Kaladesh

>>49242648
So just how common are Planeswalkers supposed to be? I only ask because it seems like every plane has like 3-5 at any given time.

>>49242648
1. Aetherworks Marvel
2. Nissa, Vital Force
3. Lost Legacy/Pia Nalaar Because I'm a sucker for feels

The one card that I can identify with.

>>49242714
Thriving Grubs?

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>>49242648
Battleship
Mister "pay to play" Orzov
Watertower

The rest is kinda cool, mostly junk

>>49242730
Terror of the Fairgrounds

>>49242730
>implying any of us is thriving
Let's be real here.

>>49242701
One in a million or so.

>>49242701
The Mending made them probably as widespread as it lowered their powerlevel.

>>49242648
The Fair land is great for muh lantmeme control, paradoxical outcome could be great in the eggs deck i'm looking to build, maybe even the big thing that blast for 50. Pretty hyped for this set actually famalam.

>>49242648
>psuedo-indian planeswalker
>named Raj
fucking lol

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>>49242714
This one?

>>49242714
Aetherkin?

>>49242795
>"no thanks"

>>49242795
>can't see shit with my sunburn captain, is it near? Now?

>>49242808
I wonder how long this was their name

>>49242648
In no particular order:
Demon of Dark Schemes
Madcap Experiment
Start Your Engines

>>49242767

One in a million seems absurdly common to be honest. Each one is basically a god.

>>49242648
Cultivator of Blades
Verdurous Gearhulk
Skysovereign

I'm building G/W Counters this set and there's nothing you can do to stop me

>>49242795
>finally print a hate card for eldrazi after eldrazi have already rotated out

10/10, WIZARDS DOES IT AGAIN

>>49242864
nuWalkers aren't "gods". They're just normal people (for a fantasy world) who happen to be able to walk the planes. They generally aren't stronger than any other mages inherently.

>>49242885
Only Dragons and Origins are rotating out, Memedrazi are around for another 6 months

>>49242885
BFZ is still in standard, it rotates out with Amonket

>>49242864
>Each one is basically a god

whut? how long has it been since you last touched Magic?

Planeswalkers these days literally can just travel between worlds. That's all the spark does.

>>49242648
Skysovereign
Torrential Gearhulk
Demon of Dark Schemes

The modules are also really cool as are a few of the other cards, I like the angel of invention too though I don't think it's particularly good.

It looks like a dumb Johnny set.

I'm in.

>>49242864

They used to be, not anymore post-Mending, and it was also a point in lore that while maybe one in a million possess a Spark, not everyone who has one ignites. Case in point: Glacian.

rakdos plainswalker when

>>49242779
>paradoxical outcome could be great in the eggs deck i'm looking to build
do you like getting punched in the crotch?

>>49242874
Oh boy secondo harvest is in standard oh boy

>>49242648
Does every single fucking set have to be 20% EDH bait now?

>>49242856
Thats HOW it fucked up.

Wizards saw the anime boom and instead of ridindg that wave they gave people a Shinto 101 text book.

So the flavor was fucked and the design was crappy.

Kamigawa is dead, bury it.

>>49243008
Why is edh CALLED A "CASUAL' FORMAT GIVEN HOW EXPENSIVE IT IS?

>>49242948
http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/search/kamigawa

http://mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Drive_to_Work

57, 58 AND 59

>>49242648

1. Voltaic Brawler
2. Longtusk Cub
3. Lathnu Hellion

>>49242648
No particular order
Noxious Gearhulk
Filigree Familiar
..Angel of Invention?

There are definitely some other good ones like Kambal, Fleetwheel Cruiser, Saheeli, Chandra, the land cycle, and Depala.

>>49243041
Commander Is typically played casually unless your group is a bunch of combo-fetching tryhards.

>>49243041
>So the flavor was fucked

No, the flavor was spot-on perfect. The problem was everything else. It was the Homelands situation all over again.

>>49243064
Let's remember that MaRo is not the best judge of anything, even his own failures. His idea of why Devoid was unpopular was because it's keyworded, not because it's inherently shit on a conceptual level (actual reason).

>>49243001
never forgetti the 3 drop daretti

>>49243163
>No, the flavor was spot-on perfect

Yeah, that explains why it's the uncontested least popular plane in terms of flavor.

Oh wait.

It's one thing to say 'I liked Kamigawa, it would be nice to see it again' (I'm in that group), but what makes Kamigawa fans deny reality and insist it was secretly hugely successful and is definitely coming back?

>>49243008
Not a single legendary is EDH playable so far, and they even went out of their way to design a legendary creature that can't be used in EDH because it starts out as not a creature.

>>49243041

Flavor was great, if/when they do a new Japanese plane and they anime it up it'll never be anywhere near as good as Kamigawa, flavorwise.

>>49243041
>Why is edh CALLED A "CASUAL' FORMAT GIVEN HOW EXPENSIVE IT IS?
Ignoring thst is because it's played by casuals, it's easily the least expensive eternal format barring specific exceptions of which there are also exceptions for commander such as buying a precon. magine having to buy more than one force of will.

>>49243189
>what makes Kamigawa fans deny reality and insist it was secretly hugely successful

Nobody has said or even implied it was "successful". Just that it had fucking fantastic flavor.

>>49243193
>Not a single legendary is EDH playable so far
Rashmi?

>>49243001
Sarkhan was printed in... Rise of the Eldrazi I think?

You also got Daretti in Conspiracy 2.

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>>49243197
>tfw rtkamigawa will be a sci-fi fantasy block.

>>49243001
prismatic walker when

>>49243189
>Yeah, that explains why it's the uncontested least popular plane in terms of flavor.

Being perfect doesn't mean that people like you. Kamigawa, in terms of flavor, was perfect. A 10/10 jackpot in terms of theme, story and lore. People hated it because its mechanics were annoying garbage and its cards weak.

>>49243233
A worse Edric that promotes playing on your opponents' turn in a multiplayer format.

Meanwhile BW guy, Gonti, Dwarf and Pia are unplayable.

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>>49243240
>turning Kamigawa into Ninja Slayer
I'm in.

>>49243163
There's nothing inherently bad about a "colorless" mechanic, no one ever complained about Ghostfire. It's just that they decided to take away any reason that might be relevant (protection, Intimidate) right before dedicating a block to it, turning it into not-Tribal.

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>>49243262
When Bolas ascends in Amonkhet.

>>49243189
The only thing we have to go on that is MaRo and his nebulous market research.

I have never once heard a complaint about Kamigawa's setting in the 13 years I have been playing.

>>49242740
You know the best part about this guy is that he hits the field and he technically does something. Literally a 4 life swing every time an opponent tries to cast shit.

>>49243291
>BW Guy unplayable.
>triggers on each opponent.

>>49243291
>A worse Edric
Other than drawing cards, being UG, and being an elf, what exactly is the relation to edric. They build into totally different decks. Rashmi is like Jori En in a better color, and Jori En was a perfectly good commander that exchanges a mana for the ability to cascade.

>>49243307
>There's nothing inherently bad about a "colorless" mechanic, no one ever complained about Ghostfire.

No one complained about Ghostfire because Ghostfire wasn't printed in a fucking "colorlessness matters" block. It was just a random gimmick on one random card in a set filled with random gimmicks. But when you actually go and make a "colorlessness matters" block, you better not fucking print Ghostfire in there, let alone two hundred different variants of it, because it RUINS THE WHOLE FUCKING POINT. The point of such a block is to have tons of colorless cards, not colored cards that are arbitrarily designated as colorless but act exactly like colored cards in every other way including cost. It was inherently fucked up anti-design that defeated the whole purpose of the block. It doesn't matter if it had a keyword or not. If your block's idea is "colorlessness matters", then you have to bite the bullet and wreck the color pie for the duration of that block, print massive amounts of cards that actually are colorless down to their mana cost, not just pretend-colorless.

>>49243291
>>49243351
Also the criticism was "unplayable". I get you mean "not good enough to be played" but Rashmi IS good enough to be played so the criticism is still moot. Also Kambal is possibly playable as well and probably better in commander than anywhere else.

Gonti and Pia are definitely not commander cards, sure, and I think Depala WAS a commander card but they don't understand how to make it worth playing trash vehicles and dwarves so also fair enough shes not good.

>>49243182
>>49243235
goodrakdos planeswalker when

>>49243395
What? There's absolutely nothing wrong with Devoid mechanically. It's not just about "biting the bullet" and wrecking the color pie, but also about balancing colors and how they build limited environments around the color combinations. They needed the lesser eldrazi to have color not just because of the color pie but also because the eldrazi should have colors to signal the kind of decks they should be played in and to make sure there's enough colored cards to go around. There is no proble mwith devoid on a mechanical level. I also don't think there's a problem with Devoid on a naming level either as I understand why they chose to do it instead of writing it out, but it does get wrapped into the issue of pointless keywords they've been having lately where they just make keywords and tie cards together to signal limited archetypes without actually needing the keywords.

>>49243495
rakdoretti is good tho

>>49242648
1. Ovalchase Daredevil - this card is a house of a discard engine and beats players / Planeswalkers in the face for 4 or chump blocks for days if needed.
2. Armorcraft Judge - In a Hardened Scales deck, this is a Harmonize (or better) with legs.
3. Aether Hub - Good land is goooooood.

>>49243406
You're utterly casual, not a single one of these legendaries have the qualities required to break tier 3 junk let alone actual be played.

Yeah sure in semantics even Haakon isn't "unplayable" but if we're going to be childishly strict in our wording you said "Does every single fucking set have to be 20% EDH bait now?" while we've seen less than half a dozen EDH cards.

>>49243041
Unless you're building Tier-1 Infinite Loop Narset decks EDH is cheaper than Modern, considering that outside of certain combo pieces most cards in your deck will run under $1-2. You can easily build functioning decks at the $100-$150 range

>>49243519
in what format

>>49243544
Wow, you did not read my post at all and just devolved into shitflinging. You know how I know you didn't read my post?
>Yeah sure in semantics even Haakon isn't "unplayable" but if we're going to be childishly strict in our wording
I wasn't doing this. I know what you meant whe nyo usaid unplayable and while I didn't say it since it didn't matter I agree with it, and my post was clearly acknowledging that definition by doing on to agree that Gonti, Pia, and Depala weren't commander playable.

>>49243561
cn2 draft

>>49243552
>Unless you're Playing it right, EDH is cheaper than Modern
Fixed that for you

>>49243561
Not that guy but he could possibly see play in Legacy Tezzerator. He isn't even Modern/Standard legal though so you it's not like he's got a lot of options.

>>49243544
Who gives a shit about tiers in EDH? It's all about making things work and building around what you like.

>>49243163
It was fucked BECAUSE it was perfect.

Super accurate shinto didnt resonate with anymore than a small sliver of the audience. Peopel actually liking ti is more important that being uber faithful

>And so—for example, if you say you’re going to do Japanese culture. And I write down everything I expect to see. Well, you know, ninjas are pretty high. Because even though ninjas in actual Japanese mythology are very tiny part of what’s going on, they are a very big part and they’re resonant of most people playing the game.

>Because most people playing the game are not super enfranchised in Japanese mythology. That they know the surface level but not the deep level. And one of the problems that Champions of Kamigawa had was they went pretty deep. Like, if you really knew Shinto and a lot of the religion, they did a lot of cool things that you would recognize. But the problem was, they didn’t do enough stuff that was easily recognizable.

>And that’s one of the tricky things about resonance is, resonance isn’t reality. Resonance is perceived reality. Meaning what the audience knows is not the same of what really is. And part of trying to do a resonant set is, yes you can do faithful things that are realistically there. But you also have to do some stuff that’s perceived to be there.

>And that’s an important point, which is you have to meet some expectations. Otherwise, the funny thing is, the audience feels like you’re not doing what you say you’re doing because even though you’re being faithful, it doesn't feel correct to them.

>And that’s the tricky part of—you want to kind of be faithful to your source on some level, but you also want to make sure you’re faithful to the perception of the source. And that’s another thing that’s really important is design, is one of the quotes they talk about is “perception is reality.”

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>>49243330
I find that difficult to believe: the fans of Kamigawa's setting are a minority over here. The main arguments against it are that the artwork is a mess, the names make it difficult to tell the cards apart, and that the setting is only fun for the weeaboos. Of course, being a weeaboo, myself, I disagree, but I can see where they're coming from. I still scratch my head at some of Kamigawa's artwork.

>>49243395
To add to >>49243503 's points, BFZ was not a "Colorless matters" block, it was a vague "Zendikar vs Eldrazi" block. It's just that they've chosen to unite all the Eldrazi with the colorless theme, even though they could've just made the minor eldrazi colored again, like in ROE.

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Does anyone else think the aetherborn aren't that black? They seem a lot more red-aligned.

First time posting in Kaldesh spoilers, so I don't know if this has already been discussed at length.

>>49243598
You know you can actually be competitive while having fun right?

>>49243503
>What? There's absolutely nothing wrong with Devoid mechanically.

Yes there is, as I just explained. It ruins the entire point of the god damn block. Devoid is as if they printed Ravnica but instead of having tons of multicolored cards, they made a keyword that means "this card is multicolored", slapped it on a hundred monocolored cards and called it a day. It's the worst possible idea.

>They needed the lesser eldrazi to have color

Nope. Not going to even address the rest of your points because this is the sort of thing where if you disagree, you are just a fucking idiot.

>>49243591
>Implying there's a "right" way to play with printed cardboard

>>49243628
You can, but why bother if it's not your thing? I'd have more fun making something around cards I like. There's nothing wrong with being competitive, but tiers hardly matter.

>>49243163
>>49243189
a Japanese set would be all anime and mecha and giant robots and ninjas and kaiju and shoen action and such . Top Down only works when people actually get the top

>>49243223
>>49243263
Kamigawas lore was very well detailed and very fleshed out but also most people didnt get it. It wasnt like Gothic Horror or Greek Myth it was just weird ass shit tied to a very poorly done set with weak power level parasitic mechanics not interconnection between the blocks, ugly ass flip cards a ridiculous legend theme, a tribal that only really worked with the set and a play pattern that didnt capture the lore at all. It failed on almost every possible rubric which is amazing because so many of those failures acted a templates for what NOT to do that made magic better.

Kmaigawa was basically your first time having sex; it was fucking horrible but it was still a good idea and when you do it again it will suck less.

pretty much every part of kamigawa has since been done in a way that doesnt totally suck. The Japanese theme is the only one left really.

Its okay that you liked it but you are part of a very very very small minority.

>>49243636
>It ruins the entire point of the god damn block.
No it didn't. How the fuck is having a mechanic that makes colored cards colorless "ruining the entire point of the god damn block"? Do you think about you post? We had colored eldrazi before that filled the exact same purpose. The difference between the old ones and the new ones is the new ones actually qualify for the colorless matters support thanks to Devoid.
>If you disagree you're retarded
damn how can i live against that argument brb killing self

>>49243636
These aren't the same though. You still had to spend colored mana on those Eldrazi with devoid.

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>>49243614
Becasue it wasnt for weaboos; as the snl sketch points out webaooism is the kind of pop culture japanophilai wotc was TRYING to cash in on; instead you got super accurate obscure shinto stuff

Kamigawa lore was made for this guy...

>>49243708
Yeah, you're right. Still, that doesn't stop people from assuming it's weeaboo bait and disregarding the entire block based on that.

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>>49243708
When it should have been made for these people

Note that this was the same year yugioh began to rape mtg ins ales for about a decade straight; the card design change; creating duelmasters, kamigawa,

This was wotc on its maximum yellow peril mode. thrashing in fear of the spikey headed overlord who would soon have more cards sold than us currency existed.

Aaron Forscthe saved mtg by selling out; and Maro showed you can sell out and still make good shit (see: Innistrad, Empire Strikes Back, the dark Knight)

>>49243725
Its funny, it was weaboo bait but it FAILED to be weaboo bait and people still hate it for being weaboo bait.

It takes it from both ends.

>>49243552
You can play legacy with cheap brews as well, this doesn't make the format cheap

>>49243395
They were like Lorwyn changelings.

If you do colorness as a core theme you have to get the as fan high while not fucking the color pie and still being backwards compatible.

Devoid was how to do that. Eldrazi tribal would be too parasitic.

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>tfw there will never be a group of Walkers based off the Gang

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>>49242648
>mfw people in my LGS are comparing Chandra to Jace, tms

Why is everyone fucking terrible at card evaluation?

>>49243852
are you saying new chandra is bad, or just not the level of format distorting power that JtMS was?

>>49243847
Oh god someone stop my autism, i keep trying to colro sort them!

>>49243847
Green, Blue, Black,White, Red

This proves all colors can equally be crazy dicks

>>49243879
She'll probably be a fine fit in standard as long as red gets more help.

I really don't think she'll see play in any other format

>>49242885
It is a delicate dance for Wizards

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>>49243852
>Oh my god guys remember the last time they released a 4-ability PW?
Uhh, yes. Yes, I do.

And that's even before you take into account Arlinn and the like.

>>49243675
>made magic better

>>49243847
>Dennis: whiteblack human
>Mac: greenblack human
>Frank: redblack goblin
>Charlie: red human
>Dee: black aven

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>>49243893
red getting more help in standard
i have some bad news for you anon...

>>49243762
It makes Commander cheaper if you're assuming the best decks though because of only needing one copy of every expensive card. I don't think anyone was claimining ANY magic format was a "cheap" format.

>>49243620
No.

>>49243921
i-i just want searing spear...

>>49243907
>>Dee: black aven
HA!

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>>49243951
me too, anon... me too...

>>49243951
Anon that card sounds like it can target face and planeswalkers and that would be very unfun

How are players supposed to have an optimal* MtG game when you could lose quickly and get burned out?

*optimal = both players have to be playing midrange and have board states of 20 green creatures and planeswalkers that all draw 30 cards and value train the fuck out of everyone

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For the record, Commander is currently the cheapest format outside of Pauper. Even the meme format of Tiny Leaders has more expensive decks on average.

>>49242740
I hadnt seen this guy. He seems pretty rad.

>Filigree Familiar
>Speedway fanatic (I like the barge and the star destroyer)
>Dwarf Whitehawk

Theres a bunch of new cards I havent seen. Torch of Defiance seems really rad, but theres no way Im actually going to get to play her, seeing as her price point is starting at 50 dollars to preorder, and wont ever go down from there

>>49243999
>Kaalia: 408
rrrrrrrrrrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I WANT MY ANGEL DEMON DRAGON WAIFU

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>>49243907
>Dee: black aven

>>49243921
>>49243951
>>49243973
have you seen the set?
GR aggro or midrange is looking pretty good.

There's a 3/2 for 1R, a 3/2 that can attack as a 4/3 trampler for GR, a 4/4 haste, a 4 drop dragon that's looks pretty dec, and while I get you're all pissy that Harness Lightning can't target players it's versalitility with all the pretty good energy generation cards should not be ignored.

>>49243847
>"You know what guys, I'm sick of the Gatewatch getting all the credit and glory. Why them and not us?"
>"Because they saved Zendikar and innistrad"
>"pff, who cares. If we just saved a plane or two we would be just as famous."
>"You know what, let's do it."
>"Do what?"
>"Save the world."
>"fuck it, I'm in"
>"Me to."
>"Alright, let's do it. Let's save the world."
>The Gang Unleashes New Phyrexia

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>>49244055
but what if i dont want to run over my enemy with 20 red green stompies, what if i want to throw spells all over the board, instead of packing my deck full of creatures and lands?

>>49243992
>U/G crush is currently a deck
>Khans block saw control and combo decks being among the most powerful decks
>calling turbo emrakul ramp decks "midrange" makes the word lose all meaning.

Midrange is a deck type, and right now has a really powerful support card in CoCo, that card is rotating out. This hyperbolic doomsaying stopped being funny years ago.

>>49244107
then youre not playing magic right

>>49244119
:(

>>49244089
>The Gang Unleashes New Phyrexia

110% perfect. Spot on.

>>49244089
Perfect

So last thread one of the things that got mentioned was how things would be handled flavorwise in a return to Lorwynmoor set, we had something for the Kithin, Flamekin, Elves and Gobbos. But I'm wondering what would happen to the other races on the plane like the Treefolk, Giants, Merfolk, Faeries and Changelings.

>>49244107
Anon, red burn has been playing creatures since the dawn of times, even if it had to be Ironclaw Orcs and Goblins of the Flarg at first. If you want to play a Legacy burn deck with no creatures, play Legacy.

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>>49244039
At least Kaalia's deck is being reprinted next year in an Anthology Set, my boy Karrthus is still at ~$15, running Prossh at the helm doesn't really fit the bill.

>>49244158
im not saying that i dont want to play creatures at all, but it looks to me, that if i want to play monored in standard, my only choice is to play mostly creatures, instead of throwing in a support board, and letting my spells do the main part.

>>49244107
pure burn decks have always been a rarity outside of vintage, and if you haven't realized this you're high.

RDWs almost always used a fair number of cheep creatures, and mana is good enough that having a small amount of green doesn't really cost you anything.

All but one of the cards I listed was straight red, and you can play the mono-red deck. Or a nearly mono-red deck like the one that one a pro-tour within the last 2 years.

>>49243999
>tiny leaders
>being that much more expensive
wtf

>>49244177
most of the cards spoiled so far have been creatures, so yes it looks like the majority of the best cards are creatures.

You could try the thermo alchemist deck, but it's not that good.

As everyone pointed out to you, RDW always used creatures for the main source of to the face damage. The burn cleared the way and provided the reach.
A creature getting in will do more damage per mana than a lightning bolt.

>>49244219
Guess what, cheap spells tend to be pretty good, and good cards tend to cost a lot of money.

>>49244219
I was looking at the Oloro list there out of curiosity and, uh... it was very um... "untuned". To say the least. Tiny Leaders as a format was meant to appeal to competitive mindsets iirc so the decks there may be more tuned. In that instance this is probably misleading but a good indicator that the general players of the format aren't concerned with tuned lists so there's less concern with buying into them.

>>49243901
Holy fuck...

I just realized that the Black Gearhulk is perfect in a Kambal Deck running multiples of the Reservoir.

>>49244235
The difference is that red burn and red removal used to be one and the same thing but now they are separate.

I'm absolutely sick of seeing burn spells that are "target creature" only. Yes, they have their place but burn is supposed to teach an important lesson (that your life total is a resource to manage just like everything else).

I have no idea why they fear printing good burn when it is the easiest strategy to counteract as long as you actually devote some of your deck / sideboard to doing so.

I'll stop there lest I get into my full rant about how land destruction also taught players about having good deck design and that your manabase is just as important as the cards you actually play in your deck (if not more so).

>>49244158
>>49244187
Fuckers, don't be dense.
RDW has traditionally been 20 lands, 20 spells, 16 creatures and 4 wild cards. Legacy Burn runs 14 creatures.

But this is creatures the tappening and 20 spells is heresy! So we can't have Lightning Strike or even Shock anymore and we're forced to run green because they don't even print enough red aggro creatures.
Hell, the aggro deck of the current meta is mono-white because red just doesn't have the balls after uncle MaRo's reconstructive surgery..

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>>49242885
>what is affinity/tron hate
This is sideboard tech at best

>>49244555
The only kind of decks that have license to talk about it becoming creatures the tappening are control decks where in standard now the "control" decks are running like 12 creatures admittedly that's not too many compared to other archetypes but it's a far cry from what it used to be.

>>49244528
they don't only print one or the other.
They do still print cards that say or. One of the 5 spoiled instant/sorcery cards does. It's a limited spell, if a pretty decent one, but the point is they do it.
Rolling Thunder was printed in BFZ.

They separated some of them, because they can increase the power level for a single task if it can't do both. If lightning axe to target players too it would be amazing.
If Harness Lightning could target players too they'd have to make it's base power significantly weaker.

>I'll stop there lest I get into my full rant about how land destruction also taught players about having good deck design and that your manabase is just as important as the cards you actually play in your deck
that's true if the land destruction is restricted, if it can just target any land it just says "you might get fucked". It's why they still print LD against non-basics. You can't deck design around LD that hits basics.

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What do you think of the prices?

>>49244555
>16 Creatures
so, the mono-red deck that won a pro-tour in Khans?
Allow for planeswalkers to fill the 'spells' slot and this could easily be the case is very block.
>because they don't even print enough red aggro creatures.
So you haven't paid any attention to the red cards spoiled so far.

>>49244683
per-release prices are always made of hope, exploitation, and idiocy.

>>49244555
The only reason Legacy burn can run that many spells is that it has the entire history of the game to draw from. You can't expect Standard to have the same amount of burn, and if you do, you shouldn't blame developers for that (and certainly not MaRo, who doesn't even care about power levels).

>>49244683
Ordered a Chandra playset while she was still at $40. I hope I won't regret it...

>>49244683
Fastlands will probably go up a little bit as they get slotted into modern and legacy decks also based on what standard deck colors come out. Other things are probably a bit overcosted. Saheeli might go up if it turns out she's good as three mana walkers are really hard to judge (like with liliana.)

>>49243901
Jesus.

>>49244683
the only cards worth buying pre-release are rares

>>49244683
Chandra is powerful enough in standard to create her own archetype (i can see some goodstuff G or W deck splashing red for her and maybe some terribile burn), but I think Nissa is much stronger and creates more card advantage considering that her emblem is easy as fuck to activate.

>>49244753

Really like the new 5-mana Nissa. She closes games fast and can provide card advantage in a grundy match up.

>>49244753
Yeah, nissa's main benefit is that you need to answer her immediately or she makes your life really difficult.

>>49244632
>far cry from what it used to be.
>esper dragons 2015
>total creatures 5-9
and 4 of those are a looter that flips to a planeswalker, and not every deck ran those.
It was a pure control deck that ran 4 of one creature (and one of another) as finishers.

This was a year ago.
That same year a nearly mono red deck won with 27 spells. 8 made creatures, but that left 19 that didn't.

/tg/ doomsayers have the memory of damn goldfish.

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To the surprise of absolutely no one

>>49244844
Especially since it was posted on this board hours and hours ago.

>>49244779
>>49244787
her biggest problem is the decks that might want her most have some pretty good cards at that mana cost.
And her biggest advantage is turning on card advantage in the long game. She doesn't answer threats, and is only an okay threat producer.
So the question will be if those green decks feel they have enough card advantage, which they have pretty decent right now, and are willing to take out the answer cards to add her in.

Chandra provides card advantage to a deck to a color that does not have it right now. And that makes her more interesting imho.

>>49244869
nice card though.
Opens up splashing in limited, with an uncommon. Will help more aggressive mana bases in constructed.
And the energy can give decks that care about energy, which could be a lot, a benefit even if they've got the right color of lands that game. Which Ice Bridge couldn't and Ice Bridge was a good card.

>>49244089
I heard the theme music in my head at the end of your post, 10/10

>>49244260
My Queen Marchesa deck is my most expensive non-Legacy/Vintage deck ever, tuned with 9 fetchlands, 3 duals, ravages of war, imperial seal, damnation, LotV, etc.
When I built Tiny Leaders to try it ended up being singleton Shardless BUG and of course much more expensive than any Commander deck I'd done before and if I were to put it back together right now I'd exceed Marchesa by a couple tens.

>>49242791
It's Rai, dumbass. Learn to read.

>>49244528
>as long as you actually devote some of your deck / sideboard to doing so.
But they think that's "unfun".
And it's not only noobs and kitchen table players that have put them in that direction, the main complaint pros have against Modern is they have to think about, anticipate, practice and metagame against a wide array of different strategies that are equally dangerous.

So, WotC solves this by making every deck a Midrange deck. It doesn't matter that blue doesn't have good prevention or red good modular damage. Just play black/white removal and green creatures, have fun like everybody else! Stop asking for wrongfun stuff!

>>49243503
No, devoid missed the point entirely.

At least outside of standard/modern.

They just needed better ruling like "This has no colour identity" or something. All the eldrazi EDH generals are left scratching their head at not being able to use the only good colourless removals that aren't all is dust.

And then smart people who want to go colourless just run Memnarch.

But devoid, as a flavour and ruling, totally missed the mark.

>>49244718
Resell two ASAP and you'd be getting a 2x1.
Not even Mind Sculptor is played as a 4x, you only play 4x of walkers you expect to die right away like LotV.

So is every human on Kaladesh an Indian besides the Nalaars?

>>49245156
>So, WotC solves this by making every deck a Midrange deck.
>>49244814
Damn goldfish.

>>49245235
At least they improved on the idea with emerge.

>>49242648
Thriving Grub and Voltaic Brawler.
I like that they can use the energy they generate to become creatures I want to pay in an aggressive deck.
But they generate the energy etb, so if they hit with early game removal before they can attack, you're still up energy, which you can use for other cards.

aether hub, for all the reasons I said >>49244904

>>49245240
Oval Daredevil is pretty pale and a redhead.

>>49245295
Grubs will never be hit with removal unless it's hyper cheap 1 toughness removal.

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This looks pretty ok tbqh

>>49244844
Wouldn't have been surprised in the least if Wizards had made this a rare. Maybe even give it a bigger name and make it mythic.

>>49245332
Lilliana +1.
And it's attacking as a 3/2 turn 3. if you get more energy, it can become a even bigger.

Tap out leaving the 3/2 grubs there without blockers. 2R for the hellion, spend the hellion energy on the 3/2 grub, hit for 8. Yes the Hellion dies, but I still have a 4/3 left, and 8 damage might win the game.

Being able to do this seems pretty good for an aggressive red deck.
What it needs is a one drop, and not even that great of one.

>>49245391
I know, it's almost like WotC isn't actually an evil jew overlord ruining the game to earn a quick buck.
It's almost like they make some land and rarity consideration in regards to the very popular limited formats.
Quickly, let us ignore this evidence.

>>49245243
>Cards designed three years ago represent the meta of today.
If a strategy doesn't show up again after three blocks it may as well not show up again at all.

>>49245429
>I know, it's almost like WotC isn't actually an evil jew overlord ruining the game to earn a quick buck
Oh boy they've thrown a single bone that isn't really a bone because the land requires you to pump energy into it to be useful for mana fixing. I guess we should ignore the blatant abuse of the mythic rare slot and how within 2 years of introducing it, format staples were being thrown in as mythics to sell boxes!

>2016
>still playing constructed

Why, /tg/? This is not (entirely) a (You) bait, I'm really interested in your opinion.

>>49245440
>a tournament played less than a year ago isn't evidence that Wizards isn't trying to kill every single other archetype
>this one years meta is however, clear evidence that they are
>also, lets ignore G/U crush, pretend that turbo ramp decks are midrange, and anything else.

CoCo is really good and has powerfully shaped the meta. That's what happened. It's rotating out now. Take out every CoCo deck from the meta, does it still look like it's all midrange?

>>49245429
>The mythic lottery isn't real because they printed a slightly better tendo ice bridge.
Go away Trick Jarett.

>>49245515
If I were to pay $20 for at most 3 hours of "fun" playing cards I won't give a shit about as soon as I'm done. I'd play poker.

>>49245470
oh, they're out to make money.
They're out to make money long term though. They're a company that has a lot of community communication and market research, and has development and plans out to the future.

They'll push things into mythic, so long as it doesn't drive people out buyers, including casual buyers. They'll also put out specialty sets to introduce more copies of cards that people want, and they'll set the rarity to make people want to buy as many copies as possible.
Too low, they don't need to buy many copies, too high they won't see a value.

Aether hub is great at uncommon, and it being there wasn't an accident. It might have pushed more packs at rare, but likely WotC realized that it being at uncommon will make the limited format better, which will sell more packs.

They're not an evil overlords, they're a business, and a business with a long term business plan that knows that keeping the game healthy and fun is necessary for long term profit.
People don't realize how little "all companies are out to make money" actually says.

>>49245571
who pays $20 bucks for a draft with no prize support?
Between prize support and selling back cards my average cost for a draft is about $10. 3 hours of entertainment for $10 is better than what I get going to the movies or to a bar.

>>49243263
> People hated it because its mechanics were annoying garbage and its cards weak.

And because they didn't grok the theme, story, or lore.

Magic was doing the whole international distribution thing back then, right? Anybody know what Kamigawa's sales numbers looked like in Japan?

>>49243591
>thinking there's any way to play EDH "Right"
Oh boy oh boy, you're the kind of sperg that gets kicked out from EDH nights from being too annoying to deal with.

>>49245627
I paid $200 for Legacy Burn back in the day and it has given back over $14K in prizes and dozens of 5-6 round tournaments of entertainment.

Limited really is for fairweather players. Don't want to commit? Don't want to care about your cards? Just play shit for three hours and sell everything at the end of the night. It's neither the best way to make your money's worth in Magic, nor the most fun experience.

>>49245571
My LGS does drafts for 15€ and provides prizes. Also if there's enough people we play for up to 6 hours (even more for prereleases). Am I so lucky?

>>49245603
On the one hand you're saying Wizards knows what you're doing, on the other hand MM2 and Eternal Masters recently happened. And so did yet another FTV no one cared about.

>Aether hub is great at uncommon, and it being there wasn't an accident
Like seriously, big fucking whoop. Are you completely blind to the blatant abuse of rarities in a desperate bid to shift boxes? It's Games Workshop all over again.

>they're a business, and a business with a long term business plan that knows that keeping the game healthy and fun is necessary for long term profit
Get over yourself. If you'd ever worked for a big company in your life you'd know that their "business plan" is a clusterfuck of different people trying to do different things, usually to the detriment of the company. Paper Magic is dying. Back in Innistrad, my LGS used to have 20-30 people on an average FNM night. And this is a small LGS. These days Standard doesn't even fire half of the time, and when it does there's 6-7 people, with byes filling out the rest.

Just because they're out to make money doesn't mean everything they do is magically good for Magic. That's just naive.

>>49243901
It's more important that it's a 4-loyalty, 4-mana, 4-ability Planeswalker that offers card advantage, self-defense, and miscellaneous utility. It's still not on the level of Big Jace, but there's no Red deck in Standard that can reliably pay for her on turn 4 or earlier that doesn't want her, and Eternal formats just need the right shell (and that was true of JtmS, too - no one card enables a deck, but the difference here is that she needs a much more specific type of deck than "Card Advantage: The Card" did).

>>49243847
>Charlie the Rat King 1BG (3 loyalty)
>+1: create a 1/1 rat token with deathtouch
>-2: Sacrifice a creature, put a +1/+1 counter on target creature
>-5: Return any number of target rats, cats, birds, insects, spiders, or squirrels from any graveyard to play under your control

>Sweet Dee, Birdwoman 2WW (2 loyalty)
>+2 You gain 3 life
>-1: tap target creature, it doesn't untap during it's controller's next untap step
>0: Until end of turn, Sweet Dee becomes an X/X bird creature with flying and first strike where X is equal to the number of loyalty counters on it, it's still a planeswalker.

>Frank the Warthog 3WBG (5 loyalty)
>+2 add one mana of any color to your mana pool, you lose 1 life
>-3: Destroy target creature if its toughness is less than the amount of mana in your mana pool
>-10: All creatures get -4/-4 until end of turn. Whenever a creatures dies this turn you gain 2 life
>Dennis, Champion of the Sun WWR (2 loyalty)
>+1: target creature you control gets +1/+1, first strike, and vigilance until end of turn
>-2 Tap a creature you control: destroy target creature that doesn't share a color with it
>-5: Create a 6/6 white Dayman creature token with haste and 'when this creatures enters the battlefield, gain control of target creature until end of turn, that creature gains haste until end of turn'

>Macdonald, Pussy Fingered Nightcrawler 1BRW (5 loyalty)
>When Macdonald has 1 or fewer loyalty counters, transform him
>-1: target creature gets -3/-3 until end of turn
>-2: Gain control of target artifact
>Flip Side: Ronald, Aspect of Night
>3/3 Bushido 3, Infect

>>49245701
Yes, normal stores charge 4 booster's worth with 1 booster per player for prizes, and it's three rounds of win or out.

>>49243628
Why the fuck would I try and make EDH nights competitive, that's what actual formats are for, at least one day a week I should be allowed to play with jank nonsense and have fun with it.

>>49245769
>Anon, Faggot of 4chan

Does this count as Standard General?

>>49245783
no, that's the snowstorm thread

>>49245697
it is if you want it to be a 3 hour a week commitment and no more, and don't plan to make it an investment.
I bounce in and out depending on how good the current format is. I don't have to care about constructed meta, and if the next block sucks it doesn't effect me because I just bounce out of a bit.

Sure I could get more hours of fun, and more value per money if I committed more. But I don't want to commit more, I've got shit I'm doing and either like or need to do with the rest of my time and money.

I'm not shitting on the way you have fun. It's a different way, and good for you. My comment was only saying that even if you are a fairweather player, it's half as expensive as that anon was saying. And if that anon was you, you've got a pretty poor understanding of the cost of limited for limited only players.

>>49245707
>Paper Magic is dying. Back in Innistrad, my LGS used to have 20-30 people on an average FNM night. And this is a small LGS. These days Standard doesn't even fire half of the time, and when it does there's 6-7 people, with byes filling out the rest.
nice anecdotal evidence there.
How about looking at the actual sales figures and aggrogate tournament turn out. Which are steady or up.
The only time there was a serious dip was during the Cawblade period, and they recovered from that.

>on the other hand MM2 and Eternal Masters recently happened.
oh wow, their tract record isn't perfect.
MM1 turned out great, conspiracy turned out great, and Conspiracy 2 looks like it's getting even more buzz than the first.

>>49245843
Call it anecdotal all you want, it's happening all over my area (North West England). No one wants to play Magic anymore.

>>49245778
those stores kill their player base.
Not WotC, the store.
The local store that did this shit, it's lost it's entire player base. They drive an hour out to another store, which provides a great heaping extra $1.50 per player on top for prizes.

>3 rounds of win or out
Even the shitty store didn't do this. It's round robin.
The only place I've heard of that does this is Magic online.

>>49245867
so what you're actually saying is paper magic, IN NORTH WEST ENGLAND isn't doing so well right now.
Because if you want to talk about magic, you look at the damn stats for magic, not a small subpopulation which you should expect variance from.
And the damn stats for magic on a whole is it's healthy.

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>>49245376
would be fun with Jori

>>49245790
But I don't give a fuck about the lore.

>>49244844
That was rare in Kamigawa, so I won't complain.

>>49245898
Unfortunately I don't care about Magic as a whole. Who in the fuck would? You sound like you either don't play it, or care about shit that has nothing to do with you. Fuck this I'm out, thread and game.

>>49245571
>>49245697
Some people want a hobby, not a job.

Limited is the only way to play magic without paying out the nose or crippling yourself.

15 dollars , your skill , a place to draft and transportation is all you need.

No need to fuck with buylists, stock prices, investment or any of that other bullshit.

The pay to win part was always the most canceorus facet of tcgs. There is a reason draft is the primary played format (standard close second)

>tfw you have collector autism so you don't sell your cards
>need to spend a lot if I want competitive decks
Fuck the people investing on cardboard ;_;

>>49245984
and nothing of value was lost.

>Still no Red Gearhulk

So is it absolutely terrible, or it is gamebreakingly awesome?

>>49246188
maybe its 2RR destroy all other artifacts 4/4

>>49246188
1 damage

>>49244683
>aetherworks marvel is $6
Glad to know my budget casual MartyrProc gets something good.

>>49245843
Actual sales figures and tournament attendance saw a steep dip during first and second quarter.

>>49246021
>Limited is the only way to play magic without paying out the nose or crippling yourself.
That's kitchen table Magic.
Limited is the most hardcore play-to-win way to play magic because most players in the pod lose at the drafting stage and don't get a dime back from what they open.
Two good decks come out of any draft, the rest are cannon fodder and who you are in this equation has more to do with where you're sitting than your skill. Sometimes no matter how well you know the card's limited play value, the limited meta and how well you read ques, your deck can still end up bombless and underpowered.

>>49246212
Underrated post

>>49246308
Kitchen table magic is a bullshit myth.

You have to live with someone else they have to play magic and you need enough cards between you to have an endless series of games that will never get stale.

Its idealized fantasy. Like the Nuclear family, mainstreet and the ma and pop shop

>>49246308
salty as fuck

>>49246377
>Its idealized fantasy. Like the Nuclear family, mainstreet and the ma and pop shop
Good goy.

>>49246377
>tfw have rel life friends that play magic that don't smell bad and are happy to host casual games
Am I living the dream?

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>>49246212

This is how salty I'd be.

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Dynavolt Tower
3
Artifact
Whenever you cast an instant or sorcery spell, get EE (two energy counters).

T, Pay EEEEE: Dynavolt Tower deals 3 damage to target creature or player.

>>49246446
Good fuel for the UR Fever Dream. Get huge as fuck lightning whatevers.

>>49246446
But the red knot would be too broken at 2, or cheaper activation

>>49246446
so, i have to play 2 1/2 spells and tap my 3 mana artifact for 3 dmg, sounds good.

>>49246377
kitchen table magic exists, the problem is if one of you knows more about how to build a good deck and play well, you start wiping the floor with the others hard.

If you're all pretty decent at magic, then at least one of the group has the money to buy a better deck, and problems emerge again.
If a small number have the money, and are willing to contribute to the whole, you build a damn cube.

>>49246308
so your bad a drafting.
Because if what you said was true, people wouldn't be able to consistently win over 50% at drafts.
>because most players in the pod lose at the drafting stage
no, once you're pretty good at drafting, you're able to consistently get yourself a deck that at least has a chance to win.
You might not always get the best deck, but you'll always be able to get a chance.
And it's those players who actually have the higher win percentage across drafts.

Learn how not to lose at drafting. Also, learn to play better. You can't relying on winning at drafting, but most drafts no one 'wins' at the draft stage so hard that they can afford not to play well during the games.

>>49246505
Alternatively, just make use of the energy generation for better energy effects.

>>49246505
It's obviously a card that relies on other cards, so you can't analise it on vacuum. The other 2 1/2 spells that you cast will not be wasted since they will, probably, resolve and you can get energy from other sources, including the instant and sorceries themselves.

>>49246483
Of course, it's not rare.

>>49246446
ENERGY DECK IN STANDARD MARK MY WORDS

>>49246546
Like I said, bullshit.

In CCGs the first and last letter will always be in conflfict

>>49246446
Can create energy efficiently and is a good energy output itself. Not bad at at all if we just got some good rare energy instants & sorceries.

>>49243001
Darevioli darevioli give me the spaghettioli

>>49246724
>Collectability conflicts with Gameness
>In a fucking format where the pool is limited from the start

Please stop posting, kys if you're feeling up to it

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So, if pic related is the only card to create a thopter instead of a servo, they have to print a token just for her right?

>>49246913

There was another card that cared about thopters, so she probably won't be the only one.

>>49246913

Maybe it'll be the pre-release token?

>>49246377
>Kitchen table magic is a bullshit myth.
Is that why the vast majority of players play kitchen magic and are the biggest demographic?
t. Kitchen table player

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>>49246959
Damn youre right.
and there I was hyped about a single cool thopter token.

>>49246913
They are clearly spoiling in a very determinate order, so I'm pretty sure they are just holding out the thopters.

>>49246913
>>49247087
Having a million 1/1 Flying creatures in limited turns Flying into a bit of a mess. Not even Innistrad had a ton of Spirits.

>>49245515
Because pauper is fun

>>49245515

EDH.

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>>49247237
I tried anon but the games... when on for too long and without proper boardwipes and whatnot, it was just a fucking mess. This was like 5-6 years ago, I hope its better.

>>49247307
The format is fairly fast

I have very rarely seen impossible board stalls outside of tron on tron matches.

>>49247307
went*

>>49246505
It's repeatable and fills up on things you were already going to do anyway in a deck that wants it. It's not going to enable a deck anymore than that Chimera did, but it's not as bad as you're making it out to be.

1. Mr. Pay-2-Win
2. R&D trio
3. Crashing this plæne--with no survivors

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>>49244844
I was honestly expecting some sorta poo in the loo reference

>Still no good equipment to use with Sigarda's Aid spoiled

Is it safe to assume that card was just a bone for EDH players and it wont impact Standard at all?

>>49244683
Walkers are always overpriced at pre-order. I think Tibalt was $20 at pre-order.
I'm just happy that the most expensive card I want is Animation Module, and it is at $3.

Also, I'm surprised that Madcap Experiment is pretty cheap considering it's a rare that can cheat in stuff at 4.

>>49246446
This is going in my Modules.dek, being able to lightning bolt shit is pretty good.

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>>49247639
Pia Nalaar at 35ct
Shitbrewing is awesome :3

>>49247522
They've had a lot of equipment seeds planted since OGW and it appears that it won't go anywhere. The goggles are probably ok but it doesn't want or care about Sigarda's Aid.

>>49247639
Liliana was $23
JVP was $19

>>49247409
I'm sure it's fine in limited but if TITI didn't make spells deck a thing I don't think this will

>>49247692
>Pia Nalaar
You are reaching some serious levels of shitbrewing.

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>>49247759
I try my best to put the Shit in Shitbrewing :)

>>49247639
I sold two Tibalts on release week for $80

>>49247772
So, you are going to use the intro deck Chandra, right?

>>49247795
Well, I dont like her artwork, so maybe in the Sideboard :x

>>49247795
>>49247812
but im definetly getting a playset of her ;)

>>49243604
It's so weird though, they've become this casual pandering fun romp lore wise where back then what sucked us in was that lengthy Weatherlight saga or the Mirrari saga. And now they consider Kamigawa and Time Spiral to be the sort of shit they'll never do again because it is bad for new players, who are apparently the main audience of the game now.

Feels bad man.

>>49248714
What I don't get is that the enfranchised players are the ones who are cracking packs and attending tournaments / FNMs / drafts / events...not new players.

I mean, keeping fresh blood going is important, but that isn't where the income is mainly coming from, right? A new player isn't going to buy a booster box but someone who has been playing for 5+ years might.

>>49248764

Anecdotal evidence: I went to a Wednesday night magic where a couple of week old players bought a box on impulse after being introduced to the game by friends. Don't undetestimate the profit power of stupid, privileged college kids.

As for not giving a shit about the "veteran " players: just look at this thread. So many complaints, yet the salt-encrusted still continue to suppprt wizards.

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>>49243319
You know I can't believe I didn't see it sooner, but he has one of them pharoah fake beard things on his chin.
Did they hint at his "Not-Egyptness" since Alara?

>>49248837
Don't get me wrong, a lot of longstanding players simply buy singles of which WoTC doesn't see much of anything from so I understand the focus on a limited environment so that drafts and sealed will use product, but I always feel like there is a better balance to be had.

Then again player numbers are apparently higher than ever so what the fuck do I know? I can hate the Gatewatch nonsense as much as I want and complain about how burn is all but dead and land destruction isn't allowed but apparently I'm wrong on all fronts.

>>49248926

I'm with you, man. It feels bad that things like Reflector mage and spell queller get printed, but we aren't allowed a measley searing spear or lightning strike.

My point was that we just keep taking what we're given, which tells WoTC they can just focus on new players while ignoring us.

Please, Kaladesh... Just give me one 2cmc burn spell...

>>49249026
I'm willing to bet that Chandra is the big bone thrown to red for the set. The 4 CMC sweeper that you also have to sac an artifact for is supporting this theory (as is the completely weak-ass "shock two things" sorcery).

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>>49248900
vengeful pharaoh also has his horn and egg thing from magic 2012 so it seems like it's been the case for a while.

>>49249026
>One 2cmc burn spell.
They did, it interacts well with the number of good cheap red creatures that make energy when they etb. Red has a gotten some good stuff spoiled

O do you only count cards that can be aimed at the face.

>>49249177
doesn't hit face
isn't burn

>>49249177
Anon, if it can't go to the face then it isn't "burn".

Damage spells that can only target creatures are called "removal".

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>>49243319
Has it come up that the Aether Revolt symbol looks somewhat like a stylized Bolas?

>>49249197
>>49249208
I blame wizards they have started calling stuff like that burn which then causes a different view between new players and older players plus it lets them say "See we print burn at reasonable mana costs!"

>>49249266
I've seen it mentioned.

>>49249197
>>49249208
>Direct damage not dealt through combat, but rather by spells or effects

>>49249197
>>49249208
I started during The Dark. Direct damage spells are burn.

>>49249372
You realize that all damage cards could hit players and creatures until the NWO, right?

Of course you think all damage spells are burn. They ALL used to be that way.

>>49249372
I'm going to define direct damage as "noncombat damage created by a spell or ability that produces damage which hits a creature or player."
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/feature/feel-burn-2010-11-15

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Is this burn?

>>49249637
Well it isn't fucking removal...

>>49249637
technically it does not deal damage, and it doesnt target creatures or players, so it would be lifeloss.

>>49242648

1. Arborback Stomper
2. Aerial Responder
3. Woodweaver's Puzzleknot

>>49249266
You'd have to be retarded to not see its a lotus. Also Bolas' horns curve the other way and have an orb between them

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>>49249516
>You realize that all damage cards could hit players and creatures until the NWO, right?

Oh, right. I forgot they started NWO in fucking Odyssey.

>>49249758
>And have an orb in between them

Which could be taken to be represented by the central hollow in the Aether Revolt symbol.

>>49249516
there were burn spells that only hit creatures before NWO

>>49249572
except the "or" in this case means that the options among cards not within a card.
So Lava Axe and Lightning Axe are both direct damage cards.


If you'd prefer Searing Spear to Harness Lightning, then you are probably like those old players who through Lighting Bolts to the face, rather than at the Iron Claw Orcs, then wondered why they kept losing.

>>49248764
The primary weakness to mtg is barrier to entry. Before 2009 when they dedicated themselves to getting new players sets set hemmoraging sales and players because they were saturated the people playing mtg were the people playing and if a set didn't catch them well you just lost ten percent of your sales or some such bullshit.

a constant steady flow of new players is what let's every set break records as the best selling one time after time. It used to be you needed to be a smash like Invasion or Ravnica but now EVERY set does it because instead of one fluctuating core, you have that core plus a bunch of new people plus whoever stuck around from last year .

couple that with duels and net awareness and generally better sets just by factor of design technology advancing from experience and you see why mtg was finally able to best yugioh in 2009 after half a decade of getting its ass kicked (Every block between Mirrodin and Lorwyn/Shadowmoor inclusive lost wotc money and players with the exception of Ravnica. Alara neither lost nor Gained players and that was because m10 set off the expansion losses with its record breaking sucesss)

The Fifth Age of Design, New World Order ,The Aquisition Plan , Alternate Format Support and Aaron Forsythe fucking saved mtg. Cry sell out all you want but the game was in a fucking hole. Had things gone on I doubt mtg would be alive today .

They went from seven straight years of losing to seven straight years of constantly making more money and players than ever before .

Hard to argue with results.

Cry sell out all you want but selling out sold well.

>>49249637
damage causes life loss, but life loss doesn't mean damage. Bump in the Night wouldn't benefit from lifelink for example.

>>49249637
>It's a lightning bolt doing that classic horror trope where a flash shows the monster
>It's like poetry

why was Innistrad so perfect /co/?

One thing I love is how they started engineering the play patterns to fit the theme.

In Scars you FELT like you wete being fucked by pure evil when you fought Phyrexians, Innistrad stewed the whole game in a tension right out of horror, and it looks like Kaladesh is going super Johnny and super multi option game play to make you feel like an inventor

It brings role playing into the play space, which is great.

Werewolves FEEL like Werewolves. When I draft a bunch of spirits flying out of nowhere and fucking shit up while they can't be touched, I feel like I am haunting

Moni white humans makes you feel like you are leading the fucking crusade, just crushing guys under foot with an army of boots .

It's a really brilliant turn, I wonder how they will make Amonkhet feel Egyptian?

What would that even look like in Play pattern?

>>49249266
First arc is Eldrazi
second is Bolas
makes sense

Third would be Phyrexians then

Set up on Ravnica then payoff on new plane?

>>49246446
God I love lightning bolt visual puns

>>49244683

Baby Jace was the only planeswalker I regret not buying during pre-order. Newliana a shit.

>>49250172
Well the way they made gods feel like gods was by using devotion which worked fairly well I don't really want them to do that again with the new gods though.

>>49246446

MODERN S-T-O-R-M

>>49250260
>Do literally nothing on turn 3 and only be able to use it once per turn
>modern
sure buddy

>>49250097
Because R&D had been collecting every stray horror story card idea they'd had for over a decade. The reason Innistrad finally saw print was because horror was hitting a peak in popular culture at the time and they were able to convince the higher ups that it was time to pull the trigger on all those ideas.

It was a top down set that they had a huge amount of time to shake out all the bugs that usually come from doing so much top-down design. It followed on the heels of one of the highest power level sets Wizards has printed since original Mirrodin and so they were comfortable printing most of the cards at an attractive enough power level to be able to keep up with Scars. It was able to take the good parts of NWO, the focus on simplicity becoming elegance of design rather than low power levels, and the mechanical advancements they learned from their past mistakes like Flip cards to create a draft format that struck a balance, not confusingly complex, not brainlessly simple, and as flavorful as it was powerful.

It was a perfect storm where so many small things all came together at the right time, in the right order.

>>49242648
Demon of Dark Schemes, Thriving Rhino, and Aether Hub all strike me as being pretty strong.

>>49250172
>In Scars you FELT like you wete being fucked by pure evil when you fought Phyrexians

Infect was literally perfect for it.
Infect scares players. It turns combat into a war of attrition, where even their smallest creatures are chipping away at your defenses. You can always heal away damage, but poison is like a stain. It gets under your skin, even a single poison counter, knowing that there's nothing you can do about it.

It's a shame there is so much opposition to it in R&D.

>>49250395
they also made tribal work in a way that was fun to draft. Where it was a thing you COULD draft for, but not a thing you had to draft for. Where some of the cards rewarded you for having a lot of certain tribe, but others could give you a pay off by only have moderate amount of that tribe.

Where the tribes each had a play style they supported, so even if you didn't get any cards that specifically mentioned 'werewolves' there were cards that worked well in the strategy that could come from having lots of werewolves.

>>49250498
>You can always heal away damage, but poison is like a stain. It gets under your skin, even a single poison counter, knowing that there's nothing you can do about it.
it's funny how much this feel got across, given how little you normally play cards with life gain.
It happens, and we all know it can happens. But the majority of decks have no way of gaining life, and it rarely feels like a thing you need or want to add to your deck.

But somehow poison got this feel across. I think in part by connecting it with -1/-1 counters, so it kept that feel even when it was creature on creature damage.

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Translation?

>>49250624
Can't you tell from the art? It's clearly Wheel of Sun and Moon.

>>49246444
>Explosion Gearhulk
>When ~ enters the battlefield, destroy all other permanents
>"FUCK" - the consul

>>49250676
They've certainly errata'd the mana cost since last it was out.

>>49250624
>4 mana black instant with lots of text and cool art
I can't read moon but I like it already

>>49250677
>>49246188
>Whenever ~ enters the battlefield, destroy all artifacts.
>"You know, I genuinely forgot this was an artifact when I approved it." -R&D

>>49250717
It's an enchantment.

>>49250715
You have to pay more now, to adjust for inflation and because it comes with a dwarf too.

>>49250717
Whoops, it's an enchantment.

>>49250717
>instant

how do you know it's an instant if you can't read moon?

>>49250732
>Whenever ~ enters the battlefield, destroy all artifacts and creatures
>"Eyyy suicide bombs"
>Pia Nalaar

>>49250624
>2BB enchantment
>enters the battlefield with 7 time counters. At the beginning of your draw step, you draw additional one card, remove two time counters from
>Your maximum hand size is equal to the number of time counters on
>Whenever you discard a card, you lose 1 life.

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Boys, I think you may want to take a loo at this.

http://i.imgur.com/qSuSCgr.png

>>49250787
I found this elsewhere so I'm not sure of the accuracy of the translation.

>>49249266
I think it looks like Gonti's mask, kind of. And since he's an AETHERborn and it's called AETHER Revolt, it kinda makes a little more sense instead of hunting for hidden symbology of Bolas. He's pretty much confirmed to be the bad guy in the next set, and Tezzeret is accidentally gonna lead the Gatewatch to his desert resort. Tezz might as well be the Starscream to Bolas' Megatron at this point.

>>49250812
Don't get it.

>>49250828
It's accurate. Name of the card is literally "staying up late", by the way. Maybe it'll be "Burning the Midnight Oil" in English?

>>49250859
>Use liquidmetal coating on saheeli
>use her - ability to copy her keep copy
>repeat as needed
>opponent is milled out

>>49250871
So it doesn't sac itself when it runs out of time counters, that seems like it is real bad, like never played in any format bad.

>>49250876
Huh, seems real good.
hello to janky combo in modern?

>>49250891
It comes out turn 4, if you aren't emptying your hand fast enough or winning within 4 turns then you are doing it wrong.

>>49250624
>>49250787
>4 mana draw 3 cards over 3 turns
>lose your hand size and lose life when discarding and susceptible to destruction
Seems... bad? What's the upside? Is there one?

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>>49250812
>you may want to take a loo at this.

fuck me it was an accident I swear.

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>>49250918
Sure man go for it.

>>49250891
Yep, it's no Phyrexian Arena. I'm still waiting for them to print an enchantment that literally just says "At the beginning of your upkeep, draw a card". They've gotten close, but never actually done it.

>>49250955
You keep drawing cards even after it's out of counters.

>>49250945
Standard is far too slow to assume that to be true and other formats are too fast to play a 4 mana do nothing enchantment.

>>49250978
I mean, there are probably other ways to make permanents into artifacts.
and I did say janky.

>>49251011
True honestly not the worst janky combo in modern, the only issue you are likely to run into is that you literally cant beat an emrakul deck.

>>49250994
>You keep drawing cards even after it's out of counters.
Oh, that's pretty cool then. Phyrexian Arena +1 mana and without losing life unless you absolutely can't empty your hand

>>49251003
>draws you cards
>Does nothing
k

>>49251056
Does nothing the turn you play it which is the turn most decks in modern at least are looking to win, I certainly think you could do better with that mana in that format.

>>49250891
There's also at least one card that does mini-proliferate. There may be enough shenanigans for a very lucky player to keep it topped up, but yeah - the real advantage is that you keep digging, so if you value gas more than life and cards in hand (in a color that has the easiest time using its graveyard), it can be pretty damn good. Drop it once you've already exhausted your hand and just let it keep ticking.

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>>49250624
>>49250787
yo

>>49250624
>>49250787
>>49251003
Honestly I think it's great for Limited, but don't think it's going to be good for anything else. It's basically free steam when you get to late game and your hand is already pretty much empty.

>>49251187
new thread

>>49250624
>>49250624
>They turned an all nighter into an accurate card
>They release it late as fuck
>In another language so you have to spend even more time translating it

MAXIMUM OVER FLAVOR

>>49251410
Or, and hear me out here they released it at the correct time for the country that uses the language it is printed in.

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>>49250624
>>49250787
>I don't want this any more.
>You look like you could use it.

>>49251467
>Japanese
>Overwork capital of the world

HOW DEEP DOES THIS GOE?@!

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2W
Instant
Exile target creature you control, then return it to the batttlefield under it's owner's control.

Draw a card.

>>49243620
It's been discussed some. The Aetherborn are an excellent example of a sympathetic Black race, but I will explain the difference.

>Red: I'm doing this because I feel like it.

>Black: I'm doing this for me, I'm going to die soon and I want to live before that happens.