Orc Queen

>>48066347
Do her similar to Gul'dan, powerful magic user that uses manipulation and backstabbings to gain power and get the orcs to do her bidding.

>>48066347
About what?

monstergirl magical realm detected

>>48066379
Or you can make her Orgrim Doomhammer with tits. She wants to conquer the world. She isn't an average dumb so she knows how to find allies and form legitimate strategies.

>>48066379
>>48066431
Is WoW the only fantasy you've ever experienced or something?

How many human slaves wat do does she have?

>>48066387
Do Orcs count as monster girls these days? I was under the impression that the definition required a beast half fused in some way to a human.

>>48066347

How about you leave your shitty magical realm out of your fucking games you dingus.

Make her a grotesquely overgrown matron Orc borne aloft on a bier by a hundred slaves.

Think a green Greasus Goldtooth with big ol' saggy titties and medicine ball muscles.

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>>48066347
She wants to civilize their orc tribe and get married with a human noble.
Her main asset is that the interespecies breeding get hybrids as result and she can't have a descendant line. So she needs create a new race biologically compatible with humans and orcs. Neither of them are into it of course. So she needs the players to get secretly what she wants. A fuckable human noble, breeding magic and a way to unite all.

>>48066463
Don't reply to moronic trolls. Don't reply to >>48066472
either: he's also a moronic troll. Or just a moronic sperg. Either way, don't feed them.

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>>48066480
Something along these lines?

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>>48066480
Or this?

>>48066347
Your setting has gendered orcs?
Your setting's orcs respect nobility rather than brute force?
What makes them not green skinned humans?
If they are just green skinned humans, you're throwing out any pretense they aren't a black savages stand in, so make them Zulus.

>>48066480
Ooh, that's good.
I love a bit of Orc smut as much as the next faggot but going hard against sex-appeal is a must when making a female BBEG.

>>48066628
Ooooh, I like that one. Kind of a riff on pig orks.

>>48066681
Weird how she has three tits tho

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>>48066708
Yeah...

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A matriarch, overgrown and hideous from her deformities, even to her subjects, she has been exposed to forces of magic nobody can imagine. She can sense nothing from her own body, but can see from the eyes of any of her subjects, hear from her subjects' ears, and feel from her subjects skin. Those that undergo a ritual can experience a power like hers, at the cost of their own vision, hearing, and pain sensitivity. The connection works both ways, with the Awakened being able to nudge others in the correct direction, depending on what sense they are sharing. Indication with vision, whispers with hearing, tugs and body twitches with feeling.

Eye symbols feature prominently in the kingdom that has begun conquering their neighbors because of their ability to coordinate. The resistance has a crossed-out eye as a symbol.

All the enemies are highly organized with gang-leader units that are blind/deaf/have no sense of pain, but have nothing if their subjects are destroyed. The pain ones are the worst since they just keep going, but killing their minions causes pain to the leaders.

If the matriarch says anything in the end, it's very little, as she cannot even see the party approach her chamber (assuming they kill everybody in the way).

>>48066708
Could be a bug bite or sting.

We played just recently with an orc queen as the BBEG. Her plan was to rise above some warring clans to a proper civilization, so the obvious solution was to do the orc method and raid the fuck out of the kingdom nearby and basically steal it.

Unfortunately we failed to stop her in time, by which point she killed the royal family except the king and forcibly married him, changing from BBEG to our employer.

>Sorry King Brent, your loss and humiliation will not be forgotten.

>>48066824
>>48066708
I think it's just a perspective thing, fourth one is out of sight.

>>48066772
Kinda cool

>>48066387
>>48066472
>hurr magical realm
fuck off

>>48066347
The orcish king who united a bunch of warring tribes has died without electing a heir, so in order to keep the tribes from descending into civil war and possibly splintering, she's sent the sons outside of their lands to prove themselves through their deeds. PCs have to run around trying to stop a bunch of adventurous and ambitious orc princes who're causing trouble across the lands.

>>48066347
w-why are her hips so big?

>>48067095
Orc babies are big.

>>48067095
Leg day erryday.

>>48067095
Because she is perfect.

>>48067034
Cont: a flip on those stories where the three princes have to go out and defeat the dragon and rescue the princess, sort of. Only it's all turned on its head: instead of vanquishing evil they cause problems for others, instead of the youngest being the most clever it's the oldest who knows all the tricks while the young is the basic barbarian, instead of defeating an external thread they're doing it to prevent internal strife. Also, make them more like PCs than regular villains, as in instead of having well-established power bases and plans, they're rootless and dynamic and outmuscled wherever they go, not on the individual level as they're all competent, but because they're in places where they have no foothold in.

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>>48066347
Green version of Haggar from Voltron.

>>48067245
Instead of rescuing they're kidnapping, instead of reclaiming heirlooms or proof of divine mandate they steal those things from others to prove themselves.

>>48067245
>>48067285
Why not also make them legit love each other, have their exploits be motivated less from greed and lust for power, and more from a boyish sense of adventure and friendly competition?

>>48067328
No problem. After all, they agreed on competing through trials rather than warring it out, and they could legitimately feel responsible for the welfare of the tribes. Same with their mother who started it. One could make a point of warring cultures not yet having adapted to more peaceful ways (could look at the constantly warring and nomadic North Asian steppes, who after uniting after Genghis began warring with other countries because it's all they knew, but quickly grew comfortable adopting the societal systems of those they conquered). The boyish enthusiasm being some metaphor for how they haven't matured as civilizations yet or something. Perhaps instead of killing them, they're captured or thwarted, the most ruthlessly murderous being killed, while the others could be shown how a more legitimate (in the eyes of the neighbors) society works, for the benefit of everyone, as nobody benefits from united warlike orcs.

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>big
>huge
>ugly
>smart but cruel

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>>48066347
A ditzy orc bar-wench that unwittingly steals a powerful magical artifact from a drunken sorcerer that turns her into an unstoppable force of destruction.

>>48066347
Don't build entire plot arcs around your magic realm.

>>48067328
Perhaps that ended up a needlessly ambitious answer: what I meant was that yes, having them be adventurous rather than villainous is what I had in mind as well, just adventurous in a way which is troubling, but perhaps not particularly dangerous, for those who're the targets/victims of said adventures. A bit like being the heroes of a town where some Jack Sparrow-like orc prince is giving everyone a headache with his shenanigans, and having to try to catch him. Doesn't have to end with killing either, perhaps out of concern for retribution from the orcish tribes led by their mother.

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>>48066347
have a lot of big orcs with caster orcs backing them.
have plot twist where the orcs are fighting the humans and elves, and elves are fighting humans, and in the end all the factions are dicks.
make the BBEG have a lot of interactions with the players. being a caster she could always teleport and spawn shit on them. if the orcs are actually evil then you can use demons and corrupted human cults.
also have a slightly smaller minion BBEG for the players to kill at some point.

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>>48066347
>>48066499

>>48066457
It's one of the few fantasy worlds that don't have orcs portrayed as being easily outsmarted by a 5th grader.

>>48066347
Dress her up, dumbass. She's gonna die without THICC armor.

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>>48070026
there are a lot of others. basically anything not /TG/ and not LOTR.
there is a good book by Stan Nicholls that i recommend.

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if you want an orc BBEG orc queen give her some undead/demon/extra evil minions.

>>48066347
I'm partial to the old mystic crone type. She's queen not because she can rule the battlefield, but because she can twist warriors into unstoppable beasts, cause enemies to turn amongst themselves, and just never seems to die no matter how long she's been there. As far as anybody can remember, she's just been there, telling the warchief where the enemy is weakest, choosing a new warchief when the old one dies. She has a necklace of teeth that gets a fresh addition on the left end every time a chief dies, and each time it happens just when the rightmost tooth crumbles into dust from age.

>>48070026
There's tons of settings with smart orcs.

Fuck even Forgotten Realms had smart orcs, although that was the case of the orc gods creating an avatar. Wesnoth is probably my favorite smart orcs though, there's plenty of dumb orcs, but there's plenty of clever orcs as well. My favorite campaign was actually the orc campaign where you have to unite the tribes to fend off an attempt by the humans to murder all the orcs.

Plus the various campaigns where you encounter orcs that abide by the treaties and will fight with dwarves and elves and humans even against other orcs to uphold the treaty. Still overly aggressive and quick to anger, but they're competent blacksmiths if not fantastic ones, and tough.

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>>48070856
i like it! im not OP though....
i dont like the crumbling teach part personally. id prefer she has a small box on her jewelry stand with the extra teeth in it. maybe she keeps the extra good war chiefs teeth as special jewelry like earrings or bracelet.

>>48066347
The orcish lands have suffered a bad crop recently, and many orcs have died of famine. Most veteran orcish warriors have died from failed raids. The crone is the widow of one of the strongest orc chieftains in the past century, and is attempting to lead her followers towards more fertile land. Her forces are composed of the young, sick, and old. What she lacks in raw physical strength, she makes up in craftiness and sheer guile.

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You could take any of those suggestions or you could throw them all out and make her an orcish pirate queen modeled after pic related. A vast fleet of war galley's and retrofitted merchant ships laying waste to the kingdoms trading fleets.

Want to make her a world ending threat and you can just give her a powerful lich as a seccond in command (forced to subservience after she found his phylactery) grabbing every half-decent mage, sorcerer, and warlock to cast some massive ritualistic spell in her fortress city to turn her reign of oceanic terror into a global one. Just gotta make it clear that she is perfectly capable of destroying the lich in single combat so as to avoid a "this is the real BBEG" moment

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>>48069599
https://www.artstation.com/artwork/GENJW

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>>48071001
AIRSHIP ORC INVASION! epic idea i cant think of anything better then orcs on a boat in the sky!

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>>48071055
love it GG!

>>48071134
>Gray female orc
great but questionable.

>>48071001
best girl

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I think orc ambushers controlled by a BBEG witch bitch orc raiding on anyone who goes outside the city gate for political reasons that the players can ignore is a good one. King has to pay top dollar to adventures so the farmers and traders can go back out.

>>48071001
A situation like hers requires a very specific situation though. It's no coincidence it happened in China instead of the Caribbean. You need tons of people, riches, a vast coast, people who emphasize strict social order, and a bunch of other stuff I'm not familiar enough with the period and place to identify.

Make the orcs matriarchal, hence the queen. Not because the females are all super powerful Amazon's or anything retarded, but for the same reason other matriarchal societies existed - males are more expandable, women aren't as good at being grunts and are more rare. So females form the priestly and political castes, with males being laborers, craftsorcs, and soldiers.

>>48066910
>Forcibly married the king

The only way this could get better is of the king was a cute boy

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loving the ideas keep the good ones coming.

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>>48072839
Orc butt is best butt.

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>>48072892
athletic and healthy bodies are just great in general. orcs just excedeed that standard. pure muscle and raw beauty

>>48071055
Hot damn, cold shower time!

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is this becoming a lewd orc thread?

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is it a good idea to use skyrim character creation for character art?

>>48073181
No. Terrible aesthetics. I mean, not Oblivion broken kind of terrible, but it's all attempting this sharp, super serious, gritty idealized GoT/LotR thing, and ends up having no character whatsoever, which is why they threw in scars and tattoos in order to fool people into thinking their characters don't look like ultra-generic ass.

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>>48073219
i mean your not wrong. but skyrim is 50% mods.

>>48073237
And half of them have Bijin Warmaidens as a dependency.

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>>48073247
well any character model type mods do.

>>48073286
and now Im missing vanilla WoW.
Goddamnit

>>48066347
Go the Bismark route and have her unit the warring orcish tribes into a massive military power. Her orcish armies would destroy any single nation who tried to attack her. Distrust and petty revelries keep more than two nations for allying with each other while the Orcish nation keeps annexing farmland, riverlands, and coasts.

The leader is smart. Very smart. She equals or out-maneuvers and negotiations kings and lords have it with her. She also knows how to country build, having plotted the annexed farmland to orcish farmers, ordered the building the mills and lumber yards along annexed riverlands, and is having a new capitol build on their recently acquired coast-lands.

The orcs, having seen a massive improvement of life, are zealously loyal to the orc-queen. There's no game of politics to be had inside her nation, though killing her would likely result in a power-vacuum until she establishes her lineage.

As for the other nations, most of them are highly opposed to the orc's industrialization and expansion, especially those that have lost land. Border skirmishes are a daily thing perpetuated by both sides. Village and homestead raiding are condemned by all lords but still happens. A few bordering countries have signed uneasy truces in exchange for a lump sum of their land (a mine-able mountain range). One country has openly allied with the orcish nation and their Duke (King's brother) consult's, and some whisper consorts, the Orc Queen.

The Adventurers are here to tip the scale. A full blown war between the orc nation and several countries could break out any day. Any single or couple countries would be crushed in a few months by the Orc's military power but nearly a several countries are on unfriendly terms, several are neutral to them, few have truces, and one is allied. Will they help the orcs, who need to land to sustain their technological leaps out of tribes? Or one of the other states, who all have different motives?

>>48073392
That's not WoW, notice the distinct lack of pastel colors, massive shoulder-pads or any other exaggerated and overdecorated gear.

>>48073617
Vanilla WoW didn't really have those things as much. Only Tier pieces, epic sets from difficult raids, looked like that back then. They were flashy because it was a badge of honor to have them as it required full-time-job levels of dedication. Then the devs though thats what people liked since they always said how cool it was, ignore the part where they thought it was cool because it was so rare, and it's all down here from there.

>>48066505
>it's impossible for other people to not find my magical realm hot too, they must be trolling
Pathetic

>>48066347
Suggestions about what?

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>>48066670
Why? There's nothing wrong with an attractive female BBEG. Especially if they're a sadistic type with no other positive qualities at all and no chance at ever being able to become not evil. Makes wrecking them all the more satisfying. Like you can have a villain that's rational and reasonable and complex and motivated and maybe you can convince them to stop what they're doing, but sometimes it's good to have a villain you can just beat down without remorse.

>>48066910
>changing from BBEG to our employer
Was she a good boss?

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>>48071055

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>>48066910
This sounds like a pretty fun campaign :3

She's an innkeeper that drugs/charms attractive male human visitors and then rents them out for the night as breeding stallions to other orc women and worse

>>48066749
Fuck what movie is that? I remember being horrified by it as a child.

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>>48075865

>>48075865
probably falling into a trap but .,... Total Recall

>>48073219
lurking on the elderscrolls /vg/ thread for a few years I can tell you that it is certainly possible to make characters in Skyrim and use them as character art. Like what everyone else has said you need to mod the shit out of it but the mods exist.

>>48072721
Nah, the King did have a young prince but she killed him with the rest of the royal family. She didn't mind him being older as well because she didn't have to wait as long for him to kick the bucket which was what she wanted, so she could remarry a proper orc. It was a shame though since he was like in his late 40s-early 50s and this regal dignified kingly sort, and here was this young orc woman physically bullying and humiliating him.

>>48074000
She was pretty tough and brutal, but fair. Intelligent enough as well that working for her wasn't a drag.

>>48066347
She's the head of some kind of evil corp/guild/thing that makes lot's of money. Big scary pantsuit wearing stong orc womyn who don't need no man.

A ruthless noble/buisness woman. Political maneuvering and murder, she'll do anything to keep her organisation and herself on top. Her public face is very kind and philanthropic in an attempt to draw attention away from her company's less than savoury actions and to juxtapose her Orcish roots(which are often seen as cruel, warmongering brutes). Behind closed doors she's selfish, cruel and obsessed with power and personal gain.

Normally she hides in Ivory tower and lets her mooks do the dirty work. However when confronted directly she can be a force to be reckoned with, going full Senator Armstrong, ripping off the finery, picking up an axe and turning into an unstoppable killing machine.

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>>48066347
Here

Literally all you want to have and include in your campaig. Given the film is older than certain /tg/ users it a sure fire and safe to utright rip it off

>>48076380
>Mfw realising it's the film where kebab removes you

Had one game where we were trying to take down a thieves guild in a major city that were growing too powerful. We spent a good deal trying to deal with this Half-elf rogue who kept causing us trouble and slipping away. We eventually identify her as one of the masters of the guild, an expert in deception and trapsmithing. Eventually get get her on the back foot and pursue her through the city, trapping her in her hide out and skulking past her traps and defenses to confront her.

Turns out when we get to the final chamber, that she was just a courier. The real guildmaster trapsmith was waiting for us, a 7 foot tall orc amazonesque chick with a broadsword and more knives than we could count, who had just played us right into a trapped warzone.

>>48076380
>The 13th Warrior
Best posted

>>48075250
What could be worse thna having to pay child support to an orc whore?

>>48067252
FUCKING DRUIDS

>>48077453

That's the plan!

>>48077540
Ayyyyyyyyyeeeeeeee

>>48066347
Gonna agree with what some other anons have said, go with a ruthless shaman/caster, something like >>48067252, was watching the new Voltron the other day and she makes a perfect example of the sort of thing I'm thinking of

Dickish, dickish magic when she's in combat, MASSIVELY empowers the empire from behind the front lines, and perfectly able to mindfuck, blast the shit out of, and strangle a bitch with her bare hands if one of the PCs tries to fight her
Also doesn't go too far on either side of the fapbait/ugly spectrum

>>48076380
This

Literally replace neandertals with orcs and you are golden. Hell, it would be even better with orcs.

Female Ghengis Khan.

>>48073617
>being this butthurt and petty
It's clearly WoW anon

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>>48077170
>>48075250
>will never solve and prosecute sex crimes in the magical realm of Neue York

>>48077170
Her forcibly moving in with you while she's pregnant

>>48066347
Belit, from Conan

>>48079215
>Neue York
>Not Neue Amsterdam

>>48079215
Man, Shadowrun should totally use that for NYC. Have the Germans move in after a big ass magical cataclysm, and subvert the system, kill with kindness and take over like the insidious bastards they are.

>>48082851
Yes their insidious beers, cheeses, and blonde women

>>48070884

>FR needed the avatar of Gruumsh for orcs to accomplish anything noteworthy and even then it began to fall apart awhile afterward.

Yeah no, I hate to say it but WarCraft orcs are probably the best ones for srs bsns. Warhammer Orcs and Orks get top marks for being dumb but still dangerously effective.

>>48083251
Don't forget the bread.
German bread is the most insidious of all.

>>48081272
>Not forcibly moving in with you and then using you to impregnate her again after she gives birth

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>>48066347
>Make the warm up bosses her sons
>Make her middle aged and matronly
>Powerful shamanistic magic
>Make her incredibly smart but attempt to pull off the "dumb orc" as obsfucating stupidity.
>Give her a harem of nubile male slaves

Her motivation should be something to the tune of Elves used to hunt her and her tribe for sport and now she's getting her revenge and ensuring none of her children will ever have to run barefoot through the forest running away in terror from the laughter of elves.

>>48066347
Powerful Orc warboss. Clan chief of clan chiefs. Claims equal status to the human nation-states: powerful enough , at least regionally, to make it stick. Happens to be female.

I'm sorry, what else do you need?

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>>48076182
Everything turned out better than expected.

>>48085144
>she forcibly introduces herself to your parents

>>48066379
I was gonna suggest an expy of Gul'Dan.

>>48066499
This is getting pretty hot

>>48086284
THIS IS MINE! THIS IS WHERE MY SPAWN SHALL COME FROM

>>48073986
Lord Dominator will never cease to make my dick hard

>>48076380
I don't think I know anyone that I'd be likely to play with that wouldn't spot it immediately.

Then again, one friend repeatedly shocks me with his plebeian ignorance. 10/10 taste anyway.

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>>48082851
>NY metro system now gets managed by Deutsche Bahn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXjhszy2f9w

>>48066499
Why does she needs to fuck a human noble?

Only an idiot human would think that to civilize orcs you would need to marry your queen to a noble human lord and create a human/orc hybrid race.

It would make much more sense to just unite the tribes, make a government, found a capital city and create an educational system.

>>48086441
Different anon and I know for sure I can run this on two different groups without anyone realising this is a rip-off.
Plus the story is really, really simple, so you can end up pulling something very similar completely on your own, without knowing the film or the book. I've once had a GM who run with us story eerily similar to Streets of Fire. So two of us called him out after the game on this and turns out he didn't even know the film exists, but given how banal the story is, it's not that hard to spin something like it on your own.

>>48066347

The way I did it years ago:

A powerful half-fiend orc warlord lady has been uniting the local tribes, enslaving or killing their leaders and is now setting her sights on the civilized kingdoms. Turns out she is actually a bunch of evil adventurers in a large-size Guise of the Thespian

>>48066347
Many years ago a renowned Orc spiritual leader bore a child who was prophesied to become the war-lord to unite all the tribes.

Then some civilized race adventurers killed him.

Now his old momma is pissed as fuck and has taken the reigns of her tribe by force, intent to snuff out the brightest lights of the culprits one by one as revenge.

>>48086381
If she's already pregnant, doesn't that mean one of her spawn already came from there?

>>48086890
Legitimacy, she knows about that sorta thing

>>48066347
like this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ching_Shih

>>48086284
>your parents think she's great, give you their blessing and ask that you two come visit more often

Siege Castle of the Orc Queen

Powerful voodoo witch that soul to some fiend in exchange of immortality and great power, is uniting the orc tribes in order to try and force the fulfillment of an Orcish prophecy according to which a great champion of the orcs will ravage the human lamds after cheating death, using the bloodshed as a mass sacrifice and rise to demi-godhood

The real chosen one is actually a young orc adventurer who wants to travel to prove his right to become chieftain of his tribe

>>48090198
*powerful voodoo witch that sold her soul

>>48088804
Errrrrr yes actually

>>48086314
Maybe if you're 14 and just found hentaifoundry for the first time. Shit's dumb, crass, and vulgar.

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>>48091197
>Shit's dumb, crass, and vulgar.

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>>48073181
It most certainly is possible with good mods. Of course just having mods is only half the work, using them well is other and that takes a hint of artistry. Pic related is OC from I made a while back.

>>48092731
what a qt

>>48092731
>Poorly lit

>>48090127
>>48090909
>YFW the only downside your parents see to your orc babymama is that you got her pregnant before marrying her and heavily pressure you to "do the right thing"

>>48092731
>OC
Looks like any number of cheesecake orcs from WoW.

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just posting an orc (female)

>>48092731
Got any more?

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>>48093613
>bitches about OC
>provides no OC himself

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>>48094154
Not much of this character. She got deleted and I can't replicate her.

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>>48095810

>>48094450
I'm pointing out the lack of OC in the supposed OC. Using mods other have made just to do the most unoriginal thing possible does not count as OC. And, as I frown on calling that sort of thing OC, why would I post any of my own? Or are you saying I should post any OC unrelated to the topic just to lend some sort of weird credit to my argument, despite the fact that my argument in no way rests on my ability to produce OC?

>>48079156
At least a green elf male is something new?

>>48095875
Do you remember what mods you used?

>>48088813
An Orc civilization created by and for orcs is inherently legitimate to orcs. What legitimacy is being looked for? Human "legitimacy"? Why would that even matter? Just raze a handful of cities or something.

A band of human adventurers once rescued a young orc girl from standard fantasy monster peril en route to a different quest against a vile bbeg. The mage of that party and the orc woman fall in love and promise to unite their two cultures in peace and marriage. Then the party goes off to defeat the bad guy of this past story, but the mage disappears and is presumed either to have jilted the orc woman, or to have been betrayed and murdered by his companions acting on behalf of some foreign kingdom hell-bent on keeping orc-kind warred upon or otherwise oppressed.

Either way, the orc woman takes it as a personal and collective affront, and becomes obsessed with inflicting pain upon humanity as they have done upon her kind.

In fact, the mage inadvertently fucked up casting a spell during the final battle with the former bbeg of the week, and accidentally made himself an incorporeal shade and has been observing the happenstances of the world and desperately trying to contact somebody to avert the crisis. It is only upon the union of the unique combination of your party members' traits that the mage manages to make contact by manifesting in a mirror or possessing a talking dog or whatever. The party must then venture to find some means to bring the mage back to the physical world, reunite the lovers, and avoid mass bloodshed, while defeating whatever third party who would have something to gain by fomenting war.

>>48092731
>no hairy armpit mod

>>48093556
>after living with you for a couple of years, two babies and another on the way, finally cave in and pop the question

>>48095810
Disgusting Human nose.

>>48066670
I feel like that's stupid and you probably have bad experiences with a bad group.

>>48066660
>What makes them not green skinned humans?
What makes any setting's orcs not green skinned humans?

>>48073219
I've never thought of Skyrim as "super serious" or gritty looking.

Also, some of the stupid things in this thread kind of make me want to run a game with a female Orc BBEG. Uniter of the clans and orcish matron both seem great, although I think "make her gross and old and disgusting" is a childish thing.

>>48098181
What kind of man waits till he puts 3 babies in a woman before proposing?

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>>48095810
i use to have a great orc character. sadly the same ending. she got deleted and recreating her just wouldn't be the same. she was my first rogue like stealth character. first time i beat the game was with her.
maybe one day ill try to use her for a character in a campaign.

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Why is it so hard to find orcs that aren't gross ugly gargoyles OR just elves with green skin?

I want pretty/handsome orcs that still look like orcs. Also, why is it that despite the fact that they're in every fantasy setting and have zero armour restrictions (and in many games half orcs don't even grow up in orcish society!) every orc art has them wearing dirty barbarian armour or maybe shaman outfits?

>>48073617
It's literally the shaman from the WoW board game

>>48086890
its not fucking sexy if she isn't buff as fuck and hot and wants to fuck humans, okay? fuck just satisfy our fantasies.

>>48098766
Yeah, I wouldn't focus on her general level of attractiveness at all. Describe her like a bbeg, not a waifu

>>48098181
Was there supposed to be a downside in this exchange?

>>48067565
>and with a wicked sense of humor

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You encounter this orc woman in the woods. She claims to have defected from the orc queen and knows vital info about her plans. What does the party do?

>>48100860
What's her CR?

Rolled 11 (1d20)

>>48100860
Roll Charisma to Seduce her

>>48100860
Time for diplomacy

>>48101243
She is unimpressed but not terribly so

She could have a warlock thing going on: bargain with some mind warping being for enough power to dominate her tribe. Since stories usually include bargains with beings that are antagonistic, her powers could come from a good being that is twisting her into a lawful zealot while she struggles for the freedom to be orc-y

>>48066347
>Sit down
>Masturbate
>Re-evaluate

>>48101350
Done

Idea still seems valid, got suggestions for it?

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>>48086419
I don't know whether you'll love or hate this image, but have it.

>>48100539
Being trapped in the 9-5 suburban prison with a green wife and three or more kids is the ultimate BADEND

>>48103137
>The neighbors are Elves with mid atlantic accents
>wife and neighbor's wife went to the same finishing school
>despite many hot playful shared showers the relationship ended badly when wife sacrificed neighbor's wife's dad during the graduation ceremony
>elves have the better pool but it is almost universally agreed that you throw better barbecues

>>48066347
olga of kiev, but an orc

>>48103681
>olga of kiev
Ahh she was just the best.

>>48104205
What, you mean "little ms. Set you house on fire with your own birds?"

Yeah, sweetheart she was, especially when she was burying people alive.

>>48076464
He pretty much converts to Norse paganism by the end of the film.

>>48103502
>your daughter and their son like each other

>>48103137
You forget the more intangible benefits though.

>>48104329
>by the end of the book
Here, FTFY.

Comparing the two, Ahmed in the film simply enjoys Norse mead and women. The one in the book goes pretty much native, including performing ceremonial murder when a girl has to be offered on a burial pyre

>>48066347
If she captures male PC's have glorious rape for the purpose of breeding a strong progeny ensue

>>48102817
>getanfeelingsocomplicated.bmp

>>48100860
Welcome her with open arms as it consists of drunken dwarves and a bloodthirsty troll

>>48095952
OC doesn't have to be good to be OC. Infact, I don't think any person on this board gives a wet-shit what you think is good or bad when it comes to OC. Providing OC in any way is leagues better than simply bitching about what someone else posted. I don't care what your argument was or even was based on. I was merely pointing out you're a shitter for bitching about OC posts without posting OC yourself.

>>48107149
>intangible benefits
Like what?

>>48083489
>What is TES
Skyrim had a fucking orc librarian. You can't get more serious businesss than that.

>>48111887

My ideal Orc peoples is a hybrid of WarCraft, Warhammer and TES, espcially the New Horde/Iron Horde from WarCraft. A strong, huge, voraciously breeding peoples who have only recently settled down into the idea of having a nation and went full retard on their nationalism and 'Orc Pride'. They reinvented themselves from their 'noble savage' roots, taking a great interest in engineering and smithing - but only insofar as it benefits practical needs and their pragmatic military approach to life. They're trying very hard to push past their tribalism and violently snuff out dissenters or Orcs wanting to go back to the 'good old days', which also means any sort of shamanism they might have had was squashed unless it, again, benefited their war industry and rapid industrial growth i.e. binding elementals and putting them to work, taming beasts to use for burden and warfare, etc etc.

They curb a lot of their more violent tendencies with lots highly physical sports, constant engineering projects, regular gladiatorial matches, and keeping their legions active at all times.

Okay so basically Romans, but Orcs.

>>48111855
Allegedly she has quite the 401orK and made a killing at the Stockade Market

>>48112037
I was gunna say Germany but Roma works to.

Could luge be considered a blood sport?

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have the generic idea with zealot paladins but with orcs. converting or smiting for a LG god

>>48114604
>you were the housewife all along

>>48098766
>What makes any setting's orcs not green skinned humans?

All the things I mentioned/
Warhammer: Orks are sentient fungus
Tokein: Orks are corrupted elves and are spawned
Traditional Orks: Pig people.

Not all orks are Warcraft Orcs

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>>48118734
Traditional Orcs were not pig people, and only Warhammer (maybe Shadowrun) really uses "Ork". I also didn't say anything about Warcraft Orcs. I just said having gendered orcs or orcs that respect nobility isn't exactly making them "green skinned humans".
Even then, most fantasy races are just "humans with X physical feature".

If the real world were a fantasy setting, black (Asian, Arab, etc) people really would be a different species. "You have a different style of culture and a different physical feature" isn't really making your races more than "X feature humans" to begin with.

This is actually one of the reasons I really like how Magic does their races. Every Plane has races that feel relatively distinct, and a lot of the typical fantasy traits are skewed or different. The usual Elf in MtG is more foresty than the usual Lothlorien style because Elves are aligned with Green Mana which comes primarily from Forests. You also get things like how typical wine swilling noble Vampires only really exist on Innistrad since they're primarily Black Mana, which is associated with Swamps. Zendikar in particular has an awesome take on Vampires, who are tribalistic hedonists. Not quite barbarians, since they have civilization and noble houses and a sprawling city, but a far cry from Dracula sitting in his throne with a wine glass of blood.

>>48118734
Tolkien literally made up orcs. The word didn't even exist on English before he used it and was a blanket term for evil spirits. Pig orcs come from japan IIRC

>>48119083
I skipped explaining my train of thought there...

I don't like how people treat certain fantasy races as having One True Way of being represented. There was a thread about Dwarves the other day where people were arguing that if you don't have Dwarves that are short stocky Jew/Viking/Scot amalgamations, you might as well not have Dwarves and people started posting elves and saying they were Dwarves.

That's just dumb. It ignores any sort of possible variation on the theme. Likewise, people treat elves or orcs as if they're all the same, but really only a few features are ever really stuck to; Orcs more so than Elves. Being evil and savage is more integral to Orcs than anything about Elves.

>>48119152
Modern orcs are more derived from D&D than Tolkien. Tolkien's orcs were basically just dark elves. Although D&D's orcs were more gorilla looking than green.
Though if I recall there wasn't really any distinction over whether "orc" and "goblin" were two different things or not.

>>48119197
What I meant is that the concept of orcs as it is known in modern fantasy can be directly traced back to Tolkien. It's not even ambiguous like with Elves where there's other authors with somewhat similar ideas or dwarves which have clear mythological origin, orcs were Tolkien's straight up OC donut steel demon goblin Mongol race that got really popular and was widely reinterpreted

Tolkien's orcs also weren't green, that's from warhammer

>>48119394
I never said Tolkien's were green. Is Warhammer really where greenskins started, though? It's so weird that green skin is so tied to what Orcs are...

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>>48073067
>>48100372
What's the deal with giving orc girls undercuts. Makes them look like fucking hipsters.

>>48119499
Makes them look more tribal. Personally, I like hipster orcs.

>>48119474
Made by Warhammer and further popularized in modern times by Warcraft, which initially was supposed to be about Warhammer

>>48119535
I feel like there have to have been green orcs before that.

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>>48119525
Never seen a tribe with undercuts before.

>>48100112
whats up with WoW and their retarded weapon and armor design?
is it their trademark or something?

>>48119882
When was the last time you saw a tribe period?

>>48119957
>What's up with this distinctive and unique character design?
>Is it a visually identifiable mark of their brand or something?
Why do you ask stupid questions

>Captcha wants me to select all the "SLOW children at play" signs
Fitting

>>48116242

Germany was also an inspiration. I imagine them trying to consolidate lands and populace by adopting anyone with a trace of orc-blood into their state, especially half-orcs, who would probably flock to them in droves compared to the treatment they get everywhere else.

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>>48118207

>>48121971
>she sees your D

>>48066347
Just gender swap a typical cunning orc warlord.

And I don't know, make each of the generals she has underneath her leading each tribe one of her husbands or something.

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>>48122403
thats weak!! your idea is so lame! if he wanted an uncreative idea im sure he would have done just that.

>>48111698
You keep calling that dumb shit OC when it isn't.

>>48066347
>Orc Queen
The reigning champions of last year's global Battle of the Bards. They've come to be the rulers of your world, convinced that they were born to be princes of the universe.

>>48066347
What emotion is her face trying to convey?

>>48125909
Arousal.

>>48125909
Zuggy smug

Her smuggness is absolute and confers DR:20 and spell resistance 20+character level. It is said only the strongest, purest, most chivalrous, and boy faced knight can break through the smug with a heartfelt confession

>>48125909
Slight smug and/or neutral

>>48125909
Mildly annoyed

Pirate Queen

>>48119882
Sidecuts were a popular haircut in warrior cultures. Vikings, mongols and some native american tribes made use of the style to name a few.

>>48067252
wait i know it's off topic but isn't Haggar supposed to be fucking hideous? i mean she doesn't look like a supermodel there but isn't a big part of her character that she's twisted by dark magics to the point she's a monster?
Hell Devil's Due comics had her look like a fucking angler fish under the hood

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>>48136543

>>48136678
>she
I honestly thought that was a dude. Looks like Xanatos' lawyer from Gargoyles.

>>48073067
Christ I hope so. I've got green fever.

>>48138918
Bump then

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Deadly unarmed combat skills.

>>48139655
Miscarriage.webm

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This is the best orc picture

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>>48073067
I hope so

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>>48140485
im want more lewd orcs.

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>>48066347
Make her a Warlock so you can justify she being the leader in a society where the strongest rule.

Also, give her an armor that makes it impossible to recognize her as a girl and make that her powers allow her to conceal her voice.

And then: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdEo_t-iVbM

Make sure you chair is low enough, or the table high enough, so that your erection doesn't flip the table.

>>48072708
>matriarchal societies existed

They didn't. There isn't a shred of evidence about their existence beyond speculation related to times before written records or attempts to present tribal customs along the lines of females doing all the menial work and males loafing around as "matriarchal".

>>48142904
I didn't want to post this, but damn was I thinking it loudly...

>>48139655
You know what. She has still a huge rack for all that muscle. While I like the aesthetic, just imagine those Dreamland mountains if she didn't burn so much fat with extensive training.

Fucking Heaven Valley.

>>48066670
>going hard against sex-appeal is a must when making a female BBEG.

On the contrary. Nobody fucking cares about female BBEGs without sex appeal, as evidenced by, oh, approximately every piece of media featuring female villains ever.

>>48143222
>What is female Disney villains

>>48143294
>Implying they aren't all attractive

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>orange orc.

Okay yes I know.

>faggots bumping a shit thread for days

You guys are embaraszing as fuck.

>>48143304
Fanart doesn't count.

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>>48143338

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>>48143350

>>48066347

A mother of monsters who struck pacts with <whatever is close to ultimate evil of your setting or whatever evil is responsible for orcs' existence> and got seriously souped up on supenatural power and taint. I'd rather make her inhumanly physically perfect and beautiful in predatory way than grotesque, but that depends on the nature of your setting's orks. Her children however are a carnival of horrors.
Her goal is to become the most famous orc ever, not only conquering all from ocean to ocean, but spawning a new and improved orc race to become true masters of the world and immortalize herself as their progenitor. The latter goal is doomed to failure because her corruption is too strong for any mortal fetus to handle without becoming some sort of what-the-fuck, how-it-can-even-live monster, but she doesn't know it and is currently trying to sleep with any powerful monster capable of interbreeding with humanoids she can find, to find a "right" parent.

In personality she is a classic BBEG, ruling by terror of her overwhelming personal might combined with some seduction towards key personalities. Prone to violent mood swings and horribly mistreating anyone who disappoints her, including, by definition, her children. Her orcs would rather die than retreat. Fighting against her involves eliminating the few underlings who can actually strategize and make her listen to reason somewhat as mid-bosses of your campaign.

>>48143344

Maleficent, Evil Queen etc were attractive before fanart. Of those I can remeber off the top of my head, only Cruella DeVille is ugly.

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>>48142904
Holy shit, what was that?

> ywn have an eager green domestic house whore who happily proclaims it as fate to have met you.
> ywn interact and appreciate her with time and graduate from your view of misogyny.
> ywn grow old together and grope each other heavily in bed until death separates you.
> ywn be buried with a frozen boner as you think of all the hot and loving moments with her.

>>48066910
>your loss and humiliation

I'm not sure that's what I'd call hours and hours of rough, passionate, snu snu with a hot orc.

>>48143573
What are the typical duties of a green domestic house whore?

>>48081887
If anything it's Neuamsterdam or Neu-Amsterdam.

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>>48083251
But beware... We Germans aren't all smiles und sunshine.

>>48066347
>Any suggestions?
yeah. Don't make her just a human painted in green.

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>>48139655

>>48070141
>LotR orcs not smart
>Stan Nicholls

M8, I loved that book to death, but these guys really aren't clever by default. Coilla and Stryke only seem clever because they're shown using basic logic next to a bunch of raunchy drunkards who might as well be dwarves for all their raunchy drinking.

Also LotR-orcs are the naturally cleverest, sliest of all orcs because for once they're not the hulking musclebrutes but essentially the rat-people of the setting.

>>48123742
>The reigning champions of last year's global Battle of the Bards. They've come to be the rulers of your world, convinced that they were born to be princes of the universe.

Did you actually run this campaign or is it just an idea? Either way I dig it.

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>>48146152
She has tusks too...

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Could always make a Muslim theme anti-paladin and evil cleric type thing but with orcs.

>>48146188
Who's on the left? Widowmaker?

>>48146188
Is that her clit sticking out? Jesus.

>>48148210
That's D.Va.

>>48148790
That's what steroids do brah.

>>48149539
Wouldn't D.Va have the face paint?

>>48149589
pretty hot desu

>>48149638
>Facepaint
>at a pool
???

>>48066660
>What makes them not green skinned humans?

+4 str
-2 int

Obviously.

>>48066941
>treating an orc queen any different then an orc king

You're all retarded.
Orcs arent human so why do you faggots assume they would have any difference between genders?

Really /tg/? A bunch of fetishshit is the best you can come up with?

>>48150930
How many species can you name that have 2 genders that are not different?

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>>48066347
This but green and wearing a tophat.

>>48150905
>+4 str -2 int
That would make them black skinned humans.

>>48151048
That makes them green skinned orcs...

>>48151044
They are completely different color, man.

>>48151044
Chinchillas still have 2 completely different genders even if they look similar one still has a penis and one still has a vagina.
Orcs are a humanoid race meaning they would hVe humanoid like similarities. Such as a masculine gender and feminine gender.

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>>48151030
>L85
Man, I hope the BBEG at least remembers to make sure she's using the A2.

>>48145881
seconding
I also wanna know

>>48145881
I assume you mean orc female house wife.
Probably rising the children to not be pussies while the men go out raiding. And hunting dinner and having more children.
But I wouldn't think orc females fall into the house wife life.

>>48151786
We're discussing an orc female that forcibly moved in(squatter's rights) with a human dude after getting knocked up by him, she might be wired differently

>>48151842
She would probably be a controlling crazy type of girl. I would think an orc caster plotting wouldn't let herself be reduced to housewife.

>>48145881
>>48151508
>>48151786
>What are the typical duties of a green domestic house whore?
Teaching her fuckboi of a husband his proper place is beneath her, both sexual and not, making sure he knows to keep the house in order while she's out and waiting on her hand and foot or having his balls emptied during pelvis crushing snu snu while she's in

>>48151867
>wouldn't let herself be reduced to housewife
What would she do then? The dude's out of the house most of the day because he's got a job, meanwhile his baby is growing inside her

>>48151963
She would take his job and try to overtake the country through politics. Make him the house wife.

>>48151177
Did you know that not all societies are two gendered?
Also, you're mixing up sex and gender there.
But also, he means that there's no reason that orc females would be socially distinct from orc males. In fact, in a lot of species, the female is larger.

>>48151963
>meanwhile his baby is growing inside her
I wish I had that greentext screenshot, but not all animal gestation is as difficult and painful as humans. A lioness can still hunt while pregnant.

>>48119152
>>48119197
Oh fucks sake do your goddamn homework its not that hard. Google says hello. Tolkien merely borrowed the word orc for his twisted elves.

irl orcs and ork in language wasn't NEARLY so standardized as it now is. They were interchangeable until spelling finally got standardized.

In eastern Europe Orcs were just a type of fey.

In western Europe Orcs were actually a type of undead warrior.

Tolkien used their real myth counterparts VERY loosely with his own twist to them and after him they got wildly popularized. If you actually did research into pre Tolkien orcs you can see a few similarities in his works.

Pig orcs are the result of a mistranslated for Nippon.

If it wasn't for Tolkien orcs would of stayed obscure. Its just a damn shame that people completely forget what the orcs were like before Tolkien unlike the dwarves and elves because they were so fucking obscure before he used them.

In that regard the orcs actually backfired on Tolkien which bothered him to the day he died. He was never satisfied with how orcs turned out it ate him up.

>>48152511
Damn this nigga got his shit together.
Respect.

>>48152511
>[Orc] was a blanket term for evil spirits
>Do your Goddamned homework!
>Talks about how "orc" was a blanket term for evil spirits
I'm pretty sure pig orcs is because it rhymes with "pork".
>In that regard the orcs actually backfired on Tolkien which bothered him to the day he died. He was never satisfied with how orcs turned out it ate him up.
Source.

>>48152647
I just read up on it and found 4 sources all claiming Tolkien himself said he wasn't satisfied with his orcs and couldnt explain them.

Your retarded on the pork thing I won't argue that.

>>48146188
Is there a bigger one? Google can't find shit.

>>48152708
See if there's an overwatch booru and look through the Zarya pics

>>48152935
Didn't know this was a /v/ board.

>>48066347
Could we have an orc clan themed off overwatch

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>>48152935
Well that was a pointless search, I'm afraid. Then again, simply googling "Zarya melon" did provide something.

>>48066347
>draw an elf
>call it an orc
>>48153166
>draw a man
>call it a woman
What a world.

>>48153943
>Post bait
>Get a (You)
What a world

>>48152025
>>48152308
>Pregger orc wife still strong enough to push you around

>>48070898
> Not melding the teeth into a giant war club capable of magically chewing into anything it hits, while granting the user the skill of the past war chiefs in battle . . . As well as their bloodlust and rage.

>>48153978
>pointing out the obvious is bait
I guess

>>48154020
>Pretending you're right when you clearly aren't isn't obvious bait

>>48150949
Lets see.
Dragons
Wyverns
Drakes
Tarrasque
Beholders
Doppelgangers
Dwarves

A whole bunch, really.

Always a laugh when the same thread has fags complaining that orcs shouldnt be just green humans and then try to apply human gendet roles to them.

>>48154648
That looks familiar... wasn't she black before?

>>48142904

I binged teh second season of this show over yesterday and today just for this girl

she's cute, but kind of an asshole and expects everyone do to what she wants without anything in return

pretty good cartoon vilain and that song was catchy af

File: Seelah.jpg (161KB, 1048x1500px) Image search: [Google]

161KB, 1048x1500px

>>48154648
>>48154870
>Putting Seelah through photoshop filters
>Making her green
>Signing it
Holy fucking shit.

>>48154782
>>48150949
I assume he meant "real life species".
But real life species don't have gender, they have sex. Most animals are stupid. Hell, they can't really have homosexuality, since most animals are too dumb to have a "sexual preference". Most are "bisexual", but only because they'll fuck anything, even dead bodies.
There are also plenty of animals with little to no sexual dimorphism.
Here's what I find with a quick google. It seems mostly not people being trolls.
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130419152136AAyHvRQ

>>48154870
She is based on that character by the looks of it. But different facr and armor
>>48154782
You got me.

>>48155665
gender is defined by reproductive organs not sexual orientation dumb ass.

>>48156194
Sex is defined by reproductive organs. Gender is made up bullshit vaguely related to what is between your legs

>>48156230
That bullshit between your legs is called. Cock and balls! You get one of 2 sets at birth with no choice and that defines your gender. Not what you fuck feel or want but what you have.

There is a huge difference between gender and gender role and sexual orientation.

>>48156396
Eh, strictly speaking sex is determined by what's between your legs, gender refers to the social/cultural view of things, so while for about 90% of human history those two matched up, we had "third gender" situations before all this SJW bullshit, mostly limited to those chosen to be eunuchs before puberty and/or shamans who would ritualistically take on both genders to become neither for reasons

Gender roll is just how a gender is viewed in the larger cultural context

Sexual orientation is, well you probably have that one right

>>48156539
A person with a cock dressed like a girl doing house wife choose taking anything persons cock up his ass.
That first person is still a male and a boy. An unmanly man but he still has a cock making his gender male.

>>48156589
Depends on the culture he's in, in ours, most medieval/renaissance European, and presumably any fantasy setting based on that, yes you would be right,

A culture that had allowances for someone of the male sex (with a working set of balls and a dick) to become a woman could possibly consider him a woman in this context
I think there's only ever been one premodern situation where that was allowed (and even then that was a historical aberration that only lasted about a century and a half) and was only found in a smattering of preIslam Arabian tribes, which I doubt the orcs in this situation are based on (unless your DM is going full /pol/)

On the other, more likely, hand if orc society saw housewife stuff as a man's job they'd still see him as being male sex and male gender


I'm being a bit spergy with semantics here I know, but sociology is something I find facinating and I hate it when people start arguing because words can have percice meaning and think two words mean the same just cause they're similar, but it's not a hill I'm willing to die on

This thread is getting derailed. Don't post anything unless it's a really good orc pic or OP related idea.
Please stop the off topic arguments.

>>48156230
>>48156194
>>48156589
Gender is not made up bullshit. It's also not determined by reproductive organs. For fucks sake, not every culture even has two genders.

We get it, you find "trannies" gross and weird and you can't comprehend anything more complicated than male and female. That means fuck all for the real world. Gender is not sex.
http://plainshumanities.unl.edu/encyclopedia/doc/egp.gen.004
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijra_(South_Asia)
I get that other cultures--even Western subcultures--are strange and alien to you, but that doesn't mean anything. Other genders exist. You can't change that. Gender is separate from sex. That is not a debatable topic. It has repeatedly been proven.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-there-something-unique-about-the-transgender-brain/
Here's the APA
http://www.apa.org/topics/lgbt/transgender.aspx
Here's a Discovery spin off Youtube channel explaining these things. Episode three is about animals and gender, even.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9QnnQN880o&list=PLwwOk5fvpuuKxHd4doNSzWk-GewL_WqpF
If you tell me that you don't believe any of this info, well, fine. I know that I can stop bothering to engage with you because you ignore factual information simply because you don't agree with it. I'll also assume that you don't believe in global climate change, and think abstinence only education works.

But for anyone who *doesn't* dismiss factual information based on personal biases, here's an interesting factoid, tangentially related to orks, too:
http://botit.botany.wisc.edu/toms_fungi/feb2000.html
>This month's fungus is Schizophyllum commune, the split gill fungus, perhaps the world's most widespread fungus-- and possessor of over 28,000 different sexes
Although I'll admit I'm not actually going to read any more of that, because I don't care about mushrooms.

And, just to make sure we're all on the same page about sexual dimorphism:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_dimorphism

>>48156760
We're past the bump limit, that's the only reason I'm trying to correct that one anon,

>>48156766
Don't assume he's motivated by disgust anon, sometimes people do not know the exact definition of words and he may simply think gender=sex

>>48156766
Culture is exactly made up bullshit. The vast majority of human behavior is based on made up bullshit.

>>48156812
Gender is made up. It's how we describe what is.

>>48156755
>Depends on the culture he's in, in ours, most medieval/renaissance European, and presumably any fantasy setting based on that, yes you would be right,
That's only if you believe that culture determines things like gender identity. I could agree with that in some cases, like the liminal and shamanistic gender identities, like hijra or two spirit, but in general? Eh, not really. You can feel a certain way, even if it's hard to put into words how you feel. Although that really just gets into linguistic determinism territory, which I'll avoid rambling on and on about. I mean, this "making up new words to describe your specific feelings towards your gender" thing is exactly what everyone hates Tumblr for, but at the same time... well, you need words. Oh God someone stop me before I go down the Sapir-Whorf rabbit hole aaaaaaa But our culture doesn't really support those things, so they create the terms for them.

I *DO* however think that culture plays a part in sexuality, but that's a bit different. Sexuality is incredibly cultural, even more so than gender identity, and gender identity is already pretty fluid (I mean, you could say that a flamboyant gay exclusive bottom is a different gender than a Conan-esque heterosexual manly man with a barrel chest covered in fur, and that both of them are a different gender than a buttoned up Ward Cleaver type who likes buggering his card buddies when his wife is off on a spa day, but I'm going down a linguistics rabbit hole again)

>I think there's only ever been one premodern situation where that was allowed (and even then that was a historical aberration that only lasted about a century and a half) and was only found in a smattering of preIslam Arabian tribes, which I doubt the orcs in this situation are based on (unless your DM is going full /pol/)
There have been plenty of those. Not even Pre-Islamic.

>>48156812
>>48156820
>Culture is exactly made up bullshit
I'll give you that, anon. I just hate when people make value judgements about which made up stuff matters and which doesn't.

>>48156790
I've so far only really encountered "Gender is sex, male sexed people can never become female, reeeeee" from transphobic people who (mis)quote outdated and biased reports on how trannies are gross and mentally ill.

>>48143161
Matriarchal =! Women doing all the work.
Matriarchal == Women in charge.

Learn the difference.

>>48156827
>You can feel a certain way, even if it's hard to put into words how you feel
And those feelings mean absolutely nothing if there is no culture for them to exist in. Because you live in a culture, any culture, you need a description to function within it. Without such need you would simply be, and the concern of gender identity would be irrelevant. Gender would not exist without culture because it's a thing designed specifically to allow interaction with culture.

>>48156827
>
That's only if you believe that culture determines things like gender identity. I could agree with that in some cases, like the liminal and shamanistic gender identities, like hijra or two spirit, but in general?
My understanding was that was the case, sex is biological, gender is cultural, most of what I've read on the matter (at least before all this SJW bullshit), reinforced that

>There have been plenty of those. Not even Pre-Islamic.
That don't involve castration? That seemed to have been common theme from what I've seen in that case, but I'll admit to not looking too heavily into the specifics of every instance

>>48156845
>I've so far only really encountered "Gender is sex, male sexed people can never become female, reeeeee" from transphobic people who (mis)quote outdated and biased reports on how trannies are gross and mentally ill.
Language has an affect on how one thinks, thinking X=Y and then being suddenly told "No Y means Z, which while similar to X can be very different" can understandably cause push back as it pings as wrong to the brain, there's actually been some interesting studies with color and the definitions of shades that imply the brain my not be able to register them in the long term memory if it doesn't have a name for said shade and will ping it as wrong if you for instance call something "Cerulean" when it remembers "Blue"


But it's getting late, I have work in the morning and the thread's dying, so this is a debate for another day and unless told otherwise I think the other anon may simply be operating under the incorrect definition, that while technically wrong (particularly in scholarly situations), is commonly used in this incorrect maner

>>48143161
Iroquois, Hopi, Mosou.

>>48156827
Men who like to dress like women and do women things cannot exist if there is no culture that says what dressing/behaving like women is. Culture must exist for gender to exist.

File: Genderbread-Person-3.3.jpg (314KB, 1224x792px) Image search: [Google]

314KB, 1224x792px

>>48143161
>>48156875
http://aplus.com/a/matriarchal-societies-different-mainstream
http://www.mapsofworld.com/around-the-world/matriarchy.html
Not actually reading either, but I just googled "Matriarchal societies".

>>48156889
>>48156929
Gender and gender expression aren't entirely the same, either, though that one is really more vague.
But since transgender people are in effect mentally intersexed (see my previous link from Scientific American), that's something that's completely irrespective of culture.

>>48156909
>That don't involve castration?
I haven't particularly looked that up, but Hijra can hold a woman's place and marry as women. There are a few others like that, but their names aren't as easy to remember.
>sex is biological, gender is cultural
This is *mostly* true. See above, though. Gender is somewhat biological. When you get down to it, pretty much anything that involves FEELINGS and EMOTIONS is based in psychology, which is biology (which is chemistry, which is physics, and so on).
Pic related is vaguely accurate enough. Though not quite. And of course it doesn't explain the brain stuff.
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20032-transsexual-differences-caught-on-brain-scan/
This is why I said "mentally intersexed" earlier.

Remember: What society says male sexed people do and female sexed people do is cultural. What sex your brain says you should be (regardless of what your body actually is) is biological. This is also true if your brain doesn't particularly see it as being one way or the other (and this extends beyond what we consider "genders"; fun fact: Gay men read maps like women https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7069-gay-men-read-maps-like-women/ )
The old "woman trapped in a man's body" metaphor is way too simplistic, but not entirely untrue.

This thread is almost dead, but hopefully this information can still be useful to someone.

Not only to inform them on real world issues that are becoming more common as people (admit that they) identify a certain way that isn't the average, but also to better help create cultures that are different from modern America.

Unfortunately, this is the only thing I have info on. Fuck ya'll if you want plate tectonics. Everyone fucks those up anyway.

>>48156971
>What society says male sexed people do and female sexed people do is cultural. What sex your brain says you should be (regardless of what your body actually is) is biological.
I think we are drawing the line at two different places here, I'm referring to only the cultural context of the role, not an individual in the role, brain chemistry is a nonfactor in how I'm looking at it, just how the culture/society sees them

>>48156971
>https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7069-gay-men-read-maps-like-women/
>Gay men employ the same strategies for navigating as women – using landmarks to find their way around – a new study suggests.
Well I must be a flaming faggot cause that's the only way I know how to get around.
This passes for legitimate science now? For real?

>>48157057
Read the whole thing.
It's actually about map reading skills. Women and gay men are apparently bad at reading maps.
>Women tend to navigate using landmarks. For example: “Turn left at the church and carry on past the corner shop.” Rahman told New Scientist that “men rely more on the points of the compass; they have a better sense of north, south, east and west”. They are also more likely to describe distances.
Studies like this are usually part of larger research, or spin offs, as opposed to the whole enchilada in and of themselves.

It's also probably not anything meaningful, but it is interesting.

>>48157021
That would be gender expression. Although I'd argue that regardless of culture, a man that dresses, presents, and identifies as a woman is a woman, even if the culture disagrees. After all, most of the internet seems intent on arguing that transgender people are never the gender they identify as no matter what, regardless of culture.

>>48156971
>When you get down to it, pretty much anything that involves FEELINGS and EMOTIONS is based in psychology
Which is very heavily influenced by culture. There are categories of psychological problems that only exist because of issues brought up by how we've interpreted societal values in relation to ourselves.
Brain chemistry, of all our biological traits, is by far the one most subject to cultural influence. Honestly with what we've come to understand about this and epigenetics I'm still surprised people treat any part of biology as some objective absolute somehow not subject to the influences of society

>>48157146
Again, compass directions and distance mean nothing to me. Maps are largely useless.

This seems like one of those things where the meaning of a correlation is highly overestimated.

>>48157189
Culture plays a part in psychology, yes, but the FEELINGS and EMOTIONS part is more biology.
I'm not saying brain chemistry isn't influenced by society (I mean, depression, anorexia, etcetera), I'm just saying that in this case we're talking about the actual architecture of the brain.

>>48157268
Well shit, nigga, maybe you love cock.
Or they're not saying anything is an absolute.
Although which of your fingers is second longest?