Well, robots? Originalorino

>>34919081
>elites destabilise countries for their own ends
>the people have to endure the consequences
wow, so fair

The biggest enemy of muslims are muslims

>>34919081
>have to

well they don't 'have to' do anything

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>before the europeans came along, the middle east and north africa were prosperous, peaceful, happy nations ten million years advanced in space age technology and the children played in the chocolate rivers and there was no crime and no one ever died

also europe has been shitting all over itself since the fucking neolithic and we still pulled it together better than the shitskins

>>34919081
That's the platform Trump ran on.

>>34919081
When did Germany or Sweden ever destabilise other countries?

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I'd love if we (by which I mean America) stopped fucking around in other countries.

of course if we did that then you'd be crying about how its so awful that a superpower isn't fucking around in other countries, sending aid and stopping genocides and shit.

>>34919081
>2017
>acting like this wasn't obama's fault

Obama legitimately created the refugee crisis that we have today by bombing the fuck out of every middle eastern country.

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i like this idea better

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>>34919157
Germany did it twice in one century. Sweden did it back in the 1600-1700s.

All of it Europe tho.

>>34919081
I'm not the fucking NATO dude, I never woke up one day and decided to give weapons to a bunch of terrorist factions in the desert.

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>>34919137
This is the most extreme strawman I've ever seen

It's the US and their kike overloads who does this and Europe and Canada are the ones who end up paying the price

>>34919137
The Middle East was quite wealthy actually. Up until the 1950's, Middle Eastern people had higher standards of living. Sure, they had neither "muh democracy" nor "muh free speech" but you have to understand that their culture is completely different. They were self-sufficient nations moving at their own pace, until they got fucked by Americans

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>>34919371
I require sources to back up these claims you make.

>>34919371
if your culture is opposed to or prohibits democracy and free speech, then I think it right and proper to say that that culture is bad and ought to go.

whether it's our responsibility, or a good practical idea, to remove that bad culture, that's up in the air.

>>34919081
Or maybe they should get gud and make their own country great. Work together to make sure their country doesnt get destabilized by others? Sorta like what the whites have done since medieval times?

>>34919137
Actually the arabs were doing p good, had a wonderful trade of ideas and goods across the Mediterranean, but then islam came along and they ruined everything.

>>34919477
Who are you to decide which cultures should go and which should stay? Cultures are ingrained in people's daily life, you can't just come in and tell them how to live. That's what happened with Iraq. It turned from a proseprous nation into a shithole. That's what happened with Libya, a wealthy nation which also turned into a shithole. When democracy comes to the Middle East, the cultural incompatibility is comparable to sharia law coming to Europe.

>>34919081
Why do people care this much about it
The avg person doesnt deal with foreign policy nor have the power to so I mean

>>34919081
Funnily enough a lot of Middle Eastern countries were doing pretty well throughout the mid 1900s. Yeah Egypt had the whole Suez Canal incident and Israel happened but aside from that they weren't doing too bad at all. Just look at Iran and Afghanistan in the 1970s for example.


And then Islam and to an extent socialism just fucked it all up and then it was completely downhill from there.

>>34919553
hence the "whether it's our responsibility, or a good practical idea, to remove that bad culture, that's up in the air." part.

But I assert that people have a natural right to control their government, instead of their government controlling them. Yeah, we might well just make things worse by coming in and toppling an illegitimate government. But that doesn't equate to any obligation to respect that government, or a culture that tolerates oppression of its people.

>>34919570
The average person starts to care when they find their village swamped with outsiders who have no respect for local way of life

>>34919596
It's sad, really. The only country that's survived intact is Jordan. The rest of the ME could have been like them

>>34919612
But the West used to live in those conditions too. You should simply leave countries that are not hostile to you alone.

Today I was in a line at Starbucks (I live in Europe) and the guy in front of me was clearly American. He orders some shitty coffee and when the bill comes out he's like "Hey, that's not what it says on this sign!" and points to a sign below the cashier that has a different price for the breakfast menu. The cashier tries to explain what it is in her own language but the American interrupts her and yells "I don't speak foreign!" Eventually, they let him take his shitty coffee for free and then he just stood there for like 15 fucking minutes "correcting" the orders of other customers.
>muh liberty and justice for all

>>34919477
>if your culture is opposed to or prohibits democracy and free speech, then I think it right and proper to say that that culture is bad and ought to go.
Fuck Humanitarian Universalists. Political involvement and democracy are not a priori goods.

>>34919596
Britain and France set things up poorly about a century ago. Then Afghanistan was invaded by the USSR, the CIA began using Wahhabism as a biological weapon and arming people, Soviets spread anti-West propagand, retards in the CIA decided every country in the region would benefit from democracy, and now this.

>>34919111
Shit's fucked; the innocent (stupid) ones are just getting assfucked so they'll come to the west, spend money, and become a product of the state, and the rapists are coasting in behind them. Literally everyone loses except the elite

>>34919887
>innocent (stupid)
What

>>34919662
Jordan isn't doing too bad as far as I know. At least they have the common sense to keep themselves out of trouble.

>>34920099
For the most part, at least. They did buttfucked a couple of times by Israel in the past

>>34919192
>All of it Europe though
Yes, don't remind us.

>>34919711
Only a person whose goal is to tyrannize others would believe that.