How do we solve the American problem?

>>9018368
We should take the US and push it somewhere else

>>9018368
start paying out of pocket instead of expecting insurance to pay for everything.

>>9018613
>People should pay for things they can't affort, rather than pooling their resources.
No.

>>9018368

By allowing parents who are able to bring their child to our country to save their child's life from socialized medicine.

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/matt-walsh-courts-in-europe-have-sentenced-a-baby-to-death-this-is-socialized-medicine/

I like how it doesn't even make sense from a purely logical point of view.

Having competing health insurance providers makes no sense at all.

The bigger the health insurance the more efficient it is, the lower the costs, and the more bargaining power they have, against medical providers.

It makes no sense to have a market or competition when the optimal solution is to have one big entity that controls the whole market.

>>9018919
like cable right?

>>9018919
wrong

>>9018943

You cannot compare different markets with different dynamics. Cable is not even an insurance market.

>>9018957

You have big stones to say that when you can see for a fact that it works exactly like that in the 40 or so other developed countries.

>>9018368
>How do we solve the American problem?
Without the Electoral College, Gerrymandering and the retarded-ass Senate, where 6% of the voters control 40% of the seats, we wouldn't have a system where one party chases loopholes instead of voters.

>>9018613
>start paying out of pocket instead of expecting insurance to pay for everything.
That's the opposite of what the successful countries are doing.
Go back to your shitty containment board and let the grown-ups talk.

>>9018943
>like cable right?
Cable isn't a monopoly.

Everyone in America thinks they will never get sick. Americans are arrogant enough to believe that misfortune only happens to others and will never happen to them. So they think of health insurance from the perspective of an eternally healthy person.

Both the insurance providers and the customers are trying to form these pools of eternally healthy individuals, because in theory that would mean they never actually have any medical costs. The moment one of these eternally healthy individuals gets cancer, everyone is suddenly trying to get them off their plan because fuck that guy. How dare he actually induce costs in our pool of eternally healthy individuals.

Americans are special like that.

>>9018368
Let everyone decide to which private insurance they want to take part in if any. Forcing monopol and adding more regulations to system that refuse to work will never make anything better.

>>9018919
Forcing monopoly frees the main provider from need to lower his prices and improve quality because he doesn't have to compete with anyone.

>>9018973
>That's the opposite of what the successful countries are doing.
Like the USA 40 years ago?

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>>9018899
>>>/pol/

>>9019038
>Like the USA 40 years ago?
Are you suggesting the US had a health care monopoly in the 70's?

>>9018368
Where is Italy and Spain? SPQR master race. literally immortal

>>9019085
I'm suggesting they didn't, and it was free from problems USA is facing currently.

>>9019038
>Forcing monopoly frees the main provider from need to lower his prices and improve quality because he doesn't have to compete with anyone.

Well, no shit. The provider would then be a state run non-profit.

>>9019108
We have to make it great again!

>>9019113
Being non-profit doesn't mean it will be cheapest.
Innovations and modernization cost money, but they can lower cost and improve quality. Without competition provider would have no reason to do it because it would not increase his income. The technology would stagnate and prices would say high.

>>9019117
You have to make it great again!
FTFY. I don't give a fuck how USA will handle it's own problems.

>>9019038
>Let everyone decide to which private insurance they want to take part in if any.

Why? There is no way for any provider to magic up some superior deal compared to any other insurance provider.

It's not like some enterprising newcomer can get in the market and magic up lower costs and better coverage.

It's literally just plain fucking math. Everything is predetermined.

The only legitimate way in which a provider can lower costs is by having a larger pool.

In reality when people have a choice of insurance providers, the only criterion that they have to work with, is, costumer service. And costumer service would be entirely irrelevant in a system with just one provider because all those administrative costs associated with handling insurance paperwork would disappear entirely.

>>9019120

The only "innovation" possible is to better detect high risk individuals and forbid them from buying your insurance policy. And figuring out legal pathways to kick-off any ill customer from your plans.

Insurance is just risk calculation. They cannot change reality. All they can do is strive to only "insure" healthy people and chase them away the moment they are get sick.

But sure, keep parroting the same retarded reasoning about "competition" and "innovation" as if we are talking about TVs and PlayStations.

>>9019123
You can have different providers with different customer service, different offer, different prices, different locations etc.
Here we have various private insurances and a public insurance+healthcare. I'm sure you can imagine which one has the worst price/quality ratio.

>>9019131
It actually can change reality. When unhealthy lifestyle will make it harder for you to get insurance and you'll have to pay more, you'll want to change it. Health is not zero-sum game, when you guarantee "free" healthcare for everyone, they will not worry about it and overall healthcare cost will increase.

>>9019108
>and it was free from problems USA is facing currently.
That's not true at all... We had much lower standards back then. In the early 40s it was super shitty, and that's why both Franklin Roosevelt and Harry Truman both pushed for universal health care, only to get lobbied to oblivion. After WWII there was a worker shortage, and employers were not allowed to offer raised wages, so they all vastly increased their benefits programs to entice workers. When we saw a huge increase in the total number of people insured, we said "well, that's pretty good." 75% of people were insured by 1958 and that was considered successful.

>>9019146
Oof, I saw 40s instead of 40 years ago, but the point is similar. We just stuck with what worked at the time, and now it's outdated.

>>9019137

>You can have different providers with different customer service, different offer, different prices, different locations etc.

Or you can have one big country wide provider that offers a cheaper price than any of those smaller providers, simply due to the fact that it has a larger pool risk and much more bargaining power.

Customer service becomes irrelevant because all the paperwork and administrative costs go away.

There are not different offers because everything is included and no different locations because everywhere is included.

All your market based solutions are inferior and the only reason you are so attached to them is purely ideological.

It's never going to be the case that an insurer with a risk pool of a 5 million souls is going to be superior to an insurer with a risk pool of 300 million souls.

>>9019153
>Or you can have one big country wide provider that offers a cheaper price than any of those smaller providers, simply due to the fact that it has a larger pool risk and much more bargaining power.
Where majority of people no longer give a fuck about their health which result in higher costs and increased price.
>Customer service becomes irrelevant because all the paperwork and administrative costs go away.
You can never have no paperwork and administration. There always have to be someone who will observe how the system works, plan and react to changes in the world. And no one will optimize this process better than private company that has to pay for every employee they have.
>There are not different offers because everything is included and no different locations because everywhere is included.
Why? Here we have various insurances that doesn't cover everything everywhere and it's a good thing.
For example some insurances cover routine visits and treatments of teeth, but they don't cover root canal treatment. It forces people to visit dentist often and treat problems quickly before they become much harder and expensive. This way you can have heather people and lower prices in comparison to "cover all for everyone" insurance.
>All your market based solutions are inferior and the only reason you are so attached to them is purely ideological.
I'm attached to them because I can imagine them working and I also can see how fucked up USA's system is. But my favorite health system is probably Singapore where they have mixed system that encourage people to use private healthcare but as the same time protects the poorest. Still, it's quite specific country so it's no where near universal solution.

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>>9018368
Just because its a graph does not mean it pertains to science.

>>9019113
>Trusting a state run nonprofit with your life

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>>9018368
>How do we solve..
What can we learn from Japan (and the other OECD countries)? Some say the yuropoors pay twice for food and half for health.

>>9019264

>wanting your medical costs to be a cost time for a for profit enterprise

>somehow thinking that having people actively trying to not pay for your medical costs is going to result in you having the best health care

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>How do we solve the American problem?

Government run universal heath care for all 0-18 years. Upon graduation all must enter into the military for 10 years (universal health care included).

After those 10 years all must go into private health care providers until age 55. Once 55 years of age all must return to government run universal health care.

Once the age of 75 is reached all must either go back to a private health care provider or a health care pool with funding invested and dictated by the stock market.

>>9019304
>Upon graduation all must enter into the military for 10 years

That's actually pretty dumb. Why would you need that many soldiers today? I mean, even right no without forced military work the military is still huge as fuck. You don't need many more soldiers.

A more solid idea is that upon graduation everyone must work at least part time on a government sponsored company. One of which can be the army, but you can also choose other industries of labor to help support the economy.

Think about it, we actually need more workers than soldiers right now.

>>9019337

Not everyone who joins the military goes into the front lines anon. I thought this was already common knowledge.

Anyway part of the reason for the mandatory military is the exercise/heath standards while the other part is getting into a trade job without going to college and funding it through loans/ debt.

>>9019349
Ok, you are right about that. But an important part of my point is also the "part time" bit. What if I want to attend university right out of school? In your military world, it would be impossible to do that if I must go to the military.

>>9019356

No it wouldn't because there are a number of people in the military who go to college using military tuition assistance, the g.i. bill or the Air Force education program.

It's actually safer to go to college while in the military because you literally have the government as a backer and on your resume.

>>9019386
Ah, I didn't know that. I thought you had to be in like a military base at all times.

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>>9018368
You can't fix American healthcare without fixing the obesity and general lifestyle problems.

>>9019600
Jesus Christ, Americans are disgusting.