Exalted General - /exg/

Hm, I'd hoped they added more errata since adding the missing charm - oh well.

So just recently picked up the PDF and there are two problems Im kind of trying to wrap my head around. For context my experince with tabletops is mostly D&D, Shadowrun, and Savage Worlds.

1st. Exactly what is supposed to amount to progression in this game? From what I gather the PC's already start out something akin to near max D&D characters and with the traits/Resources you already can start out with all the riches and other toys that would come out of that. So exactly where do you go outside of the usual "And then we conquer the world"?


2nd. Exactly to what extents are the PC's assumed to be "Good Guys" The book kind of paints the Solars as these perfect and pure beings, and how the whole affair with Sidereals way back was just the Sidereals being dicks when they should have just talked it out. But from other sources such as forums online that apparently was not always the case. Is that true? Or did the setting lore get rewritten across editions

Thanks you all in advance. So far it seems like it could be a fun system.

I wonder if they reworded Poised Lion Attitude so that it does something.

>>48850266
Most of the world thinks you're a demon possessing a body, so not really that good of a thing. Also, Creation-America-China-USSR wants to kill you. Creation-CIA too.

>>48850266
a quick addressing of these points

1) Exalted is a game about the consequences of power almost as much as the power you yourself have. Let players do insane shit with their power, then follow through on how that would actually work out.

2) Solars are not inherently "good guys", they inflect to the classical world's definition of "heroism" which is just "a person of great power/deed", divorced from ethics.

I strongly recommend hemming in character concepts to the game theme you want to run as an ST, or else you get shitty games.

>>48850306
Same wording.

>>48850350
So basically the Spiderman problem?

>>48850411
Yep, except they can spy on you from Heaven and send color-coded assassins. UNLESS the other heavenly spy organization intervenes. It gets complicated. Best to ignore it unless you want to use it for plot.

>>48850266

A person becomes a Solar by being excellent in a particular human endeavor, and winning a lottery. So, some crazy ninja who can throw ten babies into the air, take a flying leap, and disembowel all ten of them before they hit the ground, is way further ahead in line than a dude who saves one puppy from one burning building. The Flying Baby Disembowelment Typhoon is just more technically impressive, objectively speaking, and the Solar Exaltation doesn't make moral judgments. Morals are tricky, arbitrary things that change with the times, and Exaltation is an eternal thing, created by very ancient beings whose personal morals skew towards heroin addiction and railing lots of prostitutes consecutively.

That doesn't stop you, or anyone else (as in, most people playing the game), from making all of your Solars shining exemplars of social justice who swoop in to free slaves and teach people about gender pronouns, before flying into the sunset on a chariot of technicolor transgender ponies and kitten giggles.

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>>48850737
>>That doesn't stop you, or anyone else (as in, most people playing the game), from making all of your Solars shining exemplars of social justice who swoop in to free slaves and teach people about gender pronouns, before flying into the sunset on a chariot of technicolor transgender ponies and kitten giggles.

Not saying I have anything against good Solars, but thats just asking to get ejected from a game for being a huge shitter.

>>48850737
>That doesn't stop you, or anyone else (as in, most people playing the game), from making all of your Solars shining exemplars of social justice who swoop in to free slaves and teach people about gender pronouns, before flying into the sunset on a chariot of technicolor transgender ponies and kitten giggles.
Prince Diamond: "Um. Wow. Okay. This is *very* problematic."

>>48850306
What do you mean?

>>48851282
Prince Diamond is a whiny little bitch that needs to die so that Exaltation can go to someone who isn't a waste of space.

>>48851448
I am a Solar with no Charms (somehow).

A hobo with a knife jumps out at me and tries to shank me with a rusty spoon.

I spend a single action to use a Presence based Social Influence to attempt to convince him to go home and think about his life. I do not take another action. I do not flurry. I merely take a single Presence-based Social Influence action in combat.

This is completely covered by the core rules.

Guess what Poised Lion Attitude does?

>This Charm allows the Exalt to engage in Presence or Socialize based social influence on her turn during combat without the use of a flurry.

(That's the entire rules text. There is no additional context.)

OH WAIT I CAN ALREADY DO THAT. The charm does nothing as worded.

What I'm pretty sure they meant was that it lets you flurry a non-social combat action and a social combat action without taking a penalty. But that's not even remotely close to what it says.

>>48851633
>implying that anybody should be allowed to edit Morke's work for clarity
Good one.

>>48851633

Has anything else changed in the book, besides the inclusion of the missing charm? Care to post the PDF for us?

>>48850737
You sound like a bitter 2E fan. Show the page number where Exalted touched you.

>>48852185
It was page XX

>>48852185
No? 2E was garbage. 3E is somewhat less garbage, as far as RPGs go. Overall, I like it better.

You clearly have something to get off your chest. Why not share it? We're here to discuss, after all. You might find it more satisfying than trying ineffectually to insult a stranger on the internet.

>>48851633
You do realize you could be fighting this person, defending yourself, or taking any other action in the game and also get a free Social Action at them.

LESSONS CLAD IN WHITE MARBLE STYLE

Student's Sutra of alienation:

Once, there was a maiden,
Who was tasked with protection of Heaven.
Beset by enemies from eight directions, she decided to build a wall.
She built that wall even as cement destroyed her skin.
She built that wall even as bricks warped her spine.
She built that wall even as Heaven screamed in protest.
"Survive is to split off the Other", — she said.

Master's Sutra of alienation:

Why did the Maiden build the wall?

>>48853407
To keep the Mexicans out.

STAR-SHINING CHIPPED BEHEMOTH STYLE

Student's Sutra of safety:

Once, there was a maiden...
...who was terribly wronged,
And her kin were in ruins.
So she sold her house
And clad herself in finest armours,
Yet did not feel safe.
She seduced an armorsmith,
and put him to toil,
Yet did not feel safe.
She bought luck and traded freedom.
Yet did not feel safe.
"I must save myself", she said.

Master's Sutra of safety:

So she dug out a great pit, and lined the walls with her ribs.
She cured her flesh to charcoal, and fired the pit.
She boiled her blood to iron,
And struck it into a blade
with a hammer of bone.
She quenched it in her tears, and sharpened it on her spine.

As the blade entered her enemy's heart,
"I'm safe now," — it whispered.

Would a kind anon explain to me how one gets into god sanctums, what they're called (is it sanctum? its been years), and so forth in 3e? I genuinely can't figure out how an exalt, or whoever, could get into a god's sanctum other than by trickery. Any other info would help, I think its like a pocket dimension

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/exg/, I have begun to finally import A Clutch of Dragons homebrew found here into my character sheet.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/exalted/881714-a-clutch-of-dragons-hub-thread

The most important part however, before any work can begin, I need an appropriate default portrait for Dragonbloods. Pic related is what I have for Sidereals and Solars, does anyone have such a picture that would perfectly encapsulate the Dragonblooded as a whole? I was of course thinking some Sentai team but no specific picture springs to mind.

>>48853407

We build the wall to keep us free
We build the wall to keep out the enemy.

>>48853698
There's no mention of gods having sanctums in the corebook.

But, otherwise, custom Occult charms would do it.

>>48851282

God, the new signature Circle in 3E is fucking awful.

>>48850737

> That doesn't stop you, or anyone else (as in, most people playing the game), from making all of your Solars shining exemplars of social justice who swoop in to free slaves and teach people about gender pronouns, before flying into the sunset on a chariot of technicolor transgender ponies and kitten giggles.

Jesus fucking christ. Maybe Primordial rule wasn't so bad after all.

>>48854058
At least they don't have a black man.
Named Panther.
Whose goal is to free the slaves.

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>>48853746

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>>48854257

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>>48854298

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>>48854334

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>>48854418

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>>48854894

>>48854298
>>48854418
I joked about a bunch of rings like this after Avatar came out and everyone was talking about how they can use it for inspiration for Dragon-Blooded games.

>>48853968
>There's no mention of gods having sanctums in the corebook.
Jewel of the Celestial Mandarin

>>48853539
>>48853407
Keep them coming if you have more. I love the sidereal sutras.

>>48851633
Uh... You do realize that the clear intention of that Charm is to allow you to use social action AND other actions without flurrying? It could be worded better but it's not that hard to rule at your table.

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>>48854933

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>>48855711

>>48850737
Things have changed. In 2e solar exaltation was a floating ball that went around scanning for targets and then latched itself on the nearest person who met all the magic solar criteria.
Now it just means getting chosen by the unconquered sun. There may or may not be a pattern to his choosing depending on the table.

>>48855894
>Solar Exaltation usually arrives in a moment of great stress, danger, pressure, or turmoil. The Solar feels a great rush of energy suffusing her, and begins to instinctively draw on her Essence for the first time. Her Caste Mark erupts on her brow, and her anima banner quickly builds to the fullness of its radiant splendor—a state in which it will remain for several hours. Often the Solar finds herself facing a difficult or insurmountable trial of some sort, and Exaltation grants her the power necessary to survive or triumph. Solar Exaltation could bless anyone of sufficient mettle at any time and station of life—it has uplifted princes and paupers, children and great-grandfathers, savants and sell-swords, saints and assassins.

Straight from the corebook.

>>48855961
Yeah and thats different from how things worked in 2e. In 2e if there wasn't a exaltation in your area when you did your cool thing then touch shit better luck next time. Now it simply happens to who it should, when it should.

>>48856005
There's no explicit "you won the lottery" thing but I'm dubious the reader is intended to take it as Perfect Divine Intent when it's also explicit that Solars fight among themselves.

ARMS FUCKING WHEN?

>>48856178
When you write it.

Hey y'all, I've been working on an Exalted 3e Storytelling chapter. Basically information on how one can plan, run, and stat things in Exalted for the ST. For the player side, I also go into detail about custom charm Creation and some charm breakdowns for abilities.

Still somewhat WIP, but I'm mainly wondering what else I could add to chapter 2 (How to run the game) aside from what I got down here already.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sG52v0QCij7-vI0Y3Mb2s2gusu8dfkzdUOLkmMshw3Q/edit#

>>48856178
DB book is next, according to Miracles.

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>>48856210
I just want help with my N/A longfang

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>>48856178
I have all of them, right now.

So does anyone in this thread have the new backer PDF with the errata? Can you drop it in the thread if you do?

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>>48855752

>>48856402
Couldn't you just spend $4 ?

>>48856439

I'm a poorfag.

>>48856523
It's functionally the same, with a charm that works as a slightly above average Diamond Body Prana, which is incompatible with DBP. It's also got the NOT REAL Tag.

>>48856629

Still, though. I'd like to be able to read through the PDF and not recall an hour later that I'm not missing a charm. Besides, aren't we going to be making a folder with every Ex3 book, like we did with the last two editions?

>>48850266
>So exactly where do you go outside of the usual "And then we conquer the world"?

Even that is a pretty damn tall order. The world is fricken huge and you can't be everywhere, see everywhere, and punch everyone/thing at once.

You're Superman, but Exalted doesn't just ask you to punch villains and avert natural disasters, it also asks you to stop world hunger, end racism, fix the economy, solve the crime issue, end religious extremism, and other more subtle things that can't be fixed merely by punching stuff or even throwing a lot of money at it.

>>Exactly to what extents are the PC's assumed to be "Good Guys" The book kind of paints the Solars as these perfect and pure beings, and how the whole affair with Sidereals way back was just the Sidereals being dicks when they should have just talked it out. But from other sources such as forums online that apparently was not always the case. Is that true? Or did the setting lore get rewritten across editions

Exalted are god-kings. Some are nice. Some are dicks. All are capable of amazing things. Player Exalted are generally expected to be good (even if all the others were dicks) but it's kind of up to them and the storyteller to determine whether or not it was worth it. Was putting up with the bad apples some horrible god-kings worth putting up with the good ones?

>>48857597
Also, you might be Superman but other people are Superman too who might not agree with your implementation or rule even though neither of you are good/evil.

>>48856145
In Exalted, you're not supposed to take any Divine Intent as being Perfect.

>>48857909
300 Supermen running around, 400 or so Martian Manhunters, 100 Dr Stranges, and 10000 Batmans. All of them with their own view of how the world should be.

>>48856204

It's worth noting that Solars are the easiest splat to 'get'. Dragon-blooded, weirdly enough, are hard. One PC was pretty confused that his mother was apparently younger and more attractive than his actual love interest, a mortal.

(That was an absolute shitshow of a session, by the way, and the last time we played 2E.)

>>48858084

What

How does that even happen

>>48858500
DBs age way slower than mortals.

>>48858500
The mother probably(?) wasn't age wise actually younger but just appeared to be because being an Exalt is a helluva drug.

>>48858500

She had Breeding 3, and looked like a woman in her early 20s. Her unexalted son, who aged normally, looked older than her.

It just illustrates how weird things can get. Like, the PC - a prenaturally skilled swordsman - is less dangerous fully armed and armored than his mother was when she was in casual clothing. (Particularly since she practiced Air Dragon Style.)

So, a challenge for your sense of good taste and measure. Give us a good Iconic - the kind you'd be content to see in the Core. That would illustrate Exalted, Solars and their Caste well, without going for bizarre subversions or oversimplifications.

are there any statted first circle demons from adorjan?

>>48858838
Demons Descending from the Silent Wind:

1st Circle: Jacint, the Prince Upon the Tower:

->2nd Circle: Zsofika, the Kite Flute

->->->3rd Circle:
Angyalkae, the Harpists
Teodozjia, the Lions Sent into the World

->2nd Circle: Gumela, the Jeweled Auditor

->->->3rd Circle:
Amphelisiae, the Teakettle Courtiers
Demjen, the Quickeners of Ores
Marottes, the Hopping Puppeteers

All of them are statted.

>>48858947
You got your circles backwards.

>>48858947
Shit, messed up the hierarchy - Circles go the other way around.

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>>48858838
>>48858947

I'll just repost my Starter Demonologist Handbook.

Lunars need a knack to talk as an animal right?

>>48853774
It's really old but this is an A+ post

What are some good animals from the north for a full moon totem warrior? Wolf, bear, et all are a bit obvious. I want something unique,

>>48859823
Yeti or something. Turn big and hairy.

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>>48854418

>>48859371
yep

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>>48859823
A mammoth. A walrus.

>>48858084

IIRC I did say such a thing in the exalt break, so I covered my ass there.

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>>48856433
Why are all the serious candidates for the Realm throne hot redheads?

>>48861086
Pattern Spiders did it

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>>48858500
This is a 200 years old Dragon-blooded. She probably has score of wrinkled great-grand son with grey hair.

>>48861086
because they are directly related to the scarlet empress who has red hair?

>>48858084
>Dragon-blooded, weirdly enough, are hard.

Not really. They are thematically powerful - Chinese wuxia family dynasties, with lots of backstabbing and manipulation. But the strength of their thematics is enough for anyone to get them almost immediately.

When you paint the matriarch of your family in silk kimono discussing about your familial duties while strolling under the moon, people just get it. When you talk about backstabbing dynasties and the strength of the imperial chine- I mean, Realm army, people get it.

Solars can be far more difficult to get, because there thematics are more diluted. They are heroes. Good news, heroes are everywhere and can be anyone. Sure, but they are shining heroes. Well, okay, but what does that mean, explicitly? What's the tone of my characters? How should I interact with others? What's the tone of the campaign? Should I play a divine paladin? What?

Lunars are really tricky to get too when people want to play something else than a barbarian. Lunar barbarians of the wild are easy to explain and play, but what happens when you play a Lunar socialite? A Lunar crafter? A Lunar lore-master?

Abyssals and Infernals are easy. You are emo kid / vampire count and rock star from hell, respectively.

The most difficult to get is Sidereals. Try explaining that you are part jedi, part kung-fu master, part James Bond and part civil servant.

>>48861086
>>48861165

She is sometimes depicted as dark-haired as well. Hair-colour is not as important as Aspect, though. Empress and Mnemon are Earth, but Cainan and Ejava are Fire and Wood respectively - and they are also farther removed. And Roseblack may be barely related at all.
There is also Ledaal Kes, who is not a redhead, but probably not as serious a candidate as well.

>>48859823
Muskox
White tiger
Snow leopard
Yo mama (IC one)
Wendigo

Maybe find something here http://www.inuitmyths.com/

>>48855403
>Keep them coming if you have more. I love the sidereal sutras.

Effervescent Black Mantle of Regret Style:

Student's Sutra of Regret:

Once, there was a maiden...
...with a heart full of sorrow.
She took up a pen
And splashed herself on the page. It did not help.
She took up a sword
And shattered herself across the battlefield. It did not help.
She drank and drank
And wed herself to a bottle. It did not help.
She walked in aimless circles,
And tried to leave herself behind. It did not help.

Elder Sutra of Regret:

Her patience ran thin and she tore out her heart,
Leaving a nagging sore.
"You cannot escape what is not chasing you," - she said.

>>48861271
Solars do have a theme but I guess it takes a while to notice it. They are kings of the world that hates them. You have divine right to rule everything but powers that be rarely want you to actually do it. You were banished for unspeakable crimes and now you return. How will the history unfold this time?

Above is all about doing the "right" thing and being heroic so some people mistake Solars for paladins. But in Exalted being right and glorious doesn't mean you are "good".

>>48863151
Solars aren't heroic, they're the protagonists, the main characters. And like any other protagonists, they can be anti-heroes or douchebags.

Good does not mean nice, after all.

>>48861086
Why are people who aren't hot redheads allowed to hold positions of authority in the real world?

>>48863591
"Heroic" as in "mighty and driven", not necessarily good. That's what I meant.

>>48863591

They're "heroic" in the same sense that Hercules, Odysseus, Abraham, or Gilgamesh.

Did some awesome stuff, but they weren't above reproach and at times would have modern readers going "WTF?"

Because back then, a "hero" wasn't just a brave person and definitely wasn't a selfless person. A "hero" was a person who layed down the law and the smack down and shaped the world the way THEY wanted it.

>>48863871
They did great things, terrible, but great, in the words of Harry Potter.

I'm reading Empathic Aegis Discipline, and hang on a second:
>If the Solar has a Major or Defining Tie for a character who shares one of her Defining Principles, when the subject feels physical or emotional agony the Solar senses it and understands the context of their suffering.
So, if I understand correctly, to properly activate this Charm, I have to have a Major or Defining Tie to a given character, AND we have to share a Defining Principle?

In other words, if my Solar has a child, they cannot use this Charm to detect when their beloved little one is in danger, UNLESS said child (who could be an infant) also happens to agree with mommy that "Showing mercy to an enemy is a fool's errand" or "I will die to protect the ones I love"?

>>48864194
It's no big deal to make a higher repurchase to remove that part.

Never forget that custom charms are a thing for Solars.

>>48864194
>In other words, if my Solar has a child, they cannot use this Charm to detect when their beloved little one is in danger, UNLESS said child (who could be an infant) also happens to agree with mommy that "Showing mercy to an enemy is a fool's errand" or "I will die to protect the ones I love"?

Are you suggesting your Solar isn't singing lullabies to their child about the glory of slaughtering their enemies and hearing the lamentations of their women?

>>48864249
It shouldn't be a requirement to begin with. Why do I have to not only deeply care about this person, but ALSO, we have to agree on politics?

>>48864369

Because why do Solars give a flying wet fuck about people that aren't useful to their ideals? Solars are creatures of principles.

If you want to care about someone just because you wuv them and have your magic reflect that, Lunars are over.

>>48864384
>Lunars are over there.

>>48864292
You know, I always thought of Solar parents ENCOURAGING their kids teenage rebellion.

>Oh, your armed uprising against me failed and you got captured?
>Well, do better next time!
>lets kid out of prison

>>48864384
>Because why do Solars give a flying wet fuck about people that aren't useful to their ideals? Solars are creatures of principles.
Why does my Solar care about her husband or child? Probably because there's a thing on her character sheet that explicitly states she cares about her husband and child to the point that it affects her decisions made even in largely unrelated areas.

>>48864418

More clearly then: Why does your Solar MAGIC give a fuck?

Solars can love their child just because their child exists, just like Solars can be obsessed with death and skellingtons, but their magic isn't going to reflect those, because Conky is not in the habit of loving people just because they exist, just like he isn't in the habit of raising the dead.

>>48864444
You Solar magic gives a fuck about whatever you tell it to give a fuck about.

CUSTOM CHARMS bitches. They're not fucking Sidereals.

>>48864444
Caring for and protecting a person can easily also be a manifestation of one of the Solar's principles. This is true for family members in particular ("Family, Duty, Honor"), but also for people in general (e.g. a soldier when you believe no man left behind).

>>48864485
Talking about how you could write a Solar Charm to shapeshift into animals isn't really relevant when discussing the canon Charmset and why it works the way it does.

>>48864558
That's a better argument, but opens the gateway to giving Solars the omniscient "communism-dar" Zeniths had back in the link. Take the right set of Principles and a Solar could unravel a lot of mysteries in the setting just because they gave them bad dreams.

>>48864869
Or, and this is a crazy idea, you could not arbitrarily gate the "my bff is in trouble" Charms behind random Principle requirements that don't have anything to do with its effect and make some of the most thematic and natural uses of the Charm unworkable.

>>48864869
I think the easiest solution is to drop the Principle requirement, but make it so you buy it for specific character. Thus you can totally take it to be able to protect your young child who hasn't yet developed any Defining Principles, but it doesn't also tell you when that asshole dynast you really hate is having a bad day.

>>48865415
Use Sorcery.

Sorcerous workings are the essential 'I want to do this but there's not a Charm for it' mechanic.

>>48865553
I shouldn't need to use sorcery to get an effect that is obviously within Solar themes.

>>48865645
That's not within Solar themes, so quit your bitching.

You have your options listed out: Custom Charms or Sorcery.

Or would rather not have the option to step outside the designed themes at all, like many games?

>>48865791
>That's not within Solar themes, so quit your bitching.
Where does it say that it's not within Solar themes in the book? Having just ctrl+f'd every instance of the word "Principle" and checked the description of Solar themes on p. 254, let me answer my own question: nowhere.

Solars are human heroes, and the idea of an ordinary human instinctively and instantly knowing someone they deeply care for is in danger or hurt has obvious resonance with real world stories. A mother instinctively knowing her child is hurt, a twin instinctively knowing their sibling is in danger, a daughter instantly knowing her mother has begun to pass away, etc.

>>48865791
>Solars can make a meteor fall from the heavens by predicting it
>Write a description of someone that causes someone who matches that description to travel here
>Take damage for their fucking boat
>But this is too far outside of Solar Themes

Nigga what the fuck is wrong with you.

>>48866110
>>Solars can make a meteor fall from the heavens by predicting it
Guess which Charm has also been pretty controversial, largely for thematic reasons?

>>48866376
Yeah, it is pretty controversial, but the devs, in their questionable wisdom, have decided that it is a Solar charm.

And I am pretty sure this is way less out of Solar thematics then that. In fact, I'd probably put it at "Not".

>Energy Restoration Prana
>Cost: —; Mins: Integrity 5, Essence 2
>Type: Reflexive
>Keywords: Bridge
>Duration: Instant
>Prerequisite Charms: Mind-Cleansing Prana or any 3 Martial Arts Charms
>When using the prerequisite, the Exalt may channel this Charm to speed her body’s natural resting processes, allowing her to get a full night’s rest in the time it takes her to meditate, restoring one Willpower and resetting any Charms that can only be used once per day, while also restoring twenty motes of Essence. Energy Restoration Prana can only be used once per day.

...how does this Charm work if you use the "any 3 Martial Arts Charms" prerequisite?

>>48866458
It's a bridge charm. It means you can use the 3 MA charms as the prerequisite instead of the Integrity charm.

>>48866517
That ain't anon's problem. Read the first part of the charm.

>>48866552
Meditate -> get rested.

Derp. Meditation isn't an activity that requires a charm to do. Goddamn, it's like I'm surrounded by autists.

Oh, wait.

>>48866596
>when using the prerequisite
So, do you normally meditate while using MA charms?

>>48866596
I can channel the Charm when "using the prerequisite," not whenever I meditate. If it meant meditate, it should say "When meditating for at least one hour, including by using Mind-Cleansing Prana," but it doesn't say that.

My assumption would be that this is an error, but the question is if the error is "I can meditate for an hour just using some MA Charms as prereqs, getting the bonus from Energy Restoration Prana but not from Mind-Cleansing Prana, for 0m spent," OR "I cannot use Single Point Charms as prereqs, this is a mistake/holdover from previous drafts."

When will exigent book come out?

>>48866842
Never.

Rolled 1 + 2015 (1d10 + 2015)

>>48866842
Let's find out together.

>>48866651
Alas, when natural language and autism meet.

>>48866899

>Last Year

I thought time travel wasn't allowed in this game?

>>48866905
This isn't a "natural language" issue. It's just unclear Charm writing.

>>48866983
1+2015=2016 fucker.

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>>48866842

>>48866989
It's a holdover from before Integrity had all that bridge keyword fuckery. It's assumed you have MCP because this is an upgrade for that. You can buy ERP cheaper if you don't have integrity favoured but do have those 3 MA charms, but you need MCP for it to work.

>>48866842
I have no hype for the exigent book. None whatsoever. I want DB, Lunars, Infernals, hell, even new Abyssals, and I'm very hyped by the Getiminian because they look incredibly cool. But Exigents? A book about random homebrew exalts? What for?

>>48867305
So that we can get good homebrew Lunars, Infernals, and Abyssals.

>>48867336
no thanks, i'd rather just have those books.

>>48867371
Yeah but Infernals is due sometime around 2050 at the rate these devs go.

>>48867392
well then they sure as shit dont need to be dropping speed bump books till they get out things people actually want.

>>48867392
I hope they won't fuck up them too much. I want Infernals as force of nature - metal as fuck, weird, and brighting with hell's fire. I don't want transhuman Infernals with four arms and demon glands, that is boring.

Infernals were one of the most well loved Exalt splat in 2e, even though they had many issues. Changing their thematics, as opposed as changing their mechanics, should be a no-no.

I hope Holden won't be an ass this time and do something deeply stupid, but then it's Holden. Never assume he'll be competent.

Are poisons that don't inflict damage on combat scale actually better in combat than faster-acting poisons? I mean, the penalty inflicted by poison seems pretty sweet, and having it last longer seems like a good deal.

>>48867460
I hope he botches it so completely that the cancer that is the Infernal splat finally dies out completely. Same goes for the rest of the splats besides the core four.

>>48867750
I'd prefer it if you tried to figure out some way to cope with the horror of other people also getting nice things.

>>48867732

If you care primarily about the penalty, then yeah, going for a poison that lasts for a couple minutes or longer means you don't have to worry about it.

Don't underestimate the benefits of knocking a couple points of init off your opponent (or getting free damage in whenever they happen to crash), though. It's not that hard to keep poison up if your fighting style already features lots of decisives, after all.

I'm reading through the Charm list, and what is up with all the stupid shitty Charms? Threefold Magnetic Ardor, Agile Dragonfly Blade, the entirety of Steel Devil Style - aren't these people supposed to understand their own system?? These Charms are complete garbage! Literally no character should buy them!

>>48867784
Never, it's too terrible a thing to even contemplate.

>>48867791
How would you build a basic poison-centric battler

>>48867835
Such shitty bait I'm not even going to bother with finding an image for it.

>>48867858
First, get an artifact like Spring Razor that you can use to poison on hit.

Second, keep it up on your opponents.

Third, victory.

>>48867460
The theme they seem to be going for (based on comments from John/Holden in various venues) is "the absolute darkest heights of Solar excess, mirroring the worst of their atrocities of the first age (you know, all the baby eating and turning people into living plant statues and stuff?), except now they also look like that on the outside sometimes (shintai). Also, hellfire, mountains of celestial coccaine, rockstars from hell, etc. Key word is etc. On and on.

No longer will they be the Exalted of Failure, it sounds more like they are now the Exalted of Excess.

>>48867859
Dude, Threefold Magnetic Ardor costs 4m to turn a maximum of maybe six non-Charm dice (almost always less, probably more like 2-4) into as many Charm successes. It's completely worthless, it's actively worse than an Excellency. There's no reason for this Charm to be in the game. So why is it?

>>48867915
This begs a question.

Wouldn't the Solars be able to point at the Infernals and go, "See? It wasn't us, it was them!"

What's the best way to get an Alchemical into Creation? I'm thinking of having one from the Primordial War that's been in stasis in some remote corner of the world that finally woken up when the stasis mechanisms failed. I do need a way to get new Charm Modules though since I don't have the right infrastructure.

>>48867942
>non-charm dice
>actively worse than an Excellency

gently triggered

>>48867858

The key point in my mind is to have good odds of landing the poison early, so probably Thrown, Melee, or Archery roughly in that order. I would definitely also sprinkle in some Dodge, both so you can get breathing room when you need to (to re-envenom the weapon) and to profit extra off any misses their penalized attacks make (and push them that much closer to the important crash when it isn't their turn).

Once you actually do get poison in their system, it becomes easier to land each successive poisoning blow, you just need to be able to actually provide the poison; Venomous mutation (another reason to use Thrown) or an Evocation both provide plenty of poison for the span of a single fight.

I'd also keep a variety of poisons; both to be able to take advantage of multiple vectors (even better than starting off a fight with a poison? giving it to them via a meal just minutes before hand), and to stack their nastiness in a way that multiple doses of one poison doesn't do.

>>48867962
I know, it's like they're trolling or something.

>>48867952
I mean assuming you can reach into people's minds and just convince them of things, you coul- oh wait.

Sounds like a fun campaign premise: Blame the Infernals!

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>>48867915

Is there anyone else here who doesn't like the "Infernals are Solars at their worst" angle? It feels like it cheaps the former by comparing them to the latter. What happens if a contemporary Solar falls to the same levels of tyranny and hedonism? Will we be otherwise indistinguishable from an Infernal?

Interested in hearing more about Shintais, though.

>>48867962
>>48867983
Threefold Magnetic Ardor TAKES AWAY non-Charm dice and turns them into Charm successes.

>>48867961

The way I usually see it done is to have Project Razor partially succeed in some way; sends one Alchemical plus some useful widgets through, but doesn't break the Seal.

>>48867994
You got more art like this? Abyssal flavored as well hopefully?

>>48867994
Everyone? I mean, it wasn't the main thing people disliked about the Infernals preview, but it was still disliked. Also a lot of the ideas in that preview has been scrapped.

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>>48868047

Most of my art is of humans I'm afraid.

>>48868057

Didn't the devs stick out the most controversial ideas in order to test the waters?

>>48868002
So?

The purpose of that charm is exploit a large difference in Appearance. It's not useful for anyone else, and turning 1 die into 1 success is more than worth turning them into Charm successes for.

>>48868002
To make it clear:

If John has Resolve X, and Jane has Appearance Y, she normally adds (Y-X if >0) non-Charm dice to her social influence rolls against him. John might have between 1 and 6 Resolve, and Jane might have between 1 and 7 (8?) Appearance, with Charms.

Threefold Magnetic Ardor could only be possibly worth it as a slightly cheaper Excellency if Y-X > 4, but if Y-X > 4 then why the hell are you wasting four motes when you've got Appearance 6+ against a guy with total shit Resolve?? If it was like, 1m it might occasionally be worth it as a cheaper excellency but for 4m it basically never will.

How is it a troll to point out that Morke is a fucktard using evidence and reason?

>>48867994
I liked it.

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>>48868135
I've got a few but not many good ones for the more monstrous Exalted.

>>48868176
Remember the normal cost for 1 success is 2m.

4m should be worth 2 successes, right? What about matching up your App 5 vs a Resolve 2 character? 4m then becomes 3 successes with TMA.

It's a situational charm, but it's far from useless.

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>>48868220

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>>48868242

>>48868230
Added successes aren't quite the same thing as dice converted into successes, though, especially not non-Charm doce turned into successes that count as Charm dice.

>>48868266
So talk your ST into those successes remaining non-Charm.

>>48868173
The only time the bonus could possibly be more efficient than an Excellency is if it's 5+. If you have Appearance 8, that means he has Resolve 3. If you have 1/1/5 base social stats, Harmonious Presence Meditation running (you do, as it is a prerequisite), and Presence 4, you will be rolling 13 dice without spending any motes on this. 10, if for some reason you don't have HMP running. You don't need a bunch of excellencies at that point.

And that's the most insane, perfect situation possible for this Charm to be an extremely slightly more mote efficient way to spend motes. Most of the time you'll have a) more base dice than that, and b) you'll have lower Appearance than that.

>>48868230
It takes away non-Charm dice to make successes.

>Normally when a character has higher Appearance than her target’s Resolve, she enjoys a non-Charm dice bonus equal to the difference of the two values. This Charm converts the difference into automatic successes.

>>48868294
How about somebody talk Morke into understanding the most rudimentary elements of his own system.

>>48868294
That would work for me, and I am more likely to ST than play, but it doesn't change anything when discussing the Charm as written.

>>48868316
Um.

You understand that the dice given aren't autosuccesses by having a high Appearance, right? They're just dice to roll and maybe fail.

>>48868357
Yes. Each dice is worth .5 successes, on average. Meaning that turning 5 dice (2.5 successes) into five autosuccesses (5 successes), is worth 2.5 successes, or 5m as an excellency. Turning four dice (2 successes) into four autosuccesses (4 successes), is worth 2 successes, or 4m as an excellency.

>>48868395
Actually it's worse than that because you can't use double 9s or any other dice tricks on an autosuccess.

>>48867915
>No longer will they be the Exalted of Failure, it sounds more like they are now the Exalted of Excess.

From Exalt of Good Stories to Exalt of Edge.

>>48868655
>From Exalt of Good Stories to Exalt of Edge.
Gonna really miss all the intriguing, character-revealing tales of how your Infernal reacted to getting buttraped by fifty demons, huh?

>>48858771
I still don't get why they didn't bump Mirror Flag to Corebook Iconic.

>>48863151
It's not a strong enough thematic.

When I tell you a paladin, you understand what it means. When I tell you rock star from hell, rockin on your warstrider while hellfire and a thousand demons follow you, you get it. Barbarian living in the wild, tribes leader with bulging muscles, the shaman that gets moon inspired dreams? Easy. Imperial china? Easy.

But Solars? They are heroes, but so are every single other exalts. They are thematically bland, or more accurately, a blank slate.

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>>48868675
Oh, the edge. I'm sure you prefer the tale of the naked woman with legion of man-servant sex toys, don't you, son?

>>48859823
For a Full Moon? Go a Great Terror Totem then.

>>48868907
Yes, actually, the idea that one Infernal engages in debauched sexual behavior is much more palatable than the idea that every Infernal got gang-raped on induction.

>>48868993
And? Let's return to reality and the issue at hand. Going from Exalted of interesting tales of failure to Exalted of rape.

I'm sure you prefer your Exalts of rape, I'm sure you do. I'll take the tale of the man who failed to rescue his daughter from hell.

>>48869022
Infernals being the Exalts of rape is a 2eism, buddy boy.

>>48868259
That Kiyo art?

>>48868817
I'd take her or Admiral Sand over Prince Diamond any day. Also, I'd have preferred Demetheus over Generic Shonen Protagonist #1247 Wolfer.

>>48867835

>entirety of Steel Devil Style

m8

>>48868675
I think you got this backwards m8

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What is Godbound? It's a 3pp Pathfinder class that basically transforms Pathfinder into a brand new game, though still a d20 game.

In Godbound, you play a Godbound. You're a superpowered godling whom no mortal hero can stop, no matter how powerful they are. If you're a level 1 Godbound and the other guy is a level 20 mortal wizard, you'll win because your can fling your divine powers at them and they'll have no chance of resisting. Your only opposition comes from other Godbound.

What kind of Godbound can you play? Think of an Exalted type. Those are the playable Godbound, because Godbound's setting is actually just Creation from Exalted. So you can play a Solar Godbound, a Lunar Godbound, a Sidereal Godbound, an Alchemical Godbound, or whatever.

What do you do in Godbound? Take over the world, try to make the world better, or both. But don't worry, because this game doesn't have any clunky domain management rules to slow you down. You'll just have to trust in your GM to fiat how things work in downtime.

Sounds good?

>>48869506
>Sounds good?

no, not really

>>48868057
This has been talked about much more recently than the scrapped Infernals preview. The scrapped elements relate to the Reclamation and "first wave" of Infernals.

>>48868993

Actually I think the Infernal raping hazing ritual is a critically important part for any character. How they handled it themselves speaks volumes about the character themselves.

If a person wants to play an Infernal in my game, one of the questions they must answer is how they handled the rape hazing ritual.

>>48869506

This is so full of falsities and assumptions I'm not going to even bother listing out the crap in it.

Go back to your General.

>>48869506
I mean, it's a good (even great) game, but this evangelism in Exalted threads smacks of disgruntled Exalted players pushing things. It's not edition warring, but it is it's freckle-faced bucktoothed cousin.

>>48869702

It's not even edition warring. I've met one person who actually preferred 2.5e over 3e.

I don't include the people from SV with their 2.75e or whatever version.

>>48869458
It's really, really bad. My group had a character with a Steel Devil focus and he wound up rerolling because it's just... really not good. It's built around beating up people you can chump anyway.

I mean, there's a Supplemental (i.e. spend the motes before attacking) Charm that only activates if your attack successes are almost double the target's defense. When will that be useful? Against guys you could totally chump ANYWAY.

If you want a style to let you completely chump a bunch of mooks that can't adequately defend themselves, that's what Iron Whirlwind Attack is for. And it's actually useful against serious opponents, too.

>>48869506
Stop shilling.

>>48869745
I think you need to re-read my comment and the post it was commenting on.

>>48869764
>When will that be useful?

One word: Onslaught.

>>48869870
If I'm fighting somebody without an onslaught negator I can already smash their face in without going and buying a bunch of Steel Devil Charms. IWA, Single Point's form, ganking them with my gal pals, etc.

>>48869506

Jesus fuck, couldn't you even be bothered to change a word or two every time you post it?

>>48869904
I should clarify. Those things both help against chumps without a proper onslaught negator, AND ALSO do things that are useful in other situations, with people who might actually put up a fight. The same is not true of Double/Triple Attack Technique.

People without onslaught negators are screwed, DAT/TAT just makes them more screwed.

>>48869764

I will admit that Steel Devil style goes from 'eh' to "WTF" levels the instant you get access to Falling Hammer Strike as an evocation (Refluff from the Dawn Fangs of whatever). This makes it so anything with a defense penalty negator is in deep shit a few turns in (As their defense will not reset and you do white a bit of damage). Charms which make onslaught go down by 2 instead of one makes the proc chance for it extremely high.

The only major con is that total penalty negators make this flat out die, which I've only seen on Solaroids (White Reaper has Revolving Cresent, but as a non-solaroid its expensive as hell).

Okay so most of the ability spreads make sense, but why do eclipses have larceny? Im not sure i see the connection between traveling businessman/politician and stealing stuff well

>>48870724
Larceny is a social skill, it governs "I was never here" and "you remember this differently"

>>48870724
Larceny is also used for disguise (and Flawlessly Impenetrable Disguise/Perfect Mirror are great Eclipse Charms), concealing evidence, and some of its Charms are quite nice for an Eclipse type. Yeah pickpocketing isn't super in theme, but instantly falling in with underworld people and pretending to be a dynast are.

>>48868907
>Oh, the edge. I'm sure you prefer the tale of the naked woman with legion of man-servant sex toys, don't you, son?

Actually yes. She went from being other peoples servant to her own master doing whatever the fuck she wants.

>>48870149
Well, yeah, there's a reason you're not allowed to combo MA with core Solar Charms and that's it. Single Point would also go completely bugfuck insane if you could use IWA as an Evocation on your reaper daiklave, Melee if you could combo it with Single Point form on your grand daiklave, etc.

>>48871140

That's why I said rip off the Dawn Fang and refluff them into short swords, as it gives Falling Hammer Strike.

Entry level charm, but I'd be hard pressed to allow later charms into evocation trees.

>>48870724
Eclipses are adventurers first and foremost, the bureaucracy is there to support being a travelling merchant. I think of people like Joseph Joestar in Part 3 or the Man With No Name when I set out to make an eclipse more than a fat capitalist who snaps his suspenders and breaks strikes, and I don't think Larceny would be inappropriate for either of them.

>>48868877
Its easy to forget that they're Sun-heroes. Excellence as reflected by the strongest god, the god of the Sun - not simply human excellence. They're Solars, not Exalts of mortality.

Its why I rarely buy into other people's arguments that a given charm is outside of Solar thematics - Blazing Solar Bolt is an iconic charm that no one argues is outside of Solar thematics, despite it having nothing to do with human excellence.

So someone in the Jumpchain thread brought up the fact that we really don't have any art of Dragonbloods with Aspect Markings.

I'd actually forgot they existed. Let's hope that the art in the new book will showcase them when it comes out next century.

>>48871423
Sure, you can steal really powerful charms from Solar Brawl to make an MA OP. But you're not really talking about the MA in question anymore.

I would -never- give a Melee evocation the core charm from Brawl. Otherwise you're gonna get a Melee dude who is everything brawl is and more.

>>48872041

Again it really depends on what charms.

I think its fine with the Dawn Fangs as they do steal one charm yes, but then they play with the ideas in the evocation tree to such an extent that it becomes a cool style in of itself.

What you avoid is taking powerful charms as a grab bag list. I'm more interested how you can develop the theme in an evocation tree.

>>48871423
Dawn Fang is a) gone, b) not made to combo with Steel Devil in the first place.

>>48872124
If you take a really important core brawl charm like Falling Hammer Strike, then make it the focus of an evocation tree, you're just going to create a new branch of Solar Brawl, except available to Melee users and Steel Devil guys.

>>48872503

It was made to combo with Tiger Style, which also brutalizes the crap out of people if you gain threshold successes. Akin to Melee without needing to crash your opponent.

Also with Ebon Shadow, but goes much better with Tiger.

As for gone, I'm expecting it to come back in arms. Evocation samples were cut for a lot of space.

>>48872514

I disagree. Its all in the presentation and themes you wish to introduce. Dawn Fang's feel quite a bit different than normal brawl when in use.

>>48872656
>As for gone, I'm expecting it to come back in arms. Evocation samples were cut for a lot of space.
A number of Charms were cut for a complete redesign which emphasized artifacts that offered key thematic elements and unique playstyles rather than extremely overbroad and mechanistic effects.

>>48872701

A lot of the overboard artifacts include things like Volcano Cutter. Which while had some neat charms cut I believe was for the better as some were just plain stupid (Dragon's Tongue).

Still I see mechanistic effects still be rampant in other artifacts. Adorei is nearly all of them, Moonlit Huntress (Terribly disappointing, should at least have one more charm), and Dauntless.

Then again I do like the mechanistic effects of the old evocations, in that you could make an entire style or invest the beginning few to get some potent charms. For me most artifacts are a "Write what you feel is enough to represent the artifact", not a "write until you feel it is broken enough in a clever way to piss off the GM."

>>48867915
I always did think that was amusing.

The Immaculate Order teaches that the Anathema served the Yozi, stole the power of the Unconquered Sun and then twisted it to to become horrific monsters.

That's pretty much exactly what the Infernals are followers of the Yozi using the stolen and reshaped power of the Unconquered Sun - they are the very Anathema that the Immaculate Order has accused the Solars of always being.

I'm glad that irony is getting played up in 3rd edition.

Can someone post the abyssal preview, or better just add it to the drive?

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>>48874639
Here

>>48874639
Huh. I thought they were on the drive how about that.
Who's in charge of that anyways?

>>48869832
That is bait that's been seen frequently lately, not shilling.

miracles pdf?

>Threefold Magnetic Ardor

yes, it does convert non-charm dice into charm successes. I think the point is that you don't use it to steamroll someone with high resolve, you use it to effortlessly command those of average to middling resolve.

Also any faggot using it is going to have Appearance 7, and if you forget

>Awakened Carnal Demiurge
>In addition, any seduction attempt she makes treats her target as if he had one less Resolve, both lowering his resistance and increasing the effectiveness of her Appearance rating.

If it's not clear and you're using this to fuck somebody, than an Appearance of 7 means that most people will be between Resolve 1-3 against your seduction attempt. If it's 3, that means you're getting 4 auto, so a Resolve 4 person will do what you want. A Resolve 5 person will need you to actually try a tiny bit, so Spend a Willpower and you'll have 4 successes against their effective 4 Resolve.

So Appearance 7 + Threefold Magnetic Ardor means you can seduce basically anything absent an Exalt, and if you're scoring that many successes automatically, barring a fluke your dicepool is probably gonna push you over the edge for them.

>>48872701
>A number of Charms were cut for a complete redesign which emphasized artifacts that offered key thematic elements and unique playstyles rather than extremely overbroad and mechanistic effects.

Haha.

Hahaha.

Please stop trying to justify the cut of evocations. You're only making it worse.

Look at pre-evocation genocide Shining Ice Mirror. Key strong thematic elements (mirror powers through ice), and a very unique playstyle that had my each of my players wanting one for them. They absolutely adored Shining Ice Mirror pre-holocaust. They had a very long discussion about it and how it was well designed and plain old cool.

Look at Shining Ice Mirror now. A narrow, mechanistic effect, some blasts of ice... and that's all.

Same thing with Spring Razor, Black Wind, Hunting Hawk... Even the worst designed artifact of all, Volcano Cutter, managed to get some hype back then.

Now my players just don't care about evocations anymore. To the point they're mostly getting non-evocation artifacts, because they can't be bothered to get one with evocations.

New style evocations? Extremely boring, empty of any values, mechanically meh, and absolute trash. One of my player's words, even though I agree with them.

>>48876412
It's $5

>>48877413
im trying to decide if I want it in dead tree

>>48849191

Interestin question: What happens if the best outcome comes to pass?

By that I mean the events in RotSE. The Ebon Dragon breaks free, the Army of Light gathers to face him - Guided by a new Unconquered Sun - and the Yozi gets shivv'd to death by Solar heroes. Somehow, the Scarlet Empress survives all this.

Now what? Do you get the First Age all over again? (Assuming the victorious Solars don't wipe out the Dragon-blooded.) Because it seems that the only form of rule that works is rule by Solar, but you still have the Great Curse that will inevitably drive them batshit.

>>48877662
Only way to save Creation is to Monstrance all the Solars and then turn the resulting abyssals back. Free of the great Curse, the 5th or 6th Age would be the utopia everyone always wanted.

But with no Lytek in 3e there's no ral way for anyone to come up with this plan.

>>48877662
>>48877696
No.

>>48877744
>i don't like thing
>stop talking about thing IMMEDIATELY

>>48877662
Why does Scarlet have to survive. Her Deathlord is GOAT

>>48877768

I assume she's not an Akuma.

But frankly, even if she was completely innocent, I would kill her. Leave no loose ends.

>>48877194

Not him, but I actually like the new Volcano Cutter more, at least as a skeleton.

Being able to charge up potent ranged attacks and then throw an opponent onto an eruption point is mad painful. It works infinitely better as a skeleton than Old Volcano Cutter. Hell if given a choice between old and new VC, I'd pick the new even if it meant less charms.

But that doesn't excuse the cutting of other more solid artifacts as you pointed out. We know the reason is twofold. (1) Cut space [Even though some of the solar charms could've been cut to save space but I digress]) and (2) Trying to make even Artifact 3 weapons have 8-12 evocations is seriously taxing. Which is why I advocate that the artifacts not have a pre set amount but just as many or as few as needed with a hard upper cap on their amount based on on artifact level. Seriously 12 evocation charms alone should be enough.

>>48877194
>Look at pre-evocation genocide Shining Ice Mirror. Key strong thematic elements (mirror powers through ice), and a very unique playstyle that had my each of my players wanting one for them. They absolutely adored Shining Ice Mirror pre-holocaust. They had a very long discussion about it and how it was well designed and plain old cool.
I took one look at pre-cut Shining Ice Mirror and thought "this is a bloated Charm tree full of trash". The fact that it looked nice and your players wanted it doesn't mean anything, lots of garbage Charms look nice, then you realize they're garbage (e.g. Steel Devil). Especially when you consider that Shining Ice Mirror is a Reaper Daiklave and therefore ought to be made with Single Point in mind.

The primary issue with it is that it's full of overly situational Charms that will be useful only rarely but look powerful when they do proc. Flame-Drinking Stance (fire enemies), Frost-Reaping Attitude (being in melee with one guy but wanting to be in melee with another guy), Frozen Flame Evasion (fire enemies have already tried to hit you)

There's also the straight up ignoring of the strengths and weaknesses of Single Point. Frost Phantom Strike and Shining Ice Guardian Technique are both stupid, because Single Point users are going to be relying on something other than Parry (because their Parry is just an excellency, basically; GLC is useless for a Solar), and because Single Point is not very good at clashes, especially withering clashes, which don't even benefit from their reflexive clash Charm. Killing Mirror Stroke is dumb by extension of Frost Phantom Strike.

Killing Moon Rebuke is both problems, combined: overly situational (being hit with an energy bolt), AND Parry-based.

Heart-Freezing Crescent is pretty good though.

>>48877914
I do think cutting down on the number of Evocations was a good thing. A friend and I have spent a shit ton of time homebrewing an Artifact for him and it just has 6 Evocations and we've gone through hell trying to make it thematically cohesive and yet actually useful.

With the crazy amount of Evocations from before you get a bunch of small mechanical whatsits which are individually not that powerful but still cost that hardearned 10xp. It'd take 15 sessions to unlock all 6 Evocations if you're just using Solar Experience, and that's if you get the full 4 every session. How many did the old trees have? Shining Ice Mirror had 9 and Volcano Cutter, the big example of an Artifact 5 had 20? Holy shit man, you'd have to play near a full year every week to unlock all of those.

Now, the Evocations in the book may not have been executed well, but the design philosophy of having small trees with the power concentrated instead of spread all over the place is a good one in my opinion.

>>48878022

> Especially when you consider that Shining Ice Mirror is a Reaper Daiklave and therefore ought to be made with Single Point in mind.

This I find bullshit. Just because a weapon is a specific type doesn't mean it needs to work in tandem with an MA. It'll work just as fine as in Solar Melee. Not every weapon made has to fit to a specific MA style. Hell when the DB book hits I bet the evocations seen in there will likely be tailored to fit Dragonblooded (Or have the same Mastery/Terrestial split in MA)

>>48878066

The amount of evocations hardly phases me. If you're sinking 20 charms into swording evocations, than they're going to be extremely fucking potent. However just like all other charm logic, a lot of really good shit is early on and you don't need to grab literally all of it. For example, Heartflame has Burning Sky Corona, an utterly amazing charm which is a scenelong withering booster, also Wild Spirit Reflection allows you to build your anima up more quickly. I will admit some charms need reworking (Infinite Sun Flame Slash should drop the GSS prereq and let you have fun with your laser swording) and some make no sense (Inner Divinity Blaze is of questionable power when even Blood Apes have such large mote pools that them worrying about running out is moot, I'd do something like rolling the motes lost as a penalty or damage or something).

I like my characters to have tactics and options. I liked the wide approach to evocations which allowed my character to have all sorts of options and thematic ideas related to their weapon and soul being one. I don't like endless evocation lists nor do I like the lists being so short that its thematically bankrupt and that point you have the weapon for the attunement bonus alone (Hello Moonlit Huntress). What I like are things like Dawn Fangs and Spring Razor, which may not be the flashiest but definitely encourage to fight in a seriously different way.

>>48878274

(cont)

Which is why I maintain that you shouldn't be forced to make artifact evocations up to limit and forcing them. Forcing them will it make it seem like a chore and playing a game shouldn't be anything like that. Rather evocations should have as many evocations as they should have in order to properly fit their theme in a sufficient way. If you can do this with less instead of more? Great. If however you somehow manage to make very cool mechanistic way of fighting that happens to involve 10 charms? Go for it.

The most evocations I've ever put on an artifact is 26, and that was to basically test myself and make it so my tribute was basically fulfilled in nearly every way possible. Since then the most I've made is about 12 and the least four.

Learning to make the sufficient amount of charms to make it mechanically sound AND fully expressing the theme of the artifact? That shit is a lot harder than it sounds.

>>48878274
>This I find bullshit. Just because a weapon is a specific type doesn't mean it needs to work in tandem with an MA. It'll work just as fine as in Solar Melee. Not every weapon made has to fit to a specific MA style. Hell when the DB book hits I bet the evocations seen in there will likely be tailored to fit Dragonblooded (Or have the same Mastery/Terrestial split in MA)
Well that's fucking retarded because literally every other weapon in the game can be used for Melee but exactly one can be used for Single Point, so when you make a reaper daiklave it's implicitly for Single Point users.

But even if we accept this stupid idea, there's still a ton of garbage in there. All the overly situational shit still applies.

>>48878338
I'd really love to see your 26 Evocation Artifact because I think we just have different desires out of the Evocation system and an Evocation tree you made would serve to explain your preferences far better than text.

>>48878341

>But even if we accept this stupid idea, there's still a ton of garbage in there. All the overly situational shit still applies.

Tangent. Whenever its Shining Ice Mirror or the Sword of Hisou its irrelevant, they don't need to be forced into being compatible with Single Point, as some people may just want a katana and not care about martial arts in the slightest.

If you wanted to say something like "Reaper Daiklaves should often have evocations that encourage finesse or alpha strike kills" then hell I'll respect that line even if I disagree with it. But saying "All Reaper Daiklaves should fit Single point" is just plain stupid. It's like saying all Flamepieces should have evocations that line up with Righteous Devil, even though just as many people will want to skip MA and just archery instead.

>>48878417
I think it was more as the sample Reaper Daiklave given in the core book it should have Evocations for Single Point, not that every reaper daiklave should have Evocations for Single Point.

>>48878417
>Tangent. Whenever its Shining Ice Mirror or the Sword of Hisou its irrelevant, they don't need to be forced into being compatible with Single Point, as some people may just want a katana and not care about martial arts in the slightest.
What? It's not a tangent. The original topic of discussion was the idea that old Shining Ice Mirror was good, when it wasn't, it was bloated and full of stupid shit not worth taking.

>It's like saying all Flamepieces should have evocations that line up with Righteous Devil, even though just as many people will want to skip MA and just archery instead.
Every player who has Righteous Devil will start looking for an artifact flamepiece and an artifact flamepiece that doesn't work with it is a trap for them. Same with Single Point/reaper daiklaves, etc.

>>48861271
Solar are easy.
They are cape-heroes.
Comic book super heroes with absurd power and equally crippling vices. They are supposed to be Justice League but they always end up being the jerks from Injustice.
As the emphatic protagonists of the game, they are every mover and shaker who matters. But the setting is so power saturated that to matter, they all need to be Superman.

Lunars, in 3e at least, are only barbarians. Lunar socialites are fur wearing savages who threaten, fuck, and receive their way into power. They are predators. Lunar crafters aren't, Lunars make nothing worth noting and are get little use from artifacts anyway. Lunar lore masters get knowledge from dubious rituals and reading the entrails of sacrificed children.
3e Lunars are only barbarians, case closed.

>>48878446
Like if you want a cool katana artifact for your Melee character in your game and don't make it combo with Single Point that's cool, but the one in the book shouldn't do that because it's a massive newbie trap.

>>48866376
>Controversial
I think the word you are looking for is canonical.
As in, a published charm that is core to the game and thus endorsed by those who define what the game is.
So your "not within Solar theme" is wishful, vapid, thinking on your part.

>>48878412

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ebhTm5yzTWyjzrinZykqkWzzlf0WK8ZNtBp87M_xhcU/edit#heading=h.yrjbmkqic8ob

Aside from the three charms based on Virgil and the capstone Nirvana, all of the charms are based off the spell cards of Youmu Konpaku from Touhou. This was one of my first artifact evocation trees so it is a little scatterbrained, but when I was finished I was "Fuck it, I'm done." My other artifacts haven't been near this amount.

>>48878341

I'm not going to deny there was some insanely situational stuff in there that basically made the sword seem to hard counter the South (lol firewands). I believe it was due for some heavy editing certainly, but I would've tried to do it a different way at least.

>>48878446

A tangent in the degree Reaper Katana's must fit Shining Point. I honestly give zero shits what you think of Shining Ice Mirror for you or the other guy. If it works for you in whatever fashion, perfect. I'm just saying artifacts shouldn't have One True Paths. Areas they slide into yes, but not one true paths.

Basically what >>48878509 said, and doubly so for the weapon actually being worthwhile to use in the first place.

>>48878489
Right.

>>48878542
The final Shining Ice Mirror works fine for Meleeists, it just doesn't have a bunch of worthless or negative-value Evocations for Single Point stylists.

>>48878489
I like the book's explanation of Solars more:

Forged from the power of the greatest of gods, the Solar Exalted are the spiritual mimesis of the sun and all it represents: glory, magnanimity, power, relentlessness, inspiration, creativity and ascension. As the sun dominates heaven, so too do the Solars shine brighter than their peers.

They are natural-born leaders, scholars, warriors, and builders, brought forth from the greatest heroes of mankind and set on high as the Unconquered Sun’s own champions. The Solar Exalted are the greatest of all the Chosen. Be they benevolent or tyrannical in their courses, the Solars’ natural mastery of the world and their ability to uphold the loftiest principles has earned them the sobriquet of the Lawgivers.

They're the Heroes of the Sun in a world where the Sun is all about glory, magnanimity, power, relentlessness, inspiration, creativity and ascension

>>48878489
That I can get behind. Cape heroes, easy explanation.

>>48878699
>Forged from the power of the greatest of gods, the Solar Exalted are the spiritual mimesis of the sun and all it represents: glory, magnanimity, power, relentlessness, inspiration, creativity and ascension.

So what? Paladins? Anti-paladins? Normal people but glowing brightly?

The thematic of "being better" is not a powerful one. It can certainly work, but by experience first time players have difficulties grasping around that idea.

Lunars are barbarian. Solars are... better? What is the outfit of someone who is "better"? What are the thoughts of someone who is "better"? What is the default reaction of a "better" person to a slave?

This isn't a bad thing, per se. Solars have explicitly self-made morals, which means they can be anyone and do anything. But first time players want some guide to properly roleplay their characters, and Solars provide them with absolutely none.

>>48879789
>They're the Heroes of the Sun in a world where the Sun is all about glory, magnanimity, power, relentlessness, inspiration, creativity and ascension

Can't it be that their theme is extremes along with domination that falls under those sections ?

What kinds of sorcerous workings would a Solaroid with Celestial Sorcery have put up to prevent Sidereal infiltrations or Fate manipulations from fucking with his plans?

People whinig about the Evocations should remember that there is no hard cap on how much Evos you can get from one Artifact. Devs just decides that instead of bloated trees they want them to be more concise and thematic. So instead of VC being "every flame sword ever and then making volcanoes" it is just volcanoes. Also, Evos shouldn't be equal investition to your native Charms. They are additions and enablers changing how you fight, not entire self-contained styles in themselves.

>>48879789
>So what? Paladins? Anti-paladins?
What's the deal with paladins? They are holy knights and Solars can be much more than that. Scholars, builders, vigilanties, tyrants etc. Just because they are chosen by god and shiny doesn't mean they are paladins.

>>48882560
>What's the deal with paladins? They are holy knights and Solars can be much more than that. Scholars, builders, vigilanties, tyrants etc. Just because they are chosen by god and shiny doesn't mean they are paladins.

You didn't understand the point of the discussion. You'd need to be seriously retarded to not understand the point of... wait.

>People whinig about the Evocations should remember that there is no hard cap on how much Evos you can get from one Artifact.

Definitely retarded. I'm not surprised that people failing at basic reading comprehension are the only one to defend the new Evocation.

>>48882799
Listen, it's just strange for me that someone fixates on the whole "paladins" thing when it's not even what the books says. Solars do have a theme but it's not as clearly cut as others because they are the default splat.

>>48882971
They're paladins of the god of their own self-righteous opinions. They kick ass and glow in the name of their almighty self. And the sun god chose this power for them because they're so skilled at something. So they must be correct.

>>48883162
All Exalted are paladins under that definition. They all kick ass for the(ir) Lord.

>>48883278
Not really, my point wasn't that they're paladins of conky, but they're devoted to their own values, they decide what's good or evil, they purge the heretics on their shit list. And they go big doing it. The divine right to rule is fundamental to their lore, and the way they rule as benevolent or malevolent dictators shows they're not lawful good.

Lunars aren't paladins of luna, they're survivors first and foremost. They're barbarian insurgents forming tribes and militias to wage guerilla warfare from the outskirts, or undercover infiltrators using form and guile to tear authority down from the inside.

Dragonblooded aren't paladins of the elements, dragons or Gaia. They're generals and soldiers strongly tied to their lineage and the expectations of their family, house, and culture. They have the support structure and camaraderie so they aren't alone, but the burden of honour and tradition to make proud.

Sidereals aren't paladins of fate or the incarnae. They're bureaucratic agents trying to keep existence together through espionage within a corrupt celestial system. They have to be ninjas to clean up the world's messes without fucking too much with fate or pissing off the wrong gods.

Sure the other exalted have more vivid thematics, but you can't just apply "Paladin of Themself" to non-solars.

>>48878022
>I took one look at pre-cut Shining Ice Mirror and thought "this is a bloated Charm tree full of trash".
>stop liking what i dont like
Your opinions arent fact dude

>>48884073
They are. You can think Threefold Magnetic Ardor and Flame-Drinking Stance are great Charm, but I live over in the real world where they're incredibly bad and stupid.

>>48884092
>They are.
Fuck almost had me. You need to get a bit more subtle with your bait my man

>>48884166
Hell, what's even wrong with the 2e Sidereal Charmset? I mean, you can't say that any Charm is good or bad, objectively, it's all opinion. I'm going to port the 1e Sidereal Charms to 3e straight with absolutely zero modifications, and it's just your opinion if you think I'm wrong.

Reminder that the hide post function exists for a readon. Stop shitting up the thread

>>48884191
Yup thats actually exactlly how that works. There are people who like 2e charms and use them.

>>48884348
You might as well say there are people who like not wearing seatbelts and then pretend like that's exactly as valid as wearing a seatbelt.

>>48884397
Nope. There you go again trying to compare opinions to facts. Really need to get better at that

>>48884480
You're a fucking moron whose entire premise is an active assault on any attempt at analysis or thought. "Everything is just opinion, nothing is better than anything else," fuck off retard. You add nothing but an unearned sense of smugness born out of the idiotic, fallacious concept that all opinions are valid.

Does anyone here have the liminal preview lying around they want to share? I'm trying to build one for a campaign and I want to know more about them than what's in the core.

File: Liminals preview.pdf (1B, 486x500px)

1B, 486x500px

>>48885795

>>48885873
Thank you, friend.

Any one play a game of Qwixalted before? It seems pretty fun and is most definitely a lot lighter than regular Exalted. Link for those interested: http://aakin.net/wiki/doku.php?id=qwixalted

>>48883715
Solars are also the return of magic to the world. They're the legendary heroes who defeated the enemies of the gods and raised raised the First age. Only to return after they were sealed beyond death for millennia to a broken world that has lost the magic and artifice of the lost age of man.

They're Luke Skywalker bringing back the Jedi, Daenerys with the reborn dragons, they're the ones come to doom the world or save it.

Solars have strong themes.

>>48885913
Wouldn't be exg without the periodic godbound/ruleslite/2e/other game shills

File: josh-corpuz-gunner.jpg (228KB, 1251x1920px) Image search: [Google]

228KB, 1251x1920px

So, the advantage of flame weapons is that you get effectively Strength 4 for free, but you need to do all your fighting at short range (+1 accuracy at close is unacceptable, beyond that you're capped unless you're a Righteous Devil stylist, and then you're still MOSTLY capped). Also Increasing Strength Exercise doesn't help you, but that Charm probably shouldn't exist anyway. Also also, and really importantly, you have to reload with actual actions.

As has been discussed previously, this isn't really a good bargain unless for some reason you want to go moderately deep into Archery so you can reflex-shot people, but the Archery reflex shots are pretty contingent on an archer's playstyle, so as a "dip" it's kinda weird unless maybe you're Thrown and you just can't get enough fucking reflexive attacks.

TL;DR flamepieces are not great.

In the interest of fixing Exalted's iconic retarded singleshot flamethrowers for the intrepid gunslinger who is not also a Righteous Devil (because weapons really should not be locked to particular MA), which if either is reasonable as an attunement bonus:

Does some cute thing, and also...
...doesn't have the Slow tag. It just shoots.
...doesn't take a penalty when flurrying reloads. Basically the above, but one shot per round, and you can't flurry something else.

>>48886155
Yeah, cause mechanically Exalted sucks donkey balls.

>>48886129
Except that the other Exalted are also the heroes who defeated the enemies of gods, and except for the fact that the Creation has had pleny of strange, powerful and wondrous people while the Solars were gone. Solars have string themes, sure, but a lot of those themes are also shared by the other Exalted. This is fine. To be honest, being the guys who are suddenly supernaturally good at shit and don't reall fit into the current status quo is enough to make Solars interesting to me. Other Exalted can do that, but not as easily and not to the same extent as Solars. That being the Solar thing is fine.

>>48886246
No you

>>48886175
neither. fire weapons are extremely strong and were designed that way by holden/morke to serve a purpose. you might as well give reaper daiklaves +12 damage as an attunement bonus, if it's outside the scope of the design it will probably break something, or in this case everything.

you should be using archery with bows in any case.

>>48886328
Such eloquence! Such verbal mastery! Who would ever have thought it'd have come from a nameless Anon? Simply amazing. /s

what the fuck is a realm magistrate my dudes

>>48887411
A Dragon-Blooded appointed to that position by the Empress herself, given the mission of working to the benefit of the Realm, with very wide freedom and authority to pursue that mission. Kind of like a less extreme version of Warhammer 40K Inquisitors, if you're familiar with those.

>>48887411
Wandering Dragonblood sworn to effective poverty except for artifacts used to mete out justice in the name of the Empress.

They Sworn directly to Scarlet herself and are sent to walk an area of the Blessed Isle, enforcing the laws and administering oaths. They sometimes have a scribe to issue their decrees and an Archon or two who are basically unexalted squires, but otherwise they're iterant judges, juries and executioners.

>>48887453
>>48887454
thank you my top lads

>>48861271
>The most difficult to get is Sidereals
Sidereals could not be easier to get. You're the heavenly MIB, the IT department for the world itself.

>>48884519
Thanks for the new copy pasta

>>48887679
>MIB
*Cheka.

>>48887411
>>48887453
>>48887454
they're basically Warhammer Witch Hunters/Inquisitors

>>48856629
Did they fix that shit about who's gonna declare Charms first when two opponents' time to declare comes?

Because that's a pretty enormous gaping asshole in the rules if you ask me

>>48883715
What the fuck is a "paladin of themselves"?
Solars are larger than life heroes of raw power and skill, does it need to be more complicated than that?
>>48883162
>They're paladins of the god of their own self-righteous opinions. They kick ass and glow in the name of their almighty self.

Are you EarthScorpion?

>>48879789
>Solars are... better? What is the outfit of someone who is "better"? What are the thoughts of someone who is "better"? What is the default reaction of a "better" person to a slave?

That, um
Those questions are kinda the whole point of playing Solar Exalted.

>>48889486
All Charms are declared up front. Attacker declares, then defender declares, and that's it.

>>48889616
Sensible, but from what I rmeember this part
>Attacker declares, then defender declares
ia never explicitly stated in the rulebook

Also there are situations when there isn't an attacker-defender dynamic, such as contested rolls

>>48889591
Some dumb shit was bringing up solars being paladins, so I showed a version where that's true, that they have the thematics and image of an arrogant paladin smiting the unrighteous and telling people what's wrong and right, but instead of being beholden to a god, they enforce their own moral code.
I totally agree with the larger than life heroes of raw skill power and skill thing though.

UNUSUAL COMBAT STYLES

If you cross Tiger Style and Silver-Voiced Nightingale (use the SVN form) you have a light artifact thrown weapon that benefits from Strength and has +Performance damage that you can use to smash someone while popping Terrifying Battle Shriek, a unique Charm that forces enemies to move away from you. If you are a Dawn, this works on everything. If they resist, you gain three Initiative.

If they don't resist, they've just disengaged from a Tiger Stylist. GG

If you're a Melee practitioner, you can learn Flamepiece Style up to the form (4 charms) to get off an AOE intimidate - if you are a Dawn, this works on everything - and reflexively aim every round. This aim doesn't specify what you aim with. If you're wielding Shining Ice Mirror, you also get a free reflexive full defense for an effective permanent +2 Defense.

Any others?

>>48890364
The advantage of the first, in case it's not obvious, is that there aren't a lot of ways (other than being scary) that you can FORCE someone to waste their action trying to GTFO, which is a win condition for Tiger. Fluff it as a dramatic roar!

The advantage of the second is that it's fucking stupid, strap your Flamepiece Style flamepiece to the side of Mirror and call it a gunblade while you proceed to re-introduce the joys of DV cap-breaking back into Exalted like the soulless faggot you are

>>48889654
please respond

Are there any links to dragonblooded books? Or fluff and lore?

>>48889654
Yes it is, please read better.

>Players (including the Storyteller) must openly declare which Charms their characters are using, and all Charms (unless their text indicates otherwise) must be declared, and their costs spent, before any dice are rolled. Attackers declare their Charms before defenders.

Page 251 of the Core book, paragraph 2 under Using Charms and Charm Limitations.

It's even in the logical place it would be, so you can't even claim the excuse that the poison rules were hidden in the stealth rules or something, you just didn't even try.

>>48889654
>contested rolls

It's like a clash. First party declares offense, second party declares defense, second party declares offense, first party declares defense.

>>48889654
>contested rolls
There has never been declaration order rules for contested rolls.

>>48881483

First would be a working to make it outside of fate pretty much immediately.

After that? Pure gravy really. Sidereals are effectively blind to things outside of Fate.

>>48894729
That first working itself would probably draw Sidereal attention, though.

Can someone explain to me how to use the social influence system to make a stranger who has no tie to me before develop a Defining tie toward my character? I can't quite grasp the mechanics.

>>48896558

So let's say you're meeting a total stranger.

Being a smart person, you chat him up a bit, so you can do a read intentions to learn what Intimacies he wears on his sleeve. After some discussion, he talks about his family (a Major Tie of love to his wife and kids), his faith (a Minor Principle of the Immaculate Faith) and his grievances (a Minor Tie of annoyance at the village blacksmith for being a total dick).

You talk about how cool you are, regaling him with some tales of your past deeds and buying him lunch to show what a cool dude you are. This is an instill action that creates a Minor Tie of "pretty cool dude" towards you.

Then, you come back later and want to strengthen the tie, but to strengthen a Minor to a Major, you need to 1) leverage a pre-existing Minor-or-better Intimacy and 2) have even stronger evidence than what your last instill was based on (your stories and buying him lunch). So you talk about how much you hate the local blacksmith too, and play a really funny prank on the blacksmith, and then roll another instill action to strengthen the Minor tie towards you to Major.

Repeat, using a Major-or-better and even stronger evidence (such as doing something REALLY great for his family, like getting them all a nicer house and a stronger mule to work the fields with), to nudge it up to Defining.

>>48896654
Do I actually have to play pranks on the blacksmith or give the family stuff, or can I just talk my way into being their favorite person ever?

>>48896696

You CAN lie about it or just tell stories, but that makes the Intimacy very shaky, since the only evidence you have on your side is "he said stuff."

If he uncovers the truth or someone else comes along with more convincing evidence (basically anything concrete would do, if all of your Intimacies are predicated solely on stories), then your Intimacy's gonna start degrading if not drop off completely.

>>48896696
You're trying to make some stranger adjust their view of the world so that your character is someone they would literally die for.

Picture some stranger trying to make you feel that way about them IRL, what would it take to make you feel that way?

>>48896720
This is just the part I can't find in the rules, even if logic says so.

>>48896734
>Picture some stranger trying to make you feel that way about them IRL, what would it take to make you feel that way?
I mean, well, cults? Jesus?

>>48896788
>I mean, well, cults? Jesus?

So what is your character saying, with nothing to back it up, that is making this NPC decide he's worth dying for if necessary

>>48896788
>This is just the part I can't find in the rules, even if logic says so.

The rules just say you need evidence, brah, it doesn't say anything about it being physical evidence.

>>48896788
Cults offer vulnerable people something they yearn for. The feeling of purpose and belonging is the 'evidence' in this case. As for Jesus, most the time people who believe in him have been raised to believe in him from early childhood. Something like that isn't really represented in the rules, and doesn't have to be.

>>48896788
>I mean, well, cults? Jesus?
Can anyone in the history of Earth reliably convert people to Christianity or their particular cult, without offering any evidence or good reason? No? Then why do you expect there to be a game mechanic for doing it which you can manage as long as you beat some arbitrary difficulty?

A person suddenly gaining a Defining Intimacy towards Jesus is going to be, like, an alcoholic who sees a Gideons' Bible in his hotel room after his wife kicks him out for coming home drunk at 3AM for the hundredth time and has a come to Jesus moment. That would be modeled by the player voluntarily deciding to add a Defining Intimacy.

Otherwise, a person gaining a Defining Intimacy towards Jesus or Scientology or whatever is going to do it over a significant course of time, constantly being offered reasons (positive or negative - the priest is a great person they look up to, their wife really wants them to do it, they're in a torture isolation chamber and they'll only be let out when they accept the truth, etc) to accept and believe in the religion and build their life around it.

>>48849191

Here's a question: What do you even do in Dreams of the First Age?

I've never seen a setting that is so detailed and yet so thoroughly unplayable at the first time. Like, the world has 299 other heroes making sure things go well. What does a new Circle possibly do?

>>48899468
DotFA is really meant for political games, because you have 299 other Solar opponents.

>>48867961
I've seen a group do it as "an entire assembly of Alchemicals was sent through as a scouting party during the First Age, then got shut down/put to sleep until current era". Another option would just be "weird magical stuff happened and they're here now", maybe even a plot point that revolves around how they got into Creation.