What are some logically sound arguments against abortion /pol/,

>>136495945
Their logic is that an embryo cannot sustain on its own and therefore is not a legitimate being deserving of protection. Well neither can a newborn baby or a 2 year old for that matter

>>136496136
>Their logic is that an embryo cannot sustain on its own and therefore is not a legitimate being deserving of protection
aren't lefties all about helping the poor, stupid and weak
kek

>>136496136
And they're all about "science", unless it concerns fetal viability. Then, it's just, well, it's not a legal person until it's out of the vajayjay, because we said so.

The better question might be:
What are some logically sound arguments for abortion that don't also entail post-natal infanticide?

>>136495945
What is wrong with killing? What is logically wrong with taking a life? Especially when taking a life that could very well harm others. The question most won't bring up is what makes killing a bad thing

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Here's what I think:
dad agrees, mom doesn't = abort
mom agrees, dad doesn't = abort
dad and mom agrees = a happy family is born

>>136497119
its """"wrong"""" because women are all about muh emotions

>>136495945
Sound arguments against:

>You only get a few shots at motherhood in your life, will you throw this chance away?
>You might regret this for the rest of your life
>What will any future man think about you knowing you casually flush your unborn children down the toilet
>Most women find it psychologically traumatizing
>No excuses for abortion when there are so many options for contraception
>You could just adopt the baby out if you are not ready for motherhood, the only reason you would abort is for the convenience of not stretching your pussy during childbirth
>You're killing the person who would look after you in your old age
>Would you like it if your mother had aborted you?

a pro choice person either believes that a developing baby is not actually a baby or that killing an innocent baby is acceptable. if they take up the latter position, then they are at least consistent, but also vile and despicable. if they only take up the former position, it is just a matter of seeing what kind of argument they can put up

is it okay to abort a baby five minutes before it would otherwise be delivered? if the answer is yes, then they have to justify why passing through the vagina confers personhood. if the answer is no, then they have to justify what precise step on the continuous development of the body a baby becomes a person

I see no way to pin down such a point. a human life is begun at inception. abortions should be treated like any other killing of an innocent person, i.e. with the highest degree of gravity and judiciousness

If you can have an abortion because the kid relies on his mother, should you be allowed to kill someone whos in a coma on lifesupport(relies on machine) and will be perfectly fine with in the next 4 months should you be allowed to pull the plug, if they say yes then idk theyre honest and realize its murder but if they dont that one works well. Also a human life is defined by 1.Human DNA 2.Human DNA uniqe to themOnce inseminated the embryo has this 3. and that it can grow therefore a fetus is a life and should be treated as such.

>>136497723
You are right, you become a person gradually. Therefore, killing a baby 5 minutes before its birth is 99.9% of a murder. If you allow abortion at an early step, then it is not that bad, though it is a choice that must be done cautiously.

>>136495945
Most common fallacy is the attached meme - "her body."
GENETICS - embryo has different genes than every cell in "her body"
HEMATOLOGY - If embryo has same blood type as mother, it is coincidence. Embryo has it's own distinct circulatory system.
IMMUNOLOGY - Placenta exists to hide the embryo from the mother's immune system. If it was connected directly it would be killed just like any other foreign genetic entity
COMMON SENSE - What other "part of the woman's body" has it's own beating heart and brain?

1. Depriving an innocent human being of its future is morally wrong.
2. Fetuses are innocent human beings with a future.
3. Abortion deprives fetuses of their future.
4. Therefore, abortion is morally wrong.

This argument does not assume fetuses are human persons, just that they are human *beings*, which is true. (They are part of the human species, and clearly concrete beings, not an abstract entity.)

A human corpse also falls into the category of a human being, but is not a person -- it is just a dead human being.

So we can grant for the sake of argument that a fetus is not a person, just a human being.

However, just like us, and unlike corpses, fetuses are human beings with futures ahead of them. Fetuses have futures like ours.

Fetuses are also innocent human beings.

They did not do anything to justify depriving them of their future.

It is clearly wrong to deprive an innocent human being of its future. And that is what abortion does.

The autonomy of the mother does not trump the right of an innocent human being to live out its future.

Further, dependence does not equal identity. A human being depending on a mother does not entail that the mother's body is identical to that human being.

So not only is abortion wrong, it is not even the mother's body, but more accurately it is an innocent human being with a future, who she put in the position of temporarily depending on her body.

>>136500453

By the way, fetuses are also human persons, the argument above is just being modest in allowing the assumption that fetuses are merely human beings and not human persons. So that even granting the assumptions of the abortionist that a fetus lacks personhood, abortionists are still clearly in the wrong.

>>136495945
The weak must die so the strong can live on to potentially have a child that can thrive.
ALL animals do this with absolutely no remorse.

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>>136495945
There is literally nothing wrong with abortion, unless it's whites.

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The mentally and/or physically disabled should be aborted and euthanized. Prove me wrong.

>>136495945
When I saw my son flailing his arms around on an ultrasound screen in his first trimester, I was changed forever. Anyone who kills a fetus is a legal murderer.

>>136499363
>99.9% of a murder
I chuckled

>>136495945
It meets all the scientific criteria for life, it is genetically human, every one of those cells is alive and totally unique to that being.
>it's not a person
Arbitrary and philosophically ambiguous
>it's not really a living human
The cells are 100% alive
>it's not sentient
Sentience is a misnomer, humans are not at all sentient because we are just machines of varying complexity, you could say three year olds aren't sentient because they are not as intellectually or emotionally developed as adults, to make sentience a point of contention is arbitrary.
Fallacies?
Post hoc fallacy abounds
>it's not x therefore y
Argument from ignorance or the post hoc fallacy, that type of statement has absolutely zero logical flow, they need to explain and justify their position.

I'm just throwing this out there because I hate children and am generally prodeath in most cases but I never understood how "pro-choice" is called that when they demand that abortion clinics be subsidized by tax dollars. You can't choose not to pay for it so how is it a choice?

C-section, no pussy transit involved. Babies born this way are sub humans.

It's not part of the womans body because it has 46 chromosomes identical to the zygote and only it. There doesn't exist a single copy of it anywhere else. Therefore, the cells for all intents and purposes are a seperate organism.

Why should we care about it? Because it has human DNA, human genetic code. It's ultimately what makes a human.

Sperm cells and unfertilized eggs have 23 chromosomes each, therefore they arent human (even thought they technically are a seperate organism). So it's okay to kill them.

>>136501159

Very good stuff.

>>136496967
There are none.
You could argue from the spirit of nobility and that one soul can rationally and non-arbitrarily determine who lives and who dies, but that's not egalitarian and it depends upon whether or not we still accept semi-deific leaders who play god.
>>136497723
If they believe it acceptable they negate human rights in a basic sense.

every woman knows that having sex can make her pregnant. none of them have ever died from not having sex. if you don't want a baby then stop having sex with people you slut

>>136495945
How mamy hearts does a woman have?

>>136495945
>It's not her body, her choice. It's the baby's body.
>It's not only her baby, it's the father's baby too.

>>136496136
But this is just another pro-abortion argument. A newborn and a 2 year old shouldn't be considered people deserving of protection.

>>136500976
Beyond that aspect, post-embryonic fetuses do feel pain and are perfectly viable humans if left unharmed in the womb.

A post-embryonic abortion might be the ultimate expression of the female "me me me me ME ME ME ME ME" obsession. A woman who cannot be bothered to use Plan B, waits until a fetus is viable, then does not choose to give birth to it and put it up for adoption is the most concentrated form that female subhumanity can take.

With that logic, "Its my Gun, My Choice".

Fuck off stupid cunt abortion is killing a defenseless baby for no reason other than your own fuck up.

>>136499363
Murder deserves life in prison. Life in prison means infinite years until you die.
If you kill a baby as a fetus, you should only receive 1% of a life sentence.
>1% of infinity

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>>136495945
If you attack a pregnant woman and cause her to miscarry then you will be charged for murdering a person.

But if a woman decides to kill the child then it's somehow considered a clump of cells.

Abortion is basically feminism.

>>136495945
I think mothers have the obligation to care and protect their children thus it doesn't matter whatever stage of develpment that child is. Mothers that kill their child, are the most disgusting thing on this planet. I would even go as far as steralize those woman, as they're forever unfit to have children when they already killed their own. Since women that can't have children are worthless and not needed, I'm okay with them living the consequences of their decicions.

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its against jesus christ and the bible

and thats it

if thats not a good enough argument for you youre probably a child of satan and going to take the mark of the beast anyways

Niggers are the best argument for abortion.

>her choice
Implying she got pregnant not by choice. She can't claim ignorance of biology and the chances of getting pregnant.

>>136495945
my great grandmother died because abortions were taboo and none of the doctors around would do it. there are many ancient methods that have been recorded throughout history.

Point being that women are going to always seek out abortions for all kinds of reasons. not allowing them to seek professional care because of feelings or beliefs is ... well... a lot of things.... but we'll be nice and just say wrong

Idk, its kinda messed up to fucking murder babies.

Sage

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>>136502664
>my great grandmother died because abortions

good it should be death penalty for abortion
even if she had survived

>>136502119
Why would you deserve an eternity in prison for a murder ? A few decades, sure, but an eternity ?

Hormonal birth control makes the body shed the fertilized egg monthly.

What's the difference between injecting hormones so that the zygote doesn't attach to the uterine wall. Or killing the zygote at some later date?

Why not force women to be pregnant every year or two?

The problem with pro life is that it is a nonsensical position.

>>136495945
>Break the decision all together. Only non-white babies can be aborted.

>>136503096
you deserve to be crucified like your sky fairy.... may the muslims rape your family for generations. because thats what ignorant christfucks deserve.

>>136502440
>implying this hasn't been debunked 6 million times

That would only be true if a person could only get pregnant once a year. Which they don't.

It's like telling an investment bank they can make risky investments all they want and you will bail them out if they go south.

It's the reason that women have sex with random dudes until their mid thirties. If a sexual encounter was likely to end in pregnancy they would be likelier to seek a stable, better man before having it. This would result in more nuclear families.

>>136495945
>her body her choice
She already made several choices with her body, and that's why she's pregnant.

If women had no right to turn down sex then it wouldn't be their fault. But when women get to control their own sexuality then it is their own actions that caused pregnancy.

Killing a living being you created so you can keep doing the thing that creates a living being that you will kill again, is evil personified.

>>136497145
they all agreed when they put benis in vagoo

I used to try and justify abortion but i couldnt rationalize it morally. There are very few instances where it doesnt come off incredibly selfishly. Most liberal arguments you'll see are selfish. (Same with the child free people (

>>136505026
i think a lot of them see it as a merciful act.
>This world is so shit, man, why would you want to bring kids into this world, man... *smokes weed*

>>136495945
Watch the prageru video on it

>>136496374
Abortion is helping the poor by not having an unwanted child.

>>136495945
Logical fallacy:
>b-but what if the mother was raped
>or what if having the child will harm her
>therefore, I get to use abortion to fix my bad contraceptive choices

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>>136495945
If the government has to dip their hands into my wallet to pay for abortions then I get a say

Sorry ladies abortion isn't "free" only FREEDOM is in this country

>>136495945
if it's her body then why does it separate from her and live an autonomous life?
If it's her body then why can it move or not move independent of her will?
If it's her body and what she is doing is so natural, then why if left alone and not tampered with, the child will be born healthy?
See, it's not her body, it's how we humans procreate.
You don't kill out of convenience.

That's a human life, it's not a slogan.

I am uncritical pro-abortionist about the early stages of the embryonal development.
In extreme cases - such as rape, severe danger to the mothers health or high chance for the fetus to be damaged or sick, I personally even see even abortion at later stages as viable.

If you want to practice you can try to debate me.
Also ama

>>136495945
abortion is needed so that degenerates abort their children.

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>>136506838

>>136507283
hahaha great meme

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>>136507399

I have a secret message for you.

>>136495945
>Her Body
This is a lie. Humans are organisms.
Consider an organisms as a Country then consider the systems as states/goverment then organs as the organizations then cells as citizen. The skin, for example, is the Military, the bones the buildings, walls, etc.
A Baby is just another country being built inside another just to be placed somewhere else (as Israel).
So Pro-Abortion people are xenophobic and anti-semites.
The Brain is just part of a system but not the system as a whole and not even the whole organism/body

>>136507210
Degenerates are too stupid to abort their children, that or they don't realise they are degenerates and want to raise their children to be degenerates

>>136495945
I find it really hard to be pro-life when it would mean keeping a downy or some other abomination desu.

Nothing. There's nothing wrong with abortion. It keeps the nigger population in check and genetic wastes from suffering.

>>136495945
Does that mean one conjoined twin can murder the other conjoined twin?

>>136507645
That would be both suicide and not suicide.
Good Riddance

>>136507633
>keeps nigger population in check
>niggers have the highest birth rate (in regards to percentage of the population)

>>136495945
There is no consensus on what is considered a "person". There is consensus on what constitutes a Human Being. It is immoral to kill Human Beings unless you are acting in self defense (youll die if you continue pregnancy). Its pretty simple. Humans should not be murdered for the sake of convenience.

Also, its her body her choice, sure. But inside her body is another human individuals body that she shouldnt have the right to impose upon.

>>136495945
Her body her choice. Ok. Should you choose to accept that:

>A child in her body also shares your genes. Therefore, you legally SHOULD have a say in the life of the child.....Considering you are paying for it if/when it is born.

I say no abortions without proof of the father's consent via signature AND only after both parents watch videos about the mental and physical effects.

If you have to watch a half hour "Don't shake a baby" video every time you have a kid, you should be forced to spend a half hour every time you think about killing one.

Just take the Ben Shaprio route and tell them straight up that killing the baby is denying the right to life. They'll probably bring up rape victims and then call them out on their bullshit because 1% of abortions are the result of rape. So how are we going to come to a compromise if you don't address the other 99% of cases?

>>136507905
Negroes in the US have a lower birth rate than whites. Thanks to abortion.

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>>136495945
I think abortion is the equivalent of killing babies and think it's fucked

Then I remember it's mostly pieces of shit that get abortions so they're just doing us a favor

I don't value human life in general, I just value the life of persons or the value of human life to which there is emotional attachment.

Also the line we draw for legal abortion is kind of arbitrary and based purely on emotion, taste and culture.
Based on true merit, a pig is more concious than a baby. That we eat pigs but don't (tend to) kill babies (no not 3 week embryos ffs, real babies) in the end is just arbitrary human instinct/emotional attachment. Not saying that there is anything wrong with that. Not even with you guys who believe (mostly for religious/spiritual reasons I assume) that killing off a human embryo less advanced than a snake, an insect, a goldfish is something inherently evil.

I an not defending women who use regular abortions as a means of contraception; these are definitely shit-tier and this behaviour should be discouraged.

>>136502018
Thats exactly it, i know you disagree with my viewpoint nothing will really change it but that is exactly why i think it should be legal. If someone fucks up once, boom the rest of their life is pinned down to taking care of that kid. The fetus has no idea about life yet, it doesnt know what it is missing out on, but the parents do. The parents realize that they have just fucked the rest of their life up. Not to mention if the child is born a lot of the time the family will neglect the child since they dont want it in the first place. Than the child has a shit life. Well that is just my viewpoint and i know many people very strongly disagree but i just wanted to voice my reasoning.

>>136497464
None of these are sound arguments. Most rely on the subjectivity of what people beleive to be in their best interest.
The main focal point of a pro-life argument should surround "why do pro-choicers not find a fetus to be alive/human/eligible for human rights?"
If you let the pro-choicer try to defend this stance long enough, they'll eventually contradict themselves. This is when you use logic to decimate them. Don't get caught up the idea of the mothers quality of life, because this is where the leftist loves to spin it into talking about their own needs and honestly who gives a fuck. The debate should always be about trying to make the left justify killing a baby.

>>136499363
False, the complexity which defines life begins at the cellular level. Every human has a different number of cells. When the death of a human occurs, 100% of its cells dies. If you abort the "cluster of cells" that is a fetus, you are killing 100% of a certain humans cells. 100% murder you fuck.

>>136496967
Tbh there is nothing wrong killing retarded babies. We should've done what the Romans dead where they'd put their deformed retard kids out in the forest to die.

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>>136495945
>logically sound arguments against abortion
there is literally no downside to fewer humans being alive

>>136495945
Argue that to be fair to both genders, any state with abortion must also have legal paternal surrender. Most people do not want LPS to be a thing.

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>>136495945
Women's bodies are property of their fathers and husbands,therefore the matter of choice should be purely a male issue.
that said, men should always force the women to have children, because
A)it's her duty
or if it was extra-marital
B)the pains of childbirth and pregnancy will remind her not to be a slut again
any other answer is cucked feminist bullshit

>>136501828
So why don't you just have a post birth abortion and kill yourself?

>>136495945
>what are some logically sound arguments against abortion

You paying for all the kids that in your arrogance, you said needed to be born because abortion hurt your feelings.

>>136495945
What if you get raped by a nigger and start developing a shitskin baby with 85 IQ?

>>136511658
Rape doesn't exist, women enjoy it.

>>136510339
I think that was the Vikings and Spartans my nigga

>>136511980
The Romans did it too.

>>136511866
Dude. If a 200 pound nigger bears down on a 100 pound woman and also happens to have a Hi-Point (or even a knife), that woman isn't going to fucking hold them off. Especially not in this shitty "guns are bad!!!!" urban culture.

Even if they get a chemical pleasure reaction from having a dick jammed in their vagina, it's still going to be an 85-IQ shitskin baby patterned after its "father".

Are you going to let that slide, Goldstein?

>>136512524
Why would a woman be alone in the first place?
she should be with a man ,who,of course,would be armed.

>>136512716
Perhaps she's waiting outside a bank or some shit, or Tyrones 2 and 3 shot said man dead while Tyrone 1 raped her, or perhaps all three Tyrones broke into the house while the man was away.

It's impossible to prevent rape. And let me ask you a question: would you personally prefer an abortion or a shitskin baby?

>>136513326
A shitskin baby, even if just to not be a feminist who gives privilege to women.

enemies make people advance as a civilization,women make civilization go back.-
without niggers, you might even stagnate and degenerate into pacifism!

>>136513483
See, a little prodding and the Jew comes sliding out of their mask. Look at you- now you're squealing about how niggers are necessary for a good society- using emotional words to make the alternative seem bad- and basing your entire argument on "i'd rather racemix than let a woman keep her bloodline white".

>>136495945
You either believe it is murdering babies, or you are a irresponsible delusional retard.

>>136513979
the woman keeps the traces of the sperm anyway you doofus, she will be forever out-whited.

>>136495945

appeal to emotion.

They can lean on this one quite a bit in addition to the "my body my choice" fallacy, which merges the body of the infant with the body of the mother.

>>136495945

there are none.

>>136495945
We have now, in our period in time, the most contraceptives available than ever before. Especially for women: coils, the pill, spermicides, implants, patches, vaginal rings, female condoms et cetera. There are so many opportunities and ways to have sex without having a child. The advent of female empowerment has also demanded women be more responsible, as responsibility comes hand in hand with independence. If you choose to have unprotected sex, you must be prepared to accept the consequences should you get pregnant.

At the end of the day, it all boils down to this:
If you don't want to have a child, DON'T FUCKING GET PREGNANT.

Contraceptives are YOUR responsibility as much as they are the man's. You can't expect a man to do everything for you. If you're old enough to have sex, you're old enough to take responsibility for yourself - and understand that actions - including taking no action - have consequences. If you choose unprotected sex, and get pregnant, you've only got yourself to blame. After all; your body, your choice.

Which brings me onto my second point: "her body, her choice". Except it isn't her body, is it? It's that of a child. Another human being. Within her, but a separate life nonetheless. What right do you have to end that life? Does the child not have a right to live?

Thirdly, A mother cannot produce a child alone. What of the father? What if he wants the child, and you deny him by abortion? It isn't wholly your creation. It is not, therefore, wholly your decision to make.

The only exceptions where abortion is okay are children by rape and the failure of contraceptives (since you didn't want a child, and acted appropriately. Not your fault it failed).

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>>136495945

>>136495945

abortion is what keeps the undesirable population low. we need more of it

>>136495945
You want degenerates to get abortions you moron.

>>136496136
You can give up 2 year old kids though. Ever heard of adoption? You cant adopt a feetus and before, people had no problem killing a baby if they could t afford it. Nowadays wecant kill babies cause of the law but feetuses arent afford the same rights as babies.

Banning abortion is about the dumbest thing you can do. I hope you pro lifers have a plan to deal with a black market abortion world were mexicans offer coat hanger abortions to millions of women who WILL get them.

>>136495945
If not for abortions, USA would be 40% white by now.

>>136515685
>conctraceptives are 100% effective
Virgin detected

>>136517705
You're a fucking faggot. Go back and read my post again.

If you're too lazy, leaf, allow me to repeat myself:
>The only exceptions where abortion is okay are children by rape and the failure of contraceptives
>the failure of contraceptives
>failure of contraceptives

Nonce.

The little piece of shit is in that post-pubescent bitch. She can decide what to do with it. We are fucking animals and the mother can do whatever she wants with it.

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>>136495945
this and others like it are why I am pro choice abortion.

Kids are fucking terrible and people only have them now as some sort of bullshit social compulsion. Also to post them on Facebook and pinterest boards and shit

>>136495945
I have no problem with making abortion mandatory on niggers and coalburners

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>>136495945
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RldK78gPrtw

>>136500819
The burden of proof is on you to prove your assertion.

>>136520163
Hello newfag. Lurk moar.

>>136495945
>What are some logically sound arguments against abortion /pol/,
None. This conversation was played as far out as it can get before you were born.

It is impossible to logically justify anti-choice positions being forced on other human beings, unless you begin from a religious premise.

>>136497335
I swear I wish we could beat that quality out of them, women and emotions are the keys to shit falling apart no matter what it is.

Abortion, Population Control, Genocide: The ’Scientific’ Killers and Who Sent for Them
A Communist Response to Theories of ’Overpopulation’

https://www.marxists.org/history/erol/ca.firstwave/cpl-abortion/index.htm

We need more abortion not less....unless you want to live in a big infested gangland......

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>>136495945
The most logical argument I can think of against abortion is that it is not HER body, it is HER AND HER CHILD'S BODIES.

They say pregnant women count as two when making priorities; they're more important because there's a child in there.

As a parent you can choose a lot of things for your children, but you can't murder them.


I still support abortion, though. It makes bad people breed less (more blacks are aborted than born, but trashy white women also die out as a result)

>>136520467
Atheists have no morality confirmed

>>136510292
So anyone who masturbates or uses condoms is a serial killer?

>>136521232
this

>>136521920
sperm isn't a person retard.

>>136495945
the S.L.E.D. argument is by far the most solid, and it looks like a few people are onto it.

https://www.str.org/articles/the-s.l.e.d.-test#.WYkF2VWGNhE

There is one question to ask pro choice people that really illustrates their unease with abortion: Are you comfortable with abortion being someone's sole means of birth control?

Most normies are pro choice because they dont really think about the issue and genuinely believe in womens' rights...but the thought of abortion still feels taboo. It still feels like something with weight.

If an embryo really wasn't alive and there was nothing wrog with abortion people would be perfectly fine with someone not using condoms and just getting an abortion every few months....but there is a cognitive dissonence there. Although it is compartmentalized and they try not to think about it, for reasons unknown to them (those reasons are obvious when you think about ir) abortion still makes them uneasy

>>136522811
neither is a fertilized egg, however i was responding to the notion that
>the complexity which defines life begins at the cellular level
and sperm is THE cell that is directly responsible for conception

>>136495945
the logical fallacy, as on the sticky, is "appeal to nature." Men do not natural right lineage because nature has made it so only women can have babies. Take it from there.

>>136523678
holy shit, that came out utterly retarded.
The logical fallacy, as on the sticky, is "appeal to nature." Men do not have a natural right to lineage because it is only women who can have babies. What's happened is society has elevated individual freedoms over the best interests of the collective.

love how these women are pro abortion yet they are against animal abuse and prob a vegan and all that shit lel

>>136524020
How does violence against an independant thinking, living creature compare to the termination of a cluster of non-cognitive cells in your own body

>>136520467
There are other, amoralistic, premises, but you're not going to ever convince a woman with logic -- only fear works.

When does life begin? What constitutes "life?"

These are philosophical questions no one has THE answer to, and you COULD make the argument that abortion could only be justified if you were certain that you weren't taking life, which without an answer to those two questions, you can't be

I am pro-abortion, because I prefer to leave the decision to the woman absent proof that abortion is taking lifef, but I recognize the logical and ethical consistency of that "other side"

>>136500976
Same here. I When I was younger I just never put any thought into it and was "pro-choice" because I had been conditioned to be. That's a baby moving around like a baby although still a few months from being born. And it's legal to kill in many states at this phase. That's murder. The whole "bundle of cells argument" and when does conception begin... I don't care anymore. They already look like a mini human after just a few weeks. It's murder.

"People" that attempt to justify it are no different than anybody else trying to make excuses and justify the mistakes and crimes they commit

>>136500777
checked

>>136520467
>It is impossible to logically justify anti-choice positions being forced on other human beings, unless you begin from a religious premise.
So basically we should just allow murder and theft because it is anti-choice of the people that choose to murder and steal?

>>136524177
>non-cognitive

Wrong.

>>136523350
>If an embryo really wasn't alive and there was nothing wrog with abortion people would be perfectly fine with someone not using condoms and just getting an abortion every few months....but there is a cognitive dissonence there. Although it is compartmentalized and they try not to think about it, for reasons unknown to them (those reasons are obvious when you think about ir) abortion still makes them uneasy

That's because it's a fucking medical procedure and it's still physically less comfortable and more expensive than just wearing a rubber you dumbass. There's nothing morally wrong with tooth care but it's still preferable to brush your teeth daily than just going to the dentist and having them cleaned every couple of months.

>>136524882
It's totally fine for you to personally believe that and keep abortion out of your live as a choice.
The problem is that the entire debate is dependent on YMMV, and when you force what you believe onto others, you are just as bad as the perceived villain you are portraying others as.

>>136506555
checked and completely agree. What are your thoughts on government funded birth control and plan b?

>>136525182
Same argument applies to killing people. Don't you dare try to force your anti-murder views on me

>>136525383
Embryos are not people though. You can choose to let religion guide every choice you make, that doesn't make it correct though.

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>>136495945
artificial wombs

>>136503285
This is a good point. To stay consistent, we should obviously make birth control illegal, now I see a good case for that.

Thank you.

>>136524177
You're a nonthinking cluster of cells too. Only bigger.

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>>136525590
Abortions are performed long after its not an embryo anymore. This has nothing to do with religion.

>>136525753
The fact that I can comprehend and respond to your comment contradicts your assertion.

>>136495945
Check out this article
http://www.proditor.org/2017/01/30/when-you-say-something-ignorant-about-life/

>>136495945
>my body my choice
The infant's body isn't your body

>>136525891
>>136495945 (OP)
>What are some logically sound arguments against abortion /pol/
pro life help black people have tons of babies and promote diversity
>and what are some common logical fallacies that pro choicers make that I can call them out on?
that prochoice is some kind of leftist value when its really all about white supremacy.

>>136525590
A lot of these babies being aborted have neural activity in their brains. NOTHING to do with religion. Abortion is flat out murder.

Atheists only get their values from Jews anyway, its not like they are free from all value systems. When you take Christianity away from a man. He isn't free, he simply becomes a Jew.

>>136495945
Are these people promoting suicide if you feel like it or where do they draw the line for "my body my choice"?

>>136520670
> a communist response to the theories of overpopulation
kind of like the communist response to the theories of evolution? fucking retards literally think "oh yeah? well fuck your evolution, we don't need food to live!"

Communists where the original retarded lefties

After I've kind of made them admit that the embryo is a human being I always say.
"Geez, you're making me uncomfortable, people who have, throughout history, arbitrarily decided which human beings get to live or die have not been very good people" and then I hint at Nazis. This makes them panic. The "LITERALLY Hitler" arguments turned on them.

>>136497119
what most of us who aren't retarded understand is most of the people making the decision to kill are not able to be impartial in their killing and most of who they kill are not always bad but just stuff they don't personally like or want.

Just because niggers have way more niggers doesn't mean we need to give the power to kill to a bunch of white chimps, theres a reason we sent the dues vault idiots to go die in a pointless war. the irony of your stupidity is that most of the crusaders who returned got culturally enriched by all the food and women in sandpeoplestan

>>136497464
arguments for
>crime rates drop when abortion is made legal
>less kids thrown into the orphanages/foster system, for which there are not enough people adopting and fostering
>less kids who's parents can't afford to raise them (nignogs)
>it isn't moral to bring a sentient being into the world knowing that it will suffer, sometimes genetic diseases and deformities are severe enough to ruin a life, it'd be better to have never been born
>you can always adopt a child if you mis your shots at motherhood

>>136526021
this, the misconception here is that white babies are dying.
the truth is that only about 30% of aborted babies in the US are white, and they are either the result of rape/incest, or have liberal parents.

literally nothing of value is lost with abortion

arguments for:
>it kills niggers

arguments against:
>it gives women choice

>>136501159
until it can survive outside of the womb, it meets all the criteria for a parasite

>>136495945
You guys realise liberals are the ones who abort right? Let them do it. Less liberal indoctrinated children the better. Just breed with your Aryan waifu and move on.

>>136515905
>everyone is avoiding this
nobody wants to admit it

>>136526963
I bet you meet all the criteria for a parasite too, should we be allowed to kill you?

>>136495945
Freedom>fetus. You cant take my guns and you cant take my abortions.

Fuck off back to whatever european commune you crawled out you worthless piece of shit.

>>136527136
Women are the ones who abort, and women don't have there own opinions. So it's essentially Jews murdering Christians.

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>>136495945
On one hand, anything past x time has a functioning brain and it's failure is generally how we define the end of human life. It seems logical that past the time when there are measurable brainwaves, that abortion should be illegal because it's killing a functioning human.

On the other hand, mostly liberals and brown people do this, so that is fine by me. Without legal abortion, whites would have been under 51% about a decade ago. It's preventing millions of naturalized citizenships, and it's the number one thing reducing the growth rate of brown people.

So frankly, even if it is murder, so what? Our enemies are murdering themselves. Would we not shoot brown kids in a race war? Yes, yes we would. The blood might as well be on their own hands.

>>136527240
well I don't live off of others, entirely to their detriment, so no, I'm not.

>>136495945
>"Don't kill your unborn children." doesn't work
You can't talk them out of it.

You might be able to accuse them of denying science, since children have neural activity to react to stimuli at 3-4 months, yet abortions are legal up to 6 months. They are, scientifically, ending a life.

>>136527355
i wonder what it looks like if you break it down by race /and/ family/female income

>>136527385
Yes, you do.

"Abortion is either murder or the same as taking a shit." -Louis C.K.

Better to be sure than murdering thousands of people.

>>136527300
Abortion statistics show minorities get more abortions than whites. I bet Christian white females are the lowest on that list because they are trained to believe abortion is wrong. Come on man use your head.

>>136527260
Yes, good goy
Let's give White people the tooks to kill each other and facilitate the ending of their unborn lives

>>136527547
>Louis C.K
He's such a fucking cuck. Guess which one of those he believes it is btw? He believes it's like taking a shit

>>136527616
That's like saying it's okay to murder European women because 2 Pakis got killed in the middle east

>>136527758
Actually that part of his stand up was pointing out that it's neither of those extremes but in actuality it's more like killing a baby. He later says woman should have the right to murder babies but he still points out that it is murder. Not a big fan or anything.

>>136527654
Eat shit you dumb nigger, ill abort right up to the 18th year if I want to.

>>136527947
. . . Jesus christ that's even worse than I thought

>>136527503
Lower income was more likely, but religious people and conservatives were a lot less likely even when poor. No way around it, blacks and Hispanics are way over represented in abortion. It is literally the only thing that has prevented us from being a minority already. Nothing has slowed down immigration or their growth or increased our growth.

Being pro abortion should be on every white and conservative's mind now. To ban abortion would be to guarantee our losing control of our societies.

>>136503285
>What's the difference between injecting hormones so that the zygote doesn't attach to the uterine wall. Or killing the zygote at some later date?

its premeditated

>>136527847
Or it's like saying Sheniqua aborting 6 babies is better for society than Roseanne aborting 1 baby. Also whites abort when there life isn't in order but go on to raise children later. My mom is a perfect example. I have 2 siblings and my mom aborted twice because she and my dad wanted to make a better life for my brother and sister. Sheniqua aborts her 6 kids because her life will never be in order. Just look at it this way. My mom aborts to create a better quality of children but if Sheniqua couldn't abort than she would have 6 hoodrat niggers robbing your local grocery store. This is a simple quality vs. quantity debate.

>>136528400
But Roseanne aborting no babies and Sheniqua aborting all of hers is much better than Roseanne aborting 1 and Sheniqua aborting 6.

You could make the same argument for killing 1 year old infants.

>>136507210
People become more responsible when there is a nuclear family. Abortion just lets them be more degenerate, have less responsibilities, and just ruins the Nuclear family.

>>136529224
this

>>136518135
So u already admitted you dont believe that a featus has a right to live and is not a baby.

So therefore you just want to be ounitive on women for autismal reasons. You dont give a shit about the financial, social or psychological impact that would occur between parent and child as a result of an unwanted birth. Honestly you should have been aborted.

>>136528400
This exactly

>>136526662
>think how much better society would be if we just genocide the undesirables, its not like they're people.

I can see why many on /pol/ would like it but the left is all about hating nazis now. it is confusing.

>>136495945
Should Photoshop her knifing it as the silhouette not holding it lovingly

>>136528652
Dude no it's a simple numbers game. 6 little tyrones go out and Fuck your children because of Jewish propaganda and female niggers and produce 6 more tyrones each. Now you got a whole gang of violent niggers ruin your neighborhood. Roseanne aborting 1 child to help her 3 kids go to college and build a family business is completely reasonable. Ban abortion and you get 2 things.
White trash.
Stupid Niggers.
You are from Ireland so I understand your anti abortion sentiment but as an American, I'm telling you we need it.

>>136495945

Be amoral for a second. Abortion massively reduces crime rates, because less unwanted kids are born and the little cunts don't exist to grow up into big cunts.

Also, less women die in botched backstreet abortions and less women die in unsupervised childbirth.

All of the above is subjective and can't be debunked. You need to be a moralfag to have any bunk with abortion.

>>136532462
Seriously don't get the sentiment of this board. Like Hitler was badass for creating eugenics but abortion is bad even though it stops poor minorities from breeding constantly. Makes no sense. I agree that unnecessary abortion is wrong like a white woman in her 30's aborting because she wants to focus on her career but that rarely happens. It's mostly unorganized minorities and degenerates that get abortions and I don't want their children fucking up my neighborhood.

>>136527545
>yu-huh
10/10, fantastic reply. go and farm some potatoes, try not to starve to death

>>136532462
>crime rates
How convenient for your argument that you just assume legality = ethical. No, the ending of 2 million innocent human lives annually for over the past three decades is a far worse crime.
>Backalley abortion apologists
The same can be said for rapist. We will never end rape, but that doesn't mean we should provide official rape stations and respect their right to do it.

What are some strong arguments against subjective beliefs on "when life starts," such as brain function or heartbeat. A good counterargument I heard is would you consider someone who is brain dead a person, if you knew they would have function again in a few weeks.

>>136495945
that baby growing in her womb is NOT her body - it's murder if it is aborted. End of discussion. Next.

>>136535537
Well it really depends on the quality of life. I believe in eugenics. Like if you think of humanity as a herd of domestication then we should really focus on the attributes that we want to pass down for future generations. That's why abortion doesn't bother me. The statistics show that low life's are getting them and no positive attributes are lost. Abortion is meant for those who shouldn't breed. If the left wants them then let them have it.

>>136535537
Whether or not the child in utero is a alive was a question answered by biologist decades ago with the discovery of cells.

The entire debate hinges on when a human "gains" their right to life, or more specifically, what level of cognitive dissonance is acceptable before one realizes that technology is actively pushing back the arbitrary line abortionists use as a cut-off to justify their slaughter for convienence. Babies that would have been "justly" killed in the 90s are now protected today. Pro-choice is platform under a foundation of sand.

>>136537496
atop*

But you get my point

>>136535721
Well said. Its not her body, its not her blood, its not her cells, its not her womb, its not her vagina, its not her life, its not her wellbeing, its not her will.

I agree with you completely, women are property, and the only way we can keep them financially dependent on men is if we can force them to remain pregnant against their will.

This will have nothing but benefits for society.

>>136526662
>it isn't moral to bring a sentient being into the world knowing that it will suffer, sometimes genetic diseases and deformities are severe enough to ruin a life, it'd be better to have never been born
this
Why birth a genetic monstrosity that will be a drain on everything its entire life?

>>136495945
My offspring.
Abort the child, I'll abort your life.