New Experiments Show Consciousness Affects Matter ~ Dean Radin Ph.D

>>8943718
this looks like an image from that meme, and therefore, i deem this entire topic a meme.
saged

>>8943718

1) misqoting people
2) they don't know how a fourier transform works
3) the charts imply that "non meditators" have the opposite effect with almost the same confidence.

Yes consciousness affects matter, it's called EEG, or fMRI, or moving your hand.

this is bullshit.

>>8943771
Please reply only after you have actually watched the video

>>8943787

how'd they take people's EEG during online surveys? @27 minutes.

>>8943820
They did not. This hardly invalidates the experiment - in fact, it just warrants more studies.

>>8943832

I still think they cherrypick data somewhere. because I can cherrypick their data and give them a 5 sigma with their data that if you don't meditate you can't observe quantum effects.

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>>8943718
>Skip through pseudoscience video
>See "The Double Slit Experiment"
Every time

>>8943853

what triggered me is that at the beginning they claim that schrödinger agrees with them

>>8943889
How can that be? Schrodinger is DEAD.

>>8944124
...or is he?

>>8944212
i wonder if he was cremated or not, because if he's buried in a coffin (a box), well, then... lol

>Consciousness affects matter.
>What is human?
Duh.

>>8943718
>moves hand
You're right, it does.

>>8943718
- It isn't revolutionary, people have been having these nutty ideas since quantum mechanics was formulated.
- Its bullshit and the only people that take it seriously are people who don't understand the physics.
- Not trying to be elitist or anything, so Il just say that if you read a shit tone of math and actually study the real science you will see why scientists don't take this shit seriously. As far as physics goes, ordinary non-relativistic quantum mechanics isn't that hard.

Radin is with the Institute for Noetic Science, a new-age woo-fest of incredible proportions promoting psychic healing, meditation, an the like.

>>8943889
1: Replace cat with hand grenade.
2: Replace device that kills cat with one that pulls grenade pin.
3: Ask these nuts who misuse Schrodinger if they will keep this amazing new Schrodinger's Hand Grenade box experiments box in their homes or offices.
4: ?????
5: PROFIT!

For extra credit, tell them they can use their consciousness to manipulate the matter in the box if they like.

No valid counter-arguments posted yet.
Come on /sci/ you are no better than /x/.

Explain precognitive dreams without memeing yourself into the "You just deja-vu'd a new memory as it happened" or "the brain got lucky with a guess" frame of argument.

I find it hard to believe on a website of 25+ million active users that nobody else on /sci/ but me has had real precognitive dreams they cannot rationally explain via science.

>>8945116
Is this enough

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>>8945187
>>8945116
pic related

I don't even need to watch the whole 40 minutes to literally know that it's pseudoscience bullcrap.

source: the shit you posted

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>>8943718

observation by physical instruments != some mind being conciously aware of it

>"Magical thinking is most prominent in children between ages 2 and 7. During this age, children strongly believe that their personal thought has a direct effect on the rest of the world"

>>8945204
>what is experiment proving a thesis

>>8945175
Even a """scientific""" mind is irrational and falters, seeking excuses that fit its narrow worldview - even when presented with evidence that proves otherwise.

>>8945116
I watched the first minute. Maybe the author diverges from that for the rest of the lecture. But if he doesn't then here's the easy counter argument.

Observation does not require human consciousness. Any measurement device can interfere with the experiment. Human observation is only a subset of measurements that can "collapse" a system.

Postulating that observing the wave function collapses it in this exact wording was the biggest mistake of QM forefathers. Why the fuck didn't they just call it interaction.

>>8945230
Expand on the "subset of measurements" that collapse the system. The chain ends where consciounsness begins.

>>8945268
It means there are other ways to "collapse" the wave function other than direct human observation.

The chain metaphor assumes wave functions will never "collapse" without some conscious acknowledgement at the end of that chain. That assumes quantum behavior either did not exist before human beings or that wave functions never "collapsed" before human beings. Aside from how ridiculous that sounds, neither statement can be verified.

Moreover, can dogs collapse wave functions? What about my cat? How about aliums? Is human consciousness somehow super special?
This whole consciousness collapse trope is retarded and doing a disservice to quantum physics.

Some choice quotes from the video

>The double slit experiment didn't know, we think, whether it was a human looking at it or a linux system

>We don't know whether a linux system is conscious or not, but if it is it probably doesn't have the same level of consciousness as a human

"""""""""""science of consciousness""""""""""

>>8943718
it was commonplace at the major online news org I worked at that videos were meant to reach the functionally illiterate who could not benefit from reading our articles because reading was difficult. this kinda implies that any 'scientific' result presented on youtube is eo ipso bullshit. post the paper about the study and wait outside until we reach a verdict.

>>8945361
http://deanradin.com/evidence/RadinPhysicsEssays2016.pdf

Not peer reviewed because 2revolutionary4u

>>8945116

> why is the fourier transform of pixel count somehow in frequency space, not in momentum space

> why does an apparent collapse reduce the amplitude of the fourier spectrum, and not create a new shape (as you would expect from a different distribution)?

> why not make a 4 second video of a person collapsing the wave function and show everybody?

> why not have a lecture hall of people simultaniously collapsing the wave function, so no one mind may "wander"?

"We don't want this to be physics 101" aka. "We don't want to think before acting, and are

>>8945429
too lazy to come up with a proper experimental setup"

>>8943718
>YouTube video on consciousness
>6 s in
>Double slit experiment and quantum mechanics already mentioned.
Well this is going to be shit.

>>8944212
I'm pretty sure the cat killed him.
You don't mess with cats.

What is visible to the human's physical eyes is but a tiny iota within endlessness.

What he cannot see with his eyes is immeasurable, inconceivable and unthinkable; it is confusing and unimaginable for his unspiritual human intelligence and (mental) capacity.

Just because society has programmed you to function by holding science's hand, does not mean it will further your awareness in any way.

Arguing is counterproductive, I will welcome the truth while some of you slam into it and your house of cards crashes and burns.

More experiments are underway.

basically disproves consciousness

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>>8946044
Top kek

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omg no this is old.
the human observation objective tests in the 60s proved this.

>>8946260
>""""""""""Proved""""""""""

>>8946044
so, this is fucking retarded.

>>8946266
it's the least retarded thing on this board atm

>>8943718
New experiments show muh dick affects your wifes vagina in ways whitey cant comprehend.

>>8945021
out of curiosity do you understand the math behind QM?

>>8945301
Are computers conscious? I can't see how one could claim the opposite.

>>8946604
I'd say its roughly because they can't create and lack true randomness

>>8943845
True. That's why you have to falsify the experiment.

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"so.. if you imagine you have a photon"

Stopped right there.

Educate your selves brainlets:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM-QXxqApv4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voXRGVDOzMw

you cannot collapse the wave function through mere interaction with two particles, that is a faulty idea based on a misunderstanding of qm. it has been proven wrong many times by for example delayed eraser experiments with entangled particles used for measurement.

observing an entangled particle is enough to collapse the wave function of its partner without it needing to interact itself.

this fallacy has been perpetuated since the 80s and dispite its absolute refutation, its something that deterministic faggots cling to as if fact.

>>8946825
What do these videos have to do with the experiment? It can be performed on all particles, from neutrinos to molecules

>>8943748
fpbp

>>8945021
Is it possible to use your brainwaves to manipulate your physical atomic structure pulling in atoms and removing them or shaping your structure?

>>8946825
To be fair, if the one who teaches is wrong, everyone who is taught will be wrong until someone questions the idea. So I suppose i'm a sucker for taking everything as fact instead of actually thinking about it...

>>8945175
Easy, you post-hoc rationalized it.
I've had memories of "I know for a fact this has happened before" while simultaneously being aware of that the event did not happen before.
Spend enough time on 4chan and you'll start believing you've seen the exact same thread with the exact same series of replies before a few months/years ago.
So either there is a conspiracy posting copies of entire threads or it's just faulty memory. I'll go with faulty memory.

>>8946990
Yes. Some shaolin monks and other masterful spiritualists use similar techniques.

But how was fish?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGPL4bko7bw

Vacuum energy maybe. But how was fish?! WHAT

>>8946327
>out of curiosity do you understand the math behind QM?
You mean if I know how to solve an integral?

>>8943718
/pol/ already proved this with meme magic

>>8946327
Yes? Its the same fucked up application of linear algebra that gets applied to ordinary wave mechanics/PDEs. You can open the door to a little more sophistication when you deal with angular momentum or symmetry things, but at its core its just fucked up wave mechanics.

Go back to /x/.

This thread reminded how visiting that board is equal parts fun and infuriating. Lulz are had coming to that board and posting random batshit facts, but also loss of faith in humanity.

>>8946990
If our bodies had evolved such a useful function, would we not be aware of it? Such a trait would not be selected if the species did not put it to consistent use.

>>8947165
No, because such a trait is extraphysical.

>>8945175
Please explain how cars work, but none of the memeing into talk about engines, wheels, and the like.

>>8946825
is he the wildburger of physics?

>>8947063
For a VERY loose definition of "use," yeah.

>>8946825
Wtf I hate Einstein now?

>>8945175
I know what you mean. When i tell people they think im crazy or its just me rationalizing a mild epileptic event BUT i had confided my dream to an outside observer before the event took place. That same observer witnessed said event with me, and to this day he tells me that was the weirdest fucking thing thats ever happened to him. This could be chance, sure. All just statistically possible scenarios that happened to take place, but if you knew the level of detail i had explained to my friend for that dream (which at the time i had no idea would actually happen in real life, i was just telling a friend about a strangely ordinary dream) you would have a hard time saying its all statistics.

>>8946604
has a computer ever told you they're conscious? no? then they probably aren't, brainlet

>>8947165
we are aware of it, we call it free will

>>8945057
kek

>>8947138
No, do you know how to set up the integral? Any freshman can solve it.

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Even if the experiment is correct, correlation does not prove causation. If you are to believe in a causal interpretation of QM, it is more likely that Quantum phenomena causes "meditative" state in the brain than the other way around.
Inb4 Bell's Theorem disproves causality, because it does not disprove non-local determinism nor superdeterminism

>>8947208
Me here
>>8947194
I see what youre doing and i would like to participate. Lets do this chronologically. The key is turned which uses chemical energy in the battery to cause a voltage differential across a copper coil inside of a reversible electric motor called an alternator. This voltage differential causes electrons to flow and create a magnetic field imbalance to turn the alternator shaft, which then causes the magnetic field to rotate and pull the shaft further around in a circle. That rotational energy is used to turn a crankshaft which cases a piston to move up and down in a cylinder. This up and down motion works in unison with a cam shaft and some valves to create a pressure differential which pulls air and fuel in one side of the top of the cylinder, and waste products out the other. Our fuel is gasoline, which we exctract chemical energy from by removing a few carbon atoms from the molecules and binding them with oxygen under extreme heat. Also known as burning. This release of energy is kicked off by a spark (ionized air caused by large electrical discharge) generated by a small gap between wires in a (relatively) high voltage circuit. This voltage comes from a small magnet on a flywheel (kinetic energy storage wheel used to get the engine through every part of its 4 strokes smoothly) passing through a coil of wire. This magnetic field with high relative motion to a conductor induces a votage spike into the wires that lead to our spark gap. Causing our oxygen, gasoline, and heat induced chemical reaction to release its energy. This causes a temperature increase as well as a pressure increase that forces our piston down and turns the crankshaft, which turns the flywheel, and moves the piston into postition for the next firing of the spark gap. The new rotational energy we have exctracted from the chemical energy in the gasoline is transmitted through clutches and gears to the wheels. Char limit! I dont work on cars or anything related to cars.

>>8943718
I want the experiment redone with multiple people, to see if there's a cumulative effect.

Watch other video by IONS or whatever.
They've set up a global network of fucking random number generators based on radiation induced electrons.
They fucking go off scale with Happenings.
People don't even know this is being measured.
What more proof do you need?

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>>8947347

>>8947357
The thing is, they just stay flat out 0 average besides major things happens.
Butter is the answer anyway.

>>8947371
And?

>>8947381
Well, I guess the answer for you is that more research is necessary.
Or do you just dismiss it because it doesn't suit your idea of the world?

>>8947347
Wut

>>8947357
I would argue sample size. The global consiousness project is not one statistic matched up with one statistic. Its thousands of random number generators scattered thrpughout the world, and they all deviate from randomness by a measurable amount at the same time around major world events. It hardly proves anything but that is still quite the anomaly, and warrants an explanation of what the hell is really happening.

>>8947423
Develop please. I just can't answer that.

>>8947428
see
>>8947347
How is that not a better sample?

>>8947437
>>8947428
Sorry, I misread it, I kinda stopped at the first phrase.
It's still a reaction, it's not like the 'global consciousness' triggers those events.
But how do you investigate it without making up a Happening?

>>8947413
He is following the scientific method. However, since science is more politics/fashion than people make it out to be, the very nature of the hypothesis he set out to prove causes problems from a reductionist viewpoint. If he made a generalized hypothesis to a certain type of matter whose state affects the outcome of the double slit experiment, or even just the brain as a physical entity, then the majority of scientists might even agree with him. He lost me at the metaphysical concept of consciousness.

>>8947471
Well it's only natural for him to try and extrapolate on those results.
As I suggested, they need to redo the experiment with groups of people.
This could ether lead to the same result, which would tell us it's still spooky, but not as influential as we thought.
Or otherwise.

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tfw this is literally what Illuminatis talk about.

>>8944124
We must assume that he is both dead and alive, thus he simultaneously agrees or disagrees

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>>8947218
for
print "hello i am concious"
loop

Everyone wants to be the first to find it so they can use it the way they want, but if the same people were to actually get honest and use it respectfully, they would realize they already found it out from the start

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>>8943718
>makes ridiculous claim
>links youtube video
>mfw