What is /tg/'s equivalent of the Hydra Cap meme? Do your worst

>>47568404
Lion El 'Johnson,"Hail chaos."
>inb4 that's already the case

>>47568523
You shut your whore mouth.

Hail Chaos

>>47568404
Virt: "I love elves."

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Knew I saved this for a reason.

>>47568629
Good one!

Anyone know what James Jacobs looks like? He could be saying "I love martials" or "I listen to constructive criticism".

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>>47569150

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>>47568404
Hail Min-Maxing

>>47569182
>I enjoy the smell of the 5e PHB

>Elspeth
All will be one.

>>47568404
/tg/: Hail Pathfinder

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>>47568404
>Malekith
>Hail Asuryan

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>>47568404
i did this for y'all

>>47569203
But, Pathfinder has the longest lived generals with the most posters...

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Drawn by a friend of mine

>>47569409
8/10 pretty good.

>Captain America
>Hydra

Why though?

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5 minutes in gimp. Couldn't be fucked to do more than the beard

>>47569430
Because people who don't like the idea of thousands of refugees and unrestricted immigration driven by an unwavering sense of guilt and self-hatred are actually evil frothing Nazi's who are just as bad as terrorists. I'm not into comics these days, but from what I've heard the guy who wrote this shit is an unapologetic political activist and apparently most of his work is of similar preachy, cringe-inducing quality.

>>47569430
Marvel makes money by pissing off fans
>Miles Morales
>Kamala Kahn
>Falcon America
>Whor
>Civil War 2
And Hydra Cap

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>>47569502

The point is that the guy is supposed to say the opposite of what they are known to say or to believe.

>>47569519
Where the fuck did you get refugees from? I haven't heard shit about refugees having anything to do with this.

>>47569561
It's the red skull's new angle in that very same comic.

>>47569561
Hydra's anti-immigrant now. Red Skull was giving speeches about it and everything.

Then a Hydra member blew himself up to kill immigrants.

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>>47568404
I knew there was a reason I saved this!

>>47569561
Considering the current political climate it isn't much of a stretch to include refugees when discussing immigration and movement across borders in general. I won't push it though, /tg/ isn't really the place for that shit, if I was mistaken I'll happily concede that I just threw that in because it also comes up pretty regularly when talking about borders.

>>47569519
>Because people who don't like the idea of thousands of refugees and unrestricted immigration driven by an unwavering sense of guilt and self-hatred are actually evil frothing Nazi's

>Not wanting the main source of the constant bombings and crime spikes to come into your country without restriction and screening = wanting to gas millions of jews for existing.

I don't know where you could even pull something this far out of a shitty captain america decision but obviously you need to back to your job and earn money for your wife and her boyfriend's child.

>>47569710
>he doesn't realize this is what Spencer actually believes

>>47569609
We need a Horus one will a chaos god tied up saying, " Suffer not the heretic to live"

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>>47569561
Take a look.

I'll feel like the Alpha Legion would have a field day with this.

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>>47568404
I tried.

>>47569767
>Marneus Calgar
>"Hydra Dominatus."

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>>47569772
Shit,forgot main ingredient.

>>47569759
This is fucking glorious. Stealing this meme for the Trump General now.

>>47569829
nice

>>47569767
their war cry is "For the Emperor", they're literally walking examples of the meme

>>47569830
It's old news over there, buddy

>>47569873
I thought it was HYDRA DOMINATUS?

>>47569873
And just to confirm because I have little to no knowledge of the lore:
There's nothing regarding the Alpha Legion outside codex's fluff-wise, is there?

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easy

>>47569910
10/10

>>47569759
Where's the lie though?

>>47569759
Red Skull is right, you know.
Unfortunately, its coming from the mouth of an actual Nazi, so his method and logic is terribly flawed. Like, a nugget of truth in a mountain of shit.

>>47569936
On the next page, where he gets some guys to strap on some bomb vests in the name of Hydra.

When your cure is the same as the disease, that's when you know you're a liar.

>>47569894
>>47569894
read their Index Astartes article

>Battlecry
>Imperialistic cries of "For the Emperor!" and other similar are deliberately calculated to mock and infuriate foes who recognise them as traitors. Any of their victims who do not know the difference between an Imperial Space Marine and a Chaos Space Marine will simply think they have been betrayed.

>>47569953
Violence sometimes can only be stopped by violence

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>>47569953
>no don't, if you kill him you'll be just like him

>>47569953
I think Red Skull would have solved the problem a FUCKTON better if he sent those suicide bombers after ISIS.

Then he has all the right to tell the sandniggers to get out his dominantly aryan neighborhood REEEEE

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>>47568404
Here you go, anon

>>47569830
>>47569936
>>47569944
This is probably one of the reasons this shit reached memedom in the first place. It seems like the Author is trying to equate rational and completely legitimate opinions held by sane and normal people as literally supervillain tier raving.

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>>47570009

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>>47568404

>>47569520
But Kamala is pretty great, and Miles has the potential to be alright if they'd give him more non-legacy stuff

>>47570230
>not "Glory to Farsight"

ONE JOB

>>47569710
>considering an entire race of people to be terrorists is the same as treating an entire race of people like terrorists
Not that far off.

>>47570269
Or if they'd make him, you know, not shit.

>>47569430
Because fighting for truth, freedom and justice is fascist as fuck

>>47570269
Kamala would be better if the writing in her stories wasn't preachy as fuck.

Or if Ms. Marvel had better writing in general.

>>47570359
>tfw the MCU Captain Marvel film will star Carol
>tfw we'll never get a good Captain Marvel film

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Not sure if this is strictly /tg/, but hey. Had it saved.

>>47570057
>equate rational and completely legitimate opinions held by sane and normal people
>sane and normal people
>Trump
>Geert
>Michaloliakos
>Putin

>>47569759
>Red Skull said absolutely nothing unreasonable
>He's still supposedly the villain

>>47570359
Ham fisted preaching seems to be the in thing with Marvel these days. On the bright side, I haven't seen any examples from Ms. Marvel quite as bad as basically any given page from Whor

>>47570417
he says reasonable things, then the author remembers red skull a nazi with a skeleton face and has him strapping bombs to people because fuck ambiguity

>>47570417
>whining about immigrants coming to the country you emigrated from
>reasonable
what

>>47570424
DC has the same shitty problem

Cómics are written by Tumblr, what did you expect? Of course captain America is going to turn into a fascist Tumblr never read captain America, they only assume he's an imperialist fascist because, duh, America and that the only thing they care, so they turned him into an Hydra agent since he was a kid and all he did in these 70 years of history fighting for truth, justice and freedom was only pretending

>>47570654
>they only assume he's an imperialist fascist because, duh, America

BU$$$H = HITLER lol

>>47570674
Read the author's opinion

>>47570393
>>47570458
Hi. There's this disturbing tendency on the left to dismiss anything that they don't like out of hand. It's been going on since Bush's second term and it's finally reached critical mass.

It's one thing to hate on foreigners unreservedly. That would justify some of the opprobrium that they hurl around casually, as if it's no big deal. Instead, the actual policy debate is a rather dry one relating to the effect on wages, comparative crime rates and the responsibilities of a nation to enforce its own laws.

For example, I think that laws against illegal immigration should be more fully enforced, particularly the fines for hiring those illegals upon employers. The H1B visa program is similarly a joke and deliberately designed to be abused. However, I also recognize what a joke the legal immigration system is and, as such, I think the process deserves a certain amount of expediting to make it easier to move here legally.

I live in one of the most liberal cities in California. If I were to publically voice these opinions, then I would be lumped in with the Red Skull because I don't give all forms of unconditional immigration full-throated endorsement. As you can well understand, this is quite the insult. It's a serious charge and one that's thrown around with little thought to its repercussions, yet they do it lightly and with no thought as to who they might offend. There objections to dissent are so vehement as to be as shocking as they are unbelievable. They have become so fervent as to banish all room for deviation from this strict orthodoxy. In the process, they have done away with the basis of all civil discussion: The assumption that your opponent has honorable goals in mind. Now, disagreement should strip someone of all of the protections of civil debate, leaving them with only a choice between an echo chamber or their daily two minutes hate. And they go on and on, assured of their own goodness and compassion.

>>47569520
Ok the rest of this I can understand but
>Miles Morales
Don't you dare shit on Miles. He's actually a cool as fuck character that isn't just "non-white Spiderman". Lumping him with the rest of that pandering bullshit is an insult.

>>47569519
Are... Are you alright, anon? We're here. Talk to us. You don't have to shoot up that school.

>>47569759
That's why I hate all this liberal bullshit in comics now days. Because he's not wrong. And I actually kinda agree with it. So apparently that makes me a Nazi.

>>47570968
>Mary Sue as fuck with any other character ever constantly reminding us how fucking awesome he's
No, he's shit

We could've had a meme but no everyone had to go and /pol/ it up about the pollution of our aryan blood. You can't even blame questfags anymore, /tg/'s just a fucking wreck now.

>>47570910
>Hi. There's this disturbing tendency on the left and right to dismiss anything that they don't like out of hand.

FTFY

Both sides are becoming so ideologically pure that compromise our disagreement is immediately shouted down.

>>47571050
I hate to say this but the left is WAY worse about it than the right. The right will listen, smile, agree to take it under advisement, and then do what they were gonna do anyway. The left will now just shout you down and call you a Nazi. Bottom line is we are very quickly approaching a tipping point that I don't want to be here for.

>>47570275
Santiago did nothing wrong

>>47571050
Yes, but it is far and away a problem on the left. When you say that the terms "freedom" and "balanced budget" are white supremacist code words, you are truly beyond the pale.

They have literally become the party of "give me money or you're a racist."

>>47571030
What, if anything, that I said here >>47570910 would even vaguely fly on /pol/

>>47571030
>traditional gaming culture is just a fucking wreck now because of everybody trying make everything politically correct and a safe-space
FTFY

>>47570910
Word.

>>47571020
Freedom, truth and justice are now nazi things and that's why Cap is Hydra since he was a kid

>>47571074
Don't you just hate it when people prove you right like this guy just did? >>47571030

>>47571020
The media's liberal paymasters are just getting scared in the runup to the elections

The people have awoken and the left are trying very hard to discredit Trump

>>47568404
"The setting doesn't matter."

>>47568629
shouldn't it be like "Hail, reddit"

>>47568629
That's even less believable.

>>47571115
The problem is rather that people are so fed up with beibg served the same plate of shit after every election and so they go for the candidate that looks less like the established parties.

Worked for Obama before, but he was not able to deliver the promises he madd fully due to several reasons and now the swing goes for trump.

>>47571050
Eeh not really a good comparison since leftists are used to the idea that, culturally speaking, they've won, and so they can make extremely rude and hateful blanket statements against moderates and conservatives in private company or in mixed company at will, and most moderates and conservatives just learn to smile, nod, and not speak up or defend themselves. Leftist compromises are generally about "you cave on your values, while we give up nothing."

Most obvious example are issues of gun rights, compromise there is always universally of the "you give up some rights, and we give you nothing."

>>47568404
Yes, I am ok with homebrewing your own eace and class.

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>>47571074
>>47571078

I dunno, the Right seems to call you a communist, a tyrant, a weakling, a secret muslim, or an apologist if you disagree with them. Wanting to raise taxes makes you a communist, and wanting the federal government to have the capital to function makes you Stalin.

The Left may take to twitter and tumblr to make fun of you, but the Right just jumps on the radio or Fox News to make fun of you.

>>47571123
"The pool is open."

>>47571078
The reason people are questioning "freedom" instead of blindly trumpeting it is because the people who blindly trumpet it actually mean anything BUT actual freedom. Usually they're just trying to be violent assholes and, in lieu of an actual justification for their behavior, hide behind the claim that they want the "freedom" to be violent assholes.

>>47571106
I want to play fucking elfgames you autistic retard. But now we all have to stop to have serious conversation about the end of civilisation that will come because of the goddamn muslims every fucking thread.

>>47571150
Eeh, not really. The Right refuses to compromise on issues like raising any sort of revenue.

>>47571165
>Left may take to twitter and tumblr to make fun of you
And when you try to debate them, they'll throw a dozen words ending in "-ist" at you to devalue your argument, and then have you silenced/muted/banned.

>>47571165
Nah. Generally speaking, the stuff people mock people for on twitter is nowhere near the same level as the thing they're trying to make fun of. Black people mocking white dancing isn't equivalent to getting shot, and gay people mocking straight fashion sense isn't equivalent to lynching.

>>47571194
I assume that's the point where your mind shuts down, or you might have noticed that most of those words refer to actual concepts.

I question the "trying to debate" part if you would rather mock and trivialize their responses than acknowledge this.

>>47571150
Hey, rest of the world here: America's obsession with guns is weird and disturbing and muh liberals look like crazy people trying to have a reasonable conversation with school shooters. What the fuck would liberals even "give" you?

>>47571205
>I assume that's the point where your mind shuts down, or you might have noticed that most of those words refer to actual concepts.
Theoretically, but in practice it's "nuh uh!" on a slightly higher intellectual level.

>>47571194
>the left just devalues any argument presented to it without engaging!
>"fuckoff tumblr"

>>47571210
Yeah, and we like the option of owning them. That's the whole point of America. The political parties seem to have forgotten that. I'm just saying, the UK's violent crime rate is like 3 times that of the US. So, ya know, fuck off.

>>47571165
both sides (and their activists) are quick to use the media to mock their opposition. Nothing new in politics.

left's just caught up a lot of ground in the whole "be an obnoxious twat" department in recent years.

>>47571168
The freedom to do what I approve of and get the fuck out if you disagree.

Both sides of these fights are like two bickering siblings both shouting "BUT HE STARTED IT" at the top of their lungs, like that somehow justifies them as the nobly suffering victim. I say eschew the toddler-level need for justification and the moral high ground. Stop crying foul and go all in with force.

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>>47571176
We live in a country with a 39% top income tax rate and one of the highest corporate tax rates in the world. You refuse to reform entitlements and then ask for more.

Get your house in order before you criticize someone elses.

>>47571171
>serious conversation about the end of civilisation that will come because of the goddamn muslims every fucking thread.
>pic related

>>47571165
And the left will call you Islamophobic, Xenophobic, Sexist, Racist, intolerant, bigoted and they won't just do it from twitter or tumblr. You forgot to include CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, The Huffington Post, Salon.com...

So get off of your high horse.

>>47571168
>I can interpret the values of people I disagree with however I want and no one will catch me.

ftfy. Ah Ah Ah! Rule number one! What happened to assuming honorable motivations again?

And thank you for proving my point about you lefties writing people off who disagree with you as violent subhumans.

>>47571216
>in practice
I take it that a lot of people are highly practiced in dismissing words like "racist" or "sexist" out of hand, just like a lot of other fancy "bullshit" words whose meaning they're unfamiliar with. It's easy to see why their favorite strawman involve long strings of intentionally nonsensical adjectives and no points.

>>47571205
Not him, but as a sociology student I can tell you how much ideological infighting there is in the subject.

The further you go away from quantitative meghods the grumpier I get and remember to only trust statistics you tinkered around with yourself.

Most people who use -ists slang have no fucking idea what it means.

They just turn it into a meme-club to "win" arguments.

>>47571231
And US has proportionally way more shootings than any other civilized country

>>47571210
First of all, stop trying to tar 45% of the population as school shooters. Despite media coverage its a statistically rare event.

And lets play your game, shall we?

Why do you Euros build societies that look like open air prisons? You're either full PC money-burners who want you to have a license to buy plastic forks or you're all like "The Paris stock exchange is down three percent. Time to dust off fascism." Why are you all so hell-bent on being peasants again?

>>47571165

People aren't called commies for wanting to raise taxes, they're called commies for the naked Marxism of speaking of economic inequality as an intrinsic negative. Likewise, its certainly fair to call people like Bernie Sanders communists, as he indisputably used to be one and pejorative terms like that don't wear off if you drop the membership (see: David Duke).

>>47571242
>I can interpret the values of people I disagree with however I want and no one will catch me.
Nope. Your strawman was, in fact, caught.

On the other hand, the fact that violent assholes try to use "you can't criticize me because I'm FREE TO DO IT" in lieu of actual justifications is an observable fact. There's no assumption required, only observation of the obvious.

>>47571273
Also european, don't lump us all together with him and the brits.

>>47571176
Oh, that's a fair consideration. I thought this was going to be about social issues.

>>47571279
>Theye aren't called commies for wanting to raise taxes, they're called commies for the naked Marxism of speaking of economic inequality as an intrinsic negative
While I'm not all "Hail Marx", the fact the wages at the top have raised drastically by hundreds of percent while the working wage has raised by a pittance is pretty BS.

>>47571281
What's wrong with that? The burden is on you to prove why I shouldn't do a thing. If it does no demonstrable harm to someone else's person or property, why is it any business of yours?

>>47571270
US also has proportionally far more african americans than any other country (Not due to race, but due to the heinous gang culture that they've spawned)

>>47571210
>Hey, rest of the world here:

Hey, America here, the rest of the world's hatred of freedom of speech and self defense is weird and disturbing. Kindly fuck off.

>I d-didn't even want those grapes anyway

>What the fuck would liberals even "give" you?

A compromise is something in which both parties leave with something. Just demanding that Americans give up rights in exchange for nothing is not a compromise.

>>47571270
And that's an argument to ban guns....how exactly? More people die in car crashes in a six month period than killed by someone with a gun in an entire year. Should we ban cars too? If you don't want a gun, you don't have to own one. But don't you tell me what I can and cannot own in a country I'm both a citizen of and pay taxes in. Especially if you don't live here.

>>47571304
>What's wrong with that? The burden is on you to prove why I shouldn't do a thing.
In most cases, it's fairly easy to do so, while the assholes' only defense is to shout "FREEDOM!" in an attempt to silence all dissent and justify the harassment of dissenters. Usually this is accompanied by them hypocritically lying that the harm they cause is literally nothing (read: easy to ignore), while acting victimized by the ostensibly (but not actually) comparable actions of their critics.

>>47571298
Product of the information age. Overhead is so much lower that it allows firms to operate WAY more efficiently than they did even thirty years ago. What once would have required an army of secretaries making $30,000 a year now requires an email server. As such, more of that goes to dividends and the relatively fewer human links in the chain necessitate more competent leadership because of the influence they wield in the absence of massive workforces.

Thus, they command higher salaries.

>>47571298
Problem is the allways bigger growing market for workforce.

People at the top ARE worth more to companies, but even managers are replacable.

EVERYBODY is replacable nowadays except for some rare individuals and that makes everything shit.

We were not made for this swarm like existence.

>>47571311
And here I thought we had more african americans because they aren't americans in other places

>>47571289
I think it's only fair to talk about all issues. If we're going with social issues, maybe a woman's right to abortion might have been a better example?

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>be irish
>see discussion of refugees
>let's see... yep
>exactly the same shit that was being said about us last century
>again

The biggest irony is when you get people worried about terrorism, who don't seem to realize that the big extremist groups in the middle east desperately want people to stay. Taking in refugees starves them of the people and economic resources they need to do the terrible shit they want to do.

Besides, the reason the refugees' homelands are so fucked up is ultimately because of how america and the big european nations split up their territory after the wars. You're just reaping the fallout of what your own governments did back then.

>>47571331
Don't get me on semantics. We both know that I meant black people.

>>47571328
That and why bother paying American workers when you can just pack up ship and move to some third-world shithole?

>>47571328
Yes, but 475% of their average employee is kinda fucking absurd, and hurts the economy.

>>47571328
>>47571330
Same thoughts, so must be true!

:^)

>>47571326
You're still attacking a group of people. Can you formulate an argument that doesn't involve nigh-apocalyptic rhetoric about people who have never done you any harm?

And you seem awfully worked up that some people would consider personal liberty precious in and of itself.

>>47571312
>I can't defend myself without my gun, rocket launcher and tank

>>47571336
Are you "irish" or actually irish?

Also I dont know what the scandies or germany/austria and italy did to them....or greece.

>>47571298
>the fact the wages at the top have raised drastically by hundreds of percent while the working wage has raised by a pittance is pretty BS.

True, and various measures must be taken to protect the value of labor. But there's no real way to take someone who rails against "economic inequality" seriously. Such a person is obviously either a red or the pawn of someone who is very transparently pretending to not be one (ie. Bernie Sanders, who I don't particularly even dislike).

>>47571361
How is it any of your goddamn business, you socialist eurotard.

>>47571336
now watch as the thread ignores this to talk about muh tumblr

US politics is fucked.

>>47571377
>the world is fucked

FTFY

>>47571370
Don't lump us all together, there are european nations with very nice gun laws.

>>47571352
No it isn't and it doesn't. They're paid just as much as their company can get away paying them like everyone else. Their work is that fundamental and yours is that irrelevant. Get over it.

>>47571370
If I saw a friend trying to get in a car drunk I'd tell him to cut it out.

Same deal.

Also calling us socialists doesn't work. We don't care. We've had socialists for ages and the sky didn't fall down. America is the only place where "socialist" is a slur.

>>47571352
How does it hurt the economy? What hurts the economy is wage stagnation, not income inequality.

Income inequality comes with its own set of problems but they are problems that come with success. Go look at the most equal economies on the planet: They're places like Bangladesh and the Sudans.

>>47571336
>it's always the white man's fault

>>47571359
>You're still attacking a group of people. Can you formulate an argument that doesn't involve nigh-apocalyptic rhetoric about people who have never done you any harm?
Can you formulate an argument that doesn't consist of admitting that you don't actually have one and demanding that everyone act like you do? Or pretending that your own actions never happen while equating the fact of their existence to an attack?

>And you seem awfully worked up that some people would consider personal liberty precious in and of itself.
No one involved is worked up over "personal liberty". Unless you consider it an inherent right to be a violent, antagonistic asshole without anyone so much as SPEAKING against you.

That's why your cries of FREEDOM are doubted. Your definition is backwards.

>>47571336
Man, just imagine an alternate world where the Irish were 1% as bad as the """refugees.""" Everything that was said about the Irish would have been warranted.

>>47571320

I always see people comparing guns to cars in this scenario. I don't know much about the process, since I don't live in a country where guns are a big thing, but you need a license to get a car, right? I assume you need a license to get a gun, then. How rigorous is the test? Like, to get a license for a car, you need to demonstrate your ability to use it properly, that you know how to not damage people or property with it, that you can tell when something's wrong with it, that you can perform the most basic maintenance and repair, that you know the regulations about its use, and that you're physically fit enough for it to be safe, like you're not blind or anything. And there are separate licenses for sufficiently different machines, like you can't be tested on a regular car and then go drive a motorbike or a huge truck. And if you get caught out breaking the rules or being a danger enough times, you can get your license suspended or taken away.

Yet from what I hear, tests for the license to own/use a gun are not nearly to such a high standard, in a lot of places? It seems like they should be.

>>47571366
Or Spain, in fact it where the Muslims who attacked Spain first, Spaniards only defended themselves and kicked them back to Africa yet the fucker still claim Andalusia as theirs

>>47571361
>>47571361
Rocket Launchers and tanks are destructive devices. It's $10,000 just to apply to have them... and for each round of ammunition.

Please don't talk unless you have some idea of what you're talking about?

>>47571389
Yeah, you're a bong. How does it feel to know that your entire is poorer than 49 US states in terms of GDP per capita. Yes, including the shitty ones in the rural south.

>>47571312
>A compromise is something in which both parties leave with something. Just demanding that Americans give up rights in exchange for nothing is not a compromise.
Okay, I'm legit curious as to what you want to trade for gun rights now. Free texas or something?

>>47571389
>If I saw a friend trying to get in a car drunk I'd tell him to cut it out.
What if he was FREE to? Would you try to stop him then? Would you respect his FREEDOM and LIBERTY, or do something about the known and obvious danger?

>>47571333

Abortion rights are a fine topic and are not a topic of serious dispute at all. The dispute is now whether people who morally object to abortion should be forced to pay for them, which is obviously immoral. Obviously, people who want them should be allowed to have them, but just as obviously, its a contentious enough issue that people shouldn't be forced to pay for it if they don't support it.

>>47571389
Yeah but you don't have a citizenship here, you don't vote here, you don't pay taxes, so what makes you think that it's any of your business? We don't want your opinion and we don't need it. You do you, we'll do us. So kindly fuck off.

>>47571336

Fair point. I'd wager taking in and helping refugees would also promote a positive relationship with their people moving forward.

>>47571420
I'm used to americans not getting satirical jokes, it's okay.

>>47571410
And you know what? I'd be ok with that. Having a license to own a gun is a legitimate compromise. But the problem being is people don't want a legitimate compromise, people want to have their cake and eat it too.

>>47571410
Also, cars serve a purpose, i.e. getting things around. Guns exist solely to kill people. Even knives aren't equivalent, since you can at least be cooking with those.

And it's not like people don't collect guns or go sports shooting without the right to carry as many guns as they want anywhere they like at all times. That's just america, and america pays for it.

>>47571421
>Okay, I'm legit curious as to what you want to trade for gun rights now.

Nothing. I was pointing out the left does not want any compromises on gun rights whatsoever (ie both sides get something), they merely want surrender on the topic (ie only one side gets something).

Explaining what a compromise is does not mean I'm eager for one. I happily voted for Obama against McCain precisely because McCain was anti gun rights, and Obama only just recently (within a year or so) got to the point McCain was then.

>>47571410
There's also the thing that you have to pass physical and mental tests every couple of years to maintain your car license, at least in my country

>>47571410
>but you need a license to get a car, right?

No.

>>47571336
Bullshit on all levels. This has nothing to do with you and whoever says the opposite is trying to strumentalize your nobler instincts. A few hundred thousands of western europeans from christian nations isn't the same thing as milions of angry muslims.
Also: blaming colonialism for everything is pure concentrated retardedness. Everywhere outside of The West Life is shit, has allways been shit and will forever be shit. The West is what makes lives unshitty. People can join The West regardless of ethnicity origins etc but to do so they have to intégrate. Muslims will never intégrate. They hate The concept of integration.

>>47571456
So... You don't want to compromise, either. This doesn't sound like just the left's fault, anon.

>>47571475
You need a licence to drive one on a road, so basically yes. You can collect cars without one but you know that's not what people are talking about.

>>47571477
>all muslims are terrorists
and you complain about people calling you nazis.

>>47571475
Your country seems awesome

Irony mode off

>>47571478
They don't want compromise because they think they're Right. And they don't want to debate it because it's Their Position and any compromise is an attack on their freedom and liberty and identity by the evil corrupt invading Other Opinions.

>>47571478

>You don't want to compromise, either.

Hm? The left hasn't offered *any* compromises whatsoever on the topic. So I can't speculate at all on the topic. When the left becomes interested in compromise on 2A stuff, let me know.

>This doesn't sound like just the left's fault, anon.

It is, 100%.

>>47571389
Because everywhere else the socialists won and the situation is a lot worse than in america now because of it. Also the sky fell repeatedly everywhere socialism was tried. Recent example: Venezuela. You people just don't give a fuck about facts and go on anyway.
It's not biggie tho. You'll be destroyed.

>>47571467
You fucking paid for the car, it's yours, why you have to keep doing stupid shit to drive it? Your country driving laws are retarded

>>47571501
>greentexting things the person you're responding too never said
ok

>>47571401
You're the one who is taking the idea that people should treat those that they disagree with with basic civility. What does that say about you?

And you have a funny definition of freedom. I always thought that it meant that people should be left alone so long as they leave others alone.

>>47571489
>You can collect cars without one but you know that's not what people are talking about.

Most proposed gun control measures are about places limits and restrictions on obtaining guns. It's not just about the right to carry. Gun control advocates don't have the stance
>own whatever guns and accessories you want as long as you don't take them out in public

>>47569520
Kamala is great though.

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>>47571501
Only a minimal amount of them are terrorists, but a disturbingly high amount of them share barbaric ideas.

>>47571501
They don't want to integrate =\= they're all terrorists. But who expects a leftie to know how to read? Not I.

>>47571426

I think you're oversimplifying the current state of the abortion argument given that most of the Republican Presidential candidates were arguing against abortions, and many states are indirectly interfering with people's access to them by passing laws that force current clinics to shut down (a la Texas' HB 2 law).

>>47571526
Venezuela's got dutch disease. Why the fuck do you think I'm from venezuela, anyway?

>>47571537
>You're the one who is taking the idea that people should treat those that they disagree with with basic civility.
And you're the one attacking the idea. Because you want to be FREE to do so unchallenged.

Freedom has been twisted from an idea that permits the exchange and consideration of ideas, to an excuse to shut them down.

>>47571507
I agree, the USA is pretty great.

>>47571410
Because the supreme court has already ruled that a constitutionally guaranteed right cannot be treated as a privilege.

They ruled that way because assholes have tried that in the past and needed to be smacked down. The biggest one that comes to mind is voting in the Jim Crow south.

>>47571501
All muslims aren't terrorists.
BUT
A good majority of them refuse to integrate and assimilate. And that makes them disruptive. And allowing known disruptive elements into your country does not good immigration policy make.

>>47571508
It's amazing how this applies to both sides.
>inb4 "No it's just the left!"

>>47571578
Have you tried thinking of people on the other side of the culture war as actual people and not as creeping, subhuman abominations as you seem to.

And yes, you did do that when you chose to write off an entire class of people as violent.

>>47571366
>Are you "irish" or actually irish?

Descended, born, raised and living on the actual island of ireland irish.

>Also I dont know what the scandies or germany/austria and italy did to them....or greece.

Eh, I'll admit that one. Was mostly talking to the americans and brits and such.

>>47571398
>it's always the white man's fault

Nationality isn't directly related to race, Anon. I know it's not how people think in america, where they're so starved for a sense of personal identity that they'll slap any social labels they can reach on themselves to scrape for any fragment of a feeling of heritage or community they can, but I consider anyone raised british, for example, to be british, regardless of biological heritage. If there were any of them in positions of responsibility for the huge ignorant mess perpetrated on the middle east during the 20th century, they were terrible people too.

>>47571604
No, one side thinks that they're right because people will be better off with their ideals, and the other thinks they're right "just because" while simultaneously going "me me me fuckoff" whenever someone tries to argue about what's best for the people.

>>47571604
No. We've bled compromise. We compromised on the 1934 National firearms act, we compromised on the 1968 Gun Control Act, We compromised on the 1986 Closing of the Registry and we compromised on the 1994 Assault weapons ban and then they periodically come back for more.

>>47571489
>>47571547

Well, if someone already owns a gun, it's a lot harder to stop them taking it out on the streets than it is to stop someone who owns an unlicensed car from taking it out on the streets.

>>47571613
>Have you tried thinking of people on the other side of the culture war as actual people and not as creeping, subhuman abominations as you seem to.
That's you, not me. You're going on and on about how everyone who questions your actions is a subhuman monster who is out to destroy your precious freedom because they're evil, and that's all the discussion is to you.

>And yes, you did do that when you chose to write off an entire class of people as violent.
I'm not "writing off" anyone as anything. I'm acknowledging the specific behavior they're using "freedom" as a blanket excuse to defend. You, by using that blanket excuse, are using it as a blanket attack to write off an entire class of people as evil incarnate. That's the reason any questioning of your "freedom" is practically an act of war to you.

>>47571577
Never said you're from Venezuela. Just saying you like to ignore the obvious when it goes against your idiotic simplicistic understanding of economy.
No venezuela doesn't suffer on overeliance on oil. It has one of the best territories with the most resources in the planet and everyone would want to invest in it and make it and themselves filthy rich. However the socialist government of the country didn't let them. Now the few companies remaning are GTFO and Venezuela is a failed state. Like Allways when you try to apply socialism.

>>47571570

I'll admit states are problematic in this respect so yes, point to you, you're absolutely right. Mostly I just focus on my state and the federal level, as presumably I can't think of any reason offhand why state governments shouldn't be able to do... whatever is within their rights.

As far as the former republican candidates, say, Trump, Cruz, and Rubio, ironically Rubio is the most hard line on the issue, as the first two just want federal funding of it to stop and only the latter openly intended to go beyond that (requiring an ultrasound first), according to On The Issues.

>>47571631
Yes, because the Assault Weapons Ban is still in effect---oh, wait...

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/5946127/ns/politics/t/congress-lets-assault-weapons-ban-expire/

The problem here isn't that one side is coming to the table with nothing to offer. It's that doing nothing to restrict irresponsible firearm sales and usage is hurting the country.

Frankly, this isn't just a Right v. Left issue. A majority on both sides want some form of gun control:

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/most-americans-agree-with-obama-that-more-gun-buyers-should-get-background-checks/

Just out of curiosity, what would you want the pro-gun control side to offer in return for cooperation? What do you think the compromise should be?

>>47571368
To this day I hope McCarthy has a special place in hell for turning 'Socialism' into a dirty word. Now communism is pure bunkem but when you take socialism as an economic policy and back it with legislation to protect worker's rights and keep business owners from doing crap like shipping all their jobs off to fucking china then it works decently enough.

America is an Oligarchy pretending to be democracy. Capitalism and Democracy are bluntly incompatible.

>>47571656
You're the face of Chaotic Evil alignment. We're saying you are trying to destroy freedom because you allready did. Repeatedly. You finally forced us to some hills we want to die fighting for.

>>47571656

I'm sorry, but weren't you the author of these posts? You're the one who made the assertion of violence, not me.

>>47571168
>>47571281
>>47571326
>>47571401
Also, you've used the word asshole in all of these posts. You're the last person who should accuse anyone of being antagonistic.

Keep in mind that these are your own words.

>>47571649
Of course it's harder. I was just explaining why
>buy all the cars you want but you need a license to drive on public roads
and
>you need a license to even obtain a gun
are two very different and unequal ideas.

>>47571690
McCarthy has been demonstrated 100% right in everything he said and about everyone he accused. You're dishonest. Liar and proud of it.

>>47571663
Anon States Rights are a remnant from when the USA was 13 colonies that wanted to maintain their independent cultures, economic concerns, and legislative habits. They have no place in a modern nation. They especially Government will bluntly say something like "It is a woman's right to have legal access to safe abortion facilities' and then a state will do things like say 'all abortion clinics must have hallways with a width of 8 feet' or come up with other byzantine restrictions effectively designed to drive abortion clinics out of a state. Nevermind the use of states rights to obfuscate graft, election fraud, and basically turn governing a large group of people into a joke.

>>47571687
We'll give you universal background checks if you give us silencer and SBR decriminalization.

As for crime rates? Violent crime is at a rate in this country that it hasn't been at since the fifties. And that's including the skew created by places like Chicago and Detroit.

>BAM! CITATION! https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats

>>47569759
>Europe
>homeland
Europa is toch geen land jonge

>>47571706
If that's what you like to think, then it's safe to assume you're the author of this post:

>>47571078
...which serves solely to demonize half the country.

>>47571663
>I can't think of any reason offhand why state governments shouldn't be able to do... whatever is within their rights.

This here is why federalism is so difficult a system and gets so many different viewpoints. Who do you defer to when interests collide: Fed, State, or Individual?

While Kasich talked a pretty moderate game on abortion, he was very proactive at limiting access compared to the other candidates. Of course, when people started talking about him, he was the last governor in the race, so...that's probably why.

>>47571725
I'm not even american but if anyone said that a fundamental part of my country's formation and ideals had got no place in my country as it's now i'd KNOW he had an agenda to push.

>>47571725
The federal government is forbidden by law from doing anything that isn't granted to them either through Article 1, section 8 of the United States constitution, or through any amendments of it.

Of course, that hasn't stopped it before.

>>47571716
>McCarthy accused people of being spies
wow foriegn nations put SPIES in another foriegn nation? Say it isn't so.

>McCarthy found communist members who carried cards and acted as a legal political movement.
Golly Gee it's almost like being a communist was considered a viable form of government before soviet abuses of power and general economic inefficiency made it clear that communism doesn't work!

>McCarthy was right
McCarthy was either a paranoid fool with delusions of Granduer or like Nixon coldly cynical on top of being paranoid. His entire campaign was fear mongering for the sake of his own personal gain. It was not his place to accuse people or collect spies, that was the place of the CIA, FBI, and other spy bashing organizations. He bluntly ruined people's lives and did no public good at all.

Why exactly are you so insistent on lionizing a liar and a fool?

>>47571742
And you've just done everything within your power to prove me right, even reflexively attacking the idea that people should be able to live their lives unmolested.

>>47571756
it isn't the 1700s any more. We don't own slaves, we aren't 13 colonies, and 'states rights' do more harm than good. My only agenda is governmental efficiency. While we're at it we should overhaul the way we do census and count votes. Gerrymandering has gotten fucking absurd.

>>47571763
Honestly the Constitution needs an overhaul. It needed an overhaul 100 years ago. Amendments aren't enough anymore.

>>47571779
No. He accused people of being communist spies and those same people were communist spies. Your attempt at separating the communist and the spy part of the equation doesn't hold water because you could be communist -member of the american communist party- and not being accused of being a spy and viceversa. So no, you're wrong and knowingly so.

>>47571784
>And you've just done everything within your power to prove me right, even reflexively attacking the idea that people should be able to live their lives unmolested.
Your demonization is absolutely insane. Because I'm mentally capable of questioning you even when you call your actions "FREEDOM" I'm automatically evil incarnate who wants to destroy everything pure and innocent. That's what you like to assume, but when people are "attacking your freedom" they're really talking about whatever is hiding behind the word, not attacking the entire concept of freedom itself.

>>47571690

I was considering arguing with you but instead I'll just try to get your perspective: how do you define socialism and how do socialists go from "workers owning the means of production" (sounds like a pretty specific ideology) to, well, the government using its resources to help the public in general?

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but sometimes I get the impression that socialists lay claim to all forms of the government helping the poor, to say nothing of extreme claims like that the military and roads are socialist, etc. To an ancrap maybe.

>>47571756
That anon's argument is a bit of a reductive fallacy, but there's a tiny point in it that matters. After the Founding Fathers committed high treason against the the first post-revolutionary war government based on the Articles of Confederation, they wrote the current U.S. Constitution with the Bill of Rights limiting the Federal government's actions. After the Civil War and the passage of the 13th-15th Amendments, it applied the Bill of Rights to the states. It fundamentally changed the power dynamic of the federal system. America hasn't quite agreed what the new power dynamic is just yet.

Sorry guys, we're slow.

Californian here!

States rights means that California gets to do whatever the fuck it wants forever.

So fuck states rights.

>>47571828
Fellow Californian here:

Fuck you, California is awesome.

What don't you like?

>>47571413

What they say they claim is Al-Andalus, which was rather a larger chunk of ground than Andalucia is.

And it's a pretty transparent bullshit excuse. Seriously, in Spain, it's a thing we kind of laugh at. By that logic, we should be able to claim like half of Italy as ours, but that would be stupid. It's nothing more than a talking point to get people riled up. You know, standard pocedure for trying to brainwash people into violence, make up historic excuses so people don't look at things too closely.

>>47571823
No amount of run on sentences will allow you to take back what you've just said.

Why do you think I keep teasing this out of you? Because I want people to see this level of vitriol that you keep throwing around.

And how am I demonizing you? I've been far more civil to you than you have with me... or a great number of other people.

>>47571847
Hanging off the side of a mansion in beverly hills with no safety equipment for twelve dollars an hour in order to be competitive with illegal labor.

My dad doing the same work back in the eighties? Ten dollars an hour.

>>47571736

Fair dues, anon

>>47571875

Ah, I gotcha.

>>47571879
Yeah, but you're some jackoff on an image board spouting shit he heard on MSNBC. Policy makers only ever ask for more, despite falling violent crime rates.

>>47571854
>No amount of run on sentences will allow you to take back what you've just said.
No amount of hate speech will allow you to play the victim after making this post:
>>47571078

>Why do you think I keep teasing this out of you? Because I want people to see this level of vitriol that you keep throwing around.
You literally just said that disagreeing with you automatically made me a pure evil abomination.

>And how am I demonizing you? I've been far more civil to you than you have with me... or a great number of other people.
Oh, sure, you just politely and civilly said that questioning anything you choose to label "freedom" automatically makes someone the very embodiment of evil.

In reality, when people question your "freedom", they're not attacking all that is good and pure, they're talking about the specific issue they're actually talking about. So when you're acting like a violent asshole and people disagree with you, they're not against freedom, they're against assholes.

>>47571809
You've litteraly resorted to the [CURRENT YEAR] fallacy.
Think about your life, please.Seeing you like this is hard on those who love you.

>>47571725

So you make a post pointing out states rights were to preserve their independent cultures, economic concerns, and legislative habits, and then point out that... its used for just that. The federal government doesn't have any magic right to primacy over states. If the people of the state don't like it, that's what democracy is for.

The last sentence is spot on though.

>>47571624
Could you tell me about irish slavery in the americas and other british holdings again?

Would be nice to know about from your perspective.

>>47571889
So fuck this state and fuck the people who made it what it is and fuck you especially for defending it.

I hope a pack of /pol/tards make you watch as they rape a case of AIDS into your mother.

>>47571809
>Honestly the Constitution needs an overhaul. It needed an overhaul 100 years ago. Amendments aren't enough anymore.

t. gommie

>29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

>>47571900
>hate speech
No, that's you.

>So when you're acting like a violent asshole and people disagree with you, they're not against freedom, they're against assholes.

I'm confused, who's engaging in hate speech again?

>>47571828
Can you explain how California manages to take its neighbors' water? I've never understood.

>>47571896
Fuck you anon, I don't watch Cable news. I read WaPo because it still does news.

Policy makers ask for more because they're tired of seeing the same thing happen over and over again while the loud minority that opposes it does some song and dance about how adding more guns to the process will help prevent future tragedies.

>>47571231
No-one sensible is saying you can't own guns full stop, just that maybe you could make it a little harder for the crazy people to buy them, and perhaps make it less normal to carry guns with you everywhere you go.

And in return, we give you less likely to be shot because you beeped your horn at them for cutting you up at the intersection. Seems a fair swap to me.

>>47571940
>No, that's you.
You're telling lies in direct response to disproof of those same lies.

>I'm confused, who's engaging in hate speech again?
The person who thinks that anyone who speaks to him is in a "culture war" because his side represents everything that is good and pure while his critics are monstrous beings of pure evil out to destroy freedom and happiness. In other words:
>>47571078

>>47571918
And fuck you for taking a single issue and demonizing the rest of the state for it.

I hope a bunch of tumblrfags force you to watch your mother get turned into a post-op trannie before they toss you into a ditch and bury you to death with their gluten-free shit, you cock-sucking milkshitter.

>>47571825
Here's what it boils down to. "A government by the people, of the people, for the people." I don't consider the enormously wealthy to have any place in that qualifier. Ergo the concerns of the middle class and the impoverished should take precedence over the concerns of the wealthy.

But it's the opposite in the nation right now. because of the way funding senators and congressmen works they pay more attention to obscure tax loopholes that concern some guy whose greatest exertion of the last year was determining whether or not to risk hiring illegals and lay off 10 people or lay off 30 people and downsize his business significantly.

It is the governments role to care for the people of the nation and to educate, heal, and employ it's citizenry. If it can provide a healthy private market to do that in great. But the Great Recession ended with a whole bunch of banks getting bought out because they were too big to fail. The execs responsible for that fiasco weren't even jailed.

Capitalism doesn't work, not in a democracy. It needs to be replaced with something. Our current system encourages abuses of legislative loopholes, bad business behavior, and favors the wealthy over the common man.

And that's just plain unamerican.

>>47571946

Its the darndest thing how people stick up for their rights, even when the media tells them that rights are for xenophobic shitlords. Despite the fact that the majority of people supposedly support gun control, the dems always lose the presidential race when they run on a position of gun control. Weird.

>>47570393
Insane, sane, who?, sane-megalomaniac/coldwar mentality

>>47571946
https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats

>>47571908
The state I live in is so corrupt we once had a gubernatorial election between a Klansman and a convicted Confidence Man. When the local culture and economy basically becomes a means to keep a wealthy elite in power, allows a city to suffer an extreme natural disaster because vital public works were ignored in favor of pocketing the money that would've been used for it's maintenance for graft, and is more interested in using petty criminals for slave labor than actually rehabilitating them you don't have a local culture worth respecting you have a lot of problems that need to be addressed.

after a certain point you need to take a close fucking look at the way politics, economics, policing habits, and so on in a state and wonder whether or not respecting the 'unique culture.' Of an area is worthwhile.

I mean hey you want to call arresting a man for being homeless and unemployed, telling him he needs to pay 100 dollars to process his arrest papers, and then keeping him imprisoned for 6 months because he can't afford to pay to have his paperwork processed a sane way to run things go ahead.

Me I'll call that a problem that needs to be addressed.

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>>47571210
Speak for yourself cuck.
The attempt to strip guns away from the population ultimately boil down to the globalist elites not liking the idea of an armed population, that could rise against the elite agendas. It is the same reason why they shit on nationalism so much, and try to paint being nationalist as something bad and harmful.

>mfw my homeland basically told EU to fuck off when those globalist fucks started advocating for more gun restrictions.

>>47569759
Thats 1000% truth though. Are you implying he's not right?

>>47571971
No, that's totally you. You started with the unfounded assumption that the other side were "violent assholes".

That's called prejudice. What I did was make a point about an argument tactic that is becoming entirely too prevalent in this society as evidenced by: You.

>>47571984
what exactly do you use guns for anyway? A shotgun is a decent home defence weapon but a rifle's bullet is more likely to travel through your wall and kill your neighbor. Fully automatic weapons have no business outside a military engagement. A pistol is small, easy to conceal, and can usuall hold 6ish shots; a perfect criminal's weapon.

Only gun an honest american citizen needs is a double barrel shotgun for hunting. (assuming he isn't a farmer who has to deal with wild boars or other crazy, or an alaskan who lives in the far wilderness but those are fringe cases)

what exactly do you do with your weapons? take them to a range and shoot? That's a spurious use of time and money, your choice but not socially valuable.

why should society suffer so you can own overpriced dangerous toys?

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>>47571966
We already do that. All guns purchased from a licensed dealer must undergo a federal background check.

>pic related

I'm going to hazard a guess and say that you've never seen one of these before.

>>47572041
You're literally telling the same lie that was just disproven. No matter what the facts are, you're just going to keep telling the same lie about what a pure and innocent victim you are in between hate speeches and screams of FREEDOM.

>>47571979
>And that's just plain unamerican.

Well no. Like it or not, the USA's always been a place that prioritized the wealthy over the poor, and began unimaginably worse off in that aspect. Hell, a hundred years ago or so people we didn't even have public primaries.

Likewise, I'm not particularly convinced that "removing capitalism" is something that can be done without massive destruction, loss of life, and demotion of America to being Venezuela. They did it with just price controls.

I don't even know what ending capitalism means, since capitalism is just people exchanging goods and labor.

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Man, the /m/ thread was way better, After all the shit-flinging I forgot what this topic originally was a quarter way down the page.

>implying Hydra did anything wrong

Cap is fighting for justice and truth, so it makes sense for him to be with Hydra.

>>47572013

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-san-bernardino-mass-shooting-statistics-20151204-story.html

>But be careful when you hear reports that say how often such shootings happen. They are not well-tracked by federal agencies, and the definition of a “mass shooting” varies so widely among public researchers that the numbers can be confusing.

>>47572055
>what exactly do you use guns for anyway?
They're for defending the people from government tyranny. That's pretty much the point of the right to bear arms.

>>47572055

>what exactly do you use guns for anyway?

Protecting my family against criminals and of course something like if the USA ever was moving too far in the direction of the EU.

>why should society suffer so you can own overpriced dangerous toys?

Society doesn't have "feelings" and I have a right to them. Likewise my family has the right to be defended by the man of the house. In all likelihood it will never be needed, nor will my car insurance, nor will my seatbelts.

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>>47572020
Bravo Funland!

>:DDDDDDD

I will probably emigrate from germany, i am unsure if i can take this any longer

>>47572070
Democracy attempts to empower the citizen and give him a choice in his government. That's a populist notion, though it gets complex when you consider stuff like ancient greek city states with their slave owning senators and smaller citizen count.

for generations a wealthy elite has held out the promise of the american dream "you too can be wealthy if you just work hard enough!" and by the same token that wealthy elite works harder and harder to hoard as much wealth as possible.

The end goal of a capitalist economy is a wealthy uppercrust who have most of the wealth doing whatever they please without concern for the lives of the common citizen.

It's time people just admitted that the american dream doesn't work as promised and that certain elements of the social contract be prioritized over allowing a wealthy elite to do whatever they want.

If Shelter, Health Care, and Employment for every american citizen is an unamerican sentiment maybe it's time the definition of what is an is not american changed.

>>47572075
In all seriousness, is there a way to rationalize Hydra as "the good guys" that does not include the current arc about Trump Skull and Alpha Captain?

>>47572055
First of all, it's not called the bill of needs. It's called the bill of rights. The onus is not upon us to prove that we need this thing but upon you to prove that we should not have it. On that front?

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats

Also, you have NO idea what you're talking about. Shotguns loaded with 00 buckshot fire the equivalent of nine rounds of 9mm ammunition with each pull of the trigger.

Those are WAY more likely to overpenetrate through multiple walls than a 5.56 mm round because they are WAY lighter but with more energy, thus making them more likey to break up when they hit wood or other construction materials. SWAT teams all over the country are moving away from SMG's that shoot pistol rounds to sub-compact rifles for just this reason.

As for hunting? A double barreled shotgun has very little range so in open country like the prairies, it's next to useless.

As for why should society suffer?

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats

It's not. It's getting better despite record gun sales.

So you really have no idea what you're talking about.

>>47572090
Yeah cause that's working so well. Seeing plenty of armed resistance from disenfranchised citizens.

>>47572099
>Protecting my family against criminals and of course something like if the USA ever was moving too far in the direction of the EU.
you just admitted you're pretty much never going to use the guns to do anything useful and you keep them to make yourself feel better.

also good luck engaging in armed resistance. cops these days look more like soldiers, last I checked most squadcars had assault rifles on hand, I know more than a few cops who keep shotguns. things keep up at this rate they'll start carrying grenades.

>>47572020
>country doesn't allow citizens to own or carry guns for the purpose of self-defense
>calling anyone a cuck

>>47572105
I'll certainly agree that shelter, health care, and employment for all are laudable ideals, though I am skeptical that any centralized bureaucracy that covers 313 million people can implement that in a fair and even handed way.

>>47572066
Actually, I'm using your words in this thread to prove my point.

I do have to give you props for not backpedalling, though.

>>47572112
let me lay out a very basic concept for you mr. crimestats.

>I want to reduce gun violence
>ergo I decrease the amount of guns on hand.
>this will likely lead to an increase in the amount of say, knife violence but crazy assholes will always find a way

If you're hunting on open prairie use a bow. Or a musket.

>>47572121

>you just admitted you're pretty much never going to use the guns to do anything useful and you keep them to make yourself feel better.

Look up what a "deterrent" is.
>also good luck engaging in armed resistance. cops these days look more like soldiers

Cops are OVERWHELMINGLY pro 2A, dipshit. Same with the military. Your fantasies of a tyrannical takeover of America are literally a case of "you and what army?"

>>47572110
If you're bluepilled enough to think nazis are "evil", there isn't. They've always been correct from an objective point of view.

>>47572129
I'd take an attempt at it over the shrug and 'what are we supposed to do about it' that we're currently getting.

>>47572121
The presence of fire departments does not invalidate the wisdom of owning a fire extinguisher.

>>47569602
It's usually the other way around, but liberals are so delusional that in their fantasy world muslims are poor peaceful people and white christians are suicide bombers.

t. Not even white, not even American or European

>>47572085

There was an expose a few months ago that pretty much revealed that the majority of the statistics floated by the main stream media about gun violence in America are literally just shit that an anti-gun Reddit group made up because they don't like guns and wanted to do their part to get them banned.

To that end they crafted skewed and false data, and the media ran with it all because they are intellectually lazy, too broke to actually pay people do their own indepth research, and staffed by clueless youngsters now who mostly agree with opinions like that anyway because progressive college professors have programmed them to think that is the proper opinion.

Fuck I'm going to look for that expose.

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>>47569977
Nice dub dubs

>>47572145
Is Hydra "just" Nazi leftovers or what?

>>47572152
Ok.

>>47572165
I wish this idiot would die of hurt feelings already. Having nobody noticing, or remembering, Canada was better than being the cringe thread of the political world.

>>47572142
>Cops are OVERWHELMINGLY pro 2A, dipshit.
yes, and? assuming you engage in armed rebellion you're going up against cops who've been steadily increasing their militarization. That means assault rifles, armored cars, military grade body armor, and so on. Things a military detachment should have not people whose sole job is to apprehend criminals for prosecution.

Every passing year the police acquire more firepower effectively making the 2nd amendment a joke, especially in regards to an armored takeover if the USA goes "too far in the direction of the EU."

I wish I could get one of an Alpha Legion guy going "For the Emperor," since that would be perfect, as they're both Hydra, it fits the meme, and its what they say.

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>>47572103
As long as you hate shitskins and are willing to integrate into Finnish society, you are welcome. We'll forgive your ilk burning Lapland.
>mfw "refugees" are leaving here willingly, because they can't stand our autismal culture and the fact that majority of Finns fucking hate their asses.

>>47572123
Historically, there has never been a reason for you to carry a gun for self defense while in public, because our society is pretty god damn peaceful.
Still, we can own shotguns, hunting riffles, handguns etc with a rather easily obtainable permit, and because of conscription, we learn how to use heavier weapons as well.
If shit hits the fan, our population will be armed with assault riffles in a moment.

>>47572167
Hydra is its own organization. They used the Nazis to further their goals.

>>47572167
they were originally an organization more like SPECTRE from James Bond than anything else. Criminal cartels with super science and stuff.

the Nazi remnant shit is just a convenient way to tie them into the MCU movies. You could double back and say they're an ancient conspiracy who made use of the nazis rather than being nazi in origin since some of the 60s/70s soy thriller fevre dreams played up freemason terror and shit.

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>>47572141
A musket suffers from the same limitations as a shotgun.

And you do realize that you just admitted that the things you want to implement would have no affect, right?

>>47572145
>pic related

>>47572112
>So you really have no idea what you're talking about.
We would never have guessed.
Also on gun control and self defence: my country has draconian gun laws and self defence laws by wich you can shoot and hit someone only if he shoots and hits first (if he shoots and misses and then you get him you go to jail).
This craziness all started exactly with saying "well you need a document to drive a car you obviously Also need a document to own a weapon, they're both dangerous". So, americans, never listen to these assholes, they're ACTUALLY after your guns.

>>47572099
>if the USA ever was moving too far in the direction of the EU.
Lol what?
Free movement between states? You have that already
A single currency? You have that too
A federal army? got one of those.

The US is kind of what the federalists in the EU want it to be

>>47572138
>Actually, I'm using your words in this thread to prove my point.
That anyone who objects to you is a vile monster whose existence is an attack on freedom itself, and who are just ASSUMING you're mean and hateful because they're prejudiced?

I think this thread proves the opposite position, which is that people oppose you for being an asshole who posts hate speech and hides behind sanctimonious sentiments like "freedom" and "rights" to keep people from questioning your behavior.

>>47572192
Again, you and what army? Cops aren't a hivemind and come in many, many flavors.

You seem to be under the mistaken impression that for the 2A's original purpose to be valid, you have to go Rambo vs an army, just make examples of a few politicians.

>>47572203
Also the cold and the dark, I guess.

I have some job offers lined up after I finished my education.

All from Norway though, they buy in medicine related people here like crazy.

Finland is an option though.

I like you being keen on national identity without overdoing it.

How would you compare norwegian and finnish society in that regard?

Do they get infected with swedish ideas or are they more like denmark?

>>47572228
be nice to have more effective means to combat corruption in state legislature.

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>>47572141
>Hunting at range with a fucking musket.
Confirmed you have no fucking idea what you are talking about.

>>47572192
The Hunters of Minnesota are the fourth largest army on the planet.

That's just the hunters.

>>47572243
I'm more under the impression that if the 'take the nation back from the government' shit goes down we'll just balkanize and become a wartorn shit hole

>>47572141
You've forgot black market guns. If i plan on committing a crime anyway why give a fuck my gun is illegal?
>>congratulation, you've only disarmed the honest people that just wanted to defend themselves!

>>47572217
>>47572220

That was my understanding as well. So I was pretty mystified why someone would think they're the good guys, even if you're, say, a Natzee; Hydra itself doesn't strike me as particularly ideological besides desiring control. Or am I wrong?

>>47572239
No... those are your words. Would you like me to quote them again for you?

>>47572228
They did a sweeping anti free speech bill recently, for example.

>>47572201
>I wish I could get one of an Alpha Legion guy going "For the Emperor,"
Wouldn't it be "For the False Emperor"?

>>47572262
>we'll just balkanize and become a wartorn shit hole

Something the anti 2A people definitely will get if they try mass disarmament.

>>47572267
they aren't the good guys, nor are they that ideological. They're bluntly a "take over the world or at least a decent sized nation so we have money and power' organization. There's not much to get bent out of shape here over, even them mind controlling cap as "there hero has been brainwashed!" predates comic books as a plotline.

>>47572262

As opposed to now, with government officials from the top down actively balkanizing us for their own gain.

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>>47569759

>>47568404
This is the worst thread on /tg/.

>>47572285
Nah, Alpha Legion says "For the Emperor" all the time. Its a meme that works front and back. They're Hydra supporters that already say something that is bizarre and almost certainly a ruse.

I'm 99% sure Cap'n is just rusing us as well. I mean this obviously looks like one of those things where "oh noes Superman turned evil, I wonder if he is really evil?"

>>47572277
>No... those are your words.
And back to the shameless lies. Yeah, I think we're completely done here.

>>47572141
Y'know, if you'd actually bothered to read those stats, you'd have noticed that Crime is going down even as the share of guns and gun owners is going up.

>>47572303
have you bothered looking at the way your state legislation works? Google it. Try and find what committees and shit are active. Try finding which ones are wasting money and how you can have those committees disbanded so their money can be put to use elsewhere.

It's not just idiocy from the top down, it's idiocy from the bottom up.

>>47572203
>Historically, there has never been a reason for you to carry a gun for self defense while in public, because our society is pretty god damn peaceful.

So nobody is ever killed in public in Finland?
>but why do you NEEEED it
You're not so bad compared to the rest of the EU and I like your pancakes but Finland is still pretty cucked.

>>47572302
That's what I figured, yeah.

>>47572316
>>47571168
>>47571281
>>47571326
>>47571401

>>47572316
We can read. You know?

>>47572304
SAVED

>>47572228
>The US is kind of what the federalists in the EU want it to be
God I hope EU crashes and burns soon. The traitorous fuckers who seek to make some "united states of Europe" need to be slaughtered like the swine they are.

My ancestors didn't endure the rule of Swedes and Ruskies, and fight for our freedom against the USSR, just so that some treasonous politicians can sell out our sovereignty and self determination that was won with blood, to some globalist organization seeking only the benefit of rich elites.

>>47572245
I don't know much about Norway I'm afraid. They are way richer than we are, but I hear that everything there is also far more expensive. They also are probably more like Swedes than we are, seeing how Norwegians, Danes, and Swedes are sibling peoples, wheres we Finns are of different origins than they are. From what I have heard of the sages of /int/, Norway is somewhere in between of Denmark and Sweden in terms of being liberal retards.

Truth to be told, you'll most likely have more opportunities to make dosh and success in Norway, than here. Things are not going that well in Finland economically, or politically. Our political parties live ins some fantasy dreamland, and barely see the problems and dangers facing us. I actually hope for our Army to take over and install a military junta, because that shit can't be worse than the ineffective, self serving, bickering and spineless shit our current political system consists of.
The worst thing is, that we currently pretty much have the BEST POSSIBLE combination of parties in the government, in terms of getting us out of this economic mess, and refugee crisis, but even they have failed at their job. The other parties would be even worse.

>>47572320
Violent killings in public are super rare in Finland. Usually, people kill each other here in drunken brawls, family disputes, or suicide murders (aka, a father of the family kills his wife, children, and then himself).

>>47572304
Jeez comics are getting really political these days.

>>47572328
Yeah, those are the posts you lied about before calling me the very embodiment of evil. Well, technically it was after that, since the very first of those posts was in response to your black-and-white worldview wherein all your political enemies are enemies of freedom itself.

>>47572263
I see that argument a lot, and it's retarded.

1. Just because the black market exists, doesn't mean it's easy for just any criminal to go buy a gun from them

2. If only criminals and cops have guns, less people are gonna get shot by well-meaning but stupid passers-by

3. Less people will get shot for ridiculous spurious reasons, like because they dinged your car, or they played their music too loud, or their dog shit on your lawn

>>47572346
>muh cultural purity
>muh self determination
>muh sovereignty
Globalization is happening, as it stands China and the USA are seriously ideologically opposed but won't ever go to war because the USA actually owes china money and is one of their major economic players.

The EU might collapse over legislative issues but it's more likely to endure because a "United States of Europe" will make it a lot easier for business and at the end of the day money will be the only thing that matters until technology makes a capitalist economy obsolete.

If the EU doesn't devour the whole of Europe pretty much some other massive political Bloc will.

>>47572351
>Yeah, those are the posts you lied about before calling me the very embodiment of evil.
How can I lie about them if I'm quoting them with no editing?

>Well, technically it was after that, since the very first of those posts was in response to your black-and-white worldview
A man must have his principles and principles are something that you take to your grave.

>all your political enemies are enemies of freedom itself.
No. Just you by >>47571168 your >>47571281 own >>47571326 admission >>47571401

>>47572320
The gun laws were lax in the west because everyone carried and there were a fuckload of really dangerous animals around, combined with the need for killing animals quickly and humanely for food or due to injuries from cattle/sheep herding.

That was as late as the 1950's. People were a lot more polite back then.

>>>47572361
>I see that argument a lot, and it's retarded.
You'd think, but you've seen how well the war on drugs has gone. If they outlaw guns in a similar fashion, the market will still be there.

>>47572346
>I actually hope for our Army to take over and install a military junta, because that shit can't be worse than the ineffective, self serving, bickering and spineless shit our current political system consists of.

- Someone who has never lived under a military junta

>>47572350
comics were always pretty political. Superman was originally very anti industrialism and populist. You could argue he had elements of socialism in him but that's neither here nor there. The comics code authority basically neutered comics and singlehandedly destroyed the american market for horror comics.

I'm honestly left uncertain as to what the people writing these rags even believe as Marvel has been very open about exploiting outrage for a short terms sales boost.

>>47572376
>but won't ever go to war because the USA actually owes china money and is one of their major economic players.
This was the argument for why WW1 was impossible prior to when it happened.

>>47572384
>How can I lie about them if I'm quoting them with no editing?
You just did. You, yet again, treated me like a subhuman embodiment of evil, when I'm actually just objecting to people who act like assholes and use "freedom" as a buzzword to hide from objections.

>>47572361
>I see that argument a lot, and it's retarded.
>1. Just because the black market exists, doesn't mean it's easy for just any criminal to go buy a gun from them

It absolutely is. Where do you think they get them in localities where it's almost completely impossible to purchase them such as New York or Chicago? If they're criminals, they shouldn't be able to pass the background check.

>2. If only criminals and cops have guns, less people are gonna get shot by well-meaning but stupid passers-by

Passersby actually have a really good record at stopping these things. Most people don't just start shooting randomly when they hear a gunshot.

>3. Less people will get shot for ridiculous spurious reasons, like because they dinged your car, or they played their music too loud, or their dog shit on your lawn

Statistically rare. The majority of gun crimes come from the inner cities the methville trailer park and they have much deeper structural problems.

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/crimestats

>>47572361
4. The tens of thousands of people who use their firearms in a defensive manner each year can suck it.

>>47572346
>>I actually hope for our Army to take over and install a military junta, because that shit can't be worse than the ineffective, self serving, bickering and spineless shit our current political system consists of.

t. 13 year old

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I consider myself a leftist because I believe in an even playing field. I think everyone should have exactly the same chance to make their way. This means taking action against poverty, institutionalized racism and sexism (etc), and enabling access to such basic rights as a living wage, education and healthcare. It's not a perfect world, so a lot of these issues are difficult to contend with, but that doesn't mean they're not worth working toward.

Am I degenerate tumblrite scum?

>>47572419
>>47571168
>>47571281
>>47571326
>>47571401
>>47571401
Such furious backpedalling. Freedom is a two way street and by definition, it means that people are going to do things with it that you don't approve of.

That's called tolerance. Something that you only think that you are. You tolerate a crying baby on an airplane, after all.

>>47572414
WW1 wasn't one war, at least when it started out. It was several small wars going on at the same time for separate reasons that then turned into one giant war...

that ten turned into another giant war because a lot of players (primarily France) were really fucking angry at germany for their wartime atrocities and punished them so badly their country fell the fuck apart leading to a group of inept manchildren taking control of the country.

Maybe you're right, maybe first world nation would go to war againt one another but it's been quite some fucking time since you saw countries that were anywhere close to equal in technology, industry, and manpower go to full on total war with each other.

Mostly proxies and puppet wars these days.

>>47572444
If you support affirmative action then yes.

>>47572444
well as someone whose seen affirmative action staff entire government offices with incompetent fuckwads I'd say there has to be a better way to combat institutionalized racism.

while I'm sure we'll disagree on a ton of shit I think we owe it to eachother to at least sit the fuck down and find some kind of even ground and shit we agree on.

I like chocolate.

Do you like chocolate anon?

>>47572454
>Such furious backpedalling.
No backpedaling, just the same truths that your lies have always failed against. You keep spamming those quotes while lying about what's written in them.

>>47572444
depending on location I'd argue that the vast majority of sexist and racist behaviors that can be legislated against have been.
Then again, my country has a habit of anti-sexist legislation being specifically against misogyny as opposed to just blanket "See this shit? Cut it out" legislation. I just want it to be applied evenly regardless of the sex or ethnicity of the perpetrator. But no, I wouldn't say so.

>>47572444
I wouldn't call you a degenerate, but I would call you a dupe.

>I think everyone should have exactly the same chance to make their way.

You know that you can't have equality of opportunity AND equality of outcome, right? Its one or the other.

>>47572444
How does it feel to know that you're horrible at everything you claim to champion?

You try to fight racism and you wind up creating the bias that blacks were just diversity hires?

You try to bring healthcare and you drive premiums up for everyone.

You start a war on poverty and you wind up increasing it.

At what point do you say to yourself "my every instinct is wrong and if it seems like a good idea, I should do the opposite thing."

>>47572444
>I consider myself a leftist
>institutionalized racism and sexism (etc)
>Am I degenerate tumblrite scum?
Yep.

>>47572387
I don't think the markets are the same. Here in the UK guns are strictly controlled, drugs are illegal (especially so since the retarded new psychoactive substances bill). I know lots of people who take and sell drugs of all different kinds, but I've never met anyone selling unlicensed firearms

>>47572486
I don't have to say anything about them. They speak for themselves.

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>>47572376
>>muh cultural purity
>>muh self determination
>>muh sovereignty

What is wrong with any of these, you disgusting globalist piece of shit?
Your people, culture, and nation, are the only things that ultimately safeguard the fate of your kin against oblivion. My people were almost destroyed by Russians. Had they succeeded in their russificiation attempts, there would be no Finns anymore, just russified mongrels living under the rule of Russians.

Without a distinct people, your culture, and ultimately your nation, will fade away and die.
Without a strong culture, that is skeptical of outsiders, it, and your nation and people, will fall under the subversion of outside forces.
Without a nation for your people to inhabit, your people will eventually be absorbed into that of other peoples, and thus cease to exist as their distinct group.

Only a suicidal, or utterly self centered fool would advocate for any of the above scenarios.
I love my homeland, my people, and my culture, and I won't just sit idly and see it die, if there is anything I can do to help to prevent that fate.
People and nations don't exist just to make profits for some globalist corporations that have no loyalty towards anybody other than their profit margins.

>>47572394
I have served in the army, and in the army, we sure as hell knew far better how to get shit done, than our current politicians do. And as a nation, it is high time for us to get shit done if we are to avoid the upcoming disasters we are heading into.

>>47572427
>someone who holds an extreme stance must be underage.
Top kek.

>>47572497
wow it's not like aggressive action from political conservatives who refuse to even COUNTENANCE social change torpedo'd a lot of those initiatives.

granted the left is hardly helping itself with shit like Occupy Wallstreet getting torpedo's by special interest groups who can't focus for the life of them but you're pretty much ignoring the simple fact that there's people who have a vested interest in destroying any form of upward mobility or making higher education a non-profit endeavor.

>>47572510
Unlike the UK, the US has a large, all-too-open border with Mexico, who is willing to smuggle over anything that can get a profit.

>>47572512
Yes, they sure do, and absolutely none of them say "I am literally a bad guy who hates freedom".

Instead, they all say "simply using the word FREEDOM doesn't mean you're not an asshole and doesn't keep people from pointing out your bad behavior".

Because when people disagree with the "freedom" excuse, that's what they're actually saying. They aren't objecting to all that is good, they're talking about the specific actions hiding behind it.

>>47572444
>Institutionalized racism and sexism
Oh, tell me about how laws that don't give a specific advantage to any group are racist or sexist.

Equality of opportunity doesn't mean nor lead to equality of outcome. The former is fairness, the latter is communism.

>>47572525

>wow it's not like aggressive action from political conservatives who refuse to even COUNTENANCE social change

The left could have passed single payer. Instead they chose corporate welfare, with 0% Republican support (ironically since it was originally Republican in origin, in some form).

The left didn't have to pass affirmative action, but did, which is literal institutional racism.

You gotta admit, as leftist "social change" is primarily about demographic chicanery to get a permanent supermajority, the right is, well, right to stymie such efforts.

>>47572513
>What is wrong with any of these
that you don't actually understand any of these and use them as an excuse for naked xenophobia and live in terror of change.

The very fact that you use a term like "mongrel" is telling. Racial purity is pure bunkem and used as an excuse by would be iconoclasts and dictators.

Fuck's sake you worthless little tool you called for a military junta because your country might become a little less distinct...in exchange for having one currency that makes it easier for people to travel and do business.

The best part of all of this? I'm pretty sure your people and culture don't even want you Finnfrog. You got a job? A higher Education? A girlfriend? Hell any friends? Are you a functional member of society or a bored little neet posting on a laptop bought with welfare money crying bitter manchild tears because he saw a package of snacks with a foreign language on it the other day?

When the russians are actually invading finnland then you get to complain about your precious little culture being under attack. Because it's actually under attack, rather than just responding to a changing global market but making Finnland a more competitive economic power.

I'd wish for Finnland to get invaded by russia so you could grab a rifle and fight for your country but you're probably too out of shape to walk down the street much less perform a forced march.

>>47572470
It's a heavy-handed answer to a more subtle problem, as >>47572474 can surely tell you.

Really the problem is that most people are racist at a very subconscious level, usually without meaning to be. Things like college application acceptances being biased toward applicants with "white" names.

>>47572490
Wage inequality and disproportionate arrests are both still things in this country, easily visible and shouldn't be difficult to legislate against.

>>47572494
Opportunity is all I ask. If I can make it just as far as you by working just as hard, regardless of us having different races, sexes, backgrounds, etc (ignoring for this hypothetical things like job availability, etc), then I'm satisfied.

>>47572497
Please do not equate my ideals with the idiotic and corrupt Democratic Party.

>>47572540
>"I am literally a bad guy who hates freedom".
Correct. This is only implied.

>>47572584
>If I can make it just as far as you by working just as hard, regardless of us having different races, sexes, backgrounds, etc (ignoring for this hypothetical things like job availability, etc), then I'm satisfied.

Ok. So we can probably agree that battle is won then, yeah? Since its already been proven that a black man can become a president and that a woman can have 3:1 odds at becoming one as well, right?

Glad that the struggle is over.

Unless again, you're arguing about equality of outcome, not of opportunity.

>>47572584
>Please do not equate my ideals with the idiotic and corrupt Democratic Party.

tbph? Really having a hard time telling the difference right now.