libertarianism is a mental disease

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>>136139337

>>136139337

t. Liberal Cuck

>>136139337
thats why i stay in the rurals where others dont own my house

Thinking you are dumb yourself and so other people must give order to you or you die because you are dumb, is a mental desease.

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>>136139337
> mfw i meet OP

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Fuck off national (((socialist)))

You're just worried that you'll crumble in a free market economy because you're a worthless piece of shit

But hey, someone needs to dig the ditches

>>136140196
>against a liberal idelogy
>liberal cuck
american flag so I expected nothing of you anyways
>>136140376
you are basically advocating for communism

>>136140743
If you think that in communism you can decide what to do with your life for yourself, you are dumb. So communism may be good for you.

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>>136140434
This is what non-whites on /pol/ look like. They are not your friend. These people will be removed from any libertarian society before it could work, and all /pol/acks know that. All of them.

>but but but I think races can live together!

Not a /pol/ack.

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>>136140691
>adhom
show your flag amerishartlet. Rothbart is still a kike and hoppes ideas litteraly contradict eachother
>>136141091
you clearly want a competely egalitarian stateless society with nobody telling you what to do, thats communism..

>>136141414
> Oh thank god he is a jew, otherwise i would have to make an argument
And wich of hoppes arguments "litteraly" contradict eachother

>>136141350
>reddit spacing
that image is so sad, ancaps trying so hard to apear right wing. People with halve a brain can see right through youe decadent ideology

>>13614141i don't now any english word that can express how much you do not understand anyting about communism. In communism, communism decides for you.

>>13614141 i don't now any english word that can express how much you do not understand anyting about communism. In communism, communism decides for you.

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>>136139337
More lit than Rotterdam was.

>>136140743
>libertarianism is a liberal ideology

Exactly how many times were you dropped on your head as a child?

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>>136141656
>"i dont like the behaviour of some of these people, we need to remove them"
*phsyical removal occurs*
>"ok guys go do whatever the fuck you want again"
*1 year later and one flourshing loli market later*
>"wow its full with degenerates again, how could this possibly happen"
A vicous cycle
>>136141684
sto cazzo imbecile di merda, communism is a stateless egaltitarian society, who is going to decide for you?

>>136140743
Liberalism is a right wing ideology, not a left wing one. Shareblue is nothing comparing to the real meaning of liberalism.

>>136140434
>Daily reminder that helicopter rides are extended to all socialists not just commies

>>136142128
no words for this level of retardation
>>136142350
>liberalism
>right wing
rightwing is traditional/reactionary, left wing revolutionary. There is NOTHING traditional about libertarianism or capitalism

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>>136141672

>>136142579
plaease name me one reactionary capitalist intellectual

>>136142541
Right wing is a ego/capitalist spectrum, opposed to the left wing ''''''''''''''''equality and shared property''''''''''''''''. Private properties/corporations CAN enforce ethnonationalism if they ever wanted to. It's their land after all, their rules.

>>136142541
>There is NOTHING traditional about libertarianism or capitalism
If traditionalism is indeed beneficial for a community then traditional communities will be the most prosperous in a libertarian society. The degenerates wouldn't be able to live off of welfare so they would die out.

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>>136142692
>Implying I have to do anything you tell me. I'm just here to Sage and lurk.

>>136141350
This is fucking retarded.

Ancaps = no central government

Nazis = central government controlling everything

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>>136142859
>Right wing is a ego/capitalist spectrum
anarchism is revolutionary, capitalism loves only in the present, the oast and future are usless
>opposed to the left wing ''''''''''''''''equality and shared property'''''''''''''''
egalitarianism and rwlated ideologies are revolutionary since people can only be equal when history and tradition are destroyed
>>136143095
anarchy requires the destruction of power structures which to their core are traditional in nature. A goverment is continuation of centuries of history. The state represnts tradition
>>136143392
I thought so, stay away brainlet

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>I can't take a shit without the state telling me to and holding my hand

Socialist cuckolds get out.

>>136143546
I thought you were talking about libertarianism not anarchism. The USA was pretty traditional back when it was a more libertarian country.

>>136143546
>The state represnts tradition
Not so. In European early history kings (the most traditional format of leadership) were kings of their people, not a set territory. Ie king of the Franks etc

>>136143546
>A goverment is continuation of centuries of history. The state represents tradition
This is how they legitimise themself. Just because they stole from my ancestors doesn't make it ok to steal from me.
> It's been always this way so it's got to be good.
If you love tradionalism so much can have have that in a libertarian society. The only thing you don't get to do is to steal from others.

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Daily reminder that Lolbertarianism sees no problem with importing cheap workers from the 3rd world.
Oy vey why would you deny Mr Goldberg the right to make more money? Fucking statist! :^(

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>>136139337

>>136144499
THAT'S NOT REAL LIBERTARIANISM

>>136144499
As long as you keep them on your private property it's fine.

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>>136143646
>i can only think in retarded personal attacks
>>136143812
seeing as hoppe is the libertarian faux-right idol
>>136143901
he still ruled over land didnt he, i dont get your point
>>136144216
>Just because they stole from my ancestors doesn't make it ok to steal from me.
fine by me, just don't predent to be right-wing
>If you love tradionalism so much
I dont
>>136144679
EPIK xdXDxdXD

>>136143546
The fact you care about 'Muh traditions" over a high standard of living makes you sound like a true beta-male.

>>136144751
>Not real libertarianism

Sounds like it. You're free to do what you want, but go against company policy and you're fucked.

>>136145303
I know, I just enjoy pointing out how inconsistent and superficial that 'ideology' ultimately is

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>>136145168
I never ever implied im a traditionalist. Third position or bust

>>136144935
Really depends on what you consider right wing. Many people consider National socialism as far right whereas I see them as center left because of the socialism part.
There is really no global standart definition. I see the political spectrum somewhat like it is portraied in the political compass test but this is just as false/right as any other way.

Why don't you tell us how you define left right, otherwise we are talking past eachother.

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If you feel like you're getting the shit end of the stick when you pay taxes I suggest you try paying rent.

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>>136139337

>see both of these sides are shit
>therfor no freedom is the best solution
>fascists

>see both of these sides are shit
>therfor freedom is the best solution
>anarchists (not the gay capitalist kind)

>>136140196
Daily reminder that libertarianism is the closest descendant of OG liberalism responsible for usurping kings all over Europe and generally sending the west circling the shitter
Hierarchies are natural and your nonsense ideology has never been implemented in 6000 years of human history. Your rampant individualism has helped disintegrate the family unit and subvert the west

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>>136145685
read earlier posts. Reactionary vs. Revolutionary

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>>136139337

Wow it's almost as if hierarchies will always exist

>>136141414
He wasn't even trying to make an argument, so "adhom" doesn't work here.

Ultimate argument against Hitlerfags:
Nazis support gun control.

>>136146089
youre a subhuman retard, it was implemented in USA, the whole coutnry was founded on those ideals. the destruction of the family was caused by government you fucking moron

>>136140743
liberal means leftist in america, you dumb fucking newfag

>>136141350
>t. hitlerdindu stormnigger newfag

>>136146143
If they will always exist why are we all forced to follow one specific hierarchy? If they will always arise naturally why do we need them enforced with violence?

>>136146327
>it's another episode of yuropoors pretending the U.S. isn't a decadent, kike subverted third world shithole when it suits their agenda

>>136142692
hoppe

>>136146145
his argument was that personal shortcomings are the cause for my aversion against livertarianism
>>136146412
yes libertarisnims is a leftist idelogy and therefore leftsist. Very wel done

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>>136139337
>dumbass Scandinavian doesn't understand how libertarianism works
Doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

>>136146116
So if I understand your logic correctly:
Ancaps (the not gay ones) are centrist by your definition because they want to preserve the good but destroy the bad?
According to this post>>136145501

>>136143546
>>136144935
ok you just proved yourself to be a literal subhuman retard not worth arguing with

get a brain or kill yourself

>>136142128
cllllllllassicalllllllllllll lllllllllllllibbbbbbbbbbbeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllll

>>136146589
liberal and libertarianism means completely different things in america

KILL YOURSELF

>>136143455
The left is a bigger enemy. For the time being we both want the same thing: our culture to shift right.

>>136146763
Classical liberalism has very little to do with modern liberalism.

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>>136146486
>If they will always exist why are we all forced to follow one specific hierarchy?
You are choosing to submit to the authority of your government. You are free to try and raise an army to overthrow it if you wish. Or you could move to another part of the world.

Might makes right. Don't libertarians believe that? Oh no because you're little girls who think "I don't want anybody to be aggressive towards me!"

Aggression is fact of life, fuckstick. Might makes right.

>>136139337
>posting from an islamic communist country

Your opinions are invalid Ahmed

>>136139337
>libertarianism is a mental disease

> implying libertarianism allows violence

u fucking leftwing shill

>>136141350
>you don't agree with me ? not a /pol/ack

Pseudo-oldfags like you are the worst. Gas yourself

>>136146962
Right, what normies know as "liberalism" now is actually Marxism. "We're ____classical____ liberals" was the irritating catchphrase I always used to hear at the Libertarian Party meetings.

>>136146589
>his argument was that personal shortcomings are the cause for my aversion against livertarianism
That's the classic go to for lolbergtardians.
>you just wouldn't be able to compete in muh free market
Beaners and poos compete just fine and they do it for 1/4-1/2 of what a lolberg is willing to work for. These underage, coddled, upper middle class faggots are the ones who would get rekt in their own society.

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>>136139337

>>136147138
>lolbergtardians
wew

>>136146962
>>136147050
>>136147055
Hey libtards, answer my post here: >>136146994

>>136146994
Amazing, isn't it? Living in a country with easier access to weapons than anywhere else in the world and the lolbergs have never tried to compete against the state. If they can't compete against the state that is supposedly inferior and inefficient, how the fuck would they ever compete against other factions or an external aggressor in a free market?

>>136146994
That's not a choice. Not a free one at least. It's an ultimatum.
>Might makes right. Don't libertarians believe that?
Ummm no? Ever heard of the NAP?

>>136139337
How is rent non-voluntary?
>Don't pay rent to live on other people's property or other such uses
>Get kicked off of someone else's property
>Don't pay taxes to fund a Nigger's life style
>Get arrested, possibly killed
How can (((National Socialists))) say the former is cucked, despite being about responsibility, yet think the latter is red pilled, despite your money being unwillingly taken from you to pay for the well being of niggers?

>>136147550
The NAP is a spook, it's time to grow up and face reality.

>>136140196
Libertarianism is literally liberalism you mouthbreather

>>136147286
>police
We are here to arrest you for smoking an herb, because your neighbor doesn't like it.
>private police
No smoking in my house/store. Stop or I'm going to force you to leave.

wow it's totally the same thing, you sure showed me.

>>136147892
>>136147892
>>136147892

Don't fight about this. Definitions always get fucked up because authoritarian faggots always fuck up definitions over time.

>>136144499
Top one is forced on every household at gun point.
The bottom one is solely for their business/property and if you do find yourself stuck with them somehow and do not want to associate with them, then you are always free to leave.

>>136139337

Enjoy your tax-funded genocide and population replacement.

>>136148208
Yeah, just abolish your military and everyone will leave you alone.

>>136144499
>>136144499
>>136144499

Are they being forced to move?

If yes, then we are against it.

If not, then the worker is coming of his own free will, it's fine.

This isnt rocket science.

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>>136147907
Private police wouldn't be able to arrest anyone because that would violate the NAP

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>>136146678
>preserve the good
no they dont, they want to destroy the good not for equality but for short term gains
>>136146707
yaddahyaddah, fuck off swedecuck
>>136147050
pic related

>>136147501
I hope that flag is ironic.

>>136147550
It is a choice you fucking idiot. There will always be people more powerful than you in society who are trying to cajole you, but you are still free to make choices because you are a human being with autonomy.

Let's say in an ancap society that there's a private police force called Police Corp® who are the most powerful police force in the country. Everybody uses them. In fact they effectively dictate the laws of the land. The "free market" has chosen them as the law of the land (I fail to see how this differs from the free market of the electorate choosing its government, which is one of the reasons ancap is so fucking retarded, but whatever).

Then you'd just be whinging "why am I forced to submit to the laws of Police Corp®? Submitting to these laws isn't a free choice, it's an ultimatum, because it's backed by force".

Anyway all of this is moot because ancap won't happen. You're imagining a world in which there is no welfare state and in which people who can't generate money from economic activity simply die in the street. These people will rise up and storm onto the properties of people who have wealth, and they will try and take whatever they can by force. Look at the G20 protests in Hamburg, look how all those lefties just burned people's cars. That's why we don't live in an ancap society - because there are too many people who would fight against it.

>>136148473
>>136148473
>>136148473

Non aggression principle does not apply to self-defense. Someone in your home against your will is very much an aggressor and you can defend yourself accordingly.

>>136148473
it can't arrest you, but it can force you to leave.

>>136148473
>being actually retarded

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>>136148398

Libertarianism is not anarcho-capitalism.

>>136148658
>>136148663
>>136148678
Private police could only arrest you on someone else's property, and then they'd have to let you go once you were off their property or else it would violate the NAP.

>>136148703
Aren't the enforcement of contracts and protection of individuals against crime both moral issues?

>>136148008
>>136148403
>>136148658
Why are you quoting single posts 3 times? Are you autistic?

>>136148907
>>136148907
>>136148907

When I'm dealing with toddlers I make sure they can see.

>>136149001
Not an argument.

>>136147564
National Socialists would expel degenerate races from their country.

Ancaps would believe this is against the NAP.

That's why NatSoc is good and ancap isn't.

>>136149132
>>136149132
>>136149132

That response wasn't intended to be an argument. You asked a question and I gave you the answer.

>>136148635
I don't want ancap to happen. I would like a limited government constitutional republic to happen.

shiiiit possst

>>136141414
>stateless society
>Communism
Fucking wow lad, did you even make it out of primary school? Toothpaste

>>136139337
You know what Libertarianism or anarchy will turn into right? Ethnically homogeneous micro states engaged in feudalism.

Both Fascism and Libertarianism are the enemy of the Jew, as they both destroy his weapons, centralized media and centralized banking.

>but m-muh degeneracy
Capitalism isn't the problem, capitalism without values and higher ideals is the problem.

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>>136150743
Wrong flag

>>136139337
OP being beaten with a club would not be a violation of the NAP because OP is not a person.

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>>136149334
Ah fair enough. Yeah I can get behind that I guess.

Anyway I stand by my point that people are essentially voluntarily choosing to submit to the authority of a government. You can always choose to become a criminal. Or flee the country. Human beings have autonomy.

The relationship between citizen and state is a contract, like Hobbes said. People agree to give up some of their rights to the state (e.g. the right to murder) in order for the protection of other rights (e.g. the right to live without being murdered).

Some people choose to flout that contract - those people are called criminals. Or maybe they choose to overthrow the state. Or, less violently, they just lobby the government for change. Or they just vote for different leadership.

>>136152544
Yes. It's just that most states currently in the world are abusing their powers and taking away rights that people aren't willing to give up voluntarily. The contract you speak of has basically turned into: Do what we say or we shoot you.

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>>136139337

>>136142541
In the US, the revolutionaries fought against the Conservative British Monarchy.
In the US, Republican = Liberal

Or at least, it did at one point in History.

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>>136141350

>>136153682
>daily reminder that long lasting monopolies have only ever existed because of the state
Monopolies almost can't happen without the state. Certainly not lasting ones. If a corporation has a monopoly in some are and is making tons of money because of it other corporations will want those profits as well so they will invest into that field.

>>136152833
Obviously there will always be state force in any society that agrees to live by certain rules (and if they don't agree to live by certain rules then there will be violent force from anybody and everybody, as they desperately scramble to accrue wealth and power - see Liberia and other African nations).

If the people of a nation don't think their government is benefiting them, and they are no longer willing to live by the social contract of that government (they don't believe it's a good deal for them), then they can overthrow the government. Or like I say, they can lobby it for change.

So I would say all governments will ALWAYS have an element of "do what we say or we shoot you". Because the alternative is that gang members, warlords, militias will form, and THEY will say "do what we say or we shoot you".

If the government is taking away rights that you like, or you feel they are abusing their powers, then like I say, I would say your options are:

a) Move to a remote area of your country where you can essentially live lawlessly, or "off-grid", and where the state probably won't interfere with you
b) Move to a different country where the laws are different
c) Lobby the government to change its laws, or start a political movement to achieve this
d) Disregard the authority of the state entirely and live as a criminal
e) Try and raise an army to overthrow the state
f) Try and start a movement to found a new state

I'm sure there are other strategies that could be pursued as well.

>>136139337
Agreed, statism is the starting point for any serious theory of politics. Get the fuck over it libertyfags

>>136154015
The problem is there's always the incentive for a private corporation to abuse the power of the state to annihilate its competitors. Libertarians think: well thats no problem if there's no state to abuse. Thats retarded, if there's no state then whichever private company decides to fill the vacuum first gets to BE the state.
One day humanity will be mature enough to realize that oligarchy is an immutable fact of human social organization, but 'tis not this day

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>>136154015
>Monopolies almost can't happen without the state

But anarchists define the state as a monopoly on violence, and the state came about from anarchy, therefore the most strong monopolies come from anarchy.

Checkmate ancucks.

test

>>136141414
Explain how Hoppe contradicts himself.
Also a stateless society would be the least egalitarian way of conducting a society. Every form of universally enjoyed good at the expense of the tax-payer is a form of egalitarianism. Although there's a clear distinction to be made between services that protect citizens from themselves (tax-payer funded health-care, etc. Basically just a way of redistributing wealth from the successful to the unsuccessful), and the ones that protect people from outside threats (military, police). Stateless egalitarianism is the largest contradiction you can make. Libertarians, or even an-caps for that matter, are not for abolishing every form of hierarchy, we just view the state as an illegitimate authority that rewards crooks, especially in a (((democracy))). The naturally occurring hierarchy which comes to life from mutually beneficial, voluntary exchange is far more legitimate than the rotten, disease-ridden "state".