How do you beat someone who makes no mistakes?

>>49023414
Diplo. If the spell shows the golden path to any goal, change his goals.

Befriend him

>>49023414
It's got to have some sort of limit.
What's the source of magic in the setting? You might have to go full 'That Guy Kills Psions' if his destruction of the human psyche keeps up.
Outside of that, do you have anything at all that bypasses divination?
On a fundamental level, if the spell can't account for you, his path will be altered in a way you can compensate for.
I'm assuming this guy is basically the Terminator in regards to his goals- can't be reasoned with, et cetera.

Take the first "Napikin"

Does the spell adjust to accomodate your plans even if unknown to him? you could try to find out his goals precisely and guess at where it will lead him. you could illusion him to believe he's following the spell but intead following whatever you tell him. you could destroy his assets.

>>49023517
What?

>>49023414
Xanatos gambit. Set up a situation such that all possibly outcomes are a victory of some sort for you.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/XanatosGambit

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>>49023414
Worm had a similar issue, with a character that had the ability to see the Path to Victory.

She was unbeatable.

This is what I can think of:
(1) Finding the connection between him and the spell, and severing it, and keeping him entirely in the dark so he can't use his ability on you.

(2) Metagaming hard and carefully entering randomness into the PC actions to oppose him because while the GM can perfectly craft his world, he cannot tell the future himself, and does not know for certain what a PC would do. Not sure how'd you'd pull this off, though. You could also craft plans in secret amongst the players and not reveal to the GM, so that the GM cannot use this ability against you.

(3) Study him carefully and then secretly poison him or something, if you can get anywhere near him, since confronting him with the knowledge that you are his enemies readily available will never work, since he can just come up with the goal "how do I defeat these enemies" and autowin.

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>>49023527

>>49023414
The only way is to trick the GM, you have to put him in a situation where the BBEG absolutely cannot survive no matter what he does, and any kind of GM asspull will be obvious and won't be cool with all the player.

No idea but what it would be but it should probably be something that the GM thinks the BBEG is reacting to accordingly, but later activates once he has already put himself in a situation of certain death.

Like, an arrow that hits everything that evades it, or something. The important thing is that the GM should both know and not know the power of the weapon. Outsmart him.

If his spell allows him to see the path to a goal, change the goal or overwhelm him so that his spell cannot help him and all he can see with it is death or surrender.
Buy a shitton of antidivination items.
If it's something that can be fucked up by chance, make all your decisions with die rolls.
Double trap: Set up a trap for him that is somewhat easily avoidable. While focusing on this one, a second trap comes into play. Ideally, his spell will only help him for the first one, as it's an immediate goal. If you're really good at traps, make it so that avoiding the first one means getting caught in the second one.

>>49023414
Join him. But not really. Become subversive elements. Subvert his goal. Make it a perversion of the original.
Or as someone pointed out, sever the link.

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Lol counterspell
Lol casting it after him to counter said spell

You start working towards the same goal as him.

Yeah, you heard me right. Start working towards the same goal as him, and here's the important part - find a way to do it better than him. That way, each and every one of his castings will require him to keep you alive, and, in fact, unimpeded.

The problem is that you obviously need to stop him from actually accomplishing his goal, and his spell - depending on from where it draws its information - will "know" that you don't intend to actually complete the goal, so you need to find some way of hiding it, either by using some sort of spell that erases the knowledge that you're actually trying to stop him from your mind until a certain trigger (his death) or to hide that information from destiny itself (if it's some weird sort of fate- or probability-based spell that doesn't rely on gained information).

Then you need to set up some sort of scenario where the BBEG is actually more of an impediment to his own goal than you are, at which point his spell will then tell him "let them kill you." At that point, he will either graciously lay down and allow you to kill him, or his survival instinct will kick in and he'll stop trusting the information the spell gives him.

Lot of ifs in that plan but it's the best I can come up with at short notice.

>>49023414
1. Slap your GM for pulling that shit.
2. Use Gold Experience Requiem

Use it against him. If he has a goal he wants to meet affect the goal in a way that is detrimental to him. Sure he reaches his goal, but it kills him in the process. However this assumes you can learn his next move and that the goal is tamperable. Like a two stage proximity explosion spell on an important orb. One to take out any precautions his spell made him take, and then another to actually hit him with.

>>49023734
Fucked up a lich once using this technique. I like to call it The Twisted Tennessee Turnover.

>>49023578
Source of the pic ?

>>49023567
This would probably be your best bet. Someone who relies so heavily on a spell to show him the optimal path to victory probably isn't actually that good at planning things, and he would focus very hard on that one path and ignore everything else.

So create multiple simultaneous plans which work in parallel where you will somehow win regardless of what happens. His power cannot help him if there is no actual path to victory.

>>49023414
It sounds as if he must have a very specific goal in mind when he casts the spell. I think you may need to convince him that he must pursue a specific goal of your choosing while you prepare to take him down in a way he doesn't expect and therefore cannot use the spell to counter.

>>49023414
>Our GM has created an in universe explanation for why the BBEG can never be stopped or beaten
So your GM is an asshole who wants to win.
Wargames Protocol.

Find out how to cast the spell yourself. Find ANYTHING you can that let's you copy spells and craft that shit into a rod or something.

>>49023904
explain what the Wargames Protocol is?

>>49023923
The Only Winning Move Is Not To Play.

>>49023935
oh, THAT Protocol

Misinformation.

The BBEG's knowledge and thoughts influence his objective when he casts the spell. He cannot ask how to defeat an attempt on his life if he doesn't know an attempt is going to be made, and he cannot ask how to overcome an obstacle if he doesn't understand what that obstacle actually is.

Bait him with a seeming problem then blindside him with something completely unrelated that he wouldn't have thought to ask for.

Or just overpower him. There isn't always a perfect path to victory no matter how hard you try. You cannot beat a column of tanks with men wielding pointy sticks no matter how wise your planning is.

Alternatively, if there literally is nothing he cannot do, foresee, or overcome, then your GM is an asshole and you shouldn't play with him anymore.

If you have an arcane trickster that's high enough in level you can just steal his spell

>>49023414
Maybe a wish or a miracle spell where the request that he loses that ability?

>>49023941
Yep.
I may be getting the situation wrong, but this sounds looks like GM asspull with an in universe excuse. If a GM wants to win, he has supreme control over tjhe universe to win. If he's gone to some lengths to give an in universe justification for it, it sounds like he not only wants to win, but he wants to win "legit".
Quit the game.

>>49023996
Alternatively, if he's worth his salt as a GM there is a way around it

>>49023414
You need to mislead him, confuse him in his goal - think Jafar in Aladdin, he could just get the power he wanted by wishing, but he didn't think about any context of the power.

You're guy wants to poison humanity's subconscious? See if you can turn it back on him - he connects to all of humanity and all the emotions of the world melt his brain or something

>>49024022
We'd need OP to confirm what kind of DM he is. But honestly, I've known so many bad ones in my time that this kind of scenario doesn't scream "solve this challenge" as much as it does "plot magic, enjoy the railroad"

>>49024049
Yeah, but I have hope

>>49024022
That's what I'd assume. Maybe there's a wizard library or something in the world where the party can quest and find out how to disrupt its power, or where this divination comes from? Perhaps there's another spell that can block it. Alternatively, trap him in an antimagic zone. It doesn't let him see the future, it just lays out the steps to his goal. Maybe there's even a way you guys can spy on him when he casts it and find out what those steps are, and plan from there?

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>>49023414
>Golden Path

>>49024077
If you are OP, please give as much detail as yoiu can about times the GM has used the Golden Path spell in game.

Has he LITERALLY gone "doesn't work, cause Golden Path." For example?

>>49024125
No, just an anon hoping there is a puzzle to solve as opposed to an infiority complex

>>49023414
Give us as many details as you can, especially when its been used in game by the DM.

>>49023414
Chuck fireballs (or other evocation spells) and hit with weapons till he dies.

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>>49023414
with dubs

>>49023935
Not play wargames?

>>49024171
Honestly, I'd agree if not for...
>He can do it an unlimited amount of times
>I'm at my wits end
This just screams GM fiat and obvious railroad.

>>49023414
Why does he want to poison the hivemind?

>>49024246
Watch more movies anon.

Try using everyone's minds against them- if Mr. BBEG thinks everyone's trying to stop him, use that knowledge.

Have each person make traps and schemes without each one knowing, then spring them all. The GM will think you're all working together (and so will the villain, hopefully) male to much for him even to think for.

If he uses it to find the perfect way to escape from one guy, have a second guy set a trap without his knowledge. It'll be fun and cool if GM isn't an asshole

>>49024288
>Guy one pulls a trap
>Golden Path at will, escape
>Guy two pulls a trap
>Golden Path at will, escape
Even if he's not an asshole, this doesn't beat his power.
But honestly, I'm convinced the DM is being an asshole.

>>49023414
There are two broad strategies you can use. The first one is extremely unsavory but has a better chance of success, depending on his actual goals. The second is a lot weaker but less ugly (though still ugly).

1. You make his goal unattainable by inflicting tremendous self-damage. His goal is to poison an aspect of humanity's shared subconscious? Sever that aspect completely. This assumes that his plans are so grand that they must be stopped even if it means irreversible damage to humanity. Note that this relies on him personally not being a grand strategist.

2. Trick him into the wrong goal. Have a party member challenge him to a dual. Rig the entire dual scene (planet, mountain, whatever) to explode. The really important bit is that the villain must think his goal is to defeat the character in combat, not merely kill him, thus confounding the spell. Do this by attaching a lot of importance to yourself in winning a physical battle. e.g. gamble a shitload of money on the dual's result, such that it's important to you personally that the fight take place, but realizing you're purposely screwing yourselves over.

TL;DR: be willing to accept a cost to victory that he couldn't conceive of, and use that to get him to a situation where he can't ask the right question.

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>>49023414
You get good at spinning

>>49023414

So, the GM ripped off Contessa?

Well, if you're playing DnD, you just need to find a source of Mind Blank effects.

>The subject is protected from all devices and spells that detect, influence, or read emotions or thoughts. This spell protects against all mind-affecting spells and effects as well as information gathering by divination spells or effects. Mind blank even foils limited wish, miracle, and wish spells when they are used in such a way as to affect the subject’s mind or to gain information about it. In the case of scrying that scans an area the creature is in, such as arcane eye, the spell works but the creature simply isn’t detected. Scrying attempts that are targeted specifically at the subject do not work at all.

Which, even on a pessimistic ruling, will completely no-sell his spell. On an optimistic ruling, it'll completely fuck up his Path to Victory.

Only surefire way: quit this bullshit campaign, thus preventing the villain's plan from unfolding.

>>49024376
The GM could easily rule that Golden Path doesn't target any of the players, just the BBEG.
>>49024331
1, That was my plan all along.

2, The Golden Path revealed he shouldn't come to this trap, so he sent a clone.

>>49024408
>1, That was my plan all along.
If the spell is so powerful it can essentially control (by predicting flawlessly) player actions, than you've already lost (and also your DM isn't actually giving you a fair chance, and is a cunt).

>2, The Golden Path revealed he shouldn't come to this trap, so he sent a clone.
Except it won't, because the goal was "winning the dual," and a clone obviously doesn't count (since he's not fighting).

>>49024408
>The GM could easily rule that Golden Path doesn't target any of the players, just the BBEG.

Still doesn't work - the "Golden Path" cannot gather or update any kind of information about the players.

>>49024436
1, Bingo. It sounds like that is EXACTLY what the spell does.

2, The Golden Path revealed your goal was a trap. If you asked it the best way to jump into a Volcano, it'd probably point out that's a bad idea.

>>49024453
He could rule it gathers information about how their actions influence the world, even if it can't see their actions directly.

>>49024466
>2, The Golden Path revealed your goal was a trap. If you asked it the best way to jump into a Volcano, it'd probably point out that's a bad idea.

Lolwut
Why would the spell make judgments not asked of it? There's no reason for you to make it even more OP than it already is. You can't assume a spell intended to help you achieve your goals perfectly would tell you not to achieve those goals.

>>49024488
You assume that the BBEG isn't always asking in terms of his overall goal. If jumping into a volcano nts him from achieving his overall goal, he would be told to avoid it.

Its not, "How do I leap into the caldera?"
Its " How will leaping into the caldera aid me toward my goal of ultimate conquest?"

Same with the duel.
"By winning the duel, will it aid my final goal?"

>>49023414
>the precise course of action he needs to take to assure success

what if u simply put him before something he cant do? There must be a situation that has only one way of escape which would be impossible for him to deal with.

>>49024596
Getting trapped isn't success, the golden path leads him away from that outcome.

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>>49023414
Eventually he will come to a point where to achieve his goal, he must die. All you need to do is wait for that to happen.

>>49023414
What are his other abilities?

>>49023414
First thing that comes to mind is putting him in a situation where there is absolutely no way out. Setting something up like that would be tough as hell, not to mention you'd have to do it without him seeing that ahead of time and using his Golden Path to avoid it.

Other thing to try is see if you can get that ability as well and use it against him.

>>49024621
Im not talking about getting trapped

just hire an army big enough so he cant run, encircle him and wave your pointy end untill he fails to dodge

untill path of victory can teach him how to do teleport magic and break anti magic spells
if it is the case, just repeat the process untill he is so tired he can no longer teleport himself away

>>49024534
That way it's just DM fiat, so he's not actually beatable unless there is a way prebuilt into the campaign, like obtaining a counterspell.

To be beatable, that spell must have limits, otherwise you have ridicolous situations where the Villain poison your wizard meal the night before he learn Mind Blank.

But if the spell works for example by saying that in order to reach your ultimate objective you must steal the holy relic, but you must cast it again with that goal in order to learn how, then he's beatable by setting up a situation in which he completed his intermediate objective while making impossible for him to complete his ultimate one.

Like for example, if his current goal is to steal the holy relic, by putting the relic in a place that after he complete the objective of stealing it then there is no path for him to escape alive.


But as other people already said, it relies on the DM being actually good and not just using this spell as a way to make the villain unbeatable.

>>49024534
The spell isn't a general-purpose omniscient advisor. It "only" does one thing, and that is get you to a SPECIFIC goal you have in mind. You're way overextrapolating - there's no indication you can ask it yes/no or theoretical questions.

>>49024685
OP hasn't responded a single time. I'm pretty sure this is a bait thread but we're having fun anyway so it doesn't matter. Just don't expect further info.

>>49024690
>I'm not talking about being trapped, I'm talking about trapping him with an army

Being in the place where the army is isn't success, the Golden Path leads him elsewhere before the army arrives.

>>49024686
It sounds like the GM can easily just declare the Golden Path retroactively kept the BBEG safe.

>>49023844

Looks like Mark Smylie's work.
Could be his "Pagan Joan of Arc" series Artesia.

>>49024716
Based omn the fact OP is...
>at my wits end
...I'm guessing its total GM fiat.

>>49024737
How's that theoretical?
His goal is his ultimate end goal.
You can't just claim the spell isn't going to consider the steps you have in mind.

>>49024784
>His goal is his ultimate end goal.

It's like you didn't even read the OP before offering your opinion to everyone.

> shows him the "Golden Path" - the precise course of action he needs to take to assure success in whatever goal he has in his mind WHEN HE CASTS IT.

In principle, all you have to do to get around that spell is make sure he asks the wrong questions.

>>49023414
>This has essentially allowed him to carry out his entire plan (poisoning an aspect of humanity's shared subconscious) flawlessly despite every effort we've made to stop him.

Make an antidote lol. He has an end goal of poisoning the human subconscious? Let him, then immediately kill him.

Fix the damage afterwards.

>>49024784
Let's say that every day the BBEG just casts it with a single question "How do I achieve my ultimate goal?"

If the players have set a trap, achieving the ultimate goal involves avoiding that trap. If they try to coax him onto an exploding planet, he will avoid that planet. If they want to encircle him with an army, he won't be where the army can catch him.

Because if any of those things happen, his final goal won't succeed. And the spell ensures his goal succeeds.

>>49024833
Like I explain here >>49024852
All that means is he has to be single minded.

>>49023414

So where does this spell come from OP? What's the basis for it?

I mean, is the 'spell' just a mechanical way of representing Muad'Dib/Leto II, or is it an actual spell, with In-Universe origins?

If so, looking into those origins might just provide a way to beat it, or who created the spell. I mean, if a wizard came up with that kind of spell why is he/she not ruling a perfect utopia as an unageing god?

>>49024852
>>If they want to encircle him with an army, he won't be where the army can catch him.

One word: DISTANCE

1. get mercecenaries/zombies/whatever in radius of tens or even hundreds kilometers around the BBEG
2. give them some sort of tracking method so they wont be fooled by cheap disguises (soul scent or whatever)
3. make them encircle the BBEG
4. give them orders to basically kill and raze everything on their path

if BBEG uses his path of victory at any point he will notice he needs to get out of there ASAP but he cant because he isnt moving fast enough to avoid being encircled.
We just need to have an army attacking from such a distance he cant outspace them with a horse.
If path of victory gives teaches him teleportation - then teleportation has limits too, repeat the tactic untill he is out ouf mana.
If path of victory leads him to some old witch whom can give him magic boots of gotta go fast - go to the same witch, get the same boots and catch him.

>>49024945
Because the creators original goal wasn't to do that maybe?
Maybe all he wanted was to make a great sandwich?
Maybe he was blind and used it as a seeing eye spell?
"how do I buy milk without tripping over...?"

Does the BBEG have leisure time? Is he likely to ask "will this disrupt my end goal?" if there is no disruption would he do it? He wouldn't need to be using his spell afterwards because he already knows the activity is fine to do. In this case kill him as he's doing the thing he enjoys. He has already committed to that decision so it has to be him. Why send a clone to play golf when you want to be playing? After a non-detection spell on yourself, just in case, and then go there and kill him. prepare an anti magic circle or something in case he can teleport.

to sum up
1. investigate to find his usual hang outs
2. prepare all necessary spells one way or another
3. go to hang out with him in it.
4. explain in detail to the DM your plan, and why you are doing it that way as you do it.

If the DM is reasonable it should work.

>>49025003
You aren't getting how powerful this spell is. If there is a way, any way to bet out, the spell finds it.

>If this do that, if that do this
You're pretty much saying the only way to counter him is to have the same ability and stalemate him

>>49025042
>If there is a way, any way to bet out, the spell finds it.
how many ways to get out of the encirclement tactic you can come up with? Its about creating a situation with no way out.

>>49023414

There are problems in this universe for which there are no answers. Nothing. Nothing can be done.

... also PRISE LETO, THE GOD EMPEROR OF DUNE.

>>49025023
See >>49024852
If going to golf today ends without success, he can't do it.
>He wouldn't need to be using his spell afterwards
That is a collosal assumption. Why the hell wouldn't he use it all the damn time? He has no restrictions on its use.

>>49025058
>A situation with no way out
No such thing, especially if the BBEG has a spell he could use constantly to find a way out.

>>49024103
They need to build a no-chamber, immune to prescience. That's the only way. In other words, find ways to reach non detection out the wazoo. If epic levels are a thing, reach them or find an epic level caster to cast something on you. Or start a breeding program, become the bene gesserit. Basically, out Dune the Dune fan.

>>49025109
BBEG has no such spell

its the gm that holds this power. Just outsmart him.

>>49025058
You assume your soldiers are infallible machines who draw a perfect impenetrable wall. If there is one weak link, the spell finds it. If there is one guy who can be bought, the spell finds him. If there is one chance to escape when a guy is distracted by a noise elsewhere, the spell shows you where this will happen.

>>49025121
The GM controls the universe and can just say the Golden Path retroactively thwarted the players trick. Just because the GM didn't know, doesn't mean the spell didn't.

>>49025145
so use constructs under mind controll spell of level the BBEG cant break

Does the spell make him immune to getting stabbed in the fucking face

>>49023455
>"Ignore these people or kill them to ensure you reach your goal"

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>>49025069
>>49024103

Nigga...

From all the places on /tg/ only two anons noticed that reference? Shit scary and sad.

>Golden Path
>shows precise course of action
>poisoning an aspect of humanity's shared subconscious

So because OP is fag...

Just, Git gut and listen...

Breed people with traits that makes them invisible/resistant to that spell, make them an official right hand and advise BBEG and them wham! Drown that worm motherfu... i mean kill him or something.

>>49025188
If there is a chance the golem army won't spot him, the spell shows you how to evade capture.

Even if there is only a one in a quintillion chance of getting away, the spell shows you how. That's the point.

>>49025188
Then the BBEG interferes with the making of said constructs, by destroying the materials or w/e

>>49025087
In every system that uses magic it takes a toll on its user. So, even if it's at-will with no cool down. It has to have some effect on him. Otherwise the DM would have just given him some bullshit magic eyes. So there has to be some time were he isn't using the spell.

>>49025118
>>49025225

k tham makes three.

Still shit weird. I mess old Dune shitposting threads now.

>>49023414
does your setting have gods or any other very powerfull beings?

>contact a god who has to do something with fate, wisdom or chaos
>ayy dude this wiseass right here is doin this path spell
>it kinda sucks for you because he is crossing into your domain homie
>maybe you can curse the spell so he cant use it anymore?
if this works, then the golden path gives him: this is the last time you can use this spell, TRY TO REMEMBER ALL YOU HAD TO DO and he is a normal mortal. Untill GM pulls something like: he pleased the gods way before you could attend them.

Then go to a chaos god because they like to change their minds :V

>>49023527
You're all sitting around a table for a fancy dinner party. You, your party, you gm, your BBEG. To your left and right are a pair of napkins. There are enough napkins there for each of you to have one. Who decides whether you take the left of right napkin?

If you said yourself, you're wrong. The choice lays with the first person to reach forward and chose their napkin. If the BBEG reaches over and selects the napkin on the right everyone at the table must follow suit. He has been allowed to set the pace. Do not allow him to set the pace because with his ability you will never catch up. You can not win by reacting to him.

Take the first napkin.

>>49025209
No, but it will ensure he's not in a position to get stabbed.

>>49025225
or we just didn't acknowledge the reference

>>49025260
The OP specifically stated this spell is at will with no cool down.

Roll a psion and mess shut down his mind long enough to kill him

>>49023414
Have a high level psion mindfuck him.

>>49025260
You know what else is at will with no cool down?
Blinking.
What toll does that have on you?

Here's how your plans will work.
>Ambush?
Golden path at-will. Uses it to dodge every attack and land the perfect hits. Akin to being able to roll Nat 20's at will in combat.
>Trap
Golden path says avoid the left path and stand a certain way down the right path by the tree where the second, third, and fifth traps are laid.
>Political scheming
Golems path says to kill PC at certain time in certain place before their power becomes to great.
>Anything else?
Golden path let him prepare an exact counter to your power even though as a GM I only found out about it two seconds ago.

In conclusion, find a different BBEG.

>>49025058
Nigga just gonna tunnel out of the circle.

Really I feel like just never ever leaving him alone could work. Force him to use his magic constantly under varied conditions. Make him check his coffee in the morning for fear of poison. He will eventually fail to recast the spell once circumstances change, or will be caught out having not cast in the first place.

Plans with multiple positive outcomes are awesome too and would likely frustrate this villain, Ill admit though I'm not great at coming up with xanatos plans.

>>49025003
Solution. He runs straight towards one particular part of the army and arrives at nightfall, passing by the one guy who fell asleep on watch duty.

>>49025295
Yes, but like I said, even without the cool down the magic has to effect him somehow.

If not OP and friends will either lose because of stupid DM stuff or just as the campaign comes to close with the BBEG moments away from success the DM will Deus Ex Machina the shit out it and they win having succeeded at nothing the entire time

>>49023414
After reading a few people's posts and thinking on it a bit I think I figured out a fool proof way. Again, this is assuming your GM is not a shitter.

>Figure out a cure/way to fix the aspect of Humanity's subconscious the BBEG intends to poison. Keep this information hidden from the BBEG at all costs. The end of his Golden Path if you will.
>Set up a situation in which the best way for him to achieve his goal is to get himself killed.
>Let him die and reach his Golden Path.
>Once he dies repair the damage and then rejoice.

The reason this should work:
>He still achieves his goal. The issue is that the BBEG does not know of you having a fix to his goal.
>Thus when he consults his power to show him his 'Golden Path' he will not ask 'And how do I prevent those adventurers from fixing the damage?'.
>The most important and hard part of this plan is orchestrating his death. He must be dead before he achieves his goal, otherwise you will be unable to repair the damage he did since he can just 'lol Golden Path' it.

>>49025284

maby, *snigg* maby.

but why not? its such a blatant ripoff that we should catch OP on that
turns out to be interesting thread nonetheless don't get me wrong
im just suprised how much people let it slide

>>49025337
>In conclusion, find a different GM.
FTFY

Become a bigger BBEG than him. Poison all the water. All of it. When he comes to defeat you. Kill him.

>>49025391
>The magic has to effect him somehow
Yes, it shows him e perfect way to achieve his goal.
But you are assuming a downside.
Only assuming.

>This is bullshit
Yeah buddy, it is.

>>49025393
What if the PCs aren't powerful or influential enough to move armies and repair the collective consciousness of their entire species on a whim?

>>49025430
then they get stronk, until Path to Victory finds their asses and they're fucked

>>49025393
This might work, assuming the spell doesn't for see that the goal will be undone, thus not a success.

Or if the the party can actually cure the damage.

>>49025425
well even though it is just an assumption it would still be good to try so they know more about the power. The more they know about how it works the more they can do against it. I would suggest OP try any and all of the methods we have given him. Not just one. An assumption here or there might be right.

>>49025471
by that time it will have to be retconned by the DM because the players kept it secret from him. It will be too late. The BBEG will already be dead

>>49025490
The big assumption is this;
>OP CAN WIN
Played logically, this bullshit power is flawless.

And honestly if this was real, my only advice would be quit the game and piss on the DMG.

I wouldn't reccomend this to most situations, but maybe you can just catch a ride on a boat to a different continent? If the BBEG follows you and you specifically you'll know your GM is a railroading piece of crap. But only do this after trying a few times.

>>49023414
>The BBEG of the campaign we're playing has a fucking spell that he can cast at will with no cooldown or cost that shows him the "Golden Path"
Drop the game because that's the most blatant excuse for a railroad I have ever seen

>>49025526
Assuming death is success for the BBEG. Because he totally wouldn't want to see his plan achieved.

Simple, become so powerful that his golden path spell can not bring any solution to beating you.

>>49025609
Yes anon, assuming the players can make it to where dying is the only way he can succeed. I understand that it's assuming, but we have to assume a little but given the circumstances and not actually knowing what the DM has in store for the players

I have no idea how this is supposed to be a hard conundrum. It's a powerful ability, but it's super fucking easy to subvert depending on the specifics.

Mostly the fact that he has to have a goal in mind to use it.
That makes the ability close to useless against a dedicated group of people out to kill him.

>>49025419
>>49025324
>>49025314

Why not these?

>>49025786
>Spell, how do I find a way to succeed that doesnt involve dying
He finds one the players didn't account for.

>>49024326
It can't show him how to do things that are impossible, and it's fairly easy to set up situations that are completely impossible to get out of

>>49025844
I think you may need to read the thread.
This guy >>49025337
Sums it up.

>>49025867
in that case make the DM explain exactly how step by step.

If he can't leave

>>49025886
The spell won't let him get into those scenarios in the first place then.

>>49025393
>>Set up a situation in which the best way for him to achieve his goal is to get himself killed.
If the DM isn't a piece of railroading shit ( and considering he came up with this BBEG, likely is ). The best solution is find a way to reverse the poison, then alter the method acquire the poison that forces the BBEG to die in the process. His goal is achieved, unfortunately he dies because golden path doesn't do max optimal, path doesn't warn him of reversing poison for the same reason.
You don't even have to try this in game. Just tell your DM this is what you're going to do. If he bullshits a reason for it to not work, the ability is overpowered bullshit you couldn't win against in the first place and you can leave the game before going through all the trouble.

Alternatively, make attaining his goal completely useless. Make poisoning humanity's collective unconscious useless.

Maybe turn humans into a different species, I dunno. Become the justified BBEGs of another story

>>49025898
Information that is secretly guarded by an ancient order that has almost zero dealings with the rest of the world. Only the Golden Path enabled the BBEG to even find them.

That or, " You don't know how."

And that's fair. Because otherwise its metagaming.

But yeah, if this was a real game, OP should quit and leave a shit in the DM screen.

>>49025896
Yeah except he's completely wrong and is way too unimaginative. He thinks the traps end at the fifth, when you are able to always just start up new ones that weren't around before he showed up there.

You can just keep twisting harder and harder into him, in that situation, and why the hell do you even have a spot where your traps don't overlap? That's a dumb assumption

>>49024326
It really looks like a players vs DM encounter
This would propably be a shitty idea UNLESS
>the GM is not an asshole
>It was planned as the players vs DM encounter
>GM has to be outsmarted by the players in order to win
>GM won't asspull deus ex machina that will keep his BBEG on top

>>49025225
It's more like everybody noticed this,but Dune is so popular on /tg/ nobody bothered to write something about this

>>49025920
So he, at every second of his life, has the same thing on his mind, and constantly updates his golden path?
that's bullshit, just kill him while he's sleeping

>>49023414
Steal the spell and cross counter him with it.

Chances are you'll die of massive brain aneurysm because of the infinite feedback loop that is created, but at least you'll take him with you.

>>49026043
At will ability. Doesn't matter when you set the traps.

Doesn't matter if they overlap, the ability helps you avoid thrm all.

I honestly think if you've read the thread and don't grasp its OP bullshit, you may be thick.

>>49026065
>While he's sleeping
He casts the spell before sleeping to determine if its safe.

>>49025920
unless you poison all the water. Seriously guys, if he can't drink any water it will put a serious damper on things. He will then have to defeat you before you can poison all the water so that he can finish his ultimate goal. Once he gets to you you can put him in a situation it's impossible to get out of. It's a paradox. You existing jeopardizes his plan, him going to defeat you also jeopardizes his plan. Just work on multiple plans to kill all humans. Even if he finds ways around them he isn't getting any closer to his goal as long as you are a bigger BBEG than him.

>>49026112
You seem to be incapable of grasping the fact that creating new predicaments that could not be taken into account during previous usages means that subsequent usages will not necessarily be able to make up for the lack of omniscience present earlier
The overlapping was more calling out how stupid the example given about traps was. "He sends a clone" is less asinine. An ass-pull, but not something only someone with severe cognitive impairment would say

In plainer words, you're retarded.

>>49026169
So what, he's just never gonna sleep? You're several people, he's one, do the math.

>>49026065
This is the stupidest part for me. Just give him a magical eye at this point.

>>49026181
The spell shows him the way to the means to purify his personal supply of water.

>>49026169
Does it wake him up? what does it do that an alarm spell does not? It's useless to him asleep because he can't focus on the goal in his sleep

>>49026182
>Subsequent uses will not necessarily...
Subsequent uses will reveal the new predicaments as they are a barrier to his success. As such, he will be shown to avoid them.

This isn't a hard concept.

>>49026201
Unless the bed is safe. If its not safe he finds another.
>>49026240
>Before
People need to learn to read.
Seriously.

>>49026256
The whole fucking point, you illiterate, is that you create new ones which, when compounded with the old ones, create an altogether inescapable situation, which is not very difficult when you're against someone who thinks they're invincible.

This is not a hard concept.

>>49026216
That's why I said multiple kill all humans plans. Go in expecting to have your plans thwarted. keep doing this stuff until he has to deal with you personally. Him having to find a way to prevent your plan is time he could be spending towards his goal

>>49026278
It's actually kinda funny how self-assured you are despite how dumb you are.

If you hound him at every turn, no bed is safe

>>49026278
So you're saying it doesn't stop if you break concentration?

>>49026281
>Inescapable situation
>Badguy who can constantly avoid any barrier to his success
Pick one.
I'm sorry you don't understand this power is OP as fuck and can't be defeated except by further DM fiat.

>>49023414
You're fighting Contessa RIP

>>49026169
So just keep lying in wait whenever/whenever he wants to sleep. He'll either get so tired he'll forget to cast, or just die of sleep deprivation.

>>49026297
Don't get pissy, the whole point is that the power is stupidly op. Its DM fiat. There is literally no scenario in which he can't declare "the golden path foresaw that, it didnt work."

>>49023414

Put him in a scenario where all his choices are failures. It's possible to make no mistakes and still lose.

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create a situation in which the best choice for him would be to negotiate with you

>>49026343
How would you even know that information?

How do ypou know the information on jhis sleeping patterns wasn't leaked to you as part of a golden path scheme to fool you?

Truth is, you don't.

Because this power is GM fiat.
You cannot beat it.

>>49026360
How?

>>49023455
First post best post. Go see Watchmen for an example, Blue-dickman's persecution convinces him that he is the cause of much suffering.

Alternatively, convince him that he has accomplished his goal and that the current state is the direct result of his actions. Do it in such a manner that his power's instructions do not compute with the state of the world as they see it.

> Teleport a city away
> burn the nearby area where the city was
> summon some unhinged beasties to roam around
> maybe get a few unrecognizable corpses
> BBEG returns to the location of their 'hometown' to see this
> One of the PCs disguised as a mourning civvie shouts "if only YOU never did this, you MONSTER!"
> BBEG tries to solve the solution by asking his powers "how do I fix my city?"
> Powers either suggest monor political restructuring, or come up with "city is fine, next question"
> BBEG quits out of guilt

>>49026409
When the enemy is to damn big and you make a heroic last stand.

>>49026481
No I mean how do you make all his choices failures?

>>49026519
Oh, that. And sorry, I'm not the guy you were replying to in >>49026409 just so you know.
Well, a paradox could work, maybe. I dunno. My suggestion from the start was subversion of the bottom line goal

>>49026456
What OPs DM will do
>"How do I get my city back?"
>"Teleportation? Oh, so that's what happened"
You just know it

>>49025267
/thread

The BBEG has the ultimate tool that allows him to establish any plan to succeed. The only course of action is to force a deviation from that plan, and from all future plans. Always have the initiative and reinvent the battlefield.

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>>49026769
THERE IS one alternative:

In chess, a "fork" is an attack where you threaten two enemy pieces at once. IE If they move one piece, the other dies. If they move the other piece, the first dies.

So you simply set up a situation where even the BEST path is a bad choice.

BBEG needs to go from Town A to Town B and there are two possible roads? Set ambushes on both roads.

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Craft a temporal arrow that can strike its target anywhen. Shoot the arrow at the villain's previous location. Problem solved.

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What happens when a level 1 commoner that never makes mistakes has to fight a CR 20 Pit Fiend?
Answer: he dies. Victory is not always possible, even with a perfect plan. Sometimes, one side is simply that much more powerful than the other.

So the answer, OP, is that your party has to make it so that the BBEG's victory isn't merely difficult, but impossible. Array such massive power against him that losing is just a matter of time.

Of course, this game does not actually exist and this thread is a pointless thought exercise, but that's the idea.

>>49023414
According to game theory, while omniscience is a powerful advantage in most games there are some games in which it actually assures the omniscient player's loss.

Take for example, the game of chicken. Two cars driving towards a head-on collision. One of the drivers is omniscient, which means he knows the precise moment at which his opponent will swerve.

But if his opponent knows that he is omniscient, his opponent can resolve to *never* swerve. The omniscient player will know that his opponent will never swerve, and therefore *must* swerve and forfeit the game.

>>49026693
Then rename the town and make sure everyone in it gets legal citizenship to it, save for the DM's persona BBEG. Therefore when he thinks to ask that question, it wouldn't be 'his town.' I can play the semantics game all day in prep for the downfall.

>>49026456
>> Teleport a city away
What if we aren't playing a party of epic level casters?

There seem to be two types of people ITT

Those who have played with horrible railroaders and know this is utterly no win.

And those who have had nothing but good DMs and can't even conceive of a no win scenario.

>>49026933
Then do something under the same principal. Steal his fucking cat for all I care so long as it's big enough to cause 'em regrets.

Just suicide bomb him.

>>49023578
Came here just to post this. Batman gambit plus overwhelming force is the only way to do it.

>>49023650
If invinciblity is simply caused by a narcissistic and incompetent GM, same as above but using trolling and propaganda. The clown cannot honk of you disable its hand.

>>49023414
What system? If it's 3.5, just cast a Quickened Time Stop (Divine Metamagic or whatever to get the effective spell level down). If it's GURPS, your best bet is get a Switchable (Reflexive, Reduced Time [To None]) Alternate Form that has Insubstantiality with Affects Insubstantial.

Settingless, your best bet is to find out his goals and set things up so the best thing for his goal is for him to die.

>>49023414
Or you could just stab him. Lobotomize the rogue to make him immune to the hive mind bullshit, give him an anti-magic field enchantment to get rid of contingencies, and back stab him a few times. Can't prepare for a threat you don't know about, and just knowing how to defend yourself doesn't give you the physical skills to do so.

>>49026968
>Golden path see's a way to survive the suicide bomb/bum rush/whatever the fuck except injured.
>He already made reservations at nearby Tavern with a member of the local church about to arrive at his room ready to patch him up.

>>49027130
>stab him
He avoids the situation where he's stabbed by "Accidentally" causing a scene/tripping the right person/ambushing the rouge and lobotomizing him instead.

>>49027267
If my GM is going to bullshit enough that a guy can survive a stick of dynamites right to the chest I would give up.

>>49027355
>You throw dynamite at him/ drop it on his.
>Golden path tells him to extend his arm with palm curved to deflect the dynamite 5ft-10ft away and leave his singed instead of pulverized.

>>49027425
wouldn't work. besides, shockwaves exist

>>49027425
>implying I wouldn't just hug him and blow it up killing us both
I know he can see how to stop us, but he would still need to roll right?

>>49027425
No. More like
>Golden path allowed him to know you're attempt at juggling dynamite at him, so set it up with nails/Leggos spread in the right spots and a few razor blades set up so your leg is taken out of commission so he can gracefully escape while you're temporarily distracted by the flaming statue of a middle finger.

>>49027450
From how Golden path is described, it seems to just substitute any roll with a Nat 20.

Assuming the GM Is playing it right and not just saying "Oh he planned for that!" on everything you do. Make the only win state for him is to sacrifice himself somehow to accomplish his goal.

Easy as shit. Make a spell of your own that tells you when he casts that spell and what he is told. Now you know his EXACT course of action.

Essentially predictability becomes his Achilles heel.

>>49026945
All the good answers have been ignored

There are some awfully complex but woefully ill-thought out plans here.

Meta-wise, the BBEG as DM only actually knows as much as the players announce, though the DM can obviously say retroactively that this Victory spell was used.

In-game, you know a few things. First, the reason why the BBEG hasn't already won is that there is a time aspect to this thing. There is something he needs to acquire, some action he needs to perform, or some person he needs for whatever reason, and despite his own actions has not been able to speed up that timeline at all or or at least not fast enough. This means the PCs have a definite window of time in which they can act and potentially get to whatever needs to be done first. The first step is to then investigate this time aspect.

Second, you may not be sure if the BBEG actually has true foresight or is just reading your minds or intentions, if knowledge of the BB's actions extend only so far as to how they have interacted with the PCs.

With this is mind, my plan would be thus: investigate the time aspect and secure a means of transportation that is as quick as possible, if not instantaneous. Upon discovering a target, embark immediately with some section of your force/party. The rest continue to investigate. Here you are probing two things: the true nature of his power and his means of transportation. If your split force arrives at the target and does not encounter the BB's countermeasures, you know a few things: that the BB only knows as much about your actions as you do and that he is slower than you are. If they do encounter countermeasures, he either has true foresight or is simply faster than you are. In any case, the goal here is not to seek decisive battle; if encountered, as the BB may have true foresight, he might be giving battle because he knows he will win.

The other group continues to investigate possible targets and then embarks as soon as one is discovered, if it is done quickly enough. This probes ...
(cont.)

>>49027667
...the BB's ability to be in two places at once and confirms, again if done quickly during or very soon after the first op is sprung, the his speed of transportation and the nature of his power. If encountered at the first site, the BB's actions here are a tell. If the BB's countermeasures are not here, you have ascertained that he does not have true foresight and is not able to be in two places at once. If his countermeasures are here, then you have confirmed the BB's true foresight; if he could only read minds or intentions, it could not have prepared countermeasures against your second group if still engaged at the first. The linchpin is that the first group engages the BB's attention, if not his actual physical presence, even while the second group acts.

After these probes, you can then plan your actions. If the BB's power is only a kind of mind reading, the standard tactical thinking still applies: strike quickly, unpredictably, and at multiple places at once. If it is true foresight, then frankly the decks are well and truly stacked against you, and the only possible solution would be to bring to bear overwhelming force and possible countermeasures to his divination in decisive battle in such a way that the BB cannot win, but that is probably not possible.

The assumptions I make, of course, are that the BB is either working alone or is the principal planner, such that only he can direct his forces; and that the time aspect is because the BB must do something at particular times, places, and to things or people external to him that he has not yet secured. If the time aspect is that he's, I dunno, waiting for a death baby to be born deep within his lair of evil, or that he simply has to perform the poisoning subconscious ritual at some particular time, then you again have the decks well and truly stacked against you, and again your only option is absolutely overwhelming force in decisive battle.

>>49027286
How does he ask how to avoid being stabbed when he doesn't know he is being targeted?

>>49027708
>Golden Path what's the best way to get to B from A?
>Do this, this, and also this to avoid dying.

>>49026824
THIS
So much this. This is an inherent flaw in such an OP power: the BBEG depends on it, which means it does not know how to handle tough choices. It will, maybe, do nothing. Or even negotiate with you. And if the GM is worth his salt, he will probably understand the idea.

Besides, the 'best' course of action is not necessarily impossible to foil, subvert or counteract.

>>49027685
Those who suggested before me overwhelming force assuming that the BB actually can know the future are correct.

But, then, the PCs at the same time must know they are bound to fail. If the BB is acting on a plan if they actually can know the future, presumably it's because he knows of his ultimate success. Our PCs must soldier on under the assumptions that his powers are limited in its scope or its extent (how far in time the BB can know the future) or give up altogether.

>>49027750
>the precise course of action he needs to take to assure success in whatever goal he has in his mind when he casts it.

Unless staying alive is a goal he is constantly thinking about, even during sleep, then it won't protect him from unknown threats.

>>49027978
What threats would be unknown?

>Golden Path, Golden Path, what attempts on my life will be made for the next ten years?
>Golden Path, Golden Path, if I institute these countermeasures, what new attempts on my life will be made?
>And these?
>And theeeeese?

So on and so on.

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>>49023414

you can't stop him from completing the path, but you can pull him onto another path.

you need to go after this mother fucker, hit him where he lives, where his hopes and dreams live, you've gotta take all of his greatest failings, hold them right up in front of him and laugh at him for it, you've got to make him mad, so earth shatteringly mad that he changes his path, changes it from "poisoning the human subconsiousness" to "murder-fuck the party"

you've gotta find out everything you can about him, make him hate you, make him despise you, you've gotta force his hand and make him change his path, make him tread the path that kills you all

and then you've gotta let him do it

you have to let him know where you are, and let him come for you, sacrifice other party members as pawns to lure him towards you, towards the final confrontation he desires. you, the worst of the party, you have to make yourself the absolute worst person in the world, do horrible things, attack everyone he's ever liked, destroy the things he's doing this for, make yourself his nemesis, and when he comes for you, you activate a weapon which doesn't just kill him, it obliterates both his soul and your own so that he can never return and try to pull these shenanigans again

the path will lead him to the route that kills you, but it won't try to save him unless he asks it to, and if you do this right he will be able to think of absolutely nothing other than killing you

thats what you have to do, give away your lives, your afterlives, your history and legacy, your very immortal soul to beat this man

history will remember you as butchers, as monsters from the darkest depths of the human soul, and its gonna remember him as a hero, but that doesn't fucking matter, because you stopped him.

and thats all that matters

>>49028038
nigga has to remember all that shit or remember to keep asking while also being focused on his goal

>>49028098
This! Thank you!

Firstly, if he already knows who you are, and that you are his enemies, you've already lost. OP has implied that the BBEG can cast this spell at will and change his goal anytime he wants. He can simply take a break from his main goal to kill you guys and then carry on with his main goal.

If he sets his goal as "I want to live and kill the enemy" then the golden path will show him how to do that, and you will never beat him.

Thus, if he already knows who you are, get name changes, identity changes, disguises. Do some sort of magic that makes you die and come back to life, too. Make it so that, for all intents an purposes, your party is "already dead". That way, he will never be able to find the golden path to killing you. By changing your names, you have the advantage of being unknown to him.

Got all that? Good.

Now you need to realize that his masterplan will probably be his "Golden Path". By definition, he knows the best way to accomplish this. You can not stop him from completing out his masterplan and getting the thing he wants most. The only thing you can do is delay him by making him focus on other things.

If his ultimate goal involves his survival, then you can not kill him. He will already know the Golden Path to that, which will include "how to not get killed by the PCs".

You can either delay him at best, or get something that makes his goal literally unattainable, like a God on your side. But even in that case, his Golden Path would include stopping you from getting a God on your side.

Here is the best thing you can do: Introduce chance.

If his ultimate goal has an element of chance into it, then knowing the "optimal path" doesn't necessarily mean he will win. For example, if I have to take a 50/50 chance to get something I want, there's nothing that knowledge can do to help me. I still have a 50/50 chance to win or lose. But then again, his golden path will tell him how to stop you from introducing chance

>>49028098
This is wrong.

All he has to do is, instead of asking the golden path:
>How do I kill the party
He asks
>How do I kill the party without dying

And now you're dead, and he's not. Bad end.

It shows the optimal path through any situation towards achieving one's goal, a path that will inevitably lead to this goal's accomplishment so long as it's followed. Even if you kill him or seemingly subvert him, it WILL ultimately lead to the accomplishment of his goal, so long as he's followed it exactly as it commands up to the point of his death -- not that it would allow his death, if him being alive is a sub-condition to his goal.

There is no way to counteract this power/spell/whatever. It could coordinate the exact actions necessary to trigger any number of incredibly unlikely events from an otherwise chaotic reality if they served the fulfilment of the mandated goal, like orchestrating the creation of a Boltzmann brain or something even more profoundly improbable just to get the user a sufficiently delicious sandwich or something equally inane. This "Golden Path" mechanism might as well be God, for what it can potentially do and our (lack of) ability to fully comprehend its capabilities.

>>49028357
if he's still rational enough to ask that question you've failed
if he still wants to live after getting revenge, you've failed

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>>49028357

the party cannot beat this man if he thinks rationally, therefore the only way to stop him from winning is if you stop him from thinking rationally.

he's only human, he can be made to suffer, to despair, be driven to homicidal rage, and if you can get him to the point where he no longer thinks of his own safety then you've won.

if the bastard is actually the superman thought robot then of course the party can't win, the gm is a faggot, and they should go completely off the rails GTA style and see how many people they can kill to piss off the gm

but if the gm is not fucking with the party and has put legitimate thought into this then the man will be a man, he'll be mortal with a mortals feelings and failings, and you can use that shit against him

mind games anon, mind games.

>>49028303
This assumes the golden path means anything when you go to kill four or more people at the same time. I don't think the golden path would be very useful in combat. If the players are able to get him to fight they win unless somehow his HP 1000 and he gets multiattack 10 with an AC of 50 or some stupid shit like that.

Punch him til he dies.

>>49028529
This is about the only situation in which you should call in the edgelord, desu. You know, the kind of guy that will mutilate a child just for smiling at the BBEG years ago. You know, ruin EVERYTHING he isn't directly protecting at that moment. Draw him between things to protect and destroy the one he can't. Though with this being the case, you'd best hope that the destruction of the world is an acceptable loss in the face of his intended victory state, because otherwise this isn't worth it.

>>49028658
At this point the BBEG IS the DM so yes. I'd say it's worth it

>>49023414
Stop playing with Kap. He's a douchebag.

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>>49023414
Defy fate with spiral power. Let him have his one hundred percent chance of winning and seize victory anyway.

Is the future malleable in this timeline given foreknowledge of the future? That is to say, is the Golden Path answering questions that ask "what SHOULD occur in order to achieve this outcome out of all possible outcomes" or is it answering "what WILL occur before this fixed outcome happens, including my own actions, accounted for because I have asked this question and received an answer"?

If it's the second, still basically fucked. If it's the first, a malleable future, then you can possibly get him if he changed the future without further prompting what he should do given his changes. If he has any time to think out his questions, then he's fine, so the window of opportunity is to make him change the future in a small way using Golden Path without letting him use it again in the time it takes for that outcome to occur--say, in a combat.

Say he decides to fight you, given that he uses Golden Path beforehand to determine the outcome of the fight given a certain set of actions. If he sticks to that certain set of actions, he will win. But say in the combat he gets extremely nervous and panics, using Golden Path to see what he should do next in order to, say, avoid an attack. If Golden Path works this time and the action he takes deviates from what he should have done originally, the future becomes malleable, and what actions he should take may not be the ones that he should have originally taken when he had first used Golden Path. If he is then prevented from using Golden Path again to determine a new set of actions, it is then possible that he will not know what to do, given his reliance on Golden Path.

The trick is how one can force him to use Golden Path again before a previous outcome of Golden Path has occurred, make the usage of Golden Path small enough that one's total defeat was not a condition of the outcome asked for, knowing that it was used, and then preventing him from using it again. A pretty tough task, I would think.

>>49028098

I'm fucking stealing this narrative. That was beautiful.

>>49024757
Thanks

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>>49023414
its a spell so use dispell magic or whatever other spells casters use to fuck each other.

other than that,you cannot beat someone who has causality on their side,because no matter what you do your actions will either further his goals or be irrelevant.

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>>49023414
The only way to defeat you is simple. Kill every single PC except himself and he win at a heavy price. Bonus: If you die, the world is stuck in an age of darkness for eternity with no way reversing it. gg ez.

From he way OP described it I have a better idea.
Disconnect humanity from a species-wide consciousness so the human race won't die.

Make an evil clone of them; set them against one another.

>>49028636
anon
this BBEG is effectively Pun-Pun, because
>Golden Path, how do I survive this battle?
>Oh, dodge this like this, hit here, dodge that, sweep the legs, and done? nice.

>>49032752
It's like Harbringer from Worm.
>Dodge in this exact way and move like this and you can dodge machine gun fire and be mostly unharmed from point-black explosions.

>>49023578
Just an aside, but the character in Worm who could see the path to victory was never defeated, and in fact manipulated the main character at times. You are probably thinking of another character that could live in two timelines at once, who was beaten by not having any good choices left available to him.

>>49032752
But how would that represent itself mechaically? Do people have disadvantage to-hit? How would they play other than "hurr durr nobody out of four guys is able to hit him"

It seems like there are two ways to solve this problem.

1. Take advantage of the fact that he is still human, and humans make errors. Like others have said, stuff like making him have the wrong goal thus creating a blind spot and exploiting it hard.

2. Create a situation that could not be escaped even with Groundhog Day levels of knowledge of future events.

Think about that second one for a bit. What kind of problems can't be beaten by basically just loading the same save over and over? Imagine any situation in a video game you could not get out of with save scumming and try to force it on him.

>fighting a boss without enough consumables
>having an army/unit that is too weak to win a fight and too slow to avoid the fight
>you brought the wrong equipment/party comp and it is too late to go back
>you picked a class that is extremely bad at this one challenging part of the game, even if they are fine elsewhere
>ran out of mana/spells and saved before a big fight

You may also be able to exploit his blind spots that already exist in order to force him to act in certain ways as well, like taking hostages he cares about.

Giving him more problems than he can solve could also work. If you have one fireman and four fires, your city is fucked.

What this comes down to is Dm using his bbeg to control the game and cause he is a dick OR is he posing a situation and playing it as one the players can solve. People are also missing the human element of this bbeg. Maybe since he has this power he is very cocky and only uses it when he has too. Learn the bbeg. If you have a good dm the guy will have character traits you can use against him.

Example. He is so cocky he only uses his power when needed, say someone challenges him to a duel he will use it to best him. In this situation you need to assassinate him before he has a chance to notice you and use GP on you.

This is assuming the GM made a real fleshed out character and not some mr. Perfect npc.

Had this happen. He thought he could kill me, my GM thought he could kill me. It turns out I was VERY difficult to kill. There was no path to victory. All paths ended with me.

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Challenge the BBEG to a duel to the death, then right as you die/lose have your hidden friend cast true polymorph to turn him into a turtle or just nuke him with a random ability. Make sure he has no easy escape routes. If he survives call bullshit on your GM and quit the game because it will never get better and he will be angry that you even tried to outsmart him.

On the topic of your hidden friend, have him fake his death or something so the BBEG suspects his presence even less.

>>49033422
You're thinking this is a turn based jrpg. Think about the fact that if you don't have enough consumables you just have to not take damage, easy with dodging. The wrong equipment doesn't matter if the BBEG can MacGyver for what he needs. Running out of resources would probably work, but by that point he would have been so outplanned that winning is a lost cause.

>>49028944
Someone just watched the show
Someone knows the right answer

>>49034135
If it isn't turn based what is it? This is the kind of stuff we need to know

Beat him on accident.

>>49032906
The Warrior had the same ability though, and he was beaten through a combination of overwhelming his focus and orchestrating a psychological attack to break his will.

Have ten people surprise spam cast at him with wands of "10,000 random magical effects table". It's pure chaos magic incarnate so I don't think his Golden Path ability should work.
Link: http://www.traykon.com/pdf/The_Net_Libram_of_Random_Magical_Effects.pdf

Rolled 2421, 2330, 2648, 34, 4482, 2811, 9196, 5276, 2328, 6142 = 37668 (10d10000)

>>49039110
Let's do it!

Three Ways:

>Be unbeatable via overwhelming firepower or Xanatos Gambits

>The BBEG needs to essentially ask a question for his spell.
>You need him to ask the wrong questions.

>Cause there to be contrary goals so he has to pick between them

>>49023414
is there a way to gain the spell for yourself? Im interested to see how two of these spells would interact, especially if your goal was to stop his.

>>49023414
one can make no mistakes and still loose.

>>49023414
No mistakes?
Then there's a few situations you need to engineer that can ensure you win anyways.

>The optimal success requires his life
>The optimal success cannot save him
>The optimal success does not matter

All three include the assumption that the optimal path includes his survival; in other words if every golden path he takes from now on diminishes or ends him, then you win in the end.

It's also possible that by simply encountering that person and having the right... equipment, his golden path comes to an abrupt end. He can achieve his goals for a little while longer, that can be okay; so long as every time he does so, the number of options he has to succeed the next time are diminished.

>>49023414
Your options are to straight over-power him (be so forceful and continue, accounting for possibilities such that there is not a way for him to be guaranteed save himself) or somehow make his fate not in his own hands.

If you can somehow tie his fate to an element of chance, you need only continue on until the odds play out and he meets his demise.

You may be able to work some kind of life-binding magic, as well, and have someone sui for the sake of the world.

But essentially no matter how perfectly he knows to act there are two limiting factors: 1) he must be able to act on that knowledge and 2) there must be a way to safety. Set it up so you violate one of these, and be ready to not only risk, but sacrifice your lives. Remember that if you put him into anything you can escape from, he can get out of it, too. If you nuke the room so hard you have no chance of survival, odds are he's not gonna make it, either (assuming you're equally powerful)

>>49023414
"Just" make the goal impossible to attain. Sometimes you can lose even when you make all the good decisions.

It seems like opposing him directly or indirectly isn't much of a choice, but you DO know what he plans.

What about mitigation? If he's going to reach his goal no matter what, then position yourself to soften to consequences or completely counter them. He reaches his goal but you negate the effect.

See, this is the point where you just poison or snipe him while he's out shopping and hope for the best.

>>49041981
If possible he should just steal the spell

>>49023414

>Be Paladin
>Show him his entire campaign is a mistake.

So, I'm kinda curious about the other side of this coin.

Let's say you're the GM and you want to make a bad guy like this, who sees the future and has all the information and stuff. But you're not doing this to "win" and you want the PCs to actually earn their victory and find a way past him.

How do you make this scenario beatable for the PCs?