/CofD/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness & World of Darkness

>>47177322
Summoning.
Supernal, Shadow, Astral, Underworld, Abyssal, Hellmenth.
It's all good

Chronicles of Fagness

>>47177322
>What is the best part of your favorite line?

I love the Court politics in Changeling.

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I remember a bunch of different animals were made available in the original Werewolf game, where you could be a Crow or a Shark or a Snake and a few others.

Is that still in the new/current edition?

>>47177373

Not as such a big thing, no. Changing Breeds is a vestigial and ill-considered book (though, if you listen to some Werewolf diehards, so were the Fera in oWoD, so eh).

>>47177373
>Is that still in the new/current edition?
Do you mean Forsaken?

If so, then yes. But its a Eco-terrorist furry sim. Its what basically everyone hated about Werewolf.

>>47177347
>Hellmenth
What is/are Hellmenth, anyways?
The first time I saw it I thought it was a typo of Hellmouth, re: Buffy.

>>47177373
If you're talking about the non-Changing Breeds version, you can find them in the back of War Aginst The Pure or whatever. But no, beyond a passing mention in the Neolithic werewolf setting in Dark Era's there isn't anything about other shifters.

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>>47177373
I remember weresharks
Those things are cool.

>>47177483
Yeah, they where like, the most deadly (Physically) Changing breed in werewuff the apoclable

>>47177450
Skin stealers aren't really 'shifters'. More form taking druids.

>>47177447
The Hellmenth are evil worms from below the underworld that want to eat reality. Likely lower depths entities.

>>47177515
No, I'm talking about things like werewolves, like the bull-shifters that follow Helios. Not Skin-thiefs in Aztec demon, the bull shifters mentioned in a scenario for Neolithic Werewolf.

>>47177299
I just feel uncomfortable with not sticking to some semblance of veracity. I know it's not something that actually matters, but I hate that anything I do will essentially be shooting in Vancouver. I ran a few sessions of a VtR2e game based on VtMB for a friend (though that got trampled on by her job) and it was really frustrating think of all the ways that VtMB was clearly made by people who had never been to LA. Like the constant rain, and the fact that basements are common. I've never been to LA and even I know that's not how it works.

With Gotham--or more often a place I completely make up--I can get away with whatever I want because there isn't a real place, so there's no veracity. Gotham itself only works as a place to run a game because it's been through so many incarnations. Some fictional city that only has one or two versions I couldn't do.

Then again, I had a player get really pissed off when they realized Ashcroft might not necessarily be in the US, or any other set location. They didn't notice when I used "Detective Inspector". They put two and two together when there was both speakeasies and a front line WWI hospital. What's weird is that one of the reasons they said it would be important to know the specific location was for gun laws. Their character didn't even use a gun...

So basically it's my same argument with canon play. If you're going to just use the name and images and vague surface level similarities, why not just play an expy/OC and have more freedom?

>>47177420
>>47177399
>>47177373
Fera were basically always an afterthought. That's why the book was Werewolf and not Therianthrope or something. They were always "sure, I guess you can be other shapeshifters".

>>47177447
Terrifying worms that live in the deepest part of the Underworld and will one day devour everything that exists until all of reality is Underworld, because some shitty Mage will become Obsessed with figuring out the code of the ghostly run Numbers Stations, travel around the world, and destroy six of the sixty-six black obelisks that hold the Hellmenth back from being unleashed upon the world.

>>47177512
Cant you just use the translation guide for the other shape shifters for the new system? Or hell use the old system with new lore.

>>47177531
Oh are they? Weird, I didn't see them brought up in there.

>>47177558
I've no idea honestly, I got little interest with crossing things across additions beyond like, corporations or cults.

>>47177558
Both were really shitty in terms of mechanics and fluff. You'd really have to start from scratch with the core concept of "animal shifters"

>>47177574
Page 64 of Dark Eras talks about the Gudthabak under the heading Unstoppable Souls. You can read more about them, including their own special 1e powers, in War aginst the Pure on page 215 to 222. They're literally the last thing in the book.

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>>47177532
It's important to remember that these are stylized cities. Seattle suffers from perpetual rain, San Francisco and Los Angeles have fog and smog respectively, and Miami is always sunny until the story is about to conclude with a Hurricane.

Besides, you should always play fast and loose with cities. The big city your players have to deal with is San Angeles, in the 33rd State of the Union, New Arkansas.

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>>47177483

>>47177731
>tfw no Street Sharks campaign.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAg2VXRY7Os

>>47177685
Basically, I prefer to go the GTA route with cities instead of shooting in Vancouver.

(To explain that reference, a lot of shows that are set in New York or LA or Seattle or somewhere else are actually shot in Vancouver, Canada, https://youtu.be/ojm74VGsZBU I basically want to avoid doing that kind of thing with games)

>>47177685
You know LA is sunny and right by the beach, right?

>>47177541
That seems pretty specific.

>>47177778
He said London and LA have "fog and smog respectively". London has the fog, LA has the smog.

>>47177778
Yeah, but how am I supposed to combine the Beach Boys with Vampire?

Besides, isn't San Diego considered to have better cared for beaches?

>>47177842
>cant combine LA and vampires

You never seen Angel?

>>47177776
Holy shit, I just realized I need to set a Mage game in Vancouver. A hook will be that it literally has NO IDENTITY of its own in the astral.

>>47177853
Nah, the MC looks like a total fag and I've never seen Buffy.

>>47177842
Nah, LA has Malibu. The best beaches and surf in California. San Diego has warmer water, though.

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>>47177898
>I've never seen Buffy

>>47177911
It honestly baffles me how little people actually know about LA.

>>47177911
everyone just thinks of hollywood and gang violence

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>>47177945
I'm in California and I barely know about it. Heck, I barely understand the San Jose/ San Francisco megacity an hour away.

>>47177955
But this is the truth.

San Francisco has hippies.
San Jose is where computers come from.
Los Angeles is the crime center of the world.
And the rest of the state is meant to grow weed.

>>47177895
I've actually wanted to set a game in Vancouver, but then I realized that all the problems I have would still be there if I actually did set it in Vancouver :V


>>47177853
>>47177936
I've never actually seen Angel either, and barely remember Buffy even though I watched it for like a year and a half. But I like David Boreanaz as an actor.

Also, what's faggy about this, I mean, come on?
https://youtu.be/3zUkT9YAPDY

>>47177936
Niggah I'm hella serious, I ain't never seen that shit. No one ever sold me on it and It was just never on when I was watching TV.

>>47177955
Honestly, having lived here my whole life? If you stay out of a) South Central b) Compton and c) Downtown? It's pretty peaceful. Santa Monica is line the best part of the area, and Hollywood Blvd can suck a bag of dicks.

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>>47178018
>>Also, what's faggy about this, I mean, come on?

Within context, that episode is fucking great.

>alienate your core fanbase
>bring in people who used to hate your product

Did Mage 2e fuck up?

>>47178134
What did they change that would ward off the old fanbase?

>>47178092
I have no context and I've been tempted to watch the show just for that episode, but I'd probably also need to watch Buffy for Angel, and that's like five billion hours of late 90s/early 00s television.

>>47178134
>Implying the core fanbase was alienated

>>47178134
I feel like you're trying to stir up shit.

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>>47178163
There's 7 seasons, and except he first half of the 4th season being kind of a chore because they had an awkward transition of setting after not being sure if they were getting cancelled or not, it's all good.

>>47178183
Yep. Without any context, it is just a stir post.

>>47178190
Like I said, I used to watch it, even if I don't remember any of it other than Willow becoming an evil lesbian, Seth Green being a werewolf, and the fact that I want literally every WoD game I run to be like Buffy but more 'realistic' or at least gritty.

I want the players to be teenagers who deal with supernatural shit and have to keep it on the down low for the sake of their family and social standing and also not wanting to get locked up for sounding like they're batshit crazy.

I've mentioned it before, but think about it:
You're a teenager. You've been thrust into the supernatural, occult world that lies beneath the surface. You can't close your eyes and ignore the horrible shit, and you can't avoid noticing when your friends are preyed on by vampires, or getting pulled into cults to strange Gods. You go out at night--if you can avoid doing it during class--and you fight back. You do what you can to make your corner of this shitty little world less shitty, but it's getting harder. Your mom and dad are fighting. Your teachers question how tired you are. People ask where you got those bruises.
Your little brother got a wooden sword from some anime convention. You hammered nails into it and it works pretty well, and you hope he won't remember he had it. Your parents want to know where you keep taking the car. They think you're doing drugs, or involved in crime. I guess technically, you are. How long before the cops catch you breaking into an old building with a can of gasoline, a box of salt, and a bunch of matches? What happens if they think that corpse was a hobo or something? Will "he was already dead before the fire" really be a good excuse? Would anyone even believe it?

>>47178435
So the sorority compact from Hunter? Giles could be the campus Librarian or a teacher.

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>tfw have the v20 pdfs
>tfw want to run a short campaign with the intent of worldbuilding
>one friend only likes one kind of settng for roleplay
>one friend refuses to play vampire because "it's a poltical dickery sim"
>only two friends willing to play

I mean, I guess it's better in the long run to just start with two since I'm not as familiar with the rules but still it's a pain in my ass how few of my friends are interested

>>47178446
I prefer High School Hunter, but yes, that's exactly why I like the Maiden's Blood Sisterhood. Although they actually don't have to deal with most of the problems I like to focus on. In fact, they're a Compact specifically to help the members AVOID most of those problems.

My first (and so far only successful) WoD game was a Geist game with high school characters, intentionally inspired by the first few episodes of Bleach (to the point that I called it Sin-Eater Soul Reapers).

The first plot actually involved reconstruction on the school stirring up an old ghost from the 60s of a nerd who got killed by the other nerd who had a crush on him when he started going out with the head cheerleader.

Second plot involved them getting wrapped up in a serial killer case. One of them was kidnapped and tortured by the killer (an Abmortal) and another got beat to hell trying to fight him, and they ended up in the hospital despite their Sin-eater durability. They also saved a cop from being killed, so they were legit heroes.

Third plot, which is where I really pulled in the social stuff, had them in the hospital nearing recovery. There was Silent Hill stuff where they kept getting pulled into an Underworld reflection of the hospital, and had to stop the ~spooky ceremony~ from being retried and killing everyone, but one of the best scenes was where one of the teens had a talk with his mom.

She and Mack's dad had been Hunters, and Mack's dad went crazy and couldn't give up the Vigil when they had a kid. He died homeless, (and became Mack's Geist) and she wanted to keep Mack safe, even if she knew he couldn't talk about stuff, and also wouldn't stop. So she gave him his dad's old trench knife, which had the Hunter Favoured Weapon merit attached to it. It was a fun scene.

>>47178582
Will his ghost possess it if he dies, and become Mack the Knife?

>>47178582
I have always wanted to play a Tomboy who is the Captain of the shooting team and was raised Primarily by her father who taught her to shoot since she was old enough to walk.

>>47178688
>Shooting team
I know this is America, but what?

>>47178715
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_rifle_programs
You can get a sports scholarship for them bro.

>>47178715
Sport shooting is probably the one useful thing you can do with a gun unrelated to murder.

>>47178797
What about Hunting. Or Self Defense? Or what if you need to protect yourself and other people as a cop? Or maybe you just think shooting is a neat hobby.

>>47178808
>Hunting
Murder, but most people don't care as long as you eat it
>Self defense
Still technically murder
>Protecting yourself as a cop
Also still technically murder, and also rarely actually needed; in fact de-escalation tactics are almost always more useful than pulling a piece. Most cops will never fire their sidearm in the first place.
>Or maybe you just think shooting is a neat hobby
That's just sport shooting without actually doing the sport part

>>47178856
>in fact de-escalation tactics are almost always more useful than pulling a piece.
I agree. But its better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it.

>>47178134
>bring in people who used to hate your product

Has it managed to do that? Kudos if so, it can only be good for the line.

>>47178877
Yeah, but that they have it is one of the reasons the US police is so aggressive and militarized. They have stuff they don't need. British cops don't really need guns. American cops *definitely* don't need APCs that tear up civilian roads.

>>47178856
The definition of murder
>Murder is the killing of another human being without justification or valid excuse, and it is especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought.
So, nah. Not murder.

>>47178901
Can't speak for anyone else but I loathed Mage 1e, but 2e has me excited to play

>>47178938
the definition of quibble
>argue or raise objections about a trivial matter.
There's a reason "killing" is listed as the first synonym for murder.

>>47178944
Same. Mage 1e was interesting, but seemed like an overcomplicated mess. It seemed like hell on the ST, and hard for new players to grasp.

2e seems a fair bit better, and it has a stronger purpose now (without needing supplements to spell it out)

>>47178932
Well thats more to poor training, low hiring standards and the weird way police qualifications work more so then the equipment they are using.
Like if you get fired from one precinct you police training is still valid and you can get hired by another precinct. Pretty crazy.

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>>47178901
>>47178944
Conversely, I loved Mage 1e. I had so many high hopes for 2e... Which it meet and exceeded. I'm so happy with it.

>>47178967
My only concern, complexity wise, is that it seems like it might be a bit difficult as a ST to manage spell-casting in conflicts with NPCs mages. Like, you have to think about how many free Reaches and free Potency / Duration advances you get, and how much extra Reach you want, and what sort of Yantras to employ, etc.—for EACH spell one of your NPCs casts. That's on top of just being familiar enough with all 10 Arcana to be able to make use of them.

I don't envy the ST who has to try and keep all of that straight.

>>47178973
Well, yeah, but one of the other things is the psychological wage of "I have an argument stopping stick" that a lot of cops will resort to, which is an escalation tactic, and cops are taught to escalate instead of de-escalate.

I actually didn't know you could go to another precinct. Honestly the worst part about America's cops is that they get all Thin Blue Line even when someone abuses their position or is corrupt. It baffles me why that's a thing. Good cops peer pressure good cops into standing up for bad cops.

>>47179024
I mean, that's basically true even in the 1e. I've always been worried about my ability to run a game of Mage. If anything, I think that the more occult heavy nature of 2e and the fact that a lot of time you won't be waving your hands and casting magic means that a lot of the spells that NPCs do will be able to be handled in a more careful fashion, as opposed to "oh shit I have to work this out in the next like five minutes, everyone take a bathroom break"

>>47179054
It depends who you talk to really. I know someone that was a Doorkicker and he was a very friendly and very reasonable person that explained a lot of things to me.

>>47179054
>nd the fact that a lot of time you won't be waving your hands and casting magic

>wasting Reach on sensory casting

Nah fuck that, BEAMSPAM!

>>47179075
What I mean is that it feels like a lot of stuff really will be ritually cast ceremonies as opposed to DBZ wizard fights.

>>47179024
I think they could have given you the formulas in ways that are easier to grasp from the outset. For a non-ritual spell cast with no prep time the factors are fairly straightforward - you'll spend an automatic Reach on instant casting, in effect the free Reach you have to work with is just (your dots) - (spell's dots). The potency is equal to your Arcanum dots, unless duration is primary in which case it's 1. You only get two Yantras until you start building serious Gnosis so it's going to be a +1 Tool and +2 for High Speech if you can take a round for it, and as your yantra slots increase you'll mostly still just pile on more tools unless you stumble into a supernal verge.

There's also that, as Storyteller, I think I'm not alone in handwaving the NPC's offscreen casting. If you know roughly what they can do, let them do it, and pull out the dice when their spells might be Withstood by a PC.

>>47179091
>Not wanting every fight to be DBZ
What, are you high?

>>47179223
I'm Yamcha. I definitely don't want that

>>47176372

Wraith is a fucking masterpiece and I have the embarrassing tattoo to prove it.

>>47179280
You can't say that without showing us. We've already seen your cats, so we know you've got a camera.

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>>47179316

This photo is like a year old.

Last time I posted this I got accused of being a cis girl.

>>47179371
Your back is disgusting

>>47178967
>>47179019

I had high hopes for Mage 2e and have been somewhat disappointed.

We were promised a streamlined system where the Practices always reflected the effects and with no artificial arcana "speedbumps."

This did not happen. There obviously were some attempts at "balance," likely far too many mistakes that will not receive an errata because they are too substantial, and the different tone, style and capabilities of the Arcana clearly revealed they were written by multiple authors.

The fluff was certainly a major improvement over 1e, but the spellcasting did not meet expectations. I also didn't like the new combination of emphasized importance of mana together with significant mana scarcity (and failure to include any sample Prime spells that could actually acquire Mana outside of its usual sources). It's made spellcasting outside of Ruling Arcana implicitly discouraged and spellcasting generally by restricting a mage's ability to mitigate Paradox from the now essential extra Reach so your spells aren't embarrassingly short, impotent or limited.

I felt like Mage 2e was a draft with a lot of good ideas, but still badly in need of further development. The egregious amount of errata and requests for FAW help in the OPP forum threads are a testament to these problems.

>>47179398
Mana scarcity? You can get it back+1 with an exceptional successes. Praxis spells are mana machines.

>>47179419

You only get one free praxis per dot of Gnosis, and you still need an average of about 9 dice to achieve an exceptional success. Since spell penalties are required to achieve respectable factors on most spells, and Yantras are limited by Gnosis and only provide an average of +1 per Yantra, those exceptional successes are going to be far fewer than you suggest, at least under normal setting conditions and/or until the character has advanced to very high levels of power.

>>47179380
I've seen worse in porn.
>>47179371
>tfw you learn you'd fuck Jakki

Do Platonic Forms function as a real item would, eg. tass made into woood could burn, a tass magnet will stick to a fridge, etc.

Phantasms in 1e didn't, but 2e doesn't say

>>47179641

They do; that's part of being the platonic ideal of something.

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>>47179371
The fuck is with those curves? You sure you're not a chick?

>>47179380
It's not like it's got acne or some shit.

>>47179280
I fucking HATE oWoD, but I love wraith and Orpheus. Good taste, Jakki.

>>47179673
So with Prime 3 I can create uranium tass?

>>47179779
I feel like the platonic ideal of anything would have no radioactive decay.

>>47179371
Waz that symbol for? I've only looked a lil at wraith and I'm waiting for 20th to come out before goin' hard on the mother fucker.

>>47177769
Your Auspice should affect the type of Shark you have traits of. Also if you stay in one place for longer than [insert statistic here] you suffer a breaking point towards Flesh.

>>47179686
>Pug Obrimos.gif

>>47178134
I sure as hell wasn't alienated. It's just that 2e bring only the magic system for me, because as it is, 2e has no theme or coherent setting. Okay, I get it, many people dislike Atlantis (for some reason). But Mage desperately need a setting to explore and research, and there is barely anything about setting in 2e book. So I'll do the thing I always did - take mechanics from one edition and fluff from another one.

>>47179934
Ditto.

>>47179806
>I feel like the platonic ideal of anything would have no radioactive decay.

So Platonic Form lava wouldn't cool either?

>>47179934
>>47179961
Odd. I've felt that the 2e book did a much better job of creating theme and tone and setting. I feel that the drive to explore and research is stronger, and more encouraged. In fact, I feel that being a static PC is outright disincentive.

>>47180059
I feel like the platonic form of lava wouldn't exist, because lava is melted rock, and the platonic form of rock isn't a liquid.

>>47180099
Atlantis and finding it's shards was the main theme of 1e. What is it now? Because I didn't get from the 2e for sure.

>>47180141
Finding shards of atlantis might have become the theme in supplements, but I dunno, reading 1e I never got that out of the main book.

>>47179641
if they get damage do they like explode or radiate magical energy?

So is Aquaman real if Atlantis is real?

>>47180141
Like >>47180164 said, that was never a theme. Hell, I didn't even know that was a thing, other than a mention of a lost continent with ties to Atlantis but eventually disappeared, and that was just in Grimoire of Grimoires.

The main theme of 1e's corebook was a confusing mess and vaguely The Matrix.

At least in 2e you're encouraged to poke your nose into things, and STs are encouraged to not make boring cities.

>>47180218
But it's not even Atlantis, it's The Awakened City

>>47180225
>that was never a theme
The very first chapter in the book is almost completely about Atlantis, the Fall, the Lie and quest for magical truth, and that was never a theme? Okay, but then the current edition sure as hell doesn't have ANY theme, it is just "Mages in the cities".

>>47179816

Silent Legion, those who commit suicide. This sounds so stupid/edgy but Wraith got me through a period of really nasty mental health.

>>47179686

I'm not sure.

>>47179371
>using an iPhone
What's your excuse?

>>47180263
My ancient laptop broke back in August and I've been living off an iPad since then.

It's a miserable existence.

>>47180141
Mage never had a theme. It was just "here's your magic, oh by the way there's about a million things that want you dead - best of luck chap". You had to come up with your own theme

>>47180256
It does have a theme. More coherent than 1e's. A friend who couldn't get into Mage (more like couldn't stick with it) seems far more interested in this than "Matrix with a wizard theme".

Hell, all the themes are still there, but now there's bite to Paradox and you're encouraged to be a wizard instead of playing DBZ`

>>47179625
>I've seen worse in porn.

Explain further.

What, only seeing the back of the guy pounding away on top?

>you'd fuck Jakki
That needs double explanation. You can't see much here.

>>47180303
You've never seen amateur porn where they've got pimples and bumps? Ass especially is prone to that. I mean, I don't hate people for that or anything, though I do wish they'd do a little more exfoliating if they're getting super close up on their asses.
Also, thin waist, relatively decent complexion. Would probably look good in some girl's clothes and make up.

>>47180266

I think that's why I prefer the historical settings. The Sundered World asks you to go out into the untold wild and bring back secrets, because no one but the Wise can. To The Strongest has the Awakened trying to control the world as it begins to crumble apart and fall through their fingers. Mage Noir asks mages what power really means if it can't stop atrocities, inequality, and genocide. These settings grant focus that the base "you have magic, here's the factions, go chase Mysteries" is lacking.

>>47180412
Well. It's a corebook. It's supposed to be generic. It's a groundwork for you to create your own chronicle.

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>>47180218
Aquaman is a Moros with Life.

>>47180447
Hes too happy for a Moros
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE8C1WWixgc

>>47180453
Okay I can see him being a Thyrsus on the Silver Ladder or a Tthyrsus GoV, one of the two.

Crossposting from the forums for feedback here:

>51: [Beast/Hunter]: Strangers disturb the Dream, visitors other than mere sleepers. Both are recent to the eternal memories of the Horrors; one is a cadre of men and women in black suits and oxygen masks, government agents and heirs to modern monsters like GRILL FLAME and MKULTRA who use drugs and meditation to perform reconnaissance on the heart of the human race, the other young innovator-terrorists running a hack they claim the Devil gave them in the hopes of bombing the fear and cruelty out of mankind's shared mind. Both are interlopers, and both must be shown their true place in the hierarchy of nightmares.

>(As an addendum, would you like to see these guys written up as Conspiracies?)

>>47180453
Moros are allowed to be happy, they just all know that death is coming and you can't really stop it, just slow it.

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This is how I Hunter

>>47180481
Fuck off, there's loads of ways to stop death. Give your Moros the Immortals blue book if they lack inspiration.

>>47180497
I've always wanted to make a old priest character, the archetype just always seemed so cool to me.

>>47180469
That sounds really familiar for some reason...

>>47180504
To be fair i've never read Immortals, but fuck off those all -stop- death forever, that's some broken ass shit niggah if it's true.

>>47180469
I don't know what that means.

Are they delving into the Primordial Dream with magic suits? Also, a Beast focused Hunter conspiracy would be hard to do because of the two worlds thing. It'd be hard to make Lair delving interesting, I think. Too... far outside of the typical modern setting. Hunter wouldn't do well in the Hedge or Shadow, either. And it's hard to make something themed towards Beast if it doesn't involve the Primordial Dream.

This is kind of the problem with Heroes. As far as I recall, all they really do is get weapons that hurt Beasts more.

>>47180504
>>47180515
Stopping death is bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_xsfiAHaU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uetEMDXvLZk
Would it be possible to to make a Stand like Echoes into a set of Proximus Blessings? Keeping in mind the Act 1 generates SFX that play on loop inside the person hit with them, Act 2 can, on top of this, make SFX with a physical component (A sizzle sound generates a small burst of flame, a boing sound repels things etc) and Act 3 can change the structure of a word to alter it's affect on people (Most commonly seen in with it converting the English for 'three' into 'freeze' and making someone sink into the ground).

I personally think it would either fit a Mastigos Dynasty with Forces or an Obrimos Dynasty with Mind.

>>47180141
Being literally unable to stop oneself from seeking the truth at terrible cost to everyone around oneself.

>>47178435
"High schoolers with a secret life" is always fun & good but every game, comrade? I loved Persona 3 as much as the next guy but one can only enjoy teen romance & "we gotta slay the rage spirit by midnight cuz I got a test tomorrow" for so long.

>>47180848
Maybe when I finally get my fix of teen romance and "we gotta slay the rage spirit by midnight cuz I got a test tomorrow".

>>47180860
I've got a teenage Uratha spilling his spaghetti all over the place in my current Werewolf campaign, trying and failing to keep up with the adult members of the pack. I am glutted on teen roleplay, I suppose.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xclzUDeziAY
You know what we need...Werewolf Robot Wars!

A lot of the major templates have something that naturally stops people from figuring out they exist. If not natural, they have an artificial aspect of their society that prevents it...

Did they have that for Geist? I'm trying to remember, but I can't think of any explanation for why Sin-eaters haven't been figured out, except that they are relatively rare.

>>47181096
Nope.
It's mostly because they're mostly not gigantic assholes with world-topping ambitions.

>>47177989

Native Californian here, Los Angeles is generally seen as an absolute shithole. Nobody eants to go to LA unless they're going to see a concert or are passing through up to Disneyland; the city is too fucking big and gross and dirty and ghetto. I'd love to go up for some of the famous food trucks, but that's about it.

San Francisco is the most expensive place to live on the earth. It's also not LGBTQ-friendly; it only wants you if you're a white cis gay man with money.

My honest experience with SoCal that most people seem to not notice is the massive mikitary presence. San Diego is the primary Navy port and is where everything headed out into the Pacific goes; almost every family has a dad or brother currently stationed out in Japan. An hour up the coast in Camp Pendleton, where they train all the Marines. You get used to constant overhead traffic and seeing weird shit in the sky.

>>47181096
The lie

>>47181096
plenty of people already believe in ghosts

>>47181096
Its seemed implied in mortal remains that sin eater don't want humans messing with and exploiting ghost. So they try to keep it on the down low.

>>47181145

Fuck it, I'm feeling inspired.

>San Diego has a district called Old Town, which is mostly new buildings made to look old that serve overpriced bad Mexican food to tourists. The area does contain some actual historic landmarks, however, with the Whaley House being notably haunted (the tree where one of the family was hung is still there next to it) and the oldest Spanish mission in California still seeing Sunday service (it was built with Native slave labor and they were buried in the walls). Next to my old elementary school was a pioneer graveyard that the city converted into a park by relocating the headstones to an ignored corner, but none of the bodies were exhumed (I go there with my dad to pray on Veteran's Day).

>Julian is a tourist attraction up a winding mountain road, a portrait of all-American nostalgia famous for apple pies and tours of the old gold mine. Every couple years, all of the trees on the mountain burn down, and the trip to Julian is one through a sea of cracked, dead wood.

>My parents both saw "green lasers in the sky" during the 80s off the stretch of higheay by the marine base. My dad saw a "flying trashcan" over Chila Vista in the 90s. I saw lightning coming up out of the sea a few years back, again by Pendleton.

>My friend in San Clemente has lost three schoolmates to yearly suicides in May, always one boy.

>Out in Santee, the road is absolutely crawling with "phantom headlights" that try to run you off the road.

>>47181247

All of this shit is true, by the way.

Does your hometown have any fun potential story hooks?

>>47181247
>>Out in Santee, the road is absolutely crawling with "phantom headlights" that try to run you off the road.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/scp-745
Something tells me you could make these using Dread Powers.

>>47181255

Escaping from it, maybe

Many have tried, few succeeded.

I feel a little ambivalent about Mage 2e, although honestly most of the other shit people have raised is news to me. I've really liked the way stuff has been streamlined and folded in (It wasn't until this thread that I realised spellcasting may have become more complicated, not less), but anyway it really shows that they had the opportunity to build the system up from the ground again KNOWING what it would eventually contain.

I'm a little concerned about the overuse of clash of wills though. It seems as though there's no longer very many ways to just impede or weaken abilities or damage used on you, you just negate it entirely or don't. I'm sure this is in line with the general CoD gameplay style shift but it bothers me.

Promethean 2e when?

>>47181450
Yes please, I want it to be the best game someone will actually WANT to play, as opposed tot h e best game you'll NEVER play.

>>47181450

If you're real lucky some 6 months from now

>>47181434
It's more to do with how Mage works from what I understand. They either manage to impose the symbols they are calling down or they don't, they can't do it halfway.

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What are some ways to get a vampire cotorie created all at the same time/place?

So far the only thing I've got is for some kindred in the city earning the right to sire, and inviting their prospective childer to a vampire gathering.

I feel like this must be the vampire equivalent to starting a dnd campaign in a tavern, right?

Can one of the Unchained take a dog as their Cover?

>>47181586
Vamp Elder awakens, sends a missive to everyone he ever sired with "Bring me a neonate next full moon, I want to see how your taste in humans has fared over the decades".

Basically the Vamps doing the siring are as in the dark on this as the PCs, and further have to contend with hastily gaining (or not) the right to sire on a countdown.

>>47181648
Man, you have no IDEA how much my group have discussed the intricacies of fringe Demon builds.

A Demon cannot take a dog as their starting cover. The process of becoming unchained just produces exiles in the case of animal angels. They also cannot soul pact an animal as it can't understand well enough to consent UNLESS they use an ability to give it human intelligence, but most such abilities make it unusable or at least unsuitable for a cover. (Hellhounds for instance would absolutely not be able to complete a soul pact because for the duration of the ability their own 'personal infrastructure' that you are coopting is malfunctioning).

HOWEVER, very promising, is that the god machine makes a not insignificant number of dog covered angels. Which you can angeljack.

So consequentially, you can angeljack a dog cover (Which would be difficult to do deliberately, you'd need to KNOW it's going to be a dog ahead of time), or buy one from another demon. Though animal covers in general would be inestimably more valuable than human covers due to the difficulty of acquisition. Given Demon metrics for what constitutes actual valuable trade currencies, buying an animal cover is probably going to effectively put you in servitude for whoever you brought it off of for quite a while, or force you to do something dangerous enough to burn quite a few cover dots here and there.

Due to the above mentioned limitations, I would only allow a demon starting with multiple covers to take their non-primary cover as a dog under very special circumstances, and probably with a few outside-the-rules drawbacks.

>>47181096
Most of their powers are actually invisible to normies, and there aren't enough of them that they'd be able to hold their own.

>>47181709
Honestly thinking further I think it would be a given to saddle them AT CHARGEN with the condition that causes you to take cover degradation if you go too long without trying to complete the mission of your angeljacked cover.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunge
I get the feeling this stuff is integral to some sort of antagonist group somehow, why else would it get so much coverage?

>>47181709
A dog cover wouldn't actually be all that useful outside of moderate surveillance.

As an aside, would anyone else allow players to start with a second cover if the character was Primum 2 and split their 7 dots of Cover between the two? Or even just used starting XP (I always hand out about 10) to buy Cover dots

>>47181802
I've done that just once. I tried to also make them split their time between the two covers, but they made a point of the weaker cover being a recluse that no one really knows or cares about (hence why it is such a weak cover). While otherwise I would be mad about that being a power gaming trick, it was sort of the point, and their main cover had a family and a kid, so it wasn't like they were avoiding participating.

I think it was a 5/2 split.

>>47181825
>I've done that just once. I tried to also make them split their time between the two covers, but they made a point of the weaker cover being a recluse that no one really knows or cares about (hence why it is such a weak cover). While otherwise I would be mad about that being a power gaming trick, it was sort of the point, and their main cover had a family and a kid, so it wasn't like they were avoiding participating.
Kira Yoshikage? *explodes*

Huh, looks like The Pack will release while I'm on a plane.

As ever, am eager for comments and criticism on its content, even of the 'it sucks and you suck, sucker' variety.

Oh, and a side note - can't remember if it was on here or on the OP forums but someone was muttering about a mage-hunting Lodge somehow linked to the Pangaean Fox. For what it's worth, my vague notion of the Sacred Hunt or Lodge Blessing capability for the Tindalosi, who hunt those who screw about with time, would be something akin to Fox's Red Shift power; they'd be capable of catching a ride along with prey that's trying to move through the timestream or change it, so that they keep the same temporal viewpoint as the prey.

>>47182028
Furry Timecop?

>>47181802
Dogs have the advantages that they don't degrade cover from not being where they are supposed to be for extended periods or from walking around in obscure or high security areas.

Further, dog covers can be used to hang around children for extended periods without arousing suspicion.

But pretty much all of what I was saying applies to any animal cover, and you start getting to the point with animals that having a combat cover is viable, IE you break line of sight with your pursuer for a couple seconds, turn into a bear, and maul them without gaining as much god machine attention as you would for demon forming.

>>47182044
I... I *guess* you could call them that.

>"They are lean and athirst!" he shrieked... "All the evil in the universe was concentrated in their lean, hungry bodies. Or had they bodies? I saw them only for a moment, I cannot be certain."

>>47182077
I dunno, the idea of a kickboxing anthro fighting every two-bit willworker trying to kill Hitler makes me chortle.

>>47182093
With a Belgium accent while doing split kicks

>>47182116
Stop, I can only get so erect!

>>47182143
As a huge JCVDfan I kind of want to make a Time Mage that wants to stop time fuckery from other supernatural intervention.

>>47182061
Dog Cover will still degrade if you're not spending the requisite amount of time with Little Timmy.

>>47182028
>Hounds of Tindalos
Ugh. One of the dumber Lovecraft angles, but time hunting Werewolves DOES sound pretty cool.

How would they get back (to the future), though?

>>47182349
>One of the dumber Lovecraft angles
Hue.

>How would they get back (to the future), though?
Namm-Dar Doc Brown, duh.

>>47182349
>How would they get back (to the future), though?

Fetish DeLoreans, obviously.

(They'd have a 'rubber-band' style effect on their time-riding, so that once the Sacred Hunt ends they'd spring back to what was their original temporal viewpoint again).

As another side-note, I'm rereading chapter 2 of The Pack (which I didn't write any of) as I'm beginning some wind-up prep on a potential new chronicle of Forsaken, and it's got some really, really good stuff in it.

Also I'm probably going to be playing in a short game of Demon: the Descent in a few weeks. I haven't played or read Demon since playtesting, so this should be interesting.

It looks like it's gonna be set in 'nam during the War period, and we're gonna be a ring of Demons using covers as journalists for a news agency that is actually, well, an Agency.

I wonder if I can still make a Big Daddy demon form like during the playtest ruleset...

>>47182364
I actually meant one of the dumber Lovecraft references. But the "angles" part is why they're dumb.

>>47182371
Figured it might be something like that.
Sounds like they'd be one of those groups that's fun to play but it's a group thing that could quickly derail a chronicle. What would keep the Hounds from fucking up Time while they're hunting their prey? Gifts/Rites for mitigating the Butterfly Effect? Or just having to be very careful about what they step on?

>>47182433
Tell us about the Big Daddy.
You should make Metal Gear REX as your Demon. It's almost in-theme for 'Nam.

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This game kind of bothers me with the fast and loose way of doing Egyptian mythology (and that they totally rewrote the whole "chopped into pieces and couldn't find his dick, so made a dildo and fucked a corpse with a dildo dick to get pregnant" thing to be that she brought him back to life, fucked him, then he was chopped up and scattered about, but man, I kinda got Mummy vibes, even though this game is nothing like how Mummy plays, and nothing like how a bunch of Hunters would deal with Mummies.

I guess what I'm saying is that I want to shoot mummies.

>>47182524
>What would keep the Hounds from fucking up Time while they're hunting their prey?

Dunno yet, I'd have to think about that if it came to writing them up as more than a one or two sentence reference (which is what they currently are in The Pack).

>>47182524
>Tell us about the Big Daddy.

I seem to recall that you could put together a demon form with a rivet gun, really big and armoured, and possibly with a drill arm too.

>>47182569
Lara, Nathan Drake and Indiana Jones are all part of the Aegis Kai Doru yeah?

>>47180218
Atlantis is not real.
Once there was a time when it was real.
Then it had never been.
There is no Atlantis.
There has never been an Atlantis.
Atlantis is not real.

>>47180515
>I've always wanted to make a old priest character, the archetype just always seemed so cool to me.

A character in my Mage campaign has an Old Priest for a mentor.
Oh, and another tries to lead him down the path to damnation (read, join the Paternoster). This one is younger though.

>>47182857
Goodness me the Seers are getting lazy.

>>47182891
They don't have to be anything else.
They won when the Exarchs retroactively erased Atlantis.

Anyhow, Atlantis-denial isn't Seer propaganda.

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>>47182871
>>47180515
>>47180497
What about an Old Timey Priest?

>>47182623
Too much archaeologist, too little "hate mages and werewolves". The latter is an important part of AKD.
But.
Those you mentioned are great examples of Sleeper pawns of Mysterium and the Paternoster.

>>47182947
Actually... There is another Mage in the Concilium (or is it Consilium? I can never remember) who uses a Shadow Name of a witch-hunter priest.
He does it semi-ironically, as he is part of an infernalist (as in, using akathartoi) Cabal. But his job is to keep the rest of the Cabal in line.

>>47182923
If they erased it, how do we know about it?
Checkmate, Slave to the Throne.

>>47182923
So what if they did, I just want more Prelacies, namely the ones for the Stygian Exarchs (Pychopomp and Chancellor) and possible the ones for the Arcadian (Ruin and Prophet) and Primal (Raptor and Nemesis) Exarchs while we're at it.

>>47182968
I have no idea!
...
...
I honestly don't. Does it say how they know about it in the Time Before appendix?

>>47182986
Fuck those guys. I want #11.
Crown of the Void sounds like a thing to me.

>>47183004
Add Seer Status to effective Gnosis when handling Paradox, perhaps?

>>47182988
Allegedly the Abyss did a piss poor job of erasing it from existence.
You could see it in the shards of time, before they dissolved.
But other, more indirect, less obviously magical, and less useful evidences almost certainly still exist.

>>47182957
>too little "hate mages and werewolves"
I dont know wasnt the bad guy from the newer Lara croft game attempting to summon a bunch of Demons and an old Japanese Witch Queen?
And Nathan fights his way through a bunch of magic bullshit in all the games.
Indiana Jones just really hates Nazis/Loyalists of Thule.

>>47182967
But does he distract his opponents by repeating bible verses during gunfights?

>>47183013
What about Sword of the Void?

>>47183049
The Crown is the only one that varies between the ministries.
Sword of the Void just means that they can add up to a +2 Yantra by drawing on the Gate, symbolically.

>>47183064
Well i was not aware that was how it worked, I guess Throne would make the area subject to horrible abyssal things, right? Nemesis Continuum brain fuckery for everyone! Yay!

>>47183122
It has four levels:
• Chosen Vessel
You get a Condition you can milk for Beats, and every now and then get missions from your Exarch
•• Sword
Exarch themes as a Yantra, half merit dots strength
••• Crown
Attainment based on the Exarch
•••• Temple
Create a Supernal Verge keyed to the Exarch.

Temple of the Void would probably include the Place Between, the secret passages and meeting places of the Secret Order

To bring in things like the Nemesis Continuum, you need to control your Paradox, which the Sword of the Void would help with.

It's relatively easy to create new Prelacies in 2e, you just need to create an Attainment, and then go.

Raptor could, for instance, enhance blood sacrifice.

>>47182957
What do Lara Croft, Nathan Drake, and Indiana Jones have to do with Paternoster?

>>47183185
The Paternoster are the primary lorekeepers of the Seers, and thus it'd make sense that they'd have cults of archaeologists out there.

>>47183202
But Nathan just wants to make money and Indiana is all about "Muh Museum"
I am not exactly sure what Laras gimmick is.

>>47183171
I wonder what Prelates of Greed would have going for them then, Greed being Chancellors whole shebang.

>>47183241
Museum Money?

>>47183171
God, one day I'll get to play/run a game about a Pylon of the Gate working to secretly undermine both the Pentacle and the Seers to further the Gate's inscrutable goals. That or a general Scelesti-focused game where the Cabal has to choose between allying with an Annunaki trying to Prince of 1000 Leaves itself into our reality, or the Gate trying to stop it.

My personal CofD canon has the Gate, appropriately paradoxically, actually being arguably the most... relate-able of the Exarchs. She doesn't care about control as much as she cares about preserving the Tellurian at any cost, and will work with anyone and against anyone, even the other Exarchs, to achieve that goal.

>>47183757
>Gate: What's going on guys?
>Unity: Gate this is an intervention, you need to stop breaking peoples minds.
>Gate: What're you talking about? *Discombobulates an Ochema.*
>Unity: Gate!
>Gate: What:
>UnityL GAAAATE! *gets discombobulated*

>>47183844
>A sitcom about the Exarchs.

I'd watch it.

>>47181450
Prometheans in other or mixed-splat chronicles.

Should everyone take a Beat whenever they bully the promethean?

>>47183944
>5 and a half Realms
I'd watch it.

>>47183241
>Laras gimmick
Thrillseeking, then she was Fox Mulder, then she was a nerd in circumstances.

Would the abilities of other supernaturals and spells cast on them stack? For example a vampire has accelerate cast on him and uses celarity. Would the vampire multiple the celarity speed, add the two multiplayers together, or just use the better if the two?

>>47184366
I'd say they stack.

>>47184425
>>47184366
I'd go for transient stacking myself.

What are some good things to do in combat with the fifth level obtenebration power?
it's the one you turn into shadows and can't be hit physically, but I can't hit back so I need suggestions

>>47182968
>how do we know about it?
>implying you know shit about it
Primary source of Atlantean lore is the ruins. The only requirement for a ruin to be considered Atlantean is for it to be produced with magic modern mages can't do and that it calls itself Atlantean. QED Atlantean ruins are all forgeries made by bored Archmasters and Ochematas which is why you don't find ruins that talk about shit like the Vox Draconis in places where the Silver Ladder doesn't have access.

World is Real.
There are bunch of mad people claiming its a Lie.
They use nontraditional sex and narcotics to twist and destroy reality itself.
You need to kill them all and go back to work before your boss finds out you dont really sick and just pretending.

>>47186622
Just an average day for Division Six.

How strong a Yantra is using your own soul stone?
It's +2 to +3 for someone else's, but what about your own?

What would work with the Sword of Greed (Second level of the Chancellor Prelacies) to generate Yantra? The Crown probably has something to do with buying people to work for you. and Temple creates a Matter-keyed Verge, not sure how to make that work with the Chancellor though.

>>47184110
>>47183944
MY FRIENDS!...And Chancellor..

>>47186964
May use the Resources value of an object as a Yantra. The object is destroyed in the process.

>>47187306
I like it. I think one thing that should be stated about Crown of Greed, it isn't mind control, you're just buying people out with gold plated, diamond studded, junk.

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So I hit up the White Wolf wiki and got to wondering:

Are there any China based Hunter groups and organizations? I know many groups can be responded, but is there anything that aims to be a bit more precise?

>>47186964
>>47187454
I read a fan Prelacy for the Chancellor whose Crown initiation let them use their Resources dots as Status dots in Sleeper organizations., or maybe Matter dots if that's too OP. That's very thematic.

>>47187549
If TFV exists then it stands to reason there's a branch of the PLA devoteed to studying, exploiting or exterminating the supernatural. Especially in a country as rich in history and myth as China.

>>47187549
There are no published groups in either oWoD or nWoD Hunter with a distinctly Chinese focus. You'll have to homebrew.

>>47187622
That sounds good to me, what did they come up with for the Temple of Greed?

>>47187670
IIRC it was that magical tools were more effective, and High Speech by non-Seers less effective. The material being more important than the spiritual, etc.

>>47180497
I've actually got a hunter exactly like that serving as a vaguely antagonistic force towards my hunter group, he's poised to join a Knight of Saint Adrien in her quest to capture their "sorta boss".

>>47187754
Gureito.

I Imagine Prophet would grant Yantras for Symbolic points in Time as his Sword, his Crown Probably does something to let you impress your will upon the timeline and the masses, and his Temple has some affect on Awakened using Time magic near it.

>>47178715
Shooting teams are all over the world. There's probably one near you.

>>47187549
Glorious People's Republic doesn't have a supernatural menace.

>>47183202
The Paternoster are also all about religion.
>>47183241
>>47183512
>>47184163
Lara's gimmick in the originals is that she's a rich Brit who likes robbing graves. In Temple of Osiris, Carter even makes a few digs like "that's going to the British Museum, right Lara?" since the Lara Croft Diablo-like games are a spin-off of the originals instead of the reboot.

>>47188895
All beings living in the People's Republic are natural, 'super' implies they are somehow above any other citizen. They are not. They share the same responsibilities of all other citizens, are subject to the same laws and restrictions, and are required to do their part for the common effort regardless of their biological and spiritual situations.

>tfw you want to read DaveB's actual plays but the sheer size of them is scaring you off

Which one is best to start with? Are there summaries anywhere?

>>47189057
>The Paternoster are also all about religion.

Yes. But are all the Guardian cults about keeping magic hidden?
Are all the Silver Ladder cults about global domination? (Ok, I concede this one, but they are subtle about it.)

>>47189703
The Silver Ladder isn't about global domination, and Guardian Cults are pretty much all about keeping magic hidden from anyone who isn't worthy enough to complete the Labyrinth, yes.

>>47189614
Read "Bleak House" first. It's a one-shot he ran, that'll introduce you to his style without the time commitment.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?316806-Actual-Play-Mage-The-Awakening-Bleak-House

>>47189614
>summaries
That'd be missing the point, man. Dave does a great job establishing the dynamic of Mage society. And his descriptions of Astral travel are pretty sweet. The full threads are well worth a read. I went through Broken Diamond and Soul Cage in preparation for my group's new Mage game, and I would've gotten through The Man Comes Around by now too if I didn't have finals to focus on.

>>47177558
Part of the issue with this, as someone who tried really hard to make Changing Breeds work, is that there isn't a lot of design space for it. Generally, you want your other shifters to be on par with werewolves as a player option, and werewolves (particularly as of 2e) have a rather wide spectrum of things to do. You're generally better off fiddling with the exact stat spread of the different forms and then giving them access to werewolf gifts as per normal, and then calling it a day, rather than trying to wholesale create a bunch of stuff.

And definitely, definitely don't remove their ability to get into Shadow the way CB does. So much potential just snipped right off because reasons.

The Pack pdf when

>>47190580
When you buy it senpai.

>>47190580
Wednesday, at the absolute earliest.

Do writers deserve a living wage? If so, wouldn't it be more practical to just go back to the 90s model and have staff writers rather than a rotating cast of freelancers?

>>47190873

Practical? Maybe.

Possible? Not really.

The industry's bigger, but it's fragmented in a million different directions; there's no titans anymore, just a collective swarm. There's not enough money going towards any one company to support a living wage for writers.

>>47190938
Doesn't WoTC have staff artists AND writers for both D&D and MTG?

>>47190976
WotC is also not just 2 dudes who license the rights from an IP holder.

>>47191018

They're also doing a lot less in-house writing these days, given how they launched DM's Guild and have a slower release schedule for their own 5e material.

>>47191018
True, the sad thing is that WW Publishing will probably have an old school system with staff writers working on the new VtM because it's backed with Paradox bankroll. They're also funding Dracula's ridiculous sexual escapades. Meanwhile, OPP is the only actual publishing company in the mix running a guerilla operation off crowd funding, freelancing and open development.

>>47190873

We should put them all in a room with no windows and make them work all day fuck them fuck them up

>>47191083

Sounds like Dracula is living the dream

>>47191142
As long as there's internet access and food I'd be down for writing all day in a room with no windows.

>>47191153
He played Paradox into thinking he's the voice of the WoD community in Europe, he'll ride that gravy train till Paradox offloads the IP to the next company.

>>47190580
Tomorrow, Wednesday the 11th of May at 2:00 PM EST

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>>47191180

I want to be Dracula's friend and have LARP adventures

>>47191223
Be a Central European female in your mid-30s and you're in.

Anyone notice how the Orders are all basically corrupted as fuck by the Seer Ministries?

Adamantium Arow - Praetorian Ministry
Guardians fo Veil - Panopticon + Paternoster (with their messianic figure)
Mysterium - Mammon, putting a price on everything
Silver Ladder - Hegemonic Ministry

>>47180760

does this actually make it into the game in any practical sense or is this just another totally empty statement like 1e's "power has a price" nonsense?

>>47191239
The most astute part is that the Guardians of the Veil have been corrupted by Paternoster, very interesting.

>>47191239
>Both factions in a near eternal conflict are organised relatively sensibly
Who would have thought.

>>47191239
>Mysterium - Mammon, putting a price on everything

The ones who put the price on knowledge is the Free Council.
Mysterium are a mystery-religion worshipping magic.

So it's
AdArrow = Praetorian
GotV = Panopticon
Myst = Paternoster
Ladder = Hegemony
Freaks = Pantechnicon

Are there likely to be any serious changes between hunter 1e and 2e? The only changes listed in mortal remains were all pretty small, and i doubt any of the core systems are likely to see an overhaul.

>>47191304
>The ones who put the price on knowledge is the Free Council.
ioncorrect, read the mysterium book, every secret they have has its price

>>47191304

Panopticon and the Guardians share methods, not motivation.

>>47191244
well you're incentivised to pursue your Obsessions, which usually leads to putting yourself in danger. the 'terrible cost to everyone around you' part is up to the Storyteller.

>>47191374
More diversity. No I'm not kidding.

>>47187654
Didn't OWOD have that Chinese Hunter group that used magic kung-fu to fight monsters?

>>47191374
I expect slightly more in-depth changes to endowments and tactics, but the core of Hunter is just core WoD, so not a lot to change there, no.

>>47191374
>an exploration of what makes a Hunter different from a mortal
>making the Tiers make sense and maybe decoupling Endowments from Conspiracies
>more elegant Tactics system
>revised and new groups, ideally with an international focus and advice for building your own
>a fuckton of Dread Powers

Hunter 2e could easily be a huge book, especially if all the Conspiracies are reprinted.

>>47191239
Ironically, it's actually the other way around.
>Which is the other part of the setting changes – Seers and Diamond mages sometimes claim that their cold war goes all the way “back to Atlantis,” that they’ve always been enemies.
>They’re lying. The first Seers were factions in what would eventually be the Diamond.
The Orders spawned the Seers in the first place.

>>47191239
That's some pretty broad connections. They're not really even accurate. They're similar in organization, not corrupted by them.

>>47191554
Oh boo hoo.

What's your favorite Compact?

So if a Mage wants to counterspell a Sin-Eaters manifestation would they need Death or an arcanum relevent to the Key? Such as Force for the elemental keys, or Mind for Passion and phantasm.

>>47191789
The compact of killing namefags

>>47191083

>WW Publishing will probably have an old school system with staff writers working on the new VtM

I doubt it. Dracula likes to bring up that there's not a lot of money in tabletop RPGs, and that ideally the new edition of VtM would be developed so that it could be used as a de-facto video game bible. What will probably happen is that whoever gets to develop the flagship VtM game will also work on the tabletop game as a side project, as part of the video game's budget. I would not be surprised if the new edition and the video game had almost exactly the same basic mechanics.

>>47191789
I like Network Zero. I'm legitimately curious as to why haven't they leaked all of their data out to the public yet. Are they waiting for something or what?

>>47191803
Death could counterspell the power at its very source, Ghostly essence/plasm.
If it's Mind-affecting or Matter-affecting, the others could feasibly counterspell it in the "effect" state.

>>47191823

I assume a big reason is that you can't really Panama Paper the supernatural out of the shadow. There's also some likely supernatural infiltration and having to make sure all the proof is rock solid. Having a mostly decentralized organization probably puts a damper in a no holds barred release as well.

>>47191838
I'm not so sure about that. Death wouldn't counter a vampire using dominant. Even if the power came from something dead.

But on the other hand Dave has said all you need is spirit 2 to counter a werewolf's Gifts.

Hmm.

>>47191823

Either they get laughed off as crackpots or they spark massive rioting and panic. There's no clean, positive end result to the Netzos going public.

I imagine they probably send a lot of info to other groups, much like the Loyalists of Thule.

>>47191823
They probably have leaked some, however as has been repeatedly stated in various books, the public doesn't want to know.

Call it Quiescence, call it simple fear, but Joe Q. Public doesn't want to and thus doesn't recognise, seek out, or comprehend supernatral monsters, or if he does, he pushes them out of his mind and soon forgets them.

Network Zero are outliers.
They're trying to educate people about something they despreately want to stay ignorant about.

>>47191919
Vampire powers aren't powered by Death.
Sin Eater powers come from their fusion with a Geist, which is a Ghost.

What I think would be interesting is whether Fate could counterspell Contracts, seeing as they're all manifestations of the effects of the Wyrd.

>>47191789
Loyalists of Thule, though that's mostly because they reminded me of the BPRD for some reason. The members who choose to carry haunted guns as part of their repentance always stuck in my mind as especially flavorful, too, even though I can only think of a few stories you could do with them.

>>47191952
Someone Else's Problem

>>47191942
>>47191902
They do. That's what all those conspiracy theories are in the WoD world.

>>47191823
Network Zero hasn't gone public for two reasons.

Firstly, to break the Masquerade, they need really good, solid, unquestionable evidence. A lot of the stuff they have can be handwaved by the skeptics as fakes, CGI, or just too vague to be anything.

Remember that video of an alleged chupacabra that was written off as being a coyote with mange? Well, take that attitude up a few notches and you've got the basic attitude in the World of Darkness.

Plus, let's be honest, between the usual shoddy evidence, the real-world phenomena of viral imaging, CGI, stunts, etc, it's *hard* to come up with something that'll convince a person.

The other big factor is the Secret Keepers, a faction of Network 0 conspiracy theorists who think that supernaturals are already running everything, so they need something even more mega-huge if they're going to pull off a reveal.

Plus, what atamajakki said about how they provoke either laughter or riots.

So, I'm trying to decide on an initial Mystery to give my Mage players, if none of them pick obsessions/none of them have one that works to focus the group around.

Anybody have any suggestions/ideas?
So far I'm thinking either a cursed object thing, or a monster of some sort.

>>47192016
>Someone Else's Problem
Very much so.

I just really hope Habibti Ma make it into the new corebook.

Kind-hearted mortals trying to save NPCs from your cult/herd/pack/labyrinth/agency really hammers home that you aren't a good person.

>>47192049
Gulmoth. Weak one.

>>47192049
Create the City around something that will naturally generate Mysteries. Verges opening up? Someone gets lost, or maybe something comes out. Astral bleeding through? Possessed by Morpheans.

>>47192082
Thank you for re-affirming what I was already vaguely considering.

>>47192049
>something terrible was bound beneath the city a century ago by a dead cabal and it's waking gack up
>mortals are lapsing into fugue states where they act out their past lives, speaking in ancient tongues
>pick another CofD line and give Mages a reason to look into them, like a Werewolf Lodge hunting mages in the name of a shattered piece of Fox

>>47192078
Please explain what Habibti Ma is.

>>47192120

A group added in Mortal Remains. Their whole schtick is kidnapping people out of dangerous cults and deprogramming them, whether those cults are radical fundamentalist terror cells or dedicated to a vampire/mummy/mage/etc.

>>47192114
I'd advise him to smart off small intead.
Past lives, ancient monsters and shattered fragments of ancient semi-supernal Gods are not advisable for a new group still attempting to get accustomed to a new setting and play style.

File: 1459471330765.png (3KB, 184x172px) Image search: [Google]

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Did Mage 2ed leak yet?

>>47192209
Yeah, ages ago.
Look in the pastebin in the OP.

>>47192209
>Did Mage 2ed leak yet?
yes

>>47192209

Nigga it's out.

Did you get banished to the future by Aku or something.

>>47192228
Foooooolish Arrow Warrior.

>>47192220
>http://pastebin.com/PPptBB5u
I was stupid and went into the collective megabin

>>47192228
...My ST won't tell me.

Anywho, thanks guys!

>>47192049
Spirits are spontaneously becoming flesh and blood creatures and are causing Quiescence.

>>47192147
That seems highly dubious and somewhat cultlike itself.

>>47192244
OMG Samurai Jack is an Acanthus!!

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>>47192228

>>47192379
That fits the themes of Hunter pretty well though, no? The abyss also gazes into you, etc, etc.

>>47192422
One of the more annoying things in the World of Darkness is a mortal-ass nigga who thinks he knows shit.

>>47192379

Not really? Most of the group is made up of concerned family and loved ones who really son't want the people they care about to become suicide bombers or vampire chow.

I really like that they're a take on the Vigil that isn't "go shoot the bad guys" and one that highlights the invisible cost the player characters of other gamelines have.

>>47192622
Well... a lot of these organizations they might try to break up serve important purposes that these people would know nothing of.

>>47192622
Have you ever actually looked up what cult deprogramming is? It's just brainwashing- you isolate someone and force them to agree with what you tell them.

>>47179686
Nerds can't identify lats.

David Hill describing his new Beast-focused Hunter groups:

>Compact 1: The Cult
>These guys see Beasts as gods, and gods worthy of only the best tribute. So, they feed Beasts monsters, the way your pet cat leaves you dead birds. It’s certainly well-intentioned, but kinda gross and not very helpful at all. What’s a Beast to do when they wake up surrounded by staked vampires? Well, the Beast tries to stop the people from doing it again. They perceive that as a great epic blessing, they slay the dragon, and they move on to the next biggest dragon since CLEARLY they’re the chosen ones.

>Compact 2: The Minutemen
>This is a well-regulated militia full of very armed, very dangerous people with a single guiding philosophy: Monsters exist, but monsters exist because of terrorist Heroes. So, stop the Heroes, and you stop most of the collateral damage from ever happening. Look at these guys like the wet dreams of every Tom Clancy “realpolitik” guy out there. They’re “doing thankless work” like you might expect in a show like 24.

>Conspiracy: The Dream Warriors
>This group takes its inspiration from Nightmare on Elm Street 3. The fact that we’ve never been able to say this in a Chronicles of Darkness book is a crime that I want to correct. Basically, they’re troubled teens trained to be lucid dreamers. In the dreamscapes, they have super powers that look a little like Changeling Oneiromancy (I will make some subtle references that they’re related). Basically, they’re armed in their choice environment, and take the fight to the Beasts in their own realms.

>>47193571
>Beast
Ew

>>47193571
>Cult
So like Faithful of Shulpae, but slightly less dumb? Then again, Filamena did make the Faithful.
>Minutemen
I don't really see why right wing nutjobs would face the Heroes. It seems like that stereotype would be too up their own asses to think beyond trying to take government land and secede because they're all Free Men of the Land.
>Dream Warriors
I like it, but it's the kind of thing I mentioned before; they'll be useless in the real world and have to only do dream battles.

>>47193623
The only thing that should be said about Beast

>>47193571
>This is a well-regulated militia full of very armed, very dangerous people with a single guiding philosophy: Monsters exist, but monsters exist because of terrorist Heroes.

How would they come to this conclusion though?

>>47194122
>People go around spreading stories about ooky spooky monsters
>People begin to have nightmares about ooky spooky monsters
>Beasts are born

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5NqIsnyTG8
>Beast without the overtly otherkin shit

>>47192082
Define 'weak'
Is Rank 3 too strong?
I suck at coming up with my own monsters, especially when it comes to anti-reality shit like the Abyss, so I'm considering just using the Unwelcome Guest from Intruders.

>>47192351
Daww, baby Pangaeans.

>>47191789
I'm not a huge tier two hunter fan, but I love The Union, and love to hate the Abbey. So now I pose a question. Favorite Conspiracy? I think VSCU are the hands down best.

>>47193571
So... The compacts see Beasts as not the problem? Even hunters think they are okay?

>>47195053
The last one at least seems to want to hunt Beasts

>>47194888

See, I prefer Tier Two to Tier 3; flashy Endowments undercut what I love about Hunter.

VASCU are pretty great though, and I love both the Knights of St. George and the Cainite Heresy for actually feeling like conspiracies. It's odd; I see a lot of hate for the various groups added in Hunter's supplements, yet I prefer almost all of them over the ones in core. HtV had a fantastic 1e run.

>>47195402
See, I love Vanguard. They're endowments are simple and thematic. They aren't as violent as Valkyrie, who rarely go for reason. Vanguard is even known to have supernaturals on their teams. They're more FBI detective, than soldier, and I love them for it.

>>47195517

I adore them because they arrest the monsters. Hunter has so much more to offer than "shoot it until it dies," yet 90% of the groups revolve around that.

>>47195548
They have a fucking ULTRAMAX prison for supernaturals. How cool is that?

>>47195559
ULTRAMAX COOL!!!!!

>>47194277
That looks unrelated to Beast, and for all we know that could be Otherkin.
Also, P!atD is becoming one of my favourite bands with the shit people keep linking here.

>>47195559
>>47195517
>>47195548
Doesn't the VASCU write up state that they usually can't go to trial with most of what they've got, and that they really are just putting people down?

File: intruder-World_of_Darkness_-_The_God-Machine_Chronicle_-_World_of_Darkness_-_The_God-Machine_Chronicle.pdf_-_2016-04-05_18.45.47.png (55KB, 320x280px) Image search: [Google]

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>>47194735
>Intruders
No relation I assume.

>>47195559
Its probably turn into horrible scp-like shithole after some minor malfunction

>>47195946
>As a branch of the FBI, agents must answer to the agency and to American law, meaning normal serial killers are to be brought in alive, if possible, and given a fair trail. There are a few exceptions, usually with serial killers who have acquired dark, inhuman powers that make them next-to-impossible to watch in a normal prison environment, or with flat out supernatural creatures. A special facility exists in secret in Lansing, Michigan to hold those killers with superhuman abilities, and is the only one in the United States billed as an "ultramax" level prison.

>>47195963
That could make a fun game. Some of the smarter monsters, like a Vampire, might offer to help, in exchange for freedom. Do you let a dangerous monster escape to save yourself and some of the staff, or do you try and put it down knowing that even if you succeed, everyone is probably going to die and all the other monsters are going to escape.

>>47195946
No. There are a few situations where it happens but for the most part VASCU is expected to collect evidence to build a legal case & capture the Slashers they encounter. If they're too dangerous or supernatural for trial, ship them off to the Lansing facility.
They're "allowed" to kill baddies they encounter if they really, really are unstoppable killing machines that can't be stopped by any means but those encounters are relatively rare and the agents still get yelled at.

>>47195948
Nah, it's a Mage book about the abyss.

>>47195963
I bet they have a lockdown/killswitch for that exact kinda thing. They would probably view it as the hard but better option to doom the agents and guards in the facility than the latter.

>>47196040
>>47196050
It sounds like they try to bring serial killers to trial, but more often than not Guantanamo them or outright kill the monsters. But I'm pretty sure people already know what I want to do with this plot hook
https://youtu.be/-EuwFw-7ke0

>>47196097
Outright killing the monsters is Valkyrie's schtick.

So People talk about the benefits of having a Thyrsus in your Pack,but would you play as a member of a Thyrsus Dynasty of Wolfbloods?

>>47196097
Vanguard's big thing is that they're FBI. They follow the laws except in the most extreme circumstances. Valkyrie though? Black Budget program that doesn't obey laws, and most of the government(president included) doesn't know about. I honestly love the idea of Vanguard stepping on Valkyrie's shoes. Vampires in charge want one vampire avoided, but Vanguard goes and throws the bastard in ultramax.

So where are the non-Forsaken kind of werewolves.

Those do exist right.

>>47196223
You talking about the Pure or the Bale Hounds son?

>>47195963
Narratively, it's there exactly for all the doors to open and become the corridor in Cabin in the Woods.

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>>47196314

>>47196229
I don't know, aren't those still part of the werewolfsplat. Do bale hounds bite mortals and turn them into more bale hounds.

I mean from knowledge osmosis apparently there are demons and demons and Demons, and Arcadia and Arcadia, and cryptids and cryptids. But are there no unrelated monsters also labeled werewolves with a curse and an infectious bite or something. Not part of capital-w Werewolf, something simpler.

>>47196354
>But are there no unrelated monsters also labeled werewolves with a curse and an infectious bite or something. Not part of capital-w Werewolf, something simpler.
Not really.

>>47196354
>>47196405
Hunter's Werewolves work however you want Werewolves to work.

>>47196223
>>47196354
You mean Werewolves that aren't Uratha? There's Skinchangers, if that's what you mean.

So, Fan Prelacies, lets come up with some names:

>Chancellor=Greed
>Raptor=Predation
>Gate=Void
>Ruin=Predestination (I think this fits with the M/O of Ruin, don't you?)
>Psychopomp=???
>Prophet=???
>Nemesis=???

>>47191420
Mysterium puts metaphorical prices on everything, it's true. Free Council charges money.

>>47191445
That's the same as the rest of them, then.

>>47197214
The Prelacy of Shades sounds like it'd fit the Psychopomp.

Also, Ruin could also have the Prelacy of Despair.

>>47197294
I like you, all we need now are Nemesis and Prophet.

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So would pic related be a Slasher or just a really zealous hunter?

>>47192452
Which is practically all the hunter orgs, yep.

>>47197336
Is there a difference?

>>47195963
Good god. I can just imagine that place after an abyssally tainted serial killer gets brought in, presumed to just be another Slasher, but his thoughts start to crawl out of his head and infect the guards, the other prisoners, and even the facility itself..

>>47196354
Generally speaking, if you want something that turns others into itself with a bite, in WoD you'll have to look at Vampires and Zombies.
Getting bitten and turning into a Werewolf is a relatively new idea anyhow. It used to be curses, but people stopped believing in magic, and thus it became an infection.

>>47197380
Your post makes fairy sad

>>47197372
Cross your heart and hope to die, stick a needle in your eye...

>>47197323
Hmm. Shadow fits even better for Nemesis. Both because of the Shadow Realm, and because he hides the results of their actions from humans... So with that in mind, here is my proposed list:

The Chancellor: Greed (I'm also considering Wealth, since he also rules the Pantechnicon. Another kind of wealth there)
The Psychopomp: Mourning (He claims to control what comes after death)
The Nemesis: Shadow (Double meaning mentioned above)
The Raptor: Predation (Instinct might also fit fine)
The Prophet: Awe (In the traditional sense of course)
The Ruin: Despair (Nothing You Do Will Matter! Yeah, pretty despair-filled)
The Gate: Void (Iä! Iä! Chtulhu f'tagn!)

>>47197477
>>47197477
>>47197477

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