I believe abortion is murder and should be outlawed Why does

>>36715343

Tell me why you think it's murder first. And why it should be outlawed

>>36715377
A fetus is an organism. It should be outlawed because murder is illegal.

>>36715401
By that same argument, a clump of cancer cells is the same, and should not be murdered.

>>36715416
I suggest something more simple... A vegetable. Or even chlorinating water from the diseases in it.

>>36715416
A fetus is a human organism.

OP? Are you gone? At least tell us if you agree with our facts or not, and why.

>>36715451
What about things like cases of rape or incest or where the life of the mother will be endangered or the child will be born with a condition that handicaps them?

Is it an absolute or are exceptions allowed to be made?

>>36715451

What makes a human in your opinion? And you still haven't said why you think murder should be illegal.

>>36715343
IDK I feel it should be legal but morally I don't think it's right...kinda conflicting

>>36715451
By the time a fetus is rendered "human" by scientific standards (20-23 weeks) abortion is illegal anyway, unless
A.) the fetus is already dead
Or
B.) there will be complications during birth resulting in the death of the fetus anyway.

>>36715343
Because you think women shouldn't get to have recreational sex with no consequences.

>>36715465
Don't change the flow of the argument please... By saying this, you've already assumed that he was right and a human fetus has some arbitrary value, and also saved him from explaining murder.

>>36715416
A clump of cancer cells is not an independant organism to the human. But, in the same way someone shouldn't be able to cute out cancer cells of another person without permission, so too shouldn't someone be able to kill the cells of the fetus, itself a genetic individual, without its permission

>>36715465
Being raped does not give you the right to kill someone. That's ridiculous.

Someone being disabled gives neither their mother nor any doctor the right to kill them.

>>36715516
I mean, a lot of cancer develops into 4chan posters, especially /b/ and /pol/, so your point is kinda moot here.

>>36715343
>Why does this make me a misogynist?
It doesn't, but being on here for long enough will rectify that.

>>36715480
>human" by scientific standards (20-23 weeks)
There is no scientific standard for when you become human you goofball. Laws are typically based on whether or not the fetus could survive outside the womb. It is an arbitrary limit, not the scientific boundary of humanity.

>>36715516

Then you shouldn't kill tapeworms in your digestive tract without their permission. Just cut everything out and tell us why you think a human fetus should be considered human.

File: t3_56pmr6.jpg (140KB, 750x757px) Image search: [Google]

140KB, 750x757px

>mfw manchildren are arguing over something that is solely a woman's decision

>>36715548
Why shouldn't they be considered human?

>>36715544

True. Then what limit do you suggest?

>>36715548
>human fetus
>not human

>>36715558

Because the only thing that separates human from non-human is intelligence.

>>36715343
Do you believe in euthanasia?

>>36715590
By that logic a newborn isn't human

>>36715590
Then by that argument, why are some humans still considered human even if they fall into a sub human intelligence bracket?

>>36715556
So apparently the father has no say. Typical feminist/gynocentric bullshit.

>>36715605
>>36715611

Because people are usually overreacting. Like when someone kills a dog, or a cat. Empathy is good, but they have empathy for anything that moves and either looks remotely like an intelligent human being, or, like cats, develops a natural mechanism to extort empathy from us while not being intelligent. I have to admit, my own boundaries for intelligence are unclear, but I think a creature has to show an ability to comprehend several facts at once and apply them to a situation. In other words, if I had to choose between Alex the Parrot and a newborn, I'd kill a newborn.

>>36715343
Abortion does more good than harm.

Think of all the fatherless blacks that would have been born, had it not been for abortion.

>>36715678
>Typical feminist/gynocentric bullshit.

You seem like you could use the help of a therapist, anon. I'm not entirely sure you're just pretending or being ironic. If that's the way you're thinking it doesn't seem like you could be living a happy life right now.

>>36715683
Seems like a bunch of mental gymnastics to justify murder.

>>36715714
Please disprove any non-fact you may find individually. You saying that will not make me understand what is wrong with my argument.

>>36715683
What the heck you'd choose a bird??

File: 1489111926558.jpg (16KB, 310x328px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 310x328px

>>36715748
Not him but
>I'd rather kill a child than bird

It doesn't make you a misogynist, but statistically if you're a male on /r9k/ you're likely already one.

>>36715748
If you're just begging the question why don't you pack up and stop replying? If you're so entrenched in your view on abortion it doesn't seem like anyone in this thread will convince you.

>>36715795

Because it's more human than a newborn. Alex the Bird can distinguish and count shapes, and does this in any order or quantity, showing that it can apply several facts to a situation at once. A newborn can show when he's hungry... Just like, you know, every animal on planet earth. Now you tell me why you'd kill Alex the Bird. And please expand on it, don't just write "because it's a bird", or else I will assume that my point is correct (what with there being no counterpoints)

File: diogenes_ASkwT.jpg (378KB, 674x897px) Image search: [Google]

378KB, 674x897px

>>36715829
It seems pretty silly to be a misogynist. Then again it seems like more and more people on this board aren't just pretending.

It seems like robots would naturally be against prejudice given they feel a lot of the world is prejudiced against them.

>>36715831

I've posted facts and you've posted buzzwords and strawmen.

File: 1490503497077.jpg (170KB, 926x1000px) Image search: [Google]

170KB, 926x1000px

>>36715848
>It seems pretty silly to be a misogynist.

>>36715856
You're kind of messed up in the head, you know that? If you've got health insurance I'd try seeing if maybe there's some kind of outpatient group therapy that can help you be more positive about things.

>>36715867

But what if I is the baby? Why you hurt baby?

>>36715842
>And please expand on it, don't just write "because it's a bird", or else I will assume that my point is correct
That doesn't make you right, fucking idiot

>>36715891
>But what if I is the baby? Why you hurt baby?
If this board is anything to go by, LIFE hurts the baby.

>>36715516
>A clump of cancer cells is not an independant organism to the human.

Neither is a fetus. It can't survive outside the mother's body. By the time it can, abortion is already illegal unless it's already dead/would die upon birth, or to save the life of the mother.

File: barksinternally.jpg (49KB, 524x468px) Image search: [Google]

49KB, 524x468px

>>36715891
It's not a baby for a while, though. It's just a smear of cells. Would you rather damn a child to this world? Especially with a mother that doesn't likely want it?

>mfw I imagine someone spreading an early abortion on a piece of toast and eating it

why brain, why

There's two types of abortion. Medical abortion and recreational abortion.
Stacy cunts shouldn't be allowed to murder babies because chad forgot to pull out.

>>36715902

There is no right and wrong here. I don't argue to win. I want the truth, no matter whose mouth it's coming from. I have more evidence for the view I have right now. Therefore, I will keep it until a truer point of view comes around. It's not about downsizing you, I just said that your rhethoric is completely uncomprehensible.

>>36715911
It can't survive because it's been stabbed and ripped out

>>36715678
>the father has no say.
This is true because when you make the father's input mandatory, you immediately run into the following people getting say:
>abusive husbands
>deadbeat dads
>rapists

It's better for everyone involved that these type of people have no input, so the decision is ultimately left up to the woman. It's her body anyway

>>36715954
Noooooo, it can't survive because it needs the mother's body to survive. JFC.

>what is viability
>I know nothing about abortions but I know women shouldn't get them!

>A man and a woman want a baby (two consensual people have decided).
>The woman changes her mind and aborts (only one person has decided).


Women are self-centered asshole, as always.

Arguably a fetus doesn't really develop brain activity until 8-12 weeks into pregnancy. Before then it's pretty safe to assume that the fetus has no consciousnesses therefore, not "alive". Abortions before 3 months for any reason is absolutely fine. Anything beyond that needs a good reason for it to happen. e.g, rape, debilitating conditions or if the birth poses a serious risk to the mother.

>>36715998
Stupid argument. It shouldn't even have to be pointed out to you why that's retarded

>>36715998
rape isn't a good reason to murder an innocent child. fucking idiot

>>36716006

Or maybe it can't be pointed out? Point it out, right here, for all of us.

>>36715343
Outlawing abortion can cause some serious internal issues for certain countries one being our very own the USA.
Honestly as long as it isnt a 6 month old fetus i say abortion is fine and CAN be beneficial if we can teach proper sex ed to these dumb ass mexican girls getting pregnant at 15.

>>36716042
>muh sex ed
sex ed doesn't do shit

File: 1493066890042.jpg (19KB, 297x350px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 297x350px

>>36715946
>I have more evidence for the view I have right now
No you don't.
>It's not about downsizing you
There's literally no reason for you to be here claiming you're correct and everyone is wrong, but ok.
>I just said that your rhethoric is completely uncomprehensible
>uncomprehensible

The only people I've seen defend abortion are brainwashed morons and whores. You're not smart, you don't have an educated worldview, you're just being a good goy for Professor Elijah Shekelberg.

>>36716050
>muh jooz

there it is

>>36716049

Of course it doesn't do shit. The educational material is fucking horrendous. The only kinda sex ex they had at my old highschool were 30 year old VHS tapes depicting crude animations that explained fuck all. Sexual education desperately needs a revamp.

>>36715958

So women who are manipulative and abusive or some other negative quality get to walk all over whatever man happens to fall in their sights? Women can take a million and one different precautions against getting pregnant. Men can take two, and both of those can either fail or be sabotaged.

>>36716068
the entire idea of sex ed is fucking stupid. you need to shut the fuck up you're goddamn retard

>>36715343
Because the people who are pro abortion are typically the type of people who don't want to have a discussion or their beliefs challenged, so they scream sexism and racism at every opportunity in attempt to invalidate what the other person has to say.

And I say this as someone who believes in abortion.

>>36715343
How you feel about it personally aside, outlawing abortion just means condemning women to carrying to term pregnancies they don't want and likely can't or won't care for after they're born.

This causes cycles of poverty and child abuse, causes broken families, and is generally a shit sandwich situation for everyone. Poor people are expensive.

Also (and maybe most importantly), outlawing abortions doesn't make them stop. The same way outlawing drugs or alcohol doesn't make people stop consuming them. It just makes the procedures more dangerous and unsafe.

The ultimate solution to making abortion rates go down is sex ed and free contraception, but no one on the anti-abortion side in the US seems to want to hear this argument - even though it's been proven that it works.

You can only go so many rounds with an anti-abortion person before you realize that they don't want to talk about social policies that will make the actual root of the problem go away. They just want to punish women for having sex.

That's why people call you a misogynist for being against abortion. Because if you're just against abortion, but not for the policies that will make abortions less needed, you aren't making anything better for anyone. You're just making shit worse for women (and ultimately, everybody that has to deal with poorer, dumber women and abused, unwanted kids).

>>36716050

Your evidence so far has consisted of:

1)You are retarded, I am right
2)goto 1

Don't use Jesus in vain. He'd never use dirty tricks in his rhethoric like you, if the records are anything to go by.

What's wrong with being a misogynist?

oregano

I think white women should be legally obligated to have children.

>>36716068
>revamp
>>36716049
THIS is what i meant, maybe i should have been more clear.
The educational system in the US is at a current downslope and has been for about 20 years or so.
There are less and less and less High School graduates every year, atleast in my state.
I went to about 4 highschools and ive looked back on stats on who graduated on a school district website...probably not legally but i was curious.
A school in inner city of my town had my 39% of its seniors graduate, the next had only around 45-49% graduate.
Those two were inner city but in an all white high school when i was in freshman year had 68% of seniors graduate.

Doesnt that seem odd?
Why arent atleast 80% of kids passing a fucking SAT?

>>36716128
>Why arent atleast 80% of kids passing a fucking SAT?
Because American public schools are severely underfunded and overcrowded, and the standardized tests they make them teach to now are shit.

>>36716110

Unnecessary stress. Really, there are weak and cowardly people of both genders, just more females. Treat all cowards equally shittily and you'll be fine.

File: 1491247253170.jpg (1MB, 1478x6221px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1478x6221px

>>36716067
Oh, I'm sorry? Am I wrong now? Is that it? Why do Jews en masse push cultural marxism and this free-sex garbage? Why is it okay to be a degenerate in todays world? Do you know who controls the large majority of media outlets, government and pretty much dominates world politics? It's the kikes, no shit. And all this information is out there on the internet, but you probably don't care.
>>36716100
>I'd rather kill a child than a bird
Wow, you're one to tell me how Jesus would act. Jesus wouldn't spill any blood a second time for you faggots.

I really don't understand pro-life people.

>generally don't want free/affordable birth control to be available
>generally don't want improved sexual education
>generally don't want improved benefits for poor/single mothers
>generally don't adopt children from poor families

What exactly are they fighting for?

See, what i don't get is why it's so hard to use birth control. I have little respect for women who can't be bothered taking the pill or getting an implant or something. I have an IUD and it's so easy.

>>36716175
>What exactly are they fighting for?
To punish women and poors.

>>36716167

This child-killer bird-lover jesus-respecter has a question for you. Is this ironic?

>>36716181
You realize ALL methods of BC still have a failure rate, right?

>>36716175

To shit in our gene pool and make Earth one huge overpopulated third world country.

>>36716201
But 1%? really? factoring in that women only have a 33% likelihood of getting pregnant DURING the ovulation time, and the days you can get pregnant are only 5 days out of 28, it seems like a tiny, tiny chance.

>>36716192
Yes, of course I'm being ironic.

>>36716239
The fact that it's a tiny chance doesn't matter for shit if you end up being in that less than 1% "freak" pool. You can't be a little bit pregnant, once you are it doesn't matter how you ended up that way.

>>36716258
Well fine, but I don't think most abortions are from that 0.001%.

>>36716262
What I'm saying is, who gives a shit if they are? Like, literally what the fuck business is it of yours?

>>36716255

Holy shit, it's such a relief, you wouldn't believe. Fuck me for taking anything on 4chin seriously. I suppose I deserve this but you've really fucked my shit up there. Thank you.

>>36716275
I'm saying that most abortions could be avoided if people were simply CAREFUL about birth control. I'm not really against abortion, but I do think it's a shame that so many potential lives are lost through sheer laziness.

>>36716175
I'm not a pro-lifer, but the ideas that you don't want to pay for other people's degeneracy and you think abortion is murdering a child are not mutually exclusive.

>>36716298
Please kill yourself, roastie whore.

>>36716316
> so many potential lives are lost through sheer laziness
But that's not what's happening at all. They aren't "potential lives lost," since they were never intended to happen in the first place. The difference you're talking about is that the abortion would never have happened, you're not regretting people who never existed. And if you are, you're not thinking this through.

Unless you can really say you PREFER millions and millions of lives coming into the world that are completely unwanted and unable to be cared for.

File: SendMeAway.jpg (53KB, 604x604px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 604x604px

>We live in a day and age where sex means nothing
>We live in a day and age where killing a could-be child means nothing

>>36716316
>>36716379
To add to this - this is why the solution is promote sex ed and give out free birth control, not yell at people for having abortions. If you want kids to be wanted, make sure people know how not to have them when they don't want them.

It may seem straightforward to you, but it isn't to the people in Bumfucksville, Alabama who've never had a sex ed class and have never bought a condom in their lives.

The only way to argue against abortion is if you believe in an immortal soul and that you get that soul the moment you're conceived. If you have an even slightly materialist view of consciousness then arguing against abortion is retarded

>>36715343
You aren't anon. Women had the choice not to have sex- pregnancy is the natural consequence, even if contraception is used. People simply want to live hedonistic lifestyles and not deal with the consequences, so when someone points out their degeneracy they are overwhelmed with shame and viciously attack they that speak truth.

>>36716379
I literally said I'm not pro life, I just think it a shame that for want of some birth control women go through emotional trauma and the state loses money for something that is entirely preventable. And, them being unwanted doesn't mean that there isn't potential for life. Biological fact that most foetuses if not aborted will probably grow and become humans. I don't prefer them to be born and be unwanted, I simply don't think that abortions are good when birth control is an easy and available alternative.

File: heman.gif (412KB, 491x270px) Image search: [Google]

412KB, 491x270px

>>36716485
Gotcha, tiger. You don't hate women.

>>36716336
>the ideas that you don't want to pay for other people's degeneracy and you think abortion is murdering a child are not mutually exclusive.

Of course, but I think if you're going to actively push legislation on abortion then you need to have some compromise on either preventing or improving the lives of the children that they are now forcing into the world.

>>36716509
>I simply don't think that abortions are good when birth control is an easy and available alternative.
I don't disagree with you in principle. But easy and available for you doesn't mean easy and available for everyone. It's pretty obvious when you look around at the state laws being enacted that outlaw Plan B or require ID for condoms or allow pharmacists not to dispense BC, or that massive debate about BC being covered under the ACA, that it isn't actually that simple.

There are also a lot of school districts in the US that still don't allow sex ed in 2017. Completely predictably, they're also the states with the highest teen pregnancy rates.

Get out of your bubble a bit, maybe read up on the challenges faced by people who aren't you. Not everyone has the easy access to the information and resources you take for granted.

File: AreYouSerious.jpg (24KB, 288x252px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 288x252px

>>36716592
>Get out of your bubble a bit, maybe read up on the challenges faced by people who aren't you.

File: baby.jpg (7KB, 290x174px) Image search: [Google]

7KB, 290x174px

>>36715343
Pro tip. It doesn't.
>>36715401 Behold the fetus dipshit.

File: bi7q59jcyaasfqs.png (192KB, 690x528px) Image search: [Google]

192KB, 690x528px

>fetus feels pain in 20 weeks
>fetus heart beat starts in 3 weeks
>fetus has separate blood type
>fetus isn't part of the body, it's just attached via the cord
>the fetus is literally a different person
>people still unironically think a fetus isn't a person in 2017
>women are still unironically getting abortions even when only 1.3% of abortions are due to rape, the majority of abortion causes are just due to not wearing a condom

If you're pro-abortion to this day you're literally retarded lmao

>>36715343
>Abortion is okay because it's my body, my choice.
>Get you son a circumcision at birth without his consent.

Please explain.

>Abortion is okay because it's not a human being yet #pussyhat.
>Same vegan woman at college doesn't eat eggs because it's cruel to consume unborn animals.

Honestly i'm not even pro-life or any of that shit and I consider abortion to be fluff politics but the retardation and hypocrisy of normies never ceases to surprise.

Also abortion should never be a point of pride, bragging or social grandstanding. It is a shameful act in almost all cases and an example of how bad your decision-making and partner selection skills are and how poorly you treat your body.

>>36715343
Pregnancy has a lot of negative affects for some women who don't want it, and you shouldn't force them to do things with their body that they don't want to do. There are also more reasons for abortions aside from "I just don't want a baby."

Scientists are developing artificial wombs though. So if a woman doesn't want her child they might eventually be able to just implant it into one of those.

>>36715497
Underrated post

This is the reason and the left won't admit it.

>>36715958
>only men can be pieces of shit so women should make the decision

Jesus Christ

>>36717169
No, the left admits it pretty openly. It's the right that generally won't admit it. They hide behind buzzwords like "muh family values" and "protecting the unborn" but it's really pretty much this.

>>36717196
That post didn't say "only men can be pieces of shit." It said those specific types of men are shit. If you're not in any of those categories not really sure what you're bitching about

>>36717127
Children are essentially property

>B-but my future Steve Jobs

>>36717073
>>women are still unironically getting abortions even when only 1.3% of abortions are due to rape, the majority of abortion causes are just due to not wearing a condom
What the fuck is an ironic abortion?

>>36716175

>Generally don't want to fund degeneracy, pay for your own filth
>Generally don't want to ruin the innocence of kids and teach them how to get one another pregnant
>See point fucking one
>Poor families hardly ever put kids up because MUH GIBS

The right of every human being to not be murdered.

>>36717295
this is why the world is so shitty
People don't understand that kids are going to be adults one day, not really.
They just get told by their base instincts that they should have a kid and they do, without fucking thinking about the implications of creating another living being that will be introduced into the system

I really have no respect for a person that would have a child, and never pick up a book on developmental psychology

>>36715416
Will that clump of cancer cells develop into a human if left alone?

>>36715497
it's not the babies fault that the woman's body is doing what it was designed to do

>>36715465
This pro-choice argument is so stupid. It's like arguing against seat belts by saying, "Yeah, but what about if your car is underwater and your seatbelt is stuck? Hurr durr, seat belts are dumb." it's an overly specific, rare exception to an otherwise reasonable ppsition

>>36717612
Sex can also be for bonding purposes, and lowering aggression. It's been documented a lot of times in animals for those purposes, and humans do the same things. It's not just for procreation.

Because you believe a clump of cells inside a woman's uterus outweighs that person's right to live the way they want to.
Not to mention that outlawing abortion would vastly increase the number of illegal 'coat-hanger' abortions that have a high death rate.

>>36717554
>Generally don't want to ruin the innocence of kids and teach them how to get one another pregnant
Sex ed is what's making the kids have sex, everyone!

ITT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJYY1CFKzTg

>>36715998
I can see you read a science book, friend. Congratulations. But I've also read science books, and I skipped ahead to the part where that "lump of cells" develops into a baby.
This is like forcing a half-baked cake out of the oven, dumping it in the trash, and claiming you didn't ruin a cake, just a "pan of batter." It's an arbitrary label.

>>36716175
>generally
You're assuming every pro-lifer is a Bible belt, hyper-conservative meathead. Nice strawman, but the traits you just posted are just hypothetical.

>>36715401
Sorry. Not dipshit. Me dipshit. Pasted wrong post number.

If you believe that a fertilized egg is a human then every time I jerk off I'm killing millions of potential lives.

>>36715343
>ywn abort yourself

>>36717759
>generally
>every

>>36717759
>You're assuming every pro-lifer is a Bible belt, hyper-conservative meathead

No he didn't. That's literally why he said "generally" on every line.

>>36717574
A fetus will not develop into a human if "left alone" though. It requires input from the mother. It is by definition not a closed or isolated system and not capable of spontaneous growth. Nothing is.

>>36717574

>Will that clump of cancer cells develop into a human if left alone?

They sometimes grow hair and teeth, so maybe.

File: us-population-annual-abortions-non-elderly-medicaid-2008-2010.png (41KB, 914x662px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 914x662px

>>36715343
Think about how many more blacks would be around if there was no abortion.

From an ethical perspective, abortion should be banned. You believe this the wrong reason though, people should be responsible enough to take the steps necessary to prevent unwanted pregnancy, not that it's "murder" or some convoluted religious reason. It's a fucking embryo, there is no consciousness, and you aren't taking a life.

Abortion is very practical though, especially in communities where socioeconomic conditions are really poor.

>>36717769
Hilarious, groundbreaking stuff. You should be a stand up comedian.

>>36717073
>>"fetus feels pain in 20 weeks"
>Everything that feels pain is a person

>>"fetus heart beat starts in 3 weeks"
>Everything that has a heart beat is a person.

>>"fetus has separate blood type"
>Anything with a different blood type is a person.

Sufficient to say that not a single one of this facts proves that something is a person, so using them to argue that the fetus is a person is retarded.

>>"fetus isn't part of the body, it's just attached via the cord "
True, but the point is that if someone depends on your body to survive, your rights over your own body take priority over the rights of the other person over your body. Even if is a life or death situation, and (obviously) even if the other person isn't "part of your body", the fact that afects your body gives you the right to have a say. This is what we call bodily autonomy. That's where the "it's my body" thing comes.

>>"the fetus is literally a different person"
I don't necessarily desagree, but not a single one of your arguments proved that, so you should really rethink your position of why and when a fetus is a person, probably with arguments that don't also aply the practically any other living organism.

>>"people still unironically think a fetus isn't a person in 2017"
>People are ridiculous for thinking this even if I have no arguments to prove my position.

>>36715343
>women can't be bothered to put their life on hold for a year just to let another person come into existence
>inb4 adoption doesn't exist

>>36721827
Consider conjoined twins.

Would it be OK for one conjoined twin to unilaterally decide to get separation surgery knowing it would kill the other?

>>36717769
No, because sperm is not a fertilized egg.

Jerking off is not murder, sperm is not a person. A woman having her period is not murder, an unfertilized egg is not a person. Abortion IS murder, a fertilized egg IS a person.

>>36715343
It dosent, that makes you a human being with an opinion, i dont agree with your opinion but you are entitled to it nonetheless

>>36716099
>How you feel about it personally aside, outlawing abortion just means condemning women to carrying to term pregnancies they don't want and likely can't or won't care for after they're born.
Adoption is a thing retard. Don't want a kid? Put it up for adoption. Don't murder it.

>>36715343

You are entitled to your thoughts and perspectives on things OP. but let me tell you why I am pro-choice.

We are reaching a point in medicine where designer babies are as inevitable as self-driving cars. Soon we will be able to choose the details of ou children's biology. We can get rid of things like homosexuality and transgenderism for good. And if Social Justice Warriors oppose this, it will compromise their pro choice rhetoric. For decades now science has been the proud child of left wing politics because it has been inconvenient to the right wing. Now it is going to blow up in the left's face where they are going to have to choose between women having ownership over their bodies or the future for the gay race. I'm going to love it.

It makes you a misogynist because you are denying pregnant women the right to bodily autonomy. You are holding the rights of a clump of cells to a higher regard than the rights of a living, breathing woman.

It can also be indicative of more subtle misogyny (women are vessels for life and by aborting a fetus they are defying their biological purpose, getting pregnant is a risk of unprotected sex and a woman should be forced to carry that fetus to term to see the consequences of their actions, abortion is only something godless promiscuous heathen women use anyway, etc)

It's a dead issue (no pun intended) but a lot of it boils down to a willful ignorance of semantics on both sides. Either you believe life begins at the moment of conception or you believe life begins as soon as a fetus is viable outside the womb.

>>36715497
Recreational/casual sex is a fucking meme that's destroying the west

>>36722251
>You are holding the rights of a clump of cells to a higher regard than the rights of a living, breathing woman.
For 9 months.

Women get themselves into this situation, knowing the possible consequences, and then choose to murder their child rather than be inconvenienced for 9 months.

File: 1412318437191.jpg (32KB, 645x444px) Image search: [Google]

32KB, 645x444px

>let me ask you why laws should be enforced and why murder is murder
>let me also mental gymnastics my feelings away when i actually do have a miscarriage or abortion and construct a eulogy, shrine and gravestone for an apparent non-human, non-organism, non-living, non-everything that might paint me as an unethical woman

>>36715556
U almost got me but yeah the father has a say. I see what ur sayin tho from a mans perspective the babies are very much the momma's more than the father to certain degree

>>36722290

Unless they're a victim of rape, or incest, or maybe they desperately want a child but their OB/GYN told them that carrying the fetus to term would likely result in the death of herself, the fetus, or both. Maybe they live in an impoverished area where they know they won't be able to give this potential child the life they want it to have. Maybe they're simply not in an emotional/psychological/financial place where they can support both themselves and a child.

Like, there are a TON of reasons women get abortions, and to think that it's primarily used as a casual form of birth control is disingenuous and wrong.

And also, aborting a fetus and murdering a child are two VERY different things.

>>36722520
Why does being raped mean its OK to abort? Its not the child's fault that it is a product of rape.

Obviously the father should have no right to custody, and the woman should be allowed to put it up for adoption, but there's no reason to murder it.

Again same thing with poverty and not being emotionally ready to be a parent. Adoption is a thing.

>aborting a fetus and murdering a child are two VERY different things.
No, they aren't. The state even agrees; why else would you get two murder charges if you kill a pregnant woman?

>>36715343
The question of whether or not it's murder is unimportant in my mind. Abortion provides an avenue for men and women to be successful and productive without bringing a child they can't provide for into the world.

>>36722634
Adoption is a thing.

>>36722594

>Adoption is a thing

There are more than a quarter million orphaned children in the foster care system right now. It's easier to adopt a child from China or Russia than it is to adopt an American child. The foster care system is overburdened and riddled with tales of abuse and neglect. If you believe in adoption so strongly, why haven't you adopted anybody yet?

>why else would you get two murder charges if you kill a pregnant woman?
Because state legislation pushed that through the courts in the U.S. There is no country in Europe, for example, that considers the murder of a pregnant woman to be two murders. Again, it's political and not a reflection of science or our understanding of human biology.

>Why does being raped mean its OK to abort?
Because who the fuck would want a physical reminder of one of the darkest and most horrifying days of their life to be brought to term inside them? Are you honestly saying a woman who was raped should not have the right to abort this completely unwanted fetus?

>>36722665
So is death upon giving birth to a baby

>he thinks abortion should be illegal
>not thinking that abortion should be legal
>not thinking abortion should be covered by insurance
>not thinking that women who can't afford kids, don't have the emotional capacity to raise kids, or just plain don't feel like it should be encouraged to abort their fetuses

It's almost like you want tax payers to be forced to support these kids, either via welfare or foster care
It's almost like you want those unwanted children to grow up, realise they aren't wanted, become robots, suffer for 70 years, and die alone and miserable rather than just be mercifully snuffed out before they even become self-aware

What are you, a monster?

File: 1b228a84626b0981735b59049ae2ad92.png (267KB, 420x420px) Image search: [Google]

267KB, 420x420px

>>36715343
>its another "pro-lifer virtue signals about muh murder even though fetuses aren't even conscious creatures until several weeks after conception"
Why do you care? If you hate abortion so much, don't associate yourself with people who are ok with it. Stop trying to impose your moralfaggotry on strangers who would be better off without unwanted babies. Even I find abortion distasteful but I don't want people to have to conform to my beliefs