>the Cleric refuses to heal anything that isn't human

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>>48559644
This is why healers are constantly bullied.

>>48559644
>player Cleric

That Guy.

>NPC Cleric

Use polymorph magic and come back.

Bluff that it was a curse.

Threaten with death.

>>48559644
>having filthy non-humans in your party
Serves you right.

>>48559708
Polymorph the cleric into a nonhuman.

They can't magic themselves back because that would be healing a nonhuman.

>>48559759
If you're throwing around polymorph spells just to be vindictive magical healing shouldn't be an issue.

>>48559798
Yes but messing with nonwizards is what gets wizards out of the bed in the morning.

>>48559644
I don't have the screencap from Barkley's Shut Up and Jam Gaiden of Barkley saying "Goddamn animal people," but if I did I would totally post it.

>>48559835
but clerics are wizards?

>>48559907
Do you see a pointy hat on them? Robes? Arcane spells? Tomes of power? Knowledge of what they're doing and not just asking their sugargod for spells?

Therefore they're ripe for the fucking with.

>>48559907
>implying
different style of magic entirely, completely different base from where magic comes from.
cleric magic only exists as long as the god in question the cleric worships exists, or theres connections specifically from the plane that you draw from, wizards and arcane mages specifically get it from the self, and don't specifically need outside help to do shit.
its the same reason why druids arn't wizards either, otherwise all kinds of stupid shit falls under the already overly large umbrella that is wizard.

A party member who isn't willing to pull their weight won't stay in the party for long. At the first opportunity we will give him his share of the loot and go our separate ways.

Which means that the player behind said character now has to roll up a character that will work with the party.

>>48559835
Research is what gets them up, that's what keeps them up.

>>48559977
Why not both?

>>48560503
That's a means to an end. The end is fucking with nonwizards.

>>48559965
Some of them have pretty large hats like pontiffs. They wear robes of different colours for different religious meanings and holidays.

>>48559907
Only the ones with pointy hats

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>>48561019

>>48561019
Dude why would you ever want those instead of a human partner. You want half breed kids? Now I have nothing against other races, but I know mixed kids have a shit life. So it is better to stay with your own race. Plus all those other races are the wrong size, and probably smell bad too.

>>48559759
Better: get the most persuasive person you can and make them convince the cleric that their god is not human (even if they were before the ascension) and therefore not fit to be worshipped.

>>48565498
>A shit life
By what metric? The only time I can think that's true is due to their communities, rather than their parentage. Half-breeds between fantasy races usually turn out better than pure-bloods, honestly.

>Probably smell bad
>Elves
>Not smelling of forest or flowers or soap or perfume
I think you're confused there pal... And the worst any half-civilized musclewizard amazon orc would smell of is sweat. Some people like that.

>>48565694
>By what metric?
Well, for starters they have to live with the crushing shame of being a filthy half-blood. Putting one out of its misery is basically an act of mercy, really.

>>48565776
Right, so, again it's down to their community and the people they're surrounded by, got it.

You're not to good at this 'debate' thing, are you? You can't say, "A thing is bad because it is a thing;" you have to provide reasoning and evidence that doesn't loop back around upon itself.

>>48565941
His argument is more like "X is a bad thing because I (and people who think like me) will hate you and bully you."

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>>48566102
Witches are for cleaning ears, not having their ears cleaned.

>>48565556
>the Cleric gets their powers from human supremecy

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>>48567255

Why can't we alter this formula and say the Healslut is a charismatic, silver-haired gentleman with a cane for his lame leg that gets the Elf and Orc all hot and bothered because he fits the ideal of masculinity in each of their races.

>>48567323
>silver-haired gentleman with a cane
Because that's not hot to me
And from what I've seen, 4chan's tastes on the mater of clerics is much the same
A dad cleric would probably be more popular on tumblr from what I've heard though

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>>48567372
>A dad cleric would probably be more popular on tumblr from what I've heard though

I just want a DILF with steady hands healing the hurt away with some good touch.

>>48567404
Eh, not my thing, though going by the fan art that gets churned out whenever a game or something has an older guy in it, you honestly probably could find that on tumblr, no idea where though

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>>48567372
>Dad Cleric

>>48559644
>Telling EVER that you're not human or a wizard to a fucking member of the church
>The church of abel
>AKA "Fuck magic"
>AKA "Gas the elves, war of the cross now"

Duk, you dumb.

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>>48559644

Isn't that normal?

So if you ignore the fetish posts in the thread, it's just not a good team-building trait to be racist.

>>48567971
I WANT TO GIVE RIBBON A SOFT KISS ON THE LIPS TO SURPRISE AND FLUSTER HER

>>48568056
Anyone not playing a human is suboptimal and are being That Guy.
Probably being a Mary Sue too.

>>48567920
>do i need to bring out the flaming pillar or will you eat all your vegies?

>>48568183
*pillar of fire

>>48567971

>don't bully elves

Probably the worst meme on /tg/ since princess quest.

>>48568130
>Mary Sue
Someone give an accurate definition of this besides "Thing I don't like".

>>48568295
T. Mary Sue

>>48559644
Then the Healer is getting a righteous Dragonborn foot up his racist arsehole, applied furiously and with force.

You either pull your weight or you can scram. them's the rules buddy.

>>48568130
You are That Guy by not wanting to be a dwarf, kobold, human or whatever /tg/'s flavor of the month is.

>>48559644
>the party leaves the cleric behind at the next town after finding a new healer.

>>48568246
Don't bully anyone.

>>48559644
I'd do the same in his position.
After all, we're playing Call of Chtulhu.

>>48559644
Would a Paladin have grounds to smite this cleric? They are refusing to aid those in need even though it is well within their power to do so and for no good reason.

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>>48559644
If you don't do your job, and don't do it well, you will get neither loot nor food.

If you're hampering the party you have no claim to the benefits of being in the party.

If you're being a real ass about it, not only will you get no food, but you'll be denied the ability to get food for yourself. Be obstinate enough and it'll extend to water.

Eventually you will be giving those heals, and you'll like it.

>>48568426
>>the party leaves the cleric behind at the next town, whether they find a new healer or not. It's not like they are going number of healers can go down from leaving the cleric behind.

>>48568808
Absolutely not. Not doing Good isn't the same as being Evil.

>>48559644
The Theats of Theatland are a mixed race of humans and horses. Long ago, the horse-king Thead witnessed the arrival of humans from the east, and marvelled at their arts. Thead prayed to the wind-god Main, that He might grant the king humans of his own. And so Main reached out His hand, and blessed His faithful with many human children. The Theats, man and horse, have lived peacefully together ever since, mares birthing babies and women birthing foals, as Main wills. They are famed riders, masters of the saddle, bow and lance.

The Cleric is faced with a wounded Theatman. Do they heal them?

>>48568130
>Suboptimal
>Mary Sue
I want this meme to die.

Seriously, how can you be useless AND the most important special snowflake character? I'd ask you to apply some logic, but as you're racist against elves and other non-humans, I think it's clear you lack the capacity for it.

>>48569214
Human cock or horse cock?

>>48569260
Yes.

>>48559644
As a character, its fine. However they must be able to face tge consequences (my orc barbarian slices the treacherous cleric in twain) if pc, or sudden "being killed by murderhobos" if an npc

>>48569020
Inaction is as much a choice as any action. Choices are what define you. If your inaction causes someone to die, and you were fully cognizant of the consequences, and had no reason for your choice besides hatred, then you have committed an evil inaction.

Evil should be purged.

>>48569384
So commoners are evil, then?

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>>48569384
Aren't evil and monsters two sides of the same coin?

>>48568808
Depends on how loosely you define 'smite.'

They're not within their rights to run them through and leave them bleeding out across the road, but few deities or nonspecific goodness energy fields would care if they gave the Cleric a clip about the face and a stern talking-to.

>>48569260
Theatmen are indistinguishable by sight from any other race of men.

So... human cock.

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>>48559813
>>48559977
>>48561019
>>48566102
>>48567255
>>48569260

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>>48559644
That is quite alright, as the rest of the party is human, and pain is an excellent teacher. I wish my religious companion good fortune and hope that he looks after the others well.

Now let us confront these troublesome hill-bandits, while the evening is young.

>>48569751
No heresy here astartes, just the loyal inhabitants of /tg/ preforming their favorite pastime

>>48569423
This is covered in "had no reason for your choice besides hatred". Choosing to do nothing because you're weak or afraid is different. Choosing to do nothing just because of hatred is evil, and doubly so when it is well within your power to act.

>>48569820
What about choosing to do nothing because of sadistic glee?

>>48569862
That's straight-up Evil, you clown.

>>48569820
No it's not. Especially when you're working with limited resources, choosing who to spend them on and who not is not evil, even if there are questionable motivations leading to said choices.

>>48569820
But I hate monsters and let a monster die by not healing it. Is that evil?

>>48569862
What about choosing to do nothing because you get off on being submissive?

>>48569881
But it's a monster getting what it deserves, there's nothing wrong with being happy about their fate.

>>48559644
>the lizardman doesn't protect the cleric who refuses to heal him
>lizardman dies from noheals, cleric dies from noshield
>cleric player isn't allowed to roll another support character unless he agrees to support everyone equally

>>48569919
You said that you'd be passive because you'd enjoy seeing it die, not because it was evil.

>>48569933
>the Lizardman is risen from the dead to actually do his job
Clerics!

>>48569933
>Cleric agrees, but now refuses to heal anyone more than any other member of the party, regardless of how much damage they take individually
>The wizard who stays as far back as possible and takes no damage thanks to magic shields causes the lizardman to die again

>>48569989
>That Guy is kicked from the group

>>48569989
>The Cleric's player is kicked out of the group for being a passive-aggressive little-

>>48570019
Damn. Beat me to it.

>>48569887

If the reason you choose to allocate your resources is informed by pure hatred, you're evil. The fact you needed to add the additional motive of limited resources to the scenario to build any kind of argument just shows that you cannot refute my original point.

>>48569891
If your only reason for doing so is that you hate monsters, then yes it is.

>>48570054
>If the reason you choose to allocate your resources is informed by pure hatred, you're evil.

Wrong. Hatred is, by itself, NOT evil.

>>48569933
>the lizardman doesn't protect the cleric who refuses to heal him
>lizardman dies from noheals
>cleric carries on like nothing happened
Fixed. Useless lizardmen.

>>48570054
But monsters are evil. Tieflings are monsters. Tieflings are evil. No exceptions.

>>48570082
No, but action guided by it is.

>>48567939
He should be thankful we don't ditch him at the nearest church for burning.

>>48570101
Spirit of Gygax, begone from this realm of the living!

>>48570019
>>48570037
The cleric isn't a that guy. He's just playing in-character when someone rolls around with a traditionally evil race and expects everything to be hunky dory because OOC players are supposed to form a cohesive party regardless of in-game ramifications.

>>48569240
>Be important as fuck by lore and the best 6evah (more than 5evah) but be shit mechanically

WAOH
THAT WAS
SO HARD

>>48570117
Odds are when you visit that church they'll capture and burn your party (sans cleric) for being Xeno loving terrorists.

>>48570112
Exactly. ACTION guided by it. Not INACTION. Choosing to hurt someone is Evil. Choosing not to help someone is NOT Evil.

>>48570127
>I'm only being a disruptive shitter IC and OOC because it's IC
Then have fun rolling a character for whom that behavior isn't IC, we're trying to have fun as a group here.

>>48570156
What is evil
>Cleric using last few spell slots on injured party mates and ignoring the dozens of hurt civilians
Or
>Healing a half-dozen civilians and then everyone dies due to party not being able to successfully defend the town.

>>48570180
Yeah. And I object to people playing drow and tieflings in a good party due to it being moronic in the highest degree.

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>>48570101
>Tieflings are monsters. Tieflings are evil. No exceptions.

According to this chart you are wrong. The alignments that Tieflings can be are highlighted in blue.

Checkmate.

>>48569887
>Constantly talks shit about non-human peoples and cultures
>Constantly proclaims the superiority of humans over all others
>Refuses to heal non-human party members because "muh priority targets!"

We know full well where your priorities lay, you fucking asshole. That's why the Paladin just sheathed his sword in your sternum.

>>48570127
>player insists on having the ramifications come from within the party, who would know the character as an individual rather than just the race, instead of from NPCs who wouldn't.
>player decides to act out those ramifications through play that fucks over party rather than talking.
No, he's That Guy.

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>>48570156
Choosing to be passive is an action. You can't fool me with your tricky trolley trouble.

>>48570206
The Paladin falls
Being racist isn't being evil :^)

>>48570203
Yeah. But how are you going to get it past a paladin with a smiting finger when you have evil magic blood flowing through you? Being a tiefling is like being a social justice nigger in 1920.

>>48570156
inaction is still a form of action.
You are always doing something, even if the thing you are doing is standing still.

>>48570199
>That Guy is kicked from the group
We've been through this.

>>48570184
If the cleric deliberately sets out to subvert the party and cause the village to be destroyed while still pretending to be one of the good guys, that's evil. Otherwise, neither of those are evil.

>>48570112
>No, but choices guided by it are.

Fix'd.

>>48570127
>B-B-BUT I'M JUST PLAYING MY CHARACTER

>>48570241
Have to agree here. Social justice warriors aside, being racist is a personality trait, not an alignment trait. It's just like how a lawful good character can condone slavery.
>>48570249
Baby Orc

>>48570266
For the best, to avoid confusion.

>>48570253
>Special Snowflake screaming autist kicked from group

>>48570244
I don't think you can even read a chart.

>>48570284
>sperg who thinks he decides what's what in the setting regardless of what the GM rules is kicked from the group

>>48570271
>It's just like how a lawful good character can condone slavery.

Shit like this is exactly why the alignment system is fucking nonsense.

>>48570339
I am more assertive than any of the beta friends in my group and usually make almost every decision due to everyone being so passive. Banning good tieflings and drow was simple by just explaining how that makes no sense in any way whatsoever.

>>48570329
The chart is retarded in any reasonable way.
>>48570365
The alignment system is nonsense, but good tieflings are even more nonsense.

>>48570375
That's nice blogshit. It must be nice to be able to feel smart just because nobody tries to contest you.

>>48570399
>The chart is retarded in any reasonable way.
It's a very simple chart, anon. Don't blame the chart for your inadequacy.

>>48570375
>Banning good tieflings and drow was simple by just explaining how that makes no sense in any way whatsoever.
I'd love to hear this justification, because I haven't gotten my fill of being pissed off at obvious bullshit yet today.

>>48570423
>Oh this demon blooded race spawned from hell has no psychological complications whatsoever to drive the race closer to the alignment of their parents (EVIL).
Behavior is %60-%70 genetics.

>>48570447
Oh so that is why you suck so much cock! You really are just like your parents

>>48570437
The only reason drow society even survives all the chaotic evil backstabbing, slavery, torture, and random murders is because their God wills them to. This will is also probably the same reason they're the way they are. A good drow is like trying to say a demon born in hell can be good. Speaking of that, Tieflings are the children of demons. Demons are literally embodiments of pure evil in this game. If even %20 of that DNA gets passed down to the children then they're filled with %20 PURE EVIL. This probably means the most they can do is rise to neutral alignment beyond divine intervention.

>>48570437
>I threw a big embarrassing fit until they rolled their eyes and gave in rather than have to put up with my whining any longer.

>>48570399
>MUH HEADCANON!

>>48570515
>Blah blah let me be my chaotic good half-tiefling half-drow ranger with two scimitars and a panther companion.

>>48570491
>Speaking of that, Tieflings are the children of demons. Demons are literally embodiments of pure evil in this game. If even %20 of that DNA gets passed down to the children then they're filled with %20 PURE EVIL. This probably means the most they can do is rise to neutral alignment beyond divine intervention.

No, they're the DESCENDANTS of demons. Children of demons are half-fiends. Tiefling is someone whose ancestor fucked a demon some 10 generations ago.

>>48570491
Are you trying to say that the axis is like 15% good, 50% neutral, and 35% evil, or fucking what?

>>48570561
>>48570544
Wow you guys are retarded. Descendants of fields are probably like their parents anyways.

>>48570491
>drow
except the god doesn't actually control their brains and allignment, it just sets up rewards and punishments that create a society, which is enough to shape the overall alignment of the race but doesn't control every individual.
So small number of individuals can exist contrary to norms of that society.

>If even %20 of that DNA gets passed down to the children then they're filled with %20 PURE EVIL.
only if you establish that as the ontology of the setting, which D&D does not.
D&D ontology is such that once the demon blood is sufficiently diluted it does not determine the alignment of the individual.

You can create a different ontology if you want, but if you're doing that you can just whatever you want be true.

>>48570491
first of all: Evil DNA? seriously?
second: Tieflings are not children of demons, but descendants, which means that there may be dozens of generations between them.
third: tiefling traits don't follow Mendelian genetics, you may have dozens of generations without a single trait just to have a child being born a tiefling.
also: if it DID follow mendelian genetics, then you have to say at which point the evil DNA is even measurable? If every partner of theirs is human then after just 7 generations they have less than 1% evil DNA

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>>48570599
>That Guy is kicked from the group

>>48570447
>Behavior is %60-%70 genetics.

You're an only child, aren't you?

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>>48565776
>>48565941

>believes in dinosaurs

>>48570244
That isn't how alignments and outsiders interact in D&D.

While all evil outsiders immediately ping as evil under a paladin't Detect Evil, tieflings are humanoids. It doest matter that they have the essence of the lower planes in their veins, the only evil that pings is the evil that comes from their actual alignment.

>>48570629
Nope. Just educated.

Yay! Now i'm going to make a Lawful good paladin drow and nobody is going to stop me from slaying evil racist humans!

>>48571090
>Nope. Just selectively educated.
FTFY.

>>48571143
Isn't that every college student who doesn't take every single course abalaible?

>>48568808
>>48569020
>>48569384
>>48564403
Don't forget the evil Paladin so greedy and selfish and he doesn't give money to the poor and instead decides to go out and buy plate mail and the biggest most magical sword he can buy not to mention buying a horse and on top of that waste heals per days and his valuable time being an over glorified grave-robber with a bunch of guys who purposely get themselves into Danger

>>48571182
Nope. Just the ones that takes a small part of Psychology 101 that support what they already believes and ignores the overwhelming bulk of it just so they can use it to force thinly veiled racist arguments in D&D threads.

>>48571275
>Thinly veiled racist argument (about a guy with literal demon blood in a setting where demons are evil and the kid has the appearance and instincts of a demon)
Yeah I wonder why someone could be racist against a half devil looking motherfucker.

>>48559759
That's how you end up with genocidal psychopaths, you know.

>"I'm now hopeless, there's no hope for me! I cannot be any worse than I currently am, but I still hate all the nonhumans. If I can't get any worse I better stop holding back and KILL THEM ALL."

>>48571322
Because they're factually wrong and don't care. That's why they get smited.

>>48571393
>Muh racists are eeeeevil meme
Paladins are racist against evil. Meme that.

>>48571393
But they're right most of the time (%85 of tieflings end up evil or neutral or both.

In a world where there's races who are literally all evil I can safely say this can be a reasonable character trait without instantly going chaotic evil because "Muh racists". George Washington and every white political figure before 1940 was racist.

>>48571413
Evil isn't a race. What you're looking for is alignmentist.

>>48571454
> "all goblins in this setting are chaotic evil"
> "Goblins raped your mother and killed your dog."
> "Wait, why are you killing goblin children? They aren't evil!"

YES THEY FUCKING ARE.

>>48571454
Actually, barring some supernatural entities lacking free will, even the 'Always' alignment races are more like 98-99%, not a firm 100%.

>>48571658
Depends on the setting.

In some settings every orc is evil no matter what. In others it's more like what you described. In others it's just that they're stupid and prone to violence.

A friend of mine told me about the misadventures of his crazy brother and his Cleric character with a flying ring. He always ran away from every encounter and never contributed to battle.

>>48571431
no, saying "100% of tieflings are evil" is wrong all the time even if "85% of tieflings are evil or neutral".

>>48571677
...wouldn't that make them supernatural entities lacking free will?

>>48568810
Tommy Lee Jones speaks the truth.

>>48571726
Eh, not necessarily supernatural. But yeah, it means they lack aspects of free will.

>>48571658
The %98-%99 justify hating the other %1-%2 though, since the only way to tell is to actually chat with the thing for a indeterminate length of time.

>>48571981
while that would justify having society feel that way, and having a characters initial impression being that way. Within a party you would get a chance to know the individual, so a PC refusing to treat them as anything but a monster for an extended period of time is still That Guy.

>>48572101
But what if the PC refuses to join the party because of that thing and it ends up with the thing attacking the racist?

>>48572153
you have a completely different story than what we started with.

>>48572153
Then their character doesn't join the party, That Guy gets the boot, and the game actually proceeds smoothly onward from that point forward.

Sounds good to me.

>>48572174
But why would a racist join a party that has one or more of the things the racist hates?

>>48572225
But then you're excluding someone because they just don't like good drow.

>>48572227
any number of reasons. Assuming their hatred isn't to the point of extremely pathological.

The money. Working towards a common goal. Cares more about helping or being with one of the other party members than they do about their hatred.

>>48572367
if they can't get past the fact that they don't like good drow they aren't a good fit for that game.
Also, probably not a player you want to play with ever, because if they can't get past that sort of problem, they're probably really bad to be in a group with.

>>48572544
Eh. As long as it ends with the two of them killing each other I'd feel fine allowing it.