancing. Maybe a size/tonnage based on weapon tonnage, or far more likely, max damage output.

I want it to act similarly to having Artemis IV, but only adding +1 to the cluster table for rapid fire weapons instead of artemis' +2.

My reasoning is to make the Ultra ACs more appealing. The 2's cluster column is pretty brutal, and you're missing with a shot more often than not. This would bump up the cost in C-bills, weight, BV, and crits, but would also make plain jane UAC 5s a far more appealing choice, and the UAC 20 just that much more scary. They'd work with RACs just as well, but the +1 on the clusters table would hardly be as big of a game changer when you're already spitting out up to six shots.

>>49386171
1% assaults is far more likely given how utterly rare they are in the periphery, especially then, and combined with the MAF's incredibly light nature. Frankly 5-10% would be generous for the TDF which has far superior access to military-industry and ability to maintain such old vehicles.

>>49387367

Fuck off, Deadborder.

>>49387367
1% seems a bit too low to me, even if the MAF prefers more mobile units. I mean, they'd at least end up with Chargers, wouldn't they?

...but on the other hand, when on average, only about 10% of mechs in the inner sphere were in the assault class, it'd be safe to assume the numbers are a bit lower in the periphery - where maintaining them would be just that much harder.

...but 1% is really pushing those numbers way down. I'd assume 3-5%, myself.

As for the Taurians? I think you'd be right about the Assault rate, but they've still got some heavy mech production going on there, Tbolts, Mads, and Whammers, plus even Hatchetmans, though you've got me how they'd managed to build Buckaroo Banzai's latest toy in the Succession Wars periphery. I think they'd have a bigger heavy-mech proportion than average, as a result.

>>49388146

>though you've got me how they'd managed to build Buckaroo Banzai's latest toy in the Succession Wars periphery.

They changed that to make more sense. The ones mentioned in the original TR: 3025 were with Little Richard's Panzer Brigade when they left the Lyran Commonwealth. The Taurians did later build a factory for the intro-tech version of the Hatchetman in like the 3050s or something but the Roughriders blew that up.

Likewise the TC never built the Rommel/Patton, only imported it after Katrina Steiner-Davion took over the Lyran Alliance.

>>49387778
Who?

>>49388146
1% might seem a tad low, yes, but the MoC literally has had shit for industry for centuries while also dealing with attrition and a lack of sources for assaults in that era. 3% would be generous, and that would include half-working mechs minus some weapons and actuators.

Critting an ICE engine and watching it go up in flames would be great fun. I imagine it would be like watching a diesel locomotive engine go runaway and then light up the fuel tank.

>>49388146
>I think they'd have a bigger heavy-mech proportion than average, as a result
I suspect their weight distribution would look a bit like kurita's; lots of bugs and thuds, not as many mediums, since they don't build any but the griffin till later on

>>49390322
Let's add machine gun ammo with it
In fact, what's the explodiest you could equip a mech/vehicle with?

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>>49389269

Whether it's 1% or 10%, it doesn't change NEA's point that there ISN'T a good iconic MOC assault mech. The faction doesn't have enough assaults to have one in the first place, whether there's 120 assaults or 12 assaults.

With that said, if they really do only have 1% assault mechs, that means there really are only 12 assaults in the whole faction. Since there's 12 available assault mechs, that means there's only 1 of each of them at most, and the MUL doesn't count mechs that are unique in a faction. So by definition, there must be more than 12 assault mechs, and the percentage must be more than 1%. So you're still objectively wrong.

>5% is low enough that everything works and the MOC is still blatantly a lightweight force. Stop trying to shit on them more than they already are.

>>49390962
Long Tom and machine gun ammunition?

Make a big ol' mushroom cloud out of your mech.

>>49390962
>>49391062
MG ammo really shouldn't do as much damage as it does. Maybe 1/4th only because the heat from the fire is contained in the bin inside the mech.

https://youtu.be/3SlOXowwC4c You can hear an occasional large bang from what I'm guessing is some .40in+ rifle round but you can stand within a few meters of it in turnout gear and not have an issue.

Propellant from a main gun burning off in a tank will cook everything inside in seconds and if equipped with an autoloader carousel in the turret can blow itself clean off.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1VWPOpYbQI

You could empty out a ton of MG ammo and just fill the inside of a T72 with gunpowder and I don't think you could get the same result.

>>49388296
>Likewise the TC never built the Rommel/Patton, only imported it after Katrina Steiner-Davion took over the Lyran Alliance.
I think they knocked it off some time in the 60s or 70s, IIRC. The OA and MoC also did so around that era, again IIRC

>>49390962
Battledroids MG ammo. 1000 rounds a ton with the same damage potential. So imagine a BFFL Drone Bomb with that. 20000 damage at ground zero.

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>>49391300

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>>49391300
STANDING

>>49391300
[EXPLODING PURPLE BURD NOISES]

>>49391271

Not according to HB: MPS or Objectives: Periphery.

>>49391419
huh, coulda sworn it was in objectives:periphery. I'm probably just being confused by RATs and inaccurate statements on the OF again

>>49391300
Witness me!

>>49391402
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y9jLgqFpik

>>49391452
>confused by RATs
Didn't get the memo that there's been a 180 and they're now supposed to be 0% representative of what a faction has?

>>49391569

They're a suggestion and not a definitive source. The only definitive source for what a faction has access to is the MUL.

>>49391655
Different anon here, but you know, I've always wondered how exactly it is decided what goes on a given faction's MUL and what doesn't

>>49390962
I blew up a vehicle (an autocannon carrier of some sort, don't remember which and don't have the screencap handy) up with a 1-point LRM TAC for 1085 damage. Haven't had a bigger number in all the bloody years I've played BT, either on tabletop or in Megamek.

>>49391655

>They're a suggestion and not a definitive source


I've wondered that myself.

In 3145 alone I've read of factions using things that should no longer be in their military according to the tables.

I'm not sure if that means they stopped using it or if they only put a sample of what the faction would have access to for the sake of not having to use anything over a D20.

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>>49390962
Found it.

>>49391878

Some of it is just editorial-level derping like not including newer designs from that era's TRs because of the order things were written in.

Some are pure fucktardedness, like how the Legions of Vega in the 50s and 60s can't generate No-Dachis despite being the primary users.

Then there's problems of balance between factions. If a Drac, Capellan, or FWL player is rolling on their A-grade table there's a reasonable degree of similarity overall with tech and design quality, but the A-grade table for those factions is roughly as good as the D and F grade tables for the Suns or the B/C-grade tables for the Lyrans. So good luck with that.

>>49391936

>Some are pure fucktardedness, like how the Legions of Vega in the 50s and 60s can't generate No-Dachis despite being the primary users.

Odd.

I disintinctly recall there being one of those in the Dark Age novels.

It was used by the Combine commander Katana Stromark was fighting.

>>49391936

>Then there's problems of balance between factions.

For the original FMs and FM:U, any way. Xotl's stuff for 3085+ is a lot more reasonable.

And since I forgot, some of it is limited slots on what is usually a 2D6 table. Some RATs are obviously weighted to produce a force that looks like what a faction of that period is supposed to be using in terms of statistical likelihood of generating particular designs, other tables appear to throw that out the window in favour of generating forces that are statistically likely to be better than anyone else's.

>>49391936
Even beyond faction balance, sometimes RATs are internally fuckey; take FMMR as an example; the B-rated assault RAT is pretty much 100% better than the A RAT, and the same thing is true, albeit less so for the heavy mechs

>>49392156
>I disintinctly recall there being one of those in the Dark Age novels.
>It was used by the Combine commander Katana Stromark was fighting.

That was the actual Warlord of Benjamin. He could have driven anything he wanted.

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So what happened with this thing?

>>49392868
The guy who was going to make it stopped making minis.

>>49392868
>tfw MechEngineer quest will never be finished
>tfw never see the fruition of the Phobos

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on the topic of MoC assaults, stalkers and iconic variants, here's a periphery general stalker variant that I've had sitting around for a while.

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>>49392868
Nscaler had this all modeled, printed, and ready to cast. Then he shelved it temporarily to work on my Salamander mech, which went terribly, sunk his reputation and motivation. He also went through some tough times, losing his previous job and getting sick.
I'll take some of the blame for ruining minis as a hobby for him.

>>49390989
Wipe the sand out of your vagina, babe. I wasn't debating the "iconic" mech point in any case. I'm not objectively wrong about shit, so get build a bridge and get over it; periphery states were shit in 3025. Deal with it.

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>>49394181

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>>49394181
>>49394181
>periphery states were shit in 3025.

>>49394240
>>49394321
>samefagging image macros and ignoring points of discussion

I forgot I was on /btg/, my bad

Let's meme about what faction is most evil and why Clantech sucks. That'll be more ebin, right?

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>>49394369
>faction shitposting
>points of discussion

How about we fuck off with the trolling and do a design challenge?
Let's do something different this time.
We've done plenty "design mechs for mercs" challenges before, so how about we design some non-mech (tanks, BA, ASF, DropShips, JumpShips, Warships, small craft, conventional infantry platoons, whatever) units meant for the mercs market?

>>49386171
this pic makes me sad

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How about SecurityMechs, following all treaty restrictions? Roll 1d6 to see your weight class:
1 - Light (10-15 tons)
2,3 - Medium (20-25 tons)
4,5 - Heavy (30-35 tons)
6 - Corporate security (10-50 tons)

Treaty Restrictions: No ranged weapons over 2 tons*, no energy flamers, A/B/M-Pods, VSPLs, or Rocket Launchers.

*The Battlemech Taser is allowed despite being heavier. Corporate SecurityMechs may have weapons up to 9 tons in weight.

>>49392868
That looks cool.

>>49395489
My favorite mechs for riot duty were always the bugs. A Stinger with a bin of rubber rounds is tops for the job plus has the ML for heavy duty work. A wasp with tear gas rounds loaded is a good partner too.

>>49395489
And before people forget: These are Industrialmechs with weapons. Not Battlemech chassis. Design appropriately.

>>49395489
>mfw almost all securitymech ideas I've ever had violate these rules in one way or another

>>49394044
What did it look like?

>>49396105
He posted it. It was just based on the later version concept art instead of the original.

So, putting together my first lance. No one I play with minds which tech era we play in, nor cares about battle values.

I'm thinking of fielding 2 Crabs (CRB-45) and 2 King Crabs (KCG-08). I also thought about putting a Scorpion of some sort in there but was having a hard time deciding. I like SCP-12C but the NARC missing beacon would be worthless.

>>49396179

The Scorpion has iNARC which can fire other pods, like Nemesis, Haywire, or Explosive. That said it's a pretty shit investment of mass.

I'd have a look at getting a hold of something like the Preta A to serve as the spotter for the rest of your unit. I don't think the other designs you've chosen are really good either but I guess you're doing a themed unit.

>>49394856
Too meta

Two questions about the Lyrans:

What all new mechs are designed or produced by them in the 3rd War to Clan invasion era? I can think of the Hatchetman, Wolfhound and Devastator.

And of their indigenous designs between 3050 and 3067, which would /btg/ say are best and which are worst?

Working on a force for them.

>>49396515
Devastator is a Feddie protoype and not produced in quantity until the DVS-2 in 3049. Just like Hatchetman is a Team Banzai machine. Better to just put your mind to calling it all Fedcom than trying to weasel out Lyran specific.

But Fedcom-wise, you got the best of everything into 3067. Devastators, Nightstars, Thunderhawks, Berzerkers, Marauder II's, their homegrown omni program, their Phoenix upgrades. You got a LOT to work with.

Just thumb through TRO:3055, 3058, 3060, 3067 to get an idea for all the toys that you can have fun with.

>>49391236
a couple years ago there was a gun store + indoor shooting range near me that got burned down by some genius cops doing mag dumps with tracer rounds into the rubber backstop. tons of pistol and rifle ammo went up with it; sounded like somebody cooking up all the popcorn in the world for like three hours.

>>49396625

Devastator's original production site is in the Lyran Commonwealth. It's kinda surprising how many Feddie fans don't know they got a production site for it (and the Penetrator and the Falconer) in HB: HD.

It's probably more iconic for the Suns than the Lyrans but the Lyrans during the FedCom merger would have plenty.

>>49396515

3rd War to Clan Invasion is pretty sparse for everyone. Hatchetman and Wolfhound are the big two. The Banshee-S redesign was pretty extensive but it is still a variant on an existing machine rather than a full rebuild.

Of the designs they get after the 3050s, the best ones are things like the Dart, Spector, Starslayer, Nightsky, Uziel (PPC variant, any way), Verfolger, Dragon Fire, Penetrator Falconer, Nightstar, Thunder Hawk, Devastator and Fafnir. I generally prefer the standard GR Fafnir to the HGR/iHGR one too.

Worst I'd say are ones like the Fireball, Enfield, or Stiletto which are just shit at the role they're intended for and work poorly any way. The Enfield gets my nod for most unnecessary new design ever, just make a goddamn Enforcer variant if you're that worked up about its flaws.

>>49394369
>>49394369
Derp Age xD

>>49397489
The fireball is an excellent vehicle killer. Load it with infernos or tandems and swap the MG to rapid then go nuts. I forget what it was used for though. If it had anything to do with infantry then it was fucked.

>>49397837
I just realized I fucked up and was thinking of the custom variant my GM loved instead of the one using Streaks. Wow, other than the variants that are like extra speedy ground Spiders, it does really suck.

>>49397883
>the custom variant my GM loved
post it

>>49397987
It's nothing special, just a Class A refit. Swap the streak for a vanilla SRM4 and reduce the MG to half a bin.

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>>49397883
IIRC it was designed to be a dedicated Elemental hunter/killer, which it failed miserably at.

>>49398550

This.

You used to be able to load Infernoes in the Streak, but it was before Infernoes popped BA so that was pointless. Don't think you could even target BA with Infernoes back then any way.

But between that and the MG, you had to close within SRM-2 and/or Small Laser range against Elementals to kill them. It was a pure hurr durr design.

>>49398550
When Infantry/BA completely ignore TMM, that kind of happens with any sort of light you send after them.

>>49398550
Somebody should make an edit of "roll on the ground, try not to cry, cry a lot" for getting swarmed by elementals.

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>an elemental will never facefuck your cockpit with a battle claw, killing you instantly

Why live?

>>49398667
Honestly, I don't know.

>>49398667
>Why live
To remove kebab

>>49398592
They ignore the AMM, their OWN movement mod, not the TMM, the TARGET's movement mod.

>>49398643

Anyone who gets Swarmed deserves it.

You have to close to their Jump MP range (3 hexes, usually) then fail to brush them off in your physical phase, then fail to jump or flail the following turn.

The amount of BA I've killed by jumping into water when they try to Swarm must number in the hundreds by now.

Just do Leg attacks, Swarm attempts are pointless.

>>49398832
When playing with BA, the only time I attempt a swarm is when the enemy is knocked out or shut down from heat. But it is brutal when you pull it off.

>>49386225
I kind of agree; the Cyclops is supposed to be evenly distributed like the Stalker, but just much much more rare. They would only have 2-3 at most, at any rate.

>>49395489
Man, I gotta make a bunch of 'Mechs under these rules and run a campaign around 'em. Fuckin' Patlabor: Battletech Edition.

>>49398889
That one scene of them stopping a drunk guy in a construction mech, Movie 1 I think it was?, was one of the best security mech moments I can remember.

>>49398643
I think one of the BT novels actually had the line "stop, drop and roll" as the mnemonic for stopping Elementals and other infantry swarming you.

So, the Kuritan's DEST are also capable of piloting a Battlemech
How would a DEST Lance look?

>>49400800
They can also pilot Aeros and wear Battle Armor. They're some of the only top shelf boys in the old days who got LAM's. There were even DEST dudes flying them far into the 3050's and using them to fight space chickens.

>>49400800

>How would a DEST lance look?

Same as any other Drac lance. 100% Panther or 100% Dragon are both highly likely.

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>>49400800
>How would a DEST Lance look?

The only way to know this would be if somebody actually saw a DEST lance and lived to tell about it.

>>49398679
Awful /pol/ meme

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>>49386171

This is a good breakdown, and since the thread went to shit immediately afterwards, I wanted to say thanks. I didn't realize the choices of MOC equipment was quite so dire prior to the Trinity alliance, since I've never looked hard at 3025 MOC before.

According to the MUL, they have a total of 40 Mech designs available to them as of 3025, and several of those are fluffed to be either completely or functionally obsolete (Icarus II, Koschei, how the fuck do they have two different Fleas when that's a Dragoon Mech in 3025, and how the actual fuck do they have Wolfhounds?)

Realistically, the only things they'd have in any significant numbers would be Hornet -151s, Javelins, and UrbanMechs for lights, plus the Stingers they make, but don't show up on the MUL. Mediums are better: Assassin, Clint, Hermes II, Vulcan, Whitworth, Vindicator, Trebuchet, and the Shadow Hawk they make but doesn't show up on the MUL. Heavies are Quickdraw, Catapult, Grasshopper, and Marauder. And then the assaults are basically just the Battlemaster and two kinds of Stalkers.

That's pretty rough, even for a Periphery realm. I suppose the resident Periphery-hater would be OK with them not having Mechs at all, but given how light the MOC forces are supposed to be, I don't see how you can reasonably play a game with a company composed of 6 Stingers, two Vulcans, two Vindicators, 1 Shadow Hawk and 1 Marauder against...well, any company-sized group from any other faction in the game. I'm actually less upset about the Trinity Alliance now, given that it corrects a pretty ludicrous imbalance. Mind you, it still does it far too quickly and isn't justified in the fluff at all (why would Sun-Tzu bother if the MOC sucked this badly?), but in terms of making a GAME actually function, I can see where the writers were coming from. Every faction should be reasonably playable, and the MOC wasn't.

>>49400800
"Anything they want/need" would be a good guess. If they're fighting openly (say dropping a team behind Clan lines), the best Teddy K can provide; if they're going in clandestinely, whatever's appropriate for the job (FWL 'Mechs for a black op in the LC/FWL border, iconic Davion stuff for shit in the Draconis March, etc.)

And that's just the giant robots, at least some of them are trained to fly ASFs, dropships and probably jumpships as well, besides the mandatory courses in applying fist and katana to face.

>>49400800
>How would a DEST Lance look?

Canonically, one-quarter LAMs.

Source: Far Country.

>>49401514
>I didn't realize the choices of MOC equipment was quite so dire prior to the Trinity alliance
Have you literally never read about the Periphery?

>>49401533
>Have you literally never read about the Periphery?
Or even the parts of the Inner Sphere that butt up against the Periphery like the Outback or Pesht Military District.

>>49401533

I would have thought they at least had reasonable access to the original Unseens, for one. Because as of BT 2e, everybody did. Some factions had MORE of them than others, but basically everyone had access to a fair number of each of them.

That was the last time I paid meaningful attention to the Periphery powers, because they didn't interest me. So yes, realizing that they have <reasonable> access to between only 2-6 designs in each weight class is a surprise, when everyone else - even the other Periphery powers - have access to a much wider variety AND better designs to boot.

>>49401551
Exactly.

>>49401572
But what is reasonable to you? The 3025 era was the age of Mad Max and supply issues for the states with massive military-industrial complexes. The Periphery powers are obviously going to be in an even more dire situation. Not trying to be mean man but come on it's laid out pretty darn clear in the fluff. Even in 3064 stuff like assaults are rare.

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>MoC Unit in AtB, 3160 and FM: 3145 tables just for the hell of it and to get used to new tech
>Fighting shittons of FWL, Pirates, and Andurians. Surprisingly, the Marians aren't even listed in the AtB contracts tables for the Canopians, so I miss out on my chances of duking it out with RL-apalooza.
>Kind of bored of fighting FWL forever. Decide to go merc, and take this party into the CC/FS border.
>First contract, against WoB? Alright sure, maybe it's rooting out some old holdout.
>RAPERAPERAPERAPERAPE when twice my weight, almost 100% mechs, and everything is top-shelf gear in spite of a "D" rating.
>Oh fuck. alright. Lets get an anti-Davion contract going and.
>CLANTECH, CLANTECH EVERYWHERE.
>ALSO PULSE LASERS and Gunnery 3

I have been spoiled in fighting the FWL. I need to salvage the FS' munchkin toys.

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>>49401572
Basically, there was a reason why the IS never really perceives the periphery as a real threat. There is the issue of pirate incursions from the periphery, but even the crappiest regiments would be sent out there and kick their shit right in, and that was with 3rd succession war stuff when even IS powers had difficulty keeping their shit in one piece.

For the Periphery, pirate incursions were a very real threat, especially when the few mechs you have are probably bug mechs and maybe a company of Scorpion tanks.

The Taurians were the one, most unusually well equipped faction - mostly because they were more spooked by the perceived Davion "Gold menace" than pirates. Most periphery states didn't even have the ability to produce mechs.

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>>49401614
>The 3025 era was the age of Mad Max and supply issues for the states with massive military-industrial complexes

I have already brought it up here a few times, but one thing that I think that we saw in a lot of the old novels - especially in the GDL series, was that - at least I felt - there should have been a fuckton more bug mechs floating around. I always found that even in 3025, if you ever gave players a choice, the first thing they would do is gravitate towards anything 55 tons and above, which doesn't really lend well to the sort of awe-inspiring feel that they talk about mechs with in the novels.

Like the Shad. You see an old 3025 model and just about anyone scoffs, but the books made it out to be some godly beast.

I find that you can make the games much more interesting if you either force each team to take at least 50% bug mechs, or if you're using RATs, make each mech that you roll for have a 50% chance of being a bug mech, before rolling on the RAT (Which could potentially give you a bug mech, as well)

I haven't tried it with another player yet, but it has actually made for some really unique-feeling matches in Megamek against princess. When a Commando seems beefy, you know that it's going to be an interesting game.

>>49402406
I've played late-3rd war campaigns in deepest darkest Madmaxtech of the 2990's and let me tell you, nobody considers anything shit because a large chunk of the stuff you are fighting are bugs. When you see an assault, even if it's a Charger, you sit up and take notice.

Even a vanilla Shad can reach out and touch you at LRM and AC5 range which way outclasses the guns on standard bugs.

Honestly makes the Kuritans look a whole lot more intimidating with all their panthers too. You feel like hot shit with a lance of low end mediums when suddenly you're staring down a panther lance that has more firepower than an awesome.

The Xotl RAT's take this sort of stuff into account. Lotta bugs and lights.

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>Some of my favorite Light mech are the Firebee and the Toro
>They're basically extinct

I know there's better options, but I liked those fellas

>>49402406
>gravitate towards anything 55 tons and above

On the other hand, the first Merc handbook has percentages of light, medium, etc. 'Mech distribution, and heavies are surprisingly common (I think it said that the heavies form the backbone of all armies). Then again, it's not that surprising, considering that heavies can take up more punishment whilst the bugs in particular are vulnerable to pointy sticks.

>>49402618
I managed to salvage one, it's pretty damn capable for such a light mech but could use a little more speed.

>>49402694
Well franken some speed in there, duh.

>>49402609
>Even a vanilla Shad can reach out and touch you at LRM and AC5 range which way outclasses the guns on standard bugs.
Yeah, it makes a lot of sense that the fluff specifically mentions them even being put in recon lances due to their versatility. 2Hs are great bullies.

>>49402618
>Toro
Swap an LRM 5 into a Panther.
>Firebee
Drive a Pixie instead

>>49402635
You're thinking mediums. They outnumber everything. Heavies are less common than anything but assaults.

Tangentially related but I was just browsing the 9.1 tables for fun and I had no idea that the DA force levels were literally half the the 3rd War ones. Well, except the Capellans, who seemed to have grown their forces to the size of the old FWL while everyone else rebuilt jack and shit after the Jihad.

So, is the Strider the way to go for a medium fast ECM boat?

>>49402635
Reminder that the Archer had a production total of one hundred thousand units before the Succession Wars. Others probably had a good 10 to 15 thousand, since the maligned Banshee had 5k produced.

>>49403069
The Wasp had half a million. But you know
>bugs
>surviving

It tickled me pink that even in the 3rd War when mechs were so rare, that if you piloted a state bug for twenty years without wrecking it, most would give it to when you retired, since they basically wrote it off as way over the expected lifespan anyway.

>>49403064

I don't know, how important to you is mediocre speed and SHS? If those are vital considerations for you then knock yourself out.

>>49403005

Canonically, the Bugs are the most common. The Wasp is like the Vedette of 'Mechs and is followed by the Stinger and Locust. Even in late-era play like the 3060s.

Nobody does this in novels, sourcebooks, or tabletop games because adherence to that distribution makes things deathly boring though so you wind up with the impression that despite what the TRs say, Mediums and Heavies are more common than everything else put together.

>>49403064
None of its canon configurations mount ECM, and its pod space is terrible. So no. What year and era are you looking for? There are better designs out there.

>>49403101
Well I'd probably say 300k and the remaining 200k go to the Stinger, but only because 3025 doesn't give a total production run for the Wasp, but does for the Stinger.

>>49402768
>Pixie
Can't find it on Sarna. Do you mean a Phoenix hawk?

>>49403510
PHX-1 specifically is the Pixie

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>>49398889
>Fuckin' Patlabor: Battletech Edition.

Where have you been?

>>49396179
She just really likes the crab and king crab designes, and theni showed her the WoB variants with the iC3 and how that works. I'm trying to figure out which would be better price and quality wise, the slav mwo mechs or iwm mechs?

>>49405032
Slav are resin, IWM are white metal. Sculpt quality is higher on the MWO designs, while... I can't really recommend the IWM units except for stuff MWO doesn't have.

>>49405160
$10 per mech is bready gud but how much is the shipping to 'merica?

>>49405032
IWM sculpts are dogshit that hasn't been updated since the 80s. Use russian resin for OG mechs.

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What should I order to round out my strike wing? The Eagle mounts one LPL and a bunch of MPLs for the -2 to hit bonus, the Slayer has an AC10 and some medium lasers.

The corsair was some trouble to fit out, I originally went with an RAC/5 among other things but jamming cost the main part of its armament. Now it loads two MRM-20 racks, 8 MGs (can't figure out how to make them rapid fire from a fighter yet but they're great for critical peppering) and I was going to use the last ton for 5 bomb racks but the meklab thinks the weight is 0.2000003~ tons so I can't fit a fifth on there.

>>49405378
I think it was like 10 dollars for 10 mechs. It took two weeks to get here though.

>>49403153
Can you change heat sinks on an omni or are those fixed like armour?

>>49406209
You can add more, but you can't change the Heat Sink type on an Omni.

>>49406209

Engine heat sinks and heat sinks purchased with non-pod tonnage are fixed. Others are moveable.

Do note that you cannot mix heat sink TYPES, though. If the engine ones are DHS, then all the ones you buy with pod space must be DHS.

>>49406278
Well, not entirely. But DHS-P are likely beyond the scope of anyone's ruleset, unless you want people throwing things at you.

>>49406298
>not sticking DHS-P on your Strider so you can use Heavy Lasers

>>49401514
Wow, it looks like literally everything they make isn't on the MUL.
Should probably mention that on the OF so they maybe fix that

>>49406809
>>49401514
Try including Periphery General in the filter.

>>49406809

Well, they only make Stingers and Shadow Hawks, so it's not like including their production capacity would matter much.

The Piranha Principle doesn't work for the MOC. The idea is that nobody can devote the troops necessary to go kill a periphery power because they'll get swarmed by the competition. But honestly, given what the MOC has available, two medium-heavy FWL regiments could take out the entire faction.

The meme of "MOC shouldn't exist at all" aside, given what they have access to, the faction's survival through the succession wars really doesn't make sense. They're just too weak to survive - having 10 regiments doesn't help when 500 of the Mechs are Stingers and 300 more are Shad -2Hs. If the faction's survival is to make any sense at all, their mech selection absolutely should be retconned.

>>49407269

It makes you almost think there's a reason for the Clans, if at least to provide something other than "Successor States fights one of its two rivals again."

They really should have made a more diverse map of successor states.

>>49407269
Good points. I recall an anon here even discovering that one of their only two planets with mech factories (before the Detroit acquisition) didn't even always have a permanent garrison. If the FWLM spared a small task force they could shreck the MoC within a year. Heck, if the Defenders of Andurien had jumped the border to annex the Magistracy in 3030 they'd probably have done it in a heartbeat.

>>49407316

The writers really like the number five.

Five houses, five hidden worlds, Clan organisation system, etc et etc.

Could've worked too for the IS factions but it immediately devolves from "five star-spanning empires balanced against each other" to "one hero faction, one cheerleader faction, two literal retard factions who always lose and one faction we're just gonna ignore."

>>49407269
I always assumed that the MAF had a core of older machines from the SLDF era that they relied on to do most of the work, and part of the reason they were declining so badly in the 20s and 30s was that they were slowly losing those old machines and increasingly having to rely on what they built, which is crap, hence the trouble

Hey guys, fucking retard here. I just bought the Introductory box set and I'm wondering where the rest of the rules are? All the basic stuff seemed to be in the starter rules, but I'm wondering where army building and more dedicated mech building rules are? Do I have to look through the 600 other splatbooks to find em, or is there a "Full rulebook" that I'm missing. Also what era is the most fleshed out/good for beginners?

>>49407478
Total warfare book for the rest of the basic stuff.

>>49407478
Total Warfare is the current standard rules. Unit creation is Tech Manual mostly, with a few advanced types in TacOps (IIRC it's stuff like mobile structures, trains, and Large Support Vehicles).

>army building
kek
no rules for army building here

>>49407547
Indeed, BattleTech doesn't expect you to slap down 1 HQ and 2 Infantry. Any "army" building rules are just that, which is a scale you're likely to be uncomfortable playing.

>>49407478
>but I'm wondering where army building
Doesn't exist in the usual sense.

>more dedicated mech building rules
Techmanual and Solaris Skunk Werks.

>>49407547
>No rules for army building.
So do you just bring all your models and dump them on the table or something?

>>49407568
Game balance is done primarily with the Battle Value system. An equal amount of BV is *generally* (there are exceptions, like taking an equivalent BV in basically dune buggies to someone's Mech company) an equal match.

>>49407568
Usually balance is by points. Bring X Battle Value of units, sometimes there's limits on the number of units you can bring.

>>49407589
>(there are exceptions, like taking an equivalent BV in basically dune buggies to someone's Mech company)
TRUCK STRONK

>>49407589
>>49407606
Oh thanks. I was wondering what that number was for. Also, what is the best way to get minis and battlemaps for this game?

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>>49407589
>Not fighting a Clan star with it's BV equivalent in Savannah Masters

>>49407568
There's a points system, but none of that force org chart shit or anything

>>49407568
You look up the point value your units have and then use basic counting and common sense to balance them vs whatever your opponent brings.

Or you agree upon a scenario and roll up mechs on the Random Assignment Table for whichever faction or unit each of you are using and then balance it for Battle Value.

>>49407652
>using RATs for balance
Maybe if you're playing FedCom D gear vs Drac A

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>>49407633
>laughingmixtechingfaggot.png
But I do. I just upgun the old girl a bit.

>>49407690
>not using HFF
Step it up sempai

>>49407663
You can always play Drac vs Drac.

>>49407714
I said "upgun" not "upgrade."

>>49407766
Fair enough

>>49407627
buy the latest box set. It comes with 12 minis and 2 double sided map sheets

>>49408312
Already have it, is there a better way to expand the collection than just buying another one? Anything with more variety?

>>49408335
There are Alpha Strike mech packs which include more minis, as well as supplemental cards for an alternate rule set, though most of the figures are related to TRO 3039 and its associated Record Sheets. After that it's off to Iron Wind Metals, for old pewter sculpts for most of the line, as well as modern sculpts for new designs.

>>49408335
>>49408570
There's also the russian minis.

>>49409002
Explain

>>49407652
>>49407589
>>49407606
>>49407478

This'll be heresy, I know, but the 'Combat Manual' series from the 'Alpha Strike' line contains a fair chunk about how to construct faction appropriate forces.

Of course, this series is more geared toward folk who like faster playing games and not wanking off completely to someone's retro-future history to generate setting germane OOB's.
>I'm wondering where army building

>>49409831
>>49409831
warhansa

>>49408570
>>49408335
>>49407627
I too recommend getting the lance packs. Also I recently acquired the base set for robotech RPG tactics and one of the expansions. That netted me 2 riflemen, 2 warhammers, at least 4 phoenix hawks, 2 archers, and 2 longbows.

>>49398550
>>49398585

>talking to friends about battlemechs and doing similar combined arms stuff in a homebrew, Escaflowne-inspired fantasy setting
>friends all hate the idea of BA and support elements that aren't planes

Is this because we're Ameritards? I don't get it.

>>49410737
I don't get how that makes sense at all. Yanks are crazy big on combined arms.

>>49410737
They are retards. Support and logistics can mean winning a battle or withering away impotently.

>>49407633
Of course not! I fight Clan stars with their C-Bill equivalent in Savannah Masters.

How many mercenaries with their own mechs do you guys think would be at loose ends on galeata and other hiring worlds as of 3025?

>>49412815
Couple hundred at least. But what I find most interesting about that time is there are five dispossessed to every mechwarrior in the IS. It really underscores the old "Life is cheap. Mechs aren't." of the era.

So, what do you guys think REALLY happened to Nicky K's wife? Are the Green Ghosts related to her or something else.

We need all new conspiracy theories.

>>49412815
Several hundred, maybe 5-600 on the big worlds combined. Maybe a thousand, all told, including the periphery (lots of commands end up out there when they're breaking up)

>>49412815
I think probably 600 is a good number. You've got a lot of smaller commands that dissolve and a bunch of mechwarriors errant or whatever you call them running around in the Periphery.

>>49411550
Where would you even find that many Savannah Masters?

>>49413658
>Where would you even find that many Savannah Masters?

Well, if you disregarded copyright laws it's not like it has significant undercuts ....

>>49413658
You purchase a bunch of Qwickcell's Susannah Mistress.

Finally took the dive and bought the Introductory set, looking more into everything. Dark Ages is the latest 'story and universe' progression right? Are they dipping back into pre-succesion wars stuff or has nothing really shifted game/story wise since the early aughts? I know Alpha strike is a thing, but are they further developing 'classic' battletech?

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>overheats if you fire more than just lasers
>slow as fuck lets meds and heavys get in range
>torso looks like a fucking missile
Anyone want to help me figure out what this thing is for?

>>49413909
I hope this is trolling, it's a beast and l2 bracket fire.

>>49413922
Honestly no trolling.
Never got more than one turn of L2 fire off of it, and it always overheats to fast to do anything else.

>>49413972
Fire LLs+LRMs -OR- MLs+SRMs

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>>49413909
Assaulting? Stalking? Getting out of here?

Off-topic: I was talking with my brother about the 4th SW era and Battlemech roles, and how it can be difficult to design 'Mechs in that era because there aren't many empty roles left to toy with. The main thing you can really do is design 'Mechs for roles that factions don't really have.

So, what sorts of gaps can you think of that remain to be filled in the cadre of 'Mechs from that era? Have you ever designed something to occupy that spot yourself?

>>49413988
Which I do, but it still over heats too fast (12 heat from ML 8 from SRMs out paces the heat sinks fast) and I always have shit rolls for shutdowns.

>>49414006
Good FWL/Drac/Cap designs?

>>49414060
Well, as a matter of opinion, and given the era in question, I find the Dracs have a good Light trooper in the Panther, and the Jenner is a high-grade scout and backstabber. For the Cappies, depending on how you considered your source material, the Cataphract and the Vindicator are both very good, but they don't really have anything else that's home-brewed and outstanding in any way, since the Raven is kind of meh in most forms at the time, and their variants can be good (Whammy is good and I like their MAD personally) but again, generic. The FWL gets... hm. The Spider is pretty good and fairly FWL, ain't it? They also get the best Wolverine variant too as I recall, but again, not very unique. Yeah, I can't really think of anything for them off the top of my head. Running on 4 hours of sleep ain't helping matters either.

>>49414060
Funny enough, that's the one era where they're actually about on par in terms of mech designs

>>49413909
To keep on truckin'

Does anyone else do House only builds? Whenever I'm about to start a game, I almost always seem to pick mechs from the same house. I try not to, but it keeps happening.

>>49414574
I do this when I'm playing because I tend to fluff my own force as the OpFor, because I have terrible luck and dice hate me, so I build accordingly. Pirates often, but when I do House units they always come mostly off the RAT. Nothing wrong with it.

Getting to the point where I don't really care to play most canon factions anymore though.

>>49414574
Usually when I do pickup games with my buddy, we just randomly pick era and what kind of game we want to play depending on how we feel. Then one of us picks a faction, the other picks an enemy of that faction, and we ballpark a battle value.

>Don't have much time today, let's make this a quick one.
>Lance on lance, mech only?
>Sure. Hey, I've been wanting to try out some of these Solaris designs forever. Say a match in one of the arenas?
>Coliseum or Jungle?
>How about The Pool
>That's going to be interesting. What year? Can we take omnis? Always wanted to try some of the U's
>3150 balls to the wall noncanon final destination
>10k BV sound like enough?
>Let's do it.
>Hey, look up the torpedo rules so we don't have to fumble for them later

Campaign is a lot more structured.

>>49402618
The Toro's back in production during the Dark Age, no?

>>49414123
>They also get the best Wolverine variant too as I recall
Aren't the good Wolverine variants Kurita?

>>49415688

Best one is the Marik version.

The Drac one removes the JJs and adds a Large Laser in place of the A/C-5.

Best upgrades in 3025 overall goes to the Suns though. Despite the "we love A/Cs!" memery most of their refits involve yanking ballistic weapons and turning machines into energy boats.

All this talking makes me want to do a DracLance
Something like 2 Panthers, a PPC Dragon and a Hatamoto-Chi for PPC galore
Or maybe switch a Panther and the Hatamoto for a Wolverine and a Whammy for early era play

>>49416702
-K2 PPC 'pult is also an option.

>>49416608
Where does the AC thing come from?

>>49417166
Enforcer fluff mentions it being a thing, if only around the time of the collapse of the Star League when the Enforcer was created, and the Hammerhands fluff talks about how it began. The Suns are also responsible for all the new IS AC types post Star League except the HVAC, but those are awful. And some of their more iconic 3025 mechs are AC carriers, namely the Centurion, Enforcer, and Jagermech.

>>49417260

>The Suns are also responsible for all the new IS AC types post Star League except the HVAC, but those are awful.

Not all, the Lyrans and FWL did the other Ultra and LB-X calibres. Suns just did the Rotary and Lights.

That aside, the Suns has always been energy boat and Gausswall central. It's rare to see anything else, mostly because of how good their energy boat and Gausswall designs are.

>>49417384
I wasn't really counting converting ultras and LBX to other sizes as a new development, just doing what the Star League should have done centuries ago, if in the most ass way possible. And the Suns actually did handle all the LBX.

>>49417445

Lyrans invented the LB-20X and were the first to field anything with an LB-2X.

>>49418122
Not according to TM.

And as far as I can see, the Men Shen B is the first thing to use an LBX 2, its fluff even explicitly states it to be the debut of the weapon.

>>49418122
The IS 20s seem to be Lyrian across the board.

Nerds

>>49418324

They are, yes.

>>49418294

>Not according to TM.

Tech Manual literally says the FWL did the Ultra-2 and Ultra-10 while the Lyrans and FWL co-developed the Ultra-20. Fluff for the Hauptman and the chart at the back of MercSups II says the Lyrans, not the Suns, developed the LB-2X, LB-5X, and LB-20X.

Fair enough on the Men Shen config but the Lyrans were supposed to have made the weapon any way.

Would anyone here change the way LBX weapons work? I reckon adjustable loads would be neat. Make it so you can feed loads of varying damage per shot, so long as it's a factor of the main total or one/two less.

e.g. The LB-X AC/20 Can take varying loads including 20x1 (Birdshot), 10x2 (#2 Shot), 6x3 (#3 Shot), 5x4 (Aught), 4x5 (Double Aught), 3x6 (Tri-Ball 20) or 2x10 (Double-Slug). For anything of 3 damage or less give a bonus on the cluster table, don't give the cluster to-hit bonus to anything over 4 damage per pellet.

>>49418510
>Tech Manual literally says the FWL did the Ultra-2 and Ultra-10
And I never said anything about the SUns making Ultras, just LBX.

Quick question, since I'm planning my own at the moment: do Muslims in battletech still go on a Hajj? If so, does comstar have any precautions in place for the massive influx into Terra?

Hey /tg/ fluff question - does anyone know what the area of Jade Falcon occupation (and Hell's horses later I guess) is like culturally, or anything more about it? I know it was the Tamar Pact part of the Lyran commonwealth but I can't find much more about it than that.

>>49419930

>do Muslims in battletech still go on a Hajj?

Apparently it's still strongly encouraged if possible.

>If so, does comstar have any precautions in place for the massive influx into Terra?

ComStar rarely allowed anyone to come to Terra. They might have loosened things a little for the hajj but I doubt it.

>>49419933

Wolves took the Tamar region. The JFOZ and horse territory are just generically Lyran.

>>49419930
The biggest Muslim sect off of Terra are the Azami, and they were never really in a position to make a pilgrimage. Also, the average peasant will probably make a total of 15k C-Bills over their lifetime, so are unlikely to be able to get back to Terra. Additionally, Amaris nerve gassed the fuck out of the city and IIRC was said to have nuked the city as well.

>>49420030
Amaris is proof every cloud has a silver lining.

>>49420075
He was indeed an equal opportunity asshole, hitting Jerusalem, the Vatican and Mecca. All because HE was god. I'm guessing Saint Peter's Basilica had God's head replaced with Amaris'.

>>49420002
Most of the JFOZ was the Tamar Pact worlds. Wolves just took Tamar itself and a smaller number of Pact worlds.

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Born 750 years too late...

>>49420075
Even a cloud of nerve gas?

>>49420130
Based Amaris.

And honestly, as a Peripherat player (all of the Big Three) reading about his coup was pretty great. Fun to see the SLDF outfoxed and massacred, even if it won in the end.

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>>49420153
The biggest problem I had with it was that the entire Court of the Star League was apparently such a huge chunk of non entities that pic related happened. Where were the rest of the Cameron family? His mother? I mean, Kerensky was too busy being KERENSKY - SPACE POLICE, but goddamn.

>>49420196
I thought the Camerons were murdered and sealed up?

>>49420196

The Court wanted Kerensky as far the fuck away as possible because everyone was trying to manipulate Richard and had been foiled by him in the past.

They were too busy plotting against each other to realise Amaris had already won the game.

>>49420243

Amaris massacred anyone with the most tenuous links to the Cameron line to make sure nobody could rise to challenge his legitimcy, yeah.

>>49420243
I mean that they let the relationship start in the first place. Sure, jolly fat man, but Richard was like... 10. Also, if you read up on, Amaris groomed him to the point where Chris Hansen would have hit him with a stool.

>>49420269
Again, the kid had a family, who were presumably all too busy doing coke off of Mackie armor plates to care.

>>49420288
Except for Jennifer Winson

>>49420289
You know how Terrans are. No sense of community or nation, no family. Giving Terra the boot was the best thing we ever did.

>>49420030

I thought there were a decent amount of Muslims in the Outworlds Alliance who went all hippy, and also angry Black African Muslims in the Lyran Alliance - though maybe those are offshoots who don't do the hajj.

>>49420002
>>49420125

It mentions briefly in one book that the Tamar Pact was founded by Pakistani-Americans, and had a lot of "Western European" settlers, but that could mean anything.

>paycheck coming in a couple days, got a fair bit left over
>someone telling me about NewRetroArcade Neon and how great it is
>grab it since it's $20 and i haven't bought anything in two months
>faux-crts give me nasty fucking headache (had it for 10hrs now)
>applied for a refund
>requested it to steam wallet since I'll buy tabletop simulator with it, the battletech mods look neat
>refund approved in 21 minutes
>funds go Pending in wallet
>can't spend it for up to a week
>could have had it sent to my account and spent 20 anyway but now I can't get this 20 back
>gabe could handwrite a cheque and mail it to me faster than this

fug dis

>>49420634
Well there's that big sect in the Deep Periphery, but aside from them, the Azami are the biggest game in town.

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>>49398667
>an elemental will never facefuck you
FTFY

>>49420692
nice blogpost fampai

>>49421457
I realised I forgot the question. Does anybody actually use the btech mods for it? looks like it'd be a neat way to run short games.

>>49413909
don't ever talk to me or my favorite mech ever again

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How do I Lyran?

>>49421503
I host it with some friends on fridays. Mech sheets and Mechs are a bit limited (all MWO models and all of the introductory box sheets) but it doesn't really matter because you can use skunkwerks + PDF to image tools. Assuming you do get TTS there's an active Steam group (called Battletech Clan Ghoul) you can join.

>>49422616
I saw them mentioned in one of the steam workshop descriptions. Didn't realise you could do that with Skunkwerks too.

Might have to brush up with the rules but I have the basics more or less down through a fair bit of megamek play, just have to remember all the fiddly bits like attack and movement modifiers and stuff.

>>49422616
Another anon who owns TTS here, which mods would you recommend for Battletech on TTS?

>>49422549
Not trying to bash it brother, just trying to understand it.

What does a star next to a unit's name in the MuL mean?

>>49422941
A lot of shit got taken down by the PIG, so I can rehost somewhere if you'd like. If you'd just like to find it individually, search the workshop for spreadsheets/maps and search the Nexus for the MWO models. To use the MWO models open up documents/my games/Tabletop Sim/Mods/Workshop and drag in the .json file. It works by using assets from urls so you can import stuff easy.

>>49423279
I think those are the ones that are the main entry in a TRO.

okay I am trying to get my current lore up to date can people help me out? I will lay out the basics I think I have:

Suns: In trouble because infighting and Capellan Stronk
Lyrans: Gangbanged from multiple directions, but managed to get a slight breather, still not looking good though
Dracs: Actually not much problems, might be start shit soon enough
Caps: XING SHEN XING SHEN
Marik: Managed to unify and are reinforcing themselves
Wolf: Managed to carve out a nice spot between Lyran and Marik
Jades: Dicking around
Bears: No idea what they are doing
ROTS: GRAND SAVIOUR woke up out of his beauty sleep so Fortress down soon

>>49423503
That makes sense, thanks

>>49421503
just use megamek bro

>>49424014

Clan Ghost Bear is doing fine, as usual.

>>49424014

Also,

Canopus: Capellan fucktoy
Taurian: Went full retard and lost half its stuff
Outworlds Alliance: Sits around while Raven allies fuck with Suns and Combine
Horses: Realized Jade Falcon was crazy and cancelled their alliance, just consolidating.
Diamond Shark: Changed their name back to the lame one and split up into groups to go to each fifth of the galaxy and sell shit.
Nova Cat: Nearly mostly entirely dead but somehow there are survivors promising the FWL they can totally help fight wolves.

>>49424324

And of course, Star Adder is up to something terribly mysterious and lording over the Homeworlds. And ComStar exiled themselves out to the Periphery. And Goliath Scorpion is Spanish.

>>49424014
>Suns: In trouble because infighting and Capellan Stronk
Nope, they're gonna get saved. I'd bet money that Julian rides to the fucking rescue and all the "FedSuns in decline" shit is ignored.
>Lyrans: Gangbanged from multiple directions, but managed to get a slight breather, still not looking good though
They're breaking apart. Maybe they do something with the Burds to get the Wuffs out?
>Dracs: Actually not much problems, might be start shit soon enough
It's foreshadowed as hell something's gonna go wrong. My personal guess is another Combine-Ghost Bear war or the Dragoons switching sides.
>Caps: XING SHEN XING SHEN
Yup. XIN SHENG XIN SHENG. Possibility of a civil war, though, if the incestbaby thing gets out.
>Marik: Managed to unify and are reinforcing themselves
Andurien is currently in the XIN SHENG sphere, but might break away with the Canopians. But it looks like everyone else is unified. Probably gonna smack down some "muh rome" peripherats.
>Wolf: Managed to carve out a nice spot between Lyran and Marik
Mixed messages. On one hand, a decent chunk of their military is actually glorified planetary militia. On the other, Alaric's GLORIOUS WUFF VICTORY AURA is still strong.
>Jades: Dicking around
Also a civil war risk, with a decent amount of conflict between Malvina's faction and the traditionalists.
>Bears: No idea what they are doing
Sitting around, gonna probably ally with the RotS.
>ROTS: GRAND SAVIOUR woke up out of his beauty sleep so Fortress down soon
Yup. Time to bring the IS back in line. TERRA STRONK

>>49424372

I think the Lyran's idea is to have the Wolfs just take over the FWL and move in there.

>>49424401
that was the intial plan, but they wanted to sacrifice the wolves till those sad "nope fuck off"

>>49424372

>GRAND SAVIOUR woke up

Wait, what, really?

>>49424591
Yeah, it was a pretty cool short story actually. Used those freezer tubes they had in Handbook Periphery.

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>>49424591
its kinda weird, we got Stone waking up and we got RotS shadow ops running around "interfering" with the houses getting too strong.

gonna be real interesting how 3145 will continue
>inb4 more Capellan wankery

pic related

>>49424269
We lost most of our Leviathans, so no we're really not doing that well.

>>49424324
Nova Cats are completely dead. They field fewer survivors than the Smoke Jaguars did after their annihilation, plus the entirety of their civilian castes were killed or sterilized.

>>49425379
Nope! Thanks to that new EVEN MORE munched-out murdermachine you're at 2/4 Levs, which is half, not most.

>>49425379

As long as you're allowed to have any Warships at all - and forget about the fucking deathmachines that are Leviathans - you will never, ever, have anything legitimate to complain about. Herb could literally come to your house, sodomize you and your fucking dog, and burn every bit of Battletech product that you own, and you'll STILL be doing better as a faction fanbase than Steiners or Mariks.

So shut the fuck up, go wank off with Ben somewhere where nobody can hear, see, or care about you, and let real Battletech players talk. Fuck the Burrs, fuck your Leviathans, and fuck you.

>>49425765
Pls don't step in the bear trap

>>49425908

Bears and traps are opposites, though.

Hello, guys.

I'm running a campaign, though I'm a touch inexperienced with Battletech in general, so I have no idea whether to just use the wargame or try to bodge together the rpg aswell, or just keep everything that isn't combat as freeform/abstracted roleplay., any opinions on that?

Also, what are some interesting timelines/years in the general plot to set a mercenary campaign in?

>>49426047
Best time to be a merc is when your gear is equivalent or better than that of your enemies. That means stuff like the 3rd War, Jihad, DA, stuff like that.

Clan Invasion is driving 3rd War machines against frontline omni clusters. It can be interesting, but it becomes more like how to survive than how to win.

There are a few exceptions to this. Being a merc with anything at all in the Periphery will always work. Even Wilson's Hussars at their lowest were able to spend twenty five years on Butte Hold.

And there's always the odd house unit that goes mercenary every war. They'll generally have good enough gear to face down whatever they run up against.

>>49426047

Pretty much any time post-Star League is a good merc time: they're always needed.

As for what rules to use. I'd suggest just sticking to regular boardgame battletech to start. BT isn't a hard system to learn, really, but you'll have your hands full, and stacking a new crunchy RPG on top of that would be a lot of work.

What BV limit and time period do most battletech tournaments use?

>>49426047
>Also, what are some interesting timelines/years in the general plot to set a mercenary campaign in?
I've always been fond of the late 50s; you have the chaos march, which is always a fun place to be, you have plenty of events cooking in the periphery that a few mercs could tip the balance of, there's all sorts of work everywhere, including the clans, lots of interesting newtech stuff to try out, but it's not ubiquitous yet.
It's just kind of a good grab-bag of everything

>>49426288

It's HUGELY variable, because there's no "standard" Battletech tournament. The two premire tournaments are the Battletech Open and the Trial of Bloodright, both at GenCon.

IIRC, the Battletech Open uses pairs of Mechs from any era and gives a total limit of 6k BV2. The Trial of Bloodright is a single-elimination Clan-only tournament using a single Mech and a BV limit of about 2100 BV2, and jumps around in era.

If you're looking to host your own tournament, you need to limit four things: the rules level, the number of units, the type of units, and the BV2. Era isn't as important. My personal preference for a tournament setting would be something like, "Total Warfare level rules, MUST have at least 3 Mechs, maximum 4 Mechs, Mechs-only, maximum 8,000 BV2". At that point, having Clan or IS tech, or 3150 tech or 3050 tech won't make much of a difference. By setting minimums and maximums on the number of units, you keep people from engaging in the worst of min-maxing force lists (either unit spam, or one 0/0 pilot in an assault Mech).

Is there any good list for which Warhansa mechs are supposed to be? Some of them are obvious, but between tiny images and the MWO designs, not sure on some of them.

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I hope the Galatean League becomes a real faction. Mercs should rule since they are the ones fighting the wars

>>49426727
>Heavy Machine Guns
>ever

>>49422562
Lyrans aren't like the based 2nd or 3rd Reich Germans. They're more like the modern cucked Germans.

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>>49426727
>tfw the dragoons were the people in Battletech who got closest to outer heaven

>>49426883
>oppressive regulation and control of the merc market
>close to Outer Heaven

>>49427093
Nuking Outreach and slaughtering the Dragoons were the only things the robes did right

>>49427093
Yep, they ain't even fucking close but they're STILL closer than anyone else
>independent mercenary state
>run by warriors for warriors
>choose the wars they fight
>massive deterrent (WarShips)
It isn't much, but nobody else is even half that close

Battlebump

>>49425379

The Bear navy thanks to the new Leviathan III could literally take on everyone else's fleets combined and shit stomp them.

They also have the largest, best-equipped and most skilled ground forces in 3150.

They just aren't doing anything. Yet. Odds of them reinforcing Stone and BTFOing the Dracs in the next major plot arc are nearing 100% however.

>>49425765
Tell us how you really feel.

In the opinions of those here as know WarShips, what would a WarShip designed explicitly for the mercenary market, bandersnatch/cronus style, look like?

>>49430028
A debris field.

>>49424014
None matters, Ilkhan is coming! (LOL, if the devs get to it!)

>>49430028

Merc units would rarely if ever make enough to pay the annual maintenance bills. Forget about repairing battle damage or buying one.

But if you want to ignore logical limitations, probably something like the Carrack. Small, mostly a cargo transport to supply the unit with a few capital weapons to threaten DropShips or provide orbital fire support.

I hope theres a clanner streak house somewhere called Bargained and Well Done

>>49430028
probably something that emphasizes speed and cargo capacity.

I like to think a merc ship would look like a shitty bucket of bolts held together by shoddy spot welding and spit.

>>49430028
Literally just cargo, shields, and engine, with the only weapon being a tube for launching nukes.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XmDYJBZZdc

>>49430028
Since we're presumably talking something AU where that kinda stuff is cheaper, probably something with a lotta energy weapons and cargo space, maybe a few DS collars if they aren't expensive in this AU. Overall, a transport kinda ship with some guns. Also, lots and lots of passenger quarters for Dependants, those are important for mercs

>>49430028
>what would a WarShip designed explicitly for the mercenary market, bandersnatch/cronus style, look like?
Like somebody in the Deep Periphery found a stash of old Aquillas and outfitted them with Capital Missile launchers.

>>49430028
NPPCs and NLs, antique DropShuttle bays (no cost multiplier, to keep things cheap), ASF bays to avoid duplicating in a DS, passenger quarters for infantry in the unit and dependants
Possibly a collar or two, if your AU makes it cheaper.

>>49426623
you could just post the ones you have a question about and get them IDed. I'd be willing to do that for you, I played MWO.

>>49428678
>The Bear navy thanks to the new Leviathan III could literally take on everyone else's fleets combined and shit stomp them.

The Wall can ping anything with a jump drive out of existance, no matter its tonnage or firepower. The LevIII is a waste of resources.

>>49428678
Didn't Lev 3 or entire Bear Navy lose badly in some match?

>>49431402
The Wall is just a small network of Super HPG's right? Those have to target an incoming jump signature. Should really mean Fortress Republic isn't as solid as we think. I just don't get how the detection system works. The jump entry radar burst wouldn't travel instantaneously even in the same system. You have less than a minute from the burst before the ship slips in. So say you had a Super HPG on Terra, you're half a dozen light minutes too far out to detect in time.

Do they have a bunch of hidden mobile HPG's at Nadir and Zenith points of every system in the Fortress that ping back targeting to the SHPG?

Surely they couldn't cover every pirate point. And SHPG's shouldn't be able to cycle instantaneously either, so it just seems like if you want to jump a huge fleet in, you'd only lose one or two jumpships.

>>49431506
It's plot device magic, nigga. It's not bound by logical rules. It does whatever the plot needs.
I mean, it's the dumbest fucking thing to introduce to the Battletech universe, but team DA has gone and done added it in, so it's a fact, no matter what

>>49431460
If you mean the Nova Cat thing, that wasn't a Lev 3, IIRC it was a 2 at best. There's also the issue of crunch vs fluff there.
We haven't seen a Lev 3 in action, but the next best thing would be a Leviathan Prime, which the Steel Vipers had in the Reavings, where every space battle it got involved in basically read as "The Perigard Zalman show up, obliterates everything.".

It took a Texas class pulling a kamikaze misjump to kill the damn thing.

>>49427351
>implying Wayne Waco didn't stay more true to The Boss's vision.

>>49431768
Yeah, that Nova Cat navy vs Bear navy, supposedly on paper Nova Cat would lose hands down but the player pull an upset over the Bear!

>>49431402

The Wall is not going to be used against the Leviathans, stop being such a god damn retard.

>>49431460

Nope. The times a Leviathan bit it in the Jihad required a shit ton of enemy ships sacrificing themselves to get one. No individual power has the resources to throw away like that, not even the Snow Ravens.

Even with the fleets of everyone else combined they're out of luck.

The Leviathan II is *that* much bullshit. I've said it before and I'll say it again; imagine an environment where the UM-R60 is the most powerful 'Mech in existence, and imagine all games are played on flat, featureless maps. Now imagine the Hellstar is introduced into the game.

This is the difference in unit optimisation and power between the Leviathan II and other WarShips. The Leviathan III is even better than that.

It is 100% bullshit and should never have been allowed to happen. They sure as hell should never have had Jellico go and rebuild it with better weapons and point-defence bays and fluff about how it's accompanied by massed ASFs and some of the best Pocket WarShips in the game.

>>49431768

I don't think any Leviathans fought in the Trial of Vengeance game because if they had the Nova Cat side wouldn't have been able to win. IIRC the biggest ship the Bears had in that fight was a Nightlord.

>>49431874

It wasn't the two navies going all in, it was a section of each bid against the other.

The scenario was either written by a Nova Cat jerk-off who was trying to set things up for them to win (according to NEA) or, going by what I've heard, designed by someone who didn't understand how good massed ASFs were in AT2 because it's rarely played so they tried to balance the Bears' bigger, better WarShips by giving the Cats more ASFs and then improperly playtested.

The expected result by the writers was the Bears obliterating the Nova Cats. Not only was the trial over a Leviathan II (the Rasalhague) which the Nova Cats would *never* be allowed to own in the fluff, they had already plotted material for the Jihad requiring the bulk of the Bear fleet to survive and the Nova Cat force to have been wrecked.

It's also why they don't allow games to really effect canon any more.

>>49431849
It's true.
Wayne Waco was the only true heir to Big Boss in the 'verse
I really want to see what his non-goon mercs union woulda looked like without Coventry and the goddamn robes.
Sure as hell, it'd have been interesting

Is the Daishi X from page 114 of Total Warfare the deadliest killing machine ever created? Even the mighty Charger might get a run for its money from this beast of a mech.

>>49431575
The dumbest thing in Battletech is lostech and no one can prove this wrong

>>49432696
I dunno. I mean even in the modern world, you could kill a hundred scientists in any given specialist field and retard progress there for years if not a decade or more. It's still very much a master-apprentice sort of system and a very delicate one. Wrecking extremely expensive infrastructure just makes it worse.

What doesn't square is how battletech planets are all very low level education on average yet still absurdly populated. It would make so much more sense if most of them just had a couple big cities a bunch of podunk towns and a starport.

>>49432696
FASAnomics, son.
Wins every damned time.

>>49432845
>Battletech gets a new owner
>hires world leading economist to try and unfuck everything
>disappears for 8 months
>comes back, world is listening
>"this doesn't work. none of it works. none of it will ever work. I can't possibly un-fuck this."
>battletech development ends permanently

>>49432845
>>49432859
The main problems all seem to circle around population density, insanely low overall productivity and way too low jumpship numbers, as far as I gather.

Then there's the fact that like 90% of planets apparently don't have any institutions of higher learning and very little heavy industry, in spite of most of them being able to independantly feed their populations.

>>>49433091
>>>49433131
Well, is it not?

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>>49433140
MWO Zeus is sexier.

Does a mechs NEED 10 heatsinks to even function?

>>49432368
I don't have enough coffee in me I almost took this seriously.

>>49433895
Nah. Two should cover walking and running.

>>49386023
MACROSS EDITION, YAY!

>>49433838
>flat as a board
Not even once.

>>49433895
The Liberator proved that you don't even need 1.

>>49434026
>>49434137
Hrm, then I wonder why the fuck MWO requires every mech to have 10 on them...

>>49434161
Because specifically, every fusion engine comes with 10 heat sinks. The only way a mech can have less is by using a non fusion engione, ICES don;t get any, fuel cells get one, and fission engines get 5. But ICEs and FC engines are abnormal on battlemechs, usually only being found on industrials, and fission engines are just unusual altogether since fusion renders them mostly pointless.

>>49431931
>The scenario was either written by a Nova Cat jerk-off who was trying to set things up for them to win (according to NEA) or, going by what I've heard, designed by someone who didn't understand how good massed ASFs were in AT2 because it's rarely played so they tried to balance the Bears' bigger, better WarShips by giving the Cats more ASFs and then improperly playtested.

For what it's worth, my opinion is that it was the second thing, not the first. FanPro weighted things in a way that they *thought* would make it very likely the Bears would win, but they didn't realize the impact of fighter squadrons on the capital ship game. It certainly wasn't one single person who was a Bear fan trying to get his way; it was an organizational failure at all levels, combined with a failure to understand the ruleset.

The "one guy trying to get his faction to win" happened(s) during other events, but from everything I can tell, it wasn't in play during the Trial of Possession.

With that said, yeah, that's one of the reasons games don't affect canon any more. The other one being that canon is decided 2-3 years in advance and they aren't going to hold up releases while the players game out the result.

Need advice on a House Davion lance for 3039

I have:
1 panther
1 centurion
1 grasshopper
1 warhammer
All of them are prime configuration.

>>49435178

I'm pretty sure that you, or someone using your trip, has said in the past that Warner Doles wrote the scenario and did everything possible to weight the forces in favour of the Nova Cats because they were his faction, and that he ignored playtester feedback that the forces were imbalanced to get the canon-effecting result he wanted.

>>49435363
>Panther
>Grasshopper
Doesn't give it a Davion feel. What about a Valkyrie? A Dervish or JagerMech?

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>>49425711
>>49425765
>>49428678
Don't bully us. Bears are a fun faction.

>>49435363

Normal 'Mechs like those don't have configurations.

That aside, what advice do you want? They're all 4/6/X movers with relatively long-range weapons. Find a woods or hill for cover and use the ranged guns. Maybe split the Grasshopper off to go after a wounded opponent while the others keep the enemy honest. Watch the heat on the Warhammer and the armour on the Centurion.

>>49435428

Well of course its fun when everything goes your way :^)

>>49430028
Like a Rolls-Royce Silver Ghost specifically designed for middle-class soccer moms, i.e. non-existent.

>>49435602
Not everything has. It was rough for us in the invasion, we lost most of our warships and we took heavy losses in the Jihad.

Critical hit question. If I get two or three criticals out of the same attack on the same location, are they all applied simultaneously and then all damage resolved from them simultaneously? Or do I fully resolve each critical one at a time? If dealing with ammo explosions, this can actully have a noticeable effect, but the damage rules aren't clear in this regard.

>>49435363
The term 'prime' configuration only applies to omnimechs, which don't exist in 3039 in the inner sphere.

>>49433838
>MWO
so I understand there was a guy who did have models to print but now doesn't do it anymore?

What's the story here? Seems updated Battletech minis are long overdue.

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>>49436343
You still make crits for the section that took them, even if the section is destroyed. So if you roll 2 crits, and the first one destroys the section, you still roll the second crit in there.

>>49436509
>Not having a Warhammer Prime
Get it together anon.

>>49436546
>What's the story here? Seems updated Battletech minis are long overdue.
>laughingTROwriters.png
Now admittedly, pic related has tons of variants in there, but let's say only 800 of those are unique. Are you gonna finance resculpting all of these?

>>49435384
I find only these, which don't have NEA's trip:
https://warosu.org/tg/thread/41361888#p41369438
http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/33782095/#33809720

>>49436632

Hm. I must've conflated them. Thought that was NEA.

>>49436606
>but let's say only 800 of those are unique. Are you gonna finance resculpting all of these?
Eh.
I don't think you need every mech that was ever around to have a viable range of miniatures.

A starter set with two lances and a bunch of supplemental minis would be a nice place to start trying to revive the miniature gaming though.
The last time I knew of someone seriously considering playing the table top was in the 90s.

>>49436546
Check warhansa. He sells most of the current MWO range of minis (ie. classic robits) at a rather cheap $10 a piece price.

>>49437059
>warhansa
Damn. That's nice. Thanks for the link.

New thread time

>>49436334
>we lost most of our warships
At least you kept one of the best in the game. The FWL doesn't have a Thera (but the fucking snowy magpies do REEEEEEEEE)

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>>49437579
FWL weren't even a real faction. What would warrant the nuFWL anything nice?