Exalted General - /exg/

A question, can Surprise Anticipation Method eventually render the indefinite Keen Sense charms permanently committed for no motes?

>>49050071
Hmm... I was planning on saying 'no' to the question but upon reading the relevant charms, I can't see why not. But there are a couple things to note:

* The things that trigger the free motes are very specific. It can't just be anything you didn't notice, it has to be a hidden threat. Additionally, as a GM, I'd probably rule that it has to be 'intentionally' hidden.

* You probably won't get enough motes on the first relevant awareness roll to make even a single keen sense technique free but you could pay them all off over time.

>>49050177
Well, I did say eventually.

But, dang man. Turning Charms like that into what are effectively Permanent charms is hella useful.

Also, would Eidetic Memory affect the smell and taste libraries of Keen Taste and Smell Technique?

>>49050449
Yup!

>>49050379
I was just chatting with a friend about it and we decided on classifying it as 'good but not broken' on the grounds that awareness charms are expensive and a lot of them are scene length.

>>49050379
Yeah, Awareness fully stocked (Unsurpassed upgrades included) lets you keep all your god-tier indefinites on at 0 motes and pays for 3m from every other Awareness Charm before Surprise Anticipation Method kicks in to further discount anything used.

And according to Miracles of the Exalted, stocked successes are non-Charm, so Awakening Eye will usually nuke at least one given Stealth roll.

The problem is that you're never going to find a Storyteller who can deal with you. It's just way too much information to potentially have access to, all the time, for either of you to keep track, and in actual play you'll be heavily gimped by the fact the build you sunk so much investment into only works when your ST remembers you're basically omniscient in a mile radius.

>>49050766
And taking other charms that automatically notify you of something weird in the vicinity will only make it worse

So with Dark Sentinel's Way, you can Defend Other without breaking Stealth.

Crane build of the year? Melee-kuns eat your hearts out, no-sell a Decisive someone didn't know was gonna have an extra +10 Parry (the minimum for a medium weapon, Crane Form, and Fluttering Cry of Warning) and then instantly crash them with Striking Cobra Technique with your Snake-Crane hook sword. And they just think they're seeing things. Or they're a fellow Exalt and they grind their teeth in impotent rage because you have to get reaaaaally fucking lucky even as an Awareness Supernal to catch out a Stealth Supernal.

Also - is it just me, or is Rumor of Form completely fucking broken? Fuck the -1s, this lets you reflexively Stealth for 3m every time someone, anyone, happens to miss you. Even if you're not crashing them with Unbowed Willow Meditation, this is basically a free unexpected attack followup that chains with any of the assorted horrible things associated with Thrown and Ebon Shadow.

If you ARE using Unbowed Willow Meditation, you can use this to reflexively activate Ebon Shadow for the initiative theft (additional), make your Decisive, reset to Too Much Initiative, and then reflexively end Ebon Shadow Form the next time you want to try for a dodge-crash.

Everyone keeps saying Melee is king in this game, but all they really have going for them is Over-and-Under Method and some conditional attack spam. You can't flurry on something you can't see at all, and the risk of ever fucking up an attack against Dodge or Black Claw or something is horrific. They have a nice Clash in Over-and-Under Method, but Snake, Thrown, and Brawl all have better Clashes - less likely to kill someone you could kill, but more likely to end the fight against someone who's on your level through disarm, crippling disarm, super-disarm, or not costing Willpower (Spitting Hand Technique and Intercepting Fury Smite probably shouldn't play together as well as they do).

I dunno. Sell me on swords again.

>>49051080
If anything MA takes a lot more investment than Melee does.

>>49051080
Melee could beat any of them in a clash by using Rising Sun Slash, Excellent Strike, and Hail-Shattering Practice, is the thing. Melee's clash is super cheap, too. Accuracy and economy mean a lot, and melee has both. Most of those martial arts combos you've named are super expensive to maintain, and Melee has them completely beat there; If Melee can survive your onslaught and drain you of motes, it's over.

My group's Dawn does pretty well with Brawl, specifically the grapple set.
Titan Straightening method > Raging Wrath Repeated > Crashing Wave Throw
He's been able to wreck everything I've sent at him so far, but I suspect he'll have a bad time when the group gets to thorns and he has to contend with Abyssal [Solar] Melee.

>>49051459
Melee loses clashes to Doe Eyes Defense basically every time, so there's at least one case where their accuracy isn't doing it for them.

Brawl clashes Decisively for a grand total of 4m, or 5m if you're using Spitting Hand Technique against a close-ranged opponent. In a defensive standoff, they outlast Melee, since they both need to be making Withering attacks. If it comes to that, Brawl has tech for improving Withering gains.

Snake clashes Withering, so +3 non-Charm dice with their hook sword or seven-section staff, and it costs them 2m, 1wp. That's 1m over. True, they don't gain the init, but you DO lose it, and they gain your break as normal.

Rising Sun Slash is really conditional and I'd love to see the math on it actually proccing.

Hail-Shattering Practice is honestly an E1 offering for the Supernal Duelist - at E2, everyone invested in clashing is going to dip it for a grand total of 2 Charms and 3 Melee.

Thrown admittedly loses Clashes to Melee...except Thrown also has a guaranteed Disarm in Sharp Feint Feint + Shadow Spark Thrust for 5m1wp, nestled around its clash, and that clash is also 1m, 1wp, and can straight-up clash ranged.

I think the early evaluations of melee were right: it is super-well-rounded and very overall effective but excels at absolutely nothing. Later claims that it has defensive mastery seem wildly exaggerated: it doesn't Defend Other better than Crane and it doesn't Clash better than anyone UNLESS Rising Sun Slash activates.

does the realm/Wyld Hunt execute wyld mutants just for being wyld mutants?

>>49052265
It's not really a realm/wyld hunt thing, but often yes. The Fae are scary shit and those under their influence are suspect. However, wyld mutants get a fair amount of leeway depending on the situation since they can sometimes pass off as, say, a godblooded.

>>49052108
Okay I think I am being dumb but what is Spitting Hand Technique ?

>>49052384
Charm from Miracles of the Exalted. Thrown 3, no prerequisites, pay 1m to reflexively draw/ready "anything you can reach and lift."

Combined with Intercepting Fury Smite, which lets you drop Brawl's clash cost down to 4m, 0wp, 1i (because improvised) if you use and discard an improvised weapon - which you can immediately ready again reflexively.

>>49049974
>What is Exalted?
Soon to be replaced by Scion.

>>49052559
Will never replace. Even if it's good, the audience is separate. Scion looks like Exalted from a distance, but it offered a very different experience. Even in the Scion games I played in my head, where the system wasn't hot fucking garbage where you had an entire Pantheon whose special power was "fuck a dice cap" right beside the one whose trick was "cut yourself or other people for some kind of mild benefit that is literally not worth the time it took you."

>>49052800
>>49052559
Additionally, from what I understand, Scion isn't going to use the same combat system as exalted.

>>49052559
this is the one where you roll a 12-dice pool and then add 32 successes every Dexterity-based action ever for no cost, and if anyone else couldn't do that they just instantly died, right?

that's your Exalted killer?

is this also the one where the sample protagonist has high strength, low dexterity, and a revolver that doesn't add anything to damage and is aimed with dexterity?

in the ruleset where not using a weapon that adds an attribute is like playing a Dawn who can't purchase Charms?

>>49052963
That's what I meant by it being hot garbage. It had the worst combined attributes of WoD and Exalted, a system with Exalted's Dex-is-godstat but Wod's frivolous disregard for moderating power.

And an exponential success-adding system.

And tons of cool WoD-style powers you could never purchase because if you fell behind on your exponential success-adders the same thing happens to you that happens in Exalted if you don't have an Excellency or PD, but more so by orders of magnitude. LITERALLY orders of magnitude. Like, the enemy's attack roll results have more digits than your DV by two fucking columns.

>>49050766

>Yeah, Awareness fully stocked (Unsurpassed upgrades included) lets you keep all your god-tier indefinites on at 0 motes

How? Unsurpassed lets you have a 1m discount for each sense, minimum 1.

>>49054958
Surprise Anticipation Method whittles them all to 0 over time.

The Unsurpassed bonus stacks per Charm, so with all three Unsurpassed techniques you have three (1m for sight, 1m for hearing/touch, 1m for taste/smell) except since they universalize upon the purchase of the third it just becomes 3m, minimum 1.

But Surprise Anticipation Method is what brings the Indefinites down to 0.

>>49052108
>Melee loses clashes to Doe Eyes Defense basically every time, so there's at least one case where their accuracy isn't doing it for them.
You really don't understand how good Melee's accuracy boosters are if you think a mere -6 will change the balance of power.

As Melee is a clash build, they have paired light weapons. I don't know if unarmed counts as paired light weapons but let's say it does. So Melee is rolling 19 dice (10+1+6+8-6 for DED) + 1 success, and Black Claw is rolling 27. Melee has Excellent Strike, Hail-Shattering Practice, and Rising Sun Slash; Black Claw has Doe Eyes Defense.

Melee wins, ~57% of the time; Black Claw ~35%; and they tie the remaining ~8% of the time. Even if Melee is using paired medium weapons, it's ~48-44-8.

>Rising Sun Slash is really conditional and I'd love to see the math on it actually proccing.
It procs constantly. With a pool of 23d (spec + medium + full ex + ES), it procs 75% of the time. Even with the 17 pool above, it procs a little over half the time.

Man Alchemicals are fucked. Not even Ink Monkeys ever gives them any of the promised Essence 6+ charms.

>>49055992
>Melee wins, ~57% of the time; Black Claw ~35%; and they tie the remaining ~8% of the time. Even if Melee is using paired medium weapons, it's ~48-44-8.
This is at E2, btw. It gets worse the higher your Essence goes.

>>49056044
For example, at E4, a Melee character making decisive clashes against a Black Claw stylist making withering attacks (so 15d versus 27d, remember the paired weapon clash bonus applies to decisive) wins ~54%, loses ~39%, ties ~7%.

What I'm saying is: Melee's clash boosters - HSP and RSS - are really fucking good. Stupidly good. Especially with ES.

>>49055225
I don't think they stack like that. Each Unsurpassed gives a 1m discount on the Charms based on the sense in question, they normally would not stack since they cannot they are mutually exclusive. However when you get all of them the 1m discount then applies to every Charm, a bonus designed to include the Charms that aren't based on only one sense like Sensory Acuity Prana.

The Surprise Anticipation Method cheese still works but the Unsurpassed 1m discount stacking doesn't I think.

>>49056659
I would say that it does. Each Unsurpassed adds the 1m discount to its Keen charm, and if all three are active, each Keen adds that discount to all Awareness charms.

That does seem to mean 3m discount to all Awareness charms.

>>49052982
Hopefully Scion 2E will be better.

>>49056009
Essence 6+ charms are a mistake

>>49057102
3e is boring.

>>49057112
How does that contradict me? 3E even has Essence 6 charms right there in the core.

>>49056787
>When Keen Sight Technique is active, any sight-based Awareness Charm is reduced in cost by one mote, to a minimum of one. If the character has learned all three Unsurpassed (Sense) Discipline and activates all three Keen (Sense) Techniques, this discount applies to any Awareness Charm.

>This Charm follows the special activation rules of Unsurpassed Sight Discipline (p. 271), discounting the cost of taste and smell effects instead of those which enhance sight.

>Unsurpassed Hearing and Touch follows the special activation rules of Unsurpassed Sight Discipline (p. 271), discounting the cost of hearing and touch effects instead of those which enhance sight. This Charm can never discount the cost of its own techniques.

The text is somewhat hazy but I believe extending the 1m discount to all Charms is a more logical way to read it and it follows a much more balanced power curve.

The first one states you have a 1m discount to Sight based Charms, then a second statement extending this discount to all Awareness Charms provided you have all 3 Keen Sense Techniques on. Each other Unsurpassed Sense uses the same rules but replaces the 1m discount to sight with 1m discount to X, otherwise it follows the Special Activation as normal.

1/2

>>49059142
Since the only time the Special Activation rules can come into play would be if all 3 are activate there are no other edge cases that need to be accounted for, so the "same discount" would be the aforementioned 1m discount. If was truly 1m per Unsurpassed that would be written in there instead. So if you rewrote the Special Activation it would look like.

>When Keen Sight Technique is active, any sight-based Awareness Charm is reduced in cost by one mote, to a minimum of one. When Keen Taste and Smell Technique is active, any taste or smell-based Awareness Charm is reduced in cost by one mote, to a minimum of one. When Keen Hearing and Touch Technique is active, any hearing or touch-based Awareness Charm is reduced in cost by one mote, to a minimum of one. If the character has learned all three Unsurpassed (Sense) Discipline and activates all three Keen (Sense) Techniques, this discount applies to any Awareness Charm.

The last sentence doesn't reference activating each individual one gives the discount but rather when you activate all 3 "this discount", the 1m, is now applied to any Awareness Charm instead of just the individual sense based ones, emphasis being on the any.

As for the balancing aspect of it, reducing all Awareness Charms by 3m minimum of 1 would mean only 2 Charms would have a mote cost high than 1 which seems a bit much. As most of the Charms are low cost, most lying in the 1-3 mote range a 1 mote deduction to all Charms is still beneficial.

2/2

>>49059142
>>49059211

Them all being active at the same SHOULD make the other Charms completely cheap, because the senses are so supercharged at that point, the other Charms have little actual work to do, so don't require much Essence to function.

>>49059347
Fluff wise it might make sense but you can make anything make sense fluff wise, balance wise it is a HUGE bonus you get for free after collecting them all. It's not like you bought a whole Charm to get the discount, you bought 3 Charms, you probably wanted anyway, that all do their own thing on top of the discount, but then when you get all three you are suddenly tripling the discount you receive. A bit much.

Looking through let's break the Awareness Charms into their groups based on sense or general Charms that would cost more than 1m and could receive a discount.

>General
Sensory Acuity Prana
Awakening Eye (?)
Eye of the Unconquered Sun (?)
>Sight
Unswerving Eye Method
Inner Eye Focus
>Taste and Smell
Genius Palate Summation
Foe-Scenting Method
Scent-Honing Prana
>Hearing and Touch
Eyeless Harbinger Awareness
Knowing Beyond Silence
Dedicated Unerring Ear

Awakening and EotUS are in general because they don't depend on any single sense, the latter going so far as to say it can be used by a blind Solar.

So we see here there's actually a nice grouping, each Unsurpassed gives you 2-3 Charms that are discounted which, when you collect them all, gives you 3 more Charms that are 1m cheaper. Going from 5-6 Charms at 1m discount to 11 Charms at a 3m discount is far, far too much gain from merely completing the set. Again, these Charms provide bonuses besides these, having them provide such a powerful set bonus is, I believe, against the intended reading of the text.

if autochthon has titan cancer because his thing is doing the impossible and one of them dying is impossible.... is some part of him able and possibly equally destined to resurrect the dead?

>>49060126

Dude what? No, that's not Autochthon's "thing."

Autochthon is a craftermaker. Like other craftermakers in mythology (like, you know, Hephaestus) he is physically fucked up. That is why he has supercancer.

>>49060126
Also he is both the computer and the location "Autochthon" in Mage: the Ascension

>>49060126
Just because he made exaltations doesn't make "impossible shit" his theme

Can you choose not to listen to an Infallible Messenger? Considering sending a five minute long high pitched REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE to the Empress

>>49060590

>implying the Empress would leave herself vulnerable to sorcerous communications of any sort

>>49060619
But can you refuse to hear them?

>>49060619
>creates a Solar Circle version
Stop that one, Your Redness.

>>49060685
The circle of the spell would be immaterial to a well-designed Working

>>49060667
Rules don't say either way. Treat as social influence trying to inspire annoyance, I imagine, and since it can't be enhanced by Charms, it'll just get blown out by her Resolve.

>>49060741
Looks like my circle has a new hobby

>>49060757

You do realize Infallible Messenger can't cross the boundaries between dimensions, right?

>>49060781
>implying she's left Creation

>>49060796
>implying she hasn't coated herself in a thin layer of the Well of Udr, banishing assassins and sorcerous links to other worlds

>>49060741
>>49060757

You can use project your senses through the messenger and Awareness or Investigation charms if it's you control spell. Just in case you want to actually gather intel when tormenting the Empress or just look at the pained expression she makes as you bother her for the tenth time in one day.

>>49060888
>implying there's anything a DB can do to stop a Solar on a mission

>>49056009

Charms? More like not even saying how their colossi forms work

>>49050766
Awakening Eye doesn't let you store successes, it doesn't function at all like Living Shadow Preparedness. Its just a full excellency with cascading 10s for 5m 1wp.

Further more, that stealth errata hidden in a dev commentary is game breaking, and I don't allow it in my game.

>>49052108
>Hail-Shattering Practice is honestly an E1 offering for the Supernal Duelist - at E2, everyone invested in clashing is going to dip it for a grand total of 2 Charms and 3 Melee.

You cannot combine MA with melee to enhance a clash, you're picking one or the other. In any case, Black Claw is unarmed only and totally incompatible with any style that uses a weapon. Excellent Strike + Hail Shattering will cream Doe Eyes Defense on a clash.

>>49055992
>I don't know if unarmed counts as paired light weapons but let's say it does.

They do not

>>49062099
I thought they did, source?

>>49062358

The weapon isn't "Fist," you don't have two of them, you just have one Unarmed weapon representing all punches, kicks, headbutts, etc.
>The most basic of all weapons, this “weapon” models strikes and kicks made with the character’s fists and feet.

Do we know what happened to Lilith's Solar Mate's exaltation? Was it taken by the Yozi or the Neverborn?

>>49062577
It's Swan, right?

>>49057102
YOU are a mistake

>>49061752
>Awakening Eye doesn't let you store successes, it doesn't function at all like Living Shadow Preparedness. Its just a full excellency with cascading 10s for 5m 1wp.
Really?
> every rerolled success adds one to a pool of automatic successes the Solar may use to detect hidden opponents until combat ends.

>>49063809
Oh right. Yeah, it creates a small pool of stored successes (average 2) that last for the combat.

Its good, but not insane like LSP which doubles all your successes and stores them.

>>49062584
Yes, Desus' Exaltation was not one of the ones taken by the Yozi or Neverborn.

Swan is where it ended up in canon.

Hey guys, how do you feel about the combat and charms in 3e?

I'm coming from 1e, and looks like there's a shit ton of charms, some not being much better than "make 7s/8s/9s count as double successes."

For combat, I can already see a party crushing a single opponent with withering attacks, even if this opponent might be considered "boss" level.

>>49060757
She's a sorceress, she can probably counterspell it.

>>49065965
A party crushing a single opponent is only plausible if that opponent has no way of refreshing their DV. Which is why having a battle group or a pair of lieutenants is dandy if they lack that.

>>49065965

You'd be surprised how much of a high soak can make you an utter dick.

The only thing I think needs buffing are heavy weapons. Their accuracy loss isn't worth the extra damage.

>>49066224
The games I've been in have done the houserule of instead of 5/3/1 accuracy going down it drops by 1 instead so its 5/4/3

>>49066330
That just makes medium weapons even better lol.

>>49066224
Heavy Weapons are fantastic at clashing.

And like, the only tree that lets you use heavy weapons is Melee, which has no problems with accuracy enhancing. I think heavy weapons are in a good spot.

>>49067325
>Heavy Weapons are fantastic at clashing.

They literally aren't, because Accuracy is a part of Clashing too.

With the +2 bonus for being Heavy, they match a single Medium weapon (+2 vs +2) and lose to a Light (+4 vs +2), and lose HARD to a twin-wielded either (+4 or +6).

>>49067371
Parity with medium weapons in terms of accuracy and 2 more damage is fine. How common dual-wielding is is a matter of taste, but its pretty uncommon in my game.

>>49067746

"fine" is not "fantastic," especially since, as you said, clashing is kind of supposed to be a Heavy weapons' thing. They shouldn't be losing to Light weapons at this.

>>49067866
Its better than non-dual wielded weapons in decisive clashes, which is the only kind solar melee can easily make. +2 non-charm dice is fantastic for decisives.

So in 3e how well does creating a character that focuses heavily on both sorcery and crafting work. Am I splitting my focus too much?

>>49068121

Nah. Sorcery doesn't require a lot of focus, honestly; it's a super cheap buy-in for pretty big benefits.

Craft is similar-ish; it only takes 4-5 Charms before you're good enough to build Artifact 5s, but it costs you a fair chunk of craft points, so further investment is going to be about making it cheaper and easier.

>>49068121
Well Sorcery requires a single Charm at Essence 1, 3, and 5. There's a Charm in Miracles that gives sorcery a dice trick but otherwise you just need high Int and Occult. You'll want high Int anyway for Crafting then you can spend the rest of your character resources investing the fuck out of crafting, that shit is pretty deep.

>>49049974
>>49049974
>>49049974
ATTENTION

Please replace the URL
>Frequently updated Character Sheet with Formulas and Autofill
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18FYdnXLYj0JnBNxNSGIZyi_FZcg085qCyUYoCEtac_8

With
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pfjmZKzcUqAX9mB58IAEUIFkZr8rq4CvdRRM4kzwwgU/edit?usp=sharing

For some reason the one in the OP is not updating as frequently and is set to View Only as opposed to Comment Only.

Whoever makes the next OP please make this change.

what happens to an inner world when its infernal dies?

>>49068384

It likely just ceases to exist, and everything that he created to inhabit it does the same. The question "what happens to everything in it that doesn't originate there" remains.

Hey, is there anywhere that someone's deconverted/plain-text'd the assorted QCs, specifically the animals?

I know the math for accuracy doesn't actually work but I am basically looking for tyrant lizard stats to mess with for a 3-dot familiar that is not a tyrant lizard.

>>49067371
Accuracy is only a part of Withering clashes, which only Snake stylists have access to. Decisive clashes get no accuracy bonus, and those are the ones Melee, Brawl, Thrown, and Archery use.

>>49068121
Sorcery fits on every character, even crafters.

As a crafter, though, be aware that that will literally be your sheet. Whereas the Dawn has two Combat abilities, two social Abilities, and a just-for-fun with three Charms each, you're, like...what's the minimum reasonable start investment in Crafting if you don't just stop at CNNT and call it good for basic projects, like 10 Charms? 12?

>>49069547
Anyone can clash people by delaying to their action and clashing them with a withering attack.

>>49067992
Yeah, but, anyone can dual wield medium or light weapons.

>>49069567

Especially Crafters, considering that Craft (First Age Artifice) and all types of Magitech require Sorcery.

While we're on Craft, does anyone know if the Craft rewrite by Sanctaphrax is any good?

>>49069671
In fact most light weapons come paired, and we can surmise that Artifact hook swords are, like their mundane versions, also medium and paired.

>>49069647
Sure, but that's a sucker's game. Unless you know they're willing to clash you're paying Initiative to hurt yourself, and most fights in Exalted aren't duels, and if it IS a duel then they just counter-delay until you run out of Initiative - since you delayed first.

>>49069747
It can't be worse. Sanctaphrax is sort of a faggot, but so are people who play Exalted to build shit no one cares about. Sounds perfect.

>>49069755
I don't subscribe to the "I delay to your action, you delay a tick down, we blow all our Initiative together" interpretation of delaying, as it is retarded and makes intentionally clashing someone completely shit.

>>49069671
>>49069755

As a setting conceit, I would not make dual-wielding paired weapons common. I don't like the idea that everyone dual wields double swords/spears/axes/etc because its mechanically advantageous.

There is only like 1 antagonist in the book that uses paired weapons. Its not like Exalted is a pvp game and you're going to fight opponents optimized to beat your specific build.

>>49052800
>>49052963
>>49052982
>>49053022
>they're stuck in the past

>>49069775
>people who write fixes for objectively awful and broken systems for free are faggots

You wonder why the Exalted playerbase is a cesspool of cumstains nobody wants to play with, until you watch them talk about each other.

>>49069797
It is. That's why Clash Charms are real and only Snake has one for Withering.

>>49070169
It doesn't matter about your setting conceit, heavy weapons are still shit. It is insanely common for player characters to dual-wield light weapons and that's the only statistic that has any relevance.

A half-retarded Dawn spasm build can solo literally everything in the Antagonists section that isn't Ahlat or Octavian, and a good one removes "Ahlat and Octavian" from the list of exceptions. But some day there will be Abyssal antagonists without QC rules, and if you're packing a heavy weapon to that fight, you're statistically likely to get fucked, clashes or no.

The accuracy penalty is just too much. Medium weapons are only good because of their parry bonus. Heavy weapons have nothing to make up - their sole useful bonus is replicated by every light artifact weapon in the book except the direlash.

It doesn't matter what you like or don't like, if you want to play an inferior character you can, you can play a straight gimp if you like, and you can probably still beat QCs regardless...but if you care about being able to face a Dusk on equal footing, no heavy.

>>49071122
>they're stuck in the dream of Scion not fixing roughly half of what made it unplayable, introducing many new fun toys and ideas, but not fixing the other half so it remains forever unplayable

>>49071158
He's not a faggot for writing a Craft fix, anon. But you are for whiteknighting him, holy shit. Exalted's fanbase is exactly identical to every other fanbase except that it fights desperately to be more welcoming to women and minorities despite the fact that of the few of them that can roleplay, none of them can for whatever uncertain non-cognitive social nurture thrive with high-complexity mechanics. Maybe it's just too many TV shows telling them being competitive about anything, even their imaginary competence vs. the guy whose job it is to play Sauron and the mook squad, is inherently wrong. Who knows.

/TG/ is a cesspool of cumstains nobody wants to play with, but that's across all generals.

fa/tg/uys, I have a conundrum.

I want Familiar 3 but I don't want a tyrant lizard.

What kinds of things can I get with it? I'd like something that can talk, but I really want human level intelligence even more.

>>49071540
Make it a spirit familiar, call it a day.

>>49071557
What kind of spirit familiar? A god, demon, elemental?

File: what IS this.jpg (159KB, 777x701px) Image search: [Google]

159KB, 777x701px

>>49071540
>>49071557
The problem with tyrant lizards existing is that they are truly incomparable to every other fucking thing that counts as a familiar of any level. The gulf between tyrant lizard and claw strider is like the gulf between Exalts and mortals. And this is balanced by them being big and scary, but no one is clear on how much of an issue that's actually supposed to be. Exalted isn't really heavy on dungeon culture and walls can be busted down, so "it can't come inside" isn't that big of a deal, and "people get scared" is variable and uncertain and easily, easily quelled by any social character (like you, since you maxed Charisma for Familiar-Honing Instruction).

So...no one really knows how much of a disadvantage the devs thought tyrant lizards come with, but considering how often they hyped owning one, probably not a lot. And its raw stats are fucking retarded. Yeddims have slightly more soak and twice as much hardness (you know, the iconic tough thing) but not even close to its health levels, and their only combat stat of note is their broken defend other trick. Tyrant lizards are in the category of things that threaten non-Dawns with four or fewer combat Charms. They have a shot versus stealth, even. All their bonuses are non-Charm. They're fucking incredible.

And...nothing else is. Well, maybe ox-dragons if you like riding, and don't care that your mount isn't a tyrant lizard and doesn't have a horse's speed bonus.

Best best is to reverse-engineer the statblock and try and sell your ST on something you made by recombining the numbers how you want, along with a host of insanely powerful merits and abilities, on the grounds that at least it isn't a tyrant lizard.

The kinds of things you can get are basically superanimals like tyrant lizards and flame gryphons, and unique Godblooded beings. But there aren't any stats for any of that.

>>49071636
You can't have any of those with Familiar 3. You need to be a Twilight with your anima, or either a Twilight or an Eclipse with Ephemeral Induction Technique so at E2 you can try to troll your ST into letting you have a cataphract. STs: don't let players use Ephemeral Induction Technique to take any of the written raksha past E1.

>>49071721
I am a Twilight, but I don't want to troll my ST into letting me have something game breaking.

>>49071746
So just slap random demons and elementals. Regardless of anything, you need Survival - Spirit-Tied Pet, Familiar-Honing Instruction, and eventually Deadly Predator Method.

You may note that to get Spirit-Tied Pet you have to get a bullshit Charm that should just be normal use of Survival or slightly difficult use of social Skills, and that Spirit-Tied Pet is E2.

This is your life. It's unfortunate.

Good demons: agatae (ignore the text about them sometimes throwing riders, that's so bullshit). Blood apes once again suffer from "y u do dis" design and have no Excellency, meaning you need a bunch of Survival Charms running if you want them to actually fight strong things, they have garbage Join Battle, not enough Willpower, and low DVs. They can kill mortal soldiers and average animals, though, and they can contribute via onslaught because they at least take a while to die. Also, all demons are renewable. Neomah are fun but their one trick is being decent at seduction and their other trick is "no one knows how this works lol."

Good Elementals: Greenmaws are as good as it gets without being a tyrant lizard. Swaying Sundew Tongue into Thorn-Toothed Maw is a legitimate threat once you get Familiar-Honing Instruction; an acid bath is no joke, and crashed opponents are basically going to just die.

All other elementals are shit.

Ephemeral Induction Technique lets you make your own stuff. You can try to make good things.

>>49072106
Sorcery allows me to make my own things too. Like E6 gods/demons with Celestial workings.

I think I'm not gonna bother with Familiar 3, and just go Retainer 4 for a DB minion.

>>49071260
The accuracy penalty is not too much, and +4 damage over a light weapon is pretty valuable. You need to examine it in the context of Melee accuracy.

An essence 2 Dawn with Excellent Strike, Rising Sun Slash, and an artifact heavy weapon is scoring an average of 15 successes on a full excellency. It will penetrate Solar level defenses and hit significantly harder than a light weapon.

>>49072172
4 dice average 2 extra damage without any charms, and with melee accuracy, will average more than that, and ALSO increase your chance to hit.

>>49072282
Sure, but if you're likely to hit anyway, the extra damage is better. Not just base damage, but higher overwhelming too. I don't think heavy weapons are the best, but I firmly believe they're a viable choice against peer level opponents RAW.

>>49072172
Yeah, the +4 damage is actually a malus - you lose tons of damage on missed attacks over an average fight.

In general, a heavy weapon user cannot match competency to a medium or light weapon user. In the specific case of Decisive-only clashing, the heavy weapon user can beat out the medium weapon user, but without easy targets he may crash too early for this to be viable.

In the rare and unusual case of a Withering clash (Snake style, fucking around with the Delay action) he runs even with the medium weapon user.

In both cases he loses if the medium weapon user has a second paired weapon, such as hook swords, which pair naturally.

In all cases, Clash or otherwise, heavy weapons lose to light weapons. In most cases, they lose to medium weapons.

There is no build that allows a heavy weapon to flourish - the one ray of hope, Clashing a medium weapon user, depends on their build rather than your own.

hey guys. so aside from forcing everyone who likes social things to be literally a whore, dip into the tree labeled SEX so all their friends can laugh at them, and have their character described as an "erotic vision made manifest," Thousand Courtesan Ways is pretty cool.

But! When you chain Social actions together, and want to use Charms to enhance them, what happens? Can I Motive-Discerning Technique my double-plus-good read intentions/threaten? Can I do that AND benefit from Tiger's Dread Symmetry? Is this just free reign to stack all your bonuses to two actions on one roll?

>>49072106
>Blood apes once again suffer from "y u do dis" design and have no Excellency

Blood apes are objectively worse in combat than regular apes. This is how stupid that design is.

>>49073355
Mind breaking it down for me because I am still working on not being system dumb?

>>49071260
>It is insanely common for player characters to dual-wield light weapon
I have literally never seen that in three different games.

>>49073386
He's just spewing bullshit.Blood-Apes have better combat dicepools, do more damage, have more willpower and have actual charms.

>>49071198
Clash Charms are real because a) they let you clash people earlier than you in the Initiative order, b) they let you make an extra attack in the round, and c) sometimes (e.g. for a Melee character with RSS, ES, and HSP), they're more effective than your defense for preventing damage.

Not because delaying to clash, an action which is specifically called out in the book as the PURPOSE of DELAYING actions, is actually completely useless.

>>49071699

Question, do Mice of the Sun make good candidates for Familiar 3? Bare in mind that they didn't actually make it into the final corebook, but I can post their stats if you need them.

>>49075459
They didn't make it into the book because they are broken as FUCK.

Is this Exalted?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJGF0MGGc8U

>>49075459
They would if you return them to your game, but as >>49075465 points out they were hax so your ST may not agree

I just made an account on to the Onyx Path forum and what the fuck, there is no reply buttons. And apparently I'm not allowed to reply to anything.

Anyone else have this problem?

>>49076773
You have to be confirmed. :^)

>>49076816
I don't know what that means, but it sounds like the internet equivalent of a reacharound.

Seriously though how does that work?

>>49076859
You wait a few days/a week and a mod clicks the "confirm account" button on your account.

>>49076877
...why? Why do they do this?

I thought forums were, you know.

Somewhere you can actually talk to people on day 1.

>>49075465
>>49075459
Yeah, they got cut for being too good. You basically always wanted one as a combatant, they were just so synergistic. If you can get your ST to let it through, do it. Cute excuses broken.

Well, since I'm apparently stuck here-can anyone explain exactly what the differences in how the Yozis are bound are in 3e than in 2e? After everything I've heard about it so far I'm not touching it until Infernals gets done but I recall something about the Yozis being mindraped or something to stay inside.

>>49076885
Persistent problems with trolls and sockpuppets coupled to an anemic mod team, but I'm pretty sure a lot of major forums have at least some form of permissions system (even if it's only preventing you from posting links or images specifically).

My guess is the nifty text editor Onyx Path packages (which is awesome, I love being able to CTRL-B like a human fucking being to bold something) maybe makes it a little harder to screen things, too.

Anyways if you message Lioness politely she might accelerate you.

>>49076966

What?

So far as we know nothing about the Yozi's binding is different: surrender oaths and Cecelyne same as before.

>>49076966
Did you play 2E? In 2E, there wasn't any mindrape, just the Surrender Oaths, which were metaphysically binding. I guess an unbreakable set of submission-enforcing promises is kind of mindrapey. The really bad thing done to them was the maybe-justified maybe-necessary probably-not-fucking-First-Agers mutilation of their soul hierarchies, transforming them into the monsters they became. They were already pretty monstrous, mind you, but now they're just super-fucked-up. That didn't force them to stay inside Malfeas, but it definitely damaged their ability to get things done without spazzing out due to persistent insanity, and that probably does count as mindrape. Imagine someone cutting out the best parts of you and feeling your entire being collapse into itself to try and fill the void of what-was, making your psyche into so much jagged rubble, a tombstone for your own former glory. The artist becomes the ascetic. The advisor becomes the psychotic administrator. The king is usurped by his own rage. The girl who believed in her brother's strength is now the avatar of a Darwinian nightmare built around the concept of faith betrayed. The only one who made it through mostly unharmed was the Ebon Dragon, but then again, the only good thing about him is his aspect as the Primordial of freedom, and now he's a prisoner forever.

3E has deliberately said nothing about the Yozis. The Infernals preview was badly-received and rejected, and their second take - decadence and vicarious living - is a little uncertain. They might scrap that too. Regardless, 3E is probably going to push the Yozis back towards "sentient landscape" and away from "entity" as something you could coherently converse with. Third Circle Souls are going to be stepping into prominence. Malfeas is a court of his highest souls much, much more than he himself is a meaningfully motive thing in the setting.

>>49071320
>But you are for whiteknighting him, holy shit.
No, merely commenting on how awful Exalted's community, in specific, is.

> Exalted's fanbase is exactly identical to every other fanbase except that it fights desperately to be more welcoming to women and minorities despite the fact that of the few of them that can roleplay, none of them can for whatever uncertain non-cognitive social nurture thrive with high-complexity mechanics
Seek professional help. Seriously.

If you think Exalted and its community have made any significant or special effort to be welcoming to minorities and/or women, you are literally delusional. Also the rest of what you said is complete balderdash. Stop trying to string together words you don't understand the conjugation of, let alone the meaning thereof, in an attempt to gain intellectual high ground. You're making me regret engaging in a battle of wits with the unarmed.

Try not to write /tg/ in general too harshly. Plenty of us only come here to point out sperglords like you exist.

how much thaumaturgy is it acceptable to start a heroic mortal as knowing in 2e?

>>49079148
to be fair didn't one of the devs make a show of patting himself on the back over the 3e cover having a trans or something?

>>49079447
Nobody is truly inclusionary, nobody is beyond racism, sexism, religious discrimination, etc.

It's all virtue signalling by attention whores.

Lunars when?

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>>49080655

>>49080655
Sometime between now and the heat-death of the universe.

First the special (kickstarter) edition of the core book needs to be shipped. Then the next two books are arms of the chosen (artifact/evocation stuff) and the dragonblooded one. Probably the next after that assuming they don't go for something like Exigents on the grounds that they're new to the setting.

>>49080862

Don't forget that they're going to run a kickstarter for Lunars. And we all know how prone to delays these things are.

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>>49080862
>First the special (kickstarter) edition of the core book needs to be shipped.

...thefuck? The people who preordered literal years ago still haven't gotten their books?

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>>49081026
>they're going to run a kickstarter for Lunars

Say it ain't so

>>49081038
The regular core version is out already, it's print on demand. It's just the super special deluxe versions are being printed.

>>49081123
>people will be bequeathing their orichalcum deluxe versions to their grandchildren

>>49081170
well you know how it is. pay for it first, receive it last.

seems reasonable.

>>49081170
Yeah, that's kinda why I don't do kickstarter anymore. I did three kickstarters: Exalted 3e, Star Citizen, and the new Erfworld website.

That was, what, 4-5 years ago? I still haven't gotten everything for 2 of the 3.

>>49081314
I supported the GITP kickstarter

Man that was a fucking mistake

What's metalworking like throughout creation?

>>49081438
Great at weapons, shite at buildings

What about Late Modern-Contemporary Exalted lads?

>>49081438
Hammer and anvil, due to it being a spiritual thing. Even metal casting doesn't work, because the resulting lump of metal has no spirit to it.

>>49069797
I'd say as a GM if this situation comes up that you can both delay to negative infinity initiative for free and take your real damn actions, and you only need to pay 2i total to do it.

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So Sidereals are Agents of Heaven, yeah? What jobs do you give them in games in order to start out as a group or to follow a story? I'm thinking of a job in a kingdom where a local gods prized dear (blessed to be able to evade all hunters) is to be set upon by a sorcerer-kings dog (blessed to catch anything it hunts) and the newly Exalted Sidereal is sent to resolve this Unstoppable Force/Immovable Object paradox. Do any of you do anything similar?

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Everyone, I need your help! My players are going to be meeting a Fair Folk pirate and his crew soon, so I could use help getting art for Fair Folk pirates. Anything is appreciated, only specification is that the captain looks young and charismatic. Think something in the vein of pic related.

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>>49088048

Did someone say art?

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>>49088202

Because I thought I heard art.

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>>49088222

And I love posting art for Exalted

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>>49088239

Because I fukken love Exalted

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>>49088278

And I been playing it for years, since it was first released. So I've got a lot of art.

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>>49088321

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>>49088343

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>>49088368

Also ignore the file names, they're for my own cataloging of shit, so, you know, just posting stuff from it that might fit.

>>49088393
That one is basically Marena.

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>>49088393

Especially the more outlandishly clothed shit, because they're fey. And it's Exalted.

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>>49088413
>>49088420

Who?

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>>49088471

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>>49088508

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>>49088538

>>49088471
https://keychain.patternspider.net/

From there, a Lunar.

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>>49088568

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>>49088620

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>>49088643

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>>49088662

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>>49088705

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>>49088715

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>>49088726

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>>49088756

>>49073271

Dunno, they didn't clear it. Uses the same roll.

For more laugh, use awareness for its automatically successful read intentions action.

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>>49088828

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>>49088870

>>49081582

Pardon?

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>>49088918

And done dumping for now, unless people want me to dump more. Here, have a motivational musician. Who has two big motivators on her.

I have a rules question.

I've been playing Ex3 for closing in on a year now and I never really read rule book thoroughly so much as skimmed parts that seemed crucial or relevant, especially since the ST provided a combat flowchart. As a result, I think I may have a misconception about the rules.

In combat, the way we've done it is if an enemy attacks me, they roll the attack, then I get to declare my defense, use my charms, and etc. So essentially if I have a parry of 5 and they roll 6, I can spend 4m to excellency my parry up to 7 so that I successfully parry (or rather 3m, due to rounding.)

Here's the thing. I was reading about martial arts and one of the early Snake Style charms SAYS that if you have higher initiative than your foe, you can declare and use the charm AFTER they roll their attack. This is strange to me, since the way we play, we always declare and use charms after attacks are rolled anyway.

So my question is, are we playing the system wrong? And if so, can I get a page number for where attack/defense declaration order is explained, as I can't seem to find it on my own.

>>49089498
>> So my question is, are we playing the system wrong? And if so, can I get a page number for where attack/defense declaration order is explained, as I can't seem to find it on my own.

So, good luck with that.

In 2nd edition, there was a very nice (if overly complicated) chart of when charms have to be declared. In that edition, first the attacker declares charms, then the defender declares charms, then you resolve.

In 3rd edition, the same is still more or less true but it's more... implied. On page 191, the game covers resolving attacks. Rolling the attack roll and comparing it to the defense is the same step. As such, there is no 'pause' after the attack has been rolled but before the attack hits. So the result is charms have to be all declared before the roll is made.

>>49089558

The system literally says that you declare all Charms before any dice are rolled, period.

>Players (including the Storyteller) must openly declare which Charms their characters are using, and all Charms (unless their text indicates otherwise) must be declared, and their costs spent, before any dice are rolled. Attackers declare their Charms before defenders.

No implication necessary.

>>49089639
Thanks for the quote. I ctrl+F'd it and found the line in the Charms chapter, page 251. Good to know since I am STing soon.

Hey, I have a question about homebrew charms/Martial Arts styles.

I'm wanting to make a new celestial MA style but I'm unsure about what the charms should do or how the effects should scale to the charms ability and essence requirements.

For a bit of relevance, I'm wanting to make a style themed around the unstoppable, devastating quality of truly enormous storms, with it culminating into something along the lines of "storm that breaks the mountain" or some shit. Form weapon being chain daiklave.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

>>49089902
Man I know this isn't helpful but can I just say I don't think that weapon goes with the style theme at all?

>>49090402
>>49089902
Yeah, the weapon and theme don't really go together. Maybe warhammers if you want to go for 'unstoppable". Maybe warfans for the storm aspect.

>>49090426
Actually, for a storm themed style I'd think unarmed, or fist weapons (preferably bludgeoning or bladed but not claws.) Reason being, I kind of associate the power of the storm with the power of nature, and what is more natural in combat than using one's own strength and speed to overcome your foes? To embody that force of nature in one's self, and to be the storm?

>>49089902
Spears, obviously. When storms wreck shit, it's all about giant lightning strikes. Spears represent the lightning.

>>49090402
>>49090426
>>49090594
>>49090611
I figured chain daiklave would work because they can shoot forward for the "lightning" and they whip about like wind. Also, I just had this picture in my mind of someone using it and basically becoming a tornado of whipping blades accentuated with pinpoint strikes made from a distance. It would be unarmed compatible though of course.

I got to say though that I think warhammers and goremauls match better with earth aligned or similar martial arts. I see this one as being air aligned if any.

Spears could be added though as they still fit in with what I imagine for the style.

>>49090794
I don't know, I think if you want a wind and lightning vibe, you want strength and speed, the strength of wind and the sudden striking power of lightning. A chain daiklave is really neither of those, a weapon on a chain requires a lot of wind up and maneuvering to attack and doesn't feel like it has the force behind of it of an actual hand-to-hand attack. Chain daiklave seems like a weapon of fanciness and finesse, neither of which are qualities of the storm, which is strong, unrelenting, and quick.

>>49091127
The whole thing of this style could be that it's unexpectedly forceful for chain weapon using art. When you expect lots of winging up, maneuvering and finesse you get a whirlwind of steel and powerful strikes you couldn't even see.

>>49088594
That really doesn't look like Marena at all.
>>49088978
Hey art dump anon, it's been a while! Threads have been slow lately, so maybe we need inspiration from art dumps a bit more often.
>>49090402
Eh, I think the poster is right about a chain being used that feels windy and striking like a storm. Warfans would be better for tornados, spears would work for lightning specifically, but I think chain lends more to the themes of both together, a wind up could actually be part of the charm thematics, as the storm gathers.

>>49079932
>It's all virtue signalling by attention whores.

yeah, thats what i said. dev was sucking his own horn about the whole thing

So /exg/, something I'd like to ask. I have a player who's going to be playing an Eclipse based on Robin Hood, and they'll be using a moonsilver now. The specifics are still to-be-determined, but I'd like to ask what sort of evocations a moonsilver bow might have. It's fairly easy to think of some for melee weapons and armor, but bows are tricky. Melee weapons could just have something involving shape-changing, like an axe that can disconnect it's head to be tossed at enemies before returning and reattaching itself. Bows are just shooting arrows though, which aren't made of moonsilver themselves. So, what general themes can I lean on for the bow's evocations? Any ideas are appreciated!

>>49094024
There's a moonsilver powerbow in the book, Moonlit Huntress.

Otherwise, a few ideas:
* Coat arrows in mercurial Essence, possibly make them come alive to inflict damage on targets already hit. Track arrows for increased accuracy. Curve shots around cover.
* Vicious, vindictive strikes. Decisive attacks cripple and maim rather than killing.
* Using bow for trick functions: shield against ranged attacks, parry in melee, vault away from melee. Mechanically, this would probably mesh well with a special attack Charm that lets you pin a target and inflict penalties on them coming after you/contesting your disengage (c.f. Smashing tag for power).

I can't remember all of core Archery's tricks so I could be repeating something like a dope.

>>49092348
>>49092705
I like where both of you are going with this. I do want it to be surprisingly forceful for what it is. Will be easier to do since I plan to have it used for a Lunar.

Building momentum could definitely be part of it too. I like that a lot actually.

Back to the original question though, What kind of effects should a purely offensive MA style have and how should the effects escalate based on ability and essence requirements?

>>49094285
Alright, that makes sense. Trick shots sound like they'd be particularly in-theme for what the player's going for, so I'll keep that in mind.

>>49094430
The feeling of being harassed with endless attacks, the feeling of an inescapable storm, even just for fluff and not actual flurry charms. Maybe piling onslaught bonuses, though not as strong as Brawl's. The attacker sacrificing their defence for bonuses to attack. Being able to chase and harry their target, but not as strong as Tiger Style's disengages and rushes. A powerup time or extended form charm to passively gather init or build a bonus, as the storm gathers. The choice to give up those bonuses to unleash in a strike, or keep the debuff going. Wind affecting ranged attacks, or causing concealment and visual penalties. The lightning strikes being powerful but risky decisives. You could even say you can only hit an enemy once with it, or that a miss will throw you off.
I don't know, I'm just throwing ideas around.

>>49094549
Great Ideas! Thank you for the ideas. Some of it I dont get since I'm playing 2e, not 3e. How would that translate?

>>49094625
Oh, my bad. I'm so stuck on 3e that I find it hard to shift my brain into 2e's system balance. You should specify 2e in these threads.
Good luck with it.

>>49093356
That's what people like to say when they see inclusions that they hate for whatever reason, but there's no truth or meaning behind it. It's all just an excuse to attack things when there's no good reason to do so.

>>49094742
Yeah, sorry about that. I didn't think about it. GM didn't want to wait to start our game for 3e to come out and he doesn't want to switch to it now that we've been playing for so long on 2e's system. He is pretty annoying to be honest about his restrictions. He wouldn't let us be anything but Solars from the start and no sorcery. But He throws sorcerers at us because we don't have counter-magic.

>>49094820
That sucks, we've had the mostly-finished corebook for ages, I can see people not wanting to convert other splats from a long game, but Solar-only is really easy to do. 3e is so much smoother and more satisfying to run, especially the new combat and social systems. At least you have a game though.

>>49094844
True. Me and a few others in our group had all been pushing it for awhile. Before that, we played a OWoD game. It was pretty cool. Character was a mage stuck in quiet. He was convinced he was Thor. now that I know what it is, I felt like an Exalt. He wrecked everything in open combat.

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Trying to think of stuff to find in a First Age Solar manse that was meant to be a prison for supernatural beings, but one of the few survivors from the Usurpation came by and released most of what was within to ruin the day of the Shogunate that took it over. So, basically, shit that even a Solar would rather keep in jail than release it on his mortal foes because they're that dangerous.

>>49095117
Uncontrollable behemoths. High-end raksha. A Wyld-corrupted Directional Titan. The batshit crazy prototype of the Five Metal Shrike.

Here's a question, has there been an MA that uses bows? Any edition, even fan MA's work.

And no using Wood Dragon, it was shit.

I am getting increasingly, irrationally angry at the existence of Wake the Sleeper. I spend 106 XP on my E3 character with Lore out of caste to get to Lore 5, buy the damn Charm, and a relevant specialty.

Then I activate it with a full ex and point of wp and HAM and get like 5.5 Evocations (maybe more, with a good stunt, and you better believe I'm stunting that shit) on my four dot artifact weapon. Next story, I use it again on my four dot artifact armor. Now I have repaid in full the cost of buying all the way up to this stupid fucking Charm, have a bunch of Lore Charms, have other shit like that, and I have all these Evocations.

It makes me not want to buy Evocations at all, because it makes me a fucking chump for buying them rather than buying my way up to this stupid Lore Charm which, frankly, shouldn't be in the game at all.

Fuck you, Morke.

>>49097206

You can spend Solar XP on Evocations, but not Charms. If you want to buy up to Wake The Sleeper and spend your SXP elsewhere, do so. But don't get angry at shit like this.

>>49097323
Is that really the excuse you're going with for getting hundreds of free XP? "It's Solar XP only"?

>>49097354

You're lugging 8 dots of useless merits around for over half a year's worth of gaming, spending a hundred XP on Charms that do absolutely nothing to help you USE those Evocations, in order to activate a Charm that might not even be relevant to the architecture of those Evocations, etc.

It'd just be easier to take an artifact whose Evocations unlock for free when conditions are met (see: Black Wind) and spend your XP on actual combat Charms, if you're trying to XP-game the system.

>>49097354

Oh shit, you want free XP? Pick up spirit stoking elevation to spend White XP on charm costs or get Exegesis of the Distilled Form to get up to 20XP to spend on what the fuck ever every story? Wake the Sleeper only works for Evocations, how many fucking Artefacts are you attuned to anyway? Why are you wasting so many motes being attuned to so many?

>>49097401
>You're lugging 8 dots of useless merits around for over half a year's worth of gaming
No? I'm lugging around a very nice stat bundle and any attunement bonuses for half a year's worth of gaming. 5m for indefinite +1 acc +3 dam is 100% worth it, plus there's possibly some nice attunement bonus like an automatically unlocked Evocation or a bonus to damage or some shit.

>spending a hundred XP on Charms that do absolutely nothing to help you USE those Evocations, in order to activate a Charm that might not even be relevant to the architecture of those Evocations, etc.
What? They help me use those Evocations by unlocking them. They also help me do other cool things, like access the Introduce a Fact subsystem, etc.

>It'd just be easier to take an artifact whose Evocations unlock for free when conditions are met (see: Black Wind) and spend your XP on actual combat Charms, if you're trying to XP-game the system.
Black Wind (and I hope to GOD any similar artifacts) balances the low-experience cost with serious RP costs.

>>49097456
>Wake the Sleeper only works for Evocations, how many fucking Artefacts are you attuned to anyway? Why are you wasting so many motes being attuned to so many?
It takes approximately two artifacts for Wake the Sleeper to pay itself off. Say, an artifact weapon, and an artifact armor, as a character might equip to make themselves better in a fight, for a very fair cost in attunement motes.

>>49097571
>5m for indefinite +1 acc +3 dam is 100% worth it, plus there's possibly some nice attunement bonus like an automatically unlocked Evocation or a bonus to damage or some shit.
It really isn't. 5m for +1 acc and a conditional +1 damage isn't even better than the Excellency. And if you're picking an artifact with a front-heavy attunement bonus, that just means the Evocation tree is going to be shorter to begin with.

>What? They help me use those Evocations by unlocking them.
Yes, and if all you have for combat is Evocations, you're going to get stomped by someone who spent that hundred XP on literally any random 12 combat Charms.

>They also help me do other cool things, like access the Introduce a Fact subsystem, etc.
You can "access" that any time; but it's also useless in the lens of focusing on Evocations. You're flipflopping between "being a Lore-focused character gets me this huge benefit" and "I have to go out of my way to get this Evocation-focused benefit."

>Black Wind (and I hope to GOD any similar artifacts) balances the low-experience cost with serious RP costs.
>Black Wind
>serious RP costs
>kill someone you really really hate who has killed other people
LOL OK.

>>49097643
>It really isn't. 5m for +1 acc and a conditional +1 damage isn't even better than the Excellency.
Uh. Yes it is. If you think 5m isn't a damn fine price for an indefinite +1 non-Charm dice and +3 damage to withering attacks, you are fucking stupid.

>Yes, and if all you have for combat is Evocations, you're going to get stomped by someone who spent that hundred XP on literally any random 12 combat Charms.
Okay? I bought combat Charms, like Martial Arts and Dodge. Now I'm buying Evocations. Except (if I ever, under any foreseeable circumstances, want more than 10 Evocations), I shouldn't do that.

>You can "access" that any time; but it's also useless in the lens of focusing on Evocations. You're flipflopping between "being a Lore-focused character gets me this huge benefit" and "I have to go out of my way to get this Evocation-focused benefit."
There are two points here, which build on one another:
1) If I want more than 10 Evocations, ever, it is more XP efficient to buy Wake the Sleeper, including all its prereqs, the ability, etc.
2) If I buy Wake the Sleeper, I get a bunch of other benefits, in addition and above the more efficient XP expenditure.

This means that if I want to be The Evocations Guy a) it is cheaper for me to do it by being The Lore Guy, and b) the Lore Guy also, additionally, has more cool stuff to do. So John the Evocations-by-Way-of-Lore Guy is not only ahead of John the Evocations Guy in terms of Evocation count, he is ALSO ahead in terms of Cool Stuff He Can Do To Affect The Story.

>LOL OK.
It takes a ton of time and effort and scenes you might like to spend anywhere else. Same as buddying up with a useful NPC, which also increases your effective power in exchange for your time and energy.

>>49098077
>Uh. Yes it is. If you think 5m isn't a damn fine price for an indefinite +1 non-Charm dice and +3 damage to withering attacks, you are fucking stupid.
The damage is barely noticeable; the 5m would require at least 5 attacks to become more efficient than just plonking the Excellency down, since dice-caps aren't often hit (especially on withering attacks where you're already sitting on 4 non-Charm dice anyway).

>1) If I want more than 10 Evocations, ever, it is more XP efficient to buy Wake the Sleeper, including all its prereqs, the ability, etc.
You're buying it with real XP, not Solar XP; Solar XP which you cannot spend on actual Evocations without floundering the efficiency of your ~build~

>This means that if I want to be The Evocations Guy a) it is cheaper for me to do it by being The Lore Guy, and b) the Lore Guy also, additionally, has more cool stuff to do. So John the Evocations-by-Way-of-Lore Guy is not only ahead of John the Evocations Guy in terms of Evocation count, he is ALSO ahead in terms of Cool Stuff He Can Do To Affect The Story.
"The Evocations Guy" isn't an actual role, I'm sorry to tell you, so I don't know what you're expecting here.

"Dude who picks up artifacts and Just Uses Them (shittily, because he has none of the other Charms to back up using that Artifact effectively)" IS a Lore concept, because absolutely every other use of artifacts is built around another, actual skillset that is going to require Charm support from not-Lore.

>It takes a ton of time and effort and scenes you might like to spend anywhere else.
You mean like the 6 months you spent getting this "totes so busted" XP engine going where absolutely fucking nothing else was happening on your sheet?

>>49098233
Okay, you actually are just stupid and don't understand anything about the system. It's so very tempting to piece by piece reply to this post, but the very fact that you would make it proves there's no point.

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So, does a manse have to made of the same material as the aspect of the underlying demesne, or can you splice in some other magical materials if needs necessitate? I'm thinking of making a green jade/orichalcum manse atop a Wood aspect demesne.

>>49098371

Manses can be anything, just like artifacts (give or take what you want the Evocations to be like); you could absolutely build a Solar-aspected Manse out of dull grey lead if it somehow still expressed the themes of Solar Essence.

New ST here. My player approached me with a chinese dragon familiar that he can ride on and fly, with the ability to make itself small for 3 merit dots. Should I allowe it in a naval game?

>>49098594
>naval game
Bad news about the naval mechanics in this game, my man.

>>49098616
what?

>>49098594
I'd allow it, it's no different to a re-fluffed agata

>>49098594

What are it's actual stats?

>>49098594
>>49098677
But make sure it's combat ability is poor - mediocre, none of this "tyrant lizard with more bonus shit on top" stuff

>>49098684
There are none.

>>49098721

This guy presumably doesn't have many charms form Survival, then?

>>49098737
he does have dots in survival but no ride....

>>49098629
I have a buddy who loves the Craft system except for the part where once you get deep enough in Charms you basically ignore it.

He completely ripped out and replaced the naval mechanics because they were such shit.

>>49098755
No Ride? Then he's gonna have trouble riding his dragon, I recon...

>>49062577

It's Swan. Which is why she's hanging out with/Stalking him instead of Rapero the Infernal Rapist.

>>49099762
In a game I'm playing, it's my character. They haven't met yet, but I'm told they will.

And he's initiated into Sorcery by Mara, who has taken a personal interest in him.

There will be fireworks. And blood.

Honest question: Why are Dragonblooded utterly incapable of 2nd circle sorcery? That seems weird to me. Mortals can do first circle, can't they? Dragonblooded can do no better? What's up with that? Not being able to reach Adamant/Solar Circle I get, even if I think the limits on dragonbloods are arbitrary at points. What do you guys think?

>>49100836
That's the point; they're limited. They're jumped up mortals in a lot of ways.

Plus it allows a distinction between the power levels of Terrestrial/Celestial/Solar Exalted. If DB could do Celestial Sorcery, there's a lot less distinction between them and the actual Celestial Exalted.

And the ability to learn Celestial Sorcery would let them do Ambition 3 Solar Circle workings, and nobody wants that.

>>49100968
>They're jumped up mortals in a lot of ways.
You might say that it's better to show respect for a mortal, even a street urchin, since they could become a real Exalt.

>>49100999
And if they do, they'll become respectable. But not until then, in the setting.

>>49100999
Savage burn, aggravated damage.

>>49100836
>Why are Dragonblooded utterly incapable of 2nd circle sorcery?

Workings m8.

Sorcery caps are totally soft now.

>>49101040
Oh ok, not having 2nd circle sorcery spells I can totally be ok with, but my main concern was that the Realm wouldn't have access to 2nd circle demons, which are all really cool imo and seems like they should be somewhat active supernatural beings. Not commonplace of course, but beings like Mara, Makarios, and Alveua ought to be a thing in the Realm.

>>49101148
>>49101040(you)

Yup. Just looked up the rules for Workings.
"As a general rule, this is the circle
for sorcerous workings that the Storyteller feels established
Lunar and Sidereal sorcerers, as well as accomplished
Solar sorcerers, should be capable of achieving without
excessive effort, or that an exceptionally potent DragonBlood
or mortal might be capable of attaining with great
dedication, skill, and risk."


Thanks guys, much appreciated.

>>49101148
I'm sure you can summon Demons as a Working, even multiple ones. In fact devs mentioned that summoning a battlegroup of Blood Monkeys all at once would be a workig (can't remember which Circle). It takes much more time and effort and is kinda risky but you can do it.

>>49101148
Mnemon was a Dragonblooded who can summon Second Circles via an artifact, while the Empress could straight up just do Celestial Level spells thanks to the Mantle of Brigid.

>>49102561
The demons summoned via working are unbound.

The armies of First Circle demons are the product of a lot of sorcerers summoning demons and binding them each night.

>>49102706
If you are a BD and want to summon a 2CD you have no other choice. It is risky but most demons have urges and natures that can be exploited. As for the army summoning, sometimes it's easier to rush a working than spend a month summoning your troops ony-by-one. Especially when you don't care about collateral damage.

>>49102938
The weakest 2CD are as powerful as Her Redness, and most are more so.

Seems foolish to me to try summoning something that powerful without a way to bind it.

>>49103078
>hurr durr herp

The memery in this fanbase is unreal.

>>49103078
What if she has a real Exalt, like a Sidereal, protecting her?

>>49103130
Then the 2CD will always be looking for a way to work against her, to backstab her or ruin her plans.

She can never trust anything to that 2CD, because of that.

>>49103195
That's not how demon summoning works.

>>49103204
Not if you use the spells.

It will be how it works if you use a working and can then cow it into serving you by having a Sidereal protector.

>>49103078
But she can just cast Demon of the Second Circle

>>49103311
I wasn't talking about Her Redness doing it, I was using her as a benchmark for the power of the 2CD.

I was talking about someone like Mnemon doing it, someone without access to the spell.

>>49103338
Mnemon's Emerald Thurible just lets her cast Celestial Level Summoning, while her Redness can cast any Celestial Level spell freely.

Plus, there are plenty of bro-tier 2CD's like the Whim of the Wind who'd be willing to play ball with a DB even if they're not sorcerously bound.

>>49103563

>Mnemon's Emerald Thurible just lets her cast Celestial Level Summoning

Out of curiosity, what're the chances of successfully binding a 2CD, given that DBs have worse Excellencies?

>>49103669
It's honestly not that bad? In 3E the ability to reroll failures by spending WP makes it pretty competitive.

>>49103563
I wasn't aware she had that ability, so I guess I chose a poor example.

Joe Random DB ain't gonna be able to cast Demon of the Second Circle, that's my point. He's gonna have to summon unbound 2CDs, and it's hilariously unlike they will willingly submit to a Terrestrial.

>>49103733
Again, it depends on the demon. Something like Octavian? Proooobably too kill-crazy to give a shit. Someone like Makarios or Sigereth? They'd be more than happy to be out of Hell, and would be amenable to deals.

Very, very dangerous deals, but deals nonetheless.

>>49103078
finely tuned bait anon, nice work

>>49103904
Not bait.

It's even a common saying in fantasy. "Don't summon what you can't control."

Can someone give me an idea of what an exalted campaign would be like? Like what would players do? I tried running one awhile ago but i fell through cause I couldn't really figure out what to do encounterwise.

>>49105064
Big.

Solars are literal God-kings. If you try to have them scrounging in the dirt like D&D, you're doing it wrong.

>>49105251
i mean like what are some enemies suitable for them? Like beyond other exalted and wyld

>>49103338
>>49103563
Now I'm reminded of Scroll of Swallowed Darkness.

>>49105282

"suitable for" isn't really the question; Exalts are expected to overcome the majority of their opposition by far.

If your Solars roll into town and dropkick the local warlord and his army into the sun, that's the game working as intended. Then all the trouble starts: "Well that was great and all, but what now?" "You gonna feed us?" "What about his allies and enemies? There's a huge power vacuum now" "And what about the laws? Who's in charge now? You guys? Aren't we just living in fear of a NEW set of violent tyrants now?" etc.

>>49105064
If its encounters your worried about there are a few things to take into consideration.
One is to just ask your players what type of game they want. If they want a sea fairing game prepare some generic pirate ships, or a naval based wyld hunt, or some aquatic monster from the wyld itself.
Also dont necessarily worry about making sure combat is a constant thing, if you're players are okay with it there can be times when combat just doesn't happen for a while. If they do want combat you don't always have to make it a serious thing but rolling on an encounter table or something. Maybe some god wants to test their strength. Maybe a curious lunar meets the exalts and asks to spare because he doesn't know if they live up to the legend.

>>49105347
ok. I think my problem is im trying to play this like dnd

>>49105378

That's a problem for first time players and ST's. The question should never be "Will this challenge the players?" but "What are the consequences of this action?"

>>49105378
A few major tips is that players shouldn't follow a single questline against a monolithic BBEG like you would in D&D. Your party should choose their own goals and path, surrounded by too many plot hooks for them to follow. Hammer in the fact that the hooks they chose to ignore had real conseqences and that people suffer and die in their absence, but they can't be everywhere. The plot should get fucking COMPLICATED with plots within plots and mysteries wrapped in enigmas. Social conflict and untangling complex webs of motives and lies is super critical a lot of the time. Figuring out who needs stabbing is far harder than the stabbing itself.

>>49105378

This >>49105424 Anon has it right. It's not about if the Solars succeed, it's about what happens afterwards. What are the consequences and complications caused by their success?

>>49105064

Whatever you and the players want to do.

Using 4e as an example, its like skipping levels 1-10 and immediately do things like saving the realm or solving lost mysteries and wonders.

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>>49105064

From what I've read so far, White Wolf really seemed to stress what the players want out of an Exalted campaign. Really wants the ST to make a "session 0" meetup.

Creation is huge. Pic related of Blessed Isle. Compare that to the EX3 world map. Seems like Exalted supports a sandbox type of game, especially for Solars, who are more than likely forced to run from Wyld Hunt.

Here's a quick summary of story themes each Exalted type tend to focus on, and my opinions on them. For more, definitely check out the Storytelling chapter in each type's book in 1/2e.

Dragon-Blooded
-More authority and responsibility inside Dynasty. Mileage varies outside for outcastes. Focuses on political intrigue. Grayer than other types, and able to move around as they will.

Solars
-The reborn god-kings. Suited to be leaders but will probably have to make their own kingdom to become a leader. Focuses more on righting wrongs and challenging old orders/the Realm. Their themes have a wide range too, just don't expect anything good from the Dynasty.

Lunars
-Noble savages. They mostly think civilization should be brought out of the corruption of civ. Really focuses on the Threshold, fighting off the maddening Wyld, and fighting the Realm. Really restricted against all but Solar Exalted, but a Casteless Lunar opens up more doors for a mixed circle.

Sidereals
-The ninja spies that are trying to keep fate running smoothly. Lots of contracts, espionage, and martial arts. Manages spirits and works through Realm's Immaculate Order. I really don't see much potential in them as PCs, but they fit the mentor NPC type perfectly.

Abyssals
-Immortal undead champions. In order to become one, you literally have to agree on destroying the world. To me they have the most extreme options. One is to follow your deathlord in destroying the world and being a villain. The other is to seek redemption and try to become a Solar.

>>49105378
Added on to what the other anons are saying about consequences and not just combat, when you are making enemies for them to fight, take more care for them to make sense based on the area and local plot threads. Try to have them be directly tied to a plot hook or consequence of their actions, so they feel it's not just a random encounter. Usually Exalts and some other strong magical shit is needed to challenge them in a fight, but you can also get a lot of mileage out of battlegroups of mortals easily condensed together, representing small squads or entire armies. Mortals can be effective if they play it smart, stack on advantages and complications, and are lead by a competent commander.

>>49105347

Depends on the enemies really. I doubt a Deathlord or Behemoths are going to be pushovers by any stretch of the word.

>>49106447

Granted, that's why I say majority rather than all, but the kinds of enemies that can actually stop a Solar circle dead are the kinds of enemies you usually have to go intentionally looking for.

>>49103801
>Again, it depends on the demon. Something like Octavian? Proooobably too kill-crazy to give a shit.
I'm actually pretty sure that Octacian's writeup in either of the previous editions states that he likes being summoned. He is usually summoned either to fight or to lead amies, which are things he'd do anyway, and the Creation has new and interesting challenges that make for a nice change from running his empire in Malfeas.

What should I read from 1e to understand the setting better?

>>49106760
The core, Scavenger Sons, and Games of Divinity

So, my character is a practitioner of Righteous Devil Style, and I'm trying to come up with new techniques to invent. Any ideas? Right now all that comes to mind is maybe something to create fiery devil-minions to help fight.

>>49107092

MA's are locked d00d

>>49107104
Wait, what? I thought you could still invent new charms for them? Either way, my ST already gave the okay, so I guess it doesn't matter too much either way.

>>49107734

Canonially, no you can't. MA's are locked and you can't expand upon them unless they're super secret techniques...

But fuck that noise.

Summoning devil-minions sounds too out of theme. Think of things like the lone gunman in a western or the doom marine. They may be hell tainted, but they scare the devils themselves in terms of deadly aim, reputation, and killing those who go against them in the name of justice.

Anyone have a good idea how far into the series future abyssals 3E proper will be released?

Really tired of racking my head trying to modify 2e and 1e to make something functional. (I literally have nothing. I can't make it work and have given up. And I can't say I enjoyed the homebrew for them I have found to the greatest possible extent.)

>>49108108
It's not even on the roadmap yet.

Get back to work.

>>49108108
The only reason DBs and Evocations are partway done is because the devs love DBs the most and Evocations were the edition's USP so had to be a priority.

After that is Lunars and we're looking at Hilary's second term before they are out

>>49108171
>>49108267
Gah, fuck it. . . Even infernals is easier to fix. Just going to scratch the void out of the picture and make them the "mistake" of a deathlord. If it doesn't work with the fluff then I give the fuck up.

So I went full Twilight craftfag, and as a component of an artifact I have in mind, I'm going to need to build a container I can stuff a few square miles of the Wyld into.

What kind of dot rating should I expect for an effect like that? I wanna stuff the territory into my box, cart it off, and eventually WST or Sorcery it into a pocket dimension inside my main project.

>>49108322
>I want to Wyld Shape without the hassle of going all the way to the Wyld

Look up Proto-Shinmaic Vortex from 2e

>>49108297

As the person doing the Infernal homebrew?

It ain't

>>49108338
Ah, right. The First-Age power anything battery, Ishvara in a bottle.

I'm not really interested in using the Wyld as a power source. The idea is to go out into the Wyld, find some land I like, then steal it and haul it back to my workshop to subjugate at my leisure.

Still, if those damn things are the first comparison that comes to mind, I should probably just assume my ST will call it Artifact 5.

>>49108511
PSV let you wyld shape from anywhere, the battery thing was a secondary effect

Yes, it should definitely be artifact 5, if allowed at all.

>>49108356
... on second thought, you don't even have the baseline for the way their powers/charms work beyond "strange and alien"

I recant, infernals might be harder than abyssals. But still, how do I disconnect these edge magnets from the void without yanking them out of the deathlords hands?

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>>49092705
>Hey art dump anon, it's been a while! Threads have been slow lately, so maybe we need inspiration from art dumps a bit more often.

Yeah, I haven't been on /tg/ as much due to not playing 3e yet. Had my first session a few days ago. Punched a dire boar (whatever, hellboar?) for over 50 init decisive, feels good man. Definitely cannot do that again though, that was the result of a very lucky opening smackdown.

I might have to do some art dumps again more regularly.

>>49108612

To save yourself work, just do the lazy way of Abyssals. Take mostly solar charms, edit a few, presto. Unless you're trying to do Abyssals as a unique thing, it may be easier to keep it simple for the sake of your sanity unless you can think up new things on the fly quickly.

I mean hell, my 2.5e Lover charmset I quite liked, but I wouldn't dare call it "The Midnight" charmset, more like "Here are a bunch of cool, Abyssal centric charms you can take for your Midnight!"

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Mop___N9V7ZfOEbCMTfcYfQFDKbpkXWBx2-ctvsjsN8/edit

I remember having a few vague ideas for FaFL charms and Silver Prince ones, but never wrote them down.

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>>49095117

Well, in 1e Exalted, since things were so easy for Solars to kill (intentionally), they just flat out made a ton of enemies unkillable.

They stopped doing this come 2e, and instead replaced it with shit just having retarded special abilities and depowering Exalt's some.

>>49108892
Nah, I want to do something unique. Alibit I'm doing it pretty lazily.

Having abyssals copy solars completely just doesn't sit to well with me. So I'm trying to do what the writers were doing and take it as "stuff ghost can do up to eleven" compared to the solars. But I don't think I can (or should) touch that until I can adjust the fluff to let them be more than champions of murder, ghost and mortal peace activist, and the deathlords servents.

As for resonance, I saw someones homebrew use the shards variant, it seemed more like bonuses to intimidate up until it hit the limit break. I'm trying to figure out how to avert that while not chaining abyssals into the two shitty paths scenario.

favorite control spell per circle? favorite shaping ritual? favorite sorcery path?

>>49111570
My favorite Terrestrial Circle control spell is Corrupted Words. Celestial Circle is probably Magma Kraken, just for the coolness of affectionate fire. Solar Circle... there aren't any real cool ones, I don't think.

>>49111570
best terrestrial spell is almost always demon of the first circle

>>49111736
But as a control spell, it sucks ass.

>>49111570
I don't particularly like any of them, using homebrew conversions of 2e spells for more options.

would anyone be willing to help me stat up a custom first circle demon for 3e?

>>49112069
do you have a general idea of what you want? descriptions of what it is would help as a starting point

>>49112247
Sure, just testing the waters first

I haven't settled on a name yet, but they're first circle Kimberry Demons who are examplars of the ocean's motherly nature.

They are monstrous in appearance and the perfect nurse maids, matrons, and teachers, with many also extremely knowledgeable in the dark liberal arts. Which are pretty much the regular arts only with more gothic posturing.

They are guardians of children and will die before letting their charges come to harm, but firm believers in 'spare the rod, spoil the child'

I was thinking might have the ability to speak with such authority as that leaves any person who hears them feel like they're a child who has just been caught with their hand in the cookie jar

>>49111570
terrestrial stormwind rider

>>49112691
or infallible messenger

>>49112707
also, anybody else think its weird some of the sorcery basically gives you dragonblood castemark equivalent?

>>49111570
>favorite control spell per circle?
Mists of Eventide
Cortana of Empty Voices
Unity of the Closed Fist

>favorite shaping ritual?
Official: Talisman of 10k Eyes
Homebrew: Anima Maleficus

>favorite sorcery path?
que?

>>49111570
Wood Dragon's Claws, Travel Without Distance, Death Ray.

That Talisman ritual that lets you convert your own motes into sorcerous motes.

The Soul-Perfecting Elixir.

>>49112850

>Anima Maleficus

Got a link to this one?

>>49112850
I...think he means the enlightenment fluff?

>>49112836
I think it is weirder that the way sorcery works with spells having specific effects is basically charms when they had a perfectly good mage magik system to ape instead. fits far better with how the world fluff seems to want to treat them.

>>49112850
>>favorite sorcery path?
>que?

Sorcerous initiation, he means. Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes, Soul-perfecting Elixir, etc.

Shaping rituals are the individual little tricks, like "I reap sorcerous motes from standing in shadows"

>>49113238
If anything it would be the other way around; the world's fluff for Sorcerers is in the vein of Conan: highly ritualized, highly specific, drawing on outside powers.

It's native Charms that would be Mage Magic-styled; free-flowing expressions of your badassitude.

>>49113292
Oh then:

>favorite shaping ritual?
Burnt offerings from Ifrit Pact

>favorite sorcery path?
Talisman of 10k Eyes

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>>49112397
Description wise I guess they would be like the more common goetic demons, being combinations of animal parts.

Maybe like the head of a deer with the muzzle of a wolf, the body of a woman, tail of a snake, and the hooves of a goat

They'd live on the shores of Kimberry in Malfeas, where her waters meet the roots of the great trees of Szoreny

anybody ever figure out if the backer pdfs had secret identifying watermarks?

How's Mandate of Heaven, boys? Could it easily be ported to Ex3?

>>49114037
>How's Mandate of Heaven, boys?
Garbage. Took the "treat organizations as a giant character" way past "useful abstraction" and into "so literal that it starts acting weird."

If you mean Creation-Ruling Mandate, still pretty garbage, but mostly in the "so simple that the only relevant Charm is your Excellency and any political choices are obliterated by just throwing more dice" way.

>Could it easily be ported to Ex3?
Sure, probably.

>>49049974
So, I got bored and made a homebrew conversion for Arms of the Unconquered Sun style, no idea if any of it is over or underpowered yet though. Went ahead and posted it on the OPP forums (and made the thread into a stash for other homebrew martial arts), now I figured I'd post it here and see what /exg/ thinks too.

forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/exalted/961582-homebrew-martial-arts-styles

It's the first post in the thread.

>>49113567

Don't think so. It's a redundant question now that it's out, though. Buy it for $4 and post it here for the rest of us, the only one we have is the unerrataed backer version.

didn't know it was out now. That explains why the discussion to compare versions died awhile back

>>49115180
>didn't know it was out now

TIME TRAVELLER!

YOU MUST WARN THE PAST OF WHAT YOU HAVE SEEN!

YOU ARE OUR ONLY HOPE!

>>49115293
no. fuck em, it's their fault my life sucks. they brought this on themselves. I'm just here to laugh and watch it burn

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Why does Wyld-Shaping Technique suck so horrifically bad in 3e?

Why, after paying 64xp (about 13 sessions at least) or devoting vast swaths of my character's design at chargen (Supernal Lore/Lore 5/8 charms, meaning it's definitely going to be the character's niche) and going through what is basically a session's worth of effort (because now you need to bring the whole Circle along to defend you while you're fucking with the chaos) after locating one of the relatively limited places in Creation where using this Charm is actually possible, must I still pay 2xp per phase?

The charms building up to WST make sense, the charms expanding off of WST are good, but there are very many of them. Yet WST already demands extensive effort to use and requires an xp cost - oftentimes an exorbitant one if you're trying to make anything remotely worth having gone to the trouble of getting WST.

Was this to protect the niche of the absolutely trash Craft system that barely anyone wants to use?

>>49116185
I mean you can use Solar XP for it, but yeah I'm usually against XP cost on non-permanent character upgrades.

>>49116185
Reshaping the formless chaos into exactly what you need, imitating the titans that created the world, is hard, tiring work. It's as hard as it should be.

>>49116185
>Why does Wyld-Shaping Technique suck so horrifically bad in 3e?

Because fuck you for wanting free stuff