Pathfinder General /pfg/

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I still want to play a sorcerer with elemental savant and that disciple of kord class to fight fire with fire and make sure nothing resists it!

/pfg/, What should I gestalt with Aberrant Aegis to add some versatility? I was considering Synapse Symbiat for the flavor and teleporting, but I'd like a second opinion.

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>>48311524

Hey, /pfg/! How's Saturday treating you?

hhow do i spiritualist?

>>48311524
megumin is cute.

>>48311605
Pretty alright, kinda underwhelmed at the session we had this week though.

Lightweight searching for another weekend game so I got something to do.

>>48311605
Just got basically no-save killed in a game in the first hour, and now I've got nothing to do today at all.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJOovInlk-w

Come all you autist men
Listen to me
I'll sing you a song of the 'shit Mysteries

And its SHITTY WRITING, boys
NO PLAYTESTING, boys
When it uploads
We'll bantz together, boys

Blow ye Gareth's cock, boys
Blow ye dicks, BLOW
Thick-headed Ssalarn, boys, publish he goes!

>>48311605
I've had like four or five drinks so far and intend to get yet another! (It'll be the last, I'm out of soda after this!)

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>>48311717
So what, are you a fan of Incarnum that got all butthurt over Akasha?

>>48311717
Wait why the fuck are you molesting me?

>>48311717
Pretty sure even Gareth knows akasha sucks at this point.

>>48311751
It's not molestation if you, at any point, enjoy it.

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>>48311605
Pretty nice. A game I've waited for over a month finally started and it's been neat.
Except one enemy tried to throw my coffin into lava. What a meanie. I had to timestop to save my coffin.

>>48311751
>>48311757
>Blow ye Gareth's cock, boys
>Blow ye dicks, BLOW
These two lines clearly refer to how /pfg/ blows Gareth's dick, not how Ssalarn blows Gareth's dick.

>>48311605
It's pretty alright, I'm just contemplating the nature of the Dungeon Crasher Fighter. That thing just seems a bit crazy to me, at level 6 you can basically do the same amount of damage a ~15th level Fighter could do in a full round as a standard action. But at the same time it has the limitations of 3.5 combat maneuvers, Bull Rush's weaknesses, and the limited use of being either in a narrow room or some place with obstacles, so it swings wildly between fucking useless and holy shit strong.

>>48311743
To be fair, incarnum was also balls.

I think it's fundamentally flawed for several reasons, though I absolutely love the fluff and the idea.

The main thing is that you get jack shit but small scaling bonuses for directing power around. Veils should get additional abilities based on how much juice is invested, not the soulbinds. Inversely, that's also an annoying shitpile of work.

>>48311751
Because Akashic is a fucking awful book and you should all feel bad for it.

>>48311851
Hey, you know what gives you additional abilities based on how much juice you invest?

Occultist.

Occultist best veilweiver.

Paizo did a job better than DSP.

>>48311757
Eww.

>>48311784
Why is anyone on my dick? I feel like I need an adult. An adultier adult.

>>48311853
I have my disagreements with it but it ain't /that/ bad. Just... annoyingly idiosyncratic.

>>48311910
Gareth, it's a system that takes an excessive amount of effort to make it acquire basic functionality. It is, and this is honestly relatively uncommon in PF, actually difficult to get into.

The DCs on abilities scale oddly and poorly, the abilities themselves range from worthless to incredibly gamebreaking, and there's seemingly no real intent to the balance levels of things.

It's filled with decisions that seem just random and arbitrary, and it overall comes across as a very poorly done, amateur attempt to port an older system that, while not all that amazing in it's execution, was cool. And it damn well deserved better than to be butchered by Sslarn.

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>>48311957
>Ssalarn will also butcher truenaming/Tzocatl

Just kill me now.

>>48311910
Akasha is significantly better than that horse shit you guys call Path of War.

Looking forward to it outselling both the Path of War books once it finally gets released.

>>48311975
Glad other publishers started hiring Ssalarn. DSP is a shit company now.

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>>48311985
>>48312008

>>48312060
DSP turning into shit is why we got that blatant knock off full of disrespect from Owen and Fox man.

Nobody in the industry respects DSP anymore.

>>48311906
I'll buy that, sadly.

Incarnum is also a bit fucky for what it wants to be mechanically. Mostly it works out to fucking with minor ass bonuses and being able to halt the game for at least half an hour while you pick your melds again, with an overall theme of being "The guy based around saving a little money on convenience items by making his own out of not-magic" and doesn't even have the green lantern flexibility that would imply.

I'd like to see "The Guy that can route all power to a specific thing to overcharge it awesomely" or "The Guy that makes stuff out of ghosts he meets in an awesome ghosty partnership" or even "The guy that green-lanterns primal magic into equipment whenever he feels like it, but doesn't delve into higher spellcraft that much".

Hell, I'd take "The guy that uses an innate magic pool to make whatever random magic items he's got super better temporarily."

I'll also say that the synthesist summoner outdoes the totemist at everything the totemist tried to do.

>>48312106
>being able to halt the game for at least half an hour while you pick your melds again,

Confirmed for never actually playing a veilweaver. By the time we reached level 9 I shifted all my shit in less than 15 seconds.

Of course a lot of that had to do with actually paying attention during combat and planning out my turn before initiative reached me. Either way my turn was always shorter than the Gunsmoke Mystic's.

>>48312074
As much as you're right, those guys the animefag replied to are just bait.

DSP's been going the Paizo-route for a while now. Ignoring parts of playtest feedback, taking bad advice with no real reason, and allowing bad writers to stick around. Akashic is the biggest example of it, with Tzocatl only being lower due to it being so fucking god-awful that nobody even knows about it. PoW:E Temptest Gale/Piercing Thunder were lackluster at best despite a lot of feedback, Scarlet Throne Style is still crap, Steelforge hasn't been properly updated with feedback or any material in way too long. The entire way that Gareth's been trying to handle the Blinkling shit is just embarassing, and he should know well enough by now to not respond, but he keeps doing it.

The fact that there're shitposters like Touhou and Buildposter that get associated with DSP, and in Touhou's case give it a bad name by slathering their autism all over it and making people percieve it as overpowered due to entirely unintended mechanics from multiple publishers are also not helping. But that isn't going to stop any time soon.

At least Forrest had the sense to get out of the IRC before she got dragged down with the rest of them. Lets hope for the sake of the company that the others do too, because I gurantee that it won't be long before more shit gets stirred up now.

>>48312160
Played a totemist, waaay back in the day, actually.
And, sadly, with an incarnate who had to agonise over every little thing and treated minor incarnum allotment with all the care and attention reserved for bomb defusing. The game lasted both a very short time, and entirely too long.

>>48311605
Tired of barracks life, only 3 more months.

Nobody here wants to play PnP, it's all working out and drinking.

>>48312199

Akasha is a lot more streamlined than Incarnum, thank god.

>>48312161
> "Handle"
There is no handling it, there is only bemoaning my fate.

As for the rest, feels a touch dramatic, anon. Steelforge is in line behind the errata and it's project lead redeploying to another continent. Folks wanted something out of Tempest Gale that isn't in our power to give them. What is it you want from us? We're as responsive and active as our lives allow.

>>48312244
I haven't read akasha, but that's like saying this pile of smells slightly less shitty than this robot covered dr/3 pile of dog shite.

>>48312246
Maybe an ounce of professionalism and respect?

So /pfg/, I want to try playing something new and fresh. What would you suggest for a 1pp marital character?

>>48312161
>The entire way that Gareth's been trying to handle the Blinkling shit is just embarassing, and he should know well enough by now to not respond, but he keeps doing it.
Why would he ever stop responding to it? That would stop making him the center of attention here in /dspfg/. The more time we spend defending Gareth from bullies, the less time we spend thinking about the points you made about the diminishing quality of DSP's offerings.

>>48312261
...Do you honestly expect professionalism and respect on this, a siamese monkey-flaying site?

>>48312257
Well here's the playtest docs
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?409134-Dreamscarred-Press-Presents-Akashic-Mysteries-Thread-2

The final version will have changes compared to the playtest docs from what I understand.

Have fun man.

>>48312267
A Marital Master Monk.

>>48312268
(you)

>>48312246
(you)

>>48312268
Quit samefagging.

>>48312074
>Nobody in the industry respects DSP anymore.

[citation needed]

Honestly curious. Owen and Foxman with their knockoff is a Paizo-taking-potshots thing, not a 3pp thing. As far as I know, lots of the industry is fine with DSP?

I respect DSP, though I don't respect some of its writers. Personally I'd say that the more recent material is much better than it used to be. Ultimate Psionics was okay, Path of War was shit, PoW E is fun but has problems, but their Occult stuff is great.

>>48312161

What is the problem with Tempest Gale?

What's wrong with Scarlet Throne Style?

Steelforge got a part 1 release a few weeks ago, I believe.

What Blinkling shit? That they exist as a result of "race 1 fucks race 2 and gives birth to race 3"?

>>48312261
>>48312246
Professionalism would be nice, yes. DSP's got like three people who post with an ounce of professionalism. You are not one of them.

>>48312321
>blinkling shit
The fact that Gareth engages with the "blinklings are shota dogboys" shitposters means they'll keep doing it because he gives them attention. If he stops going "oh no woe is my life" every time, they'll go away.

>>48312281
More about the way he harassed other publishers on facebook like an autist or how he's constantly being a shit piece on Paizo boards whenever he's not in the playtest threads.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2tnd8?Pathfinder-Society-for-3PP-OGL#38

>>48312261
... What is it you think you're getting now?

D'ya think we'd spend our time here if we didn't respect you? Engage with your feedback? Ask for your advice? Invite others from the 3pp scene? /Pfg/ is more helpful and insightful inside of an hour than any of our other communities pull off in a month. The honesty and expertise available here is invaluable.

If I, or we, have been more honest and emotional in turn, it's because we've felt invited to be. I've enjoyed the chance to engage like that. I'd rather thought anon did too.

>>48312337

Oh. Well it's probably best to ignore all the sexual shitposters, to be honest.

Then again, OTHER people will be bitching about him ignoring people who want to talk about that stuff?

It's the internet, you can never win.

>>48312340
.......THAT reads as disrepectful and unprofessional to you? What do you want, a simpering yesman?

>>48312314
I know some people. Industry opinion, 3pp and Paizo, is that working for DSP is a scarlet letter.

>>48312340
>complaining about someone being a shitpiece
>linking a reasonable post commenting on how utterly shit a "PFS" for 3pp with a business model built on blackmailing 3pp publishers is

anon... There's much better posts by Gareth to link

>>48312359
> /Pfg/ is more helpful and insightful inside of an hour than any of our other communities pull off in a month.

If you honestly believe that then there is no saving DSP

>>48312372
Interesting. I've tried to submit my own stuff to them before. Why is that? Is it associating with 4chan in the past year?

>>48312340
Triggered much? If that's 'being a shit piece' I'd hate to see what you think of posters like Sir Giacomo.

>>48312386
Well, presumably they sort through the high volume of bullshit to find things they missed.

>>48312372
[citation needed]

>>48312386
lol

>>48312387
>http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2tnd8?Pathfinder-Society-for-3PP-OGL#38

4chan is a good part of it yes. About 60% of it.

>>48312414
Yeah like I'm gonna name my source and get them harassed by a bunch of fa/tg/uys.

>>48312321
Tempest Gale is just kinda lackluster and doesn't do much that's all that useful. Solar Wind at least is kinda alrightish, and TG just loses out to Elemental Flux hard.

Scarlet Throne Style tries to solve 1hing by just making it 2hing, but doesn't even do it properly.

Steelforge 1 got a release, and was decent. The rest of it has been ignored for months, despite a ton of feedback.

The Blinkling shit that Gareth continues to reply to for no reason at all, which just perpetuates that tripfags are attention-whores and gives his company a bad name. And as the dude who's literal job is to be the public face, that's kind of a bad thing.

>>48312246
You could, y'know, not reply. That's fairly easy to do.

As for Tempest Gale, yes, you could indeed do what people wanted, because you are literally the people producing the content. You have consumers/fans that expect, and are owed, given the support that you've been given, a certain level of quality and effort. You guys have been starting to consistently drop the ball on that, and I'm saying this as one of the people who basically idolized you guys.

You WERE the shining beacon of good, reasonably balanced, enjoyable 3pp content that had good public relations and everything. Were. Not are.

You ARE, now, the company that took it's good reputation and used it as an excuse to just not try on further products. You let an absolutely awful writer outright kill three entire projects, despite months and months of negative feedback to him. You've responded to blatant bait and shitposting repeatedly. You've taken the bait and actually talked to Buildposter. You've talked to people like DTG and allowed them to make actual product decisions, despite being nothing more than uneducated shitposters from britbongland.

Like, there's still a chance for shit to turn around. I'm probably not 100% correct on things, because I am admittedly in a somewhat shit state, but you guys HAVE had a drop in quality.

>>48312435
>http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2tnd8?Pathfinder-Society-for-3PP-OGL#38

You keep linking this. Are you the person who wanted to control a 3pp PFS?

>>48312435
Because looking like an obvious liar and shitstirrer who throws a giant hissy fit anytime DSP is brought up is any better, right?

>>48312435
>Yeah like I'm gonna name my source and get them harassed by a bunch of fa/tg/uys.
Does his name rhyme with Narc Rattle?

>>48311569
Still wondering.

>>48312450
>As for Tempest Gale, yes, you could indeed do what people wanted, because you are literally the people producing the content.

I agree with all of this except that. You really expected them to make a discipline that did ranged better than full attacking with bows? Really?

>>48312435
>Yeah like I'm gonna name my source and get them harassed by a bunch of fa/tg/uys.
So you're pulling bullshit out of your ass, got it.

>>48312435
So, basically, it's because they're a bunch of bigots? If you're not pulling shit straight out of your ass, which you probably are. Works of falsehood, etc.

>>48312482
No, I didn't. I expected them to make something that had options that were both thematically interesting, and mechanically worthwhile. As it currently stands, the utility that it gets is lackluster and ineffectual, and doesn't do much of real consequence. It's vaguely interesting, but interesting doesn't make it worthwhile.

>>48312514
That hasn't been my experience with it. Oh well. They can't all be winners.

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Guys, if we keep shit posting, maybe we'll drive DSP away! Then we can just suck paizo dick in this thread!

>>48312450
I'm not gonna do the Gale discussion from my phone; we can open that back up when I get home, if you like.

Akasha is what it is at this point. Truenaming... it's up in the air right now. Ssalarn took Arcforge with him when we separated. I won't say we don't have problems or haven't made mistakes but we've also been learning from them and trying to correct them. I know it's frustrating to hear that circumstances or logistics constrain that, but they do. And I'm sorry about that.

>>48312451
I accidentally linked that again, woops.

>>48312484
There's a reason Deep Throat never named himself until 2005..

>>48312553
why cant we just suck both of their dicks?

>>48312571
Only got one mouth anon.

>>48312558
>Akasha is what it is
But it isn't.
It is literally as simple as killing it. That would be legitimately better, both to the product itself and to the company, than releasing that absolute fucking turd. You are GOING to get bombed on EZG's shit, man. I 100% gurantee it.

>>48312558

Gareth, listen to >>48312585. You're saying "Well, I got this gun, but there's nobody else around, so I guess I'll shoot myself in the foot now." No. Just put the gun down.

>>48312585
It's been released. The final release of it is just compiling all the rest. It's also been part of a multi-year process and probably tons of money, maybe a contract or two.

What makes you think killing a monster like that is simple?

>>48312450

I think Tempest Gale does pretty well to do what it does. Sure, combat maneuvers aren't always the best, but at least it's rather easy to pull them off with Sleight of Hand.

My main issue with it is that Tempest Gale Style doesn't count as Combat Expertise/Power Attack for the purpose of taking combat maneuver-improving feats...

Scarlet Throne Style alone isn't all -too- great, but I feel it does what it does rather well, which is basically yank the riposte & parry from the swashbuckler. Plus the extra 0.5 from strength isn't really all -that- much, anyways, especially since oftentimes people will go dex with 1H.

I don't have much of an opinion on the rest, since I haven't tried one-handing or anything.

>>48312577
With the amount of compensating going on I'm betting one mouth is big enough.

>>48312599
And yet plenty of people use Akasha and it's been generally well-recieved in places that aren't here and making them money, no?

>>48312585
Considering EZG gave all the releases a 4/5 and essentially felated them saying they'd get 5/5 if it cleaned up a few things that he listed, that's doubtful.

Akasha is gonna get a 5/5 and will likely sell very well to the large number of 3pp users that apply Ezg as their only metric of whether to buy something.

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So, in an attempt to get the thread back onto a lighter note. Don't hide it from me, /pfg/.

Tell me about what class you'd choose if you were forced to play that class for every character you make henceforward.

>>48312645
Honestly? Wizard. It's a class that's versatile enough to play lots of things of many power levels especially since my group plays 3.p

>>48312645

Aegis.

>>48312645
Alchemist, easy.

fuck real spells

>>48312558
Did Ssalarn take Arcforge or did Jeremy dump it and he picked it up on the way out?
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20844227&postcount=657

>Unfortunately, DSP has reached a point where some grooming and restructuring really need to happen. As a result, Arcforge will be getting cut from DSP's release schedule

seems to imply that Arcforge was cut and dropped.

>>48312645
Alchemist and a lot of refluffing. It already does damn near everything anyway.

>>48312645
Truly and honestly? Kineticist if 3rd-party is allowed, Unchained Rogue otherwise.

>>48312645
Spheres Royal, if "homebrew" arches are allowed.

Incanter, if not.

>>48312645
Hedgewitch.

Since they steal shit from like half the classes anyway.

>>48312645
Maybe Vizier or Mystic (Amora Game, not DSP)

>>48312645
Wizard.
I want to hit level 20, become an unstoppable demi-god, then go around and help out level 1 adventurers to get them started on their adventures.

Plus I could be hella cute.

>>48312668

Sslaran's been working on it since day 1, I believe, though other writers may have been part of it.

The issue with Arcforge far as I can tell, is that DSP has a ton of writers and projects, but not enough people to do the nitty-gritty of actually making an aesthetically pleasing PDF that they can release.

>>48312713
Also, arcforge being shit. SHIT

>>48312668
The fate of various projects was negotiated. Ssalarn is confident enough to want to continue with Arcforge, which IIRC he's doing? Either way, the separation has been amicable.

>>48312601
This. On top of that, it's, essentially, promised.

>>48312645
Either Aegis or Sorcerer

>>48312733
Just stop posting, man. You're probably digging yourself deeper. Do your bosses know you're posting company secrets?

>>48312645
Aegis.

>>48312733
And going to make more money than any Path of war Product.

>>48312645
I think Sorcerer or perhaps Incanter. Both can be very build-a-specialist which means I could make characters with very different skillsets, strengths, and weaknesses on the same chassis. The only issue in my book would be the lack of skill points except on an INT-canter or that one Sorc archetype.

>>48312748
Said "company secrets" have already been shown in the open in various playtest threads.

So, being out of thread for a while, I come back to this shit show.

What exactly happened here? Summer?

>>48312752
Yeah, probably. PoW is an unbalanced and too strong, but fun mess. Akasha is an unbalanced mess that's too weak to break games and has lots of trap options. Ssalarn knows how to write for paizo fans better than the rest of DSP.

>>48312773
cant really say summer since the most of it is the circlejerk thats been here all year...

Is the Hellknight prestige class worthwhile at all? I love them lore-wise but the class abilities seem kinda lackluster.

>>48312773
Remember the retards who started the 'Paizo General'?

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Guys, I just realised. We can hold Gareth hostage and bully him until he brings us Forrest back.
To start off: BLINKLINGS

>>48312789
/pfg/ used to be nice though.

>>48312773
Basically. The usual shitposters' ranks have been swelled with the summer children to a critical mass of unbearability. They broke QANON, even.

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>>48312816

Can you not

>>48312816
Hey, non of poplar's associates were blinklings!

>>48312818
all of the cool kids left because the weirdos and content creators became too dominant

so now we just kinda got a weird combination of fetishposters, munchkins and straight up slanderous summerfags

its terrible

>>48312838
*popura

>>48312850
Same thing someone wan wan

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>>48312816
Blinklings are shit, kestrals are better.

>>48312847
too much 2hu, too much DSP wank, too much autism.

/pfg/ is not fun anymore, unless you find it fun to shitpost.

>>48312838
>>48312850
**senpai

>>48312816
Just take his alcohol.

>>48312847
>content creators became too dominant

yeaaaah. Can we get less Gareth? I appreciate that DSP and NJolly post here for playtest feedback, but I want less threads dedicated to people whining at Gareth and Gareth whining back.

At least when NJolly or Forrest post it's quick and to the point, or with content.

>>48312869
I can proudly claim that the autism increase is my single-handed achievement.

>>48312856
https://my.mixtape.moe/jaggya.webm

>>48312847
>implying /pfg/ or its predecessor ever had cool kids

>>48312879
If gareth likes posting here so much he could just drop the trip.

>>48312899
my mistake

the tolerable kids

>>48312891
>inferior yamada version
No parfait for you.

>>48312902
If he's trying to deliver official DSP news, then he can't at this point. He's too deep into tripfaggotry.

Really though he's like an annoying attention-whore. Gareth go or at least drop the trip

>>48312856

Wtf now I want a cute miniseries about Momiji and Aya running a noodle shop.

>>48312933
Could be a good idea for Gareth to take some time off from the thread, like a week.

Nothing would improve, but this meme would die

>>48312933
>>48312902
Practically every dev that's been here has stated that they post without a trip when it has nothing to do with DSP/DDS/Legendary/etc.

>>48312983
>Nothing would improve, but this meme would die
This.

>>48312645
3pp allowed? Legendary Rogue. I can take feats to gain full BaB, I've got options to trade SA out for feats or Weapon Training, I've got good skills. I can be a pseudo-mage thanks to certain archetypes, I can make crossbows work thanks to the Autoloader and some Fun interactions, and it'd be decent. Not optimal, but decent.

>>48312816
Forrest's still here you tremendous faggot.

She's just not in IRC anymore.

>>48313069
Pretty sure that's an ircfag

>>48313082
Blinklings are also entirely unconnected to why Forrest left or would potentially come back, so they're just reaching for a flimsy excuse to keep going.

Tell me what you think /pfg/.

For barbarian, fighter, monk and rogue archetypes that replace the same class feature, up to three such archetypes can be taken at once.

Is brawler better than Unchained monk?

>>48313082
Like 40 people are, it's not a small number.

>>48312983
Y'know, sure thing. Peace out, see you in August.

>>48313173
We've done it guys.
Now let's kick out everyone else and it'll finally be perfect place to sucking paizo dick

mmm, the salty taste of caster supremacy

>>48313173
Peace, man. You've earned a vacation.

>>48313173
Have a good month. I honestly mean that.

>>48313173
What the fuck, you guys

>>48313216
It's for the best! I know my breaks from the thread always happen when I get banned, at least.

>>48313173
Do I still get paid for shilling while you're away?

>>48313173
His smile and optimism, gone.

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>>48313173
>Gareth_throughout_the_year.jpg

>>48313230
>gareth
>optimism
Pick o-
No wait, actually now we get to pick none
Fuck

>>48311569
Please?

>>48313262
I don't know abberrant aegis, what're your main stats

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>>48313173

>>48313290
I rolled well for stats, so its currently:
Str: 20
Dex:17
Con:18
Int:16
Wis:15
Cha:12

>>48313326
Harbinger or warder can't hurt, neither could magus. It depends on how you want to spread out your actions.

>>48313173
God fucking DAMNIT anon! We were supposed to trade him for Forrest! Now we've got NEITHER!

>>48313132
What about other classes? Ideally you'd want to have all T3 (non PoW) and below classes to be able to do something like that.

>>48313326
The big thing you have to remember is that Aegis, especially Aberrant Aegis, is a passive class. this means having something to do with your other class (such as initiating, spellcasting, and the like) is the way to go.

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/pfg/

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>>48311605
It's running a bit sluggish. Been running about with a few concepts for a new airship for the party, what with having yet another week to handle our downtime. Still not entirely certain as to how the rest of the group feels on it, however, what with only one other person responding to the notion.

>>48312645
Alternating between Radiance House Occultist and the former but with the 3.5 vestiges.

>>48312645
Definitely the Royal. Cute, yet flexible. Like a contortionist in a bunny suit.

>>48312645
Warder or Psion

>>48312645
Psion or Wizard. Probably Psion. You can make a lot of different characters with those classes and I like being a smartass.

>>48313132
Post character examples.

>>48313132
taken together* you mean.

>tfw I've created a semi-hidden "Flashpoint" subsystem to my campaign that determines just how likely conflict is going to occur between two nations based on events that can be stopped or encouraged by the players

You guys ever create a custom subsystem for your campaign?

>>48312645
Cleric or Oracle, easy.

>>48312585
Last time I looked at DrivethruRPG, Akashic Mysteries was in the same sales category as Path of War, and it hasn't even hit print yet. I doubt killing a project that's making them just as much money as that pile of crap TOB knockoff is going to be a good business decision.

>>48314229
Holy shit, Anon, what do you have against PoW?

Like, that's some serious fucking vitriol for one of the better subsystems out there.

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Question for you people with more time on their hands than me. Is there a way to make a character that can spread its build to nearby people, who in turn spread it to unaffected nearby people, and so on until it reaches some maximum effective range or some other limit is reached?

>>48314275
I dunno, it has some pretty serious problems.

The framework is ok, but a lot of the stuff is borked.

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>>48314340
How exceedingly vague of you.

>>48314380
The base maneuver system like how strikes, counters, and boosts work is fine.

Most of the classes and Disciplines are fucked up.

Feats range from "this should have been core" to "holy shit why even publish this."

So the subsystem itself you could say is fine, but related material is... sub par.

>>48314275
Have you seen the posts in this thread? That's basically a how do you do, comparatively.

And to be frank, both PoW and Akashic stuff are not good subsystems. They're wildly variable in power, require a lot of discussion and fiddling to get proper results, require learning two new subsystems, both about as complex as spellcasting, for as many headaches as spellcasters. They did nothing to fix the mechanical problems with Initiating (one recovery system kicking the shit out of the others) or Incarnum (being an accountant for power or even general use), nor do they improve the system outside of throwing shit at a class and seeing if it stuck.

The only, and I mean only reason PoW/Akashic Mysteries are even a thing comes from secondhand 3.5 optimization wank, picked up by people who find having spells called spells on their character sheet a personal insult.

>>48314454
My sister actually picked up AM much quicker than she picked up other systems like PoW and the occultist. It is fairly simple as far as point based systems go, other than the guru, and unlike occultist using a powerful ability at the wrong time or distributing your points for the wrong circumstances doesn't result in a permanent loss of power for the day.

>>48314521
>>48314454

In play experience even running a level 5 Guru as my first Akashic character wasn't half bad. It was actually pretty easy to micromanage.

>>48314521
>>48314555
>>48314454
Using an AM character is like driving stick. It takes a bit more effort than other cars, but if you're good at it you'll save money on gas and get better performance overall.

>>48314454
>The only, and I mean only reason PoW/Akashic Mysteries are even a thing comes from secondhand 3.5 optimization wank, picked up by people who find having spells called spells on their character sheet a personal insult.

I wouldn't mind it if PoW stuff was called "spells," but the thing is, they really don't play like spells.

Spells:
>Powerful, unique effects with varied combat and noncombat use
>You have a shit-ton of them at once, and generally pick things that you think you'll use, but also pick up silver bullets
>You can run out and have to ration them; it's a gamble of when you want to use something based on future usefulness

Maneuvers
>Powerful, unique abilities that tend to be very, very combat focused, and don't have nearly the utility of spells as far as affecting the world around you
>You only have a couple at once, and they will tend to be mainstays
>You're expected to be using them each round; recovery is an extra ability and a way to help keep combat a bit fresher than spamming the one every round (but you can do that if you want, there's builds for it)
>They don't run out, but they're also not nearly as versatile. You don't have a bunch of them at once to plan for; you've got a small handful.

Call them "spells" if you want because they're varied, unique effects with their own stat block, but they don't PLAY like spells.

They don't play like core martials, but they definitely don't play like spells.

>>48314454
>>48314521
>>48314555
>>48314609
So akashic confirmed better than pow?

>>48314731
Hardly, a huge chunk of the Akashic stuff is not worth the paper it isn't-yet-printed on. "Oh boy, a +2 to Diplomacy and Bluff checks, with +1 more per Essence. THAT'S a big benefit compared to Hand Cannons or a Paladin's Holy Lance."

>>48314731
In that your character is better able to adapt to situations around them, yes.

>>48314755
But you would never have essence invested into both at the same time and they aren't the same slot either.

Why would you even leave essence in non-combat veils while in combat?

>>48314731
They're different things. Akashic is relatively simple to pick up if you're handed a character, but is a nightmare to optimize because there's so much SHIT in the system.

PoW is also easy to pick up ("you have these moves, use them, refresh them"), but it's awkward to optimize in because its balance is out of whack (protip: 6-level initiators are better-balanced. Burning feats on Advanced Study to get higher-level stuff leads to slightly weaker characters with more interesting combats, I've found), but I think it's more fun, to me, personally.

I can't wait for them to reveal the akashic initiator they promised in the Patreon. After the PoW errata, I hope.

>>48314782
Whatever happened to the Pharaoh anyway? Last I heard Ssalarn had just about finished it, but I haven't heard anything on it from DSP.

>>48314782
Gareth expressly said Paizo classes with maneuvers can go fuck themselves because their main classes are king. Guess which ones have 6th level maneuvers.

>>48314810
Guess which classes are more likely to not fuck up a game?

Most of the DSP designed initiator classes are a fucken mess.

>>48314828
The only thing fucking up our game right now is the fucking Ranger, and that's because the Ranger, frankly, should be banned in games that are against one single specific type of enemy to the exclusion of all others.

>>48314844
Is it an archery ranger?

>>48314844

What are you fighting that takes up the vast bulk of the enemy encounters? And how did he know it?

>>48314859
Yep.

>>48314844
Thinking damage and killing things is the be all and end all.

>>48314810
Even if that was HIS motivation for stuff, that wasn't, afaik, the team's motivation. Gareth's a whiny asshole.

I have played extensively with the initiators and I've found the 6-level initiators are the best ones. Rubato, Hidden Blade, Polymath, and Warpath have been super fun and decently-balanced. I'm looking forward to trying a Night Terror.

tbqh they need less Gareth writing classes and more Forrest. Everything he's written has been great in the games I'm in.

>>48314809
It wasn't anywhere near finished when it was a part of the playtesting. It was also pretty terrible.

>>48314889
Undead. We're fighting Undead, to the exclusion of all else, because we're Anti-Undead Jihadis. And while our tank basically can't die as a Warder/Cleric/Battle Templar, our Ranger does about twice the DPR.

>>48314909
It is in relation to the "MUH DSP CLASSES ARE OP IN COMBAT" bullshit people are spouting.

>>48314914
Gareth's only ever written the Zealot, Harbinger, and like one of the archetypes at-most, I thought?

>>48314914
Gareth wrote Harbinger, Rubato, and a bunch of PrCs. What's wrong with them?

>>48314894
Ok, then what you're experiencing is Achery enemy deletion, not Ranger's being OP. Any full BAB and even some 3/4th BAB characters focused on archery will run into the same problems in your campaign.

Archery is fucked up.

>>48314914
A lot of Ssalarn's stuff goes through a ton of drafts, it's likely he had another draft of it that was yet to be released.

>>48314953
>>48314951

Didn't he write a good number of feats and the Discipline Organizations?

>>48314984
Dunno about feats but the Traditions were him yeah.

So I had an idea that would kind of bring the 4e Ardent into PF, using the spiritualist as a base. Lose the spirit altogether, and instead gain an emotional focus yourself. the abilities wouldn't translate 1-1, but they'd be similar (anger would increase your damage, lust would cause opponents to focus on you, devotion would protect your allies, etc.) You'd gain a few different emotional mantles as you level up, changing them around with a minute or so of concentration, with a capstone of being able to use 2 at once. I'd probably also switch the casting to charisma, since it's all the force of your own emotions.

Is this concept worth working on?

>>48314951
Okay, sorry. Less uh. ErrantX? Less Gareth in general imo, I don't like his outlook.

>>48315026
Basically I want them to make Forrest write more initiators, because everything about the Fool's Errand stuff is amazing. Also to get him to come back to irc.

>>48315026
>>48314914
Why do you guys think that?

>>48315067
Because the 9-level initiators tend to be broken.

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>this thread
I leave for Alaska, and when I get internet access to check this place this shit happens?

Holy fuck what is it about this time of the year that causes contrarians to boil out of the woodwork?

Seriously, I may have never cared much for the tripworship that went on, but this thread is some whole new level of faggotry.

Seriously, are we being fucking raided or something? Did Ssalard make some evil pact with Paizuri or something? What the fuck is going on?

>>48315067
>>48315085
Why do you guys dislike Gareth, I mean.

>>48315089
It's good.

>>48315095
Because he's a whiny bitch who writes based on being angry about Paizo.

>>48315089
What the goddamn fuck are you blathering about, you filthy fucking cockmongler.

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>>48315095
I haven't been paying as much attention to the threads recently, but between a few actual in depth grievances with his writing, I would surmise that familiarity breeds contempt; the more the chinz see him, the more they begin to just hate his guts. It's kinda one of the reasons I've been trying to stay back away as of late.

So /tg/,

Say there was an evil man whose skills mostly involved cooking. What type of grandiose plots would he have to move up in the world?

>>48315294
Baking the King... into a pie!

>>48315294

Food golems and his dish-specialist lieutenants to subjugate the populace, whom he then forces to consume highly experimental (and often incredibly harmful) dishes in an aggressive "trial by error" approach to cooking?

>>48315294
He kidnaps the princess and forces her to suffer the indignity of being used as the silver platter upon which he serves his finest hors d'ouvres.

>>48315294
Through superior cooking skills, he will try and convince all other inferior cooks that the only way to get ahead is to copy his recipes, thereby culling their creativity while he becomes the only source of innovation in the cooking world.

>>48312450
>despite being nothing more than uneducated shitposters from britbongland.
I've got no dog in this race, but I feel like you might be hurting your case by using words like "britbongland". I mean, sure, it probably entertains some of the other people around here, but it kind of hampers your ability to be taken seriously in anything approaching an actual discussion.

>>48315482
Except Downtime God is actually from england, and he was a fairly prominent shitposter that, AFAIK, helped DSP with some stuff for Fool's Errand

>>48315520
I was there in the irc when he did, and it was mostly doing playtesting with his group and poking holes in abuses (to get them fixed).

>>48315552
A small amount of helpfulness doesn't stop him being a shitposter.

>>48315564
Then why are you still posting? You're not going to stop being a shitposter, ESPECIALLY since you have absolutely nothing of worth to add to anything here.

>>48314755
>. "Oh boy, a +2 to Diplomacy and Bluff checks, with +1 more per Essence. THAT'S a big benefit compared to Hand Cannons or a Paladin's Holy Lance."
"Oh shit, I'm at a fancy noble gala, and the courtiers here don't seem to like it when I shoot them with my giant magical hand cannons. Gee, if only I had access to something to help me navigate this social minefield."

Despite the common perception, not every game is all combat, all the time. Sometimes, a bonus to social skills actually is a very useful thing to have.

>>48314454
>They did nothing to fix the mechanical problems with Initiating (one recovery system kicking the shit out of the others)
Are you for fucking real? That was in no way the problem with ToB or PoW.

>>48315089
>Holy fuck what is it about this time of the year that causes contrarians to boil out of the woodwork?
Are you being facetious? It really is hard to tell on this site.

If you're not... school's out for the summer. All the kids have nothing to do all day, so they flood the internet in search of entertainment. 4chan is a beacon for anyone who thinks it's funny to just run around starting shit for no reason with no real consequences thanks to the anonymity, so I'm sure a disproportionate number of them end up here.

This has been a problem in online forums since there have been online forums, summer always brings a flood of bored kids.

Damn, I've been out of the loop and I just looked up Fool's Errand. This is a fun discipline. I especially like how the coolness factor of the manuever names has gone up since the original PoW.

Guys, are there any good one-on-one adventure modules?

>>48315520
The point isn't whether or not someone is from England, it's that using the term "britbongland" to refer to England defeats your assumed purpose of actually convincing somebody else to take your words seriously and give thought to what you're saying.

It's fine if you're just fucking around and looking to entertain yourself or whatever, but the tone of the rest of your comment made it seem like you were trying to have an actual adult conversation with someone and persuade them to see things your way. I was just pointing out that using silly, dismissive terms like "britbongland" is a terrible approach if that was your goal.

>>48315822
get out of here you dsp shill

>>48315111
In what way?
He does seem to be overly angered by Paizo for some reason, but maybe that's projection.

>>48315822
Yes it is fun. Now, did you actually have a question, or are you just wasting time?
Because all your post will do is bait in shillfag to scream bloody under at the top of his lungs

Oi.

Did some errata happen regarding gauntlets letting you use them as if unarmed, or not?

I recall hearing about that a while back, but I can't remember if it was an actual thing or not.

>>48314555
>>48314521
The plural of anecdote is not data, but Veilweaving is the simpler option of the two. That doesn't make it simple, or less complex and fiddly by itself. The Occultist managed to take an already fiddly concept (Essentia) and make it worse because lolPaizo. Initiating is Vancian spellcasting on an in-combat refresh timer. You'd have to try to make something less intuitive than the Occultist.

A player is more eager to grasp new mechanics than a DM, but the DM decides what gets in. DMs are a lazy and shiftless lot, so telling them "hey, I want to play this character with a whole new resource management system and all new powers" is like saying "I am a huge powergaming faggot, please rape my face" unless the DM is already amenable (and hopefully, knowledgeable) with the system.

>>48314730
A player will come out with whatever martial focused silver bullets are available in the armory, just like they rock with whatever spells are consistently useful as a full caster.

The pitch for Maneuvers can just as easily describe a spontaneous caster who focuses on damage/combat control with some way to regain spell slots (5e Sorcerer, 3.X Versatile Spellcaster), just as the Spells pitch can describe a clever Initiator who snatches stuff like the flight and Incorporeal stances, cherry-picking Strikes (but honestly more Counters, Boosts and Stances) that can solve a problem right now.

The specific refresh mechanics are certainly different, but the core system is Vancian. The whole purpose of ToB was "give spells to martials" over a decade ago, oniifam.

But regardless, think of it this way: PoW and Akashic Mysteries are the standard. A player comes up to you saying "I want to play this 3pp class: (Wizard/Arcanist), they do (arcane full caster bullshit)". You have no idea what the capabilities of the class are, outside maybe some vague grumblings of brokenness. Would you honestly be cool with that?

>>48315911
>Did some errata happen regarding gauntlets letting you use them as if unarmed, or not?

From the rules for Gauntlets:

>Benefit: This metal glove lets you deal lethal damage rather than nonlethal damage with unarmed strikes. A strike with a gauntlet is otherwise considered an unarmed attack.

The CRB defines "unarmed strike" and "unarmed attack" as the same thing.

>>48315822
I thought the Grab ability on the Fiendbound Marauder's Fiend's Grip was awesome... now I'd give almost anything to trade it for the Contender's free grasp attempts for melee attacks. I have absolutely fallen in love with Fool's Errand... even the backstory behind the discipline resonates with me, as someone who's had a soft spot for pure martials for most of my gaming career. The idea of starting a badass martial school solely as a big old "fuck you" to those damn smug mages just really gets to me.

>>48315912
>The whole purpose of ToB was "give spells to martials" over a decade ago, oniifam.
Self-contained abilities = spells is the DUMBEST fucking brainbug ever. Get the fuck out of here with this shit.

>>48315111
I though the only time that happened was when he said he made the Black Thorn Knights because the Hellknights (which at the time had pretty trash lore coverage and support) we're super disappointing to him and he wanted something better

>>48315908
Gosh sorry senpai I just thought I'd throw that out there

>>48315908
Dude, if you haven't learned to drown out the screeching assholes by now, you should probably find a different site.

>>48315930
Alright. And that never got errata'd or something to stop the obvious result that is you can just enchant gauntlets as weapons and punchpeople don't have to worry about Amulets of Mighty Fists?

>>48315963
AoMF is a shitty item that should have never existed, so it's really not much of a loss.

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>>48315972
This is me just checking, not complaining.

Aces.

>>48315957
I'm warning the other anon that he should be mindful of what he posts, since it wouldn't do for some newsagents to give the shitposter more ammo. We can't always rely on a based janitor to remove shillfag all the time

>>48316019
The shitposter can give himself ammo if he really felt like it. Why do you care?

>>48315963
I vaguely remember Jacobs saying something about "but unarmed strikes aren't limited to fists, so enchanting gauntlets for unarmed strikes doesn't work" but it was a while back, and I proceeded to ignore that ruling so hard I can't remember anything about what it actually is. As >>48315972 mentioned, you don't really lose anything out of the deal, except maybe if you really love monks suffering.

>>48314308
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/psionic-powers/m/mind-seed

>>48316049
You can use the gauntlets, but only when attacking with the gauntlets. It's not gonna buff your unarmed strikes, but your unarmed strike effects WILL buff the gauntlets.

You can then only attack with that one hand though.

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>>48316049
>tfw remembering SKR going "if you're using a weapon you have to make half of your flurry of blows attacks unarmed and half of them with the weapon" as if that was something that made any sense to anyone who wasn't him

>>48316105
Except it didn't make sense to him either. He was literally towing the company line on Bullshitmans orders.

>>48316070
>You can then only attack with that one hand though.
Which you can easily pull off mechanically, but the imagery looks... weird.

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>>48316194

>>48316264
Gene fought using both hands.

>>48314920
Congrats, you found the one situation where Rangers are super good. Bronze star.

The question that should be asked about classes is not "is this too OP," but "Am I invalidated by/invalidating other characters?"

>>48316105
>>48316171
It almost makes me sad, the way we reviled and demonized SKR, now that we know he was just the company scapegoat. But he still chose to say their lines for them.

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>>48316306
did he? Fuck, it's been years since I played it.

Get two gauntlets then

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>>48315938
Are you retarded? They come in schools you can specialize in, they come in nine levels that scale in the exact same way as spells, you have to take 10 minutes of downtime to switch them around, they use the same wording to set up as spells, and you only get to prepare one of each ability to start with, like a Wizard with OCD.

I'm sorry if this triggers you, but call a spade a spade. The Barbarian's Rage Powers, Inquisitor Inquisitions, Hunter Aspects, Alchemist Discoveries, Warlord Gambits, Aegis abilities: there are so many other hills you could choose to die on, but you choose to die on the one literally set up like spells?

Fuck outta here.

>>48312645
>>48312645
Oracle, easily.

>>48316527
No concentration checks. No potions.l No scrolls. No UMD to mimic maneuvers you don't know. There's no maneuver casting service. No material components. No maneuver like abilities. No maneuver resistance. No detect maneuver. No level 0 maneuvers. No rules for scribbling a maneuver in your maneuver book. No meta maneuver feats.

>>48316694
>This guy doesn't have a maneuver book
Get a load of this scrub

>>48316694
Let's not forget that maneuvers have a prerequisite system.

>>48312645
If 3PP is allowed then my answer is beguiler. There's a ton of different ways to build one to fill different roles. It would probably never be the most powerful character at the table, but it'd take a long time to get bored with it.

>>48311717
Why do you post this picture every thread?
I wish you would stop, or leave.

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>>48316703
I gotta admit, playing an initiator that's writing a fechtbook would be awesome.

>>48316883
Then don't respond to him, retard.

How are the kinetic and psyhic classes?

>>48312161
>Touhou's case give it a bad name by slathering their autism all over it and making people percieve it as overpowered
PoW1 really is overpowered though.

>>48316933
Kineticist has a bad rap because of the self-burn mechanic; it also has some very clearly poor design decisions. It's either a high tier 5 or low tier 4 class in most instances, though I'm sure there's some way to make it work.

If you plan on using the Kineticist class, ask your GM to let your burn mechanic affect Stamina, from the stamina subsystem in Unchained rather than your HP; it solves a lot of the problems the class has.

The psychic, meanwhile, is basically an intelligence based sorcerer with a spell list more focused on cerebral stuff. As such it's a tier 2 or so class with a heavy leaning on mind-affecting and similar. It can be very good in the right hands.

>>48316968
Right physic it is. I'm playing 5th ed for DND and playing this in pathfinder will scratch my psionic itch while I wait for the Mystic class to be offically released.

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>>48317068
> I'm playing 5th ed for DND and playing this in pathfinder I'm playing 5th ed for DND and playing this in pathfinder will scratch my psionic itch while I wait for the Mystic class to be offically released.
> will scratch scratch my psionic itch
> my psionic itch
> psionic itch
> psionic
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed

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>>48315728

A vizier has the luxury of reselecting their veils a limited number of times per day, but the guru and the daevic do not. The latter two classes have a low amount of veils until the higher levels, and thus every veil they can shape is precious.

While the guru and the daevic can indeed be optimized into a highly efficient inquisitor-type and a barbarian-type respectively, they must avoid the many superfluous and situational veils in their lists.

Also, given how blatantly visible veils with at least one point of essence are, and the relatively low Knowledge (arcana) checks it takes to identify veils and their properties, it could be seen as a major faux pas to walk around with a veil that charms minds (Cuirass of Confidence) or grants a bonus to Bluff (Waistband of the Wealthy). I could see a veil that grants a bonus to Diplomacy and Intimidate (Vestments of the Maharaja) likewise being looked upon leerily.

>>48312645
I have a strong demand for aegis 3/psyarm x, but in the spirit of "one class"

Wizard.

>>48317150
>Metaforge
FTFY

>>48312645
Bard, or maybe Investigator
provided of course that I can use the Rubato and Polymath when I feel like it.

What feats do I need to make a Bastard Sword + Buckler build work? I'll be switching from 2h to 1h to cast spells and I'm gonna want to have some kind of defense

>>48315819
>This has been a problem in online forums since there have been online forums, summer always brings a flood of bored kids.

You know what's funny, is that's actually not quite true.

When Usenet was in its infancy, it was actually *September* people dreaded, because most people couldn't access Usenet at home, and September meant an influx of new college and university students who didn't know the rules, codes of conduct, or community standards.
This all changed in 1993, when AOL started offering free Usenet access. Fittingly(?), that too happened in September. It's been referred to as the September That Never Ended, or the Unending September, because Usenet never really recovered from its userbase multiplying by an order of magnitude, 99% of whom were idiots.

>>48317251
Oldfag detected. Kinda envious, never really got to appreciate those times myself. I know it probably wasn't legit better, just nostalgia, but it's still something different.

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>>48317251
>>Usenet

>>48316968
>>48316968

>>If you plan on using the Kineticist class, ask your GM to let your burn mechanic affect Stamina, from the stamina subsystem in Unchained rather than your HP; it solves a lot of the problems the class has.

That seems like a really neat idea; how well does it scale? Being able to rest off burn is useful, but I don't see how you make it work well later, when burn starts costing a lot of HP compared to how much stamina you have, especially when you want a burn or two for defense and overload.

Am I thinking about this the right way?

>>48317389
You are. You essentially need to start either scaling up how much stamina a kineticist has access to, or scaling down costs, though for higher end stuff.

If you can get past that hurdle, though, it still leaves the class primarily constitution based due to the way stamina works and gives you a way to actually maintain a real "all day" status, even if you need rest periods in between, rather than slapping yourself really hard in the face to get some effects other casters can just pull out of their ass.

I'd say the stamina pool problem can be readily solved in one of two ways; the first is to add a kineticist class feature that gives them a bonus amount of stamina equal to their kineticist level.

Another would be to give them a class feature that multiplies the increase to their stamina pool they get from constitution. So, like, at level 1 you could get x1.5. At level 5, that could go up to x2. At level 9 it goes up to x2.5, At level 13 it goes up to x3, and at 17 it'd go up to x3.5. As a heavily constitution based class, that'd allow for relatively expansive pools without pushing too hard.

>>48316061
Huh, interesting spell. I'll consider it, although I was hoping for something a little faster-acting and a lot less permanent.

>>48311605
The guy in our group who refused to say what he was playing in our session today turned out to be a rogue. It then later turned out that he was a vigilante, and nobody in-character knows the difference between his identities.

>>48317116
Hmm I'm still thinking I'll go with the psychic.

>>48316694
There were totally menauver scrolls. They were called Martial Scrips; you read them, and they let you ready a single maneuver once.

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>>48317484
That actually sounds like an interesting vigilante dealio- You're such an exemplar anyone can put on the mask.

Actually, that sounds like an interesting hook in and of itself, having a masked social persona and just being a dude that hits shit for a day job.

Oh hey.

One of the options a Monster Cowboy can take as their mount is a Winter Wolf.

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>>48317532
>You're such an exemplar anyone can put on the mask.

And people will suddenly start to care about who they are.

>>48317793
>baneposting might have helped a struggling mother and her baby
jesus christ

>>48317870
Turns out someone DID care before he put on a mask.

Asking again:

Trying to come up with a way to port the 4e Ardent into pathfinder; considering using the Spiritualist as a jumping-off point and letting the character gain an emotional focus, removing the phantom entirely. The end result would be a sort of hybrid Fighter/Spiritualist. Worth working on?

>>48317923
Tell me of the Ardent, for I know not of its mysteries.

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Could a hellcat-blooded tiefling be a catboy?

>>48318015
Do your thing, mods.

>>48317995
In 4e, it was a psionic melee tank that used surging emotions to buff itself/allies and debuff enemies. In 3.5 I think it did a similar thing, but it was in Complete Psionic so it was garbage.

Currently my idea is to eliminate the spiritualist's phantom entirely, give it medium armor/martial weapons/shields, and let it gain an emotional focus like a phantom - granting some abilities that are always active and some that can be activated in combat. Probably going to let it gain new focuses and swap between them as they level. Capstone might be maintaining 2 at once. The spiritualist's emotional foci won't translate 1-1, but they're good starting points.

>>48312645
Prolly sorcerer or arcanist.
I rarely get a chance to play others anyways

Is it possible to have an effect that causes enemies to enRage?
I could only find the spell Rage, that however only applies to willing targets.

>>48316933
Kineticist is crap in its default, basic 1pp form. Further danger: most of its archetypes make it *worse* than it already is. The basic kineticist combines the worst aspects of "blaster spells" and "martials can't have nice things".

Of course, we're all 'tisms here, so we still find ways to make it work.

Where it gets interesting is the 3pp stuff. Everyone berserk-rage-charged the kineticist to fix it in myriads of ways, and the results have ranged from trash (well duh) to spectacular upgrades that can turn it into an honest-to-goodness powerhouse.

Hell even just the extra elements and wild talents from Porphyra can be enough to ALMOST salvage Wood, and can drastically improve the performance envelope of a standard or red-rated archtype into something you'll be happy getting a use out of.

When you combine those with the everyman gunner kineticist (we need that in the trove if it's not there already) whatever it was called, or with the Avant-Guard, suddenly you're playing an entirely different class, having gone from "Cantripman; Master of elementally fucking himself up the ass until he dies" to "R-9 w/ Standard Force"

>>48318191
An Oracle Revelation... I think Mantle Of Moonlight lets you force people into a Rage.

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>>48317142
This.
The veil detection and identification is DANGEROUSLY easy, and the things get visible. They're glowingly THERE.

You can't just walk into a party with this shit on, you're announcing to about 35-40% of untrained level 1 commoners (that's about 1/3 people in a crowd all able to point and yell) that you're covered in active spells, and anyone remotely more educated has a very good chance of telling at a fucking glance (less if veilweaving's completely unknown in the region, but at a party that's STILL going to be dozens of people too many) that you're covered in fucking mind-affecting fields.

You are literally walking around with giant neon "AM MINDRAPE MAN" signs all over your person, and you're supposed to SOMEHOW use this shit in ways that doesn't just turn into a fucking fight? Better rape their brains and quick, because they're reaching for the silverware.

>>48316359
Then here's a way to feel better about your dislike for SKR!

https://web.archive.org/web/20140202043441/http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/misc/featpointsystem.html

>>48318191
Well, if it doesn't say you can't rage the willing...

Get a collective system and force'em into it!
Then you can rage'em whatever their damned consent might be!

>>48318285
To his credit, the core idea is sound; not all feats are on the same level of power, so them all costing the same is kinda dumb.

To his detriment, his list has SKILL FOCUS costing almost twice as much as NATURAL SPELL.

>>48318353
I mean, that's really what's being pointed out. The idea is kind of fine, the execution is awful.

>>48318206
Where is the Gunner Kineticist found? In what PDF? I can go and buy it and get it cleaned, if need be.

>>48318375
>>48318353
If I had to guess, the logic behind it is "Natural Spell is only useful for one class, but any class can make use of Skill Focus or Weapon Focus". It's still fucking stupid, but at least it has a method to the madness.

>>48318415
Wouldn't explain metamagic being the same way

>>48318424
That's because you still need to have spells to take advantage of Metamagic!

Skill Focus is A L L D A Y

>>48318424
His logic is 'metamagic takes up more daily resources, therefore limiting its use compared to something that's always on'

Which makes a twisted kind of sense for metamagic but not for natural spell.

>>48318406
Not anon (well okay we're all anon) but according to NJolly's guide it's found in http://paizo.com/products/btpy9mc8?Everyman-Options-Kineticists

He's marked both it and the Elemental Blade archetype found in that book as purples.

>>48316359
He deserves it for not making a stand.

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>>48318036

>psionic melee tank

Ardents are one of the frailest classes in all of D&D 4e. They have only chainmail proficiency and no shield proficiency. Charisma/Constitution-based ardents can have reasonably high hit points, healing surges, and non-AC defenses, but their AC is still rock-bottom, which is a terrible prospect for a melee character. Charisma/Wisdom-based ardents are even worse off; all of their defenses but Will are quite low and their hit points are mediocre, making them ironically fragile for a supposedly "prescient defense"-themed build.

The closest possible subsystem to 4e's AEDU abilities would be a Path of War initiator. The zealot is already a Charisma-based psionic melee leader who mentally bolsters allies to have them fight with greater prowess. I would advise simply reflavoring a zealot into an ardent. If anything, given how mediocre ardents are in 4e, a zealot would be a far better (and more durable in full plate) combatant for their respective system.

>>48318548
But 4e is totally balanced! you're just a brain damaged 3aboo!

>>48318569
Being mediocre in 4e means it'd be still, like, t3 in 3.PF.

>>48313173
See you tomorrow.

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>>48318638

As they currently stand with all errata applied and all official sources permitted, D&D 4e's classes span from roughly high tier 3 to low tier 4, with the unequivocally tier 4 classes appearing only in the Player's Handbook 3 onwards (the seeker being the first specimen).

The ardent would be the equivalent of a low tier 3/high tier 4, perhaps more towards tier 4 as a Charisma/Wisdom-based ardent.

>>48318772
The other thing is that applying 3.X tiers to 4e classes is a bit pointless because they are specifically designed to have limits and blindspots in their skillsets so as to encourages varied parties that are there to cover for each other.
There is no class above tier 3, but the point of 4e character optimisation isn't to make a tier 1 monster of a character, it is to make a cohesive tier 1 monster of a party.

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>be level 20 paladin with 10 mythic tiers
>ridiculously high saving throws, immunities everywhere
>sleep for 2 hours because of Ring of Sustenance

>this plant sneaks into my room while I sleep

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/plants/griefgall
>Parasitize (Su)

>As a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity, a griefgall can implant itself or a seedling inside an adjacent helpless or willing humanoid's throat.

>An implanted seedling becomes a fully grown griefgall in 1 minute, during which time the seedling can be removed by a creature other than the target with a successful DC 20 Heal check. An implanted griefgall's filaments infiltrate the host's nervous system, controlling the host as dominate person. This control is not prevented by protection from evil or similar effects, nor does the host receive saving throws to resist control. Each day, the griefgall deals 1d2 points of Charisma damage to its host by feeding on its emotions.

>The griefgall shares the same space as its host without detriment to either, uses its flowers to see and hear, and can attack independently of its host, including with its tendrils from within the host's mouth.

Is this like one of my Japanese doujins where the god-tier heroine gets violated and mind controlled by a tentacle monster?

>>48318815
Your DM is a bully. That is not ok to do.

>>48318825
There is no GM.

>>48318880
What?

>>48318815
>lives in your mouth
>disguises its brain-controlling tendrils as a beautiful flower crown
Not quite the usual hentai but I could see it.

>>48318815
You were probably acting like a faggot like most paladin players do.
A few things to do: Stop applying your smite damage after the GM has told you that it isnt an evil enemy. Stop "forgetting" to count how many LoH you have left, and stop acting like paladins actually have legitimate authority.

>>48318815
Break Enchantment will remove the effect.

>>48318909
Translation:
>I played with a cheater once, he happened to play a paladin, and now I irrationally hate the whole class

>>48313132
Post examples.

>>48318815
What was your perception like? Because being asleep does not prevent it, it only adds 10 to the opposed test in favor of the stealth. A mythic 10, level 20 character, I have a hard time believing you did not at least have a chance at detecting it (at such levels I think the lowest in the party I was in was myself at like +38).

now TECHNICALLY you "only" get a second perception check to wake up, as pure RAW jamming its tentacle cocks down your throats does not deal damage, and so does not autowake you. But that's two, and if you wake up a DC20 heal check should be a fucking breeze for you.

In either of those cases you at least could use surges on there to increase the die, as you're allowed to use them on reflexive/passive things such as initiative, saving throws, perception, etc, not just on 'active' rolls like attacks or craft checks.

Now it's important to ask; was the GM perhaps explaining it slowly, giving you a few moments between each action, maybe looking to see if you've got something? Or was this a "cutscene" where you just get told what happened haha you're fucked?

If the latter, after you punch the fuck out of him ask him why you werent allowed to spend surge on your perception rolls (there's at least the two, maybe more if it had to lockpick your door/window or something first).

Now assuming it's inside you there's some good news and bad news.

The bad news is you're perma-dominated. After you knock the DM's teeth in for cinematically going "oh and then your paladin was tentacle-raped and mindcontrolled you have no saves haha I'm so fucking turned on irght now aren't you anon" you've still got some chances, and good ones to boot.

First, you now have visible, detectable flowers sticking out of you, usually as some kind of flower ornament or headdress, but careful examination (at APL6. mythic 20s should notice this shit with a cursory glance at a few hundred paces) will reveal filaments going into your fucking head through the orifices

>>48318974
Now then:
AoEs affect it not just you. Not "only it if you fail the save first": you BOTH, you and the flower, have to save your own saves against them fireballs and shit.

Second, hitting a griefgall at -4 should be something you can trust a level 20 frothing-berserker to clinically achieve effortlessly with his battleaxe like it was fucking robotic neurosurgery. In either case the thing can be killed in seconds flat, but you might not be allowedto let them (you're dominated). Still, if bill across the street sees you, he's basically one knowledge check from going "PLANTS IN HER HEAD NUKE THEM OUT" and vaporizing them before you can even react (assuming bill actually loves you and didn't put that thing in your room. who's bill?)

Additionally: to aid in the former bit: ithas its OWN senses, it externalises parts of itself to see what the fuck it's doing. even if YOU can't be snuck up on (and you obviously can unless the GM fucking cheated) IT can.

Maybe next time you'll install automated beam turrets where you sleep to vaporize gods, demigods and brain-control-plants that try to sneak a coup de grace or vegan tentacle rape on you.

It's a good habit to have.

Hey /pfg/, I am planning on running a Pathfinder campaign using the settlement building rules so that the PC's can have a home base to go back to. Are there any other optional rule sets/books/supplements that I should be using for that. Also, are there any suggestions about conditions I should have if the group wants to go an evil campaign or shift focus into more dungeon crawl type of situations instead of the more settlement building/open world aspects of the game?

>>48319038
>the settlement building rules
They are shit.
Under those rules, the optimal city has only one hex full of banks and no other buildings, not even houses.

>>48319053
>>48319038
Right, my bad. Banks and mills, not only banks.

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>>48319053
>>48319087

The optimal *kingdom* is a one-hex, one-city kingdom filled with nothing but banks and mills.

Paizo's kingdom building rules are the logical conclusion of "too big to fail."

>>48319053
Would there be a better way of doing it, such as having the settlement building be more of a reference, and not being in the players' hands. Mostly just to know the gold values of different buildings and having it not use the system, instead having less specific effects that the players do not necessarily interact with?

>>48319112
That would effectively require you to rewrite the whole system.

>>48311843
>and the limited use of being either in a narrow room or some place with obstacles
Can't you get flight and bullrush things into ground?

>>48319118
Taking it out of the players' hands would enable me to do that rather easily, making civilizations based on several ethnographical questions instead of arbitrary numbers. Using the stuff on /wbg/ would be a lot better than using the actual in-game systems, at least in theory.

>>48319125
>Press to the Wall to flank with the floor

New thread
>>48319252
>>48319252
>>48319252
>>48319252