/5eg/ D&D 5E General: Overpowered Mundane Items Edition

>>46547838
Obviously because you're locks are too easy.
Do you even dungeon anon?

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>>46547838
>Overpowered Mundane Items
This is literally the Fighter in my current group.

He has a +1 warhammer but seems to do most of his killing with things found around the kitchen.

>>46547838
Why did you create this thread when there was still one up?

>>46547838
greatsword is imbalanced and its presence in the game is detrimental to the game's quality overall.

>>46547838
Because my dungeons aren't full of "DC15 lockpick rolls or fight 3 mobs" locks.

>>46547882
Not for long. It's auto-saging and on page 8, newfriend.

>>46547838
Crowbars man
Fucking crowbars

Advantage on str to open shit AND on attacks against aberrations? Please and thank you

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made a homebrew Outlaw background


Yah, Nah, or Meh?

>>46547983

>Advantage on str on attacks against aberrations

w-what

>>46547838
>Carrying around what amounts to a 35 lb crowbar.

>>46548006
Sounds like a Half-Life reference gone overboard.

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Your group just bought a spy glass for first time, the character with it climbs to the highest point in town.

Mr. DM, what does he see?

>>46548027
Sheep, mostly.

>>46548001
>outlaw
>when criminal is a thing
For what purpose?

>>46548027
Fog because its fucking Barovia

>>46548027
Fucking on the rooftops with lots of tentacles involved. Oh, and if there is any way to see mind control, he sees that. Yeah.

>>46548027
That weird lady from earlier is looking at them.

There is a spyglass coming out of her shirt.

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>>46548007
>Battlemaster with a portable ram

>>46548027
His life flashing before his eyes because his skill and stat spread are terrible for climbing.

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So how is everyone feeling about their current parties?

Good characters?

Good players?

Good story?

Tell me all the good stuff in your campaigns so I can steal it

>>46548075
Sorry, what does the battlemaster here?

>>46548094
Fun stuff. I just wish I could sneak a dmpc for combat in there. He'd be no help to the players unless specifically asked outside of combat.

>>46548038
isn't a Charlatan a criminal too?

>>46548110
He lobbies his DM for special treatment when using Push Attack using a portable ram on some fucker's face, especially when another party member is assisting.
>charging and knocking enemies 30+ feet backwards

>>46548150
Nah, it's more like a trickster.

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>>46548158
<<

Anybody have an experience with Fantasy Grounds? is it free to play, and the GM just needs to foot the bill for resources?

>>46548176
>>46548150
The difference between Charlatan and Criminal is sort of like the difference between Petit Larceny and Grand Theft.

>>46548001
cause I felt like it and I liked the Bad reputation feature but didn't want to be a pirate.

>>46548185
You should try having fun with your games instead of resorting to
>i swing sword
>i cast lightning bolt
every round.

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I never played an RPG until I DM'd LMoP for a group of people who also never played an RPG.

Now we're starting a new campaign and I've got this weekend to design it after they made characters last week and I don't know where to start help me

>>46548225
you could run a module

if you don't want to, consider who your PCs are, and think about what their motivations might be. From there, you can design a first few sessions.

>>46548214
Fair enough. In my head I was thinking this was something you were trying to spam every combat.

Guys

Am I doing something wrong as a DM if my players don't improvise or think creatively, ever? We started out a few weeks ago, all of us new players. None of them seem to want to think about anything in an other than linear way, for example
>large evil spider on the ledge of the mouth of a cave they're in, with a large drop into the next cavern behind it. 've described the spider as being hideous looking, massive and with heavy armour plating on its top and sides and that after every attack it wobbles somewhat and has to regain its balance - cue 10 minutes of players complaining that they can't hurt it and it's killing them (it had some damage reduction and a reasonably high AC, but they could have beat it normally, just bad rolls.) It's only after I outright state that they could try bullrushing otherwise pushing it off the ledge that they do
>another one - party is faced with a large wet sewer tunnel ahead, slippy, half full of water and with a ledge to the side that they could shuffle along. I know they have shit for balance so I make sure to point out that there are iron eyelets set into the wall at regular intervals with evidence that rope used to be strung between it, thinking they'd do the same. Cue 5 minutes of them trying to get along the ledge normally and cursing me out for making too hard balance checks and not being able to proceed until I explain that they could get the surefooted one to lay a safety rope down.

I have plenty of other examples but text limit

>>46548214
>lightning bolt
>not hypnotic pattern
Smfh tbqfh f@m

>>46548284
You need to threaten their characters with death, and then start describing details in the environment. They'll think of something eventually.

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>>46547838
What's your favorite homebrew /5eg/?

I like a lot of the stuff from Walrock's blog, especially the stronghold rules and paladin of free commerce. I notice other people post his undead races in here every so often.

http://walrock-homebrew.blogspot.com/

Another homebrew blog I enjoy is middle finger of Vecna.

http://www.middlefingerofvecna.com/

Both come up with interesting stuff and they try to balance it unlike half the stuff on DMs Guild. One thing I particularly like it they try to make their stuff look good as opposed to just slapping it in a word document.

>>46548327
Remind them regularly (multiple times per session even) that there's more than one way to skin a cat. If they still don't catch on then they're imbeciles.

>>46548284
You need to make a collage of all the parts of the PHB that describe pushing, shoving, tripping, grappling, aid other, getting advantage through creative thinking and use of the terrain and so on, print it out, and hand it to every player.

Once the players know that you will reward Krog the Barbarian for using a table to beat the shit out of that goblin instead of making another boring greataxe attack, they eagerly begin exploiting the environment.

>>46548327
>>46548284
One other thing: make the threatened death swift and certain. A spider that they have trouble hitting won't inspire improv. But a spider that's sucking out the fighter's brain if they don't find some way to GET IT OFF GET IT OFF JESUS FUCK NOW will.

>>46548284
>Am I doing something wrong as a DM if my players don't improvise or think creatively, ever?

It's possible. It's also possible they're just not the type. You may or may not be able to encourage them to change.

However, the biggest problem I see with your examples is that they consist of trying to get your players to use mechanics in a fight that have never existed (or that they've never used before). In all likelihood, you then never bring those mechanics up again.

What that means is that you're trying to encourage a very narrative style of play, while they're focused on a very mechanical style of play. Bullrushing an enemy to shove it off a cliff isn't RAW, stringing up rope to gain balance isn't RAW.

That being the case, you can't just expect them to adopt the style you're pushing on them. You have to first make sure this is even what they want, and for a good while, you're going to have to explicitly tell them what options are available. Not dropping hints in game, outright stating "you can use an action to charge this and shove it backwards". As a result, rebalance your designs so it takes multiple goes- the spider takes three pushes to fall off, variants of the rope trick comes up multiple times in the same dungeon, etcetc.

If they still don't get it, then that's probably not the way they want to play the game, even if they told you it was.

>>46548339
Frog God Games or EN5IDER. Both are very high quality, but sadly both are paid-only.
Have some megas. Still looking for a few Frog God adventures.

https://mega.nz/#F!i4hH3LwZ!7k-d-dm6vldzzvOofgbSTQ
https://mega.nz/#F!7IoTjBib!Kb-rLv2KYNEq2pNtVd8jMg

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>>46548284
Nah, you're doing fine. Take it from a Forever GM currently running for 4 groups:

You will have shit groups.

You will have great groups.

But most groups? They're just at the table to roll and be spoonfed, no matter how ardently they will deny such accusations. Not every player is a critical thinker, and those who are may not pay attention if there's a lot o fuck-memery at the table.

Try "allowing" players to roll checks to notice indirect solutions. "Hey Battlemaster, your tactical expertise shows you how unstable the spider is. You may be able to topple it over the ledge with enough force!"

Basically make it the equivalent to a videogame character talking to themselves a la "There must be another path..." or "Its left eye is glowing...maybe a weak point?"

>>46548038
criminals aren't necessarily known criminals or wanted

outlaws are

and if WOTC can be a tad redundant with backgrounds, I don't see the harm in a little overlap.

>>46548339
I don't use much homebrew in my game, but I also haven't been playing for that long.

>oath of judaism
pretty fucking dumb desu senpai

>dragon warlock
It seems alright, although it goes full retard if you're a dragonborn.

What happens if we hunt down and slay my pact dragon?

If the rest of his shit is the same quality as this, I'd probably allow most of it. It seems his execution is decent but his concepts are hit or miss.

>>46548339
Very well done for a homebrew, though a bit cringeworthy in how republican it sounds.

>>46548327

I have done, and they don't. It seems if there's anything other than try to hit creature with sword they're stumped.

Another example
>large group of bad guys up ahead, dressed like a bunch of mean cunts and geared to fuck things up
>party are above them on a crumbling cliffside, badguys aren't aware and evidence that rocks have fallen in the past
>describe in detail that occasionally rocks will be tumbling down, or each foot step knocks some stones loose, and that coincidentally there's several large boulders above where the bad guys are
>also remind the party that a while back they passed a sluice gate and its controls holding back a reservoir that would feed into the valley below them, hence why they're up on the rocks since they decided they might drown
>after several minutes of intense discussion they decide to charge blindly at the bad guys

>>46548373
They know what they can do, before all of this I'd been introducing them to the mechanics both by reading them, providing examples and doing in-game demonstrations for them. They just seem to be set in a certain path and want to have a chance to do something different, but they never do if the opportunity is there. There's always complaining that the things they do are routine and straightforward, or boring

>>46548430
>Try "allowing" players to roll checks to notice indirect solutions.

I have been doing and it does sometimes work, I don't normally put them in an encounter without asking them to roll spot, search and knowledge checks (where appropriate) etc, and if it's something their character would know anyway (i.e. big rocks falling down cliffs are going to suck for anything they hit.) I think the problem is that they're too used to video game style progression where they cant choose what to do

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>>46548225

Tell us the party you're working with, we'll spot you some ideas!

>>46548485
>They know what they can do, before all of this I'd been introducing them to the mechanics both by reading them,

To add, I remind them of their skills when appropriate (e.g. you could use your strength to dislodge a rock, or use rope to secure a safety line, or bluff to talk your way past that guy etc etc)

>>46548430
>Basically make it the equivalent to a videogame character talking to themselves a la "There must be another path..." or "Its left eye is glowing...maybe a weak point?"
I think i'm going to try phrasing it like that, maybe it'll hellp

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>>46548478
It's not republican, it's democracy in general. The guy also made a communism paladin as well.

>>46548478
>unresourced 1/turn restrain on anything moving within 10 (later 30) feet if they fail a CHARISMA save
Not sure why Channel Divinity doesn't let him put enemies to sleep with a lengthy diatribe on why they're gay for not appreciating Atlas Shrugged.
*tips train*

>>46548478
there's a commie one too

>>46548201
Players can play for free (with the demo client) if the GM has an Ultimate account, which is $10/month. You can pay more for prebuilt resources or use your own.

The only thing it really has over Roll20 is that you can throw resources in a folder on your local computer and serve that up to your players with ease and no upload limit.

>>46548225
>>46548284
State the obvious, that is the most important tip for improvising that I've ever received and that I give to every player at my table. Not everything that is obvious or cliche to you, is to everyone else. Don't overthink the mundane, fluidity is often better.

For starting a campaign, start with a question for the entire group, on how all the character met instead of just tossing them into an tavern and hoping for the best. Such as:
"How were you captured?"
"What made you join X?"
"Where were you when the X happened?"
This really gets the RP flowing and all the players feel like they're on the same page.

New players like role playing more than roll playing, do NOT toss them into a dungeon until they know the rules and actually give a crap about their characters. Have the first session be mostly RP'ing with a couple small encounters, if it's a long enough session, finish off the night on tough fight. Leave them with a cliff hanger and on a high note.

Everything has consequences, both good and bad. This one of the major things people love about role playing games. You start thinking about the logical outcomes of all the players actions, this will make your campaign write itself practically.

>>46547881
It's your fighter's cooking that kills them, isn't it?

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>>46548260
>if you don't want to, consider who your PCs are, and think about what their motivations might be. From there, you can design a first few sessions.

>>46548513
>Tell us the party you're working with, we'll spot you some ideas!

Paladin (backstory pending), Ranger (seeks out mystery and knowledge), Ranger (seeks out adventure and new sights), Rogue (is a missionary)

>>46548476
>paladins of free commerce and thus freedom
>necessarily against corporatism
>Jewish
Nice try Shlomo

>>46548584
Rangers and rogue are traveling together to some rough-and-tumble frontier town (rogue's mission being missionary work, others being ADVENTURE), run it as a fantasy Wild West with a looming threat of [MYSTERIOUS MAGICAL MONSTER]. Paladin, assuming they're the "lawful" one, gets roped in as the party "good cop".

>>46548583
We're playing PotA. So far he has:
>choked a guard with half a pound of ground cinnamon
>bludgeoned half a tribe of goblins to death with a hamhock
>took out a room full of cultists by throwing a bag of flour into their air elemental and chucking a torch in
>burned numerous things to death by holding them in campfires/hearths/boiling cauldrons
>tarred a farmer's cattle and sent them running, alight, into an invading orc tribe's ranks
And that's just the stuff related to food.

>paladins of politics

They would end up dead pretty fast in any canpaign I'm running, or oathbroken

>>46548688
why's that

>>46548683
I like your fighter.

>>46548485
That cliff example is the exact opposite of what you should be doing. There should be pressure. Don't let them set up anything. Throw sure, certain, and current very aware and angry death at them. Describe random details in the environment. Don't have a plan for what they can do, just say yes to whatever retarded thing they latch onto.

>>46548683
This sounds like Random as fuck or insanely resourceful, like that fag who turned his Warrior into a Lich from the That Guy thread last Tuesday.

>>46548683
>took out a room full of cultists by throwing a bag of flour into their air elemental and chucking a torch in
dust explosion?
beautiful

>>46548683
Also,
>A hamhock survived being used to bludgeon HALF AN ENTIRE TRIBE OF GOBLINS
There's no way in hell that thing didn't get reduced to the bone after a few and then break after a quarter of the tribe.

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>>46548584

"Two hundred years ago, the Dread Lord nearly conquered the world with his demonic magics and dark armies, before a small band of heroes successfully assassinated the motherfucker. Afterward, all men shunned the lands the darkness had conquered. But recently, due to population and economic pressures in the bright lands, brave souls have been founding settlements deeper and deeper into the former empire.

The four of you are on a small caravan, two wagons bound for the settlement of Toppled Tower. A cry comes from the lead wagon: a fallen tree across the road!"

Roll perception: goblin ambush. Roll initiative. From there, you can take them to a frontier town built on the ruins of an evil empire stronghold, with a cult worshiping the old dark lord in the basement of the inn, the occasional troll attack on the walls, all sorts of classic stuff.

>>46548712
Mostly I think he's keeping track of enemy HP and going with a sub-optimal attack when he knows he doesn't need the full damage from his real weapon.
>this guard has like four health and will die from a light breeze
>what's in this room or my backpack that could finish him in the rudest way possible

>>46548780
Sounds like he is playing MacGyver for fun.

>>46548683
>burned numerous things to death by holding them in campfires/hearths/boiling cauldrons
Uh

>>46548799
Coincidentally the only way to enjoy yourself as a 3X Fighter.

>>46548698
Check his dubs, it'll explain everything.
>>46548688

Political paladins fall into cynical Machiavellian National Feudalists. Fucking Red Wizards man.

>>46548698
Because I hate extreme left as much as extreme right, and I can only be impartial for so long if my buttons are pushed

>>46548828
See, that I get, but once you start dragging IRL shit into my world it tends to bite back

Guys, I'm rolling a barbarian and I need him to be the tank. Should I pot for a shield and longsword for the extra AC and stay naked or should I opt for some feats and wear armor?

I wanna still feel like a raging barbarian. I know I'm going into totem warrior for sure but I'm not sure how I feel about the weapons he has.

>>46548904
Just pump your CON and DEX and use a shield

>>46548923
Currently at lvl 1 I have 17 str, 16 Con and 14 Dex so I should be set, right?

I really wanna get my STR and Con high for that capstone I'm not sure if feats are worth the delay towards that

Is a high CHA score really that important for a Purple Dragon Knight/Banneret? Their face-y qualities seem to come from the essentially free Expertise in Persuasion at 7th level.

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>>46548904
Do Barbarians use their bonus actions for a lot of shit?
Take Shield Master and if anyone gives you shit about a shield-using Barbarian, explain that a shield is just a larger kind of hammer, then knock them on their ass and crush them with it.

Even Conan used a shield.

>>46548949
If you could I would pump con over str, that is if you want to tank

>>46548949
Remember that your Con contributes to your AC as a Barbarian, not just your HP. A difference of one or two AC isn't that huge though when you've got a beefy health pool and are taking half damage from everything. But in the same vein, a couple damage isn't a big deal either, and you can build an incredibly high AC Barb by favoring Con and Dex over Strength and still not be a slouch in the DPS department thanks to Finesseable weapons.

And don't plan for level 20. No group ever gets that far. Things should fall apart before you hit 10, really.

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>>46549314
>No group ever gets that far.
Challenge accepted.

>>46549314
My group almost got that far in a 3.5 game. We ended up at level 16 (starting at 1) when the DM got tired of the game and we wrapped it up. We "finished" though, in the sense that we killed the BBEG and stopped his time shenanigans.

Let me get this straight, if a ghoul deals no damage can still paralyze you?

>>46549534
If it hits you, but somehow the damage is reduced to zero, the paralysis affect still occurs, yes.

>>46549534
Why wouldn't it? The paralyze effect doesn't say "if the target takes damage..."

3.5 is better.

>>46549568
(you)

Anyone have an idea of what I should do after my players finish PotA? Wing it and stop being a module babby?

>>46549663
Start a new campaign? Not all campaigns need to go on forever.

>>46549554
>>46549555
Why even roll then? a miss can still be a hit that dealt no damage

>>46549711
>Why even roll then?

Are you an idiot?

>roll to hit
>if miss, nothing
>if hit, roll damage, roll paralysis
>if fail paralysis save, paralyzed
>if damage roll + modifiers > 0, take damage

>>46549711
>a miss can still be a hit that dealt no damage
No it can't. It's not a miss if it hits you.

Thoughts on the Inspiring Leader feat? Anyone in your groups ever use it?

>>46549690
But I want them to get to 20 and beyond

>>46549711
I gotta ask, do you just roll your face over the keyboard or do you actually know what your words mean?

>>46549534
>>46549711
The only example I can think of where a ghoul could deal no damage and still paralyze you is if the character had some kind of resistance or immunity to slashing damage and reduced the damage dealt by the ghoul to zero. The wording on the attack is kind of bizarre, but let me diagram it.

It's not meant to be taken as "On a hit, this deals slashing damage. Regardless of a hit or miss, the character makes a saving throw against paralysis"

It's meant to be taken as "On a hit, this deals slashing damage. If the character is hit, the character makes a saving throw against paralysis."

It's supposed to be evocative of a ghoul's claws slashing the players and filling them with paralyzing venom. You're probably just overthinking it.

>>46549765
>What's armor protected you?
>What's it's just a scratch, no actual damage?

>>46549765
It can. That's why AC is from armor as well as dodging.

Look at it this way: The origins of the AC system are in a naval warfare game. Naturally, a warship isn't expected to be ducking under volleys, so while you can just totally miss beating the AC is not merely a matter of hitting or missing the target, and never has been--it's about hitting and surpassing it by hitting or missing a target number.

You can land a shell against a ship at a bad angle which doesn't bypass the hull--it deflects safely.
You can land a strike against an armored foe at a bad angle in exactly the same way.

You can express it more specifically and exactly if you like: just say that if you miss within the margin of what is added by the armor that the armor did its job.
But everybody at the table will still just call it a 'miss'.

>>46549765
>If I don a shield I dodge better!

>>46549314
>>46549411
I've gotten to level 20+ in tons of 3e games, chars get so OP in it that the ability to kill one equal level monster a round is jeered at as weak. Monsters also often give crazy XP, if higher level, so its a lot easier.

>>46549765
Things a miss represents:
>the attack roll was not high enough to surpass your AC

Things a miss does not represent, but is commonly misunderstood to represent:
>the attack misses
>you block/parry the attack with a shield/weapon
>the attack hit but was a glancing blow
>the attack hit but was absorbed by your armor

AC/HP in DnD are so abstracted that trying to apply realism to their mechanics is 100% full fucking retarded, as demonstrated so successfully by this idiot:
>>46549711

How do you deal with exotic races in Ravenloft? Players want to play tiefling and dragonborn, i'm not sure about allowing it.

>>46550067
I was considering banning exotic races, but then nobody at my table picked any. I share your feelings, brother.

>>46550067
CoS specifies that Barovians treat all outsiders like shit, but non-humans get treated SUPER like shit.

>>46549970
Alright, thats all houserules and shit. RAW, it does not say explicitly that its always armor, luck, dodging, or the enemy just missing a stationary target with no armor whatsoever because they suck.

You could have a game where the full plate fighter nimbly dodges everything that misses him, just like you COULD have a game where every attack against the rogue just slides off his beefy leather armor.

Deciding what happens is honestly all houserule and DM fiat. RAW you don't know(and just say "it misses").

But I do know you are shit DM if you decide that ghouls insta-paralyze everything forever.

>>46548949
Grab some feat to round out your str mod, then max CON>STR>DEX. Maybe grab a feat or two if you need to.

>>46550067
Tiefling works perfectly well, maybe not dragonborn so much. In fact, the weird tieflings from the SCAG are better for Ravenloft than the regular ones in the PHB, as they often can pass for humans better.

>>46550067
Depends on the race, depends on the player.

I won't even run CoS for my main group because they'll go full fucking chimp if one of their guys dies ignominiously.

>>46550119
>I do know you are shit DM if you decide that ghouls insta-paralyze everything forever.

>roll to beat AC
>player gets a saving throw
>ghouls insta-paralyze everything forever.

What the actual fuck are you even talking about?

>>46550119
>But I do know you are shit DM if you decide that ghouls insta-paralyze everything forever.
Not forever, just if you don't pass DC 10.

>>46549934
Then it's not a hit.

>>46549970
That's not entirely true. Being proficient in armor means you know how to use it such that it protects you better. You bend and move (and the armor is made in such a way) that when an opponent hits you, it's only a glancing blow and the weapon doesn't make solid contact.

>>46550017
Kind of. You don't hold your shield up and let someone smack it. That breaks your arm and ruins your shield. You use your shield to deflect blows.

>>46550140
Nobody knows anymore.

Never change, /5eg/.

>>46550149
>That's not entirely true. Being proficient in armor means you know how to use it such that it protects you better. You bend and move (and the armor is made in such a way) that when an opponent hits you, it's only a glancing blow and the weapon doesn't make solid contact.
I fail to see how this disagrees with my post.

>>46550095
I was thinking about making the Dark Powers change their appearance out of nowhere to regular humans.

>>46550162
The goalposts here move more than hentai hips

>>46550197
>my goalposts are moving on their own!

Why don't I have such an image?

>>46550181
It disagrees with the first part of your post. You aren't hit unless the opponent rolls higher than your AC. If you have high armor, this means that the weapon may make contact, but it's deflected or doesn't get through.

Which means it doesn't hit.

>Playing LMoP
>After a character was insta-gibbed by surprise by a bugbear in a cave full of goblins
>After TPK by a dragon who insta-gibbed us with firebreath by a surprise attack
>After all of this...another TPK by a floating flaming skull that insta-gibbed by surprise us with another fire something

Does having passive percetion 20 mean something? I think isn't worth it, also why so many impossible encounters?

Is the anon from the last thread who mentioned his Costner ranger archetype still around? If so, do you have a PDF?

>>46550140
Follow the argument lil nigga, the guy was trying to say that even if a ghoul misses AC they still "hit" armor or whatever so it counts for paralysis.

Unless you can follow I conversation and I am merely being rused. In which 6/10 made me reply.

>>46550233
I think your DM fucked up big time, since there's supposed to be a lot of buildup and warning to the dragon.

PP 20 should also spot all of that.

>>46550231
If someone punches you in the chest they didn't 'miss' you because the shirt was in the way.

So HAM really does jack shit against Ghoul, well, good to know. Nice paralyze-lock by the way, no wonder encounter ended in TPK.

>>46550279
Yeah, because they beat your AC and your shirt doesn't give you an AC bonus.

>>46548339
Faerun isn't a capitalist society its more a mix of feudalism and mercantilism

How broken would adding a "half-breed" background be, if it allowed you to choose one racial benefit from your other half that isn't an attribute increase?

>>46550262
>the guy was trying to say that even if a ghoul misses AC they still "hit" armor or whatever so it counts for paralysis.

No, what the ACTUAL fuck are you even talking about? Nobody, NOBODY, ever said anything even fucking close to that.

>>46550285
>So HAM really does jack shit against Ghoul, well, good to know.

It reduces incoming damage, the same as it does against literally every other enemy in the game.

>Nice paralyze-lock by the way, no wonder encounter ended in TPK.
If the enemy beats your AC every attack, and you fail a DC 10 "easy" saving throw every turn, you're gonna fucking die no matter what.

What fucking hole did these retards crawl out of? Are these actual ghouls shitposting from the sewers?

>>46550262
No, YOU follow the argument:

ParalysisFag is bitching because, RAW, the ghoul's claw poison triggers a saving throw on a hit, regardless of actual damage done. I imagine this is an edge case involving HAM and resistance reducing damage to zero. He appears to be of the opinion that a hit that deals no damage isn't a hit at all.

This was rapidly misinterpreted in true teegee fashion into a self-sustaining cascade of flavor text arguments.

I, for one, have enjoyed this very much.

>>46550294
>playing in Faerun

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>creating a Greatsword character because of GWM mentioned last thread
>backup character if my current char gets gibbed
>get to add tool proficiency with one gaming set (Merc. Veteran background)
>look through gaming sets in PHB
>maybe there's something like Go that he can play, something tactical
>Dragonchess
>hmm, sounds neat, I'll google

So it turns out Gygax was even more crazy than I thought.
Too bad it's such a complex game, I can't really justify a mercenary greatsword carrying around three chess boards and other intricate things that are prone to break easily.
Maybe I'll just have him play regular chess, or not-Go.

>>46550397
Call it Zthop.

>>46550279
>>46550292
Both of you are being retarded and arguing over something which you obviously agree on, due to potentially poor phrasing that I can't even be arsed to look up. Move on to something which you actually disagree over, holy shit.

Also, you should remember that being 'hit' mechanically doesn't necessarily mean that you yourself are physically contacted by any form of attack:
>Hit points represent a combination of physical and mental durability, the will to live, and luck. Creatures with more hit points are more difficult to kill.

>>46550342
Well, the combat was 4 4th level PCs vs 10 ghouls, they killed the mage in the surprise round and then it was a snowball fromthere , We could pass 2 or 3 Con saves, but not 5 or 6, eventually we, then I, were constantly getting paralyzed till they just killed us.

>>46550312
Not totally, depending on the benefit. Look at the half-elf options in SCAG.

>>46550428
How are you so triggered? Fuck off.

>>46550428
Except your opponent rolls damage, with a type, which indicates you are, in fact, hit by something.

>>46550262
Everything still makes sense if you remind yourself that, although Touch AC isn't a thing anymore, Touch Attacks still are.

Fucking home rule it, for the love of God.
>If there's no damage, poison doesn't get into the target, no save required.
Is that so fucking hard?

>>46550468
Literally quoting the PHB here, buddy. Hit points aren't just health.

I dunno, I'd assume that a near-miss from something which you are resistant to would rattle you less than something which are aren't, or something.

>>46550380
Guy who asked this>>46549534, I only asked this and then this>>46550285
I'm not the guy who said "miss should still trigger paralysis"

>>46550470
Don't do that, suddenly HAM affects on-hit abilities, which it was clearly never meant to do.

>>46550450
So your complaint is that your group has shit passive perception and/or shit tactics, and then walked into an encounter well above your CR.

That is wholly separate from this AC and ghoul-ability bitching. Your DM is shit for thinking 10 CR1 monsters was appropriate for 4 level 4 PCs, not for properly applying the affects of the Ghoul's attacks.

>>46550397
If real-world soldiers are any indication, there are a fuckton of nerds on military bases who love playing D&D; it's not 100% muscle-brained jarheads who jerk themselves off with Madden and CoD.

I can easily see ye olde military veteran carrying around his three chess sets. Remember that most ye olde military comapaigning was walking from place to place and sitting in camp forever. Actual fighting was the rare occurrance, the rest of the time people were staring at each others' camps from miles away and trying to pass the time without getting rape-happy.

>>46550529
Unless it's obviously a contact poison. Not all poisons are effective outside of the body. It's an easy house rule.

>>46550529
>shit passive perception
I wouldn't call 15 shit, but yeah.

>shit tactics
We were walking in a 2x2 formation, with the mage behind, but the ghouls just walked around us the moment we opened the door.

>>46550529
>Don't do that, suddenly HAM affects on-hit abilities, which it was clearly never meant to do.
Well, why the fuck not?
That's like saying you should bleed even if you weren't cut, as if suddenly you suffered some internal rupture if a dagger bounces off your armor.

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>>46550529
>>46550450
Actually, now that I look closer, I see exactly what happened.

Your DM didn't multiply the Ghoul encounter's XP threshold for their group. A Deadly encounter for 4x4 is 2,000 XP. A ghoul is worth 200XP, ergo, 10 ghouls for a Deadly encounter.

However, pic related.

>>46550560
>Unless it's obviously a contact poison. Not all poisons are effective outside of the body. It's an easy house rule.

Except, however, that AC doesn't represent whether attacks hit or miss you. They represent an incredibly vague abstraction of whether or not an attack reduces your HP (which is, in turn, a vague abstraction as >>46550428 noted, and even losing HP doesn't mean you took damage).

Saying that an attack that hits, but deals zero damage therefore doesn't break the skin or whatever, is going well above and beyond the level of abstraction intended by the system. You're trying to cram realism into a system that's INCREDIBLY abstracted.

>>46550380
>>46550342
>>46550262
>>46550119
>>46550450
>>46550529

I would like to point out that everyone here is being trolled. Ghouls do a minimum of 4 damage every turn, even with HAM you will always take damage, the guy is making this up to shit up a thread.

It worked.

>>46550663
>an attack hits but deals zero damage is somehow an abstraction

What the fuck? How?

>the dagger is stopped by your chestplate
>but you got poisoned ;^)

>>46550397
Take proficiency with dice games and play DnD inside DnD

I don't think it actually calls it poison anywhere anyway. Could just be undead magical shit.

>>46550701
Minimun of 4 damage? well, seems my GM messed even more, he told me several times "you receive 3 damage".

...or, now that I think about it, maybe I fucked it up and he assumed 3, after applying HAM, and I assumed 3 on total...

>>46549011
14th wolf totem uses bonus

>>46550663
I don't think it's that crazy of a leap.

>attack fails because it didn't beat AC
>was the opponent at a distance/reasonable for the attack to miss entirely? Okay, it never hit you
>was the opponent behind you with a knife and you were flatfooted and he stilled failed and it makes zero sense for him to miss because it wasn't a critical failure?
>stopped by armor

>>46550292
So I suppose either you think AC is a literal real life thing, or you're not actually thinking about any of this because you think this is the same as the ghoul conversation.
So let me really annoy you now, by pointing out that HP being damaged can also be a miss as it also represents how much stamina or fight you have in you.

But lets focus more on AC.
You're mixing up "hit versus target number" and "hitting a physical object".

Hitting the armor is hitting a physical object. This is something that happens literally only in the narrative, because the armor doesn't have a measured and delineated "Is a Physical Object" property.

Hitting the target number means you dealt damage or trigger other effects. This is the crunchy layer of the game. This is where the ghoul interactions are happening--entirely within the abstractions. There are explicitly delineated actions and outcomes and numerical comparisons.

A target-number miss can still be a narrative blow that merely glanced off of armor.
Two meanings. Like how a bat as in baseball is not the same as bats that might live in a belfry. Trying to collapse it all down into a unified definition is *literally* nonsense.

>>46549796
It's bad, just use Aid

>>46550701
There's also still Stone's Endurance for Goliaths.

>>46550702
Dude, I can't help you understand this if you're retarded.

HP doesn't represent meat points. Losing HP doesn't mean you got hurt. Not losing HP doesn't mean you didn't.

>>46550754
>...or, now that I think about it, maybe I fucked it up and he assumed 3, after applying HAM, and I assumed 3 on total...

God damnit, everyone in this fucking thread is absolutely retarded.

>>46550775
Again, that's fine from a fluff perspective, but trying to apply it to crunch doesn't make any sense. If you want that kind of sensibility you need to throw out the entire AC/HP system, because it just doesn't work like that.

Unless you rule someone takes 1 damage for failing to shave correctly in the morning, I don't see why a Ghoul can't nick you for 0 and still have paralysis apply.

Ghouls have always been the bane of low level parties.

>>46550810
I can't help you being retarded, anon. If an attack roll doesn't match or exceed your AC, the attack doesn't hit. Simple as that, and that's all I was ever arguing.

I just got a mace with Gleaming: "This item never gets dirty." What are some cool uses? So far all I can really think of is to make tavern bets and use it as a stirring rod.

>>46550530
I'm thinking of just renaming Chinese Chess into Cormyrian Chess.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xiangqi

>Elephant = Ogre (Halberdier?)
>Cannon = Wizard
>Chariot = Knight
>Horse = Scout (Elf?)
>General = General
>Advisor = Guardian
>Soldier = Soldier

Dragonchess seems like something that would almost exclusively be played by nobles and such; due to complexity (and board bloat, lmao3board) games would take forever to complete.

>>46550312
I think you mean swapping a racial trait

>>46550823
Hey, when someone says "3 damage" you say well, ok, 3, then I apply HAM and it's 0, so I write 0.

But what if your GM was already applying HAM and didn't tell you, and you didn't ask, is not that odd, we're both pretty stupid, but isn't that odd. Also we didn't get mad or anything, it was a TPK, that stuff happened, we didn't overthink it, I just asked here if ghouls can still paralyze you when they deal cero damage for x reason, I'm not trying to overrule what happened in the game, just inform myself.

But ok, imagine, instead of HAM, is a Goliath with that feature that reduces damage up to 1d12+Con which name I don't remember.

>>46550927 see
>>46550821

>>46550948
I already pointed out that I'm stupid, thanks for adding blind.

I'm thinking of letting a player choose Aarakocra for their race. Should I try to limit their flying feature? Either reduce the speed, or make it so they have to land at the end of their turn?

>>46550823
>Dude, I can't help you understand this if you're retarded.
>HP doesn't represent meat points. Losing HP doesn't mean you got hurt. Not losing HP doesn't mean you didn't.
What.
So what the fuck does 'Cure Light Wounds' do?
Help your self-esteem or something?
You're the kind of person that thinks 1 AM is part of the same day from before midnight.
The rules are meant to represent real things happening, not the other way around.
So if someone gets a dagger thrown at them and it does no damage because of heavy armor, it's perfectly reasonable to say the target wasn't poisoned because the dagger's blow was absorbed by the armor.

>>46550887
Melt it, use it to coat existing dishes, market your new line of no-stick, no-wash cookware, and sell it at a huge profit to some noble or celebrity chef. Use proceeds to buy a more combat-useful mace.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWs0i0aMsw4

>>46550988
Depends, which level are you playing? has the game tons of encounters in dungeons, inside buildings, etc? is fly going to make certain encounters piss easy?

I had a tiefling with wings in my last game and literally didn't matter but for you meaningless situations that could have been also solved easily by other ways

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>>46548202

...no, it's the difference between both of those and Fraud or Counterfeiting.

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So the party I'm DMing for is level 6 (a lore bard, frenzy barbarian, tempest cleric, arcane trickster)

Its a Ravenloft campaign, started before CoS.half assed mix between I6 and Expedition to Castle Ravenloft. Next stop is castle Ravenloft and Strahd.

I've seen about 3 different statblocks for Strahd, lowest is 12, highest is 15 from CoS.

leaning towards CoS but either way they are all too high for the party as they are.

Ireena is champion fighter 2 LVs lower controlled by the cleric.

Should I give all the players a second character to control? to even odds and provide quick replacement characters if the need arises?


>>46550887
I can't be the murderer! My weapon would be caked with blood if I did !"

>>46550983
You're welcome.

>>46550994
>You're the kind of person that thinks 1 AM is part of the same day from before midnight.
I can see that going either way depending on the situation.

I'm still not sure the ghoul's paralysis IS a poisoning thing. Is this mentioned in fluff anywhere, or is it just being assumed??

>>46550914
In addition to the ones you already have. Humans don't have anything to swap.

>>46550994
PHB outright says HP is not just injuries. There is no penalty for being at 1HP.

If Cure Light Wounds is closing up cuts, then what is spending HD on a short rest? What is a full heal on a long one?

>>46550994
>Help your self-esteem or something?

Fills you with positive energy. If this manifests itself by feeling good and full of energy, or just closing your wounds, works either way.

>>46551048
Yes, that is better.

>It's an abstration
Till it isn't, "1 single attack" in game is actually supposed to be many different feints and attacks...till you use ranged weapons because ammunition and shit. Same with HPs and AC.

>>46551094
>.till you use ranged weapons because ammunition and shit.

I hate tracking ammo so fucking much.

>>46551027
>Billy Mays selling minor magical items of dubious quality at a bazaar

>>46551094
>one melee attack can be multiple feints and swings
>but one ranged attack always involves just one arrow
>you can do either of these four times in a round
>but the guy with throwing knives can only take one off his belt and throw it before he needs a rest
fuck this action economy right in the pussy, thanks

>>46550529
>Don't do that, suddenly HAM affects on-hit abilities, which it was clearly never meant to do.

There are literally only 4 monsters in the entire MM that this could apply to, and half of them are bugs. Unless you fluff HAM as making your skin as hard as steel (but only while wearing heavy armor, wtf?) There is really no way to think about being bitten by an ordinary spider for 0 damage because of your armor and still being poisoned.

Like, its a normal fucking spider. It doesn't have fucking fangs that can pierce steel (or even your leather straps) to drip poison on you. If HAM works because your armor helps you absorb the blow here, the spider isn't getting to your flesh.

HAM isn't exactly an OP feat, and considering this only works 4 creatures that are all CR 1/8 or less (2 different tiny snakes, scorpions, spiders) I would just let it happen.

>>46551094
>"1 single attack" in game is actually supposed to be many different feints and attacks
This was true in AD&D, where rounds were a minute long. Not so much in 3e and onward where a round is 6 seconds.

>>46551212
IRL 6 seconds can be an entire duel. Look at fencing (Olympic or otherwise).

It's plenty of time for feinting and attacking.

>>46551061

>Should I give all the players a second character to control?

No, but providing the opportunity to recruit additional allies would be good. If you give them all a second character, it will feel like the DM is giving them free stuff, which doesn't make them feel clever and awesome. If they go to the tavern and recruit allies that you put there for that very purpose, they'll be fooled into thinking they did something smart, and will be happier about it.

>>46551212
Fighters attack(and can hit) up to 10 times in 6 seconds in this edition. Its probably no issue to say that they throw out at least 10 strikes every round even at low levels but you fluff it so only some of them are real attacks. You can just have them become more "accurate" as they get more attacks when they level.

>>46548339
My favourite homebrews are the ones closest to the source material, that still manahes to feel vastly different.

I played a Zerg-like monster, following the adaptation route. Ran it as a Dragonborn (acid based) with very little changed, using shadow monk as the class.

We changed the damage type on its unarmed "monk" attacks to cutting instead of bashing, and the rest was pretty much all fluff changes. The unarmed damage went up because the claws got sharper and more dangerous, for example.

It was a ton of fun, especially coming up with the fluff behind the feats I choose.

What is the most fun class to dm for and why is it warlock?

>>46549796
It's amazing if you have many rests throughout the day. It is a great addition to necromancy as well. The larger your party, the better the feat.

>>46551378
>a Fighter can fire his bow 10 times
>I can't unsheathe two weapons at once without a feat
End me.

>>46551443
To be fair, the fighter needs a feat to shoot that many times too :^)

>>46551443
I think bow only goes up to 8 shots per turn.

if you include haste EK and opportunity attacks, a GWM EK can actually make 11 attacks

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>>46551317
2 of them were introduced during the quest as a quest giver and potential replacements in case a PC died.

The paladin called them to help deal with a plague.

They spared the half orc fighter after he surrendered and told them he only attacked because Strahd said he would help him escape Barovia (guy came from the mist too) if he brought Ireena to him (lying).

add those two with Ireena and I've got 3.

I was thinking of having a Wizard or an Assassin getting drunk in the tavern while bemoaning about being stuck in this dismal hellhole with no way to escape.

>>46551490
Make it 8 then.

>>46551420
Paladins, nigga.

>>46551493
>GWM
>Ranged weapon
Wut?

>>46551493
It would be 9, and only for hand crossbow. because no AoO with ranged attacks (though you could still draw a melee weapon after firing all your crossbow shots and use your offhand for AoO)
Not counting haste of course.

>>46551378
>>46551443
>Fighters can attack 8-10 times in a turn
What the hell? How? What combination of of skills make such weeaboo fantasies possible?

Late to the party because this stuff's pretty much settled and dead by now but I like the topic, so here you go.

AD&D 1e:
>Each character has a varying number of hit points, just as monsters do. These hit points represent how much damage (actual or potential) the character can withstand before being killed. A certain amount of these hit points represent the actual physical punishment which can be sustained. The remainder, a significant portion of hit points at higher levels, stands for skill, luck, and/or magical factors. A typical man-at-arms can take about 5 hit points of damage before being killed. Let us suppose that a 10th level fighter has 55 hit points, plus a bonus of 30 hit points for his constitution, for a total of 85 hit points. This is the equivalent of about 18 hit dice for creatures, about what it would take to kill four huge warhorses. It is ridiculous to assume that even a fantastic fighter can take that much punishment. The same holds true to a lesser extent for clerics, thieves, and the other classes. Thus, the majority of hit points are symbolic of combat skill, luck (bestowed by supernatural powers), and magical forces.

3.5 SRD:
>Your hit points measure how hard you are to kill.

4e:
>Hit points measure your ability to stand up to punishment, turn deadly strikes into glancing blows, and stay on your feet throughout a battle. Hit points represent more than physical endurance. They represent your character’s skill, luck, and resolve—all the factors that combine to help you stay alive in a combat situation.

5e:
>Hit points represent a combination of physical and mental durability, the will to live, and luck. Creatures with more hit points are more difficult to kill. Those with fewer hit points are more fragile.

>>46551564
I should have clarified, didn't mean with ranged weapons. A Great Weapon EK can do 11.

It's 8 or 9 max for ranged weapons.

>tfw you want to like this system but GMs and groups don't let you
You can change the system but you can't change the fanbase, this game reminded me why I left D&D 10 years ago

>>46551597
A C T I O N
S U R G E

4 from first action
4 from second action
+1 from GWM if you killed something or crit
+1 from Haste if it's up
+1 if you get an opportunity attack

>>46551644

Start your own game with people that you like, then. Be the change you wish to see in the world, anon. Don't let your dreams be dreams.

Any suggestions for spells at 3rd level for a sorcerer? Current load-out is as follows: Thaumaturgy, Acid Splash, Friends, Mage Hand, Ray of Frost, Mage Armor, Witch Bolt, Shield.
Also, what about metamagic options?

>>46549690
Mine does, we've played in the same campaign for 5 years.

>>46551646
Oh, my dear, sweet Lord. I looked it up and the legends are true.
Thank you, Anon. If I ever get the chance to sit in the player's seat in the future, I'll keep this in mind.

Would there be any significant consequences if I lengthened the duration of a round to 10 seconds? Only thing I can think of is making per-minute effects slightly less powerful.

>>46551916
why do you want to do this?

>>46551916
The round is just an abstraction anon. Making it longer has no gameplay effect other than "boy I sure can't do much during my turn."

>>46551946
As an end unto itself. AD&D having one-minute rounds got me thinking about how I wish combat was a bit more drawn-out in terms of in-game time.

>>46551916
>slightly
Instead of 10 turns it's 6, I wouldn't say "slightly".

>>46551559
They're fun too. But I feel like warlock is the one that encourages the most DM/player interaction.

>>46551951
Except rounds are specifically said to last 6 seconds. Minute long spells, or in really extreme cases (I can't think of any where this would come up) hour long spells would take less combat rounds to run their course.

60 seconds / 6 seconds per round leaves you with 10 rounds.

60 seconds / 10 seconds per round leaves you with 6 rounds.

10 =/= 6,

ergo, changing the length of rounds to 10 seconds would change the round length of certain spells, which is a direct gameplay effect.

>>46548712
Source? I wouldn't recognize it.

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How's this for a conversion of an elder brain? Tear me apart, /tg/.

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It's been awhile since I read anything about 5e.

I heard that clerics end up making better paladins than paladins do,

What kind of cleric or build faciliated that?

>>46552086
>I heard that clerics end up making better paladins than paladins do
Whoever told you that is a liar, anon.

>>46550511
Nobody said a miss should trigger paralysis, you dumbfuck. The argument you're pushing is that if various features/abilities would reduce a ghoul's damage to 0, then the attack should count as a miss.

That's not what the RAW says. You get hit, you make a save.

>>46552062
Except most spells measured in minutes+ duration are rituals and thus rarely if ever are active during combat

>>46552086
Probably cleric of war. They're wrong, but that's as close as you can get.

>>46552110
>Except most spells measured in minutes+ duration are rituals and thus rarely if ever are active during combat
What drugs are you on, and where can I get some?

>>46550702
Not getting a cool but non life threatening facial scar from the poisoned dagger.

Laughingveteransofathousand wars.jpeg

>>46552101
>>46552111
Alright, maybe that's just the part that stuck out to me most and I remembered incorrectly.

What -is- a good cleric build that's exceptionally good?

>>46552110
>What's channel divinty?
>What's rage?
>What're other features that have 1 minute duration?

>>46552086
I strongly disagree with whoever said that. While it's true that War domain Clerics get two attacks and proficiency with Heavy armor and martial weapons, the sheer nova potential of a Paladin is much higher than that of a Cleric due to their smites.

>>46552162
nova potential?

>>46552107
I never said it should be a miss, I just asked if cero damage = no poison/paralysis, you're mistaking me for another guy

>>46552178
Going "nova" is 4e retard speak for burst damage, or alpha striking.

>>46552178
Frontload damage

>>46551916
Nice way of making rage even more short and barbs even less relevant

>>46552110
Even ignoring that you're incorrect, there are spells with casting times of 1 minute, that might be feasible to cast in combat with 10 second rounds. Another direct gameplay change.

>>46552153
I don't think you can go wrong. They're all acceptable in their own way. I think war is actually the most underwhelming.

>>46552223
Calm down nigga, I only asked what would happen.

>>46548430
Source of image?

>>46551916
You're literally making most spells and class features 40% weaker. This is a bad plan.

>>46552273
In general, increasing round time lowers DPS (which is a retarded term to use for rpgs, but I think it's appropriate here). This has the interesting effect of making spells with long casting times easier to pull off in combat, but IMO that's the only change that really alters playstyle.

>>46552079
For split mind, do you roll a concentration check for each spell the brain is concentrating on? Or roll one check for the both?

>>46552480
I confess I hadn't thought of that. What do you think?

>>46552496
Thematically, I'd go with 2 rolls. But that's also kind of annoying, so as a DM I'd prefer one roll.

>>46552544
I'll do 1. I usually forget to ask the players for concentration rolls at all.

>>46551601
I like you.

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Is it bad the most fun I've had has been with my Lucky Feat Halfling Assassin Rogue skill monkey?

Lucky Feat: 3 d20 rerolls per long rest
Halfling Lucky: Rolling 1 on an attack, Ability Check or saving throw gets a free reroll
Skill proficiencies for days
Assassinate and sneak attack lights people the fuck up.
Lightfoot so I can stealth behind medium targets which as a halfling is fucking -everyone-.

The only shame is that it's strong early on but gets surpassed by other classes come higher levels.

Good thing my campaigns never last that long I guess...

>>46551916
So if one made effects expressed in minutes to be instead expressed in "per 10 rounds," I think that'd technically solve the relevant mechanical issues. However, I think the resulting awkwardness would not be worth extending the length of a round simply for my own preferences.

Thanks for the input, all.

>>46552726
Go Lucky Diviner and become the most annoying fucker in the game.

>>46552290
>>46548430
They look more like chibi/cutesy humans than gnomes.

>>46552363
>(which is a retarded term to use for rpgs, but I think it's appropriate here)
true, which is why we use DPR (Damage per Round)

>>46552726
According to /tg/'s popular opinion, having fun shouldn't be a bad thing, so no. Party on.

>>46552757
The thing is, the damage per round doesn't change if you lengthen the round time. But the damage per second actually does, since rounds are directly convertible to seconds.

>>46548398
Do you have FGG book of feats?

>>46552859
No. I didn't know they made one.
Do you have the exact name? I can't find it on their website?

>>46552804
I feel bad at everyone's reaction every time I roll sneak attack damage. If we'd actually just level up enough they'd be doing the same and more. I never get second and third attacks like some people do. I'll never get more and more powerful spells either.

>>46552748
Diviner? Not sure what you mean. I tried to find it myself before asking.

what are some ideas for inconsequential magic trinkets of which the effects are roughly at or below the power of prestidigitation

>>46552966
Wizard archetype I think.

>>46552966
I assume he means a Divination wizard

>>46552966
Wizard archetype. They basically get Lucky that works on allies and enemies too, and you know what you're going to roll beforehand.
Roll 2d20 every morning and record them. You can replace anyone's save/check/attack with them.

>>46553001
How about a rainstick that makes a rumble of thunder when you turn it upside down?

>>46553001
Mood ring

>>46553001
A top that when spun doesn't stop spinning on it's own.

A silver bell that summons a miniature (a few inches across) thunderstorm for a few minutes when rung.

A small vase that shatters each day at noon and reforms a few hours later over the course of a minute.

>>46553001
Compass that can't be demagnitized. Always points north, except in places where north doesn't exist.

What kind of notes should I be taking down from my players charsheets? Getting a summary of their backgrounds and personality traits as well as anything else that's distinctive about their character.

>>46553008
>>46553010
ahh that's what I did find but I thought you might still be referring to my rogue.
>>46553066

Sounds like as much a pain as my rogue must be.

>>46553256
You get the feature at wizard level 2, so you could definitely dip it.

>>46548027
An orc warparty.

>>46553279
Hah, suppose you could.

Assassin rogue's not to bad for that either. You get a lot of what you need early on and then nothing else of note til very much later.

I typically dislike cross classing though since it permanently puts you behind however many levels in your primary class.

I can't think of any other way to make it work though.

>>46553126
>A top that when spun doesn't stop spinning on it's own.

How many of these can I have?

>>46553398
Assassin is notorious for having an amazing level 3 investment and having a shit level 17 payoff. Sort of like spell-less ranger to a much lesser degree.
I'm thinking about dipping 1 rogue as a wizard just to get that sweet expertise on arcana.

>>46553419
one and they wouldn't spin on top of each other or hold things up or whatever overpowered shit you were trying to do Dave.

>>46553438
Not him but the thought of spinning a few thousand of these in the duke's estate and skipping town sounds pretty great.

You could hide half of them in lesser traversed places so weeks later they find a bunch of them still spinning in a broom cupboard

>>46553001
ah! ah! yes yes, please step closer, I have this wonderful ring here! Its gemstone will shine blue whenever it is morning!

>the gemstone always stays blue and is brought back to the salesman

oh ho! you cannot say it is not morning somewhere in the realm! hahaha! *throatstab*

>>46551839
Anyone?

>>46553001
A small container slightly larger than a pocket watch which will hold within itself a single cookie.

The cookie's state will be perfectly protected and preserved for eternity.

Great for ye who craves an oven fresh cookie at unusual times.

Other baked goods of appropriate size may work but anything else will instead instantly decay to dust.

>>46553640
Oh shit, didn't see your post. Sorry lad!
I'm a spellcaster optimizer. Twinned and Quickened are both very, very good. Get them no matter what your subclass is.
Spells are a bit more variable. What'd you pick for your origin?

>>46551839
Scorching Ray if you want to do actual damage, then either Suggestion or Hold Person for 2nd level. Phantasmal Force could theoretically replace Hold Person if you get creative enough and targets INT, which most monsters are shit at.

Twinned Spell so you can Witch Bolt/Mage Armor on two people without shitting out all your slots. Drop MA if you're dragon, though, obviously. Quicken if you want to do more damage on your turn with a spell + cantrip/weapon. Heightened is good if you have save or suck spells, but it's very costly at 3rd, either take it at 10 or just use it sparingly until around level 7.

>>46553640
Swap out witchbolt for an AOE spell, witchbolt is literally worse than just attacking with a cantrip every turn. Get Hold Person or Invisibility as well.

Twin Spell and Quicken spell are pretty much THE reasons to sorcerer. You get to essentially double your concentration with twin spell, and that is absurdly good.

>>46553738
Never get witch bolt, it's a terrible spell. Phantasmal Force is one of those spells that can end encounters against T. Rexes but requires brains and a lenient DM.

>>46553438
I was going to attach magnets to them and reverse entropy chad. Sheesh.

>>46553665
I fucked up, anything besides normal baking ingredients will cause decay.

It can be used to check baked goods for poison.

It's not inconsequential any longer!

>>46553001
A rock that perfectly skips, every time, no matter how poorly you throw it.
A chair with four legs that somehow manages to wobble, despite having perfectly even legs.
A staff of disintegration. When activated, it disintegrates.
A set of personal grooming tools that never need to be sharpened.
A spoon that, when used with a bowl of soup (or stew, or porridge, etc.) never spills on the way to your mouth.
A canoe that goes forward in time, at a rate of 1 second per second.
A handheld mirror that will never break, tarnish, or get dirty.

>>46553874
>A staff of disintegration. When activated, it disintegrates.
>A canoe that goes forward in time, at a rate of 1 second per second.
It begins

>>46553728
Wild Magic. Haven't had to roll yet.

>>46553759
>witchbolt is literally worse than just attacking with a cantrip every turn.
How do you figure?
>You get to essentially double your concentration with twin spell,
I don't think that's how that works... is it?

>>46553874
>A set of personal grooming tools that never need to be sharpened.
>A spoon that, when used with a bowl of soup (or stew, or porridge, etc.) never spills on the way to your mouth.
>A handheld mirror that will never break, tarnish, or get dirty.

Awesome.

>>46553909
>>46553759
Wait... nevermind. I thought you were saying you could cast two concentration spells at once. You meant one concentration spell on to targets. Derp.

>>46553789
>>46553738
Pretend my imagination is shit. What are some fun things to do with Phantasmal Force?

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>>46553419
Just one.

>>46553909
>How do you figure?
WB requires concentration and has a pretty short leash range, on top of that, it breaks if the target so much as walks around the back of a wall. It's a straight 1d12 damage. Even Magic Missile is better than that with its 3d4+3. If you're taking a damaging Lv1 spell, Chromatic Orb is far more versatile and deals 3d8 damage of almost any type, Burning Hands is 3d6 AoE, and Ray of Sickness is also good with 2d8 + poison. It's just not good enough to waste your precious spells known on.
>I don't think that's how that works... is it?
Yes. You can cast a concentration spell on two targets, since you are just casting one spell, but making it so it has two targets. It's why Sorcerers make such good buffers/controllers.

Also, as a Wild Mage: SPAM TIDES OF CHAOS. That shit is your bread and butter. Don't be afraid of getting surges. Even the dreaded fireball isn't that bad once you're level 4-ish. But getting all your points back, or becoming invisible and not making any sound? Always relevant.

>>46554076
Phantasmal chains to restrain them.
Phantasmal lava to make them writhe in agony and waste their action trying to "escape".
Phantasmal wall of ice/fire/whatever to make them think they can't reach you.

>>46554137
That's true about it being less damage than those other spells, but that's just at first. It keeps going, and does automatic damage, which is more damage in the long run, no?

Speaking of Tides of Chaos, my DM says I need to declare I'm using it before I roll... does that sound wrong to anyone else?

>>46554227
>Phantasmal chains to restrain them.
Based on an INT save... I like it. Thanks!

>>46554227
wouldn't they just try and struggle against the chains and go through them like the bridge example in the spell's description?

>>46554285
Yes, but they still think the chains are there.
>If the target survives the fall, it still believes that the bridge exists and comes up with some other explanation for its fall - it was pushed, it slipped, or a strong wind might have knocked it off.

>>46554285
If they think they're real enough, and you create the sensation of enormous weight, they might not. You'll have to talk to your DM about the effects.
>>46554261
It's definitely worth at least 1 person in the party having. Int is probably the rarest save in the game, but failing it tends to really really suck.
Most beasts and monstrosities have shit Int, and it's reasonably common for non-wizards to leave it low. Beware casting it against wizards and smart creatures like dragons and aberrations.

>>46554076
Make the target think it's drowning, or being choked. Depending on your DM and how 'real' he thinks your illusions might be, this could actually be lethal.
Wrap illusory chains around the target, leaving it restrained. Bonus points if you make it real creepy, like having a hand come out of the ground and grab them.
Create a phantasmal creature to chase them in a certain direction, or make their weapon seem to disappear, only to create an illusory version of it show up on the ground a foot ahead of them, so they try to attack with literally nothing.
Change the appearance of one of their allies to one of yours, so they attack them. The possibilities are endless.

>>46554330
yes but a creature bound in real chains especially one like a T-Rex might still struggle against them. So even though they believe they are real they will break free and rationalize their escape from the chains but will still proceed to eat your face off.

>>46554373
I'm not sure it would be able to think it COULD break free. Not if I made sure to specify really thick chains attached to thick spikes driven deep into the ground.

>>46554261
My DM lets me use Tides after I've already rolled, though the PHB doesn't actually say. It just says you "gain advantage". Ultimately, it's up to him, though I'd say it would allow you to reroll. As a side note, have you asked him what the conditions are for forcing a surge after using ToC? Like "after I use ToC, the next spell I cast is an automatic surge" or something?

>The big half-orc fighter tries to intimidate a jackass townsman for info because he wanted a bribe instead of helping out the town.
>rolls 2, and 3 despite advantage
>the darling sweet little halfling cleric takes a break from sipping her tea to give it a try.
>rolls a 19
>She points at him with an outstretched hand that's also holding her steaming tea (it was odd that she pointed with her tea holding hand but she did it IRL too) and looks as him disapprovingly.

Incidents like these always rub me the wrong way a bit as a DM since it doesn't make sense but I usually come up with something good for it anyway.

>Jackass didn't think they'd mess his shit up in the middle of town so he wasn't really afraid of the fighter.
>halfling cleric made a disapproving face like his angry mother often did and as a child his mother poured hot water on him as a punishment. The emotional scars and fear of her splashing the tea on him made him cave.

>>46554401
Sure, but if it tried to break free, it would.

>>46554373
>The phantasm includes sound, temperature, and other stimuli, also evident only to the creature.

Presumably this would also include the feeling of physical contact.

>>46554401
the creature is still unlikely to not try and struggle at all especially a particularly stupid and/or strong target. When they do break free of the chains then they will have to rationalize how they broke free because the chains were especially thick and heavy but in the end they believe it happened because it did. in short just like the bridge doesn't hold a creature aloft the chains wont hold a creature there if it actually tries.

If the creature is sufficiently intelligent and weak to believe they have no chance i can totally see not trying at all.

>>46554412
I have not, but I should.

>>46554429
Thing is, the chains aren't "real", so no matter how hard they struggled, they will never break (unless you make them do so). The target can however, use its action to save again and attempt to disbelieve the illusion.

>>46554550
>attempt to disbelieve the illusion.
or rather realize it's fake.

>>46554550
>they will never break
Sure, but their arms will still move through them.

They will rationalize it, but their arms are free of the chains now. Either that, or the chains have stretched to accommodate the person's movement, and at that point, they aren't restraining them.

>>46554550
Yes but because the chains aren't real they won't actually hold the creature. They don't have to break the creature might rationalize that as being what happened though.

>>46554419
Are you kidding me? It's moments like that which make the game so damn fun and interesting.

>>46554550
You might trick a creature into thinking it is restrained but you won't actually prevent one from leaving the chains.

>>46548027
A man beating his wife and her loving it
And a boy beating his meat and loving it

>>46554550
>>46554573
>>46554584
>>46554586


this reminds me. players like to t do the 5'x5'x5' cube to hide under with minor illusion. do you think a smart enough creature would just notice a shadow, since the illusion can't affect the area outside of the box?

>this thread
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhrwC2BoAkE#t=0m24

>>46554685
you have to crouch to fit inside a 5 foot high cube so it's unlikely your shadow will be very big but i don't see why not.

>>46554708
were these cuffs created by phantasmal force he would have broken them and thought himself a god.

You can't fight drugs with illusions because they are already experiencing altered reality.

>>46554685
Depends on the how big the creature under it is and where the light is coming from, I suppose. Say you were near a window in daylight, and another creature was between you/your illusion and the source of the light, the cube might be between the line of sight of the shadow and the creature.

another phantasmal force question

if you were underwater and made someone think they had an air pocket around them, would they try to breathe?

>>46554829
HAHAHAHA
Yes, they would. That's truly diabolical.
You could do the same thing with an aquatic creature imagining it had a watersuit.

>>46554708
It fits perfectly.

As far as the spell itself goes, constraining them might not be such a good idea since if they struggle to get out, they'll notice the chains aren't actually holding them.

Like that guy would totally just bust out of the "cuffs" via >>46554745

But it says they perceive it to be real if they fail the check, so you're trying to argue that this alone means they have to act within the confines of the illusion. They'll actually keep their limbs together and constrained because they feel the sensation of the constraint.

So... it's debatable.

I think if they fail the check it should basically work like it's real, since they're fooled and it feels real to them.

That's the spirit of it.

>>46554829
I would think they would and then they would somehow rationalize the water they were inhaling.

>>46554829
If PF can make them get burned by an imaginary fire, walk off an imaginary bridge, and get cut by an imaginary goblin, you bet your sweet bippy they'll breathe an imaginary air bubble.

>>46554903
Maybe, but it doesn't matter since they just inhaled water. It's at least a level of success I'll take from the spell.

>>46554942
I'm saying they would probably try and inhale the air again. A stupid creature might just die this way while in intelligent one might simply stop after the first couple tries.

>>46554903
It's an intelligence save dude, they failed it. That's where they failed to rationalize it.

>>46554971
I'm saying they would try and succeed at rationalizing the water in their lungs due to them failing the save you dingus. See my response >>46554970

>>46554970
oh I'm pretty sure after they inhaled "air" and got water instead they'd realize it was wrong. I just meant that they're fucked for air at this point and have to get more, or die.

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Only their rationalization would be that the pain was coming from not breathing in enough of that air pocket... so they breathe in MORE water.

Delicious.

>>46555002
but as the spell says they rationalize any illogical outcomes. So they'll somehow rationalize it and then without any air left they're likely to try and breathe from the air again.

>>46554971
>While a target is affected by the spell, the target treats the phantasm as if it were real. The target rationalizes any illogical outcomes from interacting with the phantasm.

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>yfw two spellcasters could get together and use Watery Sphere + Phantasmal Force for instant death

So in summary phantasmal force for chains is meh but underwater it's fucking broken.

>>46555113
Against anything without water breathing underwater, yeah.

>>46555113
>>46555089
>>46555046
This is the real strength of the spell just like the bridge example. Trying to create something to interact with a creature is okay but using a danger already in place and masking it is fucking deadly.

/5eg/ - Phantasmal Force General

>>46555373
I hate to break it to you, but we've spent the last 100 posts discussing why Elves suck ass. You failed your save against Phantasmal Force and have been viewing an illusionary thread where all the posts are about that spell.

>>46555415
>>46555373
Also you're underwater.

>>46555373
All halberds are just glaives that have been made to look like that and the armor in the death house doesn't exist.

So I will say I dislike how there's not really room for big weapon little weapon dual wielding in 5e. If you can't do it you can't do it, if you can do it you can also dual wield larger weapons and there's really not a reason not to. I mean you totally can, there's just not a reason to.

On an only somewhat related note (as in a character I'm looking to make) what class would be best for a character who's an ex criminal enforcer of some type. I want someone who's very skilled at physical combat but also actually really intimidating, and I'm not sure if high charisma fighter is the way to go about it

>>46555415
You don't need magic to know that elves suck ass.

>>46555476
That's when your DM doesn't give you two magical bigweapons. You find a magic longsword and a magic dagger and bully your Rogue into letting you keep it.

>>46555517
>So this literal 14 year old human child told me the other day that I sucked ass
>So I decided to show him, I sat down for a while and complied a list of grievances towards and shortcomings of humans.
>The list was masterfully crafted, a perfect length not too long not too short, and proof read by 3 colleagues
>I pressed the final draft on high quality Elderwood pulp paper with gold trim and that special wine ink Elfandrew is known for
>Unfortunately it turns out the human child had been dead for a century
>I presented the list as a gift to one of his ancestors
>The louts couldn't even read high elven
>I left and retired to my weeping tower for 33 cycles of the moon

>>46555734
If Elves have weeping towers do Dwarves have growleries?

>>46555873
http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/growlery
what the fuck

>>46555873
No, just growlers.

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>Running LMoP
>One of my players is running a character with the backstory that his tribe's tradition is that fathers name their children after the strongest creature that they've bested in life. His father defeated an ogre, and thus he obtained the name O-Gar. His goal in life is to defeat a dragon and leave a powerful legacy.
>He gets his girlfriend into the campaign late as a wood elf ranger, she's level 2 as they're clearing Wave Echo.
>He recognizes that the bugbears in the area were looking for something when the party came upon them.
>Party makes some perception checks but doesn't find anything, his girlfriend rolls and makes it.
>"O-Gar, upon seeing the design on these gauntlets, you immediately recognize the image of the shouting ogre faces. These are gauntlets of ogre power!"
>His GF: "Ok, I put them on."

our faces

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>>46555978
>One of my players is running a character with the backstory that his tribe's tradition is that fathers name their children after the strongest creature that they've bested in life. His father defeated an ogre, and thus he obtained the name O-Gar.
This is really stupid.

>>46556014
Spoken like a nigga whose son will be named Rauly-Pauly.

>>46556014

at least he's trying :s

be glad he didn't try to make some name out of "Ancient Red Dragon"