Was it worth the wait?

>>48910684
Why is Judge Dredd a gunship?

>Anon says Deathwatch is not part of the Inquisition
>Giant Inquisition logos everywhere and on every marine

Explain this to me anon.

As far as non-forgeworld space marine flyers go, this is the least offensive

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It's not bad. It's kind of like a DA flyer that ate too much.

>>48910684
>>48910802
If these were the Storm Raven and Storm Talon, respectively, all would be right with the world.

>>48910696
The Deathwatch codex the symbol is not the symbol of the Inquisition. It's the symbol of the Deathwatch.

There is no one who has authority over the Deathwatch.

>>48910684
Scratch off the imperial bling and it can pass for an XCOM Skyranger

>>48910684
Star Craft Dropship? I thought they didn't have guns?

>>48910684
So much better than the Stormraven.

>>48911037
Now i want an xcom mini game

>>48910843
This. Fooking Storm Raven and Storm Talon is stupidly small and fat.

Also love how the suits thought the Storm Raven wasn't cheesy enough to sell the models so they added the ability to transport a dreadnaught.

They need to make that ship longer and maybe make it a hybrid thunderhawk vehicle and infantry transport by having it have an empty space to hold a Rhino/ravorback and have a special tule to mimic the movie aliens where when the storm raven lands it deploys the rhino and it can automatically go flat out.

>>48911183
Hell I want battle tech miniatures in GW quality plastic.


I see games with Imperial knights escorted by sentinels fighting ork stompers and Tau Riptides and it makes me wish there was 25mm sized Battletech game with mechs, infanty, flyers and tanks.

>>48910696
that's the death watch symbol.
inquisition one is different, larger skull and no crossbones.

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>>48911251
>They need to make that ship longer
Hello this is stormeagle.Can I help you?

>>48911420
Cease production of the curret Storm Raven and teplace it with a plastic kit of this, and I'll be happy.

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>>48911420

Excuse me?

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>>48910963
>>48911370
Deathwatch is the military arm of Ordo Xenos, which is the "fuck xenos" part of the Inquisition. Deathwatch answer directly to the inquisition, and they are more or less the Inquisition's bitch.

This is also true fro Grey Knights, but replace Ordo Xenos with Ordo Malleus.

Also
>There is no one who has authority over the Deathwatch.
Implying the Inquisition doesn't have authority over everything. Even the wolves. They just don't know it.

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>>48912126
Check the new codex. Since been retconned that they're directly under the inquisition

>>48910843
Storm Raven and Storm Talon are better when I think of them as Gunships, not full aircraft

>>48912126
Then why are the Sisters of Battle considered the military arm of the Ordo Hereticus, even though it's obviously a separate organization controlled by the Ecclesiarchy?

>>48910684
It's worth waiting for the next CSM supplement!

>>48912201
You better be shitting me.
Because now DW is running around with giant "NOT!Inquisition" signs like idiots. If this is true, all I can say is good job geedubz.

>>48912235
they're a chapter now :^)

>>48912245
Shut the fuck up you little shit, I haven't confirmed it yet.

>>48912235
Their symbol stands for the Imperium, not the Inquisition

>>48912252
It's okay. They're just a normal chapter drawn from other chapters

>>48912256
Aquila is the Imperium's symbol.

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>>48912126
>‘You are needed on this mission more than you are on Terra,’ Koorland went on. ‘And as I told you, Veritus is going too.’

>Thane let out a bark of mirthless laughter. ‘We aren’t just going where an inquisitor points us. We will be led by the Inquisitorial Representative himself. We will trust a High Lord not to take us to destruction?’

>‘No,’ said Koorland. ‘We aren’t going to trust him at all. He knows the way to where he thinks you may find the Sisters of Silence. Use his information. Listen to what he has to say. But the mission is yours. You are a Chapter Master leading Adeptus Astartes. The Deathwatch is not the Inquisition’s to command.’

>>48912286
Literally every Space Marine chapter thinks this.
But when shit hits the fan, they bend over to the Inquisition and bite the pillow.

>TL;DR Nothing new to see here.

>>48912285
You do know that the I shows up on more than just the inquisition. its part of all of the branches of the imperial government including the high lords of terra.

>>48912298
The Deathwatch is an organization independent of the Inquisition. It was founded when the marines forced the High Lords to do it. If the Inquisition steps out of line when it comes to using xenos tech, then it's the job of the Deathwatch to go after the Inquisition.

>>48912316
>The Inquisition is an organization that's independent of the Inquisition.


Well I suppose that's technically true given inquisitors fondness for working alone

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>>48912316
>The Inquisition is an organization that's independent of the Inquisition.

Well the Imperium works with a "a hand grips the other hand and both strangle the neck" mentality. Of course everyone pretends to be independent.

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>>48912201

It is a fairly old recon now. Since 6th edition SoB, grey knights and the deathwatch have been formally spereated from the inquistion. They remain best buds with the inquistion though.

>>48912286
>more radical members of their order have been known to treat with the alien or even use xenos weaponry in order to defeat a greater threat. The extreme reaction this engenders in the Deathwatch, who are by nature of a more puritan bent, has led to bloodshed on more than one occasion

tfw some muhreen stabs you with a Necron sword for being a radical because you shot an Ork with a pulse rifle

>>48912298
Clearly not.

There are PLENTY of stories of Marines giving the Big I the finger because muh honor, muh secrets.
Sometimes it ends well, like Death of Antagonis with Black Dragons, sometimes it doesn't, like Celestial Lions in Blood and Fire.

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>>48912527
Ten millenia in MS Paint

>>48912685
Good Job. Did giggle.

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>>48912285
the aquilla is one of them. But the Imperial I is in a most organisarions symbols too like the deathwatch or inquisition symbols. The Navy has a ships wheel in the I, the Echlesiarchy is an I with a skull in a sunburst and The Arbites Symbol is this.

>>48912685
>necrodermis-made

It's made from necrodermis. You don't say a normal knife is "steel made".

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>>48912527
>stabs you with a Necron sword because you shot an Ork with a pulse rifle

>>48912823
It is a tautology used as a literary device.

>>48912823
My normal knife is made of wood.

>>48910963
>There is no one who has authority over the Deathwatch.
except inquisition

>>48912823
>Autismo, activate!

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>>48912298
Or we make them disappear.

>Ordo Hereticus sends Junior Inquisitor for routine inspection.
>Invite him to dinner aboard the Tower of Angels.
>He tries to contact his ship, discovers his vox is being jammed.
>Astropaths aboard Inquisitor's ship try to send a warning signal, Librarius is jamming them too.
>Deathwing teleports onto ship, kills the crew and sends the ship on a suicide course into the nearby star.
>Blam Inquisitor the second he reaches for his gun when he sees this happen, vaporize the body with excess plasma.
>Mindwipe all serfs of the Chapter to make sure nobody remembers, mindwipe everybody outside of Deathwing, Ravenwing, and Veterans to be extra safe.

>Dear Inquisitor, we never made contact with your Junior Inquisitor and never heard of him until you contacted us about his disappearance. Perhaps his ship jumped into Ork territory and he was killed by an Ork sniper boarding party?

>>48912904
You forgot
>Mindwipe the Deathwing, Ravenwing and Veterans anyway just to be sure.

>>48910684
It's pretty OK. I wouldn't pay money for it or anything, but then I'm not the biggest spess mehreen fan.

>>48912926
Nah, they've already been through initiation into the inner circles of the Chapter and know they'll get disappeared too if they question actions.

>>48912884
And you wouldn't say it was "steel-made", would you?

QED

>>48912904
Did this ever actually happen, or is it just your uberautism?

>>48912982
It's ludicrousautism anon, get it right.

>>48912982
Inquisitors tend to disappear by ork snipers a lot when dealing with secretive chapters

>>48912990
I thought it was the other way around.

>>48912998
dependa on who's codex it is. Probably inquisitors winning more often though.
they don't have to be as sneaky aland underhanded about things as they actually have the authority to declare chapters as traitors.

>>48912904
That Inquisitor was probably a traitor, anyway. Who did he ever beat?

>>48912349
>If the Inquisition steps out of line when it comes to using xenos tech, then it's the job of the Deathwatch to go after the Inquisition.

No. That is LITERALLY the Ordo Hereticus' job.

>>48912970
No, but if I were to get one of those gay liberal steel-made knifes, I'd describe the fuck out of it's material.

>>48913027
Everybody shares. That's the Imperium way.

>>48913027
Its also ordo xenos' job.
And deathwatch.
And space marines sometimes if they think it is (and have the backing to deal with the blowout)
And admech. Although the ][ disputes this. But both sides by memory operate on the "we wont push the issue if you dont" so whoever survived would probably be declared right.
Oh and IG.
Although they get executed either way without a fucking voidtight case.

>>48912970
Well of course he wouldn't. It's wood-made, isn't it.

>>48913089
QED

>>48913038
Who does NOT watch over the watchmen?

>>48913241
The Emperor.

>>48913074

Oh AND the Sisters of Battle as xeno stuff is heretical.
AND the Arbites as it's illegal.

And all of them will fight over who gets to do it as it's the main form of dick waving they get to do.

>>48913404
And Rogue Traders who think the Inquisitor is competition for his Xenoarcheology business.

>>48913550

Usually in those cases, the Inquisitor just shrugs and becomes the Rogue Traders biggest customer, or offers a highly profitable business merger.

>>48910684
I like the design but I'm disappointed by the model. They cut a lot of corners to keep it down to two sprues and it lost a lot of modularity and potential for customization as a result.

>>48912904
They send another Inquisitor with a flotilla to escort them.

>>48910684
Shame the =][= is fixed. Would have loved to buy some as Valkyries for some Aliens themes Guardsmen.

>>48911153
Fun fact: At the start of starcraft 2's development all those years ago, they had a small defensive gun. It was phased out mostly due to balance and the dropships didn't stay behind the army.

>>48912982
That never specifically happend but is very much in line with the Unforgiven's way of handling things

Where does the eathwatch draw funds from in the newest fluff? Are they still maintained by the Inquisition?

>>48916420
>Where does the eathwatch draw funds from in the newest fluff?

The Chapters they come from. They also get support from other firms of the Imperium.

>>48912842
No it's wrong is what it is. Go tautologize someplace else.

>>48912126
>Deathwatch answer directly to the inquisition, and they are more or less the Inquisition's bitch.
No, it's a joint venture.

Also
>Implying the Adeptus Astartes doesn't have authority over everything. Even the High Lords of Terra. They just don't know it.

>>48912235
>someone didnt read the DW RPG corebook properly

>>48916420
From wherever they want to.A Watch Commander/Master can petition to both the Holy Inq as well as various chapters (or any personal contacts). A very comfortable position.

>>48916420
Chapter worlds aren't required to tithe to the Imperium, but they'll contribute to the upkeep and supply of watch fortresses in their domain because it's strategically (and politically) advantageous to have one.

>>48910684
I didn't think anyone was waiting for anything in particular.

>>48920258
I've been waiting for a Space Marine flyer that doesn't look like a coat hanger abortion, so...

>>48911275
>50 ton mech: 80 USD...

Only if you'd only need 4 mechs max plus troop and vehicle support.

>>48912349
Doesn't Deathwatch use xeno tech as well now?

>>48923081
>now
they have always been trained in the use of xenotech, and charged with the duty of capturing alien shit for study/reverse-engineering

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>>48923154
All of the Inquisition's leg breakers have been using Necron gadgets for the last thirty years.

Pic related.

>>48913635
Or the inquisitor issues him/herself a warrant of trade, orchestrates a hostile takeover and becomes the major dealer in the cold trade in-sector, pretends to be filtering out the more harmful stuff, pockets what he wants and throws missions to everyone else to stamp out any competition.
>oh rogue trader Sirrah Sillaypantaloons is undercutting me on jen-yoo-ine kroot necklaces? Time to tip off the fucking Sisters of Maximum Collateral Damage.

With Kickasstorrents down I have no source of epubs anymore. Does anyone have a link to the new Deathwatch codex in epub, mobi or pdf?

>>48910684
More GW Spam

>>48925734
>Or the inquisitor issues him/herself a warrant of trade
It doesn't work that way but okay.

>>48912286
Link to latest beast novel please, i'll be your friend.

>>48910684
>Was it worth the wait?
what the fuck am I looking at?

>>48912286
LOL
>more radical members of their order have been known to treat with the alien or even to use use xeno weaponry in order to defeat a greater threat. The extreme reaction this engenders...

fucking space marines get pissy when someone use xeno weapons, mean while said space marines have necron blade weapons.

>>48912256
The ][ with 3 bars across it is the symbol of the Inquisition, just like on Grey Knights.

>>48912285
Yes, the aquila represents the Imperium. But the ][ is a symbol used for various organizations within the Imperium. Administatum as a circle with a lower case 'a' inside it. Fleet has a halo with a wheel inside it. High Lords is an aquila with an ][ inside it and a halo and skull above it. Arbites has >>48912816. Custodes an ][ with an eagle head and thunderbolts (Emperor's old symbol). Astronomica a halo with a skull in the middle. Astra Telepathica the same except an eye instead of a skull.

In Legacy a rogue trader charter was signed by the Emperor and his signature was an ][ with an X over it. Maybe symbolizing his old thunderbolt symbol?

>>48911275
High grade BT models would be great, especially using some of the updated designs.

But fuck no to 25mm scale. The scale it's at is just fine for what the game wants to represent. GW fucked up 40k and WHFB by having them be games of huge battles at the wrong scale.

>>48912126
>Deathwatch is the military arm of Ordo Xenos, which is the "fuck xenos" part of the Inquisition. Deathwatch answer directly to the inquisition, and they are more or less the Inquisition's bitch.

They are not, though. The Deathwatch a Chapter of the Adeptus Astartes (of a unique sort) that is its own organization with its own Chapter Master and Chapter hierarchy. As such, they are TECHNICALLY bound by nobody but the God-Emperor himself and the High Lords of Terra.

HOWEVER, as the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Xenos, they have a very tight working relationship with the Ordo Xenos, and collaborate very frequently, trusting each other and sharing information in ways not normal between Space Marines and other organizations. While the Inquisitors commands are generally followed (as few Inquisitors would dare to waste the Deathwatches time for trivial matters) the Deathwatch is not "legally" required to follow their every word, and may theoretically refuse their orders (or more commonly just handle the order at their own priority). Inquisitors have "universal" power, but it also comes with the caveat of "don't piss off the people you work with," which is why most Inquisitors respect the authority of the Deathwatch and don't bother them with trivial shit that isn't worth their time.

This is same for the Grey Knights and the Sisters of Battle - the Grey Knights are a unique Chapter, and the Sisters are the armed forces of the Ecclessiarchy. Both work very tightly with their respective Ordos, but they are not the same thing and may have different goals at different times.

>>48927504
>The Deathwatch a Chapter of the Adeptus Astartes (of a unique sort) that is its own organization with its own Chapter Master and Chapter hierarchy. As such, they are TECHNICALLY bound by nobody but the God-Emperor himself and the High Lords of Terra.

Thanks, GW, for once again taking something small from the world and turning it into another full blown army to sell minis.

>>48927585
Hey, man, I don't know what planet you're from but here on Earth we like getting cool new models and bits with which to embellish existing models.

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>>48912904
You can do all of that but you still can't catch me.

>>48912264
They have a SHITLOAD of bases though, and a ton of killteams too. Their primary HQ responsible for training just three chapters has like 150 marines alone. And it has dozens of watch stations attached to it.

I actually like the idea of the Deathwatch being one good way a lot of marine chapters can put their overstrength marines in and then call them back if the home chapter takes a shitload of damage.

That way the Deathwatch gets like 10k or so marines to man all the various watch obligations and posts at any given time.

Do we know if DW has access to Angels of Death or Forgeworld units?

>>48929568
In order, no, wait for an update from FW until then no

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>>48911420
Hello, this is Big Bird, over.

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Wait a minute. The DW and GK are no longer a part of the =][=.


RED HUNTERS ARE NOW THE ONLY OFFICIAL =][= CHAPTER! WOOOOOO!

>>48929806
Shit. Gonna keep my fingers crossed for a contemptor until then. Ty, famicom.

>>48910963
What? Is it the crossbones that separate it from the symbol of the Inquisition, or what?

>>48912503
>I'm a strong independent X who don't need no Y

The more I find out about later 40k editions, the worse it gets.

>>48929996
yep.

Honestly, it doesn't look too bad. It is a bit chunky, but that's acceptable. I'm will have to work with all the DEFFWATCH iconography all over it, but it'll make for a nice dropship once it's done.

>>48910684
Why has the windshield been shuttered tight with metal plates?

>>48930867
because its armoured.
presumably they fly by sensors while in combat.

>>48910684
Anyone able to put a Valkyrie cockpit in place of the normal cockpit and lascannons? want to represent a Pegasus drop ship...

>>48930867
Thats the only thing I really dislike about the model. I really love the detailed cockpits. I made a deathwatch StormRaven for my Deathwatch that I used before this codex came out and was able to put a deathwatch pilot with pauldron and so on in the cockpit and LED it so that it had a green glow from the display. I liked that, and it gave it more character. It's something I will miss in this model, as much as I might like it.

>>48925615
What's the purpose of this huge tail? Is it her real hair?

>>48931586
I like to think its used as mass for a polymorphine transformation

>>48928097
Does the use of those models require the fluff to get changed completely from a military force assembled and deployed by the Inquisition into yet another marine chapter?

>>48932569
I think you saw "Chamber Militant" and "worked with" and assumed they were at the beck and call of the Inquisition, rather than allied agencies, just like how the Admech are an allied empire that works with the Imperium, not under it's thumb.
Stop being mad shit doesn't match your headcanon.

>>48932569
well no. but the deathwatch have been their own chapter just closesly allied with the inquistion since at least 3e and their rules from then.

this new codex hasn't changed any fluff in that regard.

>>48932853
>"Deathwatch members are primarily volunteers from Space Marine chapters that rigidly adhere to the Codex Astartes. Because teams are made up of battle brothers from several chapters, it is essential they follow a similar doctrine. On the Eastern Fringe of the Imperium, the Inquisitorial Fortress at Talasa Prime has recruited, trained and equipped Kill-teams from the Ultramarines, Scythes of the Emperor and Lamenters Chapters for service against the Tyranids."
>"As a reward for the service provided to the Deathwatch, the rare ammunition types they use are made available in limited numbers when the volunteer Space Marine is back in regular service with his chapter."
-Chapter-Approved: Deathwatch Kill-Teams

>"When a fighting force is needed, the Ordo Xenos often calls upon the Deathwatch, xenos-hunting specialists made up, as need arises, of Space Marines drawn from various Chapters."
-6e rulebook

>"Deathwatch Xenos kill-teams are drawn from many Space Marine Chapters. Those Chapters which owe service to the Ordo Xenos provide the manpower. Each is a hand picked champion of his Chapter, temporarily seconded to the Deathwatch. In this way a Deathwatch squad will be made of battle brothers from different Chapters."
>"When these squads need transport, it is provided from a Chapter's armoury"
-IA vol. 2

Sounds to me awfully lot like Deathwatch is primarily Xenos driven enterprise with little to no logistics of their own, seeing that Inquisitorial installations equip and train them and they don't even have stockpiles of their own vehicles, but have to requisite them from the chapters they draw their troops from. And their tour in the Deathwatch is not permanent.

But hey, that's just my headcanon based on everything we've been told about the Deathwatch by GW.

>>48933499
i guess i need to repeat myself: it's a joint venture of the Holy Inq and the Adeptus Astartes. it's not like the =I= just had ordered to have marines at their permanent disposal and the chapters obeyed like good lapdogs. it's a close collaboration with no clear command structure.

sounds retarded? welcome to the IoM.

>>48933587
That doesn't sound at all what >>48927504 said about them being a marine chapter with its own structure, all the privileges of a regular SM chapter, and acting entirely as its own entity that merely collaborates with Ordo Xenos when it suits them.

>>48933681
that anon depicts it a bit inaccurately though. go with what i said instead: there is no clear command structure. moreover things are subject to local politics. in some sectors/reaches the local Watch Commander may admire the =I=. in others, he might hate the =I= and will try to assert Deathwatch independence by all means necessary. usually, it's somewhere inbetween.

>>48910963
>There is no one who has authority over the Deathwatch.

then what's the fucking point of it, thematically or practically?

A force of space marines sworn to the inquisition and made up of penitents and temporary ""volunteers"" is a neat idea and makes a great deal of sense. The inquisition has use for such a force and the marines get to demonstrate loyalty to the imperium and inquisition without having to have their chaptees actually do anything.

The deathwatch just being the deathwatch and answering to no one is literally just space marine chapter #1001 with a weak ass rotating roster gimmick. Why would anyone bother to create such an organization?

Anyone got a link to the Codex?

>>48912503
3rd edition best edition.

Can we recton the later edition and start fresh from 3rd like nothing happen.

Keep the tank and psyker rules those are neat.

>>48927254
I'd actually be ok with 15mm though: something somewhat larger so that you can make out details on things like tanks and infantry, so long as the rules had better focus on combined arms. (plus, larger mech models= sex)

>>48930867
because they wanted a $65 model, not an $80 model. Same reason the I's are molded on. less customization = lower prices.

>>48933499
>that rigidly adhere to the Codex Astartes
By that logic Space Wolves and Chapter that take their own spin on the Codex shouldn't even be allowed into the Deathwatch, and yet they are.

Good things it's all old stuff.

Also there are actually Marines that are indeed permanently part of the organization. From my P.O.V. it would be also a good tactic for a Chapter to donate a lot of its own dudes and call most of them back when the Chapter suddenly gets undermanned.

>>48934065
It's pro-bowl marines, available on short notice to the =I=, with the added caveat that the Watch Commander/Master needs to assent to the inquisitorial request. If he doesn't, all kind of bad things may or may not happen.

>>48934390
LOL, no. If you mean by 'best' 'retard', you're spot-on.

>>48934770
Best explanation.

>>48934782
>are primarily volunteers from Space Marine chapters that rigidly adhere to the Codex Astartes

>>48934821
Oh poor summer child. You have no idea how glorious playing 40k was back on 3rd.

Stores full of players, always finding games during any day. People playing with painted armies! Conversions, beer and pretzel.

You know fun. When GW was run by people that care and not worried about Corporate Commander cock.

>>48929813

Looks so much better than a Thunderhawk.

>>48934848
Dude, the reason I hate 3E is because I am RT-era gamer and 3E was an obvious attempt to appeal to 12 year olds and retards with its "streamlined" (read: dumbed down) version.
>oh, wow, librarians have one psy power now
Coincidentally, it was also the time of the real first price hike.

But, hey, if you weren't 12 year old at the time, you must have belonged to the other category of gamers.

Also
>People playing with painted armies!
Yeah, enjoy your acid trip-painted minis. And now fuck off, newfag.

>>48935064

3E sure did a great job of gutting interesting stuff and opening up other cans of worms. Blood Angels Rhino rush anyone? 3.5 codex were also exemplary in their power creep as well.

The only thing making 7e rocky is the sudden mechanical design process changing mid-edition with Necrons, and with it formations becoming more absurd. Imagine if Orks, Tyranids, Grey Knights, Blood Angels, etc. were designed with the same mindset as Necrons, Space Marines, Tau, Eldar, and Deathwatch? instead of the dumbing down we saw at the beginning of 7e.

>>48934065
It's worse than that. If nobody is in charge then that means that the permanent members of Deathwatch are basically the defacto leaders of the organization. That's right, those blackshield fuckers who get booted from their chapters for whatever reason started their own secret club where they're allowed to demand loaner space marines from other chapters, use xenos tech whenever they feel like it and horde some of the space marine's most valuable artifacts, some of which rightfully belong to first founding chapters. Who let these fucking rejects that were too retarded to run with their parent chapter form such an organization?

>>48934848
Must suck to live where you live because your nostalgic callback sounds pretty much exactly like where I live. I can get games pretty much any day of the week and I've only played against a grey army once.

>>48935114

We have no indication that the Watch Captains or Watch Masters are Blackshields. If anything they are from standard chapters and left them with honors. See: Artemis.

>>48935114

>implying that chapters don't become corrupt, and that's where blackshields come from

ALT: They do something that they can never live down, and the DW offers an escape and opportunity to prove their worth.

.... Okay, it's the first.

>>48935134
But the captains that come from other chapters are only in charge while they're there. Who tells the next captain how things are supposed to be done? Who briefs them on all the Deathwatch's secret fotresses and xenos weapon caches? The blackshields are in charge by virtue of being the only permanent members. They may not command the Deathwatch directly, but they control the flow of information from one killteam to the next and in a way are responsible for the DW's traditions. They're the fucking illuminati controlling shit from behind the scenes man.

>>48935134
Actually, the guy currently the equivalent of the Chapter Master of the Deathwatch is a Blackshield.

>>48935289

The Watch Master. Don't be a dumbass, anon.

>>48935310

For all the various origins of a Blackshield its impossible to say how or why. The only consistent thread is they are loyal to the Imperium and Emperor. If you're worried about renegades, these are probably the only surviving loyalists.

Reminder that the proto-Inquisition and Grey Knights were led by a loyalist Death Guard marine.

>>48935226
In a deathwatch game I was in, my character was an apothecary and the only "survivor" of the slaughter of his company. There were the typical rumors surrounding my survival like my character hiding during the battle, potentially killing the last few marines because he did something heretical during the battle, and so on. So the Chapter Master sent me off to the Deathwatch partly for my benefit, mostly because he was tired of listening to the gossip.

>>48935064
>Yeah, enjoy your acid trip-painted minis. And now fuck off, newfag.
Who thinks people painting their miniatures a bad thing? I know most people aren't great painters but it's better than seas of grey...

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Is there a chance of us getting some blood ravens in the future? Or just a blood raven shoulder pad sprue. I would be very happy.

>>48935289
Watch Captains and Commanders/Masters generally stay on a long-term to permanent basis. Your argument is invalid.

>>48935577
Well, grey ain't cool but that saturated color-shitfest of 3E surely wasnt cool either.

>>48935785
At least people painted their armies.

People had fun, a did not wait for the next power creep.

Sure 3rd open the flood gate, but at least is not the shitfest 40k suffers now.

The fact that you have to warn people not to power creep on casual games is a problem.

Like "hey dude I'm trying a list for tournaments want to test it" is something lost, now is always how can I bring the most broken shit to the table.

>>48912887
You

see

>>48912286

They could have told the High Lord Inquisitor to fuck off if they wanted to.

>>48934782
>what is reading comprehension

"Primarily" does not mean "only". The Chapter Approved even has a caveat that while non-Codex chapers are used for recruitment as well, it's usually members who are learned in its ways. So ruleswise they're all vanilla marines.

>>48934065
>Why would anyone bother to create such an organization?

The High Lords were forced to create it during the Beast crisis by a horde of pissed off marines. Keep up, senpai.

>>48934828
>>48936100
Goddammit...me an my reading comprehension.

>>48912503
SoB never belonged in with Inquisition and was nothing more than a way to put Hereticus into the game. Grey Knights, at least, were formed by the Emperor and thus had some claims to being a fully independent organization that had close ties to the Inquisition also formed by the Emperor around the same time.

I can understand Xenos having some independence and duties at the edges of Imperial space to safeguard it from aliens, but still answering to the Inquisition.

>>48936296
RT SoB were the ones that watched the watchmen.

Unless my memory is fuzzy but, they were marine hunters. So a force to ensure no one goes full heretical and Horus like in power makes sense.

>>48936359
RT Sisters were religious commissars distributed among the Imperium to see that everyone praises the Emperor every morning, evening and 5 times during the day.

Hereticus is not a religious organization and doesn't give a fuck if you believe in the Emperor's divinity or not, they're just the internal affairs making sure everyone keeps their shit together and doesn't abuse the power they got.

Every Marines, guardsman and PDF conscript should be equally eager and capable of murdering heretics for Hereticus to employ them.

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>>48910684
Yeah it's not bad. My only real problem is that the cockpit and ramps are too squat, a marine couldn't fit through them but most vehicles in wargaming are out of scale to stop them being massive, especially aircraft.

Well done GW, you actually did good. Now don't fuck the Genestealer Cult limousines up.

>>48936460
Technically, the Ordo Hereticus was made to keep an eye on the Ecclesiarchy to make sure there was another Vandire. They aren't a religious organization in of themselves, but their origins are based around one - even if they've spread their duties to combating general heresy within the Imperium.

>>48935032
You shut up!
>I agree with you but still

>>48935032
Too bad it doesn't look like a Stormbird. They could have just renamed it something else, but then they can't ride on brand recognition.

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>>48936296

The old codex said that it was the inquisition which preserved the sisters of battle after the decree passive, they did this as they needed a chamber militant to fight heresy.

You could argue they are technically separate groups but the inquisition is clearly pulling their strings.

>>48936907
>Technically, the Ordo Hereticus was made to keep an eye on the Ecclesiarch

In the old fluff. In the new fluff they have always watched over humanity.

>>48937917
This. I want the Stormbird to look like a giant Corvus Blackstar.

>>48938182
And before that it was Thor who wanted Ecclesiarchy to have some form of military presence and Sisters were the only option that didn't break the Decree. People naturally weren't happy about it, but Thor was a hero and technically it was legal, so he got away with it.

Like I said, 3e just crammed two factions into one book because of reasons. If it had been done by Ward in 5e, people would be losing their shit over it.

Next to the Fire Raptor the best flyer to come out of GW/FW. Hellblades and the D/Eldar flyers are cool as well.

>>48938789
I'll never understand the boner people have for Fire Raptor.

>>48929853

Hue

>play Space Marine
>inquisition lands on the planet
>black templars escort the inquisitor

>>48938894
>inquisitor can't commission an escort for himself from the chapters at the scene

>>48938385
>And before that it was Thor who wanted Ecclesiarchy to have some form of military presence and Sisters were the only option that didn't break the Decree.

Which is not the same as the fluff “never" saying had a link to the inquisition.

The sisters fluff has been changed drastically pretty much every time they got a codex (only exception being the fluff in 5th and 6th edition being nearly identical).

During 2nd edition like you mentioned sisters were the only force the Ecclesiarchy could have yet now the Ecclesiarchy only follow the “spirit” of the degree passive allowing them to have all kinds of wacky fightesr like the crusaders, death cult assassins, acro-flagellants and breeding giant animal like the Hounds of Xaphan from vraks.

>>48938982
>Which is not the same as the fluff “never" saying had a link to the inquisition.

What I meant was they never should have been together in the first place.

>degree passive allowing them to have all kinds of wacky fightesr like the crusaders, death cult assassins, acro-flagellants and breeding giant animal like the Hounds of Xaphan from vraks

Denying them a standing army doesn't mean the same as denying all male members of the Ecclesiarchy the right to bear arms. Even in 2e they had Frateris Militia, which was circumvented by the fact that they're not members of the Ecclesiarchy. A priest just went and told some people "Those faggots are bad and Emperor blesses anyone who punished them. Also, totally unrelated news, there's some unguarded boxes of guns behind me."

Crusaders, even if male, are merely bodyguards. The death-cult minis are female, so maybe Ecclesiarchy recruits female members to adhere to the Decree? Do acro-flagellants and penitent engines even count? They're more servitors and actual soldiers.

>>48939220
>Crusaders, even if male, are merely bodyguards

They are honour guards of the cardinal crimson. The cardinal crimson is an order of the Ecclesiarchy not a person. Also saying they are merely bodyguards is like saying sisters are just bodyguards as they are hired to protect a cardinal and his order.

>The death-cult minis are female

Not all are female fluff wise. We have artwork of a female crusader. Yet I would not argue they are all males as there are only male miniatures.

> Do acro-flagellants and penitent engines even count?

Fluff says strictly speaking they break decree passive so yes. As I mention before the fluff says that all these units break the degree passive but only the spirit of the law is enforced.

>>48939461
>They are honour guards of the cardinal crimson. The cardinal crimson is an order of the Ecclesiarchy not a person. Also saying they are merely bodyguards is like saying sisters are just bodyguards as they are hired to protect a cardinal and his order.

Take it up with GW if you don't like it:
>"Crusaders dedicate their lives to asceticism and martial perfection, making them ideal bodyguards."

>Not all are female fluff wise.

No, but if having male combatants is a no-no for the Ecclesiarchy, hiring female ones would help to alleviate some of the hate. Inquisition, etc., are still free to have their dudes.

>Fluff says strictly speaking they break decree passive

I don't see anything like that in the current codex.

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>>48940053
>Take it up with GW if you don't like it:

No. Their fluff on their website, inquisition codex and sister’s codex says they are honour guards which are often given the duty of guarding important people due to their skills. You for some reason have taken a single line and assumed it is all their fluff for some odd reason.

>No, but if having male combatants is a no-no for the Ecclesiarchy, hiring female ones would help to alleviate some of the hate. Inquisition, etc., are still free to have their dudes.

Battle conclave fluff says their numbers are monitored by the inquisition for this very reason. You could apply the same logic to acro-flagellants and crusaders as well.

>I don't see anything like that in the current codex.

Again, battle conclave fluff says they break the degree passive and their numbers are monitored by the inquisition due to it. It says the Ecclesiarchy only follow the spirit of the decree passive not the letter.

“Known as Battle Conclaves, these groups are necessarily small in size, numbering only a few personal protectors – anything larger would breach the prohibition of ‘men under arms’ as laid down in the Decree Passive. Even so, the Inquisition covertly monitors the formation of Battle Conclaves to safeguard the spirit of the Decree Passive, if not its letter.”

>>48940424
>often given the duty of guarding important people

You mean like bodyguards? I don't care if they were the Emperor's biological children, they're still used as bodyguards in their own fluff. And as I said, it would be a pretty dick more for the Inquisition to deny high ranking Ecclesiarchy officials personal protection.

>battle conclave fluff says they break the degree passive

Have you problems reading? You posted it yourself: "anything larger would breach the prohibition of ‘men under arms’ as laid down in the Decree Passive." Battle conclaves don't break the Decree because they're not large. If they were, then they'd break the Decree, but they're not.

>>48937917
If we're talking about the Big Bird I posted earlier, that's the Sokar Pattern Stormbird?


Also it's ridiculously huge. There's a dreadnought next to it, as well as some other stuff.

>>48940581
>You mean like bodyguards?

You argued they are "merely bodyguards" which means they don't break the decree passive which is not only made up fluff but not true as they are recruited as bodyguards from an order.

>Have you problems reading?

Do you? If you kept reading you would realise that it says only the spirit of the decree passive is upheld not the letter. “No men under arms” makes no mention of size but the inquisition lets it slide.

Under the new fluff the “no men under arms” is interpreted as no large armies but small male forces are ok. Old fluff said no male forces at all. The entire point of this chat was me saying that due to the universe different interpretation of the degree passive has made it possible to have male soldiers which is technically forbidden but now allowed.

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>>48940662
>If we're talking about the Big Bird I posted earlier, that's the Sokar Pattern Stormbird?
Yes, and it doesn't look like any of the canonical descriptions of the Stormbird from any of the literature. The Stormbird is supposed to be a sleek, aggressive aircraft that shared very little, aesthetically, in common with the Thunderhawk. The Space Marines of the time regarded the Thunderhawk with contempt for being a blocky, ungainly mess of an aircraft.

Which is why it's so distressing that when the Stormbird finally, finally gets a model, it looks like a bigger Thunderhawk. In fact, the lines are literally just a scaled-up Storm Eagle - which was great for fixing everything wrong with the Storm Raven but absolute garbage for depicting what pre-Heresy flyers would look like. Sorry, that's wrong. Incorrect. They screwed it up.

>>48940767
>You argued they are "merely bodyguards"

Which the fluff supports in saying that they're used as bodyguards. How is this a problem? So what if they're from an order dedicated to perfecting their combat skills, they're only used as bodyguards. OR are you saying the dudes training to fight is breaking the Decree? You think priests and cardinals don't train? They're men and they're "under arms". The Decree was broken before it was even ratified, if we go full anal with it.

>If you kept reading you would realise that it says only the spirit of the decree passive is upheld not the letter.

And thus not broken, as said in the previous sentence.

>Old fluff said no male forces at all.

Yet it let Priests have weapons.

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>>48941148
>tfw GW makes sleeker flyers than FW
>tfw 40k has more advanced looking tech than 30k

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>>48941200
>>tfw GW makes sleeker flyers than FW
>>tfw 40k has more advanced looking tech than 30k

>>48910684
I want to remove the jolly rogers from this and use it for Sisters.

Don't ask me why my Xenos Inquisitor is leading Sisters. Maybe she's just a rogue trader in disguise.

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>>48933499

>>48912527

It's official, 40k lore really is at an all time low. Even Wardlore was better than this inconsistent drivel.

>>48941164

Crusades are used as honour guards for an order but can sometimes become bodyguards. Read the fluff. Seriously it is only a paragraph long.

>>48912126
so like the US navy and US marines

>>48927504
>They are not, though. The Deathwatch a Chapter of the Adeptus Astartes (of a unique sort) that is its own organization with its own Chapter Master and Chapter hierarchy. As such, they are TECHNICALLY bound by nobody but the God-Emperor himself and the High Lords of Terra.

What? The Deathwatch are basically a combination of the A-Team and the Dirty Dozen. A bunch of highly trained specialists who are brought together under specific situations where an Inquisitor of the Ordo Xenos thinks they might need extra muscle.

Sure, there are marines who become dedicated Deathwatch members - and it may even be the case that there is enough dedicated Deathwatchers to form a fully functioning Chapter - but they aren't a specific Chapter or organisation like SoB or Grey Knights.

>>48933499
its worth noting that a lot of the new GW TT codex flufff appears to have had a lot of crossbleed with the FFG RPG fluff.

kind of makes me hope for a second edition of the RPG.

I feel like there is enough precedence for everything to be canon at some point in time, just whatever is currently in fashion/current being most influential.

>>48947497
Honor guard in the order, bodyguards outside the order. Do guards constitute a breach of the Decree Passive?

>>48949748
Yes but who cares

>>48910684
It looks fucking awesome, but I sadly don't have the patience to paint shit like that.