/swg/ Star Wars General

I wonder when ffg will make Republic Assault

>republic clone commando expansion

>all of my credits

Has anyone else read the Star Wars ring theory? I'm not sure how much of it was just bullshitted but I almost want to believe now

>>43519580
are you talking about xwing or the RPG?

>>43519580
None of the designers like the PT very much, or at all. Best things you can hope for are fan-made rules and miniatures.

>>43519587
Wan't it basically like the Jar-Jar thing where it's just POETRY, IT RHYMES joke taken to obscene levels to imply George is really a mastermind and knew what he was doing the whole time?

>>43519982
I'm not sure even Lucas believes he knew what he was doing. Just look at Episode 1. It is, by all criteria except special effects, a horrible movie.

>>43520082
>>43519982
I dunno, I read all 8 pages and there's definitely some intentionality to the scenes and how they mirror the original trilogy, but then again some aspects of Menace just boggle my mind

>>43520137
isnt that like saying how Metal Gear Solid 2 was intentionally trolling people who liked MGS 1?

>>43520518
so you're saying its like making the prequels intentionally bad just to troll fans?

If the theory is true, then I feel like Lucas just tried to do too much, and it came out looking like a mess. Film artistry aside, the movies were still shit.

Thread reminder that even if the PT sucked, it provided us with some very, very, VERY cool spaceships.

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>>43520990
Style was the only thing the PT had in excess. A lot of things from the era look damn sexy.

>>43520990

I don't deny. The PT was shit, but the artists were on their fucking game there. It's a shame they appear in such shitty movies. They do get some more notable appearances later on, though.

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>>43520082
>>[Episode 1] is, by all criteria except special effects, a horrible movie.
I don't see it and never have. At worst it is just an average action movie.

For X-Wing, can someone give me a good rundown of the Rebel "letter" ships? I've been looking up reviews, and it seems like some are pretty good with the exception of X-Wings and A-Wings that just have a few awesome pilots.

>>43521111

If you divorce it from the Star Wars franchise, what you're left with is an action movie that doesn't hold its salt against pretty much any other action movie ever. It's just a shit movie all around, but we all have cultural PTSD because it was a product of a franchise that everybody loved.

>>43521121
E Wings outside of their aces are also pretty expensive

B Wings are dope, especially with their crew slot upgrade.

T70 X Wings are basically T65s but better in every way

turrets on y wings are mandatory, either twin or ion.

alsways have advance slam on k wings

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What should be next on my rebel buy list? E-Wing? Y-Wing?

Planning to get the Imperial Raider just for the TIE/x1 cards, and maybe a Shuttle.

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>>43520082
>Just look at Episode 1. It is, by all criteria except special effects, a horrible movie.

The special effects in episode 1 are shit, though. Remember the Windows 95 field the gungans and robots fought in? That entire sequence where the robot dropships are unloading droids looks like it's straight out of a PS1. Or how about the really shitty Yoda puppet in the theatrical release? That was better looking than Yoda in Empire? Golly.

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Someone post an actor, others post the idea of a Star Wars characer he inspires him.

>>43520082
It's mediocre as a movie but not horrible.
2 is horrible, 3 is mediocre too.

>>43521225

Might have to invest in some B-Wings. I've heard they combo well with A-Wings, speedy interceptors to help protect the heavies. Y-Wings sound fun with Ion turrets, especially with some ships to get in and help take advantage of that.

T-70s are more expensive, though. Of course, Poe is apparently a beast.

>>43521325
A grey Jedi for sure.
A not-so-benevolent-benevolent grey Jedi

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ay mates, does Star Wars Rebellion look any good

>>43521378

I just give them all Fs. At least E1 pretended to have a semblance of a story structure, but on every level all the movies pretty much failed at everything a movie is supposed to do other than run on for an hour and a half.

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>>43521165
I enjoyed the OT when I saw them at home and I enjoyed the PT when I was 14+ watching them in theaters. In recent years I learned people fervently hated the PT, especially the Phantom Menace. However every argument I hear against the PT applies to the OT as well. Star Wars was never good, but if you can relax it is at lest entertaining.

That's why I prefer to talk about it on /tg/. As shit as the movies are the universe is still a lot of fun.

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>>43521111

>complicated plotline
>no actual protagonist
>Qui-gon "the Worst Jedi" Jinn
>Jake Lloyd
>Jar Jar
>Midichlorians
>Anakin is the Chosen One, conceived of the Force
>Robots that need binoculars to see
>The villain jobs it at the end of the first movie
>The Republic's structure makes absolutely no sense.
>The bad guys are Space OPEC run by racist Japanese aliens
>Where the fuck exactly did that lightsaber duel even happen?

It's pretty bad. Granted, I'll go on record to say I think Attack of the Clones is worse.

At the very least, Phantom Menace actually had moments--like the podrace--that were incredibly memorable and felt like something you should see in a Star Wars film.

>>43521325
Comedy relief droid or alien.
Maybe Sith emperor

>>43521478
Looks neat, like a game my friends and I made and used to play when we were younger.

>>43521511

I recently re-watched the OT, sans all the Lucas edits since fuck that. He ended up bringing a lot of what went wrong with the PT into the OT through those edits, cluttering up the scenes, having more scenes that didn't help the setting or dragged already long-stretched scenes out even more, needless CGI enhancement and CGI scenes that added pretty much nothing to the story, plot, or setting whatsoever...

The only place I can see a need for some digital help might be during the fight at the first Death Star (not the opening lead up shots, the fight itself) because those dogfights are hard to choreograph and it shows. As soon as they enter the trench, though, it's a pretty fucking tight scene. They do also end up changing a lot of English to Aurubesh, which is a nice touch, but unnecessary.

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>>43520990
>>43521044
>>43521050
PT? prequel trilogy?

>>43521643

Yes. PT=Prequel Trilogy, OT=Original/Old Trilogy.

This has probably been asked a million times, but anyone got data files for the OggDude's character creator?

>>43521496
Most dialogues in 3 are pretty good, and 1 has some good scenery and the podrace.

>>43521562
>not comedy relief who is actually a Sith Lord

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So how about them laygoes

>>43521739

>Most dialogues in 3 are pretty good
>"Hold me like you did on Naboo"
>"From my point of view the Jedi are evil!"
>"The oppression of the Sith will never return!"
>"For the clones to discover the recalibration, a long time it will take"
>"Love can't save you Padme, only my new powers can!"
>"I have the high ground!"
>"I have seen a...security hologram of Anakin...killing younglings" *tries not to smirk*
>That entire "so love has blinded you?" exchange

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>>43521875

>That Carbonite Han

>>43521953
>outside the Padme-Anakin dialogues

>>43521561
>Qui-gon Jinn
>not the best Jedi
Nigga if he wasn't dead before the Clone Wars things would've gone differently

>>43521999

>only three of those are Padmakin dialogues

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>>43522041
>Best Jedi
>Any OJO member
Not even close. Luke Motherfucking Skywalker is the greatest Jedi.

>>43521561
>>43521561
Lets see how that list compares to A New Hope:
>complicated plotline
Slightly simpler still snakes around following the D-Star plans instead of the Queen
>no actual protagonist
The reason R2 is so popular, I though he was the protagonist at 10 and I can see why re-watching it now
>Qui-gon "the Worst Jedi" Jinn
Just as bad as Ben "Random wise sounding words" Kenobi
>Jake Lloyd
Young Mark Hamill
>Jar Jar
C3-P0
>Midichlorians
Magical religion
>Anakin is the Chosen One, conceived of the Force
Luke is the Chosen One, uses magic to destry the D-Star
>Robots that need binoculars to see
I don't even get this. That's the point of humaoid droids.
>The villain jobs it at the end of the first movie
Ya that was a bad choice
>The Republic's structure makes absolutely no sense.
As opposed to the Nazi Empire
>The bad guys are Space OPEC run by racist Japanese aliens
Because fighting evil corporations is a new sci-fi concept right?
>Where the fuck exactly did that lightsaber duel even happen?
In a sci-fi building like every lightsaber fight in the OT.

I guess my point is I don't see how TPM is that much worse than the rest of Star Wars. Is it bad in the continuum of Star Wars? Maybe. But as a whole compared to every other movie they aren't that far apart in being fairly average action flicks.

>>43522079
Well, you got Motherfucking right but you seem to have misspelled Kyle and Katarn, anon.

>>43522079
You're right, I was internally adding "of the prequel trilogy" to the end. Sorry

>>43522041
Nothing would've changed. Qui-Gon would've handled Anakins training exactly as Obi-Wan did. Search your feelings, you know even Liam Neeson couldn't save that character.

>>43522138
What if he was kidnapped by gangsters?

>>43522041

See, this is the main problem with Phantom Menace.

It's an utterly pointless movie. There is absolutely no reason we need to see Anakin as a kid. If Lucas had started the movies with Anakin already as Obiwan's padawan we could have had an extra movie to pace everything out properly.

And Qui-Gon and Dooku could have been given proper series spanning roles.

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>>43522112
>Kyle and Katarn
No longer canon, unfortunately. You know how it is. There are people in these threads who get triggered every time Legends characters are brought into character comparison arguments.

Still, Katarn's live-action actor expressed interest in reprising the role. Fingers crossed for the Second Coming of Mandalore the Bearded.

>>43521739

The podrace felt like it fit in Star Wars. Unfortunately, it didn't feel like it fit the movie. Such an action packed sequence stuck exactly in the middle of a movie compared to the lackluster and cluttered ending. Also those fucking aliens. And for such action there's not a lot of weight hinging on it. We've got a contrived and confusing bet to do something or other and the action doesn't advance the plot, raise the stakes, or show character development, but instead is something that needs to be sat through to advance the plot.

Some of the scenery was okay, the Gungan City, save for the shitty Gungans themselves, was absolutely gorgeous, wasted on such a shitty movie. By contrast, their fight on the Windows 95 default background was not a very impressive use of scenery.

>>43522097

Are you an android built by the government to misunderstand effective use of plot, characterization, and story structure, or did you take negative levels in WIS?

>>43522169
>Katarn's live-action actor expressed interest in reprising the role
So I take it he's STILL not a content old man, then?

>>43521875
>the human rebel with the jetpack gets a helmet
>the duros doesn't
That annoys me.

>>43522169
Legends is canon, it is it's own canon separate from the mainline canon. It is like Comic Batman vs. Movie batman if that is easier for everyone.

>>43522097

Dude, script aside, Alec Guinness fucking sold A New Hope and you best show some respect. No matter how wacky the stuff George had him say, he said it all with total gravitas and seriousness, and it forces you to shut up and take the movie seriously too.

>>43522181
>save for the shitty Gungans themselves
Gungans were pretty nice outside of Jar Jar

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>>43522198
He seems to be running a pretty chill life as a wine enthusiast, IIRC. It's just that he'd be cool with coming back if asked.

>>43522261

Now I want Kyle Katarn as a random, chill wine-sipping cameo in the movie that will baffle everyone.

>>43522097
>Luke is the Chosen One, uses magic to destry the D-Star
I don't remember Luke throwing Sheev's ass into ventilation shaft

>>43521755
like a Disney villain?

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>>43521659
>Old Trilogy.

>>43522281
Wrong Death Star, dimwit.

>>43522293
No, more like
>introduced as a comic relief
>is actually a Sith Lord

>>43522276
Until a squad of stormtroopers bust down the door.
Then the Bryar comes out from under the table.

>>43521643

PT. Poop Train.

>>43522261
>not getting it
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/e/ea/ContentOldMan-JKDF2.ogg/revision/latest?cb=20090805121026

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>>43522243

>>43522331
Whoops. Yeah, I've got no good excuse. Haven't played any of the Dark Forces games in ages.

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I ran this for a couple of friends a few weeks back and now they want me to continue it with the Operation: Shadowpoint adventure.
It was all of our first time playing /tg/ stuff and I found myself drawing a black a few times on what to do with the Threats/Advantage stuff and was hoping to get a few pointers.
Some of the things I did with them were
>Found 2 frags in a barrel that they were hiding in
>Had the bodies from a previous fight found and the alarm set off
>Johnny-5 (BX-2R the droid they met, got to join the Rebellion, and renamed) went murder crazy on seeing the guy in charge of the base and started firing wildly giving him the chance to escape
I was also not sure what to do when rolls were completely canceled out, ie 2 passes 2 fails. Should I treat that as a failure or find some sort of neutral out come?
I had a bit of trouble with the vehicle combat too but I think that was mostly do to alcohol, being tired, and trying to rush to the end, so I'm just gonna reread the book on that.

>>43522253

I'll admit, aside from the caricatures and the annoying accents, they were nicely designed models, but wasted on bad characters. It's not a bad design and it's actually pretty skillful at making something alien yet human enough to express emotion, which is utterly wasted on an annoying slapstick character.

>>43522347

I heard that in his voice.

And it doesn't change a thing. Alec Guinness is best Obi-Wan.

>>43522605

I believe a check where you don't generate net successes is a failure.

>>43522697
yeah that makes sense
I don't know why I thought otherwise

>>43521228
B-wing and A-wing base sets are fun and you can never have enough.

E-wings are odd-kind of a jousting arc dodger. If you like how an A-wing and Interceptor flies but want more firepower or survivability, go for it.

If you plan on going in scum at all, HWK-290s are great support ships. Jan pairs well with a lot of rebels, and the Jan and Kyle crew are always good.

My friends and I once had an idea for a Dark Forces Movie. It was a self aware 80's homage done in the style of Big Trouble in Little China. A sort of silly cheesy popcorn action comedy movie. The plot was essentially a retelling of Jedi Knight with some flashbacks to DF. There was a metasub plot that movie goers don't necessarily need their stories dark, or needlessly convoluted, with a pretentious highbrow "2deep4u" ending, but sometimes a simple action flick will suffice. I was thinking about writing up a full script and maybe get a fan film going, but I felt that the concept strayed too far away from the original.

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>no "lego" in OP so I can just lazy-search this and the /toy/ general with the same term
ONE JOB etc

>>43523200
Speaking of LEGOs, I love the jedi interceptors. There isn't a UCS scale one, has anyone made a custom one with a parts list?

>>43523244
Try this: http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=35450

So, what are some cool benefits for a Holocron to grant for F&D, /swg/?

Can anyone give me suggestions for a good Scum list with two Firesprays?

>>43523265
How did I never know about this site?

Found this, pretty cool if anyone else is interested:
http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/rgeiger/Instructions/UCS-Eta-2/anakin-jsf.pdf

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>>43521435
Even after some anti-tank meta mixup, you still can't go wrong with a B-Wing or three in your squad. They're mindbogglingly maneuverable for a slow ship so they can joust AND dogfight at close range pretty well.

Generally A-Wings are there to clog up enemy movement lanes and bait shots while the B-Wings close in and do the killing.

And if you've seen any of the reports from Worlds, it's pretty clear that Poe is new meta for sure. Regen is insanely valuable in this game.

>>43523397
I'd consider Poe to be blatantly broken and ban TFA pilots from tables in general.

>>43523397
>That Dug pilot
Fuckin' ace, never noticed that before. Dugs are my favorite prequel race.

>>43523397

B-Wings have their charm, but I've always been a fan of the X-Wing. Still, it's probably second on the list, with A-Wing a close second and Y-Wings a fourth but with some good charm to them. Zs also seem neat, if for cheap fighter-spam.

How about a second seat for the B-Wing for the crew space? Worth it, or am I better off with a K-Wing for crew?

>>43523563
B-Wing/E2 lets you run Kyle Katarn as crewmate to Keyan Farlander, because everyone wants to gain a Focus token when they spend their Stress like Focus on the attack.

>>43522041

>not the best Jedi
>"Hey Qui-gon, why don't you just steal the parts if conning the guy into taking useless money is apparently okay?

>>43523563
There's been a fair number of stress-control builds that use the B/E2 upgrade to put a Tactician onboard. Typically three of them alongside a generic Y with ICT, R3-A2, and BTL-A4 for lots of stress output.

>>43523659

Neat. I might have to get a few B-Wings when I start investing in this. Can they be run next to X-Wings effectively or do they work better with more specialized ships? B-Wings do the heavy lifting with cheap ship spam to fill the field? I'm hopelessly new when it comes to this, but it seems pretty fucking fun.

>>43523681
Republic credits aren't worthless, they just come with a lot of controls and tracing that a skeezy merchant like Watto wouldn't want in the outer rim.

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>>43523824

[citation needed]

The Republic has no presence out there (not that it would matter anyway since the Republic apparently has no means of enforcing any of its laws). Sheevebucks are basically worthless and Watto says as much. I doubt the idea of them being traceable was Watto's concern.

>>43522276
I don't often drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Corellian Ale.

>>43524258
I want reddit to leave.

>>43521625
Can you share unedited?

>>43523824
>>43523882
More a case of the conflict around the time of the blockade of Naboo de-valuating some currencies (and maybe a bit of the Muunlist banking clans having a bit to do with it as well) to the point of the credit wasn't worth much once you crawled out of the core-worlds.

>>43524404

Last year /tg/ got together on Christmas and watched the original unedited trilogy on a stream channel.

Maybe we could do it again?

I seem to recall that the year before it was MST2k, and before that Godzilla. At least I think that was /tg/, it might have been /m/.

>>43521625

One of the edits that really disappoints me when I go back is the dialogue change they made when Vader talks to Sheev in Empire.

In the original version, they're both talking about how Luke's dangerous and how good things would be if they can win him over to their side.

But in the George Lucas Edition Sheev actually has to explain to Vader who Luke is, which brings up two questions. 1) How could Vader be that gormless that he has to have it spelled out for him that Luke is Anakin's kid, and 2) Why was Vader hunting him if he apparently thought Luke was just another Joe Schmoe?

>>43524404
>>43524463

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/h5iw1a3dxdcx4/Star_Wars-Definitive_Original_Trilogy

Uploaded to mediafire. Quality isn't that great since it's off the VHS release, but it's definitely watchable. No edits to this one, this is what people saw in theaters.

There's also a version out there called the "Demastered Edition", where they take out all of the Lucas edits while keeping the higher quality remastered film.

>>43524506
You mean the whole "Son of Skywalker" talk? I mean, I like it because it continues this weird disconnect that everyone but Luke has between Anakin Skywalker and Darth Vader.
Vader says the name Anakin has no meaning to him anymore, so really him treating his past life as a different person is in character.

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>>43524731

In both versions they bring up the subject of Luke being the son of Skywalker. But in the Special Edition Sheev actually outright says he's Anakin's kid, and Vader's response is "wait what?". In the original version, you already get the impression Vader is aware of that and has been for awhile, even without the audience knowing that Vader and Anakin are the same person.

>>43524794
Oh, okay. So I'm thinking of the original as well. The one where the entire conversation is
>What is thy bidding my master?
>The Son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi, he's too dangerous
>What if he could be turned to the Dark Side?
>Yes, he'd be a powerful ally
>He will join us or die

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>>43524536
I remember renting this from a video store. Remember when we still had these, tg? I also remember my childish confusion when the guy recommended these instead of the ones that had stuff added to them.
I'm still waiting for a Phantom Menace like the one I saw on the trailer.
Also, for Episodes 7-9 like the ones in the books.

>>43524849

Yeah in the George Edition the conversation goes like this
>We have a new enemy: the guy who blew up the Death Star
>Yeah I know I've been tracking him for three years
>I have no doubts he is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker
>lol what?

Then the conversation goes the way we see in the original

>>43524876
Those books are overrated trash.

>>43524906
That sounds like the latest latest super special edition. Yeah, I have no interest in those, mostly for the absolutely terrible cgi edits like oh my god who thought that looked good.

>>43524876

Well, I found a torrent for them and now I'm sharing it with the masses. The absolute original.

The only difference from the theatrical release is that it is labelled "Episode IV" at the front of the crawl, as are the following films. Those weren't included in the original theatrical release, but were in the VHS release because they thought they were going to do more at some point in the future.

It remained cryptic for a long time until the release of Episode I, and then everyone wished it had remained cryptic.

>>43524995

The only thing I like about the new special edition stuff is the lightsaber touch-ups. I love the look of the old movies, but the rotoscoping effects they used back then really haven't aged too well.

>>43524995
The TPM Edition managed to fix the horrible Yoda puppetry in the original TPM theater cut and replaced it with CGI. So shut your mouth.

>>43524928
If they are overrated trash why is Abrams literally stealing everything from them.

Kylo - Jacen
Rey - Jaina
Starkiller Base - Sun Crusher
Knights of Ren - Jensaarai
Snoke - Plagueis

>>43525713
>Knights of Ren - Jensaarai
No

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>>43525713
>Snoke - Plagueis
Wait, what?

>>43525758

Are spoilers happening? Because I don't want to be spoiled for the new movie.

>>43525758
That's how you know he's an idiot.

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>>43525770

>Are spoilers happening?

No, Salty McNofun up there is just projecting his bitterness on a movie we know next to nothing about

>>43525667
But I wasn't talking about TPM, now was I?

>>43520082
>by all criteria except special effects
>not liking duel of fates
look, the prequels were shit, but John Williams still brought his a game

>>43525770
>Are spoilers happening
Almost everything movie-related in these threads is speculation at the moment. We don't know for sure what any of the new characters' relationships to the old are. Maybe Poe trained under Wedge. Maybe Kylo Ren will reveal that he took not just Vader's helmet but also his glove. Maybe Rey is a Knight of Ren sleeper agent who will be activated after being notified of Luke Skywalker's tendency to hop on transparisteel legs. Who the fuck knows? As much as I dislike Abrams' storytelling and directing, we don't know much just yet.

Is it just me, or does Star Wars reflect all of the tenets of the dark side?

Greed, apathy, focus on material objects, worship of celebrity, ego, etc etc.

Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter.

>>43526046
>Darth Vader's glove

I want to believe.

>>43525781

Kylo ren is han solo and leia's kid though. The physical resemblance to harrison ford was intentional.

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>>43526046

>Maybe Kylo Ren will reveal that he took not just Vader's helmet but also his glove

>>43526046
Redlettermedia already spoiled the movies just by watching the trailers.

>>43526032

As said before, there were still dude who brought their A-game to the shitfest. The starships were tip-top design and John Williams never lost his spark. Best thing to come out of TPM where the N-1 and Duel of Fates.

>>43526075

Tossing stale bread to the ducks again? You might want to try seeds next time, bread is actually very nutrient and mineral poor to birds, seeds or berries are much better and healthier. Birds can actually die of malnutrition from becoming too full on bread, foregoing nutrient-dense food in favor of easy feedings.

>>43526123

No, the mcguffin is luke's lightsaber. You can see the new yoda handing it to leia during the trailer.

It was anakin's lightsaber too. That's why Han Solo's Kid wants it.

>>43526131
>Tossing stale bread to the ducks again? You might want to try seeds next time, bread is actually very nutrient and mineral poor to birds, seeds or berries are much better and healthier. Birds can actually die of malnutrition from becoming too full on bread, foregoing nutrient-dense food in favor of easy feedings.

Oh, autism? Sorry to trigger you.

Do you think star wars has a message anymore? A deeper meaning? If so, what?

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>>43526098
>>43526175

I want Jacen to leave

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>>43526201

Who said anything about star wars?

>>43526098
That doesn't change the fact that Plagueis has been dead for over 70 years by TFA.

>>43526221
You're special, just for being you.

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>>43526098

>The physical resemblance to harrison ford was intentional.

You mean the head wrinkles on his helmet?

>>43526248
His death was never shown canonically, so you can't say that for certain. He was the one that mastered life and death, and then just died?

For once, palpatine's not behind it all.

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It begins.
No thread is safe.

>>43526277
>mastered life and death
>palpatine
>a reliable source
yeah, palpatine is full of shit

>>43526277
>"Unfortunately, he taught his apprentice everything he knew. Then his apprentice killed him in his sleep. Ironic. He could save others from death, but not himself."
Ol' Palps confirmed it himself.

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>>43526261

The actor.

>>43526318
>>43526317

So we know for certain that palpatine wasn't just lying to anakin about the whole thing? or which part?

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>>43526277
>Ability to self-recover, allowing the deceased Plagueis to keep on resurrecting
Domon pls.

>>43526175
Anakin's old lightsaber fell down the chute in Bespin. Depending if you consider Thrawn to be canon it was later recovered but still.

>>43526423

And Obi-Wan's old one was left at his corpse, unless Luke got it back at some time before Hoth.

>>43526463
Or Darth Vader took it as a trophy, from which it could've ended up anywhere

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>>43526423

Not him, but I think one of the few things we now for certain is that it is in fact the Skywalker lightsaber we see in those trailers.

Could be why Kylo Ren was barreling down on Finn. He wants to add it to his shrine.

>>43526485
Does he know that it used to belong to Vader, though? We don't even know if anyone knows the Skywalker-Vader connection in the new universe.

>>43526485
Well at any rate, is Luke confirmed to have gone evil at this point?

>>43526525
No.

>>43526514
Luke told Leia before heading off to confront the dad, didn't he?

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>>43526423

Well, Maz Kanata is who recovered it, or at least came into possession of it, then gave it to leia, who later gives it to finn, who is killed by kylo ren to recover the sword, which is when we see Rey crying over his body.

Spoiled yet?

>>43526525
of course not. It would make for an immensely better script, but it would step all over fanservice, which was largely the point of buying the brand in the first place.

This isn't being made from the mindset of an artist, just an accountant.

>>43526548
Oh, right. It's you.
Silly me.

>>43526514

Assuming he's not related to Anakin himself (and I really hope not) maybe he just spent a lot of time researching Vader and connected the dots.

Or maybe Luke blabbed to everyone. That's something we're gonna have to wait on.

>>43526525
No

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>>43526589
>It would make for an immensely better script
Luke going evil would also step all over everything that happened in RotJ.

>>43526564
We already know Finn lives because Boyega is in VIII's cast, and Rey probably dies since they're looking for a female lead and doing 'chemistry-reads' with Boyega.

So nice try, but no.

>>43526613
>Assuming he's not related to Anakin himself (and I really hope not) maybe he just spent a lot of time researching Vader and connected the dots.

Kylo Ren is Han and Leia's son. That's why they have that sad hug, it's when they realize what he's done.

That's also why he's force sensitive, and knows all the backstory.

Again, look at the visual similarity between the actors. >>43526320
It could be coincidental, but this is star wars. Everything is like poetry.

>>43526635
So?

>>43526589

> It would make for an immensely better script

No it wouldn't. Get out of here, Veitch

>>43526654
>Everything is like poetry.
Shitposter confirmed, time to ignore everything you say from now one

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>>43526652
Force ghost/holocron/red herring.

It's Finn's jacket that Rey is crying over. Look again.

The girl is almost certainly Luke's daughter. She is practically anakin just from what we see of her life on tatooine. Rey is the main protagonist of the new trilogy.

>>43526708

Why is quoting george lucas shitposting now?

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>>43526729
>from what we see of her life on tatooine.
>tatooine

>>43526768
>it's just another desert planet

Based on what?

>>43526729
>Something is awakening
>Something dark
>It's Finn
That would've been all kinds of hilarious.

Sup Star Wars General.

Linking my ad from the gamefinder thread for AoR, in case anyone here is interested but not actively checking gamefinder >>43526691

>>43521511
B8

>>43526792

Naw see, luke's been in hiding all this time because he wants the galaxy to forget the force and the jedi because no matter what people will fuck it up.

Kylo and Rey start their shenanigans, and it causes the force to "reawaken".

>>43526768
Remember, this is Star Wars; It has to make dollars, not sense.

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>>43526287
I keep seeing Eva images here. Is there a lot of overlap between the fanbases?

>>43526075
That's all part of the joke, I guess. George was on to something when he made the OT. Something that may have been lost in translation. After seven movies and countless books, who could say it was even there to begin with?

>>43526905
>I keep seeing Eva images here. Is there a lot of overlap between the fanbases?

Gee, what could anime fans and star wars fans have in common?

Remember, the japanese word for autism is Hikikomori.

>>43525667
Scuuuuuuum.

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>>43526905
>That's all part of the joke, I guess. George was on to something when he made the OT. Something that may have been lost in translation. After seven movies and countless books, who could say it was even there to begin with?

When you copy a master, you can sometimes get good results. Empire was a fluke of a myriad of talents coming together.

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>>43526589

I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt in assuming it's bait. Because otherwise it would only show you to be a top-tier contender for the "Man with Worst Ideas" title for 2015.

>>43527086
I'm amazed that you managed to post that without feeling any shame.

>>43527135
That's autism for you. He probably thinks he's acting like some snarky character.

>>43526750

That specific quote is taken out of context to a huge degree. In reality, yes, scripts along the same lines and same formulas and same genres or franchises should echo each other a little.

The Homeric epics were almost immediately copied down and used as a formula for what Greek heroes do, though often parodied and twisted and inverted to change the meanings for our hero and give the stories their own character. It's the nature of writing that classic formula and story structures borrow elements and reflect back at each other, it infers more meaning when it evokes the stories that have come before.

Unfortunately, Lucas doesn't understand that such meaning is deeper than simply aesthetics. He re-uses some phrases, scenes, and setups without understanding the leadup to each of those, the weight they carry in their own contexts, and the character's own stories that lend significance to these allusions.

Lucas seems to understand that it's a thing that happens in narrative from what we've seen of the behind the scenes, but not how to do it effectively or even appropriately. Literary allusion is, indeed, "LIKE POETRY," but it's not a bad thing purely on its own, it's bad when executed how Lucas execute it, with inanity.

In a way, the same people who spout the "LIKE POETRY" line are invariably just as shitty at it as Lucas. Oh the ironing that they perpetuate what they parody, all the more laughable their bait becomes.

>>43527433
>That specific quote is taken out of context to a huge degree.

It's not though. Watch the whole "Making of Episode 1" It shows how lucas thinks. Star Wars is good because of Akira Kurosawa, nothing else.

Sophistry doesn't change that.

>>43527433
>Oh the ironing that they perpetuate what they parody, all the more laughable their bait becomes.
You could also say that for the jedi themselves.

So, how about that star wars tabletop?

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>>43527504
Star wars should never take place during war. You can't have a mystic based on a soldier.

Samurai are only interesting during the meiji period. Nobody cares about just another soldier with a sword who buttfucks his ward.

What the jedi need are their own Sohei, not Samurai.

>>43527550
Tabletop simulator makes that look like a foolish investment at best.

Literally the only reason to get into it is if you want a replacement for Micromachines, in which case /toy/ would be a better place.

>>43527608
Yes, but we're on /tg/, so people will still want to talk about Star Wars tabletop games like XWM, Armada, the RPGs, the CCG, and the LCG.

>>43527677
As cover for the real discussions, at best.

It is pretty shameless. There are other boards that would be far more appropriate for 90% of the dialogue in these threads.

But the dark side won.

>>43527608
Tabletop simulator combines the absolute worst aspect of actually playing the game with the worst aspects of using VASSAL. 0/10 would not recommend.

>>43527608

I've been using FiveCore rules for some. Honestly, buying 15mm pewter figures in squads of 8 is cheaper than buying actual MicroMachines. You're competing with collector prices at that point, and scarcity since they're all OOP, and they don't sell the best models in more than one or two per product. $10 per ~15-20mm scale Droidekka anyone?

Outside of that, cheap Star Wars toys of roughly the right scale for $5 a pop for vehicles and you're set for a team of Stormtroopers or Clones. You're just going to have to do a lot of minor conversion work on the helmets of every dudesmen.

>>43527705
which boards?

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>>43527550
GM'd my first session last night
a few hiccups since they weren't all star wars junkies like me and a loose understanding of the rules but it was fun and I'm looking forward to our next session

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>>43527728
He has a good point
most star wars minis are absolute ass and even then your favorites will look like ass and be like 15-65 dollars a pop

>>43527729
/tv/ for movie discussion, /co/ and /lit/ for legends, /toy/ for everything not a game, /vg/ or /v/ for video games, /tg/ just for discussion of games.

/tg/ is just turning into "general interests that could someday possibly be turned into a setting for a "traditional game, but likely won't." It's /b/ without porn.

>>43527584
>Star wars should never take place during war
I am so incredibly close to sperging out over this. I would 10/10 if it wasn't obvious that you're serious.

>>43527801
Sorry, i like star wars for the mystical fantasy, not the over the top lightsaber fights from the prequels. I did not realize i was in the minority, but i should have.

Star Wars' quality is inversely related to lightsaber screentime.

>>43527783
/tv/, /co/, /lit/, and /v/ are containment boards and have utterly irreparable discussion standards, /toy/ already has SW discussion on stuff we mostly don't care to discuss, like figures, /vg/ is quite limited.

>>43527783

All of those boards except maybe /toy/ hate Star Wars even more than /swg/ does.

It may not always be /tg/ related (most of the time it isn't) but this is really the only "safe place" where people can talk about Star Wars.

>>43527853

/tg/ isn't? This isn't the home of dragon porn and thinly veiled threads to discuss dragon porn?

>>43527869
/tg/ understands that it's possible to discuss things without outright hating them at every opportunity. This results in better discussion than any of the listed boards.

>>43527865
>It may not always be /tg/ related (most of the time it isn't) but this is really the only "safe place" where people can talk about Star Wars.

That does explain the levels of vitriol people seem to have here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXQkXXBqj_U

>>43527882
Based on what? This thread? It's like a minefield in here. Talk about one wrong thing and you get jumped. People are wearing their triggers on their chest.

>>43527914
That's part of why it's so good. No one is afraid to defend their opinions, and you get multiple perspectives and points, despite the shitflinging.

>>43527914
I don't get to use this much these days, but you either need to lurk the fuck more or stop willfully misinterpreting the situation to feed your preconceptions.

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So, /tg/ how are all your star wars pen and paper rpgs going?

I've got some players fucking around on Telos IV during the galactic civil war. THey escaped from a prison ship during a pirate ambush, successfully convinced the local Imperial bureaucracy that they were guards aboard, and ound some lodging. Last session they started working for a Dug mechanic, and i'm gonna have him send them into the wilderness to retrieve a shipment of parts from one of the other relatively habitable settlements on Telos that isnt Thani, and on their way back encounter a local mafioso extorting the Dug.

On an unrelated note, I'm playing in a EotE game online, but the GM has been making last minute excuses not to play for like a month.

What are y'all up to?

>>43527949

That's a statement you should tell yourself.

>>43527978
Back the fuck up and give me archive links on "minefield" instances, plus a percentage comparison to total /swg/ posts.

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>>43527852
I'm not a fan of the prequels or even most of the fighting in general, but pulpy space opera practically requires some big, menacing force of evil to run away from and rally against. Without some kind of greater conflict to resolve, we'd be left with a thoughtful but boring expose on the Jedi and the nature of the Force.

I mean for Yoda's sake, it's right there in the title! It's Star Wars, not Star Ruminations!

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>>43527975

I'm gonna be 100% honest

I don't like running Star Wars games, or games in pre-established universes in general

Part of it is because everyone has a different idea about what a Star Wars game should be. I might want to run a Jedi game. Some people think Jedi are bullshit and want to play space pirates. Others might hate the idea of space pirates and want to play Stormtroopers in some hardcore military sim.

The other part is I just prefer to make up my own settings. Flexes the creative muscles more and I get the satisfaction that comes with coming up with something of my own.

>>43528000

Just read the thread. Look for long-winded attempts at witty retorts, with image macros to make them feel like a point has been made.

>>43528046
Sorry, you claimed minefield, you back it up. if you don't have significant evidence, or aren't willing to provide such, then kindly shut the fuck up on the subject.

>>43527852

I think he means more that it's fucking called Star Wars and you're implying it shouldn't take place during a war.

Though our heroes of the first trilogy, and our mystic protagonist and his mentors, are somewhat outside the war. Luke's involvement starts with being outside of it, getting in the thick of it, then actually divorcing himself from it until he's got his own showdown to deal with unrelated to the goal of blowing up the second Death Star.

Agreed with your second sentence though. With all things, there can be too much of a good thing. What were mystics in the OT turned into sword-wielding videogame characters in the PT. They use the Force willy nilly as some kind of videogame power rather than as a way of extending their reach and becoming more in-tune with the universe.

Actually, what we know of lightsabers and Force powers are pretty spread out in the OT.
>Lightsabers cut things, deflect other lightsabers, Force Choke, generic mystical guiding force
A New Hope.
>The Force can be used to move things, enhance your abilities, call out to other Force sensitives, "Size matters not."
The Empire Strikes Back
>Lightsabers deflect blaster bolts, LIGHTNING
Return of the Jedi
And they frontload ALL of this in the Phantom Menace, ruining any power it had because of its sparing use.

>>43527975
I'm reading up on the Operation Shadowpoint pdf now in prep for our second game to be held in the next few days

>>43527975
Mine's moving along. Rebels era. Tarabba sector. Players are trying to set up rebel cells and undermine the Empire. So far, they've taken out a Hyperspace Watch Post and an Imperial Waystation.

They did this by breaking into the Waystation, stealing the Gozanti cruiser from there, straffing the parts they hadn't rigged with explosives and then having the Gozanti kamikaze the Watch Post.

This was after slaughtering half of the local Imperial army contigent (granted, there was about a platoon on this backwater) in a counter-ambush, rescuing a rebel spy and outing his captor as a double-crosser to the local crime boss (who he was screwing over).

They also broke someone out of an asylum to help out a contact on Utapau, then realized that they didn't wear masks or disguises.

The Empire had some people held in that assylum under very strict Droids-or-doctors Only policy. They haven't found out who yet. ( I haven't decided ).

>>43528009
Ah. I don't see star wars as science fiction, so that may be it.

If you can make movie about a wandering samurai, you can make star wars without war. What with the billion spinoffs coming, we might see a story like Yojimbo with jedi. I doubt it'll be 1/100th as good as Yojimbo, but it's a start.

*TRIGGER WARNING*
The original trilogy didn't take place during a war either. The rebel alliance wasn't a nation. Civil war is just an antiquated term for Terrorism.
*DO NOT RESPOND WITH AUTISM IF YOU HAVE BEEN TRIGGERED*

>>43527765

He really does have a good point. I've been making my own out of third-party rules, random toys, and third-party 15mm dudesmen on a budget. Albeit, it's Clones. Might be tempted to do the same with Stormtroopers or Rebels later, though the Rebels don't have much in the way of ground vehicles, they're very space-based and mobile.

>>43528114
>>>/tumblr/

also, "response I don't agree with" is not something you can preemptively call autism on, you addled fuck

>>43528071
>What were mystics in the OT turned into sword-wielding videogame characters in the PT. They use the Force willy nilly as some kind of videogame power rather than as a way of extending their reach and becoming more in-tune with the universe.

Yoda using a lightsaber destroys everything he ever said about the force. The fact is that the people who own the brand do not understand it. They only understand the marketing appeal, and that's lightsabers.

At this point, it's what the fans want from it. There will always be more people alive who have seen the prequels first.

>>43528150
You can respond, just not with an attempt at a witty joke or with accusations of autism.

So try again.

>>43527975

Tonight my PCs will be continuing to dick around on Felucia looking for a antiquities thief who was shot down after stealing some artifacts the Infochant they owe a favor too wants.

The first session of this particular plot involved their intrepid intel gathering abilities, where the Chadrafan Sentinel nearly got into a blast-duel of honor with a Togorian (but got out of it with a stun setting shotgun to the chest), and where they ambushed some temporarily grounded imperial pilots to interrogate, attracting the attention of the cops. This led the Verpine pilot to steal one of those Troop Transports from rebels and go on a hairing police chase, while the Droid Soldier and the Sentinel steal some of the TIEs (despite having no training in Pilot between them) and provide aerial support and nearly crashing.

Then they need to get their Speeder Truck back after they talk to those pilots (Where the Droid tries to lie and say they're Imperial Intelligence) and get the info on the crash they want. So they drop the Chadrafan off because he's the worst pilot, and fly the TIEs back to their ship so they can give them to the Rebellion, leaving the character with no Pilot and no Survival to navigate Felucia, where he proceeds to get lost for several hours. And then the Droid flies out to him in a TIE, freaking him the fuck out and he bangs his face on the wheel. They they all go home and take a nap.

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>>43528114
>The original trilogy didn't take place during a war either.
The writers made it pretty clear that the situation qualifies as "war."

>>43528165
>There will always be more people alive who have seen the prequels first.
We could go full Best Korea and change that

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>>43528114
>>43528191

>>43528194
If only you had read to the end of the sentence.

>>43528165

>The fact is that the people who own the brand do not understand it. They only understand the marketing appeal, and that's lightsabers.

Well, not anymore. Did you miss the news that the franchise was under new ownership? JJ Abrams seems to be doing something better, as we don't see absolutely pornographically gratuitous use of lightsaber in the trailers and each scene we do see them seems very purposefully set up. I might be wrong, but it seems they put it in the hands of people who might just know what the fuck they're doing with it.

>>43528205
That's more or less inevitable at this point. Best korea went best because they lost access to oil.

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>>43528194

>>43528234
That's what they want you to think.

>>43528234
Disney has said many times that it purchased the brand because of the massive licensing deals they got to make, not because they appreciate the finer details of the metaphysics and mysticism of the work.

JJ. Abrams has never made a good thing in his life.

I really don't understand where you're coming from, other than hope, which is understandable but i think is misplaced.

>>43528220
>civil wars aren't wars
Well I guess the ~620,000 guys killed in the fighting between the United States of America and the Confederate States of America were all just the result of a tragic outbreak of negligent discharges.
It wasn't REALLY a war, so their deaths don't count, right?

>>43528220
Your dictionary is also wrong. According to Merriam-Webster:

>Terrorism
>the use of violent acts to frighten the people in an area as a way of trying to achieve a political goal

>Civil war
>a war between groups of people in the same country

They're not the same thing. Civil wars might involve acts of terrorism but terrorism can be perpetrated by people who are not members of the target country.

>>43528276
>JJ. Abrams has never made a good thing in his life.
have you seen his daughter?

>>43528290
Semantics isn't argument, and the dictionary is not an authority on the definitions of words.

Surely we can have a more meaningful discussion, free from politics and how they classify actions and create false dichotomies to support a political narrative?

>>43528289
Shitty Imp-wank bait isn't worth it, anon.

>>43528289
It was terrorism. As was the "revolutionary war"

Might as well call scientists philosophers.

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>>43528044
Nothing wrong with that. I run games in established settings and in original ones. I like that pre-existing settings make my job easier as DM, because I have to put together existing elements instead of creating something out of whole cloth. Feels like im playing with story LEGO bricks, instead of whittling a story out of a chunk of wood. Helps me stay fresh for my original games.

That said, I don't think the problem with what type of game to play is as bad as it can seem. I talked to my players about what sort of game they wanted, and the answer was unanimously a scum-and-villainy experience. One of my players is gearing up to run a Jedi Praxeum-era jedi game for our group. We basically just rotate until aspects everyone cares about have been covered.

>>43528078
Have you run any of the other FFG started games? I had a blast with the EotE one, and am still rolling a 41-VEX variant in our ongoing game.

>>43528108
Sounds pretty cool! What's the situation with the contact on Utapau? I love the lesser-used planets, Utapau and Jabiim are both on the agenda at some point for my game.

>>43528192
Sounds like a fun time! What's their end goal with the Infochant? And how close are they to the Rebels?

I'm hoping to give my players some good stuff on Telos before they hop planet. For now, they have to stay local to testify for the report on the now-exploded Nebulon B they escaped from. They'll pretty soon have to figure out what to do with the ship they stole from the Neb B, before the Imps confiscate it. I'm thinking that extortionate mafioso might be a good contact to find a fence. Nothing more classic than a d6 star wars game where the players are indebted to a mob boss for their ship.

>>43528290
How is a civil war not "the use of violent acts to achieve a political goal"

How is terrorism not "a war between groups of people in the same country"

They're synonymous. Only sophistry makes them different.

>>43528336
>Semantics isn't argument
Says the retard claiming that the Galactic Civil War isn't a war because "the Rebels aren't a recognized sovereign nation".

>>43528439
So ISIS is fighting a civil war? They are not terrorists?

>>43528383
>Have you run any of the other FFG started games?
This is my first time playing any tabletop game actually
I would have picked up the EotE instead but my LGS only had the AoR beginning game.
We are having a some good fun with it though

>>43528267
>>43528276

Hey, I never professed that JJ will bring about the second coming of Empire, cure autism, and make anime real. I am fully aware that my hope is most likely misplaced and actually ashamed that they've guaranteed my price of admission for what's probably just hype.

It's a fucking lucrative franchise and you'd be foolish to think Disney thinks anything other than that of it. But they also understand that unabashed money-grubbing and producing shitty product hurts sales. They had to learn this when they kicked out their old CEO, who pretty much said outloud that "We're not here to make dreams, we're here to make money!" when under his direction they started producing poor-selling garbage, broke up with Pixar and made their own CG movie division that pretty much defined "Uncanny Valley." So they've already seen that if they don't at least make an effort to appoint artists who know how to treat a franchise right, they're throwing potential profit down a hole and giving themselves a bad name for quality.

>>43528336
>and the dictionary is not an authority on the definitions of words
>dictionary is not an authority on the definitions of words
>dictionary is not an authority

Christ, suddenly it's like I'm in /epg/. Listen, if you guys can't agree on a shared definition base, all discussion IS meaningless. If you do not share a language, you can't communicate, so everybody has to use the same terms. But if you use a definition which is just yours and not some common ground source, don't expect people to agree with you.

Also, speaking as someone who has taken a class about Terrorism, his definition is pretty close to the academic consensus definition anyway. I would specifically add that I was taught that Terrorism has to both cause fear and be intended to cause fear on the targeted group. The GCW isn't specifically terrorism because the Alliance does not aim to cause fear in the Empire, they're seeking liberation - most of them would do it peacefully if they could. If anything, the Tarkin Doctrine is like the original definition of state terrorism, which dates back to the French "Reign of Terror".

>>43528533
Watch out anon.
He's gonna call you a sophist now.

>>43528533
>I would specifically add that I was taught that Terrorism has to both cause fear and be intended to cause fear on the targeted group.

And you must also realize that that definition is so vague as to be meaningless. If i tell my kids that they won't get presents if they're not good, am i not intentionally instilling them with the fear of not getting presents to coerce their actions?

>The GCW isn't specifically terrorism because the Alliance does not aim to cause fear in the Empire, they're seeking liberation - most of them would do it peacefully if they could.

Yet, through their actions they cause fear. If you were married to a stormtrooper, wouldn't you fear for their life if you heard the rebels were going to be attacking his post, or were sighted near it? Star Wars makes war too simple, imo.

>>43528435
>How is a civil war not "the use of violent acts to achieve a political goal"
Wars include the use of violent acts to achieve a political goal. You've left out "to frighten the people," however. There isn't sufficient evidence of the Rebel Alliance using terror tactics or sowing fear in the general galactic public to classify them as terrorists. In the films, we only saw the Rebs targeting military installations and forces.

>How is terrorism not "a war between groups of people in the same country"
Not all terrorist acts are committed by people against their own countrymen and not all terrorist acts are committed during a state of war. Secret police, purges, and hostage situations can happen even when a country isn't at war.

>>43528383

>Sounds like a fun time! What's their end goal with the Infochant? And how close are they to the Rebels?

Well, right now the goal is to keep him happy, because one of the PC has obligation with the guy, and he kind of sold them the location of the Rebel Safehouse they've built on Raxus Prime, so him not telling people is important.

The group is still contribution rank zero, so they're not in tight, but several of them are ostensibly Rebel operatives, kind of doing their own thing. They keep giving good material and intel to the Rebels, so they're probably going up in the world. And like I said above, they've set up their own safehouse.

>>43528500
Quality of the story and sales do not have any correlation.

or is Avatar or The Avengers really the greatest story ever told?

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>>43528336

>the dictionary is not an authority on the definitions of words.

>>43528563

Been called worse.

>>43528589

You've missed the part where I was adding to what was already said. Terrorism needs a sociopolitical component and the terror component. Just fear isn't it, and just politics isn't it.

>>43527865
>All of those boards except maybe /toy/ hate Star Wars
/toy/ hates Star Wars too. Mainly thanks to a resident shitposter on the board but also because a lot of the other shitposters come from /tv/.

>>43527975
Currently underway with Operation Shadowpoint with a combined AoR/F&D party. So far, they're doing things by-the-book, but a Despair from our droid while hacking a computer forced me to call in the Imperial Army Scouts. They managed to catch up to them, just as they called the Lambda for support. Cue our Jedi with a lightsaber jumping on it mid-air and cutting the instruments. The entire lance surrendered after that.

>>43528611
>Wars include the use of violent acts to achieve a political goal. You've left out "to frighten the people," however.
How do you prove that the intent of "terrorists" like isis is to frighten the people? All war actions frighten the people. You think the people in the middle east like random drone strikes? It has to be proven deliberately intentional? With what? A lie detector test?

>There isn't sufficient evidence of the Rebel Alliance using terror tactics or sowing fear in the general galactic public to classify them as terrorists.
The movies don't really play the conflict very realistically. It's clear that the whole work has a theme of "absolute good vs absolute evil" with no gray areas. It would clash with the tone of the movie to see a billion mourners for the death star's staff over a dozen or so worlds.

>Not all terrorist acts are committed by people against their own countrymen and not all terrorist acts are committed during a state of war. Secret police, purges, and hostage situations can happen even when a country isn't at war.
That just further proves that the term "terrorist" is a meaningless false dichotomy that only exists to further a political narrative of "Us vs. the bad guys". Which is likely just what the Empire would do. They would call the rebels terrorists, not because the term has any real meaning, but because it's politically polarizing.

>>43528660
It isn't, it's the playground of elites propagating their ideologies and ignoring the common use of words.

>>43528671
>You've missed the part where I was adding to what was already said. Terrorism needs a sociopolitical component and the terror component. Just fear isn't it, and just politics isn't it.

Right. One group has to claim the moral high ground. Only then does it call the ones it want to debase "terrorists"

All it has ever taken is a word for humans to dehumanize each other. Terrorist is no different from gook or charlie.

>>43528790
>They would call the rebels terrorists, not because the term has any real meaning, but because it's politically polarizing.
And this is exactly why people who come in spouting "rebels were terrorists" get so much flak, because it's nothing more thanthe eleventy-billionth instance of that Imp-wanker argument.

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>>43528790
>>43528823
>>43528825

Jesus Christmas am I on another planet right now? What kind of fucking rabbit hole did I just fall into?


Can we have just one /swg/ where this guy doesn't show up, or at least one where people don't try to argue with him?

>>43528849

What's that argument? that in a real world, the empire wouldn't be seen as bad?

>>43528891

Here you go. >>43528000

>>43528790
>Prove that the intent of terrorists is to frighten the people
IIRC, doesn't Takin talk about causing fear pretty openly right before he gives the order to blow up Aldera--

>Death Star's staff
Oh boy, it's you again. We've all had this conversation a billion times. Look at archived /swg/ threads for counter-points so we can stop wasting posts on repeating this argument for the umpteenth time.

>>43528899
It's possible to immediately classify "rebels are terrorists" posters as a particularly retarded form of, to borrow a phrase, Emperor-botherer. They're immune to reason and not worth engaging, but it happens anyway.

>>43528943
Every enlisted stormtrooper is 100% evil and all their family is evil?

I thought this was a safe space for discussion? Why am i being abused by namefags?

>>43528790

Well, arguably Drone Strikes are state-sponsored terrorism, but again, has a lot to do with intent. Theoretically, a drone attack has the goal to kill a guy or guys real dead without needing to move some soldiers in to do it. Yes, it almost assuredly freaks people the fuck out, but that's a byproduct. That's like calling every time you shoot a gun terrorism because you spook every animal within hearing distance. Or all crimes terrorism.

Obviously, I get that's what you're going for, to just water down the definition, probably because you're mad Fox News or CNN says it all the time, but there is actually a functional difference between the act of waging a strategic war, and specific terror tactics for the purposes of political goals. Again, going back, "terrorism" as word started from post-revolution France, and their actions about killing the shit out of "enemies of the revolution".

It's not terrorism when you shoot a guy because you want to shoot that guy, it's terrorism when you shoot a guy specifically because you want to freak people out, and who that guy is doesn't matter.

>>43528960
Wait, are you roleplaying as a denizen of the star wars galaxy, or are you being real?

>>43528982
It's terrorism when anyone without a piece of paper tries to coerce someone with deadly means.

I get it.

It's still nonsense. It's just self-aggrandizing by an evil empire. Which what makes it so mindbogglingly ironic and/or compartmentalized.

>>43528998
I'm being serious. There are people on the internet who believe that the Empire did nothing wrong, Palpatine was a hero, etc. "Rebels are terrorists" is a very fucking obvious clue as to the presence of these people, because almost nobody else is that retarded.

>>43528790
Knights of Ren pls go

>>43528982

So, war then? Do you think killing infantry will bring an end to the war? Does it matter who you kill? Does it "freak people out" to hear that 60,000 died in a single day?

Language really does limit how people can think.

>>43528114
So by that logic, the Revolutionary War wasn't really a war. Why do you hate America so much?

>>43528589
>Yet, through their actions they cause fear. If you were married to a stormtrooper, wouldn't you fear for their life if you heard the rebels were going to be attacking his post, or were sighted near it?

By your definition, all wars are done by terrorists.

>>43529043

Oh. No i'm not a part of that particular bogeyman sect. I'm just saying that if we took out the absolute morality of the theme of the movies, that the actions of both sides become almost completely gray, especially when we compare real world nations and events to the actions and events in the films.

Clearly the Empire is Evil. But if it wasn't, would it be?

>>43528972
This "discussion" has been done to death a gorillion times. This isn't even beating a dead horse. This is beating a fossil. The most common counter-arguments to your point, and most or all of your points, have been made in archived threads.

>Every enlisted stormtrooper is 100% evil
They're military personnel. They knew what they were getting into and they knew the risks. The grunts and officers of the Empire aren't all bad. A lot of Legends Rebel personnel were defectors and a lot of loyal Imps stayed loyal out of devotion to the ideals they believed the Empire stood for, but that doesn't change the fact that the Empire was overall evil and heavily inspired by the Nazis and Imperial Japan. For fuck's sake, the Emperor is a guy in black pajamas who shoots lightning and laughs evilly. His Sith Lord name is fucking Darth Sidious. He authorized two planet-killing space stations officially designated as "Death Star." Star Wars isn't subtle about things.

>>43529101
Obviously it was an act of terrorism.

But we have a narrative of being the good guys. Same as the rebels in star wars.

One word changes and the entire story is destroyed. It's a moral drama where the morals are fixed.

So, looking to expand my X-Wing collection. I have

>The two TIE/Fos from the new core set
>TIE Phantom
>Imperial Aces
>TIE Interceptor
>Slave 1
>TIE Punisher

I'm planning on picking up the Imperial Assault Carrier once it hits, but are there any other gaps in my collection I should fill?

I've noticed I have problems dealing with Decimators; what's a good way to handle it?

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>>43529076
>>43529123

Kylo, why don't you just leave and go back to polishing Vader's helmet?

>>43528960
>>43528891

>people don't try to argue with him?
>They're immune to reason and not worth engaging, but it happens anyway

Sorry, my "native" general is usually Eclipse Phase, I'm used to sociopolticial arguments that's mostly all we have to fight about.

/swg/s arguments aren't usually as bad, nobody mentions stuff like Language of Lions, Death of the Author, or fights over what stuff like "eugenics", "statism" and "capitalism" are and aren't. I could slow my roll if-

>>43529076
>Language really does limit how people can think.

Oh man, this is more like it.

>>43529027

Well, I wouldn't call a mugging "terrorism". That's materially motivated, not political. But that's the deepest level of specificity of the definitions.

>>43529123
>Clearly the Empire is Evil. But if it wasn't, would it be?

Well, they did blow up an entire planet of non-combatants who were explicitly from a culture which highly valued pacifism, that's kind of sucky by most standards.

>>43529182
>I've noticed I have problems dealing with Decimators; what's a good way to handle it?
TIE Advanced with Accuracy Corrector and Cluster Missiles.

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>>43528972
>Safe space
>4chan

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What kind of upgrades would you slap on a YT 1300? The corebook in EoE mentions its very upgradeable

>>43528891
Perfect image for this nutbag

>>43529132
>This "discussion" has been done to death a gorillion times
So? You think this thread in its history has covered 1/100th of the discussions that were had on usenet 20 years ago? You think you're special?

>They're military personnel. They knew what they were getting into and they knew the risks. The grunts and officers of the Empire aren't all bad
So the deaths of the staff would have had a tremendous effect on the population. What was the personnel count? How many mothers, fathers, sons, wives and daughters did that effect? How many people in the galaxy only know luke skywalker as "the guy who killed dad"?

Palpatine is evil. The Empire is not, if it's mostly comprised of normal folks just trying to make money by joining a service. Shit, it's not like the galaxy is a good place, most of them probably joined to protect their local area from pirates and slavers.

>>43529210
God, the StarViper has everything I need. Gonna have to buy one soon.

>>43529276
Sometimes I think more Imperial players than Scum players own 1 or three of them.

Really though, 4x Tempest Squadron Pilots can literally one-shot any non-Kenkirk Decimator, and even one or two of them will piss it off.

>>43529207
>Well, I wouldn't call a mugging "terrorism". That's materially motivated, not political. But that's the deepest level of specificity of the definitions.

We call ISIS terrorists. How have we proven demonstrably that their motive is not to form a new country, like the sons of liberty?

>Well, they did blow up an entire planet of non-combatants who were explicitly from a culture which highly valued pacifism, that's kind of sucky by most standards.

It is. But they most likely saw that such a thing was only going to lead to more unrest and more trouble, so they did the equivalent of hitting an apartment complex with a cruise missile. That and tarkin was a jerk.

I'm not saying it was right, only that it was considered necessary, like atom bombing japan.

>>43529249
>Palpatine is evil. The Empire is not
If Grand Moff "We want to scare as many people as possible by blowing up a major planet even if it's a pacifist one and the incorrect military target" Tarkin isn't "The Empire", then who is?

>>43529307
Are you saying the leadership's actions condemns all that follow them, regardless of their reasons for joining?

In the real world we don't even hold to that standard.

>>43529346
"Just following orders"?

>>43529346

We do. But only when they're the losers. "I was just following orders" is only a defense for the victors.

>>43529299
TIE Advanced and StarViper will be my next purchase, I guess.

>>43528657

True. Most classic music as we know it today wasn't top-40 by anyone's metric at the time of its release. There's mass-market appeal and there's staying power. What constitutes staying power I don't know since I haven't studied up on what makes a classic a classic. I'm sure I could set out a number of definitions and have each thwarted by a dozen exceptions to every supposition. When you start trying to set in concrete an underlying structure to absolute madness, you're bound to be driven to madness yourself. So I'll lay it out as stupidly as possible.

It's the will of the Force. A mystical energy that surrounds, penetrates, and binds all things to the universe around us, that strikes chords in our psyches and guides us towards a greater understanding. Those strong in it can resonate with others, ordering the universe according to an unfathomable universal law. Those weak in it can produce splashes and ripples of ephemeral disruption and effect but are ultimately lost on the sea of time and space and lost in to the tide and memory of the living narrative.

>>43529249
>So the deaths of the staff would have had a tremendous effect on the population.
And what about Alderaan? Not even the Empire's propaganda machine can cover up the fact that they blew up a planet of pacifists that had representation in the galactic senate. What other alternatives were there for the Rebels? Tarkin forbade evacuation of the Death Star and letting it go around unmolested would just lead to more genocides. So it was either the lives of everyone on the Death Star or the populations of multiple planets. Everyone on the Death Star knew what they were in for. Luke did the right thing and saved countless billions of lives.

>think this thread in its history
Look on the archives. Every point you've made so far has been counter-argued repeatedly in the archives. The Imperial apologist schtick is getting stale.

Any X-Wing players here? I just bought my first core set, and am starting to understand the game. Any advice? Any easy factions/ships/pilots to start on?

>>43529505
>And what about Alderaan? Not even the Empire's propaganda machine can cover up the fact that they blew up a planet of pacifists that had representation in the galactic senate
"Look, we have the princess of the ruling body of the planet here, she's a confirmed rebel and is apparently pretty high up in their ranks. It was only a matter of time before they became a significant threat to the stability of the galaxy. If they had wished to hide behind the moniker of peace, they should not have allowed their crown princess to deal with terrorists"
The empire could easily spin it as "This is what happens when you let the rebels in". That deterrent is valuable to them.

>Everyone on the Death Star knew what they were in for.
Is the entire galaxy as civilized and peaceful as alderaan, naboo, and coruscant? Did most of the imperial staff come from those worlds? Or did they come from places where lawlessness and disorder cause untold suffering?
There are no noble acts in war. You do what you have to. My dad killed a kid in vietnam because the north vietnamese soldiers had duct-taped a bomb to his hand. Is that evil? Killing an innocent that is being used by another?

It's a grey area, i would argue. Neither good nor bad, just unpleasant. That unpleasantness is why the movies avoid looking into it.

>Look on the archives. Every point you've made so far has been counter-argued repeatedly in the archives. The Imperial apologist schtick is getting stale.
Everything about star wars, aside from just discussing the new movies, has already been discussed somewhere. It's petty to pick my line of dialogue from all the others.

>>43529571

Not him, but "interesting" doesn't mean "were winners".

>>43529571

Those stories are good because they usually involve the character discovering that they are good for more than just war.

Y'know, like ben kenobi?

>>43529667
>a story where a jedi battles the conflict between the jedi's mantra of peace and their ubiquitous use as foot soldiers for the government at the time

Good lord, i would cum buckets.

>>43528474
It's called the Syrian Civil War.

And ISIS holds territory and fulfills the classic meaningful monopoly on violence criteria for states.

>>43529757

And yet we legally define it differently. Pretty sure the USA would not be allowed to interfere with internal matters like that otherwise.

>>43529798

>What is Korea and Vietnam

We can interfere wherever we think it relevant. It's like the Cold War, only the Bulwark is against extremists, not communists.

>>43529798
The US is a meddling busybody whose definitions tend towards suspect by default.

>>43529891
>>43529885

Are they evil? Or is it just relative?

>>43529919
Real-world's always murky, but they do seem to be sliding for the deep end.

>>43529649
>Is the entire galaxy as civilized and peaceful as alderaan, naboo, and coruscant?
Unconfirmed in current canon (not enough setting building yet), though in Legends, the Core Worlds and Mid Rim weren't lawless shitholes. Most of the galaxy was pretty alright, regardless of the current galactic power.

>Deterrent
Everyone in the galaxy knew that Alderaan was a planet of pacifists. You (or an anon in agreement with you) argued that just because Palps and Tarkin were evil, doesn't mean the entire Empire was. By that logic, just because Leia was a Rebel, doesn't mean all of Alderaan was Rebels. Hell, there were even Alderaanians in the Imperial military in Legends, so the Empire knew for a fact that Alderaan wasn't totally compromised.

>No noble acts
The Death Star was built to annihilate planets in an era where the Empire already had dominion over most of the known galaxy. Star Destroyers were more cost-effective, more practical, and perfectly capable of both sterilizing planets and precision strikes. The Death Star was pretty obviously a tool of genocide and repression rather than a simple military project. Blowing it up was noble as fuck.

>Everything about Star Wars has already been discussed somewhere
RPG storytimes, XWM/Armada lists and tactics, CCG/LCG talk, and starship construction are always open to new shit. There are plenty of other areas of galactic history and culture to discuss and speculate on, too.

>>43528044
>I might want to run a Jedi game.
So make sure everyone is on the page first. "We're doing a Jedi game, everyone play a Jedi."

>The other part is I just prefer to make up my own settings.
You have to make up your own setting within a Star Wars game for it to be successful. Otherwise, everyone knows all the secrets to the game (Darth Vader is Anakin, Luke's dad; there's another Death Star; the Emperor is an evil Sith Wizard dude; Yoda is a little muppet; Leia is Luke's sister). You almost have to change the old secrets, and you certainly have to create your own for your players to explore. In one game, I had it where Darth Vader wasn't Anakin Skywalker, but more a position or title that was passed on from person to person, sort of like the Dread Pirate Roberts in Princess Bride. I mean, he is a guy in a robot suit and mask. One of the players actually took up the title of Darth Vader for a while before passing it on the an NPC.

>>43529641
In my opinion either of the "Aces" expansions go well with the TFA core set. Jake (B-Wing), Keyan (A-Wing) and Poe (T-70 X-Wing) all fit into one list for Rebels, and for Empire you'll probably want the Royal Guard TIE title that comes with the Imperial Aces. Carnor Jax is a glorious pain, third behind only Soontir Fel and Darth Vader for most useful Imperial pilot.

If you plan to play it as a beer & pretzels game, just focus on collecting the ships you want to play and use list-builders/proxies.
If you plan to play it competitively, pick a build and go for the most efficient route in terms of card collection. This may involve getting that one obscure upgrade that only comes with a single ship you don't want from a faction you don't play from eBay. FFG does not make it easy.

Gents, was wondering if any of you had any resources or inspiration pieces (movies, books, ect.) to help me not be so shit at writing dogfights.

>>43529249
>Palpatine is evil.
Is he? His only goal was to end conflict and unite the galaxies. You can argue he's an authoritarian, sure, but that doesn't make him evil. And, no, being a Sith doesn't make him evil, either.

>>43530406
The X-Wing novels, comics, and games are the most relevant source. The films' dogfights were heavily inspired by World War II footage, so I'd recommend looking at those as well.

For additional inspiration, I'd recommend looking at Top Gun, and the Wing Commander games.

>>43530406
George Lucas' film Red Tails is a fun look at WW2 dogfights.

The video game War Thunder is free and a good dogfight simulator rooted in WW2.

>>43530424
Incorrect, he's objectively evil as far as the setting is concerned.

>>43530424
I believe his goal was UNLIMITED POWER. Which he achieved by causing x30000 Hitlers worth of death and destruction across a galaxy.

Take that as you will.

>>43530475
>Red Tails
Christ on a pogo-stick no, do not, I repeat do not use this, the dogfights are shit. You'd be better off with fucking Sky Crawlers.

>>43530458
>>43530475
Thanks!

>>43529704

Ahsoka?

>>43530381

Did you mix up the A and B wing pilots?

>>43530586
Absolutely!

>>43530475
>>43530519
The best way I've heard this described is that SW is WW2 dogfights in space whereas Red Tails is space dogfights in WW2.

>>43530749
Sounds about right, except space dogfights would at least be following physics.

>>43530847
GONNA SHOW HIM A LITTLE TRICK I LEARNED

>>43530749

SW is indeed WWII dogfights but in space while Red Tails is a subpar movie playing dress up as a much better movie.

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>>43530876
Fuck, even Sky Crawlers does this better, since they're not pretending existing planes can do a Kulbit, just that superprops can do Pugachev Cobras (and we have modern stunt props that can pull it off)

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>>43531011

>>43531011

That pilot's getting written up for wasting ammo. Looks like the aircraft was downed and the rest was just showing off. How much ammo does that plane typically hold in seconds of continuous fire?

>>43531011
>>43531114
I'm wondering how the three huge holes in the cockpit didn't splatter the pilot, but shots to the plane's underside did.

>>43531189
Pretty sure he was already dead, and the shots to the underside just caused some gibs to get on the glass.

>>43531230

Then why's he still shooting? fighters can only carry so much ammo and so much fuel, wasting them on an already confirmed kill is pretty goddamned wasteful. You'd put yourself out of commission with a lack of fuel and ammo if you made a kill or two like that, unless you're over friendly territory in which case you would just be out of ammo.

If you do it in enemy territory, you're going to have to ditch or bail out and hope they have a good POW policy. But probably not if you're going to pull stunts like that to their guys.

>>43531357
Maybe whatever that is can keep on chugging through a shitload of punishment and the best way to take it out is to gib the pilot?

>>43531435

Sure as hell doesn't look like it.

>>43531357
The man put himself into a spin and wasted the entirety of his ammo on a single plane in that webm, I think it is safe to say logic did not come into this. Why did the people who produced it do this? Because it looked cool to them.
>>43531435
That looks like that one Japanese prototype plane. Forgot the name of it but, if it is then its a no.

Is there anything like warthunder but with 60s/70s planes?

>>43531576
War Thunder once you're max level has 50s planes. That's close as you'll get.

>>43531599
So wait, high people can literally be flying a saber against spitfires? Jesus

>>43531599
Do they have the Arrow? I'm legality obliged to have it for my planefu

>>43531639
No, you'll be flying a Saber against Gloster Meteors and Me-262s.

>>43531668
There's a plane called the G.50 Freccia "Arrow" if that's what you're looking for. Kinda off topic though, I bet /vg/ has a War Thunder thread if you wanna check that out. Or the wiki.

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>>43530847

>except space dogfights would at least be following physics.

Actual space dogfights wouldn't even happen. Space combat would probably be more like submarine warfare than anything, with ships following each other and launching missiles around, and being missed by five million miles is considered a close call.

But that's not exactly Star Wars, is it.

>>43531830
>Actual space dogfights wouldn't even happen.
Not this discussion again.