/rcg/ -- Radical Centrism General

no love?

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Reporting in

E M P I R I C A L

E V I D E N C E

>>137485097
You are not alone boyo.

What the hell is radical centrism? Isn't that an oxymoron?

>>137486537
Honestly thought Macron would be a total cuck.
He's still a cuck but he's surprised me.

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post meeems

>everybody is stupid but me

lol you get the bullet too

>>137486915
Business should be allowed to hire who they want, but workers should be allowed to form unions.

>>137485097
Thank you for making this

>>137487032
Bullet me then, pussy. Turns out I can fire a gun AND believe in abortion.

Fucking weird, right?

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>>137486906
>Son of Jupiter
>bogpilled
>too intelligent to talk to media

>cuck

>>137487224
sounds good

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Free market(no gov't) --- crony capitalism(some gov't) --- socialism (total gov't)
CENTRISTS ARE CRONIES!

THE WEST MUST BE SAVED!

RESTORE YOUR PRIDE, RESTORE YOUR CULTURE!!

STATES RIGHTS!! https://youtu.be/hCIc5ymZai4 [Open]

CUT EPA!!


CUT DEP OF ED!!


MAGA

Heil Merkel

Heil Tredeau

Heil Marcon

For Money and Reason!

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BRING BACK THE TPP
>BRING BACK THE TPP
BRING BACK THE TPP
>BRING BACK THE TPP
BRING BACK THE TPP
>BRING BACK THE TPP

>>137487437
Merkel is an opportunist crypto-populist.

>>137487393
>jewed
>meme'd
>autistic

t. cuck

>>137486876
Idealism without illusions, kiddo.

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>>137485097
>Radical SELLOUT General

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>>137488919
Why do you hate the global poor?

Who are some centrist philosophers to read? Kant and Locke?

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>>137489697

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>>137489697
>>137490135

>>137490135
>>137490584
cool. thx. Whats your opinions on center- (left/right politics) Good or bad?

>>137490813
>he thinks centrism means being apathetic.

What does radical centrism say on the subject of
>more extreme = faster progress
?

The idea that having a pendulum swing between left/right, with each being pushed by their extremism to achieve some goals until they push too far, piss off enough people and inevitably cause their own counter-movements, being the faster way of achieving the more widely accepted demands as oppose to seeking consensus among the majority of parties directly.

>>137490877
I've became center/center-right after realizing that too many position on the Trump and Sanders side were too much feels based rather than actual facts. I still kinda like Ted Cruz despite some of his positions being fucking horrible. SJWs are a problem but are really overexagerated by people on this board, hence why you always see the same half dozen SJWs being posted here. To me market is a means to an end, not the end itself, so capitalism must be preserved but not idolized. Immigration is a net gain to the country if done in a moderate and controlled way. Minimum wage must be abolished. Populism is cancer. Inequality isn't bad as long as we curb poverty. Protectionism is almost ways bad.

Some other "almost" consensus on the center, from economists:
http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com.br/2009/02/news-flash-economists-agree.html

>>137487224
NO BAD GOY. TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS MEANS WE ALL GET THE BENEFITS OF INCREASED WEALTH. UNIONS ARE FOR GOMMIES

>>137485097
Relevant?:
https://ourworldindata.org/extreme-poverty/
http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2012/03/pinker-explains-the-long-peace/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbkSRLYSojo

radical centrism is the final redpill. Would you classify guys like Ben Shapiro as rad cent or more center right?

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>>137491483
I don't mind the extremists, their actions tend to fortify the center. If not for them in our society, Jupiter Macron would have never been elected, and some other moderate right or lefty would have got it. Extremists are a necessary evil.

>>137492826
((((TRICKLE DOWN)))) IS NOT /RAD-CENTER APPROVED/

>>137493039
center-right to right.

Centrism wins once again. Feels great being on the right side, desu

>>137493450
>tfw centrism has to defend itself from attack from both sides

>>137487398
you are a total faggot, you will never be review brah caliber

>>137493450
this picture pisses me off so much. Nothing shows who's an economically illiterate retard like showing that picture. Hey dumbass, WHERES THE WINE COME FROM?

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>>137485097
FUCKING LEAF

KYS KEKLORD

>>137493039
Ben Shapiro is a pretty solid center-right/libertarian right. Maybe only a rad-center if we consider only his economic views, but that may be a stretch.

He is a good dude, but kinda too much principle based rather than pragmatic/evidence based.

>>137485097
Centrists are liars. They usually always vote one party.

>>137494071
>always vote one party
Thats for filthy communists and NEET-socs only

>>137492176
>SJWs ... are really overexagerated ... the same half dozen
small groups of loud extremists can represent large movements. What would you need to see before calling SJWs a serious problem?

>but not idolized
What should, in your opinion, be idolized?

>Immigration is a net gain ... if done in moderate and controlled way
Is this not accomplished by requiring said immigrants to provide value to society?

>Minimum wage should be abolished
How would you deal with full-time wages being lower than living costs?

>Populism is cancer
>curb poverty
Do you not see this is a contradiction?

>Protectionism is almost always bad
>almost always
when do you consider it good/ useful?

>>137494541
Definitely not a Communist. Guess that makes me a NEET-soc, which I am guessing is an imitation Nazi? Sure! I'm not a racist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbkSRLYSojo

>>137494071
Voted for Obongo in 2008, since Palin and that fucking warmonger McCain were just fucking atrocious, then Romney in 2012, since it turns out the black man was a warmonger and wall street sellout too. Strict party lines are for literal, unapologetic faggots. Don't compromise your ideals to appease this dumbass false dichotomy of "You're either with us, or you're the enemy."

>>137495097
God, he even looks like Goebbels

>>137495750
What would you say to the idea that uniting under and sticking to one purpose leads to more quickly achieving said purpose? Alternatively, switching focus causes inefficiency.

>>137495750
You virtue-signalling cuckold.
You voted for Obama over McCain, yet voted for Romney because Obama was too war-mongering?

I voted McCain because he is a war-hero, instead of Obama the first time, and opted out of voting for Romney because he is a bona-fide pussy.

Do you call yourself a Libertarian as well?

>>137495750
it's a shame Trump is also a warmonger too.

Fuck this gay earth.

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>>137496286
>You virtue-signalling cuckold.

>>137496286
>I voted McCain because he is a war-hero
Is that a rational criteria/worthy (of leadership) accomplishment, in your opinion?

>>137485097

I used to always say I was a left leaning centrist but I actually think after checking a few of these links that I might be a radical centrist.

You've given me a lot of homework, thanks.

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>>137496586
Nothing like wrapping yourself up in comfort to keep your ideas free from critical thought. Of course we're headed into degeneracy.

>>137496732
Absolutely. Do you have a better criteria?

>>137496286
War hero does not equal proficient leader of the free world. I was paying my dues to the military during those years, I saw what an embarrassing debacle the Iraq war was, and I was not keen on more of that. Granted Obama did a masterstroke of talking the talk, but not walking the walk, but at least he had the decency to put up the smoke and mirrors like Trump did.

And Romney was more of a protest vote than anything. I knew that Mormon fuck had no chance, but Obama sold out so hard that he needed way more clap backs then he got.

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>>137493871
>economically illiterate retard
How does it feel to disagree with almost every economist, including Republican ones? Trickle-down is literally the original "good goyim" policy.

>>137494840
>before calling SJWs a serious problem?
That may be a problem to answer as I don't know what you would call an SJW. Gamergate stuff, for an example, are pretty much a non-problem to me.

>What should, in your opinion, be idolized?
Nothing, thats the thing.

>Is this not accomplished by requiring said immigrants to provide value to society?
You don't even need to "require" it. They boost the productivity, GDP, new jobs, new consumers, reduces costs, and unlike people on this board believe, people don't want to live their entire lives on a shitty welfare check. People do want work, and create households, wealth, etc.

>How would you deal with full-time wages being lower than living costs?
There would be a UBI/Negative Income Tax, but pragmatically I don't push for that in the current climate, and neither of these are necesarily a critical change to me. High minimum wages federally are retarded on diverse countries like the US also, fighting that is more import to me than straight abolishing it.

>>137494840
>Do you not see this is a contradiction?
Not really. The real populism doesn't come from the people against poverty, but rather the inequality based folks, like Bernie Sanders, that ran half of his entire campaign on this talkpoint, and people loved it.

>when do you consider it good/ useful?
Adam smith recognized national security concerns as a reason for some protectionism, but even then its kinda limited. Example are things like Energy, Oil, etc.

>>137496286
>I voted McCain because he is a war-hero
The fuck

>>137497267
It's not unreasonable to assume someone who is capable of surviving a war and actually distinguishing himself within it would be a good leader

unfortunately they also give the "war hero" treatment to self-sacrificing naive people and brave idiots which make for terrible leaders

I'm not offering a counter, merely inquiring as to why you consider it a good choice to broaden perspective, you may have a valid point, if you make it

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>>137485097

>>137485097
Radical centrism? Or just liberalism with a flashy new label? It's already been done, it's called the 'third way', now gtfo.

>>137497405
You sound like a bitch-made pussy. Afraid to pick up arms and defeat the enemy. Who cares, even if it is primarily for profit, if we invade a country and try to establish some order?

People like you breed and produce worse individuals than we have. Automation will be our cure.

>>137498177
Yup. Relatively speaking, prior to him we had no legitimate war heros in several decades.

>>137485097
Is this authoritarian social democracy or social liberal thread?

>>137487929
> Merkel is an opportunist crypto-populist
Don't use fancy sounding words you don't understand, son.

>>137493871
The wine is produced by the workers, not the owners of the means of production - but yeah, the picture sucks and so does anyone who shares it.

>>137485097
>Radical centrist is just a leftist who's too scared to admit it

>>137498187
>you may have a valid point, if you make it

The fact that he was captured and tortured and later released played well in my head. I didn't realize he was an Admiral's son and that he received favorable treatment when he was enlisted, nor that he sung like a snitch, nor that he was likely responsible for the lives of over 100 sailors when he wet start a jet on an aircraft carrier. Hindsight is 20/20, but I still think he would have done a better job than that Communist, tranny-loving, faggot, Obama.

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>>137485097
>Centrist cucks, communists and facists are too retarded to be enlightened technocratic integralist trade-unionist traditionalists

Pathetic

>>137498478
Well, McCain is a good Republican compared to the rest, just voting "because" he was an war hero that was weird to me.

>>137498478
>new label
Go back to Charlottesville, buddy

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>>137499134
Never trust socdems.

>>137498478
We don't need your disinformation, commie.

Radical centrism is the new way forward, you can either adapt or get left behind.

>>137499349
But I'm not a socdem.

>>137485097

Are you the faggots that are pulling the

>I'm better than all of you because I'm in the middle

All over the internet?

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>>137498998
>tfw when you are so deep in your ideology that you activelly look for biases to tell everyone else is a leftist

>>137499134
Socdems are a bit okay for now, but they better be gone when the day of the rope arrives.

>>137497569
>gamergate stuff ... non-problem
I wasn't /that/ informed but afiak it was related to a collusion among major industry-media leaders to manipulate public opinion. That sounds serious to me

>nothing should be idolized
sounds like anarchy to me, not efficient
people are good with "higher power" motivators, historically
What of morals? decency? freedom? not specific ways of attaining/ keeping them but merely the ideals themselves?

>people do want to work
what people want and what people /do/ is often (usually) very different
How would you help those with low self-motivation?

>minimum wage bad
>UBI good but not right now
fairly reasonable
Should immigrants be given UBI?

>populism has been hijacked by socialists/ communists
but what of populism proper? Poor people are very much ordinary folk who have fallen on hard times. Free handouts are unlikely to motivate them to self-improvement but w/o help they face an uphill battle. Suggestions?

>Examples of good protectionism (kinda)
>energy
The US congress sanctions against Russian energy that would affect European countries is (according to many) a thinly-veiled ploy to secure US dominance in the energy sector
Is this an appropriate level of protectionism?

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>>137485097
White nationalists are pretty stupid but so are SJWs, I think. You know, you just gotta realize both sides are equally bad when you really use logic to reach your conclusions instead of emotions. We could use more rational people making decisions in the world. Hell, we could use more rational people on THIS board. I see a lot of hateful stuff from time to time and let me just tell you, do you know how stupid you look? Pretty moronic, in fact.

>>137499876
I'M NOT A DAMN SOCDEM REEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>137499585

>>137499028
>surviving torture is an achievement
sure, but it doesn't make you a good... anything

>played well in my head
isn't voting according to feeling literally how democracy in US turned into a popularity contest which (many agree) is terrible?

>>137500377
>isn't voting according to feeling literally how democracy in US turned into a popularity contest which (many agree) is terrible?

Absolutely, but there are scenarios that are preferable. For example, one where an individual shows actual courage in his past is better than one where an individual grew up in privilege and was borderline gay.

>>137500634
>showing courage
>experience severe trauma
flat better than
>grew up in privilege
>receive highest level of standards

That's a tough sell m8

>>137485097
Okay you have sold me on this. I fucking hate ANTIFA but i cannot endorse the coonery of the Alt right. Where do i begin.

>>137500943
>receive highest level of standards

Except you failed to mention who looked like a straight faggot. Unless perhaps that is a benefit in your book, as you are not American and prefer a weak America.

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>>137485097
Centrists are fence-sitting fuckwits

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>>137497152
If you're about to start speaking, but first you scrunch up your face and loudly shit in your pants before uttering one word, you don't have a lot of room to criticize the folks who rightly walk away from you.

History doesn't have a proud pantheon of diaperbabies with revolutionary ideas.

>>137501185
I fucking can't stand them either. They are worse than Commies, and they usually are.

>>137501243
>Instructs me on anything
>Is a legit faggot

>>137501180
I (and most of the world) would prefer a more "team-player" America (over a "dictator" America)

The faggot part is pretty bad if you group him with those attention-whore faggots
"modest gays" are usually fairly empathetic
Shame the nigger sold out, that really killed him for me

Wow nice thread OP is off sucking a box of dick i take it.

>>137501723
you didn't hear? sucking boxed dick is in this fall

>>137486537
>Emmanuel Macron's popularity falls faster than any French president ever

>>137499922
>a collusion among major industry-media leaders to manipulate public opinion
No, thats bullshit. I probably side with the Gamergater folks, but that description may be one of the things this board overreacts and that you ended up believing.

>morals? decency? freedom? not specific ways of attaining/ keeping them but merely the ideals themselves?
Thats more of a social contract thing. Thats kind of what Libertarian do with the NAP, but much more reaching, involving taxes, crime laws, etc. By idolizing I meant not going to extremes in like Ancaps do with capitalism. Capitalism, freedom, etc, are good, but I wouldnt support child prostitution markets per example.

>help those with low self-motivation?
Well, there's nothing wrong in not working, you just have to live with a shitty government check to live your life. Radical Centrism is generally in favour of a reduced welfare state, or even abolishing it in favour of a NIT/UBI we talked about before. Macron, per example, is one of them in regards to shrinking the welfare state. Economists generally believe that should be done aswell.

>Should immigrants be given UBI?
Sure. High skilled workers will rarely depend on welfare anyway, and the lower skilled ones will be new consumers in this economy just as well as everyone. The main anti-immigration memes from the last times came from the Refugee Crisis, people on here need to understand that this is an extraordinary event, and even in Germany, per example, the economy is operating an a surplus despite all their refugees. Lauren Southern and etc, like to name some economists that are immigration "skeptics" but ignore that even they are saying that immigration is a net gain for the economy.

>populism
Populism for me is pretty much empty promises that fall on desperate ears. Ex: Trump telling that he is going to bring back manufacturing jobs from China to USA, when in reality even China itself is losing those jobs to manufacturing. (continuing in next post)

>>137485097
>radical centrism
No such thing.

>>137502005
>centralized country
>works because locals keep local while government handles coordination
>let's help those who disrupt/ harass locals
>oh no, my country hates me

>>137485097
how can centrism possibly be radical you faggot

>>137501684
>Shame the nigger sold out, that really killed him for me

Honestly, I had zero issues with him being black or looking effeminate, that is why I opted out of voting when McCain ran. The Republican party found a way to run a more weaker candidate than the Democrat party. It was unbelievable! To be honest, America is blood-thirsty, and I love it. We're an empire, and we have a lot of interests world-wide, so we must rule with a sword, and be ready to use it often, and as violently as possible. His dronings didn't really bother me so much as his transgender bathrool policies and his racist stance with supporting Black Lives Matters. In addition to racking up the debt higher than any other previous president, negligible growth (what can be expected, he wasn't smart), low home ownership rates, high poverty rates, high unemployment numbers, high food stamp rates, and just being a general demagogue and virtue-signally faggot. Also, finding out that Michelle is a transvestite and that he consumed crack cocaine and received fellatio from men was an eye-opener.

>>137502552
>I opted out of voting when McCain ran

Meant to say "I opted out of voting when Romney ran"

>>137502680
>>137501684

>I opted out of voting when McCain ran

Meant to say "I opted out of voting when Romney ran"

>>137502316
>>137499922
>populism
Another example is Le Pen telling coal miners that their jobs would be back, while Macron straight up told them to their faces that their jobs unfortunately would never be back, and got booed.

>Is this an appropriate level of protectionism?
For the current climate, no not really. It is very common in times of war, maybe when it occurs that may be justifiable.

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For the memers here, I do not think "muh both sides are equals" or some other shit you nigs think centrists believe. I fucken hate communists more than I hate the alt-right right now

>>137502316
>even China itself is losing those jobs to AUTOMATION

Fixed.

>>137485097

As a fascist I rate this thread 6,000,000/10!

>>137502316
>gamergate was something else
>you ate the bait
would you mind setting my record straight? just the elevator-pitch

>by idolizing I meant more those specific things that I don't like which I call idolizing
>these other things have a different label
double standards much? Everything must be tempered. Should some things be guiding ideals? which directions of society trump the hierarchy, in your opinion?

>reduce welfare state
>provide basic minimum a leave them to their own choices thereafter
great in principal
Are we assuming the basic minimum is so "cheap" to provide that we can do so for everyone with no real cost to society? If that basic minimum is tower blocks with small rooms and rice 3 meals a day with vitamin supplements, maybe
I think they tried that in Soviet, they turn into ghettos, unsafe and self-perpetuating downwards spiral
Do you see it ever turning out differently?

>more consumers is good
And if the consumption choices of low-skilled (low-educated) leads to these people reducing the average quality of society (back to ghettos problem)?

>Populism is saying things that are popular with ordinary people
>these things are lies
usually as it's the easiest though it doesn't have to be but your point is valid

>common in times of war
it seems to be leading to war at the moment

>>137502552
yeh, he was a total twat in the end
jumped on bandwagons and did nothing ro real substance

The war stuff if alright, so long as it's done in backwater places
The thing about empires is, they work better together, he should encourage "reasonable" competition, not turn it into single-player mode, imo

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Well adjusted citizen, bulwark of civilization, reporting in

Bump
What up freak bitches it's
Joe Rogan time

>>137504469
>would you mind setting my record straight?
There were one or two women that traded good reviews for their games in exchange for sex. It is shitty but nothing "major" about that. There is nothing wrong with gamergame, just /pol/ blowing things out of proportion. Not even /v/ cared this much after the initial exposure.

>Should some things be guiding ideals?
Economic and social freedom, equality of opportunity (not outcome unlike SJWs want), almost absolute freedom of speech, freedom of movement of business and individuals.

>which directions of society trump the hierarchy, in your opinion?
what do you mean by that

>so for everyone with no real cost to society?
Nothing like the soviets, we already do it a some success in the west, and with future restrictions on welfare, being productive and working will still be a goal to most of the population.

>unsafe and self-perpetuating downwards spiral
And welfare isnt, in most cases, cyclical: example: a third of Americans are getting some sort of welfare assistance, but for 34% of those individuals they will receive benefits for less than 12 months. These people find themselves in some kind of shock, a sickness or a loss of a job, and straighten themselves out pretty quickly with the help that welfare can provide. Only 19% who go on welfare actually dependent, in that they get on welfare and stay on it for more than five years.

>And if the consumption choices of low-skilled (low-educated) leads to these people reducing the average quality of society
What do you mean, any examples

>it seems to be leading to war at the moment
Well, not necessarily. War with North Korea, just like with middle eastern shitholes, would hardly require any method of protectionism. Society tend to believe that a "great war" is always around the corner anyway. Specially people here on /pol/.

>>137506825
>gamergame
Gamergate*

fixed

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>>137489013

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>>137485097
Popcorn brigade, sound off!!!

>>137486537
Macron? on aurait pas pu choisir quelqu'un d'autre pour représenter l'empiricism...quand même.

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I don't expect this to represent anyone else but myself.

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>>137509488
Nice meems

Imma steal

>>137506825
>minor corruption isn't major
true though hearing that I'm still happy the reaction was so visceral, it's good to nip these things in the bud early. the precedent is important

>social freedom
>almost absolute free speech
and when it steps outside the norms of decency (eg "degenerate" ideas in public)?
>free movement of businesses
that's quite a globalist approach
>free movement of people
>added with UBI for immigrants
seems risky

>what do you mean
When any (of the above mentioned) ideals are in direct conflict, which should have prioritized?
Eg Company A moves business to Country B, people cannot afford to move, those that can have an advantage in opportunity

>Nothing like the soviets
only difference I'm hearing is "it won't be forced on everyone, just those who don't have anything better"
Doesn't really get around the ghetto problem
>being productive and working will still be a goal to most people
sounds closer to naive optimism than rational extrapolation of human behavior

>only 19% stay on welfare
I'm inquiring as to how you envision reducing that number to (virtually) 0
If the 19% are concentrated in one area,
(historically) that environment is a ghetto which self-perpetuates

>examples
poor, stupid people with nothing to do buy drugs and junk food reducing their future effectiveness and likelihood of escaping the viscous cycle of instant-gratification through addictive substances
These kind of people in turn have lower living standards/ self-respect and take less care of their immediate surroundings, some turn to vandalism leading to shitty neighborhoods

>war is only combat
economic war in Europe?

wtf I love /pol/ now

>>137485097
Centrism is a falacy in political thought that all ideologies fall between two polar extreme opposites. This is exacerbated in the United States because of the two party system which creates a dichotomy of thought preventing alternative philosophy from being explored. Radical Centrism means literately nothing as it's only philosophy is to appease the ire of percieved danger. It would be better to say that you are non-combatants in the ideological war that the communists and the fascists seem bent on having. There are no notable radical centrist...since centrism is not a thing. Centrist is litteraly the slime of philosophy.
Radical centrists do not exist since centrism is not a thing. Also claiming dead successful leaders as centrist to bolster you cause of appeasment is particularly sleasy...
Mensa...really.
Oh sweety...jpg

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>>137487224
That's literally libertarianism.

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>>137511009
>steps outside the norms of decency
to be more precise, the current US speech laws are pretty much the model that I support. They look like their are open to a lot of extremes, but in reality it isn't really a problem in practice. There are groups that try to use it a "evil" way, like the Westboro nigs, but it is mostly a non-issue.

>that's quite a globalist approach
It is

>seems risky
Not really that much, it wont be necessarily a "muh open borders" thing, I talked about welfare as well before, same thing about Germany, as an example

>which should have prioritized?
Well thats the thing about centrism, things are complex and there isnt a "hierarchy" of principles to solve things. All on a case by case basis, that manage to reach the maximum possible number of people, with the minimum possible side effects.

>only difference I'm hearing
>naive optimism than rational extrapolation of human behavior
How? Western nations have already a pretty decent welfare distribuction and that doesn't impact the population need for a job outside of those cases you see in the news like the "random woman with 20 kids doesnt work and gets $1000 a month from the government". There is nothing pointing out to a Soviet style problem of parasitism.

>reducing that number to 0
We shouldn't. There will be ALWAYS some people on disability benefits, unemployment benefits, social security, etc. Its just like unemployment, it will never go down to literally zero unless you are forcing the people to work, like in the USSR. Structural unemployment guarantees that we will always have a non-zero number, and thats good for a healthy society. There are guettos, but there are other policies that target those groups instead of this being a "welfare or no welfare" issue.

>examples
That seems to be more of a cultural problems with some communities (like blacks) that have a garbage culture, no family support, etc the vast majority of welfare have time limits on them (out of characters)

>>137501185
you just jelly

>>137514327
>currently mostly a non-issue
idk, seems like currently people in the US are using the whole "free speech" guise to cause havoc and the authorities have little to no regulations on how to deal with the situation (specifically referring to the increasing number of not-so-peaceful protests which all started around the BLM time)

>it is
what happened to protecting national interest?
What would you recommend when entire industries leave certain countries? This whole jobs thing seems to be a big deal rn

>same thing about Germany
economic migrants are the problem, not refugees
They won't stop even if their excuse/smokescreen goes away (the war in ME ends)
I feel like you're actively putting your head in the sand here

>case by case
slow and inefficient, exactly the kind of mentality which lead to the poor management of refugee crisis (and will lead to more mismanagement of any other unforeseen event due to poor response time)
>reach max ppl with min effect
that's the easiest way to stagnate and slow progress by overburdening the system

>western nations have it alright for now
because they are not using your proposed system
I'm saying your suggestions (which are changing the system) will lead to bad results and you're saying they wont because the current system (w/o the changes) works...??? what?

>to 0
>literally zero
>mfw I specifically put (virtually) to try and avoid you jumping on this easy strawman
>mfw you do it anyway
>other policies
yes, those are the ones I was asking about
Do you have any suggestions?

>cultural problem
>not heavily influenced by socioeconomic
Even barring that, you have an idea on fixing culture through external means? I'm all ears.
Afiak cultures can only mature on their own, internally, which seems to correlate when their conditions improve

I'm a bit confused here. I thought radical centrists rejected Keynesian economics.

>open thread
>walls of thoughtful discussion
I love you OP

>>137516532
>free speech
the issue seems more about retards trying to restrict free speech like against conservatives, and naturally BLM. A free speech society will naturally always have retards complaining about "too much free speech".

>what happened to protecting national interest?
>entire industries leave certain countries?
Is in the national interest for the national economy to specialize and leave others areas for other nations, like we have right now, US building planes, UK building ships, Thailand building shoes, China making t-shirts and cellphones. That way the economy has a bigger productivity and boost on its industry and is more apt do deal in the globalized economy, which since WW2 is an actual thing doesnt matter if economic nationalists accept it or not. Protectionism never helps an industry to develop also, its just a subsidy to form a bubble that will burst the moment those subsidies end. South american countries are basically the textbook version of failed decades of protectionism.

>economic migrants are the problem, not refugees
Isnt the center e the right in Europe already planning to return great part of those migrants to their countries as the crisis is ending? Macron also seems to be big on that recently. Germany appears to also be sending people back to Greece.

>slow and inefficient
How? In what? Wait arent we just talking about principles?

>easiest way to stagnate and slow progress by overburdening the system
Example in mind about this slow progress thing?

>using your proposed system
If a moderate welfare system works without people being forced into parasitism how would a slightly reduced welfare system result in a increased problem? Economists agree that with a NIT and the coming of automation this will be a much superior way to conduct welfare.


>on this easy strawman
But seriously, how do you think this is possible? Just like crime, there wont be any society or group that has 0% crime. Or 0% anything.

(continue in next post)

>>137516532
Unless youre really a massive ideologue you dont create policies thinking it will be 100% effective and completely curb a problem.

>yes, those are the ones I was asking about
>Do you have any suggestions?
They involve a more fair way to distribute education for example. In the current way schools have their funding by districts, so wealthier districts have better schools than the poor ones, and poor students are more locked in this cyclical issue. There are solutions involving socio-economic quotas, but on this board it will obviously be too "sjw" to talk about. War on Drugs is another policy that affects the lower classes disproportionally. Welfare itself has been proven to be a policy that mostly breaks cyclical poverty, not perpetuates.

>cultures can only mature on their own, internally, which seems to correlate when their conditions improve
Well, I agree with that.

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>>137485097
<This is a general for the discussion of all things relating to radical centrism
>Radical
>Radical
>Radical
lmfao, it's easy taking no sides and forming arguments around classical liberalism. In a perfect white homogenized world, maybe classical liberalism will work.
But right now, your easy route will mean the dispossession of my people. No white people = no classical liberalism.

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Sage

>>137485097
>bigot
>pervert

>>137519897
how can whiteys even compete with japs
lel kill yourself untersmench

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>>137520236
First of all, show your home country you fucking larper.
Second of all, Japs are not the dominant non white group in the US. America is filled with 80 iq non white "untersmench".


Non whites will never share your esoteric views, all they want is gibz and see whitey die.

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>>137501478
I'm not instructing you, honey-chile. You don't have the capability to be any better at anything you do. You're like a wizard tapped the phrase "WAKE UP SHEEPLE" with a magic wand, and you leaped off the page, fully-formed like a real boy.

Just explaining why people who instantly disregard you are correct. Life is short, and you've never been right about anything.

>>137486915
This is not in conflict because those ideas come from different ideologies.

>>137485097
>Radical Centrist is rotated toward the right.
#NOT A CENTRIST.

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>>137521233
I'm from Somalia

But if whites are so smart why do you think theyre getting cucked

>>137518683
>always have
level of "complaining" approaching "civil war"
no laws which can in any way handle the situation
Your statement seems like more head in the sand

>specialisation is good
1. we're back to the unequal opportunity (not everyone in america wants to/ can build planes, they're too poor to move, nowwat)
You are prioritizing economic freedom of business over equal opportunity (which is how you get international monopolies, doesn't seem to be working out too well for the working class of.. anywhere)
2. different countries have different standards. you assume "the invisible hand" will force other countries to adapt to their customers?
I say ppl "learn to live with it" when they are offered no alternatives (what alternatives when there are no possibilities for competing locally with international businesses?)

>planning to return
Ppl have no ID > return where?
Greece doesn't want them (why should they?)
Free movement = let them in and then deal
Europe tried, now understanding better to control border

>dealing with every single issue as it arises
vs
>having a rule for how to deal with types of issues
Which is the method that lends itself to solving problems quickly, in your opinion?

>explain
>Let's help everyone
>>but there's more and more
>keep helping!
>>everyone gets less and less
>oh no, we don't have money for investment!

>welfare
>remove shame > more ppl sit on it
seems logical to me

>continue to go on about 0%
Let's pretend I added *except all those obviously incapable such as the sick and lame

>poor students
except the students in poor districts /actively/ resist learning due to their behaviour/ upbringing caused by their socioeconomic situation at home which does not improve because they live in the ghetto where welfare allows those not willing to continue living like dirt
Do you see what I'm getting at?
>war on drugs
poor use more, seems proportionate

>agree
conditions don't improve from external money (see: all of africa)

Do we have a discord?

>>137520122
y'know what's funny?
Even though it's obvious, nothing has changed
people casually accepted that the WMDs were fake news and everyone went "meh" we're used to being buttfucked and lied to

where are the tribunals? Looking at you, USA

>>137521233
East asians have work ethic, just lack initiative of germanic folk

>>137522739
>person is nice/ charitable / trusting
>abuse trust
>hurr y u so stupid, stupid
fucking somalian criminal pond-scum

>>137521233
Oh man, it's so strange that Germans aren't immigrating to the USA now that the Kaiserreich and the Nazis aren't in power.

>>137523536
>America is where you go when everything's gone to shit at home
>mfw now it's Europe and it's gone to shit in poor stupid places
>mfw the only solution is for war in US so we get all the civilized genes back that you poached in the 1900s
>mfw DPRK and Trump are pro EU and nuclear war is clever ploy

>>137522947
>>137518683

>which allows those not willing to continue living like dirt
*not willing to improve / don't have self-motivation etc

>>137524101
Honestly what are you talking about?
Did you forget to take your meds?

Yeah, America and modern Europe are safe havens for the world when there's trouble. Why shouldn't it be anything else but an ideal place to live?

>>137522947
>"complaining" approaching "civil war"
>like more head in the sand
How exactly?: What should be done here? There are two groups that want to harrass eachother, and me and most of society dont care if they do.

>not everyone in america wants to/ can build planes
what makes you think they are forced to do so? People dont have the right to DEMAND that they work on what they want.

>You are prioritizing economic freedom of business
duuuude what
the business are the ones that favour globalization for cheaper labour, thats literally freedom of business.

>doesn't seem to be working out too well for the working class of.. anywhere
It is. Sweatshops arent bastions of humane conditions but their creation led to a creation of a huge middle class in asian countries (specially China) during the 90s til today.

>Ppl have no ID > return where?
Obviously I was never speaking about this retarded refugee without control crisis, I said about that in one of my first posts. Free movement with checks and balances, for low and high skilled workers, with the proper beurocracy.

>Which is the method that lends itself to solving problems quickly, in your opinion?
Elasticity? Instead of one size fits all?

>oh no, we don't have money for investment!
wait, what are you even talking about? Who doesnt have money for investment?

>remove shame
shame?

>seems logical to me
About what? the welfare thing? About the reform i talked about? Thats what the overwhelming opinion and research of economists agree

>except all those obviously incapable such as the sick and lame
I wasnt talking about the incapable. It is still impossible for a society to function as that, with some magical 0 welfare recipients able to work, unless you cut every single welfare policy for them.

>except the students in poor districts /actively/ resist learning due to their behaviour
Yeah, I'm gonna call you out on this one buddy. Thats some good bullshit. How many cases do you see of this happening?

(next post)

>>137524633
It's quite simple

>Be European
>Kill and conquer
>Nobody can invade your homelands
>Kill and conquer your European neighbor because there's nobody else worthy anymore
>Also go find holiday home (America is born)
>"Shit this is getting bad, let's go on holiday"
>Suddenly: morals
>Start inviting non-europeans because they wanted a holiday home but never had the chance to make one because you already had all the best spots
>Shit, these morons are ruining homeland
>Holiday over

After WW2 and during the rise of capitalism many high-skilled individuals moved to US
Now they are spread thin and need to be regathered to keep propelling society
Quickest/ most efficient course of action is to have WW3 except on North American / East Asian continent so that all the smart people flee to safe EU and boom, progress will be given another kick up the backside just in time for the digital/ robotic revolution (Industrial 2.0)

>>137522947
>where welfare allows those not willing to continue living like dirt
Dude, thats literally fake news, my man
Those things you mention dont happen as much as you believe they happen. Like I said, welfare is proven to BREAK cyclical poverty, not perpetuate them.

>war on drugs
reporting, sentencing, policing, are extremelly biased towards low income households.

>conditions don't improve from external money (see: all of africa)
They actually do a lot, you just didnt care to find out about it.

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>>137485097

>>137527787
>lets be neutral on the subject
So this is the power of mongolian education

>>137525978
You should seriously see a therapist.

Why can't we just train and help individuals become highly trained and educated in our countries regardless of their race or national background?

I disagree that immigrants are ruining anything. Europe is still lovely, and has among the highest standard of living in the world.

The fact that you see countries and lands as holiday homes instead of lands for people to live in and call their home is bizarre and disturbing.

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>radical centrist

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Their is no way around an authoritarian state and civil war. Sorry centrist, you had 25 years. You fucked it up by selling out to the (((neo liberals))), era of extremes ahead. With good luck short war, but with a multipolar world order it looks like a new 30 year war, world wide

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>>137528233
yeah any time now, buddy

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>>137485097

I'd rather be called a racist than a cuck. I have a very left (and very uninformed) friend of a friend who is moving some fat bitch and her kid out here to Cali from Idaho. I already knew he was an ignorant leftist but he is a LITERAL KEK

you can't make this stuff up

>>137485097
lets go, bro. radical centrist everyday

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>>>137528411
nice doubles, but if you are really a Somalian >>137522739 in Somalia, it will not really concern you as you will be busy keeping pic related away from cutting your dick off and eating your heart without any form of brbe coming from the west. If you are in the West, have fun finding that place that accepts a potential traitor who isn't 100% on their side. Especially a rational Nigger. And no, not saying it is going to happen tomorrow, but a decade is not really much in historical terms.

>>137485097
jordan b peterson is the best example of a centrist. maybe not radical, but that why we are here, to put the radical in radical centrist

>>137486537
our king

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>>137528977
well if you really thought i was a somalian might aswell neck yourself

>>137487398
you fucking retard corny capitalism scocil democracy we are centrists that means that we don't have an ideology you stupid ideologue

>>137487949
No anon you're supposed to play on the joke that Macron is some sort of Far Right nutcase who wants to Genocide the Blacks, spinning his public presence, and completely ruining him in the eyes of the left, memeing the world into thinking he wants to kill all the blacks, however I guess you're just fucking incapable of any sort of fucking critical thinking, so you just decide to make some dumb fucking post that about how Macron is a weinie (which he is), because you haven't been posting on /pol/ likely for more than a few weeks and you came here from r/t_d and all you can think about is how he is not Marine Le Pen, which just goes to show you know absolutely nothing about /pol/ board culture, and care nothing about the community and the culture that has grown here over the years, pissing off the long time posters and oldfags, and basically ruining 4chan for fucking everyone, including yourself, because newfags like you don't fucking lurk, hell it used to be considered to be idiotic to not lurk for a few months, even a year wouldn't be considered crazy, but nope you get some link from r/t_d and just waltz the fuck on over to 4chan, hoping you can get in on those dank memes and get a bunch of (you)s and get on the front page of r/4chan because golly fucking gee look at all those (you)s! Those are like upvotes right? Remember to fucking include me in the screenshot guiz!!1!!1!!!1! And worst of all this makes shills even worse, since you are too fucking inept to recognize a blatantly obvious shill or slide thread and jsut keep on fucking posting instead of saging or ignoring like any resonable person who enjoys the board can fucking understand, but nope you decide to just be a dumb fucking newfag shit, not realizing that your presense is making it impossible to people genuinely interested to learn anything, since lurking will just show them the toxic shit you spew that has nothing to do with anything that is /pol/, and it's absolutely disgusting.

david simon knows whats up, watch the whole thing. not one ideology can solve every problem, you need both and in order to use both ideologies you have to be a centrist and if you want to see it in your life time, you have to be pretty radical, fuck the extremes https://youtu.be/ZYXNdELqCe4

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>>137529423
DESIGNATED MURDER DISTRICTS
fuck, you are probably worse off than a Somalian. Whites, Blacks, Mullatos, Indios, Socialists, Fascists, communists and CIA in one country. I pity you. Guess the Putsch last year wasn't enough for you to see how fucked your country is if any bigger economic crash happens

>>137529831
I'm you, but in the future.

>>137485097
Hold on one god damn minute... Obama is a "radical centrist"? The fuck are you on?

>>137501185
>falling for the false dichotomy

>>137509488
>socialized healthcare
only thing i disagree with here

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>>137530053
Not if we can stop it, and everything looks like it will be stopped by a brutal police state and a bunch of camps, like last time. I hope the left does the same mistake as 1927 in October when we go Black/blue, else it could really come to a third great war on our land. Just one thing is sure, the centrism of the last 70 year is death, currently both sides try to pull the centre their way, and it is obvious what will happen when both pull to hard, it will break.

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>>137530473
>like last time

>>137530620
other germany faggot

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>>137530683
Come on, anon
Just give in

No one needs to die here

>>137485097
Radical Centrism is just globalism.

Left is anarchy and Right is authoritarianism (or vice-versa it doesn't really fucking matter which direction)

Identity politics are the tools of pseudo-intellectuals.

>>137525525
>What should be done
Impose zero-tolerance on violence (any in protest = no more protest)
>most ... don't care
Most just voted for Trump/ Hillary /specifically/ because of these two groups

>demand
Equal opportunity means (afaik) giving people the chances to work where they want and make a living doing so (not rich, just living) which is not possible if there are no jobs available in their area that fit their interests

>literally freedom of business
which is in /direct/ contradiction to personal economic freedom. Which social ideal should be prioritised (the original question a few posts back)?

>creation of sweatshops has lead to middle-class
Valid.

>Free movement
>controlled with checks and balances
>Free
?

>Elasticity
>Quickly
Elastic means having a rule to stretch
There is no rule atm
also
>one-size fits all
>checks and balances
same principal (if you're being that reductionist)

>Shame
Living off unemployment benefits is currently viewed by society as failure to be a productive member of society (when done willingly)
UBI would remove any sort of connotation and suddenly NEET isn't an insult, it's the new normal

>logical
The part about how if NEET is normal then more people will choose to be NEET (thus making it impossible to provide for the increased number of NEET)

>0
Policy should /strive/ to reduce the able number which /stay/ on welfare to 0

>How many cases
>Go to school
>>but why, fuck school, imma skip
Attendance records for low income areas

>welfare breaks cycle
Any aid will help escape poverty for those who are willing. Those who are not will not be motivated by receiving welfare. The issue is with the latter. Welfare is not a solution there. What is?

>biased towards low income households
low income households consume more drugs so they are targeted more. I'm not sure where the bias is. If one are has more crime then that's the area where there should be more police

>care to find out
# of starving children has increased post-charity

>>137531017
anarchy is a choice
authoritarianism is a choice

globalism is a reality of living in a information age

we are just adjusting to the times famalan

>>137531017
>Radical Centrism is just globalism.
>Left is anarchy and Right is authoritarianism (or vice-versa it doesn't really fucking matter which direction)
Fucking lol kid.

>Identity politics are the tools of pseudo-intellectuals.
Congrats on saying 1 thing that wasn't fucking retarded.

>>137486906
>>137487393
He's not a cuck, he's kiked.

>>137530988
>Voter Fraud
>Former Radical Communist
>Now Islamist
Doesn't support your argument. And btw, the joke has no power, literally non, well he can decide which wine he orders and fag he smokes, but thats about it. Every other use of his potential powers will lead to a counter reaction by civil society as the rest of the political institution.

>>137485097
How do you feel about Libertarians?

>>137528037
>therapist
for empathy training?

>regardless of background
cultural differences (apparently) don't allow for it

>disagree
>lovely
Is that rock comfortable to live under?
The streets are no longer safe to walk at night in many German cities (EU country with highest standard of living), especially for women and white men /specifically/ because of the assaults by migrants.

>holiday homes instead of [real] homes
>bizarre and disturbing
call it what you will, the population movements remain the same

>>137531694
fuck all ideologues

When will things get better? Are we doomed believing in some sort of philosopher ran society that Plato thought of forever? It seems humans will largely always be retarded.

>>137531795
Fair enough. Usually find myself leaning to the right more but I usually consider myself centrist.

>>137531985
>It seems humans will largely always be retarded.
let me guess you are not one of those my little special snowfag. Pick a side or take the rope way out

>>137499876
>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_centrism
You are literally leftists.

>>137531795
>fuck all ideologues
So according to what system of believes or school of thought do you live?
>ib4 look at my flag

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>>137485097
>Radical Centrism

Can't tell if trolling or stupid

>>137532424
according to radical centrism

>>137532195
Of course I'm not, I know what it really means to understand another human and work towards building bridges.

The problem is that you can't pick a side without enabling fucking morons. I chose to side with the right because the Marxists are useful idiots and now the retarded Nazis feel empowered and are being stupid. All detrimental to a good society, all the absolute anti thesis of what America is supposed to be.

>>137531795
>lets not stand for anything n shieeet
Then what the hell is centrism even about? A lack of ideologue is still ideologue.

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>>137485097

Adam Smith, one of the great moral philosophers and political economists of the Scottish Enlightenment era, offers some practical advice in his book, the "Theory of Moral Sentiments."

Moderation in our social interactions, Smith explains, enables us to relate to and understand one another. A commitment to moderation, even and especially when the distance between our positions is quite large, is the best strategy for not only coexisting with others but also ensuring that others hear our positions and sympathize with them.

Moderation does not necessarily mean adopting moderate policy positions. Smith is not suggesting we compromise our political views and values. Instead, he is suggesting that we think about how we present these views and values to others and how we characterize those who disagree with us. It's a reminder to think of our political opponents as human beings, seek connection and embrace comity.

In order to get sympathy or commiseration from others we moderate our expression of our feelings and actions so that others can better understand and approve of our actions. If we fail to garner sympathy, we can learn from this experience and adapt accordingly.

Our social interactions, if they are to be pleasant and productive, must involve this process of moderation and adjustment. If political discourse is viewed as a battle of ideas, political life will be about winning ideological wars and not about addressing our common concerns. If we are unwilling to put in the work of garnering or giving sympathy, we will not discover strategies for better relating to one another, and avoiding polarization.

The way out of our current political climate is not to seek total victory against the opposing party. Instead, it is to seek recognition and understanding, and to cultivate sympathy for one another. In order to do this, we must be willing to follow Smith's advice to moderate, not our views or political positions, but our political expressions.

>>137532725
delet this

>>137531215
idk anon, he sounds spot on the money here (if you go by the means of attaining each side's goal)

if Right were labeled conservative and Left as progressive it's clear the sides will switch tactics depending on the current climate

Nonetheless Centrism is about expanding the Federation to encompass everyone equally

>>137532598
So you are a lefty who hopes that their definition of centre will survive another decade. Do you realize, that the centre is deserted while one half of your allies are fighting about which interpretation of Marx should be followed, while the other half is fighting with the right in the mud, becoming more fascist every day. Deal with it, the centre is not where it was for the last 70 years. And btw, that still and ideology, even a radical, as you say yourself.

>>137532923
i really couldn't care less about goy coutnries

>>137532658
You can build as many bridges as you like, if there is just one who is willing to blow them up, you lose. And stop with painting yourself as someone who isn't subverted by a believe system, you are the root of the problem, a bunch of ivory tower Niggers who discard everything that is not in there narrow believe. Where do you think those who you deem to left or too right go? They will not bend the knee, they will crush you while running against each other

>>137485097
wait, what can be so radical about centrism?

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>>137533009
Natioanlist Zionist for greater Isarel?

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>>137485097

>>137485097
Radical Centrist = Leftist Faggot
Die in a fire.

>>137533402
>founding father of Zionism
the idea of Jews returning to Zion exited since the the first exile

>>137485097
radical centrism is an oxymoron

>>137531752
Documentation of these assaults?

I'm not being sarcastic, i genuinely want to see articles.

Displaced populations have been traumatized and it is of course more difficult for them to integrate into a foreign society, especially with such a large influx of immigrants.

Germany seems to have made a mess of their program, and has taken far more refugees than they can handle, apparently.

fucking blairites

>that enlighten feeling when you spot your own confirmation bias before settling

>>137485097
Original Italian Fascism, which is Corporatism, is radical centrism

>>137533515
Well o.k, historical accuracy aside, Am I right in the assumtion, that a radical yidish centrist in Israels centrisme is defined by more land for Israel and kill all arabs, or enslave them if the UN gets pissy

>>137533838
raical centrism is not moderacy
as a radical centrist i believe killing all arabs wll probably be a bad idea but just taking all thier land and and fakign antishemtism in the united states so the jews will come back for a Jewish super majority is the best way to go

Has the issue of political propaganda gotten uncontrollable because of the Internet, and is it even possible to control without heavily regulating content?

From both sides, we see what appears to be staggering amounts of conspiracies, fake news, etc. Things that were once widely accepted, like vaccine safety, are being discredited via bunk infographs that soccer moms share on Facebook, to the detriment of our societies. (I use vaccines as an example, you can go from anything as simple as that to Alex Jones-tier child sex colonies on the moon).

The ideal would be that conspiracy theories would be exposed to the light of critical group thinking. But we see the opposite; peopl get hunkered down in echo chambers, and critical thinking flies out the window to be replaced by emotions.

Is this something that we can overcome, or is it too ingrained in our genetics to be susceptible to false info? How do we fix it?

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>>137531156
>(any in protest = no more protest)
on paper this is already what happens

>Most just voted for Trump/ Hillary
most people didnt voted at all.

>demand
great if they find a job they want, but the world doesnt work that way. work is work, its not supposed to be a ice cream selection.

>/direct/ contradiction
it isnt, they're not.

>Free
>?
Thats a semantics problem then, I dont support immigration on its own without decent border control, checks, etc
Maybe i used that to contrast with people here that are against immigration in basically all cases

>Elastic
>There is no rule atm
Doesnt really even matter to me, i dont even know what we are really arguing with this

>NEET isn't an insult, it's the new normal
Well great, but that doesnt really speak to the truth of the welfare business, that isnt motivated by feels, but rather by economics

>The part about how if NEET is normal then more people will choose to be NEET
Again, the dynamics of welfare isnt motivated about feels or about how they are viewed. People that want to live like parasites will live like that no matter what society thinks of them.

>Policy should /strive/ to reduce the able number which /stay/ on welfare to 0
It should, but it never will

>but why, fuck school, imma skip
I hope youre not trying to put the shitty school districts problem behind this one?

>escape poverty for those who are willing
>Welfare is not a solution there. What is?
And as far as the welfare records show, most people are willing. There is no solution for them. They will receive their proper checks up to their respective cap, if they are pass the period of receiving it and still havent found a living, they will die of hunger.

>low income households consume more drugs so they are targeted more
individuals from lower classes still receive longer prison sentences than the same individuals of higher income areas. This is specially true when it comes to blacks.

>starving children has increased
sauce?

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>>137534180
>>137531156

>>137533635
>articles
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/9934/germany-rape-january
Literally google, what am I, your mother? Do your own homework

>trauma
>difficulties
Giving excuses does not excuse morally and legally wrong behavior
Nothing excuses that behavior
Civilised people are thankful to those who aid them in times of need
These people are not being thankful, they are abusing generosity
I'm sure there's a very low circle of hell for that somewhere in Dante's mind

>made a mess
>accepting more than can handle
It's quite simple
Germany offered space to refugees
Economic migrants and opportunistic parasites decided to hitch a ride
The situation was dire and action was needed immediately
There was little thought given to actually vetting people
>oh god! how could you think of interrogating these poor traumatised people to see if they really are who they claim?! have you no heart or soul or morals?!
You cannot shift the blame onto the Good Samaritan for being naive

>>137534065
So basically a neo liberal pussy who will argue for peace when his country gets swarmed with kamikaze burkas. Got it, opinion discarded

>>137490135

Surprised that guns steel and germs book isn't on there

>>137534381
neo liberalism is an ideolegy to you know

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>>137532923

>centre is deserted
>more people didnt vote than hildawg/trump combined

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>>137532424
>>137532725
>believing in things because of principles instead if they work or not
look at this nig

>A lack of ideologue is still ideologue.
deep

you can still hate niggers

>>137485097
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Maynard_Keynes

What were his solutions for stagflation trough?

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>outlived the libertarian thread

>>137534842
http://www.pieria.co.uk/articles/was_keynesianism_discredited_in_the_1970s

>>137532573
None of those are proper examples of oxymorons outside the figurative usage of the word.

Crony Capitalism is a proper example of an oxymoron. It's a definable contradictory impossibility, rather than just grammatical improbability. It's just a buzzword for corporate socialism.

Radical Centrist would imply "left-leaning". Globalism is left-leaning. That's why a religion person that strays from the group and acts alone is referred to as radical. However, radical Islam is almost an oxymoron itself because Quran enables it.

>>137535416
Interesting, thanks.

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>>137533262
Hmm good point maybe I will just work to keep putting you dumbasses down whenever possible

>>137519897
The use of IQ tests to measure innate intelligence is inherently flawed, because it assumes that one's intelligence is a static measure, and completely uninfluenced by any cultural, environmental, or other socioeconomic factors.

>>137535709
but they didn't help Germany

>>137534180
On paper seems to be working great with the increasing number of violent protests, huh?

Most people never vote. Not a valid point.

Work is work seems to be moving away from equal opportunity. Some people prefer certain fields. If those are the fields available they have an advantage.

Personal economic freedom increases with choices. Business freedom reduces local choices.

Immigration with checks is good. Totally agree.

The argument was whether it's better to decide on each person individually or have a system that automatically culls certain types of individuals (back to any immigrant vs useful immigrant, we seem to agree though so no argument)

My very acute point is that the economists who all agree and have data to back it up are not relevant here. They say that welfare helps people escape poverty. This relies on the assumption that said people are trying to escape. If NEET is normal then there will be less people trying and the theory is no longer applicable.

Policy must strive to actually have impact. Reality is worked around when it does not fit the ideal rather than accepted. That is how things improve because the new normal can only be set by that which policy strives for. If policy accepts the current situation then the situation will not change.

You say that poor districts have bad school and I'm saying the schools are bad not /only/ because they are poorly equipped but also because the parents are not properly motivating their children.

Back to welfare statistic showing that people are willing. This is only true in a society where there are many external factors which /force/ people to "be willing" such as social stigma. This will be much less true with UBI. I'm totally there with you on the starving bit, good riddance.

Those that are more serious offenders must be punished more harshly. This is supposed to set an example. It may be failing but it's fair.

Your graphs say that Africa has more starving now. See 2nd "Numbers"

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>>137485097
>>137535090
I posted this yesterday and this comes back today? spooky

>>137535709
>Two front war
I hope you are a better military strategist and tactician than the whole German Military combined

>>137534826
>following a set of proven practices
>doesn't eventually develop into an ideology for the ease-of-understanding-by-the-masses convenience
>which eventually devolves because the practices are remembered and spread better/quicker than the rational behind them

>What is religion for 500

>>137535538
Wow anon, I was just going to say that!

Although
>Deafening silence
>Alone together
are oxymorons given meaning later to describe social situations
same for
>Open secret

>Living dead
I'd also put in the oxymoron buzzword, even if it's an established meaning

>>137535801
This argument is inherently flawed because it relies on saying averages are influencable and ignores the differences in maxima/minima for various ethnic groups

>>137487032
Funny, the commies say that about moderates too.
Who's gonna support your regime change LARPer?

>>137527787
Wow, you're the first guy to post an overused smuggy from some shitshack facebook page!

>>137535850
>a set of proven practices
Practices may be proven at one time, but circunstances may lead them to change, unlike people still following some ideology from the 1800s and other wanting to live their life in a way a bunch of slavers in the 1700s wanted them to do. Maybe in the next five years the world is so changed and macroeconomics becomes irrelevant, I wouldnt preach that shit anymore.

>>137535850
>paper seems to be working great
Well thats the thing, what else is to be done? On paper what you want already is the norm.

>people never vote. Not a valid point.
Why not? I'm very sure most people really dont care about nazis and commies harrasing eachother now and then.

>people prefer certain fields. If those are the fields available they have an advantage.
I hope they find their job, but public policy isn't about individual individuals working on coal or steel, is about the best effecient way to get resources.

>Business freedom reduces local choices.
You are increasing the choices somewhere else and helping in the productivity and specialization of your own country, as well as another country. We are not talking about IT, or services, or art, we are talking about raw industry.

>better to decide on each person individually or have a system that automatically culls certain types of individuals
You mean about immigration? I didnt even know all those posts on this subject were about it. If so, sure, I agree.

>If NEET is normal then there will be less people trying
Why do you think this is true? Gut feeling? People dont refuse to get welfare and not to work just because it isnt acceptable. Welfare isnt some public stuff that you can easily check on personal accounts. And to be frank, welfare and NEETS is pretty much already acceptable.

>If policy accepts the current situation then the situation will not change.
I'm just being realist/pessimist on this issue. Crime wont go down to zero. Healthy welfare recipients wont go down to zero either.

(cont)

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>>137535850
> I'm saying the schools are bad not /only/ because they are poorly equipped but also because the parents are not properly motivating their children.
But the schools being bad isnt about students attending it. It is ENTIRELLY based on taxation on its own districts.

>This is only true in a society where there are many external factors which /force/ people to "be willing" such as social stigma
UBI isnt a "upgrade" from welfare for them. It will hardly be a decent living on its own. People wont lower their standards just because it became acceptable.

>Those that are more serious offenders must be punished more harshly
No. Men, for example, receive much longer sentences on average than women do for the same offence. You wouldnt disagree with that? Thats the same thing with lower classes and blacks. Same crime, different sentencing.

>See 2nd "Numbers
where

>>137537687
Practices relevant now must be implemented asap. It's easier to have people accept them as ideologies.

If what is on paper is not working more must be done to ensure the results translate to real life

It's not valid because "live with what you've got" is not an efficient way of progressing

The most efficient way to get resources does not align with the ideal of personal economic freedom which bring me right back to the original question:
Which ideology do you prioritise for society? >Check back near the start of the when you gave a list for things you believe should be idolised, I'm still curious.

This is getting back to the whole globalism thing. Are you in favor of turning the entire globe into one mega-Federation of states?

We can broaden the topic, seeing as immigration is dealt with. Having a system as opposed to deciding case-by-case is the reason currency exists, for example. How is "one-size-fits-all" (as you so dutifully reduced the position to) not the more efficient option?

I see it as the logical extrapolation of human behavior. If the UBI is high enough to provide for all the basic needs of your typical good-for-nothing-leech-on-society (internet + junk food) then more people will choose to do so because the human brain is easily drawn into a viscous cycle of instant-gratification which is made all the more potent by companies that currently specialise in making junk food tasty and time-wasting apps entertaining. Being NEET is only currently acceptable to other NEETs, same as ghettos accept niggers. Not valid.

Obviously there will always be crime, that's what the police are for. Equally there must always be attempts to reduce crime. It's never okay to say "this is fine, it's how it is"

Except the issue isn't that the school is bad, regardless of taxation. The issue is the students are not willing to learn.

People's minimum standards and what society can provide for free are practically identical (see internet+junk food money)
(cont)

>>137538644
Although I am very much not in favor of the situation with men and women on an emotional level and although we could get into how the entire US prison system is terrible because it prioritises punishment over rehabilitation the point stands.

More men rape so all men must be made strongly aware that rape will lead to bad times.
Additionally men are more likely to be repeat offenders than women after being released.
There are psychological explanations for this which I will dutifully write out if you desire but it still stands.
Those that, as a group, cause more damage must, individually be punished more.
I wouldn't even say it's the right kind of fair but I would like to hear you proposal on fixing that kind of disparity.
Clearly the sentencing for rape is adequate so then should female rapists be given harsher punishments?

Back to blacks and drugs. If you reduce the punishment on poor-area folk they will be back sooner and continue to perpetuate that system.
Here it is even more valid because the neighborhood, unlike with rapists, has a drug scene and as such the removal of offenders in a harsh manner will impact the community on a personal level.
In richer communities where this is less prevalent there will be a lessor effect and thus the punishment becomes disproportionate to the goals sought (to fix the community, not the individual).

I could entertain the notion that the community can only be fixed properly by making the individuals better but we're back to rehabilitation vs punishment again.

>numbers
The part where it says "Changes in number of undernourished" there has either been minimal progress or a setback in all but East Africa. The proportion part is not applicable seeing as I said "more # of starving children"

>>137539740
In have to do some things and take a shit so im just gonna do a quick rundown

>Are you in favor of turning the entire globe into one mega-Federation of states?
no. I'm still fairly patriotic and I dont wish to be integrated closer to some socitieties in africa, middle east, russia and asia for example. That doesnt mean economically i'm not in favor of a more integrated world. Its not a problem trading with Saudis, it is a problem with them having a official invested voice on policy in my country.

>"one-size-fits-all" not the more efficient option?
It is more effective, I was talking about elasticity before when talking about how some policies are made, not based on a single value but rather as a "sweet spot" between freedom, security, and economic values, that sweet spot decided on an issue by issue basis.

As for UBI you may be overestimating its pay and underestimating the human dignity,

brb gonna take a shit

>>137540689
What is your case study for strict and punitive drug enforcement reducing drug use?

>>137541177
I think drugs should be legalised, controlled and taxed. /all/ of them

Yeh we'll have a couple of generations where everyone goes insane but after that it's fairly reasonable to assume people will get bored

To be perfectly honest the idea that sending petty drug dealers to prison will in some way shape or form curb drug use is ludicrous as the dealers are merely desperate poor people getting money in the easiest way possible

This is similar to how life gets better for prostitutes the more government regulation there is in the industry

If drug dealers had unions there would be minimal fuss of street violence around drugs.

Is it possible that there will be more violent crime related to people under the influence of drugs? sure but then it is definitely correct to have very harsh punishment for those who harm others through poor management of substances (if a drunk hurts someone they should equally be held liable)

Eventually people will learn. Also self defense course and non-lethal weapons should be provided freely by the state with harsh penalties for abuse

>>137539740
>Except the issue isn't that the school is bad, regardless of taxation. The issue is the students are not willing to learn.
It is, having proper staff, equipment, teachers, etc, is a great advantage wealthier kids have over poor kids. And frankly, I'm not too invested in this issue to care about nigger culture and their culture of not valuing education, the kids that dont care about it dont have me overly concerned. The problem is the kids that do value it, but are locked in shitty schools in shitty destricts.

>(see internet+junk food money)
well thats isnt living standards, people wont live with that shit on strictly welfare

>More men rape so all men must be made strongly aware that rape will lead to bad times.
Well, thats a faulty premise at its birth. You dont see women raping more because they receive lesser sentencing and you dont see men raping less because they are punished more. It takes one second to see that it isn't working. Same thing with blacks and drugs example. Its is circular logic. There are no results being shown.

>The part where it says "Changes in number of undernourished"
Sure but the "charities" are strongly targeting Sub-Saharan Africa, that had its numbers decreased since the 90s. Thats not even talking about other stats like GDP growth that since then skyrocketed (in some) with some actual financial aid.

>>137540847
Once you hand over the entire industry to a nation that nation will have power over you. That is where your specialisation leads.

Not long ago efficiency of resource gathering in raw industry was top of your list and now we're talking of sweet spots between freedom, economy and security. Sounds very wishy-washy to me (like you have no idea what you're on about)

I think you're underestimating how close we are to being able to provide something your average human will be perfectly content with wallowing in while they lament over how unfair it is that some people (those that work) get better stuff and the next minute returning to their gaming and energy drinks. It's not that expensive anymore, Anon and people are very eager to wallow while being drip-fed addiction satisfiers (see: bread & circus)

>>137542704
The available resources are not adequate to attain a proper education in poor areas of the nation. Sounds like the exact problem Common Core was developed for. I'm not sure that's working too well either. Thoughts?

Again, I honestly believe "strictly welfare" is steadily improving to the point where that is not an unreasonable expectation.

Your circular logic argument does not say anything about whether punishing less will increase or decrease the number of rapes / drugs. Where is your point on the issue of less crime?
Is it not fairly logical that if you reduce punishments then crime will increase because it will be seen as less risky/ more worth it?

That's kind of my point Anon. Charities (ie free handouts aka welfare) don't do squat while targeted investment by outsiders to improve infrastructure and build the foundations can lead to economic growth and thus indirectly improved conditions all-round

>>137509488
Good stuff

>>137543744
>Once you hand over the entire industry to a nation that nation will have power over you. That is where your specialisation leads.
No. Industries dont disappear and leave nothing on its place. 1st world countries are still growing, but on other specialized fields, like the arms, technology, etc while china gets for example smartphones and air conditioners. China is also trading its industries with the southeast asian coutries for a more dedicated and efficent comparative advantage.

>resource gathering in raw industry
> freedom, economy and security
what do these topics have to do with eachother? we arent talking about industries and domestic policy making in the same argument.

>returning to their gaming and energy drinks
>that expensive anymore
I'm curious, how much do you think the average welfare recipent gets?

>Common Core
>I'm not sure that's working too well either
What do you think that is?
This board has a really retarded view of Common Core.

>Again, I honestly believe
meh
>is steadily improving
It isn't really

>does not say anything about whether punishing less will increase or decrease the number of rapes / drugs
Your whole logic is based that more sentencing reduces crime, isnt it? How is that? Thats literally social justice. You are punishing an individual more over the actions of his whole group. Thats literally SJW logic, but favoring the wealthy instead.

>targeted investment by outsiders
This target investment is literally welfare by the western governments. Even when lending money, the African governments never pay it and get pardoned all the time.

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>>137543744
>>137545422
anyway, whatever, I'm going to sleep
take care anon

>>137545784
It was fun, take care you filthy centerist o/

>>137545422
btw if anyone agrees with any of this I'll happily keep ripping it to shreds

>>137545842
>>137545927
before going to sleep, what you even are anyway?
nazi? libertarian?

>>137546198
Labels are stupid, as you centerists would say ;^)

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>>137546302
yeah, sure thing buddy

see ya

bonus meme

>>137487032
>everyone I don't like gets a bullet
this is why you fascists, commies and muslims are fucking filth

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>>137535869

>>137532923
fear mongering and saying we're fighting to the death in order to lure people off center.
a cheap trick. is that all you fags have to offer?

>>137548157
>le "centrist means doing nothing" meme

>>137487895
>that quality
where did you get such a hi-res version?

Thank you for making this. For the few people on here with a brain.

Which moral ideals do centerists hold and in which order?

There seems to be some confusion over whose freedom is most important

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>>137548393
Proof is in the pudding,Le super intellectual Centrists have refused to address the concerns of both sides and have given rise to increasingly militaristic fanatics. So now the west is almost in a state of civil war, But it's not the Centrists fault. NO no no, its never the fault of the "joe blow centrist" that doesn't want to have difficult conversations or listen to the grievances of -->BOTH<-- sides

#Both sides are stupid & I'm so smart

Mcfuckin kill yourself

>>137549315
centrism isn't a single dot on the spectrum that has 0 traits of either side you fucking tard.
and actually it's both extreme sides dehumanizing the other side that's caused this rage.
they say everybody else is commie/fascist and then disregard everything they have to say while simultaneously threatening with violence. this causes opposite sides to bunker down and lash out.

>>137551340
If centerists are the middle ground then it is their duty to act as mediators, not sit and wait for each side to come to them.

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>mfw this thread

>>137485097
Radical Moderate here.

>>137485097
Fucking retarded.
If you are radical centrist you should be able to evenrually figure out what real opinions are worth standing for.
Otherwise your just a faggot that went into Radical Centrism TM and got stuck in your ways like a massive faggot.

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>>137548232
>saying we're fighting to the death
no one said that waffel nigger
>half of your allies are fighting about which interpretation of Marx should be followed
> the other half is fighting with the right in the mud, becoming more fascist every day.
But your interpretations grants a deep look into your mind

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>>137485097
radical centrism

>>137552232
>star wars memes
This guy gets it.

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>>137552547
>Star
>Wars

>>137551340
The silent majority refuses to care or acknowledge the on going social issue that both sides take grievance with. Centrists & silent majority have irresponsibility given up the "social responsibility" of moderating society in favor of letting impartial government and institutions run society. The problems we are facing RIGHT NOW are directly the cause of "Joe blow" not caring about civil liberties or listening to BOTH Left/right issues."Joe blow" has literally pushed the auto-pilot(government) on society.

Civil war is very likely to happen because "Joe blow" doesn't want to have difficult conversations."Joe blow" is the doctor that tells you that ever growing lump on your neck isn't something to be worried about,also you are a nob-jockey

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>>137551905
Centrist meme balls absolutely required.

When there's difficult conversation {thumbs down}

>>137552817
again, centrism isn't a singular dot that has no traits of either side. and as they overlap they do take care of left/right issues. it doesn't go all the way but what ideology completely fulfills any side?

>>137552547

>star wars
>national bolshevik

holy kek my sides, dude idk what drugs you're into but gimme some pl0x

>>137553414
hahahahahahahahahaha
you really believe this, don't you. Keep preaching to an empty court

>>137553414
As >>137551865 said

>>Centrists are the middle ground, it is their duty to act as mediators, not sit and wait for each side to come to them.

>>137553638
and you keep preaching to your circlejerk

>>137553737
So you have no beliefs? Faggot

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FEAR NOT, MY CENTRIST BROTHERS
THE AGE OF THE MIDDLE GROUND IS AT HAND

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>>137553825
>AGE OF THE MIDDLE GROUND IS AT HAND
>>Full blown civil war about to abrupt
>>Who ever wins, Centrists loss

>>137553800
Rather a circle jerk which is composed of a diverse group of nationalities and right wing ideologies, as also commies and lefties here to fight the ebin nazis. You, you chase away people if they are not enough in YOUR INTERPRETATION of centre. So keep preaching, the centrists are the extremists greatest allies

>>137552651
>>137553476
Don't worry I am Extremist Centrist.
My opinion is 0, 0 of x, y and 1/1 of z axis.

>>137485097
>Barack Obama
>Advances the marxist agenda more than any president in history
>Centrist
Leaf

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>>137553996
Step by step
We will take the left
We will take the right
No extremes can survive the power of DIALETICS

>>137490135
>centrist
>neoliberal
pick one

>>137553824
Lawyers can believe all they like but their job is to represent sides in a reasonable fashion

negotiators can equally believe what they like but their job is to get people to cooperate

why are centerists not doing their duty to their country?

This board might as well be called lefty pol or communism general

all these extremist shitting their pants because once again there people being guided by ratio and not eazy peazy fearmongering and threats is incredible. more tears please.

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>right wing SJWs getting THIS triggered that common sense has a general
H O R S E S H O E
T H E O R Y

honestly fuck extremests

>>137554361
>why are centerists not doing their duty to their country?
fear mongering by the extremists >>137554510 There isn't any space for a country in the centre

>>137554714
>there isn't a space for country in the centre
>if it's not fascist it's anarchy and communism!!1!!1!!
simple boy

>>137485097
>links wiki
"Part of a series on Liberalism"
>nice try