/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>49214640
No It doesn't Mainly because....I don't think I've done it right in the past and instead of horrified my players were more "oh cool? Is it useful to me? How can I use this to my advantage?"

Now I posted a question right as the other thread closed...

How do you choose a good shadow name for a mage?

I've been trying to find a good one for my Arrow and so far I have:
Vengeance
Israfil (Name of an Angel)

Any good ideas on what makes a good shadow name and how to choose a good one would be appreciated.

>Does body horror come up in your games?

Does it come up? Certainly; but I try to keep it infrequent otherwise it looses it's shock/disgust factor on the players and they might think they're playing a game based on 'my magical realm'.

>>49214708
Depends what kind of Arrow.
I had an idea for an Obrimos arrow and basically chose a Military sounding/ action movie Nick Name.

>>49214708
I pick the chuuniest thing I can think of

>>49214613
>Any good ideas on what makes a good shadow name and how to choose a good one would be appreciated.

Don't name yourself Odin if you want to keep both your eyes. Name yourself Odin if you want his wisdom.

Name yourself vengeance if you want to hunt down a criminal. Don't name yourself vengeance if you want to survive the ordeal.

Ask yourself; what would be a cool flaw you want to get, whats a cool story you want to live out, or whats some cool themes you want to play with? If you want to play a man fighting against the law and his own past, why not take the name of a famous condemned criminal? If your a pillar of order and harmony but you come from a broken home, why not Kintsugi, to repair with gold? If your a merciless killer who just wants to go home(especially when you can never go 'home' again) why not a famous cast away like Alexander Selkirk(literally the first one, and come on, having a mage named Selkirk would be cooler then vengeance)

Ask what you want to be, and what are you. Then have those realities collide.

Helps if you tell us more about your guy then his order.

>>49214870
Obromos Arrow -
10 years ago this character's sister died. He was very close to his only sister, she for the longest time was the only friend he had growing up in areas where there were not many (or any) children his own age. This loss triggered an obsession in him.

Mormon but graduated from Marquette University (A catholic school) with a degree in Theology, and specialized in comparative religion. He became obsessed with religion and how most religions had tiny fragments that connect them. Like how the Tibetan Buddhists have a blessing sand painting that is very similar to the Navajo Blessing Way sand painting. So similar that other than South West native imagery vs. East Asian you'd think they were the same damn painting.

He is obsessed with the obscurities and deep doctrines of various religions searching them for hidden clues, and meanings. He believes his magic is a gift from God, given to him to act as a purifying force, to sear way the supernatural creatures that are a threat to man and seek to unbalance the world.

>>49215087
Opps left out a detail.
The sister...
She was turned into chunky salsa but something supernatural but I don't know what yet.

>>49215087
>>49215179
Israfil/Israfel sounds like a good fit, imo

>>49215087
yes but how does he feel about all this shit?
His sister exploded. That happens. Yes its bad but ask anyone down the street about bad things that happened to them and you will drown in the stories.

What have they done that they regret? What will they chase to the ends of the earth?

He studies religions and their connections, does he see himself as a weaver pulling the truth together, or a heretic to his own beliefs? He joined the arrow. Why? Revenge? Is he short sighted, does he not plan to live past his revenge? A philosopher who joins the army is interesting, now you have to ask why.

> To take revenge!

If someone wanted to join your army just to get revenge, would you let them? Everyone else thinks conflict is a lifestyle, this guy just wants to get even for his dead family. Get. In. Line.

Make more. How did your arrow fail? Everyone fails at the most important times. How did you? Don't give me that ' I failed saving my sister' shit. Your not Jonny's first OC Do-not-steal. How did YOU FUCK UP? Did your pursuit of knowledge leave your family broke and in a shitty house with back locks? Did a moment of anger send your sister into the maw of the beast? Did your faith waver at the wrong time? When did you fall to sin?

Your character needs to make mistakes, you have a start of a foundation, and you can make an okay character.

>>49214640

>Does body horror come up in your games?

The last Mage campaign I ran had a super minor plot point where a member of the Ordo Dracul developed the Vicissitude Discipline after witnessing an Abyssal Manifestation. So yeah, I guess so.

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>>49215608

>>49215654
Revenge? No. Revenge is silly.

To make sure that this doesn't happen to anyone else's lived ones. It isn't about revenge for one death, it's about protecting the lives of others in South East Wisconsin.

The death of my sister just opened my mind up to the concepts that there are monsters in the dark.

When it comes to his religious studies he sees himself as one who sees the connections others are unwilling to look for. Most people have enough trouble with faith, repentance , cleansing, repeat. It's a damn miracle some people finish step 1.

He joined the arrow because they can teach him how to prevent more deaths like this. How to use his power to strike down those who would bring the conflict to civilians.

How did I screw up? How didn't I? I failed my sister, I failed to protect her. I broke my mother's heart spending so much time "searching for God away from where I should know I could find him." I got a degree in religion from a faith I did not join, meaning I'm not making money as a priest I sell books on comparative religion. You want to know what that pays?

>>49214640
>Does body horror come up in your games?
Kinda. I had a lovely bit in my last game where the players encountered an Acamoth which had taken root in some poor soul's Oneiros.

It had infected and tainted his Daimon, which changed his obsession to "brutal vivisections". They got a lovely view of some of his subjects (a lot of Claimed), and what the Acamoth it had done to the Daimon itself.

It wasn't fucking pretty.

>>49215937
Unless you want to favor one religion, it'll be pretty hard to reference that part of his backstory.

On the assumption of Mormonism, how about Michael Iscariot? The warrior angel, and the great failure himself.

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>>49214640
>Does body horror come up in your games?
Frequently.

One of the tricks is not to make it cool/sexy body malformation. And to keep it going/think it through. A monster with a huge mouth in its belly that drools rancid ooze constantly bugging your nose the whole scene and maybe after. It's going to be over the floor in spatters, attracting vermin.

>>49215937
Good think of their flaws. It gives your storyteller something to work with.

Now look for a name that he thinks he deserves.

Find a heretic. Or an insane priest if he is a bit upbeat. preferably a famous one with a gruesome or noble end. Or something to torment himself.

Take the name Nimrod if you want to be a great uniter who brings people together. Just don't build a tower and mind your prophecies(and ignore that bit about your family being enslaved...).

Just look around for famous people who fit the bill and try to make a theme. Look at Dave B's actual play, it has good examples.

reposting from last thread:

Is there a current prince/archbishop and dominant clan in Constantinople/Istanbul as of around the early 1900s?

Can Cold Iron be nanoforged?

This only applies to certain conspiracys and even so I imagine the technology is unstable at best, but can it?

>>49216277
I'd probably go for Esau over Nimrod who paraded around the coats of Adam and Eve disrespecting these scared relics. When he sold the birth right to Jacob it was because he had returned from months of hunting Nimrod and then killing him for the sacrilege.

How did I not see this name....
Nathanael - angel ruling over hidden things, fire and vengeance.
Puriel - angel whose name means "the fire of God;" angel of punishment.
Seriously how did I not see these two when I googled a list of angel names? Dang. Thinking about it I'm less about vengeance than I thought I would be. I'm not looking for revenge I'm looking to prevent sorrow...but Puriel punishes. I'm not really looking to punish. better keep looking.

Though the problem with an angel for a shadow name is no recoded flaws because angels. Isafel is connected to music and I sadly can't carry to tune. Only way I can play music is with a radio.

>>49216759
Actually...CofD is a world full of grey, and being driven my my shadow name to see people in terms of black and white might be a draw back. Guilty or Innocent.

When I adopt my shadow name Perhaps I'll put on a mask of some sort. Something that will help distance myself from my shadow self.

Masks are said to have a sort of supernatural meaning of putting on a new thing, or becoming the thing represented by the mask.

>>49213585
Spirits start out pure - spirit of Joy, Sorrow, Tree, Movement, etc.

Since very few spirits have the luxury of remaining pure past Rank 1 if they intend to survive, they eed on other essences that are similar to those they already know. As they consume essence they are refined and changed by assuming these related themes; spirits of Joy From Sexual Ecstasy (Orgasm Spirit), Sorrow of Parents Outliving Their Child, One Particular Tree, Spirit of Jogging (Smugness Spirit), etc.

This is normal, Spirits are what they eat and as long as they eat essence that relates to their existing themes then they remain spirits, becoming more narrowly defined and more powerful as they do, their Influences growing and allowing them to therefore create more easily situations that generate their preferred flavors of essence.

Magath are spirits who for whatever reason gorged themselves on essence that in no way related to their existing Influences, and often essence that is totally antithetical to them. This results in contradictory Influences/themes, and as a result the spirit is driven mad and becomes Magath.

These could be nature spirits who fell into a city and survived by consuming pollution essence. A hospital maternity wing becomes the scene of a massacre and the spirit of safeguarding children ends up swallowing too much death and rage essence and now needs to protect life whilst murdering everything in sight.

etc.

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So, on the topic of shadow names, what are your mages shadow names? I have an Arrow devoted/obsessed with protecting those who are close to him before he awakened named Aegis, and a Silver Ladder prophet named Delphi.

>>49218900
The famous Prophet at Delphi? Wasn't that originally a woman?

>>49218900
Alkahest. He's a destroyer and saboteur, and interested in the flaws in all things. Plus Moros for alchemy angle.

>>49214640
>Does body horror come up in your games?

Seeing as I run V20, and Tzimisce/Fleshcrafting is a thing...

Yes.

So my players have gotten the idea to hunt down and bind the spirit of christmas as their totem. I should shut them down because it's stupid but I also want to see what would happen because it's stupid,

>>49218900
Haven't played in ages, but I've got a few NPCs good and done. Ones I've most recently worked on are.

>Walker
Mastigos Arrow. Get power from mysteriousness. Self-centered view on Fate and its practice. Upsets Acanthus. Trying to foster an antagonistic relationship with his pupils so he can better understand them through trial and conflict.

>Sympho(manic)
Thyrsus Libertine, obsessed with sensation. Seeks to fuse Forces and Life, and make living Force, or become it. In the meantime, seeks to make Forces-Vector spells. Healing music and so forth.

>>49220845
too high rank for a werewolf pack
it would warp them itno elves

>>49220845
It would tell them:
Ho Ho Hell No! And be so high rank that it and the spirit of Haunaka wouldn't need to give them the time of day. Pretty much any holiday spirit would be way out of their league. Kwanza might not be as a joke (Kwanzabot from futurama summed it up)

>>49220579

The Oracle at Delphi was a two-stage process; a priestess called a Pythia who inhaled fumes until she had a fit and spoke in tongues, and the priests of Apollo who "interpreted" her ranting.

Anon here, looking for the GM anon interested in running the 2e Dreaming one shot.

If you're here are you still interested? Haven't heard from you.

>>49220978
Sounds like a good way to make your Mage schizophrenic

>>49220860
>>49220941
See this just makes me want to let them try. I'm a sucker for shenanigans.

Can someone walk me through 'the adamantine hand' merit? I read through the thread on the OPP forums and it didn't help.

It's an Order yantra and you can use it to get bonus dice on a spell cast on a following turn, up to your gnosis yantra limit.

So If my character was Gnosis 3 Life 2 with adamantine hand (athletics,brawl). And I want to cast a spell shutting off an enemies retina and blinding them. The turn before I punched the dude in the face and on his turn I dodged a couple damage points due to defense. Does this mean my spell now has a +2 order yantra or does it have two +1 +1 order yantras?

>>49223654
Its should be +2.

>>49215087
Mormon here. You might go for Rockwell (Joseph Smith's bodyguard with a chip on his shoulder, sought revenge for his family, killed about a hundred men)

Other good names for a Mormon Mage might include Talmage, Enoch, Raphiel, Abinadi (Your DM might get poetic with that one and have you get burnt to death) or Melchizedek.

You hit the nail on the head with finding bits of truth in religions and traditions worldwide, BYU professors love that stuff.

Was anything at all announced at the Grand Masquerade?

>>49224000
Police inquiries are still ongoing

>>49224000
Vamp 5th will suck. I think that's about it

>>49224099
So no news, then.

>>49224181
The metaplot is going to be based on what happens in their big sanctioned LARPs
I think that's the only thing we didn't know for sure that we do now

>>49223712
Thanks. Other than greater flexibility is there a reason to get both weaponry and brawl variants of adamantine hand? Since you can only attack once you'll only benefit from one variant.

>>49224000
Dracula was there and he, like, fucked everyone.

what happened to that canon index page?

>>49224652
http://wodcodex.com/wiki/Main_Page

>>49224674
ty

>>49223654
You have two +1 Order tool Yantras

>>49226513
Hey dave, quick question, Adamant Hand's true power lies in the fact that the +1 it gives you is a reflexive yantra, right? I still get another reflexive yantra when casting a spell?

>>49226513
Chargen Mage > Vampie

Why?

>>49226714
What?

>>49226714
Chargen Vampire > Mortal

Why?

>>49226714
Chargen Demon > Mae

Why?

Matt McFarland said he'll try to get a Dark Eras Companion preview out soon!

>>49227772

Exciting! I hope we get it by the end of the year.

Someone sell me on trying to find a game of Demon or Mage. I only have time for one.

>>49224232
Well it doesn't have to be offensive. Lets say for example you can use weaponry for defense. Then you can take the dodge action and gain the benefits of the yantra.

And as a storyteller I would rull that if you buy the merit twice then you can use both skill as different yantras. So thats two yantras you never have to worry about not working.

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>We fired the event planner shortly after.

>>49228949

Look, sometimes you just have to hide in plain sight.

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>>49214640
>Does body horror come up in your games?
Nope, I try to avoid inserting my magical realm into games.

>>49230264

Deviant the Renegades confirmed for the most magical realm game ever?

Is there a clear winner between oWoD and nWoD as far as Mage goes? If so, what makes it so much better? If not, what are the pros and cons of each?

5e campaign ending in the next couple weeks. DM is thinking of trying Mage next.

>>49230733
oWoD wins

At being shit

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>>49230733
oWoD Mage is Solipsism where you fight against a group of individuals who seek to crush Magic and institute technology as the prominent force in the universe. Reality is a consensus of opinion, but it isn't really, as mass delusions don't become reality, and your Magic gets more fucked up the more people realise what you're doing doesn't mesh with what they believe. You fight to ensure that their consensus doesn't overpower your Magic and leave you normal again.

nWoD Mage is Gnosticism where you draw down the power from a higher realm, which used to be connected to reality, but is now separated by a horrific Abyss which seeks the destruction of both. This separation has deeply wounded the world, and shards of the Abyss lie within each mortal's soul, which corrupts your pure Magic when exposed. You fight to preseve your freedom from the horrific tyrannical Exarchs, renegade Mages who toppled the Gods and live within that higher realm, to study and learn more Arcane secrets, and eventually free yourselves from the shackles of this reality and Ascend to the Supernal Realms, fulfil your soul's destiny, and become a part of the Universe itself. Or just relish in the power of your Magic. Or serve the Exarchs.

I much prefer nWoD Mage.

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>>49230655
>mfw I find out this is a thing
neat

>>49230749
>>49230903
>really into postmodern magic(k) IRL
>start reading the nWoD Mage 2e book
>mentions The Invisibles and Hellblazer within the first few pages
I think I'll like this game.

>>49230943

Are you an Unknown Armies fan at all?

>>49230977
I haven't played it, but I read the rulebook a while back and it looked cool. At the time I was too busy to GM anything, and neither of the people who were willing to GM wanted to run it.

>>49214640
Can't wait for my players to meet a Tzimice. It's a DA game, they have no idea what the metaplot is like, and one of them is a Tremere

>>49216395
Pretty sure the point of cold iron is that it isn't worked by a forge. Even of the nano variety.

>>49231881
I thought it was no-tools. I guess it depends if the nanites heat the iron or not.

>>49231647
Make sure that Tremere is getting shit on at every turn as a Usurper, since this is not the modern Tremere pyramid! :D

>>49232038
Already got called that by a Nossie. Has no idea what the fuck is going on

>>49232081
Hell yes.

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Hello, it's that weird First time Mage Player who's been asking a Shit ton of questions.

Okay, so I've got it narrowed down to two options. A friend of mine after I told them the story says they like the second one. But I just want to know what I'd be in for with these as my shadow name
1, Puriel - Angel of Punishment and Fire. He is largely depicted as a angelic ass kicker and God's bouncer. His name means "God's Fire"

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>>49233365
2. Ammon (Long Story here kiddos and I'm going to give you the DBZ Abridged Version). So long, long ago this guy Named Ammon goes to teach his enemies about God. Meanwhile in the lands of a certain king over his people's enemy's robbers would come and scatter his shepards and steal sheep. Why because the shepards weren't getting paid enough to risk their lives for the sheep. That's the problem when you use slave labor.
Now Back to Ammon. Well he enters this country and what happens. He's caught because he doesn't look, talk, or dress like his enemies. So they bring him before the king. King looks at him asks why he's here. Ammon says "I want to teach you about God." King says "I don't care, enjoy being a slave." Well the king figures if he makes this guy a shepard then when sheep get stolen he can dump the blame on him and execute him.

So what happens that special time of the day rolls around when the bandits come to steel the sheep. The other slave shepards nope on out of there because these bandits are armed, and know how to use their weapons. They were shepards for crap's sake they had swords more for show.
Out numbered, and out classed they ran because they weren't getting paid enough to fight and die. They weren't getting paid at all. So yeah total lack of motivation to stay and make waves. Except for Ammon. So the rest of the slaves are half way to emasculation when they realize the newbie wasn't with them. So they turn back to go grab him, and when they see that the bandits are having trouble getting near the sheep because every time they try they pull back a bloody stump. This missionary is disarming them in a very literal sense and the bandits finally decide to cut their losses before this crazy shepard decides to cut off other parts of them.

(continued)

>>49233387
So Ammon turns around. Gives them a big old smile and tells them they should all start gathering up the flock, and he helps them gather up the sheep, take them home from grazing. Then he says "Well I'm off to go groom the kings horses you guys have fun. Head shepard he gathered up the severed arms in a sack and presents them to the king. King looks at these and says "Damn you guys grew some spine finally." Head Shepard says, "Hell no we were halfway home when we realized we left the newbie behind went back to get him, and well...his is all his work."
King excretes bricks, then asks "So umm...Where is he now?"
"Oh he's grooming the horses..." King now has enough bricks to make a house.

I'm surprised that the Forces section for Mage doesn't have an optical illusion spell.
It'd be Weaving right?
Seems like a pretty major omission though, given the extreme usefulness of holograms.

For the sake of one of my players, I'm working on a little bit of homebrew for Promethean.

First, here is the Bestowment (Extempore btw)
>Taint of the Bomb
The bomb is the necessary evil, the weapon that both saved and doomed the world. A nuclear extempore has to accept roles no other promethean would want, the role of the antagonist. This promethean can achieve milestones while in the refinement of flux, but can still trigger breaking points.

(Achieving a role milestone for Flux is a breaking point)

>Flux Roles
Villain: Between great tales, and those on the wrong side of history, villains are willing to snatch everything they want without regard for those around them. The villain may have a plan, and the villain may have allies, but in the end they stand in opposition to what the world sees as 'good' and 'moral'. The villain builds up, plans, and eventually acts on schemes that would appall others. But the villain can be redeemed, because there are always other means to achieve goals, and there can always be a threat that cannot be defeated without the aid of others.

Rival: A rival isn't out to beat just anyone, they are out to beat a specific someone. They are the personal monster in someone's way. When their prey goes to bed, they imagine the rival, when their prey acts they worry about the rival. But does the rival act out of hatred? do they notice their prey at all? or is this the only way they know to get their prey's attention?

Beast: The beast is mindless, instinctive. Beyond giving in to being an inhuman freak, the beast gives in to base impulses. Obstacles are destroyed, food is horded, threats are slaughtered. The beast doesn't plan so much as hunt. The beast doesn't socialize, it has a pack. Giving in to the monster inside can be difficult, but what that proves can be more beneficial to The beast when they evolve.

>>49234969
Like I said last time, I think the approach you're taking is kind of stupid. A Zeka shouldn't just be focused on "all Centimani all the time". It misses the point of being a Promethean in the first place, and it turns Centimani into nothing more than another way to get neat toys.

On top of that, it seems to also miss how the game actually works. First, Centimani is not "being the antagonist". The entire purpose of the Refinement is that you are embracing Flux, acknowledging that you're a monster, and refusing to work towards the Pilgrimage. Making it a part of the pilgrimage beyond "I learned why I shouldn't turn away from the Pilgrimage" is failing to understand Centimani.

More to the point, you also don't seem to understand what Milestones or Breaking Points represent. A Milestone is literally moving forward on your Pilgrimage. For Prometheans, their Breaking Points are stepping backwards on the Pilgrimage. You can see how a Breaking Point triggered by a Milestone might be an issue.

Furthermore, being "the villain" is already covered by several other Roles and Refinements. Martyrs, Soldiers, Exemplars, Provacateurs, Vigilantes, Outcasts, Savages, Deviants...

>>49235119
Again, a Role is all about moving forward on the Pilgrimage. The entire point of Centimani is turning away from it entirely. You're essentially just trying to get cool "transhuman" powers without actually suffering for it. Except you're a Promethean, so you're still suffering.
Nevermind that all of those Roles ignore the purpose of Centimani: Becoming a better MONSTER.

>tfw DavidH responds to your idea and takes it seriously

:D

>>49235509
Link?

Quick question
Is Archery under Firearms or Athletics?
Does Life Arcanum cover control of Animals or do you need Mind for that?

>>49235586

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/964083-changeling-2e-japan-kinda-like-tokyo-only-bigger?p=965481#post965481

I've been sitting on the idea of Meiji Werewolf for a while and figured I'd ask the CofD Japan guy directly.

>>49235646

I would say archery is Athletics unless you're in a pre-gunpowder setting, in which case Archery replaces Firearms as a skill.

>>49235246
I remember your comments from the first time, and thanks for commenting again. Trust me, I've kept that all in mind. I'm mindfully ignoring your greater advice to just not do it, and instead tempering the greater effort with that in mind.

But that is because I disagree with you on a few points.

Centimani is indeed not 'being the antagonist'. They are stepping away from the effort to become human. For most prometheans that means they turn away from the pilgrimage entirely, the idea here is that for this extempore accepting being part of the problem is as much a step toward being human as any other.

Also, I don't fail to understand milestones or breaking points. While it is unorthodox to have a milestone trigger a breaking point, it isn't completely impossible considering the greater theme. Yes, they learned something that pushed them forward, but they do so by taking a treacherous path. Because not every breaking point trigger actually causes a fall backwards... actually it is unlikely until you at least get pilgrimage 5.

And yes, being 'bad' is covered under those roles. Which is exactly why it isn't all that problematic to have more roles covering the same.

So, I respect that you don't like the idea. Thanks for your comment.

can you take area of expertise merit multiple times for multiple specialties?

>>49214640
>using MTG art in the OP of /CofD/ & /wodg/
LOL

>>49236071
I've been pretending Mr Lich is a mummy.

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>>49236071
>Missing the point
You know, the Shadowrun thread never has to deal with people going >using Cyberpunk 2077 art

>>49236191
Honestly, shadowrun has bigger problems to deal with.

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>>49236209
Yeah, like being Shadowrun.

Someone on the forums asked for help doing the math for casting a spell in Mage and I gave myself a headache.

It's not a bad system, but my god am I too stupid to wrestle with it on the fly.

>>49236494
What was the spell? Or just gimme a link

>>49236532

Bob wants to cast Honing the Form on himself, have it last one day, and raise all three of his physical attributes from 2 to 5. His Gnosis is 2 and his Life is 3.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/mage-the-awakening/965513-bob-the-mage

I think I did everything right? I'm pretty sure Bob isn't casting that spell.

>>49236191
The Night Watch from the 70s? I can dig it

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>>49236585
Damnit, I went back a page trying to use the alt code for ● instead of just copypasting it.

>Step One: Declare Intent
"I want to Hone my Form!"
>Step Two: Determine Arcanum and Practice
Life, Patterning
>Step Three: Determine Effect and Cost
Raising Attributes, which requires no Mana
>Step Four: Determine Withstand Trait
None, though if someone really didn't like the idea of being stronger, probably Stamina.
>Step Five: Determine Primary Spell Factor
Potency, which at 1+[Life-1] is 3.
>Step Six: Cast the Spell
Though first we'll need to math.

The spell as it stands is as follows:
Potency: 3
Duration: 1 turn
Scale: 1 subject
Range: Self/Bob
Casting Time: 3 Hours

So, let's start with Reach.
1 reach for Advanced Duration
2 Reach for effecting all two additional Physical Attributes
Unless the spell is a Rote, Bob will have to use a Ritual casting or provoke Paradox.

Now for Spell Factors.
-2 to increase Duration from One Scene to One Day.
A whopping -12 to raise Potency from 3 to the 9 necessary to bring three Attributes from ●● to ●●●●●.
This takes us to a total of -14.

Bob is now at -9 to cast this spell.

>>49236682
I had actually originally been thinking of Cabals, which get benefits from having dumb themes like being Amerindian or baseball weirdos or lesbians.

>>49236943

Primary Spell Factor on honing the Form is Duration, not Potency.

>>49237065
Well fuck me

>>49237065
Posting the corrected version here, for consistency:

>Step One: Declare Intent
"I want to Hone my Form!"
>Step Two: Determine Arcanum and Practice
Life, Patterning
>Step Three: Determine Effect and Cost
Raising Attributes, which requires no Mana
>Step Four: Determine Withstand Trait
None, though if someone really didn't like the idea of being stronger, probably Stamina.
>Step Five: Determine Primary Spell Factor
Duration, which at 1+[Life-1] is 3. With Standard Duration, this is 3 Turns.
>Step Six: Cast the Spell
Though first we'll need to math.

The Default spell has a Potency of 1, a Duration of 1 turn, a Scale of one person or roughly five feet, a Range of touch (the caster is of course always touching themselves), and has a Casting Time based on Gnosis, which for a Mage with Gnosis ●● is 3 Hours. Additionally, the Spell's Primary Factor is always Potency or Duration. Whichever it is moves an additional [Arcanum-1] steps up the chart.

Our Spell So Far:
Potency: 1
Duration: 3 turns
Scale: 1 subject
Range: Self/Bob
Casting Time: 3 Hours
This clearly isn't what we want it to do, so now we tweak the spell using Reach and Spell Factors.

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>>49237666
So, let's start with Reach.
1 Reach for Advanced Duration, which will shift the time from three turns to one week.
2 Reach for effecting all two additional Physical Attributes
Additionally, we're going spend 1 Reach to switch the Primary Spell Factor; the benefit of this is that it will make Potency much stronger, making it 1+[Life-1]. It will also bring the Duration back down to the first step on the Advanced Duration chart, which is 1 Scene.
You have "Free" Reach equal to the amount your dots in the Arcanum meets or exceeds the level required to cast the spell. The Honing the Form Spell is Life ●●● and Bob has Life ●●●, so he only gets one "Free" Reach. Each Additional Reach (of which we've spent 4 total, 3 over) increases the Paradox risk of the spell by an amount determined by Gnosis, which for Gnosis ●● is one die each.

The spell is now as follows:
Potency: 3
Duration: 1 Scene
Scale: 1 subject
Range: Self/Bob
Casting Time: 3 Hours
Paradox: 3 Dice

Now for Spell Factors.
-2 to increase Duration from One Scene to One Day.
A whopping -12 to raise Potency from 3 to the 9 necessary to bring three Attributes from ●● to ●●●●●.
This takes us to a total of -14.

Our spell is now:
Potency: 9
Duration: One Day
Scale: 1 Subject
Range: Self/Bob
Casting Time: 3 Hours
Paradox: 3 Dice
But there's still a problem... Bob is now at -6 to cast this spell, assuming he uses both his Mantra and Path Tool Yantras. Bob is literally incapable of casting this spell as its penalty is greater than -5.

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>>49237673
Now, if instead of his Tool and instead of using the Spell as a Praxis Bob uses a Rote that uses Medicine, then his Medicine 3 will come into play, bringing the total casting pool up to -4. This is possible, but also ridiculously unlikely. But there's hope. If instead of being greedy, Bob chooses to only increase his Attributes ●● each, then he will save himself -6 in total Spell Factor penalties and be able to cast Honing the Form, as a Rote, Increasing his Strength, Dexterity, and Stamina each from ●● to ●●●● with a total casting pool of two dice. I would suggest using Willpower.
As previously stated, it only requires a single success, but the roll itself will come after three hours of meditation and chanting. Alternately, for an additional die of Paradox, you could cast it as an Instant action (though this would still require two turns to use your Yantras). Your original question suggested using a Praxis, but especially when you want to tweak Spell Factors, you want to use a Rote, as Rotes provide quite a few extra dice; 3 more dice in your case, though if you were a member of the Adamantine Arrows (or were using one of the Mysterium Rote Skills of Investigation, Occult, or Survival) you would add +1 to the Rote Yantra.
The other benefit of a Rote is that Bob will have "Free" Reach as if he was casting the spell with Life ●●●●●, which would mean that the Paradox is only 1 die (because casting as if you have Life ●●●●● means meeting and exceeding the spell's requirements by 3 dots), or 2 if you cast the spell as an Instant action over the course of two turns.

I think I got it but I got a weird one for you.
So....Let's say I (Ammon) want to cast a spell the creates a grenade like effect. I'm forces 3. Let's say I was leading away two gang bangers who have a distinct problem with some friends of mine putting up a shelter for battered and abused women on the edge of their territory.

Now I'm trying to create a blasting damage so I grab umm...Control fire! Just so happens I came prepared with one of my two rings. (One absorbs sunlight, one absorbs fire) And I look behind me.

>Step 1 Declair intent
Kaboom!
>Step 2
Forces 2 Ruleing
>Step 3 Determine Effect and cost
Uhhh Damage? Cost none?
>Step 4 Determine Withstand Trait
I think none?
>Step 5: Determine Primary spell factor
Potency. This is going to be over in a flash, that's how explosions work after all. So that is 1+ [Force 3 -1] which is 3
>Step 6
Cast this bad boy!

er...let's see what tweeking we need first...umm...help? I'm Gnosis 1 because I spent all my Merit points on stuff like a hallow, money, and this cool sword!
Obviously we need to speed up that casting I don't have 3 hours to run these gang bangers around Milwaukee. So +1 reach.
Potency? These are mere humans I'm not worried about them resisting. and 3 for the potency seems enough.
Size? We are in an alley but I doubt they are spread out but I want to make sure I get them all -2 to bump up size.
Range - reaching! For the love of all magic Reaching! I don't want to be at touch range when this goes off.

So far I have a spell that is
Potency: 3
Duration: Instant
Scale: Small Room
Range: Sense
Casting Time: Instant
Paradox 2

Yantra - Path Tool, and Persona (shadow name)
so +4 dice?

>>49238489
with a -2 to cast for size?

Okay I have my magic grenade? now let's see
I need to assign damage, Blast Radius, and Force
Well damage and force are going to come from potency
Blast radius from scale. So let's see...umm...I should probably split potency evenly between damage and force with any remainder going to force. So this will be damage 1 force 2. Blast radius 2?

I have Forces 3 + Gnosis 1 +4 from tools to cast this on -2 for increase scale. I'm going to contain that paradox and hope this makes them reconsider.
So I have 6 casting dice? I'd up the potency but I'm not trying to kill them, just maim and cripple them.

What the hell is an Abyssal Environmental Tilt?
There's no guidance in the book.

>>49238535
Fun for the ST?
I had an Abyssal monster lay it's eggs inside of a mage inflicting him with +2 paradox for every spell he cast.

I wouldn't do that, because it's a released paradox so it's not meant to directly hurt the mage.

It's an environmental tilt - a rules effect that applies to all characters within the area for a short space of time - that is also Abyssal. You're meant to make them up.

I'd lay the eggs in anyone who drank water from the area, or fuck with gravity, or reverse all durabilities so hard things became soft and soft hard. Or turn all wound penalties of people in the area into bonuses.

Really depends on the spell.

>>49238645
Ahh I figured a giant tentacled monster showing up would have been scary enough. After all the beast saw the tentacles coming up from the ground and said. Nope! Opened a path to her lair as fast as she could and jumped in. The werewolves saw the tentacles saw the tentacles, went to full wolf form and ran away with tails between their legs.

So would a better effect have been to have anyone who looks upon the horror from the Abyss gains madness? I mean this was a pretty dramatic f-up in the terms of Paradox. I think he was looking at something like 16 paradox dice from casting his spell on a large group of sleepers and getting their attention on him first.

>>49238645
Good to know, thanks Dave.
My players are still a bit skeptical about the threat of Paradox though.
Would it be fair to disallow players to scourge an Abyssal condition from their pattern if it was of sufficient severity?

Otherwise it seems that they could simply push their powers to the limit and beyond, attempt to contain it, then purge the condition with a singular Resistant Lethal wound.

Which doesn't exactly seem reasonable for the amount of Abyssal taint which they're filling their soul with.

>>49235509
You've come a long way from calling him a bigot him every time his name was mentioned. I'd congratulate your maturity if you weren't acting so fanboyish.

I think I'd like David Hill a lot more if his Tokyo setting had always been on point like the changelings one. That's some good stuff right there.

>>49239472
Why did he call David a bigot? He's literally the biggest Japanophile of the writers.

>>49238489
>Let's say I was leading away two gang bangers who have a distinct problem with some friends of mine putting up a shelter for battered and abused women on the edge of their territory.
Well of course they'd have a problem, it should clearly be a shelter for battered men! (Such shelters would be nice, but as women are statistically more likely to suffer the more serious effects of intimate partner violence--even as many of them still commit it themselves--the "what about the men!" argument always getting brought up by the MRA types infuriates me, as most of them don't actually seem to care) Ahem...

But in seriousness:
>I came prepared with one of my two rings
What?

Control Fire is also not a "Kaboom!" Spell, it's a spell for moving and controlling existing Fire. Damage would generally be a Fraying spell.

So, this spell is currently:
>Potency: 3
>Duration: One Turn
>Scale: 5 yards
>Range: Touch
>Casting Time: 3 hours
I'm not sure why you think you'd have 2 Paradox. In your example, you use Control Fire, which is Forces ●●, but have Forces ●●●, so you'd be fine, even using Reach for Range and Casting Time.

But anyway, what you really want to do is the following:
1 Reach for Casting Time to Instant
Cast the Spell Aimed
"Throw" the spell at an area between them, as if you were touching that area. This is a Gnosis+Athletics roll to essentially toss the spell.

I'll continue in the next post.

>>49240239
Now, you'll do 3 Bashing damage to anyone within the 5 yard area of the spell. You'll be fine assuming they're within 5 yards of each other. That's not really that bad, especially in an alleyway. But it is only 3 Bashing damage. Ideally, you'll want to increase the Potency to increase the damage. There's no Withstanding a Damage spell, but if you go overboard, you've killed someone. I would say that -2 to make the spell Potency 4 is a good deterrent.
You will of course use 1 Reach to make it Instant, but I'd suggest using another to make it give a Tilt (my advice would be Knockdown or Stunned). This will put you into Paradox, with each additional Reach granting one die. But you should be safe.

Spell so far:
>Potency: 4
>Duration: One Turn
>Scale: 5 yards
>Range: Touch (Aimed)
>Casting Time: Instant
>Paradox: 1

Your casting pool is 4 (Gnosis ● + Forces ●●●), though you'll have +1 from your Path Tool and +1 to +3 from your Shadowname (though I'm not sure how the great Ammon would be able to invoke his own name with an unleashed wave of generic energy). You'll then subtract -2 (or -4, or -0, depending on your additional Potency).

I suggest adding a second Reach to give it Knockdown because 3 bashing damage to two people might just make them mad. Doing Knockdown will give you a better chance to deal with them one at a time.

>>49240239
Aspel please. You've been on Rationalwiki for too long.

>>49238548
>>49238735
>a giant tentacled monster showing up
That's not an Environment, that's a Summoning.

>>49239472
>>49239650
Being a Japanophile is part of the problem; he kind of fetishizes Japan, while also saying other people who fetishize Japan (like weeaboos) are bad. It wouldn't be so bad if his statements came off as observations instead of pronouncements. i.e. the way he talked about the phrase "mai waifu", which legitimately IS racist (since the whole thing sprang up because it was funny how a guy in an anime pronounced my wife), and sexist (since it's objectifying and treats women as objects), and also creepy (she's not real). But he phrased it in a way many see as being entitled and pretentious. He's got that whole "I'm a Japanophile but *I* think katanas and samurai are dumb, so that makes me better than other Japanophiles" thing going on, basically.

>>49239119
I haven't been able to play around with things, but from a friend who Mages like twice a week, he says NuParadox is pretty deadly, since it comes up more often. It even keeps coming up in most of the examples I give of mathemagic.
If your players are fine with taking a Resistant Lethal wound (which seems like the kind of thing that would be pretty deadly, especially if they're doing it more than once every two days) then maybe make the damage equal to the number of successes the Paradox gained. If you get a Paradox roll with 3 successes, you'd take 3L to Scour it. You could also downgrade that to Bashing if you're looking to be gentler, while still making Paradox dangerous in the short term. But that might also work better if you increase healing times across the board, which is a thing I've wanted to do but never done because it feels like my players might not like it if Bashing healed in a day, Lethal (and Attribute damage) healing in a week, and Aggravated in about a month.

>>49240650

That's less RationalWiki and more Aspel's insistent need to go on tangents, a bad habit of many, many 4chan users.

>>49239615

I liked it quite a bit. Vampire and Changeling have the best Tokyo setting so far.

>>49241091
>mai waifu is japanese
The term 'waifu' began as a Japanese otaku thing, anon, Americans didn't create it, Japanese otaku took it from Azumanga

>>49241194
*racist, not japanese

>>49240650
To be fair, I've always felt that it's important [to feminism/humanism!] to acknowledge male victims of what are typically seen as female problems like rape and IPV, but I hate the way the MRM uses that as a way to attack and discredit feminism when they probably don't care about male victims. I mean, those folks are the ones who are most likely to mock and demean a male victim of rape or intimate partner violence, or even homophobia, by calling them wimps/faggots/cucks.

But for some reason I spoilered that joke but it doesn't show up spoilered. That keeps happening for some reason...

But on the subject of RationalWiki, I was originally going around the circlejerky parts that tell me things I already know and make fun of MRAs and anti-SJW shitters, but now I'm stuck in the CONSPIRACY NUTJOB sections and getting creeped the fuck out at night regardless of how stupid the idea is that REPTOID COMMUNISTS want to depopulate the earth and corrupt my bodily fluids (and that they might be lurking in the shadows to do so).

I want to make a crazy Conspiracy wingnut in the WoD. Someone who "knows" about EVERYTHING, but in the same way that Alex Jones or Glenn Beck "knows" about the government.

I'm talking a mortal or mortal+ character who's understanding of the Chronicles of Darkness is made up of crazy OOC fan theories.

>>49241144
I would never ever go off topic.

>>49241194
>>49241204
I am like 99% sure it started on /a/.

>>49241292
Is this going to turn into one of those great thread derails again?

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>>49238735
By the way, creepy black tentacles showing up IS a valid form for an Abyssal Environmental Tilt to take. You could use the rules for Ice or Earthquake.
Or just "any character in the area is accosted by otherworldly appendages, and must roll Dexterity+Wits or become Immobilized and take 1B per round until they can free themselves with a Strength+Brawl roll. All rolls in the area are penalized equal to the Gnosis of the Mage who cast the spell, even for those who succeed".

Or maybe you could use Swarm rules. I wish they'd been in the core. Though I suppose Swarms could be Brief Nightmares.

Minion (5/3/2 dice for Best/Average/Worst pools), ignores Armour and Defense, attacks everyone in an area, can only be damaged by AoEs or fire, and maybe does Poison. Or maybe Sickened as an Environmental Tilt.

>>49241311
I would never go off topic. Never.

Although I wouldn't mind talking about the worldview of a crazy conspiracy theorist in the CofD.

>>49240239
Yes, because feminism cares so, so much more about men.

>>49241292
>The term “Waifu” was first introduced to the English-speaking audiences through a scene from the popular high school anime series Azumanga Daioh, which aired in Japan from April to September 2002 and later released as a DVD set in the United States in September 2005. In the scene, the protagonist’s perverted homeroom teacher Mr. Kimura drops a photograph of a mysterious woman on the classroom floor. When asked by his students about the person in the picture, Mr. Kimura simply replies: “Mai Waifu.”

Oh look, the floorlicker is wrong. Again.

Go kill yourself.

>>49241311
aspels posting so yeah

>>49241484
>the whole thing sprang up because it was funny how a guy in an anime pronounced my wife
Are you illiterate?

>>49241525
It didn't start on /a/, it started over THERE. So how the flipping flying fuck is it racist, floorlicker?

>>49241571
David said the tweet that aspel used to post to show how horrible he was was about some american guy in japan trying to pick up a japanese girl by calling her his waifu

now aspel just tries to suck up in the hopes that he'll get hired to write

>>49241632
Didn't he used to complain that Hill was on some MU* where he sexually harassed girls?

>>49241632
>>49241651
>suck up
I literally just criticized him :V
>sexually harassed
No, he was just the cliquiest of the cliquey, which entails "be my best friend and typefuck me IC or I'll hate you and all the other cliquies will hate you". Which is why MUSHes will always be literally the fucking worst. You don't get cliques in a 'real' tabletop. But, hey, on the plus side at least he didn't commit arson, ragequit to avoid the consequences, then use his ST privileges to sanction his own character, and join an IC clique of people who benefited from his IC actions.

"ICC=ICA" indeed.

Fuck I hate MUSHes

>>49241292
>>49241367

>claims not to go on tangents
>goes on a tangent

Of course, tangents are always two (or more!) to tango, and by even responding, I might as well have started the Lambada.

>>49241484
>>49241525

The actual start of "waifu" as a slang term came from the Lucky Star fandom. "Konata is my Wife" was a popular meme phrase.

>>49238645

The Abyssal Environmental Tilt is by far my favorite Tilt in 2e. Free reign to go "everything's fucked FOREVER" in a can.

Why is it that everyone on 4chan knows not to feed the trolls, except when you people deal with this aspell guy?

Seriously, shut up. This is wodg, not aspell general.

>>49241813

>You don't get cliques in a 'real' tabletop.

Oh, you sweet summer child.

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>>49241813
Oh, eat my fucking asshole, you little whining cunt.

Everyone! It's time for a primer on why Aspel is such a little bitch! Here's how he acts.

>First, he decides he doesn't like a thing.
>Then, using charged terminology, like das racist, he'll start shitposting WILDLY about it, without a single care if it's true or not.
>He'll keep this up, no matter how much he's asked to stop, actually stay on the topic of the thread, or anything!
>Eventually, people cave to his bitchass just because they finally want him to shut the fuck up, allowing the sperg to dictate the conversation.

So what's the lession here, kids? Ignore the speg, and report his every post.

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>>49241845
I was clearly joking, considering both posts had tangents.
Also, it's only fucked for a *little* while. It's like a storm, you just gotta wait it out and hope everything you love and care about isn't reduced to debris. But it could be worse; I mean, it could be a Firestorm.
Although you could also use Firestorm rules to create an Abyssal Environmental Tilt.

>>49241853
>>49241877
>Ignore the speg
Irony!

>>49241864
Well in general you're going to be playing a tabletop with your friends. While favouritism can still be a thing, you aren't generally even going to have enough players to form blocs that abuse the system to their own ends. I mean, the situation I mentioned above where a player fucked shit up, deleted his character to avoid playing out the consequences, and then joined a rival faction of the people who's shit he fucked up isn't something that even CAN happen in a tabletop.

Although if you've got some bad WoD tabletop stories, feel free to share. Everyone loves Schadenfreude.

>>49241853

>Why is it that everyone on 4chan knows not to feed the trolls

Well that's never been true, or else the concept of bait as a meme wouldn't exist. The truth is, people love getting on their soapbox and expressing their opinions on an anonymous imageboard, and people love getting mad at those other people.

Aspel isn't any different than any other shitposter with questionable opinions, it's just that they've been around and said those opinions long enough that even when anonymous, thread regulars can recognize them on sight. They're the best baiter, because they cast their net wide and do it with sincerity.

>>49235119
I think the two things I still need to do are: fiddle with the rules on breaking points and vitriol beats. As it is now, if I have reaching a centimani milestone also roll a breaking point, and the person DOES fail, they would get another beat. Would be as easy as judging that this doesn't work because that is two beats for one moment, which I think the rules already say can't happen.

The other problem is milestones and breaking points for centimani roles. Which should be fun, but some might get difficult.

>>49241923

>Well in general you're going to be playing a tabletop with your friends. While favouritism can still be a thing, you aren't generally even going to have enough players to form blocs that abuse the system to their own ends.

Oh, you sweet, sweet summer child. May you always waltz among the roses and honeydews.

>>49242006

>The other problem is milestones and breaking points for centimani roles.

I suppose Breaking Points for them would be "acting a bit too human".

I thought Aspel and David Hill were the same person?

>>49242036
You can't just say things like that and then not elaborate :V

>>49235709
I missed this at first.
>Centimani is indeed not 'being the antagonist'. They are stepping away from the effort to become human. For most prometheans that means they turn away from the pilgrimage entirely, the idea here is that for this extempore accepting being part of the problem is as much a step toward being human as any other.
My point is that approach devalues what it means to be centimani in the first place. Like I said, what's problematic isn't that you have more roles covering being a bad guy; the problem is that you seem to just be trying to make being Centimani "playable" without missing out on the Pilgrimage. I mean, a lot of your Roles go against the very concept of being a Centimani.
You're basically just creating a new Refinement that happens to use everything about Centimani except the fluff.

You CAN take up Centimani in a belief that you must become the monster because "someone has to do it", but "I must be the monster to understand Humanity" is not Centimani. It's closer to Argentum or Stannum, really.

But you don't want to use Stannum, because that one doesn't have the cool transhumanist powers.

>>49242120
Yeah, but if I understand right, it is the roles that give breaking points, not the whole refinement.

So like, in gold refinement. You have breaking points for being a companion, not breaking points for gold in general.

It is a bit hard to tell, since information about breaking points is scattered in this one since other aspects of Your character play into the breaking points. They can't just have one page with a chart. Instead they have to explain breaking points in the roles area, the pilgrimage area, and probably somewhere else I've missed.

>>49242168
You seem to think I'm the player who wants to use this, I'm the ST. The player was the first person to bring up the idea a few threads ago. Honestly I don't care about the powers. I checked to see if they were relatively overpowered, they aren't.

I think they more want a chance to use the pandoran alembics.

But I think, if you were the ST in this situation, you would be trying way too hard to say no to a simple yes that would make the game more enjoyable to one of your players.

On top of that, as an extempore, getting to have a unique bestowment is exactly in their wheelhouse, especially since their pilgrimages are usually unique. They can't count on the usual 13 steps (or however many). The azothic memory doesn't lead them the same, and may never lead them to the great work.

>>49242239
>You seem to think I'm the player who wants to use this, I'm the ST.
Same diff. It's essentially just "I want to use villain powers". At the very least it very much is misunderstanding the point of Centimanus.

>as an extempore, getting to have a unique bestowment is exactly in their wheelhouse, especially since their pilgrimages are usually unique
Yes, but in this case the unique bestowment is *an entire Refinement*. That's not really in their Wheelhouse.

Also, Extempore, if they can complete the Great Work, still have to go through the *Six* Universal Milestones.

If the player really wants to be a Zeka, switching the Promethean affinity with Electricity for one with Radiation would be much more reasonable than radically redefining the antagonist Refinement.

>>49242312
That's actually pretty trash for a unique bestowment. Check their general power level, or the examples. That is terrible.

whatever happened to the gay werewolf guy. i haven't checked these generals in a few months, they used to be everywhere.

>>49240344
>>49240239
>>49238521
>>49238489
Forgot to mention: This is going to have a base Paradox pool of 2 simply because you're using such an obvious supernatural effect on two mortals. Presumably these hoodlums are Sleepers.

>>49242426
Zeka are pretty trash :V
But you're right, though. Zeka in 1e in general tweaked a lot of the existing template in a way more fitting with 2e's Extempore to begin with, like how they have no set Humour or Element, but the one that animates them is radiation flavoured. It would be more accurate to just have their "radiation instead of electricity" thing be less a Bestowment and more just a trait.

A better Bestowment would probably be to inflict the Sickened Tilt on anyone in their presence at the cost of a point of Pyros. But like I said, I never particularly liked how the Zeka were handled.

>>49241813
>You don't get cliques in a 'real' tabletop
real tabletop is literally a clique bro. it just causes no problem because it's one clique. think about it.

in the clique, everyone works together. everything goes their way. even the ST is in on it and focuses all attention on them.

the problem with any big game is that they become a handful of small games competing with each other.

>>49242535
Most people only consider something a "clique" when it's negative.

Also, I wouldn't say the problem is that it's a handful of small games so much as it is that a lot of people use their OOC connections to influence IC events. You'll have players flirting OOC and then suddenly their characters become best friends. Or you have someone's character do something stupid and then they delete it and create a new one in the IC group their action benefited. Or you have people using OOC knowledge or grudges to influence IC events.

I wouldn't necessarily DISAGREE that it's "a handful of small games competing with each other", but I'd say that's an oversimplification of the real problem. Which is that people are dicks IC and OOC and let the two overlap. This is why I say that cliques aren't a thing in real tabletop; to me at least a "clique" is something that can only exist when there's people to exclude or exploit. You can have a clique that games, and excludes people from the game, but as far as the game itself is concerned, there's no cliques, just the troupe.

>>49242598
>Most people only consider something a "clique" when it's negative.
doing that is wrong. the average tabletop group is a clique. and like all cliques, it's perfectly fine for everyone in the clique.

>Also, I wouldn't say the problem is that it's a handful of small games so much as it is that a lot of people use their OOC connections to influence IC events. You'll have players flirting OOC and then suddenly their characters become best friends. Or you have someone's character do something stupid and then they delete it and create a new one in the IC group their action benefited. Or you have people using OOC knowledge or grudges to influence IC events.

this is literally what any tabletop game is man. why are the PCs together? Why typical "no PvP rules"? why doesn't the thief rob the other PCs, and why doesn't the Paladin execute him?

games are social experiences. they're not actually independent simulated worlds. they're just proxies for human interaction and shared fantasy.

>Which is that people are dicks IC and OOC and let the two overlap.

it is not possible to separate them.

>>49240344
Okay. But that's not Kaboom. The goal here is damage like a grenade (see hurt locker 2e)
The explosion of fire should be over in a second.

Why the ring? Because it's been absorbing fire so I have some for a rainy day.

As for the shadow name? Well your right it would fit better if I was cutting their arms off while defending a flick of sheep owned by a king. See >>49233387 and >>49233423

>>49242136
We're all the same person, anon. Didn't you know?

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> stat me

Serious request, actually. 1e Requiem most preferable.

>>49242651
So you want a real kaboom? Well, you'll need forces 4 for lethal. OR matter 3 and some base components to just make a real grenade!

>>49243339

Or Forces 3 to amplify something that's already kind of mildly flammable up to explosive (Perfecting).

>>49243316
She's off the scales for WoD. You can't stat her there.

>>49243316
I have no idea who your waifu there is.

>>49243316
Size/Type: Large Magical Beast
Hit Dice: 5d10+25 (52 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares)
Armor Class: 15 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +5 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 14
Base Attack/Grapple: +5/+14
Attack: Claw +9 melee (1d6+5)
Full Attack: 2 claws +9 melee (1d6+5) and bite +4 melee (1d8+2)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Improved grab
Special Qualities: Scent
Saves: Fort +9, Ref +5, Will +2
Abilities: Str 21, Dex 12, Con 21, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 10
Skills: Listen +8, Spot +8
Feats: Alertness, Track
Environment: Temperate forests
Organization: Solitary, pair, or pack (3-8)
Challenge Rating: 4
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 6-8 HD (Large); 9-15 HD (Huge)
Level Adjustment: —

>>49243360
Also yes.

>>49243360
Death 3 to remove the base material's control of it's flammability?

>>49242646
I feel like you're not really grasping what I'm saying. Do you actually have any experience with MUSHes or other chat games?

>>49242651
>>49243339
Well, as there's no rules for having a bomb in Mage as is, you'd have to come to your own conclusions. I'm also too lazy to go read up on how explosives work, because I don't wanna download and read through Hurt Locker previews. If I recall, they deal XL and then you roll X dice and it does Bashing to everything in an area?

But I'd say it would be Forces or Matter 4 and require a Reach to make it function like an explosion. You wouldn't need to increase the area any, as the Potency would determine the force of the blast.

>>49243316
I don't even know who that's supposed to be. At best I can take a guess and assume that's the Kiss Shot Shinobu character? That's the kind of thing I only know because of Gelbooru, but I can't be sure.

>>49243508
>I feel like you're not really grasping what I'm saying. Do you actually have any experience with MUSHes or other chat games?
about 15 years' worth.

>>49243521
Then you're bad at understanding (or I'm bad at communicating).

But if you're who I think you are, I'm going with the first

>>49243559
nah, I get what you're saying. it's just misguided. there's no real difference between tabletop and MU* except scale.

>>49243402
>>49243508
Correct, that's her, though with less jailbait.

>>49243402
Not even after you mash her face in with a nerf hammer to put her at a more less-retarded powerlevel? I'm thinking more 'inspired by' admittedly rather than '1-to-1 port'.

>>49243595
Then you don't get what I'm saying.

>>49243622
Well you'd have to explain to those of us who aren't weeaboos who and what she is in the first place. Though if the character concept requires a nerf hammer, she's probably not viable for a starting character.
"This character is a super strong vampire royalty" is something you should wait and play when/if Thousand Years Of Night comes out.

>>49243695
>Then you don't get what I'm saying.
keep telling yourself you're just misunderstood bud. it's easier than being wrong.

>>49243695
My own weebism isn't that much better than most in this regard. This is the GM's brainchild for the chronicle's BBEG it seems.

> TL;DR of her:
> >older than feudalism
> >so beautiful she literally makes people off themselves
> >can bench-press a train, maybe
> >apparently had a torpor-like experience

>>49243719
Keep telling yourself that you understood. It's easier than being wrong.
It's not that you're disagreeing with me; it's that you don't seem to understand.

>>49243753
If it's an STPC, why are you asking for the stats?
Also, sounds like Majesty and Vigor, so a Daeva. Also, feudalism (in Japan) was 831 years ago.

>>49243807
Cuz I'm trying to see if we can get out of meeting her alive.

>>49243807
sure thing buckaroo

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>>49243622
>Not even after you mash her face in with a nerf hammer to put her at a more less-retarded powerlevel? I'm thinking more 'inspired by' admittedly rather than '1-to-1 port'.
Literally any basic high-level vampire with a shitload of disciplines will do. What makes Kiss Shot unique is her character, not her powers. Her abilities are rather generic and most of them can be replicated using the base VtR disciplines, though you obviously won't be leaping halfway across the planet on a whim or outregenerating sunlight.

Sup all, I finished a thing. Its a Jojo's Bizarre Adventure supplement for CofD. Doesn't include rules for vampires or pillar men though, but it does have both stand users, hamon initiates, and people who are both. Do not use with normal WoD, if you do so I can not be blamed for any imbalance. This is meant to be used on its own for Jojo shit, along with standard stuff like the core book or hurt locker when it comes out

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SykkEDk5vAL6rkzNg1vqysv0lI18D2PWZVm-bcnI3Ug/edit?usp=sharing

>>49243508
If your directly in the blast at point of origin you take aggravated damage + force lethal + force in dice Bashing. If your in the primary blast radius you take force lethal + force dice Bashing. If your in the secondary you only take the bashing dice.

>>49243844
No.

>>49244049
Oh. That'd be out of range of most of what you can do until 5 dots. At best you could probably get [Force] Lethal + [Force] Bashing for being in the explosion's area, at 4 dots, and probably with a Reach or two.

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>>49244017

>>49244213
danke

>>49244163
Yeah someone on the forums pointed that out. But also pointed out I'd be almost better targeting an area and dealing the damage as none discriminating big eruption. More consistant damage less work.

>>49244276
>dealing the damage as none discriminating big eruption
That's what I originally said: an Aimed ("thrown") spell that deals 3 Bashing damage to everyone in 5 yards and inflicts the Knockdown tilt. Likely as some kind of burst of kinetic energy.

>>49244335
Yeah but Axelgear explained it better. Plus pointed out the wisdom risk.

>>49243695
>when/if Thousand Years Of Night comes out

I cannot wait. One of my main beefs with Vampire is that it's a game where the player characters are immortal, but then the average PC is from a few decades ago at most.

>>49244455
What Wisdom risk? No more so than any other attack on a Sleeper.

>>49244596
I had figured self defense / defense of another exempted me from that.

>>49244645
It might provide a bonus, but you're still harming someone with Magic, and you're still causing a Breaking Point, both grounds for Wisdom Breaks.

>Well, in the old rules, you could only spend one Willpower per turn, period. So anything that forced you to spend Willpower negated your ability to use other powers which required Willpower.

>Like, for example, with old Majesty 5, people had to spend Willpower to attack you. That meant they couldn't use Theban Sorcery to attack you, because they had to spend Willpower in the same turn to activate the spell. (Some people let you stagger out the expenditure, but some rules actively referenced that kind of prohibition.) Now, you just can't spend more than one for a single dice pool. You can spend multiple, to multiple ends.
How did I never notice this?

>>49244697
Guess I need to read up on wisdom.

>>49244532
>One of my main beefs with Vampire is that it's a game where the player characters are immortal, but then the average PC is from a few decades ago at most.
The fact that Vampire adamantly refuses to scratch this itch is basically the only reason I like Mummy.

I've been anxiously awaiting the release of Thousand Years of Night for years now.

>>49245659

Hey, there are lots of other reasons to like Mummy! But I agree, the excuse to traipse around throughout human history is probably the main draw as well.

I'm probably going to steal heavily from Thousand Years of Night for Mummy as if I ever run or play anything. That book should be a goldmine.

Don't mind me, just posting the mega link from the pastebin because my phone is being a cuntbag
https://mega.nz/#F!wpB0ib4a!EsAU0AE4ihrNlDWzp3-MIw

>>49245659
there's been several books about playing older characters
there's even two about being thousands of years old

>>49235646
In 1e, bows could use Athletics or Firearms (we typically ruled it as whichever is higher).

>>49235646
Archery replaces Firearms in earlier settings. Just roll Archery with Firearms; the system does not need so much granularity shooting with X is a different skill than shooting with Y.

>>49241091
>and also creepy (she's not real)
Is it only creepy to obsess, or is any level of infatuation with a fictional character inherently creepy?

>>49248386
I'd say it's not the level of infatuation that makes /a/ creepy, it's the way they're threatening to create an Extempore with their obsession.
Related https://youtu.be/_YtwPPsBKGQ
I know some of it's Poe's Law, but there's way too many people who do want to get married to fictional characters.

>>49248591
The only definition I'm finding for Extempore as a noun is "something improvised." Mind clarifying?

Also, I've seen that video before. I guess I'm just curious if having fictional crushes is inherently creepy or if it's just how /a/ goes about it that's the problem.

I've had plenty of fictional crushes. I never thought it was all that unusual. But I do think /a/ is kind of odd.

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Is John Constantine a mage? Which path most accurately represents him?

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>>49248650
I think /a/ goes beyond a "fictional crush".

Also, Extempore are a type of Promethean created spontaneously. In Beast's Tokyo section, there's a Vocaloid at a popular Karaoke bar who's on the verge of becoming an Extempore due to people's obsession with her.

>>49248728
>Is John Constantine a mage?
Mages are more powerful than Constantine, but if you're converting him, yes, he'd be a Mage. It's imperfect.

>Which path most accurately represents him?
I lean Mastigos, would accept Thyrsus.

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>>49248728
Every time somebody brings this up, I've only ever seen it turn into an argument.

The simple answer is, yes, he probably is, most likely an Acanthus or an Obrimos.

>>49248765
>Mages are more powerful than Constantine
I think John is much more powerful than he seems, and is just unusually careful for a mage. He has literally summoned the devil(s) before.

>>49248802
John's thing is that he's very weak but has an extremely broad knowledge base. He's "supposed" to lose to a specialist, as I understand the character, but he has so many various tricks and is quick on his feet that he can come from unexpected directions.

So I'm thinking of making a dark ages Tzimisce, around 1270 in the Byzantine Empire. What would be some good reasons for Tzimisces to embrace, and would it be too snowflakey to not have him like vicissitude

Is there a good archive or depository for modern setting character art?

>>49248953

The Old Clan Tzimisce actively shun Vicissitude.

>>49249897
Would they be around Constantinople during the period? Like what would be good criteria for embrace?

>>49235646
Life will let you control animals just fine.

>>49244697
If harming people with magic is always a wisdom sin how'd the adamantine arrow function?

>>49250527
It's not that harming others with Magic is inherently hubristic; in fact, knowing what you're doing and preparing to mitigate the consequences could make it less hubristic: Killing someone in a fit of rage is Falling, while premeditated murder is Understanding, for instance.

Also, the Arrow--and the Guardians, and the Seers, and everyone else--often just have to suck up doing bad things. Experiencing a Breaking Point isn't an automatic drop, either. Having high Willpower also helps you when you need to Do What Had To Be Done™.

>>49250728
Yeah, I think people sometimes don't realize that being squeaky clean in the 'World of Darkness' or CofD just isn't likely. You will trip over breaking points/sins, but 90% of the time you won't 'fall'. The roll is in the players advantage for most of a character's existence, only getting bad once they really start to get up there.

Any word on how 2e is going to handle taint?

>>49251297

Taint?

>>49251371
from aberennt. Its the thing where if you go to crazy with quantom stuff weird things start to happen

>>49251493
...

Say what now?

>>49251526

He's talking about Aberrant 2e, one of the other systems coming out at some point in the future.

>>49251297

No, we really know basically nothing about the Storypath systems (Aberrant, Scion, etc.)

>>49248871
>John's thing is that he's very weak but has an extremely broad knowledge base.
The nigger can fucking time travel and not die even when killed.

>>49252066
Knowledge is power.
Read a book, motherfucker.

>>49252066
There is one person in these threads who thinks John Constantine isn't a mage because he is 'low power but makes it work.'

Best to just ignore them. No matter how many people point to his powerful contracts, great feats of magic, and being so powerful that people know not to screw with him, they won't change their mind.

>>49249982

They are found throughout Eastern Europe, specifically in Transylvania, and would likely only Embrace from long mortal lineages of the aristocracy that they traditionally have. If you're Embraced as a Tzimisce - especially as Old Clan - it's because your family has been intertwined with either the clan or subservient to them. The Old Clan shun Vicissitude in favor of Koldunism, elemental magic drawn from the earth spirits/Earthbound demons native to the Carpathians.

Constantinople is not too far afield from Eastern Europe proper, and so emissaries of all clans are likely to be found there. If you need a younger Tzimisce to be in residence, merely say that the clan elders are busy doing things back home (either fighting the Tremere or just being above the rest of the world) and so they sent you on a phony diplomatic mission so that none of the important clan members had to be bothered with it.

>>49252200
Hmm. So a Byzantine minor lord wouldn't likely be embraced then?
The idea is I want someone who lives through the age up until after the fall of the city. I just figured the Tzimisce would be in control of it around then and into the modern nights

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>>49252191
Technically speaking by the rules of Hellblazer, Constantine ISN'T a Mage in the CofD sense, he's a thaumaturgist who knows all kinds of secret spells and rituals that rely on magic and ceremony, but don't require an enlightened soul.

In his own setting, Harry Dresden also wouldn't be a Mage in the CofD sense because magic that he practices seems to be at least partially a trait only certain people can have, and they're born with it and can lose it.

But both of them are still actual examples given in the Mage book, and people who complain "it doesn't work the same way" are probably also the kind of people that complain the thread starter images aren't WoD art, and just in general don't understand how "inspiration" works.

Anyone ever roll the exact same PC for 2 different games with different storyteller or group?

>>49252346

Constantinople by Night is an actual Dark Eras book that you may want to mine for canon information. The trouble you run into is that the Tzimisce are some of the most staunchly traditional clans; they loathe outsiders, and especially in the Middle Ages you'll have one hell of a time getting Embraced unless you're Transylvania blood royalty.

Now, if you were Embraced by someone rogue or promptly exiled/executed for their indiscretion...

>>49252583
Hmm... Maybe. I think that he would fit into the Sabbat then, considering their general dislike for elders, right?

>>49252606

The Sabbat won't exist for another 200 years.

>>49252643
Right, but it would mean he would fit into it better once it's created. Do the Sabbat control Constantinople/Istanbul?

>>49252682

You're sure as hell not going to be welcome in the Camarilla, as a Tzimisce and especially as I "we're totally not infernalists, guys" Old Clan Tzimisce. When the time comes, you're pretty much gonna have to go Sabbat or independent.

I'm not sure who holds Istanbul in the modern nights, truth be told.

>>49252728
Yeah I lurked around the wiki for a while, couldn't find anything on it. Dunno about making him Old Clan though, as I'd like him to be affiliated with the Sabbat at some point

I wonder what Spirit Courts in Japan are like considering it's a Modern Country still tied to its Animist belief system. Especially to them all Spirits regardless how small or insignificant is Divine.

>>49252934
Probably just leads to a higher rate of possession, with spirits expecting random chiminage, which makes them rely on and look across to the mortal world more often.

I mean, while shinto says it is doing X, how much that actually translates to the actual spirit world as written is probably going to be up to your ST. All world religions are different flavors of wrong, so even worshiping the 'small gods', it is worshiping a bunch of nothing that MAYBE a spirit will take notice of because it benefits them.

Which, at the end of the day is only so different from a spirit of prayer/worship/hope/shame taking up a home in a christian or catholic heavy area.

>>49253065
Interestingly enough many Gods/Spirits in Shinto are not native from Japan but imports

Can a Changeling be Spirit-Ridden or Spirit-Claimed, or does their magical realm experience in Arcadia offer them a shield against such things?

>>49253364
I'm trying to remember if there is anything against it, can't think of anything.

See, most creeps have something up with their 'soul', which can help prevent possession. It doesn't typically help you from getting 'ridden', but that is a temporary, rare, and sort of obvious problem. But to get spirit-claimed, the spirit is going to kick your metaphysical inner bits to the wayside so it can have all the space inside.

The fact that your soul is damaged and modified as a changeling... don't think that protects you in this case.

Pretty high chance I'm forgetting something though.

>>49251297
AFAIK Aberrent has not even started being worked on. The Trinity team are doing Trinity and Aeon first.

I could make some educated guesses, as I wrote on the Storypath system and Scion, but they'd just be guesses.

>>49251542
>>49251297
New Trinity will use Storypath, an off-system variant made for it and Scion 2nd.

Suppose you use your 10 Merits to start at Gnosis 3 and have 3 dots in a Ruling Arcana, all I need is 23 exp to attempt Threshold Seeking? Maybe 27 is I need to bank 4 xp for the 6th Arcana Dot?

>>49253364
Unless Changeling specifically says their soul is inviolable then it's not. A spirit can use the Control (Influence) to Ride you and could in theory claim you.

That's likely to piss off a great many other Changelings though, so is a surefire way to get a Werewolf on your ephemeral ass

claws in zulo form deal aggravated damage right?

>>49252347
I understand why Constantine would be a Mage, but I just think it cheapens his character a bit. He isn't good because he's special, he's good because he's smart and he cheats.

>>49254719
Sounds like a Mage to me. The only difference is that in WoD, "Anyone cunt can do it" means anyone can obtain that "special" quality by seeing the truth.

I'm about to go into an nWoD game, but I'm having trouble deciding what to play. Anyone have anything fun to recommend?

The game is set in WW2, where the player characters are basically a WoD-influenced Basterds squad. The GM is allowing any type of WoD character up through Geist (I don't think he knows about Mummy at all).

I've had some fun with a Pyre-Flame/Industrial Sin-Eater before, but mostly what I want to do is do big damage and roll lots of dice. I'm uncomplicated that way. From what it sounds like, the group is skewing pretty Mage-heavy, so I'd kinda like to avoid picking Mage right now for variety's sake, but if the group ends up being "The Mage Squad Minus This One Asshole" I'll probably switch.

>>49254768
Well Mages are the best, so go Mage.

Specifically an Acanthus if using CofD (2e) or a Mastigos if using nWoD (1e)

>>49254826
I'm using 1e

>>49254866
Then definitely go Mage because everything else is crap by comparison and you will be the guy the rest of the party are dragging along

>>49216395

Cold iron is explicitly stated in Ctl not to include manufactured shit. So sorry, no.

>>49223780

Fellow Mormon. I can see Porter Rockwell, but none of the other figures you named had a revenge angle going for them. In particular I'm trying to figure out why you suggested Abinadi, I mean I know he's one of the more popular figures from the BoM but he really doesn't fit at all. If you want revenge guy you could argue for Teancum.

>>49215937

Hey >>49254927 here. Having read more, and learned that revenge isn't your thing so much as protecting people, If your still looking for a name and you want one kinda unique to mormons, while I still think Teancum works I'd give consideration to Moroni, specifically Captain Moroni. He had this whole defender of the people vibe going for him. Though I suppose you could say he was just super patriotic and pretty nationalist if you looked at it from a different perspective.

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So what's your opinion of the storyteller system as an actual game engine?

Personally despite balance no existing at all the core idea of the success based dice pool mechanic from an accessibility point of view.

But it's telling to me that compared to shit like dnd5e and apocalypse world no one ever tries to use the system for anything other than offical white wolf settings.

>>49254748
I'm sorry, but being more human than human Homo superior is incredibly special.

>>49254869
Can I ask why Mastigos?

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>>49255008
I like the Chronicles of Darkness version, albeit with some tweaks.

But much like you, I'm surprised no one ever tries to make homebrew that *isn't* trying to force a Noun: The Gerund monster type into the already overbloated World/Chronicles of Darkness setting.

Frankly, I've wanted to use it for a dark/low Fantasy game, and I did once convert a Mutants & Masterminds game to nWoD 1e and it didn't instantly collapse, at least not due to the mechanics changeover. But then again, PL8 really just doesn't work. You can see what I did in the linked pdf. It was mostly me converting my player's powers, or making up new powers they might later want to take, each one roughly based on an existing supernatural's powers.

Worth noting is that Chris also made Mass: The Effecting.
https://wiki.rpg.net/index.php/Mass:_the_Effecting

>>49255061
Mind in 1e could do all kinds of shit and far too little of it was Vulgar.

>>49255061
Mind had few vulgar spells, meaning it was damn near impossible to counter

Space meant you could drop people in volcanoes with 3 dots

>>49255067
That's cool.

I'm finally starting on that Night Horrors thing I keep saying I should do.

I'm trying to come up with a handful of common Dread Powers that can simulate the traits that monsters have, but I'm not sure how to handle things like Faerie Pledges or Demon Pacts. I'm using the idea of Mixed Blessings from Mortal Remains, but that's kind of a dumb power that I don't like.

But at the same time, I may be trying too hard to make it "fair" and make sense in a simple way. It's not like the existing rules for Pledges and Pacts are at all clear.

>>49255228
I need to do more homebrew. Not because I run games, but because it'd give me something to do. Plus it's fun.

>>49255067
Mass effect, that's cool.

But yeah the storyteller 'way of doing things' hasn't seem to caught on.

There is surprise the little fan conversions out there.

The only one know of is the Gentleman gamer off YouTube talking about running a BioShock game.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pKw2jisvT5g

>>49214640
One of the major antagonists was a sentient idea caged in flesh. The players decided to stop taking Devils deals with him once one of the players got himself infected with the sentient idea flesh virus thing and slowly lost his humanity and then his sentience as it turned him into the perfect weapon. The player made a new character but they still have the old one locked in a basement in case they never need to kill a city. Problem is the character is just a monsterous mess of flesh, teeth, and claws without much of a mind, if they ever let him out they'll probably never be able to cage it again. In a Victorian time period it could mean the end of civilization for a good chunk of America.

>>49255387
>The only one know of is the Gentleman gamer off YouTube talking about running a BioShock game.
Ironically, I've been thinking of doing a Bioshock-in-the-CofD setting. More based on Infinite, though, and in the actual CofD, even if I do complain that all the fan games shoehorn themselves into the main setting.

The idea here would just be "Using the power of The God-Machine a nutjob creates a psuedoreligious Libertarian cyberpunk dystopia hidden in one of the Legrange Points".
The idea is basically based off of Utopia Now with a few tweaks. Primarily that they succeeded some 30 years ago and have a religious bent.

The idea behind the hypothetical game would be the players taking a Jack/Booker role and ending up at the Lighthouse in one way or another and then being transported to this hidden Infrastructure city that's got an aesthetic straight out of late 80s, early 90s cyberpunk. The requisite magical powers would of course be Embeds that are gained by using stimulant patches. No actual idea for a story/goal/purpose there, though. Just an idea for a setting and set-up.

what splats do we have for Chronicles so far? How hard is it to use nWoD splats with Chronicles Mortal characters?

>>49255477
Beast, Demon, Vampire, Mortals, Werewolf, Mage, playtest Changelings

>>49255482
Sweet, are the PDFs all online for pirates and swashbucklers? I'm letting my players choose which splat to use after four sessions or so I just wanted to know my choices.

>>49255499
Of course they're online. They're literally linked in this thread. Check the first post.

Also, most splats don't really jive with becoming them randomly in play, especially not three to five people all becoming the same thing at the same time (unless you're all Embraced by the same vampire, or kidnapped by the same Fae, though that one messes up any character you've got so far).

>>49255482
You forgot Promethean

>>49255583
Really? I would do werewolf, Mage, and Geist games in nWoD where everyone starts as mortals. Is it that different in Chronicles?

Oh hey a Wod thread maybe we could discuss something li-

>Its another Aspel thread

Well maybe next thread.

>>49255602
>Werewolf
Everyone needs to be Wolfblooded.
Changing at the same time means being the same Auspice.
>Mage
Kind of contrived to have three to five people Awaken at the same time, or around each other.
>Geist
Again, if it happens in the same incident, chances are they'll all be the same Threshold
It would also require three to five Geister all hanging out waiting for a group of people to die.
>Vampire
If everyone gets Embraced at the same time, it would either need to be by the same Vampire (meaning the same Clan) or a Coterie for some reason mass embracing, which is usually against the law.
>Beast
Everyone needs to be a Beast already, just like how in Werewolf everyone needs to be nuzusul.
Everyone having their Devouring at the same time is pretty contrived
Though this one I actually could see happening.
>Demon
You don't even start human in Demon
>Promethean
Ditto. Your body's life is nothing like your life as a Created, so while you can have a mass creation (the book even suggests it, with either a throng of Extempore or Tammuz created from a mass grave of mobster execution victims) you can't really gain a template in play and keep playing the same character.
>Changeling
A Fae could potentially kidnap three to five people at the same time
They wouldn't need to be the same X or Y splats
Being related or familiar with each other before their Durance makes it easier to escape together
... but a pre- and post-Durance character are going to be pretty different. I mean, CHANGEd is right in the title.
Ditto with playing Fetches and then playing the Changelings.

You CAN do any of the above, but personally I think it comes off as forced and dumb.

>>49252728
>I'm not sure who holds Istanbul in the modern nights, truth be told.

The Caitiff prince.

>>49255663
>Everyone needs to be Wolfblooded.
Yes, but it can be so weak it's not represented in game traits.

>Kind of contrived to have three to five people Awaken at the same time, or around each other.
Yeah. But it'd be a great Mystery as to why it happened.

>If everyone gets Embraced at the same time, it would either need to be by the same Vampire (meaning the same Clan) or a Coterie for some reason mass embracing, which is usually against the law.
I did a pretty decent start of a group of vampires who needed more hands-on agents on the street level for their plots. That worked out pretty well, actually.

The rest I agree with.

>>49255662
He just doesn't want me to play my special snowflake Zeka, makes me so sad. All I wanna do is give people cancer.

>>49255663
>Changing at the same time means being the same Auspice.
>Kind of contrived to have three to five people Awaken at the same time, or around each other.
there's cults and significant supernatural events that can trigger these things
pcs are under no obligation to live and eat and hang around each other 24/7, just like your game is under no obligation to follow a 1:1 flow of time
>game starts in high school
>everyone goes to high school reunion
>you're all magic
If everyone gets Embraced at the same time, it would either need to be by the same Vampire (meaning the same Clan) or a Coterie for some reason mass embracing, which is usually against the law.
it's not against the law at all
we had this for a beginning of one game
the embracers did it to symbolize their bond as they were about to plot against the prince
>You don't even start human in Demon
everyone can be tasked by the gm on a similar mission/place

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Alright, this is for that homebrew Night Horrors thing I mentioned >>49255239

The Mixed Blessings Dread Power (essentially a redo of the one from Mortal Remains) is meant to be similar to Pledges and Pacts from Demon, though it can also cover being Ghouled or just a brainwashed Cultist of some sort.
The Enscorcelled power likewise is a mixture of the kind of Enscorcellment from Changeling 1e, what Mortal Remains gives, being a Ghoul, or just plain generic spooky cultist brainwashing.

How's it look? Too wordy? Too complicated? Or is it a decent rule of thumb for STs who don't want to be bogged down by minutiae?

>>49256040
Cults could trigger Awakenings, but a whole group going through the First Change at the same time still means they're all the same character type.

>pcs are under no obligation to live and eat and hang around each other 24/7, just like your game is under no obligation to follow a 1:1 flow of time
Yes, but presumably these people ARE hanging out together pretty often (and have been for four sessions), so "oh hey I'm a werewolf now!" is something that might come up before someone else has their Change.

>it's not against the law at all
"Don't Embrace people" is literally one of the Traditions. In most Domains it requires the Prince's consent to perform an Embrace, and vampire population is tightly controlled. Then again, most PCs are of the "I don't know my Sire and I was just embraced by accident or out of guilt" type of vampire, instead of going through proper channels.

>everyone can be tasked by the gm on a similar mission/place
He said they've been mortal for four sessions now. A mortal character would know they were an Angel during that time. A ring can Fall at the same time, but they're not going to be human first.

>>49256083
Angels could be double blinded cowers?

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>>49256099
I don't see the point of that, but sure, why not.

>>49237683
Rotes let you reroll any die that isn't a success, don't they? Or does the book use the term rote to refer to two different things?

>>49256563
Same term, different things.

Rotes in Mage allow you to use a Mudra, adding your Skill to the Spell Casting roll.

Rote Quality is a systems permutation that allows you to reroll failed dice once.

>>49256083
>"Don't Embrace people" is literally one of the Traditions.
No. The tradition is "If you embrace, it's your responsibility." There is no law against embraces and there's no rule about vampire population being tightly controlled

>>49256619
Jeez, that's an annoying naming convention. Probably for the best where it comes to Rotes, though. Am I reading this wrong, or are Rotes much better than Praxis?

>>49257135
Man, they really upper the 'stupid keywords' quotient in mage didn't they? Did they guy who made Mummy get in on it?

Hunter 2e when? It's been ages since the last open dev.

>>49257216
Planned for 2018, conservative estimates around 2081

>>49255008

It's because White Wolf was never interested in presenting the system as something you could use for any setting. White Wolf marketed itself as a different alternative from other games, and a part of that was having their propietary system be firmly locked to their moody settings (and Street Fighter). This was common for a lot of 90s RPGs, but no one had their shit locked down like White Wolf did. For a long time, even WoD fan material was looked down upon.

5e is because people use D&D for anything as a tradition, and *World hacks are a thing because Apocalypse World straight up has a hacking guide at the end of the book that breaks down the basic structure of the moves. We only just now have a common parlance for how to break down CofD mechanics, and even that slowly trickled out of freelancers and developers being more open about game creation. To want to make things out of Storyteller/Storytelling means having to be enough of a superfan of the games to figure out the system's parts, and more often then not that'll just lead to someone wanting to make a fan splat as opposed to an entirely new game.

tl;dr: a history of frosty reception of fan material and a lack of transparent identification of system parts had led to where we are today

>>49257246
Really? Seems a bit too conservative. They were hyping it a few months ago.

>>49257339
It's not even in first draft yet, it's still in planning and team building

>>49255008
For five years I basically used the system for whatever I felt like and that meant abusing splats, mixing stuff, and more or less being a mad scientist. But that was back when I had friends

>>49257339

If anything, the dev is assembling the team as we speak, since she said that she wasn't going to even look at the Hunter Open Call submissions until after Gencon.

>>49257135
>>49257162
"Rote" as a term means doing something that you're intimately familiar with to the point that you don't need to think about it to be successful.
That's essentially what the Mage Rotes are. Rote quality is also given to tasks that you're super familiar with, like the highest level of Professional Training. Rotes in Mage also can gain the Rote Quality when you're casting them using a Grimoire, or one that you yourself created.

Also, worth noting is that Rotes in Mage come up a lot more often than Rote quality.

>>49257280
I don't see how Storyteller was "locked down" in any particular way, or even how they were frosty to fan material; especially for nWoD, fan splats are super common, they're just always forced into the setting.

That said, Storypath seems like it's going to be a lot more of an open, available thing for homebrewers.

>>49257575
I keep checking my email, but no dice :<

>>49257874
We can only pray, that you will get denied.

>>49256083
>Brujah
>being tightly controlled and told not to embrace out of passion
PFFAHAHAHA okay buddy

The thing that's always appealed to me about WoD is this interesting balance of horror and fun. Not that horror can't be enjoyable in itself, but "fun" isn't the word I'd use for it. Being a Brujah and throwing a car? That's fun. Using magic to run up a wall while battling another Mage? Fun. Struggling with your inner demons to try and maintain some humanity? Interesting, engaging, even entertaining, but "fun" seems too lighthearted to refer to such a thing.

I really like how WoD (at least VtM, which is the only one of the games I've played, though I've read others) seems to balance the two. At least my best experiences with it have been like that.

But I've also had DMs who entirely eschewed one side of the game in favor of the other. Angsting vampires ranting about how they're damned, called in by the prince and sent to do some vague shit that mostly involves talking to some guy. No conflict, just moping. Or at the opposite end of the spectrum, YOU'RE GODDAMN VAMPIRE SUPERHEROES AND YOU CAN COMFORTABLY LIVE OFF BLOOD BAGS WITH NO INTERNAL CONFLICT AT ALL.

I'm hoping to play Mage: The Awakening at some point. Are there any early warning signs that a game is going to either just be an emo shitfest or just be a thinly veiled cape game (at which point I'd rather just play a superhero game)?

>>49258365
Mage is all about mysteries. Depends if the game feels like Scooby Doo or Indiana Jones, or if it feels like X-Files

Also dont say you like Masqeruade here, people will shit all over you. But I love it.

>>49258436
Hey! I don't hate Masquarade! I just find most of it ridiculous!

>>49258365
Horror? I thought WoD was urban fantasy

>>49258588
Whynotboth.jpg

>>49257874

>I don't see how Storyteller was "locked down" in any particular way, or even how they were frosty to fan material; especially for nWoD, fan splats are super common, they're just always forced into the setting.

Because I was never talking about CofD.

>This was common for a lot of 90s RPGs, but no one had their shit locked down like White Wolf did. For a long time, even WoD fan material was looked down upon

Acronyms mean things, Aspel. The fandom didn't start in 2004, and it was very different kind of corporate and marketing culture before then. The Wolf Pack was a thing, White Wolf's releases were mostly kept in secrecy, and the fandom itself didn't really want to do anything beyond fan games, because unlike a lot of the games that came before in the 70s and 80s, the setting itself was just as, if not more important, than the actual ruleset.

This mindset carried over to CofD fans, since there was a lot more crossover than the internet would have you believe.

Will this change in this climate, where open development is common and anyone can hack Fate and *World to make a game? Maybe! Storytelling 2e is the most hackable of the Storyteller/Storytelling editions, almost certainly by design.

4chan, ideas for Extempore Bestowments?

>>49258631
>Because I was never talking about CofD.
I wasn't talking about solely CofD either. You had things like Senshi: The Merchandising and Highlander: the Quickening even before nWoD was a thing. You don't need open development to be able to hack a game. D&D has been hacked for ages, and it's a fucking clusterfuck.

If your argument is "no one wanted to do that", that misses what the original question was: WHY did no one want to do that?

Plenty of people have tried (and often failed) at making World of Darkness fan games, even without open development or anything like that, but almost all of them are set in the WoD setting. The question is WHY aren't there more. Why has no one done the WoD hacks I wish existed, like Shadowrun and Degenesis?
Although I think what you touch on about the setting itself is partly the reason. People play for the setting, and very few people are like me (or Chris: "Why the nWoD system? Simple enough – the writer's relative familiarity with the system, combined with its 'medium' level of rules mechanic depth and complexity") and like the mechanics and know them well enough to create new ones.

>Storytelling 2e is the most hackable of the Storyteller/Storytelling editions, almost certainly by design.
Actually, Storypath is looking to basically be Fate for people who prefer WoD.

Hey /tg/ I'm planning a Neolithic Mage game. Any ideas on how to model the tribes of the various players/npc? Available resources, population, needs and haves, etc...

Or do you have any suggestions, warnings or tips for playing in such an era?

>>49258761

>You had things like Senshi: The Merchandising and Highlander: the Quickening even before nWoD was a thing. You don't need open development to be able to hack a game. D&D has been hacked for ages, and it's a fucking clusterfuck.

D&D keeps its mechanics and its setting an arm's length from each other. These mechanics, sound or no, can be easily identified and messed with. This is the entire reason the OSR happened: people knew how to use the OGL 3.0 ruleset to emulate earlier editions. Storyteller kept its setting closer to its mechanics than previous games of its time, and made hacking it into something completely new a greater challenge for that time. People have a tendency to hack rulesets when there is some kind of precident, whether it be an OGL or an actual guide to doing so in the book itself.

I am more than aware of Senshi, Highlander, Doll, Beast Wars (!), and Zombie, and that four out of five of those are fansplats and mostly kept away from official White Wolf discussion areas is telling.

>If your argument is "no one wanted to do that", that misses what the original question was: WHY did no one want to do that?

My argument is "the corporate culture, fandom culture, and opaqueness of its mechanics creates a reduced interest that has compounded itself over the years". It can and occasionally has been broken, but for it to catch on as a part of the fandom, it will need something stronger.

>The question is WHY aren't there more. Why has no one done the WoD hacks I wish existed, like Shadowrun and Degenesis?

1. In those specific cases, enough people play those games and feel that the rules are decent enough. Not "good", not "great", just decent. For many gamers, that is enough.

2. You haven't made it yet.

>Actually, Storypath is looking to basically be Fate for people who prefer WoD.

StoryPath is not Storytelling or Storyteller. We're talking about the rules specifically for CofD and WoD games.

>>49258876
End it with a True Fae grabbing them and tossing them into modern day.

>>49259168
Again, I don't see how the corporate culture has had anything to do with it (it's not like they were suing people for fangames), and I don't see how the mechanics were any more opaque than D&D's. I don't see how D&D's mechanics and their relation to the game are any different than how WoD's mechanics relate to its game. I mean, I've personally picked through this shit myself. It's not really even that difficult, and because of the diversity of games, there's always been a lot to draw on as case studies.

>You haven't made it yet.
True. But that's haaaard, and I'm lazy, and would just have to ST it myself.

>StoryPath is not Storytelling or Storyteller.
It might as well be. It's clearly in the same vain. Scion, Trinity, Exalted, and even Street Fighter were all still considered Storyteller. Storypath is just the next step.

>>49259234
No need for the gentry, though that works.

The setting as written has places where time gets wonky.

>>49259576
I can't think of any hints besides what id do. Sorry!

Does meditating at a Hallow give mages bonus die on acts of hubris like it does for sleepers suffering breaking points?

Quick question: do vampires heal bashing and lethal when active as a reflexive or instant action?

>>49260907
>If an injury would require Vitae to heal (represented by Health levels)

Vamps have to spend Vitae to heal, so it's a standard action

>>49259353

>Again, I don't see how the corporate culture has had anything to do with it (it's not like they were suing people for fangames), and I don't see how the mechanics were any more opaque than D&D's.

D&D, no matter the edition, has enough similarities between the two that you can pick then out and work with them. You could see a "core" to it. Storyteller, all the way up to its conclusion, changed often enough in ways that it would be hard to see it as a general system that could be hacked into other games. This is part of the reason why crossover in WoD was considered so difficult. Storytelling aimed to create a more unified system, but this didn't end up changing the culture of the fandom any.

While White Wolf barely pursued people for fan material, their copyright policies made it very clear that what could and could not be considered copyright infringment. Their system was not licensed out to third parties to create a precident of using the Storyteller system beyond horror/urban fantasy. This is what I mean. If it doesn't look open, you're not going to have a robust hacking culture.

>I mean, I've personally picked through this shit myself.

Yes, superfans can look through and identify the parts. But because of how the fandom is, and how it was established in the decades before, working with the system turns into bonus material for the published games for fansplats as opposed to new games using the game's rules.

>True. But that's haaaard, and I'm lazy, and would just have to ST it myself.

Tough shit.

>It might as well be. It's clearly in the same vain. Scion, Trinity, Exalted, and even Street Fighter were all still considered Storyteller. Storypath is just the next step.

That's because those games WERE made in Storyteller. While StoryPath shares DNA with Storytelling 2e, it is a different system with different aims than Storyteller and Storytelling. It's a Deadlands and Savage World kind of deal.

>>49260907
Spending Vitae to heal a wound is reflexive, I'm pretty sure. The only limiting factor is how much blood you can spend per turn.

Do you think you could use Eric Andre and Tim and Eric as inspiration for True Fae or would that not translate well? I just feel like the absurdist nature makes it very uncomfortable and to be honest pretty cruel and evil if you're talking about the Eric Andre interviews

>>49260933
I really don't agree with you. Even for oWoD, there was more than enough for people to pick apart and create their own thing, and I think the fact that nothing made an effort to work well together could actually STRENGTHENS homebrewing. It certainly never stopped D&D players, where every class basically uses different mechanics.

I mean, I agree that the culture seems to have encouraged people to make fansplats that fit the setting, but that was never a source of confusion. My question (well, someone else's question that I'm now curious about) is still simply WHY no one made anything different.

>While StoryPath shares DNA with Storytelling 2e, it is a different system
So is Storyteller and Storytelling. All the systems are different. They're completely different systems that just happen to be lumped together due to the company that made them. It's as similar to oWoD as CofD or Exalted is.

>>49261311
Would they run skit comedy in their realm of Arcadia? Or would they think they are being serious but actually be ridiculous to the point of driving their changelings mad because they are so unpredictable?

>>49261311
Depends on whether you make it annoying or not

>>49261409
I like to think that they are attempting to communicate with the silly humans in their favorite way, comedy! None of them think it's funny it's more like puppy dogs looking for attention. Violent puppies.

>>49261311
I think their juvenile brand of humor would make them great Fae, yes.

>>49261531
That's a little bit too easy to understand for true fae

Speaking of true fae, I don't know if a CTL supplement ever talked about this, but what do the changelings of the world figure is the true fae population? Sure it would be hard to figure out since each one occasionally reinvents itself, but still.

Like, how often would you bump into a changeling that had the same keeper? Is it all the time, or like a 'oh cool' thing like bumping into people who went to the same high school?

In a freehold, would the keeper diversity be extremely high or like half the number of changelings themselves?

Just a random thought I had.

I'm sure some summer court style king has to have looked into it before. Because an infinite enemy is a special problem to have.

>>49257162
When you get a time machine, go back to 2004 and tell them that.

Rote Actions were in the original nWoD corebook; they were called that because they planned for Mage to use them for rote spells. It didn't.

Now, under certain circumstances, they do. Like, "have rotes actually use rote actions" was on our to-do list.

Don't let Mage's Lexicon intimidate you, anon. It loves you really.

>>49261862
I wasn't worried about the word rote,I guess the person I was quoting makes it seem that way.

More yantra, mudra, etc

>>49255000
I decided to go with Ammon. I do a fair bit of community volunteer work in Milwaukee north side.

>>49258761
>Actually, Storypath is looking to basically be Fate for people who prefer WoD.

You take that back.

(I don't get on with Fate)

If you play it, the thing StoryPath feels most like is the FFG Star Wars games, minus the weird dice. It has the whole "succeed, succeed with complication, fail with consolation, etc" thing going on.

>>49261358

>Even for oWoD, there was more than enough for people to pick apart and create their own thing, and I think the fact that nothing made an effort to work well together could actually STRENGTHENS homebrewing

There were Attributes, there were Abilities, and then everything after was a lot of very setting specific things. Those things are distinctive enough where, yes, there'd be plentiful homebrewing for things in the setting, but very little material for things outside of the setting. Even the basic task resolution changed in subtle ways over the years.

D&D's classes have enough of a mechanical base, and the game itself is such a special exception in that so many people over 40 years have played it top to bottom. For a good 10 years of the game, making a BAB chart was half of the work.

>My question (well, someone else's question that I'm now curious about) is still simply WHY no one made anything different.

The fandom around it, because of corporate decisions, design reasons, and why they're interested in the property, is primed to look at the system as part and parcel with the setting, as opposed to something that could be used for things outside of the setting. There has not been any major precident for it.

>So is Storyteller and Storytelling. All the systems are different. They're completely different systems that just happen to be lumped together due to the company that made them. It's as similar to oWoD as CofD or Exalted is.

Except that's wrong.

Storytelling is WoD, all of Exalted, Scion 1e, and Trinity/Aberrant/Adventure 1e. Storyteller is CofD. Storypath is Scion and Trinity Continuum 2e.

Storytelling and Storyteller are lumped together here, because one was explicitly made to improve the other at the kind of game it creates. Storypath, however, is different enough in its task resolution and in what kind of games it wants to be an engine for that it doesn't have a place in this conversation. We're talking about the WoD/CofD systems.

>>49262014

And just to be clear, Scion, Exalted, and the Trinity games could have been those precedents, except they were made by the company itself, with the same kind of "setting and system are one and the same" philosophy, and with some even more radical changes to further confuse what exactly is "core" Storyteller. So even then, they're not exactly relevant to the conversation either.

>>49261956

Thank you. People bring up Fate a lot with it, but as someone who does get along well with Fate, it only comes off as surface similarities. The FFG system is a far better comparison.

>>49262187

titun tẹle

>>49262014
Other way around

Storyteller is WoD, Exalted, Trinity 1e, Scion 1e
Storytelling is nWoD / CofD
StoryPath is Scion 2e, Trinity 2e