>Biology is ea-

>>8950357
>anatomy is hard
???

>>8950365
what caused it to develop such a strange structure as tentacles? we still have no answer to it

>>8950357
biology is hard which is part of the reason why we are terrible at it. Most intelligent people realize that biology is mostly hopeless

>>8950370

To give the succ

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>>8950357
This is the kind of information i would ask my mom to read to me when i was like 3.
i could tell you all about mollusks as a 6 year old.
try researching something like this network which is itself multiple parts of multiple ecosystems that function through many layers of this nets behavior. complexity are like onions
LAYYYYERS

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>>8950370
I thought this board was for smart people

Why haven't octopi began a civilization yet?

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>>8950446
go down an order and ecological nets are structured by organisms interacting with their ecosystem and BAM you just got hit with some heavy layers fool

Biology is rote memorization and not a true hard science.

>>8950453
being aquatic basically means you can never discover fire thus never becoming a relevant

>>8950453
because of oppression

>>8950450
then explain to me the evolutionary novelty, oh master of knowledge

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>>8950357
Octopus, Squids & Nautilus are very intelligent.

Many have larger Brain than the average those Biology major who failed to get into medical school.

Octopus one day could evolve into something smarter than us here on /sci/.

>>8950476
squids and nautilus are dumbasses

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>>8950461
hey retard, how is there anything to memorize without researchers doing hard science?
i really do feel sorry for you sad sacks with an AP-bio tier understanding of life sciences
rote memorize this

>>8950357
that picture reminded me of this, sorry its unrelated

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BorQ_ULcvss

>>8950357
>octopuses

posting in a brainlet thread~

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>>8950483
Sociology is borderline pseudoscience, mixing it up with biology doesn't help your case. It also suggests you can't critically analyze things and spot the obvious flaws in UPDT2220.jpg

>>8950497
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octopus#Etymology_and_pluralization

>>8950475
Tentacles and tentacle-like structures Are some of the simplest examples of appendages organisms use to interact with their environment. It is a pre-cambrian structure found on some of the most basic multi-cellular life on earth: hydra, jellyfish. They aren't "mysterious"

>>8950461
>I've only ever taken freshman Bio

It shows

>>8950505
sociology is just a sub field of ecology
i hope that last thing was a joke because it was a good one

>>8950519
>thinkin the cnidaria tentacle has ANYTHING similar with a cephalopoda tentacle
wow

>>8950497
>not octopopolis
ishygddt

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>>8950577

>not octopopolopsocopolis

>>8950528
Arguably everything is a subfield of philosophy. What bearing does this have on the discussion?

>i hope that last thing was a joke
It is no joke. You clearly have serious problems thinking properly if you cannot critically analyze this and spot the obvious flaws and it will adversely affect your life and career, unless your career is sophistry of course.

http://rstb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/367/1606/3158.figures-only

>>8950567
he asked
>how could such a thing evolve
it's not hard to imagine how was my point.

>>8950453
Legitimate answer, because males are at high risk of dying during mating and females are at high risk of death during child birth. And I don't mean high risk like 50%, I mean like 99%. They don't raise their offspring, so no knowledge is passed down and no language is even formed. If they didn't die in childbirth and behaved like dolphins (and they are neurologically capable), they'd probably become a rival species in a few hundred generations, especially if aided by humanity.

>>8951052
Self correction:
>Oviparity depositing
>Not child birth. (Duh.)

>>8950483

those are mountains you stupid dumb fucking biolo"gist"

these double digit IQ niggers and their stupid nigger babble, I swear

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>>8950617
Well I will agree I have a thought problem at the moment, I'm trying to do all the drugs at reckless amounts tonight before sleep.
I wasn't counting on you reverse search, clever girl. That's what I thought was jokeᎡ I can't understand the picture let alone find your spook.
Explained it to me

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>biology is a soft sci-

>>8951101
ence

>>8950582
>not octopocolyptopopuloptopopsocopolis

>>8950617
Also no, social systems are ecological networks

>>8951146
>HOLD THE PHONE UP
Social networks and systems exist in ecological systems. Sociology is part of systems ecology and I'm not taking about the "y is really just x" meme

>>8950453
they rely on welfare

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>>8950468
What about using geothermal heat?

Depends on what field you're talking about OP. There's a major power gap between molecular genetics and ecology.

Also, bioinformatics is the way of the future for research and medical diagnosis.

>biology is easy
said no one ever

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>>8951101
>diffgeo applied to biological systems is biology

>>8950453

Why haven't niggers developed civilisation yet?

>>8951815
The father doesn't pass down information because he usually leaves

>>8950453
1.No individuality due to their nervous system
2.Fingers will never exist underwater
3.Die after fucking
4.Metal is impossible to mine underwater unless you are in the modern age
5.Surrounded by things that eat them unlike humans on land who can just move away
6.No endoskeletons
7.No social systems they are solitary creatures
8.No chance of a written language
9.They communicate with skin patterns rather than sound making any kanguage of theirs impractical
10.Tentacles have terrible dexterity compared to our fingers

>>8950357
If you didn't know all that before entering the degree, you don't belong in it.

>>8950370
japanese porn

>>8950370
God made it like that

>>8951795
Diffgeo is literally just a language for global analysis, although that statement has triggered fellow diffgeo-meters more than once.

>>8951690
Water from a hydrothermal vent can reach up to 464 degrees celcius, according to wiki, so octopi could potentially smelt lead, tin and zinc, but not copper/bronze or iron.

>>8951838
I would add that they live very short.

>9.They communicate with skin patterns rather than sound making any kanguage of theirs impractical
This is actually pretty cool, no? They could literally write glyphs directly on their skin, why couldn't they make a language with that?

>>8952100
yeah but how would they communicate in long distances

>>8951945
it is not about the anatomy of the octopussy, you brainlet
it is how he is an evolutive aberration

>>8950357
>remember parts of animals
>hard

>>8952100
sound can be used for long distance and doesnt need to be seen.

>>8950357
-sy

>>8950453
>octopi
Octopodes
Also to answer you question cephalopods are solitary creatures by nature living their entire lives alone so they lack any kind of social structure that would be necessary to form a society

>>8950370

God done did it.

Could a society evolve underwater
Not having fingers or fire seems fucking shitty

>>8953119
I saw an ancient aliens tier documentary about mermaids
the theory was that some humans evolved into mermaids because ancient humans would collect molluscs off the African coast

>>8950453
not very social

>>8952889
> Octopodes
Octopuses

>>8950456
>movement path is random
Huh?

>>8953127
>Octopuses
Octopus

>>8950567
Fuckin brainlets I swear...

>>8953476
Octop00si

>>8950450
why did you think that, the only intelligence test for posting on this board is being able to locate it.

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>>8951763
>bioinformatics is the way of the future for research and medical diagnosis.

Bioinformatician here, he is correct

Who the fuck thinks biology is easy? The sheer amount of things you have to memorize turns most people off of it almost immediately.

>>8951838
Noice

>>8950453
no need, already past that phase

>>8950370
>what caused it to develop such a strange structure as tentacles?
the need to survive

>>8950357
biology is shit because its all memorization, theres little to no understanding compared to other fields

>>8950453
da white man

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>>8950528
>sociology is just a sub field of ecology
>unless your career is sophistry of course.
>Arguably everything is a subfield of philosophy
>You clearly have serious problems thinking
>critically analyze
>critically

>Being this condescending even though your pseudoscience field believes in 20 demisexual, asexual, pansexual genders and denies almost all influences of evolutionary biology in humans since their too deep4u in space for bullshit ideas of tabula rasa and 100 year old books written by cocaine addict freudoed.

>>8950456
this makes no sense. fucking lifehacks blogs come up with the dumbest shit

>>8951815
Because this board isn't /pol/.

>>8950453
For one thing, they barely have more intelligence than the house cat, who also haven't created their own civilization.

>>8956187
?

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>>8956235
They may not have created their own civilization, but they have co-opted ours.

>>8950357
i always hated biology in school
instead of biology physics and chemistry we had the class called BPC but the problem was that there were no teacher that could do all 3 topics.

always got A´s in physics and B´s in chem without even learning but biology was just bland memorizing of stupid facts
teacher ingrade 10
>lets take that text with missing words, well i write the answers on the bord otherwise it takes to long.
most of the time i just read the words 10min before the test so just got B&C´s

>>8950370
it evolved you dip

>>8953983
What does bioinformatic do?

No field of stem is easy when you get at a post-phd level. There is always shit like biophysics, neuronal networking etc

>>8957374
generate simulations of biological models based on known data and long equations


cool stuff

>>8957674
>biophysics
So you're admitting that biology actually gets hard when it's mixed with physics

>>8957704
>mixed with physics

all applied science is "mixed with physics" on some level you autist. what kind of biology isn't "mixed with physics"? what i'm saying is once you get at post-phd level, all stem fields get "hard".

>>8957707
Ugh, no shit! Every thing gets hard, but if physics is harder, so it's easy compared to physics

>>8957374
Sequence analysis, structure prediction etc.

Who else here /biofag/ who gets sad every fucking time someone conflates anatomy and physiology with biology holistically?

It's like saying Math is the easiest shit in the world because I can add and subtract.

Biofags and chemfags are the coolest people on /sci/ anyways, besides maybe geofags or the stray astrofag.

>>8950357
a child could memorize that in a number of minutes with ease I really hope this is a troll

>>8957726
You do realize that's not what biology is though, correct? And a potential meaning behind the OP could be that systems that end up with organs that are far and gone from mammalian organs have a lot yet to be discovered?

Maybe the discussion is that there are a lot of levels of analysis that can be done on what selection pressures would favor some of the phenotypes shown?

Or, perhaps it could be a leadin to a question of what kind of genes were mutated to produce the organs seen in the octopus, which ones are likely homologous and which ones are homoplaisic to mammals (hint: With octopi, it's actually incredibly interesting, their evolutionary track and how much independently evolved with similar function to mammals).

Or maybe it's a systematic approach, discussing the physiological means behind the function of the octopus. What chemical is synthesized for their ink, how is it done, what are the involved enzymes, how can those enzymes be mimicked by commercial means, what kind of tissues are involved in the creation of a vacuum with suction cups, how much force can they withstand, how can similar polymers be synthesized using their suction cups as models, etc.

You're legitimately retarded if you think biology is as simple as naming body parts.

>>8957712
but physics isn't separated from other stem fields by some brick wall you autist. physics are biology and biology is physics

>>8956358
I guess that's why Australia wants to genocide them all.

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>>8957674 >biophysics

>>8957704
>biology actually gets hard when it's mixed with physics

Just like the hardest part of Chemistry is Physical Chemistry.

>>8957758
Hardest part of physics confirmed to be physical physics.

>>8950370
Tentacles made it a more successful hunter

>>8957374
Enormous, revolutionary, and unprecedented prediction power for biology. It is the means for biology to transform into a full-fledged hard science rather than sitting on the fence between hard and soft.

In the next couple decades, it will be mandatory for a biologist to know NCBI, Ensembl, etc. inside and out like an engineer to Autocad or Solid Edge. Oh, and likely need to know a programming language relevant to their field like Perl for PCR funsies.

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>>8957699
Essential stuff too, without fields like computational chemistry and bioinformatics we wouldn't be able to make effective fucking medicines, its used to elucidate the structure of enzyme receptors for drugs for example. Its helpful to see the shit you talk theory about in a 3 dimensional representation, this is just one use of the field which is now necessary for our existence. Fields like bioinformatics will prove invaluable to the superbug shit happening rn and as of the future.

>>8957802
> It is the means for biology to transform into a full-fledged hard science rather than sitting on the fence between hard and soft.

Oh my nig, I get a bit of flack for taking compsci with Biotech from both sides and chemfags, environmental, earth science and all the fields that require bio don't seem to share any interest in computational sciences either which is sort of disappointing, it can get lonely at times.

Also did you know the guy who invented PCR doesn't think AIDS is caused by HIV and climate change is an over-hyped conspiracy perpetuated by environmentalists ayy.

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>people talking about "hard" life sciences topics

>not a single mention of bioinformatics/genetics

I thought this board was full of miniature Niel dé grass Tyrone aspirants and mathematics students trying to prove they're the homo universalis of the 21st century despite not actually knowing anything.

This thread has me pleasantly surprised.

>>8958039
>the guy who invented PCR doesn't think AIDS is causes by HIV and climate change is an over-hyped conspiracy theory perpetuated by environmentalists

That's actually pretty disappointing for someone who basically made the most ubiquitous research tool for literally any DNA work today

Also, I'm picking up Perl, but what other languages are relevant to the field of bioinformatics? I've been thinking R for those dank statistics.

>>8958188
Python

>>8950450
> Thinks the board is for smart people
> is sooooo fucking wrong

>>8951101
>sees a bunch of vector-valued transformation functions
>supposed to be a hard science now?

>>8958188
python is good to know. i myself am in neurobiology, did some NEURON and helped my prof with a model of a network of axons but dont know much programming.

after i finish learning german, ill def give python a go

>>8958188
perl is shit. learn you a haskell

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>Working in a research lab, studying novel mechanisms of gene regulation and genomic structure based on alternative hyrdogen-bonding patterns
>See this shitty thread

Fucking field biologists, I swear

>>8959186

>working in field
>nice sunny day
>go collect some samples and data at some sites
>walk around fields and woods with 2 cute girls
>have picnic for lunch
>do nothing but chat for 2 hours
>write report and put info into excel, takes 1-2 hours
>thinks how perfect and easy life is
>walk past the research lab.
>all skinny pale miserable virgins
>wearing stupid rubber gloves and white cloak
>they must think they are wizards of something


ahh lifes good

>>8957797
well Im set, I was great in physical education

Since we're doing a dick comparing, what's a good hard science to combine with a BSc in biochem? I don't have mine yet but I don't know what other fields I can go into after my bachelors.

>>8959186
literally biologists and bio"""chemists""" are the most worthless """scientists""" ever.

They only are considered """scientists""" because they test (worthless) hypotheses.

>>8959221
>The majority of my lab are men over 6'2"
>Only one person is single, due to him banging college chicks on the weekend

Meanwhile

>Tromp through mosquito-infested wood, with mud flying up to your nose every step
>Finally lunch
>The woman in charge of lunch packed some vegan shit because she thinks eating meat is evil
>Worse still, it's some garbage meat-substitute that tastes like shit
>6 more hours of stomping through shit, getting chewed up by mosquitoes
>Only have to do this 30 more times to categorize all the flora in these few acres of forest
>I hope my state's science journal accepts this publication instead of that damn chem undergrad at the bigger state college

>>8959232
And research diseases, but who cares about progressing society out of suffering from horrendous diseases? We've got plague doctors to keep everyone healthy!

>>8959221
>easy
So you admit that biology is the easiest thing that could be called science and is for brainlets, then?

>>8959221
everyone in my life is severely autistic. when i was interviewed prof told them to present to me their research, and they were whispering so that the others wouldn't hear them.

i am 75% sure i got the position for having confidence and not mumbling to my shoes

>>8959232
hope you enjoy modern medicine you autist. tell me more about your high energy particle research that can never be proven, i'll wait

>>8959229

Why did you do biochem? Ever pharmaceutical in the USA will put you in a bullshit analyst job where you do loss on drying and karl fischer all day unless you have an ACS certified chemistry degree.

If you're looking for a bio-type job with proteins, you need pharmacokinetics, so I really hope you took some extra courses. You're going to be purifying proteins and "isolating" them right out of the hplc if you can even find a position.

I don't understand why anyone would major in biochemistry

>>8959244
all fields in stem can be hard, all can be easy.

>>8959248
lab*

>>8959250
I'm a blazing autismo that's good with memory and love life sciences so it seemed like a perfect fit. With a description like yours I hope I won't be too fucked.

>>8959250
>literally the chemistry of life
>work with proteins aka. natural nano-machines in the lab
>you can even go into computational, doing folding simulations etc.

Why would you not major in biochemistry?

>>8959229
Physics or CS.

>>8959252
t. brainlet biologist

>>8959266
what is a field of science you'd consider hard (not him)

>>8959260
You're totally fucked unless you go into Quality assurance data review devisions.

You have a pedantic live ahead of you, my dude.

>>8959262

There is nobody who will hire you with biochemistry. You're basically the same as an english major unless your daddy has contacts.

>>8959291
Maybe that's how it is for you. Where I live, there are plenty of jobs for biochemists.
I'm an undergraduate student, but many of the graduate students are already working in biotech companies or doing their thesis at biotech companies.

>>8950357
Why would it matter? It's not like anyone here will ever accomplish anything in their fields anyway.

>>8959291
Following your dream sucks, ah well. Luckily for me I live in a busy city and the amount of people who earned a degree is low, so there's that I guess.

>>8959266
t. undergrad autist

>>8959291
if you're good, you can go into research and eventually academia.

stay defeatist fggt

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>>8959221
My nigga
Just went to a field reasearch and there was karaoke and burguers near a waterfall

>>8950477
Not compared to you.

>>8959311
>I'm an undergraduate student
You don't know how industry works.

>>8959604
>if you're good, you can go into research and eventually academia.

No, if you luck out and happen to find a PI that has a grad student that get's a hit (very very rare now, outside of catalysis) you might find a successful academic career. Most grad work in chemistry these days is really drag mechanistic stuff.

Industry at least holds validation, which is probably the most enduring of scientific proof that we work at today. Protocol development and process validation is actually what would interest a motivated scientist most.

>>8950370
The Great flying spaghetti monster made them in its image

>>8950370
>I've never read a book on basic mollusk phylogeny or evolution
>Therefore no one has an answer to the tentacle

>>8961619
> I'm just gonna greentext and pretend I know what I'm talking about

>>8960437
>You don't know how industry works.
What a thoughtful reply. Even if I don't know how industry works, it doesn't change what I've seen and heard from peers, older students and professors, that is many biochemists work in industry.
Of course, as I've already said, this might be different for you. Maybe you live in an area that doesn't have a lot of biotech companies, or maybe you just went to a shitty university.

>>8950357
>Memorisation is ha-
>Autistic savants
Q.E.D

>>8959186
how do I become you? but less snarky

>>8950370

Out of my ass.

Taking into account that molluscs are a giant mass of muscles, the ancestor of Cephalopoda maybe was pretty much like Nautilus or Planorbis, but as these species propagated, time added diversity of forms, one of these was that the "feet" that formed the mollusc started to subdivide into extremities that were as muscular as the rest of the body, more evolution added finer control and a need to grapple and secure prey so those that started to develop suckers were chosen over the rest.

If I'm right you are looking at a giant, very modified "snail" that has one feet divided in 8 tentacles that just happen to have suckers.

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>>8951838
>No social systems they are solitary creatures

I call them bros.

>>8959235
>>The majority of my lab are men over 6'2"
>Only one person is single, due to him banging college chicks on the weekend
t. Narcissistic rage

>lab
*yawn*
I bet those chemicals are real interesting. All the ladies must swoon when you tell them benzene. Poor me they just cringe so hard their panties start to rain when I tell them what that bird calling is and what kind of tree it's on. I just bore them when I try to explain ecology. I wish I had something interesting to talk about, like the Hoffman reaction
>I'm afraid to go outside
Confirmed that lab fats aren't even human anymore.

>>8950370
some bastard mutated with something similar to tentacles and it helped him survive, so that trait continued among individuals

Half of you wouldn't even be shitposting about how soft biology is if it weren't for biologists fucking around making vaccines, deriving antibiotics from fungi, and making your food/environment you live in not garbage because of the application of their studies.

I have so much fun doing field work and the pay is pretty decent for being outside so frequently. I can actually see the application of my work in the environment rather than just publishing a paper and constantly begging for grants.

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Well, you tell me...

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>>8965376
>ecosystems
>entry level
reee why don't Marco biologists get any respect among plebs

>>8959631
Just got back from the uc research station in big sur where I dove in kelp forests all day and did mushrooms under redwoods and soaked in sulphur springs by night.
it was awful I quit my masters and am starting back at square one to become a chemist. I'm supposed to go back to that shithole. I just want to kill myself

>>8959186
>he thinks he's a big man
biology literally feels like an elective instead of a full-fledged degree. it's that easy.

t. mech eng & biology double major

>>8965376
How do I get started on sex-linking my traits and studying qt mapping

>>8950370
Adaptation

>>8960437
i-is this true, anon? how do you get into industry, then?

>>8965376
EXCLUSION CHROMATOGRAPHY, ION-EXCHANGE CHROMATOGRAPHY, AFFINITY CHROMATOGRAPHY, MASS SPECTROSCOPY

>"TORTURE"

so the more chemistry ish it gets the harder?
lol I've always enjoyed spectroscopy and chromatography, this is such a cute image though I love it

A physfag or CS version would be neat.

>>8965376
no protein engineering, I am disappoint.

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At the undergrad level, a degree in biology (or any flavor) will be mostly rote memorization. As you go towards biochemistry, you'll have more coursework in biophysical chemistry or physical chemistry, analytical chemistry, etc. Not to say that this class is tremendously mathematically rigorous (you can get by with diff Eqs), but I wouldn't say it's all rote memorization. On the other had, most tracks in evolutionary biology and ecology are rote memorization.

>>8957758
Have that textbook in my collection. Not my favorite, but it's kewl. The go-to textbook for first-semester biophysical chemistry in grad school (read: Biophysics 101) is Molecular Driving Forces by Ken Dill.

>>8959291
>There is nobody who will hire you with biochemistry. You're basically the same as an english major unless your daddy has contacts.
Don't agree with this. Not to say that you'll have a ton of opportunities, but you should be able to get hired as a lab tech in academia. Your odds of getting much in pharma or biotech that's not shitty QC/QA work are low. So you get a few years of experience under your belt, and then you're in business. My buddies and I needed to get that first gig, but after that we all went off to do a number of different things (grad school, med school, industry R&D, business development in pharma, consulting, etc.). I think that's the key with the biochem degree, it is getting that first post-undergrad experience. I wouldn't say you'll have as many opportunities as an engineering major, but you'll be better off than english or humanities majors.

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>just got BTFO on my plant bio lab exam

i fucking hate bio so much, all the multiple choice Qs are retarded and any answer could work, long answers have a million workable answers but if you don't have one specific thing you get marked down

im getting buttfucked by this class

>>8965600
You start in method development or R&d and work your way to validation

>>8965828
serves your right, math brainlet

>math brainlets literally shit themselves when there's no magical formula to solve a problem and they actually have to use their brains
shitting myself in laughter over here

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>>8965390
Devolution Science

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>>8965390
Devolution

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>>8965390
Devo

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>>8965390
Devol

>>8965376
ORF finding is monkey-tier nowadays.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/orffinder/

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>>8966082
>>8966084
>>8966085
>>8966088
Here is some real science
>journal.frontiersin.org/article/10.3389/fevo.2017.00003/full

>Due to the loss of the initial behavioral plasticity that allowed the animals to adopt the new behavior, the persistence of that behavior—and thus of the epigenetic/genetic anatomical features related to it—might become counterproductive when the external environment is changed, as is the case of pandas and the lack of available bamboo. At one moment in time, the ancestors of pandas did not eat bamboo, but then were able to perform a behavioral shift in order to eat it successfully. But, for some reason, extant pandas do no longer seem to have the ability to perform a new major behavioral shift/choice to substantially decrease their consumption of bamboo. >In some cases, lack of behavioral plasticity may in turn depend reciprocally on the presence of, e.g., anatomical and/or genetic features that were selected within the context of the behavior acquired during the initial behavioral shift. For instance, the overspecialization of the “panda's thumb” might not allow pandas to revert to the more generalized type of diet that their ancestors had. Apart from natural selection (i.e. after the pandas started to mainly eat bamboo those random mutations that happened to be advantageous within that niche were selected), the lack of plasticity could also be enhanced by phenomena such as genetic drift, i.e., to a random sampling of those organisms that had those genetic features.

>Due to the loss of the initial behavioral plasticity that allowed the animals to adopt the new behavior, the persistence of that behavior
Take this and consider the way human social behavoir emerged and the way our society has evolved to the point of complex-adaptive behavoir where we are sufficiently enslaved to it. The anthropocene and evolutionary traps. The beginning was the end. Only holistic self-awareness can save us.

>>8965376
Nice, I remember there being one for mathematics but didn't know about this one, must be recent.

>>8965376
fkn saved.

Biology, astronomy, and quantum physics are the reasons I started believing in God.