***Christian General Thread***

>>37490371
what do you think of jordan peterson?

is creationism a meme

>>37490371
>Christian

I think you misspelled moron

>>37490505
Only found out about him through the whole sjw fiasco that happened and went viral on youtube. Anyway, he tries to give his own interpretation on Scripture that I haven't looked too deeply into but from what I've heard from people who have watched his videos is that he would be considered a heretic by most Christian denominations.

>>37490528
Probably, I'm not a creationist.

>>37490582
Haha, anyways if there are any questions you have feel free to ask, and I'll answer to the best of my abilities.

>>37490603
>he would be considered a heretic by most Christian denominations.

i'll bite, how?

How do I help others find truth in Christ? I see the miseries of the world and feel like I am protected by Him while others suffer.

>fuck the church
Why was martin luther so based?

>>37490603
>Probably, I'm not a creationist.
why not? don't you believe the bible?

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best testament coming through make way beep beep

>>37490746
Preach the gospel to them. Tell them about the wonders of Christ and trust that the gospel is powerful enough to help them. But remember you should study and be ready to give an answer to questions when people argue against your faith.

>>37490766
He knew the truth and at the time the catholic church was just messed up with having orgies in the church and what not.

>>37490772
I do believe in the bible but I don't think it states what a lot of creationist state.

>>37490785
I've spoken to Mormons. Are you one?

>>37490371
Fuck OFF christanon
Take your stupid-ass calvinism and pleasure your prostate with it

>>37490718
>i'll bite, how?
It's not baiting but I was speaking to a lady on discord, and she told me that he had this idea that heaven and hell were on this earth. I would disagree with this because it puts the focus on life here instead of my eternity in the hereafter. To think worldly and try to love the world means that you do not fully love God yet.

>Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
1 John 2:15

>>37490867
What problem do you have with Calvinism? I like talking to people about my belief since they always seem to have some misconceptions about it. Feel free to ask questions.

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>>37490828
no, but I'm baptised and ordained. I can make holy water and shit. feels cool, like science-fictiony. had a mormon girlfriend for a while, tried on her religion.

I'm too philosophically, historically and anthropologically educated to be anything close to religious, but I respect people and their belief systems. I'm also a huge nerd about the holy roman empire and love the papacy and everything it represents and it's history.

mom is making me go to church again

>>37490957
Well, just try to sit and listen. You might learn something.

>>37490941
>I'm too philosophically, historically and anthropologically educated to be anything close to religious, but I respect people and their belief systems.
Ha, ok. Perhaps we can discuss these issues and come to an agreement. I too have studied this subject, and I'm open to a dialogue.

>>37490890
the thing to note about JP is that he translate alot of christian stories and teachings as moral guides and not literal things and shows the point of why it was put in the bible and why it was passed on for so long.

>heaven and hell were on this earth.
the reason he states this if i remember correctly was to show that everything you do either brings you closer to empowering yourself and the society around you and brings you to a better and healthier place in the world (heaven) or it makes you weaker and/or it makes the people around you weaker and in a more uncertain and less grounded place (hell).

>I would disagree with this because it puts the focus on life here instead of my eternity in the hereafter.
which is fine for you if that is how you want to live but it does not help the person who wants to improve themselves and the world around them, we can look towards going to heaven but what use would it be to go to heaven if we do not try to upkeep the gift we were given to by the lord, our world, and to make the place the best it can be.

>To think worldly and try to love the world means that you do not fully love God yet.

when he says the world he doesnt mean material possessions but the people on the world and the societies in it.

>Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
>1 John 2:15

i find this verse in john to be more towards putting one love of the world ahead of ones love towards god.

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>>37491003
I don't like discussing religion much with people who hold it, makes me feel mean. the closest thing I have to religion would be phenomenological views towards interpreting existence, but that's more of a method than a faith.

I would have a lot of respect for the religious man who has read through Hume and Kant's material and maintained their faith, I highly recommend doing so.

>>37491098
>reading kant and not maintaining ones faith

kant was a skeptic sure but to sit here and say he would make one turn to atheism just means that ones faith was weak in the first place.

>>37491094
Well, you've clearly researched him more than I have, but I'm always suspicious of a modern western interpretation of the Bible. There are a lot of off shoot of Christianity that have missed the message of the gospel and try to make it more man centred such as Joel Osteen's prosperity gospel and mystic Christians who think that we have the power of God in all of us and what not. But from what I've read from you, you have peaked my interest in him, and I will begin watching his lectures on youtube.

>what use would it be to go to heaven if we do not try to upkeep the gift we were given to by the Lord, our world, and to make the place the best it can be.
To this I would say is that by loving God we will do things that will not only bless out own lives but also of the lives of the people around us.

All in all, I don't disagree with what you have said and have taken it into heart. I will be checking out his stuff and make a better conclusion.

>>37491098
>I don't like discussing religion much with people who hold it, makes me feel mean.
Don't feel that way. I have talked with the worst of the worst and nothing really makes me feel down when talking about religion.

> the closest thing I have to religion would be phenomenological views towards interpreting existence, but that's more of a method than a faith.
Could you expand on these beliefs?

>
I would have a lot of respect for the religious man who has read through Hume and Kant's material and maintained their faith, I highly recommend doing so.
Sure I will do so. Are there any books in particular that I should read?

Do you believe in a soul? If so, what defines it and why does our identity revolve around our brain instead of our soul (e.g. memories and personality being altered through head trauma)?

>>37490371
sup mane. i got my septaguint next to me. u tryn to spread the word?

>>37491243
>Do you believe in a soul?
Yes.

>If so, what defines it
My idea of a soul was more of what gives us life. As we all the know the body is made up of specific parts that work together to make the body function, e.g., stomach, lungs, heart and most importantly brain. Although these things are the main components of a body, they still are powered by an outside force.

Think of it this way. If someone dies by suffocation and there are no signs of damage to the body besides not being able to breath, they still have all the components of a functioning body, but despite this, they still don't work because the "soul" isn't there. The powering force that keeps the body functioning has gone. Like a computer that has been put into water when it is put out it no longer functions because the water has damaged it and the electrical forces that powers it has gone. The computer is still there, but due to it not having that force which powers it, it cannot function.

Now I see the same with the human body. When our soul leaves our body, it is the force that keeps us alive like electricity running through a computer, and without it, it cannot do the things you mentioned a brain can below.

>memories and personality being altered through head trauma

Or maybe I don't know anything about biology, and I'm just spouting nonsense but what do you think?

>>37490371
If you just have to believe in God to get into heaven then why follow any of the doctrine?

>>37491359
That's tight man! Is it the English translation or are you reading it in Greek?

>>37490371
What was the point of making this thread?

>>37491448
The evidence of you believing will be shown by how you act. A true believer will do god's law by love not obligation.

>>37491471
Read the OP again.

Does anyone feel like small Protestant churches are closer to what Christ had in mind than Orthodox and Christian.
I get it that they have a more valid claim on being the Church of Christ and Bible literalists tend to be a bit autistic, but I can't look at corruption and obvious government shilling of the Orthodox church or the scandals of the Catholic church and say that this is the true Christian church.

>>37491220
well im glad i peaked your interest, i was born "baptist" as in i had by baptism by we rarely, if ever, went to church and always looked for the a different answer because calling him "a giant fairy in the sky" didnt sit right and thinking some powerful deity cared that i masturbated also dint seem right either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLp7vWB0TeY

is a great start.

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There's things I like about all the major schisms/sects but I just can't stand pushy non-denominational types.

It just feels arrogant to me.
>There's 40,000 schisms, sects, and sub-sects of Christianity
>Good thing my pastor finally got everything right in (random Midwestern town) in 1993 and opened his own church!

>>37491573
just tell them that christianity is what brought us here and made the society we live in and the reason we have these laws, and the reason they can spit on the teachings, god even loves the lambs that go astray.

>>37491535
Yep, I'm in the same boat as you man. I don't think Christ had in mind a man in Rome who is sitting is a high castle and defining dogma for the entire church like Rome is doing today. I think the 5 Solas are closer to what Jesus had in mind.

>>37490371
Don't you think it's kind of weird to indoctrinate your children into religion from such an early age? Especially when you cherry pick the parts you read to them?

>>37490371
Christianity is a watered down and diluted version of Islam. It's been destroyed by liberals.
Accept islam. It's the true traditionalist religion with a huge following. It respects virginity and hates fornication.

>>37490371
Oh you're still at it. Good job.

>>37491598
Thanks for the recommendation I will be sure to check it out.

>>37491622
As long as they're not gone too far astray and still believe in the basic 5 solas they're good. But then again arrogance and pride is a sin.

>>37491649
Sure, but then again I believe that it is God who saves, and there is really nothing that I can do. When/if I have children I will not force the belief on them but will just tell them about Christ, and I will let them make the choice. If it is yes well have a part, but if it is no, then I'll be like oh well. Despite this, I will never quite and try to answer any doubts he might have.

>>37491674
>watered down version of islam

lol? islam is the youngest of abrahamic religions and you can clearly see the influences of christianity.

>>37491535

>>37491535

I waffle around on this.

I don't want to argue with Catholic apologists but RCC seems very prone to getting cucked, as the current pope demonstrates. Lots of skeletons in their closet, too.

I think Nationalism is a good thing so I like the Orthodox churches. It does seem a bit clique-y though. I mean, I'm Norwegian/German but there's not a branch dedicated to us, you know?

>>37491622 sums up my issue with nondenominational types

On the other hand, early Christianity was all about small groups coming together.

I've been reading The Screwtape Letters as part of my attempt to more religious, and at one point Lewis seems to suggest that you should just find a church and go there since sectarianism and religion shopping are dangerous distractions.

>>37491674
>Christianity is a watered down and diluted version of Islam
Which came first? Also, christianity is just christianity and a lot of the things islam hates we hate too.

>>37491697
Thanks, man. Glad you're here.

>>37491723
Yeah, but if there is no concrete evidence for your religion then why bring your children into it?

Is Christian really nice to muslims, I always heard stories like both people are protecting each other while praying and stuff. is that true?

>>37491751
>What is the difference between the different groups/sects/churches of christianity?
That is a too big of a question that would take too long for me to answer but there are a lot of resources and books that can help you with fining one.

>How do I know which one to follow (if any)?
My first thing is they have to at least believe in the 5 Solas. That being:

Sola Fide, by faith alone.
Sola Scriptura, by Scripture alone.
Solus Christus, through Christ alone.
Sola Gratia, by grace alone.
Soli Deo Gloria, glory to God alone.

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>>37491674

>Lunar imagery everywhere carried over from Semitic Paganism
>Obvious syncretic blending of Judaism, Christianity, and even a few Zoroastrian ideas like 5 daily prayers
>Praying in the direction a black rock. 'Nuff said.
>Focus on ritual and dogmatic letter-of-the-law rules instead of a personal relationship with God

>>37491754
That's the thing though. I believe that there are concrete evidence and a lot of it.

>>37491764
We are to treat everyone with respect and pray for our enemies that they come to know Christ.

He did not exist in the very form of God. Well. I mean, he did, but it's almost misleading to have read him so literally. He was one with the father because he understood the father and worshipped him unlike anyone before or after him. We are made in god's image, which does actually mean we are made of the same material as god. Remember Jesus said these things and more will you also do, because we are, like him, God in mortal form.

>>37491782
Yeah but the thing about having national pride or following sports team is you don't have to devote yourself to a ton of outdated doctrine for something that we're not sure is true. At least we know the country exists, at least we know that sports teams exist. And I think that comparing the devotion and rule following that is required for practicing a religion is really comparable to things like being proud of your country or liking the Blue Valley Butt-Pluggers.

>>37490528
I'll bite
fellow christian here.

how do you think things started then if its not whats described in genesis 1?

>>37490772
The new testament overwrite the messages in the old testament after Jesus died. How do you people struggle to understand this? The conventional Christian follows only the new testament

>>37491827
What is the evidence?

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>christcucks unironically worship a shitskin Hebrew on a stick

AAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>37491829
>He did not exist in the very form of God.
He did. If you looked at the entire chapter, then it is very obvious what Christ is saying.

>who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Philippians 2:6

Here he say's he "considered" his equality with the Father. This is in the past tense meaning that he existed before his birth in Bethlehem and chose to enter into his own creation as a human besides a god so that he can live and suffer and give up his life as a ransom for many.

Are you a oneness pentecostalist by any chance>

>>37491827
we also pray that you guys will recognise allah as the god and prophet Muhammad as the messenger too :).

I hope we could be together like the times of Umar al Khatab caliphate

just wondering, Is the crusader is seen as a good or a bad by the christians

>>37491413
I personally don't believe in the idea of a soul, but to those who do, do you think animals have a soul?

>>37491897
Im coming from the school of Neale Donald Walsch desu. You may be right though I dunno. I'm not finished with the Bible.

>>37491894
>christcucks unironically worship a shitskin Hebrew on a stick
Yep, and shamelessly.

>>37491893
There are a lot to choose from I think we would have to choose from a selection to see what we can discuss. I think I can prove the resurrection happened.

>>37491936

Omar was a vicious warlord who got what was coming to him(sent to Hell when one of his slaves shanked him).

>>37491894
Anon, don't let hate get in the way of love. We are all equal, you'll be happier to accept that

>>37491094
why do you kids shill peterson all over 4chan? every board I go to I see one of you doing this

are you paid or do you actually think psychology is a relevant field of study? (protip: its pseudoscience).

>>37491936
>just wondering, Is the crusader is seen as a good or a bad by the Christians
Well, it's one of those things that are really tricky. I believe that it was wrong and didn't spread the gospel the right way, which was through preaching, but then again it did help Christianity spread to the west and most likely saved a lot of people. So I disagreed with the method but liked the outcome even though it came about through questionable means.

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>>37491894

Keep in mind that Jesus was a Mizrahi(true Jew) and they're generally good people.

The Jews everyone complains about are the Ashkenazim, who are mixed Khazar/European counterfeit Jews.

>>37491946
I believe they do but are not made in the likeness of God so are not equal if you catch my drift.

>>37491952
>You may be right though I dunno. I'm not finished with the Bible.
You don't need to be. There were people in the early church who never had the entire bible, but despite this, they were willing to die for what pieces of scripture they had.

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>>37490371
>christcucks
>on r9k

Fuck off normies

>>37492036
>i don't think forcing your children to do anything regarding religion is right.
Neither do I, but I never said it was.

>My parents didn't do so to me, and I'm not going to force my children (if I ever get any) to do anything either. its their own choice.
see the last Parag Pag here: >>37491723

>>37492055
Is that picture supposed to make me hate Christianity? Anyways, if there are any questions you have feel free to ask, and I'll answer to the best of my abilities.

>>37491674

I feel like the Shia are our brothers
>Importance of sacrifice
>Respect for Mary/Respect for Fatima
>Desire to analyze religious texts instead of just autistically memorizing them

Honestly, fuck the Sunnis, though. We've had enough of your bullshit.

>>37492124
Ah, lol. Ok!

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>>37492055
>>37491894

>Christianity sucks you guys. Why not just become atheists which will lead to a huge spiritual lacuna that will be filled by Islam?

>>37491974
Go with your strongest piece.

>>37492173
Not if we get rid of Islam as well sadly there aren't that many serious Muslim posters.

>>37490371

>Luther
>Christian

LMAO

Hey, you aborted parts of the Bible because you believed that RABBINICAL KIKES were the Jews of Jesus' time. LMAO!

>Luther made an attempt to remove the books of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation from the canon (notably, he perceived them to go against certain Protestant doctrines such as sola gratia and sola fide), but this was not generally accepted among his followers.

>>37492324
Well, the resurrection is the of the best-attested events in history. First off I'll start off by stating the biblical evidence of an empty tomb. We have in the gospel the story about women who went into the tomb of Christ and found it to be empty. This story passes the criteria of embarrassment and makes it out to be likely true. Also, there were visions to 500 people in the early days, that is also agreed by most if not all NT scholars, that it was in fact, a historical event.

All these things I can give evidence for upon request.

>>37492400
This is not true. He only criticised them and whether or not they were authentic but didn't want them to be taken out of the bible for reasons you have stated. Also, this is a common internet false allegation towards Luther. If you're going to judge other for this, then you'd have to also direct certain Catholic popes, assuming you're Catholic, since even they thought some apocryphal books shouldn't have been in the Bible.

>>37492512

I think it's hilarious how you ignore that Luther was such an ignoramus not to realize that Judaism was invalidated once the Temple fell and the people who practice it now are not real Jews. They are RABBINICAL JEWS, who are referred to as the Synagogue of Satan. If you think they have any authority over wants canon in the Bible, then you are a heretic of the Judaizer variety.

He wanted to remove the Book of James because it explicitly refutes faith alone. Also, if you believe in sola scriptura then why do you accept the Council of Nicaea as defining functions in the Church? You do realize that your whole sect is self-refuting, right?

>>37492462
Then give the evidence in a single post rather than making me ask every time.

>>37492462

No, it's not. Don't even lie about this, because you know that's false. Otherwise, we'd have to accept the "miracles" of Muhammad, Zoroaster, and various Hindu gurus. His mere existence is the most attested thing about him.

>inb4 Muhammad and Zoroaster are somehow of a lower category of Christ depsite Muhammad building a state of bureaucrats which would function as better witnesses than schizotypal desert-dwellers

>>37492585
>If you think they have any authority over wants canon in the Bible, then you are a heretic of the Judaizer variety.
No, I think that the scripture is the final authority. Also, I find it funny having a Catholic calling me a Judaizer. That's like a pot calling a kettle black. If you feel as though you can be justified by law, then you are the real Judaizer.

>He wanted to remove the Book of James because it explicitly refutes faith alone.
Like I said earlier he did not want it to be taken out because of the reason you stated, because it, in fact, does not go against faith alone. Instead, he just criticised t like a lot of Catholics criticised the apocryphal but you don't condemn them for that.

>Council of Nicaea
The council of Nicea dealt with the heresy of Arianism. What point are you trying to make?

>>37492642
In ancient culture, a woman's testimony was worth nothing, and the fact that a woman was the one who found the empty tomb made it out to false by the lenses of ancient people. In fact, the credibility of Christianity was in fact, targeted because of this by ancient people because of the fact that their main witness for the empty tomb was a woman. Also, yeah, the criteria of embarrassment isn't' infallible. There is no such thing as an infallible criteria, but it gives us evidence for the most likely thing to be true. If you're gonna lie about yourself, it is most likely gonna be something that would make your story out to be true and make you seem like a hero, not vice versa and it is something that in fact, make you look less credible in the eyes of the ancient world.

I've never met a deeply religious person who isn't one or more of the following:

A disgusting shitbag hypocrite
Annoying as all Hell
Stupid
A chronic liar
Severely mentally ill
Depressed
An expert on my life, but not their own
Mean
Faking it to not let down family

I can think of one exception. One.

>>37492724

>I think that the scripture is the final authority
>What point are you trying to make?

Then why was it necessary if all we needed to do was rely on Scripture? I think it's funny that you're trying to deny Holy Tradition but you recognize these Ecumenical Councils which used Holy Tradition to determine the true dogma of the Church.

>>37492649
Well, if we have a self descriptive source, meaning it's talking about themselves, then we use certain criteria to prove that it happened or not as well as outside sources. In Islam, they believe that Muhammad split the moon in half, but if you look at historical accounts of people at the time, no one in the world saw or even wrote about it. I mean if the moon split you'd at least some evidence for such a thing. But with the empty tomb, we can, in fact, prove it's existence by using certain criteria such as the criteria of embarrassment.

>>37492826

Jesus Christ, if you're willing to use criteria of embarrassment. Then, you should give the Muhammadans the most charity. Basically, the moon splitting thing was localized to the Arabs and it had no lasting impact on the moon to preserve the order of the universe. Also, splitting the moon wouldn't have converted anybody who didn't know what was going on and would have potentially caused mass chaos.

You didn't even refute Zoroaster or the Hindu gurus.

>>37490371
I went to church for the first time in years today
I think this is a good thing. I grew up with the church but fell away from it once I was a teenager

>>37492816
That's the thing you have wrong. If we were to believe in sola ecclesia, then our conclusion would be based on wat the church says alone, but it is not. We understand that the Catholic church has gotten some things right, but on the other hand, it had also gotten some things wrong. Martin Luther is an example since after his conversion he believes in such things as the immaculate conception and what not but later on denounced those things but at the same time, he kept other things, e.g., trinity. This was all based on his reading of scripture and not what the church said.

We believe in sola scriptura and not sola iccelesia.

>>37492803
And who might that be? original comment

>>37492875
No, the reason why it didn't have an impact was that it never happened. With Christianity, on the other hand, it's different. Also, I don't think you know what the criteria of embarrassment is. See: >>37492755

Also, I don't know too much about the miracles in zoroastrian so I would need some sources.

>>37492882
Well, it's great that you're back. How did it feel?

>>37492977

Not an argument since they'll argue that Allah (swt) perfectly restored it.

>With Christianity, on the other hand, it's different
Nice special pleading.

Criterion of embarrassment only works if you assume these people aren't cucks who had any sense of shame

>>37493056
Not an argument since they'll argue that Allah (swt) perfectly restored it.
Yes, but still. The fact that it happened and was split for a time even that would have caused a reaction from people, which it didn't. All this does is bring the Islamic faith into question.

>Criterion of embarrassment only works if you assume these people aren't cucks who had any sense of shame
No, you have to understand the context. re-read what I wrote here: >>37492755