/cofd/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

>>48631866
>What is the biggest improvement Promethean 2e has over its predecessor?

They made a conscious choice to reach out to their unspoken majority of fans who are oppressed by the rpg market in general

>>48631899
How so?

>>48631866
It's much more inclusive.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/jwiihm

Promethean 2e pdf

Try to put this in the header next time

>>48631866
>What is the biggest improvement Promethean 2e has over its predecessor?
Pilgrimage is clearer/easier.

>>48631969
I don't see it as an improvement. Pilgrimage is supposed to be difficult, nearly impossible. Not a series of steps.

>>48631866
>What is the biggest improvement Promethean 2e has over its predecessor?

>and minor qashmallim cloaked in human shape have quietly started continent-consuming wars.

That a qashmal caused WW 1 and/or 2

>>48631866

Giving the Pilgrimage a mechanical skeleton you build together as part of character creation.

>>48632056
Yeah but you don't know what you're talking about.

>>48632077
Atamajakki, can you answer my question about size limitations on Uncreated from the last thread?

Is there anything stopping an inch-tall Warhammer 40k figurine come to life from running around burning vampires to death with Vulcanus and Luciferus while they flail around trying and failing to hit a teeny-tiny enemy, or from someone bringing the Statue of Liberty to life so that she can go and stomp their enemies to death?

>>48632132
no u

>>48632163
how the fuck would atamajakki know?

>>48632202
atamajakki is life, atamajakki is love, atamajakki is our all-knowing benevolent god

>>48632202
He's a dev, isn't he?

>>48632163

All I can tell you is that I wouldn't allow it at my table, anon.

It's important to note that I A) don't know shit and B) don't work for OPP.

>>48632231
no, he's just another tranny like aspel,except he doesn't post as much

>>48631905
He's saying they used non-standard pronouns. He's mostly being a shit.

>>48632056
Except that it's literally always been a series of steps that was intended to be possible to complete. Milestones have always been a thing, and Promethean has always been the most focused game. They're just making it a lot more defined.

>>48632163
>>48632231
Unfleshed. And he's not a developer or anything, he just played a Playtest. He knows just as much as you do.

>>48632236
I'd maybe allow a mini Promethean under the same logic as Grandfather Crow, but I wouldn't allow a giant statue Promethean.

>>48632243
>>48632236
Oh, derp. My bad, man.

>>48632243
What is it with OP/WW and trannies

>>48632294

I'd be more amenable to the concept if it wasn't being pitched as "how hilarious would it be to have a tiny commissar yelling about heresy" and was instead anything resembling a functional character.

>>48632321
They made a deliberate choice to only employ freaks as writers and devs. So you get a game for trannies and other such nonsense, because that's who it's written, edited and released by

>>48632321
idunno, what is it with /tg/ and trannies? we've had at least 3 in wod generals

maybe it's that they're people like everyone else and have hobbies like everyone else

that the same things that drive people into hobbies of escapism and fantasy happen to trannies because they're people too

>>48632338

I know this is bait but you realize nearly all of the major developers are are cis white men, right? Hunter 2e wouldn't be pushing for more diverse freelancers if they already had a ton of options available to them.

>>48632294
Please go away, Rory.

>>48631866
Disquiet is divided into 2 phases.

steps 1 and 2 which happen all the damn time.
>-2 penalty on social interactions.

steps 3 and 4 which can only happen in wastelands.
>Everyone comes to kill you.

More structured and still strong. Is nice.

>>48632338
>They made a deliberate choice to only employ freaks as writers and devs.
only one co-developer is a transanything
every other developer is a straight white male
except hunter, which has a straight white female

>>48632370
>nearly all of the major developers are are cis white men

I like how you just assume you can speak for them on their gender and ethnic identities. You bigoted piece of shit.

>>48632383

Don't forget that Disquiet should be based on your Lineage; a Galateid is going to have obsessed stalkers compared to a Frankenstein's amgry mob.

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>>48632356
Well isn't that selfish, shouldn't they be doing tranny things like prostitution and aids infected cum swapping parties? Why do they have to invade my hobbies? You don't see me in those parties.

>>48632396

Why do people always try this post? It's never as clever, funny, or eye-opening as they think it is. It's like when people post "like Tumblr" ironically, because it's not like posting things ironically has ever backfired on an image board before.

>>48632488
>You don't see me in those parties.
well we don't see your face at least

>>48632488

Can we please just skip to the part of the culture war where we start killing each other so all this bullshit saber rattling can be over with already?

>>48632528
A very cis male attitude

>>48632538
Are you implying only males can want to kill each other?

That's sexist, you hack.

>>48632567
Women create life in their very bodies, hey are peaceful by their nature. Men stab women (and other men) with their cocks on a daily basis, their biology is violence.

The pronouns are awful in this book...could barely get through the phosphorus refinement. I liked the idea of the refinement in general but funk that was an annoying read.

>>48632591
But Trannies have cocks too, that makes them just as sexually violent too.

>>48632626
>assuming you can speak for trans people without knowing them

bigot

>>48632488
They're our hobbies. Playing pretend is inherently queer. You're gay, you just don't know it yet.

>>48632377
Please stop being a weird stalker.

>>48632336
I mean, I'd reject that character, probably, and that kind of personality probably wouldn't fit with Unfleshed. But I wouldn't be against the idea in general.

DaveB confirmed that Deviant's subtitle is indeed in the brochure.

>>48632389
>except hunter, which has a straight white female
She wrote an ERP book for Vampire. She's probably a bit bi.

>>48632672
Well what IS it?

>>48632706

Deviant: the Frutang

>>48632753
Don't toy with me like this

>>48632679

I'm pretty sure Fillamena Young devved for Strange, Dead Love, not MonicaV.

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>>48632847
She wrote for it.

>>48632667
If you know what 4chan is, have navigated to /tg/, and are posting or even just reading the fucking Chronicles of Darkness general you 100% jack off to trap porn and have been voting far-left liberal since it became the only option that even flirted with the concept of value twenty fucking years ago. There are two actual retards and neither of them have ever left /a/, everyone else is just pretending to be retarded.

Also the trans developer is the best developer, whose line is the only one that consistently accomplishes its themes, runs smooth, and doesn't degenerate into thousand-page slugfests over whether Time is INHERENTLY unplayable or could be salvaged by some anon's illegible homebrew if only anyone gave a shit. Vampire is the game with the most attention from the audience, pretty much the flagship of Chronicles as a whole, and also the one with the least negative shit to say about it. Literally the worst criticism I've even heard is that the Strix are unnecessary because the game functions perfectly well without referencing them.

It's almost like this pronoun shit is just unrelated, irrelevant flickers in the books of people who are only pretending to give a shit, just like you, dear reader.

>>486328477
i forgot this was real. did anyone read it? what was in it?

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So did the Shan'iatu replace/become the Judges with their great sacrifice? The Judges created them but Book of the Deceived implies they existed without the Judges then used Ammut/Dark Mother juju to become their own god-fathers, while Dreams of Avarice has them stealing into Duat like thieves in the night and having empty barren manors in the City of Black Spines, where the Arisen's collection of relics and the sekhem therein makes their existences tolerable. But then why do the Judges punish Arisen for going off mission re: relics? And why does badmouthing Irem score a sekhem hit if the Judges seem like the sort to not care...unless they are all secretly the founders.

Or was that 'pass a scepter from the left hand to the right' line meant to imply that since the temakh who became the Shan'iatu were made from the Judges, as the Shan'iatu changed and became proud and corrupt so did the Judges?

>>48633605
>Vampire is the game with the most attention from the audience, pretty much the flagship of Chronicles as a whole, and also the one with the least negative shit to say about it.

And still we await the fucking Covenants book. It has been plural years coming. I want V20 to slow its fucking roll and let VtR get some new shit sometime too

>>48633605
You know, I want to argue with that, but Vampire probably IS the most cohesive...

I mean if I'm going to argue I could point out that no one can vote far-left even though it's the only option that even flirts the concept of value; I mean, election system is fucked and two party ruins everything.

Hey guys Im new to WoD and while I own a few 1e nWoD books like Vampire and Mage Ive actually been considering switching to oWoD just to see how different they are. Im kind of OCD about completeness though and was wanting to invest in the Vampire the Masquerade 20th Anni edition. Ive read the PDF and its really great. Was curious if the Vampire the Dark Ages 20th Anni edition holds up alongside it cause I wanna see what its like to play Vampre in an older setting. Is it worth it to get it or can I just get the 1e of The Dark Ages?

>>48633655
Holy shit, yes. Satanic Lancea Sanctum heresies and an actual system for Ordo Dracul toys (that are finally yours now instead of that bullshit "you can't keep a Wyrm's Nest lol" clause from 1e) please.

I want Paradox to get cracking on a new edition so Onyx Path can properly refocus, but I know the terrible truth is they won't refocus onto Chronicles anyway, it'll be Scion and Aeon and Cavaliers of Mars that get the love.

>>48633697
>Ive actually been considering switching to oWoD just to see how different they are
Don't do it, it's a trap.

>>48633720
I am real excited for Scion 2e so I'm okay with that but really want the CofD books which have only their one 2e core book to start getting their second round of material. I feel like the 20th anniversary shit is drowning everything out. Dark Ages was cool though

>>48633697
> Ive actually been considering switching to oWoD just to see how different they are.
>Im kind of OCD about completeness though and was wanting to invest in the Vampire the Masquerade 20th Anni edition.

Don't do it anon, your wallet and enjoyment of games will thank us.

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>>48632667
I'm not, I'm just friends with someone who knew your name. But regardless, the fact that I'm always able to pinpoint you in a thread should come as no surprise considering you insert yourself into nearly every conversation you can in each post. The lust for (You)'s is unreal.

>>48633727
Do explain

Its not that 2e Vampire Requiem is bad its just I prefer having all those clans from Bloodlines Im familiar with and all those nice juicy level 9 disciplines.

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>>48633697
It's amazing

>>48633638

i'll get this in the morning

>>48633754
The level 9 Devotions are dumb. And, really, you'd be better off making the Clans from Bloodlines *as* Bloodlines in Requiem. Hell, I should get back to remaking Tzimisce, but while I like my Viccissitude, I can't think of a way to make them less Double Ventrue.

>>48633764
How did that happen. Is that an art installation?

>>48633857
If it isn't there was an implausible series of unrelated accidents there.

>>48631866
>What is the biggest improvement Promethean 2e has over its predecessor?
Since they weren't quite mechanically useless ENOUGH, it was decided to ensure that they are now without a doubt the weakest, least playable, most ridiculous of all creatures in the world of darkness.

>>48634140
They want to be human. Making them good would just be mean

>>48634140
Why are you an idiot?

>>48633774
>reseru reporting in

>>48634140
They have some powers for Demons to take, at least...

>>48634333
>Satchel
>Smartest one on on the OPP forums
I'm pretty sure he's legitimately got some autism spectrum thing going on with the way that he's obsessed with replying in the same way each time. He reminds me of Touhou now that I think about it. He's also often wrong about themes and can't handle contradictions.

>Ivan fears no man or beast of the Chronicles of Darkness
Someone got careless with find+replace, I see

So they removed the Golem as a core lineage because the Golem was never a dead body, but made from clay... but they did leave Galatea, who was made from marble.

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>>48634579
Antisemitism, obviously.

>>48634579
>>48634675
The Tammuz have always been based on Tammuz, the Golem was just one example.
The Galatea lineage write up states that Galatea was likely a corpse in reality, possibly made of multiple dead beauties. It was the same way in 1e.

I guess they got rid of the notion of Constructs--Prometheans who were made out of natural materials that have an affinity with the Lineage. This probably comes as a result of the Unfleshed now needing to be humanoid but not necessarily mechanical. In 1e I think you could have a toaster or military drone become a human Unfleshed.

What's weird is that the write up for the Tammuz and their whole Language thing still seems based more heavily on the Golem than their namesake. They still have the whole Word of Power thing, too.

>>48634506
I've gotten into an argument with him before that we took over to PM, but he is very knowledgeable about the games and I can appreciate his snark that admittedly is borderline asshat

C-can I make a Phosphorum who isn't a genderqueer, or do I have to refer to xpleer as a xplee?

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>>48634579
You fucking think?

>>48635036
I've seen him completely miss the point of an argument and keep going on about this or that with only tangential relevance. He also likes the 1e Krewe system, so he's obviously incompetent.

>>48635053
No. Suck it up.

Hurt Locker when?

>>48634787
Constructs have a sidebar devoted to them. It basically says they're not Unfleshed and you can use them if you do the work.

>>48634140
You can sorta use Corporeum to become John Wick! You'd still suck compared to any other template, but you'd totally be above the average human, most of the time!

Still no news from Gencon or brochure?

>>48635343
Most of it's already been posted on their blog, I think, in bits and pieces.

>>48635642
Seriously? The open development stuff was most of the thing? That's a pretty small thing than...

Is it just me, or is an organization of transhumanist Alchemists, Demiurges, and Unfleshed Prometheans working together seem fairly plausible? They just need the Prometheans they create to get stuck in a rut after they complete their Role's milestone so that they stop producing Disquiet while still producing a steady stream of Vitriol from their Roles, that they can then extract and use to enhance their transhuman cyborg agents with.

Maybe call them Iteration X or something...

>>48632679
Bisexuals are either homosexuals who are afraid of societal judgement, or straight people who want to seem cool.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A BISEXUAL.

>>48633857
>Hell, I should get back to remaking Tzimisce, but while I like my Viccissitude, I can't think of a way to make them less Double Ventrue.

I have a semi-writ down idea for my Tzimisce.
Originally, it was one bloodline, Ventrue with Auspex. They have powers over blood bonds, and stuff like that. Their Bloodline Gifts allow them to activate Disciplines on anyone they have a Blood Bond with.

A group of young Tzimisce didn't like this idea, and called up a demon to help them escape it. The demon explained that the only way to get away from this control was to re-make them. Thus the New Clan equivalent were made. They have Protean as additional Discipline.
Their gifts start at bone craft and flesh craft, and have some additional bonuses like the Zulu form, for personal combat. (Add 1/1 armor, 6 physical attribute dots, spread however, max 3 in one, activates all Protean Aspects). The coccoon, which makes them resistant to fire and sunlight, and allows them to "operate" on whoever is in it with no problems for lack of tools.
The Crafts allow them to shift physical attribute dots around, and temporarily gain merits. Vampires take Bashing/Lethal from Flesh/Bonecraft, Humans take Lethal/Aggravated.


Oh, and I had these to be the source of the Moroi, whom they created to defend themselves against their old masters. Basically, a Tzimisce mirror of the Tremere Gargoyles of oWoD. Moroi get the Zulu form, and a bunch of merits to mutate it further.

>>48635965
No such thing as a male homosexual. Women's sexualities are a lot more fluid than men's are. That's why you get sluts in bars making out with each other on top of tables to attract men.

>>48633605
But anon...i'm voting Trump.

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>>48631866
Assuming I have no WoD material right now, should I get the Vampre humble bundle?

I am incapable of making my own descisions. Thanks.

>>48636661
Only if you're intending to play Vampire in the near or distant future, and aren't happy being a morally bankrupt pirate.

>>48636661
Eh. Dunno. It's pretty old stuff.

Do you want semi-outdated Masquerade stuff?

>>48636683
>>48636718
Strange that they'd sell an outdated version of that's true.

How much of the material has been updated at this point? Are they going to do it all?

>>48635965
I've seen this posted unironically and I genuinely don't get it.

>>48632753
Too obvious, it's sure the subtitle won't start with neither F nor D, because it would get confused with DtF or DtD respectively.

Btw. in last thread there was some discussion about pronouns. I started reading the advanced copy of Promethean and got pissed immediately. I don't care which pronoun they use, but do they have to change pronoun mid paragraph when writing about same person, ffs? Seriously, I know that some people claim to be gender fluid, but this much?
And whole Phosphorum section with zir pronoun? They change he and she every paragraph in the rest of the book(at least as far as I have read it) and then in the whole section just zir, consistency be damned.
Sorry that's just my OCD sense tingling...

I hope they announce V25 at the WoD panel today.

Is it just me or are like half of Promethean powers "+3 dice to X roll"? That's not a very inspiring arsenal here.

>>48636921
And then, snuck in at the end, +Azoth to Strength and Stamina.

>>48632706
Renegades

>>48637094
Neat.

>>48637094
WOO! An answer!

They didn't announce anything for 2017, right? Deviant was 'supposed' to be the 2016 game and first drafts haven't even been started

Are Pandorans no longer divided by their specific Mockery?

The Scholar has an old power (Perfected Bezoar) which doesn't appear in the book. Leftover from the previous edition, or editing error?

p. 259:

>One of the most famous alchemical miracles is the transformation of gold into lead.

Chronicles of Darkness takes place in the bizarro universe so far as alchemy is concerned

>>48637094
Is there anything stopping someone from creating an inch-tall Unfleshed out of a wargame miniature, or from turning the Statue of Liberty into a giant Unfleshed to stomp their enemies to death with? The book says that they have to have a humanoid body plan, but there's no mention of any size limitations.

>>48637094
Was hoping for Revengance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-b-7tP7IW5Q

Would creating art be considered Craft of Expression?

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So I'm working on making a hunter in the Long Night who's "day job" is being a televangelist, which justifies his resources score. Has anyone ever played a similar character? Any special precautions when creating a second identity as a hunter when your face is plastered all over TV all day?

>>48633638

The 42 Judges (the ones that you choose from at character creation related to your Decree) should still be the same terrifying eldritch gods that Irem knew and feared; I don't think the Shan'iatu usurped them, because the Judges number 42 and only 35 Shan'iatu descended after the Rite, as the 7 Shan'iatu of the Deceived were sundered and turned into the temakh. Whether or not the Sekhem-hungry horrors seen in Dreams of Avarice are the original Judges or the descended Shan'iatu is beyond me, however.

>>48634404

Hello, my other half!

>>48637687

Expression.

>>48637733
>Any special precautions when creating a second identity as a hunter when your face is plastered all over TV all day?
Just one.

Make sure they're dead.

I'm currently playing a true faith-based, very moral character who's currently sitting at a morality of 9.

I'm considering bumping him up to 10 morality but I have no idea how a character with 10 morality would act, so I'm not sure if I want to go through with it.

Would anybody be able to give me some indication of how a person with 10 morality might act?

>>48638242

Well, if you already think you know how a Morality 9 character would act, just imagine someone even more morally-perfect than them.

And if you don't think you know how a Morality 9 character would act, then what's the difference?

>>48638263
The problem with that is that the only way I can imagine a morality 10 character is a character who is absolutely fanatical to the point of perhaps becoming immoral.
I'm already playing as morally as I can conceive, so it's possible I've been playing a morality 10 character all along and just haven't spent the xp yet.

If I asked everybody else how I could play more morally they'd probably just laugh.

>>48638242
Jesus.

>>48638242
>>48638302
Or Buddha, if that's what you're into.

But basically act like you're either Jesus or the Buddha.

So how about that Geist 2e reveal?

>>48637094

Finally, CofD gets a Mass Effect game!

PAMPHLET WHEN?

>>48637457
Dude DaveB is not the deve for Promethean.

Also what's stopping those from being made is the Principle. After all it is what gifts the divine fire.

>>48638383
I-Is it true?

>>48638242
>>48638294
Think about it this way:
You risk detachment for even having selfish thoughts.
If you ever even *think* of doing something for yourself, you're risking Detachment.

>>48635053

Sure you can! Several of the sample characters identify as he or she, right?

>>48638713
>identify as
When will this meme die?

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>>48637759
Temakh is what the Shan'iatu are. Shan'iatu was their title, and Dreams of Avarice doesn't make it clear if there were 42 of them or more made in multiples of 42 because of the Judges.

Shit's vague and confusing and I just want to know how deeply rused mummies are. One interpretation is bad. The other one is so bad I can see the guilds taking over the fucking world to build a duat gate to launch nukes into the underworld, all for revenge.

>>48638622
From what someone's posted, it sounds like it.

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Does anyone know what happened at the CWoD panel today?

Why'd they make the decision to start including the baseline rules in the core books now instead of referencing people to the blue book like they used to?

>>48639064
No idea. They thought they had too much space, I think.

>>48639064
>>48639076

Because "you have to buy two books to play this game" is a hard sell for most anyone who isn't D&D. There's a reason the vast majority of RPGs can be run out of just their core books.

>>48638741
>When will this meme die?

Eh. What?

>>48639105
Not that poster, but identity politics are a bad joke.

When's Mage physical copy?

>>48638622
Couple of reports from GenCon saying that Geist 2e is confirmed

>>48639386
Links? Did they confirm any other announcements? Anything VtM related? I ask because I know OP will never update this shit on their site in a timely manner.

>>48639037

They announced the revival of the Kindred of the East line.

>>48639691
massive keks if true

>>48637094
Sweet. Any more info on it releasable?

>>48639635
Why would you want to know anything VtM?

Unless you want to know if they canceled it, which they should.

Finding enough people with similar interests in playing Promethean is insane, the group I had scheduled for this weekend fell through

Demon the Descent isn't in the pastebin. Is there a dl for it besides legal and with money? Because I just want to read it when bored at work rather than play

>>48637183

There was supposed to be a big announcement at the Dark Eras panel, but I think that was going to be the Dark Eras anthology.

>>48637183
I don't even know what Deviant is supposed to be about. Is it going to be one of the closer to mortal splats or is it going to be something way the fuck out there like Prometheans?

>>48640182
Its going to be about kamen riders, megacorp experimental augmented transhumans, cyborgs and other "superheroes".

You know, shit you could do anyway with different splats.

Its going to be another redundant splat like Beast, calling it now.

>>48640182
Stupid shit.

>>48640254

The body horror angle will at least differentiate it from other games by aesthetic alone. Other games dance around it, but few games end up going full Body Melt or The Thing.

>>48639635
On the Onyxpath forums, Stew also said he wouldn't get paid for the drafts he wrote up for it if it was lie.

>>48639789
I'm as much a hater of the oWoD as anyone, but cut this shit out.

>>48640254
That's a pretty difficult thing to do in just about any other splat...

>>48638383
>>48638622
>>48639386
>>48640752
TELL ME MORE

>>48640182
You've been changed somehow from base human. Generally mad science, but can even be occult dealings. There's an organization out to get you, this'll likely be the primary antagonist. Most commonly it's the organization that made you, but if you've Jekyll'd yourself, then it's someone out to get you for research type experiments. It's been said it'll be one of the lowest powered full splats, but has some kind of Burnout mode to go all Tetsuo. Can be anything from Sarah Manning to Buffy Summers.

>>48640254
For all the weird Matrix and cyborg aesthetics, Demon isn't very Science in and of itself. Deviant has at least that sticking itself apart from other gamelines.

>>48640780
Literally all I know so far, but here's the link for proof
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/geist-the-sin-eaters/399463-will-geist-get-the-2e-treatment?p=944454#post944454

So, so far from Gencon we have the name announcement for Deviant: The Renegades and Geist: The Sineaters 2e, allegedly there's more stuff that was revealed but hasn't been posted up.

Any Hunter related news from the con?

>>48640312
Between Hosts, Claimed, Pandorans and Centimani, there's plenty of body horror in the CofD already.

Oh hey, I can say that Geist 2e is a thing now. Neat.

>>48640917

There's plenty of it but no actual game line has really claimed it as its main focus of horror. None of those are really playable.

>>48640917
Yeah, but not as a cohesive character type. No game for letting you play Akira or Dark Angel or Kyle XY or whatever.

It's also allegedly going to be a low power splat, but I have my doubts.

Well, at least it can't be worse than Beast, can it?

Now I've challenged Matt

>>48640971
What about Cheiron agents?

>>48641013

No, but the Alchemists are painted as completely utterly villainous as Heroes. Apparently CofD shouldn't have relate-able, understandable villains.

>>48636972
That sounds impressive when you think about having Azoth 8 or 10, but by then, other supernaturals with an equivalent power level are living gods for whom +8 to strength is a joke.

>>48640991

In theory, this is the niche that Tier 3 Hunter should fill, but doesn't in practice. It certainly won't now that Deviant picks up the slack.

>>48641048
I didn't get that impression to be honest. They can have mutually beneficial relationships with Prometheans before Disquiet sets in.

>>48640991
Well it was mentioned the highest power end of Deviant was going Akira or Dr. Manhattan blowout.

>>48641070
Tier 3 Hunters can be pretty powerful. And Deviant existing doesn't exactly change their niche any.

>>48641048

Clearly not, or else everyone'll just clamor to play them instead. If the fandom had their way, Belial's Brood, The Pure, and The Seers of the Throne would be the player factions of the Big Three. Jenna Moran would have just reskinned Graceful Wicked Masques for Changeling or something.

In all seriousness, though, "you'll never meet a good X because reasons" is not the best kind of handwaving.

>>48641035

That's close, but Cherion agents going rogue is a campaign story, not really a part of the proper setting.

>>48641151
Yeah. Understandable villains is something that really lifts a game.

>>48641151
Well when you design a setting and make the antagonists more sympathetic than the designated good guys maybe you've fucked up your setting design

>>48641190
Never forget Beast playtest

>>48641052
Yeah. But Prometheans have more reason than most to focus up their Supernatural Advantage.

how do sekhem sorcerers

>>48636775
>How much of the material has been updated at this point? Are they going to do it all?

A lot has been cleaned up in the V20 versions, gameplay-wise, so it's quite enjoyable to play now... and as for story, V20 took plenty of steps to move the world past Revised Edition's "Gehenna always happens in 2004, no exceptions"-bullshit.

It's a lot more agnostic in terms of *how* or *when* Gehenna hits, but doesn't change the fact that the world *is* headed towards an apocalypse of some kind. But it could be a week from now, a decade, or even a century.

They also saved the Anarchs and made them into a viable sect to play around. Anarchs Unbound for example goes into detail on how in WoD, the great recession was actually the work of Anarch hackers and activists grabbing the Camarilla Elders by the balls, holding their financial accounts hostage and going "Your move, gramps", after the Camarilla was lured into suppressing the Anarch sympathizers by pretty much any means necessary.

Camarilla Elders promptly squeaked out a "Good job, guys, we're done here, we totally won" and implemented a new policy on Anarchs; if they aren't actually being overly violent, let them do whatever the fuck they want, because otherwise their resources and stacks of money go up in flames.

>>48636775
>>48641339

Also, "Rites of the Blood" is equally awesome, since it introduces the "Four Waves" of Anarch thaumaturgy, in addition to giving more info on blood magic in general (for all the major sects).

>>48641246
Especially since now they don't have to spend xp on powers unless they want to keep them. Even then it's only with the super special "you should be buying pilgrimage instead" xp.

>>48641262

They'll be in the Dark Eras Companion.

>>48641369

Sending a Discipline over a text is genuinely the greatest Vampire thing I have read in years.

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>>48641151
>>48641048
>>48641183
>>48641190
>>48641206
>In all seriousness, though, "you'll never meet a good X because reasons" is not the best kind of handwaving.
I really hate this argument. I honestly don't understand this obsession people have with everything being a playable option. Having unplayable antagonists does not somehow make a game worse, and on the other side, having playable antagonists doesn't make the game better.

>Never forget Beast playtest
You mean where people bitched and moaned that people who were broken and low integrity were actually not bad at all and #NotAllHeroes? I like the more nuanced portrayal, but the whining was ridiculous, and not everything NEEDS nuance. Allowing for Heroes who aren't Reckoning Hunters didn't save Beast from directionless mediocrity.

>Yeah. Understandable villains is something that really lifts a game.
>"you'll never meet a good X because reasons"
Look, shoving the possibility of Good Heroes into the game means realistically the answer is "you'll never meet a good Hero because this was a last minute concession".
And as far as I can tell there can be good Alchemists. the people who've read more of the book than I have tell me that it's completely possible and gets the same treatment as Heroes, in a "why would their paths cross" sort of way. Although without doing the whole Lacuna thing and stealing Vitriol, they can't get the best powers.

It's not just that the villains aren't understandable. It's that THEY ARE VILLAINS. Yeah, Matt does a lot of "why would you bother putting this in your game" instead of letting troupes decide that on their own (The Principle/God-Machine comparisons seem to get the same "ugh, I *guess* we can give suggestions" dismissal)

And it's not like this is super unique to Matt's games. You're never going to meet a good Belial's Brood, or a good Pure. And those don't even exist. The Seers get a bit of sympathy, but by and large they're still dickbag villains on the road to power.

>>48641476
Shouldn't you be working now, Matt?

>>48641476
Look! The "unreasoning mad monster" already has a niche in Pandorans. Having Alchemists being "all evil, all the time" just ruins them.

>>48641508
I literally criticized Beast in that very fucking post, you myopic little shit.

>>48641546
Except that they're not. And they fill a much different niche. "I can't play a Centimani" is a much more valid criticism of Promethean than "all Alchemists are generic evil".

>>48641476
>You're never going to meet a good Belial's Brood, or a good Pure. And those don't even exist.

Umm. Yeah. You do.
From the point of view of the monsters they've become, their actions make sense.

Belial's Brood believe themselves to be demonic monstrosities, meant to prey upon humanity. They are not human any more, and it's folly to delude oneself to that level.
Predator Kings are similar.

Fire Touched are brought in to a huge world of powerful spirits, and are enveloped by it. Of course they serve, and work along spirits. The world doesn't make sense otherwise.

From the Ivory Claw's point of view, the Forsaken serve a mad goddess, who enslaves her children, and who is directly responsible for why the world is as fucked as it is today.

>>48641593
The Ivory Claws are literally a parody of the Garou from W:tA.

>>48641587

Centimani are playable though. They're right there in the book and everything. It just says that you probably shouldn't, and that you definitely won't progress in the Pilgmage while one.

>>48641637
>The Ivory Claws are literally a parody of the Garou from W:tA.

And they still have a point.
I disagree, but it's a point!

>>48641587
>Except that they're not. And they fill a much different niche. "I can't play a Centimani" is a much more valid criticism of Promethean than "all Alchemists are generic evil".

My complaint is that since I CAN play a Centimani, portraying Alchemists in complete black and white is bullshit.

Although I DO think the Centimani should be up alongside the other Refinements, like the Seers and VII are in their respective books.

>>48641669
Can you keep Centimani transformations you've learned before coming back the Pilgrimage? Being ignored by Pandorans would be pretty useful.

What ARE Alchemists? I don't know much about new Promethean.

>>48641593
>From the point of view of the monsters they've become, their actions make sense.
Which is true of Alchemists and Heroes too. Hell, that's the entire point of Heroes.
Belial's Brood are unabashed monsters and the Pure are basically Nazis. You're not going to meet benevolent ones with goals that align with yours unless the party is fucked up or there's some bigger threat.

>>48641637
>>48641695
Actually, the Pure as a whole are the Garou Nation. Ivory Claws are mostly Silver Fangs, and Predator Kings are Red Talons.

>>48641722
>portraying Alchemists in complete black and white is bullshit.
But they're not.

>>48641722

But they aren't a valid Pilgrimage-furthering Refinement. They're literally defined by a rejection of the Pilgrimage.

>>48641476

Belial's Brood and The Pure outright reject humanity, and the moralities and ethics of such. There are Loki-stan equivalents that defend them using their side of the story that the books present, but even with that, the rest of the game shows you why they're bad dudes.

The problem people have with Heroes and Alchemists is that to them, it's a bit more telling than showing. Knowing when to show and when to tell is a balancing act when it comes to word count, and sometimes readers can feel like the writer has struck the wrong balance.

>>48641742
yup. its a refinement like the other ones.

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>>48641473
>Sending a Discipline over a text is genuinely the greatest Vampire thing I have read in years.

I also like the "Slenderman" combo discipline from Anarchs Unbound, which lets a vampire (whenever they know they're being filmed/photographed) basically edit their own image so that the only thing anyone will see is a blurry, humanoid shape.

But I have to say, I love how the Anarchs made Facebook for vampires. It's so cringy, but I love it nonetheless.

>Fangbook modifies the user’s computer,
smartphone, or tablet so that any messages,
pictures, or videos she uploads to Facebook,
Twitter, or any other equivalent social
networking site appear to be innocuous posts
such as birthday greetings to random strangers
or widely-shared photos or video memes of
the day when viewed by non-vampires. With
Fangbook, Anarchs may participate freely on
social media sites and upload commentary and
media that might shatter the Masquerade if
mortals were actually capable of perceiving it.

>Bloodspot, similarly, is a shareware blogging
platform that can only be perceived as such by
Kindred. When a Bloodspot page is viewed
by one of the kine, she sees only a “Server
Not Found” message or some comparable
error message indicating that there is no such
webpage.

>FangChat, on the other hand, is a chat
messenger program that capable of finding
any Kindred who is online and opening a chat
window on their computer which, according
to the program’s creators, is completely
untraceable. Further, the message deletes itself
after a couple of minutes, leaving no trace.
FangChat has not been widely disseminated,
however, and there are a number of outrageous
rumors about it (mostly spread by loyalist
Tremere technomancers). Some say the
program can automatically detect lies by a
responding party. Others say that it has a built-
in GPS function that can find the haven of
anyone foolish enough to respond. Still others
say that the program is a vector for delivering
Dominate commands.

>>48641964

Bah, copy-pasting from a PDF is always a chore; the text always ends up fragmented. Pffft.

>>48641980
I recommend just taking screencaps post those.

>>48641751
An alchemist is "anyone who has touched the divine fire and got transmutations" As a default to be an alchemist you must dislike the human condition in some way. "I don't want to die" "Humans are animals, I want to be more" etc.

They pick up their magic threw understanding alchemy. They threw their magic potions and such get access to Promethean powers and can do thematic cool stuff like potions that stop aging, a vat of acid that when a human is submerged into it their flesh turns to gold, Tonics and powders that grant psychic visions. You know, cool story stuff.

Evil Alchemists hunt Promethean's because alchemists can store an unlimited amount of stolen pyros(mana for Promethean). Yes they can generate this stuff naturally threw experimentation(1-3 points a week, so slow going) and can store the stuff in beakers and jars and stuff(5-9 stored, so not much). But if they steal pyros, they can store as much as they steal, not subject to their normal cap.

Good Alchemists rarely run into Promies because presumably, rather then hunting down corpse men and stealing their bodily fluids, they are devoting their time to ALCHEMY. Well that, and if they have the slightest idea of what happens to people who hang around promies(disquiet) then they are probably going to stay away from the walking font of madness and pain. No doubt they might be willing to sell services in exchange for a promies pyros however.

You can run into both, but here at 4chan, people love to bitch.

>>48641722
Dude Rose did that for convenience. So she won't have to explain the VII in every book the make a appearance.

Dave thought that was a cool idea and stole it.

Matt put them where it would be useful, with the other antagonists.

>>48642145
My god I can't spell today.

Is it possible to complete new dawn without ever making a new Promethean?

>>48641773
So? They are still a refinement.

>>48642145
>can do thematic cool stuff like potions that stop aging, a vat of acid that when a human is submerged into it their flesh turns to gold, Tonics and powders that grant psychic visions.
Except in the rules, where they just make distillations in a cup

>>48641778
Heroes are honestly given more page count in Beast than the Pure are in WtF2e. If you're going to complain about these things, you have to understand that The Pure have been around for a LOT longer and gotten a LOT more written about them. Heroes and Alchemists are also meant to serve a *very* different role, so comparing them with things like The Pure or Seers isn't reasonable.

In fact, they're meant to serve a role more like Belial's Brood in the corebook, where they were literally nothing more than Chaotic Evil devil worshiping Vampires meant to remind people of the Sabbat more than the Lance did.

More than that, for Heroes at least, we ARE shown quite a bit. But people bitched about what we were shown and said clearly not everyone is like Thaddeus and that there were probably firefighters and social workers (even though at the time you basically had to be a Slasher to be a Hero).

>>48642131
>>48641980
Remember to scroll through and clean it up.

>>48642158
Isn't the VII write up literally just "they're creepy spooky vampires who might be connected to the Strix!"?
Personally, I think groups like Cheiron and Ashwood Abbey should go in the Antagonist section of Hunter. They should be perfectly playable, but treated as "not quite on the Vigil like you are".

>>48642172
They're more an anti-refinement.

>>48642207
>They're more an anti-refinement.

In goals, yes, not in mechanics though.

>>48642145
Through, anon. Not threw. You made that mistake too many times.

>>48642145
Alchemists also steal Vitriol to buy better Dread Powers and Transmutations.

>>48642231
It's almost as if that's why they'd be placed somewhere separately, so that people don't get the wrong idea.

>>48642244
>It's almost as if that's why they'd be placed somewhere separately, so that people don't get the wrong idea.

It's not as if one gets the idea that Seers are good guys reading the Mage core book.

>>48642234
see>>48642160

I noticed that right after I hit post.

>>48642279
Everyone knows Banishers are the real good guys.

>>48641190
I agree Alchemists were poorly written, but I definitely disagree when you imply Alchemists are MORE sympathetic than Prometheans

>>48642505
He may be referring to the Heroes. Or the Pure, if he's one of those neo-Nazi /pol/ types.

>>48642505
>My group and people I trust:
"Alchemists are pretty good"
>/wodg/, who are often wrong about everything:
"Alchemists are literally garbage and Matt is a hack"

>>48642279
Mage also hasn't had people since 2006 going "I'll play a Good Centimanus".

>>48641476
>Allowing for Heroes who aren't Reckoning Hunters didn't save Beast from directionless mediocrity
Man, ain't that the truth. I love the Beast template but I have no idea what to do with it since they shy away from, "Yeah, this is the evil campaign. You thought being Deceived was playing bad? Look again."

Too bad

>>48642207
>In fact, they're meant to serve a role more like Belial's Brood in the corebook, where they were literally nothing more than Chaotic Evil devil worshiping Vampires meant to remind people of the Sabbat more than the Lance did.
And something that was changed the first chance they had. Because it was a shit idea.

They shouldn't be making the same mistakes two gamelines in a row 10 years later.

>>48642534
>Mage also hasn't had people since 2006 going "I'll play a Good Centimanus".

Of course not. It has, however had people saying "I'll play a good Seer/Banisher/Scelestus."

>>48642534
I think Alchemists are very cool and a natural foil to Prometheans. They should be written as sympathetic villains but shouldn't have the same playability as Ghouls, Wolf-blooded, or Proximi.

And yeah, I like Matt from listening to him in interviews and such but he is a hack when it comes to the games he's been developing. Sorry

>>48642534
>My group and people I trust:
Providing this is Aspel, we know you don't have a group.
And the points aren't contrary.
Alchemists are good idea, the way it's done is garbage, and matt does seem to be a hack.
>Mage also hasn't had people since 2006 going "I'll play a Good Centimanus".
It has had people wanting to play heroic seers, though.

>>48642524
Heroes aren't even more sympathetic. Their definition might as well consist of "selfish assholes who get a murderboner", but because of the hate for Beast and the fact that Beasts cause Heroes (barely), that morphed into "beautiful and pure cinnamon rolls who do no wrong and get picked on by Beasts".

You literally had to be Slasher tier to be a Hero, and they're described as self-centered people who convince the ignorant masses to destroy something because it makes them feel important.

>>48642548
Just play it like a Hunter game. Or Mage, without any of the incentives.
Don't play an evil campaign, just say fuck it and play Vampions. Be a shitty violent Justice League of monsters.

>>48642561
It's not a mistake just because you don't like it.

>>48642578
I've never heard anyone wanting to play a good Banisher or Scelestus. It's almost impossible to play a Seer in a traditional Pentacle game, too.

>>48642596
I haven't gotten that far in the book yet, because Dark Souls, but Alchemists don't sound like they're unsympathetic.

>>48642614
>Providing this is Aspel, we know you don't have a group.
And yet I do!

>>48642633
>I've never heard anyone wanting to play a good Banisher or Scelestus.

There is even a legacy for good Scelesti in one of the Legacy books: The Fangs of Mara.

>>48642596
>but shouldn't have the same playability as Ghouls, Wolf-blooded, or Proximi.
why not?

>>48642633
>Be a shitty violent Justice League of monsters
Now that Promethean rounds it out, believe me when I say I'd love to run a MONSTER MASH crossover game with Vampire, Werewolf, Promethean, and Mummy

>>48642633
>It's not a mistake just because you don't like it.
It's a mistake because it's a limiting and primitive way to write games. Up there with "all those monsters? chaotic evil, do whatever you want to them"

Also Matt was even forced to go back and fix his mistake with beast. He won't have to with promethean because he made alchemists a small part of the game.

>>48642667
Because Prometheans are loners without supernatural buddies, and having Ghoul analogues diminishes that theme.

Because Centimanni are the playable villain protagonists

>>48642707

Also Alchemists, despite using the mystical basis of the Promethean, probably belong as a kind of hedge mage/Proximi type if they were fully playable from the get go.

So the trinity and scion seminar is tomorrow at 1 right?

>you could feasibly have a character who was a bit of a cliche be revealed to be a Promethean who was stuck in a rut
I love this.

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>>48637094
>DtR

>No one has live blogged or given a run down on the Classic World of Darkness panel from this morning
Was it really that bad of a dud?

>>48642648
They're Left-Handed.

>>48642667
Because they serve an entirely different purpose and you shouldn't force them into that fucking role when that's not what they're for.

>>48642701
It's not. They're not even all fucking evil in the first place.

>>48642989
FUCK I JUST NOTICED

>>48642989
>>48643021

What does that mean?

>>48633857
>>48636054
I made them a Ventrue/Gangrel shared bloodline with Auspex and a few handwavey devotions.
They get dice penalties for acting outside of their domain.

>>48643044
Dotonbori Robo
It gets shortened to DTR because the guy pointing at the monitor in that gif doesn't like the word "dotonbori", due to it being the name of a red light district in Tokyo, or something along those lines

>>48643055
>They get dice penalties for acting outside of their domain.

Yeah. I nailed them down with always having the "must be invited" Bane.

>>48643055
>>48643142
For Parent Clan, I went with Ventrue. Viccissitude is just Protean Devotions and Merits that make Protean 2 and 4 more flexible.
I was trying to focus on them as vapid eccentric "let them eat cake" types with a love for beauty and artistry. I couldn't for the life of me think of a good Bane, though. I wanted something that fit with what their themes where without being weird or arbitrary. The Native Soil bane that they have in VtM just doesn't work; it's barely relevant, would make Haven of Soil useless, and doesn't work well as a VtR 2e Bane with their system. They should involve Humanity in some way.

Maybe making them Daeva instead of Ventrue would work. You can have lords that aren't Lords.
(Although Dracula *was* a Gangrel)

>>48632591
>you need a cock to be a man

>>>/pol/
Is that way

>>48643285
>For Parent Clan, I went with Ventrue. Viccissitude is just Protean Devotions and Merits that make Protean 2 and 4 more flexible.
>I was trying to focus on them as vapid eccentric "let them eat cake" types with a love for beauty and artistry. I couldn't for the life of me think of a good Bane, though. I wanted something that fit with what their themes where without being weird or arbitrary. The Native Soil bane that they have in VtM just doesn't work; it's barely relevant, would make Haven of Soil useless, and doesn't work well as a VtR 2e Bane with their system. They should involve Humanity in some way.

I chose Protean for the very same reason.
The Bane of the new clan I based on the Path of Metamorphosis. If they go too long without re-making themselves or those close to them (read: Anyone you have a merit connecting to, including Touchstones), they start to grow distracted, and severe penalties to anything not involved in "fixing" them.
The greater the change, the longer they can go before making new changes.

>>48641339
>>48641369
Interesting, thank you.

Do the old clanbooks still hold value for a lore guy? If not i'll probably just get the v20 bundle on DriveThru and download whatever is missing from that.

File: Viccissitude.pdf (1B, 486x500px)

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>>48643579
This is my rough draft.

>>48643579
Stealing that bane

>>48643579
>>48643927
I feel like that Bane doesn't really fit that well either. How are you tying it to Humanity? It's also not really much of a weakness. You'll be doing that anyway thanks to having cool powers.

The Daeva Bane is without a doubt my favourite:
>Daeva immerse themselves in the mortal world; it not only feeds them, it compels them. When Daeva choose vessels, they become obsessed. When they drink from a mortal once, they’re fine. On their second and further drinks from the same source, roll Humanity. Failure causes the Persistent Dependent Condition toward the mortal(see p.302). The Condition only goes away with the mortal’s death. For this reason, Daeva tend toward either remarkable promiscuity, or they cultivate massive harems and herds.
You aren't overburdened by it, but when you're a Daeva you're tied to mortals and being social, whether it's flitting from one neck to another in a "promiscuous" way or having a close little harem. It encourages you to play your character in keeping with the Clan's themes, which is a far cry from the 1e version, where the sexual succubi could end up eternally violent and Wrathful or boring lazy Slothful types.

The Ventrue one doesn't really encourage a certain type of play, but by pushing the Touchstone loss up one, it really embraces the feel of the Lord or Ruler who lets themselves get lost in power and forget the people that help keep them grounded. It also encourages you to buy Touchstones more often, which is a thing I like, because I like that carrot/stick system.

Nosferatu I'm slightly less impressed by, but the fact that your "two lowered Humanity" social penalties don't affect your Touchstone encourages you to interact with it more. But for a lot of vamps, it won't mean anything, because they'll be dealing with only vampires; of course, that's in theme for Haunts, too; if they want someone to talk to, they're doubly forced to deal with other vamps for company.

>>48642971
>three men pretending to be normal
>one is a demon
>one is a beast who went satiety 10 and can't go back
>one is a Promethean stuck in a roll

>>48644139
>I feel like that Bane doesn't really fit that well either. How are you tying it to Humanity?

Bloodline flaws doesn't have to be tied to Humanity, do they? The Khaibit flaw doesn't.

And I think it is a weakness. I have a Tzimisce player in the campaign, and the character's drive to re-make people around her has made the rest of the coterie decide that the Tzimisce is just one more transgression and it dies.

>>48644139
Gangrel is my least favourite, because it's simply "they're prone to rage", but the fact that the penalty doesn't effect Red Surrender means that they're much more often going to go with that option instead of trying to hold off Frenzy. That's still thematic.

I'm not really going to mention the Mekhet, since theirs is basically "choose your own".

But I'm mentioning them all to highlight how to make a good Bane (and why I'm having so much trouble with mine): It should involve the Humanity score in some way and it should reinforce the themes. The Neglatu are always going to want their "hive" around them (and feel kind of like Melissidae to me), and the Kerberoi are going to want to Predatory Aura all the time because they have penalties otherwise.

>>48644295
I'm not sure whether the Khaibit or the Jiangshi has the worse Bane. Both of them are unrelated to Humanity, don't do anything to encourage certain modes of play, and the Khaibit's is literally "you get the Blinded Tilt in light that would blind you".

Also, your player is more driven by their character more than their Bane. They could just shape themselves.

>>48643005
Well "relatively" good Scelesti.

>>48644360
>They could just shape themselves.

Yup! And become walking masquerade violations, forcing themselves to hide and become even more monstrous.

>>48644399
They could always change to normal. You don't need tentacles for hair when out and about. You could even just change something innocuous. Like a dog dick

>>48644453
>>48644399
Anyway, what I'm saying is that while it's working well in your game, I'm not sure it's really all that good for a general thing.

I think I'm going blind. That or the cold medicine.

Were in Promethean 2nd ed does it talk about switching roles? The roles section talks a lot about being stuck in a rut and how to turn your back on a role and what not, but were does it talk about switching the damn things? I'm trying to wrap my head around playing a promie in 2ed.

God I wish I wasn't sick.

Also Shock absorption is new(more tanky is more good) and Transhuman potential was nerfed hard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ls5834hbssM
This a throng of Unfleshed?

>>48644610
>Transhuman potential was nerfed hard.
>By spending a point of Pyros, the player can increase an Attribute by a single dot for one action (limited only by her per-turn expenditure limits).
Sounds the same to me.

>>48644453
Sure! But the more dramatic and extreme the changes, the longer they can go without having to do it again.
I don't have any specific numbers on this, I'm just winging it though.

>>48644517
Yeah. I think it's a working base, but it takes more.

Woah, Promethean 2e is out already? I must've been away longer than I thought. Next you guys'll tell me there's a playable version of Changeling 2e floating around out there...

Actually, is there? 'Cause my group is trying to decided on our next game, and it's going to be either Promethean or Changeling, but I hadn't realize that either of them were close to a new edition.

>>48645309
It's been playable roughly for months, anon

>>48645309
Pomethean is out but it's the advance pdf so it's bound to have all manner of typos. After collecting errata from the community they'll do another editing pass and release the finalized version.

Changeling isn't even that far. We have a set of playtest document released a few months ago but while they're playable they missing stuff, like courts and tokens and damn near anything related to the hedge.

>>48645309
I can't tell if you're joking
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/676949-collected-second-edition-open-development-blogs

I can't actually find the updated Harvest rules, where the target only loses a dot of Willpower, and gains Reticent only if you're in super Embrace the Wyrd mode.

>tfw when a friend of yours makes a campaign idea of yours possible not long after you bring it up in the thread

Time to break out the notebook, I've got a Night's Black Agents/Hunter: The Vigil crossover to set up...to be run sometime in the future I guess.

>>48645387
>>48645408
>>48645566
Like I said, I've been out of the loop for a long time.

So I'm getting mixed messages: is Changeling legitimately playable right now, or no? Am I better off sticking with 1e, or is the material that is out there good enough to justify the switch?

>>48646487
>So I'm getting mixed messages: is Changeling legitimately playable right now, or no? Am I better off sticking with 1e, or is the material that is out there good enough to justify the switch?

It's kind of playable.

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>>48646487
>is Changeling legitimately playable right now
Yes. The only things that are really missing are a) Court Contracts (which aren't integral to the game) and rules specific to the Hedge (which aren't integral, but would be nice).
You could very much play a more or less complete Changeling game. It's not the FINAL version or anything, but it's playable. Think of it as early access.

>>48645408
>like courts and tokens and damn near anything related to the hedge.
Courts are done. You make your own courts, there won't be a list of them like in 1e. Just the Build-a-Freehold system and whatever Courts show up in the sample cities. Tokens and the Hedge I'll give you, but it shouldn't be too hard to do something with them anyway (they were always sort of vague).

In fact, here's my incomplete Freehold.

>>48637094
>ib4 I'm gonna kill Praxis

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>>48631866
She deserves better.

>>48646729
Remember, the first rule to making a bomb... is to always make two...

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I'm looking at getting into Mage The Ascension. Which edition is most appropriate? In particular I want one where I can hunt down sourcebooks for all the nutso technocracy factions, a reality cops game intrigues me (even if it's not what I end up running).

>>48647900

2e's probably the most complete when it comes to the Technocracy factions, and it has that Guide to the Technocracy book people like so much. M20's got a pretty robust Technocracy write up though.

>>48647900

The assorted Convention books are for Revised, and should work fine with M20

Don't let any 2e-loving reality deviants taint your mind with their lies.

Since Geist 2e is confirmed, Stew or Dave, was the underworld stuff from Mage 2e and tease of the past submerged underworld made with the upcoming book in mind?

Also not necessarily a spoiler, but do you guys feel like Geist 2e will have more focus or clarity than the first edition?

>>48648189
>Also not necessarily a spoiler, but do you guys feel like Geist 2e will have more focus or clarity than the first edition?

Well it'd be awfully hard for it to have LESS.

>>48648189

Dave said he was talking about it with the Geist developer for two years or so, so they were probably teases for whatever 2e will be like.

>>48648189

Just give me a Mummy crossover setting that explores the idea of Duat being underneath the Ocean of Fragments and the similarities between Deceived temakh and geists.

>>48648254
But where does the God Machine come into play?

>>48648234
Who's developing Geist?

>>48648284
Travis Stout

>>48648213
It would, but it could still maintain same level of lack of focus/direction and be just as bad for it.

>>48648234
Hope so, could have sworn there was a tease for more Cthonian stuff.

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>>48647900
I say at some point grab the M20 book just because its a really beautiful full color book and its writing really turned me towards Ascencion over Awakening.

The Magic rules are a tad inconsistent though so I'd take a look at CofD's Mage stuff unless you're willing to be a lenient ST who's willing to go with the flow.

>>48647900

The Mage the Awakening edition

>brochure supposed to come out on Thursday
>it's now technically Saturday

please get your shit together OPP

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>>48647900
>>48648073

I find the Technocracy a little hammy when they're a big conspiracy that controls the entire world.

Does anyone else play them as a small faction that has major influence but doesn't rule the world? (as in, humanity evolved to modern science naturally, but the technocracy was there on some major turning points)

It keeps the Ascension War interesting at the very least.

Does anyone know what happened at the CWoD panel?

>>48649021

WoD has a nasty habit of making everyone important in history a secret the member of a supernatural conspiracy. It works a lot better if every faction is much smaller-scale than the books treat them, IMHO.

>>48636848
>>48639037
>>48649044
>>48643001
>No responses
Jesus, do you people even realize there was a WoD panel at Gen Con today?

>>48649134
Isn't WoD that thing that died in the 90's? I can't imagine anyone caring about it now.

>>48649179
Someone cared enough to have an entire panel at GenCon.

>>48649179
You say that, but practically everyone in myUni RPG society knows about VtM, but only like 10% know about CofD.

>>48649084
Given all the oWoD Metaplot who REALLY controlled the world?

And yeah it gets old that humanity is vastly insignificant to the Illuminati that is the Supernatural world. Also having every bad guy be "The Man" gets old.

I'm glad CofD kept its conspiracies strictly with Hunter: The Vigil, because it fits within the Theme of the game.

>>48649252
>practically everyone in myUni RPG society knows about MET and VtM: Bloodlines
Fixed that for you.

Also to be fair the CofD change was a recent name change. My "normie" friends know what Vampire the Requiem and Masquerade is but not much else

>>48649200
You must be mistaken as that is clearly imposibru. I doubt most con goers would even remember it being a thing by now.

>>48649366

>implying anyone would forget the old White Wolf GenCon parties

>>48649500
Oh god how did those go?

>>48641964
Huh. So like hunter.net but with vamps. Is this new in 20 or was it always there?

>>48649577
Presumably, being that everything listed there is a parody of a modern website that didn't exist back in 2004, it's new in V20.

Did we get any hint of a release date for Deviant?

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>>48637094
But can I be a Renegade of Funk?

>>48637436
lel

>>48631866
does anyone have a coupon for DriveThruRPG?

I put 70 dollars on a prepaid and they want 20 cents more than what I have on the card

>>48640832
>Deviant: The Renegades

People guessed that months ago. So not worth the wait

www.drivethrurpg.com/product/187947/Onyx-Path-20162017-Publishing-Brochure?src=newest

>>48650224
>For years, we’ve entertained fan requests for rules that allow different supernatural creatures to play in the same game. This year we’re pleased to announce that we’ll create a book that’s tentatively titled The Crossover Chronicle which will provide all the necessary rules to play within a setting designed around the idea that every single supernatural exists and they may be aware of all the others, too. This will be a massive undertaking never before attempted for the Chronicles of Darkness!

>>48650339
>"Let's just agree that Beast never happened, okay?"

>>48650339
I'm scared.

>>48649134
>Caring about oWoD

lmao

>>48650374
Nah, Beast was meant to be crossover ready and to encourage that kind of play. This sounds more like "The Big Book of Crossover Stuff".

>>48650477

How much of this will be "Disquiet does this to each splat" or "what Arcana do you need for crossover stuff," I wonder?

Wouldn't surprise me if Tokyo was in this book, too.

>>48650477
Well Demon crossover book omitted beast entirely, so it seems to be a choice to just let it be forgotten

>>48650224
Oh, right Pugmire's a thing. I kinda forgot, and I Kickstartered the damn thing.

>>48650224
So, I'm confused a bit on Scion 2E. Is Origins supposed to be kind of the Core Book of Storypath, and you'll need that and Hero to play, or is it just an alternate mortals book? I think I'm okay with either, I just want to be clear.

>>48650764

Origins is the core book you need to play. Hero adds rules for being a Scion onto that. You need both books to play Hero.

Is there any reason I shouldn't buy the Vampire The Dark Ages 20th Anni edition? I like the art in it and the setting a bit more than the modern setting

>>48650857
Okay, thought it might be. It's kind of funny that the 2E CofD books wound up going the other direction, but you do what makes sense to you, I suppose. I'm still rather excited about the idea. Hope nothing's going to shit in my life when the Kickstarter happens so I can back that shit. I'm very curious about the Storypath system.

>>48650936

I personally love Dark Ages way more tgan the regular setting.

>>48650951

CofD did it that way because it's a series of related but standalone games; Scion is just one, and you're supposed to climb from Origins up to God with the same character.

I'm really excited for Origins as just a new mortal urban fantasy game.

>>48650997
I hear the 20th anni version of dark ages has a bunch of typos and stuff

>>48650936
The fact that is oWoD, for starters.

>>48651048
I already own some nWoD books. Whats wrong with oWoD? Like really I have yet to see anyone actually point out anything wrong with it besides a few nitpicks

>>48651016
I'm sort of hoping that it'll be possible to play a Scion of Kek.

Or Ebola-chan, Scion of Babalú-Ayé.

>>48650643
>Wouldn't surprise me if Tokyo was in this book, too.

Ah. Yes. Of course it will be.

>>48650764

Origins is the corebook of Storypath - it's got the core system in it. Hero is an addon, like the first edition of nWoD worked.

>>48652546
Do you regret using such a weak subtitle for Deviant?

>>48650672
Demon crossover book was basically ready by the time Beast came out. That's not to say Beast shouldn't be forgotten. Or that it should be. My feelings are complicated.

>>48652551
What? Just because it was expected it doesn't mean it was weak.

Renegades was at the top of the guesses for a good reason.

>>48648189

Yes, totally. The Geist Developer was a writer on Mage, and we knew what we were doing - where Mage 2e's descriptions of ghosts and he Underworld (brief as they are) differ from Geist 1e's, it's because we knew how it'd be changing.

>>48648254

Sorry 'jakki, it's a Lower Depth.

>>48652579
>Sorry 'jakki, it's a Lower Depth.

The definition of the Lower Depths is a stroke of genius. It allows an "Oh, but it's from over here, it's weird". That the setting quite lacked in 1e.

>>48652579
Can you tell us anything else that's changing?

Speaking of 2e's definition, if I'm reading right, a Geist or Kerberos could be a Cthonian as easily as a ghost?

>>48653323

If going by Dark Eras, I think Ye Olde Geists even used to be Cthonians.