Warhammer 40k General

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Are Eldar Corsairs any good?
I want a taste of the Wild Side.

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Scions+Inquisition+Assassins, good idea or bad?

>>43559171
They look like they're going to be pretty potent from the leaks so far. Lots of variety in how you make your army too (prince loadouts and abilities, whether to go with craftworld/commorite weaponry or a mixture, stuff like whether to have a jumping force or a force in void-hardened armour or...) which is always good.

>>43559171
Their codex is old, and not particularly competitive, but still pretty usable.

>>43559213
Yes. Very good. Scions bring useful forces and air support, Inquisition brings cheap bodies and tanks, and Assassins stab/shoot/consume soul/stabstabstab

>>43559235
Wait, are Corsairs gonna get a new codex?

>>43559235
When is the new dex gonna come out?

>>43559249
Imperial armour 11 is getting an update, including an updated corsairs army list.

Let's not bother making new books and making updates to armies that need it more, Eldar need more shit.

Imperial Armour 14 will just be a build a Wraithknight workshop book. With an army list with Wraithknight troops.

>>43559419
Corsairs are more neglected than SoB at this point. Sure CWE will get some toys as well, but they have to because it's eldar.

The thread died before anyone could reply. Try to help me avoid spending 150 dollars on the new kit but telling me how this list cannot work.

>1500ish or so list. Probably a hair under. Basically my 1000 point list with some additions

Huron (warlord)
Lord, bike, Mark of Khorne, Axe of d6 attacks, aura of 5++
4 CSM Bikers with 2 melta guns
4 CSM Bikers with 2 melta guns
2 squads of 10 cultists (DV cultists "as they come")
20 CSM with CCWs, MoS, Icon of FNP (ALWAYS infiltrating/outflanking with Huron

20 CSM with bolters, MoS, Icon of FNP (Maybe Infiltrating? depending on die roll...)
3 man Termicide squad with combi meltas

Not having any anti-air at 1500 points really makes me uncomfortable but I hate that dragon. Hell, not having anti-air or much anti-MC at 1000 points makes me uncomfortable.

Is it bad against something like necrons with wraiths?

Tau Empire (1494/1500pt.)
Primary Detachment
Retaliation Cadre

Commander (197pt.)
Crisis battlesuit; Vectored retro-thrusters; Drone controller; Command and control node; Puretide Engram Neurochip; Multi-spectrum Sensor Suit; XV8-02 Crisis 'Iridium' Battlesuit; Marker drone (x2);

3x - XV8 Crisis Battlesuits (195pt.)
2x - Shas'ui (57pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Flamer; Fusion blaster (x2);
1x - Shas'ui (81pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Fusion blaster (x2); Vectored retro-thrusters; Gun drone (x2);

5x - XV8 Crisis Battlesuits (265pt.)
4x - Shas'ui (52pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Plasma rifle (x2);
1x - Shas'ui (57pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Plasma rifle (x2); Vectored retro-thrusters;

4x - XV8 Crisis Battlesuits (317pt.)
1x - Shas'ui (74pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Missile pod; Target lock; Drone controller; Marker drone (x2);
3x - Shas'ui (81pt.); Crisis battlesuit; Missile pod (x2); Target lock; Marker drone (x2);

3x - XV88 Broadside Battlesuits (300pt.)
1x - Broadside Shas'ui (94pt.); Broadside battlesuit; Twin-linked high-yield missile pod; Twin-linked smart missile system; Target lock; Missile drone (x2);
1x - Broadside Shas'ui (109pt.); Broadside battlesuit; Twin-linked high-yield missile pod; Twin-linked smart missile system; Velocity tracker; Missile drone (x2);
1x - Broadside Shas'ui (97pt.); Broadside battlesuit; Twin-linked high-yield missile pod; Twin-linked smart missile system; Drone controller; Missile drone (x2);

XV104 Riptide battlesuits (220pt.)
1x - Riptide Shas'vre (220pt.); Riptide battlesuit; Nova reactor; Riptide shield generator; Ion accelerator; Twin-linked smart missile system; Stimulant injector;

>>43559249
FW is finally updating their Eldar book to be in line with the latest codex (it's currently two books out of date), which includes updating the corsair armylist.

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>>43559419
>being this mad about Eldar.
Bitch away all you want, it only makes me more smug.

No fair how most new codexes get this new force chart that allows you to take formations inside as auxiliary and such.

>>43559503
You will literally never kill them before they reach your lines. What you need vs wraiths is lots of str 5 firepower.
Of course this assumes your opponent has more than 1 unit of wraiths, if they don't then the list is fine.

>>43559593

Actually, S7 massed is statistically the best thing to hit them with. Lots of 2+ wounds without being as expensive as trying to instant death the fuckers.

How do I get the best from the Deathstrike?
Should I bring piles of Lascannons to pop transports and then hit them where it hurts?

Hey /tg/

I got 55 euros on my paypal account to spend so I thought I'd buy some models or tools or whatnot related to warhammer 40k. I play GK + inq and I'm mostly looking for some Militarum Tempestus to serve as henchmen or maybe some Pagk. Before I dive into the twisted world of "pro painted" models aka ebay, I'd like to ask if any of you guys have sweet deals for me?

Suggestions about purchases are also welcome. So far I got:

-2x librarians
-Inquisitor in terminator armor
-draigo
-NDK
-14 termies
-10 interceptors
-5 Militarum Tempestus scions
-4 Crusaders
-4 Servitors
-ADL

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Looking for some clarification. In the Vraks IA Book, the purge detachment says that it must consist of models with the chaos renegades faction or chaos space marine faction. Now, does this mean that I can have a mix of CSM and renegade troops in the same detachment? There'd be no need for ally shenanigans and I can run oblits alongside rapier lasers.

>>43559761
I believe so yes, but they all must be devoted to Nurgle.

>>43559761
I remember seeing someone ask FW about it through e-mail and they got no as an answer.

It's probably the OR that's the issue.

>>43559789
No they don't, they just can't be dedicated to anyone other than nurgle. You can take unmarked units.

>>43559801
Oh ok.

>>43559791
Yeah I just saw the thread, damn. Must consists of a single faction. Oh well.

ANother question regarding the Vraks book: Does the Arch-Demagogue in the HQ command squad count as a demagogue in that he can take the ordnance tyrant devotion?

>>43559826
If it makes you feel any better, if you were playing me I would have no issue with mixing factions.

Your friends might be the same.

>>43559826
Why wouldn't he count as a demagouge?

>>43559657
Take three.

>>43559851
I'd think he would but the fact that his unit listing listed him as an "Arch-Demagogue" and not just a "Demagogue" like in the troop command squad section had me questioning it. Not sure if there was some strict RAW interpretation out there saying that he wouldn't be able to.

>>43559213
Fluffy-wise? Awesome
Game-wise? You're gonna die

>>43559634
>>43559593
>>43559503
Actually never mind, I just noticed this guy was using a buffmander and trying to target lock his way to cheese (which you can do, the formation states they must all fire are the same unit, while target lock states they can fire a a separate unit)

>>43559657
You gotta pop open tanks before you launch the missiles, lascannons do this well.
Aside from that, giving your deathstrikes the ability to re-roll to hit and/or servo skills work wonders for ensuring the nuke hits the target.

>>43560052
Only if he plays against some kinda min max netlisting WAAC faggot. You know, the kind of player that people don't play against outside of a tournament

>>43560134
>can do
meant can't

>>43560134
Actually I want buffmander for broadsides or guys with plasma rifles.

>>43559479
So you want us to point out the flaws of the list and possible ways to fix it?

>>43559479
where does the khorne lord go?

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>>43559593
>>43559634
Not same anon, but is there anything in specific I can field to combat necrons in general?
Also looking for mostly suits, guess I could run anything, but I'm looking to avoid kroots, ethereals and vespids though.
only been to local shop a couple times, it looks like the majority of players have necrons, though.

>>43560287
Well the whole point of that formation is to deep strike for the bonus BS, and auto arrive on turn 2. If you just want to take battlesuits, play with the farsight book instead.
Thought, considering how many points your wasting on gun drones and missile drones and marker drones, your better off taking the standard hunter cadre. Add in some pathfinders and a few FW for horde control.

>>43560179

I believe you can target lock someone to fire seperate from the combined fire, and the primary target of his unit still gets to combined fire.

What you really shouldn't try to do is abuse the precise wording to screech "BUFFMANDREO ENTIAR GUNLIEN LAWL" like an inbred baboon.

Christ people, I don't know any other community that tries to rape the wording of RAW on such an epidemic level. Usually it's just a few guys off in one corner whilst everyone else has basic reading comprehension.

>>43559419

Complaining about a Xenos sub faction getting an update after a million years is like complaining aout SoB getting updated by saying WOW OF COURSE, ANOTHER IMPERIAL UPDATE.

>>43560416
In my butt.

>>43559419
>Complaining about Corsairs getting an update.

Fuck yourself.

>>43560444

Well, you can do overwhelming firepower perfectly well, so focusing down units shouldn't be hard so long as you don't expect to kill multiple units per turn very often.

From there, it's target priority. Kill the things that can meaningfully harm you first, use jump-shoot-jump like a little shit to dodge the rest.

Warning: Destroyer Cults will be better at JSJ tactics than you: They get move through cover and can freely ping through terrain.

Oh, and take a Ghostkeel unit. Give him a taste of his own unkillable bullshit gimmick.

>>43560449
I do-ont like squshy tau infantry. Shit, even drones better, than pathfinders. And they at least can take some wounds and save suits.

Hey guys, remember that brief period we got gimmicky alternate force org charts that just got you a couple slots shuffled about and a gimmicky obsec replacement instead of putting formations in your formations so you get free benefits whilst you get free benefits?

That was nice.

>>43560134
>Only if he plays against some kinda min max netlisting WAAC faggot. You know, the kind of player that people don't play against outside of a tournament
It's from extremely limited codices.
Those codex only offer that much stuff, no flexibility.

It's not about min maxing, but the fact than anyone can basically tailor his list without even knowing what you intend to bring.

>>43560743
I'm going to Hall of Mirror you in the ass with my BS5 tankhunting -1T miss-rerolling cover-ignoring Ghostkeel if you that stop speaking such nonsense.

>>43560815

Why the fuck is Wall of Mirrors a tau gimmick instead of a Harlequin gimmick?

Srsly, ignoring the rules and just focusing on the fluff effect, that's not even how stealth fields works. It is how the Harlequin holo fields might work if you networked them to make a bunch of bewildering illusions... But stealth suits are for making you invisible.

>>43560892
They really fucked the Harlequin mini-army hard. Too little options and an awful force organization chart (that you are forced to use or go unbound since they don't have an HQ) made it almost unplayable. And even the formations were bad.
I wanted to use it as my main army with allied Eldar/DEldar, but it was really impossible

>>43560777
Wait, so even if I combine three different codex, I still wouldn't have enough variety?

>>43560980

Really just needs a Great Harlequin and maybe something like mimes for some cheaper number-boosting units and it'd work as a functional army.

Not a strong one, but eh, the game had plenty of wimpy armies. It's the no HQ that murders things.

>>43560993
They are not full codex. They are 3 mini-codex.

You don't really have that much after all, especially considering that not all in those codices are worth using.

>>43560574
Its an absurdly powerful update with over the too shit everywhere. It also stole several tricks from DE, who happened to get a codex that sits outside of the current meta.

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>>43561039
Well that's sad.

>>43560444
Why do you need to tailor your list before you play them? A simple, balanced tau army can shoot them down easy.

>>43560462
The combined fire rule says they must target the same unit, while target lock says they may. Sorry pal, you gotta shoot the same unit, no massed split fire buffs.

>>43560601
Well you don't have any good markerlight platforms then, so I would suggest you twin link most everything you can and take a commander with real weapons. The broadsides are already twin linked, just take the puretide chip and join the commander to a squad.

Or you can instead go for double weapons and pray you hit.

Better still, taking the optimized stealth cardre would help you get some ignores cover and you can put marker drones on the stealth suits, they will stay alive.

>>43560777
>It's from extremely limited codices.
What's limited? The vindicare will provide spot assistance, the eversor kills most stuff in melee, the callidus is great for removing 2+ saves
That's not even talking about how much melta and plasma, even base AP 3 the scions can bring.
Then the inquisition can run all manner of things, including 2+ save guardsmen with rending stormbolters thanks to triple monkey surprise.
The only thing limited is reading comprehension, at least until someone wins a tournament with the stuff.

>>43560993
You do, don't listen to these tards. They've never even read those codexes it seems.

>>43561087
The inquisition codex allows for a shitload of stuff. A fair amount don't even have models either so that lets you do some kitbashing fun as well.

The other two are kinda limited though it must be said, but each assassin fills its role out excellently and scions do their not-marines-but-close-enough thing well too.

>>43561032
What were they thinking when they made it, seriously. That mini-dex has what, 7 options? Of which one is dedicated transport and 3 are one character elite options. Which leave us with 1 troop option, 1 fast attack option (that is seriously overcosted for its worth) and one heavy option.
While only a few months later we got the Skitarii-Cult Mechanicus mini-dex with its fucking T7 3+ FNP monstrous creatures

>>43561096

You can declare combined fire with three units, getting the +1 BS and marker sharing.

If a member of unit 2 uses a target lock, the unit still gets combined fire, but the model split firing does not because he is not combining his fire.

Reading comprehension people.

>>43561182
What happens when you load more shit into a buket full of it.
Everyone tries to make it more shitty.

>>43561182
I said no split fire buffs

>>43560743
Yeah and most of them sucked or were required for your army to work.

Dark Eldar and Blood Angels I'm looking at you.

>>43560980
Just take one of the smaller formations on their own.

>>43561096
>good markerlight platforms
Isn't t4 4+ marker drone better than t3 5+ pathfinder?

>>43561285
far less markerlights

>>43561285
Well the stealthsuit leader can take a markerlight, then two marker drones. All of them will have +3 to their cover saves, so infiltrate into a rule somewhere and laugh as you take 2+ cover saves all day.

I think it's 129 points for that unit. Gives you 3 markerlights and 3 burst cannons if you need the extra fire power.

That being said, point for point if you want markerlights pathfinders get you the most.

>>43561340

You want a tiny marker unit with three lights? Take Snipers.

>>43559029

The quick reference sheet link has 404'd.

>>43561340
>>43561361
Non Tau player here. What's the range on markerlights?

Is the Leman Russ Demolisher any good for its point cost? I'm wondering if its worth taking a stock Demolisher over an upgraded Eradicator (plasma sponsons, etc.) to pop DE skimmers.

>>43561376
36

>>43561361
Snipers aren't a marker unit, they are snipers. One markerlight does not make that worth it.

>>43561435
It's an ordinance weapon, meaning you have to snap fire your other guns (so don't give it sponsons)
If your trying to kill DE skimmers, your best bet from a lemon russ is the punisher cannon oddly. A single demolisher shot will just get jinked.

>>43561340
140 pt. And slot. For 3 markerlights and shitty BC.
>>43561376
36

>>43561376
36", and you don't get any kind of save against it

>>43561476

Snipers can take three markerlights.

>>43561376
36''. They're also heavy, so pathfinders can't effectively fire them on the move (marker drones can due to jetpack infantry being relentless, but their bs is bad without a character with a dron controller).

>>43561285

Pathfinders are very cost-efficient at shooting Markerlights, but they are also very fragile. Every competent player will direct their guns towards your Pathfinders.

Marker Drones are more survivable, but cost more and require the presence of drone controllers to give the same amount of Markers. Generally you want a Command Laser-Pointer buffing the accuracy of the Drones into BS5.

Sniper Teams are extremely efficient at providing Markerlights. You can place three spotters with BS5. The problem is that it doesn't synergies well with the sniper drones against heavier target and occupy a Heavy Slot.

Skyray has 2 networked Markerlights with skyray mode. It has the armour of a Hammerhead and it is armed with 8 seekers and can easily shot down the majority of flyers. Also you can use Seeker missiles to murder enemy Warlords.

These are the most common used sources of Markerlights. Other choices are too expensive for their cost, or secondary.

>>43561492

At BS5.

Their main problem is that low mobility means you can't keep line of sight consistently.

>>43561285

You can also buff Marker units with other Marker units in Cascade.

2x Pathfinders + 10x Firewarriors are roughly the equivalent of an Honor Guard.

>>43561476
I was planning on taking a Demolisher alone (170 pts) or taking an Eradicator with Plasma Cannon Sponsons since the nova cannon ignores cover. If I have Pask in a Punisher in my list already, is it worth taking another Punisher?

Kan oi put morkerloits on me power klaw so's what oi kan hit fings betta?

>>43561435
Mid range firepower is DEs bane, like assault cannons and the like.

You have the punisher Gatling cannon right? Slap Pask in one and watch the DE player weep.

Kan oi put morkerloits on me power klaw so's what oi ken 'it fings betta?

>>43561096
Yeah, as for the Scion/Inq/Assassin army, it works way better than your average /tg/ autist thinks. There's really not a lot of limiting, considering the toys Scions and Inquisition get to play with.

>>43561504
Skyray is probably the most fun unit in the Tau codex, so it says a lot that the cheeselords never take it.

>>43561600
Yew stoopid git, dat's wot da fissheez do! Yew fink dey'z any gud at choppin'?

>>43561504
Just want suitonly army, without bunch of useless infantry and only 3 elites slots. %%and no, I hate traitor faggot farsight%%

>>43561599
Punisher is extremely overrated against everything EXCEPT Dark Eldar and 4+ GEQ (as in Scions, Skitarii, that shit). Otherwise take an Exterminator, with sponsons. Better at general shit-wrecking, especially with plasma and Pask.

>>43561635
>useless infantry
>4+ S5 AP5 shooting blobs

Right-o. Don't let the mind-thieves trick you into taking Riptides or the Stealth Mirror Funhouse either.

>>43561600
I'm sorry, mr. Killbeating, but I'm afraid that the markerlights only work in ranged attacks, and even then they need the precision of a carefully trained army to work at their best.
But I'm sure that if you join as in our pursuit of the Tau'va you can a great use of them too.

>>43561643
>>43561599
For DE, right now I have a list for Punisher Pask and Executioner buddy. Currently undecided for a 3rd tank, that I want to keep separate from the Tank Command Squad.

>>43561635
>without bunch of useless infantry
lookit this git

>>43561709
Don't be afraid to go with the vanilla. It's not my favorite, but it is generally the most useful all-around version. It's also the most flexible, and you can tool it for most things.

Do also consider Hellhound/Devil Dogs. They're a lot nastier than they first appear, although the bulk of it is psychology. They scare the piss out of their respective targets, and they're tough enough that they do need dedicated fire to bring down. Which means they're not shooting at your tankstar.

>>43561504
>forgetting Tetras

Typical babby.

>>43561375
Hasn't for me.

>>43561655
Why not? 3x crysis with 2x bc will do it better, than 10x fw squad. And they r t4 3+

>>43561477
>markerlights and shitty BC
Why even play tau?

>>43561492
3 markerlights that can't move, die to any kind of firepower and consume a heavy slot

>>43561574
If you take the other punisher as another tank commander for that BS upgrade, it will prove useful.

>>43561610
>it works way better than your average /tg/ autist thinks.
Since it's not a superheavy for a deathstar that spams invisibility, the top tier noobs ignore it and any possibilities.

>>43561635
>Just want suit only army, without bunch of useless infantry
Infantry win wars son, don't hate on that str 5 at long range with a decent armor save. Kills all kinds of crap.

>>43561835
>Infantry win fire-fights. Tanks win battles. Aircraft win wars.

Get it right, son.

>>43561819
And they will get shot off the board by the end of turn two.

Newfags don't get the importance of cover, and how it makes 4+ infantry a real fucker to kill if they've got a competent player backing them.

>>43561835
>Chimeras? You can take Chimeras for reduced cost and 12pts 3-body tax? Ugh! You disgust me, you CASUAL!

>>43561504
If Forgeworld stuff is taken into account there's also a 20 point signature system that gives you a networked markerlight and target lock, and the Tetra, which is the most effective source of markerlight, being a 35 points (in practice 40 points since you usually want to give them the 5 point upgrade that lets them move through cover) fast skimmer with 2 twinlinked markerlight. Really fragile with av10 and 2 hp, but it can move 12'' and fire the markerlights, and with twinlinked it has a pretty good chanse of hitting with them.

Also with Stealthsuits being mandatory for that really good Ghostkeel formation, I think they can make a pretty good markerlight carrier unit. A shas'uin in the unit can buy a markerlight+target lock for 5 points, and they can get 2 marker drone,s giving you 3 markerlights that can fire on the move and have stealth+shrouded. With drone controller and the formation bonus, they all have bs4 when near the Ghostkeel.

>>43561835

Meh, like I was using more than one Tau heavy slot for my broadsides anyhow.

Snipers usually last the game, they aren't a high target priority despite decent output for cost.

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How does /tg/ feel about Eternal Crusade?

I've heard some people were disappointed, but never exactly /why/.

>>43561874

Buddy, if you took the 900 points it takes to properly kit out a Optimised Stealth Cadre, you probably aren't going to need many markerlights.

>>43561774
I want to try the Hellhound because it has Torrent, and one more STR to use against those skimmers. I'll need to buy one when I get the chance since I don't have one on me.

>>43561868
>Infantry get dug in and are a bitch to kill without templates
>Tanks get shot off the board turn two
>Aircraft don't really do shit, this is Tau we're talking here

Don't go confusing your game of toy soldiers with real life now, anon.

>>43561874
Tetras are very kewl, yeah. They have one hell of a learning curve, but once you git gud with them they are probably about the best source of MLs in the game, for points.

And you may as well kit those Stealth Suits out for ML duty anyway, since they'll be frontlining it with the Ghostkeel.

>>43561905
It's really unpolished, the maps are disappointing, the graphics are actually worse that Space Marine's, the classes are boring, you pay for summons that let you auto-win. Shit like that.

>>43561905
Blatant scamming, broken promises, reduced scope, and shitty execution. And the game isn't even out yet.

>>43561819
18" burst cannon
30" pulse rifle

>>43561925
It is good, but be careful when going against those skimmers. If one gets in your ass, you're gonna get penetrated. Squadrons of two packing Heavy Bolters will be a good bet against the deldarmens, but you'd otherwise probably be better off with a Heavy Flamer so you could roll up to a big blob, hit them with the torrent template in the back, then with the flamer in the front. It's pretty fun.

>>43561967
15“ rapid fire
18“ carbine

>>43561925
Consider Forge World's version, too. Recasted, of course, because fuck that price tag. It's pretty damn nice-looking, and is better than "Chimera with shit on it".

>>43561997
Right, the range where you fire 20 S5 shots into whatever asshole is coming at you is the same as where those Burst Cannons would for basically triple the points, and far fewer wounds.

Enjoy getting grav'd to death, mate.

>>43561932
>the graphics are actually worse that Space Marine's
It's a bit much to compare a games graphics that's in Alpha to a full release.

But in terms of gameplay I'm inclined to agree.

>Tau
charge distance
not charge distance

Is there any way for Chaos to field the Baneblade variants? All I can find is the stock Baneblade, not the Stormsword and the other options.

>>43562041
Normally, I would agree, but Space Marine has been out for MORE THAN 4 YEARS.

And they want to release it as a next-gen console game, too.

>>43562054
No, because FUCK YOU that's why.

IA13 might have it thou.

>>43562054
Ask your opponent. If he isn't a total shitlord, he'll let you use a variant.

>>43559213
good idea but will probably fail, unless you bring massed Acolytes for cheap infantry, or like a Landraider for the inquisitor otherwise you'll get tabled before you can do much.

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Anyone got any tips for scratch building some Renegade rapier laser batteries? I know I've got several lascannon bits lying around, as well as some tracks from some Mantic model.

>>43562112
Use glue

>>43562112
second this, i need 12 for my renegades army and I can't stand the thought of having to go through fw.

>>43562036
120 vs 100 points. Not a big difference.

>>43562112

Mechanius Servitors.

Don't include the torsos.

Done.

I was getting some help last night with my new 1000 point Space Wolf army.

I was told I needed TWC and over-corrected by putting too many on the list. Then I was advised to replace one of the squads of TWC for Long Fangs but I have no idea what to do with them.

Rhino or Drop Pod? Set em up in back to support from distance?

HQ

Wolf Lord (190pts) - Thunderwolf,
Power Armour, Storm Shield, Wolf Claw

Troops

Grey Hunters (195pts)
Rhino
10x Grey Hunter - 2x Meltagun

Grey Hunters (230pts)
Rhino, Wolf Standard
10x Grey Hunter - 2x Plasma Gun

Fast Attack (195pts)

2x Thunderwolf Cavalry - Storm Shield
Thunderwolf Cavalry Pack Leader - Storm Shield, Thunder Hammer

Heavy Support

Long Fangs (30pts)

Total: 840/1000

My thoughts for 1250 are to get a Stormfang, then for 1500 replace the stormfang for the formation I was told about that lets me bring Bjorn with two other Venerable Dreadnaughts for ~440pts.

>>43562111
See:
>>43561835
>>43561610
>>43561096
You literally know nothing. Go back to your muhreenz.

>>43562134
Shit, was thinking of XV9s. Never mind that.

Point about the wounds still stands.

>>43562131
based chinamen

>>43562112
maybe the lower bodies of some of the mechanius troop, the katapron i think?

>>43562112
What this >>43562129 guy said

What are some good way as a Tau to deal with the Cult Mechanicus's Castellan? The only thing that came to mind is mass Kroot to snipe them to death

>>43562153
Thing about Space Wolves is that it's really hard to go wrong with a list that includes TWC. They're really good. As it is, it sounds like a good plan. For 1250 you don't really *need* the Stormfang, but it definitely won't hurt.

>>43561922
You hardly need 900 points for it. 3 Ghostkeels with fusion blasters, bonding ritual and 2 target locks are 433, plus the cost of additional support systems if you want to give them any. Two stealth suit teams are 180 points total, plus the points for upgrades. Stealth suits aren't bad but since they're in the formation primarily as "tax" (the bonus of the formation is tied to the Ghostkeels; if the seatlhsuits die it makes no difference), spending points to increase the team size rather than buing other things for the rest of your army isn't that practical, especially as you're probably already have some difficulties fitting the three Ghostkeels and minimum-sized stealthsuit units along with the Hunter Cadre in most common point sizes.

>>43562214

I originally had two squads of three but was told it was too many. Tactically thinking the advice is sounds since I didnt have the Long Fangs before.

I have enough points to bring two more units of vanilla Long Fangs and still have ~90 pts left over for upgrades.

The only model I have so far is my Wolf Lord on a wolf

>>43562210
That's actually the easiest way.

Definitely do not try to drown them in S5. Trust me, it doesn't do shit to them. There's a Tau player in my meta who keeps trying it on my Mechanicus, and all he gets are burnt-up Fire Warriors.

Instead, Missilesides are an option. Flamers are surprisingly viable, believe it or not. If you can, wait until he uses Conqueror Protocols and snipe the shit out of the datasmiths, then just ignore the immobile robots for the rest of the game. Those Datasmiths are definitely the weak point of the formation, and you have blasts and Precision Shot to take them out.

>>43562250
Yes. You can have too many, don't get me wrong, and Long Fangs are also a badass workhorse unit.

Do decide what you want to do with the LF's before you kit them out, though. They fill specialized roles, far more than vanilla Devastators.

>>43562255
Can monstrous creatures look out sir?

>>43562225

Yeah see, if you treat something as a tax, it becomes a tax.

A unit of 6 stealth drones at BS4 rearing vehicles and mowing hordes is a damn good unit, a unit of 3 is a piddly distraction. Commitment absolutely multiplies impact in this case.

And you don't need to take the Decurions y'know. You'll just monobuild yourself into a corner.

>>43562275
Yes, but the unit has shitty Ld.

>>43562272

I am terribly new so I don't even know what role Devastaors fill..

Any opinion on deployment of Long Fangs?

In a dedicated transport or just footslogging to the nearest cover?

>>43562319
Never, ever footslog your Long Fangs. Buy them a transport. You will not regret it.

Devastators generally sit near the back and pump out mediocre amounts of firepower. Long Fangs, by contrast, are more of a precise tool, but are high-maintenance. They're much killier, but you have to have them closer for the most part, and they need constant management to keep from getting killed. Never feel bad about sacrificing a Rhino to give them a turn of cover.

>>43562319
If you have to foot it to cover, you're playing on a bad table. But yeah if you can't deploy in cover, run.

What's the best way to take out a Knight? Circle with a fast unit so you can either melta it's butt and/or make it use Ion Shield there and you then shoot it from the front? Just spam volume of shots at it and hope some get through?

Motherfuckers' intimidating.

>>43562373

So for transport do I look for a Drop Pod or Rhino?

Appreciate the help. Sorry for playing 20 questions with ya.

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Could Land Raider become Super Heavy Vehicles and the next Lord Of War choice for Space Marines ?

Would that save them ?

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>>43562403
run up and rip it apart, khorne demands giant metal skulls and tiny human skulls

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>>43562403

We had this discussion two threads ago I want to say and it went pretty well.

Obviously it varies from list to list.

For my Dread Mob I was told to glance it a bit with my rokkits and MAYBE lootas while charging my Deff Dreads to take it out in one melee so as not to get ROFLstomped.

>>43562406
Drop pods count as moving, so have fun with snap firing. If you don't have heavy weapons then use it for the old fashion melta attack. Rhinos can help to redeploy them and make sure no one shoots them when they're in a metal box.

>>43562406
Hey, no problem, man. You wouldn't get anywhere if you didn't.

Either is decent, really. The Rhino is more flexible, and gives them decent cover. The Drop Pod lets you put them right where you want them, but you are forced to footslog them afterward.

Personally, I think Drop Pods work better. Long Fangs don't tend to last all that long, ironically, so you may as well deploy them somewhere you can be sure they'll take a bunch of shit out.

That said, don't give up on them as a suicide unit -- they are not that. Try to keep them alive, but don't risk other units (aside from the occasional Box) to do it.

>>43562451
No, just make extra armor standard and give them weapons options. Autocannon sponsons and lascannon turret would kick ass.

>>43562403
Dominions with melta in drop pods around him. It's only 6 hull points, you will shave it off.

>>43562462
>>43562468
Interesting, so essentially pelt it with volume of fire and then tie it up in CC with something big to try and stop it from shooting something else? I'll be facing an Errant with a Chainsword, so I'm scared of the giant melta pieplate.

>>43562477
I've seen a dude kill a baneblade and a knight in turn one with the sky annihilation whatever formation. All them meltas doing d3 + 1 hull points on everything.

>>43562470

Gotchya.

So two 5man units of Long Fangs each with its own Rhino.

Any thoughts for Heavy Weapons?

I was thinking of doing it like my troops with 1 unit taking a Multi Melta and the other a Plasma Canon.

Should I give the Long Fang Ancients matching Melta and Plasma and power fists in each unit?

>>43562403
>Motherfucker's intimidating.
Damn right they are.

Shooting is not likely to get you anywhere unless you have anti-tank on fast platforms like Land Speeders. Engage them in melee with something that's punchy as shit. A Dreadnought, a bunch of Kans, Onager battlesuits. Deploy what you have to to take it down in one melee, because they always win protracted fights with Stomp. It's a better weapon than that D chainsword, funnily.

Either that or glance it for three turns while it battlecannons you. Take your pick.

>>43562497
Wait, it's an Errant? That makes it easy! Shoot it to death from afar, before it can deploy that melta.

>>43562545
The powerfists are unnecessary. But that sounds solid otherwise. Just give them a normal power weapon (a maul, probably) if you really expect them to get into CC.

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>>43562112
Get some 50mm bases, small flying bases and Warmachine Cryx Spell Martyrs. Glue two flying bases to each other into small disc of tzeentch style things. Maybe add some Chaos bits for decorations. Put it on the base with something elevating it, so it looks like it's hovering. Add spell martyr on top.

Make crew look like sorcerers.

>>43562451
Fuck no, 1 LR an army is retarded and GW would know that. I think a game wide buff on sponson weapons being able to shoot at different targets and a slightly cheaper base cost would make them more viable.

>>43562545

>I was thinking of doing it like my troops with 1 unit taking a Multi Melta and the other a Plasma Canon.

You are already thinking better than half the new players I seen.

>>43562589
Those are legion of Everblight models, but otherwise a good plan.

>>43562589
Slaves chained to it pulling them forward, if you can. Heavily greenstuff the 50mm bases, too, otherwise it'll look like you just glued two bases together. Horns, Chaos stars, that sort of shit.

>>43561868
>Aircraft win wars.
Tell me more about syria

>>43562160
I know inquisition can have 2+ armor guardsmen with rending stormbolters and a 5++, did you faggot?

I also know the unholy power of 3 acolytes plus a psyker, only ever using psychic scream, for 25 points.

And much more, but you spend too much time not reading your codexes I guess. Plebs with no free time I guess.

>>43562550
Yeah it's an Errant. I don't have anything that's punchy as shit, but I do have plenty of shooting. He'll likely be running Grey Knights with inquisitorial backup and his Knight Errant. I'm thinking of going with my small non-OP Tau/Necron coalition. It's mostly footslogging infantry, has one flyer, one big tank and a Conclave of the Burning One formation. Hoping I can roll the D on his ass, but it's 24" range so it would be lulzy.

Actually perhaps my C'Tan is the punchy guy. An invuln, FnP and S9 T8..

>>43562539
Yup. That's why Tau and Eldars have the edge with gargantuants since only weapons that inherently have ID can quickly whittle them down.

So now my Space Wolf 1000 point list looks like:


HQ

Wolf Lord (190pts) - Thunderwolf,
Power Armour, Storm Shield, Wolf Claw

Troops

Grey Hunters (195pts)
Rhino
10x Grey Hunter - 2x Meltagun

Grey Hunters (230pts)
Rhino, Wolf Standard
10x Grey Hunter - 2x Plasma Gun

Fast Attack (195pts)

2x Thunderwolf Cavalry - Storm Shield
Thunderwolf Cavalry Pack Leader - Storm Shield, Thunder Hammer

Heavy Support

Long Fangs (90pts) - Multi-melta, Rhino

Long Fang Ancient - Melta Bombs, Meltagun

Long Fangs (100pts) - Plasma Cannon, Rhino

Long Fang Ancient - Melta Bombs, Plasma Gun


I added the melta bombs because I had 10 points to kill.

>>43562661
>Eldars

>>43562650
I have seen C'tan take down Knights. Problem is that it's all luck, but if you feel lucky it's an awesome way to do it.

Send those footsloggers toward it, flank the sides simultaneously, and open up with Gauss Flayers. They will take it down fairly fast, but you'll lose dudes. Not that that should be a problem, you can afford to and he can't.

>>43562599
> I think a game wide buff on sponson weapons being able to shoot at different targets
That's what making them super heavy would do. They're supposed to be super tanks and relics, not taken en masse and blown up by a single melta.
>>43562476
A 5 point upgrade and extra weapon options won't save them, especially if it's autocannons.

>>43562644
You don't need to make the 50mm base any different, it's just to give the thing a good footprint, equal to the rapier. I think 40mm is a bit too small.

Using flying bases for a disc of tzeentch is an old conversion. I think even GW had done it in the past. Just put some blades and spikes lining the edge of it, and it'll do fine.

>>43562589
For rapier laser destroyer batteries? wtf are you on about?

>>43562666

Hail Satan!

Also list looks fairly well rounded for a 1000 point game.

Make sure the Lord joins the TWC

Have your hunters B-line objectives while your Lord and Cavalry challenge anything that looks at them funny.

Long Fangs can be used to follow and support your Hunters or soften up an area or objective to clear the way for the Hunters.

>>43562497
i don't play much but i fought a knight once with my chaos daemons, it didn't do much. managed to charge my flamers of tzeentch but it was flailing around uselessly or i was making my saves easily.

for my chaos daemons i'd have to use some burning chariots, hope for the greater reward with flesh/armorbane, soulgrinders,bloodthrister of D, or another greater daemon. you have to force saves, they're like terminators

>>43562666
Sure, bombs are as good a place to dump it as anywhere.

That looks good. Again, let your TWC be the up-front arseholes, with Long Fangs hiding in cover behind them. Use those Rhinos as cover. If more than two are still alive by the time the game's over, you did Rhinos wrong.

Well, I exaggerate, but you get me. Use them offensively.

>>43562703
>especially if it's autocannons
So you don't think double twin-linked autocannon sponsons would help? That's... well, that's special, anon. Just like making it a LoW is special.

>>43562718
>blades and spikes lining the edge
That's mainly what I meant, yeah.

>>43562736
Well, they're renegades, so Chaos stuff is ok. Rapier isn't a vehicle, it's got toughness and wounds, so it can be organic just as well as inorganic.

Chaos sorcerers bind a daemon to a slave and use wars and runes to control it and turn it into a gun platform, firing powerful beams of warp energy at the enemy.

>>43562701
Exactly, GK are very small modelcount-wise. I could send my Night Scythe against it since he only has a heavy stubber that can shoot at it, Gauss Flayers, my Crisis commander, C'Tan and I can give my Fire Warriors EMP grenades as a last resort.

I think I'll do fine. Honestly I'm afraid the formation might prove to lean towards being OP. Don't want to cause my friend grief.

>>43562703
It would also mean they could move 12" as standard and dumb shit like that. There's no point in making it convoluted.

Referring to meltas, giving them the anti melta armour as an upgrade option would go a long way too.

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So I was able to witness firsthand yesterday the disparity of the current 7th ed codexes. I had a 2k SM list ready to go at my FLGS, nothing ultra cheesy, just a CAD with the 1st company strike force and librarius conclave. only real cheese was a 3 man Cent Dev squad, but the guy I was going to play said to bring some. He couldn't make it so i played a 1v2 game against a guy with Tau, and a Guy with DE.

>Tau dude is a WAAC faggot in his early 40's apparently known for rules lawyering.
>DE player is a bro in his early 20's, these dudes could not be more different.
>Half of my force each goes to take on theirs.
>Tau just delete my units, nothing left after three shooting phases.

I somehow managed to keep a sole marine on a few objectives and won by one point, but all i had left on the board was a rhino, 4 tac marines, and 2 librarians. If it continued to turn 6 I'd be tabled. 1000 points of DE killed 200 points of SM. 1000 points of tau killed 1500 easily. I killed a single suit from the tau and killed off all but a talos and chronos from the DE. The whole time the tau dude was giving the DE dude shit for not killing things.

On the bright side I now have a bud to play fluffy games against, and know to bring only the finest cheddar against the other.

>>43562277
>And you don't need to take the Decurions y'know. You'll just monobuild yourself into a corner.
The Tau Decurion is veyr flexible, thought. You only need need one Commander, three troop choises and 1 FA, HS and elite choise, which can be almost any of the units availeable for the slot (the only common chose not included is a Skyray for the HS slot). Aside from the troops which are pretty much tax, you'll have no problem fitting the requirements with units you'd take anyway (Commander, one Riptide or battlesuit unit, Pathfinders or markerdrones and a Broadside unit), and the bonuses it gives are extremely good (even without going into the buffmander schenanigance, letting multiple units benefit from the same markerlights is a huge deal).

>>43562781
Honestly, that sounds good. I frankly think you're mostly evenly matched, and both lists sound pretty fun.

The EMP grenades are a bit overkill, since he's only gonna have the one big nasty vehicle, but you should do okay. It sounds like it'll be an interesting game in any event.

OSC with 3 ghostkeels vs knight. Who win?

>>43562756
>So you don't think double twin-linked autocannon sponsons would help?
No, not really. Even if what you mean is quad sponson autocannons. Make it quad assault cannons and then we'll talk.

>That's... well, that's special, anon. Just like making it a LoW is special.
So a super heavy vehicle shouldn't be a LoW ?

>>43562793
>1000pts of Tau killed 1500 easily.
Yeah, welcome to the end of 7th.

>>43562841
The Knight, assuming he's smart enough to keep the ion shield on his ass the whole time. You can only shoot rear armor with it IIRC.

>>43562828
Well he does have a Dreadknight too, which has proved to be quite a pain.

but yes I think you're right. The God-shackle makes the C'Tan immune to S4 fire due to T8 but he always takes psybolt ammo so most of his shooting is S5 anyway.

Yeah, makes a change from always pitting my CSM against him. I figured this time it'll be more fun. A buncha footsloggers with a few big tough distraction units going head to head.

Plus I'm hoping to try out my Doomsday Ark against his unit of Paladins and Grandmaster. Maybe can flatten them in one turn. Also he's likely bringing Draigo.

>>43562788
>It would also mean they could move 12" as standard and dumb shit like that. There's no point in making it convoluted.
I'm not sure if you're talking about making them super heavy or if you meant changing power of the machine spirit to apply to all weapons.

>Referring to meltas, giving them the anti melta armour as an upgrade option would go a long way too.
True but currently melta is just one of many things that opens it easily. As long as it just has 4 hull points and can be exploded it's hardly worth the points.

>>43562875
Shit, man, quad assault cannons? In that case, we ARE in LoW territory.

I just meant twin-linked autocannons, one set per side, a la Rifleman dreads.

>>43562893
Yeah, I'd say it's an even match.

Shit, I kinda want to watch it. It sounds like it'll be fun as hell.

>>43562841
Against just the OSC, the Knight can just always keep its ion shield in the rear, so the formation bonus actually bites you in the ass, especially as the Knight's rear armour is the same as its sides. With the short range of the weapons (24'' for the ion guns, 18'' for the meltas), you'd have a hard time staying out of charge range. I'd say the Knight will probably charge the Ghostkeel unit and kill it before they can remove all of its hullpoints.

Now, if the Tau also had something that prevented the Knight from always covering its ass, like a railgun pointed at its front, that'd be different.

>>43562928
The Knight would want to get stuck in with the Ghostkeels as fast as possible, which it could probably do.

My guess? It takes them out and then drops dead next turn.

>>43562920
>I just meant twin-linked autocannons, one set per side, a la Rifleman dreads.
Sorry but they're not really impressive. If you have multiple cheap platforms firing them then ok, but on a Land Rider they will open a Rhino in two turns, one if you're lucky. That or kill two Tactical Marines - they're just not really effective in the current state of the game with everything getting cheaper or tougher, they're too weak to open something quick and have too few shots to hope that enough wounds will go through.

>>43563014
Stick to your 3 TL boltguns and single lascannons then.

>>43562648
Aircraft do win wars. You give infinite time, infinite money and infinite supplies and you'll eventually win. But that's not possible.

In conventional wars, aircraft win it. You can't do shit without aircraft. Syria and the wider ISIS problem is constantly dynamic.

1. Aircraft bombs positions
2. ISIS retreats
3. Allied forces take the place they held
4. Aircraft move to do it else where
5. ISIS return in force and push Allies out
6. Rinse and repeat

I also said wins wars, I didn't say "wins wars on their own".

>>43563064
>applying actual military strategy to 40K

Only bad things will come of this, anon.

Also, the term you're looking for is "poorly executed aerial blitzkrieg".

>>43562880
>>43562928
And if ghostkeels won't use wall of mirrors and just shoot side armor?

>>43562160
You're having a laff if you think he won't get tabled running a deepstrike army alongside Assassins if he doesn't have something durable to couple with it.

If you see someone deploying and they deploy 2-3 assassins and some squishy inquisition shit, you can be pretty sure they will just melt.

Taking a Knight or something that won't die is usually a good idea for that kind of list.

>>43562793
Did you even read your own story or are you always so biased? Anyway grats on your victory with your 7th ed codex.

tell me about techpriests /tg. what drives them? what makes a tech priest a priest? what makes a good priest go bad

>>43563133
Then why not just take Broadsides?

>>43563143
>deepstrike army alongside Assassins
Ah, but I never said that, did I?
Inquisition can bring a surprising amount of tank and tenacious melee, and that's what he'd have to do.

You're of course right when you leave Inquisition out of the equation, though. And a Knight would help, but many people don't like Knights.

So let's say that unit of Berzerkers are 7 4/16" from the Tactical Marines they are attempting to charge. Do the Berzerkers have to roll 7 or 8 to reach close combat?

>>43563107
I know. But it's also kinda true for 40k. If you don't have control of space around the planet, you're fucked.

>>43563172
>what drives them?
Loot and shiny things, mainly. They're kinda like magpies, but with more cogs and skulls and enormous guns and shit.

>what makes a tech priest a priest?
Well, the ones you see in game are all actually ordained ministers of one type or another of the Cult Mechanicus. They literally are clergy, it's just that they all are engineers too.

>what makes a good priest go bad
Again, they REALLY like their loot. Like, seriously, Blood Ravens do not have shit on these dudes. So if somebody tries to deny them said loot, even if it's the Imperium (who they have less loyalty to than most think), it's giant murder robot time.

>>43563186
They'll always hit front armor with ion shield.

>>43563171
I'm not really biased against tau, just this guy fit the /tg/ stereotype of a WAAC player. As an example, when The DE player asked if my cents could go to ground, before I could even explain Slow and Purposeful to him, the Tau dude cut in and called him stupid for even asking. The DE dude looked ready to leave then and there. I was expecting to face Gladius Spam and could not really change my list, and they saw it beforehand and made theirs accordingly. 2 other tau dudes there are pretty cool, this dude was just the only one there at the time.

>>43563247
That is true, and it's generally pretty well-demonstrated in the fluff. Slow-ass Tau ships evading Imperial Space Caddys aside, there's a bunch of circumstances where the only reason they're fighting on the ground is because they want the planet bad enough to not nuke the fuck out of it from orbit.

>>43563186
>Unit has several ways to bypass ion shield and target the weak side/rear armor while also having decent mobility to kite the knight for few turns
>why not take the immobile unit that has to shoot at front armor that is ioned up
Gee boss, i dunno.

>>43563171
>having a good codex
>being an utter prick

These are different things, dear anon.

>>43563290
What is side armor from two sides.

Just because it can't jump across the table like everything else does not mean it's immobile.

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>>43563246
>4/16"

probably 7" since you're not accounting for base size or using the banner.

>>43562920
Haha yeah, I hope we get to do it this saturday. I have a sortof training session tomorrow for a new job, so right now things are up in the air.

Might even get to face an inquisitorial valkyrie! He did it up with the brass etching symbols, it's real nice! And his Knight got painted in blue with slight green in this real nice marble pattern with inks. I'm jelly as fuck.

>>43563246
That's a dumbass question. If you roll a 7, you can charge up to 7". Are you 7" away from the model you want to charge? No, you're 7 4/16" away. You need to roll an 8, dipshit.

>>43563404
>Inquisitorial Valkyrie
Sounds awesome. Wish he'd post pics, because I need some flyer inspiration.

>>43563064

But it doesn't work if the land forces are shit. It's like multiplying by zero.

The easiest counter-strategy against air-forces is simply to disperse your forces.

>>43563430
He doesn't browse the chan but if I can make it/remember I'll try to snap some photos. He's more of a painting guy rather than a converting guy though, so it might be very out-of-the-box aside from the brass bits.

>>43563476
Hey, I'd go for it. Painting makes it, extra bitz or no.

How're the new Eldar Corsairs rules looking? Anyone have build ideas yet? The whole thing with the groups in the formation not liking each other and being allies of convenience amuses me.

>>43563133
They lose the other bonuses from the formation as well (notably +1 bs, as the Knight is unlikely to be in cover). Still, having the Ghostkeels and melta-toting stealthsuits surround the Knight and firing it on multiple sides probably will hurt it. Or you can trick the opponent into assuming you're going to use the formation bonus so he puts the shield in the rear, and then shoot it from the side.

How're the new Eldar Corsairs rules looking? Anyone have build ideas yet? The whole thing with the groups in the formation not liking each other and being allies of convenience amuses me.

>>43563870

I have no idea why this suddenly posted a second time, twenty minutes later.

>>43563505
Will keep in mind. Might face assassins too, likely his Vindicare. Hope I can match up to his power, since my Necrons have the heavy hitters (Overlord in a Lychguard meatwall, night scythe, doomsday ark and C'Tan formation) while my Tau provide oodles of fire support with troops and stealth JSJ shenanigans.

I guess it's all about priority targeting. Maybe I can counter-snipe a vindicare with my Fire Warriors if he rears his head. It'll be fun, since he'll feel every loss due to model count and I'll feel every loss due to being able to counter his.

this is why I will never go cheese Tau or Necron. This way I can still be strong and rely on smart play, rather than show my list and collect my gold star.

>>43563935
See, that's a fun list, because it's not an automatic win button. You will have to work and use the specific abilities of the Tau and Necron forces to be able to do anything. You haven't taken the bullshit formations, so you actually need to play the game.

That's how it should be.

>>43564102
I believe so too. Mind you the c'Tan formation is STRONK (S9 T9 4++ with 4+ RP and 5+ FnP, 5 wounds, both Crypteks have 2 wounds, 4++/4+ RP and IWND and use the shard's T8) but honestly random powers, 24" range and being the only thing that might be considered real good is just asking to get focus-fired. It's a gamble.

>>43563870

I have no idea why this suddenly posted a second time, twenty minutes later.

>>43563186
>Inquisition can bring a surprising amount of tank
>initial post he rebutted recommended taking a land raider or some kind of durability

I'm actually planning on running a simillar list so I can use the Solar Auxilia I'm painfully slowly building up (and rightly so with £70 for a squad) in 40k in the meantime.

May as well post it for shits.

All my current budget is gonna go into Solar Auxilia so this list is literally the few imperium models that I have + Solar Auxilia counts as Stormtroopers / veterens.

1850 points of inquisitorial bumfuck

_Inquisition Detatchmen_

///HQ///

Inquisitor Hector Rex (Warlord) - 175 points

Inquisitor Karamazov - 200 points

///Elites/// (Different detachment technically but it's just easier for formatting)

Eversor Assassin - 135 points

_AM allied detatchment_

///HQ///

Lord Commissar - 65 points

///Troops///

Veterens, Grenadiers (Carapace armour - 75 points
>Karamazov goes here

///Elites///

5 Bullgryns, Power mauls & shields - 310 points
>Hector Rex goes here

_Stormtrooper detatchment_

///HQ///

Command squad, 4 Plasma guns - 145 points

Command squad, 4 Plasma guns - 145 points

///Elites///

5 Stormtroopers, 2 meltaguns - 90 points

5 Stormtroopers, 2 meltaguns - 90 points

_Knight detatchment_

Knight Warden, Ironstorm missle pod, Big hand that throws vehichles - 420 points

Planning on buying some fantasy ogres and converting them to the Solar Auxilia unit so that's why they have that loadout

>Eversor sucks
>You've spent half your points on 4 units
>1 S10 blast will wipe your Ogryns out
>you have no transports

I know all these things, but those points aside what do you guys make of this list?

Ogryns with Hector Rex can lead to S9 Ogryns (S5 + 2 from maul + 2 from Hammerhand) with a 4+ invuln which is pretty scary.

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TFW Tau pathfinders sieze the building with pepe and grab you victory points

>>43563049
Dude, or you being pissy or something ? Yeah, I will stick to them, they're both better at their dedicated job than auto cannons. If you disagree then make an argument for it.

>>43563246
Well you are over seven inches, so you have answered your own question.

>>43564424
Ebin meme mate.

>>43559213
In theory, yes they should work but the Scions are just a very average list that lack the punch needed to be an effective alpha strike list.

I just wish hellstrike missiles were a large blast as opposed to just ordance krak missiles. Then maybe the list would work.

>>43564424
PAINT YOUR THINS.

>>43564556
You didn't need to do that. You've now shitted up the thread with that post. Come on, it's harmless fun. We're all fucking autists to some degree here.

>>43564636
No. Don't get so worked up over a post.

Looking at picking up Cult Mechanicus with Skitarii allies, and I'm wondering if the Skitarii will count for unit count when doing canticles. Obviously they won't benefit, but will they count?

>>43564206
Fuggg, I'm actually a bit conflicted here. I dunno if he's fielding the valkyrie but I only have the scythe capable of skyfire (4 TL S7 tesla shots).

I can get skyfire on my commander but I'd have to trade in either the shield gen or the stims. Both of those together make for a very durable harassment unit considering he also has 2 shield drones. What do? Keep jacked commander or tone it down for some skyfire peace of mind?

>>43563578
formation bonus is declared before ion shields, that doesn't work, he'll know what's about to go down.

>>43564690
No. The Skitarii and Cult Mechanicus codexes are obviously designed to be used together, but they're still entities unto themselves. Special rules don't carry over unless it's specifically said that they do, as is the case with a few of the Cult Mechanicus relics.

Any thoughts on how to spend my remaining points to hit 1850?

+++ New Roster (1811pts) +++

++ Eldar Craftworlds: Codex (2015) (Combined Arms Detachment) (1242pts) ++

+ HQ (120pts) +

Farseer (120pts) [Farseer Skyrunner (15pts), Shuriken Pistol, Singing spear (5pts)]

+ Elites (193pts) +

Striking Scorpions (193pts) [8x Striking Scorpion (136pts)]
····Striking Scorpion Exarch (57pts) [Scorpion's Claw and Scorpion Chainsword (30pts)]

+ Troops (354pts) +

Rangers (60pts) [5x Ranger (60pts)]

Windriders (81pts) [3x Windrider with Scatter laser (81pts)]

Windriders (81pts) [3x Windrider with Scatter laser (81pts)]

Windriders (81pts) [3x Windrider with Scatter laser (81pts)]

Windriders (51pts) [3x Windrider with twin-linked Shuriken catapult (51pts)]

+ Fast Attack (120pts) +

Shining Spears (120pts) [3x Shining Spear (75pts)]
····Shining Spear Exarch (45pts) [Star Lance (10pts)]

+ Heavy Support (130pts) +

Falcons (130pts)
····Falcon (130pts) [Brightlance (5pts), Twin-linked shuriken catapults]

+ Lord of War (325pts) +

Wraithknight (325pts) [2x Scatter laser (30pts), Two Heavy Wraithcannons]

++ Eldar Craftworlds: Codex (2015) (Formation Detachment) (464pts) ++

+ Formation (464pts) +

Aspect Host (464pts) [+1 Ballistic Skill]
····Dark Reapers (140pts) [4x Dark Reaper (100pts)]
········Dark Reaper Exarch (40pts) [Reaper launcher]
····Warp Spiders (162pts) [7x Warp Spider (133pts)]
········Warp Spider Exarch (29pts) [Death Spinner]
····Warp Spiders (162pts) [7x Warp Spider (133pts)]
········Warp Spider Exarch (29pts) [Death Spinner]

++ Fortifications and Stronghold Assault (2013) (Fortification Detachment) (105pts) ++

+ Fortification (105pts) +

Imperial Bunker (105pts) [Escape Hatch (25pts), Void Shield (25pts)]

>>43564741
Pardon me, I was told you seem to be knowledgable about the hobby and I wanted to ask you a question.

Are Chaos Daemons a fun army to play? I was told that they don't really play like any other army in the game and their models look great. I don't mind going multi God.

>>43564874
Maybe give your Farseer the spirit stones of anath'lab? I consider them mandatory.

>>43564905
Fucking autocorrect

>>43564905
>Are Chaos Daemons a fun army to play?

I think it very much depends on what sort of game you want. There's an enormous amount of random chance involved when playing Chaos Daemons - you don't buy upgrades, you buy rolls on tables of randomly generated upgrades. You get very few ranged attacks, and instead in the Shooting Phase, you roll on a big table to see what weirdness happens instead, like Khorne throwing giant brass skulls at the battlefield or enemy Psykers being spontaneously possessed. It's also a largely footslogging assault army, with all the problems that involves in 7th edition, but the ability to Summon large numbers of new units in-game gives them enough attrition to push home into close combat. They do Psychic Powers very well in general but, again, they're randomly generated.

Personally I love them. The models are extremely varied so there's a lot of scope for creating a really eye-catching army, and their playstyle is pretty unique. You've got to be good at thinking on your feet and improvising based on whatever the Codex decides to throw at you - I've had games where my army has had to deal with being reduced to a miserable 6+ invulnerable save for several turns in a row, and others where the opponent can't kill my units as fast as I can create new ones. But if you want a more stable, reliable army which lets you plan out your moves well in advance, you'll probably hate them.

File: AdMech_WarConvocation.png (556KB, 1139x840px) Image search: [Google]

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>>43564690
Not unless you use the War Convocation formation (pic related). It's effectively a single army composed from Skitarii, Knight and Admech units, that lets them all benefit from the canticles (and also get free wargear and ignore gets hot on their weapons). The Skitarii side requires on of each unit (except the Ironstriders, where you have to take either Ballistarii or Dragoons), but the Admech and Knight side just use their normal FOC (so at least one Knight and at least one HQ and two troops from Admech).

>>43564318
Looks pretty good overall, but you're lacking servo skulls. Add another inquisition force and take a few of those.
Also instead of taking 2 command squads with plasma, change the lord commisar to a company command with plasma and carapace, maybe give them a ride.
You might even be able to upgrade the other veteran unit with a ride as well or something.

>>43564905
Daemons are a fun army to play, either mono, dual or multi-god.
There's some massive butthurt over how the warp storm can do damage to your army, but it's not really a big deal.
They play like a specialist army, with all different kinds of units.
One important note, outside of psy powers, they don't really shoot much.

>>43565091
>you don't buy upgrades
technically if you just take the weapons, it's like buying upgrades. pretty much exclusively do that unless we are talking about specific models.

>>43565091
Holy shit you sold me on them.

The random stuff sounds amazing, I love random chance. It makes no two games the same. I don't care if it screws me over, that sounds fun as fuck.

Summoning sounds fun. How does that work without perils?

>>43565116
What the flying fuck? So you can just take a unit and load it up to the gills with whatever shit you want, any and every option is free?

Is this weapons-grade anti-kaiju-tier bullshit or does the codex have fuckall options to begin with?

>>43565091
>>43565126
Also I love melee.

>>43565239
They only peril on a double 6 so it's safer to throw dice at it, as a general rule I say throw double the cost at a power you want to succeed.

>>43565262
bullshit to the max, this is the faction that has special plasma guns that fire three times and relics that make your character take a toughness test a -1 or die.

>>43565239
Daemons can still roll perils when summoning, but only on double sixes. It lets them summon things a lot more safely, although the high warp charge cost still remains. Still, summoning Horrors to gain extra warp charges to summon even more Horrors to gain even more warp charges to summon more stuff, like some kind of matryoskha doll made out of daemons, is a very powerful thing.

The thing about all the random stuff with daemons is that it does add a lot of extra bookkeeping. You randomly roll your wargear (although you get the option of always taking the default choise, and you don't have to roll for the relics), which means you'll have to note down what gear each of your unit champtions and heralds/greater daemons have at the beginning of every game.

>>43565329
Meh I can live with that, it's sounds fun as hell.

Another question, just how good are they in melee? I mean I know the Bloodthirsters and the other greater daemons are good at it (to put it lightly, I have seen them being used) but what about regular units?

>>43565239
>Summoning sounds fun. How does that work without perils?

Daemons don't get any special protection against Perils; generally speaking you just hope it doesn't happen and absorb the wounds as best you can when it does. Your primary Summoning batteries are going to be squads of Horrors, so it doesn't matter much if they Perils, since you'll just lose one model out of a squad of 10+, and they can keep on casting.

>>43565262
It's pretty absurd. Admech armies have quite a few upgrades and weapon options available, and a lot of them are pretty expensive. A squad of Skitarii, for example, can reasonably expect to bring three Plasma Cavaliers (90 points) and an Omnispex (10 points), with a Phosphor Blast Pistol (10 points) and Arc Maul (25 points) on the squad leader.

The base unit costs 110 points for ten, just to put that into perspective. The War Convocation isn't something you should play unless your group is VERY competitive.

>>43565324
>>43565387
Good lord that sounds terrible! I'm surprised I hear more about Eldar cheese when this smells like the ripest batch of brie I have ever laid my nose upon.

>>43565365
>but what about regular units?

Very good, but usually a bit fragile. Daemonettes throw out a huge number of Rending attacks and Bloodletters bring Furious Charging power swords to the table. Plaguebearers have poisoned attacks and auto-glance on a 6, but as you'd expect are really slow and have mediocre WS. Most Tzeentch units can't fight their way out of a paper bag, but Screamers are very fast (they count as Jetbikes) and can swap their handful of St4 attacks for a single one at St5 Ap2 Armourbane, making them really good at eating vehicles in close combat.

The more elite units put their own spins on things, but those are the running themes. Khorne gets Furious Charge on everything and Power Swords on most units, Slaanesh gets bonus to Run moves and loads of high-I Rending attacks, Nurgle is slow but tough and capable of grinding away at things, and most Tzeentch units want to stay out of combat.

The biggest problem is the army-wide lack of Assault Grenades. The Skullcannon can help with this, since anything it hits loses the benefits of cover for the turn, but often your best bet is just going to be sending in a small squad (probably the remains of one the opponent mauled with shooting earlier) to tie an enemy unit up before charging in with freshly summoned reinforcements next turn.

>>43565365
They have a lot of powerful melee units. Daemonetters and Bloodletters, while strong in combat (the latter has a ton of rending hits at high initiative, the former has decent strenght and ap3 weapons) suffer from being pretty vulnerable (even with invulnerable saves they still have one wound and low toughness) and 6'' movement (Daemonettes do have fleet and gain extra run distance, though). Seekers are fragile but fast, Screamers are (strangely enough considering Tzeetch is more associated with shooting than melee) probably the best melee unit aside from the Bloodthirster, due to being very fast, hitting hard and being extremely durable (they can get the ridiculously cheesy rerollable 2+ invulnerable save with the use of a certain relic). Nurgle stuff is more focused on being tough, but with poisoned weapons they can reliably wound anything (except gargantuan creatures, which are only wounded on 6s by poison). I'm still very sore about Bloodcrushers losing their 3+ saves, though. A daemonic rhino made from metal and pure rage should not have an armour save equal to an Ork wearing a leather jacket!

>>43565451
It's compensated by the fact that a lot of units you have to take are overcosted shit, and giving them free upgrades doesn't change that.

Ruststalket and Infiltrator for example are too fragile to work as assault units, and giving them upgrades that make them more powerful on a charge doesn't change that they will be raped before.

Also all those that say that this formations gives you like 800 free points are bullshitting. It's technically true, but more than half of those points are wasted in useless equipment that you take only because it's free.

It's like if marines could take free equipment and so you take a powerfist, a meltabomb, a plasma pistol and digital weapons on the sergent of a Devastator squad. You take them because they are free, but you'll never use them.

All competitive lists of War convocation I have seen require Flesh tearers allies in order to bullshit with drop pod to be viable, and pure skitarii lists with the same allies are usually the same strenght.

>>43565451
War Convocation by itself isn't quite that bad, at least compared to some other top-tier lists, like pretty much anything with Eldar. Free special- and heavy weapons on Skitarii and being able to take all the relics ever without additional cost is great, but most units are rather slow and armed with with low- to midrange weapons, and you have no access to transports of any kind, allowing enemies that outrange you to shoot a lot of your stuff to death before you can make use of all those upgrades (even when loaded to gills with wargear, Skitarii are still only t3 4+ save guys).
Once you ally with Marines and start throwing down drop pods filled with Admech units it gets really crazy, though, as now you don't have to footslog across the board to get all your guns into range.

>>43565365
If you used them right they can beat everything and anything in melee.
Just with mono-nurgle I normally have 3-4 monsters with instant death ap 2 weapons. Aside from them I've got 40+ little guys with their invul, sometimes boosted to a 3++ or even a 2++ if I'm lucky, and FNP.
I've had a single squad of plague bearers get charged by 3 full squads of thundercav. Lost... 3 plague bearers?

That being said if you don't play smart you can get killed from just instability tests. You gotta be careful.

>>43565451
Your basic units are very good offensively but very squishy so you will need to summon a few.

As your bigger stuff they have what I consider the BEST melee units on the game because they're all psykers that can use their powers to buff themselves.
What's scarier than a giant monster? I giant monster that uses it mind powers to move at super speeds or go invisible!
All the powers that were ment to buff wimpy human psykers up to "decent" buff your monster up from "really good" to "can solo death stars"... with some luck.

>>43565451
Well, the difference is that with the War Convocation, all you have to do is not take it. Admech armies aren't inherently overpowered. By contrast, almost everything in the Eldar codex is, to a greater or lesser degree, undercosted for what it does and often outright better than what other Codexes can do. Jump Packs move 12" a turn? Eldar ones move 18". Your snipers have Stealth? Ours have Shrouded. Hormagaunts and Daemonettes get +3" to Run? Banshees get +3" to run AND charge.

This doesn't mean everything in the Eldar codex is completely broken, and it's very possible to play an Eldar army that isn't unfair, but at times it can be pretty frustrating for the opponent. Whatever they do, Eldar do better.

>>43565637
>>43565643
I see, well that's not so bad, though the drop pod shit does sound ridiculous though. I guess it needs an extra step to be true cheese, as opposed to Eldar where the cheese is right there on the deli counter.

>>43564691
Also can I get a reply for this please? I'm a bit stumped.

Blood Angels player. I only like playing Space Marines and I'm interested in starting another army since my BA suck right now.
Which SM army/variant should I play?

I really like Grey Knights but they kind of suck outside of Chaos/Daemon opponents. Also their army list is extremely limited but they are cool looking. Dreadknights are still really good unless your opponent is spamming poison or grav.

Dark Angels get sexy Ravenwing bikers and BS4 OVERWATCH WTF on top of most of the same benefits from vanilla SM.

Space Wolves are really good at assault and get some fucking BANANAS relics and a cool venerable dread and a unique damage type.

Regular SM have tons of units and now White Scars and Raven Guard have unique relics and warlord traits as well as their own decurions.

If anything, the best place to start would be using whichever SM army is the best ally for the Blood Angel's strengths which are assault and fast vehicles.

I need advice.

I love ogres and I want to make an Ogryn list.

Could an army mainly consisting of Ogryn be viable? I'd love the idea of just converting up 20 Fantasy Ogres into Ogryn mercenaries and them being the main part of my list.

Was thinking of this as a list

1500 AM CAD

HQ:

Tank commander, Leman Russ Vanquisher, lascannon - 175 points

Leman Russ Vanquisher, Lascannon - 145 points

Leman Russ Vanquisher - 135 points

2 Primaris Psykers - 100 points

troops:

10 Veterans - 60 points

10 Veterans - 60 points

Elites:

10 Ogryns - 410 points

10 Ogryns - 410 points

1 Psyker will go in each Ogryn squad and most probably roll on Telepathy with 1 of them taking prescience for the Vanquisher sqaud.

The Vanquisher squad is there for 1 main reason - Demolisher cannons.

I want to be sure that no S10 blasts will just shit away 1 3rd of my army in one fell swoop.

>>43565387
>>43565495
>>43565558
>>43565673
>>43565688
Well thanks guys this sounds like the army I was born to play. All the melee and psykers and summoning and random stuff sounds perfect.

As I am typing this I have just ordered a daemon prince off of GW. I'm going balls deep into this new faction.

>>43565721
Well what do you want out of your allies? More melee? Shooting?

>>43565752
Friends don't let friends order from the GW website. If you have a FLGS, try to get stuff from them, otherwise use discount online retailers.

>>43565721
Honestly, for ally Space marines (and I would argue Space marines in general) the best is a chapter of unkown orgin, as the ability to choose your tactics (and by extension, what charecters and relics) doesn't lock you into one play style, so if a chapter's tactics doesn't help what type of list you want to play, just choose one that does.
But grey knights are also a good ally army.
So either unkown origin vanilla marines, and/or grey knights

>>43565718
It should also be noted that as it is a formation the composition of the units is already set in stone. In this case the Battle Maniple is extremely restrictive with what you can take on the skitarii side. That definitely helps tone things down some.

>>43565721
Grey Knights. Unless your meta is chock full of grav/other sources of AP2. In which case probably not Grey Knights. However, if you played Blood Angels for jump packs and assaulting, then you will likely find something to like with the new Raven Guard detachment. Rock out that shit with the Talon Strike Force and assault turn one(in most cases) with the Shadowstrike Kill Team. It will be awesome

>>43565822
For a while, ordering from GW was actually the cheapest option for me living in Malaysia due to lack of flgs and exhorbitant shipping prices from online discount retailers.

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>mfw I cant decide what legion to play
>mfw I just ordered 7 primarchs

>>43565822
Due to the shitty exchange rate, GW is currently cheaper than other sources, sadly.

>>43565729
Yes you can make it viable.
Firs things first, take a priest instead of psykers, you get rerolls from them in melee, he also makes the ogryns fearless.
I would say to remove the 3rd vanquisher

You should have around 185 points left, so spend 110 on two chimeras for the veterans, then 60 on plasma guns since you lack some good AP 2 at range. Only 2 guns per, since that's the max that can shoot out the hatch.

>>43565721
GK don't suck outside of fighting Daemons, they do very well if you don't get grav shoved up your asshole

>>43565955
Oh malaysia? Alright then figured you were elsewhere.

>>43565957
Don't play a legion, play THE legion

Has anyone got any pics of 'good' Ogre to Ogryn conversions?

When searching it seems that all the conversions never repose the arm to properly hold a gun and it always looks really shit.

How good are harlequins? I just got an air compressor and air brush, and want to put them to real use with the Harlies crazy color schemes.

>>43566795
They are fine, but having their eldar buddies around too helps.
If you really wanna paint, make both armies that work together. Would work very well and you can do so by avoiding the d-weapons.

>>43565718
Leave the stims and generator. You have plenty of dudes, so just snapfire it out of the air. It's not as hard as it sounds.

As someone who regularly plays Admech, it's completely cheese-free as long as you don't ally Drop Pods. You want real cheese, take 12 Onager Dunecrawlers in unkillable squadrons of three for 1080 pts, then fill to taste with disturbingly well-armed cheap troops.

That is fucking cheddar.

Would a Double CAD Word Bearers army like this work?

---Chaos Side---

>Dark Apostle with Blind Fury Axe and MoK - 150 points

>2x 9 Chosen with Champion all with power weapons and Rhino transports - 305x2=710 points

>34 Chaos Cultists with Champion all with CCWs - 150 points

CSM side is all bent on using the Apostle's abilities to make them close ranged beasts. Cultists and Chosen are both very Word Bearer things to have, too.

---Daemons---

>Fateweaver - 300 points

>4x Heralds of Tzeentch on Discs Psyker Level 3 - 120x4= 480 points

>6 Screamers of Tzeentch - 150 points

>10 Horrors - 90 points

>3 Flamers of Tzeentch - 69 points

Fateweaver for rerolls, Heralds for divination while having Horrors and Screamers for mass Horrors/Screamerstar, and Flamers for support. Yeah mostly Tzeentch daemons, but Tzeentch daemons while having MoK on CSM seems like a Chaos Undivided team that's willing to use the best of everything like Word Bearers.

>>43566973
Look up 1dchan CSM tactica, it's good some good tips there,

Generally Chosen with power weapons suck balls as they cost as much as terminators but don't have any of the benefits.

Fateweavers a bit of a point sink without the Grimoie relic, you get a lot of powers yeah, but lose all the versatility that comes with having an MC as he can't take a hit and sucks in melee.

If you want a really fluffy Word Bearers list looks up the Crimson Slaughter supplement. They are basically a renegade space marine warband who turned into Word Bearers.

>>43559213
I play straight inquisition and assassins, sometimes I will play deathwatch(space marine veterans).
Fluffy and fun with wacky inquisition stuff to mess around with.

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So guys, it's the guy who was asking about the Hades Breaching drill again, Someone posted a rulepage that said regular IG can use a veteran squad to substitute for a Death Corps Engineer so that regular IG can use it, but is this acceptable in basic 40k rules? I didn't find anything about the Breaching Drill in the Astra Militarium Codex or the Rulebook

>>43567171
Chosen are overall less expensive than Berzerkers though, no? And do the same job as close range MEQs if equipped with power weapons? I might take out Fateweaver cuz extra reroll really ain't that important and I can maybe field a Termie squad and give my heralds Grim of True Names instead.

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Hey guys are the Dark Eldar any good?
I was clearing out my brothers stuff and I ran into a box of them. I've always wanted to get into this game but haven't because it's expensive af.
But now I've got a box of this stuff already so I'm just wondering is the race worth investing more in?
I like to be at least a bit competitive in games I play so I don't wanna play some janky ass shit.

>>43566973
If you want to use chosen that way, they need a landraider, otherwise they can charge when they exit their ride. Also one unit of chosen will work, I would recommend taking a unit of MoT warp talons, because these can get a 2++ if you really want it.

Word bearers using screamer star? Please, don't embarrass yourself.
Just take a single herald with the grimore, you also need another unit of horrors. Also make sure your chosen have the MoK and the icon of wrath.

>>43567294
As a first army? They are really hard to play
Complete glass cannons and considering there's a lot of ignore cover floating around these days, your boats won't make it to the enemy.

If you want to start them, wait for their next codex update. Only that can make it worth it for you.

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>>43567283
big blue warhammer 40k stamp instead of Apocalypse stamp. It's good for 40k.

It's in one of the imperial armour books.

>>43567283
Evidently it is. I remember the post of that rules page.
I guess go back through the archive, print it out, and if anybody challenges it say "it's in Imperial Armor What-The-Hell-Ever, got the page here."

>>43567351
Oh okay. So not that good then?
When's the codex coming out then? Are there like release dates for that?

>>43567503
>>43567535
Never mind.

>>43567294
The short answer is that they are very very unforgiving and as such make it very hard for new players to have a positive experience with. On the competitive scale, they can be plenty competitive if you ally them with Eldar(but then again what isn't competitive if you ally with Eldar) but on their own you have some serious problems. They are not insurmountable but they are pretty fucking glaring and people will exploit the shit out of them when playing against Dark Eldar.

>>43567503
Fuck yes, would it be possible for more than one or am I probably looking at just one?

>>43567563
>>43567535
>it's in Imperial Armor What-The-Hell-Ever, got the page here.

Imperial Armour 1, 2nd edition I believe.

>>43567594
In a CAD you can run 3 (1 for each elite slot)

>>43567621
CAD?

>>43567670
Combined Arms Detachment.

>>43567288
No, Chosen with Power weapons are way more expensive and they have different roles.

Generally, Chosen are best for special weapons like melta, Plasma and Flamers.

The problem with melee chosen is, if you actually give them a power weapon they cost about 30 points, which is the exact same cost as a terminator.

For the same cost you could a 2+ save model with access to a combi weapon and a heavy weapon if you take 5.

Also don't listen to >>43567351 units with MoT can NEVER get more than a 3++ and both Land Raiders and Warp Talons are awful.

The 1d4chan page will give you a fair bit of info on how unit work and common pitfalls with them.

Other than that, how do you actually want your force to work?

Do you want Tzeench daemons with Word Bearers support or Word bearers as the main force?

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So I've got Lorgar and Vulkan here, but I'm torn on which chapter I want to run. They're both pretty different so I'm having a hard time deciding.

So if you had to choose, Word Bearers or Salamanders?

>>43567294
Tbh they kids suck at the moment.

Their firepower is very mediocre, which hurts them like hell due to them being a "glass cannon" and their entire protection is based around cover saves.

Which are laughed at in the current meta.

Plus there are some nigh unwinnable match ups, Tau with their new codex are the best example. Eldar literally do everything DE do but better.

I would say wait for a new codex, but that is a few years away at best.

>>43567756
Word Bearers personally, but that's because they do some of my favourite things in fiction, which is weaponising the supernatural and using the warp and daemons to fight.

Salamanders seem pretty cool though.

>>43567756

That is the face of a man who is exceedingly tired of SOMEONE'S shit...and that someone is probably everyone.

>>43567294
>>43567540
Don't listen to this dude, I don't know what kind of god awful advice he is giving >>43567351 Dark Eldar are a 7th Edition codex which means you wont have an update for atleast a year, maybe longer, so that isn't any advice, that's just bullshit.

They are tricky to play but have a fair few good units.

Generally, they are on the same powerlevel as about half of the armies, who are way below the others. This means that they can be fine depending on what people at your local scene play, or they can suck if they are the WAAC type (mostly there is a mixture).

If you like the aesthetic though go for it.

A lot of their units are awesome, there are just a few trap units that suck massively.

>>43567572
>>43567758
Well damn. Kinda shame they go to waste then. Oh well.
New question. What is like the average cost of a decent 1500 point army if you start from scrap?
If it's race specific lets say necrons cause I always thought they were rad in DoW

>>43567923
One chick at myFLGS runs DE and has a pretty massive amount of them, at that.
Trying to pick up Tau sometime, anything in particular I should be afraid of when she fields them?

>>43567941
For 1500? About 400-500 USD. Rule of thumb is 1/3rd of points cost.

>>43567756
I've never really gotten the Salamanders aethetic as they just seem Lizard themed compared to all the other chapters having a cultural theme (I know it's aztecy but fuck, they could've done a better job) so I'd defo go with Word Bearers.

They seem more interesting and some of their models are just fucking amazing, like the dude with the Blade Slaves (cant remember his name).

Also their unique legion stuff seems way more interesting than Salamanders.

>>43567969
Does she run vanilla or covens?

Because I will be straight with you, you will DESTROY Dark Eldar with Tau with not much effort as you are pretty much their direct counter.

>>43567969
No, Tau fuck over DE massively.

You need to actively avoid bringing stuff that's too powerful to avoid fucking her over too hard.

>>43567969
Not really, everything Tau has is like a built in hard counter to Dark Eldar. Jinking Raiders? Markerlight those suckers. Charging units? S5 AP5 will mulch them. Talos Pain Engine? It'll be in pain when your battlesuits show it how a real Monstrous Creature does things.

However, if it's DLFG, and I suspect it is, army gimmicks are not going to save you. Thing with Tau is synergy. Sperglords on this board don't know how that works, so they lump a bunch of battlesuits of one kind or another together and plug holes with Fire Warriors. That's not a good plan. You need to know what each unit does, how it complements other units in the book, and how they fit into your basic strategy.

Tau are a good beginner army, but don't be that guy who shits Riptides everywhere and mauls everything.

>>43567988
Most stuff is way more interesting than Salamanders, to be fair. The only part of their fluff I ever enjoyed was when they got sent into Terra's core to wipe out a DAoT robot mining colony, before there were Primarchs or anything. It was a pretty cool piece of fluff.

>>43567923
That doesn't sound too bad desu. By the way those other guys were talking it sounded like if i take a DE army to my lgs i'll just get demolished.
So is there like a guide for building an army somewhere? What are the trap units so I can check if my box has them?

>>43567941
>>43567986
Cost depends on 2 major factors.
1. Where you're buying them from. If possible, don't get em from GW. Local gaming stores or discount retailers are better bang for your buck.

2. The components of the army. Hyper elite armies are cheaper due to lower body count. Buying limited transports or vehicles also helps keep the costs down.

For example a hyper elite army like Grey Knights should go for about 300 usd. Maybe even lower if you can score some sweet deals. 300-450 would be for the rest of the factions assuming you keep to the cheaper models/get sweet deals/battleforces. 450 to 600++ are typically reserved for horde type armies. Hope this helps

>>43564318
that formatting is horrible. that aside it might just work

>>43568136
They're very hard to play. Your first couple of games, you probably will get demolished. But once you get over the learning curve, they're a pretty damn good army.

As for list-building, get started with 1d4chan tactics for them, as it's a good place to get your bearings. Then set out on your own and experiment like a Haemonculus with several lifetimes of repression.

>>43568136
I'll list a few trap units now, because I'm a nice guy:

Wyches, hellions, anything other than Khymera in the beast master unit, a kitten out melee archon... and voidravens, although others might tell me I'm wrong there.

Haemonculus covens are pretty good by the way.

>>43568000
>>43568023
Hm, that's good.
Also probably vanilla.
Runs a couple (with a few blue tinged, at that) grotesques and seems pretty gleeful about running them, so my Tau crushing DE seems pretty good fluff wise. And I just like the idea of crushing dark eldar anyway.
>>43568082
>dont be that guy who shits riptied everwhere
I gotta be honest, I probably would have done that not too long ago, or the same with crisis suits.
im still not exactly sure what markerlights are, i need to read more tau codex, I'm -quite- new

>>43568136
Avoid Wyches and Hellions like the plague. If you want to take Wracks, Grotesques and the Pain Engines, use the supplement. The stars of the codex are the Kabalite Warriors, Scourges, the Raider, Ravager and Venom. Everything else is dependent on local meta so your mileage may vary.

>>43568212
Does she have any other armies or just Dark Eldar?

>>43567503
I'm pretty sure those rules are out of date now. Latest rules have it with a toughness value and shit.

>>43568247
That's kind of what I was thinking. I really wanna use that drill but don't wanna drop the dosh on Krieg Corps

>>43568212
It's really okay. We all were new at one point, and the cheese sucked a lot of people in.

Markerlights are a shooting weapon that does no damage, but highlights its target so that you can gain several effects like cover ignoring, boosted Ballistic Skill, things like that. They're a pretty important part of playing Tau, but they're also pretty easy to learn.

>>43568244
Unsure, why?
I'll ask next time I see her.

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>>43567796
>>43567988
>>43568123
Well, I was leaning towards Word Bearers anyways, but I think you guys solidified it for me. I love the batshit crazy preacher look, and Lorgar's fluff and model is what pushed me over the line I think.

Now I just gotta work on some lists. I've never played CSM before, and I dont think the local folks play 30k all that much.

>>43568212
Here's the thing. While the odds are in your favor, you should remember a couple of things. Doubly so if you're new and the Dark Eldar player isn't.

1. Tau is all about synergy as >>43568082 said. This is good... and it is bad. While it means your army's power rises exponentially when working together, losing one unit can cause massive drops in damage output. You need to make sure your army can take losses or else the moment you lose a key component, the war machine just might break down and then it just goes to shit from there.

2. Even if you're new you must have heard that Tau crumble the moment they get into melee. Yes, the Tau has some great anti melee tricks up their sleeve. They are not I Win buttons though and require some thought on how to use them. If the Dark Eldar player is crafty enough, you can expect to see a bit of melee combat.

I thought there was a third point but those two seem the most pertinent at the moment. Good luck, man.

>>43567540
We don't know when a new book would come out. Hell your best bet may be an edition update.
It's not the kind of army for a beginner, it can work and it can work well, but damn it's tricky to play them, outside of the one formation using high toughness guys with power from pain stacking.

If it's what you really want to play, go ahead. I just wanted you to be aware it's not an easy thing to do.

>>43567755
If he want's to run chosen with power weapons, let him. It's something like 5 attacks each on the charge, with MoK and the icon at +1 str, which is pretty good.

2++ works btw
5++ becomes 4++, then during game you use the book to reduce by two, into a 2++

>>43567923
>They are tricky to play but have a fair few good units
That's just saying play the one combo or go home. He needs to be aware how difficult it would be to play them.

An edition update could help DE, after all they used to have a cover save on skimmers just from moving in 6th, but that changed in 7th which sucked for them.

>>43567941
Cost is dependent on the source of the models. You can find good deals on ebay and such. You can build a 1500 point army for $300 USD or for $3000...

Nercons are a sturdy and flexible army, good for beginners since their guns pretty much hurt everything. You don't have to worry about bringing the right weapon mix, just gauss, gauss and more gauss, then a little something to kill stuff with a 2+ save

>>43567969
>anything in particular
Besides the fact you will nearly table the DE in one turn, maybe two? No not really.

>>43568136
It's not terrible, but if you play against tau or anything with a good amount of stuff that ignores cover saves, your dead. As in you may want to pass on the match.

>>43568215
>The stars of the codex are the Kabalite Warriors, Scourges, the Raider, Ravager and Venom
Old DE best DE

>>43568315
They're getting a new 40K codex soon-ish, supposedly, so don't worry about meta with them too much, and don't buy any units you think are ugly until new model releases hit.

They really are best traitor legion, though.

>>43568315
If you don't mind waiting, I'd wait and see what the new year brings. CSM and Daemons are one of the last few 6e books to get updated. How they get updated remains to be seen but I'd say odds are good they'll see some kind of update within the first half of next year. So wait and see what the new year brings before committing to a list and buying shit. My two cents

>>43568254
Either way it will still be legal in an IG army. FW aren't the sort to keep stuff off limits to other armies that fluff wise are the only ones that have something (for example, only DA have mortis dreads but every other marine chapter can also bring them but in a more limited fashion).

>>43568136
Here;s the tactica: https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Dark_Eldar(7E)

1d4chan is generally a good guide for new players but it does get some things wrong and miss some good things.

You wont get demolished most likely and if you do you can just ally in some Eldar.

I've seen people use Wyches they converted to have more armour as counts-as howling banshee's and it's pretty cool.

Trap units are Wyches and helions as another anon pointed out.

Good units that don't get the credit they deserve are Scourges and Reaver Jetbikes imo.

Reavers are some of the cheapest jetbikes in the game and have really fun special weapons.

Scourges on the other hand, are amazing for deepstriking special weapons.

>>43568311
Oh just in case she decides to bring allies. But do update us.

Also, and last question I swear, where do you live? No specific locations for obvious reasons, but country/ city is cool.

I have my reasons for wanting to know this, honestly.

>>43568143
Oh okay I see. Thanks for the info.
>>43568179
I've been scanning through the 1d4chan page it's good stuff. Probably gonna go shopping tomorrow for some important additions. And paint i guess.
>>43568208
I definitely have some hellions. Damn they looked like green goblin so i thought they'd be rad. Oh well. Cheers for the advice.

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>>43568340
>>43568360
Okie doke, I wasn't in too much of a hurry anyways. I grabbed that Calth box because I have a massive hard-on for Contemptor's. I'll have plenty to occupy myself with while I convert the living shit out of these models (once they get here).

Gonna have to get better at painting wee little lines of text.

>>43568363
Fuck yes then, I'll try and pick up one, it fits my personal fluff perfectly.

>>43568383
I personally think that after reading it, the Dark Eldar tactics are one of the poorer tactics pages on 1d4chan. The person who wrote it seems to be under some illusion as to how good DE are and regulatory speaks of "hosing down blobs" of guardsmen with little effort and other unrealistic things.

It seems kinda bad imo.

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>>43568317
oh yeah I'm not new to 40k enough to not know the tau being garbage at CQC buh, buh, but they cant even fight in melee!, just new to actually bothering to learn all the rules for this edition.
I've done a metric ton of the DOW games and done a decent amount of other shit.
I tried it out all the way back in like 4th-5th, but it was too complicated/expensive back then.

>>43568322
>Tabling an an opposing army in one turn
>tfw

>>43568385
New mexico, but I'm attempting to move to other states soonish.

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>>43568247
>>43568254
I guess you either can't use it anymore with regular IG, or you'd use the old rule set.

Honestly, you'd have to email FW about it.

This is from IA5 part 2.

>>43568498
I was skimming it and noticed the same thing. 1d4chan tactica really shouldn't be trying to sell an army, that's GW's job. I may go back through and clean house to one extent or another.

>>43568531
It's in the new Siege of Vraks book. Very recent. It can be taken as an elite choice in the Imperial Guard codex. It costs 100 pts.

>>43568550
Based anon.

>>43568531
I looked it up proper, the previous image with the drills rules is the newest for the imperial guard, the ones you posted are the newest for that siege army list and the one with a toughness value that I was thinking of is the newest for the death korps.

This is a clusterfuck and a half but that's as much sense as I can get out of it.

>>43568215
I guess i'll need to scan the players when i go to my lgs tomorrow to know what i'm up against.
>>43568322
I understand. It's just more compelling for me to go for them as I have a decent base for building an army. I might go for the necrons though if i can find some good deals.
>>43568383
What does the 'allying in' mean basically? Can I just add any eldar units to mix in with my DE?

>>43568661
So am I going to need to buy both of these rulebooks to take with me in order to correctly use the drill in my regular IG?

>>43559761
IA 13 replaced all the vraks books from a chaos perspective yo...it is better in every way.