EMDRIVE IN SPACE: A SUCCESS

>>8553010
I wish there was a forecast for when they expect results.

>>8553010
>Such an engine would violate the law of conservation of momentum by generating mechanical action without exchanging matter
stop posting stupid shit

>>8553047

Looks like you have to rewrite your textbooks, sonny.

Reality doesn't care.

>>8553103
that line i quoted is twisting words and concepts into a state beyond recognition. it DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING. if you aren't smart enough to read >popsci.com you shouldn't be posting here. if you aren't smart enough to understand when you're reading bullshit you should be focusing on your education.

A fair step for based chinks, a gigantic fuck you to traditional western science dogma.

>>8553117
what did they prove again? can you show me an article with their findings? or is an article written on popsci.com enough to persuade you something is truth?

>>8553117
I hope you are kidding, there is really no proof that they have done anything. And if they did do anything, it would have only been as a result of the usual chink tactics - copying the west.

Space Travel is upon us.

And so is space warfare.

>>8553010
>Popsci.com
>China claims...

China also claims that nothing happened in Tienanmen square.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/emdrive-chinese-space-agency-put-controversial-tech-onto-satellites-soon-possible-1596328

https://www.reddit.com/r/EmDrive/comments/5i1otc/electromagnetic_drive_arabian_nights_or_a_major/

The Chinese article

>>8553047
>>8553110
>>8553124
>>8553131
>>8553310
buttblasted physicists crying over their wasted years regurgitating fairyland models.

>>8553340
wft I love memedrive now,

WHY IS THE MEMEDRIVE SO GOOD

WHY DOES IT HURT MY BRAIN SO MUCH BUT I STILL CANT GET ENOUGH OF IT

I LITERALLY ORGASM AT THE THOUGHT OF HAVING LEARNED BULLSHIT FOR ALL THESE YEARS IN COLLEGE

I REGRET NOTHING

>>8553010
But, China has never even been to space. They don't even have rocket technology.

I'll wait till I have one in my car to start celebrating

>>8553047
Yeah I'm a retarded layman here but it seems like the reason it doesn't break the universe is that it requires a shitload of energy input to do anything, so it's not a fairy tale "perpetual" or "infinite" machine anyway

That said there's a benefit because you don't need to carry a ton of propellant to throw out your asshole to push you away but nevertheless you'd need a bitchin reactor

>>8553406
It requires a lot of energy to produce more kinetic energy than what you put into it. It's still free energy.

The Chinese are on the forefront of submitting garbage to scientific journals, and continually pollute the peer review process (especially in the medical community) with a zerg rush that only China is capable of.

>>8553457

That's only at relativistic velocities which is out of the scope of humans, and it's probably junk science anyway.

>>8553347
>scientific cuck

>>8553522
>That's only at relativistic velocities which is out of the scope of humans
Not true. The break-even velocity is given by

V = 2Rc/(1+R^2)

Where R is the ratio of thrust/power of emdrive to thrust/power of a photon rocket.

The fastest thing humans have ever created is the pair of Helios probes, which reached speeds of approximately 70km/s

To have that speed be the break even speed you would only need an R of 17131 or greater.

Now check out this page which gives experimental results of R

http://emdrive.wiki/Experimental_Results

Five experiments give Rs greater than that.

Now consider that the Helios probes were launched in the 70s, these are only "prototype" meme drives being tested, and the other tests are not far behind 17131.

So if the memedrive worked as advertised, it would mean easy free energy.

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>>8553571
+ for science

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>>8553406
>>8553522

>the reason it doesn't break the universe is that it requires a shitload of energy input to do anything, so it's not a fairy tale "perpetual" or "infinite" machine anyway
>That's only at relativistic velocities

Q factor of the resonance cavity is the best way of determining the efficiency of the EM drive in generating thrust, the higher the better on a linear scale. The current test machines have all operated at less than <50000 Q factor; the theoretical maximum obtained by using Super-cooled superconducting niobium cavities is excess of 100000000000 Q factor.

If the EM drive truly works as proposed and tested by Shaw and others, it WILL obsolete all other engines and methods of power of generation.

What gets me is not the memedrive. Its how many people are convinced ANY of our current models for anything in the universe are 'true'.

IF the Emdrive is "pushing off" of an unknown and normally very hard to detect something, then it's nothing magical at all,it's just using a fuel we normally can't interact with that's everywhere and it's not violating any thermodynamic laws.

Hey guys quick poll. Are you buttblasted about meme drive?

>>8553571
>http://emdrive.wiki/Experimental_Results
>including the retracted NWPU results without even a mention they were retracted

>>8553674
Nah. Why would you be? Either it's nothing and the Chinese and Harold white look like dopey cunts, or it's real and we get to see the biggest shitstorm in physics of all time.

Oh and space will actually genuinely open up too. nuclear freighters will be cruising out to Europa within a decade if it works.

I want it to work, god damn it, why am I this gullible?

>>8553676
What do you expect anon, it's a wiki run by like 5 people, half of who are probably schizophrenic.

>>8553010
Link doesn't even work.

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>>8553677
>why am I this gullible?

>>8553677
Because the guy who made it was too smug about it and because your degree becomes a joke

>>8553683
Degrees are already jokes, this is just confirming what ive been saying all along.

>>8553676
On second look, they at least put in a null result from NWPU.

>>8553683
I don't even have a degree, I'm very conscious of how improbable this is, but the dreamer in me is kicking the shit out of the skeptic right now.

I'm just so tired of how mundane our universe is at the macro scale, all the fun things and awesome places are so far away as to take millennia of travel even at "fast" speed of a thousand miles per second. The weird what the fuck almost magical shit is all happening at a level too small for us to more than indirectly perceive. This is a macroscale miracle, it's like a giant sized quantum eraser or something, something that destroys intuitions and makes you stagger back in bewilderment at the weirdness of everything.

Listen to this stupid shit i'm typing, I'm so fucking ignorant about all of this, that's probably why i bother paying any attention to this dreck.

>>8553683
>Because the guy who made it was too smug about it
this tbqh

>>8553689
>Listen to this stupid shit i'm typing, I'm so fucking ignorant about all of this, that's probably why i bother paying any attention to this dreck.
you're not wrong

it's like if there was a maths article published saying 2+2=4 is a lie and it actually is 5. there'd be people going mental saying we get free shit now because we can just put 2 doughnuts with 2 more 2 doughnuts and we suddenly get a free doughnut. infinite doughnuts for everyone!

well, I believe in free doughnuts just as much as I believe in the memedrive.

>>8553711
This is a little different than that anon, it might just be that thing is pushing off of something that's hard to detect, ie, it has thrust and is in fact 100% compatible with physics.

And need I remind all of you that in point of fact a "reactionless" drive IS possible if you could ever warp space a la an Alcubierre drive? This might even in some weird indirect way be doing just that.

>>8553723
>it might just be that thing is pushing off of something that's hard to detect
well, that's not reactionless thrust so it's not really what we're talking about and my point doesn't apply

if it works it would literally be possible to put in 2 units of energy and then 2 more and get 5 out which is, I think, pretty closely aligned to my example

>>8553010
fuck thats enough. im moving to maths.

>>8553674
nah its fake. never trust chinks.

>>8553010
>It's a piece of space tech that sounds almost too good to be true
really makes you think

If the universe is actually a simulation,could this working be due to some underlying oversight in the system?

>>8553776

It's honestly a bit dumb to assume the universe is a simulation when discussing physics. It's a bit like saying "but what if there's a god that keeps everything together?"

Most of the objections that rely on the free energy aspect assume that the memedrive would continue to produce constant thrust at high velocities. If that is true then it's certainly a damning fact, but it hasn't actually been shown to be the case.

Fuck off back to /r/emdrive or wherever you come from

>>8553787
Petition to call it REMdrive because they're all dreaming

Solar sails using lasers is a reactionless drive, and no one seems to care about that.

>>8553799
because sails are gay

>>8553807

I guess they are, but they're still only using electricity to power the lasers, which propels the craft

It has the same lack of expelled mass as the EM drive

>>8553811
Serious it would need a constant line of sight to work, and as we all know laser beams disperse with distance until there is not enough repulsive force to push the sail.

>>8553837

There's also the problem of breaking if you don't have a laser set up at your destination.

>>8553856
>>8553856
Can actually be done by useing celestial bodys, as a brake.

>>8553799
>Solar sails using lasers is a reactionless drive
wrong

>>8553859
>useing celestial bodys, as a brake.
umm... isnt that called crashing?

>>8553982
Only if you hit it. If you manage to stop before it hits, then no.

>>8553799
No. Whatever design you use, conservation of energy applies. If your design is a reflective one, then the laser suffers a doppler shift as it hits your sail. If you actually have a laser propulsion, then the electrons in you batteries that are in an excited state lose energy as they power the laser and go to a less excited state, losing mass as they do.

Did they ever rule out the microwaves expelling the copper as propellant?

>>8553789
underrated

>>8554022
>Did they ever do a good job?

What do you think, anon?

>>8554022
I have a published paper that claims exactly that.

>>8553789
Wew

>>8553789
AYYY LMAO

>>8554081
how would they escape? are microwaves unsave too now?

If emdrive is real how come my microwave doesn't fly?

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>>8554101
Holy fuck, my sides

>>8553789
That's not funny. Delete that post.

>>8554101
same reason your fan doesn't fly away when you turn it on.
ghosts are holding it.

>>8553571
Kyubey eternallly btfo

I came to /sci/ because the threads on /k/, /his/ and /pol/ are all to retarded to believe.

But this is actually the same shit.

Stay classy, 4chan.

>>8554148
What did you expect when even the scientists are puzzled with meme drive?

>>8554149
Nothing in particular.

I was just hoping for some insight as to why it works or why it's bullshit.

>>8554157
>why it works
No one knows

>why it's bullshit
Because of past experience of the last 400 years

>>8553010

Chinese propaganda, unironically fake news.
Someone in their space agency is scoring political points by "beating" the US after the whole Trump thing.

>>8553655
STOP SPREADING FAKE NEWS RRREEEEEEEEEE

>>8553110
>>8553124
>>8553131
>>8553310
>>8553515
>>8553711
>>8553743
>>8553749
>>8553787
>>8553789
>>8554174

Thank you for your service

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>>8554157
>I was just hoping for some insight as to why it works

It doesn't work

> or why it's bullshit.

Pic related. It looks more like something heating up then cooling down, so my money is on some thermal effect. It wouldn't be with out precedent, there was something called the Pioneer anomaly, it was a very small acceleration (on the order of [math] 10^{-9} ms^{-2} [/math]) that was causing Pioneer 10 and 11 to drift off course, from the time it was discovered no one had much of an idea what was causing it, although there were a lot of """"explanations"""" for it, sound familiar? Well after years of investigation, accurate modeling of the interior of the probes showed that there was some anisotropy in the emission of radiation, and that when this anisotropy is properly taken into account, the anomaly disappears.

I'd put my money on a similar effect in the case of memedrive.

I fully believe that the meme drive works and I take great delight in the tears of Materialist philistines, BUT anything China says should almost be presumed false at this point.

>>8554306
>I take great delight in the tears of Materialist

>>>/x/

>>8554192
>posting memes

>>>/s4s/

>>8554335
Nice rebuttal, cuck.

>>8554319
>an unironic materialist
>>>/garbagecanofhistory/

>>8554350
>>>/x/

What can we also meme into existence? Cold fusion?

>>8554356
>>>/trash/

>>8553702
>implying you wouldn't be smug after inventing by pure chance the definitive "fuck you" engine

>>8553010
>come here expecting actual new info
>nothing new
FUCK OFF WITH YOUR CLAIMED SUCCESS

THEY ARE TESTING IT BUT HAVEN'T CONFIRMED ANYTHING IN ORBIT SO PRETTY MUCH THEY STAND WHERE NASA DOES

IF SUPER CONDUCTING EM DRIVE IS SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO LIFT A CAR THEN WHY THE FUCK WON'T THEY MAKE IT OR AT LEAST TRY TO MAKE THE THRUST STRONGER?

>>8554389
If you found something great by chance, would you lie saying you did it on purpose?

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What kind of fucking retards even fund this shit?

This is wrong on so many levels i don't even
Someone should clean up NASA and fire people.

>>8553010
i fucking LOVE this timeline. Can't wait to memememe around in space.

Since China won the meme race, how will we be able to compete?

>>8554754
Why compete? Let's turn the tables on them. Let them do all the work this time, and we will steal all their trade secrets.

>>8554760
>steal all their trade secrets
>from a racially homogeneous totalitarian state

lol

>>8553010
>China claims

stopped reading there

>>8554370
Do you even E-cat?

>>8554774

Try giving them money. That usually works because of the crazy high incentive to be corrupted in their economy.

>>8553306
>Space Travel is upon us.
>And so is space warfare.


We have been traveling through space since the beginning of time. -
- Also we're traveling though time -
Our planet moves, our solar system moves, Galaxie ...

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>>8553515
>This

Honestly Chinese authors consistently publish utter shite

>>8554101
Fuckin skin effect, rot E = 0 on the surface is a fucking meme and not applicable to the real world. I could imagine the E field entering the copper and interacting with the atoms (plasmonic resonance?) kicking copper atoms out of the wall.

>>8554774
Wait a second. Are you trying to suggest that Chinese IQ isn't higher than all other countries combined? Just give it time.

>>8555030
Just give it time. This is the same shit people were saying about the Japanese in the 60s 70s and 80s.

>>8555064
No, the japs where did never publish such ammounts of pseudoscientific horse shit.
Simply because they are not as corrupt with communist propaganda to top ist of.

The memedrive is bust. Deal with it!

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>>8553789
now that was good

>>8553010
>popsci
fake news

>>8553789
Or because it's the end of the world as we know it?

>>8554128
Ayyy lmao

>>8554435
No

>>8554010

And you'll lose energy in your batteries with the Memedrive too

Chinks post fake news. Hype!

>>8554081
link to the paper?

>>8553010
>http://www.popsci.com/I6e7som75zjo7EHe.03
>EMDRIVE: CHINA CLAIMS SUCCESS WITH THIS 'REACTIONLESS' ENGINE FOR SPACE TRAVEL

Did you even read what you posted?

>>8553340
brainlets they are it is true

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>>8553789
why is the drive being named after best girl?

LMAO AT ALL OF THESE BUTTBLASTED STEMTARDS

But m-muh degree! Muh 300k starting!

FRIENDLY REMINDER there is no scientific method

>>8553010
>404

>>8554101
Because its covariant subspace resonance isn't aligned to the quantum frequency of the solar graviton waves.

>>8554335
>implying [esfores] is the only board on which memes are posted
I seriously hope you guys don't do this.

>>8554435
No, because they wouldn't pay you for further testing, instead they'd hand it over to an actual scientist/engineer who can figure it out.

>>8553010
If I recall correctly photons have no mass, but have moment, is the EM drive really breaking physics rules?

>>8559601
The em drive shouldn't be able to drain the momentum of the photons selectively in a maxwell's demon manner.

The radiation pressure should be net zero within the frustum.

But bouncing a dense laser between to mirrors to push the mirrors apart, that's highschool AP physics.

what if the meme drive is stationary and space is pushnnig off on it?
Checkmate, physicians.

>>8559605
Alright, I took a read about it...very interesting, surprisingly interesting, hope it does really works.

>>8553571
If youre going .5c in space and you travel into a gravitational field will you shatter at the realization of all that energy?

>>8559712
You're never not in a gravitational field

So excited!

>>8554192
the "no response to RF-off" thing is bullshit
you can pretty clearly see the double peak, of which the first corresponds exactly to start of RF-off and the second to end of RF-off (which is not instantaneous as you can see)
oh and fuck off with your textbook cooling curve as well. of fucking course there's a cooling effect
what you have to account for is the sharp increase from 60 to 80 seconds, which is not thermal (and in fact aligns to the RF power curve with too short a lag to be thermal)

>>8553010
Crookes radiometer?

>>8553340
damn
I had this feeling for a bit but this helps me realize that.

Theory without application is garbage just like application without theory is

>>8553124
>he hasn't read the nasa paper confirming that there is small but detectable thrust

>>8553782
Why would the memedrive stop accelerating at high velocities?
Hardmode: no violation of special relativity

>>8553789
The end of the words is QUANTUM PLASMA

>>8553010
>US "serious resources" researching EM Drive

Oh you mean that one mechanical engineer who works in the basement of NASA who's total lab budget is $50k/year?

The one who's latest publication is about bringing down the energy requirements of "warp drive" to the mass-energy of a small truck like three years ago?

The one who's EMDrive results got thrown out in peer-review because his laboratory set-up was unable to account for radiative reflections off of the wall of his vacuum chamber?

That guy?

>>8553010

Thunderf00t proved the EM drive is a pile of horseshit and unlike the majority of this board he understands science.

>>8562056
No, we are obviously talking about the guy who has an EMDrive on a space station in space, l2read.

>>8553668
This.

While I admit the prospect of using poynting vectors to push off of the quantum vacuum is pretty exciting, it doesn't violate any known principles.

>>8561718
>Theory without application is garbage just like application without theory is
spot on

>>8553677
> Nuclear freighters cruising the world's ocean's
> Thinks it's a new thing

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NS_Savannah

>>8553776
>>8553779

Not wrong philosophically, mind you, but if we allowed philosophers to have any say in science, all they would do is make a priori arguments about "well you can't ever KNOW something" and whether or not a force is mediated through a vacuum because there's nothing there.

>mfw modern-day philosophers are still stuck in the aether

Thus we tend to throw them out of our conferences before they can do any damage.

Even if you can't truly KNOW that a system is real, since we have to live within that system and since that system seems to follow logical rules, we might as well understand what those rules are and how to take advantage of them.

>tl;dr Speculation without evidence is just a priori nonsense that Natural Philosophy abhors and has banished to the comment sections of Phys and popsci

>>8562070
Modern day philosophy knows it has nothing to do with this and doesn't try to say anything concerning it. It's all about analytic philosophy now.

>>8562070
>Even if you can't truly KNOW that a system is real, since we have to live within that system and since that system seems to follow logical rules, we might as well understand what those rules are and how to take advantage of them.
Useless.
>>8562075
aka the worst kind of philosophy.

>>8562056
Lost

>>8562065
You do know he said Europa, not Europe? Europa is one of Jupiter's moons. This had nothing to do with sailing world's oceans.

The guy making the announcement for China has really put himself in a shitty position if it fails to deliver. It's going to be mildly sad for me if it turns out, as it probably will, to be nothing, but it's going to pretty much end his career. I hope he had a good reason to actually make such a bold gambit on the tech actually working.

>>8562456
Yeah 'cause the Chinese really have a reputation for caring about their reputation.

>>8553124

>>>waaaaaaaaaaaaaah muh papers, muh peer review, muh journals, i don't care if it works, WE get to say whats true and false!

face it, the 'scientific' establishement is on life support because it's fucking entirely useless, and all the theoretical shit you've been doing for decades is pure fucking useless fairy tales that is just wasting money. real advances, real work is done by engineers with a hunch just spitballing stuff. it doesn't matter how it fucking works, what matters is that it does in fact work.

and 'scientists' haven't been working for a long time. BYE BYE, funding!

>>8562608
This reads like a liveleak comment.

>>8561718
Wrong even if you cant explain cars motors they would

>>8562064
still drive.

>>8553010
PHYSIKEKS ON SUICIDE WATCH HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>8562822
I have a mental model of how to steer a car while adjusting gears and checking for obstacles...

>>8553047
>muh laws
>muh religion

>>8562063
>poynting vectors to push off of the quantum vacuum is pretty exciting, it doesn't violate any known principles.
>Pushing off the vacuum
>doesn't violate any known principles.

Wew lad.

How many meme drives would it take to power the whole world?

If there is extra energy being produced, could it be possible to throw one or two of them into a feedback loop?

>>8563523
you cleary haven't read about EM drive at all. You need a huge amount of energy to produce a tiny pushing force.
The only meme part in EM drive is that it apparently doesn't require a counterforce to start moving. Similar to a situation where you could grab your own shirt and lift yourself off of the ground by pulling upwards.

>>8562064
For centuries mankind used sails to move trough the oceans, without really understand the Bernoulli principles

>>8563573
through

>>8562070
>mfw modern-day philosophers are still stuck in the aether
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_energy

>>8562787
t. booty blasted (((((((((((researcher))))))))

>>8563551
>use tiny force to accelerate a turbine
>eventually turbine gets going fast enough to power itself
Grats you've made a perpetual motion machine, this is why people think memedrive isn't real

>>8562608
>no proof
not an argument


When did we actually start trusting these """"""popsci""""" news?

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>>8557806
>best girl
>not the green-haired goddess crusch

I hope the Chinese succeed and start a full blown mission to mars. Imagine the US congressional butt hurt.

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>>8564146
rms knows his shit

This is why technology (engineering) will always be more mportant than science and physics.

>>8553010
>Produces SO MUCH THRUST it takes the world's most sensitive equipment to detect it.

Good luck getting into space with the gunpowder equivalent of a burning ember.

>>8553789
Laughed then cried, well played anon.

Nuclear powered memedrive space ships

//Space Navy is the future

>>8564854
Anon you are preddy dumb.

Emdrive would be for use in satellites to maintain/adjust orbits or for long distance space travel. Chemical rockets would be necessary to get stuff into space.

>>8553306
thank you for solving why ayy lmaos don't give out antigravity drives and advanced weaponry