Pathfinder General /pfg/

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>Ask to be a Changeling Witch for Reign of Winter campaign cause Witches n' shit
>GM says no because he only wants core/featured races where it states the RP points
How do I convince him? Changelings aren't even bad as an uncommon race

Ok so I'm getting into the alchemist and call me crazy but are all extracts really standard action regardless of the original spell?

By this I'm really interested in the bottled ally extract since if this we're the case, Infusion would mean me and my tumor can drop two pokemon in the first round and have them act immediately kind of like academae graduate wizards.

>>47172280
Sanger doesn't strike me as a Paladin.

He's a Samurai, but with the Chevalier PrC.

He's most famous for smiting evil, but he's quite capable of smiting anything he goddamn wants.

Resolve is also swanky, Samurai get Katana et al. proficiency, and their levels count as Fighter levels, so he could get Deadly Stroke.

>>47172331
Pointing out that Irrisen is rife with Hags, Changelings get a minus to CON, and the ENTIRE THEME OF THE CAMPAIGN IS WITCHES.

>>47172421
Sword Saint Samurai, even.

>>47172280
How would you stat macroscopic strangelet matter in Pathfinder? Would it be more interesting as a mindless ooze monster or a special material that requires magic to actually be safely used?

>>47172331
I'd tell you to check and see what D20 say the RP is, and to also show him your copy of ARG, but for some reason I can't access D20

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>>47172280
Dis guy.

>>47172331
How's shit going for that Khajit? Did things ever turn around for her? Did she start learning magic? Does she still do that party trick with the pineapple and yo-yo?

>>47172498
>Illidan
>a Paladin

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>>47172280
Pic related; fought for the glory of his secretly Lawful Evil liege.

>>47172502
She's not learning 'magic' quite as much as she's learning to just make supernatural shit happen directly.

Things have been on hiatus for a good number of months since Kaz underestimated the amount of effort that would go into the merch drive, as well as the next update apparently being the biggest in the comic's entire run.

Things have kinda turned around, yeah, sooorta? Things keep knocking her back down, but we're at a point where things will go great, or they'll go terribly.

Anticipation, yo.

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>>47172525
HE HAS SWORDS! THEY CLEAVE EVIL!

Hey, /pfg/, need some help with an NPC backstory element for one of my players.

They are currently playing a paladin in search of an old friend, who is missing and believed to have fallen.

I intend for the friend to show up as an Insinuator antipaladin, having been forced to bargain with dark forces after falling in a misguided attempt to save the world by any means necessary, but I also want the antipaladin to be redeemable so the possibility exists for my player to save their friend.

To this end, I need some non-edgy ways a paladin can fall while remaining at least somewhat sympathetic.

>>47172388
>are they really standard actions regardless of the original spell?
Yes
>bottled ally extract... Infusion... tumor can drop two pokemon and have them act immediately
Yes

Also consider the fact that your progression is delayed and spotty, you'll likely not have augment or improved summoning (without totally wasting a feat on spell focus), planar preservationist feat is MANDATORY after a certain point (probably level... 7-9?), and to get the best effect you'll be blowing through extracts like candy. It's still really good, though.
Preservationist by itself is a ridiculous archetype, holy shit.

>>47172611
>Not having your extracts actually be candy

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>>47172525
>>47172498
to be honest I'd be inclined to actually stat him as a soul hunter slayer dual wielding double-scimitars because fuck the rules, dropping solar wind in exchange for black seraph, and using some veiled moon & thrashing dragon, maaaybe tiny bits of broken blade

not sure how to handle his magic aspects though

"we've been fighting a fucking box for 45 minutes!"

w e j

>>47172585
I MEAN VENGEANCE DEMON HUNTER CLEAVE THE SOULS RIGHT OUT OF EVIL

then they eat said souls, but that just prevents respawns

Kinitecists are amazing
Prove me wrong
>inb4 muh burn costs

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>>47172603
Gave into despair and hopelessness. They never fell to the wrong side, but they lost their way.

Which book puts forth Archetypes?

>ROW campaign on roll20
>Oh this looks...
>15 PB
>summoner b&
>drawback

Good campaign when?

>>47172650
>extracts are candy
>summon spells are animal crackers
Alchemist is battlechef and/or little old grandma.

>>47172688
Kinitecists are fucking incredible, way better than the Kineticist which is fucking terrible.

>>47172660

gestalt.

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>>47172611
>>extracts are always a standard action
So, I was pretty sure this was how they worked too, but then they went and printed an Alchemist-only spell that's a swift action, and only makes sense as a swift action, so who fucking knows anymore

>>47172760
Yeah, but have you seen Kiknightecists? They're basically a strict upgrade over a Kinitecist, and I think it's pretty cool to be able to gish it up as a heavily armored mage without necessarily having to go Magus. Not that there's anything wrong with Magus, but a Kiknightecist can use heavy armor right out of the box, and doesn't have to worry about running out of spells.

>>47172854
Hm, that's curious.

I was gonna say 'Bomb Admixtures have been a thing for a while' but I went and checked, and the OTHER bomb admixtures are standard actions.

Weird.

>>47172585
They cleave FOR evil.

>>47172854
>>47172905
I'm placing my bet on it being written by someone who doesn't understand how alchemists work. It's not unbelievable that could happen and slip through the cracks.

That said, I also don't see a reason not to let it just work as printed.

>>47172280
I had a lot of fun with Andrei.

He was a Shelynite Paladin who was deliberately played as sort of a stereotypical heartthrob - not necessarily the brightest, but sweet natured, a little dangerous, and willing to be the center of attention. He took responsibility for his party, kicked in the doors of evil, and counseled troubled kids to seek adventure and virtue and take pride in themselves.

He was adventuring to teach people self-love and how to make yourself a better person, and part of those lessons was knowing that he wasn't quite there himself, but that it was still his duty to give it his best effort.

>evil campaign
>an alternate timeline where our PC's take Tar-Baphon's place in history
>we're the ancient evil that's awakening at Gallowspire
>just one small problem - we're all level 1 due to our powers waning under the Great Seal

On a scale of "probably" to "HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA" how likely are we to die in our first combat? Why does HE get to keep his levels /and/ his Mythic Ranks?

My friend is complaining about being an underpowered heal-bot as a cleric. How can I make him feel more effective? Are there any good cleric fighter builds? Alternatively, how do I talk him out of multiclassing into fighter and going straight cleric?

>>47172927
A large part of illidans / demon hunters shtick is murdering the shit out of demons. Nobody is quite sure if they're good guys or bad guys cause of the powers they dabble in, but by all accounts the *seem* to be good.

>>47173260
Not everyone who fights evil is a Paladin though.

>>47173230
Because he's not a PC in a campaign that's meant to start in Rusty Dagger Shanktown.

>>47173256
Tell him that the only heal spells he should be using should be in wand form and that he should prepare buff spells to codzilla it out.

I am playing a LE Asmodean Cleric, and am in fact using the Asmodean Advocate archetype.

>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo---cleric-archetypes/asmodean-advocate-cleric-archetype

Two CG party members of mine has been attempting to screw me over constantly. Going through my character's belongs, stealing from my character, spying on my characters, and generally attempting to undermine everything I accomplish. I have no done anything negative towards either of them, and have indeed only acted pragmatically in front of time. All of my more evil dealings occur when I leave the party while in town to go send letters & attempt to make contact with the local branch of the Asmodean cult (which has become difficult, I need to cast invisibility before I leave the party so they can not follow me).

Thoughts? What should I do?

>>47173505
>Stealing from your character
Set the situation up so that the LG/LN member of the group catches the CG characters in flagranti.

>>47173562
The party member's alignments are the following:
>CG sorcerer
>CG hunter
>TN warlord
>CN oracle
>LE cleric (me)

>>47173647
>entire team is Chaos

Run.

>>47173647
You should still bring it up to the GM. Players stealing from other players for no IC reason is a huge red flag.

>>47173681
Me and the warlord seem like the only sane ones. I am working with them because of a mission from the church, my character having been told by a higher level cleric of asmodeus that I need follow up on a possible demon outbreak (the campaign is following someone who is turning mortals into psuedo-demons).

I'm there for that, the CG ones are there because they need to kill some demons, the warlord is there to try and find an estranged son, and the oracle is there because he believes his curse was inflicted on him by the same guy who is making the demons.

Also the sorcerer didn't actually invest in social skills besides intimidate, and thus I am the party face using Profession (Barrister).

>>47173733
Also I am confused, I want to take Evangelist, but it seems I can't as a cleric of asmodeus. This seems odd to me, is there a reason for it?

>http://archivesofnethys.com/PrestigeClassesDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Evangelist

>>47173785
What? Yes you can, all those listed classes are just the "usual class entries" by each deity, they are by no means required. You'll notice, for instance, that absolutely none of them have Cleric as a suggestion, despite the fact that it would work well. All you need is to be properly aligned, have the Deific Obedience feat, and have one of +5 BAB, 5 ranks in a skill, or 3rd-level casting.

>>47173733
>>47173505
You are lawful evil. Tell them if you even so much as suspect them being near your things or going through your stuff that you'll kill them.

You don't make threats - you make promises.

But yeah, it sounds like your group is fucking retarded "LOL SO RANDUMB" people who cant understand that even chaotic characters don't shit where they eat unless they're int/wis 3. as >>47173681 >>47173698 say.

>>47173872
>You don't make threats - you make promises.
I do not think I could kill both of them, and they seem to be wishing to an excuse to kill me first. I may have to be preemptive.

>>47173899
Which ones have been going through your stuff and what are your domains?

>>47173951
I am an Asmodean Advocate so I only have trickery.

The two CG ones, the Sorcerer and the Hunter.

>>47173899
I wouldn't take an offensive effort against them. Defend yourself from them, but let them live unhindered because they are your allies in this cause (that doesn't mean you can't voice displeasure at their actions, of course, but just call them out on being dicks instead of making threats). You don't have to hurt them to be evil. Look after yourself, and tell them they're being dumb shits and if they keep being dumb shits it'll some day get them in trouble.

>>47173698
I'd also point out that they're not acting very good if they're doing shit like that. They sound like the kind of players that put good on the character sheet because they want to be perceived favorably and want to think of themselves as heroes, but who can't be assed to actually act good when it's inconvenient or annoying or not-fun.

>>47173981
What level are you/they?

>>47173872
Plant incriminating shenanigans. Wait for them to steal it. Tell the fuzz.
If they take it as an excuse to try to kill you, get the fuzz to help you.
If they continue, use your asmodean connections to drop whatever hellknight order most disapproves of this shit to drop in on their asses.
Lawful means having friends. Evil means having friends that don't ask questions.

>>47173991
We are all level 7.

>>47173982
>You don't have to hurt them to be evil. Look after yourself, and tell them they're being dumb shits and if they keep being dumb shits it'll some day get them in trouble.
I have considered booby trapping my belongings, contact poison on several things so that the next time someone roots through my bags they get poisoned.

I have craft alchemy so I can make the poisons myself.

>>47174043
>Lawful means having friends. Evil means having friends that don't ask questions.
I'm stealing this quote

>>47174043
I am far from any hell knight order, but I have been able to make contact with several local branches of the Asmodeus cult. In the town we are currently in the cult has 19 members, and I am the highest level among them. I'm far from Asmodeus's influence.

I may use the local law enforcement.

>>47174059
You're a 7th level cleric of Asmodeus. There's no reason for such mundane vulgarity.
Glyph of Warding and Bestow Curse aught to learn 'em good.

>>47174162
I mean do I really want to curse my party members? Or poison them for that matter.

>>47174124
Asmodeus has nothing to do with it. They're committing a crime against you by the local laws if they steal shit from you. All you have to do is forge shit that looks threatening (Which you can do) and get the fuzz in on it (which you can do) and suddenly it comes down to who has more ranks in Profession (Barrister) OH LOOK AT THAT.

>>47174201
Again I am unsure if I want my party members arrested. Losing the two of them may compromise my mission from the church because at the very least they are effective in combat. I need the hunter to have a tracker who can actually follow demons. The sorcerer would not be a great loss, but I believe killing him would cause hostilities with the hunter.

>>47174186
No. But it's entirely within your rights and (arguably) in character for a Lawful Evil cleric to ensure his possessions are protected.

>>47174186
See how eager the Sorcerer is to fuck with you or your stuff when he takes a -6 to his Cha. If it comes to combat because of it, he's severely gimped.

>>47174221
Then you use your barrister ranks to let them out under your supervision. You are, after all, a cleric of a lawful deity. DM probably won't put them in lockup for theft, in fact you should probably conspire beforehand with him. Either way, they'll end up owing you.

How important is intellect to an Aegis? I have 35 point buy here and could take a 14 in int and have some cha left over or I could go for a 16 int.

Yeah, charisma is usually a dump stat, but i am playing a noble so i need it for noble things

I understand it's GM specific, so here's a fun question;

How does construct armor work in your setting? Is it only humanoid? Can you make a nonhuman looking armor and put your mans in it? Can you make an animal companion in a humanoid suit built for it? Can I have a fluffy white dog in a big plate armor if it has the right proficiency? But no seriously, it seems that, by right of non-detail, if you use a construct limb- or construct armor- with features that you don't have naturally, that you can use them without an extra hiccup of learning it or proficiency; beyond those needed to use armor or shields effectively. It's a fun question to consider if you enjoy in-setting shenanigans of wizards with too much time on their hands.

>>47174303
14 is plenty for an Aegis. You only need it for PPs and reconfigure, and even then they're not critical.

Need my players to walk in on a scene of two Clerics trying to impress a third into converting.

I've already got this for inspiration: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxyOTFQFWQ0

But does anyone have any other good examples?

>>47174305
On a different but related note...
>Play an awakened corgi synthesist summoner
>Take Humanoid base form
>Assuming I can 'cast' as a dog without a feat, because otherwise that would be asinine
>Do I need to take a feat to cast as a humanoid?

>>47174305
I had a dragon who wore armor made out of a mithral golem.

Motivations for bad guys who may have redeeming features or beneficial traits/methods?

>Wizard seeks to turn random people into demons/devils, which are immortal and don't need food and drink. They retain their personalities but are easily corrupted to bring down the established authorities. Do the players attempt to stop the wizard, knowing that the created halfbreeds are far superior to their predecessors and, as the wizard argues, the next step in evolution?

>Alchemist researches means to make humans immune to harm and immortal/permanent freedom of movement. This means the government cannot intimidate people into following the law and anarchy develops, which may be good or bad depending on the participants. Do the players embark on a quest to restore order, knowing that doing so will rob people of their future centuries of life?

>>47174059
Well you're at 7th level, so the slayer doesn't have iterative attacks. That works to your favor.

Sadly the trickery domain isn't as good for what you might want to do as law, evil, slavery or ambush would be.

Bestow curse on the sorcerers casting stat, should drop him out of a fight. Greater infernal healing , planar ally (lesser) calling a bearded devil & channel negative energy should let you beat the slayer in a short fight.

Be warned that planar ally does take 10 minutes to cast *and* it's expensive in terms of gold. They'll also probably be reluctant to fight because they can permanently die - though preparing a second infernal healing (if you're wis 18-19) *can* help with that (40hp at 4hp/rd for 10 rounds).

>>47174555
Hunter* sorry

>>47174475
The demons/devils do not retrain their personalities.

>>47174475

Would be better if he were turning them into Axiomites or Archons or something.

With demons or whatever, there isn't much of a moral quandary. Shit just ain't gonna end well, and it doesn't take a 20 int wizard to tell you that.

>>47174665
>inb4 Church of Mahathallah copypasta

What's the best way to make calling thunder from the sky not suck?
Weather domain from spheres of power?

>>47174555
>>47173647
It is important to note that at 7th level the cleric actually has a spell advantage over the sorcerer and hunter, having access to 4th level spells while they're still only working on 3rd level.

You've also got some nasty shit like hold person.

>>47174852
Well, first of all, I think what you actually mean is calling lightning from the sky. Of course, that will probably come paired with thunder.

Second of all, ask your DM if he could throw an intelligent weapon your way that can (or can eventually) cast a spell like Call Lightning some number of times per day. Intelligent weapons get their own actions to cast spells with, so you'd be able to do it without impacting your action economy. At the same time, it's only 3d6 per round on one target, so it shouldn't be too powerful especially at mid or high levels. Won't have to worry about the balance much.

>>47174852
Thundercaller Bard

SoP weather lightening isn't always reliable last I read it

Alright, let's say I'm a neutral Druid.

"A druid who ceases to revere nature, changes to a prohibited alignment, or teaches the Druidic language to a nondruid loses all spells and druid abilities (including her animal companion, but not including weapon, armor, and shield proficiencies). She cannot thereafter gain levels as a druid until she atones (see the atonement spell description)."

I can into Lichdom?

Say I can cast simulacrum.

How do I make the ultimate butler?

Hey /pfg/ why are the majority of people that play this game so fucking retarded? And refuse any suggestions to the contrary?

>>47172854
>havocker
Holy shit this looks like fun, I might actually play this.

>>47175013
With two talents, you can direct a bolt 1/round. You still need a severity 4 storm to cause lightning, so some set up time is required.

Can you stack multiple 'pulse' powers, like Concussive Onslaught?

Seems normal to, but there might be something I missed in the rules saying no?

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>>47175043
No. Undead are an abomination against nature. They are a perversion from the most natural cycle of all: life and death.

The green and growing bloom in the spring, grow strong in the summer, wither in fall, and die in winter. A child is born, grows, then ages and dies.

It is a cycle that has existed since the very beginnings of life. The old must give way to the new. Even Elves and Dragons, in time, grow old and perish.

Negative Energy, the force which powers the undead, is anathema to life - and what the Necromancer kills, he then removes from the cycle by raising that too as the undead.

To seek Lichdom is to blaspheme against Nature.

>>47175043
worm that walks maybe. Or some sort of immortal superpredator.

IDK, I'd let you go primal zerg on it

>>47174977
I was kinda hoping for the big long cast time with big long payoff. But pathfinder really doesn't do that well, nearly every spell has a standard, full round or 1round casting time. The concept of a 3 round casting time but appropriately more powerful spell apparently never occurred to them, which is a shame.
>>47175191
That sounds alright.

>>47172280
Very first campaign for the entire group. First time GM-ing for the GM.

Our paladin/face-of-the-group had decided that we take SOME magical fruits that a desert city had that protected their city from wild beasts.

Somehow this was translated to our relatively small battalion of troops taking all of the magical fruits from the entire city.

We came back to a post-apocalyptic desert town with no survivors only days later.

Tark did nothing wrong.

>>47175043
A Siabrae is a classic example of precisely how >>47175268
is wrong.
The tools you use in the defense of nature can be ANY. But generally its expected druids will go into Siabraedom, not Lichdom. Either way you'd be a Neutral Evil character most likely, not a Neutral one.

>>47175043
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/moss-lich-cr-2

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/worm-that-walks-cr-2

>>47175420
Did you even read the fluff on Saibrae? They're druidic defenders that were corrupted by the demon shit they were fighting against, not merely evil druids.

>>47175268
And thus, Negative energy is indeed a part of nature. The winter to life's summer, the death that gives way to new life. The cycle never stops - even immortals can die and give way to anew.

To argue that is to argue that gods, spirits, and souls are in violation against nature. Cayden Cailen is as much as an abomination against nature as a Lich, using that very argument.

>>47175285
Had a mental image of a druid using a tree as his/to store his phylactery, corrupting the woods around him in the process and justifying it with giving birth to a new, competitive kind of life. Seemed pretty dank to me.

>>47175501
You might want moss lich then. You could even refluff it to a fungal lich if you want.

It's cheaper than traditional lichdom and should something ever get your phylactery, you can just choose to make a new 'seed' of one.

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>>47175501
>Cayden Cailen is as much as an abomination against nature as a Lich, using that very argument.
Are you implying he isn't an abomination?

Random question/request for the thread.
I have to make a character for a new campaign I'm going to join, it's implied that it needs to be a least a little broken in order to be effective/not die. DM has a pretty thorough understanding of rules, so kinda want to avoid being TOO munchkiny...
Anyways, for plot reasons cannot be a summoner, kineticist, sorcerer, magus, or oracle.

Anybody have any thoughts? I'm kinda drawing a blank here...

>>47175642
Forgot to mention, character is starting at level 12. Rest of the party leans towards neutral/good.

>>47175580
Yes, but for entirely different reasons than those you suggested. :^)

>>47175559
Looks pretty cool for all intents. Makes one mean wildshaper.

>>47172280
> implying Paladin can be a lolicon
> implying Paladin would ride humiliate his best friend as ride him as a horse
> implying Paladin wouldn't bet on so-so odd.

>>47175642
You're level 12 so as a wizard, you've almost got level 8 spells.

Once you do, demiplane clone factory so you'll never really die.

Get creative with contingency as well.

>>47175179
It is weaker than a standard witch. But go for it if you want to make friend with laser.

>>47175467
No, they are druids who willingly chose to take the corruption into themselves to preserve nature. They have started a crusade against all life yes, but they don't lose druidic class features. Its a similar thing to Blight Druid, where one can revere nature's fallen state or its rot and decay.

>>47175642
Also, greater invisibility>limp lash. Broken, broken, broken spell.

>>47176047
> enemy can just spend move acrion to end the spell
> broken

Am I missing something?

>>47172331
Sounds like he's already made up his mind, you should play a core/featured race or find another game.

>>47176047
I seem to be missing the part where this is broken...

>>47172603
If redemption/atonement is on the table he should just be a fallen paladin. Being an anti-paladin heavily implies he is beyond atonement.

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>>47175103
Pathfinder Society

They cannot turn anyone away, so there are no consequences for being an asshat.

>>47173256
As a cleric he'll need a way for his buffs to last all day to be effective in combat. He could spend a turn or two buffing himself but at that point he's probably even less effective then the healbot. Especially if the GM is throwing out counter-spells/dispels/debuffs and etc.

Honestly a 2 level fighter dip wouldn't be the end of the world for him, take that magical knack trait and enjoy some combat feats like combat reflexes with a martial reach weapon or something.

>>47173313
Is right, a wand of CLW is a boon to everyone and remember he can touch up to six friends before using it. (Full Round Action). Imo he should leave a slot open for every spell level he has so he can take an hour to prepare anything situational like lesser restoration. Prepare Domain spells and standard buffs, he can always channel or spontaneously cast cure spells so he should never be preparing them.

>>47175997
>>Those druids who stubbornly (or faithfully) refused to flee their sacred lands managed something that few others did—they prevented the wholesale invasion and corruption of their land from demonic influence, but only at a terrible cost. They took the corruption into themselves, and today, these druids exist as blighted, undead parodies of their former selves.
>>crusade against all life
>>[the siabraes believe] the druidic faith was meant to die

Yeah ok bub. Druids who revere destructive aspects of nature such as natural disasters are completely different than druidic hellspawn demonkin

>>47173505
You should expect that when you play the exact opposite alignment of two of your own party members...sounds like poor planning and management on your GM's part.

>>47176354
>he'll need a way for his buffs to last all day to be effective in combat

What spells/feats fulfill that requirement?

>>47176111

This, desu, especially if nobody's keeping track of encumberance. You'd essentially have to keep the target unable to move for several rounds, which should mean it's fucked anyway.

Though if you could find a way to get past insane SR, a maximized limp lash would take out most chromatic wyrm dragons in one hit, since they usually have 6 dex dont tell any 1 u leveled that up

Of course, they can still cast spells with a somatic component, notably including dimension door. maybe if you could use silence or something, but that also allows spell resistance.

>>47174475
The first example is god awful, literally classic elitism.

The second is a little less awful but basically the same thing.

If you want a redeemable "villain" try one who's just opposed to the party. Like a Bounty Hunter who's after a political prisoner protected by the party who may or may not have been framed for murdering someone important.

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>>47174336
Return of the Jedi, or the Blue Harvest spoof.

The clerics don't have to use plasma or brilliant energy swords.

So I'm reading through Reign of Winter, and I'm kind of enjoying the first book. It's nothing amazing, in fact it's actually pretty terribly written and paced as far as adventures go. But it's got a cool basic underlying premise, I guess (though I absolutely want to change it from "Use teleporting house to timetravel because lolreasons".

What I want to know is; Why is 90% of the first book dedicated to nothing but bland combat? There's no characters, no roleplay, no setting. It's just "Walk into frozen zone, then have 15 encounters before you get to the center".

What would you guys replace like, all of this stupid combat with if you had to chop it all out and condense the adventure into 8 sessions?

>>47176383
What does his alignment have to do with it unless his party members are metgaming fucks (which it sounds like they are)? He'S done nothing untoward them or the party, and they're just fucking with him.

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So now that the dust has settled, what aspects of Dark Souls 3 have you shamelessly stolen and incorporated into your campaign?

>>47176412
I could tell you in 3.5, but in PF alot of spells/tricks/exploits have been rightfully neutered. Stuff like midnight sticks, persistent spell, and divine power are removed or altered in PF but I'm sure they have their equivalents somewhere.

Still, Clerics have a lot of way to be useful in combat. What makes them a T1 is that they can do so much more than just "I power attack with my weapon!".

Basic shit like Compel Hostility, Sanctuary, Hold Person, Obscuring Mist, or whatever makes it more than possible for a Cleric to contribute in and out of combat.

>>47176656

Nothing wrong with a little inner party conflict if you have the right group but this is something that clearly wasn't handled beforehand as evident by the anon's complaints.

Assuming alignment matters at all they should be in each others way. But how it's being handled is clearly haphazard and the fact the player seeks to deal with his own teammates just screams poor GMing to me.

>>47176658
Atmosphere.

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So, this might be a stupid question, but I'm having a little trouble trying to figure out how to explain what Arcanists "are" in a in universe fluff sense.

Best I've be able to muddle together for a homebrew setting is that they're people that had the innate talent to be Sorcerers but then started to get the arcane schooling of a Wizard and found that their innate powers let them sort of "cheat" and do things that Wizardry isn't "supposed" to do (arcane exploits)

Has Pazio made much fluff about what they are and how they work in Golarion?

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>>47176921
There's some background information in Advanced Class Origins.

According to the wiki:

>http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Arcanist
>Rather than focus on the innate abilities of their bloodlines or the research and study of the arcane magic, arcanists use their unique insight into the workings of magic to apply both approaches at once. Their distinct views on magic, extensive knowledge, and tremendous potential often leads them down reckless paths in pursuit of greater powers.

>>47177005
ah cool, that's kind of a more eloquently worded version of what I was thinking, thanks

Help me understand how permanent bonuses work for headbands.

If I wear a headband of Vast intelligence for 24 hours so that it becomes a permanent increase, and then take it off, do I still keep the intelligence bonus?

IF so, does that mean that I can pass the headband around the party over the course of a week and so we all recieve the bonus permanently?

The wiki isn't clear.

What were the biggest changes from the playtest of PoW:E and the final release? I heard that Harbinger was getting heavily reworked and that some traditions were getting damage dice nerfs.

>>47177282
It is permanent in the sense it applies towards your bonus spells per day, to your skill ranks, and other such things.

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>>47172280
Sir Evendur Tallis of Waterdeep, Aasimar Paladin of Mystra, member of the Knights of the Mystic Fire.

I created him as an NPC for a Pathfinder game set in the Forgotten Realms.

Even the paranoid rogue liked him, and she didn't like the other NPCs. He had traveled to the Inner Sea to investigate a shadow weave temple that the PCs uncovered. His troubadours hadn't caught up with him yet, and he wasn't the type to brag about his accomplishments, so the party didn't think much of him at first. As he followed them along, the PCs warmed up to him.

Unfortunately, the rogue tripped his death flag by being too busy to listen to his troubadours when they caught up with him. If she had listened, and brought him along, the paladin wouldn't have gotten into a fight with her boss. This caused him to be at less than full health while fighting an Erinyes of Tiamat that was helping a crime syndicate that was fighting the PCs.

The campaign ended before I could have him brought back to stalk the PCs as part of the Mystran Inquisition. I think the PCs still would have liked him, even as we was hurling spellfire at them.

What are the best classes to go into Umbral Blade from, /pfg/?

>>47177405

Harbinger doesn't get int to everything. Just half int to attack, and later on full int to damage. They also got rid of the "attack at range" ability at level 13 with the ability to not provoke AoOs from claimed enemies.

There were also a bunch of changes to various maneuvers, too much to list here. Just buy the book, it's probably worth the money.

>>47177282
It's not permanent increase. It's just not a temporary bonus.

Temporary bonus and normal bonus are 2 different thing. For example, temporary bonus on dex will only affect you AC and reflex save, and nothing else, even when you are a swashbuckler with dex-to-hit and dex-to-damage.

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>>47177554
Stalker, Harbinger, or Mystic, since they get Veiled Moon normally.

>>47177443
Dude. It's bot permanent. Nothing in the item even state "permanent". Only "treat this as temporary bous for the first 24 hr".

Temporary bonus is a term for specific type of bonus.

>>47177651
Sure, if something isn't temporary then it is permanent. It's a binary description.

>>47177675
Not in this game.

>>47177675
No, Temporary exist. Permanent does not.
Temporary means it doesn't give you bonus spells, etc.
After that it becomes a regular enhancement bonus which while always active is not "permanent". Just a normal enhancement bonus which does give bonus spells, etc

>>47177675
I think it's just a semantic arguement.

What the guy was asking for is actually called "inherit bonus".

Permanent bonus in Pathfinder is use to call anything that last more than one day.

>>47176301
My first PFS game I ever played the GM turned someone away after 15 minutes. My second PFS group plays in an 18+ only venue. There are two times I've regretted playing PFS:

First was at a convention when one of the GM's kids shows up at the table, and even then we were asked in advance. I just wish I could text message myself from the future and tell myself to say I'm uncomfortable with children at the table because I curse too much or something. Because my god he was the worst kind of player.

The second time was when the GM was being stubborn about not knowing the rules and screaming "table variation! TABLE VARIATION!" over shit that made my character unplayable ("You can't quickdraw thrown weapons more than once per round!")

>>47177822
No, an inherent bonus is something else entirely. You get it only from wishes, rebirthing chambers and maybe one or two other things.

How the Hell does a Gun Tank reload with a heavy or tower shield? Is there an Errata somewhere saying they can, like, use their teeth on a pistol, or pull a Terminator 2 and reload a blunderbuss with a flip-cock?

Why didn't they think about this?

>>47177939
Which what the guy was asking for. He want the bonus that will be apply to his character forever.

>>47178012
Adding to that, how the fuck do you make tower shields not suck?

>>47178052

Get rid of the attack penalty, reduce the ACP to something reasonable (-4?), allow it to bash with a higher damage die than heavy shield bashes, and you're pretty much set.

Guys, another magic question. Does the +4 AC from mage armor stack with other armor bonuses? If I have, say, Silken Ceremonial Armor +3 and cast it, is my Armor Bonus 4 or 8?

Because I'm looking at AC rules, and my DM is saying that even though I have Dueling Mastery and Scarlet Einhander stance, when I cast the Shield Spell while wielding a Dueling Sword, I only get +4 to AC, and not +8, because those are all shield bonuses and only the greatest one counts.

>>47178090
No. It's a bonus of the same type, so your armor bonus is +4.

>>47178090

All typed AC bonuses do not stack except for dodge.

>>47178107
Well fuck. There goes my entire build, and it only took until I was level 6 to realize it.

Fuck me sideways.

So a lot of people here have said that if you have an untyped bonus from attribute X and a typed bonus (let's say insight) also from attribute X, they would stack.

But wouldn't stack if they were both untyped. Does anyone have a source for this ruling? May be very important for me.

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>>47178132
Can you give us the concept of your character and information about the campaign.

We might be able to help you rebuild it.

>>47178152
You're half right; there's a stupid, obscure FAQ somewhere that prohibits you from ever adding the same attribute to a modifier twice, no matter the type of bonus.

For example, an OD Warder gets Wis instead of Dex to Initiative, and an Inquisitor gets Wis+Dex to Initiative, but a Warder/Inquisitor does not get Wis+Wis to Initiative.

>>47178084
Well, you can't bash with a tower shield, and you got anything specific?

>>47178195
But what if they say, got a dodge/insight bonus equal to their wisdom?

That's what I mean as a typed bonus.

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>>47172280
Dunno if favorite, but my current PC happens to be my first Paladin.

The family got sick from an undead plague. She survived. The father died. The mother remained sickly. She fell for the village doctor, but he just saw her as another patient. Idolizing turned to desire and eventually obsession, his steadfastness to his research becoming the source of her envy. She eventually started hurting herself for his attention, the masochism drawing the attention of Zon-Kuthon. Tempted by the deity to start slaying his patients, becoming something of an axe murderer. She'd eventually crack when she killed her own mother, chopping the doctor to bits with the intention of raising him as the same kind of undead that caused the plague in the first place...before being stopped by a Paladin of Shelyn.

The artful treatment of her painted axes and repentant nature of her foolish youth caught the attention of the church. After several years doing what she could to help the church hunt down the source of the undead menace she'd atone for her sins, swear an oath of justice and honor and become a paladin of Shelyn, albeit one haunted by the call of the deities brother...

>>47178220
That works

Source:
>http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9sgk

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>>47172280
Favourite pally is my current one.

Grew up in a shit-stain CE tribe. Quarter orc (illegitimate son of a human slave and a travelling half-orc), got relentlessly beaten for it, started stealing and fighting to live.

The tribe worshipped a demon, a fairly minor one. Can't remember the name now, fire demon in the Lords of Chaos book. He was drafted to the blood war and wanted to send slaves in his stead.

Sent my character (and a slew of others). Game was pretty high powered, so they were subjected to abyssal enhancement methods, slapped with mind control amulets to keep them in check, and sent at the devil front lines.

Eventually Ragathiel's strike team forcibly plane-shifted him off world (both to save him and take from the demons). They showed him a life worth living and a cause worth fighting for. So he lives to pay back Lord Ragathiel for sticking his neck out to save a mixed-blood former-demon worshipper and helping him to be redeemed.

And now he's full of vengeance and Righteous Indignation.

>>47178272
>pic
>sword
>"Druids are OK I guess"

I shouldn't have laughed, but I did.

>>47178180
Right now I'm Warlord1/Sorcerer5 (Infernal Bloodline), planning to prestige into Bladecaster

Just finished book one of Iron Gods. My character is, long story short, a mix of Count Dooku, Prince Zuko, and MCU Loki. Son of a minor Numerian warlord. basically, his Teen Goth Rebellion phase actually netted him power... and banishment.

Basically, I wanted to be the most untouchable motherfucker. I wield a Dueling Sword, and took Weapon Finesse, Quick Draw, Exotic Proficiency, and Weapon Focus (Antihero Feat, Human Bonus Feat, Level 1 Feat, and Warlord Bonus Feat), and then Dueling Mastery at level 3. I focused on Scarlet Throne School, and My level one spells are Mage Armor, Shield, Magic Weapon, and others, and I have a set of Silken Ceremonial and a MWK Buckler.

Str- 8
Dex- 14
Con- 14
Int- 13
Wis- 11
Cha- 18

In other words, my bonuses when all spells are active were (I thought)
>Dex instead of Str for Attack Rolls with Dueling Sword
>+1 to Attack and Damage Rolls with Dueling Sword
>+4 Shield Bonus from Shield Spell
>+2 Shield Bonus from Dueling Mastery
>+2 Shield Bonus from Scarlet Einhander
>+1 Shield Bonus from MWK Buckler
>+1 Dodge Bonus
>+4 Armor Bonus from Mage Armor
>+1 Armor Bonus from Silken Ceremonial Armor
>+1 Deflection from Ring of Protection

For a total AC of 28.

You can see how I was excited.

If my DM lets me, I'll rebuild to focus more on blasting.

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>>47178336
Your AC is now 10 + 4 armor + 4 shield + 1 deflection + 1 dodge = 20 at best.

Were you here a month or two ago trying to make a Count Dooku build?

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>>47178407
Yeah. I thought I was really onto something even if I couldn't use the sword to deflect arrows.

Also wouldn't it be

10 + 4 Armor + 4 Shield + 2 Dex + 1 Dodge + 1 Deflection for 22?

I've lost the link to that one guys web site project that was putting up all the tier 3/4 stuff in one place, anyone got it?

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>>47178515
>http://pathminder.github.io/

>>47178469
Yes, I forgot about the Dex bonus.

What level were you trying to pick up Bladecaster? You still need Combat Casting and Improved Counterspell.

>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/prestige-classes/bladecaster

>>47178556
>>http://pathminder.github.io/
Exactly, thank you!

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>>47178556
Level 11. I was going to pick up the last two perks at levels 7 and 9.

I'd be Warlord 2/Sorcerer 8/Bladecaster 10.

Currently looking and I think I can salvage the build by dropping most of the buff spells in favor of blasts and necromancy (Because I might as well get some Battle Droids now)

I'll switch weapon to rapier, and lose EWP and Dueling Mastery in favor of the two feats needed for Bladecaster.

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>>47178622
You should go into the prestige class early. You can use Stance of Arcane Steel and Martial Caster to raise your AC. Since you're getting maneuvers and spells, you can ready more counters and learn spells that grant concealment to make you harder to hit.

Did you exchange any disciplines?

Are you using PoW:E?

>>47175247
CAN you stack onslaughts?
Like, keep on casting it, hits once on turn one, twice on turn 2, thrice on turn 3 and so on?

Kinda like when spamming blizzard in diablo 3 or whatever

>>47178052
Allow anyone to take Mythic Tower Shield Proficiency, even (especially) non-Mythic characters.

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>>47178812
If I go into the prestige class early, then It'll be a while before I can catch up in terms of spellcasting potential, is my main concern.

Since only have the one level in Warlord now, I only have 6 maneuvers, 4 from Scarlet Throne ans 2 from golden lion, and Scarlet Einhander stance, which I'm going to keep for now, since I'll be a level 10 initiator at level 12 (I have the Practiced Initiator Feat from POW: E, so that'll be 2 ILs from Warlord, 2 from Practiced Initiator, 4 from sorcerer, and 2 from Bladecaster)

>>47159659
>>47159669
>Seamless Skin
>Paizo genuinely made a magic skinsuit

Jesus christ that's the most blatant magical realm item I've seen since Lamashtu's mask. There are entire threads of material on /d/ about these things.

>>47178336
You are a Sorcerer. Cast Mirror Image and Displacement.

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>>47178999
You're not losing that much spellcasting. You don't advance in spellcasting at that 1st level, but you can cast spells in armor.

Here's my recommendation for feat and class seelction:
Warlord 1 - Weapon Finesse, Deadly Agility, Quick Draw
Sor1 - whatever
Sor2 - Combat Casting
Sor3 - whatever
Sor4 - Improved Counterspell, learn Blur
Warlord 2 - Your IL = 4, so get that level 2 maneuver and stance

Take your first level of Bladecaster at level 7, and get some better (mithral) armor. For the next few levels, your spellcasting will catch up. Learn Displacement and whatever the guides say. You also get access to Riven Hourglass and Elemental Flux. Use the Distorted Clock stance to increase the duration of Displacement and use Elemental Flux maneuvers for elemental blasting. Air becomes your active element for Force Lightning shenanigans.

What happens when you get Freedom of Movement while Swallowed Whole?

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Good day, /pfg/

This is my 11th iteration of the fucking Fighter's fix I am working on.
http://pastebin.com/RNUjW7ST

I call it the Fighter's Focus.
Tell me what you think.

>>47179687
>11th iteration

Dude, let it go. Fighters will always be shit.
Your fix is nice though, I'll give it that.

>>47179642
They can't grapple you in the first place?

>>47179687
>In addition to the bonus feat gained every even levels, a fighter may also gain a Fighter's Focus with a level equal to or less than their levels in fighter.

Do they spend a bonus feat on that or is it FREE and on top of the bonus feat?
E.g. do you just get the fighter focus ability if you decide to go that way or both a feat and the fighter focus ability?

>>47179748
Both. They get a bonus feat AND a free focus every even levels.

>>47179738
Yeah, but what would happen if the effect started after you were swallowed?

>>47179034
That whole book is blatantly magic realm.

>>47179687
>In addition to the bonus feat gained every even levels, a fighter may also gain a Fighter's Focus with a level equal to or less than their levels in fighter. Unless with the DM's prerogative, they may not take several Fighter's Focus with the same level requisites.
Doesn't that last line mean that unless you ask the GM, you can't take any Fighter's Focuses after 10th level?

>>47179831
Yep. It actually more about asking the DM's permission if he'll allow your fighter to grab several fighter's focus which grants an animal companion, a familiar, and a cohort. Or grabbing several focus to make your fighter add his levels to all skills.

>>47179852
Shouldn't there be more granularity or options that go all the way up to 20th level then, or are you just assuming that all Fighters will have multiclassed out by the time that 10th level comes around?

Does anyone have the scan from Inner Sea Intrigue that included the new Shadow Illusion spell?

>>47179873
Frankly, I can't make options past 10th level with a consistent level of utility and power.

>>47176921
Sorcerers who have just enough work ethic to actually study magic but not enough so they figure out "exploits" to make up for the fact that they dont want to put in the hours like a wizard and have slowed progression.

So, what are the best item mastery, weapon mastery, and armor mastery feats?

Any opinions on it?

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Do kineticists suffer ASF?

>>47180308
Nope, not arcane casters.

Restarting my weekly campaign tomorrow.

I will be retiring my current LG Human Constable because the party is basically made entirely of murderhobos, and he was a strictly by-the-books cop who believed in the system and bringing criminals to trial.

Things got a bit nasty between players as a result.

So I'm bringing in a CN Gnome Lunar Oracle, specialized in shapeshifting and animal companion, based off of Lini, though I honestly know nothing about Lini or gnomes in general.

How should I be playing such a character?

>>47179769
guaranteed escape via mouth/oriface of swallowing

>>47180308
>>47180369
And even if your GM is retard and say they are arcane caster. Spell-like ablity doesn't have somatic component.

> Want to play Havoker Sorcerer
> has to finish the character sheet by tonight
> GM won't allow it because "it book hasn't come out yet"

>>47180759
What level are you starting at?
I have a much better suggestion for you.

>>47180767
level 6.

The GM won't allow character traits though (not even via additional traits feat). So I can't go with Admixture Wizard multiclass.

>>47180781
Level 6, eh?
What's your DM's attitude towards 3pp like DSP/Psionics?

>>47180786
3pp not allow (because he's too lazy to read through all of them).

>>47180858
Your DM sounds like a dick, desu.

>>47180865
僕もそう思いよww

>>47180865
Or someone that does not Path of War that everyone and their mother will dip in because fuck all the other classes.

>>47180952
No, it was already said he's just lazy.

Speaking of Bloodline Mutate Havok Sorcerer.
Which of these is a better option?

Pure Orc?
Orc/Psychic ?
Orc/Draconic?

Do Crossblooed even work with Bloodline Mutation?

>>47180865
ADOLT WURLD

>>47181516
According to this faqs.. http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fz#v5748eaic9rai

Crossed Blood alter Bloodline Power. So no.

Is there any way to deliver spells with a bow and arrow?
I've always liked the idea of magic archers.

>>47181838
Eldritch Archer archetype for the Magus.

>>47181838

The eldritch archer magus and the arcane archer PrC get to do that. The arrowsong minstrel bard can do something similar.

>>47176716
Divine metamagic used to be great but my DM in our 3.5 game banned it. Divine power got nerfed too.

All I can really think of are metamagic rods of extend. Also alchemists are great because of infusions.

>>47176716
I also was asking how to get long-term buffs because I'm the guy spamming threads about paladin/oracle gestalt and most of the stuff affecting cleric spellcasting will apply to oracles as well.

Is there still that rule from 3.5 that if you are supposed to double your damage from two separate sources, you instead triple it once? What if it's a crit where you don't double everything?

If so, where? In some obscure FAQ somewhere?

>>47174059
Sadly you need Craft:Poison to mske poison. Not craft alchemy. The DC to vraft is equal ro the poison's save. My level 13 alchemist ran into this issue in the last campaign. Apparently they are (unnecessarily), separate skills.

>>47181794
But Bloodline Mutations are not an archetype :^)

>>47182183
> and a bloodrager or sorcerer cannot swap a bloodline power that she has altered or replaced with an archetype for bloodline mutation

Crossblooded altered bloodline power. So it doesn't matter if Mutation is an archetype or not. Your power aren't qualify for mutation anymore.

>>47182146

I believe this is incorrect. http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/glossary.html#afflictions specifically says you use alchemy to craft poison.

>>47182146
Nigga yes you can, fuck there's a feat that allows you to make even more poison than one normally could with craft alchemy. Stop trying to compartmentalize skills even more so than they are.

>>47182146
Your gm was an idiot who didn't want you to play your class correctly

>>47180308

Those hips look funny.

>>47179796

If Ultimate Intrigue is a look into Paizo's magical realm, I want more!

For real though, I figure Paizo thought Intrigue is often paired with seduction and sex, so they just ran with it... Along with more than a few of their fetishes.

>>47183296
Inner Sea Intrigue, not Ultimate Intrigue.
Ultimate Intrigue is the one with a kissing Mesmerist archetype, Inner Sea Intrigue is the one with the touch of infinite orgasms.
Totally different levels of lewdity.

>>47182146
That looks like a houserule made up by your DM to shaft alchemists even harder than Paizo, matey.

>>47183402
>Inner Sea Intrigue is the one with the touch of infinite orgasms.
So they made a Toki archetype?

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>>47183488
They made a whole PrC for that.

So for Polymorph Any Object, do half-breeds or "descendants" count as the "same-class" of creature? IE: sorcerer walks up to a dragon, casts PAO to turn the dragon into a human half-dragon, or a wizard turns a succubus into a tiefling of the appropriate type. Same kingdom (animal), same/lesser intelligence, but same class gets iffy because of creature typings. I doubt I will ever play a character of a high enough level to pull this shit, but I want to know anyway.

Dragons not being immune to enchantments is an amazing thing, by the way.

>>47183554
The correct answer is DM fiat.

>>47183498
Well now I know what I'm doing for my next character: Wandering Heart Beguiler into Enchanting Courtesan who worships Lymnieris.

>>47183779
Enchanting Courtesan is Wis-based. The PrC primarily caters to clerics. Preferably with the charm (or lust) domain and the conversion inquisiton (for wis to all social stats) instead of a second domain.

Are there any ways to make a wis-based harbinger or a int-based privateer? Trying to make something akin to the fighting style hunters use in bloodborne. I've got gestalt as an option, which helps greatly, but finding the right combinations has proven difficult.

>>47183498
Holy shit what. Caster PrC get an infinite use attack that's Save and Still Suck on top of spellcasting progression?

/pfg/, you guys like kitsune, right?

>>47184072

#BTFO

>>47184122
...Did you just copy/paste your GitP BBCode to 4ch? Son, delete your post before the merciless mocking pixies smell blood in the air.

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>>47184122
Is /pfg/ still anti-Spheres of Power?

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>>47184122
Destruction Sphere Handbook was a bloated that only tangentially fixed some of the issues with Destruction Sphere.
And this is coming from someone who actually bothers to spend money on nearly all your products.

Also, hyperlinks don't work on 4chan. I suggest next time you might want to ask Amber for a crash course on how 4chan and /pfg/ in particular works first.

I will look at that playtest however, and see if I can provide feedback. Prepare your anus, because I'm going to go in dry.

>>47184169
We're not antiSoP, just tsundere and slightly disappointed

>>47184169
/pfg/ is positive on the core book, and neutral, leaning positive on Expanded Options. /pfg/ is also incredibly skeptical about all the Handbooks, because the ones released so far have ranged from dreck to stupid broken, and Meyer's insistence that balance shouldn't be a concern doesn't exactly fill us with reassurance.

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>>47184122
>still using the old, outdated 6/9 initiation progression

You done goofed.

>>47184208
Hey, I hate parts of the Core book too. Weather was broken, in the bad way. Conjuration was broken, in the "good" way.

>>47184104
>the furry version kender
>probably bait, but I'm biting anyway

I also assume that anything the "furry community" touches turns to shit, but "the furry kender" is kind of harsh. I can see it though, especially since catfolk tended to wind up with the same bullshit attached.

Trying to play "whimsical asshole" requires that the player not actually be an asshole. News at 11.

Hey everyone, Stack here from the DDS Freelancers. Some of you know that we've been brought on to make Expanded Handbooks for each of the Spheres of Power; for those of you not in the know, it's an alternate magic system that can work alongside or replace a campaign's normal Vancian magic.
Having gotten plenty of feedback on the Destruction Sphere (even after it got released!), I return to humbly present the Alteration Expansion for you guys to rip into and cut your teeth on, for as much feedback as we can pull. Comments directly on the document are the easiest for me to keep track of and reply to in a timely manner, so it'd be greatly appreciated if you could make comments there as well as possibly here in the threads.

The thread on GitP is here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?487580-Spheres-of-Power-Shapeshifter-s-Handbook-Open-Playtest

The Google Doc is here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dUvSqJPOjCoXei1lean_sAjw2NmWonAEm47VQVSKfVo/edit

>>47184208
Telekinesis was bretty gud, and Light is looking nice so far as wel.
Then again both were done by Amber

>>47184253
Enhancement's looking pretty promising, was that Amber?

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>>47184122
>Transformation
>Prerequisites: Con 13
>Benefit: Choose one Alteration sphere talent that grants a form but does not cost a spell point. As a full-round action, you may assume the form of a single creature whose type corresponds to this form talent (see Creature Types and Form Talents in Section 3) as a supernatural ability. The same creature (wolf, spider, treant, etc) is mimicked each time. This transformation lasts until you choose to revert to your original form as a full-round action. This ability does not grant any traits from the Alteration sphere as part of this transformation. Treat your hit dice as your caster level for the purposes of this effect. This is a polymorph effect.
>Special: This feat can only be taken at 1st level. You may gain traits from the blank form option of the shapeshift ability of the Alteration sphere while under the effects of this feat even though it is a polymorph effect.

O-Okay, let's just let people turn into tarrasques at level 1.

>>47184304
Tarrasques of their same base size, with a given speed, single natural attack, no su or sp abilities, etc.

>>47184338
Where is that said? Because just reading the feat it looks like "you turn into the Tarrasque" flat-out.

>>47184281
Nope, that's someone else. Don't think he's ever posted here, but he goes by Amechra on GitP.


Also, hi guys. Sorry I haven't been around for a while, but there's been a loooot of editing and reviewing work to do and its devoured my time.

>>47184338
You should say that.

Same goes for stuff like a pile of natural attacks, because "polymorph effect" is defined.

>In addition to these benefits, you gain any of the natural attacks of the base creature, including proficiency in those attacks. These attacks are based on your base attack bonus, modified by your Strength or Dexterity as appropriate, and use your Strength modifier for determining damage bonuses.

>>47184244
HEY

DID YOU SAY YOU WROTE THE DESTRUCTION BOOK

I HAVE A BEEF TO PICK WITH YOU

THE BLASTER ARMORIST DOESN'T GET SUMMON EQUIPMENT

SO WHAT REPLACES THE SUMMON EQUIPMENT-BASED ARMORIST CAPSTONE?

FUCKING NOTHING

YOU KEEP INFINITE ARSENAL

SO YOU GET A BLASTER TO LEVEL 20

HURRAY, NOW YOUR EQUIPMENT DOESN'T COST A SPELL POINT TO SUMMON

EXCEPT WHOOPS

YOU DON'T FUCKING HAVE ANY

GREAT (LACK OF A) CAPSTONE, GENIUS

>>47184244
>Protean (Shifter Archetype)

Please do not name things the same as things that exist, it gets confusing. We may as well have Angel (Paladin Archetype), or Psychopomp (Wizard Archetype).

>>47184474
Especially when the fluff for both the class and the outsider is literally "chaos incarnate".

>>47184474
>>47184490
Agreed, personally I feel that Maelstrom Shifter or Riotous Form may be a better names

>>47184367
The feat does refer to talents that grant forms. The intent is that you gain unlimited use of a single locked form, with limited ability to add traits with the improved transformation talent.

>>47184610
Thing is, PF defines "polymorph effect" in the core rules, and your feat says nothing to point you at spheres polymorphs.

Its wording is shit. Make it better.

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>>47184122

Let us see now. What can be done with a single magic talent and a single trait with this handbook?

One talent goes into the Alteration sphere, with the Beast Soul, Flesh Warper, and Unmistakable Mark drawbacks. With those drawbacks, the character takes the new Object Transformation talent and, from the core SoP book, the Animal Mind and Ranged Alteration talents.

The character also has the new Favored Curse magic trait, increasing the saving throw DC for the following trick by +1.

The character points at an enemy within Close range and then spends a spell point to apply an Object Transformation (ice). If they fail the Fortitude saving throw, the character can spend another spell point to make the transformation last for a minute per caster level.

Assuming the target fails the Fortitude saving throw, they are now immobile, bereft of limbs and natural attacks, and unable to use verbal or somatic components. They have hardness 0, with their only saving grace being that they take half damage from energy and ranged attacks. They could very well be out of the battle entirely.

If the target fails the Will saving throw against Animal Mind, their Intelligence is also reduced to 2, and they are unable to use "any spells, sphere abilities, supernatural or extraordinary abilities." The only hope for them then is spell-like abilities.

This seems rather brutal for an investment of a single magic talent and a single trait.

>>47177405
Pretty much everything got tweaked. Traditions got changed. Maneuvers all over the place were slightly altered. Flux nerfed some, RH nerfed some. Archetype maneuver progression buffed.

>>47184610
>Object Transformation

Not only is this blatantly a Creation talent, it's ALREADY an ADVANCED Creation talent.

And you have way too much love for these "pick one of a pile of different monsters to imitate".

You're losing sight of the joy of Alteration, which is that it gives you a blank canvas to paint on. You're forcing us into YOUR vision of what we want to be, rather than going "here's a simple base form and a pile of traits, take what you like.

>>47184648
That is indeed a potent combination. The full effect listed does require 3 spell points and two saves. Flat out paralysis would open the target to a CDG and is available from hold person and other effects, for comparison. That said, object transformation should probably be adjusted to mitigate its debuff potential.

>>47184700
He did this with destruction, too, with his "destruction is for BFC" stuff

>>47184244
Dude, seriously, what the hell is with all this transforming shit between living and nonliving material? No. This handbook is banned in my game until you learn what your Sphere does. I realize you're writing to a quota, but this shit is the reason I refunded my Destroyer's handbook. You don't give a shit for the demarkation between spheres.

>>47184700
Not sure I see how giving a previously unavailable option restricts your ability to assemble your own creation from the various trait options present.

>>47184244
>perfect imitation

Way to make Alteration strictly better at disguise than Illusion is.

>>47184753
Because the sphere should be getting MORE of its core, central concept, not shitty 3.5-style "pick a monster and be it"

>>47184737
Turning an object into an animal is not in creation nor enhancement. Nor is turning an animal into an object temporarily. Those seem like alterations to me.

>>47184753
What if I want to be a beholder? Or a Mindflayer? Or a Otyugh? Nope, can't be any of those!

>>47184753
Let's be metaphorical, here.

Here's what you're doing:

TALENT: Beholder Form. Gives eye beams, hovering.

Here's what you SHOULD be doing:

TALENT: Aberration Form.

SUGGESTED TRAITS: Eye Beams, Hovering

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>>47184728

You could also save a spell point by using Aquan Transformation from the core SoP book rather than Object Transformation.

What I am saying is that it seems rather out-of-line for a single talent and a single trait (one could eschew the trait, really, bringing the investment cost down to one talent) to allow a character to lock out most enemies out of a fight with one saving throw.

The second saving throw for Animal Mind is simply insurance against those who need no verbal or somatic components to cast. It is unnecessary against most opponents.

>>47184728
The platypus section is stupid. Platypi have been known to bite people with thier bills, and having some extras due to your base is a complete not problem.

Plus a Platypus can be made with just 3 talents easily. Animal Transformation base, claws from Shapeshit, swim speed from Aquan TF traits, and poison from Vermin TF traits.
The rest is fluff and cosmetics, and a player can always swim or move slower or bte less if he's really trying to disguise as a platypus.

>>47184779
You know, your smarter colleges have feats and special talents that exist with multi-sphere prereqs and the like for combining what are obvious infringements on other people's spheres.

Maybe you should learn a thing or two from them.

>>47184779
Fleshcraft is right there, for all your turning nonliving shit into living shit needs. If it's an advanced talent for Creation to make even a nonliving body out of nonliving materials, and an advanced talent for Enhancement to make a nonliving body into a living one, how the hell is it okay for it to be a basic talent for Alteration to make a living body out of nonliving materials? Who signed off on this?

>>47184728
>Flat out paralysis would open the target to a CDG and is available from hold person and other effects, for comparison.
Also allows a save each round to get out of.

Also is kinda hard to get in SoP.

>tfw wizard with Heavy Armor Proficiency, Lay on Hands, & Sneak Attack
What am I doing with my life?

I have some people joining my game. They have played RPGs before but they haven't played pathfinder. The couple are joining a existing group of 4, which includes a investigator, a dervish dancer bard, a unchained rogue, and a zen archer. Any suggestions for what classes I should suggest they play?

Something easy for new people to play hopefully.

>>47180378
Be a murderhobo

Anyhow, feedback on the document is preferred as it is easier to have a discussion there than in a fast moving thread here. I will not be able to respond here in a timely fashion most of the time so will not be here regularly.

>>47184845
Witch is a pretty simple class to play if you want to go debuffs. Toss a few hexes around and cackle like your life depends on it

>>47184866
>/pfg/
>fast moving thread
lolwut?

>>47184889
Let me translate:

"You guys are way more vicious on my baby than I was prepared for, and I need an excuse not to respond to you."

>>47184866
Son, we are one of the slower threads, on one of the slower boards of 4chan

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>>47184889
Compared to what they're probably used to on the Paizo Forums or WORDSWORDSWORDS in the Playground, /pfg/ and 4chan in-general are blisteringly-fast.

>>47184866
Fuck off nerd.

>>47184889
>>47184901
>>47184908
Ok guys be a bit nice. If you aren't FROM 4chan then this can be a scary and terrifying place. Don't rip him an new asshole that is bigger than his current gaping one.

>>47184845
Sounds like they don't have much frontline. Barbarian and Cavalier are reasonably simple while still having some real strength to them. Cleric's only hard decisions are spell selection.

>>47184930
I started out being a bit nice. But the fact that his response to every criticism is "NO, YOU'RE WRONG!" means I don't give a shit anymore and I just want him to leave faster. We all know he's going to bail soon anyway, I'm just giving him the push.

>>47184394
The armorist is 90% "you don't actually get a new ability, you just remove another small part of the near-total-lockdown on enchantments we put on the big list! But it's costing you a class ability!" anyways.

>>47184968
I JUST WANT TO FIRE A FUCKING MEGAMAN CANNON

HE MADE A CLASS THAT GIVES ME A MEGAMAN CANNON

THEN HE POURED TONS OF RESTRICTIONS ON IT

THE LEAST HE COULD DO IS REALIZE THAT HE NEEDS TO GIVE IT A NEW GODDAMN FUCKING CAPSTONE TO REPLACE THE ONE THAT LITERALLY. DOES. NOTHING.

Quick questions to people who play Spheres of Power. How does it interact with actual magic? Specifically I want to replace all casters with spherecasters, but I also want to allow Alchemists. As there really isn't a spherecasting version of the alchemist would they be too powerful alongside spherecasters? Should I revert to a Words of Power alchemist or write a sphere-using alchemist?

>>47184997
Alchemists are fine as is alongside spherecaster.

>>47184650
Elemental Flux is slightly too good, but because it offers 4 modes for half its stances and strikes. High variation while being no worse than others. However, just a wee bit under that level of versatility should be where all the other disciplines were in terms of utility (they aren't).

Hourglass is actually pretty bad. Most of its moves are pretty shitty, in particular now that the small handful of no-save debuffs it had are now just as short-lived, but now give things a save. Its most powerful abilities generally refer to the extra standard action a turn one gets from the level 8 stance, and while utterly badass, this is at a level where even a psychic warrior is devastating the countryside, let alone the "real casters" and certain spheres as well...

>>47184997
Fun fact, I've done exactly what you're doing. My campaigns are PoW, SoP, and by popular request, Alchemists. They get along fine with Spherecasters, their "spell" list doesn't really allow for the broken shenanigans you're banning out.

So I have a question about Thunderstomp

>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/thunderstomp

It says you CAN use your caster modifier instead of strength, but do you have to? I want to cast this and use my strength.

>>47185031
It says CAN use, not HAVE to use your caster modifier, if you want to use your str, by all means, it's just there for the low str caster.

>>47184753
Because by doing it this way, if you don't cover all the monsters, that screws some people over quite arbitrarily. And you won't, because pagecount and fuck that's a lot of work.

the traits/abilities/etc people want to mix and match are a strong part of the core Alteration, which is what folks jump into the sphere for.

>>47185031
Then use your strength. The "can" is completely unnecessary unless they wanted to give you the option.

>>47185052
>>47185042
Excellent, ranged trip here I come.

>>47185023
Ah good, because that's very similar to what I'd like to run. Glad to hear it plays decently.

I may add a few casting traditions. I don't think there will be enough demand for psionic or occult classes but adding some psionic and occult flavored casting traditions might be interesting.

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>>47184983
I FUCKING KNOW, RIGHT?
IT'S JUST LIKE THE AKASHIC HAND CANNONS. THAT FUCKING PISSED ME OFF TOO.
I HAD TO MAKE A TECH WARSOUL REACTOR KNIGHT BUT IT'S NOT TECHNICALLY AN ARM CANNON, IT'S JUST AN INFINITE AMOUNT OF XASERS I CAN MAKE OR UNMAKE WHENEVER THAT ARE COUNTING AS COLOSSAL. BUT THEY'RE NOT ON MY ARM

WHY ARE WE SCREAMING.

Can someone help me with the alchemist and the extracts thing? Say I have infusion...So it is a potion that is a free action to draw? Can I put it on the ground and then can someone else pick it up?

Can I toss it to the ground over there and someone else can drink it? What kind of actions are these?

You guys care to share some adventuring tips?
Stuff like "A troll's regeneration can be disabled by acid" and "Vampires are repelled by garlic" and "Always carry a bag of flour in case you get attacked by invisible creatures" and "Have a secret passphrase to check for doppelgangers" and "Holy water fucks undead creatures up pretty good" and "Devil-looking creatures will probably be healed if you hit 'em with fire"

>>47185147
Rope is always mandatory, have multiple sets of rope, one thats knotted and attacked to a grappling hook, and another for tying dudes up

>>47185170
Already got a robe of infinite twine famalam

>>47185147
Don't play Pathfinder.

>>47185180
The game I'm playing is as far from PF as it can really be, desu

>>47185147
Adamantium dagger is the best lockpick arround.

Always carry a morningstar at early levels. Blugeoning and piercing help with early game DR.

Don't fight enemies on their turf or in the way they like to fight. IF a troll shows up, buy a horse and a longbow. If a harpy tries to fight you, find where it lives and fight it in a cave.

Consumable items are actually incredibly powerful. People shell out 16k for a +4 headband, yet seem unwilling to shell out 1k for a one combat flight spell. Flight is probably more important than that +1 to your save DCs.


Never underestimate the ability to just deal a whole lot of damage really fast. "being dead" is probably the best status condition to apply.

Grappling is a great way to deal with humanoid casters. Nothing ruins a casters day more than being grappled. Note: Does not apply against a dire t-rex.

"Pre-combat buffing" doesn't actually happen that much in fights where you need it. If you have time to control when/how the fights happens you probably don't need it, and when you need it most is when you can't delay the fight for two rounds to get your buffs up.

While a bit of a maymay, roll protection still exists a bit. Damage dealer, utility arcane caster, utility divine caster, skillmonkey, etc. are bases you want covered in your party if you want to be able to deal with a variety of challenges.

At the end of the day: you are some dudes sitting around a table having fun. "realism", "rules", etc. don't matter shit if people aren't having fun.

>>47185147
Always keep enough power in reserve to end the inevitable betrayal by a partymember before it snowballs into out-of-character arguments. No disintegrations*.

High DR is a problem early on, but can quickly be overwhelmed or bypassed, while energy resistances will grow into blanket multi-elemental immunities.

Always assume what you kill that's "named" has a way of coming back if you just leave it for dead. Take the appropriate measures, and be ready to use 'vision' or equivalents to hunt its phylactery down in case it has one.

KNOW your fucking class and its abilities. Fucking annoying when people don't know what they can do and start acting stupid or taking half an hour to take their turn because they couldn't be bothered to look shit up beforehand. Is this an 'adventuring' tip? not really, but do it anyways.

Devils, Demons, Yugoloths, Abyssals, all of those things with "lower planar" names ARE ASSHOLES THAT WILL TRY TO BETRAY AND EAT YOUR SOUL. Do you like that? No? Then never show them mercy, never make deals with them from anything other than a position of absolute and total control (that is to say, their measly soul is in your hands and your "deal" with them is crafting checks to make unintelligent magic items).

Celestials and other "upper planars" ARE ALSO ASSHOLES. Never assume your "good" is "good enough" for them, never assume they won't decide you need to sacrifice yourself for the greater good.

Freedom of movement will save your life countless times, but it has a very small number of dangerous counters to it like the tetori monk. Stay out of danger to begin with


*This is no way to say that disintegration is not exactly what should be done to traitors immediatley, but rather that as a Fort-Partial guaranteed to be both successfully saved against AND ignored on the partial due to stalwart, disintegrate is a useless pile of shit that will never achieve this goal of eliminating up-to-and-including the enitre rest of the party here and now.

>>47185147
EYES OF SKULL HAS A SECRET
AIM FOR THE EYE OF GHOMA
DODONGO DISLIKES SMOKE
PAY ME FOR DOOR REPAIR CHARGE
LETS PLAY MONEY MAKING GAME
GIVE THIS TO THE OLD WOMAN
MASTER USING IT AND YOU CAN HAVE THIS

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>>47184169

Why is Ahri Best Fox??

>>47185186
who said anything about stacking.
I had to eat those multiclasser feats AND natural blade for this.

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>>47185311
>Implying

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>>47185325

Tamamo is shit! SHIT!

You even posted the *wrong* Tamamo, shame on you!

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>>47185341
>Implying

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>>47185331
Multiclass feats are those feats that compensate or share progression. Some are "your levels in X count as Y for this, and levels in Y count as X for that", like sneak attack and unarmed monk or something.

As for those I took:
>Fighter's Blade: Blade Level +4, up to a maximum of your character level
>Mech Pilot: Gain a mech at level-4, can stack (thus keeps the mech upgraded despite having stopped on reactor). Requires Psicrystal, Technologist, Psi-Core, though. Yes, I put a feat in technologist for this. I deserve that goddamn mech.
>Natural Blade: Trait that gives up to +2 blade levels, up to a maximum of your character level

So a soulknife can get up to 6 levels of not being a soulknife so long as it has at least 3. Of course, it's not getting new bladeskills if it's doing that, but at least your weapon - without which why the fuck would you keep soulknife, right? - stays nice, crispy and on top of things.

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Why do the Spheres writers have such a hangup with /pfg/?

Can they not handle the bants?

>>47185408
It took DSP like fifty years to handle the bants so yeah I guess that's it

>>47185408
say you've spent several nights - maybe even weeks - coming up with this new class or these new abilities, and you think it's awesome.

then you come here, and half a dozen rabid autism-wolves (they're like siberian wolves but mumble and grumble rather than howl) proceed to tear half of it to shreds while asking how you could have been so blind and cranially-impaired to ever believe anything you wrote in the problem sections is any less than complete and utter shit.

Then one or two of them even put up numbers or examples to really drive the point home.

And you thought you'd be told how awesome the artwork is, and maybe at most they'd find a few typos.

Gonna join a campaign soon, party is a spellslinger wizard with 14 int, an aegis that shits out damage and is basically carrying the team, an ironskin/drunken chained monk, and a bard who literally begins performing and spends combat sitting in a corner trying not to get hit. What can I play to at least take some weight off the Aegis' shoulders?

>>47185434
>And you thought you'd be told how awesome the artwork is

Man, we know how great our artwork is. We've got bazooka centaurs, how could it POSSIBLY be bad.

>>47185434
I'd be glad.

Kill your fucking darlings. I'm *still* mad nobody savaged my homebrew, I didn't get any useful data until I brought it to Forrest and some other professional friends.

If people are angry, it's because they're invested in the product. Yeah, as an author, you worked your hardest to make something people would enjoy.

If they're not enjoying it, guess what? You did it wrong. Take a step back, extricate your ego from the process, and go 'okay, how do I fix this'. These people are your audience, they do influence your success. They're not always right, but if they have something to say, you *listen* and you consider whether it might be valid.

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>>47185420
Your hopes deserve derision followed by crushing.
Your hopes regarding mechs and maneuvers as well, of course.

What doesn't really stack is the action economy of a reactor knight: Overdrive uses swifts for the most part, and a few of its actions well, they're actions, so if your standard's used up forget about using strikes.

However, yes, your mech, being *equipment* (basically you fill your armor slot with class features and lose compatibility with some of the big 6) lets you take up stances and all that shit.

Because Exploding God Finger is a thing.

>>47185479
Amber ;.; why don't you come to the chat anymore, we miss you!

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>>47185480

>mfw this is what I've secretly yearned for every time I post my goddamn homebrew setting ideas in the Worldbuilding thread
>mfw instead of tearing into my ideas or giving me the thumbs up for the cool bits, they either give me a stock one or two questions (and never react to my reply) or just ignore it entirely

>>47185408
People can't handle harsh criticism. Took me a while too for whenever I bring homebrew to this hellhole.

>>47185449
What's particularly annoying is that (like WoW Elemental Shaman), very often, the numbers and playtest data get handwaved by the people we are showing this to.

Usually in favor of anecdotes about how they or their friend thought it was fine.

And that's just *begging* for the rest of us to bare our 'tism fangs.


>>47185453
A rubato so at least one monk isn't being a useless coward?

A Tactician, to keep all this shit organized?

A Vitalist, to keep this shit slightly less organized but oh holy fuck dem healz?

A Cryptic, maybe? though again that's really in the 'bard' zone.

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>>47185480
>>47185514
Can I join in on this feel circle?
I've had to post homebrew three times before getting genuine and harsh criticism. its so frustrating when you actually want people to be hard but it never happens

>>47185560
Well, the sharks are already circling, the waters are red. Throw in your chum.

>>47185453
I heartily recommend a Zealot.

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>>47185616
Alrighty then!

My shitty PoW Template: The Seneshcal!

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tDAG5bs1VC_YGkBxR8J8IsfoPuAWOeLPeI1n9z_eeqc/edit?usp=sharing

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>>47185560
Feel time?
>Sign up for a game on roll20
>Work on the character for like 2 weeks with an intricate backstory and motivations, trying the crunch to the fluff as seamlessly as I can
>He's in the Wayward Path and we're starting at level 6 so he's gotta have a big-ass travelogue already, right?
>Spend another week writing the travelogue
>Next couple days do basically nothing but scrounge for character art online as I wait for the GM's response
>GM responds with something like "holy shit this is probably the best character I've ever seen in my 10 years of tabletop RPGs dude! but it won't work for my game sorry"
>Doesn't respond any further
>Character's been collecting dust for over 8 months now

New thread
>>47185775
>>47185775
>>47185775
>>47185775

>>47185697
So, this is basically just "cavaliers and samurais get maneuvers"? Eeh, simple, but functional. Nothing seems wrong with it.

Tell me, though: Do they only get ONE of their path disciplines, or is that just poor formatting? Like.. Does a Tactics guy get, say, Golden Lion, Tempest Gale, AND Iron Tortoise, or Golden Lion and Tempest Gale OR Iron Tortoise.

>>47185817
Only one. So he would get Golden Lion, a choice between Tempest Gale and Iron Tortoise, and a third discipline based on his Order.

>>47185560
>that pic
Carthago delenda est.

>>47184983
Play an avenger vigilante warlock, but fix mystic bolts so that they're [1d6 + 1] x 4 levels. So 4th level vigilante warlock is 2d6 +2, 8th, 3d6+3, 12th 4d6+4, 16th 5d6+5, 20th 6d6+6

Or convert 3.5 warlock and use it while wearing medium armor.

>>47185231
>Consumable items
And according to wealth by level... if you spend 1k on a consumable and use it by your next level you should have gotten the value of that consumable back.

Like 15-20% of your character wealth should be consumables. Because if your DM isn't a fuckup, you *should* be making that money back. It should never be permanently spent.

>>47182218
Recall that you can take them in place of bloodline FEATS too. Not just Powers.

>>47184208
Destruction's actually pretty good.

Focused Blast and Greater Blast can help out with its previously kinda sub-par damage.

>>47184997
Incidentally, there is a Spheres version of the Alchemist, in the Nature book.

It's alright.

They do get a Discovery to be able to pick Extracts back up, albeit limited.