Well, /sci/?

Yeah that is a nice drawing well done

>>8052054
0.75^5 = 0.24

Therefore greater chance to negate all damage on bottom row, since 24% > 15%

Anything else?

>>8052076
It's 1 - 0.25^5, idiot

>>8052148
You are an utter moron.

>>8052148
0.75 is the probability that one person negates all damage. 0.25 is the probability that one person gets damaged. 0.25^5 is the probability that they all get damage (assuming independence) 1 - 0.25^5 is the probability that at least one isn't damaged.
We want 0.75^5 because this is the probability that none of the five get damaged.

>>8052054
Bottom track is a binomial distribution (that they get harmed) with mean (5*0.25)
Top is binomial with mean 0.75. Since 1.25 > 0.75 I choose top as that statistically kills less people.

Is the goal to kill them or not I'm confused

MULTI

TRACK

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>>8052054
obligatory

>>8052054
>Not posting the /pol/ edit.

>>>/wsg/1068832

>>8052304
LOL man!

>>8052300
This is what I came here to see

>>8052054
Flip a coin

>>8052321
Ingenius. This way, you've only killed half as many people, while the coin killed the other half.

>>8052347
Then flip an infinite amount of coins

>>8052054
I don't get it.
Before the car moves to hit the people, it has to travel half the distance there. Before it can travel half the distance there, it has to travel 1/4 of the distance there.
If you add up all these increments, you see that the train moves backwards 1/12 feet.

>>8052054
Is this still an ethical question or purely a math one? Because if it's just math then I don't get what the goal is.

I mean if the only goal is to minimize the number of people who get hit then obviously you switch the track. If it's to maximize the chance of stopping the trolley then obviously you don't. If it's an ethical dilemma then I have to know what will happen if the trolley isn't stopped to have some idea of the relative importance of those aims.

>>8052232
The goal is to identify it as an attempt to mess with your emotions, to not take it as a personal responsibility and then to figure out who the fuck is messing with your head.

Put yourself in the shoes of the one man. You'd save yourself, right?

>>8052426
Retard.

>>8052608
>what is humor

>>8052426
I don't see why it would move backward. It seems like it would never be able to make it all the way to the people because it would always have to go another half the distance that's left and it would never run out of halves.

baka at this shit tier scrub who can only manage a 15% damage negate, flip the switch and kill that fucker

if 5 people out of 6 have a 75% chance to negate all damage and 1 out of 6 has a 15% chance to negate all damage it's obvious that the last person is a genetic fuck up and should be killed anyway for the good of all

even of 5 out of those 5 people come out alive they're gona fuck you up later in life for risking their lives instead of the other guy's and they won't believe they had a floating text over them saying they have a higher chance of surviving

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What about now?

>>8052054
This one is actually simpler than the usual formulation, if you dont pull the lever you have an almost 1/4 chance of no one being hurt

>>8052054
E[Left]=0.85 deaths
E[Right]=1.25 deaths

Left is better if all lives are equal.

Probability of no death[Left]=0.15
Probability of no death[Right]=0.237

Right is better if you will be prosecuted for murder if any of them dies

>>8052232
kek out loud

>>8052426
mild kek

>>8053157
>>8052054

STOP SHITTING ON MY PHILOSOPHY DEGREE

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>8052608
He's right though. Do the math.

>>8052054
Don't pull. The expected values are comparable, and only one doesn't put the agency on you.

>>8053157
>the guy smiling while pulling his dick

>>8053160
however, you can score a multikill

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You should be able to answer this.

>>8053878
Pull it
duh

>>8053878
easy, you pull. the result of your actions is ambiguous, but pulling is the only one that guarantees your safety. my dog could answer this, and he did.

>>8053885
You read it wrong

>>8052158
*udder

>>8053885
Answer to OP:
Pull the lever
Pulling the lever kills 0.85 of a person on average
Not pulling the lever has the following chances:
23.73% chance of killing no one
39.55% chance of killing one person
26.37% chance of killing two
8.78% chance of killing three
1.46% chance of killing four
0.097% chance of scoring a pentakill
So not pulling leaves us with 1.25 people killed on average.

Pull the lever.

>>8053878
pull the lever and pray that the sweet release of trolley-death takes me to a world without trolley problems

I don't get how this is an issue to begin with. It's ethically clear, the less people you kill, the better...

>>8053924
Because acting makes you responsible for the deaths. By pulling the lever, you are forcing a man to be sacrificed. You are actively killing someone by acting

>>8053924
fewer

>>8053916
Don't turn and crash

>>8053903
youre forgetting that id let 1.25 people on average die before i took the chance of getting hit by a trolley

>>8053929
I feel like that logic falls apart pretty quickly. Say I'm the president of a country that I know is about to be invaded and the invaders plan on killing everyone in my country. Let's say I also know that my military can defend the country, but at the cost of many lives. By your logic, I should not make the decision to defend, and should instead choose not to act and let more people die.

>>8053878
dont pull
fuck the other guy

>>8054029
You're missing the point.
The trolley problem ultimately means that are you willing to sacrifice someone without their consent in order to save lives?

>>8052054
In the one second I have before the train arrives I think what the fug are all these numbers floating around these people I wonder if some put lsd in the punch and by the time I've thought this the train had continued in whatever path it was on.

>>8054037
>are you willing to sacrifice someone without their consent in order to save lives?
yes

>>8054037
But the alternative is letting people die without their consent. It's only really a dillema if you make a hard distinction between action and inaction. Personally, I don't. Choosing not to act is an act in itself, in my opinion.

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either push the fat guy off the bridge killing him or 5 people die

>>8054061
No it's not a dilemma at all. The only one having done anything wrong is the guy tying them up. You are just toying with peoples conscience.

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Alright, you cucks.

There is a train traveling at a very high speed along the track. The track splits into three tracks at a certain point. The topmost track is completely clear. The middle track has five people strapped down, which will all die if the train hits them. The bottom track has FIFTEEN (15) people strapped down, who will all die if the train takes the bottom rail.
You are given a strange switch which is known to exhibit quantum behavior. If you pull the switch, there is a 50% chance that the train will switch rails to the top track, and a 50% chance that the train will switch rails to the bottom track, killing all fifteen people. If the switch is not pulled, the train will continue down the middle path, killing five people. As the switch relies on some unknown quantum effect, the outcome of the switch can not be calculated (I believe this property is called indeterministic?).

No, you can't untie the people on the tracks, you gigantic autist.
The only options presented to you are to either:
>1) Pull the switch
>2) Do not pull the switch

Which do you choose?

>>8054200
This. You should be asking yourself

>Who tied these guys up and set me up to be in this situation which I am in.

>>8054219
Use the switch until track goes up

>>8054219
fuck i knew i forgot something
you can't do that, once the switch is switched you can't switch it again

also you're a cunt

>>8054219
E(X) of the random variable representing the number of people killed if you pull the switch is 7.5. 7.5 > 5. So you should leave the switch as it is.

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Shitty mouse and paint skills aside...

Well, /sci/?

>>8054279
Tie the lever down and go eat.

Or just pull it enough times that they can get free.

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>>8054280
What about now?

>>8054291
Then all you have to do is pull the lever once and you can go eat, no tying required.

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ive got tons of these, if anyone wants more

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what now /sci/

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>you should be able to solve this

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>>8054684
yes please

>>8054742
>Non-quantum objects in superposition
Did schrödinger not teach you anything?

>>8054777
I don't know, I think I'll just kill marx

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>>8054729
kek

>>8054787
schrodinger was wrong...

>>8054777
The only moral solution is to stop time forever.

>>8055448
american free speech huh... everything is a-ok except communism which in heart seeks a more fair distribution of resources and labor
power of propaganda is terrifying

>>8055503
if you kill the company owner, the demon can just keep doing the same thing to other person, and marx will protect those workers during/after the rebellion

if you kill the workers, marx still leads the rebellion, kills a shitton of people, and that's that

if you kill marx, the rebellion is prevented, saving shittons of people, the company owner can keep exploring those workers, but if any of them commits a crime, that worker will be punished properly.

>>8055503
>marxov chain detected

>>8055521
>the rebellion is prevented, saving shittons of people
And we can always start a non-bloody socialist revolution if we really need to.

>>8055503
> its not free speech if its against my communist ideologies
lel

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>>8055521
>the company owner can keep exploring those workers
>exploring
I now understand capitalism better

>>8055532
I don't think you understand... well... anything, like at all.

>>8055535
>it's not blind adulation for my communist ideology
>therefore it isn't free thought

>>8055535
The thing about free speech is that it's not defined or dictated by other people.

>>8053916
"...and the author of the example"
Well, it's obvious.

>>8054034
This. His fault for not realizing he was entangled.

>>8054065
The bridge is too low. Trolley will crash and send its pieces flying, right onto men on tracks, thus killing them.

>>8054291
Fucking engineers, I swear.

>>8054742
So, if you turn around and close your ears, you can blissfully pretend nothing happened?

>>8053916
>this is what it's actually like to be a time traveler

>>8054742

pull the lever and close my eyes

>>8055585
That ensure both outcomes will occur it at least one universe. All you've done is frozen yourself in time.

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>>8054777

>>8055543
>>8055540
jesus christ...
how is killing a person free speech?

>>8055620
Communism asks you to kill people for the glory of the nation. Usually it ask you to kill yourself. Thus, if advocating for communism is protected by free speech, then free speech is always murder.

>>8055626
>Communism asks you to kill people
I can't even...
>guns kill people
>cars kill people
>bullets are evil
>thermodynamics is corrupt
boo fucking hoo retard, grow up and take responsibility, as if those things aren't always going on regardless of the ECONOMICAL MODEL adopted by a nation

>>8055619
the only way I can see to take out the media is to switch after the front wheels are past the switching mechanism, derailing the trolley and causing it to roll through them.

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>>8055619

>>8055631
>by a nation
For the glory of Rome!

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>>8055639

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>>8055642

>>8055642
Saved.

>this is what politics is actually like

>>8055646
Trolleyfractal is worst reality 0/10 would not be caught dead in again.

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>>8055649
glad you enjoyed

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>>8054275
>>8055656
oh fuck somebody already posted that one

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>>8052054

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>>8055654
try this one on for size

>>8054684
oh shit waddup

>>8052426
Lel

>>8052054
Is pretending I didn't see morally equivalent to not pulling the lever?

>>8052608
>he doesnt understand math

you're retarded for not understanding everyone is perfectly safe here.

>he doesnt wait for the train to half cross the turn, flip the switch, then pull the train in two directions causing it to derail.

dont give me any of that multi track drifting shit either.

>>8052054
I can't, I'm not a sociopath

>>8052054
>getting involved

>>8055823
>closet sociopath detected

>>8055819
>train derails
>train falls over horizontally
>doesnt stop moving, conservation of momentum
>kills all of them regardless
>keeps going, takes out people in the nearby crossroad
golly gee did you think that one through?

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Well, /sci/?

>>8055891
either 5 people dies, or no one dies, I pull the lever so it's not my fault

>>8055891
I'll only do it if the [math]n[/math]th guy does too.

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WELL, /SCI/?

>>8055903
Hey [math]n[/math], [math]n+1[/math] here. Pulling.

>>8055907
Exactly identical to the previous one. Everyone just keeps pulling.

>>8055907
Finally. I can feel the free will oozing from this thought experiment.

>>8053916
kek

>>8054219
I'd pull it. If I'm gonna let 5 people die, what's ten others? I'll try my luck.

>>8055924
No

>>8055924
>you misread the situation and prevent Mr. A from switching the tracks to save the five people
>Mrs. A witnessed the whole thing

>>8055924
>white Americans
Fucking disgusting. Over you go, fat ass.

>>8053878
Don't pull obviously.
I don't know anything about those other people, I have to assume my life is worth more than theirs.

>>8052054
Good try, philosophy.
But adding numbers doesn't make you science or not worthless.

>>8055924
over you go, fatso!

>>8055944
>>8056106
>feel the bern

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>>8055891
>>8055907
>n of people on track increases by 1 each lever ad infinitum

What to do, /sci/?

>>8057687
by 5*

>>8054065

Not a dilemma, fat people do not deserve to live.

>>8057687

Better pull it or we'll be overpopulated

>>8057687
So if it gets pulled infinite times you'll have saved 1/12th of a person.

>>8057919
it would actually mean that you killed 1/12th of a person, but whatever

>>8052701
>implying you're funny

>>8052054
Do nothing.
Not because of the math, but because its the right thing to do

>>8052426
Go to bed zeno.

>>8057687
given human nature they'd probably keep pulling forever. no one wants to be the guy that killed 5N people.

>>8052300
best

>>8057958
You would have saved 1/12th of a person, or killed 11/12th of him.

>>8054742
>and thus it is said to be in superposition
No it's not you massive fucking autist, you just said it is on c

Can someone do a trolley problem where it's a tesseract / hypercube thingy? pls

>>8052054
The probability of killing someone on the upper track is 85%

The probability of killing at least one person on the lower track is
[math]\sum_{k=1}^{k=5}\frac{5!}{k! * (5-k)!} * .25^k + .75^{5-k} = 0.76[/math]

Thus, it's safer to go with the upper track and ensure you maximise the chances of killing at least one person.

>>8052054
Don't pull the lever because murder is wrong.

>>8055619
>save myself from acid AND nuke Australia

Easy.

>>8057687
>Procrastination

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>>8055555
Checked

>>8055619
Is that guy tipping the acid or pulling it?

Can you actually survive this situation consdering killing the kids also nukes the immediate vicinity?

Multitracking is the best answer. Why are we assuming that these faggots tied to the track are innocent? They're probably involved in some drug cartel to end up there.

>>8055619

The aspiring doctors part makes me want to kill those kids more than I would want to otherwise.

>>8059327
why

>>8059334
Fucking premeds man, I agree with >>8059327.

>>8057919
>Not -1/12th of a person

>>8057958 fixed it for you.

>>8058940
Except you sitll die cause you're surrounded by mines

>>8054742
>pull lever
>close eyes
>kill all 10 people
>???
>profit

>>8058452
The probability of killing at least one person on the lower track is
[math]\sum_{k=1}^{k=5}\frac{5!}{k! * (5-k)!} * .25^k * .75^{5-k} = 0.76[/math]
FTFY

Also, why not just do 1-P(0 people die)?

>>8060145
Yeah idk, I was just revising probability

>>8055477
>The only moral solution is to stop time forever.

>He thinks time exists

>>8055620
>jesus christ...
>how is killing a person free speech?

We don't fucking know it was the communist who brought up free speech out of nowhere. Why he thinks "killing communists" is the same as "free speech" is not our problem.

>>8055649

No, which is the problem. If politicians didn't know ahead of time whether they'd be the target of their bullshit policies, we'd have much fewer bullshit policies.