Warhammer 40k General

when do I get fires of cyraxus
need me a dune train for my tin men

Tell me about the last game you played.
What were the armies? What happened? Who won?

>>47847523
Some time late this year or early next year.

>>47847523
Enjoy the 110$+ troop transport.

What do you have against someone fielding one Imperial Knight at games of over 1,500 points?

Anyone know of a torrent for all of miniwargamings paid battle reports?

Most of their free ones for 7th have been filled with that faggot quirk and other random 12 year old guests

>>47847631
I don't, so long as you make sure your opponent is ok with it.

>>47847631
My list can't kill it, guaranteed, but I'd let you run it anyways.

>>47847656
>Faggot quirk
Matt?

>>47847631
Nothing really. I'm completely against the addition of superheavies in regular 40k well, at least without the added benefits when not having one while battling against them that escalation gave and even I wouldn't have issue with a knight at those point levels.

>>47847706
>Matt?
Nah Quirk.

Dude who flat out has no idea on how to play nor even the statlines of his own units.

nobody gave a shit about my list in the last thread, but I changed it since then anyway

csm 1500

daemon prince
>daemon of tzeentch, power armor, wings

20 cultists
10 csm
>combi-melta, 2 melta, rhino
10 csm
>2 flamer, rhino

4 terminators
>4 combi-plasma, 3 power axes/1 chainfist
5 chosen
>5 flamers, rhino

4 spawn

trilas predator
vindicator
vindicator

I would like to run 3 rhinos with marines for coolness purposes. would like more efficient means of doing this while still having a decent amount of power armor and offensive output

>>47847741
Oh that's an actual person?

I mostly watch the banter ones because Dave reminds me of my dead brother.

>>47847741
It's because everyone but Matt and the new guy are actually good at the game. The others were hired because they're good modelers.

The new guy was specifically hired because he knew the rules of a bunch of games.

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This thread now needs bingo! The free tile for today is "CATAPHRACTII BIKES".

After all, the whole purpose of these is to foster discussions.

>>47847823
>>47847901
yea i can only seem to watch dave and occasionally the mountain because everyone else seems way to serious about a game with small miniature plastic men.

>>47847926
>someone taking the bait even though they know it's bait, butthurt ensues
Nothing could describe the last few threads anymore perfectly.
But seriously, why the hell has this general been even shittier than usual lately?

>>47847727
This exactly. If someone brings a Superheavy to a casual game of 40k, it's your duty to inform them that you're immediately going to claim your right to a +1 Seize, and the unique, SUPER warlord trait table from escalation.

It was put there for a fucking reason, to even the playing field that happens whenever someone brings a superheavy when you don't have one.

Looking for some feedback on 1500 pts Blood Angels CAD before I start gluing shit. Hoping to infiltrate DC and librarian into combat. Not sure if I am going too heavy on troops choices.

HQ [ 1 ]
Librarian (ML2, Gallans, Veritas, Jump Pack) - 130pts

Elite [ 3 ]
5x Death Company (Jump Packs & 1x Powerfist) - 140pts
5x Death Company (Jump Packs & 1x Powerfist) - 140pts
5x Sanguinary Guard (Swords) - 165pts

Troops [ 3 ]
5x Tactical Marines (Heavy Flamer, LasPlas Razorback) - 165pts
5x Tactical Marines (Heavy Flamer, Drop Pod) - 115pts
5x Tactical Marines (Meltagun, Combi-Melta, LasPlas Razorback) - 175pts
5x Tactical Marines (Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Drop Pod) - 125pts

Heavy Support [ 3 ]
Sicaran(Battle of Sarosh = 1 gun gets interceptor/AA buffs) - 165pts
2x Rapier Quad Mortar - 120pts
1x Rapier Quad Mortar - 60pts

>>47847970
Somewhere around 70% of the whole bingo is common bait. I try to make sure that it stays around 60 - 70% 'Common' bait, and the rest of it as board memes.

I'm surprised "Drop Pods with the Doors Glued Shut" didn't last very long after the initial outrage over it first happening. I guess we need to wait for someone to bring a 35 drop-pod list to an official tournament, and use it to intentionally wall poor saps inside of their own deployment zone so they can't leave.

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>the pic that should have been in the OP

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>>47848006
>not being able to destroy immobilized AV10

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>>47848012
We need to build a wall from shitty op images like these

>>47847979
> Sicaran with Battle of Sarosh for dat "Ignores Cover - Sunder - Skyfire - Interceptor".
> Cheaper than a Deredeo with War On Murder

Oh wow, why didn't I ever think of this? Isn't Sarosh a voluntary Skyfire, or is it permanent? Because if it's the latter, I can see why the DwWOM is more useful. But still.

>>47848033
AV12

>>47847979
how the fuck you going to infiltrate DC?

>>47848051
you get skyfire, intercepter, tank hunter and night vision once per game

>>47848058
master of ambush warlord trait

>>47848048
I'll keep making them until and you will NEVER stop me because western countries do not have sensible immigration laws in 2016

>>47848058
Not that anon, but he's rolling CAD, so he can try for Trait #3 on Strategic, Master of Ambushes. It lets you infiltrate ANY infantry, and by extension their transports.

>>47847979
Characters grant Infiltrate to the squad you attach them to, Infiltrate doesn't grant to the character. A Librarian with Master of Ambushes should be giving HIMSELF, and both of the Death Company squads infiltrate, while he then joins the squad of Sanguinary Guard to give them his infiltrate. Their delish 2+ saves make them better body guards anyway.

>>47848088
YET

>>47848072
Oh, so it's discount emergency anti-air. Carry on then, I suppose that's much easier to take in smaller games than the 255/235 point Deredeo.

>>47848095
>>47848085
Thank you apparently sleeping all day isnt healthy for my memory. also i never roll on the normal warlord trait table i just roll on the Blood Angles warlord traits.

>>47848123
>he thinks trump will actually do shit about immigration

laughing_reptilian_elites.vox

I'm pro trump for shitposting purposes but come on senpai, you don't actually believe what anybody in this political freak show says right?

to keep this post 40k related:
what happened to the audiobooks in the OP? are there 40k audiobooks archived elsewhere? would like to listen while painting

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>>47848148
Oh, how good are the Blood Angels warlord traits? Usually I roll on Strategic, because it's a grab-bag of Army buffs that you can never really go wrong with, except maybe using Princeps of Deceit on a high leadership army. But that's precisely what CAD is for.

>>47847491
>rules
>https://mega.co.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGs..
>7th edition reference sheet
>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4104995/Games/7ed..
>Forge World
>http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Forge_World_and_Apo..
All of these links are formatted wrong. Does anyone have the proper links?

>>47848178
> Books got removed from the OP
Oh shit, thanks for pointing that out. Here, have my library card, and be sure to stay well the fuck away from the clowns. They're very murderous, fickle things.

https://mega.nz/#F!wx4BiKhD!YhnAf1BqSmAB8dO6xDM56Q!c4pGAJDb

>>47847599
>implying I don't already have 2 flawless recasts of them
I kekd

>>47848183
Mixed bag of minor combat orientated buffs and giant army wide buffs. It's risky to roll on if you don't have a reroll.

>>47848207
That's all fluff. Do you have any of the rules?

>>47848207
t. hanks

>>47847926
Okay, so this bingo sheet has two tiles that need replacing. I'm currently taking suggestions for replacements of the following:

> "Ultramarines are the Best Chapter"
> "Mathhammer doesn't tell you how well units perform in real battes."

>>47848183
eh they are decent you only want about 3 of them in total when playing. Mostly just so that you can reduce scatter on your Jump infantry or your warlord Rampage as i dont know if the heroic bearing trait gives your own troops fearless and you dont really need it as all troops already have ATSKNF.

>>47848268
I also have the vermillion keys for the codexes, yes. Here's the better database, since the OP has a null link. May their tactical knowledge make you a better commander in the field.

https://mega.nz/#F!BxI1HSgI!0tKymKh9RZTzGpgIA5EyCg

>>47848284
>Complaining about the OP image

it still makes me angry that neither the Blood Angels or the Dark Angels got anything from the Angel of Death Supplement.

>>47847491
What the fuck OP, all of your links are fucking broken. They all got cut off somehow. Don't fucking post next time. Just let me handle it with a fresh set of links. Codexes, Reference Sheet, Forgeworld, and White Dwarf are all broken. The only goddamn thing that still works is the Rules Errata.

Here, use this format next time.These are more recent links, and contain everything.

[Insert Edition] edition
> Codexes
https://mega.nz/#F!BxI1HSgI!0tKymKh9RZTzGpgIA5EyCghttps://kat.cr/warhammer-40k-pdf-library-t9575373.html

>FAQ
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Rules-Errata

> The Black Library(Stay the fuck away from the clowns)
https://mega.nz/#F!wx4BiKhD!YhnAf1BqSmAB8dO6xDM56Q!c4pGAJDb

>>47848392
Me too, Anon, me too.
Keep your fingers crossed for a stand-alone codex later.

>>47847926
>>47848334
>>47848419
>bitching about the links in the OP

>>47848481
Itll never happen, The Blood angels are probably the bastard love child of the space marines. We are on the BT route currently and i fear for the next edition. on another note how anyone have the BA start collecting formation/picture?

>>47847458
Paradox is just built for 3 WC spells, but if you already have a robe on him then go wild. Frankly with a robe I might give my LoC a greater and 3 lessers, or even an exalted rolling for doubly blessed just because the staff of change is probably one of the best 10 point weapons in the game and the robe accomplishes most of your durability. Guaranteeing a summoning/incursion/prismatic gaze a turn is just so disgusting though, especially the latter with a flying BS 6 platform.

>>47848392
It's called Imperial Armour 2; Warmachines of the Adeptus Astartes. You still have access to Deredeos, Leviathans, Rapiers, Typhons, Deathstorms, Lucius Patterns, Dreadnought Pods, Infernum Razorbacks, Fellblades, and Legacies of Glory.

You really, REALLY should consider picking up the book so you can expand your options. Just Rapiers alone can seriously expand the threat level of your army since Laser Destroyers are like kryptonite to tanks.

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>>47848644
I think that anons issue is more that a book called angels of death didn't contain anything for THE angels of death, not that they're lacking the options provided in the book.

>>47847748
Rhino gunline. It's easier to do with loyalist formations, but basically you do this:

>move rhino (6 or 12", doesn't matter)
>disgorge troops on the side
>fire
>flat-out rhino in front of troops and rotate so they are LOS blocked
>repeat

Flamers are also kinda useless unless you really expect to see a lot of hordes/bunched enemies. Melta or plasma are better (take plasma if you can get rerolls somehow).

So many of the units for KDK are resin...

Wew, should I just stop being a bitch and learn to work with resin, or could I make a decent KDK list with only plastic models?

>>47848284
You really should just be using mathhammer as a informal gauge than a hardline fact for determining if a unit is good/bad. Or just use it for finding out if it's worth shooting/assaulting a thing that turn

OP here.
Don't know what happened with the links. Just copied them from the last OP, because I'm on my phone right now and don't have the copypasta saved on it.
Sorry about that. I guess that once again, OP is a faggot.

Is there a specific model for the blood angels captain as i cant seem to find one at all.

>>47848783
>Not having an entirely resin army

git gud

Are the Typhoon launchers worth it for land speeders?

Been working on custom vehicles and was interested in hearing opinions on this one. Still haven't worked out points costs, and it needs playtesting.

Chaos Assault Rhino
BS3 Armour Front 11 Side 11 Rear 10 HP2
Open-topped, Fast Vehicle
Option to buy Daemon Smog Launcher
Heavy 3, One use
Fire 1, 5+ cover save
Fire 2, 4+ cover save
Fire 3, 3+ cover save

>>47848794
I don't even use mathhammer myself, since it only tells you how effective weapons are in a literal, "This character can punch out this character" sense. I favor FAXIV for finding out how effective units are, based on the difference in their "points cost" and "Effective cost".

A unit with a lower points cost than their effective cost will perform extremely well on the tabletop, and an army with a vastly higher effective cost than its points cost will similarly do very well. A properly optimized gladius has easily ~3000 points worth of firepower to play with in a 1850 game.

>>47848872
What would be the disadvantage to firing 3 at once? Most of the time it's not going to survive long enough to use the other charges anyways.

>>47848901
Each charge is one use. So all three at once leaves none for the rest of the game. Or you could spread them out for small boosts if you have cover.

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>>47848644
>Typhons
But, anon, there's only one of him. Unless Fabulous Bill has tried cloning him?

>>47848783
Use alternative angry dog minis (check the fantasy line for your preferred option) for flesh hounds and you shouldn't need to touch anything resin at all.

>>47848826
There's the new terminator captain model that came with deathstorm, captain karlean or something. If you want a power armour captain it would be really easy to build one out of the BA upgrade sprue and some nice power armour bits from either the BA tactical or sanguinary guard sprues.

>>47848861
Depends on what you want to use them for. I like to bring a couple of independent speeders with the launchers to hold back field objectives while also putting down a bit of long range firepower, but that's with ravenwing jinking magic so your mileage may vary with other chapters.

>>47848935
Well that's what I'm saying, there's no real reason to ever just use one.

In the open field, why not take the 3+, because you take the 5+ and probably die anyway or take the 4+ and then only have a 5+ remaining.

How would it work in cover? Each charge improves save by one? That just sounds kinda broken. Sure, you use one charge to take your 5+ cover to 4+. Or you could just get a 2+ because fuck you. That rhino isn't going to have a purpose after it gets rid of its cargo anyways, might as well just abuse the cover save and die a turn later compared to a normal rhino. Why hurt your odds trying to keep it alive longer?

>>47848958
Oh, I mean the Typhon Siege Tank. It's a 6 HP superheavy that packs a 48" massive blast with Ignores Cover.

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>Regiments from the World of Jippon are noted for two things: their mastery of amphibious warfare, and their sheer fanaticism.
>Power swords in the traditional fashion of Jippon's curved blades are standard issue for Commissars,
>Nearly every armored regiment is considered capable of traversing water, which they use to their advantage - flanking the foe from unexpected position.
>The Jipponee do not hesitate to initiate full-on, headlong charges into superior enemy forces when called upon to do so. The rallying cry of "Ten Heika Banzee!" is often heard during these massive offensives.

>>47848964
I was planning on going White Scars. I thought they had the +1 jink too, but it's only on bikes for some reason.

>>47848760
I have played against an IG player with a bunch of troops that I wished I could flame to death, same with an ork player so I'm hoping those 2 flamer squads help as what I want to be a take all comers list. probably not possible with chaos but a man can dream. also that chosen squad will still kill damn near 5 marines on average by forcing saves, assuming each template gets 5 hits which seems reasonable to expect in my experience

>>47849030
Ah, I know. Just messing with you.

>>47848964
god dammit, i really wanted to make Dante Aphael. you or any other anon know someone who sells good bits?

>>47849054
There's other things that kill marines better for cheaper. Well, maybe not in C:CSM, I'm not sure. But that seems like a big points investment to kill... 5 marines.

>>47848884
>I don't like mathhammer because they actually tell you objective facts
>I prefer a hilariously subjective and inaccurate system
Retards like you are why the mathhammer tile should stay.

>>47848884
You're gonna have to explain what FAXIV is, cause that sounds like interesting food for thought but yes I kind of agree with you on the point efficiency thing. It's one of the reasons free transports with the Gladius Strikeforce can be hilariously more powerful than one would imagine. It's really hard to be the low low price of "free"

>>47849054
>also that chosen squad will still kill damn near 5 marines on average by forcing saves
Sure, in the magical Christmasland of hitting five 32mm bases with each flamer template.

>>47847748
Split up the cultists, give the Prince a familiar and some mastery levels, drop the Termicide back down to 3, yank the chosen, split the spawn up and give them MoN.

>>47848964
So should I just be flooding the table with bloodletters?

>>47849194
>You're gonna have to explain what FAXIV
Give X an arbitrary point value. Try to guesstimate the rough value of changes to that statline. Change as necessary so that it conforms with obvious balance issues but fails to actually provide meaningful insight.

>>47849114
>>47849241
>32mm

most people I have played against still have 25mm but damn I guess the bigger base sizes would make it worse. also as I said in my post already, it's not specifically for marines, it's for orks/guard. I was just saying it can kill half a squad of marines too if there's nobody else around (on 25mm bases anyway). if I shouldn't take those chosen then wat do, I want marines in a rhino that can do something but only have 150 points. 5 flamers seems like the best bargain option

>>47848935
>>47848872

Ah. For clarity, I'd just say "3 Daemon Smog Lanchers" rather than one, and list the profile as Heavy 1, One Use Only. Makes it much more clear.

Overall, I'd say give it back its last Hull Point and you'd be golden, and I'd keep its BS at 3 while giving it the Daemonic Possession special rule.

Also, just FYI, base Rhinos do come with a Combi-Bolter stock. You'd be perfectly okay in giving one to this.

I'd personally put it at around 60pts or so, just for the fact that it's an Assault Transport + Daemonic Possession.

>>47849243
Jesus, fuck no. Buy Chaos Warhounds from the Fantasy line and paint them red. Voila, cheap Flesh Hounds. Core of your army should be the Gorepack. Back them up with a small CAD of 2x Cultists and a Jugger-HQ of your choice. Maybe add some Maulerfiends or something else to add some more punch. Expand into the decurion at higher point levels.

>>47849194
I have a massively outdated list for FAXIV up 1d4chan, but it's so old that it's pretty outdated.

But the general gist of it is that you check vehicles out by using the old school rules for creating vehicles on a points system, and compare it to the actual codex costs.

The only thing still useful on the wiki though is part of the setup for weapons. As a general rule of thumb, a Single shot at (Wounds infantry and most things on a 2+), and AP2, is worth 15 x (%hit). So a Plasma Gun in the hands of BS4 is worth 19.8 points.

So more (tendency to wound) shots at Ap2, and higher ballistic skill, means more points. At the extreme end of the scale is the Grav-Cannon, which costs 35 points, and is worth 49.5 points in the hands of a space marine. It's worth even more in a gladius, thanks to the To-Hit bonuses granted by your formation.

>>47849287
Anon's right, old FAXIV(Which you find by googling it) was nearly 90% guesswork, and it's too unfinished to be of any use by someone who isn't a statistics major

>>47849293
Even at 25mm getting 5 marines per flamer is absurdly optimistic. 2-3 is a far more reasonable estimate.

>>47848872
it's complete shit and unnecessary, we already have enough "here's some trash to fix your codex problems but actually it won't really" gear, no thanks. just give our assault-based units like berzerkers and chosen a rule that says "this unit can charge from any vehicle as though it is an assault vehicle", done and done. it seems that people can't comprehend the fact that assault units should just be buffed with no downsides because at the moment it's completely underpowered, there's no reason to giveth with one hand and taketh away with the other. just giveth, we need it just to keep our heads above water.

I only just learned that Orks can have Chaos as desperate allies. Is this worth it? I always thought khorne daemonkin were pretty cool but I wouldn't want to have more than like ~300 points of them in an ork army. Aren't they really good as psychic stuff? I never touch that stuff with my orks.

>>47848644
Never played against a typhon, is it a fun super-heavy or a "please end this game" super heavy?

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>>47849042
Ah, that is something people often forget when comparing the WS and RW forces - it's not just bikes. That said it's still a good and fluffy tactic for your chapter if you don't want to bring more static vehicles along for the ride.

>>47849113
This guy? He's pretty much just the BA tactical squad sergeant https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/catalog/product/600x620/99120101122_BATacticalSquad03.jpg with the backpack from the plastic captain kit, should be pretty painless to recreate.

>>47849243
What resin units in particular are you worried about? Because honestly looking through the khorne line I don't see any of concern past a few older HQ models, out of all the chaos gods khorne is easily the most supported model wise.

>>47849132
Gonna start this off by saying I'm a different dude:

>I don't like mathhammer because they actually tell you objective facts

While the math isn't "wrong," it only tells you how things play out in a vacuum. The tabletop is not a vacuum at all, and there are always in-game complications like terrain, your opponents layout, your own layout, your opponents strategy changing, your own strategy changing, etc. Mathhammer is not going to tell you how to adapt to new strategies and how to best use your units - it's only good for raw numbers.

Point of this is to say that if you're relying on mathhammer to win your battles, you're not gonna win a lot of battles. Mathhammer is an incredibly useful tool, and one that I use on all my armies, but too many people tout it like it's gonna make you win all the time when it does not do that at all. Mathhammered netlists will almost always lose to smart gameplay against an average list (not gimped, average).

Also hyper-optimization is high-risk strategy and always will be.

>>47849287
SO....you just add a point value to everything and add it up on a per model basis to see if it's good or not? That sounds like it only works if you've already got a system in place to determine point value to begin with, because 22 points for a Flash Git is not as good as 22 points for a Sternguard.

>>47849364
>>47849194
This is also a perfect showcase of FAXIV's other major issue. No one but one delusional faggot actually has the whole thing, so any criticism can instantly be shielded by claiming it's fixed. Not that the inherent flaws of the system will ever go away.

Want to get into WHFB originally but its dead now for whatever the fuck that new shit is so turning to 40K. Is there an online sim or something to test out warhammer 40k combat and get into it and is there like a Z'gok version (coming from gunpla) of units that are super cheap that I can practice painting on? I really odnt want blotchy shitty units and thats like my biggest barrier to getting into 40K.

>>47849396
>it only tells you how things play out in a vacuum
It's the only objective evaluation system. It can accurately predict the potential for X to injure Y, and allows basic comparative and efficiency analysis.

The rest of your strawman horseshit isn't worth specifically addressing.

>>47849428
The idea was fine, it just never got executed. Some units are inherently more valuable than others, but that value is so hard of a target to really find. Nice strawman by the way.

>>47849403
You spend 22 points for a Flash Git, and 22 points for a Sternguard. The difference is that a Flash Git doesn't offer enough to offset its points cost, and will likely never do so. While a Sternguard veteran has more to offer. To put it simply, taking a Flash Git will inherently make your list WORSE. While a sternguard will improve it.

>>47849392
The Herald of Khorne on a Juggernaut and stuff like Flesh Hounds are resin.

I'm willing to bite the bullet and work with resin, I'm just... uneasy about it.

>>47847901
Matt seems like such a shithead.
He ruthlessly stomps new players and people with casual lists with his ultra-competetive builds, and he always seems to have a cover save even though his opponent never does in the same situation.

He's the kind of guy that would make me leave for lunch with my friends if he walked into my FLGS.

>>47849549
I'd honestly only play with Dave.

I've seen videos where the other player will say Dave did something wrong and Dave will check the book and then, more often than not, allow the rolls to either be re-done or do whatever he has to to tilt the advantage back to the guest.

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>>47849549
pretty beta, you should make him leave for lunch instead

>>47848095
Master of Ambush grants Infiltrate to your Warlord in addition to 3 non-vehicle units. No need to waste one pick on himself.

I've also considered doing the Infernal Tetrad and rolling on that chart in the hopes of having 4 infiltrating DPs and the ability to infiltrate 12 other daemon units.

>>47849442
I'd go to a store, they're usually eager to indoctrinate fresh meat. In fact they might even try to sell you on fantasy, if they're willing to demo it then it might be at least worth looking into. But yeah playing a small skirmish with a guy who's job it is to know rules would be a good experience. If you're experience there is bad go to a different GW I guess.

>>47849510
But I already wouldn't take Flash Gits outside of I like the model and it's neat to occasionally get a Str5 AP1 shots out, and it's in the same force org slot as Lootas and Mek Guns. Then again I do have Sternguard as well whose sole purpose is first turn drop pod melta and they do that job very well. I more look at it as, "what can they do, and do they share a slot with a unit that is more useful in the same slot?"

>>47849510
>Nice strawman by the way.
What strawman? He literally came in, admitted to all the faults, and then claimed that everything was fixed in the copy that no one has ever seen and has shown zero actual predictive/analytic capability.

Woah, Grav Guns are OP? Thank god FAXIV was here to tell us this. Free transports in a battle company add a lot of free points to a list? Who could have guessed it?

>>47849442
There's a vassal module and tabletop simulator options, but they're both a bit clunky to use.

For painting I googled Z'gok and got images of a robot with quite large panels that would be easy to paint, so I take it that's what you're looking for. Space marines are pretty much the 40k version of that, so this set is probably the best way to get into it: https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Space-Marines-Starter-Paint-Set-2016

It's £20 direct from GW, but if you look around you can find third party retailers that sell 40k stuff new for 20% off.

>>47849539
Yeah the juggernaut may be an issue, but you can get chaos warhounds or the undead wolfs from the fantasy line to replace fleshounds for far cheaper. Resin isn't that difficult to use or paint really, just way more fragile than plastic. I understand your aversion to it completely though.

>>47849607
So then technically you could have 5 units infiltrating? Warlord, Warlord's babysitters, and 3 other units of your choice?

>>47849619
Flash Gitz suffer from having a sort of Meh' weapon. The unreliable AP makes it worth a lot less, but you can assume it's AP3. It works best against GEQ, but the entire rest of your army is a hard-counter to GEQ already. In addition, your low ballistic skill reduces the effectiveness further.

So Flash Gitz are just too unreliable to ever justify their points cost, and most of the time will only deliver 'meh' results.

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>people who expect you to spend the whole day at an FLGS

why do people expect this, nigga I got places to be. I understand that a lot of people make it an evening to stay at the FLGS all day on a saturday or something, but it seems like way too many people assume this is automatically the case for everyone. this has happened to me multiple times:

>post on store forum for a game
>end up texting the dude for meetup times at the store etc
>show up at agreed time
>receive text: "hey man I'll be there in like 2 hours"

man what, I never agreed to this. I don't want to stay here for 2 hours dicking around talking and watching other people play and THEN play a game for another 2 hours, I wanted to spend a couple hours playing and then just leave. I don't mind chilling at the store all day IF I HAD PLANNED TO DO SO BEFOREHAND

>>47849549
Matt doesn't make good lists, he's just a great player. I could go on about how absolutely fucking terrible his Tau and Nid lists usually are. His Marine lists are usually just random stuff. The dude takes fucking mass Lictors for christ sakes.

If you actually watch the game the vast majority of his opponents are garbage decision makers who rely on their lists and roll poorly for reserves. Matt just takes random shit and beats the breaks off of people in game.

Unless he's testing new shit or someone wants a stress test his lists are poorly optimized.

>>47849691
I legit find it's better to come to the store with a few lists of multiple point values and then just ask there.

>>47849669
Dude, I actually play Orks. I accept that random chance is my sword of Damocles so I just roll with it, and Flash gits are on the low side of bad random chance in that whole book. Again, the Flash Gits have a bitchin gun that is neat to build and paint for sheer variety.

>>47848284
How do we fix CSM?
or
There are no CSMs in CSM armies.

Is it just me, or are KDK players generally complete twats? there's 4 guys playing them around here, and of those 3of them range from irritating to insufferable douchebag, not to mention being massive powergamers to boot

>>47849691
You should've told that cunt to shove it, it'd be different if he canceled or told you ahead of time, but what you described is bonkers

>>47849392
shit how am i this stupid that i couldnt tell its just the sergeant kit with the captains backpack.

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>>47849657

Oh, for context, Z'gok suits in Gunpla are basically 5$ kits you can quickly build and more or less use to practice technique and improve since they're like 50-60% off a real HG kit.

I can take a look at that, I basically just want to hoard up a couple sets of squads and just practice painting until I get something that looks.. not professional, but passable. I dont want to show up with a 3rd grade art class project on the field.

>>47849337
My group likes to play at 1.5k, what kind of stuff should I try to have?

>>47849710
I do that too or just text people I know but sometimes when I'm not sure I'll get a game/certain people will not be there I post on the forum, it's a big store so it's usually somebody different every time

>>47849726
it happened three times with different people, although one was for a trade, not a game

>text "I'm here"
>"oh you're already there? I'll be in the store around 5"
>around 5
>it's 1pm
>mfw

we agreed to 1pm you cockhead, it's right here on my phone.

>>47849782
What armies were you thinking of collecting?

>>47849782
Ah, well the set linked is pretty expensive in comparison to that but it covers all bases. An anon in the WIP thread recently bought and painted that set with guidance from Duncan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_odi1c7ErCg without any experience beforehand and they came out amazing for their first minis.

>>47849442
If you're looking to get into WHFB I'd recommend just getting the new Total War game.

>>47847926
Have a free wanting old rules back on me.

>>47848794
The better you do your mathhammer the better gauge is. Averages are a start, but you at least want to be able to see the probability curves against the units they are likely if you want a more hard-line approach.

>>47849709
I largely agree with this post, but I -do- think he is a bit anal with sticking to the rules. I tend to enjoy his battle reports more for his explanation of his tactics and his knowledge of the rules. Dave is either the best or worst, no fucking middle-ground. Steve is too fucking fat and breathes like his namesake would, but he is a cool guy with enjoyable reports(Dude dropped CWE for their underpowered Dark Kin). Quirk is just shit at the game, but one of the more enjoyable employees. Josh seems pretty cool, but I haven't seen enough to decide on him(Except he is hella ugly).

If anything? I miss Leland

>>47849870
maybe people don't wanna play with you, do you have a reputation there?

>>47849380
daemons are great, daemonkind are okay if crippled. daemons can easily do anything you need. you could get the khorne get started box and easily use that as an ally detachment for daemons or daemonkind.

>>47849015
It's a first draft. My group usually plays on boards with decent cover, and I wanted to try and give our assault players a chance. Maybe instead it could grant shrouded for a turn?

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>>47849039

>>47849307
Cool, thanks. I'll try it out like that when we start playtesting.

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>>47850536

>>47849372
I'm not really trying to fix anything. My group likes coming up with new units and vehicles all the time. Just trying new stuff for fun.

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>>47850293
>maybe people don't wanna play with you, do you have a reputation there?

sure man, I have a weird reputation where people only halfway hate me so they schedule games with me but then realize they want to be late to them

I was wondering and wanted to get the option of tg.

Do you like formations? Do you think formations are good or bad for the game as a whole?

If your answer to these was no, are you playing an army that doesn't have any good or no formations?

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>>47850551

>>47850607
is the concept good? yes

is the execution? this is a GW game my man

Going to buy the Start Collecting DE box next weekend. I'm planning on getting a Razorwing Jetfighter if the shop has one, too. Good idea to have a solo Razorwing or do I need 2 Razorwings to use Death from Skies shit?

>>47850607
Formations have ruined the game by allowing people to take tax free armies and spam their best units. I use a CAD instead, and I think if formations are hwre to stay they need to include very substantial taxes (a Wraithlord is not a tax people).

>>47850657
Multiple flyers defiantly got better with Death from the Skies, but since the Razorwing Jetfighter is a fighter, all of it's bonuses pretty much only apply against enemy flyers.

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>>47850582
well shit, maybe it's a prank. what do you play by the way? perhaps your locals are just shit, might be time to find a new store

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>>47850607
the main problem in my opinion is that formations are so bland, GW has basically pulled The Elder Scrolls: Wargame Edition, a franchise that started as overly complex with truckloads of options gradually became a casualized snoozefest geared toward children for maximum profits.

some people say "but it's good game design dude, you need to get rid of the archaic bullshit and streamline the system." those people are fucking faggots and the cancer that kills everything good ever. people who like complex games get into those games in the first place because they enjoy an immersive, in-depth experience with lots of content. when you remove half the shit in the game for "efficiency", it's not the same game anymore. yes, old 40k was full of retarded stuff like anti-plant grenades, and yes, it was awesome. having a bunch of suboptimal but fun options is great, it's not like you have to use them. just pick the best stuff like you already do.

anyway the point to this rant is that I don't see why GW doesn't #yolo and just come up with crazy stuff to include in formations, instead they play it simple and just turn everything into a universal special rule. to hell with that, I want a formation that gives me an ability you won't find anywhere else in the game, I want a situational formation that only works good against guardsmen without chemical masks, I want a tactical model placement system that gives me bonuses for swimming in dangerous rivers. this whole thing would be different if GW was playing things conservative to maintain the integrity of finely tuned game system, but they're not, the game isn't even balanced in a peg-legged tightrope walker's wet dream. might as well go balls out at this point.

How fun are necrons?
How good are necrons?

>>47850924
>Fun
Not very

>Good
With Decurion? Very

>>47850953
Whats unfun about them?I like their fluff

>>47847706

Why could your list not kill it? How do you deal with Necrons and the odd LR?

>>47850979
They're just bland and I say this as a necron player.

>>47850979
They are so boring to play
Basically marines in robot form - very few special rules

I love my DE despite them not being a good as Necrons

>>47850979
They walk forward, shoot, and don't die. They don't have a ton of tactics involved. Their units are so resilient that cover is optional and you don't have much to fear. Your units are so slow you have to pretty much determine where you want each unit to be from turn 1 and get there by turn 5.

>>47851017
>>47851016
>>47850989

Well shit.
How are Tyranids then?

>>47851076
"One army list is viable" the faction

>>47851017
Crons aren't that slow unless you footslog everything.

>>47851076
I'd say more fun to play and a little more tactical in terms of having to manage synapse, highly specialized units, and cover bubbles.

However, they are much weaker (generally only one good list), but depending on your meta they can be successful.

>>47851118
With the jink changes, I've seen Ghost Arks begin to drop off, but yeah jetbikes and Wraiths are fairly quick.

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>>47850988
Because I only play with my brother, his wife,my best friend and my girlfriend, our lists are mostly "I like this model, how can I put it into a formation, if at all?"

So, this is why my list (attached) is what it is. I've had a lot of trouble killing knights with it, as I think I should.

>>47849442
Two points, firstly if you liked Warhammer because of the setting then don't abandon ship yet. There's the 9th Age as a spiritual successor and Avatars of War and Kings of War are alternatives (AoW's models look very similar to WHFB).

>>47851102
>>47851126

Guess I will just stick with DE.
Are their melee units viable? I really like Incubi and Mandrake model. Are DE vehicles good?I like how tgey are literally ships

Would I be a bad sport for refusing games to a friend who just rolls incredibly well? Like the impossible saves/hits/results he manages to to roll are just fucking unbelievable. And it's EVERY game. I know he isn't using loaded dice. He just rolls stupidly well and I have always narrowly lost against him because he manages to pull some insane rolls to save the game.

>>47851294
Yes

>>47851294
>Man your luck is great
>I DON'T WANT TO PLAY AGAINST YOU FOR BEING LUCKY

You.

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>>47850612
There world war brought into compliance by the use of exterminates, twice.

>>47851210
Incubi are fairly good, not spectacular, but a few small hit squads of them tend to perform pretty well. Mandrakes aren't great, but they aren't bad either. Their problem is that they aren't exactly strong melee units and not strong shooting units; they do both OK. Wracks are decent CC units, and Grotesques are phenomenal (run both as Haemonulous Coven though since they have a better Power from Pain table for them).

Raiders are good for ferrying your melee units around the board (they used to be good at carrying Warriors, but the recent FAQ made all of our vehicles worse at carrying shooty units). Venoms (with double splinter cannons) are exceptional; they put out a ton of poisoned shots, making them a decent threat to anything with a toughness value. Ravagers (our tank equivalent) is decent. With disintegrators it is really good against anything with a good save (Marines, Terminators). With Dark Lances it makes an OK anti-vehicle platform, but Scourges with Haywire Blasters are usually just always better.

The one thing about our vehicles is that they are squishy, very very squishy. They move fast and posses a lot of bonuses like open topped or a ton of dakka, but they will die if something with even moderate strength fires at them and you don't jink (So you pretty much always have to jink).

In terms of powerlevel Dark Eldar tend to be on the weaker end of the spectrum, and pretty much can't do anything if the enemy has reliable ways of ignoring cover. That said, pick the army you'd want to paint and play. Unless you're a sore loser, pick the army you think looks coolest, has the best fluff and matches your play style. I have both Tau and Dark Eldar, and while I like my Tau suits, it doesn't come close to my love of my spiky hedonists in their spiky ships,\; playing Dark Eldar is just often more fun even if I don't win nearly as often.

>>47851294
not sure, but i know i have some luckier dice and cards i use when i know i need some help against a strong opponent or grey knights.

>>47847631
I have a hatred for people that bring knights.

>>47851304
>>47851314
I know it seems whiny but it's just not fun anymore because I know he'll pull the turnaround roll out of his ass if the game even remotely starts turning in my favor. And it's every single time. He has the highest win rate in the group just because he rolls so stupidly well. He plays Daemons so I'm convinced he sold his soul to Tzeench.

>>47851403
Call a priest, then.

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>>47847539
1850 points. My gk vs casual eldar. He got first turn, but only killed a couple models. I basically went straight for his seer council and took out most of them plus all his wraithguard my turn 1, and it was too much for him to recover from.

>>47851418
Bruh, I am the priest. I play Grey Knights.

>>47851429
would've thought a WAAC list would do that to a casual list?

>>47851429
>2 Dreadknights
I know GK aren't exactly OP or anything, but after three years of having to face them for 50% of my games, I can't help but shudder when ever I seem them. So many dead Kabalite Warriors in raiders, so many insta-killed Carnifexes. Trying and failing to kill 2 Dreadknights can flame any point on the board T1 was my life.

>>47851346
Thanks.

I will definetly want to use Scourges. Together with incubi they are my fav model. Im not a fan of wracks and talos models so hopefully I can just pass them

>>47851481
Not him, just throw a squad of guardsman at him. Guaranteed he'll roll 4 1's to save from flashlights. At least that's what happens to me in many occasions.

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>>47851462
How is my list waac? I brought a xiphon and a brotherhood champ. You're out of your mind. I literally played against a 5 knight list the day before. Get over yourself.

>>47847539
Space Marines vs Tyranids.

The first three turns, my Marines kept dying while barely managing to take any bugs down with them. My friend loves to keep going and hates when anyone concedes, so I kept playing.

By turn 4, he controlled half of the table, and the only squads still alive were my Assault Terminator Squad and my Heavy Bolter Devastator Squad.

As he marched across the table, the devastator marines laid down a hailstorm of righteous fury while the assault terminators charged into the oncoming horde and began swinging their thunder hammers with all of their might, taking down as many bugs as they could.

When the smoke cleared, every marine was dead, but nearly every fucking bug he had deployed as dead as well. It was then that we both realized there was a scout squad with sniper rifles hiding in a building that I had forgotten about.

As the last squad of warriors started sprinting across the battlefield to rip the scouts apart, they took desperate shots at the foul xenos, and they somehow managed to kill them (warriors only had 1 one wound left on each of them).

That scout squad was the only squad that had survived the entire battle, and now I think they've earned their power armor. Need to think of something to put on the new Tactical Marines to show who they are.

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Why is the fucking Hive Tyrant with its oh-so-horrifying S6 in the tank killer category?

>>47851530
>my list isn't waac because I played against something more waac

>>47851504
Scourges and Incubi are my favorites as well. A 5 man haywire squad of Scourges is the best anti armor in the codex and will usually be able to handle a vehicle each. For Inubi, I tend to run 4 in a venom along with my warlord (generally a Succubus since I like the model).

Not taking Wracks or either of the MCs usually isn't a big deal, you'll just be a little more susceptible to ignores cover armies which you already sucked against. Also Reavers(jetbikes) with cluster caltrops are generally pretty good for their points.

>>47851563
Where is the hive tyrant there? I don't see it.

>>47851529
My friend has the worst luck, unless it's rolling 2+ saves, then its nothing but success. Then on turn 5 after I've already lost, he'll roll 5 out of 6 1s just to spite me.

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>>47851565
You really arguing 2 dread knights and me taking a brotherhood champ and xiphon at 1850 is waac? Okay. You obviously don't play the game. Either that or grey knights must have touched you somewhere.

So, I'm pretty new to the game, can somebody explain this shit to me? Walking over some sandbags or something like that on the ground is difficult terrain, okay, I get that. Walking 6 inches vertically up a wall to get to the top of a building is a-okay though? I don't understand.

>>47851734
You are correct. Vertical movement is just regular movement distances. However, if the different levels are inside of terrain, you must still roll for difficult terrain. Then if you rolled less than the height of the level, you cant go up.

>>47851734
They took out pretty much every rule to do with verticality and levels in buildings for 7th ed.

>>47851571
I fell in love with DE in that DoW game. Fast army with lot of firepower was exactly what I wanted. I remember some of their units were different in the game. Like mandrakes were just bald elves and talos was some scorpion like vehicle.
If I will use Archon I will give him different head because I dont like bald elves

>>47851792
DoW was 3-4th edition, DE and Necrons had their big updates after that.

There any way to make DE Wyches usable? I've got 20 of them and would like to at least field a squad.

>>47851800
Too bad. I prefered the old Talos.
Is start collecting DE thing good for my money? Already got one squad of kabalites because I wanted to practice painting and building

>>47851832
Totaly forgot about them. Why do DE have so many melee units?

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Late night assembly.
Newish to building and aspiring CSM player.

What advice can you offer on future assembly?
How was the posing?
The mould line & nub removal?

>>47851833
The get started is a good deal and a good start to an army

>>47851843
They arent a pure shooty army or a pure melee army, they doth both equally. Some would argure they are even a melee army first, and a shooty army second.

>>47851832
Not really. They dont pack a punch and they are too easilt shot down. I guess they tarpit well, but thwy are still a tad to expensive to do just that.

how well do SM Black Templars play? im looking at getting into 40k and im tossing up between a Black Templar or a _____tau army, partly because i like the aesthetic of them and im a sucker for shiny looking shit even if it costs more to get the black templar upgrades and unique models etc

>>47851934
They play bottom of top tier, top of mid tier depending on how you build them.

Would you play Total War:W40k ? I think their WHFB wasgood

>>47851954
Without a doubt. Ive always thought 40k would fit very well into total war gameplay.

>>47851943
would you mind elaborating or referring a source that does? also are the black templars chapter upgrades compatible with the venerable dreadnought that comes with the SM Start Collecting Bundle.

>>47851954
i would but "modern" (ie. guns and long range fighting/skirmishes doesnt translate as well into the format that total war gameplay has unlike how medieval and feudal japan settings do.

40k setting works for games like the current DoW series but i feel like having drawn out battles that dont have units in a fairly rigid formation (like line battles in empire and napoleon)

that being said i would be more than keen for them to give it a go if they pulled it off it work be terrific, but frankly i highly doubt sega would have DoW running at the same time as a 40k Total War franchise so itd be a few years away at least.

The way the battles would play out would be something like Graviteam tactics: Operation Star id imagine except less clunky and more Orks and hellfire

>>47847748
I didn't think you could take 5 chosen with 5 flamers. Isn't the compulsory Champion restricted to taking upgrades from the wargear page only?

>>47851756
Thanks, it doesn't really seem logical that its harder to walk over rocks then walk up vertically up walls, but I guess thats just game mechanics.

>>47852059
5 chosen can take 5 weapons.
One of the options specifically say "One Model may take".
So, that model is the champion.

They're not the only ones to have similar rules.
Eviscerator on Loyalist Assault Squads, for example, which you can give to a random Assault or the Sergeant.

>>47851177
I'm probably missing it since I don't really play marines but whats your plan against other heavy vehicles that aren't knights? (Russ\Land Raiders etc)

>>47851462


See, this is why I don't play 40k anymore. Its so filled to the brim with un-official "morale" rules, that you just should know before getting in to the game.
To sum it up, 40k is a lot like "Well, you could play anything you want, but then everyone will think your a dick. And don't dare to use the rules as written, because then your a rule lawyering prick. I'm just saying this to help out and because I'm such a good sport"....

Most of the game is lost because of moral standards and also badly written rules with no play testing what so ever. There are some hardcore tournament gaming groups, where anything goes, but then your stuck on the other side of the scale, not being able to play things you simply find cool.

>>47851403
Possibilities-
His dice are loaded, intentional or not
He's using practiced rolling to influence the results
He's better at the game than you and you blame the dice rather than admit your failings (all too common).

>>47851920
Are you using some cabal colour scheme or your own?

>>47851988
Black Templars are Space Marines. They share the same codex, so anything Space Marines is compatible.

Only Dark Angels, Blood Angels and Space Wolves have a completely separate Codex.

Those of you who are a bit more casual...

Why is your army the most fun army to play?

>>47852221
i meant are the physical upgrade models compatible with the venerable dreadnought (the armor plates with iron crosses and skulls on it)

>>47851843
>>47851920
Don't let appearances fool you gang. Dark Eldar are NOT a melee army. Strength 3 and the occasional 10-20 point rending on one model a close combat army does not make. While Pain Engines and Incubi are okay in theory, in practice Incubi have no grenades meaning they will strike last in initiative order for anything with even a toe in cover which, against anything half decent at melee in the game, will spell their death, and pain engines are unfortunately slow in a theoretically 'speedster' army.

I could go into major detail about all the flaws of their close combat options, and while none of them are on the Tau spectrum of awful (your base kabalites are actually halfway decent in assault, provided they aren't assaulting anything tougher than tactical marines) but it should never be your go to plan. Strength 3 doesn't do a whole lot, even with the Wyche's rerolls, and even our once fearsome archons just ain't what they used to be with AP3 Huskblades and Nerfed Soul Traps. Stick to shooting save for special circumstances (hit and running reavers, maybe a pain engine here or there, surprising a unit of scout marines that weren't expecting dark eldar movement in the assault phase or what have you)

>>47852229
>Why is your army the most fun army to play?
They aren't that fun these days. The enjoyment I ge comes from play with my friends and not much else which is the sole reason I haven't left this hobby

>>47852229
CSM just became fun recently, with the new formations. It was a nice change of tone.
Funny how that was something everybody had for years and we get them now.

Of course I can't play with half the other players, but with Orks, DE, Tyranids, IG and similar is pretty cool.

To be honest, I hate how the top tier is played.
It's all 2+ rerollable, alpha strikes, first turn whipeout and rock-scissor-paper composition.
I want CSM to be updated like the next guy, but I really don't want to reach those level of bullshit.

>>47852229
I like the theatrics of a wall of dudes with giant tanks behind them and vietnam-y feel of valks flying around them.

>>47852341
>but I really don't want to reach those level of bullshit.
You got nothing to fear in that case, now enjoy your Shitbrute with Hatred

>>47851375
I've been out of the loop for a while, what makes knights different from riptides and the like?

>>47852356
I don't know.
When GW really wants to sell you something, he doesn't have the light touch, so to speak.

Curse of the Wulfen part 2 is coming.
The can either give us something completely broken or something completely uninspired (See IG and Daemons decurions).

Disappointment is coming either way.

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>>47852387
Knights, both Imperial and, more cheesily Wraithknights, are part of the new GW mantra of letting people bring super heavy creatures and vehicles to casual wargames. Riptides are underpriced overperforming monsterous creatures. An Imperial Knight is a small titan with an invun save, a silly amount of hull points, a d weapon and several ap 3 blast templates. Though, being honest, shits tame compared to Wraithknights and Stormsurges.

>>47852410
>I don't know.
Indeed you don't it seems. GW won't start to make OP CSM to sell models, because they sell without them.

You won't be getting anything broken, just something that falls between useless shit and moderately worth considering

>>47852446
No need to be rude.

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>>47851833
You can still find an old Talos on Ebay.

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>>47852472

>>47852472
Wot iz 'dis? Snacks?

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107 sealed boosters and 51 decks :)

>>47852476
That is one ugly model. Would almost be better off messing around with Necron spyders.

>>47852595
Whats in Eldar box

>>47851866
Looks great to me Sempai

>>47852618
>>47852561
Not him, but that's decks for Battle for Pandora Prime.

It was an old and now forgotten collectible cards game.

>>47852446
Man, Codex Space Marines players are the biggest dicks

New player here.

At the moment I paint each part individually and then assemble. Is it better to assemble first since I see a lot of unpainted models already posed?

>>47852666
Nah, you can do some partial assembly (Legs, torso and head in particular), but its easier to paint separately like you've been doing. People just assemble first as they want the instant gratification of having the model present and usable.

How good are Inquisition Acolytes? I was gonna chuck my Hereticus (badass DW Cassius conversion) I have with my IG vets but I managed to pick up a chimera cheap. I was now going to grab the SC tempestus box and use the scions as acolytes with 3 meltas and hotshots along with a multimelta servitor. I'd sell the Taurus and commissar as I'd never use them.

Is this worth the trouble or is BS3 gonna fuck me over? I'd have a psyoccolum but that's situational.

>>47852473
>>47852644
What?

Anyone seen the Formation rules for the 2 new "getting started" boxes for Eldar and Dark Eldar?

>>47851833

I have a friend who is like you, he started DE because he loved the models, and quit because he didn't like the new look of the DE.
Me on the other hand love the Dark Eldar models, and despite not being "hurdurr-Eldar-op" rated, they make up for it with some of GW best miniature range.

>>47852666
You should assemble as much as you can and paint the parts separately that would cause you problems while painting.
For example, I find that Tactical Marines are best painted with their right arm separately from the rest of the model, that way you have full access to the chest area. Otherwise you can assemble the whole model.

Good luck with your painting, Satan

>>47848419
man I still can't get this shit to work right.

>>47849384
>is it a fun super-heavy or a "please end this game" super heavy?
Well, does a 48" S10 AP1 Ignores Cover Primary Weapon 1 7" pie plat sound like fun to you? Most people tend to think not, especially since it's only 350 points, 14/14/14 and HP6.

You can shut it down with Sicaran Venators, but you kind of need at least two of them to make it reliable and they're a bit overpriced for general purpose tank destroyers.

>>47852839
>You can shut it down with Sicaran Venators, but you kind of need at least two of them to make it reliable and they're a bit overpriced for general purpose tank destroyers.
And I just realized this is the 40k general, not the HH general, so you actually don't even have access to those. On the flip side, 40k has so many other bullshit options available, so... I don't know, depends on how insane your meta is, I guess.

Would Breacher be better if they could carry Carbines and Blasters?

Someone should make a Tau fandex that's balanced, but isn't just flat across the board nerfs (because then nobody would use it). Change things to be less powerful and/or more expensive, but fluffier and/or more fun.

If I had wanted to play a gunline or spam monstrous creatures I'd have started IG or Tyranids...

>>47852898
Uh, if you don't want gunlines or MCs what do you want? Battlesuit spam? Because you can do that already. Farsight Enclaves exist and are fun.

>>47852896
You mean both at once? Yes, obviously. They'd be amazing objective campers.

Or, as an option? That'd be pointless.

The problems with breachers are:
>you need to literally stand on your target to do anything
>Tau have one transport and it's not well suited to them

If they had just a bit more range on their two closest firing profiles, a transport that was good at zipping them around and/or cheap, or the option of some bit of wargear/drones/mixed weapons to help them out or round out their purpose, they'd be great.

Personally, a 45 point 11/10/10 open topped fast skimmer transport I could stuff them into would be fucking fun as hell, but I don't know if it'd be balanced or actually help them out that much.

>>47852229
Having a Jaeger that everyone hates/fears, Jump shoot Jump shinangians, and FIRE ZE MISSILES

>>47852911
Mobile infantry, alien auxiliaries, focus on range (ex: firewarriors have great range for basic infantry, but then the codex gives you 8 options for dumping WALLS of pulsefire within 15" for some fucking reason), alien auxiliaries, light skimmers (not all this AV13 unkillable jinking bullshit), focus on air support (our *GW* flyers do mostly nothing), alien auxiliaries, and so forth.

Honestly the only part of the book I feel is fluffy is all the wargear options. Even marker lights are a really dumb execution of concept.

>>47852992
This is what I always wanted Tau to be as well, a combination of the Eldar's mobility mixed with the Imperial Guard's focus on ranged combat and slight real-world military influence, with strong air support instead of increasingly huge units. Instead GW decided to turn them into the super Gundam faction, and I ended up selling them all.

>>47852911
>Farsight Enclaves exist and are fun.

>for me
>I could give a fuck about my opponent
>Tau players

>>47852839

Whaaat, I see so much hate for knights but is this a real thing?

>>47852341
Nigger please.

>>47853080
He's leaving out it can only fire 24" if it moves, but yes. Not to mention she can take armoured ceramite to remove the problem of melta.

>>47851546
How about each one has a tyranid bit/skull somewhere on the base?

>>47853105

Does it have many other weapons? How are you supposed to deal with that?

>>47853147

It's basically a more compact version of the Tri-vindicator squadron really. More efficient, doesn't need a formation bonus to ignore shake and stun either.

It's only other weapon I'm aware of is an improved Thunderblitz. You can run over a unit standing too close to it before you shoot.

>>47853147
You can buy normal predator sponson weapons, HK missiles etc.

Dark Eldar Get Started box worth it?

Are the units inside any good?

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>tfw GW make it very clear that they know what units are good and what factions are strong but simply just don't give a crap.

>>47852666

another retarded question.

how do I unglue weapon?Let say I make my model with x weapon but want to change it later

>>47849549
>ultra-competetive builds

From what I've seen, Matt doesn't play WAAC unless he's fighting a high-tier army. Whenever he goes against a mid-low tier army, he usually tones his lists down a bit to keep things competitve and interesting. I've his Necrons get tabled by Sisters of Battle because of this.

>>47853218
Depends on what glue you used.

If Super-glue you'll have to snap it / cut it off at the joint.

If plastic glue, well, best get cutting because you just welded two pieces of plastic together.

For future modelling, use magnets.

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>>47850137
>I miss Leland

Yup, same here. He seemed to have the best mix of being entertaining, intelligent, and friendly.

>>47853217

>Wraithguard 70 meme money

why is this allowed

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>>47853080
Very. It's the SM Super-Heavy assault gun, and unlike the Vindicator, it can't be stunned. Feast your eyes.

Frankly, I'm surprised it doesn't appear in lists more often. It's an absolute wrecking ball of a machine, if a bit pricey. For 370 points you get a vehicle that pretty much requires heavy ordnance or some form of auto-glancing trickery to kill.

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>new player
>fighting with IG against admech friend
>he has a knight
>he forgets about a bunch of my veterans and special weapon squad (all melta) and does not use the directional shield thing in theyr direction
>fry the robot

now, it seems quite strange... i dont know jackshit about most of the other codices, he just made up some rules to nerf his badass unit and let me have the satisfaction of killing it in two turns, right?

>>47853257
It rarely appears as it's harder to get, either from our friends from the far east or giving money to FW. I've proxied it using a Land Raider to deal with a friends growing centurion collection. Hilarity ensued.

>>47853264
Nope, the Ion Shield can only cover one facing, which is decided at the start of each Shooting phase (yours and his). Flanking a Knight such that the shield can only cover one of the multiple threatened faces is pretty much the best way to kill it at range.

As for him forgetting about your meltas...well, that's his fault.

>>47853264
>I destroyed a vehicle

Wow, well done, I'm sure it was hard.

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>>47853277
You're overthinking it. Get a Land Raider chassis, then stick an appropriately big gun on it. There's some third-party conversion bits that are basically designed to do the job, too. Pic related.

Reminder that Orks are shit and will never be good.

>>47853314
I was just asking, the guy tends to be a bit too much gentle, so there is a huge possibility that he lost his main unit intentionally in our first game.

>>47853351
Well duh.

>>47853329
I had totally forgotten about these guys, interesting stuff. And yeah I've overthought it, my meta is touchy about FW at all so who knows how much they'd complain about a conversion. Apparently Infernum Razorbacks are OP to them, which is amusing considering it used to be Twin linked and FREE to take.

>>47853378
>metas still being touchy about FW
Wow, I didn't think this was still a thing. My local meta couldn't give two shits; there was a new player using WFB pikemen as tau fire warriors.

>>47853422
The closure of the good one of our countries two GWs more or less signalled the end for most of the more bro players. I was against FW for some time due to being new in 4th edition and my regular opponent having a tiger shark with the old flyer rules when a 110 point TL Krak missile was the only AA a Marine player could reliably have. 5th gave me some better perspective but I think a lot of people still have not realised how impotent a lot of FW stuff is in the modern game.

1850 Competitive IG/Admech

Pask - exterminator, MM, lascannon
Pask's bro - exterminator, MM, lascannon

Conscript - x50, priest, commissar
PCS - autocannon
Squad 1 - autocannon
Squad 2 - autocannon
Vet squad - carapace, x3 melta, chimera
Vet squad - carapace, x3 melta, chimera

Vendetta

Wyvern battery- x2 wyvern

Tech priest dominus - volkite, macrostubber, Autocaduceus of Arkhan Land, conversion field

Kataphrone destroyers - x5 destroyers, flamers and grav

Aegis - quad gun

How does this list look?

>>47853422
>one of our countries two GWs
Jeez, where do you live, the Balkans?

>>47853496
Ireland. Ironic considering it's a short ferry ride and a drive to GW HQ.

>>47853329

Isn't a Typhon noticeably larger than a Land Raider though?

1500 Astra Militarum

Battle Group Command

Leman Russ Squadron = 410
- Tank Commander
- 2 Demolishers
- 2 Heavy Flamers
- 2 Multi-Melta Sponsons


'Emperor's Fist' Armoured Company

Leman Russ Squadron = 370
- Tank Commander
- 2 Battle Tanks
- 2 Heavy Bolter Sponsons

Leman Russ Squadron = 135
- 1 Vanquisher

Leman Russ Squadron = 120
- 1 Eradicator

Leman Russ Squadron = 185
- 1 Executioner

Enginseer = 40


'Emperor's Talon' Recon Company

Scout Sentinel Squadron = 120
- 3 Sentinels
- 3 Missile Launchers

Scout Sentinel Squadron = 120
- 3 Sentinels
- 3 Autocannons

>>47853482
I'm a guard player, so I'll just talk about that part of it.

>Pask - exterminator, MM, lascannon
>Pask's bro - exterminator, MM, lascannon
This is fine. Pask's crony tank will miss a lot more than you want him to, since he's only got about a 65% chance to hit on the sponsons/hull gun with Preferred enemy.

>Conscript - x50, priest, commissar
I don't recommend this. They'll miss 2/3rds of their shots, and unlike Orks, they're rubbish in melee even with the priest (literally no AP weapons is baaad)
>PCS - autocannon
Not an awful setup, but I usually kit my PCS with sniepr rifles to use the 4 special weapon slots. Can go either way.
>Squad 1 - autocannon
>Squad 2 - autocannon
Sure, this can work. Perhaps not competitively, but it can work.
>Vet squad - carapace, x3 melta, chimera
>Vet squad - carapace, x3 melta, chimera
At the competitive level your vets aren't gonna dismount unless the vehicle's been destroyed or they need to babysit an objective for the rest of the game, so that third melta's gonna go to waste. I'd replace it with a heavy flamer; it gives the squad some serious cover hate AND lets them overwatch for the vehicle using a S5AP4 Wall of Death.

Vendetta
Good, but you need to put something in it. Your PCS can fit...

Wyvern battery- x2 wyvern
Proper. Give them camo netting AND enclosed crew compartment; they WILL draw fire.

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>>47853537
It's side armour is thicker, and the protected tracks is a key difference as well. First point can be fixed with some plasticard.

>>47853496
>Balkans

While we are talking about shitholes I have to ask. Anyone tried ordering from GW to Eastern/Central Europe? Is it without a problem?How fast was delivery?

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>>47853548
>>47853537
It's close enough that TLoS won't care, which is the primary gripe you'll run up against when proxying units.

Pic related; I proxy it for a Thunderer Siege Tank. It's in fact slightly shorter than an ACTUAL Thunderer, since the FW model uses the Mars Alpha pattern Russ hull, but otherwise is exactly the same shape.

>>47853542
Took out the blob squad, upgraded my pysker (didn't write him down) to ML2, grabbed another 2 chimeras with meltas in them and changed my PCS to have a heavy flamer, x3 flamers for dropping out of the vendetta (because cool).

>>47852472
>>47852595
How much costing this?

>>47851177
You're using Imperial Fists in a Bolter-spam Gladius, when you ALREADY have a huge amount of rerolls from the Gladius. Seriously consider changing your chapter tactics to something more useful, since bolter drill offers you nothing.

>>47853610
>airdrop PCS
Good.
>Primaris for twin-linking your gunline
If all he's twin-linking is a pair of autocannons, it's a bit of a waste of points to have him be ML2.

>>47853719
if I change the auto cannons to missile launchers would that be better with ML2?

>>47853760
Ehh, it's more that ML2 lets you cast two powers, so you're kind of wasting it without a second unit to try and twin-link, unless you want to try and bet on perfect timing and/or the other buff spells.

>>47852848
> "This is the 40k general, not the Horus Heresy general"
> "You don't have access to those"
Nigger, have you even picked up Imperial Armour 2 before? It allows access to both the Sicaran and the Typhon to all Murheenz(Space wolves, grey knights, dank angels, blood angles, and generic spess murheenz).

Also if I'm not mistaken, some of them are restricted by the Relic of The Armoury rule, which means you can only have one of them in your primary detachment. If you want more, you are required to take a techmarine tax for each additional relic.

>>47853779
I think I may bet on trying to cast the buffs/debuffs to be fair; and I really don't have anything else to spend it on.

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>>47853783
He was talking about the Venator nigger.

>>47853783
For generic marines it actually requires the 100 point master of the forge, which isn't a thing anymore.

>>47853823
you should probably go for a 30-man gunline squad with 3 ACs then. 3 is the standard for heavy guns in 40k, because one will die and one will miss.

>>47853829
Which got FAQ'd by forgeworld down to the generic techmarine, who now has both the cost, equipment, and statline of the original Master of the Forge.

>>47853217
those prices are all over the place,

a 70 pound wraithknight is like $135 Australian yet we get it for cheaper, but then a 90 pound stormsurge is $175 but here it costs $250?
then the shadowsword is more expensive for bongs yet we pay $30 extra for a soul grinder etc...

i know their pricing is dumb but why even have so much variation just because of different regions.

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>>47853865
forgot the photo

>>47853865
shipping, Australia is on the otherside of the world.

>>47853862
i still find it weird that they downgraded the master of forge and master of sanctuary to low ranking officers

>>47853862
The FAQ for IA2 V2 on their site makes no mention of it, am I looking in the wrong place?

>>47847539

2000 points Steel Legion vs Necron Decurion

I've lost to decurion a few times, so I know what to expect this time around. I take a list with only one chimera for CCS, and only one tank - LR executioner. Aegis Defense Line strung between two large ruins terrain pieces. Everything else is infantry: 50 man platoon, 50 man conscripts, another 50 man platoon, each with a psyker and priest in them. Lots of plasma rifles, no heavy weapons at all. 1 wyvern, 1 vendetta with PCS.

I place one platoon in each ruins and drop the conscripts behind the ADL. LR Exec behind another ruins piece with a camo net. Wyvern in the corner, Valkyrie in reserve. I win first turn, I cede it and go second.

He walks across the field with destroyers, scarabs and warriors. No wraiths in the list, he really likes destroyers. Shoots 36 shots into the closest infantry platoon, I go to ground and lose 6 guys. Fires the rest of his army and takes out another maybe 6 guys.

My turn, wyvern unloads on warriors and drops 3. Both infantry platoons move to edge of terrain and fire. Closest squad gets both psychic buffs and FRFSRF order for 150 twin-linked rending shots on the closest warrior unit. It is annihilated to a man. Rest of the list doesn't hurt much, executioner lands 3 wounds on the destroyers.

Turn 2 he retreats back to cover and tries to use mobile destroyers to knock out the tank. 3+ cover save makes that tough, but he eventually gets it. He then eats another 150 twinlinked rending shots and loses all his destroyers but 2. He charges them. Guardsmen are fearless and don't care. Priest hymn lets them reroll wounds first round, so they actually win, destroyers break and run.

For three more turns he shoots his entire army into my infantry and I just go to ground, absorbing casualties. He moves his warrior to an objective turn 4 and I rush out of cover, overwhelm it, and saturate the board with 100 infantry. Valkyrie sweeps in and contests another point. GG, Imperial victory.

damn Dark Angels look cool.

Start Collecting Dark Angels when?

>>47853971
It's called Dark Vengeance, and its cheaper than a Start Collecting, assuming you have some poor sap to unload the CSM onto

How cheesy are Corsairs as an army? They look like fun to use but with Craftworlds being the way it is I'm afraid I'll be branded WAAC if I start collecting them.

>>47853916
it doesnt really explain how GW decides to absorb the cost of the shipping on some models and then charges huge amounts for other models despite the fact shipping would be almost neglegible over the thousands of units they would be able to ship per container.

>>47853862
>>47853829
My mistake, it's not from their FAQ, but from emails. If you email forgeworld about it, they'll respond by saying that the techmarine(generic SM), and Interrogator Chaplain(Dank agnels) counts for it

>>47854004
In pickup games, they might be considered WAAC shittery, anyone who knows their strong points will think otherwise

>>47853964
I wish I had enough men to do that. I hate decurion.

>>47853993

ah nice...

can anyone explain to me how it can cost 65 bong money from GW store and "only" 55 bongs from a store in my third world country? Shouldnt it be the other way round? how come resellers are cheaper than original store.

>>47854159
Resellers have access to sekrit Reseller prices from GW. They get to buy things from GW for much cheaper, so long as their store fulfills certain requirements(Such as having a certain percentage of their store dedicated solely to 40k stuff)

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>>47851375

>>47854091

I'm not sure if it would still work against a wraith-heavy list, but it worked here because I finally realized a few things:

>chimeras and LR were bad investments, since every necron weapon strip HP off vehicles.

>he only has one scoring unit: warriors. Focus them down.

>He has no monolith, and therefore no AOE

>Even though he is tough with animation, he doesn't actually have a lot of killing power against mobs.

So the winning strategy against this guy was just to outlast his shooting phases. He didn't have enough to throw at me. At the end of it all, we actually both still had half our armies alive, very little killing was done - but my half was scoring and his was not.

>>47854186

shit. I need to make a friends with someone from reseller store desu

>>47854195
I once had a Maelstrom game against a Decurion with my Gladius(I brought the OPTIMIZED one with 18 lascannons and 24 plasma guns). The mission type was the one where you draw as many cards as you have objectives, so I just objsec spammed the entire board, so that my opponent could only ever draw one objective, while I was drawing up to 5 every turn.

Decurions are insufferably shit, so long as you play proper maelstrom and actually bother with the points. They're so fucking slow that they can't do shit about anything, so they inevitably lose by points.

>>47854066
Is there anything in particular I should avoid to make my list more [spoiler_____fun[/spoiler]?

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>>47854233
There is no worse feeling than realizing you made a mistake just after hitting Post.

>>47854233
Wraithknights

>>47851563
S9 AP2 Blast Heavy Venom Cannon?

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>>47854195
So it sounds like gunline is the way to go, then; lots of HWT's and lots of cover.

I'd argue the wyvern is the exception to the 'no vehicles' rule, since it's simply that good. Otherwise, One should generally try to bring dudes, not tanks. I have a lot of Lascannon HWT's and some Autocannons, but the bulk of my collection is vehicles.

...and Scions. I have a suprising number of scions. I wonder if pic related would do any good?

>>47854241
Just use Ctrl+S man, foolproof Spoilering

>>47854382
It sounds good until you realise that your entire bonus is negated by your opponent killing a single Commissar. If it was a lord it would be decent as they have some survivability.

>>47854382
So... What's stopping me from just assassinating your 1-wound commissar with a Deredeo from the complete opposite side of the board?

>>47854415
>>47854424

Aegis line + stick him in the command squad + stick the squad in the taurox, so he's hiding behind 6 wounds and 3 HP, all with a 4+ cover save.

It's not great, but it'll keep him alive for a few turns.

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>>47854473
it'd be a shame if someone were to murder him and take his skull for Khorne

>>47854382

Do you get more points for killing reinforcements?

>>47854492
Your opponent would still get KP, since the unit was completely destroyed, so it's of dubious usefulness in kill point games. In objective games, having endlessly-respawning-deep-striking-meltagun squads can be a massive pain for your opponent...as long as they bring vehicles.

Or you could bring plasmas and give infantry and MC's trouble.

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>>47853890
The Knight is cheaper than the stormsurge?

How many IG regiments can produce a single planet?

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>>47854629
12

>>47854629
It depends how fertile the people are, and how the training is. Cadia seems to have babies popping out faster than a Commissar can BLAM people.

>>47854682
Isn't their pop growth so crazy that they raise a new regiment every day, I'm sure I read somewhere that reproduction is regulated to produce this effect.

Rolled 2 (1d6)

1-2 Dark Eldar
3-4 Eldar
5-6 Tyranids

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>>47854764

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>>47854764

>>47854682

Wha'ts the size of an IG regiment?

>>47854893
w-what does it mean

>>47854932
>“All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.”

you're the glass cannon faction where 5+/6+ and av 10/11 open topped is the norm. they're very easy to kill so you must be tricky and fast

My deff dread and dakka jet are finally complete!

Hey, Ork bros, how is your army looking?
I can't wait to try these two out because they look so powerful, I'm afraid the deff dread will just instantly explode to melta but I'm sure the dakka jet will clear a few tables for me.

>>47854912
5000+

>>47854998
Not him but fuck man, I really do want to play an army like this but shit if the FAQ didn't kill my jinking mech strategy dead. Guess GW just wants more Craftworlder players...

>>47855524
join chaos, we have invuls and other tricks you can rely on

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>>47855609
But Anon, I'm actually a bored CSM/Daemons player that wanted to try something different.

>people saying that super heavies should be banned.

im i a cheeselord waacfag if i use a baneblade as a centerpiece of a mechanized army with basically no heavy weapon teams?

>>47855685
No.

Ignore the neets that can't afford large kits.

>>47853329
I just got a vindicator cannon and mounted it on the hull.

>>47853537
Nope. The retarded fact is that the Spartan is not that much larger than a regular old GW Phobos, with mostly the extended front ramp giving it a larger profile in terms of hull volume. Yet it sports 150% more transport capacity.

20 I could have imagined, seeing that the Phobos can fit 16 (Crusader). The extended front of the Spartan could have easily accommodated for the difference. But 9 more...? FW needs to move units, I guess.

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>>47855642
not gonna lie i am eyeing that dark eldar box but i don't know if i really wanna deal with a new army and i need to finish my seeker chariots. i swear by the end of summer i will have a full unit of seeker chariots done and i don't care if it costs my sanity

>>47854998
>the God rabbit quote from Watership Down

As a DE player, I came a bit.
Fuckin' perfect

>>47855685
Baneblades a shit, only the Ignore Cover one is even a problem and it's probably not even that good in today's meta.

Page 8
>>47855780
New thread
>>47855780
Working links!
>>47855780

>Okay, for my dread army I seriously need some goddamn anti air, I'm buying a Deredeo.
>hmm... And a leviathan. Not strictly necessary or anything, but a lovely centrepiece and I've been winning lots of games. Might as fucking well take the hit to effectiveness it technically represents.
>The fuck do you mean that's not qualifying for free shipping
>FINE, I'LL TOSS IN A FUCKING THANATAR, ITS IN PREVIEW PICS FOR FIRES OF CRYAXUS WHY THE FUCK NOT

help me I have a problem

>>47855846
must be nice to be so rich. what you should've done is do a big order with some locals at your lgs

>>47855750
i wish i could find a good quote for a chaos undivided army. i can min/max if need be but i'd rather run chariots and cav