/srg/ Shadowrun General:

My players are new to SR so I'm trying to restrict them to the core rulebook (5e) for character creation so they don't get option overload.

One of them wants to play a Rigger. I know it is usually a bad idea for,new players but he is pretty good at learning lots of rules and I know for a fact he will read all of them.

My question is, are Riggers still viable without any of the content from Rigger 5.0? That means no vehicle mods, no hidden weapon mounts, no swarms, and none of the stranger drones or vehicles. But he should be fine with a typical Van and some roto-drones right?

>>49239148
It would only be fair. Giving a player Rigger 5 but not giving the others Run and Gun might lead to unstable balancing and/or jealousy among the players.

>>49239175
Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of. I may introduce new books once they are a few runs in but for now I'm just hoping balance is good across core.

>>49239148
>are Riggers still viable without any of the content from Rigger 5.0

Absolutely. I say this because 'viable' really depends on YOU the GM, because you're the one who determines the opposition. Rigger 5 gives the player a lot more options, that's useful for taking on harder challenges but you can easily set suitable opposition for core rules Rigging.

>>49239258
I guess you are right. It is a foolish notion. I obviously will only give them missions that would conceivably hire the kinds of characters the players want to play. It was more a concern of not giving them sufficient options to play their archetype right because of things like putting any weapons mount on your vehicles instantly making them forbidden and being forced to rely on drones and other players for shootouts or because they don't have sufficient ways to protect themselves from a security spider.

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>>49239148
Depends on the kind of rigger that he wants to play. Being a drone rigger without their book requires a lot of compromise, as drones are exceptionally fragile and kind of shit. So they'll get broken a lot and be kind of not good when they do get used.

I'm gonna repeat my run idea here from last thread

>The runners get hired to participate in Horizon's latest advertising campaign
>They are promoting a new ultra-luxury coffee delivery service, where your high quality coffee is delivered to you by real shadowrunners.
>A thermo filled with coffee worth like half a million nuyen must be delivered to a high-profile rock star, while filming their activities with a Horizon Flying Eye
>After slipping past all security undetected, they finally find the guy, who's playing some sweet riffs in a dark room(Voodoo Child starts playing)
>As they deliver the coffee, they realize they have actually stepped into a concert that's being broadcasted
>Fireworks go off and colorful AR displays advertise Horizon Shadowcaf as fans loudly cheer

How does it sound

Does anyone have any good adept power combinations? I'm a new shadowrun player that's looking to build an adept for an upcoming game. Just wondering if anyone with more experience had some suggestions.

>>49239460
Sounds silly and intense. 10/10 would keep the Johnson as a permanent contact

>>49239460
>Saints Row 2.5

>>49239761

Isn't that basically Pink Mohawk in a nutshell?

>>49239795
By the looks of it, yes more or less

>>49239795
>Isn't that basically Pink Mohawk in a nutshell?
Pink mohawk's often less tongue in cheek. You do over-the-top bullshit, but still take it semi-seriously. The Saints Row franchise intentionally makes itself the butt of its own jokes.

>>49239941

Still, makes for a fun SR campaign.

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To the 4e anon looking to catch up to 5e,

Don't read Boston Lockdown. That subplot is dying and for good reason. Read Market Panic if you want some actual setting progression and interesting hooks, then go back to BL if you have the time and the inclination to read about another bodysnatching metaplot.

>>49239962
For sure.

>>49239966
>Read Market Panic if you want some actual setting progression and interesting hooks
And a complete lack of knowledge as to how business and economics work

>>49240226
Are you the guy who\s still bitching about the Excalibur?

>>49239761
>Said pretty much the same thing in the last thread

My nigga.

>>49238945
>Connecting to Renraku Public Grid...
>... Sleazing Grid ID
>... Persona Mask Applied

I think I asked this a few generals back, but don't believe I ever got an answer.

Usually we start the generals with the login/connecting code sequence from SR5 and the likes - is there any noticeable difference between the type of code sequence that would go through between jacking into the Matrix during the 50's era of cyberdecks, versus the post-Crash 2.0 era?

That is to say, what would be written down if you wanted to emulate the jack-in/login code sequence during the 50's?

Given the op, what's the sleaziest character you've ever made?

I hate the way people always make their pcs handsome with flawless skin; made a rigger who watched porn and BTLs while waiting to be needed.

>>49240360
>That is to say, what would be written down if you wanted to emulate the jack-in/login code sequence during the 50's?
This shit was all made up off the top of a hat. Make up different shit if you want.

>>49240405
'Top of your head' is the phrase.

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>>49240375
Made an actually racist orc supremacist once. He would go out with his buddies and beat the shit out of other metas they found walking around alone.

>>49240375

I keep trying to make a witch hunting radical Christian mysadept that specialises in counterspelling and banishing in Chummer but it feels like I'm trying to do too many things at once.

>>49240276
I'm sorry I expect a game about big business to know how big business works

>>49240375
Haven't played him yet, but I made a spy working for the North Korean government in exile (now basically a criminal organization hat specializes in drugs and counterfeiting) who is basically a drug dealer.

>>49240432
Huh. So it is.

>People unironically playing SR5 now
What happened to /tg/?

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>>49240513
Despite the explicit explanation, both in the books and elsewhere, that the Excalibur was a PR disaster that is necessitating a shift in Ares branding and backfired in the boardroom due to previously established rivalries, but did not actually have a huge effect on the finances of Ares beyond endangering their standing arms contracts with the UCAS?

Are "never cut a deal with a dragon" book any good?

>>49239460
Yes. That is all. In fact that's so much yes it'll now be the next run.

>>49239966
I wanna be people
>Be People
I don't wanna be people, I can't live in a world where I have to take a shit.

God AIs are so WHINY

A bunch of new-to-shadowrun players wanted to play, and I was the only one with any experience so I was running a game for them.

I didn't really put a lot of effort into everything because none of them had played SR before, and half of them had never played tabletop, so I just re-used some of my retired characters from when I used to play as NPC contacts that gave them jobs.

>TFW on the group's first face to face contact with my old rigger which was by far my strongest character, the group's orc who decided to be the group face threatens her
>Nobody in the group actually had a single point into social skills, the rigger contact on the other hand did
>NPC rolls intimidate against the group and since nobody had any social stats they all get 0 hits and take reduced pay for the job

Seriously though. The meeting took place in the rigger's own garage, full of home made drones that cost hundreds of thousands of nuyen as well as various automated defense systems and the orc player honestly thought it was a good idea to wave his gun around at the first contact they've had in the game.

I would understand if he had any skill in intimidation or if it was in a public place, but... what do you expect from somebody that's never played tabletop and is essentially playing a Chaotic Stupid character?

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>>49240672
So many new players just try to strong-arm their way through games. I blame vidya, and specifically the fact that in a lot of western rpg vidya the PC can do whatever he wants and there's never blowback beyond someone saying something in the moment. You can be a complete dickweed and extort everyone you come across and you don't lose a thing.

>>49240713
Honestly, every group I've ever been in or run has had THAT GUY that has to be the edgelord that flashes his weapons in every encounter.

You know the guy, the one who designed his character with no purpose besides combat, and when he's not rolling dice to kill things he's not paying any attention to the game.

>>49240405
Fair 'nuff. Just figured I'd see if there was any kind of standard of generally-agreed-upon idea of what it'd be like before going off and doing something like that.

What's the wizzest thing you chummers have done in-game?

>>49240582
I'd chalk it up to mainstreaming, and a little bit of this >>49240713

SR5 tends to play pretty easily with the edgy 'do what I want without consequence' crowd, and for better or for worse that'll be what filters into even /tg/ over time.

When Empowering your attuned animal with Qi Marks, do those Qi Marks contribute towards addiction for you?

I'd hope not, since you're not empowering them for yourself, you're doing it for the animal.

>>49240838

Weirdly enough, I'm playing SR5 and I keep anticipating consequences. I've already compiled a list of things that could come back to bite us on the arse, called the "we're fucked, aren't we?" list.

>>49239148
Let him have armor mods at the least.

>>49239148
If he's going to do any real drone rigging (read more than two or three shooting drones) you may want to allow the swarm program if only because it's a fairly simple way of speeding up resolving a whole lot of shots going at a target.

So /srg/ how does this sound for a first time run for a group that's entirely new to Shadowrun?

>The charismatic fixer sits down with the group, talking in a heavy Brooklyn accent
>"Look, ya know I like you guys. But you're small time. However, I've got a certain Mr. Johnson knocking on my door, and he's asking for experienced shadowrunners. I dropped your names and told him about you guys's skills, and he liked what he heard for the most part. But you ain't getting the primo jobs without proving yourselves a bit to him."
>"This first one is simple enough; a secret datacache got geeked in the Barrens, and Mr. Johnson and his Corp can't claim said data personally without being suspicious. You just need to get in the morgue before they slice the body up like a Tofurkey on Thanksgiving, make a small incision above the left ear to gain access to the subdermal Data Lock, unlock and extract it with this cyberdeck. It's all that one's good for, and any other action is locked up with some serious AAA security protocols. Sew him back up, and leave. Low security, low risk."

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>>49241282
>doesn't say "youse guys"

I shoot him immediately, clearly a bug spirit trying to lure me into a trap.

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>>49241282
But seriously, it sounds fine as a start. What's the twist?

>>49241293
I keep seeing lots of pics of people with multiple arms through augmentation. Is that actually in one of the shadowrun books somewhere and I've just never notcied it?

>>49241326

Nope. The only way to have more than 2 arms, cyber or otherwise, is to have a metagene quality related to it.

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>>49241326
No, it's just a cool looking thing. They don't want to put in multiple arms because they're afraid it will break the system. They also have Nartaki, because they're dumb.

>>49241303
The first couple runs are just proving grounds to ease the players into it, difficulty getting higher with each one. Deliberate plot twists don't come into play until they earn the trust of Mr. J through their fixer Benny

>>49241345

They don't really like multiple ANYTHING really. Multiple attacks are kinda awkward too.

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>>49240978
You'd probably have to ask your GM. Per RAW, attuned animals are mundane and have no MAG rating of their own. A qi-mark would automatically trigger focus addiction for them.
>>49240790
The fluff template we use started with 4th Edition, as far as I'm aware there aren't any fluff bits from earlier.
>>49241282
>Being given a cyberdeck
Ehhhh. Even if it's locked down, that's a few tens of thousands of nuyen you're giving them. Make it a modified commlink or somesuch and you're more or less golden.
>>49241326
Nah, it's not permitted in Shadowrun, for Reasons related to a bunch of fluff that doesn't really exist anymore. Mostly we just like the art style.

Hey /tg/
I'm new to SHadowrun (after having played the recent videogames) and a friend of mine is gonna run me and some others through a one-shot. I had this idea for a rigger that sets up inexpensive drones (possibly made from scrap) as "intelligent explosives" (think flying up to someone's face and exploding). How possible/viable is this? I know drones aren't exactly cheap normally speaking, but there's gotta be some way.

>>49241384
Good point about the cyberdeck. My reasoning was even if they're new players, why would they screw themselves out of a AAA corporate run "contract" for what is pocket change in comparison?

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>>49241366
But there still ought to be something that makes things exciting.

Maybe the Mealtime Killer's latest victim is at the same morgue, and there's a news crew trying to sneak in at the same time as the PCs to get some choice footage. Or the Mob is holding a send-off for Two-Grins O'Flanagan, an old bartender with 5 decades of serving drinks to the Finnegans. Something that doesn't fuck them over, but makes it a bit more exciting than just getting into a building.

>>49241430
Horizon Flying Eye has a flashbang version. It's super expensive to try to do that as a permanent gimmick, considering grenades are less than 100 nuyen and the Flying Eye with smoke and flashbang is 2500.

Just get a grenade launcher on a rotodrone.

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>>49241450
Because players are often greedy and shortsighted; if they have literally any piece of equipment, they'll do whatever they can to keep it permanently, even if it fucks them over to do so.

How open are you in your campaigns to big plays that change the status quo?

The Shadowrun universe does not come off as a static place. The timeline is full of upsets, invasions, mergers, breakups, assassinations and so on. New editions also bring big changes. Do you keep that going in your games, or try to stay away from the big setting features so it's easier to integrate future content from the main timeline?

If your games have ever had big changes to the status quo, let's hear it!

>>49241487
Hmmmm.... How about it's the same night the anarchist gang decides to start torching shit with Molotovs, so now the runners need to escape while staying low and off the radar from the cops as well as the gangers?

>>49240432
and I say it "off the top of my ass"
people can be different chummo

it's how you can tell you're speaking a living language...

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>>49241627

I can dig it.

>>49241384
> A qi-mark would automatically trigger focus addiction for them.

That's a huge drawback, and kinda defeats the point of attuning with your animal. (Hey let's make a deep bond with an animal only to make it an addict.)

They're probably not affected by it.

>>49241582
I always found it super weird the NANs still exist when they're obvious buffer states the real powers should be mulching through on the way to North American Reconquista
My campaigns basically always have a bunch of wars big and small where CAS, UCAS and Aztlan are all grinding their way through Natives to get into position for the next big war.

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>>49241627
That would work nicely. Just something that throws a bit of a monkey wrench into their plan.

>>49241638
It's funny when people make a mistake, and admit it, then a couple hours later someone comes along and says "Nuh-uh, it's not wrong." Your choice to malform an idiom to fit in more profanity is your own choice, but that doesn't mean that you're correct. Living language is a spook used by people who are unwilling to communicate in the same way as everyone else.

>>49241384

What effect does focus addiction actually have anyway? The core book is annoyingly vague in that regard.

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>>49238945
Yo, I'm making a Jewel Thief/heist infiltrator, I need a secondary function that'll complement my skills. I originally thought decker, but doing so would limit my contacts and skills, plus my group just got a technomancer. I was thinking poisons and drugs, any other suggestions?

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>tfw you let the Adept have a drag of your Deepweed

Mistakes were made. Things were seen. He punched a hole in our van and that's coming out of my pay check.

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>>49241747
Combat/gunslinging is easy with a physical infiltrator's AGI. Face is a possibility.

>>49241807
Hmm, how would martial arts play into gunslinging? For instance, using Gun Kata when in close range or disarming someone and using their own gun against them?

>>49241582
immortal elves are dumb, I never have them or use them

>>49241001
have none of those things come back yet?

>>49240838
that right there makes me like it less
actions need consequences...I WANT stupidity to bite me on the ass

>>49241282
>>49239460
I was collecting interesting /tg/ characters from these threads

maybe I should collect run ideas and intros instead...

or is someone already doing that?

>>49241326
there are round about ways involving drones and rigging, but thats super clunky.

>>49241430
if you have a GM that lets you get away with rigging that shit quickly from literally 0-cost scrap then it's an okay deal otherwise no...drones be expensive yo.

>>49241704
>malform an idiom to fit in more profanity
nah, I malformed it because of "doing lines of coke off some strippers ass"

and I told nobody it was wrong I simply said that people can say things differently. I've never heard "top of my hat" before but I have heard "top of my brain" and "top of my shit" and I know one carpenter who says "off the back of my hammer" all to mean the same thing.

to improvise

>>49241760
what possessed you to give, ANY superhuman, drugs of any kind in an enclosed space?

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>>49241694
The benefit is mostly gaining Sense Link and the ability to use it as a material link for casting. You could make an argument that it's essentially equivalent to Quickening, but Adepts Don't Work That Way so it's kinda thorny. Besides, most rituals are garbage anyway. No real reason for Empower Animal to be any different.
>>49241720
Well, it's a psychological addiction with a threshold of 2 and an addiction rating of the combined force of all your active foci. Without getting into the specifics of the clusterfuck that is calculating how often you make the tests, you essentially have to get two hits on a LOG+WIL test to resist the addiction.
You're supposed to work with your GM to decide what that will mean for your character if you do get addicted, but in most cases it just becomes a death spiral.

>>49241720
Basically you gain addiction and because of the nature of that addiction turning off your Foci, even when needed, is going to be difficult to do.

The exact mechanics of that, however, are a thing that I'd say really depends on both the nature of the foci in question and the addiction level. Except for this. Assume that given the chance a focus addict at a level beyond mild is going to keep them on and try to make sure to avoid situations where they'd be shut off in something of the inverse of how a dry addict it tempted to fall off the wagon.

>>49241836
Cowboy Way is what you want for disarming people. Gun Kata is not awful either, depending on what you want about tricking people vs. shooting really well.

>>49241582

My players and I are a bunch of softies, so we always start setting right what went wrong in my games. Lots of helping good people take power in corporations and governments and working up alliances between different good characters in the setting, along with beating on bad guys like Aztechnology or racist anti-meta organizations.

I want to piggyback on your question and ask people if you feel like you need to stick to the tone of Shadowrun? A lot of people seem to take it in a grimdark direction where everyone has to be amoral money-grubbers and things can only get worse but I don't think it has to be played like that. I don't even think the source material is supposed to be read like that, but the earlier stuff did look more lighthearted compared to now. I blame 40k for convincing everyone roleplaying has to be grim and dark.

>>49241876
>have none of those things come back yet?
>yet

I dread the day that the yet comes to pass. The list includes:
>blowing up the restaurant of a local mob
>stealing some kind of in-development simchip that was rumoured to boost the intelligence of the user permanently, but was under perhaps the least protection possible whilst still actually being protected. Ish.
>failing a job for the Triads through no fault of our own (the girl was actually dead before we got there)
>stealing the Yakuza member who was responsible for killing said girl and handing him over to the Triads
>killing a senator (which in all fairness we were hired to do. We even made it look like an accident)
>getting a bunch of civilians killed in the process of killing said senator (how were we supposed to know the troll bodyguards would panic and open fire on the crowd?)
>trying to rob a bank and failing
>causing a number of explosions and then pinning the explosions on the local mob from earlier
>robbing the same bank and succeeding, and then blowing the bank up
>stealing a magic scroll of Aztec origin from said bank (I know enough about SR to know anything Aztec is usually bad news)

And now we're in that god damn Renraku arcology. You probably know which one.

>>49241885
>You're supposed to work with your GM to decide what that will mean for your character if you do get addicted, but in most cases it just becomes a death spiral.

That's the bit I don't really understand about focus addiction. The rules are nice and simple, it's the actual effect of being addicted I don't know.

>>49241303
>>49241366
The big plot twist will ultimately fall on the players themselves. One of the later runs will give them a chance to download a copy of the Data from their first run, which will reveal that the Corp they're working with is planning to have faulty codes implanted across the globe into every personafix Simsense chip, that causes it's user to go into a murderous rage a la Deus Ex, however the Corp plans to make a big dramatic announcement while using a shutdown code they "worked on diligently nonstop since the malfunction" in order to shell out their NEW Simsense, which even though BTLs aren't exactly legal products, the new chips will be far easier to produce into BTLs. So now you'll have scared legal Simsense users buying them en masse, but crime syndicates buying them in bulk too to turn into fast and easily made addictive chips

Are there any hammers in SR5 that are actually designed for use in a fight rather than being improvised? I don't want to have to use a club and refluff it if I don't have to.

>>49242103
If they fail to get this information to stop it, or don't give two shits, they'll now also have to deal with enraged rogues who come from all manners of privilege

>>49240672
This story sounds unfair to the player. If you have friends who haven't played Shadowrun or even haven't roleplayed at all, you should do your best to set up a game that'll help them learn and have fun.

Having someone make a rookie mistake then turn around and tell a "get a load of this moron" story about them isn't a good way to promote your game.

>>49240375
I played a Decker once who
>wore suits over t-shirts with old band names or vintage pixel art
>was a gigantic hipster when it came to matrix games, music or anything, preferring "vintage" early 21st century stuff
>constantly rubbed that in everyone's face
>wore a fedora everywhere, combining it with a vintage gas mask on runs to conceal his identity
>used "that guy in a suit with the green apple concealing his face from the famous painting" as his Matrix avatar to show how refined he was
>was otherwise a sleazy coward
The gruff Street Sam threatened him with physical violence about five times per session. It was a blast.

>>49240375
Our rigger is addicted to porn, and his encyclopedic knowledge of Rule 34 helped us in a johnson meeting.

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>>49242072
the triad, yakuza, senator, the dead civillians, and the number of explosives. shouldn't come back to haunt you if you did them right...cause you were hired to do them. it's bad buisiness to shoot the messenger or hunt down the runners who ran on you, if you are offended you hire runners to run on the guy that hired the first runners

>You probably know which one.
the name Deus comes to mind

mind the murder-drones.

>>49242213
>the name Deus comes to mind

Yeah that sounds about right, though in game he's been referred to as "Father" or "The Great Father", and angelic named entities have been keeping us out of the computer system.

We have seen the spinning dreidel things briefly and ran from them, though I refuse to call them Whirling Dervishes on the grounds that if I keep mocking them, maybe I'll do some kind of emotional damage to them (and given that I'm the face of the party, I'm probably best equipped for that. Maybe.)

Also, we were never hired to cause explosions. They come by default with our decker/demolitions expert. Did I mention we blew up the Yakuza guy's super yacht too? Turns out rating 6 explosive foam stuffed inside 2 squeaky orc toys and placed near the engine does a lot of damage. In all fairness though the yacht in question was called "The Sea Fucker", so it kinda deserved it, if just to preserve some decorum and good taste. Standards and all that.

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>>49242310
the dervishes aren't even the worst thing...

and did the team punish the demo-decker suitably for not explaining the power of the explosive squeakers

>>49242348

The explosive squeakers became the default explosive delivery device after the 1st run, which is where he got them from (they were the toy that came with the kids meals, before we blew the place to kingdom come, he looted a bag full of them). So yeah blowing up the yacht was intentional, but made it onto the list. That said, the demo-decker has been vigilant in hacking every camera he can, so that helps.

>bumblebee
So that's what stung our heavy weapons troll in the last session! I guessed it was some kind of bug but the little blighter was too fast for any of us to get a good look at.

So im planning a run where the runners a hired by Mr.Johnson to steal something out of a secured facility.

The clue is, that Mr.Johnson is the Chief of Security of the facility and wants to demonstrate the lack of safety equipment at his disposal.

Therefore he offers the job, but the runners have to keep it non lethal to receive the full pay, or otherwise they will have to suffer great pay cuts.

The Runners should be oblivious to the fact that the whole run is "just a test".

What reason could a Johnson give to make the whole run non-lethal ?

TL;DR Need reasons/lies for a non-lethal run from Mr.Johnson.

>>49242418
did it do the 10 lethal damage?

>>49242455

Thankfully, our heavy weapons troll survived (she took about 6 boxes of damage in the process though, thankfully the GM let her roll Body to try and resist the damage) though she's gone even further into "terrified Scooby Doo" mode.

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>>49242448
>I don't want any bodies.

All that needs to be said. The Johnson's reasons are his own, you don't interrogate him about why he has certain specifications any more than you ask him what he wants the MacGuffin for. If they press him, he says that he doesn't want corpses that draw attention, just the job done quick and quiet.

It's up to the players to decide if they want to dig into the Johnson's fake identity to uncover motive

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>>49242531
yeah, that place is STILL a hellhole

Are there any qualities, defects, or other effects that make it so you can't freely jack out of VR? I've got a rigger concept in mind, but it doesn't work so well if they can just hop out of a drone they're Jumped In to as soon as shit starts going wrong.

>>49242541

We've only met the dolls and the people with cold brains, and seen those dreidel things and half the party is already creeped out. Hell, the demo-decker refuses to even consider hacking one of the dolls to try and figure out what makes them tick, and like I said the heavy weapons troll (who is larger than half the party combined) is in full "terrified Scooby Doo" mode, complete with hiding behind smaller party members.

>>49243171

I know you can get Link Locked in VR, but that's something done to you by IC/spiders rather than done to yourself. That said, don't forget that dumpshock is a thing, so you usually want to switch to AR first before jacking anyway, especially if you're in hotsim.

>>49242538

The Johnson could even add that they're paying extra specifically because they want no bodies. It's pretty standard for Johnsons to pay extra for stipulations like that, or even include optional bonuses based on how it's done.

>>49242199
>his encyclopedic knowledge of Rule 34 helped us in a johnson meeting.
I'll take "What do you not expect as a character trait?" for 500, Alex

Am I reading Nine Paths to Enlightenment right? It seems to imply that, for the opposed test for a given trial, the GM picks a stat and that's the one you use, and then they use the other one. However, at first glance it reads like they pick a stat which they use, and you get the one that's left over.

>>49241384
holy crap what is this image from

>>49243297
A Quality or some kind of device fault that causes you to get link-locked through normal use is more what I'm looking for. Where once I'm Jumped In, I've got to stay in until I get some down time, unless I want to eat some biofeedback by jacking out.

>>49242199
>and his encyclopedic knowledge of Rule 34 helped us in a johnson meeting.
I've got to know how

>>49243713
Ask your GM if they're using Omega grade 'ware, and if so take your Control Rig as Omega Grade and see if that can be your downside in exchange for the cash and availability breaks.

>>49243991
Huh, that could work, thanks. Honestly, I'd have paid extra to get that feature - it's important for fluff reasons, even if it's mechanically debilitating.

>>49244054
It's less a feature and more a horrible drawback along the lines of being unable to (voluntarily) jack out or switch modes if somebody else owns your deck and doesn't allow you to do it.

Only slightly better because it's you doing it to you, and you've got some idea of how long it'll last.

How much armor is enough armor for your typical melee cyber samurai?

>>49244375
All the armor. But, really, whatever you can get away with in the circumstances you're in. Pick up a street set, a high society set, and a fuck it set.

>>49244054
I can't shake the feeling that you want that because you want your character to stay jumped into his Realistic Features 4 I-Doll or Direktionssekretär after each run.
Please tell me I'm wrong, and if you can't, please tell me the details.

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Odd question perhaps but what if any voice mod programs do you like to use when roleplaying? We're doing it over Skype and such and I think it would be cool to mess about with, at least pitch so my squeaky gnome doesn't have a deep bass voice, or perhaps so he does...

>>49244521
How about a aug'ed elven Decker that's two focus points when it comes to fighting are silenced pistols and hand blades for "fuck-your-shit-up" close range melee?

Who's two focal points are silenced pistols and hand blades*

Fuck me for improper syntax, right?

>>49239687
I'm a big fan of keeping it simple and focused with Magic 6, Improved Initiative (or whatever it's called) 3 and Combat Sense 5 (eventually 6 when you can swing it through initiation or mentor spirit). That eats through your entire power point allotment, but if you combine it with maxed out Reactions and Intuition, then you get a character with a frankly ludicrous defense dice pool of 20. It's not optimal to focus on defense when you could be attacking, but I like it.

>>49239687
It depends on what kind of adept you're going for. Adepts are very specialized. You can go infiltrator, combat, or do a face role and be really good at it, but mostly just at that thing.

>>49244797
Depending on your augs, I'd suggest getting a simple armored jacket with gel packs and a bit of anti-fire and anti-shock mods in it as a general purpose base for keeping yourself alive.

Now if you have High Str, strap on at least one point more of +armor stuff than you have Str. Probably not a shield, though, because it and a helmet require a lot of Str.

>>49244562
It's actually because I'm angling to play out a scene where the Rigger is stuck in their drone, but their comatose body is under threat, and instead of just jacking straight out they're forced to play keep-away to get their meat body somewhere safe - like Jimmy from Hardcore Henry, or whatever, and I don't see that happening by waiting around for an enemy Decker to lock them in.

>>49244208
Like I said, even if it's mechanically debilitating, I want it for fluff reasons, and I'd have been willing to actually pay extra to get it, rather than taking it as a flaw, or whatever. Luckily, the omegaware idea's perfect.

>>49244375
>How much armor is enough armor for your typical melee cyber samurai?
As much as humanly possible. It's a colossal advantage to be able to take Stun damage instead of Physical, so 25+ is perfectly reasonable for the character who wants to not-die.

>>49243842
We did this run where we protected two rich kids at a gamecon.
The Johnson wanted to meet with us inside a secret server on a matrix game. The problem? None of us are gamers.
At first, the meet went poorly, with our Johnson shocked at how normie we were.
Our rigger than asked to roll knowledge: Porn, just to get some intel on what the fuck we were doing.
>10 dice.
>Our rigger has 10 fucking dice in Knowledge: Porn
He aces the roll, and begins to remember all the porn he wacked off to about the female characters of the game.
He then managed to have a lucid conversation with the Johnson, proved that we are hip and cool enough for the job, and score us a bonus 5,000 just for impressing him.

What role do you imagine a runner named "greasy joe" would play?

I know he's going to be fat, sweaty, and cigar smoking.

>>49245775
The obvious choice would be face, but I got an image of a street sam from that.
Imagine that you meet a big, bulky guy with skin like a short-order kitchen floor and who looks like he's in bad health, but could easily pass for a mafia boss. He's wearing a suit and has clean, soft and sweaty hands - most people with experience with shadowrunners would say he's a face.
Except the hands are SOTA synthskin, and under that is God knows how many pounds of armored cybernetics and even more guns. I'm not sure how cyberlimb capacity works in 5e, but you could cram something in there that's at least fluffed as a Tommy gun.

>>49245775
chemical weapons rigger

the grease layer is a defensive tactic against his own weapons

rig that guy with every drug in every form. and he always carries plenty of lube and glue and structure-barrier foam also acid capable of burning through things...and to a lesser extent, explosives usually in binary chemical forms

>>49245775
Mafiosa face. Dump it all into contacts and drug smuggling using a chain of diners as a front. Don't be the powerhouse. Command the powerhouse.

>>49245775
Mage focusing on fire spells. Overdoes enemies just like the cheap burger 'meat' at a greasy spoon level dive. (Or an Adept with a pair of Qi Foci giving Flamethrower and Fireball.)

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>>49241384
What is that image from and how do I make my computer it?

>>49238945
That picture made me cum twice today. First before work when I just randomly saw it on the first page of 4chan, then now again when I saw it in /tg/ while browsing. Cheers.

>>49245822
I thought most faces were skinny elf pricks?

>>49246150
Just because that is the most mechanically advantageous way to play it doesn't mean that's the only way to play it. Lore wise there are probably faces and charismatic individuals of every metatype.

>>49246179
I just meant a tubba grease would be a kind of unorthodox face

>>49246189
I'm sure he means it's riddled with more pockmarks and scars than Danny Trejo's ass cheeks

>>49246189
>>49246150
Faces usually focus on talking to people (negotiating, seducing, con games, ...)
Remember that in SR CHA isn't explicitly explained, but seems more like force of will rather than appearance. Which is why there isn't much CHA ware and the Ware that exists (Tailored pheromones) Is more about making them more susceptible.

You can have an someone be the most beautiful little bitch in the entire megaplex, but who is a shitty face because he stutters, is easy to manipulate and doesn't have the drive to change peoples minds
And you can have people that look ugly as sin (e.g. Oni) but can sweet talk the pants off of you simply because they are confident, direct and ALWAYS know the right words to get you to change your opinion

>>49246370
Appearance likely does have some factor in it, because it is extremely blatant to anyone that looking good does increase ones inherent "charisma."

That and shit's scientifically proven.

>>49246370
In the 5e core it's called out as being not all physical but at the same time not being completely non-physical.

So a high charisma can be bad-looks-good-persona or good-looks-weak-persona but a really high charisma is usually good-looks-good-persona.

>>49246418
In Shadowrun, it's probably less obvious because appearance has become a commodity. Biosculpting and surgery have become cheap and effective, so even (or especially) people with bad charisma will get surgery to look better or worse. People are used to seeing metatypes, SURGE freaks, posergangs, biosculpted furries and freaky-looking mages, so pure appearance probably has a bit less to do with charisma in Shadowrun than it does in real life. It's still a factor, but the fact that you'll usually mainly be attractive to those of your own metatype who also like people with your kind of appearance while you're charismatic to everyone makes it a slightly smaller part of Charisma.

>>49246418
>>49246441
I was talking more from a 4e perspective

>Charisma is a nebulous attribute. More than just looks,
>Charisma represents a character’s personal aura, self-image,
>ego, willingness to find out what people want and give it to
>them, and ability to recognize what she can and can’t get out
>of people. A whiny demeanor, a me-first attitude, or an inability
>to read body language or subtle hints are just a few traits
>that can give a character low Charisma. A character with high
>Charisma might simply enjoy entertaining others, may excel
>at making friends and/or manipulating people, or may be all
>flash and fun with whomever it is today. A high-Charisma
>character might deliver jokes at the right moment, have a sexy
>way of carrying herself, or command respect because her timing
>is always impeccable.

So charisma seems more behavior rather than appearance
I know that there is a optional rule for GMs in Augmentation that depending on your appearance you get a ±2 dice modifier depending on how your appearance fits in. a completely unaugmented person my get a -2 DPM where Augments are seen as normal just as a razorgirl/-boy gets it in normal society

>>49245775
>What role do you imagine a runner named "greasy joe" would play?
Street Samurai. Have him be loaded up with a Nephritic Screen, Narco, auto-injectors, that kind of shit. Essence-loss and drugs both fuck up your health/metabolism, and for him it's led to him having glandular issues that make him fat, sweaty, with jaundiced-looking pale skin and bad acne.

And then, when shit hits the fan, he goes from being a nervous-looking, fat, sweaty guy who always smells like he could use a bath, even fresh out of the shower, to rocking a pharma-grade Kamikaze and Betameth speedball, with poisoned Spurs as his weapon of choice, his eyes wild, his skin flushed practically crimson with blood, and sweat pouring off of him making his clothes cling to him like he just got out of the rain.

If you can get your GM to give you those drugs on Chemical Glands, all the better, because that can further explain his glandular issues.

It'd work best as a dwarf, but an ork would be fine too, or a human as a last resort. Body/Willpower/Logic would be your primary attributes (for resisting mental and physical addictions), Charisma would be your dump, and the remainder would be as high as you can get them. So Attributes A, ideally.

>>49245943
Do you have a source for the elf with the FN FAL? I asked google and got nothing.

>>49245682

> Depending on your augs

Come one, that one augposter. You know who you are. I'm waiting.

>>49245943
>>>/g/

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>>49243696
>>49245943
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1xkXhYJKQ4

>greasy joe is either a sam or a face
Too bad you can't hybridize those too well without fucking over the end character.

So, when making stealth characters is it generally a bad idea to put smartgun systems on weapons? In case any decker running overwatch catches the runner?

>>49243272
I will pray for you.

>>49245765
>>Our rigger has 10 fucking dice in Knowledge: Porn
"I RECOGNIZE THAT BULGE!"

>>49247255
>generic porn
>not specifically metahuman & intermeta pornography

>>49247187
No.

Go wireless off when you're being stealthy, and use Running Silent when you need the bonus dice.

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>>49246712
It's my friend's character, a weapon specialist and former Tir Ghost named Banshee from our campaign. I belive they drew it as they are an artist and it's in their style but I've never asked her.

>>49245682
>gel packs
I'd strongly recommend against gel packs.

Don't get me wrong, the +2 armor is nice.

But in 5e, Knockdown is a hell of a status effect. You take a -1 to hit, your opponents gain +1 to hit you (and additional gain Superior Position if they're attacking you with a melee weapon), and you need to make a Body+Willpower (2) test in order to even stand back up - which itself costs an action.

Personally, I'd choose having slightly less armor over all-but-guaranteed knockdown.

>>49247760
Was your campaign from 2014? Because while I can't find a source on google, I can find posts using that image going back at least that far.

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>>49247899
Started in 2013, but the campaign ended at the end of 2015, so that sounds about right.

>>49247853
That's why I said it was aug dependant.

If he's got stuff in that boost his str (and thus Physical Limit) sky high, then the lowered limit wont' matter too much. Going from needing to take 8 boxes of damage in a hit to needing to take 6 in a hit is bad, but either of those were shots that you didn't want to take in the first place.

Now, if you think they're going to be packing Gel Rounds, then definitely don't go for it. In that case anyone not a heavily chromed Troll is going to get knocked down.

>>49247853
>If a character takes a number of boxes of damage (Stun or Physical, after a Damage Resistance Test) from a single attack that exceed his Physical limit, then the attack automatically knocks him down

It's not that hard to knock someone down without gel packs.

>>49248028
>It's not that hard to knock someone down without gel packs.
But with them it's almost guaranteed.

>>49248193
Depends on your phys limit, base armour, and occasionally whether that +2 armour rolls well enough to offset -2 phys limit.

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Are the 5e Metaplot (disregarding the "new" matrix) and 4e ruleset mutually exclusive?

>>49248263
>Depends on your phys limit
Yes, like anything there can be outliers, but for anyone who doesn't have an absurdly high physical limit and soak pool, gel packs tend to come with more penalties than bonuses, because they tend to all but guarantee you're going flat on your ass.

>>49248307
For the average person (limit 4), getting hit with anything dangerous means landing on the ground. Gel Packs just confirm it.

Bod/Rea/Str need to be high outliers for that not to be the case.

>>49248419
Your typical street samurai might have a Limit in the 6-9 range. Dropping that down to the 4-7 range is a significant decrease, the way the math on average damage taken per hit tends to play out, taking you from usually not getting knocked down by SMG fire to usually getting knocked down by SMG fire instead.

Knockdown is debilitating, and unless you're chasing an armor level that'll make an important class of weapons usually do Stun instead of Physical damage to you, the gel packs are just usually not worth it.

That, and they make you look like you stapled a bunch of soy sauce packets to your jacket.

>>49247326
That would be Specialized, no? General knowledge would include those things as well, just part of the greater whole, rather than exclusively specialized in it.

>>49248669
>Dropping that down to the 4-7 range is a significant decrease
The way the math works out, it's not going to be an effective -2 if you get a hit from those +2 AV dice.

-2 to hit (only applies within 5m) is minor for a street sam; they're either going to be spec'd to dodge, soak, or both.

However you rock it, the armour is more useful (alive / less hurt > still standing) and the penalty is less major than you make it out to be. For those that really need to be standing fast, there are things like kip-up. (which also helps throw out more melee attacks)

>That, and they make you look like you stapled a bunch of soy sauce packets to your jacket.
Get a decent fashion designer and do something other than derelicte chic.

>>49248968
>Get a decent fashion designer and do something other than derelicte chic.
The fuck are you talking about? Gel packs look stupid like that no matter what you attach them to. Right from the book:
>This stuff looks silly but can save your life. Gel packs look like a bunch of take-out soy sauce packets layered all over your clothes or armor.

And yes, it's a penalty that can be mitigated with things like martial arts, but when your enemies are gaining a +1 to hit you, the Superior Position bonus, you're taking a -1 to hit them, you can't move any faster than a crawl, and by default it takes both an action and a successful check in order to even stand up?

That's a pretty big penalty.

And the fact that you have to go into Martial Arts or minmax the shit out of your Physical Limit if you want to try to mitigate it really just goes to illustrate how big of a deal it actually is.

>it's not going to be an effective -2 if you get a hit from those +2 AV dice
On average, 2 dice provides negates 2/3 of a point of damage. That means that, on average, it's an effective -1.33. That's still a penalty worth noticing.

If the gel packs are the one thing standing between usually taking Physical from an Ares Alpha or usually taking Stun, then sure, the tradeoff might be worth it.

But if you're just trying to get a little extra soak? That increased knockdown chance is almost certainly not worth it at all.

>I just made a rigger/face

I regret nothing.

>>49249082
>Gel packs look stupid like that no matter what you attach them to
Sure. You can never wear anything over them or stitch them into an inner lining, because you take character writing as gospel. Mate. Fuck off.

>your enemies are gaining a +1 to hit you
Only in melee.

>the Superior Position bonus
I tend to require more than just standing vs prone to get this bonus (mileage varies by group), and that's going to be a melee only bonus.

I'm inclined to take 'attacker prone' penalty as a melee only, too. (-1 is still nothing against standard street samurai dice pools; they should be prepared to eat environmental modifiers higher than that as par for the course)

Considering melee isn't the main option for security, HTR, etc ... again, Prone isn't the major pain you make out.

Then there's this;

>If the Defender uses a Take Cover action to get behind something where more than fifty percent of the defender’s body is obscured by intervening terrain or cover, he gains a +4 dice pool modifier to his Defense roll against any attack.
>This modifier can also apply to prone targets that are at least twenty meters away from their attackers.

>>49249636
So you aren't using the rules as written, changing where penalties do and don't apply, and whether or not certain armor mods are obvious to casual inspection.

Cool. Sounds like you enjoy them.

Don't act like your houserules are in effect when giving advice for games you're not running.

>>49249636
>twenty meters
Homie, that's a long-ass distance, especially when most combat in Shadowrun takes place indoors.

>>49249636
>I'm inclined to take 'attacker prone' penalty as a melee only, too.
You'd be wrong. The 'attacker prone' penalty applies to all attacks - ranged and melee - and the 'opponent prone' bonus applies to all attacks - ranged and melee.

If you're more than 20 meters away, you get to enjoy a +4 cover bonus, but realistically speaking that kind of distance is going to come into play in a minority of combats in the game.

Also, even though there's no official movement penalty for being prone, if I were you I'd expect most GMs to limit your movement to only Walking, possibly applying sprinting-style penalties to such movement, if at all, as you're forced to crawl.

Then you can try to stand up, to remove those penalties, fail your Body + Willpower roll to stand up, and lose an action attempting and failing it.

After all of those, a character with a melee weapon gaining a Superior Positioning bonus against you is really just icing on the shit-cake.

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>>49249684
Mate. Don't act like you have some kind of high ground on this. Just makes it hard to take you seriously.

>>49249726
I find most combat takes place as we're leaving, if not as we're escaping.

>>49249896
Pic related; clearly -1 to attack.

Have you noticed you're interpreting the rules, too? "This one I read RAW, that one I add my own rules to."

I'm trying to make a mage who's more combat oriented moves are fire based. Would getting shape material [fire] be as useful as I think it is? Fire tends to get everywhere and it seems like a way to manipulate which way the flames go would be useful as fuck, especially in an enclosed area.

Also what about napalm wall? probably useless as cover but using it for area denial and obscuring vision seems to make it worth it..

>>49250954
>Would getting shape material [fire] be as useful as I think it is?
The usefulness of Shape spells very much depends on the GM.

>>49245775
If you don't mind using SURGE, one of the qualities makes a guy covered in a layer of grease/sweat.

so is there like a shadowrun pdf mega or trove or something?

>>49251708
Bruh.

>>49248276
Don't think so no. The corp related metaplot anyway, no-one cares about CFD.

Do Cyborgs still exist in SR5e?

>>49251786

Shh wait I want to see how long it takes for him to figure it out.

>>49251818
No, they've been retconned out of existence, along with cyberzombies, good taste, and fun.

>>49251831
What? Cyberzombies are in Chrome Flesh. Not statted, but like 8-9 mentions pop up, and theres like an entire chapter about them.

>>49251831
Cyberzombies still exist, there's an extensive section on them in Chrome Flesh, it's just their stats that he been retconned, along with the last shred of CGL's dignity.

>>49251870
>>49251893
Just ... give it a moment before you put fingers to keyboard, next time. See if you don't reconsider the reply.

So I added bonus attributes with a Qi Foci, then being slightly confused on how Qi Foci work, deleted it, but for some reason the bonus stayed, how do I get rid of it?

Is dual-wielding as awful as it was in 4e?

>>49252158
Yes.

Can you actually play as a toxic mage/adept, or is it strictly NPC only?

What if you're a troll adept from the barrens who's basically just been through too much violence, and is a fairly broken person, basically using shadowrunning as an excuse to let themselves go and slowly edgeing towards suicide by security unless saved?

Can someone please explain how being a Changeling works in SR5? Say you want to be a Surge III changeling.

Do you pay 30 karma to get it, then you select the qualities? If so, that seems kinda shit, doesn't it? Do you just select 30 positive and 30 negative karma worth of qualities?

>>49252355
you pay 30 karma

you select up to 30 karma worth of positive surge qualities

then you select negative surge qualities whose karma is equal to your positive surge qualities, or 1 less. if 1 less, you have to pay an additional point of karma

>>49252388
It doesn't say you pay 30 karma though? Why would you pay 30 karma to get 30 karma of positive and negative? You only even get 25 karma to begin with.

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>>49239460
Hell to the fuck yes.

You can springboard it into an interview with the guy who bought the damn coffee. "Oh, cool, you made it past my security and delivered my coffee, now I have a job for you"

>>49247101
Hey, I'm not sure if this is a bug or what, but for karmagen Chummer is showing Adept under positive qualities, but it isn't a positive quality. What's up with that?

Are there any advantage for using directional microphones instead of onni-directional or laser mics?

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So I'm preparing what might be my 3rd attempt at this game. I've got a general question; does the term "Barrens" refer to any place shitty enough to not have matrix coverage, fresh food, and without a government? Or are the Barrens specifically Redmond and that area near Denver?

>>49252783
They're an intermediate step between getting everything, with no directional filter, and receiving all sound near the object you point at.

>>49252789
Yes.

>>49252551
Aaaand this is the point when my character would take advantage of the fact that he's a sinner by promoting his legitimate business.

Sure, you COULD try to call out the shadowrunners for being connected to my legitimate business but I've already hacked your security thisfar and we never agreed we weren't going to show gore trids to your audience.

Best let the advertisement play in the peripheral AR.

Sure, I leave a little loose end in that someone who hired me connects my two identities but blackmail can be a two way street and my sprites are tireless.

>>49252770
It doesn't contribute to your limit, but it's easier to have it in the positive quality section than it is to make a new section so I've never bothered to change it.
>>49252462
So you take another 5 karma worth of negative qualities to afford it. The 30 karma choice is only if you want to pick every single part of your fursona. You can use the ones that are worth less karma to not be in control of your positives and negatives instead.

What are the key splat books to make use of? Like wanting to use core with some extras but keep it lean as possible.

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>>49251803
Welp, guess I'm using 4e all the way into 2078.

Can an AI use a Technomancer's Living Persona as a home node?

>>49253406
You mean your bionode. The Living Persona is just your interface with the Matrix.

Bionode, I'd say it's possible if you treat it as a node like any other. GMs might strike you down due to the Resonant/abstract nature of the bionode (as I understand, it's not literally only your brain, but a Resonance construct centered around it).

Also why would you do something that stupid

>>49253406
A Persona isn't a device, so no.

Is there any way to identify someone's mentor spirit?

>>49253644
Analyse their behavior.

>>49253441
I meant the bionode, as >>49253439 said.

>>49253644

If you have enough magical knowledge then >>49253678 is your best bet. Mentor Spirits always affect the mage's personality.

>>49253105
How are you meant to actually handle the Surge quality points themselves? Just do Free qualities?

>>49253764
Same answer though; can't run programs on a bio-node, so it can't house an AI.
>Unlike peripherals, standard nodes, and nexi (Nodes, p. 55), biological nodes are not “places of the Matrix” with addresses and access ID numbers, and can neither run programs nor store data.
>>49253842
In Chummer? Take the Changing quality, add the metagenetic qualities you want. Chummer'll handle the rest of it.

>>49252279
Toxics have enough mental problems that it would likely cause severe intergroup problems if you're not very careful, and their auras and magic are also giveaways. There's standing bounties for Toxics.
It's doable, but it's like running a Chaoic Evil wanted mass murderer in a party of Paladins. Possible, but probably not worth the bother, to you or your group.

What you described doesn't ensure you're Toxic, though. You can be a fucked up person and still a regular Shaman/Mage. Either way, the problem isn't the premise, it's the implementation.
>>49253164
Run and Gun adds a LOT. If nothing else, get that one. Run Faster and Street Grimore have a lot of good, applicable content as well.

>>49253807
>>49253644

There's a nontrivial chance that there might be at least some measure of Shamanic Mask involved when they cast. If you could witness them cast a decently powerful spell, particularly if you were assessing them at the time, you'd have decent odds of IDing their mentor.

>>49253920
Well its not just Shamans that have mentors anymore.

>>49253920
Basically, I want Doom, but I'm not sure if that requires toxic or if you can just refluff it?

>>49253930

Yeah. Which really stretches the definition of Shaman and Mentor spirit, but the same idea applies. A mentor is intrinsically tied up in your magic. Hence the bonuses and often pretty integral problems.

Although wether masks appear for say, Hermetics is a subject on which contemporary fluff doesn't say much. 3rd ed fluff explicitly said that the mask appeared when you did magic, such was the connection between the two.

Kinda seems like it would vary depending on the tradition, but we don't really know either way. Given that the change seemed more like the annihilation of mechanical differences between traditions, it seems like it's down to the GM.

Seems like a bit of a cop out to have no sign of it at all, though. They're not stat buff spirits, after all.

>>49253164
Run&Gun and Chrome Flesh.

Rigger 5.0 if a player is dead-set on playing a rigger, Data Trails if one is dead-set on playing a decker. Don't add them otherwise.

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Alright chummers, listen up.
I'm writing up a big list of missions for a Shadowrun campaign, so the players can pick which jobs to accept from a huge selection.
I know you all have at least one great idea in you. Post your mission ideas here.

A COLD DAY IN HELL
>The Pitch
The CEO of a small corporation is hiring Runners to track down his wife, who disappeared two weeks ago. He suspects she left him under pressure from an underground drug ring she used to be part of.
>The Full Story
Religious cultists who believe firmly in the reincarnation of the soul are kidnapping criminals and ex-criminals across the country, taking them to an underground facility and putting them into experimental cryogenic stasis to effectively remove their corrupt souls from the gene pool. The Runners must discover and infiltrate this complex, and rescue the CEO's wife.

>>49254014

For a wonderful moment, I wasn't sure if you meant Doom as in Thulsa, or Doom as in Victor Von. And then I remembered the spirit.

Beyond that, the IDEA of Doom is a very, intrinsically toxic one. The buffs, not so much.

If you wanted the despair without the annihilation ethos, there's a lot of spirits that might work for a Shaman on the out. Dragon Slayer, Berserker, etc. Shamans can get burnt out on the service of their ideals like anyone else.

Either way, a Toxic shaman is really something you want to talk with your GM about. If they don't want capital T Toxics, that's a pretty hard wall, particularly if you want the mentor spirit.

>>49254066
Basically, I want a combat-focused Troll adept with Hobo with a Shotgun, Surge for mutations, and to go around being a meatshield and clobber shit with a large melee weapon.

>>49254026
>They're not stat buff spirits, after all.

In 4th I ran a Dragon mage, I decided the most Dragon-ishh thing he could do is just plain resist his mentor, because what Dragon bows to another without great duress?

Depending on how much I pissed Dragon off that session by being too damn proud to revere him (as everyone should revere him) I could be 'punished' by the prick. Losing the spirit summoning bonus, having him send spirits to 'test' me, that sort of shit.

It was fun.

>>49254084

Well, hell, that doesn't require Doom. How about Dragonslayer, or Shark? Or even Rat? Both of those can be made to fit pretty easily, even if they're a bit less soul-crushed out of the box.

>>49254090
That's a pretty neat take on it. Must have been fun for your GM.

>>49254158

Battle of wills and wits between the GM and I? yeah he had fun, its why I want Dragon back in 5th. I want to play a mage who wakes up to his apartment on fire in the middle of the night again.

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>>49254066

>>49254158
+2 to a combat skill

>>49253912
What book is that quote from? Is it in 5e?

>>49254090
>>49253678
For the group I am currently preparing to play in, I will be playing a physadept with a custom/GM approved Snowfox mentor spirit.

We worked out, that Snowfox does not commune with you in a direct sense.
Instead, if Snowfox wants to tell me something,
I get kind of a frozen astral overlay of the world.

Hallways start building up snow, glass panes glaze over. And he guides me using pawprints in the snow and similar indirect omens, without ever showing himself directly.

And the coldness is the leading theme here, because Snowfox is all about survival in harsh environments and ambush hunting. As my world gets cold, so does the mental processes of the adept. Starting to become cruel.

The totem/spirit grants me traceless walk and melanin control powers, while forcing me to roll a test, to attack an enemy headon, without surprise or other advantageous factors.

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>>49254258
Page 55 of Unwired.
For a 5e reference:
>Since your living persona is just a persona, not a device, you don’t have any onboard storage; this is easy enough to deal with because you can store files in nearby devices.
>You cannot reconfigure your living persona or run programs, as those are abilities unique to commlinks and cyberdecks.
>You are not a device, so you cannot be a slave or master, nor can you be part of a PAN or WAN.

If you're that desperate to be a monad, just buy a flash-grown wimp, jam some nanites into it and enjoy your new meat bicycle.

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>>49254352
>Deus Ex poster
>GNU/Deus Ex
disgusting

Is there a particularly good reason for a crossbow archer to not take Deadly Venom and make it Contact, and either coat arrows or use Injection Arrows?

>>49255288
There is almost no reason for a crossbow archer to not use injection bolts, period. A pocket crossbow with injection bolts requires almost no stat investment to do insane amounts of damage as well as having more utility than any normal gun.

>>49254059
Break into/infilitrate a Knight Errant precinct and disappear a piece of evidence from the evidence locker or a person from the holding cells

Can a normal Adept learn an Alchemical Spell to make preparations with?

>>49255540
Nope.

so which of the four different conflicting rigging systems should i be using?

>>49255540
Does Adept spell power work with Alchemy skill?

>>49255556
Mystic Adept, at least?

>>49255579
Why on earth would you want to?
>>49255592
>Mystic adepts purchase their spells/rituals/preparations in the same way as magicians.
Yup.

Oh, nevermind I guess. Enabler is a fucking Health spell, which means that it's Command trigger only, which means it's basically pointless as far as I can tell.

Well, you can still go Surge into Deadly Venom, take Poisoner to make it 13 potency baseline, and maybe combo it with the poison being slathered on an injection arrow with the arrow having even more shit?

>>49255288
The only one I can think of is you really don't want the surge negative qualities, as I've been trying to build a Prototype Transhuman with a spider motif today, and finding a decent poison to put in chemical gland seems to be a fool's errand.

>>49255612
>Why on earth would you want to
To make this >>49255540 happen.

>>49255679
What they mean is alchemy is bad, like truly terrible and utterly not worth using.

>>49255690
I am fully aware of it.

>>49255690
To be fair, you CAN houserule it.

If you make alchemy basically work as: Make your Alchemy+Magic roll with the normal limit, this determines Potency. There is no roll when activating, you just use Potency for the hits.

Then it's actually decentish, with the exception that it can kinda-sorta get screwed via Edge use.

Well, that and you need to make preparations not just poof in a few hours.

>>49255717
Well, you can houserule pretty much anything, doesn't change that the base rule is bad, and as this relates to a build the anon asking is unlikely to control how or if it is houseruled.

>>49255761
>Mechanic is useless to the point of being effectively impossible to use by default
>"Gee man, I dunno, I don't really think anyone would houserule this to make it useful at all. It's better to make it just dead text and never able to be used, right?"

>>>/pfg/

>>49255779
That's not what I meant and you fucking know it.

So the mortimer of london greatcoat looks like an old navy wool coat, but what does the argentum coat look like?

>>49255938
A fashionable gray-ish long coat?

>>49255938
No idea. 3e Canon Companion, 4e Arsenal / Attitude, and 5e Run & Gun are your main goto books for clothing descriptions, and they really fucked up on that last one.

>>49255996

Fuck it I'm just going to look up coats on google images. I wish there were more descriptions/art of these things..

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>>49250954

> Fire
> A material

>>49256012

Street Grimoire lists 'fire' as well as water and a bunch of other shit as examples for shape material

>>49256002
It has a 'Newest model' trait so I guess they make new design every year or so.

>>49256017

Well, fuck me sideways then. Starting up a nearby fire sounds like a great way to provide yourself with some nice firepower.

>>49256037
>great way to provide yourself with some nice firepower
You'd be surprised. Fire starts at 3DV, only applies at the end of each combat turn, and only increases by +1DV per combat turn. Open flames are -2AP.

>>49256037
>start fire
>pull a mustang and have the fire loop around you and your team to set everyone else on fire

Having more control over fire as a mage throwing fireballs seems like a very smart idea.

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>>49256037
Shape [Fire] actually has a rather limited use unless you've got a lenient GM, since non-magical fire kinda stops being fire when it doesn't have anything to burn.

>>49256139
>>49256062

Having a column of flames leap from a burning building into a target rich enviroment seems fun though.

>>49256139
SR5's crossfire or hard targets book has flame bracers especially made for this.

Is there any way for physadepts to gain access to the magical skills? I know Assensing is unlocked with Astral Perception, but what about the rest?

>>49256652
HT 190. Adept Spell power gives you very limited spellcasting.

>>49256703

What about counterspelling? Or anything to do with spirits or alchemy?

>>49256751
The thing is, the possibilities for a physical adept to get into stuff for mages are not many in number, because then you would be a Mystical Adept.

So why not take mystical adept, if you want to be able to do all mage stuff (beside projecting) and get adept powers?

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>>49249896

You only have to pass the Stand Up test if you're wounded. It's guaranteed if you haven't been hurt yet.

I agree that being prone is still shitty, but it's something.

>>49256751

They get some powers that let them fight spirits better, but summoning, counterspelling, and alchemy are pretty much out.

>>49245682
Thankfully I bought an armored jacket and an armor vest to be won under his shirt

>>49257409
Not that the vest makes a lick of difference while you're wearing the jacket.

>>49256963

Because having spells doesn't fit the character concept. Having counter spelling and banishing does, as does the adept part, but casting spells doesn't, and you get free spells as part of being a mysadept but it seems like a waste to not use them. If I could trade them in for something else that would be great but I'm not sure you can.

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>>49257534
Without GM fiat you're pretty much boned. The only adept power I'm aware of that boosts Counterspelling is Sorcerous Parry from SR4's Way of the Adept, and that's limited to followers of the Magician's Way., ie magicians or mystic adepts.

There's a shenanigansy way to go about it where you get a Great Form Spirit of Man to use Endowment to grant you the Magical Guard critter power, but that's not exactly an off-the-bat option. Otherwise if the character is a troll they could contract HMHVV and gain access to the Magical Guard power by becoming a Fomoraig, Dzoo-Noo-Qua or Mutaqua.

>>49257922

Mysadept it is then, I guess.

>>49257159
>You only have to pass the Stand Up test if you're wounded. It's guaranteed if you haven't been hurt yet.
If you've been knocked down by a gunshot, you're 100% guaranteed to have been wounded, because knockdown triggers off of you taking damage.

What the actual fuck are you talking about?

>>49257534
>you get free spells as part of being a mysadept
You can trade spells for rituals, right? Are there any rituals that would fit your character concept?

Alternatively, you could scrounge up exclusively spells that do make sense, like detection spells or something.

One thing I like about Shadowrun but rarely see people do at all is that you can easily make a character who's basically just bought themselves into being a shadowrunner, fulfilling their dreams with cybernetics and biotech where they wouldn't be able to do it themselves. I used to see concepts like that floating around at times, but now it seems like everycharacter I see is a hyper-competent professional whose character growth is explained solely in their backstory and who needs every bit of their cyberware for meta reasons.
I think it's a bit of a shame - one of the main themes of Shadowrun is after all the universal availability of skill, beauty and uniqueness, and the devaluing of these concepts because of it. Instead, from looking at characters that come up here, you get the impression that these people got cyberware because they were cool in the first place, which just smashes up the themes that have been in the game for a long time. Sure, there are cool shadowrunners and faceless corp drones, but looking at old crowd art in for example 3e, you can see that a fuck of a lot of people just try to stand out from the crowd and be unique with all the cyberware and biomods they can get.
I don't know because it's that people can't grasp the change in norms or because they've become obsessed with minmaxed powerhouses, but I've really started missing characters with builds and backstories like those.
If anyone thinks of a concept off the top of their head, I'd love to see it - I don't think I've seen a character concept on here that wasn't "and then they got these cool minmaxed cybernetics/powers because something grim happened, and then they became cool and competent" in about half a year. Shadowrunning is canonically stated to be full of showoffs and posers, and it's only uninteresting to play someone with a baked-in motivation and set of flaws like that if you're unhealthily fixated on your character never failing.

>>49257978

Not really? The idea is that he's an Awakened character of some kind that hunts down the Awakened as penance for his sin of being Awakened (so Deus Vult, Prejudice against Awakened, the negative quality that's basically self-flagellation, the works). Basically a Shadowrun version of a witch hunter.

>>49257989
I think you're basically full of shit, to be blunt. I extremely regularly see character concepts whose characters are just people who kinda stumbled into the shadows using 'ware or magic as a crutch.

In my current game, for example, we have a spoiled rich girl who got herself 'wared up with her family's money as part of a misguided rebellious streak, and in my previous game I played a former corporate researcher who got egregiously injured on the job, given cyberlimbs as a settlement, and, on finding themself out of work, decided to get started in shadowrunning to stick it to those assholes.

The exact kind of character arc you're talking about seems more like the standard than the exception to me, and your concerns are nonexistent.

>>49258076
Then it might be a problem with this thread in general. It's always reassuring to know that people like that are still out there - I know that this thread has a tendency to be very min-maxy, and I guess I just let it boil over.

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>>49258016
Rituals:
>Remote Sensing
>Ward
>Circle of Protection

Spells:
>Analyze Magic
>Analyze Truth
>Clairaudience
>Clairvoyance
>Detect Individual
>Detect Magic, Extended
>Heal

With that combination, you'll be able to set up anti-magic wards, detect and analyze magic, know whether the witch lies, see and listen at a distance, track and individual down by magic, have all of those magical senses work at extreme ranges, and heal your wounds when you're injured.

I know you'd rather not have magic at all, but I think that assortment of rituals and spells will fit your concept pretty nicely.

What do you think?

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>>49258016
Replace all the spells he gets with alchemical preparations, fluff them as poisons and healing salves rather than explicitly magical spells? They're fucking useless compared to actual casting, but it would seem to fit the theme.
>>49257989
>>49258129
I'm confused, are you mad that there aren't more characters like Mr. Armoire the guy with 32 capacity worth of smuggling compartments in his body, or is this some kind of stormwind fallacy 'only characters that take sleep regulators because they had problems with insomnia as a child are REAL characters' complaint?

>>49257989
>"and then they got these cool minmaxed cybernetics/powers because something grim happened, and then they became cool and competent"

What is the line with that though? One character concept I had was a former high ranking (and still incredibly sleazy, think Gordon Gecko/Wolf of Wall Street kind of thing) businessman who accidentally embezzled a large amount of money thanks to his mentor spirit (he genuinely believed there would be a huge return for the company) and basically got burned for it. He's completely unrepentant though: the embezzlement and mentor spirit shenanigans occurred because he became Awakened and now he believes he has a ton of magical power due to the "astral investments" his mentor spirit/accountant "Sal" is managing.

No idea what tradition I'd make him though. Is there a tradition that's basically money = power? It doesn't have to literally be throwing nuyen at people (though the idea of using Fling on a bunch of cheap credsticks to throw them at people is hilarious, and I'm totally fluffing the Control Thoughts/Control Actions as buying people out) but just the underlying philosophy that money has as much influence on magic as it does on the real world.

>>49252789
There's a few places called "X Barrens", enough that you could probably apply the term to any city slum and folks would grok.

>>49258261
>No idea what tradition I'd make him though.
Either Chaos Magic or Black Magic. Those are the real postmodern/non-religious traditions, without having the weird Solomonic ritual trappings of Hermeticism.

>>49258184

That's not a bad idea actually. Ward and Circle of Protection are easily refluffed as blessing a given area (I'm going with Christian Theurgy as the tradition, so there's precedence there), though I'm not a huge fan of Clairaudience/Clairvoyance: they seem a little "getting info from demons"-ish. Maybe swap those for Detect Magic and something else? I'd say Detect [Life Form] and make it Detect Awakened but I'm pretty sure you can't do that.

>>49258281

Black Magic was what I was leaning towards too, it fits the whole "sleazy businessman/salesman" archetype, especially the whole thing about luring people in with promises of what they desire but really you're just stringing them along until you're finished with them.

>>49258198
I hate to say this, but that's a complete strawman, and none of those things are even remotely close to what I was saying.
What I'm mad at is that there seems to be a trend for characters to be cool and competent professionals who all got their cybernetics or magic for deeply important and dramatic plot reasons that in the end only end up making the character less flawed, less relatable and hard to develop further.
Fluff, especially older fluff, is crammed to the brim with the idea of shadowrunners as 20% competent mercenaries and 80% thrill-seekers, gangers, attention whores and try-hards who're hired because they're disposable and likely won't be a threat if they get mad at you for being a Johnson and thus leaving out a lot of details.
I personally really like the postmodernism of criticizing the "cybernetic badass" or the "cool modern wizard", and even Shadowrun picks on these by writing in movies about shadowrunners and the cool shit they get up to. It feels to me like the characters I see are straight-faced versions of what Shadowrun itself made fun of and stated is downright rare among shadowrunners themselves, and I can't help but think that someone is missing some sarcasm.
Playing with the idea of characters who're just fundamentally disposable wannabes seems more interesting to me - there's more space for the person when the events in their life aren't incredibly larger-than-life, they're easier to understand and thus roleplay correctly, they have baked-in flaws and hooks that can be played on straight off the bat purely through roleplaying, and on top of that the setting also makes more sense when you assume that most shadowrunners are pettier than most modern player characters, since it leaves more room for incompetence, messy operations and shenanigans and encourages more playstyles than high-stakes black-trenchcoat conspiracy.

Is there no Quality for avoiding killing? I'm about to roll a non-lethal character, and it would be great if I could get some definition on that as well as some tasty bonus karma. There's Code of Honor, which is close, but that makes me also have to stop my murder hobo team from murder hobo'ing, which just won't fly. Assassin's creed (within Code of Honor) looks like it might work, but I'm not sure if I'm still bound to the same "stop your team from being your team" thing.
Isn't there just some sort of +5karma your character (and them alone) doesn't kill with standard penalties for breaking it?

>>49254059
GLOSSOLALIA
>The Pitch
The Voynich Manuscript is in town, as part of a Renraku-sponsored exhibition on famous mysteries. The Johnson has someone who says they can decipher the writing. Either bring the book to the Reader, or the Reader to the book.

>The Full Story
The Reader is a guy possessed by a powerful free spirit. This spirit believes that the Manuscript holds magical secrets, so he will try and take it and run (the Johnson won't be happy if the Manuscript is damaged or lost; he wants to know what it says, then return it). The book has some passing references to a dragon lairing inside the mountains of Eastern Europe, in the stories of a mad monk who stumbled across sleeping Schwartzkopf in the Middle agesI know the Manuscript may have a real place in SR canon, but I don't care.

>>49258374
>making the character less flawed, less relatable and hard to develop further.

To be fair, the system itself doesn't help with that: if you want characters that start off as wannabes and improve over time, the GM has to be way more generous than what the book suggests they should give the runners in terms of rewards (or Karma at the very least). Meanwhile, the one point in time where players have a vast amount of room to play with in terms of customising their character is at chargen, so they tend to do all the "big" stuff there because it's unlikely that they'll get another chance to do so.

>>49240375
Our party's face is a novacoke addicted blacklisted trid producer, played as though autistic.

>>49258374
Idk if this is the right place to notice a pattern. Most people here build the best possible character or different character concepts and don't play them, or at least that's what it looks like to me.

My table plays a group who aren't professional from the get go: a college girl/wannabe archeologist looking for expedition funds, a hilariously naive AI who's being chased by terrorists, a magician who ran away from a cult that worshiped rats, and a guy who's name is The Club.

You just don't hear about these kinds of playstyles here much.

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>>49256002

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>>49256573
Honestly, those are pretty shit, especially as you need the Exotic skill for them.

Might as well go Heavy Weapons and carry a flamethrower for true burninating (and other big guns as the situation dictates), and a bunch of disposable lighters for subtle work.

>>49258374
>the idea of characters who're just fundamentally disposable wannabes seems more interesting to me
Let me guess, You are a fan of the old DnD style "Your characters are just average or slightly higher than average, delving into dungeons at the chance of incredible riches"?
There is nothing wrong with that, but I don't think that it fits into the new editions that much, though I can only speak of 4e.
The only way I see this to go is with Street (Level/Scum/whichever is the better one cuz I forgot)

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>>49258403
Pacifist.

>>49258439
I have kind of the opposite experience.
"Cool" characters' goals tend to be bigger and more mechanical - defeat this and this enemy, ruin this and this corp, initiate God knows how many times or otherwise taking time or easily risking disrupting gameplay, especially if it's a big ideological cause.
When it comes to lower-key characters, though, the central conflict is getting used to the shadowrunner life - and there are as many ways of tackling this as there are characters. It's a plot arc that can be stretched for as long as you want to right out of the gate, doesn't necessarily require karma or specific kinds of runs, and can be inserted into more or less whatever situation while still being natural. Getting this done before starting play often leads to an uninteresting character whose real goal is seven sessions in the future and who can't develop on it without money or karma. Meanwhile, getting the purchases done at chargen and having the characters adapt to them makes for a more living game with more interesting and relatable characters who actually change through roleplaying and have an automatic shared goal which they always have an opportunity to work on in their every action, instead of having to brood about their angsty backstory for multiple sessions until their GM gives them the right run, which no one else's interested in.
This is just my personal experience, but oh God how I've seen this a lot in roleplaying in general.

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>>49258403
There's Pacifist, but you're still supposed to attempt to dissuade your party members from doing it. Maybe represent it with Phobia?
>>49258374
Ooookay, so let's try to unpack this. What you want to see is more Johnny Spinrad, less Kane? Or do you want to see street sams that start out with an AK-97 and a smartlink and salivate at the idea of getting a used cyberlimb? Because street scum exists, and is terrible. Like >>49258439 said, the game's mechanics encourage you to front-load and specialise during character creation.

>>49258566
Pacifist restricts the use of ANY violence, including non-lethal. My character was going to work off of surprise attacks, he's still rough and tumble, he just doesn't want to take a life over it.

>>49258338
I was thinking Clairvoyance/Clairaudience could be fluffed as divine visions - the sort of thing that guided old testament prophets.

Detect Magic was actually already on the list - the Extended version - so that's not a thing you'd be able to swap in.

I'd definitely ask your GM, though, if Detect (Life Form) could be used for Awakened, since Detect Magic explicitly doesn't detect Awakened people/critters (though it does detect their spells and foci and such).

If you were to scrap Clairvoyance/Clairaudience, Detect Awakened and Detect Enemies would probably be your best bet. Remember not lean on them as a crutch too much, though - Assensing is still king; the Detect spells are more for use with Remote Sensing, to detect these things at extreme range.

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>>49258657
>4 pistols, no holsters

>>49258675
He took Resources E, needed the holster money for the jacket.

>>49258403
You want Code of Honor: Assassin's Creed, otherwise it's just a fluff detail, not a Quality.

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>>49254059
DAY TRIP
>The Pitch
You get called up in the middle of the night by a contact. An alchera has formed outside the city, and a professor wants an armed escort immediately to get him there and keep him safe while he explores. No time to waste, no time to prepare, it could be gone at any moment!

>The Full Story
The professor has had a string of bad luck recently, orchestrated by his grad students (they are hoping to get him fired and that one of them will get his seat, so they've formed an uneasy coalition of ambitious douchebags). The unwitting professor brings one of them along to help him with the fieldwork, and the rest are quietly coming up to sabotage the Prof and scoop up anything of value (both from him and from each other, to further their own careers).

>>49258720
That's what I was thinking, but does that still include the part where I need to be the parties Paladin, and stop my party from killing? Last I checked I'm running with a cannibalistic psychopath and that's would be a SERIOUS problem.

>>49258786
If you don't want the mechanical restriction, don't go looking to get karma for it. "My character prefers not to kill people, but won't stop other people from killing [and in fact abets them in doing so by working with a cannibal psychopath], and still does things that might result in death [such as attacking from stealth, because even with non-lethal intent it's still dangerous]" is a personality trait.

>>49258657
It's not a problem of stats and equipment, it's a problem of what people do with their allocations.
What I'm seeing too much of for my own tastes is characters who have no real dynamic between their skills and their personality - they're one and the same, because they're already cool and competent and used to it all. Their 'ware or magic is too convenient, too min-maxed and too gratuitous, and they often end up playing very similarly and not very interestingly at all. Their learning process has been finished before the game starts, and there's little that can compel character development or internal conflicts. They have their goals and motivations cut out for them at character creation, and they tend to be so precise and demanding that they cripple character development and jeopardize group dynamics instead of leaving room for growth.
If, however, you play a character who's still unused to all of this, who still has selfishness, vanity or just plain thrill-seeking as part of their motivations, who's still ignorant on a lot of points when it comes to being a shadowrunner and who's generally not a hypercompetent professional with a clear-cut cause and only "cool, gritty" flaws, you can use the exact same stats and end up with a much more engaging game in which everyone has a huge amount of character development to do right out of the gate.
For example, would you rather play Glory before or after all the grimness and tragedy? I know exactly what I'd go with, and that's because there's a lot more wiggle room and character development potential before the character has become used to their circumstances and can take it as their daily life. Being used to the events of the game right off the bat results in characters who're harder to relate to and who have narrow avenues for character development which might not fit with the game. Groups who get used to things together get more bonding opportunities, and all their differences become characterization tools.

>>49258667
Code of Honour.

>>49258786
Then it's not a Negative Quality, just a personal play preference.

>>49258815
>>49258903
I've seen Qualities that are significantly less restrictive and even more pointless, but fine whatever. I just thought that would be a rather understandable quality to exist, and thought it was worth asking about. I DO want the mechanical restriction, I just don't want to constantly cause party fights and get hit with penalties just because one of my group-mates is a huge edge-lord.
Guess I'll just pick up a few more garbage Qualities.

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>>49254059
2 LEGIT 2 QUIT

>The Pitch
To regain street cred lost after that sex tape with the breeder came out, DJ Tuzk has promised a once-on-a-lifetime show: performing on the back of a semi racing down the 405, fighting Hellhounds with his crew while busting mad rhymes.

>The Full Story
DJ Tuzk is a fool, but his manager is not. The 'Hellhounds' who are going to be attacking the show will be hired actors. The PCs are charged with preventing the real Hellhounds from interfering, by any and all means. Go blow up their bikes, run interception out of view of the cameras, get the Halloweeners to start a huge gang war; however they want to do it, just keep the real Hellhounds away from the concert.

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>>49258935
You do realize that the Assassin's Creed, unlike the Warrior's Code, only refers to people that you, personally kill, right?

Warrior's Code says 'or allow to be killed through their actions.'

Assassin's Creed only penalizes you 'for every unintentional and/or unpaid murder they commit.'

So you'd just refuse to accept wetwork contracts, and refuse to use lethal ordnance.

And stop pissing and moaning you fucking bitch. It's unbecoming for a child, and humiliating for an adult.

>>49258999
That's what I was fucking asking. I'm only complaining because no one gave me an answer and instead just shat on me. Honestly all I wanted was either a tiny 3 karma quality for a vow of non-lethalness, or just an answer to my original question.
Thanks for finally telling me, but at the same time, fuck you drekhead.

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>>49259086
Fuck off, you whiny little bitch. Actually read the book next time instead of expecting us to do 100% of the work for you.

>>49259110
>read the book
>confused about the shitty wording
>decide to ask my fellow SR players a simple clarification question
>HURR READ THE BOOK
Okay.

>>49258669

That's a fair point, but divine revelations are more God given to his followers, not his followers casting a spell and getting them. Mysterious ways, and all that.

Also, can you not take Detect Magic and its extended version in the same spell list? I thought you could?

>>49259167
>God given to his followers, not his followers casting a spell and getting them. Mysterious ways, and all that.

You're not casting a spell, you're praying for guidance. Sometimes your prayers are answered, sometimes not. Sometimes the glory of revelation leaves you weakened but ecstatic.

>>49259167
You can, but there's no real reason to. Having 2 less drain is pretty irrelevant, when you can just cast Extended and sustain it for a while.

And it's really easy to refluff spells as god-given visions - or at least, have them be interpreted that way by the warrior. Same with Detect Magic - you're not casting a spell, the Lord is pointing you in the direction of the unclean.

>>49259191
>>49259210

That's a really good point actually, I hadn't thought of that.

Also, I would have thought the difference between the normal and extended versions is that you can use the normal version to filter out a lot of positives that aren't that useful to you. Or would you just cast the extended version at a lower force? But then if you do that, wouldn't you have an issue with the targets resisting due to a lower limit on the spell limiting the number of hits?

>>49259299
Just think of it as blips on your minimap. You're still going to want to assense each thing individually, but it tells you where the stuff is, at least.

And then, once you've focused in on what actually is useful? That's when Detect Individual comes into play.

That's the strength of having so many Detect spells - you can broaden or narrow your focus as-needed.

I'm trying to make a swordy adept for 4 ed, first time player. 12/12 armor isn't bad for the non-cybersam, right?

>>49259118
If you're confused and others aren't, it's pretty clearly your fucking fault.
Hold yourself to the same standards as others and apologize (or at least be very polite) if you have to ask for help to do things that other people can easily do on their own.

>>49260315
I tried to be polite, but it was just thrown back in my face. I simply wanted to confirm that I was not incorrect about my assumptions of the text, but only got insults. I don't understand what is so wrong about a simple question, I see countless questions in this very thread, you don't even need to respond if you don't want to.

>>49260647
There's a low tolerance for stupid fucking questions here, and it's lower than wherever you came here from.
4chan has generally always been against spoonfeeding, but you can get it through once in a while - but not only were you asking a pointless question in an already exasperated tone, you got buttblasted when people told you that you're trying to game the system because you're constantly begging for extra karma.
Two people told you that you're not going to get karma for it, and you got mad at them like it's their fault that Catalyst's balancing sucks. There might be other flaws that give more karma for a smaller payoff - but you're getting mad at these people for not telling you what you want to hear. There's no flaw like the one you want in the rules, and if you want karma for it, ask your GM.
What did you expect? Did you expect them to tell you that they called Catalyst and had them make a special flaw just for you? You were being passive-aggressive and whiny when people answered your question, seemingly expecting them to change the rules on the fly just for you.

>>49254059
The last one I ran to my players:
GOOD WILL
>The pitch
The runners are tasked with crashing a charity event.
>The full story
[Company A] and [Company B] are competing for the good graces of the city's council. [Company B] is hosting an auction of several magical items, giving the funds back to orphans / SINless / puppy shelters. Mr. Johnson is an exec from [Comapny A], and hires the runners to steal one of the auctioned object before the event, have it enchanted by a friend of his, and put it back in place without anyone noticing. They are also given two side objectives: putting a rootkit into the hotel's control server, and intercepting a convoy of exotic delicacies intended to be served at the event.
If all objectives are completed, Mr. Johnson will gladly invite the runners to watch the result of their efforts live, with him, in his high-luxury suite in the very same hotel the charity is held at. When the selected item it put on for sale, the enchantment triggers, releasing a high-powered version of Swarm, supported by an equally convincing trid show, and the loudspeakers booming about an ancient curse. Panic ensues

>>49260315

>No one ever had to explain anything to me in my life, now let me whine about your perceived whining!

>>49260714
I already said I would have settled for 3 Karma or whatever, I was simply looking for the restriction for flavor. My post was a question for confirmation of something that was slightly confusing to me, that took 4 posts to get, and a general "maybe I missed something" statement, in case someone had a better suggestion. I even got some good suggestions, they just weren't what I was looking for unfortunately (apparently this is whining?). I was never looking for "free" karma, I was looking for Qualities that fit my character.
I'm sorry that out of all the questions in my thread, mine was somehow upsetting because people were making assumptions about what I was looking for. I'm sorry I had to keep this going for so long because no one would actually answer my question without being 4chan. I'm even sorry I expected any kind of civilized discourse.

>>49258517
You know, you don't need to attack with them to use the shape flame spell... just shape the flame

>>49257433
Stylistically, my character has his coat open, so I figured I'd just get that extra piece of armor, especially if we gotta run an extraction for someone without armor, so that I could give them a defensive buff without royally fucking myself over too

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>>49260980
But what's the point in having a weapon you don't attack with? If all you want is fire, all you need is a lighter- it's much less likely to get you arrested.

Technomancer book update:
>Errata has been sent to the errata team. Unfucks fading values and re-words certain Complex Forms for understandability. No word on when you'll see that, it's out of my hands.
>design is complete, content is finalized, rules writing has begun
>lore section is 100% complete
>current ETA for completion of book is late October. Talking with the line developer to try and fast-track the book to avoid the clogged ebook pipeline.

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>>49261446
Shouldn't the rules and the lore be written together? What happens when it turns out the lore is such that it fucks up the rules, by demanding things that are mechanically impossible?

>>49261483
That's why you communicate with the other writers. Obviously there'll be editing to make sure the whole book lines up right.

>>49261626
Sorry. The way you said it implied you in one room hammering out fluff, then upon completion shoving it through a slot in the door to the rulesmonkey.

>>49261665
I promise that's not how it works.

It's more like a tube than a slot.

>>49261693
Is the tube pneumatic? Is that what's taking so long, you guys are Star Citizening this bitch?

>>49260647
>crying because sometime was impolite to you while they spoonfed you exactly what you wanted
>being this much of a whiny bitch

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>>49261446
>>49261693

Oh, hi, LM. I thought I've seen you mentioning somewhere that you're gonna stop posting as you. Good to see you're alive.

>>49261997
>I don't know how to use the archive!
She said she's only posting when she has something worth posting.

>>49261995
>while they spoonfed you exactly what you wanted
But they didn't, that's my point, I only got "whiny" because my question wasn't answered. Sure, it has NOW, but the point at which everyone is whining about my whining, is when my question was completely ignored and I was simply insulted for it. Once again, if I had simply gotten a "yes" or "no" none of this would have happened.

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Hey I'm pretty new to SR but I have a game coming up and what I have in mind is a tomboy Oni gal for a street scum level game with kind of a Bancho gimmick, wanna smash some stuff and get into trouble/in over my head with a fight first rabblerouser vibe. Any advice on it?

Let me see if I've got this right:
1) a device on a PAN or Host uses its master's DR+FW to defend against hacks
2) a device physically accessed only uses its own DR+Host FW to defend against hacks
3) a host's other devices hacked through a physically accessed device only uses the physically accessed device's DR+host FW?
4) placing a mark on a host lets you enter it. Does this same mark transfer onto everything else inside the host, letting you start with one mark? Or am I thinking of PANs?

>>49262574
1) If it's not totally unattended, the device will use Owner's Mental Stat + Master's Matrix Attribute to defend against matrix actions. But not to absorb damage.

2) If a device is directly connected to, it uses either Owner's Mental (if attended) or Device Rating (if totally unattended) + Firewall (usually equal to Device Rating) to defend.

3) If something is part of a WAN, meaning slaved to a Host, and is directly connected to it will use DR (unattended stuff) or Mentral Att (if attended) + its Firewall to resist. If you're not able to directly connect it's going to use the Host's Firewall even if you can physically access the thing.

4) You're a bit wrong. In PANs and WANs marks only propagate from slave to master. But if you're inside the host, you're considered directly connected to everything in the WAN so it's all using the lower numbers.