VENEZULA HOW DID IT COLLAPSE

One implies the other

It's a mystery. We won't be able to tell for hundreds of years. Marx was a pretty smart guy.

>>139596969
Fuck them.

>>139597021
How so?

Cia ruined them

Corrupt Government.

But, that goes hand-in-hand with socialism so I guess that's the cause.

>>139596969

Socialism.

Many nations in the middle east spent decades with oil as main source of capital, but didn't pursue socialist economics and social policy. They thrive, Venezuela did not.

the cia infiltrated because they are scared of true communism

>>139596969
It's socialism. At this point, the problem isn't the low oil price, it's because production has been so badly managed output is collapsing.

When oil has made a handful of nations incredibly rich and powerful but gommies couldnt figure that one out

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>>139597181
Oil revenue possibilitates all the welfare, subsidies and bloated state. The state controls the economy, and has no reason to develop it if it can sustain itself through oil exports alone.

>>139596969
communism wasnt tried again. many such cases.

>>139596969
Socialism. They could have used all that oil money to diversify their industry and ensure they don't get fucked over if the price dips.

Instead they spent it all on gibs which has 0 return.

>>139596969
This photo is misleading. It's actually a Venezuelan supermarket demonstrating against nationalism by showing how few goods would be left if they removed all foreign brands.

America boycotting the country and stopping trade, essentially cutting it off from the rest of the world. Another example of crony American capitalism.

>>139596969
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7udbzg-sr6Y

turn on the auto translation, it is fairly accurate.

>>139596969
Socialism.
After all, why hasn't Qatar gone down if being dependant on oil alone is bad?

>>139596969
But it wasn't real socialism

>>139596969
even the dumbest populations have smart individuals.
Socialism prevents meritocracy to take place, therefore prevents smart individuals to thrive and change society for the better.

The dumbest a population is the more likely they are to implement full blown socialism and also the more dramatic the consequences are.
Socialism is a trap with double dipping mechanics: the dumber you are the worse it's going to be if you use it but also you are more attracted to it.

>>139597374
This.
The problem is that gibs are running costs you cannot just slash when you have a bad year. For stuff like the repairs of infrastructure it's not that much of a problem, you can slow it down a bit and keep them in an "acceptable" condition rather than a good one and they'll still do their job.
But you cannot tell your leeches that they won't get any food anymore.

It's the same shit that kills companies, and why their first action for lowering expenses is always downsizing the workforce.

>>139596969
Its not free to extract and process oil, socialism or no socialism, they can't extract and process their oil at these prices. Saudi arabia got cleaner oil with less impurities so it kinda works for them.

Fracking and oil sand is a joke and where not even profitable before the oil glut. It was made possible by cheap credit (low interest rates) and people speculating for a quick buck.

>So did venezula collapse because of socialism or them being dumbass only having oil as a main source of capital?
Both

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>>139596969
I think commies will call it "State Capitalism", or some shit.
Literally, real " Communism" is: stateless, classless and money...
AKA: impossible, until a 100 years from now after the singularity

>>139597692
>After all, why hasn't Qatar gone down if being dependant on oil alone is bad?
Because their oil can be extracted and processed with a profit at these prices. The arabs are sitting on the best oil in the world.

>>139596969
>Venezuela
>96% roman catholic
>100% marxist
There's only so much cancer one group of people can stand.

venezuela is having problems because of diversity...the mestizos recently--in the last decade or so--became a majority when combined with the indios...and so now the whites are no longer in control...whites no longer being in control is the problem...not socialism or anything else...

>>139597374
Yes they're not democracies which can lead to unsustainable socialist policies. However there is more at play here, Venezuela has had a very large amount of poor immigrants in the last century, from other south-american countries, and furthermore Latin-America is a corrupt hell-hole.

>>139596969
Low iq

>>139597544
Lol, the fuck kind of broken analogy is that. It'd make a lot more sense if they replaced all the products with giant donation jars that go to those countries for nothing in return. They should've at least done it right if they're going to make the stock bois do all that needless work

>>139597520
worked for saudi arabia

How about an absolute dumbass as a president who believes socialist bullshit in spite of the hard economic facts and who implements unsustainable economic policies like subsidized stuff and guaranteed wages for people that aren't nearly productive enough to make up for what they earn?

Any bets on whether he gets out of this alive, or is shot by an assassin / a military junta who takes ove?

>>139596969
Picture of one empty shelf. I'm utterly convinced now that everyone in Venezula is utterly poor.

Oh wait, I recall a picture like this supposedly from Crimea after it voted to rejoin Russia.

>>139597797
>Socialism prevents meritocracy to take place

THIS

Socialist organizations are all about cutting down the tall poppies. They don't want anyone making them look stupid and lazy so they push them out.

>>139598194
>unsustainable socialist policies.
Funny thing is oil arabs have more socialist policies than any commie country can dream off.

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>>139597374
>Many nations in the middle east spent decades with oil as main source of capital, but didn't pursue socialist economics and social policy.
Can't tell if trolling or paki

>>139597374
>they thrive
Yeah, for those who own the oil deposits.

I would rather live in current Venezuela than any of those countries.

>>139599333
They pursued socialist welfare but not socialist economics. One is spending wealth and the another is meddling with how wealth is made.

>>139596969
>Be random communist shithole. Lets call it Venezuela
>Somehow be lucky you got lots and lots of oil
>Don't have tech because see above
>fuckit.png
>Buy tech from capitalistic pics
>Drill 4 oil
>feelsgoodman.mp3
>Murica discovers a new method to get oil from fracking
>Hmmm k
>Saudi and other OPEC counties tank the price to push them out of business
>Prices for your product go down. Prices for tech stay the same.
>Loose lots of money.
>Can't do shit against it
>People get angry at you
>Have civil unrest
>Go down the shitter like every other communist shithole before you.
>Blame capitalists
>Say real communism has never been tried
>repeat for lulz

>>139596969
The Mexicans don't have a sealed southern border for no reason at all. That's saying something, considering themselves. Central & Southern America are straight garbage, no discussion.

>>139601328
>>Prices for your product go down. Prices for tech stay the same.
Yep.

Venezuela being a socialist shithole in a part of the world that is notorious for socialist takeover and nationalization of foreign capital is not really making it easy for foreign oil companies to expand their business in that country or finding investors that are willing to invest there.

Socialism > higher risk > fewer investors and/or investors that want more in return for investing > stranglehold on industry. If they where like Chile its entirely possible that some big oil company would be willing to invest there and make it possible to extract oil at a profit again. Even Nigeria is better because there you can at least buy the local politicians by throwing expensive consumer goods at them or play them of against each other.

the money ran out. It happens in every socialist country.
The money will run out in the usa as well, if we keep this up.
One cannot loot and distribute ones way out of a problem. We must work and produce our way out of problems.

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>>139597544
brekek

>>139596969
the ENTIRE reliance on oil was the issue

the government socialist or otherwise, did not invest in farming and then middle production of those goods.
Instead relying on oil exports to prop up the government, which inturn propped up their dollar.
Oil fell, dollar falls, stores cannot afford to buy imported food
Since they didn't concentrate on making food within the country.
Bingo bango. Venezula

top down management can't organize the individual needs of everyone

too much restriction on individual decision making and limiting or prohibiting resources

everyone people catch a break to find solutions, the government "cracks down" on it

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>>139596969
>or them being dumbass only having
no, it's just "them being dumbass" in a broad, general way

>>139596969
Based Hugo Chavez got assassinated. That's how.

>>139596969
Overreliance on oil combined with wasteful spending on things like military. Also unchecked populism and corruption. These are by no means unique to socialism or left wing ideas, despite what PragerU and Steven Crowder want you to believe.

>>139597260
Cuba is communist but is at the middle of corruption rankings in Latin America last time I checked.

>>139597374
Venezuela doesn't have the political clout in OPEC that somewhere like Saudi Arabia does.

people that owned the oil companies decided they dont give af about its citizens

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>>139596969

>>139597797
>>139599022
Why did the Soviet Union have so many scientists, researchers, and innovation? Why is Cuba, a poor island country, known for making new medical innovations and sending physicians to work all over the world?

didn't the media practically hailed Hugo Chávez to be some second coming of Jesus Christ? He did criticize Bush and was the punching bag of the left then.
I seem to remember people in Venezula crying tears of utter joy over him a decade ago. I even remember /pol/ or /news/ sucking the guy's cock for taking hold of oil production and making Venezuela Great Again.

>>139607936
I don't know, but remember, communism has never been tried, so it wasn't that...

>>139596969
>So did venezula collapse because of socialism or them being dumbass only having oil as a main source of capital?


Wow,Venezuela is so socialist that 70% of it's economy is privately owned!But muuuh socialism.
The Venezuela argument is stupid for two reasons. The reason the economy collapsed is because of the US and Saudi Arabia's joint action to flood the market with cheap oil.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrodollar

Brocialist Party of America
http://www.ned.org/region/latin-america-and-caribbean/venezuela-2015/
Endowment for demoacy is a CIA controlled organization and as you can see it has given millions to opposition in Venezuela
230,000$ for 'independent media' except that media only relies on American money LMFAO
2) Venezuela's economic troubles have very little to do with socialism. It's roots can be traced to the Venezuelan banking crisis of 1994 under then president Rafael Caldera, when 17 out of Venezuela's 49 commercial banks failed and had to be taken over by the government (sound familiar?). The crisis happened because oil (which Venezuela kinda lives & dies by) prices fell. Up to 31% of Venezuela's GDP was spent on the bailout, & the economy got completely fucked because of it. Venezuela's socialist policies came later under president Hugo Chavez to help combat this, but by then there was only so much that could be done. Here's a contemporary article:
http://www.nytimes.com/1994/05/16/us/failure-of-high-flying-banks-shakes-venezuelan-economy.html?pagewanted=all

>>139608518
Archived that for you

>http://nytimes com/1994/05/16/us/failure-of-high-flying-banks-shakes-venezuelan-economy.html?pagewanted=all
https://archive.is/qCZnP

>>139608554
thank you based dane.

>>139597374
Many nations like Libya, Syria, Egypt, Tunisia, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Yemen ... that were all socialist baathist countries ?

90% of those countries thrived under socialism and only collapsed when U.S started pushing democracy bullshit

Educate your self European burger

>>139608518

this

>>139596969
retarded socialism + corruption + shit oil + saudis selling their oil cheap

>>139607936
>Why did the Soviet Union have so many scientists, researchers, and innovation?
Lolwut? Don't buy into commie propaganda.

>>139596969
Dutch Disease?

>>139596969
business owning class purposefully sabotaging the country and not producing so they can blame it on the government. Oil company jews helping spread the propaganda and create artificial opposition as well

>South American socialist one commodity state
>that one commodity was of relatively bad quality

It was a recipe for disaster from the get go desu.

>>139597181
Only dumbasses would think a socialist economy that is a one trick pony would end in anything but famine.

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>>139596969

>>139611155
I know that living standards were poor but didn't the USSR have a lot of inventions, especially those related to space?

>>139596969
Socialism in combination with wasting all the oil money on short-term bullshit. Compare with Greece where retirement age is 55 thanks to EU money.
They could have thrived with socialism if they just had decided to spend money on long-term investments. Education and infrastructure, build a solid country for our children and their children, and what if the oil runs out?
The one sane thing the socialists did in Sweden was to upgrade the telecommunications infrastructure in the early 1990s. Thousands of miles of optic fibers were laid not only between the big cities but to bumfucking nowhere. As a consequence I have a halfdozen ISPs to choose from, all dirt cheap, while americans only get to pick one retardedly expensive.

>>139611868
they were quite literally stolen from the Nazis.

>>139597374
Many are getting wrecked. The level of wreck depends on how much foresight they had. Venezuela had none, they assumed oil at all time highs would never go down and spent all the money they had. Saudi Arabia knew oil would come down and built massive reserves.

>>139596969
Socialism. The main problems they ran into was that they had a degree of wealth through one singular avenue, oil, and used it to mollify the people with so many social programs that a good number no longer bothered working or innovating. Then when the revenue stream from oil inevitably depleted as they put all of their eggs in that dumb basket they were fucked.

>>139596969
It collapsed because it was not real socialism

>>139597374
Saudi Arabian population is really just kept pacified with crown handouts since basically nobody works, knows how to work or well anything related to work. Saudi Arabians are house Saud's pets.

>>139611868
>USSR have a lot of inventions, especially those related to space?
Like google maps or GPS?

>>139607936
>sending physicians to work all over the world

They are no9t real doctors you retard, they are subversive agents. We had HUGE problems with cuba doig this shit here with the Mais Medicos (More Doctors) program. Almost none of them had any medical experience, and the ones that did have any were angola tier vodoo medicine. Once they arrived, they immediately enrolled in government programs and start creating agitator cells and leading communist protests and shit like that.

Go fuck yourself stupid american commie, you have one of the best places in the world and are throwing it all away because of leftist indoctrination. NEVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE BELIEVE INTERNATIONAL LEFTIST PROPAGANDA.

>>139611868

>Steal all nazi technology after raping and murdering the population
>WE WUZ SCIENTISTS N SHIT

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>>139614514
Thank you based anon.

>>139614633
To be fair they gave asylum and good jobs to the nazis.

And say much cause Mengele died in Brazil of old age.

>>139614514
Thank you. Please never stop revealing truth.

>>139596969

Corrupt politicians and CIA meddling.

>>139614891
I like when americans think everything it's about their own goverment.

>>139597047
kek

>>139614772

I won't deny that, top-tier nazi scientists were usualy given good conditions to work.

>>139596969
They paid for their socialist policies with oil money.

The US and saudis tanked oil to fuck over russia, and it tanked Venezuela. Because their economy isn't diversified, their was a sudden, massive gap between what the country made and what it had to pay. Oil is literally 90% of the country's exports and a major driver of the economy there.

Instead of figuring out what to do, the various parts of the government decided to simultaneously try to back-stab eachother. Their version of congress(which is anti-marduro) frequently ignored rulings from their supreme court. The supreme court moved to abolish the assembly, and that triggered riots because well, you're trying to get rid of elected officials lol.

tl;dr oil dropped by 90% and different sides decided to air old grievances instead of trying to fix shit.

>>139615059
Not strange at all, after maduro was given extra faculties from congress we stoped hearing about the situation in Venezuela, he's officially a banana dictator now.

Good for him.

>>139597374
>Many nations in the middle east spent decades with oil as main source of capital, but didn't pursue socialist economics and social policy.
They've also been having a string of really violent civil wars and revolutions due to the drop in oil and water scarcity.

Oh wai-

>>139612405
So were our rocket scientists senpai. Russians still got to space first.

>>139612576
Also Saudis aren't part of a democracy like Venezuela is.

>>139614752
>>139614854

Forgot to post evidence, but here it is, the sources are in portuguese however. The entire cuban medical probgram is a scam to spread gommie agitators in target countries. These frauds killed innumerable people by pretending to be doctors and administering medicine wrongly.

http://www.implicante.org/editor/blog/relatos-assustadores-medicos-cubanos-cuba/

https://folhapolitica.jusbrasil.com.br/noticias/114382566/policia-federal-descobre-esquema-de-fraudes-no-mais-medicos

http://noticias.r7.com/educacao/mec-apura-fraude-em-curso-de-medicina-pelo-programa-mais-medicos-03052017

http://veja.abril.com.br/blog/felipe-moura-brasil/bomba-do-8220-mais-medicos-8221-gravacao-mostra-como-governo-do-pt-mascarou-objetivo-de-financiar-cuba/

http://noticias.band.uol.com.br/jornaldaband/videos/15410530/gravacoes-revelam-que-objetivo-do-mais-medicos-e-atender-governo-cubano.html

http://noticias.band.uol.com.br/brasil/noticia/100000741766/mais-medicos-ministerio-da-saude-tentou-mascarar-acordo-com-cuba.html

>>139615940
Ja ja, you got all the shitty cuban doctors.

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>>139596969
Russia, Nigeria, and Saudi Arabia all ran into the exact same problem in 2015 and none of them collapsed

>>139596969
they collapsed because their communism wasn't the REAL communism

>>139597608
This should be shown in schools to 12-14 y/o
Simple but effective, could be use to discourage Marxist ideologies

>>139613848
Obviously before that lol. They had the first satellite, a lot of the first equipment for space exploration, the first animal in space, and the first person in space.

>>139596969

both

>>139614514
Are you calling the UN communist, since it has recognized Cuba's achievements?
Put your tinfoil hat away.

>>139617393
too bad its in some stupid language no one knows

>>139617229
Russia can bully money out of others.

Nigeria, it's a similar case than venezuela but Yoruba people carry that country even with Igbos being being igbos.

Saudi arabia has legalized slaves.

>>139596969
CIA plot just like they did with Chile except this time they bit a big dog.
The other SA countries will come together to block the invasion like they always have.

>>139618010
and Venezuela has an entire population of legalized slaves.

>>139596969
>communism
>100% failure rate everywhere
It must have been evil American influence! That is the only explanation!

>>139596969
Look at Saudi Arabia and the UAE. They only had oil as a source of capital, but they seem to be doing just fine.

>>139618265
You have to pay them they didn't found a way to exchange without money, because venezuela was to globalized.

In Bolivia you can still exchange goods for goods in a remnant of the Inca ruling called trueque.

This way you can maintain an internal economy so people can have food, Venezuela outside the mayor cities must be perfectly functional, that's why the goverment still has enough support.

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>>139617897
>Are you calling the UN communist

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-true-that-the-United-nations-is-comprised-of-communist-leaders

http://www.unwatch.com/un_communist.shtml

You do know the UN was created and is staffed by communists and socialists to this day, correct?

>>139596969
It collapsed the way any other communist states collapse, once everyone thinks they are equal the government/one guy abuses them while still saying that they are "equal".

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>>139618768
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLwSyZSnaRU

Socialists belong there, they won fair and square.

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>>139619683
For fucks sake they act like Pidun the cursed, a hundred times traitor.

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>>139615313
one of the better surmations
Just trace the Trump announcements on Venezuela, look at global oil prices and the nation's post-Chavez politics and you'll get a decent understanding.
The vague right seem to be using Venezuela as a stick to bash socialists, thus missing out US imperialism, OPEC oil cabal and post-cold-war geopolitics.


all of the
>muh gobbunism fails ebery time
eg/ >>139613250 >>139604688

fail to make an argument and represent a failure in equivocational rigour. shame this place is going down the same drain as everywhere else

GO READ A BOOK

>>139620685
You don't get it, we always have to deal with imperialism, but we don't let people die of hunger unless they are corrupt fucks, wich happens from time to time with all kind of systems.

>>139618265
When your population is so retarded that they stop farming and distributing food you have no other choice but to force them to do it.